Welcome to the Actor's Guide Podcast, Episode 22!
The podcast has hit a small milestone, and E-Kan and Rían will discuss the significance of getting to its 22nd episode and a shocking statistic of how many people quit. E-Kan also talks about what actors can learn from YouTubers about building a brand and dealing with the creative grind, and the biggest misconception about building an audience. If you’re getting burnt out from the marathon of being a creative, this is the episode for you.
Also this week Rob Lowe had some fiery criticisms of the lack of production in Hollywood and said LA should be fired. Does he have a point? E-Kan and Rían also discuss what the bigger story is about his comments that everyone is missing. Rob Lowe coincidentally is shooting a show in Dublin, and the guys discuss how the city is booming with production right now. Is Dublin going to take over Hollywood? And the bigger question - is that a good thing?
They also talk about how, despite the recent positive news about California’s film and tv tax credits, a filmmaker named Cat Rhinehart has a heartbreaking story of getting rejected for CA Film tax credit three times…
And if you stick around, you’ll also hear why many think 1 podcast subscriber equals 1000 followers on Instagram. This is going to be a good one…
Send us your questions actorsguidepodcast@gmail.com! Follow us on YouTube, Substack, and all social media @actorsguidepodcast!
Links:
https://www.reddit.com/r/podcasting/comments/1jjmjot/how_long_did_it_take_you_to_get_to_a_1000/
Rob Lowe interview with Adam Scott- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ELn-95HeRE
Filmmaker Cat Rhinehart video about CA tax credit -https://www.instagram.com/reel/DHKEmNNygtS/?igsh=NTc4MTIwNjQ2YQ==
Hidden gems-
https://newbridgehouseandfarm.com/
Capri Club - https://capriclublosangeles.com/ner.com/products/sal-suds-biodegradable-cleaner?srsltid=AfmBOormctFIcl9lQ3AJZd_ejc9q20QuVNFjTynNd3UF7sdGQm9HmrmF
Time stamps:
(00:00) Intro
(04:10) Rob Lowe says LA should be fired
(08:00) The most surprising thing about Rob Lowe’s comments
(10:50) Filmmaker gets denied for tax credits three times
(13:30) Dublin taking over Hollywood?
(14:20) The problem with studios going international
(17:30) How many podcasts fail
(21:00) What can actors learn from the YouTubers
(23:30) How actors should measure their growth
(27:30) Why podcasts followers are stronger than social media followers
(30:20) Hidden Gems
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
All right, welcome to
the Actors Guide podcast,
The End of the World.
My name's E-Kan Soong
and this is my co-host.
Rían Sheehy Kelly, did you say--
Wait, wait, I said it wrong, right?
You said Actors Guide
podcast to the end of the world.
Okay, I had a feeling
that was a little off.
Okay, let me try again.
Hey guys, welcome to the Actors Guide
(00:21):
to the End of the World podcast
where we talk about acting in Hollywood
in a way people understand.
I'm your host, E-Kan
Song and this is my co-host.
Rían Sheehy Kelly, how are you doing?
What's up, buddy?
I'm good, dude.
Make sure you follow us
wherever you find your podcast.
We're also on YouTube and
Substack if you like video.
Follow us wherever you find social media.
Wait, what's so funny?
(00:41):
I was just laughing at if you like video.
You like moving pictures.
We're on Substack.
Yeah, you know, whatever you're into.
Do you hate museums
because the pictures don't move?
Yeah, exactly.
For all of you guys out
there that hate museums,
we got you covered at Actors Guide
Podcasts on social media.
(01:03):
Send your emails, comments,
actorsguidepodcasts.gmail.com.
I mean, this is a tongue twister.
This is a tongue twister every day.
By the way, we had incredible comments
about our Jeremy
Strong, Kieran Culkin debate.
Yeah.
I don't know if you got that.
Rude up a little storm, I saw.
Yeah, we got some fiery
comments about the differences
(01:24):
between Jeremy Strong
and his intense process
and Kieran Culkin's Go with the Flow.
I think a lot of actors were going with
the traditional route,
preferring Jeremy Strong's passion
over Kieran Culkin's casual nature.
His folly.
To say the least.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, it's interesting.
(01:46):
It's interesting.
It is.
I mean, that's also the difference
between social media
and society and also, you
know, a lot of what people
inside Hollywood and
actors actually think.
So anyway.
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(02:07):
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(laughing)
First off, we're talking
about Rob Lowe's comments
on his podcast.
(02:28):
He had some hard shots fired at LA
and the state of Hollywood.
He also happens to be
shooting a show in Ireland.
So he has, you know, a
very specific insight.
Yeah, we'll get into that.
Also, today is a very special episode.
(02:50):
This is episode number 22 for us.
For those in the podcast world,
there is a statistic
about hitting 21 episodes.
We're gonna get into that.
We're gonna get into what it's been like
to build this podcast from scratch,
what we learned, what we didn't.
And, you know, maybe
you're not building anything
or building a podcast,
(03:12):
but if you're creative
and you're getting worn
out from the marathon,
this episode's for you.
And also we're gonna talk about
how that connects to our acting careers.
It is a marathon, isn't it?
Acting, it's career is long.
So yeah, it's gonna be a good one?
Yeah, absolutely.
I just, and one more
thing I wanna add to that
is we're gonna teach
you how to birth a calf.
(03:33):
Because it's spring.
It's not, we're not gonna do that.
That's what you've been
doing over in Ireland.
Well, I was on a farm
a couple of days ago.
And that's--
Legit farm.
Yeah, I went to, you
know what I might say?
I might save it as a hidden gem,
but it's probably a gem that
a lot of people know about.
If your gem is how to birth a calf,
(03:54):
I have a feeling that a lot of people
might not know that.
Strong forearms, that's the key.
Yeah, well there's a
dirty joke in there somewhere,
but we're not gonna go there.
No, we're not.
Talking about cows, come on.
So first off, word around town.
We both heard this
clip, and to be honest,
this clip definitely got around.
(04:17):
Rob Lowe does not mince words.
He was interviewing Adam Scott.
He was talking about
his show, his game show,
that he shoots in Ireland.
And he made an off
comment saying that it's cheaper
to fly 100 Americans for this game show
than actually shoot across the
street in LA, at the studios.
(04:40):
This blows my mind.
It's a game show.
He's not the only one.
Jamie Foxx does one too.
Jamie Foxx shoots a game show as well.
Oh, that's right.
We were talking about Jamie Foxx's show.
Thank you for reminding me.
We were actually thinking
about getting into the story
earlier because we heard
that there was a game show
shooting in Ireland, that
they were sending Americans
(05:02):
flying them over to Ireland.
We couldn't get a direct,
we couldn't get a conclusive
answer on that, so we didn't
really bring up that story.
But we just got it from Rob Lowe,
the fact that they're
sending 100 Americans
for his game show that
he shoots in Ireland.
So I got it mixed up with Rob Lowe,
but it was actually
Jamie Foxx, you're right.
Rob Lowe took shots.
He said LA should be
(05:22):
fired for what's happening
with film and TV.
It's still mind boggling
to me that it's cheaper
to do that here than it is in LA.
Another example of what
we've been talking about,
hopefully ad nauseam,
because we're trying to get
California and we're trying to get LA
to do something about it.
(05:43):
But also, I'm okay with Ireland.
I'm okay with Ireland
doing something about it
right now as well,
because I have a different,
I have a different perspective here.
I have a vested interest in
Ireland doing well as well.
Rob Lowe said
something interesting as well,
because he said he was
set to do his next show
in New York, and that he was ready to go,
(06:05):
and then it was going
to be shot in New York,
so he just pulled it,
because he didn't want
to move to New York.
And I was thinking
about that, and I was like,
okay, I understand that, but also,
so many other people involved in that.
Imagine getting cast in a
show, and the lead is like,
I don't want to go to
New York to do this,
and the whole show gets pulled,
and it may never come back, you know?
That's quite a blow.
(06:27):
It's just the way he
said it, I was like, ooh.
That's a really great point.
There's a lot of people
involved in that show,
and I understand that he's in a position
where he doesn't have
to move to New York,
so if he doesn't want to,
and it upset his family life
and everything else, but
also, there are a lot of people
involved in a show, you know?
It was just a little
(06:49):
shocking to hear the way
he talked about it, I was like, ooh, wow.
That's a great point, I was actually
gonna bring that up,
but I didn't even look
at it from that side.
So real quick about these comments,
we'll put the link in the description.
Rob Lowe does not mince
words, and we would love
to be in the position
to fire shots like that.
Rob Lowe was very
vocal during the strikes,
(07:10):
he was actively on
the streets, picketing,
his heart is with LA,
this is where his home is,
and it's great, we want
more stars to be that vocal.
I actually thought
what you just brought up
was the more
interesting part of the story,
is a lot of crew,
especially in Hollywood,
was always pointing fingers
at A-list stars and saying,
(07:31):
hey, you know what, it's
about time that Brad Pitt
and all the A-listers start
fighting to keep productions
in Hollywood, and start
fighting to keep productions
in California, if you're a
star, and if you have power,
you really need to start
stepping up and leverage that,
because we need to keep
productions in California.
That's what a lot of
people on crew stories and so on
(07:54):
is what the narrative is.
And you said this, but the
deal was already good to go.
It was inked, the scripts are ready,
they were ready to
greenlight, and he said,
they said, we're gonna
shoot this in New York,
and he said, I'm not
moving to New York for this.
Yep.
What I thought was interesting was,
as powerful as Rob Lowe
(08:14):
is, he wasn't big enough
to change the studio's decision.
I think what I'm getting at is,
there's no star that's big enough
to help the studio's bottom line.
If they see it's cost
effective to be in New York,
or Atlanta, or Budapest, or Ireland,
they're going to do it, it
doesn't matter what the star is.
(08:34):
And unfortunately, us as actors,
and even Rob Lowe as powerful as he is,
he doesn't have that power.
Now, I don't know, to your point,
I don't know if he knew
the show was gonna poof
and magically go away.
I think he was also saying, hey guys,
we have a bunch of studio lots here,
I'm pretty sure we could do this in LA.
(08:56):
He probably was
intending on doing it in LA,
and they just put this out to him,
and it might have been a game of chicken,
and they didn't bluff.
I see, I didn't realize that yet.
Now that's a decision
with him, his family,
I mean, we can't speculate on that,
but when it comes down to it,
the studio, the show
(09:17):
just magically went away.
I'm actually a little surprised
that they didn't try to replace Rob Lowe,
but the show just magically went away,
and it went poof.
So we don't really know
the ins and outs of that,
but that's what I gather is,
a powerful star is not powerful enough,
to stop the studio's decisions.
(09:38):
You also know of a director
who was set to direct a movie in LA,
and I think was
willing to forego his salary
to get it made in LA,
but it just, it was too expensive,
and they wouldn't do it.
They wouldn't shoot in LA.
On that note, we're
coming out of award season,
(09:58):
we've been talking about the finances
of all these Oscar films.
This is why Brady Corbett
makes $0 making The Brutalist.
This is exactly why.
They're trying to save as much money,
and on top of it, they shot The Brutalist
in frickin' Budapest.
Adam Scott and Rob Lowe
were literally saying,
if we made Parks and Rec today,
we'd be shooting in Budapest.
(10:18):
Yeah.
That's wild, that is wild.
And also, Adam Scott just
made a movie in Ireland.
They did have very nice
things to say about Dublin,
which is nice.
Good, good.
What are these days?
I can't wait for the day
that we shoot a live podcast,
you and me in the same room, in Dublin.
Yeah, in Dublin, in Dublin podcast.
(10:38):
Okay, so on this note as we wrap this up,
we do know that there
is a lot of positive news
coming out of California.
51 projects got
approved for the tax credit.
So I don't think anyone's
taking Rob Lowe's comments
as gospel when he was
talking about the tax credits.
(10:58):
He was talking very loosely.
Obviously, California has tax credits,
but it's just trying to keep competitive
with Atlanta and New York and so on.
Someone sent this my way and it was
pretty heartbreaking.
Someone sent this video of a director,
her name's Kat Reinhardt.
I don't know her personally,
but someone sent me her video.
(11:18):
She talked about how she
got rejected for a tax credit.
Oh. This round.
She got rejected multiple times.
And I believe this movie was $10 million.
Okay. She's ready to go
with this movie, $10 million.
Her heart and soul is in it and it got
(11:40):
rejected three times.
Wow. And she made this point
that, hey, you guys aren't even,
there's nothing
pleasant about this process.
We're trying to bring jobs to California
and we want this to be in LA.
And I've never talked to anyone
who's actually
actively tried to get approved
for a tax credit and she has,
(12:02):
I'll link her video into the description,
but she has a long video
talking about the entire process.
Yeah. Does she explain
the criteria on what
grounds was it rejected?
I don't know if she gets, I don't know,
to be honest, I don't think she actually,
I don't even think she
knows why she got rejected.
Interesting, okay.
But when you hear that
46 films got approved
(12:23):
and she tried three times and she didn't,
and the budget is $10 million
and you're trying to
bring work to California,
I don't know if there's any good reason
to get rejected at that point.
Yeah. So we'll put that video
in the description, but dig into that
because there are not
always Rosie's stories
coming out of LA and at that point,
(12:43):
stay in LA, the petition is trying to get
tax credits uncapped.
Just uncap them and just,
while we're trying to
recover from the fires
and everything else, just uncap them
and just keep shooting and
if anyone's ready to shoot,
let them shoot.
That's interesting. So yeah.
And on the flip side of that,
(13:04):
I know of someone
who's trying to get a movie
produced in Ireland and
they've been going through
that process and they
were told that it is so busy
in Ireland right now that
they would have to fly crew in
from Eastern Europe to make this movie.
So that's how busy it is here.
(13:26):
I did see someone post some
very strong opinions on this,
basically alluding to the
fact that the rates here
are lower than the US for
everybody across the board
and that's why, in a
sense, they felt like Ireland
was getting taken advantage of
because they were able
to make things so much,
(13:48):
for so much less here.
And then I was talking to
someone about it yesterday
and the counterpoint
they made to that was then,
was like, well, okay,
but you raised the rates
for everybody and you
lose the production.
So what's the happy medium?
You know what I mean?
And it's this balance of,
it's brilliant that
there's production here.
Yes, the rates are a lot lower.
So there's a kind of
(14:11):
an ebb and flow of that
where it's a delicate balance.
You're completely right, Ryan.
It's funny, I was totally
not going to bring this up.
You look at the contract,
you look at all the things
that we're fighting
as a union and you say,
we pushed everyone away
because our rates are too high.
And the counterpoint is,
(14:32):
well, we're trying to
get paid a fair wage.
Sure, there are always
places that are cheaper to shoot,
yet are you saying we
should not fight for a fair wage
and get residuals and get union rates?
Now, here's the thing,
you're completely right.
And this is not only Ireland.
I think it's really,
(14:53):
I'm glad that you put the
opinion of who said that
because when it comes
down to it, you're right.
Is it worth having
these productions come in
and quote unquote,
take advantage of Ireland?
A lot of other people say,
look at how much they're bringing in.
They're bringing in other industries.
They're bringing in
people who are doing props,
(15:16):
clothing, laundromats,
who are doing all the dry cleaning.
Look at how much money's coming in.
It's not just Ireland.
They've been doing it in Asia for years.
By the way, did you
notice how many Korean shows
are on Netflix?
Okay, this was not an accident.
They were hitting Korea
hard for the past three,
(15:38):
four years, even before Squid Game.
Squid Game was the cherry on top, okay?
And we know for a fact,
in Asia, no union
restrictions, no nothing.
And to be honest, that's
another project for us.
I'm going to go in the numbers
and I'm going to see who gets paid more,
Ireland or Korea.
Oh, that's interesting.
(15:58):
And we're going to see who's really
gonna take advantage of.
Because when it comes down to it,
these union regulations
are not paying residuals,
are not paying for a lot of things.
And by the way, Korea is
starting to think about
trying to unionize.
Wow.
This is what's going to happen.
Korea's like, "Hey,
(16:18):
you've been tapping us dry."
Oh yeah, Squid Game is
also a huge international hit.
We're going to start thinking about
changing some contracts now.
And so, when it comes down to it,
it's great for the studio to
go find the cheapest dollar.
You're going to run these places dry.
And then eventually
everyone's going to fight
(16:39):
for a fair wage.
Anyway, you just lit me up.
No, no, that's great.
But I think the
measure of it for me is like,
you know, if you're a
working professional,
like can you make a living from this?
I think that's the benchmark.
I think it's a livable profession,
but unfortunately as time goes on,
it's going to be livable for a smaller
(17:01):
and smaller amount of people.
And I think that's the issue
that we're having right now.
Yeah, because even on
the Crew Stories Instagram
or Facebook page, I mean, it talks,
you see so many people say,
you know, Crew Member
for X amount of years.
I had to quit this year
because I just wasn't making any money.
It's brutal.
That's how most of the
older Crew Members feel.
(17:23):
And it's sad.
All right.
Well, on that cheery note.
(both laughing)
I was bringing the jokes.
So let's dig into this.
We're going to talk about
a couple of statistics here
that is just kind of
eye-opening for podcasts.
And it also really applies
to anyone building anything creative.
(17:44):
Found this out before we started this,
but I was always in the back
of my mind, remembering this.
90% of podcasts don't
get past episode three.
That's wild.
Three episodes.
That's 1.8 million who quit.
This post was from three years ago.
So just imagine
(18:04):
there's more podcasts now.
So this statistic is
probably even more stark.
Of the podcasts that are left,
90% will quit after 20 episodes.
That's another 180,000
podcasts that vanish.
To be in the top 1% of podcasts,
(18:25):
you only need to publish
21 episodes of your podcast.
(both laughing)
Your competition is not
the 2 million podcasts.
It's the 20,000
podcasters who didn't quit.
Obviously, we're not doing this to pat
ourselves on the back,
but this is a time to,
like we have talked
(18:45):
about in past episodes,
celebrate the small victories.
By the way, a lot of
podcasters probably don't even know
this quote or don't know the statistic.
Well, I think it's a
testament to sort of the shared ethos
or the shared sort of
goal that both of us got
into this podcast for the same reasons.
And that was to get free stuff.
(19:07):
You know what?
We have not got nearly
enough free stuff yet.
It hasn't felt like a ton
of work to me, to be honest.
Now I know, to be fair,
you do the lion's share
of the work involved in this podcast.
You can't edit the podcast just in case
you don't like the edit.
It's him, it's him, it's not me.
I kind of just show up
and talk, which is lovely.
(19:27):
Do a lot of people
underestimate how important it is
just to show up?
Sure.
Because it gets a little murky
when we talk about actors, right?
Because we can easily say,
what is that benchmark for actors?
It was a blessing to have
this quote for you and I
to start building this.
I was like, let's
just get to 21 episodes.
What does showing up for an actor mean?
(19:49):
It means I'm gonna still
submit myself on actor's access.
I'm gonna try to get an agent.
Are you gonna stay in class?
Dio, we're gonna bring
up this metaphor again,
but we're talking about the
marathon and not the sprint.
Killian Murphy, around the time when he
was doing Oppenheimer,
he said it took me 20
years to build a career.
The real hard work that's
not sexy is consistency.
And no one is applauding
(20:10):
you when it's happening.
But in hindsight,
consistency looks great.
But it's never celebrated
when you're actually in it
doing it.
Yeah, it's really interesting, isn't it?
Like the 20 year thing,
and I can totally identify with that.
What does showing up mean?
It probably depends
on why you're doing it.
(20:33):
As well, you know what I mean?
Or your experience of it.
Like if you're showing up all the time
and you're not happy,
if you're showing up
and you're going to class
and you're doing all the things that
we're talking about,
but you're just not happy and
you're just miserable in it,
it's probably not worth showing up for.
You know what I mean?
I think the only reason
I've been able to stay in it
(20:56):
is because I really enjoy it.
And it's kind of an, I'm
sort of obsessed with it.
You know what I mean?
Well, you might be a bad example because
you love it too much.
Haven't I was showing up in the same way.
You know what I mean?
There are times and periods in my life
where I wasn't doing the amount of work
(21:16):
that I do right now.
So showing up is kind of
the gradients of that too.
For actors, so much of our
world is so not concrete.
And I think that's why
it's nice to have this podcast
statistic as a parallel.
I was goofing around on YouTube
before we started this podcast.
There are some things that
(21:37):
I was lucky enough to learn.
Subscribers and views are vanity metrics.
Subscribers and views are vanity metrics.
That's interesting.
So this subscribers on
YouTube is essentially
the same thing as followers on Instagram.
So now we're going to talk about growth.
(21:57):
Now we're going to talk about metrics
as far as how do you
know that you're growing?
We won't get into the
weeds about this stuff,
but this is a good
parallel for those as an actor.
It doesn't matter how many
people are subscribed to you.
The important part is it's
going to take you a long while
or many episodes to figure out
what the F you're even talking about.
(22:17):
You have so many other
things to worry about.
Do not worry about the vanity metrics.
Interesting.
And as an actor, you might
be worried about followers
and how come no one's
following me and blah, blah, blah.
Well, first off, maybe
focus on your career,
getting really good.
Denzel Washington says the best marketing
is being really good.
(22:38):
Where does the money come into it though?
That's where Ria was.
The way that the money is calculated
is you need to hit a
threshold of subscribers,
you get monetized and you get paid
depending on how long
people are watching.
Oh, so it's not, so yeah, okay.
So it means, it really means something.
(22:59):
It does mean something.
So if you have something
that was super clickbaity
and you had a bajillion
people followed it and watched you
and your video was five seconds
about some kid tripping on the sidewalk,
you were only getting
paid for that watch duration
and your video was
(23:19):
super short and clickbaity.
This is the game.
They don't know if they
want to subscribe yet.
They don't know if they like you.
Maybe you said something
that they might wanna
watch for five minutes
and you have to
realize that's really good.
This is a great segue
because we're gonna get into this.
The question is, is what is your brand
and what are you selling?
(23:40):
And that also goes back to
our, in our acting world.
I can compare myself to a
six foot blonde swimsuit model.
I could do that all day.
You often do.
But then at what point?
(laughing)
But really that's private.
What I do in my
private time is just between,
is just between us.
(24:00):
And this is actually a
couple of these tidbits
actually came from the podcasting Reddit.
How long did it take you to
get to a thousand downloads
in an episode in the first seven days?
This is not meant to be
super inside baseball,
but there's a point to this.
And someone put a great response.
You cannot compare
listens with another podcast
(24:22):
unless the two podcasts in question
are in the same listening space.
True crime or comedy
podcasts have a much higher ceiling
in terms of potential listens.
Yet one targeted at woodworkers
who exclusively builds wash basins
has a completely
different potential listen.
(24:43):
Some shows will never
get to a thousand listens
in the first week,
but can be considered
quite successful nonetheless.
The answer you're looking
for is not going to help you.
(laughing)
So the answer you seek is not this path.
You see how important
niche branding it is.
(25:06):
It's so much harder as
an actor, to be honest.
Because we go to an audition,
we see 15 people just like us, if not 25.
What are you going to do with these
metrics and analytics
to tell you if you're growing?
Do you count the number of auditions?
This is why it's so sometimes harmful
to compare yourself to other actors.
(25:26):
You can go on threads,
or you can go on Instagram
and hear other actors
having so many auditions.
What kind of auditions are they?
Are they non-union?
Are they commercial?
Are they stage?
Are they TV?
Are they film?
You don't know.
So what good does it do you?
They could be in a different city.
And what if the industry is just so slow
that your lack of auditions
has nothing to do with you?
(25:47):
It's just the fact
that the industry is slow.
This is the problem
with most of these metrics
and analytics that we
use to compare ourselves
to other actors.
So what if the metric is, Killian Murphy,
it took me 20, 30
years to build a career?
What if that's the metric?
Podcasts as well is
kind of a social thing too.
Because I find that
people are willing to recommend
good podcasts to you as well.
(26:08):
They're like, "Oh, you got
to check out this podcast."
It's a very kind of a,
it's like books kind of,
but it's like more sharey.
Like, "Oh, you should
listen to the actors
go to the underworld
rather than the actors
go to Italian restaurants."
Like people will recommend.
(laughing) That's a great point.
So now announcing our offshoot,
the actors go to different things.
(26:28):
That's actually a great segue.
We've had conversations every so often.
Let's just talk about the difference
between podcasts and other social media.
You brought up a great point.
It's like sharing a book.
I've heard a couple of
smart people on social media
and podcasters say this.
One podcast subscriber,
according to someone else,
is worth a thousand Instagram followers.
(26:49):
Is worth a thousand TikTok followers.
You watch TikTok and you watch Instagram.
You watch a 30 second video.
You get some information.
Often you forget who you just watched.
You're watching it for a
click hit of information
and you have no
connection to who they are.
You're not like, "Oh my God,
I love this TikTok person,"
blah, blah, blah.
(27:10):
It's gone in the algorithm.
You're already watching another video.
You don't even remember
what you just watched.
This is a weird form where our episodes
are getting to around 30 minutes now.
You come by, you stop
by, you have a good listen.
You're listening into our conversation.
We want you guys to stop by and check in
and have a good time.
You're sitting on our conversation.
(27:30):
And some of you are sitting in
for 30 minutes of this conversation.
So just imagine how
many times in your life
do you actually participate
in a long form
engagement of a conversation?
I love my mom.
I do not have, I
unfortunately don't talk to my mom.
(27:51):
I talk to her more than I
talk to my mom every week.
So if you say that, only 10
people listen to my podcast.
You have to take into
account how great that is.
10 people listen to you
speak and maybe intelligently
or maybe you made them laugh.
Just imagine in your life,
regardless of what job you are,
whatever walk of life,
(28:12):
you sat and you spoke
and 10 people were there in front of you
listening to you speak.
It's actually kind of rare.
Let's say that you
were pitching someone on,
let's say you're a
salesperson and you're pitching them on
why they should buy this vacuum cleaner.
If you're talking to 10
people, that's actually a lot.
(28:32):
And if we were in an audition room,
very rarely we're
going in person anymore.
If you're in an audition room
and you say 10 people in front of you
and you're acting in front of them,
10 people is actually a lot.
I have been in those rooms.
I had 15 people on two
small couches regularly.
Every time I went to
callbacks for this TV show,
(28:53):
15 people on two small couches.
So let's not lose the
sight of 10 real people
are listening to your
podcast for maybe 20 minutes.
And that's the power of
engagement and this platform.
Hmm, there you go.
We're really doing it.
We're really making people listen.
(29:14):
This is not just us
patting each other on the back.
I'm just kind of this mindset shift
because there's so few real metrics,
whether you're an actor,
whether you're a writer,
you're trying to
create a blog on sub-stack
and what have you.
It's a long trudge
with very few celebrations
(29:36):
and maybe few victories in the beginning.
You keep going.
I'm always a little
surprised when people say,
"Oh, I listened to this episode, I said,
"I listened to your podcast."
I'm always really kind of
taken aback, as in my head.
And I almost don't know how to react.
I almost get a little embarrassed,
even though I'm so appreciative.
100%.
Let's just remember
(29:56):
that even if you're small,
and obviously we're still small.
We're still small podcasts.
We're building, we have a lot of fans
to appreciate what we're putting out.
But when it comes down to it,
it's let's not lose the sight of--
Free stuff.
Let's not lose sight of
that we really need free stuff.
Anything, anything, doesn't have to be.
(30:17):
Can be hand lotion, just whatever.
Enough of the congratulations.
We're done patting ourselves on the back.
My hidden gem for this week is based off
what I said earlier
about visiting a farm.
And if you're in and
around Dublin Newbridge Farm
is fantastic.
And I had not been
there since I was a kid,
(30:38):
and it was excellent.
And it's spring, so
there was lots of lambs
and baby animals, baby ducks.
Go and look at these cool animals.
The biggest pig I've ever seen.
It was a huge pig.
There's a huge pig in there.
But yeah, it was great.
It was great fun.
The grounds of the
Newbridge House is lovely,
and just a really
(30:59):
pleasant, it was a really good day.
So go to Newbridge
House and Farm, if you want.
And it was only a fiver in.
There was a special on from
like Tuesday to something.
It was a five euro.
Wow, okay.
You could see baby
animals and mini horses
and aviary, all kinds
of stuff for a fiver.
Nice.
All right, cool.
(31:19):
Yeah, and we'll put the
link in the description
and all the information.
So my hidden gem, I was
celebrating a friend's birthday
at this bar lounge
thing that I never heard of.
Apparently it has a huge cult following.
It's called the Capri Club.
It's in Glendale.
I was blown away by the
(31:42):
people that were just coming in.
It was Saturday afternoon, nonstop.
They actually kicked my friends.
Well, I mean, I don't
wanna say kick them out,
but my friend's booth was getting so big
that we actually moved out to the patio.
All these hip people
from elder millennials
(32:02):
to Gen Zers coming in throughout the day.
It was just nonstop all afternoon.
So really cool little bar.
It's called the Capri Club.
Check it out if you're in
Glendale or if you're in LA.
And it's a good time.
Yeah, they had a blast.
It was really fun vibe.
So that's the Capri Club in Glendale.
(32:25):
Yeah, it is.
So that's our show everyone.
Hope you enjoyed it.
Onwards.
We'll see you next
week to episode number 23.
Absolutely.
See you next week guys.
Well, thanks for watching guys.
If you liked what you
saw, maybe give a like,
maybe subscribe.
It helps people find the podcast.
Also, if you didn't
catch last week's episode,
it's right over here.
(32:48):
Don't worry, we'll wait.
All right, welcome to
the Actors Guide podcast,
The End of the World.
My name's E-Kan Soong
and this is my co-host.
Rían Sheehy Kelly, did you say--
Wait, wait, I said it wrong, right?
You said Actors Guide
podcast to the end of the world.
Okay, I had a feeling
that was a little off.
Okay, let me try again.
Hey guys, welcome to the Actors Guide
(00:21):
to the End of the World podcast
where we talk about acting in Hollywood
in a way people understand.
I'm your host, E-Kan
Song and this is my co-host.
Rían Sheehy Kelly, how are you doing?
What's up, buddy?
I'm good, dude.
Make sure you follow us
wherever you find your podcast.
We're also on YouTube and
Substack if you like video.
Follow us wherever you find social media.
Wait, what's so funny?
(00:41):
I was just laughing at if you like video.
You like moving pictures.
We're on Substack.
Yeah, you know, whatever you're into.
Do you hate museums
because the pictures don't move?
Yeah, exactly.
For all of you guys out
there that hate museums,
we got you covered at Actors Guide
Podcasts on social media.
(01:03):
Send your emails, comments,
actorsguidepodcasts.gmail.com.
I mean, this is a tongue twister.
This is a tongue twister every day.
By the way, we had incredible comments
about our Jeremy
Strong, Kieran Culkin debate.
Yeah.
I don't know if you got that.
Rude up a little storm, I saw.
Yeah, we got some fiery
comments about the differences
(01:24):
between Jeremy Strong
and his intense process
and Kieran Culkin's Go with the Flow.
I think a lot of actors were going with
the traditional route,
preferring Jeremy Strong's passion
over Kieran Culkin's casual nature.
His folly.
To say the least.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, it's interesting.
(01:46):
It's interesting.
It is.
I mean, that's also the difference
between social media
and society and also, you
know, a lot of what people
inside Hollywood and
actors actually think.
So anyway.
And our sponsor for today's show,
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without needing to worry
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These trailers are put to the test
(02:07):
and are built to last no
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And now comes with a bidet.
For the raccoons.
(laughing)
First off, we're talking
about Rob Lowe's comments
on his podcast.
(02:28):
He had some hard shots fired at LA
and the state of Hollywood.
He also happens to be
shooting a show in Ireland.
So he has, you know, a
very specific insight.
Yeah, we'll get into that.
Also, today is a very special episode.
(02:50):
This is episode number 22 for us.
For those in the podcast world,
there is a statistic
about hitting 21 episodes.
We're gonna get into that.
We're gonna get into what it's been like
to build this podcast from scratch,
what we learned, what we didn't.
And, you know, maybe
you're not building anything
or building a podcast,
(03:12):
but if you're creative
and you're getting worn
out from the marathon,
this episode's for you.
And also we're gonna talk about
how that connects to our acting careers.
It is a marathon, isn't it?
Acting, it's career is long.
So yeah, it's gonna be a good one?
Yeah, absolutely.
I just, and one more
thing I wanna add to that
is we're gonna teach
you how to birth a calf.
(03:33):
Because it's spring.
It's not, we're not gonna do that.
That's what you've been
doing over in Ireland.
Well, I was on a farm
a couple of days ago.
And that's--
Legit farm.
Yeah, I went to, you
know what I might say?
I might save it as a hidden gem,
but it's probably a gem that
a lot of people know about.
If your gem is how to birth a calf,
(03:54):
I have a feeling that a lot of people
might not know that.
Strong forearms, that's the key.
Yeah, well there's a
dirty joke in there somewhere,
but we're not gonna go there.
No, we're not.
Talking about cows, come on.
So first off, word around town.
We both heard this
clip, and to be honest,
this clip definitely got around.
(04:17):
Rob Lowe does not mince words.
He was interviewing Adam Scott.
He was talking about
his show, his game show,
that he shoots in Ireland.
And he made an off
comment saying that it's cheaper
to fly 100 Americans for this game show
than actually shoot across the
street in LA, at the studios.
(04:40):
This blows my mind.
It's a game show.
He's not the only one.
Jamie Foxx does one too.
Jamie Foxx shoots a game show as well.
Oh, that's right.
We were talking about Jamie Foxx's show.
Thank you for reminding me.
We were actually thinking
about getting into the story
earlier because we heard
that there was a game show
shooting in Ireland, that
they were sending Americans
(05:02):
flying them over to Ireland.
We couldn't get a direct,
we couldn't get a conclusive
answer on that, so we didn't
really bring up that story.
But we just got it from Rob Lowe,
the fact that they're
sending 100 Americans
for his game show that
he shoots in Ireland.
So I got it mixed up with Rob Lowe,
but it was actually
Jamie Foxx, you're right.
Rob Lowe took shots.
He said LA should be
(05:22):
fired for what's happening
with film and TV.
It's still mind boggling
to me that it's cheaper
to do that here than it is in LA.
Another example of what
we've been talking about,
hopefully ad nauseam,
because we're trying to get
California and we're trying to get LA
to do something about it.
(05:43):
But also, I'm okay with Ireland.
I'm okay with Ireland
doing something about it
right now as well,
because I have a different,
I have a different perspective here.
I have a vested interest in
Ireland doing well as well.
Rob Lowe said
something interesting as well,
because he said he was
set to do his next show
in New York, and that he was ready to go,
(06:05):
and then it was going
to be shot in New York,
so he just pulled it,
because he didn't want
to move to New York.
And I was thinking
about that, and I was like,
okay, I understand that, but also,
so many other people involved in that.
Imagine getting cast in a
show, and the lead is like,
I don't want to go to
New York to do this,
and the whole show gets pulled,
and it may never come back, you know?
That's quite a blow.
(06:27):
It's just the way he
said it, I was like, ooh.
That's a really great point.
There's a lot of people
involved in that show,
and I understand that he's in a position
where he doesn't have
to move to New York,
so if he doesn't want to,
and it upset his family life
and everything else, but
also, there are a lot of people
involved in a show, you know?
It was just a little
(06:49):
shocking to hear the way
he talked about it, I was like, ooh, wow.
That's a great point, I was actually
gonna bring that up,
but I didn't even look
at it from that side.
So real quick about these comments,
we'll put the link in the description.
Rob Lowe does not mince
words, and we would love
to be in the position
to fire shots like that.
Rob Lowe was very
vocal during the strikes,
(07:10):
he was actively on
the streets, picketing,
his heart is with LA,
this is where his home is,
and it's great, we want
more stars to be that vocal.
I actually thought
what you just brought up
was the more
interesting part of the story,
is a lot of crew,
especially in Hollywood,
was always pointing fingers
at A-list stars and saying,
(07:31):
hey, you know what, it's
about time that Brad Pitt
and all the A-listers start
fighting to keep productions
in Hollywood, and start
fighting to keep productions
in California, if you're a
star, and if you have power,
you really need to start
stepping up and leverage that,
because we need to keep
productions in California.
That's what a lot of
people on crew stories and so on
(07:54):
is what the narrative is.
And you said this, but the
deal was already good to go.
It was inked, the scripts are ready,
they were ready to
greenlight, and he said,
they said, we're gonna
shoot this in New York,
and he said, I'm not
moving to New York for this.
Yep.
What I thought was interesting was,
as powerful as Rob Lowe
(08:14):
is, he wasn't big enough
to change the studio's decision.
I think what I'm getting at is,
there's no star that's big enough
to help the studio's bottom line.
If they see it's cost
effective to be in New York,
or Atlanta, or Budapest, or Ireland,
they're going to do it, it
doesn't matter what the star is.
(08:34):
And unfortunately, us as actors,
and even Rob Lowe as powerful as he is,
he doesn't have that power.
Now, I don't know, to your point,
I don't know if he knew
the show was gonna poof
and magically go away.
I think he was also saying, hey guys,
we have a bunch of studio lots here,
I'm pretty sure we could do this in LA.
(08:56):
He probably was
intending on doing it in LA,
and they just put this out to him,
and it might have been a game of chicken,
and they didn't bluff.
I see, I didn't realize that yet.
Now that's a decision
with him, his family,
I mean, we can't speculate on that,
but when it comes down to it,
the studio, the show
(09:17):
just magically went away.
I'm actually a little surprised
that they didn't try to replace Rob Lowe,
but the show just magically went away,
and it went poof.
So we don't really know
the ins and outs of that,
but that's what I gather is,
a powerful star is not powerful enough,
to stop the studio's decisions.
(09:38):
You also know of a director
who was set to direct a movie in LA,
and I think was
willing to forego his salary
to get it made in LA,
but it just, it was too expensive,
and they wouldn't do it.
They wouldn't shoot in LA.
On that note, we're
coming out of award season,
(09:58):
we've been talking about the finances
of all these Oscar films.
This is why Brady Corbett
makes $0 making The Brutalist.
This is exactly why.
They're trying to save as much money,
and on top of it, they shot The Brutalist
in frickin' Budapest.
Adam Scott and Rob Lowe
were literally saying,
if we made Parks and Rec today,
we'd be shooting in Budapest.
(10:18):
Yeah.
That's wild, that is wild.
And also, Adam Scott just
made a movie in Ireland.
They did have very nice
things to say about Dublin,
which is nice.
Good, good.
What are these days?
I can't wait for the day
that we shoot a live podcast,
you and me in the same room, in Dublin.
Yeah, in Dublin, in Dublin podcast.
(10:38):
Okay, so on this note as we wrap this up,
we do know that there
is a lot of positive news
coming out of California.
51 projects got
approved for the tax credit.
So I don't think anyone's
taking Rob Lowe's comments
as gospel when he was
talking about the tax credits.
(10:58):
He was talking very loosely.
Obviously, California has tax credits,
but it's just trying to keep competitive
with Atlanta and New York and so on.
Someone sent this my way and it was
pretty heartbreaking.
Someone sent this video of a director,
her name's Kat Reinhardt.
I don't know her personally,
but someone sent me her video.
(11:18):
She talked about how she
got rejected for a tax credit.
Oh. This round.
She got rejected multiple times.
And I believe this movie was $10 million.
Okay. She's ready to go
with this movie, $10 million.
Her heart and soul is in it and it got
(11:40):
rejected three times.
Wow. And she made this point
that, hey, you guys aren't even,
there's nothing
pleasant about this process.
We're trying to bring jobs to California
and we want this to be in LA.
And I've never talked to anyone
who's actually
actively tried to get approved
for a tax credit and she has,
(12:02):
I'll link her video into the description,
but she has a long video
talking about the entire process.
Yeah. Does she explain
the criteria on what
grounds was it rejected?
I don't know if she gets, I don't know,
to be honest, I don't think she actually,
I don't even think she
knows why she got rejected.
Interesting, okay.
But when you hear that
46 films got approved
(12:23):
and she tried three times and she didn't,
and the budget is $10 million
and you're trying to
bring work to California,
I don't know if there's any good reason
to get rejected at that point.
Yeah. So we'll put that video
in the description, but dig into that
because there are not
always Rosie's stories
coming out of LA and at that point,
(12:43):
stay in LA, the petition is trying to get
tax credits uncapped.
Just uncap them and just,
while we're trying to
recover from the fires
and everything else, just uncap them
and just keep shooting and
if anyone's ready to shoot,
let them shoot.
That's interesting. So yeah.
And on the flip side of that,
(13:04):
I know of someone
who's trying to get a movie
produced in Ireland and
they've been going through
that process and they
were told that it is so busy
in Ireland right now that
they would have to fly crew in
from Eastern Europe to make this movie.
So that's how busy it is here.
(13:26):
I did see someone post some
very strong opinions on this,
basically alluding to the
fact that the rates here
are lower than the US for
everybody across the board
and that's why, in a
sense, they felt like Ireland
was getting taken advantage of
because they were able
to make things so much,
(13:48):
for so much less here.
And then I was talking to
someone about it yesterday
and the counterpoint
they made to that was then,
was like, well, okay,
but you raised the rates
for everybody and you
lose the production.
So what's the happy medium?
You know what I mean?
And it's this balance of,
it's brilliant that
there's production here.
Yes, the rates are a lot lower.
So there's a kind of
(14:11):
an ebb and flow of that
where it's a delicate balance.
You're completely right, Ryan.
It's funny, I was totally
not going to bring this up.
You look at the contract,
you look at all the things
that we're fighting
as a union and you say,
we pushed everyone away
because our rates are too high.
And the counterpoint is,
(14:32):
well, we're trying to
get paid a fair wage.
Sure, there are always
places that are cheaper to shoot,
yet are you saying we
should not fight for a fair wage
and get residuals and get union rates?
Now, here's the thing,
you're completely right.
And this is not only Ireland.
I think it's really,
(14:53):
I'm glad that you put the
opinion of who said that
because when it comes
down to it, you're right.
Is it worth having
these productions come in
and quote unquote,
take advantage of Ireland?
A lot of other people say,
look at how much they're bringing in.
They're bringing in other industries.
They're bringing in
people who are doing props,
(15:16):
clothing, laundromats,
who are doing all the dry cleaning.
Look at how much money's coming in.
It's not just Ireland.
They've been doing it in Asia for years.
By the way, did you
notice how many Korean shows
are on Netflix?
Okay, this was not an accident.
They were hitting Korea
hard for the past three,
(15:38):
four years, even before Squid Game.
Squid Game was the cherry on top, okay?
And we know for a fact,
in Asia, no union
restrictions, no nothing.
And to be honest, that's
another project for us.
I'm going to go in the numbers
and I'm going to see who gets paid more,
Ireland or Korea.
Oh, that's interesting.
(15:58):
And we're going to see who's really
gonna take advantage of.
Because when it comes down to it,
these union regulations
are not paying residuals,
are not paying for a lot of things.
And by the way, Korea is
starting to think about
trying to unionize.
Wow.
This is what's going to happen.
Korea's like, "Hey,
(16:18):
you've been tapping us dry."
Oh yeah, Squid Game is
also a huge international hit.
We're going to start thinking about
changing some contracts now.
And so, when it comes down to it,
it's great for the studio to
go find the cheapest dollar.
You're going to run these places dry.
And then eventually
everyone's going to fight
(16:39):
for a fair wage.
Anyway, you just lit me up.
No, no, that's great.
But I think the
measure of it for me is like,
you know, if you're a
working professional,
like can you make a living from this?
I think that's the benchmark.
I think it's a livable profession,
but unfortunately as time goes on,
it's going to be livable for a smaller
(17:01):
and smaller amount of people.
And I think that's the issue
that we're having right now.
Yeah, because even on
the Crew Stories Instagram
or Facebook page, I mean, it talks,
you see so many people say,
you know, Crew Member
for X amount of years.
I had to quit this year
because I just wasn't making any money.
It's brutal.
That's how most of the
older Crew Members feel.
(17:23):
And it's sad.
All right.
Well, on that cheery note.
(both laughing)
I was bringing the jokes.
So let's dig into this.
We're going to talk about
a couple of statistics here
that is just kind of
eye-opening for podcasts.
And it also really applies
to anyone building anything creative.
(17:44):
Found this out before we started this,
but I was always in the back
of my mind, remembering this.
90% of podcasts don't
get past episode three.
That's wild.
Three episodes.
That's 1.8 million who quit.
This post was from three years ago.
So just imagine
(18:04):
there's more podcasts now.
So this statistic is
probably even more stark.
Of the podcasts that are left,
90% will quit after 20 episodes.
That's another 180,000
podcasts that vanish.
To be in the top 1% of podcasts,
(18:25):
you only need to publish
21 episodes of your podcast.
(both laughing)
Your competition is not
the 2 million podcasts.
It's the 20,000
podcasters who didn't quit.
Obviously, we're not doing this to pat
ourselves on the back,
but this is a time to,
like we have talked
(18:45):
about in past episodes,
celebrate the small victories.
By the way, a lot of
podcasters probably don't even know
this quote or don't know the statistic.
Well, I think it's a
testament to sort of the shared ethos
or the shared sort of
goal that both of us got
into this podcast for the same reasons.
And that was to get free stuff.
(19:07):
You know what?
We have not got nearly
enough free stuff yet.
It hasn't felt like a ton
of work to me, to be honest.
Now I know, to be fair,
you do the lion's share
of the work involved in this podcast.
You can't edit the podcast just in case
you don't like the edit.
It's him, it's him, it's not me.
I kind of just show up
and talk, which is lovely.
(19:27):
Do a lot of people
underestimate how important it is
just to show up?
Sure.
Because it gets a little murky
when we talk about actors, right?
Because we can easily say,
what is that benchmark for actors?
It was a blessing to have
this quote for you and I
to start building this.
I was like, let's
just get to 21 episodes.
What does showing up for an actor mean?
(19:49):
It means I'm gonna still
submit myself on actor's access.
I'm gonna try to get an agent.
Are you gonna stay in class?
Dio, we're gonna bring
up this metaphor again,
but we're talking about the
marathon and not the sprint.
Killian Murphy, around the time when he
was doing Oppenheimer,
he said it took me 20
years to build a career.
The real hard work that's
not sexy is consistency.
And no one is applauding
(20:10):
you when it's happening.
But in hindsight,
consistency looks great.
But it's never celebrated
when you're actually in it
doing it.
Yeah, it's really interesting, isn't it?
Like the 20 year thing,
and I can totally identify with that.
What does showing up mean?
It probably depends
on why you're doing it.
(20:33):
As well, you know what I mean?
Or your experience of it.
Like if you're showing up all the time
and you're not happy,
if you're showing up
and you're going to class
and you're doing all the things that
we're talking about,
but you're just not happy and
you're just miserable in it,
it's probably not worth showing up for.
You know what I mean?
I think the only reason
I've been able to stay in it
(20:56):
is because I really enjoy it.
And it's kind of an, I'm
sort of obsessed with it.
You know what I mean?
Well, you might be a bad example because
you love it too much.
Haven't I was showing up in the same way.
You know what I mean?
There are times and periods in my life
where I wasn't doing the amount of work
(21:16):
that I do right now.
So showing up is kind of
the gradients of that too.
For actors, so much of our
world is so not concrete.
And I think that's why
it's nice to have this podcast
statistic as a parallel.
I was goofing around on YouTube
before we started this podcast.
There are some things that
(21:37):
I was lucky enough to learn.
Subscribers and views are vanity metrics.
Subscribers and views are vanity metrics.
That's interesting.
So this subscribers on
YouTube is essentially
the same thing as followers on Instagram.
So now we're going to talk about growth.
(21:57):
Now we're going to talk about metrics
as far as how do you
know that you're growing?
We won't get into the
weeds about this stuff,
but this is a good
parallel for those as an actor.
It doesn't matter how many
people are subscribed to you.
The important part is it's
going to take you a long while
or many episodes to figure out
what the F you're even talking about.
(22:17):
You have so many other
things to worry about.
Do not worry about the vanity metrics.
Interesting.
And as an actor, you might
be worried about followers
and how come no one's
following me and blah, blah, blah.
Well, first off, maybe
focus on your career,
getting really good.
Denzel Washington says the best marketing
is being really good.
(22:38):
Where does the money come into it though?
That's where Ria was.
The way that the money is calculated
is you need to hit a
threshold of subscribers,
you get monetized and you get paid
depending on how long
people are watching.
Oh, so it's not, so yeah, okay.
So it means, it really means something.
(22:59):
It does mean something.
So if you have something
that was super clickbaity
and you had a bajillion
people followed it and watched you
and your video was five seconds
about some kid tripping on the sidewalk,
you were only getting
paid for that watch duration
and your video was
(23:19):
super short and clickbaity.
This is the game.
They don't know if they
want to subscribe yet.
They don't know if they like you.
Maybe you said something
that they might wanna
watch for five minutes
and you have to
realize that's really good.
This is a great segue
because we're gonna get into this.
The question is, is what is your brand
and what are you selling?
(23:40):
And that also goes back to
our, in our acting world.
I can compare myself to a
six foot blonde swimsuit model.
I could do that all day.
You often do.
But then at what point?
(laughing)
But really that's private.
What I do in my
private time is just between,
is just between us.
(24:00):
And this is actually a
couple of these tidbits
actually came from the podcasting Reddit.
How long did it take you to
get to a thousand downloads
in an episode in the first seven days?
This is not meant to be
super inside baseball,
but there's a point to this.
And someone put a great response.
You cannot compare
listens with another podcast
(24:22):
unless the two podcasts in question
are in the same listening space.
True crime or comedy
podcasts have a much higher ceiling
in terms of potential listens.
Yet one targeted at woodworkers
who exclusively builds wash basins
has a completely
different potential listen.
(24:43):
Some shows will never
get to a thousand listens
in the first week,
but can be considered
quite successful nonetheless.
The answer you're looking
for is not going to help you.
(laughing)
So the answer you seek is not this path.
You see how important
niche branding it is.
(25:06):
It's so much harder as
an actor, to be honest.
Because we go to an audition,
we see 15 people just like us, if not 25.
What are you going to do with these
metrics and analytics
to tell you if you're growing?
Do you count the number of auditions?
This is why it's so sometimes harmful
to compare yourself to other actors.
(25:26):
You can go on threads,
or you can go on Instagram
and hear other actors
having so many auditions.
What kind of auditions are they?
Are they non-union?
Are they commercial?
Are they stage?
Are they TV?
Are they film?
You don't know.
So what good does it do you?
They could be in a different city.
And what if the industry is just so slow
that your lack of auditions
has nothing to do with you?
(25:47):
It's just the fact
that the industry is slow.
This is the problem
with most of these metrics
and analytics that we
use to compare ourselves
to other actors.
So what if the metric is, Killian Murphy,
it took me 20, 30
years to build a career?
What if that's the metric?
Podcasts as well is
kind of a social thing too.
Because I find that
people are willing to recommend
good podcasts to you as well.
(26:08):
They're like, "Oh, you got
to check out this podcast."
It's a very kind of a,
it's like books kind of,
but it's like more sharey.
Like, "Oh, you should
listen to the actors
go to the underworld
rather than the actors
go to Italian restaurants."
Like people will recommend.
(laughing) That's a great point.
So now announcing our offshoot,
the actors go to different things.
(26:28):
That's actually a great segue.
We've had conversations every so often.
Let's just talk about the difference
between podcasts and other social media.
You brought up a great point.
It's like sharing a book.
I've heard a couple of
smart people on social media
and podcasters say this.
One podcast subscriber,
according to someone else,
is worth a thousand Instagram followers.
(26:49):
Is worth a thousand TikTok followers.
You watch TikTok and you watch Instagram.
You watch a 30 second video.
You get some information.
Often you forget who you just watched.
You're watching it for a
click hit of information
and you have no
connection to who they are.
You're not like, "Oh my God,
I love this TikTok person,"
blah, blah, blah.
(27:10):
It's gone in the algorithm.
You're already watching another video.
You don't even remember
what you just watched.
This is a weird form where our episodes
are getting to around 30 minutes now.
You come by, you stop
by, you have a good listen.
You're listening into our conversation.
We want you guys to stop by and check in
and have a good time.
You're sitting on our conversation.
(27:30):
And some of you are sitting in
for 30 minutes of this conversation.
So just imagine how
many times in your life
do you actually participate
in a long form
engagement of a conversation?
I love my mom.
I do not have, I
unfortunately don't talk to my mom.
(27:51):
I talk to her more than I
talk to my mom every week.
So if you say that, only 10
people listen to my podcast.
You have to take into
account how great that is.
10 people listen to you
speak and maybe intelligently
or maybe you made them laugh.
Just imagine in your life,
regardless of what job you are,
whatever walk of life,
(28:12):
you sat and you spoke
and 10 people were there in front of you
listening to you speak.
It's actually kind of rare.
Let's say that you
were pitching someone on,
let's say you're a
salesperson and you're pitching them on
why they should buy this vacuum cleaner.
If you're talking to 10
people, that's actually a lot.
(28:32):
And if we were in an audition room,
very rarely we're
going in person anymore.
If you're in an audition room
and you say 10 people in front of you
and you're acting in front of them,
10 people is actually a lot.
I have been in those rooms.
I had 15 people on two
small couches regularly.
Every time I went to
callbacks for this TV show,
(28:53):
15 people on two small couches.
So let's not lose the
sight of 10 real people
are listening to your
podcast for maybe 20 minutes.
And that's the power of
engagement and this platform.
Hmm, there you go.
We're really doing it.
We're really making people listen.
(29:14):
This is not just us
patting each other on the back.
I'm just kind of this mindset shift
because there's so few real metrics,
whether you're an actor,
whether you're a writer,
you're trying to
create a blog on sub-stack
and what have you.
It's a long trudge
with very few celebrations
(29:36):
and maybe few victories in the beginning.
You keep going.
I'm always a little
surprised when people say,
"Oh, I listened to this episode, I said,
"I listened to your podcast."
I'm always really kind of
taken aback, as in my head.
And I almost don't know how to react.
I almost get a little embarrassed,
even though I'm so appreciative.
100%.
Let's just remember
(29:56):
that even if you're small,
and obviously we're still small.
We're still small podcasts.
We're building, we have a lot of fans
to appreciate what we're putting out.
But when it comes down to it,
it's let's not lose the sight of--
Free stuff.
Let's not lose sight of
that we really need free stuff.
Anything, anything, doesn't have to be.
(30:17):
Can be hand lotion, just whatever.
Enough of the congratulations.
We're done patting ourselves on the back.
My hidden gem for this week is based off
what I said earlier
about visiting a farm.
And if you're in and
around Dublin Newbridge Farm
is fantastic.
And I had not been
there since I was a kid,
(30:38):
and it was excellent.
And it's spring, so
there was lots of lambs
and baby animals, baby ducks.
Go and look at these cool animals.
The biggest pig I've ever seen.
It was a huge pig.
There's a huge pig in there.
But yeah, it was great.
It was great fun.
The grounds of the
Newbridge House is lovely,
and just a really
(30:59):
pleasant, it was a really good day.
So go to Newbridge
House and Farm, if you want.
And it was only a fiver in.
There was a special on from
like Tuesday to something.
It was a five euro.
Wow, okay.
You could see baby
animals and mini horses
and aviary, all kinds
of stuff for a fiver.
Nice.
All right, cool.
(31:19):
Yeah, and we'll put the
link in the description
and all the information.
So my hidden gem, I was
celebrating a friend's birthday
at this bar lounge
thing that I never heard of.
Apparently it has a huge cult following.
It's called the Capri Club.
It's in Glendale.
I was blown away by the
(31:42):
people that were just coming in.
It was Saturday afternoon, nonstop.
They actually kicked my friends.
Well, I mean, I don't
wanna say kick them out,
but my friend's booth was getting so big
that we actually moved out to the patio.
All these hip people
from elder millennials
(32:02):
to Gen Zers coming in throughout the day.
It was just nonstop all afternoon.
So really cool little bar.
It's called the Capri Club.
Check it out if you're in
Glendale or if you're in LA.
And it's a good time.
Yeah, they had a blast.
It was really fun vibe.
So that's the Capri Club in Glendale.
(32:25):
Yeah, it is.
So that's our show everyone.
Hope you enjoyed it.
Onwards.
We'll see you next
week to episode number 23.
Absolutely.
See you next week guys.
Well, thanks for watching guys.
If you liked what you
saw, maybe give a like,
maybe subscribe.
It helps people find the podcast.
Also, if you didn't
catch last week's episode,
it's right over here.
(32:48):
Don't worry, we'll wait.
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