April 30, 2025 • 37 mins
In this episode, Claire Pedrick and Monica Ruiz explore the themes of transformation and personal growth through coaching. Monica shares her journey from corporate executive to coach, discussing her experiences of awakening, the struggle between control and surrender, and the importance of embracing both light and darkness in the journey of self-acceptance. They delve into the concept of flow in life, the challenges of navigating loss and change, and the need for connection in a world that often promotes isolation. The conversation culminates in recommendations for further exploration of these themes through literature and personal reflection.
Book Recommendations: Adyashanti: The End of Your World
Takeaways:
- Transformation can happen in moments or over time.
- Monica's journey into coaching began with a realisation of her role as an enabler.
- Awakening is a process of liberation and self-discovery.
- The unexpected can challenge our identities and plans.
- Surrendering control can lead to deeper trust in life.
- Embracing darkness is essential for self-acceptance.
- Flow in life requires letting go of control and expectations.
- Navigating loss involves being present with grief and change.
- Life is a spectrum of experiences, both good and bad.
- Connection with others is vital for personal growth and healing.
Sound Bites:
- "Transformation is in a moment or over time."
- "I'm an enabler and an encourager."
- "Flow is you let go of the control."
- "Can we make space for everything?"
- "Be with it, and it starts changing."
- "It's a destruction of that paradigm."
- "We are wired for connection."
Contact Monica through Linked In or http://www.ingeniuminmovement.com/
Contact Claire by emailing info@3dcoaching.com or checking out her 3D Coaching Supervision Community
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If you’d like to find out more about 3D Coaching, you can get all our new ideas and offers in our weekly email.
Coming Up:
- Former Olympian Cath Bishop on what she has learned about teams from rowing
- Open Table: Inclusion and Difference in 1-1s
Key Words
transformation, coaching, awakening, personal growth, surrender, self-acceptance, flow, loss, connection, self-actualisation
We love having a variety of guests join us! Please remember that inviting someone to participate does not mean we necessarily endorse their views or opinions. We believe in open conversation and sharing different perspectives.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:14):
Hello and welcome to this week's edition of The Coaching Inn.
I'm your host, Claire Pedrick, and today I'm delighted to be in the company of my friend,Monica Ruiz.
Hello, Monica.
We often talk, don't we, in coaching about transformation, and sometimes transformation isin a moment, and sometimes the transformation is over time, and sometimes it...
(00:44):
is unexpected and looks different from what we thought it was going to look like.
So that's what we're going to be talking about in today's episode.
So Monica, before we talk about transformation, tell us a little bit about your journeyinto coaching.
Thank you.
Thanks for having me today.
(01:05):
As an avid listener of podcasts and huge fan of yours, it just feels like a dream cometrue being here.
So let me just say that straight away.
Journey to coaching started when I was back in corporate.
So my background is in corporate.
I used to be a corporate executive back in the day, city of London.
(01:30):
I had this conversation with my friend Vivek, now might be listening to this so this isfor you, who actually shared something about, wow, you're such a great leader, your team
really loves you, you're just a great encourager.
And kind of that something clicked to me around, wow, I'm going to be really good atbusiness and strategy and doing these thinking processes, but actually I'm an enabler.
(01:59):
And I'm an encourager for these people to grow, fulfill themselves, journeys.
It's kind of, pondered on that a little bit with my culture at the time.
And I just decided, you know, I really like learning.
I really like expanding my horizons.
So thought, why not training for these coaching things?
I completed my training and I loved it.
(02:22):
And I loved every second of it.
And I really saw myself doing that.
and kind of brought a gigantic piece of fulfillment, kind of almost like it fitted in atime where I was a bit disenchanted by corporate and, you know, why am I doing what I'm
doing?
She landed at the right time.
(02:43):
So that first year was a bit of a, let's just try this out.
It worked out.
So, you know, a few months after I was having a chat with my CMO to say, I'm out of here.
Hahaha
And that's how it started, you know, that's how it started.
This year is my year number seven, doing this full time.
(03:04):
Wow, wow, so there was something in there about purposefulness.
Mmm, it is.
So you and I have spoken about this before, but for you, the personal transformationthat's come more recently, you've described as awakening.
(03:27):
Yes, Tan-tan.
I was a little bit in the background because I have a feeling that some of our listenerstoday might just feel a bit like, what is she talking about?
What is she's on?
You know, in awakening, I'm sure, you know, might just mean several things, differentthings for different people.
(03:48):
But to me, in the context of transformation, it's just a complete liberation process.
you know, that requires everything from you.
that comes from the inside.
that comes from inside, indeed.
Yeah.
(04:09):
So tell us about.
Start where you like to tell us about Awakening, Monica.
For you.
So like in coaching or, know, in any reflection, it's really, I find really handy to kindof look in perspective, kind of, you know, looking back and say, okay, you know, on hand
(04:31):
side.
So looking back, I could see, you know, things bubbling up and it was like a rumbling, theocean rumbling in the background around 2021.
you know that I got married after trying to get married for some time just because COVIDand lockdowns and you know I think about that time sometimes thinking that it was a
(05:00):
complete different lifetime but it wasn't that long ago right so it was kind of a timewhere I found myself really struggling with but I want to do this but I can't really do
that and I think kind of that's when the cracks started really going deep into
I've been this high achiever all my life.
You know, I have always made things happen.
(05:20):
It was part of my identity.
I felt really proud of it.
And in fact, you know, one of my, you know, one of my pitch lines when going forconsulting work or coaching work, you know, I come from corporate, I get things done.
I make things happen, you know, so you can trust me.
I will deliver.
(05:40):
I won't let you down.
So it was kind of all of these things.
And that kind of really showed me and I think collectively really showed us that theunexpected can happen.
And you don't know, you have no roadmap for this.
You have no blueprint for this.
So kind of there was a bit of a tremor there.
(06:02):
2022.
It was a big year for me.
had a big surgery and it was a year that I left London.
And it was an absolute heartbreak because London has always been home for me.
Person of reasons, you know, I was in a bit of a phase where I needed movement.
I needed to kind of shift things to kind of see that will spark a change, a change that Iwas seeking.
(06:25):
So I relocated to the Netherlands where, you know,
the accelerating gear, you know, that would go right into sixth gear.
I was like, okay, fuck off.
It does when everything really started.
And in the beginning, you and I talk about this, I didn't know what was going on.
(06:47):
like, am I losing my mind?
Am I going psychotic?
You know, because it was like, I will be invited to go into these very deep spaces of...
not just reflection but almost like all these tools all of this knowing that you thoughtyou had is no longer available you can't really push life is just taking over and you just
(07:16):
have to kind of go with it so that's another summary of
And that was tragic, as you know, we spoke about this because all of a sudden youridentity is questioned.
Oh, but I used to do these things and I used to be able to do those other things.
And now all of that is taken away.
The rug is being pulled.
What do do?
(07:38):
So that first year was a lot about, am I losing my mind?
Now as you can see, I love about it, but you know.
It's been devastating.
It sounds like a losing control.
Mmm.
And I'm just, can you talk a bit about the difference between losing control and choosingto release control?
(08:05):
mmm I love that and it feels like a very subtle difference because the difference is inthe choice or the internal choice you know how much of a choice do I have here and I know
this is gonna sound very non-coaching but one of the most difficult things in this journeyfor me was realizing how little control I had even in the choice you know
(08:34):
life had to go so hard at me to really let go and really build trust.
think you know like there's there's kind of a combo here in terms of letting go controlwhile you build you build trust in things will be fine you might not know where this is
going but just trust right it's also trust in I'm not really choosing like I used to butthat's okay
(09:02):
almost like I tried to say that life has your back and life and some of us will usedifferent labels for this.
So also want to be, you know, welcoming in whatever label that is for you.
For those that are listening, you know, is that God is that the universe is life is soulis spirit, you know, whatever matter that connects us all, larger purpose.
(09:27):
So to me, it was actually, you know, was a bit about
recognizing that there was a choice, there was still a choice in terms of...
how much, the choice really of thinking about this, the only choice was how much I'm gonnakeep resisting this.
(09:52):
That was really the ultimate choice.
the more that I resisted, harder it got.
So it was something about surrendering to something outside yourself.
Absolutely, that is happening within yourself.
Yeah and I know you had some company on the journey.
(10:15):
Yes!
Like yourself.
we have a mutual friend who is experiencing something similar and different during thistime.
Hello, Todd.
I'm sure he's been listening.
he was, he still is one of my lifelines because in all of this and to me, these awakeningjourneys started.
(10:40):
And again, I'm seeing these right now in a lot of peers, in a lot of clients, in a lot offriends within my network.
Maybe we collectively are going through a gigantic shifts in consciousness and theseawakening or
deep transformation, whatever you want to call it.
It's happening at different layers, degrees and intensities.
(11:01):
Also I'm learning that it's different for every person.
So I just happened to be really lucky to find someone that understood that language andkind of was really able to provide some reassurance, I think, around you're not going
crazy.
This is okay.
You've got this.
And because of his background around, you know, working with the shadow and working withthe darkness and, know, kind of really embracing that, you know, wholesome acceptance
(11:31):
around, I am okay.
He provided a vital support, especially because for me, everything started with the riseof darkness, the rise of aspects of me that I wasn't, until that point, I didn't accept.
I wasn't willing to embrace.
It's like, no, no, no, that's not me.
I'm a good person.
You know, a good person doesn't do this.
(11:52):
So he was pivotal in really bringing compassion, bringing understanding, bringing softnessinto.
You know, you are embodying the qualities of being alive.
You're embodying the qualities of life.
And that's a spectrum.
And in your little understanding of the world, that is good, that is bad, might bedifferent for someone else.
(12:20):
The journey is embracing it all.
Doesn't mean that you're becoming it.
And again, that's the identity piece is also quite important in the journey to reallyalmost a position in where it belongs.
know, because you're kind of becoming an instrument of life.
So life is becoming you, you are embodying it, but you're not it.
And to me, that was a distinction that kind of came farther along the line of, I'm notthese things, you know, or because I have access to these things doesn't mean that I need
(12:49):
to action them.
It doesn't mean that I need to kind of take action on them.
So the subtle layers and kind of came after, you know, first was, you know, the
It was a big bang.
It was the explosion.
Everything was contained.
It had to expand.
(13:09):
had to grow.
It had to go.
So that was kind of the first piece.
And as you know, I'm working right now around this grieving, loss, know, the meaning andthe significance around it.
But yeah, it was devastating.
All these things that I held precious, that I identified with, gone.
(13:30):
Then who are you anymore?
So there's a real sense as you're talking Monica about a journey of letting go ofsomething and of becoming and of toleratingly having absolutely no idea of what the
becoming might become.
(13:55):
not only tolerating but being okay with it and embracing it.
To me, and I'm really honest with this, I haven't got that yet.
There's days that are better than others.
There's some days where I wake up and I feel absolute possibility in me and that feels soexpanded and so glorious.
(14:17):
That wow, anything is possible because like the saying goes, when nothing is certain,everything is possible, right?
And that feels expanded and that feels sublime and that feels gorgeous.
And some days that feels like you're literally looking at the abyss.
And then you feel lost and it's like, that, it was like a vertical feeling of, this iskind of very deep and, where does that go?
(14:48):
So, and again, it's kind of also recognizing how much the mind is always trying to makestories out of everything.
And to me that was the key aspect that really unlocks a lot of the suffering.
The choice of suffering really, because if you are able to be with what it is and not makea story out of it, it's going and it's coming and it's leaving, then it becomes, you're
(15:20):
much more in flow, you are flow.
your flow.
The moment that the mind is trying to grip and this thing is happening because of and youknow that means that and then you need to make that choice.
You're done.
Yeah, so moving away from logic to a well, a real lived example you're describing of goingwith the flow.
(15:49):
It is something that to me kind of really hit home because I lived in Asia many years.
I really embraced Eastern's philosophies, Buddhism.
I'm a meditation teacher, know, many of my personalities and gigs, you know, alongsidecoaching is meditation.
You know, I've been meditating for two decades and it really hit true for the very firsttime.
(16:12):
You know, it's not this ideal flow, this constructed idea that then I choose when I'mflown or no.
Flow is you let go of the control.
Flow is you are the water that runs under the stream that doesn't question if there's awaterfall coming or there's a bug that is interrupting the flow or there's a stone that
(16:34):
makes it, that is changing direction.
Water doesn't question anything.
just flows.
Water just flows.
There's the concept of it.
And there's the richness of the layers of how all of that kind of lands and it getsembodied.
So there's a letting go.
(16:56):
letting go, acceptance and trust.
That doesn't mean again that kind of we are going into these...
I think because of my...
you know I've always been reading and interested in things you know there was this timethat I felt really nihilistic like this is just the end there's nothing right?
Okay absolute thinking here comes you know...
(17:22):
maybe what it is is something else.
It's just that you don't know and you might not have to know and that's okay.
So a massive tectonic.
shifting moving.
(17:43):
And the implications that I had in my daily life because you know I'm talking right now asa you know I'm a monk and I live in a monastery and I spent you know 18 hours meditating,
no!
I wish sometimes in fact I'm going to a monastery like next week to do precisely that.
I love doing that every now and then.
(18:03):
You have to just come in with life.
You you show up to work, you pay your bills, you're over your relationships.
So to me, that was really difficult because there will be days that I will be so immersedin this process.
It's like, how, how, how am going to just, you know, deal with this?
And the many other layers of loss, know, awakening kind of in a way, turn up the intensityand in a way brought
(18:32):
breathed into which areas of my life would actually touch and dissolve.
But then there was practical things around the passing of a very dear one, my own journeywith motherhood and miscarriages and what that meant to me, me and my partner temporarily
(18:54):
separating because we needed space to really process.
the idea of coming to the Netherlands and not really working out and being in between theUK and the Netherlands and now potentially relocating back to the UK, you know.
So, so much, you know, because it's not like one thing and then that one thing hits youand kind of expands, you know, it's that multiple complex layers of
(19:21):
this is not working and there's nothing you can do about it.
Because when I really went to kind of resource from that muscle of, let me just go to thethings that I used to do in the past, I used to work.
Not only they're not there, they're not working.
So there's kind of this sort of, there's a latent space of, so what do you do now?
(19:44):
Nothing.
Be with it.
Sit with it.
The only way is through.
So what's the thread?
Monica, what's the thread that you're holding onto through this process?
this trust the word is trust and even like at times it has glimpses of hope and not hopebecause it's gonna get better it's hope in
(20:17):
Let me rephrase that.
I think what it has really brought is a sense of wholesomeness, but wholesomeness in theway that, not the sugarcoated version that wellness tries to sell us, wholesomeness in the
way that life is a very wide spectrum of colors and tastes and textures.
(20:43):
and holding on to the idea that only when life goes well or goes the way that I want meansthat I'm going well or I'm doing well is a complete illusion.
You know, I always say, you can we make space for everything?
Can we make space for, can we be with everything?
(21:04):
Can I be with you today, know, right now excited and sharing this journey and, you know,two hours in the afternoon, can I be with my grief?
And that's okay, you know, it doesn't have to be that, because I've been with my grief,I'm doing something wrong because I feel bad.
No, that is just, you know, I think part of this reshifting is very necessary.
(21:26):
Hmm.
Because we have this kind of absolute thinking and absolute expectations of, you know, asuccessful life means always happy, always succeeding, always growing, always creating.
Is that a true representation of life?
Where's the destruction?
Where's the dissolution?
Where's the despair?
Where's the sadness?
(21:47):
Where's the pain?
Another thing is, are we making a story out of it?
really anchors us and kind of then creates all of these narratives and neuroses in us.
But can we be with things?
And still, you know, I think that we all bring a very valuable personal richness into theworld that comes with a desire and with a purpose and with a mission.
(22:15):
And that's beautiful that we kind of we feel that.
And that kind of is just part of the whole conglomerate of richness in the collective.
So there's something in what you're saying about accepting what is.
It reminds me, of that, of there's a systemic principle that says acknowledge what is andhow often we want to make what is into something else.
(22:47):
And how unsexy that sounds in our world, you know, because our world wants change andwants to drive and be better and become a better version of yourself, you know, all of
these kind of, you know, I'm not going to say they're well-intentioned, but they're alsovery misleading.
into creating something that is not, because it really creates scapes and avoidingmechanisms of being with what it is.
(23:17):
And that was kind of one of my, you know, being really honest, that was kind of one of mygetaways.
Like, but I can get away from this.
I can just cope with something else.
can't, know, it is too hard.
I don't want to deal with it.
And, you know, the one learning that after these four very intense years is
(23:37):
Be with it.
Be with it.
And the moment that you are with it, the moment that it starts changing.
That's kind of, it's almost a counter-intuitive thing.
That, I don't need to do anything.
It is when I stop scaping and I'm with the thing, that then me and the thing starttransmuting, starts changing.
(23:58):
Yeah.
and can even do this thing.
As you're talking, it makes me think about how different what you're describing is fromthe world of kind of self-actualizing.
I can have anything, I can be anything, I can do anything, and it can eternally get betterand better.
(24:19):
And I think that there's some danger in the world that we inhabit in our work, that thatcan, you know, if I read more, do more, meditate more, pray more, whatever more, I can
make things happen.
And what you're describing is something quite different.
(24:43):
It is.
destruction of that paradigm really because I have inhabited that paradigm all my life andin one of my darkest moments I could really see where that was coming from that was coming
from not enoughness I always want more because I'm not enough because I don't earn enoughbecause I'm not
(25:11):
I don't meditate, there's always this sense and again, we need to know systemic.
I love that you actually brought the systemic aspect.
Look around system that we're living in.
And I'm not saying the whole system, but capitalistic system, exploitative system, wherewe consume or we produce.
(25:33):
And I think it's very important in the times that we're living that we really questionthat, really question.
Where is that messaging coming from?
How is that supporting me?
Because, and I'm not saying not to progress, you know, I do a lot of change management incorporations with my clients, you know, fantastic to move the needle.
(25:55):
That needs to go with hand in hand with the work around enoughness and graciouscontemplation around what is already there.
and how good that is already.
You remind me of Becky Hall's book, The Art of Enough.
(26:19):
Have you read it?
Yes.
Yeah, Becky came on to a really early episode of the coaching and talk about the art ofenough.
And it is very counter-cultural, isn't it?
It is.
Also because we're really, you know, in the times that we're currently living, which arereally pushing us into farther division, farther absolute thinking, you know, is this or
(26:43):
is that?
And life is the opposite.
Can these two things be?
And that's okay, these two things being, right?
You know, can we still strive for progress while we nourish our enoughness?
While we nourish the things that are good?
They think they're less good, but actually they got us here and they have a value.
(27:07):
Can we honor that?
And that, even talking about this Claire, really, you know, even acknowledging thesepieces can be extremely healing and extremely, you know, returning to this wholesomeness,
returning to this place of, that was there all along.
(27:31):
That's why, this process is very internal.
And to me, someone that I have always considered myself very social, very active, youknow, these few years felt really weird because I became a bit of a hermit, like, you
know, really being with the feeling and kind of, you know, practicing this, thisreflection is necessary.
(27:52):
Necessary kind of, you know, to really look at, not from a point of view of creatingbarriers and becoming more individualistic, but, know,
I always say this, you can't explain how a strawberry tastes until you have tried it.
So you got to do that first and then, you know, tell you, strawberry is so gorgeous.
(28:12):
Have a few because they taste like X, Y, and Z.
So everything becomes that, know, are we able to give ourselves this thing?
Therefore we can then share that with others, which is, know, breaking away with ourindividualistic approach.
It's not about my own self work.
And then we stop here.
It is my work.
I can even put it out there for others.
(28:34):
So you're talking about courage.
Shit loads of it.
Courage, yes.
Encourage, I think again, we go into this kind of further dimension around, know, somepeople will embrace religion to kind of go into this outer dimension.
(29:03):
we don't know, you know, and I look at my training as well, know, uni, you know, you know,and I have a very long list of diplomas and masters and things, and, you know,
accumulation of knowledge, right?
But the accumulation of knowledge is very internal.
It's just words and things, you know, but then we don't really know what is externalknowledge, you know, around the things that are us that are greater than us that we are
(29:26):
connected with.
And, you know, nature.
as we have spoken as well, is a great place.
I for me, I don't consider myself a religious person, but I can relate to the idea ofgoing to nature, going to church for me.
I'm just there, I'm in the elements, I feel connected, I feel grounded, feel there's thisconnection with something that is greater than me.
(29:52):
And I think that that's important, especially in the processes of change andtransformation.
It is important to feel that you're not alone.
Hence, my lifelines, Todd, you, all the very key people in my life, my partner, thatreally provided that.
(30:14):
My partner always says, you're a balloon and I need to put a little string so when you goa little bit too high up, I can put you back.
So, that's kind of a little strength.
As you're talking, it reminds me, there's a book by a man called William Damon, it'scalled The Path to Purpose.
(30:36):
And he was the Professor of Human Development at Stanford University.
And he said that research meets religion.
Mm-hmm.
when you begin to see that actually all of us have a need to be connected to somethingoutside of ourselves.
And some people do that through faith and some people do that through other things, whichis what you're describing here.
(31:02):
But that knowing, believing, understanding that we had that...
I'm thinking about John Donne who said, no, no person is an island.
person is an island.
He said, no man is an island, but that feels very sexist.
So no, if you want the recognizable quote, it's no man is an island.
(31:23):
John Donne.
there is something, isn't there, about recognizing our connectivity?
And so fascinating to see that in the world now, politics, economics, organizations,coaching.
That's why this work is so important.
(31:44):
And that doesn't mean that we only need to become coaches or politicians or therapists.
Part of the work that I'm doing and I find so rewarding is a lot of my clients are goingthrough their own awakening journeys.
And it's about how they are taking that internal journey into the current environment,know, their families, their jobs, know, whatever they do, because it's so necessary.
(32:09):
part of the, my little, you know, my humble opinion, you know, these existential crisiswe're going through right now in terms of values and systems and kind of the empire
crumbling, all that stuff is because, you know, we're going, or there's an invitation togo isolated.
And that's very against nature because nature is connectedness.
(32:31):
Right.
And even our brains are wired for connection.
We have a chunk of our brain, the mammalian part of brain that we share with other mammalsthat it is exactly designed to survive in a pack.
So it's literally going anti-biology, going against our own biology.
So in these conversations, it's important to kind of remind us first of our own nature,second, you know,
(32:54):
how that nature expands and activates in us and in others and how actually that then fuelspurpose, fuels happiness, you know, supporting change, supporting others as well, whatever
function and role that we're playing in society.
(33:17):
Wow.
So Monica, if people want to explore this more deeply, what might you recommend?
So there's one of my teachers, I can't really recommend him enough, Adyashanti.
He, I say, there's a lot of people talking about this and there's many, and there's manyauthors that have written extensively about the experience of awakening.
(33:47):
To me, he has a very particular style in simplifying very complex concepts.
into a very day-to-day language and actually the way that he distills the experience ofawakening into words is just majestic.
I've never read anything like this so I've tried many authors, I've tried many processes,you know I'm just sticking to his teachings.
(34:15):
Adyashanti, there's one of his books, The End of Your World, which is a fantastic startingpoint.
Then he has, you know, meditations and guidance and practices.
There's another of his books, Emptiness Dancing, which is beautiful.
Again, a series of conversations.
And the fascinating thing is, except the end of your world, which his publisher requestedhim to write as a manual for people that were going through this, everything else is just
(34:47):
extracts from his talks.
and they have been so little minimally edited.
He's so coherent.
He's so well put together.
You know, it's incredible, you know, to actually see that someone speaking can be soprofound and well put together, really.
So I will absolutely encourage anything from Adyashanti.
(35:11):
There's a few other authors around this.
But again, I'm going to just leave it there.
course, mean, anything that has to do with in a particular case, because of my background,having lived in Asia and, you know, meditation, a lot of the Eastern philosophies are
(35:35):
really based on the attachments Buddhism, you know, is about not suffering and, you know,suffering described as the attachment on the storyline or what's happening.
So
A lot of these principles are already really rooted in Taoism, in Buddhism, in a lot ofthe ancient texts.
So that's also kind of a way to really explore if maybe reading through an author, aWestern author, you know, like, no, it's not that accessible.
(36:04):
mean, even Adashanti himself, you know, he's a teacher.
you know, he is well versed in practicing Eastern philosophies as well.
Thank you.
And if people want to talk to you, how do they get in touch with you?
Yes, I'm always really keen on sharing experiences.
And in fact, you know, one of the many ideas that never really crystallized yet, you know,is actually creating space for this, you know, almost like just sharing space to kind of
(36:31):
share experiences.
You know, you can get in touch with me via LinkedIn, Monica Ruiz, through my business,Ingenium in Movement, both on Instagram and LinkedIn, my website.
just ask Claire.
She will direct you to me.
(36:53):
Well, what a pleasure it is to talk to you and to listen to your journey.
Thank you Claire and thank you for your support.
It's been so fundamental and what you do has so much value and brings so much richness toso many of us.
Really, thank you for doing this.
Well, thank you for coming and thank you everyone for listening.
(37:14):
We'll be back next week with another episode.
Bye bye.
Hello and welcome to this week's edition of The Coaching Inn.
I'm your host, Claire Pedrick, and today I'm delighted to be in the company of my friend,Monica Ruiz.
Hello, Monica.
We often talk, don't we, in coaching about transformation, and sometimes transformation isin a moment, and sometimes the transformation is over time, and sometimes it...
(00:44):
is unexpected and looks different from what we thought it was going to look like.
So that's what we're going to be talking about in today's episode.
So Monica, before we talk about transformation, tell us a little bit about your journeyinto coaching.
Thank you.
Thanks for having me today.
(01:05):
As an avid listener of podcasts and huge fan of yours, it just feels like a dream cometrue being here.
So let me just say that straight away.
Journey to coaching started when I was back in corporate.
So my background is in corporate.
I used to be a corporate executive back in the day, city of London.
(01:30):
I had this conversation with my friend Vivek, now might be listening to this so this isfor you, who actually shared something about, wow, you're such a great leader, your team
really loves you, you're just a great encourager.
And kind of that something clicked to me around, wow, I'm going to be really good atbusiness and strategy and doing these thinking processes, but actually I'm an enabler.
(01:59):
And I'm an encourager for these people to grow, fulfill themselves, journeys.
It's kind of, pondered on that a little bit with my culture at the time.
And I just decided, you know, I really like learning.
I really like expanding my horizons.
So thought, why not training for these coaching things?
I completed my training and I loved it.
(02:22):
And I loved every second of it.
And I really saw myself doing that.
and kind of brought a gigantic piece of fulfillment, kind of almost like it fitted in atime where I was a bit disenchanted by corporate and, you know, why am I doing what I'm
doing?
She landed at the right time.
(02:43):
So that first year was a bit of a, let's just try this out.
It worked out.
So, you know, a few months after I was having a chat with my CMO to say, I'm out of here.
Hahaha
And that's how it started, you know, that's how it started.
This year is my year number seven, doing this full time.
(03:04):
Wow, wow, so there was something in there about purposefulness.
Mmm, it is.
So you and I have spoken about this before, but for you, the personal transformationthat's come more recently, you've described as awakening.
(03:27):
Yes, Tan-tan.
I was a little bit in the background because I have a feeling that some of our listenerstoday might just feel a bit like, what is she talking about?
What is she's on?
You know, in awakening, I'm sure, you know, might just mean several things, differentthings for different people.
(03:48):
But to me, in the context of transformation, it's just a complete liberation process.
you know, that requires everything from you.
that comes from the inside.
that comes from inside, indeed.
Yeah.
(04:09):
So tell us about.
Start where you like to tell us about Awakening, Monica.
For you.
So like in coaching or, know, in any reflection, it's really, I find really handy to kindof look in perspective, kind of, you know, looking back and say, okay, you know, on hand
(04:31):
side.
So looking back, I could see, you know, things bubbling up and it was like a rumbling, theocean rumbling in the background around 2021.
you know that I got married after trying to get married for some time just because COVIDand lockdowns and you know I think about that time sometimes thinking that it was a
(05:00):
complete different lifetime but it wasn't that long ago right so it was kind of a timewhere I found myself really struggling with but I want to do this but I can't really do
that and I think kind of that's when the cracks started really going deep into
I've been this high achiever all my life.
You know, I have always made things happen.
(05:20):
It was part of my identity.
I felt really proud of it.
And in fact, you know, one of my, you know, one of my pitch lines when going forconsulting work or coaching work, you know, I come from corporate, I get things done.
I make things happen, you know, so you can trust me.
I will deliver.
(05:40):
I won't let you down.
So it was kind of all of these things.
And that kind of really showed me and I think collectively really showed us that theunexpected can happen.
And you don't know, you have no roadmap for this.
You have no blueprint for this.
So kind of there was a bit of a tremor there.
(06:02):
2022.
It was a big year for me.
had a big surgery and it was a year that I left London.
And it was an absolute heartbreak because London has always been home for me.
Person of reasons, you know, I was in a bit of a phase where I needed movement.
I needed to kind of shift things to kind of see that will spark a change, a change that Iwas seeking.
(06:25):
So I relocated to the Netherlands where, you know,
the accelerating gear, you know, that would go right into sixth gear.
I was like, okay, fuck off.
It does when everything really started.
And in the beginning, you and I talk about this, I didn't know what was going on.
(06:47):
like, am I losing my mind?
Am I going psychotic?
You know, because it was like, I will be invited to go into these very deep spaces of...
not just reflection but almost like all these tools all of this knowing that you thoughtyou had is no longer available you can't really push life is just taking over and you just
(07:16):
have to kind of go with it so that's another summary of
And that was tragic, as you know, we spoke about this because all of a sudden youridentity is questioned.
Oh, but I used to do these things and I used to be able to do those other things.
And now all of that is taken away.
The rug is being pulled.
What do do?
(07:38):
So that first year was a lot about, am I losing my mind?
Now as you can see, I love about it, but you know.
It's been devastating.
It sounds like a losing control.
Mmm.
And I'm just, can you talk a bit about the difference between losing control and choosingto release control?
(08:05):
mmm I love that and it feels like a very subtle difference because the difference is inthe choice or the internal choice you know how much of a choice do I have here and I know
this is gonna sound very non-coaching but one of the most difficult things in this journeyfor me was realizing how little control I had even in the choice you know
(08:34):
life had to go so hard at me to really let go and really build trust.
think you know like there's there's kind of a combo here in terms of letting go controlwhile you build you build trust in things will be fine you might not know where this is
going but just trust right it's also trust in I'm not really choosing like I used to butthat's okay
(09:02):
almost like I tried to say that life has your back and life and some of us will usedifferent labels for this.
So also want to be, you know, welcoming in whatever label that is for you.
For those that are listening, you know, is that God is that the universe is life is soulis spirit, you know, whatever matter that connects us all, larger purpose.
(09:27):
So to me, it was actually, you know, was a bit about
recognizing that there was a choice, there was still a choice in terms of...
how much, the choice really of thinking about this, the only choice was how much I'm gonnakeep resisting this.
(09:52):
That was really the ultimate choice.
the more that I resisted, harder it got.
So it was something about surrendering to something outside yourself.
Absolutely, that is happening within yourself.
Yeah and I know you had some company on the journey.
(10:15):
Yes!
Like yourself.
we have a mutual friend who is experiencing something similar and different during thistime.
Hello, Todd.
I'm sure he's been listening.
he was, he still is one of my lifelines because in all of this and to me, these awakeningjourneys started.
(10:40):
And again, I'm seeing these right now in a lot of peers, in a lot of clients, in a lot offriends within my network.
Maybe we collectively are going through a gigantic shifts in consciousness and theseawakening or
deep transformation, whatever you want to call it.
It's happening at different layers, degrees and intensities.
(11:01):
Also I'm learning that it's different for every person.
So I just happened to be really lucky to find someone that understood that language andkind of was really able to provide some reassurance, I think, around you're not going
crazy.
This is okay.
You've got this.
And because of his background around, you know, working with the shadow and working withthe darkness and, know, kind of really embracing that, you know, wholesome acceptance
(11:31):
around, I am okay.
He provided a vital support, especially because for me, everything started with the riseof darkness, the rise of aspects of me that I wasn't, until that point, I didn't accept.
I wasn't willing to embrace.
It's like, no, no, no, that's not me.
I'm a good person.
You know, a good person doesn't do this.
(11:52):
So he was pivotal in really bringing compassion, bringing understanding, bringing softnessinto.
You know, you are embodying the qualities of being alive.
You're embodying the qualities of life.
And that's a spectrum.
And in your little understanding of the world, that is good, that is bad, might bedifferent for someone else.
(12:20):
The journey is embracing it all.
Doesn't mean that you're becoming it.
And again, that's the identity piece is also quite important in the journey to reallyalmost a position in where it belongs.
know, because you're kind of becoming an instrument of life.
So life is becoming you, you are embodying it, but you're not it.
And to me, that was a distinction that kind of came farther along the line of, I'm notthese things, you know, or because I have access to these things doesn't mean that I need
(12:49):
to action them.
It doesn't mean that I need to kind of take action on them.
So the subtle layers and kind of came after, you know, first was, you know, the
It was a big bang.
It was the explosion.
Everything was contained.
It had to expand.
(13:09):
had to grow.
It had to go.
So that was kind of the first piece.
And as you know, I'm working right now around this grieving, loss, know, the meaning andthe significance around it.
But yeah, it was devastating.
All these things that I held precious, that I identified with, gone.
(13:30):
Then who are you anymore?
So there's a real sense as you're talking Monica about a journey of letting go ofsomething and of becoming and of toleratingly having absolutely no idea of what the
becoming might become.
(13:55):
not only tolerating but being okay with it and embracing it.
To me, and I'm really honest with this, I haven't got that yet.
There's days that are better than others.
There's some days where I wake up and I feel absolute possibility in me and that feels soexpanded and so glorious.
(14:17):
That wow, anything is possible because like the saying goes, when nothing is certain,everything is possible, right?
And that feels expanded and that feels sublime and that feels gorgeous.
And some days that feels like you're literally looking at the abyss.
And then you feel lost and it's like, that, it was like a vertical feeling of, this iskind of very deep and, where does that go?
(14:48):
So, and again, it's kind of also recognizing how much the mind is always trying to makestories out of everything.
And to me that was the key aspect that really unlocks a lot of the suffering.
The choice of suffering really, because if you are able to be with what it is and not makea story out of it, it's going and it's coming and it's leaving, then it becomes, you're
(15:20):
much more in flow, you are flow.
your flow.
The moment that the mind is trying to grip and this thing is happening because of and youknow that means that and then you need to make that choice.
You're done.
Yeah, so moving away from logic to a well, a real lived example you're describing of goingwith the flow.
(15:49):
It is something that to me kind of really hit home because I lived in Asia many years.
I really embraced Eastern's philosophies, Buddhism.
I'm a meditation teacher, know, many of my personalities and gigs, you know, alongsidecoaching is meditation.
You know, I've been meditating for two decades and it really hit true for the very firsttime.
(16:12):
You know, it's not this ideal flow, this constructed idea that then I choose when I'mflown or no.
Flow is you let go of the control.
Flow is you are the water that runs under the stream that doesn't question if there's awaterfall coming or there's a bug that is interrupting the flow or there's a stone that
(16:34):
makes it, that is changing direction.
Water doesn't question anything.
just flows.
Water just flows.
There's the concept of it.
And there's the richness of the layers of how all of that kind of lands and it getsembodied.
So there's a letting go.
(16:56):
letting go, acceptance and trust.
That doesn't mean again that kind of we are going into these...
I think because of my...
you know I've always been reading and interested in things you know there was this timethat I felt really nihilistic like this is just the end there's nothing right?
Okay absolute thinking here comes you know...
(17:22):
maybe what it is is something else.
It's just that you don't know and you might not have to know and that's okay.
So a massive tectonic.
shifting moving.
(17:43):
And the implications that I had in my daily life because you know I'm talking right now asa you know I'm a monk and I live in a monastery and I spent you know 18 hours meditating,
no!
I wish sometimes in fact I'm going to a monastery like next week to do precisely that.
I love doing that every now and then.
(18:03):
You have to just come in with life.
You you show up to work, you pay your bills, you're over your relationships.
So to me, that was really difficult because there will be days that I will be so immersedin this process.
It's like, how, how, how am going to just, you know, deal with this?
And the many other layers of loss, know, awakening kind of in a way, turn up the intensityand in a way brought
(18:32):
breathed into which areas of my life would actually touch and dissolve.
But then there was practical things around the passing of a very dear one, my own journeywith motherhood and miscarriages and what that meant to me, me and my partner temporarily
(18:54):
separating because we needed space to really process.
the idea of coming to the Netherlands and not really working out and being in between theUK and the Netherlands and now potentially relocating back to the UK, you know.
So, so much, you know, because it's not like one thing and then that one thing hits youand kind of expands, you know, it's that multiple complex layers of
(19:21):
this is not working and there's nothing you can do about it.
Because when I really went to kind of resource from that muscle of, let me just go to thethings that I used to do in the past, I used to work.
Not only they're not there, they're not working.
So there's kind of this sort of, there's a latent space of, so what do you do now?
(19:44):
Nothing.
Be with it.
Sit with it.
The only way is through.
So what's the thread?
Monica, what's the thread that you're holding onto through this process?
this trust the word is trust and even like at times it has glimpses of hope and not hopebecause it's gonna get better it's hope in
(20:17):
Let me rephrase that.
I think what it has really brought is a sense of wholesomeness, but wholesomeness in theway that, not the sugarcoated version that wellness tries to sell us, wholesomeness in the
way that life is a very wide spectrum of colors and tastes and textures.
(20:43):
and holding on to the idea that only when life goes well or goes the way that I want meansthat I'm going well or I'm doing well is a complete illusion.
You know, I always say, you can we make space for everything?
Can we make space for, can we be with everything?
(21:04):
Can I be with you today, know, right now excited and sharing this journey and, you know,two hours in the afternoon, can I be with my grief?
And that's okay, you know, it doesn't have to be that, because I've been with my grief,I'm doing something wrong because I feel bad.
No, that is just, you know, I think part of this reshifting is very necessary.
(21:26):
Hmm.
Because we have this kind of absolute thinking and absolute expectations of, you know, asuccessful life means always happy, always succeeding, always growing, always creating.
Is that a true representation of life?
Where's the destruction?
Where's the dissolution?
Where's the despair?
Where's the sadness?
(21:47):
Where's the pain?
Another thing is, are we making a story out of it?
really anchors us and kind of then creates all of these narratives and neuroses in us.
But can we be with things?
And still, you know, I think that we all bring a very valuable personal richness into theworld that comes with a desire and with a purpose and with a mission.
(22:15):
And that's beautiful that we kind of we feel that.
And that kind of is just part of the whole conglomerate of richness in the collective.
So there's something in what you're saying about accepting what is.
It reminds me, of that, of there's a systemic principle that says acknowledge what is andhow often we want to make what is into something else.
(22:47):
And how unsexy that sounds in our world, you know, because our world wants change andwants to drive and be better and become a better version of yourself, you know, all of
these kind of, you know, I'm not going to say they're well-intentioned, but they're alsovery misleading.
into creating something that is not, because it really creates scapes and avoidingmechanisms of being with what it is.
(23:17):
And that was kind of one of my, you know, being really honest, that was kind of one of mygetaways.
Like, but I can get away from this.
I can just cope with something else.
can't, know, it is too hard.
I don't want to deal with it.
And, you know, the one learning that after these four very intense years is
(23:37):
Be with it.
Be with it.
And the moment that you are with it, the moment that it starts changing.
That's kind of, it's almost a counter-intuitive thing.
That, I don't need to do anything.
It is when I stop scaping and I'm with the thing, that then me and the thing starttransmuting, starts changing.
(23:58):
Yeah.
and can even do this thing.
As you're talking, it makes me think about how different what you're describing is fromthe world of kind of self-actualizing.
I can have anything, I can be anything, I can do anything, and it can eternally get betterand better.
(24:19):
And I think that there's some danger in the world that we inhabit in our work, that thatcan, you know, if I read more, do more, meditate more, pray more, whatever more, I can
make things happen.
And what you're describing is something quite different.
(24:43):
It is.
destruction of that paradigm really because I have inhabited that paradigm all my life andin one of my darkest moments I could really see where that was coming from that was coming
from not enoughness I always want more because I'm not enough because I don't earn enoughbecause I'm not
(25:11):
I don't meditate, there's always this sense and again, we need to know systemic.
I love that you actually brought the systemic aspect.
Look around system that we're living in.
And I'm not saying the whole system, but capitalistic system, exploitative system, wherewe consume or we produce.
(25:33):
And I think it's very important in the times that we're living that we really questionthat, really question.
Where is that messaging coming from?
How is that supporting me?
Because, and I'm not saying not to progress, you know, I do a lot of change management incorporations with my clients, you know, fantastic to move the needle.
(25:55):
That needs to go with hand in hand with the work around enoughness and graciouscontemplation around what is already there.
and how good that is already.
You remind me of Becky Hall's book, The Art of Enough.
(26:19):
Have you read it?
Yes.
Yeah, Becky came on to a really early episode of the coaching and talk about the art ofenough.
And it is very counter-cultural, isn't it?
It is.
Also because we're really, you know, in the times that we're currently living, which arereally pushing us into farther division, farther absolute thinking, you know, is this or
(26:43):
is that?
And life is the opposite.
Can these two things be?
And that's okay, these two things being, right?
You know, can we still strive for progress while we nourish our enoughness?
While we nourish the things that are good?
They think they're less good, but actually they got us here and they have a value.
(27:07):
Can we honor that?
And that, even talking about this Claire, really, you know, even acknowledging thesepieces can be extremely healing and extremely, you know, returning to this wholesomeness,
returning to this place of, that was there all along.
(27:31):
That's why, this process is very internal.
And to me, someone that I have always considered myself very social, very active, youknow, these few years felt really weird because I became a bit of a hermit, like, you
know, really being with the feeling and kind of, you know, practicing this, thisreflection is necessary.
(27:52):
Necessary kind of, you know, to really look at, not from a point of view of creatingbarriers and becoming more individualistic, but, know,
I always say this, you can't explain how a strawberry tastes until you have tried it.
So you got to do that first and then, you know, tell you, strawberry is so gorgeous.
(28:12):
Have a few because they taste like X, Y, and Z.
So everything becomes that, know, are we able to give ourselves this thing?
Therefore we can then share that with others, which is, know, breaking away with ourindividualistic approach.
It's not about my own self work.
And then we stop here.
It is my work.
I can even put it out there for others.
(28:34):
So you're talking about courage.
Shit loads of it.
Courage, yes.
Encourage, I think again, we go into this kind of further dimension around, know, somepeople will embrace religion to kind of go into this outer dimension.
(29:03):
we don't know, you know, and I look at my training as well, know, uni, you know, you know,and I have a very long list of diplomas and masters and things, and, you know,
accumulation of knowledge, right?
But the accumulation of knowledge is very internal.
It's just words and things, you know, but then we don't really know what is externalknowledge, you know, around the things that are us that are greater than us that we are
(29:26):
connected with.
And, you know, nature.
as we have spoken as well, is a great place.
I for me, I don't consider myself a religious person, but I can relate to the idea ofgoing to nature, going to church for me.
I'm just there, I'm in the elements, I feel connected, I feel grounded, feel there's thisconnection with something that is greater than me.
(29:52):
And I think that that's important, especially in the processes of change andtransformation.
It is important to feel that you're not alone.
Hence, my lifelines, Todd, you, all the very key people in my life, my partner, thatreally provided that.
(30:14):
My partner always says, you're a balloon and I need to put a little string so when you goa little bit too high up, I can put you back.
So, that's kind of a little strength.
As you're talking, it reminds me, there's a book by a man called William Damon, it'scalled The Path to Purpose.
(30:36):
And he was the Professor of Human Development at Stanford University.
And he said that research meets religion.
Mm-hmm.
when you begin to see that actually all of us have a need to be connected to somethingoutside of ourselves.
And some people do that through faith and some people do that through other things, whichis what you're describing here.
(31:02):
But that knowing, believing, understanding that we had that...
I'm thinking about John Donne who said, no, no person is an island.
person is an island.
He said, no man is an island, but that feels very sexist.
So no, if you want the recognizable quote, it's no man is an island.
(31:23):
John Donne.
there is something, isn't there, about recognizing our connectivity?
And so fascinating to see that in the world now, politics, economics, organizations,coaching.
That's why this work is so important.
(31:44):
And that doesn't mean that we only need to become coaches or politicians or therapists.
Part of the work that I'm doing and I find so rewarding is a lot of my clients are goingthrough their own awakening journeys.
And it's about how they are taking that internal journey into the current environment,know, their families, their jobs, know, whatever they do, because it's so necessary.
(32:09):
part of the, my little, you know, my humble opinion, you know, these existential crisiswe're going through right now in terms of values and systems and kind of the empire
crumbling, all that stuff is because, you know, we're going, or there's an invitation togo isolated.
And that's very against nature because nature is connectedness.
(32:31):
Right.
And even our brains are wired for connection.
We have a chunk of our brain, the mammalian part of brain that we share with other mammalsthat it is exactly designed to survive in a pack.
So it's literally going anti-biology, going against our own biology.
So in these conversations, it's important to kind of remind us first of our own nature,second, you know,
(32:54):
how that nature expands and activates in us and in others and how actually that then fuelspurpose, fuels happiness, you know, supporting change, supporting others as well, whatever
function and role that we're playing in society.
(33:17):
Wow.
So Monica, if people want to explore this more deeply, what might you recommend?
So there's one of my teachers, I can't really recommend him enough, Adyashanti.
He, I say, there's a lot of people talking about this and there's many, and there's manyauthors that have written extensively about the experience of awakening.
(33:47):
To me, he has a very particular style in simplifying very complex concepts.
into a very day-to-day language and actually the way that he distills the experience ofawakening into words is just majestic.
I've never read anything like this so I've tried many authors, I've tried many processes,you know I'm just sticking to his teachings.
(34:15):
Adyashanti, there's one of his books, The End of Your World, which is a fantastic startingpoint.
Then he has, you know, meditations and guidance and practices.
There's another of his books, Emptiness Dancing, which is beautiful.
Again, a series of conversations.
And the fascinating thing is, except the end of your world, which his publisher requestedhim to write as a manual for people that were going through this, everything else is just
(34:47):
extracts from his talks.
and they have been so little minimally edited.
He's so coherent.
He's so well put together.
You know, it's incredible, you know, to actually see that someone speaking can be soprofound and well put together, really.
So I will absolutely encourage anything from Adyashanti.
(35:11):
There's a few other authors around this.
But again, I'm going to just leave it there.
course, mean, anything that has to do with in a particular case, because of my background,having lived in Asia and, you know, meditation, a lot of the Eastern philosophies are
(35:35):
really based on the attachments Buddhism, you know, is about not suffering and, you know,suffering described as the attachment on the storyline or what's happening.
So
A lot of these principles are already really rooted in Taoism, in Buddhism, in a lot ofthe ancient texts.
So that's also kind of a way to really explore if maybe reading through an author, aWestern author, you know, like, no, it's not that accessible.
(36:04):
mean, even Adashanti himself, you know, he's a teacher.
you know, he is well versed in practicing Eastern philosophies as well.
Thank you.
And if people want to talk to you, how do they get in touch with you?
Yes, I'm always really keen on sharing experiences.
And in fact, you know, one of the many ideas that never really crystallized yet, you know,is actually creating space for this, you know, almost like just sharing space to kind of
(36:31):
share experiences.
You know, you can get in touch with me via LinkedIn, Monica Ruiz, through my business,Ingenium in Movement, both on Instagram and LinkedIn, my website.
just ask Claire.
She will direct you to me.
(36:53):
Well, what a pleasure it is to talk to you and to listen to your journey.
Thank you Claire and thank you for your support.
It's been so fundamental and what you do has so much value and brings so much richness toso many of us.
Really, thank you for doing this.
Well, thank you for coming and thank you everyone for listening.
(37:14):
We'll be back next week with another episode.
Bye bye.
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