October 8, 2025 • 36 mins
There’s so much pressure to “move on” after losing a pet.
But real grief doesn’t follow a timeline—and it doesn’t need to be fixed.
In this heart-centered episode of Straight Up Dog Talk, Em is joined by Anne-Marie Farage-Smith, grief educator and author of Healing Wisdom for Pet Loss. Together, they explore the complex and often misunderstood world of pet loss grief—including anticipatory, disenfranchised, and complicated grief. If you’ve ever felt like your sadness was “too much” or unsupported, this conversation will validate your pain and offer a more compassionate path forward.
You’ll learn:
• Why pet loss grief is so intense—and why society often misses the mark
• How to identify the type of grief you’re experiencing
• Small but powerful ways to honor your pet’s memory without “moving on”
This episode is a safe space for anyone in the thick of pet loss—or walking alongside someone who is.
Press play for grounded, gentle insight—and learn how to move forward with your pet’s memory, not away from it.
Guest Info:
Website: farage-smith.comBook: Healing Wisdom for Pet Loss
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
What if the most loving thing you can do after losing a pet
isn't moving on, it's actually learning how to carry the love
without the shame? Welcome to Straight Up Dog Talk,
the podcast helping burned out pet parents who feel stuck with
their pup. Finally, let go of the guilt,
learn to communicate and build the bond you've always dreamed
(00:20):
of through a partnership based approach that combines training,
nutrition, and enrichment instead of chasing the quick
fixes that don't actually work. I'm Anne and in this episode
you'll learn why pet loss grief is real and valid, the
difference between anticipatory,acute, ambiguous,
disenfranchised, and complicatedgrief, and how to honor your pet
(00:43):
with simple rituals, reflective writing, and creative memorials
without a timeline or the pressure to move on.
Because healing isn't forgetting, it's finding a new
way to love. For welcome Anne Marie, who is
an author. She sent me a wonderful book
called Healing Wisdom for Pet Loss, an animals lover's Guide
to grief. This is her book, so you
(01:04):
definitely need to check this out.
We're going to just jump right in here at the beginning.
Tell us what inspired you to write Healing Wisdom for Pet
Loss. Was it personal?
Was it clinic? Was it something else entirely?
Mixture of. Everything.
It wasn't one thing, except I would say maybe the one final
thing that put me over the pointwhere I said I think I really
(01:25):
need to write this book was the fact that I was hearing so many
stories from clients about theirloss of their pet and was not
being validated. And that was just like, whoa.
And then I kept thinking about more and more issues with this
loss and the fact that it's, youknow, really a disenfranchised
(01:48):
loss because it's not really validated in our society as well
as it should be, in my opinion. Yes, there are definitely people
out there that will understand it and you can talk to them
about it and they get it. But I think the overwhelming
majority are folks that just don't want to talk about it and
they don't feel validated. So they don't want to talk about
(02:08):
it because they don't want to feel like they're being listened
to truly. So that was the big reason I'm
hearing those stories about the loss in the life of their
beloved pet was just overwhelming.
Like I, I got to make this more recognized.
And so I think the best way is to write a book and get it out
there to as many people as possible.
You've. Supported a lot of people
(02:29):
through the pain of losing a beloved animal.
What do you wish more people understood about pet loss and
the way it shows up in our lives?
Oh, important, this losses and it needs to be grieved fully and
to be it really needs to be understood.
And with that, I, I think it would go along that if it's
understood, there would be more compassionate help for it.
(02:51):
And people would really get the fact that this is a pet that's
been in your life maybe for many, many years, maybe a short
amount of time. But regardless of the amount of
time, they've had an impact on our lives, a huge impact.
They're really a part of the fabric of our being.
We get up with them, we start our day with them, we end our
day with them and all the times in between.
(03:13):
And so it's, it's a huge amount,I'm sure as a pet lover, they
bring unconditional love. And it's really, it's, it's
really a pure love. It's pure and non judgmental.
I think that's just like awesome.
I mean, wow, it's pure and they do not judge us, you know?
So it's like, wow, it's a perfect basis for our
(03:34):
relationship. Do you think that that is why so
many people don't understand petloss?
Like the people that don't have pet pets in their home, they
don't understand the loss because they don't feel that
pure unbridled love the way thatwe do.
I think that that's part of it. They never really had that
relationship in their life, so it's hard for them to to
(03:57):
understand it. But it doesn't mean you can't
learn nothing about it and try to understand it.
Especially if you have a partneror a good friend that has one
that they've lost, you can at least try to understand it by
asking them some questions like wow, I just didn't realize that
this would have this much impactfor you when you lost your pet.
Can you help me understand it? Can you share something with me?
(04:20):
Because I really want to understand it.
Hopefully that would be something that maybe you would
encounter somebody that really wants to understand but doesn't
and they're open to hearing about it.
And then of course, you, you mayexperience the opposite, which
would be very sad and difficult.Or someone just says, come on,
just get over. It was just a dog.
(04:40):
It was just a cat. Come on.
You can get another one. Well, you absolutely can get
another one, but it will not be the same one I.
Think that's where a lot of people get lost.
We're just starting to really validate the dogs, cats, pets
are unique individuals. They have their own thoughts and
their own personalities. And I think that a lot of
people, especially people who'venever had that deep of a
(05:03):
relationship with the pet, they just don't see that and they
don't respect it. And so they don't understand
that losing a pet is just like losing a family member in that
aspect. It's like you said, part of your
day, part of your routine, part of the ritual that you go
through. And it is such a beautiful,
unconditional relationship that it, it really, I think it cuts a
(05:25):
lot deeper than even, I'm going to say it, losing a human
sometimes because with humans there's always conditions,
there's always stipulations, there's always anger and hurt
feelings and maybe a little bit of tension or we don't talk for
a while. There's there's ups and downs in
our relationships. We don't have that with our
(05:46):
pets. And so I feel like people who
have never really felt like theywere connected to people that
deeply like me, who love animalsvery, very deeply, is because we
have that really thick connection that our pets bring
to us. And they fill us with so much
joy, without judgment, without shame, without fear, and all of
those things. Yeah, I agree.
(06:08):
That's a lot of good points you brought up because like I said,
I think that the biggest thing is there isn't that judgment
there. They don't care if your hair is
is pink or white or you're tall or you're short or you're thin
or you're heavy, whatever. They just want to be with you
and they're not out there to judge you.
That's that's, that's the biggest thing.
(06:28):
And their love for you is not going to keep changing unless
you know, there's abuse there oranything like that, of course,
but that's a whole other story. We won't get into that.
Your book highlights different types of grief, like
antispiratorial grief, disenfranchised grief.
Can you walk us through what those are, what they mean, and
(06:49):
why they matter? Sure.
No matter what you go through inlife, if you be informed about
whatever it is, it helps you getthrough it better.
So it's better to be out there and not be in the dark about
something. All these types of grief are
common in any type of loss that you have, even if it's a loss of
a job, a loss of your health. It's not just about pet loss.
(07:10):
So you can kind of use these forany type of grief you may be
going through at the time. What's really interesting about
anticipatory grief is that you've got some time the plan,
whereas you wouldn't have it if it was a sudden Moss, like for
example, a car accident or something like that, a tragic
accident. So I'm just with Tory grief, I
(07:31):
think it's something we need to really be grateful for.
Embrace it. Yes, we're going to have all the
sadness knowing that the end result is going to be we're
going to be losing our pet. But we can plan when we're kind
of more in a stable frame of mind and not like overwhelmed by
the immediate loss. So it's an opportunity to make
plans for what you want to do after your pet dies, if you're
(07:55):
going to have their remains cremated or if you're going to
bury them or scared of the rashes.
So you can plan for that. You can plan for exactly how you
want to honor them afterwards. And then you can also think
about a lot of other ways as youmove through the grief, because
you may have an idea now what you want to do to honor their
memory, but you're going to havea lot more ideas later.
(08:16):
It's just an opportunity to planfor the time when they will
actually pass on. And then there's the acute
grief. That's the immediate grief that
you have right after the loss. You're going to have maybe some
symptoms in your, your body where you're restless, you can't
sleep, you don't feel like eating.
So you're going to have the, thebodily symptoms, you're going to
(08:39):
have the physical symptoms. Maybe you're really angry
because maybe you thought you should have done something
differently and you didn't. So there could be some anger
there. And like I said, the bodily
symptoms, which can be, you know, anything ranging from, you
know, asleep, not eating, not able to function.
If you come to that point where you're not able to get up in the
morning and function, if this goes on continually for a long
(09:01):
time, you get into complicated grief.
And that can be where you reallyneed to seek out some additional
professional help to get you through this.
And it should be no shame in that.
It's a difficult loss. There's no timeline for grief.
Actually, there's no timeline for it.
So it's not like you're going tosay, oh, I should be over this
in six months. No, it doesn't work that way.
It kind of ebbs and flows too. So you can think you're doing
(09:23):
pretty good now. Oh, a couple months have gone by
and then all of a sudden something hit you and it's like,
wow, something came back like a trigger, something that made you
think of this casting of your pet and it just overwhelms you.
It's going to be a process whereebbs and flows.
It takes time, there's no timeline.
But if it does become something that's overwhelming to you,
(09:44):
we're not able to function in your daily life, then it's a red
flag to maybe seek out some professional help.
So the other types of grief we've talked about anticipatory
acute so far, there's ambiguous loss.
That's a loss where there's a lot of uncertainty about the
death. Maybe the gate was left open and
then your pet took off and don'tknow where to be found.
(10:07):
And maybe you you never find them.
So there's always this uncertainty of what happened to
my pet. It could be something like that
or could be a case where I went through with my dog Wishbone.
He had cognitive dysfunction, which is a doggy dementia.
So we lost him like he was physically present in our life
(10:28):
until the day he died. So he was physically present,
but he was emotionally not as there for us.
It's just like a person that hasAlzheimer's or any kind of
dementia. So they're they're physically
the present in your day-to-day life, but they they're not
really fulfilling the emotional part of what you need from them.
(10:48):
So that's what it wasn't Wishbone.
We we decided that we were goingto let him leave on his own
terms after we discussed it withour vet.
And as long as he wasn't in painand he continued to eat and we
could take him for walks, we felt that it was OK, we're going
to just let him go on his own time.
But if anything changed then, you know, maybe would have
changed our minds. So he, he died peacefully and he
(11:09):
actually just started stop eating and drinking.
And the next day he, he passed. So it was difficult because we
just felt, let's just let him goon his own terms and he still
would give us love. He would sit in our laps and we
would be able to pet him and he seemed to respond to it.
So as long as he was doing that and wasn't in pain and he was
able to walk around and go for walks, we decided to try that
(11:33):
route and we're glad we did. So that's ambiguous loss.
A couple features of that. And then we talked briefly about
complicated loss a few minutes ago.
And that's, that's the one whereyou need to to be aware that if
it's comes to the point where you're not functioning and your
day-to-day activities, you need to seek out some professional
help on that. So I think we've covered all the
(11:53):
types of grief, but there's another one that's called
discrepant grief. It's actually when there's one
person or people and that don't understand it and you're going
through all this immense, immense grief.
So it's kind of like a discrepancy over the grief
because somebody else is thinking, why are you having
such a difficult time? I'm still carrying out on my
(12:14):
life and that's fine because we're all different and that's
the way you handle it and this is the way I'm handling it.
So there's that discrepancy in the grief that could be in the
same household. Important for people to
understand these types of grief.Well, in the beginning, I think
I mentioned that it's good to beinformed of what's going on in
(12:34):
your life. Whether you have a diagnosis of
something yourself personally, you're going to want to
understand as much as you can about whatever that disorder is
or diagnosis, because that's going to help you to understand
it better and know what you can do to help yourself and know
what the medical profession can do maybe to help help you.
So it's having an understanding of clarity in your life.
(12:58):
So that's why it's important to understand the whole idea of
grief and loss and the differentcomponents of it so you don't
feel like, Oh my God, this is awful.
Why am I feeling like this? Well, I understand that that's
something that comes along with this type of grief and you just
have a better understanding of it.
I really liked about your book was that it's designed to meet
people wherever they are. It's not necessarily meant to be
(13:21):
read front to back. Why was that flexibility
important to you when you were writing it?
Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up because that's one of the
topics I'd like to start out with too.
So that's why the book has the title and Animal Lovers Guide to
Grief. I'm, I'm thinking about all the
different topics I wanted to include in the book and what I
wanted to cover. And I really wanted to talk
(13:41):
about the relationship we have with our pet, the history of the
human animal bond. And I said, wow, but I gotta
wrap this up and make it understandable to people.
Like why is that in there for well, the reason it's in there
and I included is because it's important to understand the bond
that we have with our pets so that we can say, wow, I really
(14:04):
understand now why this grief isreally affecting me because I
truly do have a deep bond with my pet.
You can read about the history of that and how it evolved over
history. You can understand how they help
heal us in our lives. The dogs that are are utilized
for pet assisted therapy. They're they're healing for us.
(14:24):
They provide so many benefits toour life.
So now that that we understand that we can fully understand why
we're grieving with this loss like we are.
So I wanted to put that in thereso not to read it necessarily.
If you just bought the book because you had a loss, I
mentioned in that guide how to use this book, You might want to
(14:46):
start with anticipatory grief and understanding that and start
planning for this loss that's going to happen.
On the other hand, if you pickedit up, because I would suggest
every pet parent to actually buythis book or have somebody gift
to them because they do have a pet that someday unfortunately
will leave us. And so you could start reading
that part about the human will bond now and if you have have a
(15:10):
clearer understanding of how they help heal us through animal
assisted therapy and so on. So it's good to get now when you
do adopt A pet or bring a pet into your life in whatever way
you do, a lot of good information, I think in there to
help you better understand the grief.
So that's why I decided to go with the Guide to Grief.
I really like that you can jump back and forth to topics and
(15:32):
have support where you need it. I thought that was really,
really neat. It was not what I was expecting
as I sat down thinking, I'm going to read this book.
And then I was like, oh, wait, Idon't have to do it like this.
And so it was really neat to be able to kind of jump around and
and experience different parts of your book as I was ready to
either reflect or move forward or think about my current
(15:54):
situation by current dogs. It was really, really neat
aspect of your book. I really like that.
Everything that really stood out.
Yeah, you're welcome. Another thing that really stood
out was the reflective writing and the creative props.
What kind of healing have you seen come from those journaling
exercises in yourself or your clients?
(16:14):
If I could just step back on thethe guidebook idea for a moment,
I'd appreciate that too. The only thing is, if you just
lost your pet and you pick up this book, I would suggest you
go right to the section on taking care of yourself because
if you're just feeling completely overwhelmed by this
whole situation, it's important to read about things to help you
(16:36):
take care of yourself now beforeyou get into some of the other
areas of the book. What was your follow up
question, please? The.
Use of reflective writing and creative prompts and what kind
of healing you've seen come fromthem.
A lot of people like to keep journals and they find it very,
very helpful. And a lot of people don't want
anything to do with it. And that's fine.
But I would put it in the book prompts that relate to the loss
(16:59):
of your pet or your whole relationship with your pet.
And because it can be very, veryhealing, it can make you, the
idea is to reflect on those and at a quiet place in your home
and a quiet place in your life. And there's things you can do to
get yourself in the mood to before you start doing these
exercises. You can do a little bit of
(17:21):
visualization of your pet, closing your eyes, listening to
some soft music and just visualizing your relationship
with your pet and what your pet meant to you.
And then you can do one of the appropriate reflective
experiences because they're after each chapter.
So depending on what chapter maybe you just read or want to
get into, you want to do that maybe first, or maybe you want
(17:43):
to skip around and do a different one.
That's perfectly OK. So just the act of writing and
getting our thoughts in order can be very healing in general
for a lot of people. And I also suggested that you
maybe want to go out and get a special notebook, something you
can decorate, something that it's got a nice cover on it, not
just your basics dental notebookor whatever.
(18:05):
Something that you can really you can keep and reflect on all
your writings at a later time, maybe after a year, maybe I'm
the anniversary of the death of your pet, you might want to go
back and reflect on some of those things that you wrote.
And it's just kind of like, I don't know, I just ran, ran
across a few letters that I had.I was surprised I still kept
(18:26):
them. Or here's a here's an example.
I had some letters that my mom wrote to me.
She's passed on many years ago when I was in college.
I says, wow, I kept these. I was going through some things
and I, I started reading them. It just meant so much to me to
read her words and what she said.
So that reflection brought me some peace in knowing that all
(18:46):
the love that she had for me andso on.
So it's the same idea. You're really, you're reflecting
on the loss of your pet and whatyour pet meant to you and the
fun times you shared. And you'd be surprised.
It brings a smile to your face. And so by doing that, it brings
good endorphins into your body. Those are the feel good
hormones. And it just makes you feel like,
(19:07):
oh, wow, whenever I talk about my dogs, Jazzy and Wishbone, I
just get all excited and I startsmiling.
It's like, wow, I feel good. I love to look at their
pictures. I'm slipping through a book I
have of pictures of Wishbone on my first Jack Russell.
And I was just like so many happy memories.
And so I, you know, I felt good.So that's why it's good to have
(19:29):
those exercises that you do and then go back at a later date and
reflect on. So have it, have a nice
notebook, put it away and keep it.
And I would suggest looking through it again at maybe the
1st anniversary, maybe after sixmonths.
That's what I would suggest for those.
I think it'd be very healing. I love that idea.
(19:50):
I've worked with a pet loss grief counselor myself
personally. We've had her on the the podcast
before and it's something that'sbeen really, really incredible
for me. And because I held on to a lot
of guilt from some previous petsthat I lost, it was really
healing. And one of the prompts that's in
your book is something, an exercise that she had me do,
which is. Get a letter from your pet.
(20:11):
Yeah. And it's just such a cool
experience, right? Because it makes you think back
to how your pet looks at you andhow your pet thought about you.
And you remember all of those things, like you were saying,
all of the adventures that you had, all of the things that you
did together and how they lookedat you and how they responded
when you came home. So tell me how that idea came to
(20:32):
you. And how do people, Cuz I know
how I felt when my counselor asked me to do this, but how do
people typically respond do thatexercise?
Some people don't really want toget into that and I respect
that, but what I say to them then is OK, that's fine.
Maybe right now you don't want to do that, but keep an open
mind that maybe you want to check that out a little later,
(20:55):
go back to it and revisit it because I think it can be very
healing and then some people areright on board with it.
I've had actually some emails from people I don't even know
that have specifically mentionedthose exercises as being helpful
to them and why it was helpful. They had nice little extra thing
to know that people are are benefiting from that.
(21:17):
I'm glad to hear that. I love that people have written
you letters and told you about that.
That's so cool. What a neat response to your
book to get letters from people and and hear that response.
What a beautiful thing to share with people that you don't even
know. Like how cool is that?
That's so cool. It's very, very rewarding.
I just, I just love that. It just kind of validates for me
(21:40):
that, wow, my book has made a difference.
And it, that's what I, that's what I wanted.
The whole purpose of writing this book was to help people.
They see it on the shelf in the bookstore or they see it at
someplace else and they think, wow, I didn't know there was a
book on that. This one looks interesting.
And they flip through it and they buy it and they send me a
comment or review and it's like,oh, wow.
(22:01):
I'm just so happy to know that I've made a difference in
people's lives by helping them out through this loss because
it's just more and more common. There's, I think more and more
people have more than one dog intheir household.
And like I said, they're a part,they're a part of their life,
their daily life for sure. So it's been very rewarding
experience. I love that for you.
(22:21):
I love it so much. I think it's just a really,
really neat thing, especially inan area where we don't talk
about it and there is so much pressure, like you said, to move
on after losing a pet. So with that being said, how can
people honor their grief while still creating a new kind of
peace? Like your top tips?
Right after your pet dies, I would suggest, I just love this
(22:44):
idea of lighting a candle. If you don't want to use a real
candle, you could, you know, battery operated.
But to put that candle someplacewhere you're going to see it and
a picture of your pet that you just lost and just spend some
time there as you're going through these different feelings
of loss. Just sit there and close your
eyes and just think about something in particular that
(23:05):
really brought so much joy to your life.
And then open your eyes and lookat the picture of your dog and
that candle bringing there and knowing that they'll always be a
part of your life because they live on it through the memories
that we have with them. Choose something in the book or
on your own or a combination of what's in the book and what you
think of to honor your pet on the anniversary in particular of
(23:30):
their death would be a good time, maybe their birthday, if
you had a birthday celebration for them.
You can do something special. You can make a donation like if
your dog died of a particular disease or disorder, I think
that's a great way to honor them.
Make a dog donation if you're able to, to an organization that
is researching that. And there are places like that.
(23:51):
Also, if your dog was maybe a senior dog, maybe you want to
make a donation. Well, eventually they're all
going to be senior dogs. But what I mean by that is if
that's something you want to like, focus on getting out the
information about the importanceof adopting senior dogs as well
as just puppies. They can offer us so much in
their later years as well. So any way that you could honor
(24:11):
your pet by some of the ways that I mentioned in my book, I
think are good. Jumping off point or your own
ideas I think would be helping your healing process for sure.
I think those are all great ideas.
One of the things is really important to memorialize your
pet in that way because you can carry that forward with you.
Even though they can't necessarily physically be there
(24:32):
with you, you can carry their memory forward with you.
I think that's why a lot of people like to create Instagram
pages for their dogs because it's a memory log of all of the
things that they did with their dog and all of the things that
they went through. So it's really important to do
those things and to have those memories and those places that
you can go back and, and look upon and think, Oh yeah, this is
(24:52):
something that, like you said, maybe it's a particular kind of
rescue. Well, he made me think of this
or he made me do that. Or maybe it's a specific kind of
charity. Maybe your dog was really good
with kids and so you donate to some kind of educational area in
the for kids. I just think that there's so
many things that you can do to help just spread that love that
(25:13):
your dog would have spread. It's a beautiful thing that we
can do. And listen, there's so many
things and there's memorial rock.
We have a memorial rock in our in our garden with a little
statue of a Jack Russell terriernext to it.
And we have which phones name onit and a cute little saying that
we used to always say you see itevery day you go out in the yard
(25:34):
because it's there and maybe puta flower there too, you know,
little planted flowers. So yeah, this is endless amount
of ways you can do memorial ideas.
And it's it's so good for you too, because you get that.
It's almost like it's relief, but it's also that all of the
good that comes back with the the going through the memories
and all of that. So yeah, it's really, really
(25:56):
important to honor that and to. Find.
Ways to bring it into your life.Let's pretend that you're
talking to someone right now whojust lost their pet.
Just lost their pet like 2 minutes ago and they have no
idea where to start. What would you want them to hear
the most from you today? You're not alone in your grief.
(26:18):
I think that's really powerful. You are not alone in your grief.
I'm here. I'm here to listen.
Lots of times it's a matter of just being there.
It's not like you're giving all of these words out to them.
You're being quiet. You're opening up the door so
they can step in because now they know that their grief is
recognized and they're not alonebecause you're right there.
(26:42):
Even if you're not there in person, if you're talking over
the phone, those words just saying you're not alone, I'm
here for you. And then you let them talk and
you truly listen. Sometimes it's just like I said,
it's not a lot of our words thatwe have to say.
We have to listen. That's what's really important
and knowing we're there for them.
(27:02):
So that's what I would say and Iwould say it's important right
now now for you to take care of yourself because this is a
really difficult loss. And I would maybe ask them, OK,
so it just happened. Were you able to make some plans
ahead of time? Was the sudden I wouldn't delve
a little bit into that, but I would keep it more listening to
them first and not overwhelming them with too much information
(27:26):
because they just kept the wow, I just lost my dog.
He or she is not here anymore. So they kept the kind of like,
get that, like belief that they really are gone.
And then they have to acknowledge it.
Yes, he's not coming back anymore.
She's not coming back anymore. They've left this world.
That's what I think. But you are not alone.
(27:48):
And that's what I tried to really put in the book.
You're not alone in this grief. Others care and to reach out
when it gets become, when it be,it's so overwhelming that you
don't know what to do and you'renot eating, you're not sleeping.
It's becoming so overwhelming where you can't even do those
things. So reach out for help.
There are people that understandand care.
(28:08):
There absolutely are. What would your advice be if
somebody was struggling and theywere not sure if they should
start with a book, start with a community group, or start with
professional help? I think it's going to be
something that they might have to try one thing or another
thing of those three choices that you mentioned and see what
might work from them. If they are somebody that tends
(28:30):
to gravitate toward reading a lot, get a lot of their
information from reading, I would suggest maybe reading the
book first. If there's somebody that more
likes to be in front of somebodyand talk to them, I would
suggest they reach out to somebody and and speak to them.
So I think it just depends on what has worked for you in the
past. If you're somebody, like I said,
who's a reader, the book might be good.
(28:53):
And then once you've digested some of the things in there, you
can talk to somebody about some of those topics that are in the
book. I know I do that with a lot of
clients that are coming to me for a pet grief and loss.
I might suggest they read something that I send them to
read or parts of the book and then say, now we'll talk about
that further. Or what part do you want to
(29:15):
focus on in the book that you read that you have some
questions about? Kind of like what we're doing
here. It would just depend on the
person and how they have generally found help for issues
in their life in the past. Is it talking a lot?
Reading couple of good ways. Great.
Before we wrap up to date, tell everybody a little bit about the
Rochester Center for Pet Loss and Grief.
(29:37):
Tell everybody a little bit about where they can find you
and a little bit about what you specialize and how they can
contact you. The Rochester Center for Pet
Grief and Loss is something thatI started, that it's all virtual
now, what I do with that aspect of my practice.
I wanted to highlight pet grief and loss as something that
(29:57):
people can get help for if they wanted it.
So I wanted to put that out there and promote that and I
kind of wanted to focus on that title as opposed to my other
practice, which is counseling connections.
So I wanted to take out that if anybody felt like I don't need
counseling for this, if they sawcounseling connections, they
(30:18):
might think that that's like a mental health.
I don't have a mental health problem.
Incidentally, grief is not pathological conditions, but
it's important to talk about it with a comp trained counselor if
that's what will be helpful for you.
I just wanted to bring that awareness out there that there
is such a thing as people who dowork with people that have lost
(30:38):
their pets and it's not something that should be hidden.
And this really put it out thereto the public that they can see
the name of this Rochester Center for Pet Grief and Loss.
Wow, I'm really dealing with this loss and I need some help.
Maybe I can contact the person that has this business.
That's why I did it like that. I still have the constant
connections practice as well. I specialize in grief and loss.
(31:02):
Over the years I've done all types of constant for all
different types of conditions, but over the past maybe 15
years, I've specialized more in grief and loss, and then I got
more specific into pet grief andMoss as well.
I felt there was a huge need forthat and I wanted to bring that
service to the community. Incredible.
How long have you been working in this community?
(31:24):
This is actually my second career.
I started out as a teacher many years ago and then I went back
for another master's degree, which was in mental health
counseling. That was like 16 years ago.
So I've been in the field for 16years with the mental health
counseling and have had additional training in grief and
loss as a grief educator. There was additional training
(31:45):
and specifically in pet loss counseling trained professional
and that as well. And then of course, writing the
book and constantly doing research and learning constantly
about all the different things that are involved with grief and
loss and pets in general. So it's just a huge field about
the importance just having pets in our lives and training them
(32:06):
in the pet assisted therapy area.
That's huge. I've done some volunteer work in
that in the past too. So just kind of came 360 circle
and focusing more and more just on pet grief and Moss and the
whole pet world. Just kind of being more
awareness to the disenfranchisedgrief and helping even employers
to know that this is a real grief that they're could be some
(32:31):
time off for work for. Because I I've also worked with
individuals that weren't able totake time off of their work,
only take maybe a couple hours off.
They had their pet euthanized and they had to go back to work.
And it was just really, really difficult.
And the person feeling like theycan't share this with their
(32:51):
fellow workers because they're going to feel shame and they
feel like, oh wow, why are you feeling so bad?
You can get another dog like I said earlier, and isn't the same
dog. Oh, the person after a while
finally breaks down at work and sobs and fellow employees say,
what's going on? Why you so sad for what's going
(33:11):
on? Oh, nothing, I'll be OK.
I just got the sniffles and theydon't share it.
Or maybe they finally do and they get somebody that comes
back with either a very understanding response to it or
the opposite. And so you never know what
you're going to get. So I'm just trying to bring more
awareness to the community. I've done some speaking on this
topic, the importance of recognizing this grief and
(33:33):
allowing some time for your employees to have time off and
being open to that possibility because it's a loss, whether
it's a human or a pet in your life, it's still a loss.
So if we're going to give time off for a human loss, we need to
give time off for a pet loss because that's a valid A valid
loss. So that's why I want the
(33:55):
community know that this is a valid loss and needs to be
acknowledged and validated just like any other loss, to share
something very positive too. I know one person in particular
told me when they lost their pet, wow, it was like amazing.
It was like, that's the way it should be, just like a human
loss. What do people do for a human
loss? They generally bring over food.
(34:17):
They might send flowers, they might send cards.
OK, well, it's no different witha pet loss.
And so this person experienced that the neighbors were bringing
over food, they were bringing over flowers, whatever, and they
got it. And it was like, wow, this is
great. It's like this validation that
people get it. It's just like heartwarming to
(34:38):
me. So heartwarming.
It's like, yes, yes, I'm going to keep trying to get that word
out there and do my part to havethis loss truly validated and
honored. Well, thank you so much for
doing what you're doing. I love normalizing hard topics
and you are out there fighting areally big battle with this one,
so I appreciate it. Thank you so much for taking the
(34:59):
time to chat with me today and tell everybody about your book.
What would you like to leave ourlisteners with today?
My book is filled with a lot of compassion and understanding for
this topic, and I hope that you can purchase it or purchase it
for somebody else. You know, that's good a deal
with deal with this loss becauseevery pet owner, every pet will
have to deal with this loss. They come into our lives and
(35:22):
we're, we're we're so happy and thrilled and that's a happy
time. But then when they leave us,
which they do, they, they will leave us.
And that's the saddest part of the journey with our pet.
So my book or any other, the book that you choose can be
helpful to read. I wrote this with a lot of love
and the intention to try to helpothers that are afraid to not
(35:45):
afraid Now they feel like I don't think I can go and talk to
somebody just right now. Maybe I will someday, but right
now I just need some other kind of help.
Well, I think you might find some of that help in this book,
and I hope you do, because you're not alone in your grief.
You are not alone and you can absolutely feel the love in this
book. So you guys heard her Spread
joy. Be kind and buy the book.
(36:07):
If you've been feeling like no one really understands what
you're going through with your dog, it can feel really
isolating and heavy carrying allthat weight by yourself day
after day. That's why I created a free
community, a safe space where you can share the hard stuff,
get support, and be surrounded by people who truly get it.
(36:27):
You'll find the link in the shownotes below.
Thank you for listening to Straight Up Dog Talk.
Remember, new episodes drop every Monday and Wednesday.
See you next time.
What if the most loving thing you can do after losing a pet
isn't moving on, it's actually learning how to carry the love
without the shame? Welcome to Straight Up Dog Talk,
the podcast helping burned out pet parents who feel stuck with
their pup. Finally, let go of the guilt,
learn to communicate and build the bond you've always dreamed
(00:20):
of through a partnership based approach that combines training,
nutrition, and enrichment instead of chasing the quick
fixes that don't actually work. I'm Anne and in this episode
you'll learn why pet loss grief is real and valid, the
difference between anticipatory,acute, ambiguous,
disenfranchised, and complicatedgrief, and how to honor your pet
(00:43):
with simple rituals, reflective writing, and creative memorials
without a timeline or the pressure to move on.
Because healing isn't forgetting, it's finding a new
way to love. For welcome Anne Marie, who is
an author. She sent me a wonderful book
called Healing Wisdom for Pet Loss, an animals lover's Guide
to grief. This is her book, so you
(01:04):
definitely need to check this out.
We're going to just jump right in here at the beginning.
Tell us what inspired you to write Healing Wisdom for Pet
Loss. Was it personal?
Was it clinic? Was it something else entirely?
Mixture of. Everything.
It wasn't one thing, except I would say maybe the one final
thing that put me over the pointwhere I said I think I really
(01:25):
need to write this book was the fact that I was hearing so many
stories from clients about theirloss of their pet and was not
being validated. And that was just like, whoa.
And then I kept thinking about more and more issues with this
loss and the fact that it's, youknow, really a disenfranchised
(01:48):
loss because it's not really validated in our society as well
as it should be, in my opinion. Yes, there are definitely people
out there that will understand it and you can talk to them
about it and they get it. But I think the overwhelming
majority are folks that just don't want to talk about it and
they don't feel validated. So they don't want to talk about
(02:08):
it because they don't want to feel like they're being listened
to truly. So that was the big reason I'm
hearing those stories about the loss in the life of their
beloved pet was just overwhelming.
Like I, I got to make this more recognized.
And so I think the best way is to write a book and get it out
there to as many people as possible.
You've. Supported a lot of people
(02:29):
through the pain of losing a beloved animal.
What do you wish more people understood about pet loss and
the way it shows up in our lives?
Oh, important, this losses and it needs to be grieved fully and
to be it really needs to be understood.
And with that, I, I think it would go along that if it's
understood, there would be more compassionate help for it.
(02:51):
And people would really get the fact that this is a pet that's
been in your life maybe for many, many years, maybe a short
amount of time. But regardless of the amount of
time, they've had an impact on our lives, a huge impact.
They're really a part of the fabric of our being.
We get up with them, we start our day with them, we end our
day with them and all the times in between.
(03:13):
And so it's, it's a huge amount,I'm sure as a pet lover, they
bring unconditional love. And it's really, it's, it's
really a pure love. It's pure and non judgmental.
I think that's just like awesome.
I mean, wow, it's pure and they do not judge us, you know?
So it's like, wow, it's a perfect basis for our
(03:34):
relationship. Do you think that that is why so
many people don't understand petloss?
Like the people that don't have pet pets in their home, they
don't understand the loss because they don't feel that
pure unbridled love the way thatwe do.
I think that that's part of it. They never really had that
relationship in their life, so it's hard for them to to
(03:57):
understand it. But it doesn't mean you can't
learn nothing about it and try to understand it.
Especially if you have a partneror a good friend that has one
that they've lost, you can at least try to understand it by
asking them some questions like wow, I just didn't realize that
this would have this much impactfor you when you lost your pet.
Can you help me understand it? Can you share something with me?
(04:20):
Because I really want to understand it.
Hopefully that would be something that maybe you would
encounter somebody that really wants to understand but doesn't
and they're open to hearing about it.
And then of course, you, you mayexperience the opposite, which
would be very sad and difficult.Or someone just says, come on,
just get over. It was just a dog.
(04:40):
It was just a cat. Come on.
You can get another one. Well, you absolutely can get
another one, but it will not be the same one I.
Think that's where a lot of people get lost.
We're just starting to really validate the dogs, cats, pets
are unique individuals. They have their own thoughts and
their own personalities. And I think that a lot of
people, especially people who'venever had that deep of a
(05:03):
relationship with the pet, they just don't see that and they
don't respect it. And so they don't understand
that losing a pet is just like losing a family member in that
aspect. It's like you said, part of your
day, part of your routine, part of the ritual that you go
through. And it is such a beautiful,
unconditional relationship that it, it really, I think it cuts a
(05:25):
lot deeper than even, I'm going to say it, losing a human
sometimes because with humans there's always conditions,
there's always stipulations, there's always anger and hurt
feelings and maybe a little bit of tension or we don't talk for
a while. There's there's ups and downs in
our relationships. We don't have that with our
(05:46):
pets. And so I feel like people who
have never really felt like theywere connected to people that
deeply like me, who love animalsvery, very deeply, is because we
have that really thick connection that our pets bring
to us. And they fill us with so much
joy, without judgment, without shame, without fear, and all of
those things. Yeah, I agree.
(06:08):
That's a lot of good points you brought up because like I said,
I think that the biggest thing is there isn't that judgment
there. They don't care if your hair is
is pink or white or you're tall or you're short or you're thin
or you're heavy, whatever. They just want to be with you
and they're not out there to judge you.
That's that's, that's the biggest thing.
(06:28):
And their love for you is not going to keep changing unless
you know, there's abuse there oranything like that, of course,
but that's a whole other story. We won't get into that.
Your book highlights different types of grief, like
antispiratorial grief, disenfranchised grief.
Can you walk us through what those are, what they mean, and
(06:49):
why they matter? Sure.
No matter what you go through inlife, if you be informed about
whatever it is, it helps you getthrough it better.
So it's better to be out there and not be in the dark about
something. All these types of grief are
common in any type of loss that you have, even if it's a loss of
a job, a loss of your health. It's not just about pet loss.
(07:10):
So you can kind of use these forany type of grief you may be
going through at the time. What's really interesting about
anticipatory grief is that you've got some time the plan,
whereas you wouldn't have it if it was a sudden Moss, like for
example, a car accident or something like that, a tragic
accident. So I'm just with Tory grief, I
(07:31):
think it's something we need to really be grateful for.
Embrace it. Yes, we're going to have all the
sadness knowing that the end result is going to be we're
going to be losing our pet. But we can plan when we're kind
of more in a stable frame of mind and not like overwhelmed by
the immediate loss. So it's an opportunity to make
plans for what you want to do after your pet dies, if you're
(07:55):
going to have their remains cremated or if you're going to
bury them or scared of the rashes.
So you can plan for that. You can plan for exactly how you
want to honor them afterwards. And then you can also think
about a lot of other ways as youmove through the grief, because
you may have an idea now what you want to do to honor their
memory, but you're going to havea lot more ideas later.
(08:16):
It's just an opportunity to planfor the time when they will
actually pass on. And then there's the acute
grief. That's the immediate grief that
you have right after the loss. You're going to have maybe some
symptoms in your, your body where you're restless, you can't
sleep, you don't feel like eating.
So you're going to have the, thebodily symptoms, you're going to
(08:39):
have the physical symptoms. Maybe you're really angry
because maybe you thought you should have done something
differently and you didn't. So there could be some anger
there. And like I said, the bodily
symptoms, which can be, you know, anything ranging from, you
know, asleep, not eating, not able to function.
If you come to that point where you're not able to get up in the
morning and function, if this goes on continually for a long
(09:01):
time, you get into complicated grief.
And that can be where you reallyneed to seek out some additional
professional help to get you through this.
And it should be no shame in that.
It's a difficult loss. There's no timeline for grief.
Actually, there's no timeline for it.
So it's not like you're going tosay, oh, I should be over this
in six months. No, it doesn't work that way.
It kind of ebbs and flows too. So you can think you're doing
(09:23):
pretty good now. Oh, a couple months have gone by
and then all of a sudden something hit you and it's like,
wow, something came back like a trigger, something that made you
think of this casting of your pet and it just overwhelms you.
It's going to be a process whereebbs and flows.
It takes time, there's no timeline.
But if it does become something that's overwhelming to you,
(09:44):
we're not able to function in your daily life, then it's a red
flag to maybe seek out some professional help.
So the other types of grief we've talked about anticipatory
acute so far, there's ambiguous loss.
That's a loss where there's a lot of uncertainty about the
death. Maybe the gate was left open and
then your pet took off and don'tknow where to be found.
(10:07):
And maybe you you never find them.
So there's always this uncertainty of what happened to
my pet. It could be something like that
or could be a case where I went through with my dog Wishbone.
He had cognitive dysfunction, which is a doggy dementia.
So we lost him like he was physically present in our life
(10:28):
until the day he died. So he was physically present,
but he was emotionally not as there for us.
It's just like a person that hasAlzheimer's or any kind of
dementia. So they're they're physically
the present in your day-to-day life, but they they're not
really fulfilling the emotional part of what you need from them.
(10:48):
So that's what it wasn't Wishbone.
We we decided that we were goingto let him leave on his own
terms after we discussed it withour vet.
And as long as he wasn't in painand he continued to eat and we
could take him for walks, we felt that it was OK, we're going
to just let him go on his own time.
But if anything changed then, you know, maybe would have
changed our minds. So he, he died peacefully and he
(11:09):
actually just started stop eating and drinking.
And the next day he, he passed. So it was difficult because we
just felt, let's just let him goon his own terms and he still
would give us love. He would sit in our laps and we
would be able to pet him and he seemed to respond to it.
So as long as he was doing that and wasn't in pain and he was
able to walk around and go for walks, we decided to try that
(11:33):
route and we're glad we did. So that's ambiguous loss.
A couple features of that. And then we talked briefly about
complicated loss a few minutes ago.
And that's, that's the one whereyou need to to be aware that if
it's comes to the point where you're not functioning and your
day-to-day activities, you need to seek out some professional
help on that. So I think we've covered all the
(11:53):
types of grief, but there's another one that's called
discrepant grief. It's actually when there's one
person or people and that don't understand it and you're going
through all this immense, immense grief.
So it's kind of like a discrepancy over the grief
because somebody else is thinking, why are you having
such a difficult time? I'm still carrying out on my
(12:14):
life and that's fine because we're all different and that's
the way you handle it and this is the way I'm handling it.
So there's that discrepancy in the grief that could be in the
same household. Important for people to
understand these types of grief.Well, in the beginning, I think
I mentioned that it's good to beinformed of what's going on in
(12:34):
your life. Whether you have a diagnosis of
something yourself personally, you're going to want to
understand as much as you can about whatever that disorder is
or diagnosis, because that's going to help you to understand
it better and know what you can do to help yourself and know
what the medical profession can do maybe to help help you.
So it's having an understanding of clarity in your life.
(12:58):
So that's why it's important to understand the whole idea of
grief and loss and the differentcomponents of it so you don't
feel like, Oh my God, this is awful.
Why am I feeling like this? Well, I understand that that's
something that comes along with this type of grief and you just
have a better understanding of it.
I really liked about your book was that it's designed to meet
people wherever they are. It's not necessarily meant to be
(13:21):
read front to back. Why was that flexibility
important to you when you were writing it?
Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up because that's one of the
topics I'd like to start out with too.
So that's why the book has the title and Animal Lovers Guide to
Grief. I'm, I'm thinking about all the
different topics I wanted to include in the book and what I
wanted to cover. And I really wanted to talk
(13:41):
about the relationship we have with our pet, the history of the
human animal bond. And I said, wow, but I gotta
wrap this up and make it understandable to people.
Like why is that in there for well, the reason it's in there
and I included is because it's important to understand the bond
that we have with our pets so that we can say, wow, I really
(14:04):
understand now why this grief isreally affecting me because I
truly do have a deep bond with my pet.
You can read about the history of that and how it evolved over
history. You can understand how they help
heal us in our lives. The dogs that are are utilized
for pet assisted therapy. They're they're healing for us.
(14:24):
They provide so many benefits toour life.
So now that that we understand that we can fully understand why
we're grieving with this loss like we are.
So I wanted to put that in thereso not to read it necessarily.
If you just bought the book because you had a loss, I
mentioned in that guide how to use this book, You might want to
(14:46):
start with anticipatory grief and understanding that and start
planning for this loss that's going to happen.
On the other hand, if you pickedit up, because I would suggest
every pet parent to actually buythis book or have somebody gift
to them because they do have a pet that someday unfortunately
will leave us. And so you could start reading
that part about the human will bond now and if you have have a
(15:10):
clearer understanding of how they help heal us through animal
assisted therapy and so on. So it's good to get now when you
do adopt A pet or bring a pet into your life in whatever way
you do, a lot of good information, I think in there to
help you better understand the grief.
So that's why I decided to go with the Guide to Grief.
I really like that you can jump back and forth to topics and
(15:32):
have support where you need it. I thought that was really,
really neat. It was not what I was expecting
as I sat down thinking, I'm going to read this book.
And then I was like, oh, wait, Idon't have to do it like this.
And so it was really neat to be able to kind of jump around and
and experience different parts of your book as I was ready to
either reflect or move forward or think about my current
(15:54):
situation by current dogs. It was really, really neat
aspect of your book. I really like that.
Everything that really stood out.
Yeah, you're welcome. Another thing that really stood
out was the reflective writing and the creative props.
What kind of healing have you seen come from those journaling
exercises in yourself or your clients?
(16:14):
If I could just step back on thethe guidebook idea for a moment,
I'd appreciate that too. The only thing is, if you just
lost your pet and you pick up this book, I would suggest you
go right to the section on taking care of yourself because
if you're just feeling completely overwhelmed by this
whole situation, it's important to read about things to help you
(16:36):
take care of yourself now beforeyou get into some of the other
areas of the book. What was your follow up
question, please? The.
Use of reflective writing and creative prompts and what kind
of healing you've seen come fromthem.
A lot of people like to keep journals and they find it very,
very helpful. And a lot of people don't want
anything to do with it. And that's fine.
But I would put it in the book prompts that relate to the loss
(16:59):
of your pet or your whole relationship with your pet.
And because it can be very, veryhealing, it can make you, the
idea is to reflect on those and at a quiet place in your home
and a quiet place in your life. And there's things you can do to
get yourself in the mood to before you start doing these
exercises. You can do a little bit of
(17:21):
visualization of your pet, closing your eyes, listening to
some soft music and just visualizing your relationship
with your pet and what your pet meant to you.
And then you can do one of the appropriate reflective
experiences because they're after each chapter.
So depending on what chapter maybe you just read or want to
get into, you want to do that maybe first, or maybe you want
(17:43):
to skip around and do a different one.
That's perfectly OK. So just the act of writing and
getting our thoughts in order can be very healing in general
for a lot of people. And I also suggested that you
maybe want to go out and get a special notebook, something you
can decorate, something that it's got a nice cover on it, not
just your basics dental notebookor whatever.
(18:05):
Something that you can really you can keep and reflect on all
your writings at a later time, maybe after a year, maybe I'm
the anniversary of the death of your pet, you might want to go
back and reflect on some of those things that you wrote.
And it's just kind of like, I don't know, I just ran, ran
across a few letters that I had.I was surprised I still kept
(18:26):
them. Or here's a here's an example.
I had some letters that my mom wrote to me.
She's passed on many years ago when I was in college.
I says, wow, I kept these. I was going through some things
and I, I started reading them. It just meant so much to me to
read her words and what she said.
So that reflection brought me some peace in knowing that all
(18:46):
the love that she had for me andso on.
So it's the same idea. You're really, you're reflecting
on the loss of your pet and whatyour pet meant to you and the
fun times you shared. And you'd be surprised.
It brings a smile to your face. And so by doing that, it brings
good endorphins into your body. Those are the feel good
hormones. And it just makes you feel like,
(19:07):
oh, wow, whenever I talk about my dogs, Jazzy and Wishbone, I
just get all excited and I startsmiling.
It's like, wow, I feel good. I love to look at their
pictures. I'm slipping through a book I
have of pictures of Wishbone on my first Jack Russell.
And I was just like so many happy memories.
And so I, you know, I felt good.So that's why it's good to have
(19:29):
those exercises that you do and then go back at a later date and
reflect on. So have it, have a nice
notebook, put it away and keep it.
And I would suggest looking through it again at maybe the
1st anniversary, maybe after sixmonths.
That's what I would suggest for those.
I think it'd be very healing. I love that idea.
(19:50):
I've worked with a pet loss grief counselor myself
personally. We've had her on the the podcast
before and it's something that'sbeen really, really incredible
for me. And because I held on to a lot
of guilt from some previous petsthat I lost, it was really
healing. And one of the prompts that's in
your book is something, an exercise that she had me do,
which is. Get a letter from your pet.
(20:11):
Yeah. And it's just such a cool
experience, right? Because it makes you think back
to how your pet looks at you andhow your pet thought about you.
And you remember all of those things, like you were saying,
all of the adventures that you had, all of the things that you
did together and how they lookedat you and how they responded
when you came home. So tell me how that idea came to
(20:32):
you. And how do people, Cuz I know
how I felt when my counselor asked me to do this, but how do
people typically respond do thatexercise?
Some people don't really want toget into that and I respect
that, but what I say to them then is OK, that's fine.
Maybe right now you don't want to do that, but keep an open
mind that maybe you want to check that out a little later,
(20:55):
go back to it and revisit it because I think it can be very
healing and then some people areright on board with it.
I've had actually some emails from people I don't even know
that have specifically mentionedthose exercises as being helpful
to them and why it was helpful. They had nice little extra thing
to know that people are are benefiting from that.
(21:17):
I'm glad to hear that. I love that people have written
you letters and told you about that.
That's so cool. What a neat response to your
book to get letters from people and and hear that response.
What a beautiful thing to share with people that you don't even
know. Like how cool is that?
That's so cool. It's very, very rewarding.
I just, I just love that. It just kind of validates for me
(21:40):
that, wow, my book has made a difference.
And it, that's what I, that's what I wanted.
The whole purpose of writing this book was to help people.
They see it on the shelf in the bookstore or they see it at
someplace else and they think, wow, I didn't know there was a
book on that. This one looks interesting.
And they flip through it and they buy it and they send me a
comment or review and it's like,oh, wow.
(22:01):
I'm just so happy to know that I've made a difference in
people's lives by helping them out through this loss because
it's just more and more common. There's, I think more and more
people have more than one dog intheir household.
And like I said, they're a part,they're a part of their life,
their daily life for sure. So it's been very rewarding
experience. I love that for you.
(22:21):
I love it so much. I think it's just a really,
really neat thing, especially inan area where we don't talk
about it and there is so much pressure, like you said, to move
on after losing a pet. So with that being said, how can
people honor their grief while still creating a new kind of
peace? Like your top tips?
Right after your pet dies, I would suggest, I just love this
(22:44):
idea of lighting a candle. If you don't want to use a real
candle, you could, you know, battery operated.
But to put that candle someplacewhere you're going to see it and
a picture of your pet that you just lost and just spend some
time there as you're going through these different feelings
of loss. Just sit there and close your
eyes and just think about something in particular that
(23:05):
really brought so much joy to your life.
And then open your eyes and lookat the picture of your dog and
that candle bringing there and knowing that they'll always be a
part of your life because they live on it through the memories
that we have with them. Choose something in the book or
on your own or a combination of what's in the book and what you
think of to honor your pet on the anniversary in particular of
(23:30):
their death would be a good time, maybe their birthday, if
you had a birthday celebration for them.
You can do something special. You can make a donation like if
your dog died of a particular disease or disorder, I think
that's a great way to honor them.
Make a dog donation if you're able to, to an organization that
is researching that. And there are places like that.
(23:51):
Also, if your dog was maybe a senior dog, maybe you want to
make a donation. Well, eventually they're all
going to be senior dogs. But what I mean by that is if
that's something you want to like, focus on getting out the
information about the importanceof adopting senior dogs as well
as just puppies. They can offer us so much in
their later years as well. So any way that you could honor
(24:11):
your pet by some of the ways that I mentioned in my book, I
think are good. Jumping off point or your own
ideas I think would be helping your healing process for sure.
I think those are all great ideas.
One of the things is really important to memorialize your
pet in that way because you can carry that forward with you.
Even though they can't necessarily physically be there
(24:32):
with you, you can carry their memory forward with you.
I think that's why a lot of people like to create Instagram
pages for their dogs because it's a memory log of all of the
things that they did with their dog and all of the things that
they went through. So it's really important to do
those things and to have those memories and those places that
you can go back and, and look upon and think, Oh yeah, this is
(24:52):
something that, like you said, maybe it's a particular kind of
rescue. Well, he made me think of this
or he made me do that. Or maybe it's a specific kind of
charity. Maybe your dog was really good
with kids and so you donate to some kind of educational area in
the for kids. I just think that there's so
many things that you can do to help just spread that love that
(25:13):
your dog would have spread. It's a beautiful thing that we
can do. And listen, there's so many
things and there's memorial rock.
We have a memorial rock in our in our garden with a little
statue of a Jack Russell terriernext to it.
And we have which phones name onit and a cute little saying that
we used to always say you see itevery day you go out in the yard
(25:34):
because it's there and maybe puta flower there too, you know,
little planted flowers. So yeah, this is endless amount
of ways you can do memorial ideas.
And it's it's so good for you too, because you get that.
It's almost like it's relief, but it's also that all of the
good that comes back with the the going through the memories
and all of that. So yeah, it's really, really
(25:56):
important to honor that and to. Find.
Ways to bring it into your life.Let's pretend that you're
talking to someone right now whojust lost their pet.
Just lost their pet like 2 minutes ago and they have no
idea where to start. What would you want them to hear
the most from you today? You're not alone in your grief.
(26:18):
I think that's really powerful. You are not alone in your grief.
I'm here. I'm here to listen.
Lots of times it's a matter of just being there.
It's not like you're giving all of these words out to them.
You're being quiet. You're opening up the door so
they can step in because now they know that their grief is
recognized and they're not alonebecause you're right there.
(26:42):
Even if you're not there in person, if you're talking over
the phone, those words just saying you're not alone, I'm
here for you. And then you let them talk and
you truly listen. Sometimes it's just like I said,
it's not a lot of our words thatwe have to say.
We have to listen. That's what's really important
and knowing we're there for them.
(27:02):
So that's what I would say and Iwould say it's important right
now now for you to take care of yourself because this is a
really difficult loss. And I would maybe ask them, OK,
so it just happened. Were you able to make some plans
ahead of time? Was the sudden I wouldn't delve
a little bit into that, but I would keep it more listening to
them first and not overwhelming them with too much information
(27:26):
because they just kept the wow, I just lost my dog.
He or she is not here anymore. So they kept the kind of like,
get that, like belief that they really are gone.
And then they have to acknowledge it.
Yes, he's not coming back anymore.
She's not coming back anymore. They've left this world.
That's what I think. But you are not alone.
(27:48):
And that's what I tried to really put in the book.
You're not alone in this grief. Others care and to reach out
when it gets become, when it be,it's so overwhelming that you
don't know what to do and you'renot eating, you're not sleeping.
It's becoming so overwhelming where you can't even do those
things. So reach out for help.
There are people that understandand care.
(28:08):
There absolutely are. What would your advice be if
somebody was struggling and theywere not sure if they should
start with a book, start with a community group, or start with
professional help? I think it's going to be
something that they might have to try one thing or another
thing of those three choices that you mentioned and see what
might work from them. If they are somebody that tends
(28:30):
to gravitate toward reading a lot, get a lot of their
information from reading, I would suggest maybe reading the
book first. If there's somebody that more
likes to be in front of somebodyand talk to them, I would
suggest they reach out to somebody and and speak to them.
So I think it just depends on what has worked for you in the
past. If you're somebody, like I said,
who's a reader, the book might be good.
(28:53):
And then once you've digested some of the things in there, you
can talk to somebody about some of those topics that are in the
book. I know I do that with a lot of
clients that are coming to me for a pet grief and loss.
I might suggest they read something that I send them to
read or parts of the book and then say, now we'll talk about
that further. Or what part do you want to
(29:15):
focus on in the book that you read that you have some
questions about? Kind of like what we're doing
here. It would just depend on the
person and how they have generally found help for issues
in their life in the past. Is it talking a lot?
Reading couple of good ways. Great.
Before we wrap up to date, tell everybody a little bit about the
Rochester Center for Pet Loss and Grief.
(29:37):
Tell everybody a little bit about where they can find you
and a little bit about what you specialize and how they can
contact you. The Rochester Center for Pet
Grief and Loss is something thatI started, that it's all virtual
now, what I do with that aspect of my practice.
I wanted to highlight pet grief and loss as something that
(29:57):
people can get help for if they wanted it.
So I wanted to put that out there and promote that and I
kind of wanted to focus on that title as opposed to my other
practice, which is counseling connections.
So I wanted to take out that if anybody felt like I don't need
counseling for this, if they sawcounseling connections, they
(30:18):
might think that that's like a mental health.
I don't have a mental health problem.
Incidentally, grief is not pathological conditions, but
it's important to talk about it with a comp trained counselor if
that's what will be helpful for you.
I just wanted to bring that awareness out there that there
is such a thing as people who dowork with people that have lost
(30:38):
their pets and it's not something that should be hidden.
And this really put it out thereto the public that they can see
the name of this Rochester Center for Pet Grief and Loss.
Wow, I'm really dealing with this loss and I need some help.
Maybe I can contact the person that has this business.
That's why I did it like that. I still have the constant
connections practice as well. I specialize in grief and loss.
(31:02):
Over the years I've done all types of constant for all
different types of conditions, but over the past maybe 15
years, I've specialized more in grief and loss, and then I got
more specific into pet grief andMoss as well.
I felt there was a huge need forthat and I wanted to bring that
service to the community. Incredible.
How long have you been working in this community?
(31:24):
This is actually my second career.
I started out as a teacher many years ago and then I went back
for another master's degree, which was in mental health
counseling. That was like 16 years ago.
So I've been in the field for 16years with the mental health
counseling and have had additional training in grief and
loss as a grief educator. There was additional training
(31:45):
and specifically in pet loss counseling trained professional
and that as well. And then of course, writing the
book and constantly doing research and learning constantly
about all the different things that are involved with grief and
loss and pets in general. So it's just a huge field about
the importance just having pets in our lives and training them
(32:06):
in the pet assisted therapy area.
That's huge. I've done some volunteer work in
that in the past too. So just kind of came 360 circle
and focusing more and more just on pet grief and Moss and the
whole pet world. Just kind of being more
awareness to the disenfranchisedgrief and helping even employers
to know that this is a real grief that they're could be some
(32:31):
time off for work for. Because I I've also worked with
individuals that weren't able totake time off of their work,
only take maybe a couple hours off.
They had their pet euthanized and they had to go back to work.
And it was just really, really difficult.
And the person feeling like theycan't share this with their
(32:51):
fellow workers because they're going to feel shame and they
feel like, oh wow, why are you feeling so bad?
You can get another dog like I said earlier, and isn't the same
dog. Oh, the person after a while
finally breaks down at work and sobs and fellow employees say,
what's going on? Why you so sad for what's going
(33:11):
on? Oh, nothing, I'll be OK.
I just got the sniffles and theydon't share it.
Or maybe they finally do and they get somebody that comes
back with either a very understanding response to it or
the opposite. And so you never know what
you're going to get. So I'm just trying to bring more
awareness to the community. I've done some speaking on this
topic, the importance of recognizing this grief and
(33:33):
allowing some time for your employees to have time off and
being open to that possibility because it's a loss, whether
it's a human or a pet in your life, it's still a loss.
So if we're going to give time off for a human loss, we need to
give time off for a pet loss because that's a valid A valid
loss. So that's why I want the
(33:55):
community know that this is a valid loss and needs to be
acknowledged and validated just like any other loss, to share
something very positive too. I know one person in particular
told me when they lost their pet, wow, it was like amazing.
It was like, that's the way it should be, just like a human
loss. What do people do for a human
loss? They generally bring over food.
(34:17):
They might send flowers, they might send cards.
OK, well, it's no different witha pet loss.
And so this person experienced that the neighbors were bringing
over food, they were bringing over flowers, whatever, and they
got it. And it was like, wow, this is
great. It's like this validation that
people get it. It's just like heartwarming to
(34:38):
me. So heartwarming.
It's like, yes, yes, I'm going to keep trying to get that word
out there and do my part to havethis loss truly validated and
honored. Well, thank you so much for
doing what you're doing. I love normalizing hard topics
and you are out there fighting areally big battle with this one,
so I appreciate it. Thank you so much for taking the
(34:59):
time to chat with me today and tell everybody about your book.
What would you like to leave ourlisteners with today?
My book is filled with a lot of compassion and understanding for
this topic, and I hope that you can purchase it or purchase it
for somebody else. You know, that's good a deal
with deal with this loss becauseevery pet owner, every pet will
have to deal with this loss. They come into our lives and
(35:22):
we're, we're we're so happy and thrilled and that's a happy
time. But then when they leave us,
which they do, they, they will leave us.
And that's the saddest part of the journey with our pet.
So my book or any other, the book that you choose can be
helpful to read. I wrote this with a lot of love
and the intention to try to helpothers that are afraid to not
(35:45):
afraid Now they feel like I don't think I can go and talk to
somebody just right now. Maybe I will someday, but right
now I just need some other kind of help.
Well, I think you might find some of that help in this book,
and I hope you do, because you're not alone in your grief.
You are not alone and you can absolutely feel the love in this
book. So you guys heard her Spread
joy. Be kind and buy the book.
(36:07):
If you've been feeling like no one really understands what
you're going through with your dog, it can feel really
isolating and heavy carrying allthat weight by yourself day
after day. That's why I created a free
community, a safe space where you can share the hard stuff,
get support, and be surrounded by people who truly get it.
(36:27):
You'll find the link in the shownotes below.
Thank you for listening to Straight Up Dog Talk.
Remember, new episodes drop every Monday and Wednesday.
See you next time.
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