July 18, 2024 • 19 mins
Welcome to the first edition of the Content Combo Podcast, presented by Casual Films. Join your host, Thomas Elliott, along with editors Ansh Grey, Joey Kan, and filmmaker Richie Fowler as they delve into the art of creating compelling on-screen interviews.
In this episode, our experts discuss the key elements that make an interview captivating—from lighting and ambience to the clarity of sound and the delivery of content. They explore how directors can draw out the best from their subjects and the importance of making talent feel comfortable and authentic.
The team also shares valuable insights on the editing process, highlighting how to distill hours of footage into a concise and engaging narrative. They discuss the role of the director in setting the tone on set and how strategic decisions can enhance the final product.
Whether you're a filmmaker, content creator, or simply curious about the behind-the-scenes of producing effective video content, this episode offers practical advice and insider tips to elevate your interview videos.
Don't miss out on this informative and engaging conversation. Tune in every Friday for more from the Content Combo, and follow us on LinkedIn or via the Casual Films website.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Music.
(00:05):
Welcome to the Content Combo podcast, presented by Casual Films.
Tune in every Friday so you can hear from our team of experts about how to deliver
effective video content that drives results every time without fail.
(00:27):
And now it's over to our hosts.
Welcome to the first edition of the Content Combo Podcast.
I'm your host, Thomas Elliott, and joining me to make up the combo this week
are editors Arch Gray, Joey Kahn, and filmmaker Richie Fowler. Hi there.
Ooh, sexy. Whoa, Richie. Look at that, you have a great voice for podcasting.
(00:48):
In today's podcast, we are going to be talking about creating compelling interviews.
Dun, dun, dun. Dun, dun, dun.
So, let me start by asking the three of you, what makes a really compelling
on-screen interview for you? Can I start?
Do you? Yeah, go, please, jump in. I would really say the lighting.
(01:09):
Lighting? Really the lighting. The lighting, the ambience, and the way how the
interviewer is basically just enunciating every word.
It needs to be, yeah, if it all works very well, then you have a very captivating story.
You have a very captivating interview, even if it can be something super
boring for like a general audience just because of
like the setting that's already there it can just elevate that
(01:32):
to like a different level yeah no i mean i totally agree
i feel like definitely when you're talking about like eye catching
this in terms of like what draws you in sure
a visual image does really draw you in but content you
know is very important how you approach the subject what the
subject's saying are they saying in a way that tells the
story it's captivating it's compelling i think these
(01:54):
are all things that are important for a good interview
how does a director or filmmaker draw that out
of the subject you know so i feel like yeah you know
story content uh how it's being drawn out
of them the look the visual that's definitely a
really key factor because i think that's something that
immediately catches people's attention in our shortest attention
(02:15):
span you know one year that we live in yeah i
agree because an interview is mostly someone talking after
a while you don't really for me personally yeah
you wouldn't really care about like what he looks like or how much pixels are
on screen but the sound clarity of his voice how the person delivers what he's
(02:37):
saying he or she or they are saying is very important because.
For me if if i'm listening to a video and the sound is crap i just want to turn
it off i don't and I'll listen to it after five seconds.
Yeah, I mean, I agree with everything that's been said. I think for me,
it's what is it that they have to say, right?
(02:57):
How compelling is it? And, you know, compelling can vary depending on what the
interview is that you're doing.
Because a lot of the time when you're doing interview stories.
It may not be the most compelling story.
It might be, you know, this is an announcement video where we're talking about some kind of news.
But it's, again, how compelling is that news? how
compelling are you communicating that news exactly i'm taking
(03:20):
an interest in it and i think there
there are a lot of factors for me what makes that interview compelling one
is how relaxed human and comfortable the
talent is you know how good are they at articulating that
story yeah the delivery and there's a
big difference between people who rehearse their stories before
an interview and people who just turn up and wing it and
(03:41):
there are some people who are pretty good turning
up and winging it but i don't think anybody is great at turning
up and winging it i feel like and you can always tell i can
always tell when it turned up if if the you know the ceo or
the customer or whoever it is if you you
can tell when they've rehearsed it and it's such a big joy as
a director when you turn up they've rehearsed it i think lighting also
(04:02):
really helps and for me the framing of the
interview is really important because the framing tells you everything
about that person so i think all of those things really impact what
makes a great compelling on-screen interview for me and also
then how you support that with editing and music you know which
bits you choose to leave in which bits you take out and i sometimes feel like
(04:23):
compelling interviews are not always perfect interviews sometimes there are
things in there where somebody makes a mistake and i quite like that because
it makes it feel human like the david beckham popping his head in the victoria.
Come on, Victoria. Come on, Victoria. You grew up rich and tuned or something.
(04:44):
What car? What car? What car did your parents drive you to school in?
So I think, you know, again, we're acknowledging the makeup of this room too
for audiences who are not familiar.
So while you and I primarily work as editors and Richie works as a filmmaker
and director and I'm a director and a creative, we all have experience from
(05:04):
a directing point of view and we all have experience from a filmmaking point of view.
So I'm going to ask, what do you think it takes from the directing point of
view to get a really good compelling on-screen interview.
Can I start? One thing I
found is when I've
seen people do interviews on set and I've seen different directors directing
people is the speed of which certain directors can get people to be comfortable
(05:27):
with them makes a big difference in how the talent reacts and and how good their
delivery is at that moment in time.
Because I think that people feed off each other's energy in the room, right?
So he's able, the person's able, the director's able to make the person feel
comfortable immediately and makes a sense of ease.
(05:50):
And then it turns into not an interview, but it just like two friends talking about a subject. Yeah.
I mean, I often think of it like acting a scene, right? Yeah.
That in a scene, an actor on camera
is only as good as the camera is the actor who's off camera right
right and so the director's job
in a way is to feed the performance of the interviewee right so when you're
(06:13):
interviewing somebody you know and i mean there's some very hilarious footage
of me at various points with people nodding very enthusiastically or doing whatever
it is but that energy totally feeds,
the other person you see your camera right because they get their like oh i'm
doing good i'm doing Yeah, they get the self-confidence boost.
Everybody who comes in to do an interview feels vulnerable. And I don't care
(06:37):
who they are. Like, I don't care if you're like a plumber or a prime minister.
Like, everybody feels really vulnerable when they come in for an interview because
it's not a normal situation.
There are cameras. There's like, you know, a boom guy who might have bad B.O.
Standing there. Capturing your soul.
There's somebody asking you questions. Sometimes they're not satisfied with
(06:59):
those questions and you have to go again.
Comfort is so important. To add on to that, you know, having,
getting the subject comfortable, getting them at ease so that they don't feel
like they have to put on like a PR, like a public kind of facade or show,
or giving you answers that they feel like they need to give you.
You know, cause I feel like, especially you Thomas, or you know,
(07:22):
myself as well, but we've definitely been in situations where there's been people
want, you know, they feel like
they need to tell you something that is not true or authentic to them.
And so actually, it comes across very much like that. And so I think I've seen
Thomas doing this where there's been situations where he's spent his time trying to ease the person.
(07:47):
But yeah, getting them comfortable, getting them at ease, making them feel like
they're authentic and themselves.
I think that's very important. There's that word again, authentic,
which we love so much. We do love it.
It's not easy for me like for me like I don't like being in front of the camera
because my whole life I was spending behind the camera so for me I'm used to
(08:09):
that and also like I just don't like myself on the camera but there are times
where like yeah sometimes when I was put in front of the camera and I didn't
know how to react and the director basically just,
comforted me told me he was actually relating to me and he became more like
a friend and eventually that's what basically put me in front of a camera and I was like, okay, great.
I'm more comfortable now despite a boom operator right next to me.
(08:32):
The lighting just blinding me sometimes and the camera is over there and I can
see the red light glow and I'm like, okay.
That is, I mean, I'm obviously scared a bit over there but at the same time,
you know what, I'm actually quite comfortable as well because I already had a chat
with a friend who's a director and basically the director confident
me so that was like the that's actually quite important
(08:55):
i always feel like the pressure is even worse when somebody who's sitting
there who's an employee for a company and they're like the communist
people or something at the back of the room or their boss and
they're kind of sitting there behind every time they see it yeah i
can see
what i'm seeing opposite i can see them going you're looking at them and
you're thinking what are they thinking about what i'm saying and it is
(09:17):
like in a way it's that thing of like almost always being a
bit of a hypnotist and going no no don't look at them don't look
at them look into my eyes come back to me come back to me we're talking okay
right i mean if you look at the try the way i think
particularly which you know i try and set up interview situations i try
and put the cameras as far away as possible i try
and keep the crew as far away as possible i try and keep my chair
(09:38):
particularly if it's an off-camera interview and they're looking at me as the interviewer i
try and keep myself as close to them as possible shooting on longer lenses so
that we can facilitate that so then it just feels more like they're back there
don't worry about them it's us talking and you know what it's okay to file we
find walk away through this I always feel that that gets a much better result than anything else.
(10:04):
The tactics would you do because I feel like there's been situations where if
If you can't draw that authenticness, you have to manufacture it, which is worse.
Well, not just manufacture, but you have to be kind of strategic and part of
that's kicking half the crew out.
Or it's like, as Anish mentioned, if the light's too bright,
(10:27):
that's like managing the lights or that's like part of the lighting plan,
making sure it's not too bright in their face.
Because that's pretty- Yeah, it's horrible. Nobody likes it. No, exactly.
Yeah. I mean, I think there are a lot of different strategies.
I mean, we have had situations where I've even had to ask the client to leave.
I've had to. And, you know, you might put them out in the hallway and put a
monitor out there and some headphones and say, look, you know,
(10:48):
you can still give feedback to me.
You can still yell through the door, but you are making the talent uncomfortable.
They just don't feel comfortable talking in front of you. You're creating pressure.
And so I think within reason, you know, it's removing anything that's going
to create pressure from the scenario,
whether it is the light, whether it is, you know,
I mean I often try and prefer I don't let a
(11:10):
boom guy stand there I fix microphones and
tell the boom guy to go away you know I'm also very specific
about the way the crew interacts with the
interview subject even right down to now there are only certain sound recorders
I work with because I don't like sound recorders who yell at the talent that's
one of the things that really annoys me you know when you're trying to kind
of have this very controlled environment with somebody and make them feel comfortable
(11:34):
and they're talking and then suddenly you know this other voice just
barks at them, something like, ah, sound was terrible, go again.
You know, like, no, can't have that.
Yeah, but that's what happens. That's what it sounds like too.
Like, I'm sure they don't actually sound like that, but to me,
that's what it sounds like.
Sometimes they would actually just tell to the client, like,
oh, like you're speaking way too loud.
(11:54):
They're supposed to be a director, you know? Yeah, and I'm always like,
you know, I direct my sound guys, I'm like, come on.
If you've got feedback, whisper in my ear, I'll take care of it,
don't talk to the talent.
In the same way that I also I do that
to the clients too you know we're possible I'm like whatever comments
you have see here feel free to use my ear as a
vehicle to talk to the talent but please don't talk to them
(12:15):
directly because I find again as soon as there's somebody
else that they're talking to they lose focus they think about other things they
get confused and you know I know that's very hard for a lot of people to sort
of understand but that's what happens because you're in any you're in a situation
where you feel under pressure even if you don't so trying to remove that pressure
as much as possible so important.
(12:36):
I mean that's quite interesting because like i mean
we can probably do a whole podcast on the same like the role of the director and
setting tone and setting because like the
more i understand about directing
the more i kind of realize it's true part of it is uh setting
the tone that's not just with the subject but that's also with
the crew that's also with the client it's about
(12:57):
um you know showing them that you're serious and
professional but also able to be uh able
to break down people's walls so they feel comfortable um so
it's a very fine fine balance that i feel like that you've heard totally
you have to adapt your tone too depending on who you're
interviewing because you know a ceo who's
very time poor he's very different to a customer
(13:20):
who has a really emotional story you know
a ceo often it really is about that sort of
professionalism of coming in and being able to just kind of make them
feel like a rock star and get them out
the door as fast as possible you know i feel like
ceos really love it when they come in and they sit down and
they feel like wow you've totally got this nailed for me you're making
me look good you give me the right feedback you're not hiding anything
(13:43):
from me you're telling me directly what you want and what
you don't want great i'm done i'm out the door whereas you know if you're going
into somebody's house you know we've done this we've done stories with yeah
incredibly difficult stories where people will have to tell you really personal
things that's a totally different approach and that often takes more time it's
softer there's a lot more pre-interview there's a lot more sort of.
(14:05):
You know often in that situation um you know because i have two ways of doing
interview and overlay shoots one is you know if it's somebody like a ceo or
something i might want to do the interview first and then shoot with the b-roll
afterwards but if it's like a really emotional
story I might want to shoot the b-roll first so
that that person gets used to me and you
(14:26):
know I kind of like particularly that trip you and I took to Malaysia where
we had to go and tell a really personal story I think that b-roll day where
we went you know to church with our subject and spent time with them really
helped because then when we came to do the interview he felt so comfortable
talking to us and that's you know I think that's a really you could pick the way you work.
Yeah, we were allies, that's our popular buzzword.
(14:49):
In the pre-interview, they were visibly uncomfortable with answering some of
the questions and they were like trying to specify like oh you can't say this
or you have to like remember that,
to be sensitive about this certain topic and blah blah blah like kind of like
this and then And so I was thinking like, Ooh, this is going to be interesting.
(15:11):
And when they actually land on set, you know, when they meet them in person.
But yeah, he guys did a good job on that.
That's a very important story. Yeah.
Once an interview goes from the set to the edit suite.
What is the process you guys go through? Do you watch the interview in its entirety?
(15:35):
Or do you transcribe it and highlight bits?
How do you keep what was good from the whole interview but compress it down
to truly compelling viewing?
You want to go first? Okay, yeah. So what I like to do personally is,
before even looking at anything,
if possible, I would talk to
(15:57):
the director or whoever was on set because
they're there and I need to like download thoughts
from that person's brain um to
be like it's quite a painful process yeah be like okay
what do you remember about the good parts of this interview what do you remember
about the bad parts of this interview what's the story that you think is there
(16:19):
and then I try to mark that down and then I look through the interview and I
try to find those points that they were talking about.
If you just try to go straight from just looking at the interview without asking
anyone, you can still make a story, but you probably spend like twice or three
times amount of time getting what you need.
(16:43):
Yeah, I mean, yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, for example, if the director is
not there, for example, like it's not on the shoot or he's busy in meetings
or something, then I would just like read the scripts that was already prepared
for basically is to get a rough idea.
And then I would watch the entire thing after, of course, making sure the audios
are all synced up, both the cameras, three cameras, how many cameras there are,
(17:06):
are all synced up, then I'll start watching the interview.
And while I'm watching it, I also make like my own little notes,
as in mockers. You just know, okay, they were talking about this subject,
they were talking about this subject, okay.
This thing was better for this particular subject. So just making those points as well.
And yeah, then like seeing like, yeah, what is actually there in total,
like what's the story in total and then for this time document director do you also and this is.
(17:31):
Maybe revealing a trade secret spoiler alert
um do you also i think you
know there's also understanding that there is you know
people often say there's the film that you make in pre-production there's what
you shoot and that's what you edit i also think like one
of the misconceptions a lot of people have about documentary storytelling is
that you just capture reality and cut it together and put it out but
(17:54):
in a way you are still manipulating a
story for an audience right you are you are using
bits and pieces of a story to highlight emotion
or highlight other bits and pieces do you
even like look through and go oh look there's a great reaction that maybe i
would use for something or there's a great hand gesture that i could use to
(18:16):
emphasize a point even if it didn't relate to that specific point that they
were talking about but you sit there and go oh you know it just needs a little bit of juice there.
Is that something that you you think about when you're cutting
a story together without again you know giving away
all the secrets I don't know someone says something and then they start
(18:36):
like tearing up or something and you're like oh great and you just like mark
that down you don't know if it's gonna be used or how
it's gonna be used but you know that's an emotional moment
in the interview so you want to remember that
but usually the visual sequences that
like are emotional or work nicely are probably found
in the b-rolls more and the actual like talking parts
(18:59):
yeah yeah or is
it even sometimes you know you're finding like a bit that
links something together or whatever else or that can amplify the emotion
that they may because you know sometimes and this is the other reality of editing you
may have two moments that happened in real-time 20
minutes apart that by the time you
(19:21):
cut them are split seconds
apart oh yeah this is the train trade secret part right yes and again it's like
as long as it's within the authenticity and the intent yeah I was saying the
intent of the story but that is documentary filmmaking right like you You are, in a way,
(19:42):
taking what was there and...
Just using it up. Yeah. Adding that juice. Adding the juice.
Letting the juice loose. Yeah.
Right off the cutting a nice steak. Right off the cutting the steak.
You're curating the experience of the audience to what is required of the story.
(20:03):
So maybe at the 10 minute mark, he says steak, but it doesn't say it very well.
And then he says steak again that's a 20 minute mark yeah but he says it like,
steak you know and you're like oh this is so much and you're like okay fine
it was a very compelling steak yeah.
(20:24):
Also like sometimes when you're when you're watching uh like just a raw interview
um you already start making like a mental images of basically the sequences
and everything that you want to basically start doing for this story, right?
So you tend to just get used to it and just start.
For me, sometimes if I'm already one of the stories, it's not even a language which I can speak.
(20:47):
So for me, I was relying on subtitles and something about the story caught me.
So before even I finished watching the entire interview, I just started editing
whatever I wanted to do from before.
And yeah, in the end, we just made the story and then yeah, it was good.
So sometimes that can also happen.
Yeah i mean i always like it there are those moments that i
(21:08):
can feel in the interview too that i love it when the editor
has lined them up and put them in the right place we
had that recently with the story where there was
this line that it you know and again it's hard for me on the shoot day because
sometimes you're doing interviews that are in different languages but there
was like a moment that i could tell felt really emotional you know right and
then when we saw it in the edit with the subtitles and the way that you'd cut
(21:30):
it with the music and you'd kind of just put it in that right sweet spot in the story.
And I remember everybody standing around and we had the intern in the office
at the time and everybody just sort of ran and just went, ah,
and you could just feel this vibe and you went, wow, that's,
to me, that's a compelling interview.
We've cut that just perfectly. Right.
Any advice that the three of you would give to talent to prepare for an interview?
(21:55):
Know what you're doing for.
Know what you're gonna say. Know what you're saying. Yeah.
That's a good question actually, what would you tell? I guess it depends on
the context, you know, it depends on the story, what the video you're trying to,
create, because, you know, even like going back to like as a director,
how they would approach it, sometimes it's good to have someone who's not prepared
(22:16):
because then you get more, in a way, more authentic answers.
But you don't stop them? Sort of like?
Potentially, well, you know, it's not the same.
We're not like The Sun. You know, the magical old lady.
We're not The Daily Mail, we're not trying to that's not what is this yeah how
should they prepare i guess like.
(22:38):
Yeah i guess it depends on the subject it was something that's like
quite like technical or maybe they're
talking about a service or like a policy or
something you know then you'd expect them to at least know
some of the details about it i think it's just preparing
to have preparing to have clarity right it
doesn't necessarily mean you prepared it that it's so polished that it sounds
(23:00):
polished but in the same way that i feel like if you rehearse anything that
you're gonna say you sort of start
to cut the extraneous fat out of the conversation and you get to the clear.
Because ultimately that's what we want from interview writers we want clarity we want
to be able to understand the story and everybody tells stories differently
but you want people to kind of
(23:23):
get to that good stuff you and part of that
is if you've thought about what you're going to say and that's
why we always furnish questions to people before the interview go
away have a think about it you know i don't expect you to
know all the answers um and even then i'm sneaky
because i often ask questions that are not on the list because i i do also find
(23:43):
and i i prepare talent for that by saying to them look what i'm going to interview
you i go where the conversation goes like i'll have my set list of questions
but if you say something that i suddenly go oh oh, wow, that's really good.
I'll probably ask a follow-up question. That will happen because that's where the conversation goes.
So you kind of need to, in a way, I think also as a talent, prepare yourself.
(24:05):
Like if this was a really important conversation you were going to have with
somebody, where might that conversation go? What might you talk about?
If it's for a particular thing for a brand, I think it's always trying to think
about what is the message that you're putting out there?
What is it that you want people to feel and understand at the end of that story?
How do you want them to respond to it is really important.
(24:26):
I guess it's like kind of priming your subject in a way, but whether that's
overly or subtly, that's a tactic in itself.
That's a strategy to kind of prime them, get them thinking about it,
maybe thinking more deeply about it than they normally would.
So yeah, that's another directing tactic you can look out for.
(24:49):
Any advice you would, the three of you would give to brands about doing a great
interview video? Come to casual.
Song plug? 100%.
Any other?
I think like understand what you're shooting, like even in the interview.
(25:14):
For example, Dior is a great brand.
Miss Dior who started the whole company and there's a huge image on there.
And even for like such a simple interview, like for example,
a recruitment video, for example.
Even if like, say it's an HR person or if it's like a talent they wanted to
replace the HR person in an interview, it needs to be captivating.
(25:35):
It needs to be storytelling.
It needs to be, you know, it needs to like have like emotional connection in there.
Even if it's for just a recruiting video, which is still a recruiting video, it's still important.
So I think giving emphasis to what you're basically shooting and what's the
interview is really, really important.
So it's just know what you want to, what your message is, basically.
(25:58):
Know what message you're trying to convey before you start, because you can
have someone talk about anything really, but concise, clear message is the most important thing.
Thing having a great client who knows kind of at
least roughly knows the story or the intention of the story and
(26:18):
you know choosing a good uh subject to tell
that story i think that's very important um so yeah
so i think that's that's the advice is knowing the
story more i think my final thought would be thinking about
what your audience is going to take away from the experience of
that interview how you want them to feel is really
(26:38):
important because that will dictate how you
set the interview up i think there is a
really common misconception out there um
that interview videos are the easiest videos to
do and while that may be technically correct that you can set up an interview
very easily and you can shoot b-roll there is such a vast difference between
(26:59):
a really good interview video and a video that is just dog awful thank you for
joining us on this edition of the Content Combo podcast.
As always, I'm your host, Thomas Elliott. And thanks again to our amazing combo,
Arch Gray, Joey Khan, and Richie Fowler for their contributions to our show.
Tune in every Friday for more of the Content Combo. And don't forget to follow
(27:22):
us on LinkedIn or via the Casual Films website.
Music.
Music.
(00:05):
Welcome to the Content Combo podcast, presented by Casual Films.
Tune in every Friday so you can hear from our team of experts about how to deliver
effective video content that drives results every time without fail.
(00:27):
And now it's over to our hosts.
Welcome to the first edition of the Content Combo Podcast.
I'm your host, Thomas Elliott, and joining me to make up the combo this week
are editors Arch Gray, Joey Kahn, and filmmaker Richie Fowler. Hi there.
Ooh, sexy. Whoa, Richie. Look at that, you have a great voice for podcasting.
(00:48):
In today's podcast, we are going to be talking about creating compelling interviews.
Dun, dun, dun. Dun, dun, dun.
So, let me start by asking the three of you, what makes a really compelling
on-screen interview for you? Can I start?
Do you? Yeah, go, please, jump in. I would really say the lighting.
(01:09):
Lighting? Really the lighting. The lighting, the ambience, and the way how the
interviewer is basically just enunciating every word.
It needs to be, yeah, if it all works very well, then you have a very captivating story.
You have a very captivating interview, even if it can be something super
boring for like a general audience just because of
like the setting that's already there it can just elevate that
(01:32):
to like a different level yeah no i mean i totally agree
i feel like definitely when you're talking about like eye catching
this in terms of like what draws you in sure
a visual image does really draw you in but content you
know is very important how you approach the subject what the
subject's saying are they saying in a way that tells the
story it's captivating it's compelling i think these
(01:54):
are all things that are important for a good interview
how does a director or filmmaker draw that out
of the subject you know so i feel like yeah you know
story content uh how it's being drawn out
of them the look the visual that's definitely a
really key factor because i think that's something that
immediately catches people's attention in our shortest attention
(02:15):
span you know one year that we live in yeah i
agree because an interview is mostly someone talking after
a while you don't really for me personally yeah
you wouldn't really care about like what he looks like or how much pixels are
on screen but the sound clarity of his voice how the person delivers what he's
(02:37):
saying he or she or they are saying is very important because.
For me if if i'm listening to a video and the sound is crap i just want to turn
it off i don't and I'll listen to it after five seconds.
Yeah, I mean, I agree with everything that's been said. I think for me,
it's what is it that they have to say, right?
(02:57):
How compelling is it? And, you know, compelling can vary depending on what the
interview is that you're doing.
Because a lot of the time when you're doing interview stories.
It may not be the most compelling story.
It might be, you know, this is an announcement video where we're talking about some kind of news.
But it's, again, how compelling is that news? how
compelling are you communicating that news exactly i'm taking
(03:20):
an interest in it and i think there
there are a lot of factors for me what makes that interview compelling one
is how relaxed human and comfortable the
talent is you know how good are they at articulating that
story yeah the delivery and there's a
big difference between people who rehearse their stories before
an interview and people who just turn up and wing it and
(03:41):
there are some people who are pretty good turning
up and winging it but i don't think anybody is great at turning
up and winging it i feel like and you can always tell i can
always tell when it turned up if if the you know the ceo or
the customer or whoever it is if you you
can tell when they've rehearsed it and it's such a big joy as
a director when you turn up they've rehearsed it i think lighting also
(04:02):
really helps and for me the framing of the
interview is really important because the framing tells you everything
about that person so i think all of those things really impact what
makes a great compelling on-screen interview for me and also
then how you support that with editing and music you know which
bits you choose to leave in which bits you take out and i sometimes feel like
(04:23):
compelling interviews are not always perfect interviews sometimes there are
things in there where somebody makes a mistake and i quite like that because
it makes it feel human like the david beckham popping his head in the victoria.
Come on, Victoria. Come on, Victoria. You grew up rich and tuned or something.
(04:44):
What car? What car? What car did your parents drive you to school in?
So I think, you know, again, we're acknowledging the makeup of this room too
for audiences who are not familiar.
So while you and I primarily work as editors and Richie works as a filmmaker
and director and I'm a director and a creative, we all have experience from
(05:04):
a directing point of view and we all have experience from a filmmaking point of view.
So I'm going to ask, what do you think it takes from the directing point of
view to get a really good compelling on-screen interview.
Can I start? One thing I
found is when I've
seen people do interviews on set and I've seen different directors directing
people is the speed of which certain directors can get people to be comfortable
(05:27):
with them makes a big difference in how the talent reacts and and how good their
delivery is at that moment in time.
Because I think that people feed off each other's energy in the room, right?
So he's able, the person's able, the director's able to make the person feel
comfortable immediately and makes a sense of ease.
(05:50):
And then it turns into not an interview, but it just like two friends talking about a subject. Yeah.
I mean, I often think of it like acting a scene, right? Yeah.
That in a scene, an actor on camera
is only as good as the camera is the actor who's off camera right
right and so the director's job
in a way is to feed the performance of the interviewee right so when you're
(06:13):
interviewing somebody you know and i mean there's some very hilarious footage
of me at various points with people nodding very enthusiastically or doing whatever
it is but that energy totally feeds,
the other person you see your camera right because they get their like oh i'm
doing good i'm doing Yeah, they get the self-confidence boost.
Everybody who comes in to do an interview feels vulnerable. And I don't care
(06:37):
who they are. Like, I don't care if you're like a plumber or a prime minister.
Like, everybody feels really vulnerable when they come in for an interview because
it's not a normal situation.
There are cameras. There's like, you know, a boom guy who might have bad B.O.
Standing there. Capturing your soul.
There's somebody asking you questions. Sometimes they're not satisfied with
(06:59):
those questions and you have to go again.
Comfort is so important. To add on to that, you know, having,
getting the subject comfortable, getting them at ease so that they don't feel
like they have to put on like a PR, like a public kind of facade or show,
or giving you answers that they feel like they need to give you.
You know, cause I feel like, especially you Thomas, or you know,
(07:22):
myself as well, but we've definitely been in situations where there's been people
want, you know, they feel like
they need to tell you something that is not true or authentic to them.
And so actually, it comes across very much like that. And so I think I've seen
Thomas doing this where there's been situations where he's spent his time trying to ease the person.
(07:47):
But yeah, getting them comfortable, getting them at ease, making them feel like
they're authentic and themselves.
I think that's very important. There's that word again, authentic,
which we love so much. We do love it.
It's not easy for me like for me like I don't like being in front of the camera
because my whole life I was spending behind the camera so for me I'm used to
(08:09):
that and also like I just don't like myself on the camera but there are times
where like yeah sometimes when I was put in front of the camera and I didn't
know how to react and the director basically just,
comforted me told me he was actually relating to me and he became more like
a friend and eventually that's what basically put me in front of a camera and I was like, okay, great.
I'm more comfortable now despite a boom operator right next to me.
(08:32):
The lighting just blinding me sometimes and the camera is over there and I can
see the red light glow and I'm like, okay.
That is, I mean, I'm obviously scared a bit over there but at the same time,
you know what, I'm actually quite comfortable as well because I already had a chat
with a friend who's a director and basically the director confident
me so that was like the that's actually quite important
(08:55):
i always feel like the pressure is even worse when somebody who's sitting
there who's an employee for a company and they're like the communist
people or something at the back of the room or their boss and
they're kind of sitting there behind every time they see it yeah i
can see
what i'm seeing opposite i can see them going you're looking at them and
you're thinking what are they thinking about what i'm saying and it is
(09:17):
like in a way it's that thing of like almost always being a
bit of a hypnotist and going no no don't look at them don't look
at them look into my eyes come back to me come back to me we're talking okay
right i mean if you look at the try the way i think
particularly which you know i try and set up interview situations i try
and put the cameras as far away as possible i try
and keep the crew as far away as possible i try and keep my chair
(09:38):
particularly if it's an off-camera interview and they're looking at me as the interviewer i
try and keep myself as close to them as possible shooting on longer lenses so
that we can facilitate that so then it just feels more like they're back there
don't worry about them it's us talking and you know what it's okay to file we
find walk away through this I always feel that that gets a much better result than anything else.
(10:04):
The tactics would you do because I feel like there's been situations where if
If you can't draw that authenticness, you have to manufacture it, which is worse.
Well, not just manufacture, but you have to be kind of strategic and part of
that's kicking half the crew out.
Or it's like, as Anish mentioned, if the light's too bright,
(10:27):
that's like managing the lights or that's like part of the lighting plan,
making sure it's not too bright in their face.
Because that's pretty- Yeah, it's horrible. Nobody likes it. No, exactly.
Yeah. I mean, I think there are a lot of different strategies.
I mean, we have had situations where I've even had to ask the client to leave.
I've had to. And, you know, you might put them out in the hallway and put a
monitor out there and some headphones and say, look, you know,
(10:48):
you can still give feedback to me.
You can still yell through the door, but you are making the talent uncomfortable.
They just don't feel comfortable talking in front of you. You're creating pressure.
And so I think within reason, you know, it's removing anything that's going
to create pressure from the scenario,
whether it is the light, whether it is, you know,
I mean I often try and prefer I don't let a
(11:10):
boom guy stand there I fix microphones and
tell the boom guy to go away you know I'm also very specific
about the way the crew interacts with the
interview subject even right down to now there are only certain sound recorders
I work with because I don't like sound recorders who yell at the talent that's
one of the things that really annoys me you know when you're trying to kind
of have this very controlled environment with somebody and make them feel comfortable
(11:34):
and they're talking and then suddenly you know this other voice just
barks at them, something like, ah, sound was terrible, go again.
You know, like, no, can't have that.
Yeah, but that's what happens. That's what it sounds like too.
Like, I'm sure they don't actually sound like that, but to me,
that's what it sounds like.
Sometimes they would actually just tell to the client, like,
oh, like you're speaking way too loud.
(11:54):
They're supposed to be a director, you know? Yeah, and I'm always like,
you know, I direct my sound guys, I'm like, come on.
If you've got feedback, whisper in my ear, I'll take care of it,
don't talk to the talent.
In the same way that I also I do that
to the clients too you know we're possible I'm like whatever comments
you have see here feel free to use my ear as a
vehicle to talk to the talent but please don't talk to them
(12:15):
directly because I find again as soon as there's somebody
else that they're talking to they lose focus they think about other things they
get confused and you know I know that's very hard for a lot of people to sort
of understand but that's what happens because you're in any you're in a situation
where you feel under pressure even if you don't so trying to remove that pressure
as much as possible so important.
(12:36):
I mean that's quite interesting because like i mean
we can probably do a whole podcast on the same like the role of the director and
setting tone and setting because like the
more i understand about directing
the more i kind of realize it's true part of it is uh setting
the tone that's not just with the subject but that's also with
the crew that's also with the client it's about
(12:57):
um you know showing them that you're serious and
professional but also able to be uh able
to break down people's walls so they feel comfortable um so
it's a very fine fine balance that i feel like that you've heard totally
you have to adapt your tone too depending on who you're
interviewing because you know a ceo who's
very time poor he's very different to a customer
(13:20):
who has a really emotional story you know
a ceo often it really is about that sort of
professionalism of coming in and being able to just kind of make them
feel like a rock star and get them out
the door as fast as possible you know i feel like
ceos really love it when they come in and they sit down and
they feel like wow you've totally got this nailed for me you're making
me look good you give me the right feedback you're not hiding anything
(13:43):
from me you're telling me directly what you want and what
you don't want great i'm done i'm out the door whereas you know if you're going
into somebody's house you know we've done this we've done stories with yeah
incredibly difficult stories where people will have to tell you really personal
things that's a totally different approach and that often takes more time it's
softer there's a lot more pre-interview there's a lot more sort of.
(14:05):
You know often in that situation um you know because i have two ways of doing
interview and overlay shoots one is you know if it's somebody like a ceo or
something i might want to do the interview first and then shoot with the b-roll
afterwards but if it's like a really emotional
story I might want to shoot the b-roll first so
that that person gets used to me and you
(14:26):
know I kind of like particularly that trip you and I took to Malaysia where
we had to go and tell a really personal story I think that b-roll day where
we went you know to church with our subject and spent time with them really
helped because then when we came to do the interview he felt so comfortable
talking to us and that's you know I think that's a really you could pick the way you work.
Yeah, we were allies, that's our popular buzzword.
(14:49):
In the pre-interview, they were visibly uncomfortable with answering some of
the questions and they were like trying to specify like oh you can't say this
or you have to like remember that,
to be sensitive about this certain topic and blah blah blah like kind of like
this and then And so I was thinking like, Ooh, this is going to be interesting.
(15:11):
And when they actually land on set, you know, when they meet them in person.
But yeah, he guys did a good job on that.
That's a very important story. Yeah.
Once an interview goes from the set to the edit suite.
What is the process you guys go through? Do you watch the interview in its entirety?
(15:35):
Or do you transcribe it and highlight bits?
How do you keep what was good from the whole interview but compress it down
to truly compelling viewing?
You want to go first? Okay, yeah. So what I like to do personally is,
before even looking at anything,
if possible, I would talk to
(15:57):
the director or whoever was on set because
they're there and I need to like download thoughts
from that person's brain um to
be like it's quite a painful process yeah be like okay
what do you remember about the good parts of this interview what do you remember
about the bad parts of this interview what's the story that you think is there
(16:19):
and then I try to mark that down and then I look through the interview and I
try to find those points that they were talking about.
If you just try to go straight from just looking at the interview without asking
anyone, you can still make a story, but you probably spend like twice or three
times amount of time getting what you need.
(16:43):
Yeah, I mean, yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, for example, if the director is
not there, for example, like it's not on the shoot or he's busy in meetings
or something, then I would just like read the scripts that was already prepared
for basically is to get a rough idea.
And then I would watch the entire thing after, of course, making sure the audios
are all synced up, both the cameras, three cameras, how many cameras there are,
(17:06):
are all synced up, then I'll start watching the interview.
And while I'm watching it, I also make like my own little notes,
as in mockers. You just know, okay, they were talking about this subject,
they were talking about this subject, okay.
This thing was better for this particular subject. So just making those points as well.
And yeah, then like seeing like, yeah, what is actually there in total,
like what's the story in total and then for this time document director do you also and this is.
(17:31):
Maybe revealing a trade secret spoiler alert
um do you also i think you
know there's also understanding that there is you know
people often say there's the film that you make in pre-production there's what
you shoot and that's what you edit i also think like one
of the misconceptions a lot of people have about documentary storytelling is
that you just capture reality and cut it together and put it out but
(17:54):
in a way you are still manipulating a
story for an audience right you are you are using
bits and pieces of a story to highlight emotion
or highlight other bits and pieces do you
even like look through and go oh look there's a great reaction that maybe i
would use for something or there's a great hand gesture that i could use to
(18:16):
emphasize a point even if it didn't relate to that specific point that they
were talking about but you sit there and go oh you know it just needs a little bit of juice there.
Is that something that you you think about when you're cutting
a story together without again you know giving away
all the secrets I don't know someone says something and then they start
(18:36):
like tearing up or something and you're like oh great and you just like mark
that down you don't know if it's gonna be used or how
it's gonna be used but you know that's an emotional moment
in the interview so you want to remember that
but usually the visual sequences that
like are emotional or work nicely are probably found
in the b-rolls more and the actual like talking parts
(18:59):
yeah yeah or is
it even sometimes you know you're finding like a bit that
links something together or whatever else or that can amplify the emotion
that they may because you know sometimes and this is the other reality of editing you
may have two moments that happened in real-time 20
minutes apart that by the time you
(19:21):
cut them are split seconds
apart oh yeah this is the train trade secret part right yes and again it's like
as long as it's within the authenticity and the intent yeah I was saying the
intent of the story but that is documentary filmmaking right like you You are, in a way,
(19:42):
taking what was there and...
Just using it up. Yeah. Adding that juice. Adding the juice.
Letting the juice loose. Yeah.
Right off the cutting a nice steak. Right off the cutting the steak.
You're curating the experience of the audience to what is required of the story.
(20:03):
So maybe at the 10 minute mark, he says steak, but it doesn't say it very well.
And then he says steak again that's a 20 minute mark yeah but he says it like,
steak you know and you're like oh this is so much and you're like okay fine
it was a very compelling steak yeah.
(20:24):
Also like sometimes when you're when you're watching uh like just a raw interview
um you already start making like a mental images of basically the sequences
and everything that you want to basically start doing for this story, right?
So you tend to just get used to it and just start.
For me, sometimes if I'm already one of the stories, it's not even a language which I can speak.
(20:47):
So for me, I was relying on subtitles and something about the story caught me.
So before even I finished watching the entire interview, I just started editing
whatever I wanted to do from before.
And yeah, in the end, we just made the story and then yeah, it was good.
So sometimes that can also happen.
Yeah i mean i always like it there are those moments that i
(21:08):
can feel in the interview too that i love it when the editor
has lined them up and put them in the right place we
had that recently with the story where there was
this line that it you know and again it's hard for me on the shoot day because
sometimes you're doing interviews that are in different languages but there
was like a moment that i could tell felt really emotional you know right and
then when we saw it in the edit with the subtitles and the way that you'd cut
(21:30):
it with the music and you'd kind of just put it in that right sweet spot in the story.
And I remember everybody standing around and we had the intern in the office
at the time and everybody just sort of ran and just went, ah,
and you could just feel this vibe and you went, wow, that's,
to me, that's a compelling interview.
We've cut that just perfectly. Right.
Any advice that the three of you would give to talent to prepare for an interview?
(21:55):
Know what you're doing for.
Know what you're gonna say. Know what you're saying. Yeah.
That's a good question actually, what would you tell? I guess it depends on
the context, you know, it depends on the story, what the video you're trying to,
create, because, you know, even like going back to like as a director,
how they would approach it, sometimes it's good to have someone who's not prepared
(22:16):
because then you get more, in a way, more authentic answers.
But you don't stop them? Sort of like?
Potentially, well, you know, it's not the same.
We're not like The Sun. You know, the magical old lady.
We're not The Daily Mail, we're not trying to that's not what is this yeah how
should they prepare i guess like.
(22:38):
Yeah i guess it depends on the subject it was something that's like
quite like technical or maybe they're
talking about a service or like a policy or
something you know then you'd expect them to at least know
some of the details about it i think it's just preparing
to have preparing to have clarity right it
doesn't necessarily mean you prepared it that it's so polished that it sounds
(23:00):
polished but in the same way that i feel like if you rehearse anything that
you're gonna say you sort of start
to cut the extraneous fat out of the conversation and you get to the clear.
Because ultimately that's what we want from interview writers we want clarity we want
to be able to understand the story and everybody tells stories differently
but you want people to kind of
(23:23):
get to that good stuff you and part of that
is if you've thought about what you're going to say and that's
why we always furnish questions to people before the interview go
away have a think about it you know i don't expect you to
know all the answers um and even then i'm sneaky
because i often ask questions that are not on the list because i i do also find
(23:43):
and i i prepare talent for that by saying to them look what i'm going to interview
you i go where the conversation goes like i'll have my set list of questions
but if you say something that i suddenly go oh oh, wow, that's really good.
I'll probably ask a follow-up question. That will happen because that's where the conversation goes.
So you kind of need to, in a way, I think also as a talent, prepare yourself.
(24:05):
Like if this was a really important conversation you were going to have with
somebody, where might that conversation go? What might you talk about?
If it's for a particular thing for a brand, I think it's always trying to think
about what is the message that you're putting out there?
What is it that you want people to feel and understand at the end of that story?
How do you want them to respond to it is really important.
(24:26):
I guess it's like kind of priming your subject in a way, but whether that's
overly or subtly, that's a tactic in itself.
That's a strategy to kind of prime them, get them thinking about it,
maybe thinking more deeply about it than they normally would.
So yeah, that's another directing tactic you can look out for.
(24:49):
Any advice you would, the three of you would give to brands about doing a great
interview video? Come to casual.
Song plug? 100%.
Any other?
I think like understand what you're shooting, like even in the interview.
(25:14):
For example, Dior is a great brand.
Miss Dior who started the whole company and there's a huge image on there.
And even for like such a simple interview, like for example,
a recruitment video, for example.
Even if like, say it's an HR person or if it's like a talent they wanted to
replace the HR person in an interview, it needs to be captivating.
(25:35):
It needs to be storytelling.
It needs to be, you know, it needs to like have like emotional connection in there.
Even if it's for just a recruiting video, which is still a recruiting video, it's still important.
So I think giving emphasis to what you're basically shooting and what's the
interview is really, really important.
So it's just know what you want to, what your message is, basically.
(25:58):
Know what message you're trying to convey before you start, because you can
have someone talk about anything really, but concise, clear message is the most important thing.
Thing having a great client who knows kind of at
least roughly knows the story or the intention of the story and
(26:18):
you know choosing a good uh subject to tell
that story i think that's very important um so yeah
so i think that's that's the advice is knowing the
story more i think my final thought would be thinking about
what your audience is going to take away from the experience of
that interview how you want them to feel is really
(26:38):
important because that will dictate how you
set the interview up i think there is a
really common misconception out there um
that interview videos are the easiest videos to
do and while that may be technically correct that you can set up an interview
very easily and you can shoot b-roll there is such a vast difference between
(26:59):
a really good interview video and a video that is just dog awful thank you for
joining us on this edition of the Content Combo podcast.
As always, I'm your host, Thomas Elliott. And thanks again to our amazing combo,
Arch Gray, Joey Khan, and Richie Fowler for their contributions to our show.
Tune in every Friday for more of the Content Combo. And don't forget to follow
(27:22):
us on LinkedIn or via the Casual Films website.
Music.
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