March 7, 2025 • 35 mins
From building hospitals to building future industry leaders, Adrienne Sraver has done it all! A Project Executive at Barton Malow Builders and an instructor at Ohio State University, Adrienne takes us on a journey from the jobsite to the classroom. She shares how navigating occupied renovations in healthcare construction prepared her for mentoring the next generation. We chat about confidence, adaptability, and why the best construction lessons aren’t always found in textbooks. Whether you're laying foundations or laying out lesson plans, this episode is packed with insights on bridging industry experience with education. #WICWEEK2025
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Episode Transcript
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(00:05):
Welcome to the Construction Cafe, where the buzz of the construction industry meets thewarmth of a friendly conversation.
I'm your host, Tristen Magallanes.
Join me at our virtual cafe as we explore the foundations of construction culture, sip oncutting edge concepts, and amplify the unspoken voices in our industry.
So grab a cup of your favorite beverage, pull up a seat, and let's build more than juststructures, let's build connections.
(00:33):
This is the Construction Cafe.
Hey everyone, welcome back to the Construction Cafe.
Super excited to consider you our series on Women in Construction Week.
(00:54):
And today we have joining us Adrienne Traver.
Thanks for joining us Adrienne, I appreciate it.
Thanks for having me.
first I want to just, can you introduce yourself?
Tell us a little bit about your role, where you work and you know, something fun if youwant, throw in there.
Yeah, of course.
So Adrienne Traver, I am a project executive at Barton Mallow Builders in Columbus, Ohio.
(01:16):
And I've been in the industry for about 17 years, all locally based in Columbus.
So graduated with the Ohio State University and graduated in 08.
So it was like lucky to have a job at that point.
yeah, that's a rough time to come into construction.
Yes, but also cheap labor.
So there was that, right?
So, yeah, and then I started at a general contractor, did work briefly at a subcontractorand then worked on the owner side actually for nine years.
(01:43):
So I feel like through all those experiences, it's just wealth of lessons learned andapproached and how I execute and manage teams and work on, you know, work at the executive
level now.
I also work at the Ohio State University as an instructor.
So I teach at the construction systems management program, a required class calledIntroduction to Construction Management, and then also demolition and renovation, which
(02:09):
I'm passionate about.
I love working in occupied space.
Yes.
Yeah, it's just a little elective.
So but yeah, those are the two classes.
So I've been doing that now.
for four years.
That's cool.
Are there a lot of alum who work in the industry that teach in the program?
Is that like typical?
(02:31):
So there are a couple, yes.
So there's a variety of industry professionals and then of course faculty and tenuredstaff that are within the program.
Yeah.
My husband tells me about his apprenticeship, when he went through his apprenticeshipprogram at the union, and he was critiquing the instructors in the apprenticeship programs
(02:52):
of they're not really taught to be instructors and that it's challenging sometimes tolearn.
So it's just really cool to hear people who...
jump in who are in the industry, who have the ability to teach and give back in that way.
Because I do think it's kind of like in service to the industry, But it's also kind of, Idon't know, I'm a nerd.
I think it's fun to teach things in general.
(03:14):
So yeah.
I think the one thing that I do enjoy is just the connection to the industry.
I try to encourage, you know, the wealth of our network, of course, is so important, butthen also just start to get exposure early because I just kind of like with some
weaknesses or some challenges that I felt like I had, just trying to overcome those earlyfor, you know, people to start building confidence early.
(03:38):
You know, getting exposure to a project job site can be quite overwhelming when you're notquite sure what's
what it's like, you know, so trying to do that in college, think is a wonderful way tostart to instill confidence and start to navigate, you know, your career.
Absolutely.
I've helped with some of the intern programs at some of the companies I've worked at byhosting job site tours There are quite a few young folks coming into the industry or just
(04:05):
new people in general, not necessarily young, who've never stepped foot on a job site.
And so they're studying something related but just have never done that.
And then there's others like myself who grew up
around the industry.
So it was just a normal natural thing for me.
It wasn't awkward or weird.
Just out of curiosity, what's the percentage of male to female in your classes?
(04:29):
So this semester, I probably have 12 % female.
yeah, so there is another Introduction to Construction Management class who is male led.
I'm not sure the percentage or I'm not sure if they've gravitated my way.
(04:50):
But I would be curious.
But yeah, I know I do have about 12%.
So it's great to see that.
Heck yeah, that's awesome.
Well, can you tell me, because part of what we're trying to do the whole week of Women inConstruction Week is to talk a little bit about the roles that the women we know hold in
the industry, because we want folks to understand that construction is not just swinging ahammer, and it's not just one thing.
(05:15):
There's a plethora of roles you can have, and they're all incredible and different andamazing.
just educate everybody a little bit.
What's your role about?
What do do?
Do you specialize in a specific area?
Yeah, sure.
So as a project executive here, I was tasked to grow our health care market sector.
So I do love working in projects that may be a bit more complex due to the systems thatare required within the scopes of work.
(05:43):
But I also have this focus of like the soft skill.
of working in occupied spaces and tailoring your construction to accommodate the needs ofothers.
And I think that's an approach that, you know, I was instilled when I first, you know, gotinto the industry and just noticed how that was so impactful and also created in powerful
(06:05):
conversations.
You know, nurse managers were able to understand what was going on and weigh in.
It just seemed to be very proactive and we were much more
successful in executing.
So I now am trying to build a group of people with like minds that are focused on thosetypes of, you know, complex projects and passionate about serving others and what we do.
(06:29):
So I do manage a team here.
But I, you know, focus on pursuits, execution, and all of the above.
So
That's really a good, interesting way to frame it.
I don't think I've heard a project executive frame their job of sort of this in service toother kind of, especially in healthcare, which is funny.
I'm reflecting to several of my doctors know that I work in construction.
(06:54):
One of them was my OBGYN.
And as he's doing my exam, he's like, what do you think about?
you know, the ceiling tile.
I'm just like...
He's like 80 something years old and I'm not even, we're probably not 80, but he wasprobably around 70.
And I'm like, you're up in my hoo-ha asking me about ceiling tiles.
So I guess this is what we're doing.
I mean, had a sweet, sweet man.
(07:16):
He had been my doctor for many, many, years and helped me with a lot.
It was just comical.
But a lot of the small minute things make a very big difference for those folks.
And if they're not brought into the conversation early,
One, you might be ripping things out and changing them later for them.
Or they're operating in a situation that is not ideal for them and patient care, whichflows even further down into service, right?
(07:41):
It's not just them, but it's some of the communities that they serve.
And so I find that incredibly good way to frame it and I appreciate that perspectivebecause I don't hear that a lot.
So that's awesome.
And I think having that mindset, I mean, worked locally in Columbus in many marketsectors.
So as an owner's rep, I had contracts with two higher education universities.
(08:04):
I worked at the John Glenn Columbus International Airport for five years, working on somecomplex renovations of renovating the existing facility and managing residents in on their
campus.
again, super drastic portfolio.
But I think I always have that frame in mind.
And I think that level of care just really creates a different space for people to makedecisions and also just a positive team environment because we have that care in mind.
(08:37):
Yeah, well, I find it's more enjoyable to work with people that actually give a crap,right?
if it's just about numbers and checking boxes that serves a purpose and there's a place inthe world, But if there's also this sense of care, I think that just brings something
different to a team environment in general, to a project in general.
And I think it's really great.
(08:58):
Is there something you could point to throughout your career, not just maybe your currentrole, like a bigger challenge or a really big frustration that you've had in your role
that you've noticed or maybe even changed?
I don't know.
Yeah, I think like, it's really interesting.
was looking back at my career and kind of like what I've overcome.
I think at the beginning, it's really just establishing confidence.
(09:21):
Establishing confidence to actually have a seat at the table to make, to, you know, feellike your opinion's valued.
And then also not be afraid to ask questions when you're in a space of learning.
I think there's, you know, the desire to grow and lead, but not necessarily feel like youfit.
And I think that is really, puts that in your mind in a negative context.
(09:45):
Mm-hmm.
because of that, it's like your own internal battle that other people aren't experiencingon the same platform.
So I think that's really hard when you're, I guess, entering the industry or just a spacewhere you just don't feel like everyone else.
(10:06):
Yeah, yeah.
I'm trying to reflect back to my experiences as well with that.
I think I felt early on it was more about my age than anything, know, like the young oneof the team.
But yeah, no, I've experienced that too.
I will say it took me probably 20 years to get that confidence of like, feelingcomfortable and it...
(10:28):
very interesting.
think it depends on who you're surrounded by.
So when it comes specifically to, you're talking, we're talking about like, you know, kindof feeling comfortable, gaining confidence.
Is there something specific you can point to when it comes to equity for women in theindustry that you think is most needed or you can point to like a thing that you're like
this, if we could help with this one thing, it might shift things for women in theindustry.
(10:53):
Anything that comes to mind?
I think women in general take on so many roles and sometimes that requires flexibility.
Knowing that they have so many responsibilities of leadership inside and outside of thework environment, it can be extremely limiting to not offer the flexibility and I guess.
(11:13):
confidence, but just like understanding that their work will be done, but sometimes it'sjust not done in the same like context because of requirements of either, you know,
running around for children or supporting, you know, going home because of some, you know,sickness or it's just no, that's really important, I think.
(11:35):
Yeah, I agree.
That's a good one.
And I appreciate you bringing that up.
Because I've seen lately in the last couple of years, I would say five years, I would sayaround COVID time, actually.
I started to notice different pockets of employers starting to bring more of thatflexibility in.
Because people were faced with a lot of challenges during that time and needed to have theflexibility
(11:59):
But you're 100 % right.
I've joked, I think the last episode I recorded too, I joked about I would love to do anexperiment, if I can ever find someone to do this with me, of having childcare at the job
site for trade workers.
So because it's, you you're often driving fairly far away.
and it's early in the morning, which is hard to find care at that time of day unless it'sa family member usually.
(12:23):
So if we offered that, could that flexibility allow for more women to show up on jobsites?
And I don't know that anyone's ever going let me try that social experiment, but I thinkit would be really incredibly interesting.
So.
because again, the commitment of when to show up is very rigid.
And of course, that can be so challenging to have that commitment.
(12:49):
Yeah.
And we'll call it what it is.
Women are still largely responsible for the care of children on this planet.
So bringing in different flexible hours and locations, which is hard because you have togo where the work is in construction.
And there are usually time limitations relative to city ordinances and or weather issuesand things like that.
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I think it's all something that can be thought through thoughtfully just like we weretalking about with, you know, clients.
We can think through ways to serve better the employees and the folks showing up in thisindustry, in my opinion, and make changes.
It might happen slower than we'd like, but it's getting there.
also just think of creating a space that can be heard.
(13:35):
It's like making sure that your employees, they're actually able to comfortably voice thatthere's these challenges and maybe the approach of supporting them.
You're open to that rather than not.
Yeah.
Do you find or have you heard that women and or differently gendered people feel like theycan't bring forward those things because they're afraid of retaliation or being seen as
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that person, you know?
Yeah, and I know that there's people that I have hired here that were working inenvironments that were extremely taxing really long hours during the week and didn't feel,
I guess, supported in that.
And ultimately, that led to a difference of employer required.
(14:22):
Obviously, you know, no one's trying to, it's not about being taken advantage of.
but that individual should be able to have a career and both, right?
And yeah.
You know, it's funny.
Reminds me sort of I worked in civil construction for many years.
And one of my first main bosses, I remember kind of had this mindset of like, yeah, workstarts at seven.
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But if you're not here at six, you're late kind of that was the vibe 100 % across theboard.
And if you're not working through your lunch, and if you're not, you know, staying an hourlate, like, it wasn't enough.
And setting that kind of standard for, I think, anyone is not healthy.
But that's very, very much how it felt always.
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And not openly said, but the way you were treated, if that wasn't how you also showed up,was very obvious.
And I still see that actually fairly often in the industry.
And I would imagine for folks trying to come into the industry who are also trying tobalance the care of others.
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other responsibilities.
Maybe they just need to have three jobs to maintain economical viability in this societytoday, which is also another very real thing.
You know, that's really, really hard.
And I would love for that to shift for folks in this industry.
And I think the best way is leading by example
I agree with that.
think there can be some people that have a mindset of like, you have to prove it to makeit.
(15:53):
And that can be very challenging for acceptance, right?
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
You know, going back to your teaching, I remember when I first met you, that was justsomething that struck me I wish more, specifically women who are in the industry would
lean into spaces and teach or show up in those spaces where folks are being educated tocome into this industry, whether it be in apprenticeship programs or educational
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institutions.
Because I feel like if they see us, we're here, they see examples of women that arealready in these positions.
They're more likely to sort of ask for advice from us and make connections through us.
So I feel like that's just, I have a standard question to ask of like, what is yourpersonal contributions towards positive change for women in construction?
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And I think you're a great example of just that doing what you're doing at the
college.
And so have there been any students that you've stayed connected with and you've seentheir career progress?
And are you able to share any of that?
Because I just think it's exciting.
no, it's interesting.
It's funny because I have so many people that since it's the introduction to constructionmanagement class, feel like.
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It's also my responsibility to like educate them about all the opportunities.
I mean, I always say that I feel like I'm the biggest cheerleader of the constructionindustry because there are so many opportunities and you name it.
If you have a trait or a passion, I feel like there's a way to be able to involveyourself.
Yeah.
I mean, it's like the ultimate team sport.
(17:24):
We're all in it together.
There's ability to collaborate.
It's just like, we're dependent on each other.
There's so many positives.
So that is like my prime focus and instilling in the class.
So they like recognize all of those positives and then from there, it's like their senseto explore.
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In my class, I do require a presentation where the students have an opportunity to eitherinterview someone with the industry or walk a job site.
that's fun.
And then they come back to class and report out and do their like five minutepresentation, sharing photos, experience, things like that.
But that's starting to get them again, just to see what it could be for them or just tomake a connection.
(18:11):
Yeah.
So when I first, I love it.
And also I'm like selfishly like, I love to hear about these projects because I mean, Ican walk on job site now and then just like still geek out.
100 % same.
So, but I had a student when I first started introduction to construction management, hername is Peyton Hash and she actually is an architecture student, which I loved because I
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was.
And I told her, was like, you're welcome to the dark side.
you are like, I was like, come over to construction.
the.
I hear this from so many architects.
So funny.
So, you know, she's very passionate about architecture, but I was like, I think it wouldbe really impactful for you to experience construction just because that mindset may be
(18:56):
helpful for you as you grow in your, you know, architecture.
content.
So she ended up working with us for the summer on a project and was our project engineeron the job site, meeting minutes, project photos and engaging with our superintendent.
And, you know, we still stay very closely connected.
Now she's her junior.
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So she was a freshman when we when I hired her and we still, you know, remain connected.
I support her and her scholarship applications.
I mean, she's trying to put herself through school.
And that's really important for her to have that full experience.
And this year, I think she's gonna have her architecture internship.
So I'd love to see her grow and thrive.
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That's awesome.
And I love, you know, I know not everybody has the time to necessarily give back to likeup and coming professionals or folks going through either apprenticeship or academic
institutions.
But even if every woman in the industry took time, like for one year of their career tohelp mentor or guide or network another upcoming woman, I just feel like that would make a
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huge difference.
I know it's hard, like I said, not everybody has the time.
We're already caretaking for so many other spaces in the world.
But it's definitely something I think is incredibly important So.
I think that's amazing and I appreciate that you do that and continue to follow some ofthem and that's pretty amazing.
One thing that we did at the university is called the Industry Advisory Council.
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I was the chair of that.
So it's really just the construction organizations that help support the program.
So we recognize the challenge of diversity.
in the program, but just of course in construction in general.
And so our thought was let's highlight that, but also highlight leaders and kind of have araw conversation.
(20:44):
So we ended up having a panel.
I think this was prior to COVID.
was four years we had the panel every year, but we invited women leaders in the industryto speak and really tell their story.
And we gave a book, whether it was just like a soft skill book to every, like it was, andso we called it Women Inspire Construction.
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But what our goal was was to like create community.
Because I think out of all of this, like the theme is like building that, right?
And that's when you know you have people to rely on when you have those questions that youdon't know where to go or you have a champion.
somewhere, they might not be with you all the time, but knowing you have that.
Right, right.
And yeah, again, it's not like you don't even need to have a constant connection.
(21:31):
It's like a I'm here if you need me kind of situation.
And I've tried to offer that myself to certain folks.
And I get joy from those relationships on my side of the fence too.
It's not just, know, to be honest, I learned just as much from them and their experiencesbecause there are different, a lot of them, because there are still people who are...
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same age just coming over into the industry and then you have the up and coming youngerfolks.
And I will say that the younger generation has definitely helped me shift my leadershipstyle and has helped me learn certain things and lean into like acceptance and kind of get
rid of quote unquote old school construction ways of certain things that I inherently justtook on And so I'm thankful as equally.
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it's not.
Like there's a lot of benefit to doing it for us as leaders in the industry and upcomingfolks.
The other thing I think really important is socializing the message that being successfulin this industry for anyone, not just women, doesn't mean you have to continue to climb a
ladder and reach a certain rank or level.
Like if you were to come and I say, I pick on this particular like.
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but I'm not intending to pick on any of you guys.
But if you want to come in and be the best damn accountant you can be, and you want toclock out at 5 o'clock and go about your day, and you love it and that's life, that's
freaking success.
So I really want to help folks to lean into
embracing success at whatever level they want to exist in this industry.
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And if you want to be a badass carpenter and you don't want to be a foreman, you just wantto be a badass carpenter, let's do that.
Like find joy and happiness there and stop listening to the rhetoric that you have toclimb to the top because, but also if you want to climb to the top, I'm here for it.
Yeah, no, that makes 100 % sense.
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And I think that pressure of putting people in roles that are not meant for leaders isalso a thing, right?
Like there's some people that's like, no, I like to run projects.
It's like you're not a manager of a group of people.
Like that's completely fine.
Like let's recognize people's talents and where they want to lean and just allow that tohappen.
(23:49):
Because that's how you actually find people in leadership positions that are not meant forthat.
Yeah, I think my first episode of the leadership series I released with Scott Brown, wetalked about the concept and the word leader.
And, and also the fact that there's a lot of people who don't belong with that label,because it's just, they get the label, right?
(24:11):
And then it's assumed that they have skill set and this all this and I'm like, they don't.
Let's just be honest, a lot of people don't.
And also a lot of people don't really want it.
I think a lot of people are convinced or shoved into it or they see money and they followthe money.
I get it.
I think everybody that can happen to any and all of us, especially when we're strugglingeconomy and struggling to care for our finances and whatnot.
(24:35):
So I would love to do a whole like series on financial education for folks in theindustry, too.
But someday I'll get there.
Too many ideas.
So just another kind of question comes to mind because you actually do engage with a lotof younger folks coming into the industry.
For you thinking back to like your beginner self in the industry, if you could give yourown self a piece of advice as your younger self, what would it be?
(25:06):
First, I can say stick true to who you are.
For me, identifying values is really who you are.
That's been my guiding principle in everything.
And I think that makes me maybe a bit more unique than others because that for me is anon-negotiable.
I've left positions because of it.
(25:26):
I've found places that support integrity, truth, and that's very important because it'sthe platform of who I am and that's my reputation.
knowing that and having that strength of self is something that I think is very important,especially as you go into an industry that you can mold so easily, where there is
(25:49):
conflict, where there is the decisions that can potentially challenge you when we'redealing with money and finances and also risk, right?
So I think that's for me, like,
the first because it's I focus more on soft skills.
But then I think the next one is boundaries.
(26:13):
Starting in the industry, of course, I was like, I don't think I took a vacation for fiveyears, right?
I mean, it was all about like proving myself and like, I mean, I can't
I can't even tell you how much we worked.
I was working day projects, night projects.
I don't know if it was like trauma bond with your coworkers, because we literally likenever stopped working.
(26:35):
But it's like unreal, the bond that you have with some, you know, with your coworkers,because we're always together.
I mean, it was crazy.
But ultimately, as that like,
I started to grow and started to bring more awareness and also just needed that to stop,right?
Like it was not sustainable.
It was really hard to be able to reframe the relationship because it's destroyed.
(27:01):
Like throwing up a boundary like eight years in, like doesn't quite work, right?
Well, but most of the time not.
Yeah, well, it wouldn't necessarily be as respected, right?
So I think that it was really important to, like in my career I learned that, but if Iwould have known that earlier, that would have changed a lot of things for me, I think.
(27:26):
Well, here's the more fun question.
Do you think your younger self would have listened to any of that?
Because I know my stubborn ass would definitely not have heard any of that at all.
So it's always entertaining to ask that question.
And then I'm like, who would you would have actually heard or listened to any of that?
(27:48):
I do think had we had mentors that were different and had different examples,
you know, maybe a little bit of it could have seeped in, right?
Had the right person delivered the message in the right way.
Well, and that's the thing, like, I also, to prove myself, obtained my MBA, I have my PMP,I have my CCM, like, I mean, it was like, you name it,
(28:11):
whether it was like my leaning in on my own lack of confidence to prove myself or it wasto outwardly show, look at what I can bring, either way, like either way, like I did that
and it was like just complete drive to make that happen.
think generationally also though, because I don't know age wise how close we are in age,it doesn't matter.
(28:37):
But I think thinking of how long you've been in the industry, how long I've been in theindustry, I think there's a time period there of like a decade plus where having the
paper, having the letters behind your name really did actually mean something relative togetting hired, relative to value and worth.
I think that's shifting a great deal.
people are recognizing that sometimes full formal, extra certifications, educations andall that stuff isn't always necessary.
(29:04):
I say isn't always because I still firmly love academia and I love research and I stillwant to chase certifications but I enjoy it.
It's not necessarily I need to prove anymore.
I don't, but I think you're right.
I think there was an area, a time period
from probably like the 90s and back where that truly meant something.
(29:26):
And part of that I think also comes from the fact that like, I forget what year, but upuntil a certain year, women weren't even allowed to get an education at college.
So like, let's acknowledge the importance of that for women also in why part of thatdiscourse was created for us.
So yeah, that's really interesting.
I still want to do a PhD.
I have no idea.
to y'all, I think it's just because I'm like a natural learner, or I love to learn.
(29:49):
And my dad always said like, no one can take education away from you.
So it's like, that's powerful.
funny, say, I tell my husband, I'm like, short of like traumatic brain trauma, injuryissues kind of thing happening.
Like I will always have my mind and my ability to think and be creative that way.
So I think I love it for that part of that reason.
(30:11):
I do love doing things with my hands too though.
Like I grew up, my dad's a carpenter and I still like enjoy projects around the house.
And I always am thinking of new things and my husband's like,
Wait, can we finish this one before we start that one?
I'm like, but I need to rip out.
There's one day I just decided to pull up a piece of corner of the carpet.
(30:34):
And by the end of that day, all the carpet in the house had been removed because I foundhardwood floors underneath.
That sounds right.
tracks, right?
That tracks.
Yeah.
But I wouldn't have it any other way.
And I love it.
And so it's been great.
To sort of wrap up the episode, this is my fun question that I love asking people if, isthere anybody in the industry, who another woman in the industry, a couple women in the
(30:59):
industry that you think deserve a shout out?
Because I think it's great to like elevate others who have either mentored us or justpeople we've noticed or just think
They're fucking badass for whatever reason we think so.
And if you have any of those, I'd love for you to share them.
Yeah, definitely.
You know, it's funny being on the owner's side.
I've had the opportunity to hire a lot of teams and so I just like been able to work withincredible women.
(31:25):
So it's like it's amazing now that I.
when you work with people and also like the women in the industry, I'm like, you are mypeople.
we problem solve, we're like so like minded.
I can't tell you now, like being a Barton Mallow I have lunch with, you know, people fromTurner and people at CK and all these like adjacent companies that are competitors, but
(31:45):
I'm like, they're my people, it's fine.
And so I love that.
I think a couple of things.
When I first started in the industry, I was at Quandel Construction and I actually, one ofthe first people that they hired to be with my team was Jackie Atkin.
And so we shared the same office and I was like in the beginning, like, my gosh, no, not agirl.
(32:07):
Like, which is not okay, but I was still like nervous.
because I've had that same reaction, so...
Well, all in all, we basically had the clubhouse, which was our office.
So just imagine our relationship now, right?
And then Holly McLean, who also worked there, she, like the clubhouse was where it's at.
(32:30):
So we're, you know, bound for life for sure.
But.
it.
Love it.
Yeah, there's definitely a couple others like Betsy Goldstein.
She's a business development and actually started her own business.
She's worked at the ABC, which was basically our builders group.
And then now, you know, was empowered and took it on her own, which is absolutely amazing.
(32:54):
And just like seeing people that like have like
that drive to take on risk and believe in their mission so much.
Like that to me is just so much power.
Whether it's because I'm not risk adverse or whatever, but I just see that and it's justso incredibly unpowerful to see people claiming their space for their own and really
(33:18):
making it work.
That's awesome.
Well, I don't know either three or any all of all three of them.
Wow.
My grammar is failing me now.
But I love asking this question and then I will totally LinkedIn stalk people and be like,I need to know you now.
But I.
(33:38):
Yeah.
like, it's so funny to see like where we came from and where we are now.
And that's really awesome too, to like be able to cheer on your peeps.
I love it.
Well, I really appreciate you joining us today.
If folks want to go take class at Ohio State University, check it out.
(33:59):
You have an amazing instructor here.
And you're now my second favorite person at Barton Malow Victor's my first I love talkingwith him and catching up with him.
so great people at Barton Malow over there.
Love you guys, it's great.
But thanks for joining.
I really appreciate it.
Thanks so much, Tristen I appreciate it.
(34:24):
Thank you for tuning in to today's episode of The Construction Cafe.
We hope you found our conversation as inspiring as your next big project.
Remember, you can dive deeper into the resources and topics we discuss by connecting withus on LinkedIn and Instagram.
Just search for The Construction Cafe.
Don't miss out on future episodes.
Be sure to follow us on Spotify, Podbean, and Apple Podcasts to keep the conversationgoing.
(34:48):
If you're passionate about the construction industry and have a story to share, we'd loveto hear from you.
Visit our website at the constructioncafe.com and drop us a note.
Let's keep building together.
Welcome to the Construction Cafe, where the buzz of the construction industry meets thewarmth of a friendly conversation.
I'm your host, Tristen Magallanes.
Join me at our virtual cafe as we explore the foundations of construction culture, sip oncutting edge concepts, and amplify the unspoken voices in our industry.
So grab a cup of your favorite beverage, pull up a seat, and let's build more than juststructures, let's build connections.
(00:33):
This is the Construction Cafe.
Hey everyone, welcome back to the Construction Cafe.
Super excited to consider you our series on Women in Construction Week.
(00:54):
And today we have joining us Adrienne Traver.
Thanks for joining us Adrienne, I appreciate it.
Thanks for having me.
first I want to just, can you introduce yourself?
Tell us a little bit about your role, where you work and you know, something fun if youwant, throw in there.
Yeah, of course.
So Adrienne Traver, I am a project executive at Barton Mallow Builders in Columbus, Ohio.
(01:16):
And I've been in the industry for about 17 years, all locally based in Columbus.
So graduated with the Ohio State University and graduated in 08.
So it was like lucky to have a job at that point.
yeah, that's a rough time to come into construction.
Yes, but also cheap labor.
So there was that, right?
So, yeah, and then I started at a general contractor, did work briefly at a subcontractorand then worked on the owner side actually for nine years.
(01:43):
So I feel like through all those experiences, it's just wealth of lessons learned andapproached and how I execute and manage teams and work on, you know, work at the executive
level now.
I also work at the Ohio State University as an instructor.
So I teach at the construction systems management program, a required class calledIntroduction to Construction Management, and then also demolition and renovation, which
(02:09):
I'm passionate about.
I love working in occupied space.
Yes.
Yeah, it's just a little elective.
So but yeah, those are the two classes.
So I've been doing that now.
for four years.
That's cool.
Are there a lot of alum who work in the industry that teach in the program?
Is that like typical?
(02:31):
So there are a couple, yes.
So there's a variety of industry professionals and then of course faculty and tenuredstaff that are within the program.
Yeah.
My husband tells me about his apprenticeship, when he went through his apprenticeshipprogram at the union, and he was critiquing the instructors in the apprenticeship programs
(02:52):
of they're not really taught to be instructors and that it's challenging sometimes tolearn.
So it's just really cool to hear people who...
jump in who are in the industry, who have the ability to teach and give back in that way.
Because I do think it's kind of like in service to the industry, But it's also kind of, Idon't know, I'm a nerd.
I think it's fun to teach things in general.
(03:14):
So yeah.
I think the one thing that I do enjoy is just the connection to the industry.
I try to encourage, you know, the wealth of our network, of course, is so important, butthen also just start to get exposure early because I just kind of like with some
weaknesses or some challenges that I felt like I had, just trying to overcome those earlyfor, you know, people to start building confidence early.
(03:38):
You know, getting exposure to a project job site can be quite overwhelming when you're notquite sure what's
what it's like, you know, so trying to do that in college, think is a wonderful way tostart to instill confidence and start to navigate, you know, your career.
Absolutely.
I've helped with some of the intern programs at some of the companies I've worked at byhosting job site tours There are quite a few young folks coming into the industry or just
(04:05):
new people in general, not necessarily young, who've never stepped foot on a job site.
And so they're studying something related but just have never done that.
And then there's others like myself who grew up
around the industry.
So it was just a normal natural thing for me.
It wasn't awkward or weird.
Just out of curiosity, what's the percentage of male to female in your classes?
(04:29):
So this semester, I probably have 12 % female.
yeah, so there is another Introduction to Construction Management class who is male led.
I'm not sure the percentage or I'm not sure if they've gravitated my way.
(04:50):
But I would be curious.
But yeah, I know I do have about 12%.
So it's great to see that.
Heck yeah, that's awesome.
Well, can you tell me, because part of what we're trying to do the whole week of Women inConstruction Week is to talk a little bit about the roles that the women we know hold in
the industry, because we want folks to understand that construction is not just swinging ahammer, and it's not just one thing.
(05:15):
There's a plethora of roles you can have, and they're all incredible and different andamazing.
just educate everybody a little bit.
What's your role about?
What do do?
Do you specialize in a specific area?
Yeah, sure.
So as a project executive here, I was tasked to grow our health care market sector.
So I do love working in projects that may be a bit more complex due to the systems thatare required within the scopes of work.
(05:43):
But I also have this focus of like the soft skill.
of working in occupied spaces and tailoring your construction to accommodate the needs ofothers.
And I think that's an approach that, you know, I was instilled when I first, you know, gotinto the industry and just noticed how that was so impactful and also created in powerful
(06:05):
conversations.
You know, nurse managers were able to understand what was going on and weigh in.
It just seemed to be very proactive and we were much more
successful in executing.
So I now am trying to build a group of people with like minds that are focused on thosetypes of, you know, complex projects and passionate about serving others and what we do.
(06:29):
So I do manage a team here.
But I, you know, focus on pursuits, execution, and all of the above.
So
That's really a good, interesting way to frame it.
I don't think I've heard a project executive frame their job of sort of this in service toother kind of, especially in healthcare, which is funny.
I'm reflecting to several of my doctors know that I work in construction.
(06:54):
One of them was my OBGYN.
And as he's doing my exam, he's like, what do you think about?
you know, the ceiling tile.
I'm just like...
He's like 80 something years old and I'm not even, we're probably not 80, but he wasprobably around 70.
And I'm like, you're up in my hoo-ha asking me about ceiling tiles.
So I guess this is what we're doing.
I mean, had a sweet, sweet man.
(07:16):
He had been my doctor for many, many, years and helped me with a lot.
It was just comical.
But a lot of the small minute things make a very big difference for those folks.
And if they're not brought into the conversation early,
One, you might be ripping things out and changing them later for them.
Or they're operating in a situation that is not ideal for them and patient care, whichflows even further down into service, right?
(07:41):
It's not just them, but it's some of the communities that they serve.
And so I find that incredibly good way to frame it and I appreciate that perspectivebecause I don't hear that a lot.
So that's awesome.
And I think having that mindset, I mean, worked locally in Columbus in many marketsectors.
So as an owner's rep, I had contracts with two higher education universities.
(08:04):
I worked at the John Glenn Columbus International Airport for five years, working on somecomplex renovations of renovating the existing facility and managing residents in on their
campus.
again, super drastic portfolio.
But I think I always have that frame in mind.
And I think that level of care just really creates a different space for people to makedecisions and also just a positive team environment because we have that care in mind.
(08:37):
Yeah, well, I find it's more enjoyable to work with people that actually give a crap,right?
if it's just about numbers and checking boxes that serves a purpose and there's a place inthe world, But if there's also this sense of care, I think that just brings something
different to a team environment in general, to a project in general.
And I think it's really great.
(08:58):
Is there something you could point to throughout your career, not just maybe your currentrole, like a bigger challenge or a really big frustration that you've had in your role
that you've noticed or maybe even changed?
I don't know.
Yeah, I think like, it's really interesting.
was looking back at my career and kind of like what I've overcome.
I think at the beginning, it's really just establishing confidence.
(09:21):
Establishing confidence to actually have a seat at the table to make, to, you know, feellike your opinion's valued.
And then also not be afraid to ask questions when you're in a space of learning.
I think there's, you know, the desire to grow and lead, but not necessarily feel like youfit.
And I think that is really, puts that in your mind in a negative context.
(09:45):
Mm-hmm.
because of that, it's like your own internal battle that other people aren't experiencingon the same platform.
So I think that's really hard when you're, I guess, entering the industry or just a spacewhere you just don't feel like everyone else.
(10:06):
Yeah, yeah.
I'm trying to reflect back to my experiences as well with that.
I think I felt early on it was more about my age than anything, know, like the young oneof the team.
But yeah, no, I've experienced that too.
I will say it took me probably 20 years to get that confidence of like, feelingcomfortable and it...
(10:28):
very interesting.
think it depends on who you're surrounded by.
So when it comes specifically to, you're talking, we're talking about like, you know, kindof feeling comfortable, gaining confidence.
Is there something specific you can point to when it comes to equity for women in theindustry that you think is most needed or you can point to like a thing that you're like
this, if we could help with this one thing, it might shift things for women in theindustry.
(10:53):
Anything that comes to mind?
I think women in general take on so many roles and sometimes that requires flexibility.
Knowing that they have so many responsibilities of leadership inside and outside of thework environment, it can be extremely limiting to not offer the flexibility and I guess.
(11:13):
confidence, but just like understanding that their work will be done, but sometimes it'sjust not done in the same like context because of requirements of either, you know,
running around for children or supporting, you know, going home because of some, you know,sickness or it's just no, that's really important, I think.
(11:35):
Yeah, I agree.
That's a good one.
And I appreciate you bringing that up.
Because I've seen lately in the last couple of years, I would say five years, I would sayaround COVID time, actually.
I started to notice different pockets of employers starting to bring more of thatflexibility in.
Because people were faced with a lot of challenges during that time and needed to have theflexibility
(11:59):
But you're 100 % right.
I've joked, I think the last episode I recorded too, I joked about I would love to do anexperiment, if I can ever find someone to do this with me, of having childcare at the job
site for trade workers.
So because it's, you you're often driving fairly far away.
and it's early in the morning, which is hard to find care at that time of day unless it'sa family member usually.
(12:23):
So if we offered that, could that flexibility allow for more women to show up on jobsites?
And I don't know that anyone's ever going let me try that social experiment, but I thinkit would be really incredibly interesting.
So.
because again, the commitment of when to show up is very rigid.
And of course, that can be so challenging to have that commitment.
(12:49):
Yeah.
And we'll call it what it is.
Women are still largely responsible for the care of children on this planet.
So bringing in different flexible hours and locations, which is hard because you have togo where the work is in construction.
And there are usually time limitations relative to city ordinances and or weather issuesand things like that.
(13:13):
I think it's all something that can be thought through thoughtfully just like we weretalking about with, you know, clients.
We can think through ways to serve better the employees and the folks showing up in thisindustry, in my opinion, and make changes.
It might happen slower than we'd like, but it's getting there.
also just think of creating a space that can be heard.
(13:35):
It's like making sure that your employees, they're actually able to comfortably voice thatthere's these challenges and maybe the approach of supporting them.
You're open to that rather than not.
Yeah.
Do you find or have you heard that women and or differently gendered people feel like theycan't bring forward those things because they're afraid of retaliation or being seen as
(14:01):
that person, you know?
Yeah, and I know that there's people that I have hired here that were working inenvironments that were extremely taxing really long hours during the week and didn't feel,
I guess, supported in that.
And ultimately, that led to a difference of employer required.
(14:22):
Obviously, you know, no one's trying to, it's not about being taken advantage of.
but that individual should be able to have a career and both, right?
And yeah.
You know, it's funny.
Reminds me sort of I worked in civil construction for many years.
And one of my first main bosses, I remember kind of had this mindset of like, yeah, workstarts at seven.
(14:47):
But if you're not here at six, you're late kind of that was the vibe 100 % across theboard.
And if you're not working through your lunch, and if you're not, you know, staying an hourlate, like, it wasn't enough.
And setting that kind of standard for, I think, anyone is not healthy.
But that's very, very much how it felt always.
(15:09):
And not openly said, but the way you were treated, if that wasn't how you also showed up,was very obvious.
And I still see that actually fairly often in the industry.
And I would imagine for folks trying to come into the industry who are also trying tobalance the care of others.
(15:29):
other responsibilities.
Maybe they just need to have three jobs to maintain economical viability in this societytoday, which is also another very real thing.
You know, that's really, really hard.
And I would love for that to shift for folks in this industry.
And I think the best way is leading by example
I agree with that.
think there can be some people that have a mindset of like, you have to prove it to makeit.
(15:53):
And that can be very challenging for acceptance, right?
Yeah, absolutely.
Yeah.
You know, going back to your teaching, I remember when I first met you, that was justsomething that struck me I wish more, specifically women who are in the industry would
lean into spaces and teach or show up in those spaces where folks are being educated tocome into this industry, whether it be in apprenticeship programs or educational
(16:19):
institutions.
Because I feel like if they see us, we're here, they see examples of women that arealready in these positions.
They're more likely to sort of ask for advice from us and make connections through us.
So I feel like that's just, I have a standard question to ask of like, what is yourpersonal contributions towards positive change for women in construction?
(16:42):
And I think you're a great example of just that doing what you're doing at the
college.
And so have there been any students that you've stayed connected with and you've seentheir career progress?
And are you able to share any of that?
Because I just think it's exciting.
no, it's interesting.
It's funny because I have so many people that since it's the introduction to constructionmanagement class, feel like.
(17:03):
It's also my responsibility to like educate them about all the opportunities.
I mean, I always say that I feel like I'm the biggest cheerleader of the constructionindustry because there are so many opportunities and you name it.
If you have a trait or a passion, I feel like there's a way to be able to involveyourself.
Yeah.
I mean, it's like the ultimate team sport.
(17:24):
We're all in it together.
There's ability to collaborate.
It's just like, we're dependent on each other.
There's so many positives.
So that is like my prime focus and instilling in the class.
So they like recognize all of those positives and then from there, it's like their senseto explore.
(17:44):
In my class, I do require a presentation where the students have an opportunity to eitherinterview someone with the industry or walk a job site.
that's fun.
And then they come back to class and report out and do their like five minutepresentation, sharing photos, experience, things like that.
But that's starting to get them again, just to see what it could be for them or just tomake a connection.
(18:11):
Yeah.
So when I first, I love it.
And also I'm like selfishly like, I love to hear about these projects because I mean, Ican walk on job site now and then just like still geek out.
100 % same.
So, but I had a student when I first started introduction to construction management, hername is Peyton Hash and she actually is an architecture student, which I loved because I
(18:35):
was.
And I told her, was like, you're welcome to the dark side.
you are like, I was like, come over to construction.
the.
I hear this from so many architects.
So funny.
So, you know, she's very passionate about architecture, but I was like, I think it wouldbe really impactful for you to experience construction just because that mindset may be
(18:56):
helpful for you as you grow in your, you know, architecture.
content.
So she ended up working with us for the summer on a project and was our project engineeron the job site, meeting minutes, project photos and engaging with our superintendent.
And, you know, we still stay very closely connected.
Now she's her junior.
(19:17):
So she was a freshman when we when I hired her and we still, you know, remain connected.
I support her and her scholarship applications.
I mean, she's trying to put herself through school.
And that's really important for her to have that full experience.
And this year, I think she's gonna have her architecture internship.
So I'd love to see her grow and thrive.
(19:38):
That's awesome.
And I love, you know, I know not everybody has the time to necessarily give back to likeup and coming professionals or folks going through either apprenticeship or academic
institutions.
But even if every woman in the industry took time, like for one year of their career tohelp mentor or guide or network another upcoming woman, I just feel like that would make a
(20:01):
huge difference.
I know it's hard, like I said, not everybody has the time.
We're already caretaking for so many other spaces in the world.
But it's definitely something I think is incredibly important So.
I think that's amazing and I appreciate that you do that and continue to follow some ofthem and that's pretty amazing.
One thing that we did at the university is called the Industry Advisory Council.
(20:23):
I was the chair of that.
So it's really just the construction organizations that help support the program.
So we recognize the challenge of diversity.
in the program, but just of course in construction in general.
And so our thought was let's highlight that, but also highlight leaders and kind of have araw conversation.
(20:44):
So we ended up having a panel.
I think this was prior to COVID.
was four years we had the panel every year, but we invited women leaders in the industryto speak and really tell their story.
And we gave a book, whether it was just like a soft skill book to every, like it was, andso we called it Women Inspire Construction.
(21:07):
But what our goal was was to like create community.
Because I think out of all of this, like the theme is like building that, right?
And that's when you know you have people to rely on when you have those questions that youdon't know where to go or you have a champion.
somewhere, they might not be with you all the time, but knowing you have that.
Right, right.
And yeah, again, it's not like you don't even need to have a constant connection.
(21:31):
It's like a I'm here if you need me kind of situation.
And I've tried to offer that myself to certain folks.
And I get joy from those relationships on my side of the fence too.
It's not just, know, to be honest, I learned just as much from them and their experiencesbecause there are different, a lot of them, because there are still people who are...
(21:51):
same age just coming over into the industry and then you have the up and coming youngerfolks.
And I will say that the younger generation has definitely helped me shift my leadershipstyle and has helped me learn certain things and lean into like acceptance and kind of get
rid of quote unquote old school construction ways of certain things that I inherently justtook on And so I'm thankful as equally.
(22:15):
it's not.
Like there's a lot of benefit to doing it for us as leaders in the industry and upcomingfolks.
The other thing I think really important is socializing the message that being successfulin this industry for anyone, not just women, doesn't mean you have to continue to climb a
ladder and reach a certain rank or level.
Like if you were to come and I say, I pick on this particular like.
(22:40):
but I'm not intending to pick on any of you guys.
But if you want to come in and be the best damn accountant you can be, and you want toclock out at 5 o'clock and go about your day, and you love it and that's life, that's
freaking success.
So I really want to help folks to lean into
embracing success at whatever level they want to exist in this industry.
(23:03):
And if you want to be a badass carpenter and you don't want to be a foreman, you just wantto be a badass carpenter, let's do that.
Like find joy and happiness there and stop listening to the rhetoric that you have toclimb to the top because, but also if you want to climb to the top, I'm here for it.
Yeah, no, that makes 100 % sense.
(23:25):
And I think that pressure of putting people in roles that are not meant for leaders isalso a thing, right?
Like there's some people that's like, no, I like to run projects.
It's like you're not a manager of a group of people.
Like that's completely fine.
Like let's recognize people's talents and where they want to lean and just allow that tohappen.
(23:49):
Because that's how you actually find people in leadership positions that are not meant forthat.
Yeah, I think my first episode of the leadership series I released with Scott Brown, wetalked about the concept and the word leader.
And, and also the fact that there's a lot of people who don't belong with that label,because it's just, they get the label, right?
(24:11):
And then it's assumed that they have skill set and this all this and I'm like, they don't.
Let's just be honest, a lot of people don't.
And also a lot of people don't really want it.
I think a lot of people are convinced or shoved into it or they see money and they followthe money.
I get it.
I think everybody that can happen to any and all of us, especially when we're strugglingeconomy and struggling to care for our finances and whatnot.
(24:35):
So I would love to do a whole like series on financial education for folks in theindustry, too.
But someday I'll get there.
Too many ideas.
So just another kind of question comes to mind because you actually do engage with a lotof younger folks coming into the industry.
For you thinking back to like your beginner self in the industry, if you could give yourown self a piece of advice as your younger self, what would it be?
(25:06):
First, I can say stick true to who you are.
For me, identifying values is really who you are.
That's been my guiding principle in everything.
And I think that makes me maybe a bit more unique than others because that for me is anon-negotiable.
I've left positions because of it.
(25:26):
I've found places that support integrity, truth, and that's very important because it'sthe platform of who I am and that's my reputation.
knowing that and having that strength of self is something that I think is very important,especially as you go into an industry that you can mold so easily, where there is
(25:49):
conflict, where there is the decisions that can potentially challenge you when we'redealing with money and finances and also risk, right?
So I think that's for me, like,
the first because it's I focus more on soft skills.
But then I think the next one is boundaries.
(26:13):
Starting in the industry, of course, I was like, I don't think I took a vacation for fiveyears, right?
I mean, it was all about like proving myself and like, I mean, I can't
I can't even tell you how much we worked.
I was working day projects, night projects.
I don't know if it was like trauma bond with your coworkers, because we literally likenever stopped working.
(26:35):
But it's like unreal, the bond that you have with some, you know, with your coworkers,because we're always together.
I mean, it was crazy.
But ultimately, as that like,
I started to grow and started to bring more awareness and also just needed that to stop,right?
Like it was not sustainable.
It was really hard to be able to reframe the relationship because it's destroyed.
(27:01):
Like throwing up a boundary like eight years in, like doesn't quite work, right?
Well, but most of the time not.
Yeah, well, it wouldn't necessarily be as respected, right?
So I think that it was really important to, like in my career I learned that, but if Iwould have known that earlier, that would have changed a lot of things for me, I think.
(27:26):
Well, here's the more fun question.
Do you think your younger self would have listened to any of that?
Because I know my stubborn ass would definitely not have heard any of that at all.
So it's always entertaining to ask that question.
And then I'm like, who would you would have actually heard or listened to any of that?
(27:48):
I do think had we had mentors that were different and had different examples,
you know, maybe a little bit of it could have seeped in, right?
Had the right person delivered the message in the right way.
Well, and that's the thing, like, I also, to prove myself, obtained my MBA, I have my PMP,I have my CCM, like, I mean, it was like, you name it,
(28:11):
whether it was like my leaning in on my own lack of confidence to prove myself or it wasto outwardly show, look at what I can bring, either way, like either way, like I did that
and it was like just complete drive to make that happen.
think generationally also though, because I don't know age wise how close we are in age,it doesn't matter.
(28:37):
But I think thinking of how long you've been in the industry, how long I've been in theindustry, I think there's a time period there of like a decade plus where having the
paper, having the letters behind your name really did actually mean something relative togetting hired, relative to value and worth.
I think that's shifting a great deal.
people are recognizing that sometimes full formal, extra certifications, educations andall that stuff isn't always necessary.
(29:04):
I say isn't always because I still firmly love academia and I love research and I stillwant to chase certifications but I enjoy it.
It's not necessarily I need to prove anymore.
I don't, but I think you're right.
I think there was an area, a time period
from probably like the 90s and back where that truly meant something.
(29:26):
And part of that I think also comes from the fact that like, I forget what year, but upuntil a certain year, women weren't even allowed to get an education at college.
So like, let's acknowledge the importance of that for women also in why part of thatdiscourse was created for us.
So yeah, that's really interesting.
I still want to do a PhD.
I have no idea.
to y'all, I think it's just because I'm like a natural learner, or I love to learn.
(29:49):
And my dad always said like, no one can take education away from you.
So it's like, that's powerful.
funny, say, I tell my husband, I'm like, short of like traumatic brain trauma, injuryissues kind of thing happening.
Like I will always have my mind and my ability to think and be creative that way.
So I think I love it for that part of that reason.
(30:11):
I do love doing things with my hands too though.
Like I grew up, my dad's a carpenter and I still like enjoy projects around the house.
And I always am thinking of new things and my husband's like,
Wait, can we finish this one before we start that one?
I'm like, but I need to rip out.
There's one day I just decided to pull up a piece of corner of the carpet.
(30:34):
And by the end of that day, all the carpet in the house had been removed because I foundhardwood floors underneath.
That sounds right.
tracks, right?
That tracks.
Yeah.
But I wouldn't have it any other way.
And I love it.
And so it's been great.
To sort of wrap up the episode, this is my fun question that I love asking people if, isthere anybody in the industry, who another woman in the industry, a couple women in the
(30:59):
industry that you think deserve a shout out?
Because I think it's great to like elevate others who have either mentored us or justpeople we've noticed or just think
They're fucking badass for whatever reason we think so.
And if you have any of those, I'd love for you to share them.
Yeah, definitely.
You know, it's funny being on the owner's side.
I've had the opportunity to hire a lot of teams and so I just like been able to work withincredible women.
(31:25):
So it's like it's amazing now that I.
when you work with people and also like the women in the industry, I'm like, you are mypeople.
we problem solve, we're like so like minded.
I can't tell you now, like being a Barton Mallow I have lunch with, you know, people fromTurner and people at CK and all these like adjacent companies that are competitors, but
(31:45):
I'm like, they're my people, it's fine.
And so I love that.
I think a couple of things.
When I first started in the industry, I was at Quandel Construction and I actually, one ofthe first people that they hired to be with my team was Jackie Atkin.
And so we shared the same office and I was like in the beginning, like, my gosh, no, not agirl.
(32:07):
Like, which is not okay, but I was still like nervous.
because I've had that same reaction, so...
Well, all in all, we basically had the clubhouse, which was our office.
So just imagine our relationship now, right?
And then Holly McLean, who also worked there, she, like the clubhouse was where it's at.
(32:30):
So we're, you know, bound for life for sure.
But.
it.
Love it.
Yeah, there's definitely a couple others like Betsy Goldstein.
She's a business development and actually started her own business.
She's worked at the ABC, which was basically our builders group.
And then now, you know, was empowered and took it on her own, which is absolutely amazing.
(32:54):
And just like seeing people that like have like
that drive to take on risk and believe in their mission so much.
Like that to me is just so much power.
Whether it's because I'm not risk adverse or whatever, but I just see that and it's justso incredibly unpowerful to see people claiming their space for their own and really
(33:18):
making it work.
That's awesome.
Well, I don't know either three or any all of all three of them.
Wow.
My grammar is failing me now.
But I love asking this question and then I will totally LinkedIn stalk people and be like,I need to know you now.
But I.
(33:38):
Yeah.
like, it's so funny to see like where we came from and where we are now.
And that's really awesome too, to like be able to cheer on your peeps.
I love it.
Well, I really appreciate you joining us today.
If folks want to go take class at Ohio State University, check it out.
(33:59):
You have an amazing instructor here.
And you're now my second favorite person at Barton Malow Victor's my first I love talkingwith him and catching up with him.
so great people at Barton Malow over there.
Love you guys, it's great.
But thanks for joining.
I really appreciate it.
Thanks so much, Tristen I appreciate it.
(34:24):
Thank you for tuning in to today's episode of The Construction Cafe.
We hope you found our conversation as inspiring as your next big project.
Remember, you can dive deeper into the resources and topics we discuss by connecting withus on LinkedIn and Instagram.
Just search for The Construction Cafe.
Don't miss out on future episodes.
Be sure to follow us on Spotify, Podbean, and Apple Podcasts to keep the conversationgoing.
(34:48):
If you're passionate about the construction industry and have a story to share, we'd loveto hear from you.
Visit our website at the constructioncafe.com and drop us a note.
Let's keep building together.
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