November 18, 2025 • 41 mins
Holidays and family gatherings often bring out the best and sometimes the worst in behavior. How can parents prepare their children to navigate social situations with grace and respect? In this episode of the Gospel Shaped Family Podcast, Josh and Jen share why teaching manners matters and how it reflects the dignity of others made in God’s image
They outline ten essential etiquette skills every child should know, from saying “please” and “thank you” to practicing table manners and making introductions. You’ll also hear practical ways to train children, including simple practice at home, recommended books like Manners Begin at Breakfast and Emily Post’s Etiquette, and even community etiquette classes
Whether it’s preparing for holiday dinners or everyday interactions, this conversation offers biblical wisdom and hands-on strategies to help children grow into respectful, considerate adults.
Subscribe now and join us as we shape hearts, homes, and churches around the gospel one conversation at a time. Check us out on YouTube, Rumble and anywhere you get audio podcasts.
Book 50 Things Every Child Needs to Know Before Leaving Home: https://bit.ly/50thingspc
Renewanation: https://bit.ly/rangsfpc
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Manners Begin at Breakfast: Modern Etiquette for Families: https://amzn.to/4h5uj4z
Emily Post's Etiquette, 19th Edition: Manners for Today:https://amzn.to/4h7xc50
Twice Freed by Patricia St. John https://amzn.to/4h5cyCo
Patricia St. John Box Set https://amzn.to/3KFhAtc
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
I'm Josh and I'm Jen.
Welcome to the GospelShaped Family podcast.
Each episode brings biblical wisdomand practical conversations
on parenting, marriage, and family,and we discuss
how to disciple the next generationwith a biblical worldview.
Whether you're raising children,shepherding a church, or longing
(00:20):
to build a legacy of faith in your home,this podcast is for you.
Join us as we explore how to shape hearts,homes, and churches around the gospel,
one conversation at a time.
Hey everyone!
Welcome back to the GospelSheep Family Podcast.
Good to see you all. It's a good day.
(00:40):
Well, the holidays are approachingChristmas and Thanksgiving.
I should say that in a different order.
Thanksgiving and Christmasare right around the corner.
And today we're tackling the topic of
how to teach our kids, mannersand some basic common etiquette.
We know that that Thanksgiving dinneris right around the corner.
(01:03):
You mean you mean your children aren't,like, perfectly behaved
and know how to act in public and like,just perfectly all the time?
Always perfect.
Whenever I think of this, there's, like,
this book serieswe read to the kids where the premise was,
that somebody said, those children
act like they were raised by wolves, butthen they were actually raised by wolves.
(01:24):
In the book series.
Book, I forget, ash,the mysterious of Ashton Blaze.
Anyways, I was think
where they raised.
That's a good series. Yeah,
they were the incorrigible
children of Ashton Place.
Yeah, that was athey were raised by wolves.
They were raised by wolves.They acted like
(01:46):
they did not know about mannersor etiquette and really basic ways.
Yeah.
Did you, were you trainedwith any kind of manners or etiquette?
Grown up? Oh, let me think.
I don't know,
I don't remember,you know, specific, like,
like meal time.
(02:06):
Please.
And thank you type of things.
I remember, you know, I was a musician,so I remember learning very easily.
Learning concert etiquette,
you know, like,
how to stand, how to sit,how to, like, up slide.
I remember that stuff.
But that's not like real life mannersand etiquette type things.
(02:29):
I'm sure my parents instilledthose things.
You know, like, say, thank you.
I don't remember itever being very formal, but,
I don't know.
Your parents were so intentional.
Oh, man.
I have a ton in this area.
Yeah, you had a lot.
I was raised mostly in Texas growing up,and we were trained to say yes, ma'am.
Ma'am? Yes, sir, no, sir.
(02:50):
And then with that in Minnesotaand we moved to Minnesota,
you know, I'mI've got this southern boy accent.
I don't have it now.
They they ridiculed it out of me by now,but, I, I would say yes, ma'am, no, ma'am.
And people in Minnesotaliterally said, don't call me ma'am.
Yeah.
And I remember
my parents had to sit this downand they said, they don't do that up here.
(03:13):
You need to stop sayingthat they like untrained.
That's for etiquette.
But we were, you know,my parents are in full time ministry,
and so theythere was a lot of training about how to.
Yeah. I'm sure.
Look, people in the eyeand shake hands and interact.
We sat in a lot of living rooms with,
you know, raising support for our family.
(03:35):
And, you know, they don'tyou don't want a child that's unruly
and naughtyand doesn't know how to operate.
And I remember, one point,my mom wanted to teach us
how to eat and sit at a table,like in, more of a formal setting.
And I remember, a coupleshe did a couple of week
(03:56):
training on how to set the table where,
where the napkin goes,where the fork goes, the knife, the spoon.
How you sit at a table properly,
you know, putting a napkin on your lap,no elbows on the table. And,
you know, we think,you know, it's like, at this point,
(04:17):
you know, with our home, it'snot a big deal,
but there's always situationsthat a lot of us as adults
end up in now where that is appropriate
in some more business or formal
settings, social that it's like,wow, that's
that has been really helpful in my lifeas an adult.
Yeah. Many, many times.
(04:37):
Yeah. I love that.
Well, one of my favorite quotes is fromEmily Post.
Emily Post is like the Queen of etiquette,and she has this quote.
It says this nobody wakes upin the morning and says,
I think I'll be rude today.
Nobody says that.
And most of
us think of ourselvesas being polite and kind,
(05:01):
but there's always that situation whenwe're in a hurry or we're under stress or,
you know, we just get lazy and we don'talways use the manners that we should.
So we thought it would be greatto talk about what are some common
etiquette things,and why are we teaching those to our kids?
Because we don't want to be the personwho is rude today.
(05:23):
Yeah, yeah.
So first reason, of course, is thatsimply is a reflection of the image of God
and the dignity of other people, that it'shonoring to them, to treat them in a way
that's respectful and, and courteous.
And so this recognizes, recognizes that.
Yeah.
Oh, and anotherreason be Jenny Penny today.
(05:44):
Another reason
is that, the world we live incan just be rude.
It can be rude, it can be angry.
It can be unkind.
And we don't want thatto become the default for our kids.
We don't want that to be somethingthat they see as being acceptable.
We want to be the antithesis of that.
(06:07):
We want to be kind and loving,to the people that are around us.
And not just rude, but also coarse.
Oh yeah. Rude.
I think of the,you know, the just what's on TV
from like even in cartoons for kidsor a lot of, you know, a lot of kids
movies will have charactersfarting like burping humor.
(06:30):
You know,you're going to get a laugh in a movie
and then you know that that impacts kidsthinking that that's normal and funny.
And, you know, we've got three boys.
So there's, there's a lot of,training in this area that happens.
And we all will say to our boys,if you ever want to date or marry
(06:50):
a woman, they're not going to appreciatethat like you.
And you're goingto, you know, you need to move out.
And you know, every guy.
You know, I won't say every guy,but most guys, we've been there and,
you know, and we've we've had,we've had to get trained in this area,
but our world just is isn't is
it is it is formation all in this waywith our kids in a negative way.
(07:13):
So we have to do some counter formationtraining in their life or otherwise.
That becomes the, the default, I think.
Yeah.
And so, we're also preparing our childrenfor every situation.
And, you know, we like to say they're,we're helping them get ready to dine
with kings or with queens, you know,more than likely that may never happen.
(07:37):
But in the event that we end upsitting down with individuals that,
are in that kind of level of influence,
we want our kids to be comfortable,fluent, have, you know, confident.
No. And we have had, at times we have had
the opportunityto be in situations like that where,
(07:57):
you know, political figures or,the other influential figures,
I'll just share a funny story of what,our son John.
So I graduated with a PhD
from Southern Seminary, and,
Southern Seminary.
The president is our Mohler.
And one of the things Al Mohler does
(08:19):
when you graduate with a PhD, it'sonly the PhD students.
He invites all of the PhD studentsand their family over to his house.
And they he puts on this very formal,
you know, this just,you know, party or d'oeuvres.
Yeah. Or d'oeuvres.
Charcuterie in the, like, white tent,
(08:42):
you know, in his backyard.
They've servers with, you know, wearing
very, very fancy things in his home.
It's like a two scale model of MountVernon.
Yeah, of where George Washington lived.
Yeah, I mean, it's.
Yeah, it's a replica, so. Right.
Know, we've lived in the countryfor a very long time, and,
(09:02):
and so our kids, when they're little,we have allowed them to go to the bathroom
outside are potty trained potty training.
John. Yes.
As boys, but we hadn't trained himin, in some certain ways in the area.
So we were at Albert Moliere's house,fancy party outside and all this stuff.
And I look and John's by a treewith his pants down doing.
(09:23):
He's like 2 or 3 years old at this time,like pants down to his ankles.
Go into the bathroom.
The tree, you know, Albert Roller's house.
And they are like, oh,
like what
ever, you know, you know,you're you're like, mortified as a parent.
And, you know, we look back at that nowand we laugh.
This. Yes.
(09:43):
2 or 3 year old that,you know, you know, if we
that is a natural default for our kids
and even potentially for us as adults,
we want to prepare our children for each
and every situationthat they are going to be in.
And this kind of common etiquette,manners,
(10:04):
will prepare our children well to succeedin those kinds of situations.
So maybe parenting fail on our partthere with that.
But I was so little.
I'm going to give us grace. Yeah.
All right, Jen, let's,let's switch to a different segment.
And this one today iswhat are you reading?
So, what's what's been on your readinglist, lately here, Jen,
(10:27):
I've read a couple different things.
The bookthat I brought to the table to share
today is actually a bookthat I'm reading out loud to the kids
right now as a part of our homeschool.
And I'm sure we'll talk moreabout how we homeschool in the future.
But, I like to have a book going at allat all times, preferably a couple.
We have three books going right nowin our homeschool.
But right now I'm reading out loudthis book, if you're watching by video,
(10:50):
you can see it.
I'll hold it up.
It's by Patricia Saint John,and it's called Twice Freed.
And it is basicallya retelling of the Book of Philemon.
So it takes placein the time of the New Testament.
And I won't give away the whole plot.
But there is a boy,the main character is a boy,
(11:12):
and he is a slave, and he learns that his
his father was actually a witnessto the stoning of Stephen,
and that, experiencetransformed his family.
And it is just an amazing story.
I'm reading it out loud. Our kids,
(11:36):
are this morning, our
1716 year old popped in just to listen,
and he was, you know, he hasn't been therefor the because he's in college.
He's in college.
We do like dual credit here in Minnesota.
So he doesn't you know he'snot always there for like read aloud time.
And he was like that sounds juicy,you know.
So he liked it.
(11:59):
But I would recommend Patricia Saint John.
Her books were out of print for a while.
There's a, there's a publisher called ten.
Ten of these.
Ten of those? Yeah, ten of these.They're from.
They're from the UK.
Yeah, they're they're wonderful.
I like talking with them.
They are so delightful people.
And they, have brought Patricia
(12:20):
Saint John's books,I think all of them back into print.
They like this is an older version, like,I'm not sure.
When this was printed,
the original came out in 1970.
I'm just looking at the copyright.
But this edition is older, but
they've done a whole different,
(12:41):
printing of all of her books. Yeah.
So I would recommend Patricia Saint John,this is a great family read aloud.
Or if you're just looking for somethingto read, even a fiction, it's great.
I would fully recommend twice readglorious.
It's a fun one.
All right. Well,I'll share what I'm reading.
I just finished this book.
It is called Do Fathers
(13:04):
Matter What Science is telling usabout the parent we've overlooked?
And I look at that question, two fathersand I laugh a little bit because
as a Christian with a biblical worldview,of course, we go, yes.
Do we even need to ask this question?
But, this is written by a non-Christian.
(13:24):
It's interestingthat he, has decided to ask
that questionand I would say, out of a ten,
I might give this book a twoor a three on this on
a, scale, like three generous.
Yeah.
I was pretty disappointed with it.
I so not a high recommendation.
(13:47):
I'm going to share a few things out of it,and then you've got
the good stuff from this book,so that's good.
I write a book that I don't recommend.Yeah.
So sometimes, you know, not every bookwe read is, is, is a home run run.
But, I found
there are a few helpful things in herethat I did think were interesting.
He said he talks about, the records showthat fathers were
(14:08):
and are widely overlookedin scientific studies.
He said I got, when he,when he put fathers, in a search,
he only pulled up
15,156 studies,had anything to do with fathers
when he put mothers in a search,
that got just under 100,000.
(14:32):
Wow. And maternal pulled up 279,000entries.
Paternal brought uponly one tenth of that many.
So the year that you're getting to see it?
Hardly.
Fathers, are about 5 to 10%of what is, studied
with mothers and, very, very limited.
(14:53):
I found that, actuallyto be quite helpful.
Yeah.
Let's see,I have a couple more things here.
He, talks about,
and one of the thingsthat has happened with fathers
is they're just neglectedin a lot of areas in science.
And this if you know anythingabout psychology, anybody
(15:16):
that's studied developmental psychology,you'll know the name.
Bowlby with attachmentsyndrome, attachment theory.
Kind of what
helps the, relationship of a of a
of an infant and young childand a primarily mother develop.
And what causes the attachmentnot to happen?
(15:38):
Well, Bowlby,in his study of attachment theory,
he doesn't even address fathers at all,which is really interesting.
This is what basically Bowlby saysthe role of the father, was basically,
believed to provide supportfor the mother.
And, he's a very big supporting actor.
Like, that's your job, but,you know, put put money on the table.
(15:59):
Help, mom.
But you really don't have muchof a connection with, with your children,
in, any, any good way.
I'll give you a taste of the,
the this is written by a full
on naturalist evolutionist.
Not a Christian whatsoever.
These are the kinds of thingsfrom a biblical worldview.
(16:21):
We need to be super discerningwhen we read books like this.
And there are some helpful thingsthat we can pull from books like this.
But here's one thing that he says.
He says the ultimate purpose of goodfathering
is to ensure the survival of children.
So we think, you know, from a from ascriptural perspective, is that accurate?
(16:42):
And we can resoundingly say,
in part,
but intotal, no, it it falls drastically short.
That now, of course,the Bible talks about the parents
role is to carefor the physical needs of a child. Yep.
So that is, that's a small part of it.
(17:04):
But if that's our focus and we'reneglecting the heart, the spiritual,
the eternal focus, and we take care ofthe physical needs at that.
And we've fallen,we've fallen horribly short.
We have failed as a parent. Yeah.
With what is most critical,most important.
So I, if you can see on here,
I don't know if you can see itnext to that on the book I wrote.
(17:26):
Nope.
That was that was all I wrote next to it.
I sometimes, you know,I have these books that I read
sometimes like this that are onesI don't agree with.
And I if I'm underlying stuff,I always wonder
if somebody picks this up, like,if I die or my kids come and pick
this up off my shelfand they think, did dad agree with this?
I make sure I write stuff in the margins.
Nope.
(17:46):
Or I'll cross out stuff and writewhat's scripturally true.
True in them.
So do fathers matter?
I feel like I could have writtena book on this, like ten times
better than this guy,because the Bible gives us so many reasons
why fathers do matter,that we're not, we're not addressed here.
But, my takeaway from this isif anybody listening to this feels like,
(18:12):
wow, I'm trying to figure out whereto, emphasize
some research, some resources.
There's a lot out there for mothers.
There's not a lot out there for fathers.
And, and we know, as the father goes,so goes
the family, so goes the church,so goes a community.
(18:34):
And part of our problem in this countryright now is we don't have strong men.
We're not raising strongyoung people to be godly men
who who lead their familiesto lead their churches, and,
and so we need to be doing that, as,
so that he has familyfrom a secular perspective.
Did he say we need to emphasize fathers?
(18:56):
We need to, he largely
emphasized their valuein what you just said, what I just said.
But that was largely the extent of it.
You know,they bring value in emotional stability.
They bring value in,
you know, the survival side.
It was all materialistic kinds of things.
(19:18):
But it didn't,didn't expand beyond that. So,
Yeah. Wow.
Well, I'm glad you didn't recommendthat book. No, I'm glad you.
It seems like a looser book.
Yeah, but I appreciate these.
At least. Shine the light on. Yeah, yeah.
I didn't realizefathers were, neglected to that degree.
I had no idea. Yeah, I had no idea. Yeah.
(19:39):
Very interesting. Okay, well,thanks for sharing that. Yeah.
All right.
Well, yeah.
Let's transitionback to etiquette and manners.
Yeah.
So, Jen, what would you sayare some of the essential
etiquetteand manners skills that we have said?
This is important.We need to convey this to our kids. Yeah.
So we've kind of come up over the years
with different lists of thingsthat we want our kids to,
(20:02):
to know and to just kind of like,come easily to them.
I'll kind of tick these offand then you can,
interject if you want to sayanything about any of them.
But they are saying, please and thank you,
holding
doors, opening doors,especially on our boys to be those people
who will offer to open the door,
(20:24):
for the people around them.
We encourage our children to addressadults as Mr.
or Mrs. when that's appropriate.
And it's funny because kind of likeyou said before that you,
your parents were like, no, you don't haveto say no, ma'am and yes, ma'am.
And we yes, a lot of timeswe'll get parents who will say,
(20:46):
no, no, no, just call me first nameby their first name.
And we'll still encourageour kids to, say Mr.
or Mrs..
I think until they get a little bit older.
Yeah, when they're about 18. Yeah.
Actually, I was just funny.
Our oldest,
just a year or two ago said,I think I'm old enough now.
(21:08):
I don't need to say, mister.
I think I'm getting into, like,I'm like an adult now.
I think I'm kind of a contemporary.
Yeah. Mr.. And Mrs..
Yeah. So I think that that's kind of like,
I don't know, familiarity, I don't know,but yeah.
So we encourage our kids to say Mr..
Or Mrs.,
saying,excuse me instead of her up interrupting.
Excuse me, excuse me.
(21:28):
We work on this onea lot still all the time.
Please say excuse me
or wait interrupting,
sneezing or coughing into your arm versusyour hand.
Being able to say no in a gracious way.
So no thank you or I'll pass this time or,
(21:49):
just being able to have that vocabto say no,
just smiling, having a pleasant demeanor,
looking people in the eyes,
and just being able to, like,make a connection with people
when they're speaking, answering questionswith a question.
So, for example,if an adult asks, how are you,
(22:09):
teaching our kids to respond, how are you?
Oh, I'm sorry,I wonder if I'm fine. I'm great.
How are you? Yeah, exactly.
So just, you know, giving them the freedomand that skill to to answer
with a question, obviously makingintroductions, introducing other people,
and being aware in social situations.
Oh, maybe you don't know.
(22:30):
Or maybe you two don'tknow each other's names.
We've alsoencourage sometimes for our kids to, like,
say their name to somebody who they thinkmaybe might not remember the name.
Like, oh, by the way, I'm, you know, soand so, but just having that awareness,
like, you know, not everybody remembersyour name on the first try.
And then just a lot of tableetiquette, napkin in your lap
(22:53):
and sitting up straight and, you know,how are you reaching?
Which way are you passing, chewingwith your mouth open, table manners
and things like that goes a long way in,especially like going into the holidays.
You really want to have, a handle on,you know what?
What do we expect of our kidsat Thanksgiving dinner?
(23:13):
What do we want it to look like?
But those are the things that we'veidentified that's really being a priority.
And we try to model that our kids willreplicate our behavior in these areas.
So if we're.
Yeah, you know, ifwe're doing these things, you'll see that.
And, as it gets reinforced,obviously as we
verbally teach it, but then as we'rejust doing that, it, you know,
(23:34):
it becomes like second nature over timewhen there's consistency in these areas.
All right.
So let's talk about thatkind of the how to how do we
how do we actually train a childin some of these areas.
What would you say to that.
Yeah,I would say the best one is just practice.
If this is something that you're goingto be intentional about, like we just want
(23:55):
to make sure we have certain manners,that we're working towards.
Just practice. Just practice.
So if you want to have a certain outcome
with, like, even,say, your Thanksgiving meal coming up,
you could absolutely practice at homewith, this is how we're going to set.
Let's put our napkins on our lap.
You know,let's look at where the silverware goes.
(24:17):
Let's talk about after our mealhow much food is on the floor afterwards.
And so practice is essential
and even in social situationsfor some of the things we've talked about,
even just gearing up beforehand, like,oh, you're going to be meeting somebody.
So stick out your handand make an introduction, say
(24:39):
your name, give a smile.
And so practice really is what it takes.
And it does not need to be arduous.
It doesn't need to be a huge deal.
But it's just it'sjust a gentle nudge to remember.
Remember that this iswhat we're going to do and make it fun.
Make it fun. There you go. Yeah.
(24:59):
There's some really great books out therethat help with this.
And you've actually brought one.
This is my favorite one.
This is such a cute book.
This book is called MannersBegins at Breakfast.
Modern etiquette for families.
And it is just a very delightful bookwith,
(25:21):
very practical,
ideas for teaching manners.
Like, I just flipped it open,and this one is like a little drawing.
The artwork in this is phenomenal.
But it's a picture of
this is what my silverware looks likewhen I've paused my meal.
And this is what my silverware looks likewhen I finished my meal.
And so the artwork is colorful and it'sbeautiful, and it's more so meant to be,
(25:46):
a a book for parents.
But they would work through itwith their kids.
Like, this is an illustration onhow would you break bread?
So if somebody serves you a bread basket,are you going to like,
take your knife and saw the bread?
No, no.
You're just going to break itand gently put the bread on your plate.
But there's, you know, sectionsfor everything about dining,
(26:08):
patterns, things in your home.
There's some interestinglike Q&A about like,
how do I handle certain situations.
Just such a great book.So we've used different resources.
Yeah, that's a very good one.
We mentioned Emily Post already.I love Emily Post.
I always used to read her columnwhen I was younger.
(26:28):
Yeah, yeah.
So hers is calledetiquette manners for today.
And it was that.
Yeah, yeah.
Etiquette. Emily Post.It's like a light bulb.
Yeah.It's really pretty manners for today.
And there's other ones out there as well,
but those are some of that ones we,we recommend.
And those are good for us as parents.
But, like, I'm sure our kidswould love paging through them.
(26:50):
I'm sure that if you put a book
like manners begin at breakfaston your coffee table
or to somewhere in view,it's it's really beautiful.
These books are beautiful.
Even the Emily Post book.
And so my guess is that your kids
would love to just, like,page through them and look at them.
And sometimes it's kind of fun to thinklike, how would I handle this situation?
(27:12):
What would it look like?
And so using some funresources is a great way to go.
Great. Way to go. Yeah.
The next one would be to takean etiquette class, in our area,
there are etiquette classesoffered all the time.
I see them in our community and,
our churchdoes this through our homeschool group.
(27:34):
They have different groupsthey'll bring in
and they'll do a big etiquette dinnerwhere,
they set the table and the childrenlearn how to sit and to do all the things.
And so, that could be a really funexperience to do with your family.
Again, making it fun, making it memorable.
And so doing some of that, kind of likeyour, your, parents did with you.
(27:57):
Yeah. Yeah, that was super helpful.
Yeah, totally.
You know, the last thing we'll mentionis don't be afraid to ask
if you're in an environment or situationand you're just not sure.
Like what?
What should I do here?
What's the appropriate,what's the correct etiquette?
Just ask whoever's aroundand they will probably
give you some guidance in the rightdirection.
(28:19):
That's true for us.
As adults, but, yeah,good advice that we can give to our kids.
And I'll get asked thiseven from time to time, people
say things like, how should I address you?
You know, as a doctor,I often go to different places.
Should I call you doctorand all the hill and, you know.
No, you don't need tocall me doctor. All the hill.
(28:39):
You know, Josh is just fine.
But some people, you know,they there might not think that same way.
So, when, you know, we for a long time
would go to literallyevery single monthly city council meeting.
We did this for six years in our citybefore we moved out here to the farm.
And, you know, we needed to know,
(29:01):
what's the correct etiquettewhen you come into a city council meeting?
When do you speak?
How long do you have?
What's how do you addresshow do you address the council?
And there's, you know, there's there'sspecial etiquette and, ways to act there.
And we did we just, you know, askthe mayor, ask the city council members.
Yeah. And they were very gracious.
(29:22):
I remember even being like, at,like a girls night out,
and we ordered a bunch of appetizersat the table.
You know, the ladiesordered, like, a bunch of appetizers,
and they all were,like, delivered at the same time.
And the gal sitting next to me was like,what are we doing here?
We're passing these appetizers.
Yeah. I was like,yeah, take a little bit of each one.
(29:43):
We're going to pass around,put it on your own plate,
don't eat off that plate, you know.
And so just ask easy and then you knowyeah yeah yeah.
Well and we'll just, win this one all upwith, if you found this really helpful,
the, the series
that we're doing here right nowis coming out of our book, 50 things
(30:03):
where we have 50 different thingsto train children to be godly adults.
And so this is one of the 50things is etiquette. And,
and, good manners.
And same with friendsthat we did the last episode
and family worship and corporate worshipand and these, these
all come together to help our kidsdevelop into godly individuals.
(30:29):
And this, of course,
is a small piece of that, but it is,you know, it's a portion of that.
And so if you're lookingfor a helpful resource towards that end,
we would commend that to you.
It's available at Renew nation.org.
All right I think that does it for today.
Thank you guys for tuning in.
And we will see you next time. Bye bye.
(41:38):
Thank you for listening to the GospelSheep Family podcast.
Please share this episodeand give us a five star rating
wherever you get your podcasts.
I'm Josh and I'm Jen.
Welcome to the GospelShaped Family podcast.
Each episode brings biblical wisdomand practical conversations
on parenting, marriage, and family,and we discuss
how to disciple the next generationwith a biblical worldview.
Whether you're raising children,shepherding a church, or longing
(00:20):
to build a legacy of faith in your home,this podcast is for you.
Join us as we explore how to shape hearts,homes, and churches around the gospel,
one conversation at a time.
Hey everyone!
Welcome back to the GospelSheep Family Podcast.
Good to see you all. It's a good day.
(00:40):
Well, the holidays are approachingChristmas and Thanksgiving.
I should say that in a different order.
Thanksgiving and Christmasare right around the corner.
And today we're tackling the topic of
how to teach our kids, mannersand some basic common etiquette.
We know that that Thanksgiving dinneris right around the corner.
(01:03):
You mean you mean your children aren't,like, perfectly behaved
and know how to act in public and like,just perfectly all the time?
Always perfect.
Whenever I think of this, there's, like,
this book serieswe read to the kids where the premise was,
that somebody said, those children
act like they were raised by wolves, butthen they were actually raised by wolves.
(01:24):
In the book series.
Book, I forget, ash,the mysterious of Ashton Blaze.
Anyways, I was think
where they raised.
That's a good series. Yeah,
they were the incorrigible
children of Ashton Place.
Yeah, that was athey were raised by wolves.
They were raised by wolves.They acted like
(01:46):
they did not know about mannersor etiquette and really basic ways.
Yeah.
Did you, were you trainedwith any kind of manners or etiquette?
Grown up? Oh, let me think.
I don't know,
I don't remember,you know, specific, like,
like meal time.
(02:06):
Please.
And thank you type of things.
I remember, you know, I was a musician,so I remember learning very easily.
Learning concert etiquette,
you know, like,
how to stand, how to sit,how to, like, up slide.
I remember that stuff.
But that's not like real life mannersand etiquette type things.
(02:29):
I'm sure my parents instilledthose things.
You know, like, say, thank you.
I don't remember itever being very formal, but,
I don't know.
Your parents were so intentional.
Oh, man.
I have a ton in this area.
Yeah, you had a lot.
I was raised mostly in Texas growing up,and we were trained to say yes, ma'am.
Ma'am? Yes, sir, no, sir.
(02:50):
And then with that in Minnesotaand we moved to Minnesota,
you know, I'mI've got this southern boy accent.
I don't have it now.
They they ridiculed it out of me by now,but, I, I would say yes, ma'am, no, ma'am.
And people in Minnesotaliterally said, don't call me ma'am.
Yeah.
And I remember
my parents had to sit this downand they said, they don't do that up here.
(03:13):
You need to stop sayingthat they like untrained.
That's for etiquette.
But we were, you know,my parents are in full time ministry,
and so theythere was a lot of training about how to.
Yeah. I'm sure.
Look, people in the eyeand shake hands and interact.
We sat in a lot of living rooms with,
you know, raising support for our family.
(03:35):
And, you know, they don'tyou don't want a child that's unruly
and naughtyand doesn't know how to operate.
And I remember, one point,my mom wanted to teach us
how to eat and sit at a table,like in, more of a formal setting.
And I remember, a coupleshe did a couple of week
(03:56):
training on how to set the table where,
where the napkin goes,where the fork goes, the knife, the spoon.
How you sit at a table properly,
you know, putting a napkin on your lap,no elbows on the table. And,
you know, we think,you know, it's like, at this point,
(04:17):
you know, with our home, it'snot a big deal,
but there's always situationsthat a lot of us as adults
end up in now where that is appropriate
in some more business or formal
settings, social that it's like,wow, that's
that has been really helpful in my lifeas an adult.
Yeah. Many, many times.
(04:37):
Yeah. I love that.
Well, one of my favorite quotes is fromEmily Post.
Emily Post is like the Queen of etiquette,and she has this quote.
It says this nobody wakes upin the morning and says,
I think I'll be rude today.
Nobody says that.
And most of
us think of ourselvesas being polite and kind,
(05:01):
but there's always that situation whenwe're in a hurry or we're under stress or,
you know, we just get lazy and we don'talways use the manners that we should.
So we thought it would be greatto talk about what are some common
etiquette things,and why are we teaching those to our kids?
Because we don't want to be the personwho is rude today.
(05:23):
Yeah, yeah.
So first reason, of course, is thatsimply is a reflection of the image of God
and the dignity of other people, that it'shonoring to them, to treat them in a way
that's respectful and, and courteous.
And so this recognizes, recognizes that.
Yeah.
Oh, and anotherreason be Jenny Penny today.
(05:44):
Another reason
is that, the world we live incan just be rude.
It can be rude, it can be angry.
It can be unkind.
And we don't want thatto become the default for our kids.
We don't want that to be somethingthat they see as being acceptable.
We want to be the antithesis of that.
(06:07):
We want to be kind and loving,to the people that are around us.
And not just rude, but also coarse.
Oh yeah. Rude.
I think of the,you know, the just what's on TV
from like even in cartoons for kidsor a lot of, you know, a lot of kids
movies will have charactersfarting like burping humor.
(06:30):
You know,you're going to get a laugh in a movie
and then you know that that impacts kidsthinking that that's normal and funny.
And, you know, we've got three boys.
So there's, there's a lot of,training in this area that happens.
And we all will say to our boys,if you ever want to date or marry
(06:50):
a woman, they're not going to appreciatethat like you.
And you're goingto, you know, you need to move out.
And you know, every guy.
You know, I won't say every guy,but most guys, we've been there and,
you know, and we've we've had,we've had to get trained in this area,
but our world just is isn't is
it is it is formation all in this waywith our kids in a negative way.
(07:13):
So we have to do some counter formationtraining in their life or otherwise.
That becomes the, the default, I think.
Yeah.
And so, we're also preparing our childrenfor every situation.
And, you know, we like to say they're,we're helping them get ready to dine
with kings or with queens, you know,more than likely that may never happen.
(07:37):
But in the event that we end upsitting down with individuals that,
are in that kind of level of influence,
we want our kids to be comfortable,fluent, have, you know, confident.
No. And we have had, at times we have had
the opportunityto be in situations like that where,
(07:57):
you know, political figures or,the other influential figures,
I'll just share a funny story of what,our son John.
So I graduated with a PhD
from Southern Seminary, and,
Southern Seminary.
The president is our Mohler.
And one of the things Al Mohler does
(08:19):
when you graduate with a PhD, it'sonly the PhD students.
He invites all of the PhD studentsand their family over to his house.
And they he puts on this very formal,
you know, this just,you know, party or d'oeuvres.
Yeah. Or d'oeuvres.
Charcuterie in the, like, white tent,
(08:42):
you know, in his backyard.
They've servers with, you know, wearing
very, very fancy things in his home.
It's like a two scale model of MountVernon.
Yeah, of where George Washington lived.
Yeah, I mean, it's.
Yeah, it's a replica, so. Right.
Know, we've lived in the countryfor a very long time, and,
(09:02):
and so our kids, when they're little,we have allowed them to go to the bathroom
outside are potty trained potty training.
John. Yes.
As boys, but we hadn't trained himin, in some certain ways in the area.
So we were at Albert Moliere's house,fancy party outside and all this stuff.
And I look and John's by a treewith his pants down doing.
(09:23):
He's like 2 or 3 years old at this time,like pants down to his ankles.
Go into the bathroom.
The tree, you know, Albert Roller's house.
And they are like, oh,
like what
ever, you know, you know,you're you're like, mortified as a parent.
And, you know, we look back at that nowand we laugh.
This. Yes.
(09:43):
2 or 3 year old that,you know, you know, if we
that is a natural default for our kids
and even potentially for us as adults,
we want to prepare our children for each
and every situationthat they are going to be in.
And this kind of common etiquette,manners,
(10:04):
will prepare our children well to succeedin those kinds of situations.
So maybe parenting fail on our partthere with that.
But I was so little.
I'm going to give us grace. Yeah.
All right, Jen, let's,let's switch to a different segment.
And this one today iswhat are you reading?
So, what's what's been on your readinglist, lately here, Jen,
(10:27):
I've read a couple different things.
The bookthat I brought to the table to share
today is actually a bookthat I'm reading out loud to the kids
right now as a part of our homeschool.
And I'm sure we'll talk moreabout how we homeschool in the future.
But, I like to have a book going at allat all times, preferably a couple.
We have three books going right nowin our homeschool.
But right now I'm reading out loudthis book, if you're watching by video,
(10:50):
you can see it.
I'll hold it up.
It's by Patricia Saint John,and it's called Twice Freed.
And it is basicallya retelling of the Book of Philemon.
So it takes placein the time of the New Testament.
And I won't give away the whole plot.
But there is a boy,the main character is a boy,
(11:12):
and he is a slave, and he learns that his
his father was actually a witnessto the stoning of Stephen,
and that, experiencetransformed his family.
And it is just an amazing story.
I'm reading it out loud. Our kids,
(11:36):
are this morning, our
1716 year old popped in just to listen,
and he was, you know, he hasn't been therefor the because he's in college.
He's in college.
We do like dual credit here in Minnesota.
So he doesn't you know he'snot always there for like read aloud time.
And he was like that sounds juicy,you know.
So he liked it.
(11:59):
But I would recommend Patricia Saint John.
Her books were out of print for a while.
There's a, there's a publisher called ten.
Ten of these.
Ten of those? Yeah, ten of these.They're from.
They're from the UK.
Yeah, they're they're wonderful.
I like talking with them.
They are so delightful people.
And they, have brought Patricia
(12:20):
Saint John's books,I think all of them back into print.
They like this is an older version, like,I'm not sure.
When this was printed,
the original came out in 1970.
I'm just looking at the copyright.
But this edition is older, but
they've done a whole different,
(12:41):
printing of all of her books. Yeah.
So I would recommend Patricia Saint John,this is a great family read aloud.
Or if you're just looking for somethingto read, even a fiction, it's great.
I would fully recommend twice readglorious.
It's a fun one.
All right. Well,I'll share what I'm reading.
I just finished this book.
It is called Do Fathers
(13:04):
Matter What Science is telling usabout the parent we've overlooked?
And I look at that question, two fathersand I laugh a little bit because
as a Christian with a biblical worldview,of course, we go, yes.
Do we even need to ask this question?
But, this is written by a non-Christian.
(13:24):
It's interestingthat he, has decided to ask
that questionand I would say, out of a ten,
I might give this book a twoor a three on this on
a, scale, like three generous.
Yeah.
I was pretty disappointed with it.
I so not a high recommendation.
(13:47):
I'm going to share a few things out of it,and then you've got
the good stuff from this book,so that's good.
I write a book that I don't recommend.Yeah.
So sometimes, you know, not every bookwe read is, is, is a home run run.
But, I found
there are a few helpful things in herethat I did think were interesting.
He said he talks about, the records showthat fathers were
(14:08):
and are widely overlookedin scientific studies.
He said I got, when he,when he put fathers, in a search,
he only pulled up
15,156 studies,had anything to do with fathers
when he put mothers in a search,
that got just under 100,000.
(14:32):
Wow. And maternal pulled up 279,000entries.
Paternal brought uponly one tenth of that many.
So the year that you're getting to see it?
Hardly.
Fathers, are about 5 to 10%of what is, studied
with mothers and, very, very limited.
(14:53):
I found that, actuallyto be quite helpful.
Yeah.
Let's see,I have a couple more things here.
He, talks about,
and one of the thingsthat has happened with fathers
is they're just neglectedin a lot of areas in science.
And this if you know anythingabout psychology, anybody
(15:16):
that's studied developmental psychology,you'll know the name.
Bowlby with attachmentsyndrome, attachment theory.
Kind of what
helps the, relationship of a of a
of an infant and young childand a primarily mother develop.
And what causes the attachmentnot to happen?
(15:38):
Well, Bowlby,in his study of attachment theory,
he doesn't even address fathers at all,which is really interesting.
This is what basically Bowlby saysthe role of the father, was basically,
believed to provide supportfor the mother.
And, he's a very big supporting actor.
Like, that's your job, but,you know, put put money on the table.
(15:59):
Help, mom.
But you really don't have muchof a connection with, with your children,
in, any, any good way.
I'll give you a taste of the,
the this is written by a full
on naturalist evolutionist.
Not a Christian whatsoever.
These are the kinds of thingsfrom a biblical worldview.
(16:21):
We need to be super discerningwhen we read books like this.
And there are some helpful thingsthat we can pull from books like this.
But here's one thing that he says.
He says the ultimate purpose of goodfathering
is to ensure the survival of children.
So we think, you know, from a from ascriptural perspective, is that accurate?
(16:42):
And we can resoundingly say,
in part,
but intotal, no, it it falls drastically short.
That now, of course,the Bible talks about the parents
role is to carefor the physical needs of a child. Yep.
So that is, that's a small part of it.
(17:04):
But if that's our focus and we'reneglecting the heart, the spiritual,
the eternal focus, and we take care ofthe physical needs at that.
And we've fallen,we've fallen horribly short.
We have failed as a parent. Yeah.
With what is most critical,most important.
So I, if you can see on here,
I don't know if you can see itnext to that on the book I wrote.
(17:26):
Nope.
That was that was all I wrote next to it.
I sometimes, you know,I have these books that I read
sometimes like this that are onesI don't agree with.
And I if I'm underlying stuff,I always wonder
if somebody picks this up, like,if I die or my kids come and pick
this up off my shelfand they think, did dad agree with this?
I make sure I write stuff in the margins.
Nope.
(17:46):
Or I'll cross out stuff and writewhat's scripturally true.
True in them.
So do fathers matter?
I feel like I could have writtena book on this, like ten times
better than this guy,because the Bible gives us so many reasons
why fathers do matter,that we're not, we're not addressed here.
But, my takeaway from this isif anybody listening to this feels like,
(18:12):
wow, I'm trying to figure out whereto, emphasize
some research, some resources.
There's a lot out there for mothers.
There's not a lot out there for fathers.
And, and we know, as the father goes,so goes
the family, so goes the church,so goes a community.
(18:34):
And part of our problem in this countryright now is we don't have strong men.
We're not raising strongyoung people to be godly men
who who lead their familiesto lead their churches, and,
and so we need to be doing that, as,
so that he has familyfrom a secular perspective.
Did he say we need to emphasize fathers?
(18:56):
We need to, he largely
emphasized their valuein what you just said, what I just said.
But that was largely the extent of it.
You know,they bring value in emotional stability.
They bring value in,
you know, the survival side.
It was all materialistic kinds of things.
(19:18):
But it didn't,didn't expand beyond that. So,
Yeah. Wow.
Well, I'm glad you didn't recommendthat book. No, I'm glad you.
It seems like a looser book.
Yeah, but I appreciate these.
At least. Shine the light on. Yeah, yeah.
I didn't realizefathers were, neglected to that degree.
I had no idea. Yeah, I had no idea. Yeah.
(19:39):
Very interesting. Okay, well,thanks for sharing that. Yeah.
All right.
Well, yeah.
Let's transitionback to etiquette and manners.
Yeah.
So, Jen, what would you sayare some of the essential
etiquetteand manners skills that we have said?
This is important.We need to convey this to our kids. Yeah.
So we've kind of come up over the years
with different lists of thingsthat we want our kids to,
(20:02):
to know and to just kind of like,come easily to them.
I'll kind of tick these offand then you can,
interject if you want to sayanything about any of them.
But they are saying, please and thank you,
holding
doors, opening doors,especially on our boys to be those people
who will offer to open the door,
(20:24):
for the people around them.
We encourage our children to addressadults as Mr.
or Mrs. when that's appropriate.
And it's funny because kind of likeyou said before that you,
your parents were like, no, you don't haveto say no, ma'am and yes, ma'am.
And we yes, a lot of timeswe'll get parents who will say,
(20:46):
no, no, no, just call me first nameby their first name.
And we'll still encourageour kids to, say Mr.
or Mrs..
I think until they get a little bit older.
Yeah, when they're about 18. Yeah.
Actually, I was just funny.
Our oldest,
just a year or two ago said,I think I'm old enough now.
(21:08):
I don't need to say, mister.
I think I'm getting into, like,I'm like an adult now.
I think I'm kind of a contemporary.
Yeah. Mr.. And Mrs..
Yeah. So I think that that's kind of like,
I don't know, familiarity, I don't know,but yeah.
So we encourage our kids to say Mr..
Or Mrs.,
saying,excuse me instead of her up interrupting.
Excuse me, excuse me.
(21:28):
We work on this onea lot still all the time.
Please say excuse me
or wait interrupting,
sneezing or coughing into your arm versusyour hand.
Being able to say no in a gracious way.
So no thank you or I'll pass this time or,
(21:49):
just being able to have that vocabto say no,
just smiling, having a pleasant demeanor,
looking people in the eyes,
and just being able to, like,make a connection with people
when they're speaking, answering questionswith a question.
So, for example,if an adult asks, how are you,
(22:09):
teaching our kids to respond, how are you?
Oh, I'm sorry,I wonder if I'm fine. I'm great.
How are you? Yeah, exactly.
So just, you know, giving them the freedomand that skill to to answer
with a question, obviously makingintroductions, introducing other people,
and being aware in social situations.
Oh, maybe you don't know.
(22:30):
Or maybe you two don'tknow each other's names.
We've alsoencourage sometimes for our kids to, like,
say their name to somebody who they thinkmaybe might not remember the name.
Like, oh, by the way, I'm, you know, soand so, but just having that awareness,
like, you know, not everybody remembersyour name on the first try.
And then just a lot of tableetiquette, napkin in your lap
(22:53):
and sitting up straight and, you know,how are you reaching?
Which way are you passing, chewingwith your mouth open, table manners
and things like that goes a long way in,especially like going into the holidays.
You really want to have, a handle on,you know what?
What do we expect of our kidsat Thanksgiving dinner?
(23:13):
What do we want it to look like?
But those are the things that we'veidentified that's really being a priority.
And we try to model that our kids willreplicate our behavior in these areas.
So if we're.
Yeah, you know, ifwe're doing these things, you'll see that.
And, as it gets reinforced,obviously as we
verbally teach it, but then as we'rejust doing that, it, you know,
(23:34):
it becomes like second nature over timewhen there's consistency in these areas.
All right.
So let's talk about thatkind of the how to how do we
how do we actually train a childin some of these areas.
What would you say to that.
Yeah,I would say the best one is just practice.
If this is something that you're goingto be intentional about, like we just want
(23:55):
to make sure we have certain manners,that we're working towards.
Just practice. Just practice.
So if you want to have a certain outcome
with, like, even,say, your Thanksgiving meal coming up,
you could absolutely practice at homewith, this is how we're going to set.
Let's put our napkins on our lap.
You know,let's look at where the silverware goes.
(24:17):
Let's talk about after our mealhow much food is on the floor afterwards.
And so practice is essential
and even in social situationsfor some of the things we've talked about,
even just gearing up beforehand, like,oh, you're going to be meeting somebody.
So stick out your handand make an introduction, say
(24:39):
your name, give a smile.
And so practice really is what it takes.
And it does not need to be arduous.
It doesn't need to be a huge deal.
But it's just it'sjust a gentle nudge to remember.
Remember that this iswhat we're going to do and make it fun.
Make it fun. There you go. Yeah.
(24:59):
There's some really great books out therethat help with this.
And you've actually brought one.
This is my favorite one.
This is such a cute book.
This book is called MannersBegins at Breakfast.
Modern etiquette for families.
And it is just a very delightful bookwith,
(25:21):
very practical,
ideas for teaching manners.
Like, I just flipped it open,and this one is like a little drawing.
The artwork in this is phenomenal.
But it's a picture of
this is what my silverware looks likewhen I've paused my meal.
And this is what my silverware looks likewhen I finished my meal.
And so the artwork is colorful and it'sbeautiful, and it's more so meant to be,
(25:46):
a a book for parents.
But they would work through itwith their kids.
Like, this is an illustration onhow would you break bread?
So if somebody serves you a bread basket,are you going to like,
take your knife and saw the bread?
No, no.
You're just going to break itand gently put the bread on your plate.
But there's, you know, sectionsfor everything about dining,
(26:08):
patterns, things in your home.
There's some interestinglike Q&A about like,
how do I handle certain situations.
Just such a great book.So we've used different resources.
Yeah, that's a very good one.
We mentioned Emily Post already.I love Emily Post.
I always used to read her columnwhen I was younger.
(26:28):
Yeah, yeah.
So hers is calledetiquette manners for today.
And it was that.
Yeah, yeah.
Etiquette. Emily Post.It's like a light bulb.
Yeah.It's really pretty manners for today.
And there's other ones out there as well,
but those are some of that ones we,we recommend.
And those are good for us as parents.
But, like, I'm sure our kidswould love paging through them.
(26:50):
I'm sure that if you put a book
like manners begin at breakfaston your coffee table
or to somewhere in view,it's it's really beautiful.
These books are beautiful.
Even the Emily Post book.
And so my guess is that your kids
would love to just, like,page through them and look at them.
And sometimes it's kind of fun to thinklike, how would I handle this situation?
(27:12):
What would it look like?
And so using some funresources is a great way to go.
Great. Way to go. Yeah.
The next one would be to takean etiquette class, in our area,
there are etiquette classesoffered all the time.
I see them in our community and,
our churchdoes this through our homeschool group.
(27:34):
They have different groupsthey'll bring in
and they'll do a big etiquette dinnerwhere,
they set the table and the childrenlearn how to sit and to do all the things.
And so, that could be a really funexperience to do with your family.
Again, making it fun, making it memorable.
And so doing some of that, kind of likeyour, your, parents did with you.
(27:57):
Yeah. Yeah, that was super helpful.
Yeah, totally.
You know, the last thing we'll mentionis don't be afraid to ask
if you're in an environment or situationand you're just not sure.
Like what?
What should I do here?
What's the appropriate,what's the correct etiquette?
Just ask whoever's aroundand they will probably
give you some guidance in the rightdirection.
(28:19):
That's true for us.
As adults, but, yeah,good advice that we can give to our kids.
And I'll get asked thiseven from time to time, people
say things like, how should I address you?
You know, as a doctor,I often go to different places.
Should I call you doctorand all the hill and, you know.
No, you don't need tocall me doctor. All the hill.
(28:39):
You know, Josh is just fine.
But some people, you know,they there might not think that same way.
So, when, you know, we for a long time
would go to literallyevery single monthly city council meeting.
We did this for six years in our citybefore we moved out here to the farm.
And, you know, we needed to know,
(29:01):
what's the correct etiquettewhen you come into a city council meeting?
When do you speak?
How long do you have?
What's how do you addresshow do you address the council?
And there's, you know, there's there'sspecial etiquette and, ways to act there.
And we did we just, you know, askthe mayor, ask the city council members.
Yeah. And they were very gracious.
(29:22):
I remember even being like, at,like a girls night out,
and we ordered a bunch of appetizersat the table.
You know, the ladiesordered, like, a bunch of appetizers,
and they all were,like, delivered at the same time.
And the gal sitting next to me was like,what are we doing here?
We're passing these appetizers.
Yeah. I was like,yeah, take a little bit of each one.
(29:43):
We're going to pass around,put it on your own plate,
don't eat off that plate, you know.
And so just ask easy and then you knowyeah yeah yeah.
Well and we'll just, win this one all upwith, if you found this really helpful,
the, the series
that we're doing here right nowis coming out of our book, 50 things
(30:03):
where we have 50 different thingsto train children to be godly adults.
And so this is one of the 50things is etiquette. And,
and, good manners.
And same with friendsthat we did the last episode
and family worship and corporate worshipand and these, these
all come together to help our kidsdevelop into godly individuals.
(30:29):
And this, of course,
is a small piece of that, but it is,you know, it's a portion of that.
And so if you're lookingfor a helpful resource towards that end,
we would commend that to you.
It's available at Renew nation.org.
All right I think that does it for today.
Thank you guys for tuning in.
And we will see you next time. Bye bye.
(41:38):
Thank you for listening to the GospelSheep Family podcast.
Please share this episodeand give us a five star rating
wherever you get your podcasts.
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