A Year After Birth: Holistic Insights for Postpartum Wellness

Navigating Postpartum: Challenges, Successes, and Holistic Approaches   In this special episode of 'The 80/20 Holistic Home' podcast, Felicia reflects on her journey through her third baby's first year, covering personal experiences with breastfeeding challenges, postpartum struggles, and balancing life with multiple children. She also shares holistic practices that significantly improved her pregnancy and postpartum recovery, including chiropractic care, intentional nutrition, red light therapy, homeopathics, and more.   Tune in for practical insights and holistic tips for a more harmonious postpartum experience.   00:00 Welcome to The 80/20 Holistic Home 00:37 A Special Episode: My Son's First Birthday 01:24 Breastfeeding Journeys: Challenges and Triumphs 04:50 Postpartum Reflections: Stress and Surprises 12:26 Holistic Approaches: Nutrition and Care 22:06 Planning for Postpartum Success 27:45 Final Thoughts and Positive Takeaways  

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
Welcome to the 80, 20 holistic home, the podcast that empowers you to live a healthier low tox life while embracing the beauty of balance.
Here, we dive into practical ways to reduce toxins in your home, nurture your body and mind with holistic wellness practices and create a life that feels as good as it looks without the pressure to be perfect.
.999Join us as we create homes that nurture our wellbeing, support our families and leave room for the joy of living with ease, because when you focus on the.

(00:28):
80 percent that truly matters.
The rest falls into place.
Welcome to the 80, 20 holistic home.
This week is a special episode.
I knew when I started the podcast, like this was one of my first episodes that I had locked into my schedule for this week specifically, this week is my son's birthday.
first birthday.

(00:48):
So this is marking, now I have a one year old, my kind of last infant.
This is likely going to be your last baby.
My last infant is turning one. 13 00:00:55,874.999 --> 00:01:01,175 We're done with all like the month milestones and I've been postpartum now for one whole year. 14 00:01:01,534.999 --> 00:01:03,574.999 So I have a lot of thoughts and a lot to reflect on.
And I thought I would just kind of talk through that and share some things that I did differently through this You know, pregnancy, birth, the postpartum journey and reflect on some of that today.

(01:13):
.999It's funny because even though as a third time mom you know, pregnancy and postpartum is such a unique journey. 17 00:01:20,854.999 --> 00:01:24,934.9995 I mean, there's a lot of similarities, but there's every journey is so unique. 18 00:01:24,934.9995 --> 00:01:34,635 And this one definitely, definitely was With my second, the first thing that kind of jumps out at me when I think back, the first thing that like was different it is, it was breastfeeding.

(01:34):
I struggled with my first, we had some breastfeeding up and downs.
We saw a lot of location consultants. 21 00:01:40,654.999 --> 00:01:41,844.998 I did triple feeding. 22 00:01:41,844.999 --> 00:01:44,14.998 I was pumping, we had a hard time latching. 23 00:01:44,14.998 --> 00:01:44,874.9985 She wasn't getting enough. 24 00:01:44,874.9985 --> 00:01:45,794.998 She wasn't gaining weight. 25 00:01:46,224.998 --> 00:01:47,704.998 And so that was really tough. 26 00:01:47,714.998 --> 00:01:50,844.999 And we eventually got to where we were breastfeeding really well. 27 00:01:50,864.999 --> 00:01:51,534.9985 But it took a while. 28 00:01:51,534.9985 --> 00:01:52,284.9985 It took a lot of work. 29 00:01:52,284.9985 --> 00:01:52,965.04825 It took a lot of time. 30 00:01:52,965.04825 --> 00:01:53,894.899 It took a lot of appointment. 31 00:01:53,944.999 --> 00:01:55,54.999 Added a lot of stress. 32 00:01:55,464.999 --> 00:02:01,914.999 And that was not something that I was hoping to repeat when I was actually going into having my second, that was the biggest thing on my mind. 33 00:02:01,924.998 --> 00:02:03,554.998 That was like, I'm going to nail it this time. 34 00:02:03,594.999 --> 00:02:05,94.999 I'm going to put so much effort into breastfeeding. 35 00:02:05,124.999 --> 00:02:07,744.999 I'm going to feed that baby around the clock at the beginning. 36 00:02:08,64.999 --> 00:02:13,634.999 Anytime she's so much as looks at me sideways, I'm feeding that baby to get my supply going and to get her latching. 37 00:02:14,304.999 --> 00:02:16,754.999 And my second was just such a natural breastfeeding. 38 00:02:16,754.999 --> 00:02:18,54.999 She had a great latch right away. 39 00:02:18,54.999 --> 00:02:20,724.999 I could tell the difference and she was feeding really well. 40 00:02:20,724.999 --> 00:02:26,334.999 And she actually gained back up to her birth weight within like one week, which is can be rare for a breastfed baby. 41 00:02:26,434.999 --> 00:02:27,894.999 So we had a great journey. 42 00:02:27,924.998 --> 00:02:32,894.999 And so then with my third, I just kind of had this feeling of like, well, I figured that out. 43 00:02:32,944.999 --> 00:02:33,954.999 I know how to do that. 44 00:02:33,954.999 --> 00:02:37,934.999 Well, just beat them a lot in the beginning and it'll all work out. 45 00:02:37,934.999 --> 00:02:39,724.999 But of course, that's not really what happened. 46 00:02:39,744.999 --> 00:02:40,764.998 We had some curve balls. 47 00:02:41,144.999 --> 00:02:49,844.999 He actually was very lip and tongue tied, which I didn't even really know of those things when I had my first two, I think they've gotten a lot of popularity in more recent years.

(02:49):
I mean, of course they've been a thing, right.
But I just didn't know about them.
And I actually have no idea if my girls are lip and tongue tied, but he was latching, but I could feel that it didn't feel quite as like strong.
And he, it seemed like he was getting enough from my perspective, you know, he, it felt like he was like on long enough and he was active and he wasn't sleepy.

(03:11):
Like my first was when she was on.
So from my perspective, it felt like things were.
Going well, but we had our first couple of weight checks.
.001He wasn't gaining, he was gaining, but not quite at the rate that I think, my midwife and our pediatrician were looking for. 56 00:03:28,930.001 --> 00:03:32,260.0005 And we see really natural, crunchy, holistic minded people. 57 00:03:32,260.0005 --> 00:03:34,319.999 So I was I trusted their opinion here.

(03:34):
I think sometimes.
A lot of the medical community could get really hung up on those weight numbers.
.999And I think that's what happened with my first as we put a little bit too much into that weight and then add a lot of stress to me, not to say that it would, you know, we didn't end up in a good spot and that I think weight is not important at all, but it just felt like it was the only thing we were looking at and there was no I don't know nuance there. 61 00:03:55,739.999 --> 00:04:01,949.998 But yes, the people, my providers that I've chosen for my third that I really trusted we're showing a little bit of concern. 62 00:04:01,949.999 --> 00:04:04,259.9985 So we ended up doing a lot of things. 63 00:04:04,259.9985 --> 00:04:05,289.999 We did some body work. 64 00:04:05,289.999 --> 00:04:06,699.998 We did craniosacral therapy. 65 00:04:06,699.999 --> 00:04:08,89.999 We were doing chiropractic. 66 00:04:08,529.998 --> 00:04:11,329.999 We did we had the lip and tongue tie evaluated. 67 00:04:11,339.999 --> 00:04:14,149.999 I was seeing an IBCLC all the stuff. 68 00:04:14,179.999 --> 00:04:26,899.999 And it was, again, it just added a lot of appointments, which when you are, Postpartum and you're trying to juggle kids and sleep schedules and a newborn and hauling them around all these appointments. 69 00:04:26,899.999 --> 00:04:31,249.999 The lactation consultant actually came to my house, which was nice, but hauling them around to all these appointments. 70 00:04:31,249.999 --> 00:04:34,469.998 It just, it felt a little bit more like my experience with my first. 71 00:04:34,469.999 --> 00:04:38,989.999 And I wasn't expecting that I was expecting things to go smoothly because I was, so much more experience now. 72 00:04:38,989.999 --> 00:04:40,379.999 And I knew so much more about breastfeeding. 73 00:04:40,379.999 --> 00:04:40,919.999 I had done it. 74 00:04:41,279.999 --> 00:04:41,949.999 I checked the box. 75 00:04:41,949.999 --> 00:04:46,629.998 I did it well with my second, we had a beautiful breastfeeding experience in the beginning. 76 00:04:46,629.999 --> 00:04:46,959.999 So. 77 00:04:47,499.999 --> 00:04:50,329.999 That was kind of tough to deal with. 78 00:04:50,499.999 --> 00:05:01,979.999 Mentally it was adding a lot of stress and we did end up having to start triple feeding again just to kind of make sure that he was getting that little extra bit and getting topped off and to make sure that it wasn't like an input issue. 79 00:05:02,489.999 --> 00:05:10,359.899 In addition to the weight, that wasn't the only metric we were looking at, right? In addition to not gaining quite as quickly as one would hope, he also was not pooping. 80 00:05:11,229.899 --> 00:05:18,709.899 He had the initial meconium poops right after birth, but then he wasn't having consistent bowel movements after that. 81 00:05:18,759.899 --> 00:05:19,999.8995 So that was a bit of a concern. 82 00:05:20,569.8995 --> 00:05:28,404.8995 So we were doing all kinds of things also with like the body work and the chiropractic, and then also you know, stimulating the area and trying to get him to go. 83 00:05:28,874.8995 --> 00:05:32,644.8995 And it just it felt very much like my experience with my first and it was really stressful. 84 00:05:32,644.8995 --> 00:05:40,74.8985 We ended up getting the lip and tongue tie revised which that was a little, but that was more traumatic than I had been anticipating. 85 00:05:40,374.8985 --> 00:05:47,574.8985 I think a lot of times that as yeah, we got our ties revised or crunchy like Facebook mom groups or online or an Instagram or whatever. 86 00:05:47,974.8985 --> 00:05:53,304.8985 People kind of mentioned that they have that happened and it's almost like a side note or something but it was like, oh my gosh. 87 00:05:53,929.8985 --> 00:05:54,819.8985 I had a really hard time. 88 00:05:54,819.8985 --> 00:05:55,859.8985 The baby was super fussy. 89 00:05:55,859.8985 --> 00:05:58,149.8985 And of course I'm like a week and a half postpartum. 90 00:05:58,149.8985 --> 00:05:59,659.8985 So I'm crying, he's crying. 91 00:05:59,979.8985 --> 00:06:07,929.898 I had to do the exercises like, Oh my gosh, you have to do them like six times a day, which basically is like moving their lip around and their tongue. 92 00:06:07,929.898 --> 00:06:09,699.8985 And of course they hate it and they cry. 93 00:06:09,699.8985 --> 00:06:13,989.899 So it's I was just like gearing myself up to listen to him cry six times a day. 94 00:06:13,989.899 --> 00:06:16,249.899 And it was another thing to keep track of. 95 00:06:16,249.899 --> 00:06:18,809.899 Like, did we do all the exercises today? So. 96 00:06:19,564.899 --> 00:06:24,914.899 That added a lot more stress to the beginning of my postpartum experience than I was anticipating. 97 00:06:24,914.899 --> 00:06:30,604.899 I thought that was just something we were going to nail, like, and I was open to other things being a challenge. 98 00:06:30,604.899 --> 00:06:32,434.898 I guess I knew that it's a challenging period. 99 00:06:32,434.899 --> 00:06:35,294.898 I had done it enough times to know that even when it's easy, it's not easy. 100 00:06:35,724.898 --> 00:06:38,774.898 But yeah, that just kind of rocked me a little bit and it was hard to keep up with. 101 00:06:39,284.898 --> 00:06:40,994.898 And I had put so much more. 102 00:06:41,244.898 --> 00:06:44,744.898 Stock this time into kind of planning for my postpartum period. 103 00:06:45,454.898 --> 00:06:52,124.898 So it felt like, well, my planning should have paid off and I should have had a really easy time and it didn't work out that way. 104 00:06:52,244.898 --> 00:06:56,324.898 So I think, when you have multiple kids, you know, that that's just kind of how it goes. 105 00:06:56,324.898 --> 00:07:00,884.897 Sometimes they're also different and they throw curve balls and wrenches into your plans. 106 00:07:00,984.897 --> 00:07:03,734.898 Yeah, so that was really, really stressful at the beginning. 107 00:07:03,784.898 --> 00:07:05,324.898 Another thing that. 108 00:07:05,979.898 --> 00:07:12,919.898 Surprised me about having this third baby was how I don't even, I can't even think of the right word. 109 00:07:12,919.898 --> 00:07:28,649.898 It wasn't hard to integrate back into our daily lives, but it was just, there was more moving parts and pieces in our life now, more so than even when we added our second, when we, so just the age gap between my kids, between my first and my second is about two and a half years. 110 00:07:28,669.898 --> 00:07:32,909.898 And then between the second and third, it's almost four years, closer to four years. 111 00:07:33,789.898 --> 00:07:39,349.898 So not that crazy different of an age gap, like a year, year and a half, but it felt really different. 112 00:07:39,349.898 --> 00:07:44,519.898 That age gap felt a lot bigger than the gap that we had between my first and my second. 113 00:07:44,519.898 --> 00:07:50,599.8985 And I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that when I had my second, my first was still a toddler. 114 00:07:50,619.8975 --> 00:07:51,879.8985 She was two and a half. 115 00:07:51,879.8985 --> 00:07:54,629.8985 So she was still, she still had a nap for a little bit. 116 00:07:55,9.8985 --> 00:07:58,209.8985 She she was potty trained, but she was still did pull ups at night. 117 00:07:58,639.8985 --> 00:08:00,19.8985 We were just more. 118 00:08:00,279.8985 --> 00:08:14,529.8985 There's not as big of a difference between an infant and a toddler and kind of your daily rhythms and your schedules and how you manage those kids than there is when you have a elementary school aged, an older toddler, and then an infant. 119 00:08:15,379.8975 --> 00:08:18,669.8985 When we, before we had him, you know, before we had our third baby. 120 00:08:18,874.8985 --> 00:08:22,934.8985 We, our two girls were they were both out of diapers, out of pull ups. 121 00:08:22,954.8985 --> 00:08:26,424.8985 They were nighttime trained, potty trained, nobody was taking naps. 122 00:08:26,454.8985 --> 00:08:32,514.8985 So we didn't have a lot of, like, that just gives a lot of ease back into your life, right? When you can come and go as you please, you don't have to plan around a nap time. 123 00:08:32,944.8985 --> 00:08:34,634.8975 You don't have to make sure you have diapers. 124 00:08:34,634.8985 --> 00:08:37,194.8975 You're not changing diapers stuff like that. 125 00:08:37,204.8975 --> 00:08:38,194.8985 Like your kids are older. 126 00:08:38,194.8985 --> 00:08:40,484.8985 You can reason with them, it's just different. 127 00:08:40,484.8985 --> 00:08:49,154.8985 So then when you it felt more of like, I want to say a step backward, but like back into a baby phase, it felt like a bigger step back. 128 00:08:49,154.8985 --> 00:08:51,84.8985 And it was more of a change to our life. 129 00:08:51,614.8985 --> 00:08:53,914.8985 So it was harder to juggle everybody's schedules. 130 00:08:53,974.8975 --> 00:08:57,764.8985 It was hard to have to deal with, especially a school schedule. 131 00:08:57,894.8985 --> 00:08:58,614.8995 There's so much that. 132 00:08:59,514.8995 --> 00:09:00,44.8995 It was surprised. 133 00:09:00,74.8995 --> 00:09:13,654.8995 This could be a whole episode topic of itself, but it was such a surprise to me when my oldest started going to like public school, how much there is to it as a parent and how much, how many spirit days you have to keep track of and the schedules. 134 00:09:13,654.8995 --> 00:09:14,864.8985 And sometimes there's early release. 135 00:09:14,894.8995 --> 00:09:21,154.8995 Like it's just going from when you have a kid in daycare and it's kind of the same all every day. 136 00:09:21,204.8995 --> 00:09:27,169.8995 Going to a public school schedule is just There's a lot more to track and there's a lot more mental load that comes along with that. 137 00:09:27,689.8995 --> 00:09:36,229.899 So having to do that on top of then also having a toddler in full time daycare and then also having an infant with their own unique schedule. 138 00:09:36,229.899 --> 00:09:36,799.8995 It was just a lot. 139 00:09:36,809.8985 --> 00:09:42,289.8995 It just felt like we were all in different directions and trying to like manage. 140 00:09:43,64.8995 --> 00:09:47,364.8995 Everybody's stuff and make sure everybody's needs are met was a lot more challenging. 141 00:09:47,374.8995 --> 00:10:01,544.8995 And I also, I didn't feel this as much when I had my second, and I don't know if it's because we just, it was easier to have the baby and the toddler together, or if I just didn't notice it because she wasn't As old. 142 00:10:01,584.8995 --> 00:10:02,34.8995 I don't know. 143 00:10:02,54.8995 --> 00:10:03,284.8995 I don't know what the difference was. 144 00:10:03,284.8995 --> 00:10:11,94.8995 I didn't feel this as much when I had my first and my second was that I missed my older kids because now we're doing, a lot of divide and conquer. 145 00:10:11,94.8995 --> 00:10:14,474.899 And my husband would take the older kids and do stuff with them. 146 00:10:14,474.899 --> 00:10:21,704.8995 When I was like at home with the baby or sleeping or, doing feeding around the clock or whatever it was, it was, it was a lot harder to carve out time. 147 00:10:22,4.8995 --> 00:10:34,104.8985 One on one time with the older kids or even two on one time, even to have both of them with me more so than it was when I had my first and my second, I don't remember not seeing my first a lot when I had my second. 148 00:10:34,114.8985 --> 00:10:46,714.8995 And I don't know if maybe she was just around more, maybe it was easier to let you know, when I was feeding the baby that she would just kind of play, bring some toys in the room and play at my feet while I was, rocking in the chair and feeding baby, like maybe that's part of her age, but yeah, it was just a lot easier. 149 00:10:46,714.8995 --> 00:10:47,894.8995 And I very much was. 150 00:10:48,239.8995 --> 00:10:54,769.8995 Struck by the feeling of like, I've missed my older kids and I was kind of missing out on a lot which I just don't remember with my second. 151 00:10:54,789.8995 --> 00:10:56,339.8995 So that was a little bit. 152 00:10:56,719.8985 --> 00:11:02,859.8995 That was probably the biggest thing beside the feeding that stuck out to me as being challenging this postpartum period. 153 00:11:02,919.8985 --> 00:11:06,379.8995 And it's also kind of what led to maybe. 154 00:11:07,64.8995 --> 00:11:13,584.8995 It's definitely a factor of what led into the decision of when me and my husband are like, yeah, this is going to be our last, I think we're all set here. 155 00:11:13,884.8995 --> 00:11:15,484.899 We've always said we wanted three. 156 00:11:15,764.899 --> 00:11:18,204.898 And then after we had my second, we're like, no, we're good with two. 157 00:11:18,204.898 --> 00:11:19,574.899 And we got rid of all of our baby stuff. 158 00:11:19,674.899 --> 00:11:22,594.899 And then a year after we got rid of all of our baby stuff, we're like, no, we should have three. 159 00:11:22,804.898 --> 00:11:23,324.899 So we did. 160 00:11:23,644.899 --> 00:11:29,744.899 And then when, even when we were pregnant with three and we kind of were thinking about that, I was going to stay home and some different life changes we were going to make. 161 00:11:29,764.899 --> 00:11:32,74.899 We were, Kind of like, well, maybe we should even have four. 162 00:11:32,74.899 --> 00:11:34,854.899 Maybe that's, it was on the table and kind of an idea that we were thrown around. 163 00:11:34,854.899 --> 00:11:43,44.899 But after we had baby and just kind of got pulled back into that infant life and postpartum, it was like, yeah, no, we're probably good with three. 164 00:11:43,94.899 --> 00:11:44,854.9 It's just, it's a really good balance for our house. 165 00:11:44,864.9 --> 00:11:49,604.9 And now that things are getting a little bit easier with him coming up on the one year mark he's down to one nap. 166 00:11:50,344.9 --> 00:11:58,304.9 You know this we've gotten some flexibility back and I think we're just really happy with the balance that we're striking and don't want to totally rock that boat again. 167 00:11:59,94.9 --> 00:12:08,314.9 So yeah, that was something that really, really stuck out to me is as the unique challenge in this postpartum journey was now that we have more than one kid and they're older and they can voice. 168 00:12:09,94.9 --> 00:12:10,114.9 Mommy, you know. 169 00:12:10,974.9 --> 00:12:13,384.9 Frustration, basically that they weren't getting time with me. 170 00:12:13,384.9 --> 00:12:17,914.9 That was, it weighed on me a little heavier than it did with the other, with my other postpartum journeys. 171 00:12:19,664.9 --> 00:12:21,454.899 So those are two things that were challenging. 172 00:12:22,624.9 --> 00:12:26,234.8995 But I do want to talk about some things that really worked this postpartum journey time around. 173 00:12:26,234.9005 --> 00:12:33,684.9005 Cause I do feel like I said, I spent a lot more time planning and focusing on what my postpartum journey was going to look like. 174 00:12:33,944.9005 --> 00:12:36,104.9005 And I think that that paid off in a lot of ways. 175 00:12:36,134.9005 --> 00:12:41,694.9005 I, I had those two challenges, but a lot of times in a lot of ways, this was my easiest pregnancy and postpartum journey. 176 00:12:42,144.9005 --> 00:12:45,404.9005 And I think a lot of that has to do with, I am the crunchiest that I have ever been. 177 00:12:46,194.9005 --> 00:12:59,664.9 I, when I had my first, I was like, I've talked about this in my beginning episode, but I had started to think about, I was always kind of crunchy about food and I started to think about the products in a home and what we were using and our personal care products and cleaning products and that kind of stuff. 178 00:12:59,664.9 --> 00:13:11,934.899 But I wasn't thinking about the way that we medically treated ourselves and the way that what I thought, The way that I parented basically, you know, I knew that I wanted to have a natural birth. 179 00:13:12,14.899 --> 00:13:13,634.899 I didn't, I ended up having an epidural. 180 00:13:13,634.899 --> 00:13:22,304.898 I knew that I wanted to breastfeed, which took a lot of work and stress, but we got there, that was kind of the end of like, what I, what my goals were and what I thought was going to be crunchy. 181 00:13:22,634.897 --> 00:13:24,494.8975 And with my second, I was in that same spot. 182 00:13:24,494.8975 --> 00:13:31,974.8975 It really wasn't until after I had my second and we had a, her experience with febrile seizures and some other things and COVID and all that, that I really started to think. 183 00:13:32,564.8975 --> 00:13:38,944.8975 Change the way that I thought about health care and how I wanted to treat my family and what I wanted our health care to look like. 184 00:13:38,944.8975 --> 00:13:45,414.8965 So this was the first pregnancy where we did not do or, you know, baby where we didn't do shots. 185 00:13:45,434.8965 --> 00:13:46,464.8975 He has had no shots. 186 00:13:46,579.8975 --> 00:13:47,289.8975 From the beginning. 187 00:13:47,309.8975 --> 00:13:49,519.8975 That's a choice we made after doing a lot of research. 188 00:13:49,879.8975 --> 00:13:55,49.8975 This is the first baby where we saw a holistic care provider for his pediatrician versus pediatric care. 189 00:13:55,409.8975 --> 00:13:57,629.8975 We had a home birth with a midwife. 190 00:13:57,639.8965 --> 00:14:01,659.8965 We did not see, I did not see a traditional OB at all throughout my whole journey. 191 00:14:01,949.8965 --> 00:14:03,139.896 I didn't do the glucose test. 192 00:14:03,159.897 --> 00:14:05,329.897 I did blood sugar monitoring with a prick. 193 00:14:05,329.897 --> 00:14:06,989.897 I did that for five days, the finger prick. 194 00:14:07,669.897 --> 00:14:08,379.897 To track that. 195 00:14:08,799.897 --> 00:14:12,769.897 I gosh, what else? Lots of stuff that we just did. 196 00:14:13,109.897 --> 00:14:14,69.897 I just did a lot differently. 197 00:14:14,69.897 --> 00:14:19,169.897 I focused a lot more on nutrition in my pregnancy Lily Nichols books. 198 00:14:19,179.897 --> 00:14:21,199.8965 That was the real food for pregnancy. 199 00:14:21,199.8965 --> 00:14:22,989.897 That's one of my all time favorite books. 200 00:14:23,9.896 --> 00:14:25,789.897 And I like share that with everybody that I know that's pregnant. 201 00:14:26,189.897 --> 00:14:28,29.897 And it just changed the game for me. 202 00:14:28,39.897 --> 00:14:29,899.897 I felt so much better this time around. 203 00:14:29,899.897 --> 00:14:37,629.8965 I've talked about in the past how I struggled with SPD and I did a lot of things that was, creating a better and healthier experiencing for me and my little one. 204 00:14:37,629.8965 --> 00:14:39,749.897 I also more intentionally slowed down postpartum. 205 00:14:40,519.897 --> 00:14:41,839.897 So that made a big difference, but. 206 00:14:41,929.897 --> 00:14:52,699.897 I made a list of kind of some bullet points of things to consider that I think are crunchier things, and that made the biggest impact for me in my pregnancy and postpartum journey. 207 00:14:52,999.897 --> 00:15:04,469.897 That anybody who's pregnant or looking at a postpartum period coming up should consider, should be on the list and you should evaluate it and see if it's a fit for you and if that fits into your 80 part of your 80 20 pregnancy and postpartum. 208 00:15:05,789.897 --> 00:15:09,59.897 The first thing that had the absolute biggest impact was chiropractic care. 209 00:15:09,189.897 --> 00:15:09,939.897 Hands down. 210 00:15:10,239.897 --> 00:15:12,659.897 I saw, I went to the chiropractor every week. 211 00:15:12,689.897 --> 00:15:17,909.897 I was going to her gosh, I started going to her about a month or two before I got pregnant. 212 00:15:18,239.897 --> 00:15:25,759.8975 And I saw my chiropractor every single week besides when we were on vacation throughout my entire pregnancy and starting about. 213 00:15:26,419.8975 --> 00:15:28,119.8975 A week postpartum as well. 214 00:15:28,119.8975 --> 00:15:30,939.8975 I started going in and getting adjusted and got baby adjusted. 215 00:15:31,389.8975 --> 00:15:40,709.8975 We went to a, I've talked about before which again could be a whole podcast episode, but I had SPD, symphysis pubis dysfunction for all of my pregnancies. 216 00:15:40,969.8975 --> 00:15:44,149.8975 But basically that's when your pubic bone spreads too far apart. 217 00:15:44,149.8975 --> 00:15:47,359.8975 There's too much relaxant, the hormone relaxant that enters your body when you're pregnant. 218 00:15:47,359.8975 --> 00:15:50,294.8975 That's when you're Spreads too far apart and it becomes unaligned. 219 00:15:50,614.8975 --> 00:15:53,984.8975 And as you can imagine, when you have a pelvis, it's not aligned. 220 00:15:53,984.8975 --> 00:15:55,494.8975 You have like one hip, the tire than the other. 221 00:15:55,494.8975 --> 00:15:56,594.8975 It causes a lot of pain. 222 00:15:56,894.8975 --> 00:16:02,54.8975 My, it was the worst with my second and I could like barely walk around a lot of the time. 223 00:16:02,54.8975 --> 00:16:02,734.8975 So I. 224 00:16:02,934.8975 --> 00:16:06,114.8975 When we decided to have a third baby, I knew I needed to do something different. 225 00:16:06,464.8975 --> 00:16:11,864.8965 And I needed to have a different experience because it was really, really hard and impacted my health really negatively in a lot of ways. 226 00:16:11,884.8975 --> 00:16:18,324.8975 So we found, I found a chiropractor when you're pregnant or you're postpartum, or you're looking at a baby, you want somebody who is Webster certified. 227 00:16:18,324.8985 --> 00:16:18,984.8985 So that's what I did. 228 00:16:18,984.8985 --> 00:16:21,144.8985 I found a Webster certified chiropractor in my area. 229 00:16:21,524.8985 --> 00:16:25,744.8985 And it just played an absolute vital role in aligning my body and easing discomfort. 230 00:16:26,234.8985 --> 00:16:31,324.8985 In addition to easing conditions like SPD or sciatica pain or any of that stuff. 231 00:16:31,344.8985 --> 00:16:37,24.8985 I mean, it's just good overall care that really helps your body stay in alignment and it also really helps with baby's positioning. 232 00:16:37,504.8975 --> 00:16:39,314.8975 I was lucky that all my kids were head down. 233 00:16:39,994.8975 --> 00:16:41,554.8975 My middle though was like sunny side up. 234 00:16:41,594.8965 --> 00:16:47,564.8975 I forget if it's anterior posterior is what that's called, but she was like facing up instead of facing towards your. 235 00:16:47,714.8975 --> 00:16:48,184.8975 back. 236 00:16:48,584.8975 --> 00:16:55,54.8975 So that the contractions for that birth were just a lot different, but it can kind of really help with baby's positioning. 237 00:16:55,54.8975 --> 00:17:01,224.8975 And especially if you have a head up baby, chiropractic care can help flip them and just get them into ideal positioning. 238 00:17:01,784.8975 --> 00:17:04,324.8975 I also, with all three of my births, Which is funny. 239 00:17:04,364.8975 --> 00:17:06,864.8975 I ended up my water broke with all of them. 240 00:17:06,864.8975 --> 00:17:11,64.8965 That was my first sign of labor as I had premature rupture of membranes with all three of them. 241 00:17:11,544.8975 --> 00:17:14,334.8975 And then contractions didn't really start naturally. 242 00:17:14,374.8975 --> 00:17:21,894.8985 So, I had some interventions with each of them, of course, with my third, it was more of a natural holistic intervention, but an intervention nonetheless. 243 00:17:22,334.8985 --> 00:17:31,234.8985 But I went the longest with my third, which is unusual, right? You always hear that the more babies you have, like you tend to go a little bit earlier, but I went the longest with my third. 244 00:17:31,234.8985 --> 00:17:39,634.8985 And I think it's because my body was just more in alignment and I was able to kind of head off, push off that rupture of membranes that my body likes to do. 245 00:17:40,24.8975 --> 00:17:42,204.8985 Because baby was just more comfortable and things were. 246 00:17:42,489.8985 --> 00:17:43,189.8985 More in alignment. 247 00:17:43,779.8985 --> 00:17:48,619.8985 So that's, if I could like tell pregnant women, anything it's chiropractic care. 248 00:17:48,669.8985 --> 00:18:01,109.8975 If you're having any kind of aches and pains, or if you are really striving to have a natural birth or a home birth, and you want to avoid interventions, chiropractic care can absolutely help and support your body into getting there. 249 00:18:02,404.8985 --> 00:18:06,914.8985 Again, I say I focused on holistic nutrition and supplementation so much more this time around. 250 00:18:06,914.8985 --> 00:18:09,434.8985 I followed pretty much everything from Willie Nichols books. 251 00:18:09,454.8985 --> 00:18:14,84.8975 And two of the big things that I, if you've read the book, you know, that I took away from that were beef liver and bone broth. 252 00:18:14,384.8975 --> 00:18:16,14.8975 And those were two things that I was incorporating. 253 00:18:16,244.8965 --> 00:18:24,984.8985 Beef liver was daily bone broth was as much as I could, get it a couple of times, a couple of times a week, I would make my broth every week for my chicken bones and beef bones that I have. 254 00:18:25,14.8985 --> 00:18:26,609.8985 And I would Just sip on that. 255 00:18:26,919.8985 --> 00:18:31,189.8985 I also was taking magnesium, which is a big mineral that contributes to a lot of aches and pains. 256 00:18:31,189.8985 --> 00:18:32,939.8985 I was also taking trace minerals. 257 00:18:32,939.8985 --> 00:18:44,469.8975 I was adding more minerals into my diet, something that was really different to me because this was my first pregnancy where I followed midwifery, the midwifery model and was under the care of a midwife is how much more she focused on nutrition. 258 00:18:44,769.8975 --> 00:18:51,84.8975 So actually one of the first things I think when I entered my Gosh, I can't remember what appointment it was, but it was early on. 259 00:18:51,94.8975 --> 00:18:54,174.8975 It was maybe at the end of the first trimester, maybe going into the second trimester. 260 00:18:54,174.8975 --> 00:18:58,934.8975 I think they give you like a reprieve when they know you're nauseous and it's not your like regular quote eating pattern. 261 00:18:58,934.8975 --> 00:19:04,994.8975 But she did have me track my food for like three days with everything that I ate and my macros and calories. 262 00:19:05,24.8975 --> 00:19:08,54.8975 And then she reviewed that and like gave me notes and made suggestions. 263 00:19:08,504.8975 --> 00:19:16,44.8975 And a lot of the times, whenever I would kind of come in and have a complaint, like, Hey, I'm having a lot of heartburn or Hey, whatever it was, she, the first thing that we would look at was. 264 00:19:16,199.8975 --> 00:19:17,649.8975 Food and supplements. 265 00:19:17,999.8975 --> 00:19:20,179.8975 So that just like spoke right to my heart. 266 00:19:20,209.8975 --> 00:19:21,209.8975 I love that approach. 267 00:19:21,229.8975 --> 00:19:30,579.8985 We were so much more focused on nutrition and I felt like I was just had the healthiest pregnancy, like size wise and weight gain and had the biggest baby that I've have had. 268 00:19:30,579.8985 --> 00:19:34,229.8985 So my girls were both seven pounds and then he was nine pounds, three ounces. 269 00:19:34,239.8975 --> 00:19:37,839.8985 So he was the biggest baby I had, but I was not, I was not bigger with him. 270 00:19:38,249.8985 --> 00:19:40,659.8985 So it was, I just felt really good about the nutrition. 271 00:19:41,719.8985 --> 00:20:01,229.898 Something else that's kind of like a waterfall effect from the chiropractic care is that I was much more active this pregnancy, which was amazing because I, I've talked about a little bit in my first podcast episode, my journey and how much fitness meant to me when I started getting healthy and I started just taking care of my body a little bit better post college, how much of a fitness junkie I became. 272 00:20:01,499.898 --> 00:20:08,889.899 So when I had my first and second pregnancy and I had more of that pelvic pain, it was really hard on me mentally, not to be able to work out and not to stay fit. 273 00:20:09,249.898 --> 00:20:16,709.899 I had this idea and this thought that I was going to be one of those people that had that super fit pregnancy and was out there like, I don't know, running marathons and doing CrossFit. 274 00:20:17,509.899 --> 00:20:19,99.899 I didn't do either of those things pre pregnancy. 275 00:20:19,99.899 --> 00:20:20,739.899 So I don't know why that was in my mind at all. 276 00:20:20,739.999 --> 00:20:23,559.899 I just had this like fit pregnancy. 277 00:20:23,739.899 --> 00:20:24,849.899 Image in my head. 278 00:20:24,859.899 --> 00:20:29,879.899 And then when I was in so much pain and that wasn't happening, that was kind of a hard mental hurdle to get over. 279 00:20:29,879.899 --> 00:20:32,719.899 But this time I was as active as I wanted to be. 280 00:20:32,739.899 --> 00:20:34,299.899 And it felt really, really good. 281 00:20:34,629.899 --> 00:20:35,709.899 I was doing, I did daily. 282 00:20:35,709.899 --> 00:20:37,169.899 I kept up with daily walking. 283 00:20:37,209.899 --> 00:20:39,279.898 That's something that I like to do even not pregnant. 284 00:20:39,309.898 --> 00:20:40,419.899 And there's so many benefits. 285 00:20:40,709.899 --> 00:20:52,789.9 And I was able to keep up with three plus times a week of strength training which is something that was, Tough in the past to do whenever you have SPD, one legged movements are not your friend. 286 00:20:52,859.9 --> 00:21:00,89.8995 When you're balancing on one leg that can kind of exacerbate the conditions or the impact of the, how it feels. 287 00:21:01,39.9005 --> 00:21:06,259.9005 So being able to find like some good strength trainings that are specific for SPD really helped. 288 00:21:06,299.9005 --> 00:21:12,309.9005 And I found a lot of ways to modify, even if I was doing a regular strength class to modify a single leg movement and just, do the. 289 00:21:13,269.9005 --> 00:21:16,179.9005 Biped or whatever, double leg movement version of that is. 290 00:21:16,579.9005 --> 00:21:21,469.8995 So that was definitely like a cornerstone of this pregnancy and what made it such a positive experience for me. 291 00:21:21,469.9005 --> 00:21:22,899.9005 Cause I was still getting this as endorphins. 292 00:21:22,919.8995 --> 00:21:23,849.9005 My body felt better. 293 00:21:23,849.9005 --> 00:21:25,139.9005 I was moving around easier. 294 00:21:25,559.9005 --> 00:21:28,39.9005 Those gentle exercises helped keep my body moving. 295 00:21:28,79.8995 --> 00:21:32,999.9005 It helped foster strength and flexibility, which were, I feel like absolutely crucial in my postpartum recovery. 296 00:21:33,349.9005 --> 00:21:40,809.9005 And it was a complete waterfall effect, right? It not only did I feel better in my pregnancy, but I had a little, a Way easier time physically recovering postpartum. 297 00:21:41,369.9005 --> 00:21:51,839.9005 This was my hands down, my easiest postpartum recovery physically, I felt the best that, I would go into all these appointments that we had, where we were trying to figure out what was going on with baby and his feeding. 298 00:21:52,79.9005 --> 00:21:54,299.8995 And people would ask me, well, how are you feeling? I feel amazing. 299 00:21:54,399.9005 --> 00:21:55,969.8995 I could, I feel amazing. 300 00:21:56,859.9005 --> 00:21:59,259.8005 So physically it was just such a great recovery for me. 301 00:21:59,259.8005 --> 00:22:04,889.8005 And I think being able to stay so active made all the difference that and the chiropractic care, which of course are kind of like tied together. 302 00:22:06,569.8005 --> 00:22:13,139.8005 Another thing that I did differently this time around was actually like putting intentional thought and planning into my postpartum experience. 303 00:22:13,569.8005 --> 00:22:17,379.8005 I did a lot of work to do meal prepping ahead of time, more than I had in the past. 304 00:22:17,409.8005 --> 00:22:18,989.8005 That was my best friend was meal prepping. 305 00:22:19,369.7995 --> 00:22:22,719.8005 I was really, you know, I had two kids at this point, so I knew that I wasn't going to have. 306 00:22:23,14.8005 --> 00:22:26,184.8005 Time to stand in the kitchen for hours, meal prep, all these freezer meals. 307 00:22:26,194.8005 --> 00:22:32,554.8005 So I, for like the couple of months leading up to birth, I started just making double batches of things that I would cook for dinner. 308 00:22:32,564.8005 --> 00:22:36,784.8005 And that was like my meal planning, my, my trick to stock my freezer for postpartum. 309 00:22:37,554.8005 --> 00:22:40,144.7995 I did do a couple of intentional things outside of that. 310 00:22:40,484.8005 --> 00:22:41,74.8005 I made. 311 00:22:41,259.8005 --> 00:22:44,989.8005 In addition to some different freezer meals I made soup to have for lunches. 312 00:22:45,19.8005 --> 00:22:56,679.7995 Cause I remember that from my first postpartum journey was like, I had some freezer meals like for dinners, but then lunchtime is, would roll around and be like, ah, what do I eat? So I specifically made things like lunches and dinners and breakfasts. 313 00:22:56,739.8005 --> 00:23:04,339.801 I did a bunch of I made a bunch of egg bites cause I knew the first couple of days I was going to want something really gentle and easy and really high in protein. 314 00:23:04,949.801 --> 00:23:06,519.801 So that made a big difference. 315 00:23:06,519.801 --> 00:23:07,439.801 I also made some snacks. 316 00:23:07,459.801 --> 00:23:11,69.801 I made a bunch of like lactation balls and like snack bites, my protein bites. 317 00:23:11,659.801 --> 00:23:13,859.801 And all of those were just so amazing to have on hand. 318 00:23:14,169.801 --> 00:23:18,949.801 So the meal planning having meals like prepared for me that worked. 319 00:23:19,4.802 --> 00:23:19,904.802 So smoothly. 320 00:23:20,4.802 --> 00:23:26,664.802 I wrote out this plan and I picked meals specifically that included nutrients that new moms are typically like depleted in. 321 00:23:27,4.802 --> 00:23:33,844.8 And that's helped support like milk production and healing and, things with lots of like collagen and bone broth. 322 00:23:33,874.8 --> 00:23:36,904.801 I focused on foods that were warm, warming foods and spices. 323 00:23:36,904.801 --> 00:23:41,294.801 There's a lot in traditional Chinese medicine that talks About keeping your body warm and staying warm. 324 00:23:41,534.801 --> 00:23:46,684.801 Postpartum a lot of warming spices, like Kurt, I made a curry and cinnamon and stuff like that. 325 00:23:46,694.801 --> 00:23:50,114.801 A lot of protein a lot of animal based protein in my meals. 326 00:23:50,164.801 --> 00:23:54,24.8 And I wanted easy to digest cooked vegetables lots of healthy fats. 327 00:23:54,64.8 --> 00:23:55,184.8 Like I said, lots of collagen. 328 00:23:55,204.8 --> 00:24:02,44.8 Those were all things that I was like load pick, you know, designing this menu of meals that I wanted to make and just loading up meals that have that. 329 00:24:03,194.8 --> 00:24:13,544.799 I also made it a point to do, I had the goal to do the five, five, five, which is, if you haven't heard of it, it's like five days in bed, five days on bed, on the bed, and five days around the bed. 330 00:24:13,914.8 --> 00:24:20,914.8 I will tell you that once I started this, I was really confused about what the difference between on the bed and around the bed is, or even in bed and on bed. 331 00:24:21,204.8 --> 00:24:26,4.8 Like, am I just not supposed to have my blanket on me? But I think the takeaway is that you're just supposed to kind of stay. 332 00:24:26,349.8 --> 00:24:33,769.8 In your room, huddle up with baby and just try to move, as besides you go to the bathroom and that kind of stuff, move as little as possible. 333 00:24:34,179.8 --> 00:24:36,749.799 So I made it a point to stay in bed and rest longer. 334 00:24:36,979.8 --> 00:24:46,559.801 I had my, this required a lot of buy in and support from my husband and my mother in law who basically waited on me like hand and foot and took, you know, my mother in law took care of the other kids. 335 00:24:46,559.801 --> 00:24:48,259.801 And my husband was like fetching me food. 336 00:24:48,689.801 --> 00:24:52,689.801 Help me go to the bathroom, going to get things from downstairs when I needed it, that kind of stuff. 337 00:24:52,699.801 --> 00:24:56,339.801 So it requires a lot of help which can be hard to do. 338 00:24:56,339.801 --> 00:24:59,259.8 I know people talk about say that like, well, you need to do a five, five, five. 339 00:24:59,259.801 --> 00:25:05,249.799 And the first thing I would always think of is yeah, it's easy to say, but like when you have other kids, it's, that's not just, it's not easy to do. 340 00:25:05,909.8 --> 00:25:09,559.8 So I did kind of, and it's uncomfortable to reach out and ask people for help. 341 00:25:09,559.8 --> 00:25:09,829.8 Right. 342 00:25:10,349.8 --> 00:25:12,299.8 But I did make the effort to do that this time. 343 00:25:12,299.8 --> 00:25:15,899.8 And I do feel like it made a lot of a difference, even after it didn't end up being 555. 344 00:25:15,949.8 --> 00:25:26,509.8 I didn't get away with 15 days you know, basically in and around the bed, but I, it was more like a like a four to one or something like that, but that's a lot more. 345 00:25:26,774.8 --> 00:25:31,434.8 Rest and relaxation that I had planned for and that I did with my other two postpartum journeys. 346 00:25:31,774.8 --> 00:25:36,284.8 And I feel like that really contributed to how amazing I felt and how healed my body was. 347 00:25:36,634.8 --> 00:25:45,884.8015 My bleeding was better this time around, it was shorter and I didn't have recurrence, which I had, you know, where you would like stop bleeding and then it would open up again and you'd be bleeding more. 348 00:25:46,274.8015 --> 00:25:47,354.8015 Like I did with my first two. 349 00:25:47,354.8015 --> 00:25:52,669.8015 So that I feel like was That's a good sign that things were healing and that I really took care of my body. 350 00:25:52,749.8015 --> 00:26:00,819.8005 So all the physical recovery, that's like the success, the check Mark of this postpartum journey was my physical recovery was just so much better. 351 00:26:00,819.8015 --> 00:26:01,799.8015 I felt so good. 352 00:26:02,319.8015 --> 00:26:06,429.8025 I also used red light therapy, so that was something that was new for me this time around. 353 00:26:06,429.8025 --> 00:26:10,349.8025 I didn't, I bought my red light therapy device after I had my second. 354 00:26:11,4.8025 --> 00:26:13,354.8025 And so I was using that this time around. 355 00:26:13,404.8025 --> 00:26:18,924.8025 And that was like, so such a soothing practice that really, I think, enriched my healing practice process. 356 00:26:19,314.8025 --> 00:26:24,434.8015 I used it, I would just like put it on while baby was feeding, like making sure it was pointed to his back. 357 00:26:24,804.8025 --> 00:26:29,354.8025 I would put it on while I was feeding in the morning to kind of try to like help set that circadian rhythm. 358 00:26:29,424.8025 --> 00:26:32,114.8025 I used it on, you know, I would put it. 359 00:26:32,374.8025 --> 00:26:35,704.8025 Down my pants, you sit on for like wound healing down below. 360 00:26:36,54.8025 --> 00:26:38,114.8025 And I think that that helps speed up a lot of things. 361 00:26:38,124.8025 --> 00:26:41,424.8025 So love the red light therapy, use it in my postpartum journey. 362 00:26:41,424.8025 --> 00:26:42,224.8025 And that was awesome. 363 00:26:42,534.8025 --> 00:26:45,64.8005 I also I used homeopathics this time around. 364 00:26:45,94.8005 --> 00:26:48,234.8005 So I used Arnica only for my pain management. 365 00:26:48,264.8015 --> 00:26:50,964.8015 I took Arnica pellets instead of using like. 366 00:26:51,359.8015 --> 00:26:56,9.8015 you know, Tylenol, Advil, Motrin, whatever the case may be for pain management after birth. 367 00:26:56,39.8015 --> 00:26:59,659.8015 And it was, I was shocked with how effective it was. 368 00:27:00,9.8015 --> 00:27:03,979.8015 I, sometimes when you use things that are more natural, they're just like a little bit less effective. 369 00:27:03,979.8025 --> 00:27:12,869.8045 It's not that big power punch that like something that like a pharmaceutical can, Can give and sometimes you want to give that up because you don't want the side effects of that big, powerful punch. 370 00:27:13,209.8045 --> 00:27:17,619.8045 But I did anticipate that it wouldn't feel as good, but I felt great. 371 00:27:17,659.8035 --> 00:27:23,69.8035 It was, and they say that the more kids you have, the worst, like that cramping and all that can be, but. 372 00:27:23,649.8045 --> 00:27:24,449.8045 I felt really good. 373 00:27:24,449.8045 --> 00:27:26,159.8045 I used Arnica pellets. 374 00:27:26,579.8045 --> 00:27:31,809.8045 I took them orally and then I had an Arnica balm that I would use on my belly around when I would get like cramping. 375 00:27:31,869.8045 --> 00:27:37,679.8045 So those general alternatives, the homeopathics worked amazing for me and I was so happy that we went that route. 376 00:27:39,589.8045 --> 00:27:45,909.8045 So that's kind of the highlights and the crunchy things that I tried this time around, and that blended to such a good experience. 377 00:27:45,929.8045 --> 00:27:47,809.8045 I'm glad I talked about the things that were challenging for us. 378 00:27:47,839.8045 --> 00:27:52,919.8045 Cause now I'm like wrapping this up and just like talking about all the positive things more or fresher in my mind. 379 00:27:52,919.8045 --> 00:27:55,719.8035 And it just, I'm like, ah, that was such a good postpartum birth. 380 00:27:55,749.8045 --> 00:27:57,599.8055 It was, you know, such an experience. 381 00:27:58,289.8055 --> 00:28:02,519.8055 The journey taught me so much about self care and the importance of nurturing my body and my mind. 382 00:28:02,799.8055 --> 00:28:05,796.1236818 I hope you and maybe new ideas for your own journey. 383 00:28:05,796.1236818 --> 00:28:06,799.7055 And remember that. 384 00:28:06,939.8055 --> 00:28:08,569.8055 You know, the journey is yours. 385 00:28:08,729.8055 --> 00:28:11,309.8055 You always get to decide what your 80 is and what your 20 is. 386 00:28:11,639.8055 --> 00:28:16,609.8055 Nobody else knows the full, view of what your pregnancy and postpartum looks like. 387 00:28:16,609.8055 --> 00:28:20,829.8055 So some of this doesn't resonate with you, just leave it here and don't think about it again. 388 00:28:20,829.8055 --> 00:28:26,559.8055 And if it does, I hope that it's inspiring and that you find something new that's maybe going to work for you in your journey. 389 00:28:27,139.8055 --> 00:28:29,189.8055 Thank you for tuning into today's episode. 390 00:28:29,209.8045 --> 00:28:31,629.8045 I have been loving sharing my podcast here. 391 00:28:31,629.8045 --> 00:28:37,679.8065 This is episode number five, and I have just been loving this routine and the feedback and discussion that the podcast is warranting. 392 00:28:37,689.8065 --> 00:28:46,639.8065 If you have been enjoying listening, I would be so honored if you would leave a rating and review at Apple podcasts or Spotify or wherever you're listening until next time, take care.