Empowering Girls Through Physical Activity

In this podcast we hear from Beky Williams, Managing Director of Stride Active, Dan Thomas, Head of PE and Business at Kingstone High School and Lucy Finch, Teacher of PE at Kingstone High School.  

The group discusses projects which have been involved in, that have proved instrumental in gaining feedback from girls within the Herefordshire region, taking action to create space for open conversations to hear from girls on how to reduce barriers to physical activity.  

The activities and collaborative events are underpinned by key design principles; aimed at empowering girls to gain knowledge and confidence to increase girls' participation in sport and physical activity within Herefordshire.  

The ‘Here Girls Can’ project is the locally adapted offer of the national This Girl Can campaign, commissioned through Sport England and funded by the National Lottery. In 2025, This Girl Can celebrated its 10 year-anniversary. 

Insight and data: If you are interested in this work, some impact reports for consideration: PE & School Sport: The Annual Report 2024 - Youth Sport Trust  which highlights some national challenges in youths accessing physical activity.  

Earlier this year, Stride Active released the 'Here Girls Can 2024 Impact Report'. The report quotes 85% of girls recording an increase in confidence after attending an event. You can access the full report via the links below.  

Kingstone High School received the Youth Sport Trust ‘Girls Active Report’ for 2024, exploring girls' motivations, barriers and overall engagement in physical activity. The responses given for key barriers to engaging in sport, physical activity and PE at school were on average more positive for girls at Kingstone High School compared to the national average.  In the report, 79% of girls at Kingstone High School enjoyed taking part in physical activity.

This was reflected in many areas, relating to some of the issues and actions referenced in this podcast.  

Links related to this episode:   Home | Active Herefordshire & Worcestershire   Kingstone Academy Trust - Achieving Success Together  

Here Girls Can - Stride Active  

This Girl Can | Active Herefordshire & Worcestershire   This Girl Can | This Girl Can | This girl can  

common challenges and bestpractices intended for

(00:26):
professionals, communities andindividuals involved in tackling
and sustaining change in thehealth voluntary and community
sectors, with a particularemphasis on how physical
activity and movement cancontribute to prevention and
recovery.

(00:46):
With these podcasts, we'reaiming to support you, if you're
dealing with similar challenges,and draw upon the knowledge of
expertise we've got fromstrategic projects right through
to grassroots projects allacross the two counties of
periforshire and Worcestershire,our podcasts will cover
everything from communityengagement, social prescribing,
positive aging, flood defenses,physical activity, clinical

(01:09):
champions, funding, integratedcare systems and vcse
partnership, working plus girlsengagement in sport. We release
a new episode every month, somake sure you subscribe to be
notified when a new one's out.And if you could take time to
review the podcast, we'd reallyappreciate it. So let's get on
with today's episode.

(01:32):
In this episode, we're talkingabout empowering girls through
physical activity, you're goingto hear about a hugely
successful project from BeckyWilliams, Managing Director of
Stride active. Joining her aretwo people involved in girls PE
at school, Dan Thomas, head ofPE and business at Kingston High
School, and Lucy Finch, teacherof PE. Kingston high school

(01:54):
received the youth sport trustgirls active report for 2024
exploring girls motivations,barriers and overall engagement
in physical activity, theresponses to barriers in
engaging in sport, physicalactivity and PE at school was,
on average, more positive forgirls at Kingston compared to
the national average. So theguys are going to share with you
the projects they've beeninstrumental in gaining feedback

(02:17):
from girls within theHerefordshire region, leading to
ideas and actions that createspace for open conversations,
and as you'll hear, theactivities and collaborative
events are all underpinned bykey design principles aimed at
empowering girls to gainknowledge and confidence and
increase their participation insport and physical activity. To
start the chat, I asked Beckyabout how they identified the

(02:38):
challenge of girls participationin sport.

Becky Williams (02:43):
So everything we do is is kind of really grounded
in pupil voice. So before weeven started thinking, do we
need to do something here? Wewent out and spoke to a lot of
girls. So we run a number offocus groups across the whole of
the county, from girls kind ofbreath in years kind of five,
six, through to girls in yearseven, eight, to find out how
they felt about PE sport,physical activity, what their

(03:04):
issues were. And there was somuch coming out, there was such
a need coming out, that we feltlike we had to do something with
that. And quite shocking, thingsthat the girls were saying so
how boys perceived them, thecomments they would get, how
they felt that they weren't asgood as the sporty girls, how
they wanted just a safer, moreinclusive environment. So all

(03:25):
that kind of came through fromthe focus groups, and from that,
we're able to build a programbased on their design
principles. So they effectivelycame up with four design
principles, and that's what weuse now to kind of ground the
programming. Can you give us anidea of the scale of the
organization as it is at theminute and what it's delivering.
So here girls, can we run aprogram of a festival once a

(03:50):
year? We could do it way morethan once a year. The demand
from schools is huge for it, butwe run a festival once a year,
and what we have last year, wehad 38 schools apply to be part
of that Festival, which isaround a third of our schools in
the county. So it is huge, andwe have to turn a lot of schools
away, just because we keep thefestivals quite small. So it's

(04:10):
difficult managing the demandfor it versus keeping it small
enough so the girls feelcomfortable and safe and not
intimidated by being around1000s of young people, which
some of our other programs mighthave that scale. We talked about
it a lot on the podcast. Itcomes up now and again. The size
of groups must be so critical toengagement and delivery? Yeah,
absolutely. So we cap ours ataround 100 young people, and

(04:33):
they're supported them by around12 to 14, what we call girls
champions. So young leaders insports, which Kingstone have
provided those young leaders,and we've done some training
with them. So yeah, maximumaround a kind of 100 and 120
young people on site, and but wekeep the groups within that even
smaller. So the way the programworks is that they all take part

(04:53):
in a range of different nontraditional activities on the
day. And so group sizes willlikely be no more than around
15. So.
So they only have around 100people together at the very
start, where we open thefestival, we kind of do some
like empowerment, some warm ups,which is really, really lovely.
And we use Starlight company tosupport us with that. And then
they then break down into muchsmaller groups where they feel,

(05:15):
you know, much more comfortable,like I say, less intimidated, to
actually then take part and trythose new activities. Okay,
that's good.

Rich Hurst (05:23):
Dan, I just want to come to you from, I mean, from
Kingston High's point of viewand what you've experienced.
What would you say is the gap inengagement between boys and
girls in sport?

Dan Thomas (05:37):
I think the main barrier initially is the
confidence, really, I think thatwas something that we found was,
was our biggest barrierinitially, when we when we
first, when I first startedworking here, was that that
difference in level between boysand the girls, and there's some
early experience previously, butI was in a much bigger school,
so perhaps didn't see it on thatsort of, sort of scale. And then

(05:59):
coming to a smaller schools likeKingston was a bit more eye
opening to notice the differencebetween the lack of engaged
engagement of the girls that wehad here in comparison to the
boys.
It was quite nice. I joined justafter COVID, during COVID, and
to come in almost sort of fresh,have a blank canvas to go from

(06:21):
and yeah, and then from there,being able to tackle that
barrier. But yeah, I think theconfidence was, was the key
issue amongst amongst ourstudents. And over time, we've
started to build that that gapis still there. I think that's
something that's always going tobe there, but, but yet, the gap
is narrowing. How tough is thatchallenge to to, in theory,

(06:41):
improve girls confidence,

Unknown (06:45):
very tough. I think there's, there's a lot of things
that that that hinder that. So,for example, just the sports
they do, the groupings thatthey're in, being on timetable
when boys are on and then it'sthen that next step, then from
just going from right we've gotthem engaged in the PE lessons

(07:05):
now, how do we build on gettingthem to PE play in sport, at
breaks, at lunches, afterschool, outside of school.
That's that's the next challengethat I think we're starting to
face now. And I think that'ssomething that if anyone's got
the answer for it, would begreat, but I think we're making
strides in the right direction.But, yeah, I think the other

(07:25):
thing around confidence as wellis around kit choices we've seen
and how that affects theirparticipation. So what the P kit
looks like. We hear about that alot in schools, and also,
increasingly, is aroundmenstrual cycle and how that
actually affects theirparticipation, and that's now
becoming one of the biggerbarriers that we're seeing
coming through. And again, heregoes can is looking to address

(07:48):
that, so we do some veryspecific work and education
around that as part of thefestival to help combat some of
those issues.

Rich Hurst (07:55):
Lucy, what was, what was? P like for you growing up
and playing it at school?

Lucy Finch (08:00):
Yeah, it's very much. Boys were separate. Girls
were separate. They did thetraditional girls sports, and
then boys did the traditionalwasn't really mixed, so didn't
really have that exposure. So wedidn't really see or we were on
the same timetable, but weweren't performing the same
sports hall, or it was only ifit was like wet days, then you'd

(08:20):
be merged and and it was sort ofsimilar to now, as in, you'd get
the ones that didn't like sport,they would go to the back of the
hall, and then you'd get theones that are sporty, that would
take part then. So there aresome similarities now to when I
was younger, but I thinkconfidence is definitely, you
know, one of those that's veryhigh up as a barrier current
situations. And what are youseeing in your when you were

(08:43):
coaching? What were you seeingin differences now, as opposed
to, maybe back then,
very much friendships,
in terms of group ins, when wewere younger, it was very much
you put in a group you'd performnow it's if you try that you
wouldn't get the engagement. Soit's very much given them the
ownership of their groupings andtheir friendship, which then
they feel a bit little bit moreconfident to participate in

(09:05):
sport.

Rich Hurst (09:07):
Becky. As the program's grown and you've seen
things develop, what have beenthe key signifiers of success,

Becky Williams (09:18):
we've had a lot, I think, and it's really nice
working hand now, roughly threeyears into into the program as
it looks currently, and we'regetting long term feedback
coming back. So that is a keysuccess for us when we're
hearing about individual youngpeople that have taken part in
the festival and have eithergone on to just be more
confident in school, not just inPE lessons, but across across

(09:39):
the board, and they're takingpart in PE more willingly, or
even in extracurricular clubs,they've kind of grown in
confidence. So we're definitelyseeing that and hearing that as
feedback. But I think the otherbig thing for me, for it to be
sustainable, is the changes thatwe're seeing schools make. And I
think that's, you know, whereKingston are an amazing example,
where they've engaged in thefirst.

Unknown (10:00):
Of all since we've started it, and they're making
lots of changes on the back ofrecommendations that we're
giving, but also the girlssaying, Actually, we think this
will, this would be better, orthis would help us. So it's that
combination, I guess, betweenour expertise, but also pupil
voice and that that's reallycoming together in schools and
making those changes too. Soyeah, very much. Between those
kind of those two things. Yeah,it's really interesting. Like

(10:22):
when the girls go on on thefestivals and they come back,
and I think it was the last onesthat they came back from, and
you gave them some cards aboutwhat like to write down three
words about how PE makes mefeel, or something along those
lines. And loose, brought themback and gave them to me when
she the first thing he did whenshe walked through the door,
gave them to me, and I was like,it was really like, powerful

(10:43):
just to read those words and andto see

Dan Thomas (10:46):
like, because obviously I've got this vision
in my head of what I think theproblem is, but without actually
gaining that understanding, andparticularly on a day when it's
all focused about them and it'sabout the girls and
we can, we give out people voiceand we get feedback, but it's
almost like you read and whatyou want to read sort of times,

(11:08):
and so to hear it and hit home abit more, I think it's really
useful, and that's somethingthat's like, just having that
little takeaway at the end justgets you thinking a bit more and
about right? We clearly do have,still have an issue, and this is
what needs to be done. Whatchanges are you either putting
in place or thinking of puttingin place as a result? So we've
made several changes over thelast couple of years. The

(11:30):
biggest one was kit. The firstthing, first thing we did when I
when I joined, was we introducedsome leggings. The girls wanted
a massive one for the leggingsthat's proved really popular.
We've changed the for next year.We're going to change our tops
that we're offering. Hoodies aregoing and we've got most more
sporty tops that they wanted.We're introducing different
shorts that the girls wanted. Sokit was a massive barrier. I

(11:56):
think it's just making them feelcomfortable in the first place.
Is they got to be comfortable ifthey're not going to be
comfortable in their own bodiesand be comfortable coming into
the lesson then, then we'renever going to get them through
the door. And that's somethingthat we don't have an issue
with. Here
it was. It was an issue. Butthat's that's now eradicate. We
rarely have to turf people likethe changing rooms because they

(12:18):
don't want to come out becausethey're worried about how they
look, or or or their appearance.And I think that that was a big,
big change that helped listeningto the girls as well, in the
sense of who they want to begrouped with. So like Lou said,
that's
the sporty girls and the nonsporty girls, and that's not

(12:41):
really a stigma that we want tocarry. They're all sporty girls
to us. They all want to in theirown way, shape or form,
regardless of what they'redoing, whether there are what
we've now got is a performinggroup and an inclusion group. So
our performing groups will willdo our mainstream sports and get
the opportunities to keepperforming in things such as

(13:01):
netball,
tennis, football,
badminton, are more mainstreamsports, but then we've also
introduced for our less ablestudents, our inclusion groups
sports where they're not asphysically demanding, but we are
still getting some spawn abilityout of them. So volleyball has
come in and been really popular.And we've done table tennis,

(13:24):
which the girls are reallyliked. And he was listening
again to the girls what theywanted to do. Like the weather
is probably our biggest, biggeststumbling point. We're limited
to the indoor space that we'vegot here, and only having the
one space, and sometimes it'sfour groups on at the same time,
and
it is hard getting, getting thegirls to go out outside. And so

(13:46):
we're looking at introducing aPE Coke, for example, and
offering, offering that as analternative to get them out
there. But then we've, we'veaccommodated so like even just
using the corridor to put tabletennis tables out in and making
that as an indoor space to touse, although it's not ideal, it
started to win the battle.Listen. I mean, these are quite
significant changes. What wereyour reactions first when you

(14:09):
kind of started getting thatinitial feedback from the girls
about what they wereexperiencing, what they wanted,
what they wanted to change? Imean, it was interesting, but
then it was nice to hear becausethey were changes that we could
change. They weren't things thatthat were out of this world that
we couldn't put into action. Soit was nice to hear that just as
simple as using indoor spacerather than on our topics,

(14:31):
having three times they wereoutside. But yeah, it is
interesting. And like I said,it's nice that we can actually
put this change into action.Becky, that idea of performing
and inclusion groups kind ofseparating the two groups,
that's quite that's quiterevolutionary, isn't it?

Rich Hurst (14:47):
And a good example of what you're trying to do and
that what you're trying toachieve,

Becky Williams (14:50):
yeah, I think there's lots of different
examples like and every schoolwill be different in terms of
what they put into place, butit's given those girls a space
where they feel.
Less judged. That's one of thekey things that the in the focus
groups that we had, they feltjudged, and that then prevented
their participation. Soactually, taking that fear of
judgment away, and that's one ofthe key design principles of

(15:11):
fear, girls can it's effectivelywhat how Kingston have kind of
adhered to that, that principle,but it'll be different. So in
other schools, they've developeda trampolining Club for Girls
Only, so and that's a spacewhere it's those girls that
aren't going to any otherextracurricular clubs that get
invited to go to that. And Ithink here you guys did
something around having a girlsonly club off the back of your

(15:33):
girls can, didn't you, which wasled by your girls champions. So
whatever way you look at it,it's around how you provide that
safe space, yeah, where there'sa judgment free kind of zone.
And I think, because it's donevery different in different
schools, but that's the one ofthe key things that's really
coming out from from the programand and you, I mean, I'm
guessing now, as you're gettingto this stage of it, you're

(15:54):
seeing more and more examples ofit, of it. I mean, positive
effects. Just wondering, inparticular case studies. You
think what you're you know whatyou're trying to do to achieve,
essentially, definitely. Sowe're hearing, kind of three
years on, about one of one girlfrom a local high school that
came and took part in the firstfestival didn't like PE. It was

(16:15):
a struggle to get her there. Shedidn't want to go in the first
place. Really, very rare, like,very rare, like very frequently,
bring notes into PE. Not a goodrelationship with PE teacher.
She came, and three years later,the teacher came back to me,
really recently, and said thatgirl that we bought here goes
kind of made a massivedifference to her, because she
is now, you know, she comes toPE, she's happy. She's in kit

(16:38):
all the time. She takes part,and she's also a young sports
leader, so she's now actuallyrole modeling to other younger
girls, which is amazing. Andthat's almost like for us, full
circle. And when you hear that,it's such a lovely, lovely thing
to hear, because it's yes, youknow, we want to have an impact
on the day. So we always hear onthe day that girls are more
confident, they're happier,they're engaging better than

(16:59):
they would in the normal plesson, which is brilliant here
on the day. But ultimately, whatwe want is to say this program
is making a fundamentaldifference to girls and their
relationship and attitude tophysical activity, because when
they leave school, we want themto hold that with them. You
know, we know the drop off. Dropoff can start as young as kind
of year four, year five, thatthen exasperates when he hits

(17:21):
secondary school, and then, evenmore so, when PE is no longer
compulsory. So by the time youknow young people are leaving
school, their relationship withwith sport and physical activity
could just drop off the radar.And what we ultimately want to
do is to stop that fromhappening, because we want young
people to grow up happy andhealthy. So the fact that three
years later, we're still hearingthat a young person attended the

(17:45):
festival changed their wholeattitude around it, built a
different relationship withtheir PE teacher and is now a
young leader like that. That'samazing. That's exactly what we
want to achieve on the program.And I know you guys have had
kind of similar experiences withsome of your students here.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. We had one,one student in particular, who
who found PE struggle really,really had a few battles, and

(18:09):
she was somebody when she firstcame to high school, didn't want
to engage at all with with PEwas put off by that, I think,
that perception and that she hadof what PE was going to look
like in high school based on herexperiences at primary school,

Dan Thomas (18:24):
sorry, and
since she came, came along, shewent to one of the first, I
think it's the first one thatyou guys did with us, and she,
she, since then, has flourishedin PE has had a really positive
experience now no longer, no
longer battles and moans aboutgoing out to PE gives 100% and

(18:45):
she joined cycling along to thefootball club after school and
representing the school footballteam. I think she represented in
maybe Rounders and netball aswell. So from going from not
wanting to do piece or to nowrepresenting the School in clubs
is, is a big leap. And I think,as Becky says, the next, the
next set, then, is that, thatdrop off we don't want to see

(19:07):
happening once post 16, it'sright. We now need to get, find
a, find a club outside of schoolthat she can get involved with
and and the same with a lot ofour students, that that next,
that next link, getting externalpeople in to support that next
step. So where do we go from

Rich Hurst (19:29):
there? Right? We'll get you back to the chat with
Becky Lucy and Dan shortly, justtime now to let you know about
our previous episode in theseries about successful
partnership work between thevoluntary community social
enterprise or VSC network, andthe integrated care system. It
was great for understanding theaims of partnership work between

(19:50):
the two organizations and whatit means to SHARE Community
Voices with the healthcarecommissioning service. One of
the guests was Christine price,Chief Officer of Health.

Unknown (20:00):
Watch Herefordshire, and she talked about some of the
changes they feel could helporganizations looking for
support. But I think one of theways your question about, How do
we work together to achieve it,we have to believe it's

Christine Price (20:12):
And I think the other, the other part is, you
possible.
know, funding and the way thatcommunity organizations have
worked is often that they'repitted against each other.
They're competing fordiminishing pots of money and
funds here and there, and Ithink we could do better to come
together and think what is acollaborative way that we could

(20:34):
maximize those funds, and whoreally is the best organization
to lead on this initiative orthat initiative, and is there a
better model in partnership thanthere is in competition? So
that's our previous episode ofthis series, but there are
others to discover too simply bysubscribing and checking out the
feed right. Let's get you backto what is our final

(20:56):
conversation the series now withBecky, Dan and Lucy.

Rich Hurst (21:01):
How big a challenge is that going to be, then trying
to improve, you know, whateverresources it's going to take,
kind of taking it beyond that.Because where, you know, talk
about the drop off, where do youstop getting involved and try
and hand it on to other, otherorganizations?

Becky Williams (21:16):
I think that's why working with community,
clubs and organizations is sucha fundamental part of who it
goes can as well. So everythingis delivered by local
organizations. So, you know,we've got the court, the skating
rink, we've got Hereford yogacenter, functional fitness
through aerial hoop. You know,it's really varied in terms of

(21:39):
what we offer young people onand importantly, their non
traditional activities as well.So like what Dan was saying
around that perception of whatPE looks like, actually, we're
kind of broadening those ideasthat this isn't just what PE is
like. It's much, much wider thanthis. So working with those
community organizations, it doesmean that young people can start
to then go into exit routes, andagain, that's some of the
feedback that we've heard, thata young person that's come to

(22:01):
here goes can, and they've nowjoined aerial hoop as a result
of that. So because they foundthat they like and they engage
with and equally, it might notbe, you know, we are a really
sparsely populated county, so weknow that not everyone can come
into the center of Hereford. Butwhat it does, it places them in
community venues with communityproviders. It helps them to
understand what that looks liketo walk through the door of

(22:22):
somewhere different for thefirst time, rather than just
their own school sports hall.And all of that really makes a
difference. And again, we've hadteachers say that girls have
joined clubs in their own area,so ones that we haven't used as
part of here, girls can, butthey've liked that activity and
then found that locally. Soyeah, they are fundamentally
important. And I suppose that'swhere the work of active
heritage and Worcester comes inis actually supported. Actually

(22:42):
supporting that widerinfrastructure. Because for us
as stride active, you know, ourwork is, is solely around
schools and supporting schools,and that's where you know, our
work sits. But that partnershipthat we have with active
heritage and Worcestershiremeans actually we can almost
say, right, this is developing.We now need some support to
actually help those widercommunity organizations to adapt

(23:02):
and take on some of this aswell.

Unknown (23:05):
And they have engaged really well with here goes cam
program, and we did a conferencecollaboratively last year,
which, again, both Lucy and Dancame to and we had local
providers come and talk anddeliver as well. So they're
engaged in this movement aswell, and they want to make a
difference. And I think bringingall these partners together has
been the really fundamental bitin terms of hopefully making

(23:27):
that long term change

Rich Hurst (23:29):
What was the what was the conference that
impressed you most? Then Lucyjust nodding away about what?
But what Becky was saying abouthow it went and everyone that
came in, what did you see thatwas really encouraging. I

Lucy Finch (23:38):
t was interesting just to hear new ideas and new
ideas, not just in schools, butthrough clubs and different
things that we can sort ofimplement in school. So there
was an idea that was mentionedby Dan that took up a lot of
interest that we've sort ofincluded now in our changing
room. So the use of one of thewalls painted black, and the

(24:00):
kids have had their and thegirls have had their chance to
put their inspirations for 2024in so they can write what they
want to achieve in sport or ingeneral, for that year, which is
sort of, they can go in thechanging rooms and have a look
at and know that they've madethat input. Yeah. So it's
interesting to hear new ideasthat we can sort of implement in

(24:20):
schools as well.

Dan Thomas (24:21):
The important thing with that was we put it. We
tried this the first year we'vedone it, and we've tried it this
year in the girls changingrooms, so it's just the girls,
so they're not judged by theboys as they walk past. But I
think over the over the years,that's something we want to
maybe put it in the foyer, sothat everybody can see it and
share that and celebrate that.But I think initially, just to
get that foot in Him, we decidedthe girls change rooms the best.

(24:42):
But yeah, can you, can you shareanything that they've put on
there?
Well, loose, no better than me.But the ones that I the ones
that I've seen vaguely are likethings such as, like wanting to
win the football cup with theschool this year. And there's
simple things. It's just likepeople like, go out.
Running more or be eat morehealthily and go to the gym

(25:04):
three times a week, that sort ofthing. It's just simple little
things that

Becky Williams (25:08):
that they're achievable. And it's just nice
to hear that the girls that thatthey probably wouldn't have had
that safe space to share thatbefore, and it's just their
opportunity. And we thoughtlike, say, vandalize them some
property for the kids is aneasy, easy win. So, yeah, it's
what? It's a long way fromwriting. Dan was here something
basically, wasn't it? Yeah, Iget it. I get it. But it's funny

(25:29):
how those ideas come round. Likeyou say you've got that into the
conference, and all of a suddenthese things start getting
picked up by everybody. So thisnow, I suppose, for the future,
poses in a nice system, in thatway of what you've with, the
feedback you're getting, thesharing you're doing with people
like active Herefordshire andWorcestershire, and then
everybody building on that, notobviously just here, but also

(25:50):
elsewhere. Yeah, very much. Soand what we need to do now is to
create the same kind of movementin all schools like Kingston
have got here, and that's whywe're really starting to pick
out kind of or almost Ambassadorschools, which are schools like
Kingston, bishops St Mary'sschools locally, that are really
leading the way and making somefundamental changes and actually

(26:12):
being bold enough to make thosechanges. I think that's one
thing that's been really nice tohear about some of the changes
that you've made here, is thatyou're not afraid to make them,
and they're having positiveimpacts. And we to share that
now and share best practice. AndI think that was another thing
that we had at the conference.Bishop actually delivered a
presentation there as well. Sohead of pea delivered a

(26:33):
presentation around the changesthat they had made as a result
of this, and that includedthings like providing CPD lip
skin in teachers, around themenstrual cycle and the effect
that has on girls participation,and just trying to normalize
that conversation. Because,again, that was one thing I
think, Lisa, we've talked a lotabout that, haven't we, when
we've done your girls championtraining, that girls want to

(26:56):
have that conversation, but it'sa massive barrier, and we
therefore need to make sure thateveryone's educated to have that
conversation confidently. And Ithink, you know, Kingston are a
place where That definitelyhappens now. And you know, it's
like testament to Dan, like, thefact that when we did a he goes
can conference, it waspredominantly attended by female
PE teachers, which is not whatwe want. We want. We want as

(27:17):
many males there as possible.And that's where you can see
that, you know, Kingston havereally taken us on board,
because Dan was one of the veryfemales that that came, and it
was so important that he wasthere. And we really want to
highlight that actually, becausethat's therefore where you're
seeing the change, because he'svery happy to talk about it, and
he believes in it and and youcan see it's reaping the

(27:40):
benefits in this school. Lucy,what signs are you seeing, then
that this is this is working? Ithink it's just the vast numbers
that we have at clubs. When Ifirst started a year ago, clubs
were sort of sparse. You'd havethe odd few turn up, and it
would predominantly be thosethat were attending all the

(28:00):
other sports are sporty,traditional sporty ones. Yeah.
So it's nice to see that thereare a different range of
students turning up, and justthe numbers that consistently
turn up both lunch times andafter schools. It's really nice
to see.

Dan Thomas (28:15):
I want to round off by sharing some of the things
that have worked for you withpeople who are trying to get,
maybe not just necessarilygirls, but disengaged groups, I
suppose, into sport, intophysical activity. Now I know I
could ask, I could ask any ofyou to tell us about the
benefits of sport and physicalactivity in in wider life. I
think that's a very broad, openmessage. But I want to, I

(28:36):
suppose, now down tospecifically what's worked on
this program, what you're goingto continue doing and trying to
share important tips that way. Ithink it's the best way to do
it. So Dan, I'm going to startwith you. Can you give us some
of the best things that haveworked, or some really good tips
when it comes to what you'veseen work? Yeah, so the best
things really have been so whenwe first started the program was

(28:59):
it was targeted at specificstudents, and it was a small
focus group. So Chloe, who wasthe previous teacher who took
the initial lead on it, shestarted with a small focus group
with our girls champions. Wethen listened to the students
they all wanted. Oh, why is itonly those girls that get to go
and then it was nice to seelike, sometimes more sporty
girls we'd love to go and playwith so and so and so and so as

(29:22):
well. And it was actually nicethis year, I went down to a
fixture loose was doing thegirls fixture outside, and there
was one girl who you wouldn'tclass as being a sporty girl at
all. And she surprised somepeople, but she definitely
surprised me with how gifted shewas at football. And one of the
girls, the captain the team,went up to her and patted her on

(29:43):
the back hat. She made a reallygood, really good pass. And it
was just that, that moment therewas like, right? That's, that's
what this we've been trying toachieve. And it started to open
those barriers. And now we'vegone from having this small
focus group that came on alunchtime with our girls
champion to now Lucy's getting.
60, 7080, girls there atlunchtime, just wanting to play,

(30:03):
and they were all playing witheach other, and there's no
nastiness in there. You can seethe encouragement that's going
on in there. So having expandingthat out, so so that initial
target group, and then beingable to expand and increase the
numbers, we then like highlightthat just before Christmas, we
did a Girls Night In was an ideathat we stole from from somebody
else. And we did, we did glow inthe dark dodge ball in the

(30:28):
Sports Hall, which went down.They had, like, glow sticks, UV
paints. We had the girlschampions were like, selling
sweets and drinks as well. Andthen we had in the screen in the
foyer. We had some just dance onthere as well, and it's just
music playing. And, yeah, Ithink that just then was a
really good way to to round itall off. And that's like, right?

(30:49):
We're now at that stage, like,we've gone from five, five to 10
girls trying to get engaged tonow we've got that mass
participation, and they'recomfortable in participating
with each other, and we'vebroken a barrier. So it's now
moving on to that next stage,but the end, they would be my
couple of successes that I'dencourage other people to have a
go at. Okay, Lucy, what aboutyou? So we the start of the

(31:12):
year. We all separated justbefore PE separated the girls
off from the boys, just so thatwe could sort of speak about the
barriers or different thingsthat came to it, which is where
we introduced them, at thesports bras and we had a chat
about how we can support ourbodies and things when we
participate. And then the men'srecycle is also one of those

(31:32):
topics that we spoke about. Andit's just, it's just interesting
to see, and it's nice to seethat from those conversations
that we we spoke about all yeargroups, how confident they are
to speak to you about those soat the start, you wouldn't, it
would be an awkwardconversation, and it would be a
quiet thing that they'd say toyou on the slide. And now it's,
it's having that openness andthat open conversation that they

(31:53):
can come to you and they ask youand and they're not afraid. It's
quite nice. They're not afraidto say what they are, what they
need, which is, which is nice,yeah, what's, what's the secret
to creating that environment?
I think, like, just with us,we're very fortunate to have
somebody like Lucy, where we gota role model for our students,

(32:14):
and something that they're,they're happy to go and
approach,
like loose, loose places, a verygood level of football outside
of school. And so what we didwas, one of the smaller things
we did was, right, we need torole model everybody playing
sports. So it's not just those,those kids. So we got all the
staff, we've got posters on thewindow to put up a photo of them

(32:34):
playing sport. So even like, itdoesn't matter if you're an
English teacher, a geographyteacher, just because you're not
PE teacher doesn't mean youcan't play sports. So then, then
encourage, I think students tendto have that openness about
having having a conversation,and, like I say, going back then
to loose and having that rolemodel within the department that
they come and speak to Lucyabout things like that, about

(32:55):
sports bras and advice where toget best legions from. And it's,
it's really nice that they canhave conversations about
what they're doing when they goto the gym and things like that
that just they wouldn't, theywouldn't normally be open to.
And I think it's just yeah, likerole modeling in it, and just
showing that we're all human,we're all it doesn't matter,

(33:16):
shape, size, whatever age, like,it doesn't, it doesn't matter.
And yet, having that, those rolethose positive role models for
them to look up, to

Rich Hurst (33:25):
Becky from a slightly more strategic point of
view, obviously, what the guysare doing on the ground and
Kingston is working in differentways. From a strategic point of
view, trying to embed somethinglike this. What are your key
kind of tips or bits of advicefor starting a movement like
that? I think it will be to takethe full design principles that
have come from girls,

Becky Williams (33:45):
because they can work across any situation any
school. So they are to createjudgment free zones so the girls
don't feel judged by anyone,whether that's boys, the sporto
girls, they feel safe andinclusive, like some of the
examples that you've heard bothLucy and Dan talk about today,
to feel comfortable. So again,that relates predominantly to
kits and what they're wearing,how they feel on their bodies.
Again, we've seen some changesthere mood and choice. So

(34:08):
depending on how girls feltabout themselves, or what mood
they were in, they wanted thechoice to take part in different
things. So not just doing teamsports, but individual sports,
sometimes having things that arelower intensity or higher
intensity, so around having thatchoice around what they can take
part in, which, again, we'veheard about that as well today.
And the final one is fun. Sothat's the fourth one, and that

(34:30):
was time to socialize withfriends, to chat, to have music.
Music is a massive game change,and we started to introduce that
into some of our other eventsthat we do. Just having some
music in the background, and itchanges the whole dynamic as
well. You know, we ran the kindof, kind of participation
netball tournaments, again,targeting these kind of girls,
and we just put some music on,and in between the games,
they're just dancing, justtaking part, and the whole

(34:52):
atmosphere is very, verydifferent. So they're the full
design principles that we use,and we've seen schools take
those and.
Those and embed them, because Ithink they just give some very
clear parameters, but theflexibility that any
organization can do their ownthing with that. And again, just
listening to girls, I thinkthat's the most important thing

(35:13):
we can say, is that when youstop and you listen to the
girls, the American teacher thatsaid, Oh my gosh, I didn't
realize they felt like that, orI wasn't even aware that that
was a thing, or, you know, thatthat has been the biggest
difference for a lot of schools,not schools that have made
change off the back of theprogram is listening to the
girls and what they want. Andfine, we touched on it earlier,
but I just want to reinforcethat point of how useful that

(35:35):
partnership with active heritageand Worcester is going to be
going forward. Just give us afinal thought on that. Oh,
absolutely, because it means,you know, when we work together,
we can pull resources, andthat's really important, you
know, they they've got a lot ofinsight, which they're able to
share with us in terms of girlsparticipation. So we can do more
targeted work. I just think, youknow, bringing together lots of

(35:56):
different ideas is really,really important. So, you know,
we work really closely with thechildren and people team, but
also with the marketing leads,because that's a really
fundamental part of this, is howwe promote this and how we
engage others in it as well. Soactually, it's drawing on all
those different sets ofexpertise from both our
organization, the schools, andalso active heritage and water

(36:19):
tour as well.

Rich Hurst (36:21):
So our thanks to Becky Lucy and Dan for their
time chatting. Hopefully youfound it useful and inspiring.
We've added some links in theshow notes about here girls can,
as well as plenty of other itemsaround funding, partnerships and
community bodies. To find outmore about what active
Herefordshire and Worcestershirecan do, go to their website,
active hw.co.uk,

(36:43):
remember, there are otherepisodes in this series, so make
sure you subscribe to keep aneye on active Herefordshire and
Worcestershire social channelsfor more, but thanks for
listening, and we hope you'vereally benefited From being part
of the active best practicenetwork. You