October 8, 2024 • 33 mins
Welcome back to The Copy Table! Season 2 is all about the processes your copywriting business needs to thrive. So, you've got leads, and they're interested in working with you. How do you seal the deal? Enter the magic of the proposal!
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Listen in to Erin, Nicole, and Grace's latest conversation, and you'll learn:
- The essential components of a winning proposal (as in - what you need to share so that a "yes" is as easy as possible).
- Why you don't need to have a fancy proposal - you just need it to be compelling and clear.
- How to turn a winning proposal into a replicable process (and some of the tools we use & our best tips).
- What you need to do after you send a proposal to up your odds of success.
Most importantly? You'll learn that the process behind a winning proposal isn't as difficult as you might think.
Don't forget our free gift to you - listen to our recording of the Not-A-Funnel Sales Funnel here: https://www.thecopytable.com/notafunnel ^it's available until October 24, 2024
The takeaway? There really is no one right way to build a copywriting business you love, but it's on you to use your powers of persuasion responsibly!
Whether you need actionable tips to market your copywriting business, a push to raise your rates, or the courage to plant your flag in a new niche, we've got you covered. Over the years, we've met some extraordinary people who've helped us, and we're ready to help you avoid the pitfalls that so many copywriters find.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the copy table, the podcast for copywriters who want to get new ideas and inspiration for building and scaling a business you love.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
In this podcast, hosts Grace Fortune, Nicole Morton, and Erin Pennings bring new topics and guests to the table every single episode.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
We're spilling the beans on how you can use your interests and expertise to define what success means to you and take steps to achieve it. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to season two of the copy table. I am Grace Fortune, and I'm with my co hosts, Erin Pennings and Nicole Morton. Season two of the copy table is going to be all about processes, as you may already know, but this episode in particular is about a process that is near and dear to all of us, and it helps people get, and actually helps people land their dream clients and make them an easy yes. And this episode is all about proposals and understanding what your prospects want. So Erin and Nicole both have words on this topic. So I want to dig right in. Erin, rapid fire. Why are you so excited about proposals?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
The TLDR is that too many people leave a lot on the table when it comes to proposals. And there are some very simple things you can do with your proposal to really wow your audience. And I want to get into it. But before I do, I want to know, like, what is Nicole so excited about? Because then we can come back and talk all about the things that we wish people did, but they don't.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
That's right. For me, proposals set the tone for the entire engagement of your relationship. And so this is where you're getting off on your best foot. This is where you are establishing your rapport, managing expectations, reducing all of the ambiguity in your engagement together.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yes, yes, yes, yes. And, like, nodding along, going, huh. Yes. Oh, my gosh. So much to this. Grace, what do you want to say about proposals? Because I know you love these, too, and I know this is something that's really important to you.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Yes, definitely. Yes. I also love proposals because Nicole and Erin, like you kind of already said, it gets you started off on the right foot with your client. And I, I'm a sucker for really great design. So if you make your proposal match your brand and make it look really nice and polished, it makes you look so professional. And I love that you can very easily standardize and templatize your proposals. So a lot of people think that they are difficult to make. You have to start from the ground up every single time, make a brand new thinking proposal for every single prospect you're trying to land. And it's not like that at all. You can very easily make a one and done proposal and make it a simple process for you. It doesn't have to be as complicated as people think it is.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
It doesn't have to, but I'm not. You know, I've never figured out I have a streamlined template, but my will still always take me an hour to 2 hours to write. Unless it's. Unless it's going for something that I've done a million times and then it's a little bit more templated.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Sure. I mean, and that's fair. I mean, there's going to be times when you have to customize and make specific things for your proposals. But there, in general, though, there are a lot of pieces of your proposals that you can templatize. Like, for example, I personally add my terms and conditions in my proposals. Those are the same no matter what. The way that my proposals look like, the fonts, the images that I use, the testimonials that I use, by and large, those are almost always the same thing. So standardizing what you can and customizing only what you need to, I think, is a totally valid approach to processing this approach or this piece of your workflow, for sure.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
So I think let's go back to the beginning and talk about what purpose the proposal serves and what absolutely needs to be in there. So I touched on how this is kicking off the engagement with your prospective client. Now, we haven't closed at this point, so we're still trying to put our best foot forward, trying to demonstrate how we're the best and only solution to your prospective clients problems. And I think there's so much opportunity to do relationship building even during the proposal process. And I think the misconception is that proposals are just, hey, this is what the price is. Are you in or out? Can we talk about that a little bit?
Speaker 2 (04:52):
If you're just saying what the price is, that's an invoice. That's not a proposal. To me. You know, your proposal does a couple of things. It has to catch their attention. It has to show them that you've heard them and that you understand their problems and their goals, and it has to tell them how you're going to solve them. And some people do that in a single page engagement letter. My accounting clients are very successful doing that in one to two pages. My proposals are long, but they're designed and laid out in a way that it's very clear. Okay, here's what we talked about. Here are your goals. Here's how I'm going to help you do that.
(05:31):
And I break down the process right there in the proposal to the point that even if it's something that I've never done before, I spend time to figure out how it's going to get broken up in the process of the project so that when they say go, we can just move forward and there's not a whole lot of barricading over. Well, how am I going to do this? What's this? Let me figure this out. Because otherwise you sell something and then you. How do you know if you bid the right amount of money? How do you know if you have grossly underestimated the amount of time you're going to have to eat your shorts to get it done or come begging for more money? How do you know if it's going to work for you? So that's a critical part.
(06:08):
And then I share my framework, my process, and then I tell them how much it's going to cost, and it's not because I'm trying to build it up to be this huge, expensive thing. It's just like I want them to be like, yes, I like this, before we even talk about money, because ideally, just like any sales page, right, you're building up the value of what you're doing. And then they look at the amount and it's like a no brainer for the investment. And then, you know, I've used software before that sends a contract after the proposal, and I've done some now with my current software that just the corporate, the TNC, the contractual agreement into the proposal, and whatever works for you and your brain, I think, is what matters. But there's a lot of ways to do it. That's the grossness.
(06:54):
The grossness. That's the gross amount. Minimum amount of information that I think should be in there. It doesn't have to be six pages. If you can, again, figure out how to do it in two. Fantastic. But I like to give them some visuals I like to share to paint a picture of what that's going to look like. So it's very clear what they're getting. Nicole, what's your minimum viable proposal?
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Excellent. I think you touched on it. Is that the secret of a great proposal is that it's about your client, it's not about you. It's affirming that you have heard their problem, you understand their problem. You have the expertise to solve their problem, how you're going to solve their problem and then what's going to look like on the other side. And, in fact, the best proposals tell that as a story. And so I think if you can shape the conversation as a tiny hero's journey, that's the way some of the most effective proposals work. You start with reiterating who you are, what you do, and why that matters. What I heard. Here's how I've solved this problem in the past. Here's how I'm going to solve this problem for you.
(08:01):
This is what that process looks like, how long it takes, what you can expect coming out of it, and then at the end, what the investment is.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
And I take a different approach. It's interesting. I show them what their main goal is. I actually have a headline that shares what their main goal is, and then I show them what they want, how they can get it, and then I tell them why me and what my experience is and the testimonials that are incorporated in. And then I get deeper into the process and how it all breaks down and then the sales. It's interesting. It's just two different approaches to story. And that's fascinating. I'd never thought about proposals of story.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
Yeah, me either, actually.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
But you're spot on. Spot on, Nicole, that's brilliant.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Yeah, I love that. So my process starts with a discovery call. So I talk to them for, you know, 15 to 30 minutes, get to know them, what are their goals, what are their struggles, et cetera. Identify how I can help them. And then I kind of outline that in the first page of the proposal so that they know that I heard them, I understood how, and how I plan to help them. Then I get into, like, the actual breakdown of how I'm going to help them. So, like, basically, I look at it as like a deliverables format. I say, here's what you're going to get. Here's a, here's an itemized breakdown of what each piece costs, and here's the total investment when I can start. And then on the next page, it's. What exactly are the next steps?
(09:30):
So I think that a lot of people miss that particular steps. Letting people know what they need to do next.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Yes. Oh, that's such a good point. Like a sales page, like a call to action. Here's what happens when you do this.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
And then after that. And then after that. And that's the foundation of such good project management, too. Here's what, where we are, here's what's next. So that they always know what. What that next piece is. Here's what. Here's what's next for you. Here's what's next for me.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
I love that. And that's in there. Like, I just hadn't thought about that as a specific component to guide them.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
Yeah. And I also add testimonials into my roses as well, ones that are relevant for what my clients need. So I offer different launch services. So if I have a testimonial about a specific piece of a launch that I'm going to be helping this new perspective client with, then I'll add a testimonial about that specifically so that it's relevant. I don't want something generic if I have something that speaks to the result I've gotten about the piece that they need, because then it just. It helps build trust.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
So what do you think? I want to flip this back on some of the proposals that you've received from people or that you've seen. What is the number one mistake that you've seen get made?
Speaker 1 (10:51):
I think the easiest mistake to correct, let me answer it that way. The easiest mistake to correct is making sure it's client facing language, not, I can do this for you, I have done this. Instead, you can expect this. This is what you can expect to come out. This is the solution to your problem. I heard this. I heard you tell me this. You said in our conversation, x client facing language, I think is the easiest thing to fix. And upfront.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
In our conversation, these are the primary goals. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
I heard you say grace.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
What about you?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
I'm gonna say probably the biggest mistake that I've seen people make is not personalizing it enough. So a lot of times people use like automated proposal services and whatnot, that just send like a very general proposal, and it just, it doesn't really give the warm fuzzies for clients who are reading that when you can clearly see that there wasn't a whole lot of thought or energy put into it. There's nothing wrong with using automation. Like, I love automation, don't get me wrong. But in that particular stage of the game, I think that showing that you're going to be giving your clients personalized attention and putting thought into your communications with them, I think it will only serve you better to display that instead of just giving something generic and plain that doesn't have any personalization in it.
(12:16):
Also, there's been times when I've gotten proposals that have just been really plain and just boring. I've even seen ones that have typing mistakes that were clearly not proof that didn't match what the conversation that we have that they show that they didn't understand what the actual problem was. Like. It's just there's a lot of little mistakes that people can make and I. That can really impact your close rate or your guest rate.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
There's two that I've seen, and I don't know if this is their most common. I know we touched on when it's not a proposal, when it's an estimate of what it's going to cost. But I've also had the opposite happen where I remember specifically asking, what are your rates for these things? I wasn't expecting a formal proposal by any means, but it was a. I don't know, there were like ten paragraphs to tell me that I could set the rates. And I was like, first of all, I want to pay you what you were. Well, you know, what feels good to you? It was a very long piece and it lost me. Like, it's like it needs to be to that. To that. And I guess where I'm going here is that needs to be succinct.
(13:24):
It needs to be clear to the point, as long as it needs to be. But don't add a lot of extra fluff in there if you don't need it in there. If someone has asked you a question, make sure you. Yes. Tell them why it's important and how you can position it, but make sure to answer the question and get to it as succinctly as possible. So that's one. And I'm like, don't make it too long. And then I'm like, but don't forget to make it long enough. On the other hand, I realize that it's conflicting advice, but where possible, include the process, not just the process of the proposal. You know, after you sign this, you'll get an invoice and then we'll set up our kickoff call or whatever your process is. But also like, okay. Phase one is research and discovery.
(14:11):
We're going to figure out all of the details, make sure we're on the same page. Phase two is planning and strategy. Phase three is actually doing the thing so that they can understand, you know, oh, this. This phase is about two to three weeks. Good to know. And that way they have a pretty clear understanding of what to expect so that you're basically starting the onboarding process before you ever started the sale because I think much easier.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Absolutely. Yeah. And I would say our next episode is going to focus onboarding as a whole. But the proposal process is a very important part of the onboarding process.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
This part of onboarding was so important that we thought it deserved its own episode. Another thing that I've seen is people not like branding or making their proposals look like it comes from their business. So, for example, if you send a proposal through a plain word doc, it doesn't have your business logo or anything on it. It's not branded or nice looking. Like I said, I'm a sucker for design. If something is very plain to me, it doesn't capture my attention. Attention. I need visuals. When I'm looking at a proposal, I want to see that whoever is making this proposal is putting some effort to win me over. Right. I don't want to see something super generic and plain.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
And I'm the opposite. I like a good visual, but that doesn't make or break it. If I'm hiring a designer, I want their proposal to maybe have some visuals. So if I'm hiring a writer, I have no business doing design. Right. Like, and I don't want that to be what wastes the time for people.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Sure.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
So, you know, I think that it's an interesting thing, and it may be worth talking on the sales call. Would you like a formal proposal? Would you like something that's just a little bit simpler and gets these ideas down? Because I know there's some people that I greatly admire that very rarely send out full, like, gorgeous proposals anymore. They're just like, here's what you get. I'll send over the official details later. Let me know if you're in. And it's like, it's really interesting to see that difference.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Sometimes an effective Google Doc can be as good or more powerful than a beautifully designed proposal that doesn't actually say anything.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
I love me a Google Doc sales page.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Sure. Just to clarify, like, I am all for making, like, a Google document or something, but I would at least like to see that it has your logo on it. Maybe a font that you use for your business. I just want to see that it looks like it's coming from your business. Not just a copy pasted times New Roman or, God forbid, comic sans thing.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
No.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Just can say, yeah. Like, I want to see something that looks like it at least had some effort put into it. And of course, the words matter a lot more than what it looks like. I'll give you that 100%. But I just want to see a little bit of effort, because that, to me, that shows that you're going to put an effort for my work?
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (17:20):
I think that's fair. That's all that I want.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
That's it, Grace. Just solve the Internet. Hooray.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Yay. Oh, my gosh. That's so funny. So we've kind of waxed poetic a little bit about the mistakes that people make in their proposals. What I would love to know is, how do you guys send out proposals? What systems do you use? Nicole, do you want to kick us off?
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Yeah. So my proposals are Google Docs that are then integrated into my accounting software. So I happen to use freshbooks, so I can send that out. That way it makes it easier to integrate when I get the yes. See, I'm pre manifesting the yes already. When I get the yes, it's easy to integrate the next steps, which should be, you know, contracts and payments, which we'll cover in another episode. But I keep it simple. I have great jealousy and inspo from people who use gorgeous proposal software. And one day I will be that grown up. Today is not that day. So for me, the MVP is a branded Google Doc that gets fired off from my accounting software. What about you, Grace?
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Okay, so my proposal process is I have a template set up in the Microsoft word. It's got all of my images, it's got all of my fonts and everything already loaded in there. I have like, almost like a, I call it a wording library. So I can just take, like, a copy and paste for whatever specific deliverable that I'm doing. I set mine up that way. And then what I do is I export the finalized document as a PDF, and then I send the proposal through sign request. So what happens after I hit send? On sign request, my prospective clients get an email that says, hey, your proposal from grace fortune is here. Take a look at it and sign it. And then they ideally sign it.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
They sign it. We're manifesting the yeses today.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
We are. What about you, Erin?
Speaker 2 (19:19):
So I started out doing the PDF that I'd send over through hellosign, or I don't even think hello. I think hellosign is now Dropbox sign. And then if they were like, yeah, yeah. Then we'd do the contract, and then I'd send the invoice. And I found the whole process really cumbersome. So I set up Dubsado, where it's all automated. So as soon as, like, then it, then I had the proposal template set in there, and I just would fill in the chunks that are personalized. So, like their goals, the section I mentioned there how we're going to do all the things for them and the cost. Then as soon as they said yes to the proposal or chose the option, if there was an option, it would then take them to the contract to sign and then to the invoice.
(19:59):
It was just from a single email sentence. And I really like that. That's still my favorite process because it keeps all the pieces separate and keeps it focused so that there's only one decision at a time. Yes, I'm going to sign this. Here's what I want to do. Okay, cool. Sign the contract, pay the invoice. These days I'm using high level because I moved my whole CRM over there, and it's a similar process, except I need to bring the contract into the proposal, which makes it a little less clean, but it still works well. And again, I like it because it automates it. I can click send and it will send. Your proposal from Erin Pennings is waiting. It will send, then the invoice.
(20:36):
I'm just a fan of everything that simplifies because the more steps that I have to take to repeat going back to processes. Right. It all sends out as one piece. And so that's really an important piece for me to know.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
I mean, that sounds like that makes a lot of sense. When you send out your proposals, do they? I think, Erin, you already mentioned this, but do yours include terms and conditions?
Speaker 2 (20:59):
They do now. They did not before, but they do now. And then when we do our contracting and payments section, I'll tell you all about my favorite clauses in our next episode here. So I have some definite clauses that I appreciate and adore.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
Same. What about you, Nicole? Do you include your terms and conditions in your proposals?
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I do, only because it's just one less thing I have to worry about later. I certainly don't need to review them. I do reference that they're there and then to let me know if there are questions. But they're included in the proposal. They're also attached in the contract. So I double dip a little bit, but that's just for my peace of mind.
Speaker 3 (21:38):
Yeah, that's perfect. So my proposals are kind of a hybrid. It's a proposal, a contract, and my terms and conditions all rolled into one. I like to streamline the process as much as I can. So it's like, yes, you want to work with me or no, you don't kind of thing. I don't want people to have to make more than one decision to say yes to the proposal and then have to say yes to the contract afterwards. You know what I mean? Like, I like to do it all as much as I can to keep it clean, and once they agree to it, then I send invoicing. So it's interesting to hear about everybody's different approaches because they're all very unique and they're all totally valid. Like, there's more than one way to do this.
(22:16):
My one way isn't necessarily the right way, and neither is everybody else's. Right. You can streamline something that works for you.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Yeah. Making use of the systems that you have access to. Not everybody wants to have another expense for proposal software. Like, I think, oh, there is one. Oh, my gosh. I think it's better proposals or something. It's beautiful. Like, it works so nicely. Everything looks so good, but it's very expensive. I think it was a couple hundred dollars a year. So I'm like, yeah, I'd rather just save the money and do it my way. And I don't need to spend anything.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
So I want to take that and flip it, though, because I was like, at first, when I first started paying for proposal software, I was like, oh, it's another expense. And then I realized how much time it saved me. And I thought about that, how much time and how many busy work steps that it was reducing for me. In which case then it was like, oh, this is saving me 2 hours for every proposal I send out. Even if I only send out one proposal a month, that's 24 hours a year that it's saving me. Based on what you charge and how busy you are and what you're willing to put up with.
(23:28):
If you are thinking you want it but you're biting the bullet or you're not sure if you want to bite the bullet or not yet because of the cost, I would encourage you to look at, like, what is it that you're charging? What is it that the cost is worth to you? For me, I got tired of having apps, six different apps for six different things. And so I found a software that now does everything for less than I was paying for. All of it.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
Just to offer a different perspective, where is it worth you spending your money?
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
I'm certainly always an advocate for free where possible, because everything's a subscription. But there are upsides to paying for things sometimes, too.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
Yeah. And that's where you have to use the, I call it the art of discernment. You have to take a look at, like, how much time are you spending on your proposals? How much time is your investment going to save you like for 24 hours a year? Yeah. A couple hundred dollars is absolutely worth it because your time is worth hopefully more than $100 an hour. Right. Like, we'll just say that going through kind of reverse engineering how much time it's going to save you, what it's going to cost you and where you are in your business and kind of working backwards from there and seeing is an investment like that really worth it for you?
(24:43):
I've got my proposals so templatized and my library so kind of like dialed in that it doesn't really take me much time to copy and paste and personalize what I need to. So I found something that works for.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Me, and I think that's what's important. I think that's the big takeaway. Figure out what your pain points are, what works for you, and what absolutely drives you up the wall and drives you baddie every little step that is involved. If I can simplify it and build so real quick like that is my favorite use of chat. GPT, by the way, is the streamlined processes. You can say, this is a problem, how do I fix it? And it will tell you how to build zaps, how to build complex automations in whatever platform you're using.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
So that's crazy.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
I knew. Take that for the tip of the day that it may or may not be.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Maybe we should do Erin. Life hacks with Erin. Yes. Maybe we should do an episode on that. How to use GPT to make processes. That could be fun.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
I could do it in about five minutes.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
We just had chat. Write the whole episode.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
There we go. No, no.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
As we navigate the turbulent waters of copywriting.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
All right, let's dial it in. Let's say we're sold on processes. Okay. The reasons are sold on processes. Rapid fire. What's the minimum viable proposal? Inclusion. So, you know, you've got, you know, five. Five must have, six must haves. Rapid fire. What are they?
Speaker 2 (26:16):
The problem, the solution. What's in it for you? You the client? Who the heck is this person or this company to be doing this? And social proof. So I put that in as one. The process, the cost, and I'm including in the cost. Like, how is it broken up? Is it a deposit? Is it painful? How does that work?
Speaker 3 (26:40):
My five for me. It's similar to yours, Erin, but mine is an introduction section with the problem, a recap of a conversation that we've had. What you get, which includes the investment, the exact deliverables that they're getting, and then number five is, what's the next? What do they have to do next?
Speaker 1 (26:58):
That's perfect. Yep. It opens with a cover letter ish. Thank you for the opportunity statement. This is what I understand the business problem to be. This is the implication of how it's affecting your business. Here's the solution. How does it work? Why does it matter? What can you expect? Sprinkle in some proof and then next steps.
Speaker 3 (27:20):
Awesome.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
And poof, you're done.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Poof, you're done. All right, well, any final words before we wrap this one up and head on into contracts and payments?
Speaker 3 (27:33):
I just want to encourage people listening to this to make a proposal template that's as easy to work with as possible. Something that, you know, that looks polished and professional, but something that you can replicate easy. And I think that this is where the value of having, like, productized, consistent offers really comes into play. Because the more you're offering the same things, the easier it's going to get to make these proposals. You'll have to personalize and customize them less and less. So I would say just start small and keep plugging away at it. You don't have to perfect it the first time you send your proposal out. Just work on making little improvements each time. How about you, Nicole?
Speaker 1 (28:12):
Yeah, I start small. Use online resources if you need to. There's certainly hundreds, if not thousands, if not bazillions of templates online from a reputable source, like maybe HubSpot or better proposals, or even the copywriter club. If you need something to scaffold off of, make that happen.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
Yeah, I agree. Actually, there is something that I wanted to mention from a process perspective that we didn't touch on yet. So after you send a proposal, I wanted to kind of talk about following up. So a lot of people are afraid to follow up after sending a proposal because they think that they're going to be annoying or too pushy. I would say creating a process for what you are going to do as far as follow up removes a lot of the emotion out of it. So if you know that you are going to follow up, like, let's say, a week after you send the proposal, or two weeks, getting that set in stone will help with that.
(29:10):
And also just making sure that you stay consistent and putting a due date on the proposal, like you can put on the proposal, how long the proposal is valid for? We'll say like two weeks to give them time to make a decision. Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (29:25):
Please put an expiry date on your proposal because the worst case scenario someone will come back six months after you have tons more experience and want to execute on your proposal that should have expired months and months ago because now your rates are oftener.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
Yep, 100%.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
All right, one more thing touch on before we wrap, and that is proposals. Present them in person or not present them in person.
Speaker 3 (29:54):
Do you mean like on a video call or like literally in person?
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Oh, yep. The idea of presenting a proposal in person and walking somebody through each little stage of it kind of makes me want to break out into hives. So I would say my personal preference would be to just email it to them and let them review it on their own time. If they have questions, they can either schedule another call with me and ask them or just write me back an email.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Okay, again, full disclosure. Past me would have agreed with you entirely, but now being on the agency side and having live proposals be the norm, I have seen how powerful it is to be able to present this work in person and also be able to gauge your reaction, your prospect's reaction in real time and be able to talk over questions. So don't discount the opportunity to do an in person proposal. And yeah. Are you reading off your slides a little bit? Sure.
(30:56):
But you're also initiating a conversation and you can also pin them down for to get a meeting on the books to go over the proposal and review any questions, maybe in a week to ten days so that you're not sitting and nail biting for weeks upon end wondering if they've actually want to do business with you or, you know, if they've moved on. So I was of the same mindset, Grace, but I have seen the light and I do highly recommend it. And you know what a nervous little chihuahua I am. And I do highly recommend it.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Interesting. I mean, to be totally candid, I've never considered doing a live proposal before. Maybe that's something I need to experiment with later on.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Look, see? We're experimenting in real time.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
Wow. Love that. Just to wrap up again, I just want to encourage you to just create a process for your proposals. Like decide how you're going to send them out, technology you're going to use, figure out based on your niche and your offerings, what is the minimum viable things that need to be in your proposal for you, and put them in there and try to standardize your proposals as much as possible so that you don't have to keep reinventing the wheel every single time you're sending one out. It's so much less stressful when you have the work mostly already done for you. Even if you can get to like 80% pre done, that's still way better than 0% pre done.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
Absolutely. So let us know how you are incorporating these action steps into your business. We'd love to hear your feedback either by email, hello@thecopytable.com, or catch us on social media, LinkedIn, Facebook or Instagram. And let us know how are proposals propelling your business forward? So we will talk to you about our next process. He's going to be. Oh, Grace, we're so close. But next is contracts and payments. I know. All right. So we'll catch you guys next time on the coffee table.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Thanks for listening.
Welcome to the copy table, the podcast for copywriters who want to get new ideas and inspiration for building and scaling a business you love.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
In this podcast, hosts Grace Fortune, Nicole Morton, and Erin Pennings bring new topics and guests to the table every single episode.
Speaker 3 (00:19):
We're spilling the beans on how you can use your interests and expertise to define what success means to you and take steps to achieve it. Hey, everyone. Welcome back to season two of the copy table. I am Grace Fortune, and I'm with my co hosts, Erin Pennings and Nicole Morton. Season two of the copy table is going to be all about processes, as you may already know, but this episode in particular is about a process that is near and dear to all of us, and it helps people get, and actually helps people land their dream clients and make them an easy yes. And this episode is all about proposals and understanding what your prospects want. So Erin and Nicole both have words on this topic. So I want to dig right in. Erin, rapid fire. Why are you so excited about proposals?
Speaker 2 (01:18):
The TLDR is that too many people leave a lot on the table when it comes to proposals. And there are some very simple things you can do with your proposal to really wow your audience. And I want to get into it. But before I do, I want to know, like, what is Nicole so excited about? Because then we can come back and talk all about the things that we wish people did, but they don't.
Speaker 1 (01:43):
That's right. For me, proposals set the tone for the entire engagement of your relationship. And so this is where you're getting off on your best foot. This is where you are establishing your rapport, managing expectations, reducing all of the ambiguity in your engagement together.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
Yes, yes, yes, yes. And, like, nodding along, going, huh. Yes. Oh, my gosh. So much to this. Grace, what do you want to say about proposals? Because I know you love these, too, and I know this is something that's really important to you.
Speaker 3 (02:15):
Yes, definitely. Yes. I also love proposals because Nicole and Erin, like you kind of already said, it gets you started off on the right foot with your client. And I, I'm a sucker for really great design. So if you make your proposal match your brand and make it look really nice and polished, it makes you look so professional. And I love that you can very easily standardize and templatize your proposals. So a lot of people think that they are difficult to make. You have to start from the ground up every single time, make a brand new thinking proposal for every single prospect you're trying to land. And it's not like that at all. You can very easily make a one and done proposal and make it a simple process for you. It doesn't have to be as complicated as people think it is.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
It doesn't have to, but I'm not. You know, I've never figured out I have a streamlined template, but my will still always take me an hour to 2 hours to write. Unless it's. Unless it's going for something that I've done a million times and then it's a little bit more templated.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
Sure. I mean, and that's fair. I mean, there's going to be times when you have to customize and make specific things for your proposals. But there, in general, though, there are a lot of pieces of your proposals that you can templatize. Like, for example, I personally add my terms and conditions in my proposals. Those are the same no matter what. The way that my proposals look like, the fonts, the images that I use, the testimonials that I use, by and large, those are almost always the same thing. So standardizing what you can and customizing only what you need to, I think, is a totally valid approach to processing this approach or this piece of your workflow, for sure.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
So I think let's go back to the beginning and talk about what purpose the proposal serves and what absolutely needs to be in there. So I touched on how this is kicking off the engagement with your prospective client. Now, we haven't closed at this point, so we're still trying to put our best foot forward, trying to demonstrate how we're the best and only solution to your prospective clients problems. And I think there's so much opportunity to do relationship building even during the proposal process. And I think the misconception is that proposals are just, hey, this is what the price is. Are you in or out? Can we talk about that a little bit?
Speaker 2 (04:52):
If you're just saying what the price is, that's an invoice. That's not a proposal. To me. You know, your proposal does a couple of things. It has to catch their attention. It has to show them that you've heard them and that you understand their problems and their goals, and it has to tell them how you're going to solve them. And some people do that in a single page engagement letter. My accounting clients are very successful doing that in one to two pages. My proposals are long, but they're designed and laid out in a way that it's very clear. Okay, here's what we talked about. Here are your goals. Here's how I'm going to help you do that.
(05:31):
And I break down the process right there in the proposal to the point that even if it's something that I've never done before, I spend time to figure out how it's going to get broken up in the process of the project so that when they say go, we can just move forward and there's not a whole lot of barricading over. Well, how am I going to do this? What's this? Let me figure this out. Because otherwise you sell something and then you. How do you know if you bid the right amount of money? How do you know if you have grossly underestimated the amount of time you're going to have to eat your shorts to get it done or come begging for more money? How do you know if it's going to work for you? So that's a critical part.
(06:08):
And then I share my framework, my process, and then I tell them how much it's going to cost, and it's not because I'm trying to build it up to be this huge, expensive thing. It's just like I want them to be like, yes, I like this, before we even talk about money, because ideally, just like any sales page, right, you're building up the value of what you're doing. And then they look at the amount and it's like a no brainer for the investment. And then, you know, I've used software before that sends a contract after the proposal, and I've done some now with my current software that just the corporate, the TNC, the contractual agreement into the proposal, and whatever works for you and your brain, I think, is what matters. But there's a lot of ways to do it. That's the grossness.
(06:54):
The grossness. That's the gross amount. Minimum amount of information that I think should be in there. It doesn't have to be six pages. If you can, again, figure out how to do it in two. Fantastic. But I like to give them some visuals I like to share to paint a picture of what that's going to look like. So it's very clear what they're getting. Nicole, what's your minimum viable proposal?
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Excellent. I think you touched on it. Is that the secret of a great proposal is that it's about your client, it's not about you. It's affirming that you have heard their problem, you understand their problem. You have the expertise to solve their problem, how you're going to solve their problem and then what's going to look like on the other side. And, in fact, the best proposals tell that as a story. And so I think if you can shape the conversation as a tiny hero's journey, that's the way some of the most effective proposals work. You start with reiterating who you are, what you do, and why that matters. What I heard. Here's how I've solved this problem in the past. Here's how I'm going to solve this problem for you.
(08:01):
This is what that process looks like, how long it takes, what you can expect coming out of it, and then at the end, what the investment is.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
And I take a different approach. It's interesting. I show them what their main goal is. I actually have a headline that shares what their main goal is, and then I show them what they want, how they can get it, and then I tell them why me and what my experience is and the testimonials that are incorporated in. And then I get deeper into the process and how it all breaks down and then the sales. It's interesting. It's just two different approaches to story. And that's fascinating. I'd never thought about proposals of story.
Speaker 3 (08:40):
Yeah, me either, actually.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
But you're spot on. Spot on, Nicole, that's brilliant.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Yeah, I love that. So my process starts with a discovery call. So I talk to them for, you know, 15 to 30 minutes, get to know them, what are their goals, what are their struggles, et cetera. Identify how I can help them. And then I kind of outline that in the first page of the proposal so that they know that I heard them, I understood how, and how I plan to help them. Then I get into, like, the actual breakdown of how I'm going to help them. So, like, basically, I look at it as like a deliverables format. I say, here's what you're going to get. Here's a, here's an itemized breakdown of what each piece costs, and here's the total investment when I can start. And then on the next page, it's. What exactly are the next steps?
(09:30):
So I think that a lot of people miss that particular steps. Letting people know what they need to do next.
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Yes. Oh, that's such a good point. Like a sales page, like a call to action. Here's what happens when you do this.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Yes.
Speaker 2 (09:46):
And then after that. And then after that. And that's the foundation of such good project management, too. Here's what, where we are, here's what's next. So that they always know what. What that next piece is. Here's what. Here's what's next for you. Here's what's next for me.
Speaker 3 (10:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
I love that. And that's in there. Like, I just hadn't thought about that as a specific component to guide them.
Speaker 3 (10:10):
Yeah. And I also add testimonials into my roses as well, ones that are relevant for what my clients need. So I offer different launch services. So if I have a testimonial about a specific piece of a launch that I'm going to be helping this new perspective client with, then I'll add a testimonial about that specifically so that it's relevant. I don't want something generic if I have something that speaks to the result I've gotten about the piece that they need, because then it just. It helps build trust.
Speaker 2 (10:39):
So what do you think? I want to flip this back on some of the proposals that you've received from people or that you've seen. What is the number one mistake that you've seen get made?
Speaker 1 (10:51):
I think the easiest mistake to correct, let me answer it that way. The easiest mistake to correct is making sure it's client facing language, not, I can do this for you, I have done this. Instead, you can expect this. This is what you can expect to come out. This is the solution to your problem. I heard this. I heard you tell me this. You said in our conversation, x client facing language, I think is the easiest thing to fix. And upfront.
Speaker 3 (11:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
In our conversation, these are the primary goals. Yeah.
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (11:23):
I heard you say grace.
Speaker 2 (11:25):
What about you?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
I'm gonna say probably the biggest mistake that I've seen people make is not personalizing it enough. So a lot of times people use like automated proposal services and whatnot, that just send like a very general proposal, and it just, it doesn't really give the warm fuzzies for clients who are reading that when you can clearly see that there wasn't a whole lot of thought or energy put into it. There's nothing wrong with using automation. Like, I love automation, don't get me wrong. But in that particular stage of the game, I think that showing that you're going to be giving your clients personalized attention and putting thought into your communications with them, I think it will only serve you better to display that instead of just giving something generic and plain that doesn't have any personalization in it.
(12:16):
Also, there's been times when I've gotten proposals that have just been really plain and just boring. I've even seen ones that have typing mistakes that were clearly not proof that didn't match what the conversation that we have that they show that they didn't understand what the actual problem was. Like. It's just there's a lot of little mistakes that people can make and I. That can really impact your close rate or your guest rate.
Speaker 2 (12:41):
There's two that I've seen, and I don't know if this is their most common. I know we touched on when it's not a proposal, when it's an estimate of what it's going to cost. But I've also had the opposite happen where I remember specifically asking, what are your rates for these things? I wasn't expecting a formal proposal by any means, but it was a. I don't know, there were like ten paragraphs to tell me that I could set the rates. And I was like, first of all, I want to pay you what you were. Well, you know, what feels good to you? It was a very long piece and it lost me. Like, it's like it needs to be to that. To that. And I guess where I'm going here is that needs to be succinct.
(13:24):
It needs to be clear to the point, as long as it needs to be. But don't add a lot of extra fluff in there if you don't need it in there. If someone has asked you a question, make sure you. Yes. Tell them why it's important and how you can position it, but make sure to answer the question and get to it as succinctly as possible. So that's one. And I'm like, don't make it too long. And then I'm like, but don't forget to make it long enough. On the other hand, I realize that it's conflicting advice, but where possible, include the process, not just the process of the proposal. You know, after you sign this, you'll get an invoice and then we'll set up our kickoff call or whatever your process is. But also like, okay. Phase one is research and discovery.
(14:11):
We're going to figure out all of the details, make sure we're on the same page. Phase two is planning and strategy. Phase three is actually doing the thing so that they can understand, you know, oh, this. This phase is about two to three weeks. Good to know. And that way they have a pretty clear understanding of what to expect so that you're basically starting the onboarding process before you ever started the sale because I think much easier.
Speaker 1 (14:40):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (14:40):
Absolutely. Yeah. And I would say our next episode is going to focus onboarding as a whole. But the proposal process is a very important part of the onboarding process.
Speaker 1 (14:53):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
This part of onboarding was so important that we thought it deserved its own episode. Another thing that I've seen is people not like branding or making their proposals look like it comes from their business. So, for example, if you send a proposal through a plain word doc, it doesn't have your business logo or anything on it. It's not branded or nice looking. Like I said, I'm a sucker for design. If something is very plain to me, it doesn't capture my attention. Attention. I need visuals. When I'm looking at a proposal, I want to see that whoever is making this proposal is putting some effort to win me over. Right. I don't want to see something super generic and plain.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
And I'm the opposite. I like a good visual, but that doesn't make or break it. If I'm hiring a designer, I want their proposal to maybe have some visuals. So if I'm hiring a writer, I have no business doing design. Right. Like, and I don't want that to be what wastes the time for people.
Speaker 3 (15:52):
Sure.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
Sure.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
So, you know, I think that it's an interesting thing, and it may be worth talking on the sales call. Would you like a formal proposal? Would you like something that's just a little bit simpler and gets these ideas down? Because I know there's some people that I greatly admire that very rarely send out full, like, gorgeous proposals anymore. They're just like, here's what you get. I'll send over the official details later. Let me know if you're in. And it's like, it's really interesting to see that difference.
Speaker 3 (16:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:22):
Sometimes an effective Google Doc can be as good or more powerful than a beautifully designed proposal that doesn't actually say anything.
Speaker 2 (16:33):
I love me a Google Doc sales page.
Speaker 3 (16:35):
Sure. Just to clarify, like, I am all for making, like, a Google document or something, but I would at least like to see that it has your logo on it. Maybe a font that you use for your business. I just want to see that it looks like it's coming from your business. Not just a copy pasted times New Roman or, God forbid, comic sans thing.
Speaker 1 (16:59):
No.
Speaker 3 (16:59):
Just can say, yeah. Like, I want to see something that looks like it at least had some effort put into it. And of course, the words matter a lot more than what it looks like. I'll give you that 100%. But I just want to see a little bit of effort, because that, to me, that shows that you're going to put an effort for my work?
Speaker 1 (17:19):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (17:20):
I think that's fair. That's all that I want.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
That's it, Grace. Just solve the Internet. Hooray.
Speaker 3 (17:27):
Yay. Oh, my gosh. That's so funny. So we've kind of waxed poetic a little bit about the mistakes that people make in their proposals. What I would love to know is, how do you guys send out proposals? What systems do you use? Nicole, do you want to kick us off?
Speaker 1 (17:44):
Yeah. So my proposals are Google Docs that are then integrated into my accounting software. So I happen to use freshbooks, so I can send that out. That way it makes it easier to integrate when I get the yes. See, I'm pre manifesting the yes already. When I get the yes, it's easy to integrate the next steps, which should be, you know, contracts and payments, which we'll cover in another episode. But I keep it simple. I have great jealousy and inspo from people who use gorgeous proposal software. And one day I will be that grown up. Today is not that day. So for me, the MVP is a branded Google Doc that gets fired off from my accounting software. What about you, Grace?
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Okay, so my proposal process is I have a template set up in the Microsoft word. It's got all of my images, it's got all of my fonts and everything already loaded in there. I have like, almost like a, I call it a wording library. So I can just take, like, a copy and paste for whatever specific deliverable that I'm doing. I set mine up that way. And then what I do is I export the finalized document as a PDF, and then I send the proposal through sign request. So what happens after I hit send? On sign request, my prospective clients get an email that says, hey, your proposal from grace fortune is here. Take a look at it and sign it. And then they ideally sign it.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
They sign it. We're manifesting the yeses today.
Speaker 3 (19:17):
We are. What about you, Erin?
Speaker 2 (19:19):
So I started out doing the PDF that I'd send over through hellosign, or I don't even think hello. I think hellosign is now Dropbox sign. And then if they were like, yeah, yeah. Then we'd do the contract, and then I'd send the invoice. And I found the whole process really cumbersome. So I set up Dubsado, where it's all automated. So as soon as, like, then it, then I had the proposal template set in there, and I just would fill in the chunks that are personalized. So, like their goals, the section I mentioned there how we're going to do all the things for them and the cost. Then as soon as they said yes to the proposal or chose the option, if there was an option, it would then take them to the contract to sign and then to the invoice.
(19:59):
It was just from a single email sentence. And I really like that. That's still my favorite process because it keeps all the pieces separate and keeps it focused so that there's only one decision at a time. Yes, I'm going to sign this. Here's what I want to do. Okay, cool. Sign the contract, pay the invoice. These days I'm using high level because I moved my whole CRM over there, and it's a similar process, except I need to bring the contract into the proposal, which makes it a little less clean, but it still works well. And again, I like it because it automates it. I can click send and it will send. Your proposal from Erin Pennings is waiting. It will send, then the invoice.
(20:36):
I'm just a fan of everything that simplifies because the more steps that I have to take to repeat going back to processes. Right. It all sends out as one piece. And so that's really an important piece for me to know.
Speaker 3 (20:49):
I mean, that sounds like that makes a lot of sense. When you send out your proposals, do they? I think, Erin, you already mentioned this, but do yours include terms and conditions?
Speaker 2 (20:59):
They do now. They did not before, but they do now. And then when we do our contracting and payments section, I'll tell you all about my favorite clauses in our next episode here. So I have some definite clauses that I appreciate and adore.
Speaker 3 (21:14):
Same. What about you, Nicole? Do you include your terms and conditions in your proposals?
Speaker 1 (21:18):
I do, only because it's just one less thing I have to worry about later. I certainly don't need to review them. I do reference that they're there and then to let me know if there are questions. But they're included in the proposal. They're also attached in the contract. So I double dip a little bit, but that's just for my peace of mind.
Speaker 3 (21:38):
Yeah, that's perfect. So my proposals are kind of a hybrid. It's a proposal, a contract, and my terms and conditions all rolled into one. I like to streamline the process as much as I can. So it's like, yes, you want to work with me or no, you don't kind of thing. I don't want people to have to make more than one decision to say yes to the proposal and then have to say yes to the contract afterwards. You know what I mean? Like, I like to do it all as much as I can to keep it clean, and once they agree to it, then I send invoicing. So it's interesting to hear about everybody's different approaches because they're all very unique and they're all totally valid. Like, there's more than one way to do this.
(22:16):
My one way isn't necessarily the right way, and neither is everybody else's. Right. You can streamline something that works for you.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Yep.
Speaker 3 (22:25):
Yeah. Making use of the systems that you have access to. Not everybody wants to have another expense for proposal software. Like, I think, oh, there is one. Oh, my gosh. I think it's better proposals or something. It's beautiful. Like, it works so nicely. Everything looks so good, but it's very expensive. I think it was a couple hundred dollars a year. So I'm like, yeah, I'd rather just save the money and do it my way. And I don't need to spend anything.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
So I want to take that and flip it, though, because I was like, at first, when I first started paying for proposal software, I was like, oh, it's another expense. And then I realized how much time it saved me. And I thought about that, how much time and how many busy work steps that it was reducing for me. In which case then it was like, oh, this is saving me 2 hours for every proposal I send out. Even if I only send out one proposal a month, that's 24 hours a year that it's saving me. Based on what you charge and how busy you are and what you're willing to put up with.
(23:28):
If you are thinking you want it but you're biting the bullet or you're not sure if you want to bite the bullet or not yet because of the cost, I would encourage you to look at, like, what is it that you're charging? What is it that the cost is worth to you? For me, I got tired of having apps, six different apps for six different things. And so I found a software that now does everything for less than I was paying for. All of it.
Speaker 3 (23:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:53):
Just to offer a different perspective, where is it worth you spending your money?
Speaker 3 (23:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (23:58):
I'm certainly always an advocate for free where possible, because everything's a subscription. But there are upsides to paying for things sometimes, too.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
Yeah. And that's where you have to use the, I call it the art of discernment. You have to take a look at, like, how much time are you spending on your proposals? How much time is your investment going to save you like for 24 hours a year? Yeah. A couple hundred dollars is absolutely worth it because your time is worth hopefully more than $100 an hour. Right. Like, we'll just say that going through kind of reverse engineering how much time it's going to save you, what it's going to cost you and where you are in your business and kind of working backwards from there and seeing is an investment like that really worth it for you?
(24:43):
I've got my proposals so templatized and my library so kind of like dialed in that it doesn't really take me much time to copy and paste and personalize what I need to. So I found something that works for.
Speaker 2 (24:56):
Me, and I think that's what's important. I think that's the big takeaway. Figure out what your pain points are, what works for you, and what absolutely drives you up the wall and drives you baddie every little step that is involved. If I can simplify it and build so real quick like that is my favorite use of chat. GPT, by the way, is the streamlined processes. You can say, this is a problem, how do I fix it? And it will tell you how to build zaps, how to build complex automations in whatever platform you're using.
Speaker 3 (25:30):
So that's crazy.
Speaker 2 (25:31):
I knew. Take that for the tip of the day that it may or may not be.
Speaker 3 (25:36):
Maybe we should do Erin. Life hacks with Erin. Yes. Maybe we should do an episode on that. How to use GPT to make processes. That could be fun.
Speaker 2 (25:45):
I could do it in about five minutes.
Speaker 1 (25:49):
We just had chat. Write the whole episode.
Speaker 2 (25:52):
There we go. No, no.
Speaker 3 (25:55):
As we navigate the turbulent waters of copywriting.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
All right, let's dial it in. Let's say we're sold on processes. Okay. The reasons are sold on processes. Rapid fire. What's the minimum viable proposal? Inclusion. So, you know, you've got, you know, five. Five must have, six must haves. Rapid fire. What are they?
Speaker 2 (26:16):
The problem, the solution. What's in it for you? You the client? Who the heck is this person or this company to be doing this? And social proof. So I put that in as one. The process, the cost, and I'm including in the cost. Like, how is it broken up? Is it a deposit? Is it painful? How does that work?
Speaker 3 (26:40):
My five for me. It's similar to yours, Erin, but mine is an introduction section with the problem, a recap of a conversation that we've had. What you get, which includes the investment, the exact deliverables that they're getting, and then number five is, what's the next? What do they have to do next?
Speaker 1 (26:58):
That's perfect. Yep. It opens with a cover letter ish. Thank you for the opportunity statement. This is what I understand the business problem to be. This is the implication of how it's affecting your business. Here's the solution. How does it work? Why does it matter? What can you expect? Sprinkle in some proof and then next steps.
Speaker 3 (27:20):
Awesome.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
And poof, you're done.
Speaker 2 (27:22):
Poof, you're done. All right, well, any final words before we wrap this one up and head on into contracts and payments?
Speaker 3 (27:33):
I just want to encourage people listening to this to make a proposal template that's as easy to work with as possible. Something that, you know, that looks polished and professional, but something that you can replicate easy. And I think that this is where the value of having, like, productized, consistent offers really comes into play. Because the more you're offering the same things, the easier it's going to get to make these proposals. You'll have to personalize and customize them less and less. So I would say just start small and keep plugging away at it. You don't have to perfect it the first time you send your proposal out. Just work on making little improvements each time. How about you, Nicole?
Speaker 1 (28:12):
Yeah, I start small. Use online resources if you need to. There's certainly hundreds, if not thousands, if not bazillions of templates online from a reputable source, like maybe HubSpot or better proposals, or even the copywriter club. If you need something to scaffold off of, make that happen.
Speaker 3 (28:34):
Yeah, I agree. Actually, there is something that I wanted to mention from a process perspective that we didn't touch on yet. So after you send a proposal, I wanted to kind of talk about following up. So a lot of people are afraid to follow up after sending a proposal because they think that they're going to be annoying or too pushy. I would say creating a process for what you are going to do as far as follow up removes a lot of the emotion out of it. So if you know that you are going to follow up, like, let's say, a week after you send the proposal, or two weeks, getting that set in stone will help with that.
(29:10):
And also just making sure that you stay consistent and putting a due date on the proposal, like you can put on the proposal, how long the proposal is valid for? We'll say like two weeks to give them time to make a decision. Does that make sense?
Speaker 1 (29:25):
Please put an expiry date on your proposal because the worst case scenario someone will come back six months after you have tons more experience and want to execute on your proposal that should have expired months and months ago because now your rates are oftener.
Speaker 3 (29:43):
Yep, 100%.
Speaker 1 (29:44):
All right, one more thing touch on before we wrap, and that is proposals. Present them in person or not present them in person.
Speaker 3 (29:54):
Do you mean like on a video call or like literally in person?
Speaker 1 (29:57):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (29:58):
Oh, yep. The idea of presenting a proposal in person and walking somebody through each little stage of it kind of makes me want to break out into hives. So I would say my personal preference would be to just email it to them and let them review it on their own time. If they have questions, they can either schedule another call with me and ask them or just write me back an email.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Okay, again, full disclosure. Past me would have agreed with you entirely, but now being on the agency side and having live proposals be the norm, I have seen how powerful it is to be able to present this work in person and also be able to gauge your reaction, your prospect's reaction in real time and be able to talk over questions. So don't discount the opportunity to do an in person proposal. And yeah. Are you reading off your slides a little bit? Sure.
(30:56):
But you're also initiating a conversation and you can also pin them down for to get a meeting on the books to go over the proposal and review any questions, maybe in a week to ten days so that you're not sitting and nail biting for weeks upon end wondering if they've actually want to do business with you or, you know, if they've moved on. So I was of the same mindset, Grace, but I have seen the light and I do highly recommend it. And you know what a nervous little chihuahua I am. And I do highly recommend it.
Speaker 3 (31:32):
Interesting. I mean, to be totally candid, I've never considered doing a live proposal before. Maybe that's something I need to experiment with later on.
Speaker 1 (31:40):
Look, see? We're experimenting in real time.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
Wow. Love that. Just to wrap up again, I just want to encourage you to just create a process for your proposals. Like decide how you're going to send them out, technology you're going to use, figure out based on your niche and your offerings, what is the minimum viable things that need to be in your proposal for you, and put them in there and try to standardize your proposals as much as possible so that you don't have to keep reinventing the wheel every single time you're sending one out. It's so much less stressful when you have the work mostly already done for you. Even if you can get to like 80% pre done, that's still way better than 0% pre done.
Speaker 1 (32:24):
Absolutely. So let us know how you are incorporating these action steps into your business. We'd love to hear your feedback either by email, hello@thecopytable.com, or catch us on social media, LinkedIn, Facebook or Instagram. And let us know how are proposals propelling your business forward? So we will talk to you about our next process. He's going to be. Oh, Grace, we're so close. But next is contracts and payments. I know. All right. So we'll catch you guys next time on the coffee table.
Speaker 3 (33:03):
Thanks for listening.
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