April 24, 2025 • 58 mins
The Dog Expert podcast. The podcast dogs would want you to listen to. Powered by canine principles.com. Helping passionate dog people go from feeling unsure and overwhelmed to confident, compassionate, and science savvy through a rich library of online courses and formal qualifications. Each week on the podcast, we dive deep into the real, raw and rewarding world of dogs.
This isn't about obedience. This is about understanding because dogs aren't problems to solve. They're free thinking, sentient beings to connect with.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Dog Expert podcast.
(00:02):
The podcast dogs would want you to listen to.
Powered by canine principles.com.
Helping passionate dog people go from feeling unsure and overwhelmed to confident, compassionate, and science savvy through a rich library of online courses and formal qualifications.
(00:22):
Each week on the podcast, we dive deep into the real, raw and rewarding world of dogs.
This isn't about obedience.
This is about understanding because dogs aren't problems to solve.
They're free thinking, sentient beings to connect with.
(00:44):
Hello and welcome from me and Emily.
Jo and Emily.
Hey, hello we are absolutely delighted to be here with you on episode one of the Dog Expert podcast.
Oh, this has been so exciting.
So exciting.
(01:05):
We had a little, test run yesterday and had a bit of a panic because we suddenly thought we were live.
Didn't quite go to clan, did it.
But definitely this is something, since you discussed this with me, I think it was a couple of months ago, that I have really been looking forward to.
All nervous, all excitement, but it's just so awesome to be a part of.
(01:28):
Oh we're delighted that you could co-host because we have got some exciting things in store for everyone, haven't we? Absolutely.
Especially the guests that are going to also appear will be amazing.
Yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely.
So this is the podcast for you if.
You love dogs.
(01:48):
If you are nuts about dogs, whether you are a dog, guardian, a dog owner, or whether you work with dogs and you want to find out more, you want to tune into the expert speakers that we've got coming up for you, or whether you just want to listen to two dog mums who are real people who've got.
(02:14):
Kind of good sense of humor.
I'd say we just laugh a lot.
We are here to talk every Wednesday during season one at seven 30, live on YouTube, live on Facebook, live on Insta, and we are going to be sharing lots of dog pearls of wisdom with you.
(02:41):
From us and from our wonderful guest experts who we've got coming on.
So this episode is just an introduction to the podcast, who we are, what we believe in, and what is in store, what you can expect a little bit of behind the scenes.
And then we will lead into next week's episode and tell you a little bit more about what you can expect next week.
(03:13):
So do you want to start, Emily, with a little bit about your path or do you want me to go first? What should we do? Let's win in Rome, right? I'll go, I'll.
Hello everyone.
So my name is Emily Dustin.
(03:33):
I own and run Sea Spotlight Learn here in New Zealand.
I am very fortunate to come from a dog training and behavior background as my mother's a behaviorist in South Africa.
So I've been brought up in the industry from being a tiny tot I started assisting in her Pappy classes from being eight years old.
And then as I got older in my teen years, I entered multiple dog sports competitions and continued my education studies and everything else in between.
(04:05):
And we decided to immigrate to New Zealand almost six years ago now.
And.
Once we moved here, I just still absolutely wanted to continue with what I do and I opened up C Spot Learn and here I am, four years in New Zealand and it's absolutely amazing and everything is just full on and busy as every, I'm sure you Jo as well.
(04:31):
You're just as busy and here we are.
Fantastic.
Fantastic.
We are very glad that you are here.
You may have written a little book.
Yes, that too.
So these two books that I've written one is training Humans Teaching Dogs.
That was my first book.
(04:51):
I had never written a book before, so it was something that was.
Such an accomplishment.
And that's just everything from basic understanding from your puppy development stages to adolescents and how to work through challenging behaviors.
And then last year I thought, oh, I'd love to write a children's book, because it's just so many families with children that.
(05:17):
With dogs at home or even dogs that they come across in the streets can, be quite problematic.
And it's from the dog's perspective.
So my children's book is called A Friend Named Dog, and that's just part of my passion and my approach with when it comes to helping families and the dogs that are a part of those families.
Understanding body language and what to do if the dog looks like this.
(05:40):
And it's okay to not say hello, even if they're cute and fluffy.
Look at what the whole dog's body language is telling you.
So those are the books that I've written and it's just always primarily my goal to help families and anyone who has a dog.
Fantastic.
Where can people find your books? I know we're not selling, but that's so a valuable one.
(06:03):
So mainly on Amazon in New Zealand, they've sold on my website, but you can also find them on Amazon.
Fabulous.
Fab.
You.
I guess seeing as you put your cards on the table, I should put mine out there too.
So my name's Jamie Dalton and the official blurb, if you like, is that I'm the Director of Studies at Canine Principals.
(06:27):
I'm the principal at the international school, the Canine Psychology, and I also head up the International Institute for Canine Ethics.
My passion is cognitive led dog rehabilitation is something that I've been studying for about 15 years now.
And using that to rehabilitate using cognitive led methods to rehabilitate rescue dogs and dogs who've experienced traumas.
(06:56):
For example, post-surgery or post traumatic event, whether that be a bereavement where a dog.
Been with a body of a guardian, for example.
Or whether that be post a road traffic collision.
And cognitive led research is research.
Cognitive led rehab is something that I am really passionate about spreading the word about more.
(07:22):
I grew up training and showing Belgian Shepherds mal.
Back in the early eighties I was showing by the age of eight ring craft and obedience.
Don't even like the word now.
You must obey me and do as you are told.
(07:42):
I was apparently quite good at it at early teens.
Or tweens even.
I was being paid by breeders to show their dogs in the ring as well, because I was getting the results that they wanted, which was basically a dog that was interacting with me to show its best side off to a judge.
(08:07):
And a dog that felt safe and confident to interact with me.
And what I didn't realize until later on in life was that what I'd started to do was to build a space where the dog could decompress and to.
I'd get the dog that I was handling take it away from the show, away from the area, and just let it observe and let it be, rather than trying to interact with it, I'd literally just sit down on the floor, let the dog just chill.
(08:38):
And just let it do what it wanted.
And I didn't realize at the time that's what I was doing, but I just knew that's what the dog needed.
'cause I too was struggling with overwhelm in that environment.
And that's what the what the dog needed.
So I.
Later on in life.
Because obviously back then it was all choke chains and Barbara Woodhouse and harsh methods that never sat right with me.
(09:01):
It wasn't until I started my canine education and started learning and studying and devouring every single book that I could get my hands on.
And none of my books are not dogeared.
They're all highlighted scribbles on, and I think I give some of my friends who are more precious about.
Keeping their books in pristine condition, heart palpitations.
(09:22):
But yeah, so I've been studying dogs and obsessed with dogs for as long as I can remember.
One of my early childhood memories is memorizing a dog breed book from cover to cover.
But yes I started getting involved in the rescue world about 25 years ago.
(09:43):
Just probably just before the millennium.
And started to realize what a state the dog rescue world is in already back then it was and how many healthy dogs are euthanized every day because of the, the amount of dogs that we have here in the uk Is it the same over in New Zealand? I wouldn't unfortunately be that clued up with how bad it is here, but I know in South Africa it's horrendous.
(10:13):
It's not good.
And it's not just, it's not just.
Dogs with behavioral challenges, whatever the reason is, it would be economic states as well, or not being spayed or nted and so many unwanted litters.
It's overrun and they do the best that they can with what they have, but it is overrun.
(10:34):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think it's the same hearing that there are so many external factors, but ultimately, I don't think we should necessarily go down a rabbit hole on this and scare everyone on the first episode, but but it is it has been an ongoing problem.
The rescues are bursting in the, at the seams and.
(10:56):
There is nowhere for dogs to, to go.
But I did hear a stat and I was sent the source of it, but I can't remember right now.
That said that the most common cause of death in dogs under the age of three as a behavioral.
Problem or, yeah.
Which is pretty scary.
(11:17):
So the more we can do around education, the more guest experts that we can get in on the podcast, the more conversations we can have.
Absolutely.
And it's, and I think that's one of the most important things as well, because it's not just about.
Okay, I have a dog in my house.
It must listen.
I need to do this.
It must do as it's told.
And all these things that go along with either Gen un, unintentional generational training, how people were brought up with their dogs, with their parents, which is also a completely different era.
(11:47):
We know so much more and understand so much more about dogs now and families are also, I feel way more invested with their animals.
And they want to do the best that they can with their dogs, but they just they just are overwhelmed with the endless Google search and 20 different people saying 20 different things and their hearts are in the right place.
(12:09):
They try and implement these training strategies that are out there, but because it's just so conflicting and overwhelming, itten and unfortunately does more harm than it does.
Good.
And I think that's also why I'm so excited about this podcast is because we can just, everyone that we get involved, all of our brains, we all love and want the same thing.
(12:30):
And that's just to help the dogs and families that we work with and give them tools that is not coercion, intimidation, or consequence and going, this actually does work.
If you've got this challenge and you've got this problem.
These are the things that you can do, but this is why your dog is doing this.
Yeah.
And most of the time, anytime I talk to a client, the minute I go, this is why your dog is doing it, and they go oh, that makes so much sense.
(12:57):
Oh, and then their whole demeanor goes.
Okay, I can do this.
Because it's so much better as our human brains to have that understanding.
Yeah.
Because once we've got that, then the rest is easy to work with.
Yeah.
And I think one of the great things about.
This podcast, obviously I'm completely biased, but one of the great things about this podcast is that we're all coming at it.
(13:23):
Both of us and our guest experts we're all coming at it from a place of no pressure on the dog and doing things in a way that encourages.
The dog and empowers the dog to feel confident in making their own choices and know that they're safe to do that in a constructive, safe way for humans and dogs.
(13:45):
We are not saying go and let your dogs be free and feral on the streets and take no responsibility for whatever chaos they, they may cause.
Not saying that at all, but what we are saying is that.
Everything that we do with our dogs, every interaction that we have needs to be on a consent based level rather than us forcing them and expecting things from normal all the time.
(14:10):
We want them to want to be with us.
We want them to think of us as allies and teammates rather than controllers and suppresses and feel they have to be compliant and avoid in case something unpleasant happens.
Yeah, absolutely.
One of our dogs, maybe we should introduce our dogs.
That's a good idea because they're obviously the most important part of this.
(14:33):
Oh, for sure.
One of our, I've got four dogs.
I've got Chip, Charlie, dude, and Willow.
And we also have four children, and I always go through the dog's names before I get to the children's names.
Mom, I'm not a dog.
But Chip is an ex working sheep dog and she's been with us for seven months-ish now.
(14:58):
And she actually used to urinate with fear herself when she was thought that she was going to be asked to do something.
And the day that I saw her.
Rolling in Poo made me so happy because for the first two weeks of her life, she was just literally hiding her life of her life with us.
(15:22):
Yeah.
She was just hiding in her crate and just too scared to come out and to see her confidently skipping through the feels, relaxed body language, no tension, and just go, oh, there's some poo.
I think I'm gonna have a role in that.
Even saying that it's something.
Like it resonates with me so much because there, there will be in my career when I'm working with a client and they've got a rescue dog, right? You've got no history about this dog.
(15:51):
You don't know anything about them but you, you just work with the dog you have in front of you.
Yeah.
And.
The one lady that I'm actually thinking of, and this was back in South Africa, her dog was terrified of everything.
Spooked by shadows, movements, and very similar, just hiding, avoiding very low body language demeanor, stiff, rigid movements just in case someone looked at the, really traumatized.
(16:13):
Whatever happened to the dog, it wasn't good and worked with the dog for a couple of months.
And the beginning, we actually didn't do anything.
All it was 'cause.
Where I was in South Africa, I had training grounds and facilities.
So my clients in would come to me instead of me going to them like I do here.
Yes.
And she would, over a couple of weeks, she would just come, let the dog out, open the door in the car and we would just stand there and, we waited and she was so patient.
(16:40):
This woman was phenomenal because it takes a lot to be that patient because you don't get those results, that instant gratification you are wanting to achieve with this dog.
And after two months she phones me and she goes, you won't believe what my dog did.
And I was like, what? And I was so worried 'cause I thought it was gonna be bad.
And she goes, she jumped.
(17:03):
Went on the kitchen table and stole the ham, and we were so excited because the general person will go, oh my gosh, that's really rude.
No, you mustn't do that.
But for this particular dog, that dog was so brave to feel the confidence.
Yeah.
Get on the table and sneak a piece of ham and we were.
(17:23):
So ecstatic.
It was like the most amazing thing ever that this dog was so brave to steal ham.
But then again, that happened.
So all she did then was go, obviously this is not something we want to continue.
Yeah.
And it's environmental management, not leave things on the counter anymore.
And she never got the opportunity to repeat and rehearse the behavior so it didn't happen again.
(17:44):
But I think a lot of people don't realize that whatever you give feedback to, whatever behavior you give feedback to, whether it's negative feedback or positive feedback, that's the behavior you're going to see getting repeated.
So if you are, if you're scolding a dog, you are giving it feedback on that behavior, albeit negative behavior.
(18:05):
Negative feedback.
So what we are looking to do is create an environment where we are taking responsibility for our actions.
It's us looking internally at how we can set that dog up for success rather than punishing a dog for behaving in a certain way.
That reminds me of my long hair rot.
(18:28):
That reminds me of my longhaired, Rotty boy that sadly went over Rainbow Bridge about five years ago now.
But he was my rock.
He was an absolute legend and he came, he was I.
From a house where he'd been kept in an under stair cupboard and he'd been, they had a table leg just to beat him with.
And he was a sort of late night rescue mission that, and he was they managed to get him out and he came, basically came to me just overnight, until rescue space was found.
(18:59):
And then 10 years later, sadly we lost him.
But the, but when he first came, he would.
He was so scared to look anywhere apart from a head in the house.
Like he would walk past a plate of food that was on the floor or anything.
He would just be like, oh my goodness.
Oh my goodness.
When he would run when we were outside, he'd run looking backwards.
(19:23):
He was more scared of what was coming behind him then.
Yeah.
What was in front to the point that he would crash into things which other people might have seen as funny.
But actually it was fear.
Yeah.
It was pure fear.
And I remember the day when my husband rang and said I had a ham sandwich.
(19:43):
It's oh, what you mean? He said a customer came in.
I went out.
Came back, ham sandwich was gone.
Shouldn't have left it on your desk then.
Really? Should you? Yeah.
But that's also felt confident enough to Yeah, and that's, and those are the things, and it's, it's.
(20:06):
Any behavior and it's helping people understand and adjust expectations.
And it is, the expectations are unintentional.
We we speak people, dog speaks dog and we are the bridge of that communication, that species gap.
And it's, a lot of controversy around everywhere going, oh, dogs are not children, don't treat them like children.
(20:27):
They're dogs.
And I go.
Absolutely.
They are not children.
However, the cognitive ability levels are remarkably similar to a two and a half to 3-year-old child.
There, there are things that.
Dogs are exceptional at problem solving predicting patterns of behaviors.
They know the shoes you're putting on for walking versus the when you go out the door, the cupboard you reach to for the dog lead, and, the food cupboard because they're really good at things like that.
(20:56):
But the cognitive ability to distinguish the difference between.
Consequences that people, and only in people minds that humans understand is completely different because you'll have the scenario of the dog messing to eat the Hamm.
It should know that's on the kitchen table.
It's out of reach.
Dogs are natural scavengers.
They're opportunist eaters, they're opportunistic.
(21:18):
It's going, oh, that smells quite nice.
Thank you.
And that's how they've survived for thousands of years.
Yeah, with people.
That's it.
Survival is paramount, isn't it? Yeah.
Food is survival and it's, and that's what it boils down to because there's so many things that it's helping people understand that this dog is not being deliberately defined, rude or naughty.
(21:40):
Not trying to control, wake up in the morning and go, oh, how am I going to rule this household? The dog wakes up and goes.
Probably most and I'm projecting, oh, I'm hungry.
I need to wee.
Then you let them out and you have that pattern every single day.
And any other behaviors or challenges that are unwanted or unpleasant, that is emotion based, that is something either lack of exposure or negative association, or just the dog not having that ability to navigate a situation or event.
(22:11):
Those, that's where we come in and just help shape the behaviors we're looking for.
I've got a question for you then, leading off that.
Yeah.
Would you, what would you say is the one kind of myth or misconception that you wish more people really understood? Oh, I don't think there's one.
(22:36):
Can I with two, two calls out a scroll? Can I go with two? Go for it.
Alright, so I think it's dominance and path leadership.
Yeah, it's, those two for me are the, are tricky because.
(22:58):
At the end of the day, dominance is not a personality trait.
And this is, this goes around in the, in, in the training industry.
It's a behavior.
Sophia y wrote a beautiful paragraph about dominance, and it's actually more towards survival of the fit, right? And if you change that word, dominance to survival, you're gonna have a very different interpretation of that word, because dominance is not a strategy to be better.
(23:24):
Because I'm the best of everything.
It is to gain.
Vital resources to promote survival.
And that is like breeding rights, territory food.
'cause if you don't eat, you die.
If you don't have a warm, dry place that's safe, you could die.
You're vulnerable.
And these are all basic instincts.
Part of our primitive wiring with an, whether it's a dog or human.
(23:46):
And if a dog displays an undesirable behavior that usually stems from defensive responses, protective responses, all these things that happen that the dog has no control over and pet leadership.
When they did that study with caps of wolves, it was, they were captive, they were squished in a very tiny space that was.
Utterly unnatural.
(24:07):
They all came from different, they weren't related, were they even? Yeah.
They weren't related, and they were incredibly stressed.
So packed leadership where they go alpha, the alpha bitch and the alpha male, controlled the subordinates and they ate first and they put them in their place.
If they showed any those animals were highly stressed, so their behaviors were quite extreme and exaggerated because of their environment survival mode as well.
(24:31):
All the time.
And then what happens is they go, oh dogs are quite like wolves, so they must be the same.
And the domestic dog being bred for thousands of years for, engineered for specific purposes is different.
Their brains are smaller, their jaws are smaller.
They're, so maybe similar parallels with regards to a common ancestor, gray wolf, but.
(24:54):
There's still a domestic dog.
And they're still the separate species.
And the idea of the control and correction, which that word just goes, do that.
It's and it's so hard because.
I never ever want to offend anybody because then they get defensive and if they feel defensive then I can't help them because then they feel, oh, now I've done something wrong.
(25:20):
Then they may feel bad, and that's not what we want to do.
We want to empower the people we work with, give them the confidence.
Like I say to my clients all the time, I'll go, my job is not to be with you all the time.
My job is to see you a couple of times, depending on how complex the behavior is.
Maybe a little bit more than a couple.
But it's to give you that confidence in the tools that you know what to do and how to implement it without me.
(25:45):
And it's that knowledge that's empowering.
It's that knowledge of you are, you do not need to assert, I.
This kind of intimidation and going do, as you're told, yank on the lead.
No you're pulling, and the dog's kind of going, what's going on? But I just wanted to smell that smell, and you're going, oh, you're trying to walk in front of me and be the leader.
(26:06):
And now you're just adding unpleasant experiences and the dog is not making that connection because the timing of learning and the timing of associative learning is so important because.
When those things happen, the dog might make a completely different association than what you think they're making.
So with regards to my different tangent on your question, I think the dominance and the pack leadership is the two main ones that is very difficult to work through in, in with the general audience.
(26:38):
Yeah.
Yeah, I agree.
And I think the training.
The human is more important than training the dog because not only are we and doing it in a fun way where possible.
Yeah.
So that we're empowering them and making them feel like they are achieving and they're getting some sort of little gamification bits maybe.
(27:01):
And they're, their brains are like, wow, this is cool.
I'm actually enjoying this.
Dopamine.
Dopamine motivation.
Dopamine.
Yeah, exactly.
Exactly.
You can't just give them bits of cheese or chicken, but you you might some, but we want people to love.
Doing what they're doing with their dogs in a positive way, because then the dog will also pick up on that.
(27:26):
Yeah.
And the dog will know that actually your heart rate is raised, your breath rate's increased.
Or if you are like me, when you are concentrating, you actually hold your breath and the dog thinks, oh my goodness, you're gonna die.
But these dogs are amazing beings.
They can.
(27:46):
Smell for the most.
They've got what, 220 million to 300 million hair receptacles? Where's ear and the jacobson's organ for special processing? It's phenomenal what they hearing, that is a three mile radius.
No, it sensor a three mile radius, isn't it? I can't remember now.
It would, I can't confidently say because I can't recall, but it is very far, very one per menopausal brain here as well.
(28:13):
It's amazing.
But they can smell like a drop of, I can't remember what it was, the experiment where they did a drop of something in a Someone watching or No, in a swimming pool.
And the dogs could sniff out the comments.
Find your little J.
Do you remember? It's a while ago now.
But yeah, so they are these amazing beings and we try and tell them that the first thing we say is sit or down.
(28:38):
It's what? And it is the sit.
The sit.
Don't get me wrong.
The sit is great.
It is.
It is so overused because, depends on the dog though, as well.
And it depends on the dog and the person.
Hounds, they can't, their body Yeah.
Their body shape just isn't made to sick.
Absolutely.
And it is it's easy to teach the sit And I think that's what, we get the most gratification.
(29:01):
'cause it's the instant gratification, right? It's the quick fix.
Yeah.
It's not quick fix.
It's the quick.
I've got managements, I've got control.
My dogs responded to me.
Oh yay, this is working.
Okay, so we do this all the time, but sometimes, and it's completely unintentional.
Sometimes the sit doesn't deal with the behavior you're trying to work with.
(29:21):
It's just the bandage, and it's fine for basic tasks and simple exercises, but let's say getting your dog to sit before crossing the road every time.
It is not necessarily ideal because what you would probably want to work on the most is impulsivity.
The dog giving you the sit gives you management.
(29:42):
Absolutely.
Because you can't have the dog rolling all over the place while you're trying to cross the road.
Look left and right to make sure it's safe, but it's the, Hey buddy, wait.
Without the sit.
Okay, great.
Yeah.
That's the life skill because that's impulse control, that's management.
That's, predictable pattern of behavior.
The dog understands, which I'm not taking away from the sit.
(30:02):
No, but I've never seen a dog walk up to a road without a guardian and sit down by the side of the road and go, oh, I just think I'll sit here a minute and wait and see if any cars.
I need to say my misconception before I forget.
'cause I've the, you have walk your dog four times a day.
(30:28):
No, people say that though.
And it used to be the thing like you have to walk your dog.
Some of the rescue dogs that I've fostered over the years, take weeks before we even go out the house because they're just not feeling safe enough.
And hundred percent safety foundations, if you haven't got those in place before you leave the house and you build up gradually and.
(30:53):
Adds up.
It's just trigger after trigger, stacking after trigger, stacking over stimulation.
You.
Oh, wow.
That's, I love that you brought that up.
That is excellent.
It's a whole rabbit hole right there.
That is it's so common.
And I had a gentleman a couple of, oh, maybe two years ago, and he had.
A little Maltese cross, cute little fluffy noodle of multiple mixes.
(31:17):
And he was walking him three times a day and he goes, I have to get out.
The dog's gotta get out.
Go.
Because you've gotta take the dog out for a walk the dog, because a tired dog is a good dog.
Another misconception, and yeah, went through a couple of things.
Something wasn't right.
And I said to him do me a favor.
Let's just see how this goes.
Remember, everything's a process of elimination, right? Don't walk your dog for two weeks for me, and then only walk your dog once every second day and see how that goes.
(31:48):
And by the fourth week.
The dog was so much better.
Way more relaxed in demeanor and confidence to smell when in 'cause they were walking Just to sniff.
Just to feel able to sniff.
Yeah.
And he said, my dog had never sniffed before.
He goes, this is amazing.
And the dog was actually pro taking in the smells and processing the world around them instead of rushing past the roses.
(32:12):
But it's, I think it's what you mentioned earlier on, it's a bit like it's what we've always done, so it's what we've got to do.
Whereas actually it's not what we've always done because if you look way back into history, they just used to open the back doors and let the dogs out for the day.
So it's not what we've always done.
It is come in.
I'm not suggesting that's what we should do now by any stretch, but it's.
(32:34):
What we need to be doing is working on the safety foundations and the dog's basic needs, and making sure that they're pain free.
They've got no dental pain.
They've got no allergies that are bugging them.
They've got no arthritis.
They've got no issues.
That gut.
Intestinal problems that are causing them pain and discomfort.
We need to be working on their nutrition and making sure that we're actually looking at the contents of the food that they're getting and doing our research.
(33:02):
Yeah, because so often we see the the bigger brands that maybe have more of a marketing budget who've got that confident, bold marketing.
Trumping the ones that are actually the nutritional ones that maybe aren't packed for the cereals and have got the right balances of foods in the, and not rendered the same way that destroys so many amino acids.
(33:27):
S as well.
Yeah.
And also the sleep thing is something I'm super passionate as well, is making sure that they actually have the opportunity and they're taking the opportunity to get proper remedial sleep.
Where they're flat out, yeah, on their sides.
You've got that really nice big rise and fall of the chest.
You've got other parts of their body that are moving 'cause they're so relaxed.
(33:50):
And just making sure those foundations are in place before you start dragging your dog out for a walk.
Yeah.
'cause you wanna build up to desensitizing the equipment that they're the equipment.
Hopefully you are looking at a harness.
Yes.
With a Y front, you are definitely not using a slip lead or even a flat collar that is putting pressure on your dog's poor, sensitive neck, and their skin's a lot thinner than ours as well.
(34:19):
So not only is it giving them.
Intraocular pressure, potential for damage around the neck.
But you're actually looking at a more balanced approach, and I always like two points of contact, one on the chest, one on the back, so that it's more balanced for them and rotation of the shoulder so dogs can extend than you're wheelchair.
Then not limited, but we're making sure that we're setting these dogs up for success because, for example, I used.
(34:49):
Used to take dogs from a rescue that I worked with sighthounds, greyhounds who'd come straight off the racing track, used to take them down, Fort touch, Tellington, touch with practitioners who were in their final throws of becoming tea touch practitioners.
And one of the first things they picked up with on these dogs were that they were on collars.
(35:13):
And these dogs have been racing round a racetrack always the same way.
Yeah.
And they've been going from 40 miles an hour to a dead stop.
And their necks were the shock absorbers and their necks had so much tension in them and so much pain and discomfort.
Then you put a collar in a lead on that and the dog's not naturally able to elongate its neck 'cause everything's tensed.
(35:37):
On any dog nevermind a greyhound off the track.
But that's another rabbit hole.
We could go down another day.
Oh, definitely one of those.
That's my jam.
It's all good.
So you guys are in for a whole heap of fun with this podcast.
We're gonna go down lots of different rabbit holes, but we have got some fabulous guest experts coming on.
(35:58):
We're going to be talking about a different theme each week, and we are going to be looking at case studies.
You guys can message in questions.
You can comment questions on the post.
And we'll reply to you.
We're gonna be talking about book discussions and we're just gonna be really having honest chats about the emotional side of living with and loving our dogs with a real emphasis on practical and compassionate support for dog guardians, ethical dog professionals, and just dog geeks like us.
(36:32):
Really just trying to make the world a better place.
One dog at a time.
One dog at a time.
So before we wrap up, I do think it's really important that we do actually introduce our dogs then, because really they are the stars of the show.
And I think that people, if you don't want to know about our dogs, why are you listening? Really, quite frankly.
(36:55):
Do you wanna go first? Yeah.
Oh, he's out.
Oh, we are waking up in, in his defense.
It is what's the time now? Oh, 11 minutes past seven.
Thursday morning.
In the morning.
In the morning.
Yeah.
I think you've seen the light come in as the podcast has gone on.
(37:15):
Hold on.
We are itchy.
You don't have to bring him on.
Just tell us about him and where he came from.
Oh, sorry.
I was gonna just show you 'cause he has the most beautiful face in the world.
I think that's, I think my dogs have actually got the most beautiful faces.
So his name is Cooper.
He's just reached 18 months.
I, he's pretty chilled golden retriever.
(37:39):
He's quite goofy, which I absolutely love.
He is only recently graduated to me dropping my long line on walks, which I've had some interesting comments of people going.
But you work with dogs.
He should have a recall like so early and I was like no.
I love him, but he will leave me for water.
(38:00):
And that's putting him in a situation to fail and rehearse a behavior I really don't want to encourage.
He has his freedom.
And all of that.
But he is now 18 months and graduated to long line dropping, and I've got a, I'll say 99% recall because I never have a hundred.
Depends on what's around, but he's pretty awesome.
(38:20):
Hangs out with me with reports and work and the grooming salon that I have because we do reward-based grooming and we do, so that's probably one of the services I offer.
So he chills out with us and really nice distraction for the other dogs.
'cause when the dogs get a break and they compatible with him, then they play.
So he's my little C spot.
(38:41):
Learn.
Support dog.
He's a little bird.
He's fabulous.
Yeah.
There's something really interesting there in the the recall a hundred percent recall, and people say You should have a hundred percent recall, but I challenge you to.
Find a beagle that has gone beagle because their ears or a bloodhound, their ears are designed to waft the scents up to their noses.
(39:08):
So once their heads are down, they've got sensory overwhelm from all of the information that they're processing with those scents wafting up their noses.
And those dogs, like the Bloodhounds for example, have got the 300 million head head.
What's the word I'm looking for, Emily? Thank you.
(39:29):
They've got the increased amount, which means that their sense of smell is even more powerful than all of all of the breeds.
With 220 million plus, is it million or thousand? I just don't, I remember, I recall 5 million, but who? Who? Oh, someone five.
And it's humans.
That's us.
Dogs are not robot models.
(39:49):
Oh, they're not Jess.
Well done.
No, and I think we are not perfect.
So why would we ever expect any other being to be perfect? They're freethinking.
They're sentient beings.
Absolutely.
I need to introduce my dogs before we go, please.
Chip is the colleague that I talked about.
She's red and white.
(40:10):
She is beautiful.
She lived working the sheep in the hills up north all her life.
We.
Had to adopt her.
When we heard about her, because it wasn't from a rescue, it was from someone who was rehoming her because she needed a quieter life.
(40:31):
She's now nine.
So at least they were rehoming her, which is good.
Turns out she's actually scared of sheep, the poor girl.
So she's spent her whole life being forced to do something.
And she's actually scared of sheep, bless her.
Whether that's association fear or whether that's how it's always been, we'll never know.
(40:51):
But she has just because she lives in a, we were told when we got her that we should let her out for an hour a day from her kennel and then put her back in.
Oh, that's not happening.
Okay.
Bye bye.
Bye.
My dog.
She has recently discovered, so first of all, she discovered sofa cuddles.
(41:16):
So at first she was very much I'm not sure I'm allowed up here.
And every morning once she discovered them she, we.
Come into the room and she'd be all like, she does all a happy little dance.
And then she started just sitting on the sofa really quietly and just sitting there and I realized she was waiting for sofa snuggles.
So I'd go and sit at the other end and she'd come over and be like, oh.
(41:40):
And then about three or four weeks ago.
I just, I was sat on the sofa with Charlie, who's our terrier yeah, who I'll introduce in a minute.
Although many of you watching who have watched stuff where with me before, will be familiar with his butthole.
'cause he likes to walk across the camera, relay it to everyone.
(42:01):
But she was, chip was watching Charlie on my lap from the other sofa.
And then he got off and she came and jumped on and just put her head on my lap.
And she was very much I don't know if I'm supposed to do this.
I like it.
I like it.
And so we've graduated now to I'm here.
(42:24):
I sat face on your face, so we're working with that.
But just that she feels confident enough to be around us is just incredible because she was so shut down and petrified when she first came.
And she did have fear based.
Reactivity yeah, as well.
So she's come so far in seven months and is such a brave girl.
(42:48):
She's a real cutie.
Then I feel like I should speed up because I could talk all night about my dogs and I've got a few That's okay.
We can end it and carry on talking.
Charlie is the terrier.
He is a cool dude.
He was actually drugged for the first nine months of his life because his guardians got him as a puppy and both of them were diagnosed with cancer, sadly within a.
(43:15):
Couple of weeks of getting him and with their treatments, they found it really hard to cope with a puppy, Jack Russell.
And they, at age nine months finally came to the conclusion that they were going to have to rehome him.
And I'm still in touch with them.
They're absolutely wonderful people.
They're fabulous.
And I send them pictures all the time.
(43:36):
And he was three a month ago.
He is, the most amazing dog, if you're ever having a bad day, half an hour with him and the world is in two minutes with him and the World is an amazing place.
That's his Viva is just like he loves.
Life and life is there for living.
He's just incredible.
(43:58):
And he'll bring you a toy and he'll be like, oh, let's play with this.
Let's play with this, and you'll do something with it.
And then he'll go towards it and then suddenly go, oh, actually squirrel, just be, he is just cracking.
And then we've got Willow.
Willow is.
(44:18):
Seven-ish.
She wa she came over from Ireland where she was found scavenging in BIM bags when she was maybe about four or five weeks old.
She was tiny.
She was rehomed I think twice, maybe three times before she came to us.
Age, four months.
Multiple homes at such an early age.
(44:38):
Such a baby.
And she was such a baby.
I always remember the.
First day we went up to meet her at kennels and my husband crouched down and she belly crawled to him.
I really wanna say hello, but I'm so scared right now.
Yeah.
When she was one, she developed cluster seizure epilepsy.
And she got so bad that by the time she was two we had her booked in to be put to sleep on the vet's advice.
(45:03):
Twice and twice we'd been on the way to the vets.
The first time my daughter rang me in absolute bits and said, people do this.
Please don't do this.
At least, at least let me say goodbye.
'cause she wasn't living at home at the time.
Yeah.
And the second time it just felt so wrong.
She wasn't even three at that point.
So we'd gone through all of the channels that we could, pushed it as far as we could with the vets, the veterinary hospital.
(45:30):
She'd had they can't.
Diagnose epilepsy.
They have to rule everything else out.
So she'd had fluid, acid fluid taken from the brainstem.
Yeah.
And tested.
And it come back basically that it wasn't anything else, so it had to be epilepsy.
Okay.
And finally we introduced Skullcap and Valerian.
(45:52):
In amongst the high dosage of drugs that she was on, we introduced that as a natural one.
And she, her seizures started to the frequency of seizures started to calm down.
So the reason that she'd been booked in all this bit of feedback there.
The reason she'd been booked in to be put to sleep was because she was having 20 seizures over two days, every two weeks, and it was taking.
(46:16):
It was crazy.
It was taking a week to recover between, at least with it between seizures.
So she was literally having a few days of quality of life before she'd be hit again.
Yeah.
So it was really horrific time.
And there's a wonderful Facebook group for.
Guardians who've got epileptic dogs.
And that was my sanity in the early hours.
(46:37):
Many, many a time when I was despairing.
So Willow's a very special girl.
We never know how much borrowed time we're on with her, but she's now seven.
She's just grateful for what you have.
Absolutely.
If you, would you be able to share that Facebook? 'cause I think that would help.
Yeah, that would help so many.
Yeah.
Yeah.
She, that's amazing.
(46:57):
Honestly, that group in the middle of the night and people saying, do you know what you are saying, my dog was there and was at that horrific point, and we did this, we tried this.
And for me, just knowing that I wasn't on my own in the middle of the night.
Yeah.
And despairing it, it is really horrible feeling.
So yes, so Willow is very special and she still does zoomies and she still bounces around like a.
(47:22):
Nutter.
The only thing I'd say with Willow the effect that the epilepsy has had on her body means that she's gone gray a lot earlier than we would've expected her to.
She was completely black with just a tiny white stripe on her head and a white chest area.
But when she was younger, but she was completely you'll see pictures with of her on some of the socials.
(47:45):
She's pretty much gray now all over.
And then finally as dude we.
Yeah, we didn't know his name when he came into rescue, so we just You named him dude.
We didn't name him dude.
It was just like, do you wanna come in, dude? And then he'd decided his name was dude.
So we just stuck with dude.
Oh, I love that so much.
(48:07):
But dude had cloud coma in his eye when he came into rescue, so he had to have one eye removed pretty quickly.
And the other eye had to have very expensive drops for a very long time, which were paid for by the rescue.
But it just goes to show if you know a good ethical rescue and you can support them in any way, it doesn't have to be fostering or anything like that.
(48:30):
If you can just afford a few, afford a couple of quid here and there, it can go to the dog dude.
So yeah, dude, I was removed.
He had the other one for another year after we got him.
And then that one.
The pressure in it built up and he had to have that one out two years ago I think now.
(48:50):
So he's probably about 11.
He also has to have most of his teeth out as well, so he has nothing to hold his tongue in his mouth really.
So his tongue, he, yeah.
I.
Make dude into a human.
I think he'd be like an old school country gentleman with a tweed coat on, and really good manners.
(49:13):
He is just such an absolute treasure.
He's such a darling.
What they did though, when they removed the first eyes, they put a prosthetic eyeball in.
Oh.
Okay.
When they removed the second eye, they didn't, so the prosthetic eyeball on the one side held the shape of his face.
Yeah, on the other side.
They didn't put one in.
So he looks Oh yeah.
(49:34):
Mismatched and his tongue rolls out.
Oh, he's a dude.
He is a darling.
That is such a great name.
He's massive as well.
He's got his own sofa.
He doesn't like sharing that.
That's his, so they're.
Anyway, we've gone down a million rabbit holes that are not related to the podcast, but it gives you a taste of what we are like, our personalities, the dogs behind the scenes and the kind of vibe, the vision that we've got for the podcast, the difference that we want to make, the education that we want to spread in a kind, ethical, positive way, and, I feel like maybe I should give you a little snippet of what's coming up next week.
(50:19):
Next week we're going to be talking about canine emotions, and we have got a mystery guest next week.
Keep watching the canine principles socials, I.
And we will be revealing who the mystery guest is.
I think many of you will have heard of them and you will love who we've got coming on.
(50:40):
But I'm going to keep that a secret for the minute, just a little bit.
The rest of this season of the Dog Expert Podcast, we are going to be introducing you to some of our homegrown, our own ex.
Experts in some of the canine principles, tutor teams.
(51:00):
So if you are actually studying with canine principles, you may already have come across some of the guest experts that we're going to be having on.
We are going to be talking about some really cool topics and each week at the end of the episode.
Episode will tell you what's coming next week.
But we've got some great, we've actually got content lined up until February next year.
(51:22):
We brain dumped it.
We were like, oh my gosh, and we have to talk about this and we have to.
So we've got a few things in the pipeline for you, and we've got some amazing people coming up to share their pearls of wisdom, all with the same values and the same passion that Emily and I have got.
(51:46):
So we want to say a massive thank you, don't we, for joining us.
Oh, thank you so much.
One down a hundred to go.
A hundred.
Is that all? Yes.
Let's try for more, but thank you.
Thank you so much for joining.
It's such a, oh, I'm just.
This is so exciting, so nerve wracking and exciting all in one.
(52:09):
And Jo, you're amazing.
So I'm just happy to co-host with you and I think we are going to have so much fun.
We are gonna have so much fun.
And hopefully you guys will too.
We will lovely leave you there.
We'll look forward to speaking about all things canine emotions with our miss.
Guest next week.
(52:29):
Please do hit the subscribe button guys and share your love.
Share the podcast as well with anyone else who you think would like it to anyone you think would benefit from it.
We would love for you to share with.
With them too.
And I have got a little outro clip to play you, but I can't find it.
(52:56):
Can I, while you look for it? Yeah.
Can.
People who are viewing, is there a place for them to write their questions of things that they find the most pressing, and then we can address them whenever we can, or if there's a common theme, then we can add that into our very long.
List long brain dump.
(53:19):
Yeah.
But we might also be able to address them on message and we might also on the chat and we might also be able to address them and tie them into some of the subjects that we've already got lined up.
And we might even be able to get specific guest experts from our amazing network that we're.
So blessed to be surrounded by to come on and chat to you specifically about what you're asking.
(53:43):
So yes, do pop in the comments.
We will keep an eye on the comments and respond to you in the comments or email info@canineprinciples.com
and we will come back to you as soon as we can.
So it's a thank you very much from me and a thank you very much from Emily.
Thank.
(54:05):
See you next week.
Thank you for listening to the Dog Expert Podcast, the podcast dogs would want you to listen to.
If you've enjoyed this episode, do come and let us know in our free Facebook group for dog lovers Everywhere Ethical Dog Training with Canine principles.
That way we can make more content like this that you'll love.
(54:28):
We would love for you to leave a review on here and hit subscribe so that you never miss an episode.
Dog Expert podcast.
(00:02):
The podcast dogs would want you to listen to.
Powered by canine principles.com.
Helping passionate dog people go from feeling unsure and overwhelmed to confident, compassionate, and science savvy through a rich library of online courses and formal qualifications.
(00:22):
Each week on the podcast, we dive deep into the real, raw and rewarding world of dogs.
This isn't about obedience.
This is about understanding because dogs aren't problems to solve.
They're free thinking, sentient beings to connect with.
(00:44):
Hello and welcome from me and Emily.
Jo and Emily.
Hey, hello we are absolutely delighted to be here with you on episode one of the Dog Expert podcast.
Oh, this has been so exciting.
So exciting.
(01:05):
We had a little, test run yesterday and had a bit of a panic because we suddenly thought we were live.
Didn't quite go to clan, did it.
But definitely this is something, since you discussed this with me, I think it was a couple of months ago, that I have really been looking forward to.
All nervous, all excitement, but it's just so awesome to be a part of.
(01:28):
Oh we're delighted that you could co-host because we have got some exciting things in store for everyone, haven't we? Absolutely.
Especially the guests that are going to also appear will be amazing.
Yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely.
So this is the podcast for you if.
You love dogs.
(01:48):
If you are nuts about dogs, whether you are a dog, guardian, a dog owner, or whether you work with dogs and you want to find out more, you want to tune into the expert speakers that we've got coming up for you, or whether you just want to listen to two dog mums who are real people who've got.
(02:14):
Kind of good sense of humor.
I'd say we just laugh a lot.
We are here to talk every Wednesday during season one at seven 30, live on YouTube, live on Facebook, live on Insta, and we are going to be sharing lots of dog pearls of wisdom with you.
(02:41):
From us and from our wonderful guest experts who we've got coming on.
So this episode is just an introduction to the podcast, who we are, what we believe in, and what is in store, what you can expect a little bit of behind the scenes.
And then we will lead into next week's episode and tell you a little bit more about what you can expect next week.
(03:13):
So do you want to start, Emily, with a little bit about your path or do you want me to go first? What should we do? Let's win in Rome, right? I'll go, I'll.
Hello everyone.
So my name is Emily Dustin.
(03:33):
I own and run Sea Spotlight Learn here in New Zealand.
I am very fortunate to come from a dog training and behavior background as my mother's a behaviorist in South Africa.
So I've been brought up in the industry from being a tiny tot I started assisting in her Pappy classes from being eight years old.
And then as I got older in my teen years, I entered multiple dog sports competitions and continued my education studies and everything else in between.
(04:05):
And we decided to immigrate to New Zealand almost six years ago now.
And.
Once we moved here, I just still absolutely wanted to continue with what I do and I opened up C Spot Learn and here I am, four years in New Zealand and it's absolutely amazing and everything is just full on and busy as every, I'm sure you Jo as well.
(04:31):
You're just as busy and here we are.
Fantastic.
Fantastic.
We are very glad that you are here.
You may have written a little book.
Yes, that too.
So these two books that I've written one is training Humans Teaching Dogs.
That was my first book.
(04:51):
I had never written a book before, so it was something that was.
Such an accomplishment.
And that's just everything from basic understanding from your puppy development stages to adolescents and how to work through challenging behaviors.
And then last year I thought, oh, I'd love to write a children's book, because it's just so many families with children that.
(05:17):
With dogs at home or even dogs that they come across in the streets can, be quite problematic.
And it's from the dog's perspective.
So my children's book is called A Friend Named Dog, and that's just part of my passion and my approach with when it comes to helping families and the dogs that are a part of those families.
Understanding body language and what to do if the dog looks like this.
(05:40):
And it's okay to not say hello, even if they're cute and fluffy.
Look at what the whole dog's body language is telling you.
So those are the books that I've written and it's just always primarily my goal to help families and anyone who has a dog.
Fantastic.
Where can people find your books? I know we're not selling, but that's so a valuable one.
(06:03):
So mainly on Amazon in New Zealand, they've sold on my website, but you can also find them on Amazon.
Fabulous.
Fab.
You.
I guess seeing as you put your cards on the table, I should put mine out there too.
So my name's Jamie Dalton and the official blurb, if you like, is that I'm the Director of Studies at Canine Principals.
(06:27):
I'm the principal at the international school, the Canine Psychology, and I also head up the International Institute for Canine Ethics.
My passion is cognitive led dog rehabilitation is something that I've been studying for about 15 years now.
And using that to rehabilitate using cognitive led methods to rehabilitate rescue dogs and dogs who've experienced traumas.
(06:56):
For example, post-surgery or post traumatic event, whether that be a bereavement where a dog.
Been with a body of a guardian, for example.
Or whether that be post a road traffic collision.
And cognitive led research is research.
Cognitive led rehab is something that I am really passionate about spreading the word about more.
(07:22):
I grew up training and showing Belgian Shepherds mal.
Back in the early eighties I was showing by the age of eight ring craft and obedience.
Don't even like the word now.
You must obey me and do as you are told.
(07:42):
I was apparently quite good at it at early teens.
Or tweens even.
I was being paid by breeders to show their dogs in the ring as well, because I was getting the results that they wanted, which was basically a dog that was interacting with me to show its best side off to a judge.
(08:07):
And a dog that felt safe and confident to interact with me.
And what I didn't realize until later on in life was that what I'd started to do was to build a space where the dog could decompress and to.
I'd get the dog that I was handling take it away from the show, away from the area, and just let it observe and let it be, rather than trying to interact with it, I'd literally just sit down on the floor, let the dog just chill.
(08:38):
And just let it do what it wanted.
And I didn't realize at the time that's what I was doing, but I just knew that's what the dog needed.
'cause I too was struggling with overwhelm in that environment.
And that's what the what the dog needed.
So I.
Later on in life.
Because obviously back then it was all choke chains and Barbara Woodhouse and harsh methods that never sat right with me.
(09:01):
It wasn't until I started my canine education and started learning and studying and devouring every single book that I could get my hands on.
And none of my books are not dogeared.
They're all highlighted scribbles on, and I think I give some of my friends who are more precious about.
Keeping their books in pristine condition, heart palpitations.
(09:22):
But yeah, so I've been studying dogs and obsessed with dogs for as long as I can remember.
One of my early childhood memories is memorizing a dog breed book from cover to cover.
But yes I started getting involved in the rescue world about 25 years ago.
(09:43):
Just probably just before the millennium.
And started to realize what a state the dog rescue world is in already back then it was and how many healthy dogs are euthanized every day because of the, the amount of dogs that we have here in the uk Is it the same over in New Zealand? I wouldn't unfortunately be that clued up with how bad it is here, but I know in South Africa it's horrendous.
(10:13):
It's not good.
And it's not just, it's not just.
Dogs with behavioral challenges, whatever the reason is, it would be economic states as well, or not being spayed or nted and so many unwanted litters.
It's overrun and they do the best that they can with what they have, but it is overrun.
(10:34):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think it's the same hearing that there are so many external factors, but ultimately, I don't think we should necessarily go down a rabbit hole on this and scare everyone on the first episode, but but it is it has been an ongoing problem.
The rescues are bursting in the, at the seams and.
(10:56):
There is nowhere for dogs to, to go.
But I did hear a stat and I was sent the source of it, but I can't remember right now.
That said that the most common cause of death in dogs under the age of three as a behavioral.
Problem or, yeah.
Which is pretty scary.
(11:17):
So the more we can do around education, the more guest experts that we can get in on the podcast, the more conversations we can have.
Absolutely.
And it's, and I think that's one of the most important things as well, because it's not just about.
Okay, I have a dog in my house.
It must listen.
I need to do this.
It must do as it's told.
And all these things that go along with either Gen un, unintentional generational training, how people were brought up with their dogs, with their parents, which is also a completely different era.
(11:47):
We know so much more and understand so much more about dogs now and families are also, I feel way more invested with their animals.
And they want to do the best that they can with their dogs, but they just they just are overwhelmed with the endless Google search and 20 different people saying 20 different things and their hearts are in the right place.
(12:09):
They try and implement these training strategies that are out there, but because it's just so conflicting and overwhelming, itten and unfortunately does more harm than it does.
Good.
And I think that's also why I'm so excited about this podcast is because we can just, everyone that we get involved, all of our brains, we all love and want the same thing.
(12:30):
And that's just to help the dogs and families that we work with and give them tools that is not coercion, intimidation, or consequence and going, this actually does work.
If you've got this challenge and you've got this problem.
These are the things that you can do, but this is why your dog is doing this.
Yeah.
And most of the time, anytime I talk to a client, the minute I go, this is why your dog is doing it, and they go oh, that makes so much sense.
(12:57):
Oh, and then their whole demeanor goes.
Okay, I can do this.
Because it's so much better as our human brains to have that understanding.
Yeah.
Because once we've got that, then the rest is easy to work with.
Yeah.
And I think one of the great things about.
This podcast, obviously I'm completely biased, but one of the great things about this podcast is that we're all coming at it.
(13:23):
Both of us and our guest experts we're all coming at it from a place of no pressure on the dog and doing things in a way that encourages.
The dog and empowers the dog to feel confident in making their own choices and know that they're safe to do that in a constructive, safe way for humans and dogs.
(13:45):
We are not saying go and let your dogs be free and feral on the streets and take no responsibility for whatever chaos they, they may cause.
Not saying that at all, but what we are saying is that.
Everything that we do with our dogs, every interaction that we have needs to be on a consent based level rather than us forcing them and expecting things from normal all the time.
(14:10):
We want them to want to be with us.
We want them to think of us as allies and teammates rather than controllers and suppresses and feel they have to be compliant and avoid in case something unpleasant happens.
Yeah, absolutely.
One of our dogs, maybe we should introduce our dogs.
That's a good idea because they're obviously the most important part of this.
(14:33):
Oh, for sure.
One of our, I've got four dogs.
I've got Chip, Charlie, dude, and Willow.
And we also have four children, and I always go through the dog's names before I get to the children's names.
Mom, I'm not a dog.
But Chip is an ex working sheep dog and she's been with us for seven months-ish now.
(14:58):
And she actually used to urinate with fear herself when she was thought that she was going to be asked to do something.
And the day that I saw her.
Rolling in Poo made me so happy because for the first two weeks of her life, she was just literally hiding her life of her life with us.
(15:22):
Yeah.
She was just hiding in her crate and just too scared to come out and to see her confidently skipping through the feels, relaxed body language, no tension, and just go, oh, there's some poo.
I think I'm gonna have a role in that.
Even saying that it's something.
Like it resonates with me so much because there, there will be in my career when I'm working with a client and they've got a rescue dog, right? You've got no history about this dog.
(15:51):
You don't know anything about them but you, you just work with the dog you have in front of you.
Yeah.
And.
The one lady that I'm actually thinking of, and this was back in South Africa, her dog was terrified of everything.
Spooked by shadows, movements, and very similar, just hiding, avoiding very low body language demeanor, stiff, rigid movements just in case someone looked at the, really traumatized.
(16:13):
Whatever happened to the dog, it wasn't good and worked with the dog for a couple of months.
And the beginning, we actually didn't do anything.
All it was 'cause.
Where I was in South Africa, I had training grounds and facilities.
So my clients in would come to me instead of me going to them like I do here.
Yes.
And she would, over a couple of weeks, she would just come, let the dog out, open the door in the car and we would just stand there and, we waited and she was so patient.
(16:40):
This woman was phenomenal because it takes a lot to be that patient because you don't get those results, that instant gratification you are wanting to achieve with this dog.
And after two months she phones me and she goes, you won't believe what my dog did.
And I was like, what? And I was so worried 'cause I thought it was gonna be bad.
And she goes, she jumped.
(17:03):
Went on the kitchen table and stole the ham, and we were so excited because the general person will go, oh my gosh, that's really rude.
No, you mustn't do that.
But for this particular dog, that dog was so brave to feel the confidence.
Yeah.
Get on the table and sneak a piece of ham and we were.
(17:23):
So ecstatic.
It was like the most amazing thing ever that this dog was so brave to steal ham.
But then again, that happened.
So all she did then was go, obviously this is not something we want to continue.
Yeah.
And it's environmental management, not leave things on the counter anymore.
And she never got the opportunity to repeat and rehearse the behavior so it didn't happen again.
(17:44):
But I think a lot of people don't realize that whatever you give feedback to, whatever behavior you give feedback to, whether it's negative feedback or positive feedback, that's the behavior you're going to see getting repeated.
So if you are, if you're scolding a dog, you are giving it feedback on that behavior, albeit negative behavior.
(18:05):
Negative feedback.
So what we are looking to do is create an environment where we are taking responsibility for our actions.
It's us looking internally at how we can set that dog up for success rather than punishing a dog for behaving in a certain way.
That reminds me of my long hair rot.
(18:28):
That reminds me of my longhaired, Rotty boy that sadly went over Rainbow Bridge about five years ago now.
But he was my rock.
He was an absolute legend and he came, he was I.
From a house where he'd been kept in an under stair cupboard and he'd been, they had a table leg just to beat him with.
And he was a sort of late night rescue mission that, and he was they managed to get him out and he came, basically came to me just overnight, until rescue space was found.
(18:59):
And then 10 years later, sadly we lost him.
But the, but when he first came, he would.
He was so scared to look anywhere apart from a head in the house.
Like he would walk past a plate of food that was on the floor or anything.
He would just be like, oh my goodness.
Oh my goodness.
When he would run when we were outside, he'd run looking backwards.
(19:23):
He was more scared of what was coming behind him then.
Yeah.
What was in front to the point that he would crash into things which other people might have seen as funny.
But actually it was fear.
Yeah.
It was pure fear.
And I remember the day when my husband rang and said I had a ham sandwich.
(19:43):
It's oh, what you mean? He said a customer came in.
I went out.
Came back, ham sandwich was gone.
Shouldn't have left it on your desk then.
Really? Should you? Yeah.
But that's also felt confident enough to Yeah, and that's, and those are the things, and it's, it's.
(20:06):
Any behavior and it's helping people understand and adjust expectations.
And it is, the expectations are unintentional.
We we speak people, dog speaks dog and we are the bridge of that communication, that species gap.
And it's, a lot of controversy around everywhere going, oh, dogs are not children, don't treat them like children.
(20:27):
They're dogs.
And I go.
Absolutely.
They are not children.
However, the cognitive ability levels are remarkably similar to a two and a half to 3-year-old child.
There, there are things that.
Dogs are exceptional at problem solving predicting patterns of behaviors.
They know the shoes you're putting on for walking versus the when you go out the door, the cupboard you reach to for the dog lead, and, the food cupboard because they're really good at things like that.
(20:56):
But the cognitive ability to distinguish the difference between.
Consequences that people, and only in people minds that humans understand is completely different because you'll have the scenario of the dog messing to eat the Hamm.
It should know that's on the kitchen table.
It's out of reach.
Dogs are natural scavengers.
They're opportunist eaters, they're opportunistic.
(21:18):
It's going, oh, that smells quite nice.
Thank you.
And that's how they've survived for thousands of years.
Yeah, with people.
That's it.
Survival is paramount, isn't it? Yeah.
Food is survival and it's, and that's what it boils down to because there's so many things that it's helping people understand that this dog is not being deliberately defined, rude or naughty.
(21:40):
Not trying to control, wake up in the morning and go, oh, how am I going to rule this household? The dog wakes up and goes.
Probably most and I'm projecting, oh, I'm hungry.
I need to wee.
Then you let them out and you have that pattern every single day.
And any other behaviors or challenges that are unwanted or unpleasant, that is emotion based, that is something either lack of exposure or negative association, or just the dog not having that ability to navigate a situation or event.
(22:11):
Those, that's where we come in and just help shape the behaviors we're looking for.
I've got a question for you then, leading off that.
Yeah.
Would you, what would you say is the one kind of myth or misconception that you wish more people really understood? Oh, I don't think there's one.
(22:36):
Can I with two, two calls out a scroll? Can I go with two? Go for it.
Alright, so I think it's dominance and path leadership.
Yeah, it's, those two for me are the, are tricky because.
(22:58):
At the end of the day, dominance is not a personality trait.
And this is, this goes around in the, in, in the training industry.
It's a behavior.
Sophia y wrote a beautiful paragraph about dominance, and it's actually more towards survival of the fit, right? And if you change that word, dominance to survival, you're gonna have a very different interpretation of that word, because dominance is not a strategy to be better.
(23:24):
Because I'm the best of everything.
It is to gain.
Vital resources to promote survival.
And that is like breeding rights, territory food.
'cause if you don't eat, you die.
If you don't have a warm, dry place that's safe, you could die.
You're vulnerable.
And these are all basic instincts.
Part of our primitive wiring with an, whether it's a dog or human.
(23:46):
And if a dog displays an undesirable behavior that usually stems from defensive responses, protective responses, all these things that happen that the dog has no control over and pet leadership.
When they did that study with caps of wolves, it was, they were captive, they were squished in a very tiny space that was.
Utterly unnatural.
(24:07):
They all came from different, they weren't related, were they even? Yeah.
They weren't related, and they were incredibly stressed.
So packed leadership where they go alpha, the alpha bitch and the alpha male, controlled the subordinates and they ate first and they put them in their place.
If they showed any those animals were highly stressed, so their behaviors were quite extreme and exaggerated because of their environment survival mode as well.
(24:31):
All the time.
And then what happens is they go, oh dogs are quite like wolves, so they must be the same.
And the domestic dog being bred for thousands of years for, engineered for specific purposes is different.
Their brains are smaller, their jaws are smaller.
They're, so maybe similar parallels with regards to a common ancestor, gray wolf, but.
(24:54):
There's still a domestic dog.
And they're still the separate species.
And the idea of the control and correction, which that word just goes, do that.
It's and it's so hard because.
I never ever want to offend anybody because then they get defensive and if they feel defensive then I can't help them because then they feel, oh, now I've done something wrong.
(25:20):
Then they may feel bad, and that's not what we want to do.
We want to empower the people we work with, give them the confidence.
Like I say to my clients all the time, I'll go, my job is not to be with you all the time.
My job is to see you a couple of times, depending on how complex the behavior is.
Maybe a little bit more than a couple.
But it's to give you that confidence in the tools that you know what to do and how to implement it without me.
(25:45):
And it's that knowledge that's empowering.
It's that knowledge of you are, you do not need to assert, I.
This kind of intimidation and going do, as you're told, yank on the lead.
No you're pulling, and the dog's kind of going, what's going on? But I just wanted to smell that smell, and you're going, oh, you're trying to walk in front of me and be the leader.
(26:06):
And now you're just adding unpleasant experiences and the dog is not making that connection because the timing of learning and the timing of associative learning is so important because.
When those things happen, the dog might make a completely different association than what you think they're making.
So with regards to my different tangent on your question, I think the dominance and the pack leadership is the two main ones that is very difficult to work through in, in with the general audience.
(26:38):
Yeah.
Yeah, I agree.
And I think the training.
The human is more important than training the dog because not only are we and doing it in a fun way where possible.
Yeah.
So that we're empowering them and making them feel like they are achieving and they're getting some sort of little gamification bits maybe.
(27:01):
And they're, their brains are like, wow, this is cool.
I'm actually enjoying this.
Dopamine.
Dopamine motivation.
Dopamine.
Yeah, exactly.
Exactly.
You can't just give them bits of cheese or chicken, but you you might some, but we want people to love.
Doing what they're doing with their dogs in a positive way, because then the dog will also pick up on that.
(27:26):
Yeah.
And the dog will know that actually your heart rate is raised, your breath rate's increased.
Or if you are like me, when you are concentrating, you actually hold your breath and the dog thinks, oh my goodness, you're gonna die.
But these dogs are amazing beings.
They can.
(27:46):
Smell for the most.
They've got what, 220 million to 300 million hair receptacles? Where's ear and the jacobson's organ for special processing? It's phenomenal what they hearing, that is a three mile radius.
No, it sensor a three mile radius, isn't it? I can't remember now.
It would, I can't confidently say because I can't recall, but it is very far, very one per menopausal brain here as well.
(28:13):
It's amazing.
But they can smell like a drop of, I can't remember what it was, the experiment where they did a drop of something in a Someone watching or No, in a swimming pool.
And the dogs could sniff out the comments.
Find your little J.
Do you remember? It's a while ago now.
But yeah, so they are these amazing beings and we try and tell them that the first thing we say is sit or down.
(28:38):
It's what? And it is the sit.
The sit.
Don't get me wrong.
The sit is great.
It is.
It is so overused because, depends on the dog though, as well.
And it depends on the dog and the person.
Hounds, they can't, their body Yeah.
Their body shape just isn't made to sick.
Absolutely.
And it is it's easy to teach the sit And I think that's what, we get the most gratification.
(29:01):
'cause it's the instant gratification, right? It's the quick fix.
Yeah.
It's not quick fix.
It's the quick.
I've got managements, I've got control.
My dogs responded to me.
Oh yay, this is working.
Okay, so we do this all the time, but sometimes, and it's completely unintentional.
Sometimes the sit doesn't deal with the behavior you're trying to work with.
(29:21):
It's just the bandage, and it's fine for basic tasks and simple exercises, but let's say getting your dog to sit before crossing the road every time.
It is not necessarily ideal because what you would probably want to work on the most is impulsivity.
The dog giving you the sit gives you management.
(29:42):
Absolutely.
Because you can't have the dog rolling all over the place while you're trying to cross the road.
Look left and right to make sure it's safe, but it's the, Hey buddy, wait.
Without the sit.
Okay, great.
Yeah.
That's the life skill because that's impulse control, that's management.
That's, predictable pattern of behavior.
The dog understands, which I'm not taking away from the sit.
(30:02):
No, but I've never seen a dog walk up to a road without a guardian and sit down by the side of the road and go, oh, I just think I'll sit here a minute and wait and see if any cars.
I need to say my misconception before I forget.
'cause I've the, you have walk your dog four times a day.
(30:28):
No, people say that though.
And it used to be the thing like you have to walk your dog.
Some of the rescue dogs that I've fostered over the years, take weeks before we even go out the house because they're just not feeling safe enough.
And hundred percent safety foundations, if you haven't got those in place before you leave the house and you build up gradually and.
(30:53):
Adds up.
It's just trigger after trigger, stacking after trigger, stacking over stimulation.
You.
Oh, wow.
That's, I love that you brought that up.
That is excellent.
It's a whole rabbit hole right there.
That is it's so common.
And I had a gentleman a couple of, oh, maybe two years ago, and he had.
A little Maltese cross, cute little fluffy noodle of multiple mixes.
(31:17):
And he was walking him three times a day and he goes, I have to get out.
The dog's gotta get out.
Go.
Because you've gotta take the dog out for a walk the dog, because a tired dog is a good dog.
Another misconception, and yeah, went through a couple of things.
Something wasn't right.
And I said to him do me a favor.
Let's just see how this goes.
Remember, everything's a process of elimination, right? Don't walk your dog for two weeks for me, and then only walk your dog once every second day and see how that goes.
(31:48):
And by the fourth week.
The dog was so much better.
Way more relaxed in demeanor and confidence to smell when in 'cause they were walking Just to sniff.
Just to feel able to sniff.
Yeah.
And he said, my dog had never sniffed before.
He goes, this is amazing.
And the dog was actually pro taking in the smells and processing the world around them instead of rushing past the roses.
(32:12):
But it's, I think it's what you mentioned earlier on, it's a bit like it's what we've always done, so it's what we've got to do.
Whereas actually it's not what we've always done because if you look way back into history, they just used to open the back doors and let the dogs out for the day.
So it's not what we've always done.
It is come in.
I'm not suggesting that's what we should do now by any stretch, but it's.
(32:34):
What we need to be doing is working on the safety foundations and the dog's basic needs, and making sure that they're pain free.
They've got no dental pain.
They've got no allergies that are bugging them.
They've got no arthritis.
They've got no issues.
That gut.
Intestinal problems that are causing them pain and discomfort.
We need to be working on their nutrition and making sure that we're actually looking at the contents of the food that they're getting and doing our research.
(33:02):
Yeah, because so often we see the the bigger brands that maybe have more of a marketing budget who've got that confident, bold marketing.
Trumping the ones that are actually the nutritional ones that maybe aren't packed for the cereals and have got the right balances of foods in the, and not rendered the same way that destroys so many amino acids.
(33:27):
S as well.
Yeah.
And also the sleep thing is something I'm super passionate as well, is making sure that they actually have the opportunity and they're taking the opportunity to get proper remedial sleep.
Where they're flat out, yeah, on their sides.
You've got that really nice big rise and fall of the chest.
You've got other parts of their body that are moving 'cause they're so relaxed.
(33:50):
And just making sure those foundations are in place before you start dragging your dog out for a walk.
Yeah.
'cause you wanna build up to desensitizing the equipment that they're the equipment.
Hopefully you are looking at a harness.
Yes.
With a Y front, you are definitely not using a slip lead or even a flat collar that is putting pressure on your dog's poor, sensitive neck, and their skin's a lot thinner than ours as well.
(34:19):
So not only is it giving them.
Intraocular pressure, potential for damage around the neck.
But you're actually looking at a more balanced approach, and I always like two points of contact, one on the chest, one on the back, so that it's more balanced for them and rotation of the shoulder so dogs can extend than you're wheelchair.
Then not limited, but we're making sure that we're setting these dogs up for success because, for example, I used.
(34:49):
Used to take dogs from a rescue that I worked with sighthounds, greyhounds who'd come straight off the racing track, used to take them down, Fort touch, Tellington, touch with practitioners who were in their final throws of becoming tea touch practitioners.
And one of the first things they picked up with on these dogs were that they were on collars.
(35:13):
And these dogs have been racing round a racetrack always the same way.
Yeah.
And they've been going from 40 miles an hour to a dead stop.
And their necks were the shock absorbers and their necks had so much tension in them and so much pain and discomfort.
Then you put a collar in a lead on that and the dog's not naturally able to elongate its neck 'cause everything's tensed.
(35:37):
On any dog nevermind a greyhound off the track.
But that's another rabbit hole.
We could go down another day.
Oh, definitely one of those.
That's my jam.
It's all good.
So you guys are in for a whole heap of fun with this podcast.
We're gonna go down lots of different rabbit holes, but we have got some fabulous guest experts coming on.
(35:58):
We're going to be talking about a different theme each week, and we are going to be looking at case studies.
You guys can message in questions.
You can comment questions on the post.
And we'll reply to you.
We're gonna be talking about book discussions and we're just gonna be really having honest chats about the emotional side of living with and loving our dogs with a real emphasis on practical and compassionate support for dog guardians, ethical dog professionals, and just dog geeks like us.
(36:32):
Really just trying to make the world a better place.
One dog at a time.
One dog at a time.
So before we wrap up, I do think it's really important that we do actually introduce our dogs then, because really they are the stars of the show.
And I think that people, if you don't want to know about our dogs, why are you listening? Really, quite frankly.
(36:55):
Do you wanna go first? Yeah.
Oh, he's out.
Oh, we are waking up in, in his defense.
It is what's the time now? Oh, 11 minutes past seven.
Thursday morning.
In the morning.
In the morning.
Yeah.
I think you've seen the light come in as the podcast has gone on.
(37:15):
Hold on.
We are itchy.
You don't have to bring him on.
Just tell us about him and where he came from.
Oh, sorry.
I was gonna just show you 'cause he has the most beautiful face in the world.
I think that's, I think my dogs have actually got the most beautiful faces.
So his name is Cooper.
He's just reached 18 months.
I, he's pretty chilled golden retriever.
(37:39):
He's quite goofy, which I absolutely love.
He is only recently graduated to me dropping my long line on walks, which I've had some interesting comments of people going.
But you work with dogs.
He should have a recall like so early and I was like no.
I love him, but he will leave me for water.
(38:00):
And that's putting him in a situation to fail and rehearse a behavior I really don't want to encourage.
He has his freedom.
And all of that.
But he is now 18 months and graduated to long line dropping, and I've got a, I'll say 99% recall because I never have a hundred.
Depends on what's around, but he's pretty awesome.
(38:20):
Hangs out with me with reports and work and the grooming salon that I have because we do reward-based grooming and we do, so that's probably one of the services I offer.
So he chills out with us and really nice distraction for the other dogs.
'cause when the dogs get a break and they compatible with him, then they play.
So he's my little C spot.
(38:41):
Learn.
Support dog.
He's a little bird.
He's fabulous.
Yeah.
There's something really interesting there in the the recall a hundred percent recall, and people say You should have a hundred percent recall, but I challenge you to.
Find a beagle that has gone beagle because their ears or a bloodhound, their ears are designed to waft the scents up to their noses.
(39:08):
So once their heads are down, they've got sensory overwhelm from all of the information that they're processing with those scents wafting up their noses.
And those dogs, like the Bloodhounds for example, have got the 300 million head head.
What's the word I'm looking for, Emily? Thank you.
(39:29):
They've got the increased amount, which means that their sense of smell is even more powerful than all of all of the breeds.
With 220 million plus, is it million or thousand? I just don't, I remember, I recall 5 million, but who? Who? Oh, someone five.
And it's humans.
That's us.
Dogs are not robot models.
(39:49):
Oh, they're not Jess.
Well done.
No, and I think we are not perfect.
So why would we ever expect any other being to be perfect? They're freethinking.
They're sentient beings.
Absolutely.
I need to introduce my dogs before we go, please.
Chip is the colleague that I talked about.
She's red and white.
(40:10):
She is beautiful.
She lived working the sheep in the hills up north all her life.
We.
Had to adopt her.
When we heard about her, because it wasn't from a rescue, it was from someone who was rehoming her because she needed a quieter life.
(40:31):
She's now nine.
So at least they were rehoming her, which is good.
Turns out she's actually scared of sheep, the poor girl.
So she's spent her whole life being forced to do something.
And she's actually scared of sheep, bless her.
Whether that's association fear or whether that's how it's always been, we'll never know.
(40:51):
But she has just because she lives in a, we were told when we got her that we should let her out for an hour a day from her kennel and then put her back in.
Oh, that's not happening.
Okay.
Bye bye.
Bye.
My dog.
She has recently discovered, so first of all, she discovered sofa cuddles.
(41:16):
So at first she was very much I'm not sure I'm allowed up here.
And every morning once she discovered them she, we.
Come into the room and she'd be all like, she does all a happy little dance.
And then she started just sitting on the sofa really quietly and just sitting there and I realized she was waiting for sofa snuggles.
So I'd go and sit at the other end and she'd come over and be like, oh.
(41:40):
And then about three or four weeks ago.
I just, I was sat on the sofa with Charlie, who's our terrier yeah, who I'll introduce in a minute.
Although many of you watching who have watched stuff where with me before, will be familiar with his butthole.
'cause he likes to walk across the camera, relay it to everyone.
(42:01):
But she was, chip was watching Charlie on my lap from the other sofa.
And then he got off and she came and jumped on and just put her head on my lap.
And she was very much I don't know if I'm supposed to do this.
I like it.
I like it.
And so we've graduated now to I'm here.
(42:24):
I sat face on your face, so we're working with that.
But just that she feels confident enough to be around us is just incredible because she was so shut down and petrified when she first came.
And she did have fear based.
Reactivity yeah, as well.
So she's come so far in seven months and is such a brave girl.
(42:48):
She's a real cutie.
Then I feel like I should speed up because I could talk all night about my dogs and I've got a few That's okay.
We can end it and carry on talking.
Charlie is the terrier.
He is a cool dude.
He was actually drugged for the first nine months of his life because his guardians got him as a puppy and both of them were diagnosed with cancer, sadly within a.
(43:15):
Couple of weeks of getting him and with their treatments, they found it really hard to cope with a puppy, Jack Russell.
And they, at age nine months finally came to the conclusion that they were going to have to rehome him.
And I'm still in touch with them.
They're absolutely wonderful people.
They're fabulous.
And I send them pictures all the time.
(43:36):
And he was three a month ago.
He is, the most amazing dog, if you're ever having a bad day, half an hour with him and the world is in two minutes with him and the World is an amazing place.
That's his Viva is just like he loves.
Life and life is there for living.
He's just incredible.
(43:58):
And he'll bring you a toy and he'll be like, oh, let's play with this.
Let's play with this, and you'll do something with it.
And then he'll go towards it and then suddenly go, oh, actually squirrel, just be, he is just cracking.
And then we've got Willow.
Willow is.
(44:18):
Seven-ish.
She wa she came over from Ireland where she was found scavenging in BIM bags when she was maybe about four or five weeks old.
She was tiny.
She was rehomed I think twice, maybe three times before she came to us.
Age, four months.
Multiple homes at such an early age.
(44:38):
Such a baby.
And she was such a baby.
I always remember the.
First day we went up to meet her at kennels and my husband crouched down and she belly crawled to him.
I really wanna say hello, but I'm so scared right now.
Yeah.
When she was one, she developed cluster seizure epilepsy.
And she got so bad that by the time she was two we had her booked in to be put to sleep on the vet's advice.
(45:03):
Twice and twice we'd been on the way to the vets.
The first time my daughter rang me in absolute bits and said, people do this.
Please don't do this.
At least, at least let me say goodbye.
'cause she wasn't living at home at the time.
Yeah.
And the second time it just felt so wrong.
She wasn't even three at that point.
So we'd gone through all of the channels that we could, pushed it as far as we could with the vets, the veterinary hospital.
(45:30):
She'd had they can't.
Diagnose epilepsy.
They have to rule everything else out.
So she'd had fluid, acid fluid taken from the brainstem.
Yeah.
And tested.
And it come back basically that it wasn't anything else, so it had to be epilepsy.
Okay.
And finally we introduced Skullcap and Valerian.
(45:52):
In amongst the high dosage of drugs that she was on, we introduced that as a natural one.
And she, her seizures started to the frequency of seizures started to calm down.
So the reason that she'd been booked in all this bit of feedback there.
The reason she'd been booked in to be put to sleep was because she was having 20 seizures over two days, every two weeks, and it was taking.
(46:16):
It was crazy.
It was taking a week to recover between, at least with it between seizures.
So she was literally having a few days of quality of life before she'd be hit again.
Yeah.
So it was really horrific time.
And there's a wonderful Facebook group for.
Guardians who've got epileptic dogs.
And that was my sanity in the early hours.
(46:37):
Many, many a time when I was despairing.
So Willow's a very special girl.
We never know how much borrowed time we're on with her, but she's now seven.
She's just grateful for what you have.
Absolutely.
If you, would you be able to share that Facebook? 'cause I think that would help.
Yeah, that would help so many.
Yeah.
Yeah.
She, that's amazing.
(46:57):
Honestly, that group in the middle of the night and people saying, do you know what you are saying, my dog was there and was at that horrific point, and we did this, we tried this.
And for me, just knowing that I wasn't on my own in the middle of the night.
Yeah.
And despairing it, it is really horrible feeling.
So yes, so Willow is very special and she still does zoomies and she still bounces around like a.
(47:22):
Nutter.
The only thing I'd say with Willow the effect that the epilepsy has had on her body means that she's gone gray a lot earlier than we would've expected her to.
She was completely black with just a tiny white stripe on her head and a white chest area.
But when she was younger, but she was completely you'll see pictures with of her on some of the socials.
(47:45):
She's pretty much gray now all over.
And then finally as dude we.
Yeah, we didn't know his name when he came into rescue, so we just You named him dude.
We didn't name him dude.
It was just like, do you wanna come in, dude? And then he'd decided his name was dude.
So we just stuck with dude.
Oh, I love that so much.
(48:07):
But dude had cloud coma in his eye when he came into rescue, so he had to have one eye removed pretty quickly.
And the other eye had to have very expensive drops for a very long time, which were paid for by the rescue.
But it just goes to show if you know a good ethical rescue and you can support them in any way, it doesn't have to be fostering or anything like that.
(48:30):
If you can just afford a few, afford a couple of quid here and there, it can go to the dog dude.
So yeah, dude, I was removed.
He had the other one for another year after we got him.
And then that one.
The pressure in it built up and he had to have that one out two years ago I think now.
(48:50):
So he's probably about 11.
He also has to have most of his teeth out as well, so he has nothing to hold his tongue in his mouth really.
So his tongue, he, yeah.
I.
Make dude into a human.
I think he'd be like an old school country gentleman with a tweed coat on, and really good manners.
(49:13):
He is just such an absolute treasure.
He's such a darling.
What they did though, when they removed the first eyes, they put a prosthetic eyeball in.
Oh.
Okay.
When they removed the second eye, they didn't, so the prosthetic eyeball on the one side held the shape of his face.
Yeah, on the other side.
They didn't put one in.
So he looks Oh yeah.
(49:34):
Mismatched and his tongue rolls out.
Oh, he's a dude.
He is a darling.
That is such a great name.
He's massive as well.
He's got his own sofa.
He doesn't like sharing that.
That's his, so they're.
Anyway, we've gone down a million rabbit holes that are not related to the podcast, but it gives you a taste of what we are like, our personalities, the dogs behind the scenes and the kind of vibe, the vision that we've got for the podcast, the difference that we want to make, the education that we want to spread in a kind, ethical, positive way, and, I feel like maybe I should give you a little snippet of what's coming up next week.
(50:19):
Next week we're going to be talking about canine emotions, and we have got a mystery guest next week.
Keep watching the canine principles socials, I.
And we will be revealing who the mystery guest is.
I think many of you will have heard of them and you will love who we've got coming on.
(50:40):
But I'm going to keep that a secret for the minute, just a little bit.
The rest of this season of the Dog Expert Podcast, we are going to be introducing you to some of our homegrown, our own ex.
Experts in some of the canine principles, tutor teams.
(51:00):
So if you are actually studying with canine principles, you may already have come across some of the guest experts that we're going to be having on.
We are going to be talking about some really cool topics and each week at the end of the episode.
Episode will tell you what's coming next week.
But we've got some great, we've actually got content lined up until February next year.
(51:22):
We brain dumped it.
We were like, oh my gosh, and we have to talk about this and we have to.
So we've got a few things in the pipeline for you, and we've got some amazing people coming up to share their pearls of wisdom, all with the same values and the same passion that Emily and I have got.
(51:46):
So we want to say a massive thank you, don't we, for joining us.
Oh, thank you so much.
One down a hundred to go.
A hundred.
Is that all? Yes.
Let's try for more, but thank you.
Thank you so much for joining.
It's such a, oh, I'm just.
This is so exciting, so nerve wracking and exciting all in one.
(52:09):
And Jo, you're amazing.
So I'm just happy to co-host with you and I think we are going to have so much fun.
We are gonna have so much fun.
And hopefully you guys will too.
We will lovely leave you there.
We'll look forward to speaking about all things canine emotions with our miss.
Guest next week.
(52:29):
Please do hit the subscribe button guys and share your love.
Share the podcast as well with anyone else who you think would like it to anyone you think would benefit from it.
We would love for you to share with.
With them too.
And I have got a little outro clip to play you, but I can't find it.
(52:56):
Can I, while you look for it? Yeah.
Can.
People who are viewing, is there a place for them to write their questions of things that they find the most pressing, and then we can address them whenever we can, or if there's a common theme, then we can add that into our very long.
List long brain dump.
(53:19):
Yeah.
But we might also be able to address them on message and we might also on the chat and we might also be able to address them and tie them into some of the subjects that we've already got lined up.
And we might even be able to get specific guest experts from our amazing network that we're.
So blessed to be surrounded by to come on and chat to you specifically about what you're asking.
(53:43):
So yes, do pop in the comments.
We will keep an eye on the comments and respond to you in the comments or email info@canineprinciples.com
and we will come back to you as soon as we can.
So it's a thank you very much from me and a thank you very much from Emily.
Thank.
(54:05):
See you next week.
Thank you for listening to the Dog Expert Podcast, the podcast dogs would want you to listen to.
If you've enjoyed this episode, do come and let us know in our free Facebook group for dog lovers Everywhere Ethical Dog Training with Canine principles.
That way we can make more content like this that you'll love.
(54:28):
We would love for you to leave a review on here and hit subscribe so that you never miss an episode.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.