July 8, 2025 • 48 mins
Welcome to Episode 36 of the Actor's Guide to the End of the World! This week, the AI Regulations Ban gets voted down by the Senate 99-1, so chalk one up for the good guys. Can’t speak about everything else in the bill, but that’s really good news for AI state regulations. Thanks to the overwhelming action taken by voters calling in to their local lawmakers and Senators, state AI laws will still be in effect and are safe… for now.
The guys also discuss a recent MIT study on the brains of Chat GPT users and the results are TERRIFYING. You’ll want to hear this. Rían shares how he used Chat GPT for the first time and what happened when E-Kan tried to adjust a picture of the Pyramids in Egypt in Chat GPT.
The guys also discuss the trending vertical shorts that are sweeping through the entertainment industry. Cheesy, addictive, quick to shoot, and non-union-What can go wrong? What actors need to know and are they good for your career?
It’s the good, the bad, and the ugly on this week’s episode!
Follow us wherever you find your podcasts @actorsguidepodcast and on all social media. New episodes every Monday!
https://www.reuters.com/legal/government/us-senate-strikes-ai-regulation-ban-trump-megabill-2025-07-01/
https://time.com/7295195/ai-chatgpt-google-learning-school/
https://www.instagram.com/p/DLEzpBUxwG5/?utm_source=ig_web_button_share_sheet
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DLafRmfJ2qi/?igsh=MTl4YWJjMzlkZ24xYw==
Hidden Gems:
Wabry Strawberry Sauce
https://www.amazon.com/W%C3%A4bry-Organic-Syrup-14-9-Strawberry/dp/B01B38XU7W/ref=asc_df_B01B38XU7W?mcid=ee468f94a7a33797ba79ab5d5c5adc45&hvocijid=9132119578248570766-B01B38XU7W-&hvexpln=73&tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=721245378154&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=9132119578248570766&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9002783&hvtargid=pla-2281435179098&th=1
DeMillo’s (Portland, ME) - https://www.dimillos.com/
Time stamps:
(0:00) Intro
(3:15) AI Regulations survive
(4:40) Chat GPT affect on users’ brains
(10:50) Are we willing to be uncomfortable?
(15:15) How a journalist uses Chat GPT
(18:37) Is it worth it to go to film school or drama school?
(24:00) There still is hope for our youth
(26:30) Vertical shorts are sweeping Hollywood
(29:40) Should actors do vertical shorts?
(36:00) What actors should be aware of
(40:15) Hidden Gems
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
More recently, I used it
to help me with an email
the other day for the first time.
I was like, oh yeah, do you know what?
I forgot that I didn't know it exists.
I was dealing with an insurance company
and basically, yeah.
So, you know, like it modified,
like my initial email
would have been something like,
where's my fucking money,
give me my fucking money.
And then Chat GPT was
like, where's my fucking money,
give me my fucking money, please.
(00:22):
(laughing)
Hey, welcome to the Actors Guide
to the End of the World podcast
where we talk about
acting in Hollywood in a way.
People understand, I'm E-Kan Soong
and this is my co-host.
Rían Sheehy Kelly, what's up?
What's up, buddy?
As always, follow us
wherever you find your podcast
at Actors Guide Podcast.
We have video on sub-stack.
We have video on YouTube.
(00:42):
Follow us on all social
media at Actors Guide Podcast.
And if you get a chance, leave
us a like, leave us a review.
It really helps the podcast,
really appreciate all the
support we've gotten so far.
Helps our self-esteem,
makes us feel like valid human beings.
Yeah, yeah, we love
the validation over here.
On the show for today,
we talk about the latest update AI
regulations in the US
(01:04):
have survived for now.
We also talk about an
MIT study on the brains
of chat GPT users.
Not good, by the way.
Spoiler alert, we also
talk about the phenomenon
that is going around
addicting vertical shorts.
They're sweeping the
entertainment industry.
Are they sweeping the
entertainment industry?
I don't know.
(01:27):
(laughing) We're gonna have an honest talk about it.
Do we hate them?
Do we love them?
And on with the show.
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(01:47):
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(laughing)
Did you get some sun this week
when you were in Chicago?
I did, I got some Chicago sun.
There you go, there you
go, that's what I thought.
Went to the beach in
Evanston, which was lovely.
Evanston's nice.
It is, man, it's lovely.
I got burnt, I got burnt
(02:08):
for the first time this year.
Even though I was
literally putting on factor 50.
I put on a few times, I still got burnt.
Rean is freshly baked from Chicago.
That makes it sound like I'm high.
I'm not high, by the way.
(laughing) It means I got sun.
I was in the sunshine.
That's a good call,
(02:29):
this is a family show.
Family show.
Yes, had a lovely time
in Chicago for a week,
which was great, I
was there for a wedding.
It was fantastic.
Caught up with a load of
old friends and you know.
Nice. It was great, dude.
So we're at Around
Town, we have an update.
The bill that will not die.
So we talked about this last month,
(02:49):
maybe a month and a half ago.
There's this big bill,
quote unquote, a beautiful bill.
That's being passed up, it got passed up
through the Senate,
it's now to the House.
Now, the one thing that
we're gonna talk about
is the AI stuff.
Actually, they
technically called it a moratorium.
There was an AI moratorium in this bill
that would ban any states
from having any AI regulations
(03:11):
for the next 10 years. Bananas.
Exactly.
That part was removed from this bill
thanks to all the people who called in,
thanks to everyone
calling in to their senators
and their local representatives.
Now, it got voted down 99 to one.
So if there's any silver lining or
glimmer of good news,
(03:31):
that was it.
We're not gonna speak about all the stuff
that's still in the bill.
Can we name and shame the one?
Who's the one?
Who's the one that was like,
no, I think that's a good idea.
I don't think you should regulate AI.
You'll probably dig that up.
Anyway, so that is a glimmer of hope.
So we do have state protections.
(03:53):
We have California state laws.
We have big Tennessee state
laws that have been passed
and are still standing.
So chalk one up for the good guys.
We did it, everyone.
Anyway, so that was just a
little update word around town.
The other atrocities in the bill,
we don't know to be continued.
TBC.
(04:13):
So this is a fun one.
So there is a study by MIT just completed
on the brains of chat GPT users.
So their headline was,
MIT just completed the
first brain scan study
of chat GPT users and
the results are terrifying.
So this is from, handle AI researches.
(04:35):
We'll put the link of this post.
This is a study from MIT.
So long story short,
the results are not good.
We have talked about this
a little bit in the past.
We've talked about social media
and how that might
affect our attention span,
but this is just a little more specific.
So let me just jump
into a couple of these.
(04:56):
AI isn't making us more productive.
It's quietly bankrupting
our cognitive abilities.
Here's what four months of data revealed.
So they have examples
of writing an essay.
83.3% of people using
chat GPT couldn't remember
what they wrote just
minutes after finishing.
Minutes.
(05:17):
Which sounds about right.
I mean, I mean.
I do, I think I do for,
like when you learn lines
for audition, for an audition,
if you don't go over them constantly,
like you forget them sometimes
or instantly afterwards, I've forgotten.
Like stuff doesn't, if
there isn't a reason for it,
or if you don't have to put an effort
for it to stay in your
(05:38):
head, or you don't need it,
then I think your brain
probably just goes, all right,
see it, that's fine.
That's spot on.
That's spot on.
And I wanted to get into
this a little bit later,
but ultimately, and this is kind of my,
now obviously we're kind
of laughing at this article.
This is all real, this is all factual,
this is a real study.
(06:00):
AI in general is very polarizing.
It's going to get more polarizing.
It's easy to just kind of laugh at it.
We know that AI is
gonna be a powerful tool.
It's gonna be useful in so many things,
many apps and many programs.
But ultimately my
biggest fear is that we're busy
doing a bunch of
short, quick, fast thinking,
Googling things, chat GPTing things,
(06:22):
using AI to find things, and not doing
long, slow thinking,
like learning lines for a scene.
Even reading, like I used to read,
I grew up and through most of my life,
read every night before I went to sleep.
Like I would read a book
in bed and fall asleep.
That I can't tell you
the last time I did that
because I scroll my phone now,
(06:44):
and I hate that I do it.
Like I really hate that I do it.
And I'm like, tonight's the night,
I'm gonna get back to reading.
And my concentration
levels are shot, I think,
just from using the way I use a phone,
the way I scroll.
And I used to beat myself up for this,
like, you know, like, what are you doing?
You know, you're
fucking ruining your brain.
But I realized that like,
I am not only fighting
(07:05):
my own attention span,
I'm fighting like the
combined brain power
of everybody who puts time and money
and energy into making your phone
the most addictive it can be.
Keeping you engaged in--
They're winning. They are winning.
They are absolutely winning.
To sell you stuff, you know,
to keep notifications was a big one.
(07:26):
Everything is designed
to just keep you engaged
in this short form, low attention,
low critical thinking, just like,
from, from, from, from
endless scroll that like.
So it's not surprising that chat GPT has
that effect on people
where they just don't remember.
And I'm like, I haven't
really utilized that until,
(07:49):
more recently, I used it
to help me with an email
the other day for the first time.
I was like, oh yeah, do you know what?
I forgot that I know exists.
And--
you know, it seems, it feels like the
easy way out every time.
You're like, well, okay, I'll just, I'll
just get this to do it for me.
And it helped you with that email.
Yeah, it did. It was a good email.
(08:09):
I was like, that was, that was better
than I, that was more, you know,
polite than I would have put it. It was,
I was dealing with an insurance company
and basically, yeah.
So, you know, like it modified, um, like
my initial email would have been
something like, where's my fucking money?
Give me my fucking money.
And then chat GPT was
like, where's my fucking money?
Give me my fucking money,
please. So it was, you know,
(08:33):
it just softened the blow a little bit.
Well, there you go. The power of AI. Uh,
I will say on the, the,
the reading thing, I was so blown away. I
was, uh, you know, I'm,
I'm late to the party on
many, many slang things,
but when the first time I saw TLDR,
someone texted me TL, yeah,
too long, did not read.
Too long, didn't read. Yeah.
I was so blown. I mean, first of all, I
(08:54):
absolutely would have never guessed it.
And then them explaining it to me,
I was so blown away that
that was even existing,
that it was even necessary. And then here
we are, that was, you know,
months ago. And now I'm
realizing, Oh, it is very valid.
This is the world that we live in.
Everything is TLDR. What else here? Uh,
(09:14):
other fun things. Brain
scans showed the damage clearly.
Neural connections
dropped from 79 to just 42.
That is a 47% loss in brain connectivity.
If anyone cares about that anymore,
if your computer lost nearly half its
processing power, you'd say it's broken.
That's what's happening to
our brains of chat, GPT users,
half our processing
(09:35):
grower, my God. And back to our,
our little writing metaphor teachers
couldn't tell which essays were written
with AI, but they knew something felt
off, some descriptions,
soulless, empty of real content, flawless
language, but no personal insight.
The human brain can sense cognitive debt,
(09:56):
even when it doesn't have
the words to explain it.
And I don't want to sound like an old
fogey and it's easy to be so black and
white with this. We know it's a tool. We
know that we're using Google.
We're new. We know that we have all this
technology at our fingertips.
I'm wondering if we're, we're at a place
in society and we want to read more
books, but we, but we don't have the
time. Are we willing to be uncomfortable?
(10:18):
That's it. No, exactly. Uh, the 30 seconds is not right.
30 seconds it takes if your internet is
slow for your phone to load,
dealing with ads on YouTube.
Are we willing to deal with the time it
takes to read an article versus the TLDR,
the, the long journey of
let's say writing a novel,
(10:40):
creating a short film, editing something,
or is it the new standard is just going
to be pop something into AI with the
correct prompts and it'll come
out in two and a half minutes.
This is another, another
metaphor. I was in a pinch. I was,
I was editing something. I was touching
up a photo of the pyramids in Egypt and
(11:00):
I was like, okay, well
let me just try chat GPT.
I don't want to take the time to remove
some of the tourists in the background
and fix it up. Let me just throw it in
there. I threw it into chat GPT.
It removed all the tourists.
It also changed the color and removed the
texture of the sand.
(11:21):
So my point is is for the better or was
this a nightmare for the worse?
It wasn't horrible, but it was off.
It's like everyone was saying of the, of
these chat GPT essays.
It just didn't look real. Right? Yeah. So
it's like, it's like,
I'm showing everyone a
picture of the pyramids. Do it.
Is the sand really that
smooth? This didn't look real.
(11:43):
So there was part of
me, it was like, okay,
this is the perfect
metaphor for AI. It's like,
it did what I wanted.
It's slightly off and then it removed the
texture and I had no control over it.
Am I going to keep putting in prompts,
put the texture back in the sand,
blah, blah, blah. Can you not change the
(12:03):
color? And at that point,
I just didn't use chat GPT at all. And
some people don't care.
I did.
And I just left the people in the
background and left
the tourists in there.
AI is not perfect. And it's actually kind
of nice that it's not perfect.
Eventually we'll get to the point where
we don't actually need to do the slow,
hard work. Why? If you had the choice,
(12:25):
would we actually choose to do the slow,
hard work? I feel like real writers,
and I said this even beginning,
I said this years ago when we just
started talking about AI, um,
real writers actually
like doing the long,
hard work and actually
enjoy the presence of writing.
Some do. I, well, I think
the smart ones probably,
I think the smart ones
probably use, use it as a tool.
(12:47):
You know, I actually spoke
to a writer friend about this,
a very accomplished writer and they use,
they use, you know, AI as a,
as a tool, but like also said that like
AI cannot do what I can do.
It's, it would take them longer to, if
they had chat GPT write a script,
it would take them longer to make that
(13:07):
script good than it would to write the
script themselves from scratch,
but they can use it for prompts and they
can use it for certain things or for
research. It's a tool like anything else.
I think as well, like, you know,
there was this resistance. Um,
one of my friends is a
comic book artist and you know,
had some resistance to everything being
(13:29):
digitally drawn now as it is, you know,
but also has had to adapt and
use that as well. So I think,
I think it's kind of a, the, the smart,
the people who use it
effectively can use it as a tool.
People who depend on it entirely, I think
are fucked to be honest.
Cause like that's not,
when researchers asked chat GPT users to
(13:52):
write without any AI help,
they did worse than people
who never used AI at all. Uh,
this isn't just
dependency. It's cognitive atrophy.
It's like a muscle that stopped
remembering how to move, you know,
there, there you go. It's these, these
skills are getting weaker.
So I just don't know. Do you know anyone
who uses it? So, I mean, I don't know.
(14:13):
I don't think you can really be a writer
if you're just using AI as a,
as a way to write, but like,
let's, let's talk about this.
I personally don't want to be the last
one at the party and I also don't want to
be an extinct dinosaur. So I, I, I'm
going to do the work and be as open as
possible. A hundred
percent. If you're writing, uh, uh,
(14:33):
AI can help you find
better adjectives. Uh,
AI can help you craft certain things. I
mean, it, it, it only,
it can amplify the skills that you
already have. So say for example, I, I,
I saw a video that was for basic writing.
This is an ex journalist.
He's talking about how he uses chat GPT.
They put it in a way that's,
that was pretty spot
(14:54):
on AI or chat GPT or a
tool like that is essentially an
assistant who is very savvy
that you can be mean to.
Probably not a great practice either.
But if you had a writer's assistant, um,
I get it.
You don't need to take the time to be
extra polite to them in a human social,
(15:17):
I mean, here's the thing. I, I, I, I get
why that's a selling point.
I get why, um, you know,
for a basic level assistant that would be
handy and, and there you go.
And it's in every law office,
every bank is using it and all the
analysts are being told by their boss to
(15:39):
start using it.
Well, that's the thing, isn't
it? Like, I mean, that's the,
that's the argument,
one of the arguments against AI is that
it like it kills those jobs and it kills
the, it robs people of the experience.
Like having an assistant, you know,
that assistant is presumably
an aspiring writer or a law,
or a law clerk or whatever.
(16:00):
You're robbing them of that opportunity
to learn. So, you know, what,
what does that produce
down the line? You know,
what kind of workforce does
that produce in, you know, in,
in writers or now look,
there's people find a way,
they always have and they'll, they'll
figure out how to write,
but it kind of takes away, you know,
(16:22):
that pipeline of people coming up and
learning, learning that way.
That's probably in a lot
of positions, like not just
That's a great point.
(16:44):
On that note, you're 100% and this is
what people were worried about with
during the strike and there was in the
stipulations of contracts, it was the
size of the writers rooms.
They introduced AI is allowed in writers
rooms and those tools, but this idea of
apprenticeship is dying.
(17:05):
You're completely right.
Those positions aren't going to exist and
I think it's actually a big nod to create
your own stuff because that's the only
time you're actually going to have the
experience of building something.
Editing it yourself, directing it
yourself, writing it yourself.
(17:26):
Because on the upper level of TV shows
and films, it's going to be Ryan Murphy,
Shonda Rhimes and then everyone else.
One of my big worries is for the next
generation, all the young ones who are
walking around with
smartphones and Google and AI.
My sister is an art teacher, public
(17:48):
school. She's been working at a high
school for the past couple years now.
There was a program thrown by Adobe, so
it was sponsored by Adobe and they had an
expert and a mentor over there.
So needless to say, they were talking
about Adobe. This is how you use it. But
also these are some new AI tools.
(18:09):
They're they're pitching very talented,
real artists in high school. Their brains
aren't even fully developed.
So they're seeing these tools for the
first time and they're like, wait, it
just creates right these people.
I've seen these kids work. They are so
brilliant and they'll just draw something
right in front of it.
(18:29):
It almost brings me to tears after the
program. All the kids went up to her and
said, did you approve
this? This isn't right.
All these high school artists said, what
is with this AI art? We don't want to
have anything to do with it.
And I was like, thank you. Fight the
power. It's kind of nice to see. And
we'll see. We'll see the next
(18:49):
generation if that continues.
Let's just wrap up. Let's just wrap up
this AI thing. The last statistic here.
Chat GPT helps you finish tests 60
percent faster, but it cuts the germane
cognitive load essential for real
learning by 32 percent.
In other words, you're swapping long term
brain power for short term speed. That
(19:11):
sounds like you're advertising chat GPT.
It sounds like you're doing it like a
like a like a pharmaceutical, like a big
fire, like a like a drug ad.
And you're saying the good chat GPT can
help you do this, but it also ruins your
brain. Well, he runs your brain.
Well, it all I'm trying not to I'm trying
to be fair about this. It's easy to
hammer and it's easy to hammer this.
But ultimately, people are going to still
(19:32):
use chat GPT fund. And, you know, let's
say working out, you will need many reps
to actually build muscle.
Abs don't happen within 30 seconds yet.
So we might still need to do long, hard
and uncomfortable work at some point.
Anything worth doing takes time except
(19:54):
losing weight on a zimpic, apparently,
because I've seen a lot of
those epic around lately.
Exactly. People drop and wait
very fast. Exactly. Exactly.
Yeah, apparently there's a generic
ozimpic that's running around. So that
that's that's also I mean, who knows,
technology is making
leaps and bounds right now.
So moving on, this is a good segue
(20:16):
because the lines are getting blurred. We
have to talk about this because it was
just on my mind, these vertical shorts
that are taking over Hollywood.
Very much like A.I., I just feel like I
want to be fair. And I also want to be
honest. This is not it's
(20:38):
not pretty on either side.
Well, let's explain what they are first.
And I'm assuming you're familiar with
them to a degree, right?
These are vertical shorts.
They're on apps. They're essentially a
minute or two minute long short episodes,
highly addictive,
mostly campy soap operas.
A lot of these companies are Chinese
companies, not tick tock related, but
(20:59):
very similar. And they're expanding and
breaking out over in Hollywood.
If you're in L.A., it's it's one of the
only things that are shooting. They're
almost 100 percent non-union.
It's they'll throw you whatever, whatever
they have, you know, a couple hundred
dollars, maybe more
all non-union contracts.
But they are actively being watched. Real
(21:22):
Shorts alone is a Chinese company. And it
can. It's some months is making ten
million dollars a month on revenue, ten
million dollars a month at a time where
major studios are hurting.
But these non-union vertical shorts of
really cheesy soap
operas are just on fire.
(21:43):
Like you say, they're basically the
modern soap operas, but done in very
short form and done made
and churned out very cheaply.
I would love to hear if you got any
specific information from people who
worked at Biz. I don't know any friends
on hand. I did have to
do a little research.
I I did a video on it on my Instagram
(22:04):
just because I want to talk about it. A
lot of my non-union actor friends were
asking about it, whether they thought it
was bad for their career or not.
It's polarizing. It's polarizing. And I
will be fair. If you watch this, I'd like
to say that this is pretty
standard of a soap opera.
It is not standard of a soap opera. If
you're going to compare that to General
(22:25):
Hospital, I'm trying. I'm not.
I don't want to be judgy about what the
content is because some people can say
I'll never watch General Hospital or, you
know, one life to live.
You will be able to tell the difference
between these shorts
and General Hospital.
Some people will compare it to a Hallmark
movie. They're all cliffhangers. And, you
(22:46):
know, the brilliance of this is not only
are they being watched,
they are making money.
They are making a lot of money. You will
need to for some of the apps, you will
need to pay a dollar to see the ending,
to see the next episode.
People are paying money. People are being
trained to pay for money when everyone
cut cable and doesn't want to pay for
(23:08):
Hulu or Netflix. They are
paying to see these shorts.
So, yeah, so there's a couple of things
here in my head about that. One, people
are paying for it. People are watching
it. Who are we to say
it's right or wrong?
I mean, I can watch them and I don't want
to do them. Well, I don't have the
option. But like, but I I mean, what
(23:30):
would you say to a non-union
actor or an open coming actor?
Some an agent had said to had kept
sending somebody these vertical shorts
and they kept shooting them down. And
they were like, you know, the agent was
kind of saying, well, these are the only
things going on at the moment.
Like, are you sure you won't do them? And
this person was kind of pushing back
against them. So and then I
(23:51):
know people who've done them.
And I know someone who's doing one, I
think, at the moment. And she's, you
know, it's giving her she's non-union and
it's giving her employment for
a month or whatever, you know.
So it's a tricky one. I mean, you know,
part of me is like, look, if you're if
you're if you're not a union and you're
open coming and you want to
experience on camera, go for it.
I mean, I don't know what the I don't
(24:14):
know what the downside is for someone in
that position. It's experience.
Yeah. Let's talk about the good things.
Right. Because, you know, we're trying to
explain these vertical like, honestly, if
you're not on the app or if you haven't
seen these things and you should
essentially Google it because it was hard
for me to really
picture it until I saw it.
(24:36):
Now, keep in mind, if you're listening to
this, these shorts are essentially all
non-union actors like Rian
and I don't have the option.
So I just want to be clear here. I don't
want to sound judgy and poo poo. I am 100
percent jealous that there is so much
work that is successful. I will admit it.
(24:56):
I am happy not to do them. But I, you
know, there is a little FOMO, right? If
you were not. And this is actually part
of the reason why I did the video,
because it's easy for people to judge it.
By the way, the writing alone, people
thought this had to be written by A.I.
(25:16):
It's the billionaire werewolf who's, you
know, sleeping with your I'm not even
talking about a lot of
werewolves, a lot of billionaires.
They're all hot. Oh, yeah. This is the
thing. This is it. This is general
hospital and then add more billionaires
and more werewolves.
Amazing. I didn't know the content.
Oh, no, no. This is not exaggeration.
(25:38):
Well, I mean, I think that's a good place
to end it. Thanks for listening, guys.
We'll see you next week.
Everyone was convinced this was written
by A.I. And then the consensus was this
is so cringy and weird. A.I. couldn't
have done this. OK, you
would actually probably love it.
Most people actually would get a kick out
(26:00):
of it. And I think that's part of the
camp and part of the fun. Now, here's the
thing. This is the one time in our
industry where you can make some decent
scratch, get some experience.
You might be in demand and might keep you
busy. And by the way, everyone is kind of
looking around, twiddling their thumbs. I
don't have any judgment.
(26:22):
I know this might be weird to say. I
think if non-union actors could do it, I
think they should because
there's nothing else going on.
I was going to say, but the only thing to
be careful of, well, one, the writing is
obviously shite. So like you're not
working with great material,
but you're getting experience.
The other thing is, I don't know what I
presume these are like viewable in
(26:45):
perpetuity for no
more money. I'm guessing.
So there's probably an in perpetuity
clause there for this kind of stuff. And
I don't know what kind of A.I.
protections are in there, if any.
So these I presume without knowing. Thank
you. Very ignorant. But like they could
be used to train A.I. potentially. Right.
Thank you. Thank you for bringing that
(27:06):
up. Let's get to the bad stuff.
You're welcome. OK, you're welcome. Union
actors might judge it, might feel above
it. I actually to do my video, I want to
be fair and I also want to do research.
By the way, TikTok, not surprisingly,
loves these shorts. If you are in a
(27:29):
popular vertical short, you very well
could leverage that
for a TikTok following.
So just put that in perspective where
there are some ways you can make money.
This is the difference. Is it better for
your acting career or is it
better for your bank account?
Some people might want to be TikTok
famous and they're perfectly happy. And
(27:51):
maybe they become an actor later on.
Maybe they don't. So there's no judgment.
If you're 22 years old and I saw a lot of
really hardworking actors on TikTok who
were doing these vertical shorts, talking
about their experience,
they're like, we don't love it.
It's not great. But here I am. I'm making
money as an actor. And I can't knock
that. Let's talk about the dangers.
And I would love if we can get someone to
(28:12):
comment or if anyone's done a vertical
short, if you can tell us if these
contracts are in
perpetuity, it is not set in stone.
A lot of these are in perpetuity
contracts. That means that they have your
use, your likeness and rights forever.
This is stuff that people want to touch
(28:33):
with a 10 foot pole ever. But if every
actor is doing it, you know, ideally
non-union actors, they know that they're
going to get away with it.
We have union protections in every TV and
film show. That's never the case that
someone would be able to use it.
What does forever mean? Not only does it
mean like 50 in 50 years or 100 years
(28:55):
when everyone's gone, it means that if
you sell it or license it to Netflix.
And it gets five billion more views. You
don't get a penny. You have non-union
contracts. They're getting
away with a lot of things.
A rate could be $200 a day. It's not bad.
Non-union, $200 a day.
Have fun on set. Goof off.
(29:15):
I've heard three grand
was thrown at somebody.
Three grand a day? Not three grand a day.
Because they kept turning
them down and they wanted them.
Wow.
But even say so. So that's it. That's an
isolated case. And that's a very specific
case. I don't want to in general. It's
$200, maybe $800 a day if you can
(29:37):
negotiate a thousand dollars a day.
But you're right. Three
thousand dollars is that's a lot.
That's when you stack that up against a
ULB rate, which I think now is $249 a
day. That's ultra low budget or a UPA,
ultra low budget project agreement.
A modified low budget is about $480 a
(29:59):
day, I think. Even a low
budget is less than that.
So when you stack up the day rate for
union jobs, I mean, these vertical shorts
in a lot of cases are
blowing them out of the water.
The lines, the lines are blurred. I saw
that argument. If you compare it to an
ultra low budget, ultra, like you said,
(30:19):
it's a hard comparison.
I think it's unfair. You're right. Is
there any fair in Hollywood? Real shorts
is making ten million dollars.
None of these actors will ever make any
residuals. And it's a buyout. Now, here's
the thing. We talk about
usages. We talk about usages.
We don't. The short term is how much
(30:40):
money am I walking away with? That's the
short term. The long term is impropriety.
And this this also bridges to non-union
commercials. There are some non-union
commercials that you will walk away with
eight thousand
dollars, ten thousand dollars.
That is pretty good for a buyout. They'll
own you for two years or so on or longer,
(31:01):
and they'll rerun it a bajillion times.
But the point is, is that is a really bad
usage rate that non-union commercials
will take advantage of non-union actors.
This is even worse. Our industry, the
lines are blurring where if people are
going to get used to more non-union.
This is my danger. My danger is if people
(31:23):
get more used to non-union work, if
non-union vertical shorts are going to
take over Hollywood, and
this is the new standard,
then slowly all of us are going to be
working in perpetuity and not having
ownership over our
likeness. That's my worry.
Yeah, I just looked up the rates there.
So it's actually lower than I thought.
Vertical shorts, apparently they pay
anywhere from 100 to 500 per day.
(31:45):
But the average seems to be sort of four
to 500. Those are fair. And we also
didn't get into hypothetically, if they
sold all these shows to
a third party company,
and they can use all these shows to train
generative AI. If you signed away a
contract in
perpetuity, they could do that.
(32:05):
No one's saying that they are doing that,
but it's very possible that they could.
These are all tech companies, so that
could happen tomorrow.
Yeah, and you're right. The pay is... And
look, I obviously want everybody to be
doing union projects and that to be, you
know, for them to be
more widely available.
But you're talking about 1246 a day on a
union show versus the availability of
(32:27):
these vertical shorts. I mean, you know,
you're not booking
co-stars every day of the week.
Exactly.
And then these vertical shorts seem to be
just available to, you know, whoever's
interested, whoever wants to audition and
wants to get involved.
There seems to be a lot of them, is what
I'm saying. So it's
volume versus, you know.
What happens when Disney and Netflix
(32:48):
start shooting vertical shorts
themselves? We would hope that their
union... Well, just imagine if Disney and
Netflix start throwing billions of
dollars into non-union TV shows.
I don't even know where our industry and
our union would fall in that, but just
imagine that that's
what I'm worried about.
(33:10):
To put your mind at risk, we'll all be
dead someday. So I just...
You mean put my mind at ease?
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, we'll keep an eye on
that. But if you hear anything, let us
know in the comments. Hit us up. Actors
Guide Podcast at gmail.com.
Hit us up in the comments on our social
media. I'm still amazed. People can't pay
(33:34):
rent. They're paying $80 to
$100 addicted to these shorts.
And that's the beauty. Hey, people are
watching something. I got
that. Let's do hidden gems.
Hidden gems. Let me get my hidden gem. So
this is my... I don't
know if you can see this.
Salad dressing? No, not salad dressing,
although it looks like salad dressing. My
(33:54):
hidden gem for this week is...
So I spent a week in Chicago. I stayed
with some friends in
Evanston for a few days.
And Daniel and Maythele, if you're
listening, and they made... Maythele made
phenomenal pancakes and
they had this syrup on them.
And it's this organic, no added sugar,
(34:16):
strawberry syrup. I don't
know where it comes from.
Wow. But basically, it's called wah-bree
or... It has a formula over the A, so I
don't know how you pronounce that.
But it's fantastic. And it has one gram
of sugar, which is no grams of added
sugar and one gram of
sugar. And it's delicious.
So you loved it so much
(34:36):
you bought some of yourself?
No. Maythele, I came home today and
Maythele had sent me some in the mail. I
just got an Amazon
delivery of this stuff.
And saying, to remind you of your family
in Illinois, basically.
Wow. What a great friend.
Yeah. So huge love to
(34:59):
Daniel and Maythele.
It's really sweet.
It's really tasty.
There's no sugar in it.
That's great. I love that. So we'll keep
it on the culinary train here. So I did a
little trip up to Maine. I'm in Maine for
the first time ever.
A quick little stop in Portland. Also a
special shout out. Our
friend Mary Nederkorn.
(35:21):
So gracious. I visited
her on the way to Portland.
Stopped by her place in Boston. She
offered her place as a pit stop just to
make us some food, be able
to rest from the long drive.
She hosted my parents and my sister. And
(35:43):
we walked around their
garden, ate their fresh vegetables.
They made handmade bread, lunch for us as
a pit stop. Incredibly
gracious. So a special shout out.
Your hidden gem is Mary Nederkorn.
No, no, no, no, no. That was a shout out.
That was a shout out.
Yeah, I know. If you're lucky enough to
know Mary Nederkorn,
(36:04):
then God bless you. Yeah.
That's pretty niche.
That's pretty specific.
So we stopped in Portland for a couple of
days. I want to shout
out this restaurant.
Portland, Maine is a very popular little
food, up-and-coming food
city. A lot of choices.
I will shout out. There's a lobster
restaurant that's literally on
(36:24):
a floating barge. Pretty big.
Like there's a nice deck. You could take
pictures and chill out. But my family
had, you know, a table full of lobsters.
I'm allergic. So I was just watching
them. Are you? Yeah,
I know. We share that.
Do you have an EpiPen?
Do you have an EpiPen?
I just stay away from it. I don't carry
(36:47):
it around. I should, but
I just stay away from it.
You have one, though, right?
Well, the issue is they expire after two
years. I know. Yeah, yeah.
So I don't keep buying them. You don't
reopen? I have one. Yeah, I have one. But
again, I stay away from it.
It's crustaceans. Crab,
lobster, and shrimp. I can't go.
Yeah, same thing as
me. I stay away from it.
(37:08):
Chinese. I know we're getting on a
tangent. Chinese food. Good God. They put
shrimp paste in every sauce. Yeah.
So 100 percent. I get I get cut all every
so often. I'll eat some some Chinese
sauce. And next thing you
know, it has shrimp in it.
So you've got to watch out. But that you
and me are right. We're right there.
Also, also a quick question on that. Did
(37:29):
you always have that allergy? Because I
did not. I developed mine later.
This is this is a fun story. I developed
it later. I grew up eating cocktail
shrimp. No problem.
Crab lobster. No problem.
My mom cooked shrimp a certain way.
Actually, we might be able to diagnose
each other right now. My
mom cooked shrimp one way.
(37:51):
It was like Asian style, like they had
the heads on it. I literally
almost died in high school.
We were so blown away by it. They didn't
take me to the hospital. I almost died
from a food allergy and a phylicic shock.
We waited it out and I just the food
(38:12):
allergy. I was like puffed up everything.
I almost died. We
didn't know what it was.
I should have went to the hospital. I
didn't even know I had a food allergy.
And it was only when shrimp
was cooked that certain way.
I never touched it again. And we were all
shocked. And my mom felt really bad
because she cooked the shrimp.
Years later, I was still eating shrimp. I
just didn't eat shrimp that way. I went
(38:34):
to a friend's barbecue and they had a
Cajun style when it
was cooked the same way.
But it was New Orleans style. And I was
like, oh, this shouldn't be an issue. It
was Asian style that almost killed me. I
ate it Cajun style. Almost died again.
And then last time I ate a lot of shrimp
and I got dizzy. I got dizzy. I was
(38:55):
bloated. I looked like I was a Will Smith
and hitch. I almost died again.
And I swore it off. I was like, you know
what? Honestly, I ate enough. I don't
miss it. And that's where I
fall. I just stay away from it.
Okay. I had to tell you that story
because you just asked me. I had to tell
you. No, it's a good. It's a good story.
It's a good story because mine was I had
(39:16):
eaten it my whole life. No real issues. I
remember getting sick from a seafood
pizza when I was younger.
But I think that might have been
unrelated. Anyway, I had no problems. A
crab one time, I think it was working
somewhere. I think it was
in Chicago. I was working.
And I ate crab and I was like, and I was
like, my throat got really scratchy and
like kind of like trouble breathing. And
(39:37):
I was like, that's weird. And like my
throat was closing up a bit.
And but I because I had eaten it before I
didn't make the connection. I thought,
okay, so it was okay. And I was all
right. And, you know, went away after a
few hours and I felt okay. So I was like,
whatever. Just ignored it.
And then I had it a few months later and
it was worse. It was the same reaction.
Throw closing up, you know, eyes puffy, I
(39:57):
think. And like, but it was worse. So
then, you know, I was like, okay, well, I
got to stay away from that. My sister had
also developed an
allergy. Wow. Well, there you go.
So I stayed away from it for years. And
then, you know, I got an Epi-Pam or
whatever. And then years later, I got an
Epi-Pam and I got, you know, moved out
here. And then I did an allergy test a
while later. And they're not always
(40:20):
reliable, I believe. Yeah, they're not
100%. They're not 100%. But they did an
allergy test and doctor was like, oh,
you're fine. And I was like, okay, great.
So I started out by
trying to eat shrimp again.
Instantly, like a hay fever reaction,
like my eyes puffed up itchy eyes
instantly from eating the shrimp. I told
the doctor and he's like, yeah, you can't
eat any of that. He's like, you're out.
(40:41):
So I can't eat any crustaceans.
Wait, did he explain why the
test said one way and then?
Because I hadn't touched it for over 10
years. Like there was none of it. My body
just didn't react to whatever they did.
So it just, it didn't show up as an
allergy. But then, but then I had an
allergic reaction to shrimp. So
shrimps out. Shrimps out. Lobsures out.
(41:03):
So back to it. I'm also in the lobster
capital of the world here in Maine. So
everyone's enjoying lobster. So my hidden
gem going back to my hidden gem.
D'Amilo's restaurant is all floating on a
barge. It was exactly what my family was
looking for. They had a bunch of lobster.
I had a fried haddock sandwich. I'll
probably, I'll probably put pictures of
it in the video. But it was great. It was
(41:26):
great. And to be honest, this entire
trip, it was the best lobster we had. So
I want a special shout out. So many good
food options in Portland, Maine, but that
gets our stamp of approval. This is like
the time. This is like the time that I,
I, my hidden gem was Woods Cafe. Like
you're just your hidden gem is a lobster
restaurant that you can't eat most of
what they serve. My hidden gem was Woody
(41:49):
Harrelson's like weed cafe. I couldn't
touch. I couldn't touch any of the
anything in there being sober.
Ironically, he probably
smelled more weed than I ate lobster.
Well, do we do any reason that like we
went in at 10 in the morning and nobody
was smoking weed. So that was the only
reason I was able to stay there.
Yeah, yeah, it's great footage. It is
(42:10):
very exciting watching someone just chomp
away into a lobster though. It gets kind
of nauseating after a while, but you just
it's pretty exciting
for them. Yeah, yeah.
Exciting for them pretty gross. I always
found lobster too much work. Anyway, I
never, I never worked.
Crab and lobster is not worth the hustle.
Yeah, give it up guys. Let it go.
(42:31):
That's all stop eating it. Yeah, leave
the cards alone. All right, guys. I hope
you enjoyed it. See you next week and
we'll be back at it.
See you next week, guys.
More recently, I used it
to help me with an email
the other day for the first time.
I was like, oh yeah, do you know what?
I forgot that I didn't know it exists.
I was dealing with an insurance company
and basically, yeah.
So, you know, like it modified,
like my initial email
would have been something like,
where's my fucking money,
give me my fucking money.
And then Chat GPT was
like, where's my fucking money,
give me my fucking money, please.
(00:22):
(laughing)
Hey, welcome to the Actors Guide
to the End of the World podcast
where we talk about
acting in Hollywood in a way.
People understand, I'm E-Kan Soong
and this is my co-host.
Rían Sheehy Kelly, what's up?
What's up, buddy?
As always, follow us
wherever you find your podcast
at Actors Guide Podcast.
We have video on sub-stack.
We have video on YouTube.
(00:42):
Follow us on all social
media at Actors Guide Podcast.
And if you get a chance, leave
us a like, leave us a review.
It really helps the podcast,
really appreciate all the
support we've gotten so far.
Helps our self-esteem,
makes us feel like valid human beings.
Yeah, yeah, we love
the validation over here.
On the show for today,
we talk about the latest update AI
regulations in the US
(01:04):
have survived for now.
We also talk about an
MIT study on the brains
of chat GPT users.
Not good, by the way.
Spoiler alert, we also
talk about the phenomenon
that is going around
addicting vertical shorts.
They're sweeping the
entertainment industry.
Are they sweeping the
entertainment industry?
I don't know.
(01:27):
(laughing) We're gonna have an honest talk about it.
Do we hate them?
Do we love them?
And on with the show.
Now, a quick word from our sponsor.
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There are no limits with Crafty Bag.
(01:47):
You can go from fig
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(laughing)
Did you get some sun this week
when you were in Chicago?
I did, I got some Chicago sun.
There you go, there you
go, that's what I thought.
Went to the beach in
Evanston, which was lovely.
Evanston's nice.
It is, man, it's lovely.
I got burnt, I got burnt
(02:08):
for the first time this year.
Even though I was
literally putting on factor 50.
I put on a few times, I still got burnt.
Rean is freshly baked from Chicago.
That makes it sound like I'm high.
I'm not high, by the way.
(laughing) It means I got sun.
I was in the sunshine.
That's a good call,
(02:29):
this is a family show.
Family show.
Yes, had a lovely time
in Chicago for a week,
which was great, I
was there for a wedding.
It was fantastic.
Caught up with a load of
old friends and you know.
Nice. It was great, dude.
So we're at Around
Town, we have an update.
The bill that will not die.
So we talked about this last month,
(02:49):
maybe a month and a half ago.
There's this big bill,
quote unquote, a beautiful bill.
That's being passed up, it got passed up
through the Senate,
it's now to the House.
Now, the one thing that
we're gonna talk about
is the AI stuff.
Actually, they
technically called it a moratorium.
There was an AI moratorium in this bill
that would ban any states
from having any AI regulations
(03:11):
for the next 10 years. Bananas.
Exactly.
That part was removed from this bill
thanks to all the people who called in,
thanks to everyone
calling in to their senators
and their local representatives.
Now, it got voted down 99 to one.
So if there's any silver lining or
glimmer of good news,
(03:31):
that was it.
We're not gonna speak about all the stuff
that's still in the bill.
Can we name and shame the one?
Who's the one?
Who's the one that was like,
no, I think that's a good idea.
I don't think you should regulate AI.
You'll probably dig that up.
Anyway, so that is a glimmer of hope.
So we do have state protections.
(03:53):
We have California state laws.
We have big Tennessee state
laws that have been passed
and are still standing.
So chalk one up for the good guys.
We did it, everyone.
Anyway, so that was just a
little update word around town.
The other atrocities in the bill,
we don't know to be continued.
TBC.
(04:13):
So this is a fun one.
So there is a study by MIT just completed
on the brains of chat GPT users.
So their headline was,
MIT just completed the
first brain scan study
of chat GPT users and
the results are terrifying.
So this is from, handle AI researches.
(04:35):
We'll put the link of this post.
This is a study from MIT.
So long story short,
the results are not good.
We have talked about this
a little bit in the past.
We've talked about social media
and how that might
affect our attention span,
but this is just a little more specific.
So let me just jump
into a couple of these.
(04:56):
AI isn't making us more productive.
It's quietly bankrupting
our cognitive abilities.
Here's what four months of data revealed.
So they have examples
of writing an essay.
83.3% of people using
chat GPT couldn't remember
what they wrote just
minutes after finishing.
Minutes.
(05:17):
Which sounds about right.
I mean, I mean.
I do, I think I do for,
like when you learn lines
for audition, for an audition,
if you don't go over them constantly,
like you forget them sometimes
or instantly afterwards, I've forgotten.
Like stuff doesn't, if
there isn't a reason for it,
or if you don't have to put an effort
for it to stay in your
(05:38):
head, or you don't need it,
then I think your brain
probably just goes, all right,
see it, that's fine.
That's spot on.
That's spot on.
And I wanted to get into
this a little bit later,
but ultimately, and this is kind of my,
now obviously we're kind
of laughing at this article.
This is all real, this is all factual,
this is a real study.
(06:00):
AI in general is very polarizing.
It's going to get more polarizing.
It's easy to just kind of laugh at it.
We know that AI is
gonna be a powerful tool.
It's gonna be useful in so many things,
many apps and many programs.
But ultimately my
biggest fear is that we're busy
doing a bunch of
short, quick, fast thinking,
Googling things, chat GPTing things,
(06:22):
using AI to find things, and not doing
long, slow thinking,
like learning lines for a scene.
Even reading, like I used to read,
I grew up and through most of my life,
read every night before I went to sleep.
Like I would read a book
in bed and fall asleep.
That I can't tell you
the last time I did that
because I scroll my phone now,
(06:44):
and I hate that I do it.
Like I really hate that I do it.
And I'm like, tonight's the night,
I'm gonna get back to reading.
And my concentration
levels are shot, I think,
just from using the way I use a phone,
the way I scroll.
And I used to beat myself up for this,
like, you know, like, what are you doing?
You know, you're
fucking ruining your brain.
But I realized that like,
I am not only fighting
(07:05):
my own attention span,
I'm fighting like the
combined brain power
of everybody who puts time and money
and energy into making your phone
the most addictive it can be.
Keeping you engaged in--
They're winning. They are winning.
They are absolutely winning.
To sell you stuff, you know,
to keep notifications was a big one.
(07:26):
Everything is designed
to just keep you engaged
in this short form, low attention,
low critical thinking, just like,
from, from, from, from
endless scroll that like.
So it's not surprising that chat GPT has
that effect on people
where they just don't remember.
And I'm like, I haven't
really utilized that until,
(07:49):
more recently, I used it
to help me with an email
the other day for the first time.
I was like, oh yeah, do you know what?
I forgot that I know exists.
And--
you know, it seems, it feels like the
easy way out every time.
You're like, well, okay, I'll just, I'll
just get this to do it for me.
And it helped you with that email.
Yeah, it did. It was a good email.
(08:09):
I was like, that was, that was better
than I, that was more, you know,
polite than I would have put it. It was,
I was dealing with an insurance company
and basically, yeah.
So, you know, like it modified, um, like
my initial email would have been
something like, where's my fucking money?
Give me my fucking money.
And then chat GPT was
like, where's my fucking money?
Give me my fucking money,
please. So it was, you know,
(08:33):
it just softened the blow a little bit.
Well, there you go. The power of AI. Uh,
I will say on the, the,
the reading thing, I was so blown away. I
was, uh, you know, I'm,
I'm late to the party on
many, many slang things,
but when the first time I saw TLDR,
someone texted me TL, yeah,
too long, did not read.
Too long, didn't read. Yeah.
I was so blown. I mean, first of all, I
(08:54):
absolutely would have never guessed it.
And then them explaining it to me,
I was so blown away that
that was even existing,
that it was even necessary. And then here
we are, that was, you know,
months ago. And now I'm
realizing, Oh, it is very valid.
This is the world that we live in.
Everything is TLDR. What else here? Uh,
(09:14):
other fun things. Brain
scans showed the damage clearly.
Neural connections
dropped from 79 to just 42.
That is a 47% loss in brain connectivity.
If anyone cares about that anymore,
if your computer lost nearly half its
processing power, you'd say it's broken.
That's what's happening to
our brains of chat, GPT users,
half our processing
(09:35):
grower, my God. And back to our,
our little writing metaphor teachers
couldn't tell which essays were written
with AI, but they knew something felt
off, some descriptions,
soulless, empty of real content, flawless
language, but no personal insight.
The human brain can sense cognitive debt,
(09:56):
even when it doesn't have
the words to explain it.
And I don't want to sound like an old
fogey and it's easy to be so black and
white with this. We know it's a tool. We
know that we're using Google.
We're new. We know that we have all this
technology at our fingertips.
I'm wondering if we're, we're at a place
in society and we want to read more
books, but we, but we don't have the
time. Are we willing to be uncomfortable?
(10:18):
That's it. No, exactly. Uh, the 30 seconds is not right.
30 seconds it takes if your internet is
slow for your phone to load,
dealing with ads on YouTube.
Are we willing to deal with the time it
takes to read an article versus the TLDR,
the, the long journey of
let's say writing a novel,
(10:40):
creating a short film, editing something,
or is it the new standard is just going
to be pop something into AI with the
correct prompts and it'll come
out in two and a half minutes.
This is another, another
metaphor. I was in a pinch. I was,
I was editing something. I was touching
up a photo of the pyramids in Egypt and
(11:00):
I was like, okay, well
let me just try chat GPT.
I don't want to take the time to remove
some of the tourists in the background
and fix it up. Let me just throw it in
there. I threw it into chat GPT.
It removed all the tourists.
It also changed the color and removed the
texture of the sand.
(11:21):
So my point is is for the better or was
this a nightmare for the worse?
It wasn't horrible, but it was off.
It's like everyone was saying of the, of
these chat GPT essays.
It just didn't look real. Right? Yeah. So
it's like, it's like,
I'm showing everyone a
picture of the pyramids. Do it.
Is the sand really that
smooth? This didn't look real.
(11:43):
So there was part of
me, it was like, okay,
this is the perfect
metaphor for AI. It's like,
it did what I wanted.
It's slightly off and then it removed the
texture and I had no control over it.
Am I going to keep putting in prompts,
put the texture back in the sand,
blah, blah, blah. Can you not change the
(12:03):
color? And at that point,
I just didn't use chat GPT at all. And
some people don't care.
I did.
And I just left the people in the
background and left
the tourists in there.
AI is not perfect. And it's actually kind
of nice that it's not perfect.
Eventually we'll get to the point where
we don't actually need to do the slow,
hard work. Why? If you had the choice,
(12:25):
would we actually choose to do the slow,
hard work? I feel like real writers,
and I said this even beginning,
I said this years ago when we just
started talking about AI, um,
real writers actually
like doing the long,
hard work and actually
enjoy the presence of writing.
Some do. I, well, I think
the smart ones probably,
I think the smart ones
probably use, use it as a tool.
(12:47):
You know, I actually spoke
to a writer friend about this,
a very accomplished writer and they use,
they use, you know, AI as a,
as a tool, but like also said that like
AI cannot do what I can do.
It's, it would take them longer to, if
they had chat GPT write a script,
it would take them longer to make that
(13:07):
script good than it would to write the
script themselves from scratch,
but they can use it for prompts and they
can use it for certain things or for
research. It's a tool like anything else.
I think as well, like, you know,
there was this resistance. Um,
one of my friends is a
comic book artist and you know,
had some resistance to everything being
(13:29):
digitally drawn now as it is, you know,
but also has had to adapt and
use that as well. So I think,
I think it's kind of a, the, the smart,
the people who use it
effectively can use it as a tool.
People who depend on it entirely, I think
are fucked to be honest.
Cause like that's not,
when researchers asked chat GPT users to
(13:52):
write without any AI help,
they did worse than people
who never used AI at all. Uh,
this isn't just
dependency. It's cognitive atrophy.
It's like a muscle that stopped
remembering how to move, you know,
there, there you go. It's these, these
skills are getting weaker.
So I just don't know. Do you know anyone
who uses it? So, I mean, I don't know.
(14:13):
I don't think you can really be a writer
if you're just using AI as a,
as a way to write, but like,
let's, let's talk about this.
I personally don't want to be the last
one at the party and I also don't want to
be an extinct dinosaur. So I, I, I'm
going to do the work and be as open as
possible. A hundred
percent. If you're writing, uh, uh,
(14:33):
AI can help you find
better adjectives. Uh,
AI can help you craft certain things. I
mean, it, it, it only,
it can amplify the skills that you
already have. So say for example, I, I,
I saw a video that was for basic writing.
This is an ex journalist.
He's talking about how he uses chat GPT.
They put it in a way that's,
that was pretty spot
(14:54):
on AI or chat GPT or a
tool like that is essentially an
assistant who is very savvy
that you can be mean to.
Probably not a great practice either.
But if you had a writer's assistant, um,
I get it.
You don't need to take the time to be
extra polite to them in a human social,
(15:17):
I mean, here's the thing. I, I, I, I get
why that's a selling point.
I get why, um, you know,
for a basic level assistant that would be
handy and, and there you go.
And it's in every law office,
every bank is using it and all the
analysts are being told by their boss to
(15:39):
start using it.
Well, that's the thing, isn't
it? Like, I mean, that's the,
that's the argument,
one of the arguments against AI is that
it like it kills those jobs and it kills
the, it robs people of the experience.
Like having an assistant, you know,
that assistant is presumably
an aspiring writer or a law,
or a law clerk or whatever.
(16:00):
You're robbing them of that opportunity
to learn. So, you know, what,
what does that produce
down the line? You know,
what kind of workforce does
that produce in, you know, in,
in writers or now look,
there's people find a way,
they always have and they'll, they'll
figure out how to write,
but it kind of takes away, you know,
(16:22):
that pipeline of people coming up and
learning, learning that way.
That's probably in a lot
of positions, like not just
That's a great point.
(16:44):
On that note, you're 100% and this is
what people were worried about with
during the strike and there was in the
stipulations of contracts, it was the
size of the writers rooms.
They introduced AI is allowed in writers
rooms and those tools, but this idea of
apprenticeship is dying.
(17:05):
You're completely right.
Those positions aren't going to exist and
I think it's actually a big nod to create
your own stuff because that's the only
time you're actually going to have the
experience of building something.
Editing it yourself, directing it
yourself, writing it yourself.
(17:26):
Because on the upper level of TV shows
and films, it's going to be Ryan Murphy,
Shonda Rhimes and then everyone else.
One of my big worries is for the next
generation, all the young ones who are
walking around with
smartphones and Google and AI.
My sister is an art teacher, public
(17:48):
school. She's been working at a high
school for the past couple years now.
There was a program thrown by Adobe, so
it was sponsored by Adobe and they had an
expert and a mentor over there.
So needless to say, they were talking
about Adobe. This is how you use it. But
also these are some new AI tools.
(18:09):
They're they're pitching very talented,
real artists in high school. Their brains
aren't even fully developed.
So they're seeing these tools for the
first time and they're like, wait, it
just creates right these people.
I've seen these kids work. They are so
brilliant and they'll just draw something
right in front of it.
(18:29):
It almost brings me to tears after the
program. All the kids went up to her and
said, did you approve
this? This isn't right.
All these high school artists said, what
is with this AI art? We don't want to
have anything to do with it.
And I was like, thank you. Fight the
power. It's kind of nice to see. And
we'll see. We'll see the next
(18:49):
generation if that continues.
Let's just wrap up. Let's just wrap up
this AI thing. The last statistic here.
Chat GPT helps you finish tests 60
percent faster, but it cuts the germane
cognitive load essential for real
learning by 32 percent.
In other words, you're swapping long term
brain power for short term speed. That
(19:11):
sounds like you're advertising chat GPT.
It sounds like you're doing it like a
like a like a pharmaceutical, like a big
fire, like a like a drug ad.
And you're saying the good chat GPT can
help you do this, but it also ruins your
brain. Well, he runs your brain.
Well, it all I'm trying not to I'm trying
to be fair about this. It's easy to
hammer and it's easy to hammer this.
But ultimately, people are going to still
(19:32):
use chat GPT fund. And, you know, let's
say working out, you will need many reps
to actually build muscle.
Abs don't happen within 30 seconds yet.
So we might still need to do long, hard
and uncomfortable work at some point.
Anything worth doing takes time except
(19:54):
losing weight on a zimpic, apparently,
because I've seen a lot of
those epic around lately.
Exactly. People drop and wait
very fast. Exactly. Exactly.
Yeah, apparently there's a generic
ozimpic that's running around. So that
that's that's also I mean, who knows,
technology is making
leaps and bounds right now.
So moving on, this is a good segue
(20:16):
because the lines are getting blurred. We
have to talk about this because it was
just on my mind, these vertical shorts
that are taking over Hollywood.
Very much like A.I., I just feel like I
want to be fair. And I also want to be
honest. This is not it's
(20:38):
not pretty on either side.
Well, let's explain what they are first.
And I'm assuming you're familiar with
them to a degree, right?
These are vertical shorts.
They're on apps. They're essentially a
minute or two minute long short episodes,
highly addictive,
mostly campy soap operas.
A lot of these companies are Chinese
companies, not tick tock related, but
(20:59):
very similar. And they're expanding and
breaking out over in Hollywood.
If you're in L.A., it's it's one of the
only things that are shooting. They're
almost 100 percent non-union.
It's they'll throw you whatever, whatever
they have, you know, a couple hundred
dollars, maybe more
all non-union contracts.
But they are actively being watched. Real
(21:22):
Shorts alone is a Chinese company. And it
can. It's some months is making ten
million dollars a month on revenue, ten
million dollars a month at a time where
major studios are hurting.
But these non-union vertical shorts of
really cheesy soap
operas are just on fire.
(21:43):
Like you say, they're basically the
modern soap operas, but done in very
short form and done made
and churned out very cheaply.
I would love to hear if you got any
specific information from people who
worked at Biz. I don't know any friends
on hand. I did have to
do a little research.
I I did a video on it on my Instagram
(22:04):
just because I want to talk about it. A
lot of my non-union actor friends were
asking about it, whether they thought it
was bad for their career or not.
It's polarizing. It's polarizing. And I
will be fair. If you watch this, I'd like
to say that this is pretty
standard of a soap opera.
It is not standard of a soap opera. If
you're going to compare that to General
(22:25):
Hospital, I'm trying. I'm not.
I don't want to be judgy about what the
content is because some people can say
I'll never watch General Hospital or, you
know, one life to live.
You will be able to tell the difference
between these shorts
and General Hospital.
Some people will compare it to a Hallmark
movie. They're all cliffhangers. And, you
(22:46):
know, the brilliance of this is not only
are they being watched,
they are making money.
They are making a lot of money. You will
need to for some of the apps, you will
need to pay a dollar to see the ending,
to see the next episode.
People are paying money. People are being
trained to pay for money when everyone
cut cable and doesn't want to pay for
(23:08):
Hulu or Netflix. They are
paying to see these shorts.
So, yeah, so there's a couple of things
here in my head about that. One, people
are paying for it. People are watching
it. Who are we to say
it's right or wrong?
I mean, I can watch them and I don't want
to do them. Well, I don't have the
option. But like, but I I mean, what
(23:30):
would you say to a non-union
actor or an open coming actor?
Some an agent had said to had kept
sending somebody these vertical shorts
and they kept shooting them down. And
they were like, you know, the agent was
kind of saying, well, these are the only
things going on at the moment.
Like, are you sure you won't do them? And
this person was kind of pushing back
against them. So and then I
(23:51):
know people who've done them.
And I know someone who's doing one, I
think, at the moment. And she's, you
know, it's giving her she's non-union and
it's giving her employment for
a month or whatever, you know.
So it's a tricky one. I mean, you know,
part of me is like, look, if you're if
you're if you're not a union and you're
open coming and you want to
experience on camera, go for it.
I mean, I don't know what the I don't
(24:14):
know what the downside is for someone in
that position. It's experience.
Yeah. Let's talk about the good things.
Right. Because, you know, we're trying to
explain these vertical like, honestly, if
you're not on the app or if you haven't
seen these things and you should
essentially Google it because it was hard
for me to really
picture it until I saw it.
(24:36):
Now, keep in mind, if you're listening to
this, these shorts are essentially all
non-union actors like Rian
and I don't have the option.
So I just want to be clear here. I don't
want to sound judgy and poo poo. I am 100
percent jealous that there is so much
work that is successful. I will admit it.
(24:56):
I am happy not to do them. But I, you
know, there is a little FOMO, right? If
you were not. And this is actually part
of the reason why I did the video,
because it's easy for people to judge it.
By the way, the writing alone, people
thought this had to be written by A.I.
(25:16):
It's the billionaire werewolf who's, you
know, sleeping with your I'm not even
talking about a lot of
werewolves, a lot of billionaires.
They're all hot. Oh, yeah. This is the
thing. This is it. This is general
hospital and then add more billionaires
and more werewolves.
Amazing. I didn't know the content.
Oh, no, no. This is not exaggeration.
(25:38):
Well, I mean, I think that's a good place
to end it. Thanks for listening, guys.
We'll see you next week.
Everyone was convinced this was written
by A.I. And then the consensus was this
is so cringy and weird. A.I. couldn't
have done this. OK, you
would actually probably love it.
Most people actually would get a kick out
(26:00):
of it. And I think that's part of the
camp and part of the fun. Now, here's the
thing. This is the one time in our
industry where you can make some decent
scratch, get some experience.
You might be in demand and might keep you
busy. And by the way, everyone is kind of
looking around, twiddling their thumbs. I
don't have any judgment.
(26:22):
I know this might be weird to say. I
think if non-union actors could do it, I
think they should because
there's nothing else going on.
I was going to say, but the only thing to
be careful of, well, one, the writing is
obviously shite. So like you're not
working with great material,
but you're getting experience.
The other thing is, I don't know what I
presume these are like viewable in
(26:45):
perpetuity for no
more money. I'm guessing.
So there's probably an in perpetuity
clause there for this kind of stuff. And
I don't know what kind of A.I.
protections are in there, if any.
So these I presume without knowing. Thank
you. Very ignorant. But like they could
be used to train A.I. potentially. Right.
Thank you. Thank you for bringing that
(27:06):
up. Let's get to the bad stuff.
You're welcome. OK, you're welcome. Union
actors might judge it, might feel above
it. I actually to do my video, I want to
be fair and I also want to do research.
By the way, TikTok, not surprisingly,
loves these shorts. If you are in a
(27:29):
popular vertical short, you very well
could leverage that
for a TikTok following.
So just put that in perspective where
there are some ways you can make money.
This is the difference. Is it better for
your acting career or is it
better for your bank account?
Some people might want to be TikTok
famous and they're perfectly happy. And
(27:51):
maybe they become an actor later on.
Maybe they don't. So there's no judgment.
If you're 22 years old and I saw a lot of
really hardworking actors on TikTok who
were doing these vertical shorts, talking
about their experience,
they're like, we don't love it.
It's not great. But here I am. I'm making
money as an actor. And I can't knock
that. Let's talk about the dangers.
And I would love if we can get someone to
(28:12):
comment or if anyone's done a vertical
short, if you can tell us if these
contracts are in
perpetuity, it is not set in stone.
A lot of these are in perpetuity
contracts. That means that they have your
use, your likeness and rights forever.
This is stuff that people want to touch
(28:33):
with a 10 foot pole ever. But if every
actor is doing it, you know, ideally
non-union actors, they know that they're
going to get away with it.
We have union protections in every TV and
film show. That's never the case that
someone would be able to use it.
What does forever mean? Not only does it
mean like 50 in 50 years or 100 years
(28:55):
when everyone's gone, it means that if
you sell it or license it to Netflix.
And it gets five billion more views. You
don't get a penny. You have non-union
contracts. They're getting
away with a lot of things.
A rate could be $200 a day. It's not bad.
Non-union, $200 a day.
Have fun on set. Goof off.
(29:15):
I've heard three grand
was thrown at somebody.
Three grand a day? Not three grand a day.
Because they kept turning
them down and they wanted them.
Wow.
But even say so. So that's it. That's an
isolated case. And that's a very specific
case. I don't want to in general. It's
$200, maybe $800 a day if you can
(29:37):
negotiate a thousand dollars a day.
But you're right. Three
thousand dollars is that's a lot.
That's when you stack that up against a
ULB rate, which I think now is $249 a
day. That's ultra low budget or a UPA,
ultra low budget project agreement.
A modified low budget is about $480 a
(29:59):
day, I think. Even a low
budget is less than that.
So when you stack up the day rate for
union jobs, I mean, these vertical shorts
in a lot of cases are
blowing them out of the water.
The lines, the lines are blurred. I saw
that argument. If you compare it to an
ultra low budget, ultra, like you said,
(30:19):
it's a hard comparison.
I think it's unfair. You're right. Is
there any fair in Hollywood? Real shorts
is making ten million dollars.
None of these actors will ever make any
residuals. And it's a buyout. Now, here's
the thing. We talk about
usages. We talk about usages.
We don't. The short term is how much
(30:40):
money am I walking away with? That's the
short term. The long term is impropriety.
And this this also bridges to non-union
commercials. There are some non-union
commercials that you will walk away with
eight thousand
dollars, ten thousand dollars.
That is pretty good for a buyout. They'll
own you for two years or so on or longer,
(31:01):
and they'll rerun it a bajillion times.
But the point is, is that is a really bad
usage rate that non-union commercials
will take advantage of non-union actors.
This is even worse. Our industry, the
lines are blurring where if people are
going to get used to more non-union.
This is my danger. My danger is if people
(31:23):
get more used to non-union work, if
non-union vertical shorts are going to
take over Hollywood, and
this is the new standard,
then slowly all of us are going to be
working in perpetuity and not having
ownership over our
likeness. That's my worry.
Yeah, I just looked up the rates there.
So it's actually lower than I thought.
Vertical shorts, apparently they pay
anywhere from 100 to 500 per day.
(31:45):
But the average seems to be sort of four
to 500. Those are fair. And we also
didn't get into hypothetically, if they
sold all these shows to
a third party company,
and they can use all these shows to train
generative AI. If you signed away a
contract in
perpetuity, they could do that.
(32:05):
No one's saying that they are doing that,
but it's very possible that they could.
These are all tech companies, so that
could happen tomorrow.
Yeah, and you're right. The pay is... And
look, I obviously want everybody to be
doing union projects and that to be, you
know, for them to be
more widely available.
But you're talking about 1246 a day on a
union show versus the availability of
(32:27):
these vertical shorts. I mean, you know,
you're not booking
co-stars every day of the week.
Exactly.
And then these vertical shorts seem to be
just available to, you know, whoever's
interested, whoever wants to audition and
wants to get involved.
There seems to be a lot of them, is what
I'm saying. So it's
volume versus, you know.
What happens when Disney and Netflix
(32:48):
start shooting vertical shorts
themselves? We would hope that their
union... Well, just imagine if Disney and
Netflix start throwing billions of
dollars into non-union TV shows.
I don't even know where our industry and
our union would fall in that, but just
imagine that that's
what I'm worried about.
(33:10):
To put your mind at risk, we'll all be
dead someday. So I just...
You mean put my mind at ease?
Yeah, exactly. Yeah, we'll keep an eye on
that. But if you hear anything, let us
know in the comments. Hit us up. Actors
Guide Podcast at gmail.com.
Hit us up in the comments on our social
media. I'm still amazed. People can't pay
(33:34):
rent. They're paying $80 to
$100 addicted to these shorts.
And that's the beauty. Hey, people are
watching something. I got
that. Let's do hidden gems.
Hidden gems. Let me get my hidden gem. So
this is my... I don't
know if you can see this.
Salad dressing? No, not salad dressing,
although it looks like salad dressing. My
(33:54):
hidden gem for this week is...
So I spent a week in Chicago. I stayed
with some friends in
Evanston for a few days.
And Daniel and Maythele, if you're
listening, and they made... Maythele made
phenomenal pancakes and
they had this syrup on them.
And it's this organic, no added sugar,
(34:16):
strawberry syrup. I don't
know where it comes from.
Wow. But basically, it's called wah-bree
or... It has a formula over the A, so I
don't know how you pronounce that.
But it's fantastic. And it has one gram
of sugar, which is no grams of added
sugar and one gram of
sugar. And it's delicious.
So you loved it so much
(34:36):
you bought some of yourself?
No. Maythele, I came home today and
Maythele had sent me some in the mail. I
just got an Amazon
delivery of this stuff.
And saying, to remind you of your family
in Illinois, basically.
Wow. What a great friend.
Yeah. So huge love to
(34:59):
Daniel and Maythele.
It's really sweet.
It's really tasty.
There's no sugar in it.
That's great. I love that. So we'll keep
it on the culinary train here. So I did a
little trip up to Maine. I'm in Maine for
the first time ever.
A quick little stop in Portland. Also a
special shout out. Our
friend Mary Nederkorn.
(35:21):
So gracious. I visited
her on the way to Portland.
Stopped by her place in Boston. She
offered her place as a pit stop just to
make us some food, be able
to rest from the long drive.
She hosted my parents and my sister. And
(35:43):
we walked around their
garden, ate their fresh vegetables.
They made handmade bread, lunch for us as
a pit stop. Incredibly
gracious. So a special shout out.
Your hidden gem is Mary Nederkorn.
No, no, no, no, no. That was a shout out.
That was a shout out.
Yeah, I know. If you're lucky enough to
know Mary Nederkorn,
(36:04):
then God bless you. Yeah.
That's pretty niche.
That's pretty specific.
So we stopped in Portland for a couple of
days. I want to shout
out this restaurant.
Portland, Maine is a very popular little
food, up-and-coming food
city. A lot of choices.
I will shout out. There's a lobster
restaurant that's literally on
(36:24):
a floating barge. Pretty big.
Like there's a nice deck. You could take
pictures and chill out. But my family
had, you know, a table full of lobsters.
I'm allergic. So I was just watching
them. Are you? Yeah,
I know. We share that.
Do you have an EpiPen?
Do you have an EpiPen?
I just stay away from it. I don't carry
(36:47):
it around. I should, but
I just stay away from it.
You have one, though, right?
Well, the issue is they expire after two
years. I know. Yeah, yeah.
So I don't keep buying them. You don't
reopen? I have one. Yeah, I have one. But
again, I stay away from it.
It's crustaceans. Crab,
lobster, and shrimp. I can't go.
Yeah, same thing as
me. I stay away from it.
(37:08):
Chinese. I know we're getting on a
tangent. Chinese food. Good God. They put
shrimp paste in every sauce. Yeah.
So 100 percent. I get I get cut all every
so often. I'll eat some some Chinese
sauce. And next thing you
know, it has shrimp in it.
So you've got to watch out. But that you
and me are right. We're right there.
Also, also a quick question on that. Did
(37:29):
you always have that allergy? Because I
did not. I developed mine later.
This is this is a fun story. I developed
it later. I grew up eating cocktail
shrimp. No problem.
Crab lobster. No problem.
My mom cooked shrimp a certain way.
Actually, we might be able to diagnose
each other right now. My
mom cooked shrimp one way.
(37:51):
It was like Asian style, like they had
the heads on it. I literally
almost died in high school.
We were so blown away by it. They didn't
take me to the hospital. I almost died
from a food allergy and a phylicic shock.
We waited it out and I just the food
(38:12):
allergy. I was like puffed up everything.
I almost died. We
didn't know what it was.
I should have went to the hospital. I
didn't even know I had a food allergy.
And it was only when shrimp
was cooked that certain way.
I never touched it again. And we were all
shocked. And my mom felt really bad
because she cooked the shrimp.
Years later, I was still eating shrimp. I
just didn't eat shrimp that way. I went
(38:34):
to a friend's barbecue and they had a
Cajun style when it
was cooked the same way.
But it was New Orleans style. And I was
like, oh, this shouldn't be an issue. It
was Asian style that almost killed me. I
ate it Cajun style. Almost died again.
And then last time I ate a lot of shrimp
and I got dizzy. I got dizzy. I was
(38:55):
bloated. I looked like I was a Will Smith
and hitch. I almost died again.
And I swore it off. I was like, you know
what? Honestly, I ate enough. I don't
miss it. And that's where I
fall. I just stay away from it.
Okay. I had to tell you that story
because you just asked me. I had to tell
you. No, it's a good. It's a good story.
It's a good story because mine was I had
(39:16):
eaten it my whole life. No real issues. I
remember getting sick from a seafood
pizza when I was younger.
But I think that might have been
unrelated. Anyway, I had no problems. A
crab one time, I think it was working
somewhere. I think it was
in Chicago. I was working.
And I ate crab and I was like, and I was
like, my throat got really scratchy and
like kind of like trouble breathing. And
(39:37):
I was like, that's weird. And like my
throat was closing up a bit.
And but I because I had eaten it before I
didn't make the connection. I thought,
okay, so it was okay. And I was all
right. And, you know, went away after a
few hours and I felt okay. So I was like,
whatever. Just ignored it.
And then I had it a few months later and
it was worse. It was the same reaction.
Throw closing up, you know, eyes puffy, I
(39:57):
think. And like, but it was worse. So
then, you know, I was like, okay, well, I
got to stay away from that. My sister had
also developed an
allergy. Wow. Well, there you go.
So I stayed away from it for years. And
then, you know, I got an Epi-Pam or
whatever. And then years later, I got an
Epi-Pam and I got, you know, moved out
here. And then I did an allergy test a
while later. And they're not always
(40:20):
reliable, I believe. Yeah, they're not
100%. They're not 100%. But they did an
allergy test and doctor was like, oh,
you're fine. And I was like, okay, great.
So I started out by
trying to eat shrimp again.
Instantly, like a hay fever reaction,
like my eyes puffed up itchy eyes
instantly from eating the shrimp. I told
the doctor and he's like, yeah, you can't
eat any of that. He's like, you're out.
(40:41):
So I can't eat any crustaceans.
Wait, did he explain why the
test said one way and then?
Because I hadn't touched it for over 10
years. Like there was none of it. My body
just didn't react to whatever they did.
So it just, it didn't show up as an
allergy. But then, but then I had an
allergic reaction to shrimp. So
shrimps out. Shrimps out. Lobsures out.
(41:03):
So back to it. I'm also in the lobster
capital of the world here in Maine. So
everyone's enjoying lobster. So my hidden
gem going back to my hidden gem.
D'Amilo's restaurant is all floating on a
barge. It was exactly what my family was
looking for. They had a bunch of lobster.
I had a fried haddock sandwich. I'll
probably, I'll probably put pictures of
it in the video. But it was great. It was
(41:26):
great. And to be honest, this entire
trip, it was the best lobster we had. So
I want a special shout out. So many good
food options in Portland, Maine, but that
gets our stamp of approval. This is like
the time. This is like the time that I,
I, my hidden gem was Woods Cafe. Like
you're just your hidden gem is a lobster
restaurant that you can't eat most of
what they serve. My hidden gem was Woody
(41:49):
Harrelson's like weed cafe. I couldn't
touch. I couldn't touch any of the
anything in there being sober.
Ironically, he probably
smelled more weed than I ate lobster.
Well, do we do any reason that like we
went in at 10 in the morning and nobody
was smoking weed. So that was the only
reason I was able to stay there.
Yeah, yeah, it's great footage. It is
(42:10):
very exciting watching someone just chomp
away into a lobster though. It gets kind
of nauseating after a while, but you just
it's pretty exciting
for them. Yeah, yeah.
Exciting for them pretty gross. I always
found lobster too much work. Anyway, I
never, I never worked.
Crab and lobster is not worth the hustle.
Yeah, give it up guys. Let it go.
(42:31):
That's all stop eating it. Yeah, leave
the cards alone. All right, guys. I hope
you enjoyed it. See you next week and
we'll be back at it.
See you next week, guys.
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