November 11, 2024 • 44 mins
You will not know everything when you start your business.
Accounting, marketing, offer structures, pricing…… the list goes on
But that should never stop you.
The belief you have in yourself, your skills, your experience is what you need to get started. That is exactly what my wonderful guest in this episode, Jesminara Rahman, had when she took the leap.
Transitioning from a secure job at HMRC she jumped ship to join the side of small businesses, fighting in their corner in tax disputes with HMRC.
Jesminara shares the essential skills she needed to develop fast at the start of her journey that created business growth. She gives incredible insights into how she built a flexible team empowered by choice, something so many businesses could learn from.
Jesminara is forging the way for balance in business, listen up to find out how you can too.
“I knew because of my expertise that I could do it”– Jesmin
You’ll hear about:
00:00 - Flexible Work Culture and Employee Empowerment
01:12 - Jesmin's Journey to Starting a Small Business
03:11 - Overcoming Fear: The Leap into Entrepreneurship
05:53 - The Emotional Toll of Tax Investigations
10:00 - Balancing Family and Business Responsibilities
12:52 - Building Resilience Through Adversity
15:47 - Essential Skills for Business Growth
20:00 - The Importance of a Good Accountant
24:04 – Jesmin’s advice for Small Business Owners
28:12 - Creating a Supportive Work Environment
31:54 - Navigating the Challenges of Business Ownership
36:05 - The Power of Collaboration Over Competition
Connect with Jesmin:
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jesminararahman-taxinvestigationexpert/?originalSubdomain=uk
Connect with me:
The HoLT - https://www.the-holt.com/
My website - https://leaturner.co.uk/
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/lea-turner/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/leaturnerholt
Join The Holt waiting list - https://www.the-holt.com/waitlist
This podcast is sponsored bySafe Space From The Workplace. You can check out their podcast here - https://shorturl.at/IASSn
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Jesminara Rahman (00:00):
My
(00:00):
employees have that
flexibility in that it's
not set hours. I say,
this is your task. This
is what you need to do.
But when you want to do
it, it's up to you. So
they have the freedom to
take time off whenever,
as long as a task is
done, at it by a specific
deadline. That's all I
care about. They can do
it at home. They can do
it at the office, because
majority of my staff is
(00:21):
actually female, and so
we've all got caring
responsibilities as well.
It doesn't make sense
that my lifestyle is
adjusted to that, but not
to them, because that's
Lea Turner (00:32):
Jesmin, thank
unfair. You.
you so much for being on
the whole Survival Guide
for small businesses. I'd
love to find out a little
bit more. Why don't you
tell everybody a little
(00:52):
bit about who you are and
and how we came to be
here today.
Jesminara Rahman (00:56):
Okay?
My name is Jesminara
Rahman, Jesmin for short,
because I know it's a bit
of a mouthful, and I was
originally a taxi
inspector for HMRC for
about 15 years. I left
and then set up my own
consultancy in 2015 and
(01:21):
ever since now, I provide
specialist or expert
advice on tax
investigations. So you're
Lea Turner (01:30):
now on our
side as business owners.
You're fighting our
corner when, when things
go wrong with HMRC, I
Jesminara Rahman (01:36):
represent
clients in disputes with
tax disputes with HMRC.
So you switch sides. I
have gamekeeper turned we
don't
Lea Turner (01:47):
want to lose
the listeners when they
think you work for HMRC
now, very much on our
side.
Jesminara Rahman (01:51):
I very
much represent taxpayers.
Lea Turner (01:54):
And it's,
it's really interesting,
because we've known each
other for a fair few
years now, and I've, I
can definitely say that
I've seen your confidence
massively increase in the
time that I've known you
as a business owner, but
in conversations that
we've had before, you've
said to me that, you
know, starting a business
wasn't ever really in
your plan, and you've
kind of never had much of
a business plan, and you
(02:15):
were kind of dragged
kicking and screaming
into and I think this is
a really interesting. It
interests me because when
I first started my first
business, it was to make
a little bit of extra
money so I could travel,
and then it went really
well. And I say really
well financially, it
didn't make much money,
but it made me the same
(02:36):
amount as I made when I
worked full time. So I
was earning two full time
wages, which was lovely,
but I was killing myself
and managing both. And I
had to give my business a
chance, and I really
didn't want to, I did not
want to leave employment,
and I didn't want to be a
business owner. And I
found it all very, very
scary, but I took that
risk, and I never had a
(02:56):
business plan. And even
now, even with the
businesses that I run
now, which arguably have
been very successful. I
don't have a business
plan. And I think we all
get very bogged down when
we're starting
businesses. We think we
have to have it all
planned out, and we have
to know exactly what the
goals are. And I'd love
to hear a little bit more
about that when you
started, and how you
(03:17):
muddled through and
winged it without, and
how nine years later
we're here. You've got a
very successful business,
but you haven't taken
that traditional route
that we all are told. We
need business plans and
and we need to have a map
of exactly what we're
going to do. You've not
done
Jesminara Rahman (03:34):
it. So
I think we've got that in
common. You and I, we we
have.
Lea Turner (03:38):
So how did
you manage that? Like,
how did you start out and
make it successful
without all of those
things?
Jesminara Rahman (03:46):
One of
the common barriers, I
think, between in setting
up in your own business
is people are afraid to
leave their secure jobs,
and so that's the first
hurdle for a lot of
people in in that it's
very difficult to take
that all out risk in
(04:06):
setting up on your own
and leaving a secure
income behind. So what do
Lea Turner (04:13):
you think the
fear is? You think it's
the fear of I'm not going
to make enough money, it
definitely, and the fear
of everyone's going to
realize that I failed and
and judge me for it
definitely. Yeah. And did
you feel those things?
Jesminara Rahman (04:23):
Actually, my reason was, one of my reasons, main reasons was I wanted to go into lecturing. So I was I left that, and I wanted to fulfill one of my dreams, which was to be a university lecturer. So I actually did my teaching qualification, and it was and then I started looking for vacancies. And I did actually achieve that dream, but I met up with my ex, one of my ex directors from HMRC, now she had retired. Her name was May Anderson, and she's Scottish. I can't I'm very awful at accent. Accent, so I'm not going to do the Scottish, Scottish people watching, yeah, and lovely accent, though it is, but I just can't mimic it. And she we met up over lunch, and in spit of spitter feels, and she just said to me in her very brusque way, you don't be stupid, Jesmin, go back into tax. And it was literally her that made me pivot what I was going to do. Abandoned the dream, because she said you can go into lecturing anytime you want. Give it, give it one year tax. Give that one year. And if you don't like being on this side in tax, go back into what you want to do, but you can't keep leave it for a few years, because you need to be up to date with your knowledge in tax. So you can't have a gap and then go back in because it's it's difficult and and she said, You try it. Take my advice and try it. So It's all her fault, then it is her fault. Yeah, that I, I literally it was because of her. I went back into
(06:06):
tax.
Lea Turner (06:08):
And I'm
assuming you don't regret
it, no,
Jesminara Rahman (06:12):
so I
don't it was actually the
best decision I could
have made at
Lea Turner (06:17):
the time,
different for you,
because obviously you
went from working for
HMRC to totally switching
sides. What was the like
emotional switch that you
made? Like, did you feel
more job satisfaction?
Was there more motivation
and passion for it when
you were arguably on the
kind of little guys side,
(06:38):
I
Jesminara Rahman (06:38):
felt
the the small medium
businesses were not
represented in the way
they needed to be, and in
HMRC tax gap reports,
you'll see the majority
of the gap In taxes
collected is allocated to
(07:00):
small medium businesses.
So a lot of the targets,
targeted activities
actually on small and
medium businesses. And I
felt that there needed to
be a fair representation,
and if I could cascade my
knowledge, which is what
I do on LinkedIn, and
help to knit that in the
bud disputes, that could
get to somebody like me
(07:22):
and knit that in the at
the beginning and help
with my advice and that I
felt it was, it was worth
it, yeah,
Lea Turner (07:30):
so kind of
like a little tax
superhero for people. And
yeah, I try, and I don't
think it's me blowing
smoke to say that you are
exceptionally good at
what you do, you have
created incredibly strong
reputation for being very
good at what you do and
the results that you get
for people. Yes, and I
think that speaks to your
passion for helping
people. And you know, we
(07:52):
all get, need to get paid
for the work that we do,
but having the passion
for helping people has
been is that, would you
say that's one of the key
things that's kept you
going for nine years?
Definitely
Jesminara Rahman (08:04):
gives
me great satisfaction
when I managed to uphold
a case for the client.
Great, because these tax
investigations have such
a heavy toll on business
owners and and
Lea Turner (08:20):
it's not just
financial, right? It's
not it flows out to every
area of that.
Jesminara Rahman (08:24):
Majority
are in depression. By the
time they've come to me,
they're overworked,
they're stressed, and
they're in depression,
and they've been
medically diagnosed with
depression, wow, that's
tough. That must
Lea Turner (08:34):
be really
tough on you, though, to
to take that emotional
load on, because I know
you're you're the
specialist when it comes
to the money, but there's
got to be some of that.
The emotional toll that
comes out in there
Jesminara Rahman (08:49):
is, but
that's where you have to
be careful as well,
because at the end of the
day, you can't play
mother. Yeah, and there's
a there's a barrier,
there's a you have to be
careful to because you
can't replace that role
in their lives and and
become the complete
emotional support because
(09:10):
you're not their mom,
they're an adult, yeah,
but you can signpost them
to the services that they
need, but you cannot
provide the complete
emotional support that
maybe their family should
be providing. But I
definitely have had those
moments. I've had those
times when you know a
(09:30):
client is suicidal, and
they're in the car park
and they're talking from
their car and saying
that, you know they can't
they can't bear it
anymore. And I think that
also shows in my reviews
as well and testimonies.
There's the times when
they've been in a dark
(09:51):
space, and I have guided
them out of it, and
Lea Turner (09:55):
that's not
something that you would
necessarily expect. You
know, when you went into
this. This, you probably
weren't expecting to have
to have that level of
compassion and empathy
with the people that you
work with. So it's, it's
amazing skill that you've
you must have honed to be
able to but also to be
able to keep yourself
safe from that, because
it's quite easy to let
that ebb into your life
(10:16):
and put a lot of extra
pressure and stress on
you, and thinking about
that like as a business
owner for nine years, and
you had two youngish
children at the time when
you took this risk of
going out on your I've
got four children. Sorry,
four children. That's
alright, times 10
children. My goodness,
for some reason, maybe
it's we've only talked
(10:37):
about the younger
Jesminara Rahman (10:37):
two.
The younger two, yeah,
because I normally talk
about Mason and Armand,
the ones
Lea Turner (10:42):
that still
are at home, yeah. So
they all know. How did
you like when
Jesminara Rahman (10:46):
they're
all at home? All at home,
all four of them. Oh,
Lea Turner (10:49):
my goodness,
I can't even imagine
that. I said, What's the
age range on them? From
Jesminara Rahman (10:53):
25 to
1325? To 30? Yeah, 1313,
I
Lea Turner (10:58):
was going to
say 25 to 30 year old. 30
year old. No, Goodness
me. So with those, those
kids at home, like, what,
what went through your
head as you took that
risk into like, was, was
the family supportive?
Was it frightening to
you? What about the
people in your wider
circle beyond the family?
Jesminara Rahman (11:19):
I just
think that one door
closes, another door
opens. And I didn't look
back. I looked forward.
And I just, I'm very task
orientated, so I just
think I have to do this,
this and this. So I
didn't even look
backwards at all.
Lea Turner (11:36):
Did you have
any kind of like around
you, the people around
you friends, not
necessarily the
colleagues, that were
well aware about how good
you are or what you do.
And I can imagine, were
very encouraging. My
Jesminara Rahman (11:47):
great
my colleagues were great
and I, and in fact, I
remember putting a
WhatsApp group together
with my ex colleagues as
well, and we and we
proposed some names, and
I, and we had a poll, and
we all, majority of them,
chose tax resolute. I
Lea Turner (12:06):
mean, it's a
good name. It's a really
good name, because it's
so good for SEO, right?
That must be extremely
good for it. But the word
Jesminara Rahman (12:13):
resolute,
resolute absolutely
works. You stand by your
stand by this your client
side,
Lea Turner (12:19):
and that's
you like that is you, in
a in a nutshell, isn't
it? Because you're a very
you don't let anything
get by you, if you can
help it, and you've got a
real strength to you. Was
there pushback from like,
the family and the people
that maybe weren't,
because I know that, I
had people that that were
around me were going, Are
you sure this is a big
right? Yeah,
Jesminara Rahman (12:40):
no,
Lea Turner (12:41):
no one.
Jesminara Rahman (12:42):
I'm a
bit stubborn. I think so
Lea Turner (12:43):
they knew
that whatever you told
your I will do it. Yeah,
I
Jesminara Rahman (12:46):
will do
it. But,
Lea Turner (12:47):
I mean, that
goes with resolute,
doesn't it? Well, the
thing is,
Jesminara Rahman (12:51):
I, when
I did my I flunked my A
levels. I didn't do very
well. I gotten I did well
enough to get into
university, but I did not
do well. And I'm not
going to say what I get,
because my children could
be listening, and I don't
want to. I don't want to
provide that example to
them. I just want to keep
them like yet go for the
best. I don't want them
(13:12):
to say, well, Mum, you
got this so we can do
what I didn't get
Lea Turner (13:14):
any A levels
at all, so you still do
better than me.
Jesminara Rahman (13:18):
And at
that time, I think I just
learned that resilience.
My dad actually stopped
talking to me for about
three weeks when I got my
results. He was so
disappointed in me. And
my mom was like, from one
moment she she was see
sawing, from this moment
to that, Oh, I saw you
tried to revise really
(13:38):
hard, and then to, how
could you do this kind of
thing? And I think that
just taught me, right?
You're on your own, and
you have to clear up this
mess and do what you can
and and go forward. And
so I think my resilience
really came from that
situation. My dad
afterwards, he did become
(14:00):
very proud of me. I got
my two one in my degree
and so on, but it
actually did teach me to
be very emotionally
resilient, but that I can
do it and stand on my own
two feet belief as well
yourself. And
Lea Turner (14:13):
it takes a
lot of self belief, and
we have to dig deep
inside someone sometimes
to find it. But when you
do decide to go out on
your own as a business
owner, there are
absolutely, very likely
going to be people around
you that don't get it.
And I certainly found
that I had friends that
then risk averse, and I'm
a risk taker by nature.
Throughout my life, I've
(14:34):
been the kind of person
that will jump into
things head first and
figure out the details
later, and that's almost
when we were talking
about, like, the jump
that you made into self
employment, you knew you
were going to make it
work, because that's the
kind of person that you
are. Well, I
Jesminara Rahman (14:50):
was
cautious. I do it with a
bit. I did have money
saved. I did have a
fallback. So it's not as
if you did have gone back
into lecturing. I could.
And even I went into
lecturing, but I came out
of it again because it
just wasn't earning as
much as I could in my tax
investigation consultant,
it didn't make sense at
the end. That gave
Lea Turner (15:10):
you more
confidence, though,
knowing that there was a
plan B, should it not
succeed, or was there
just never any question
in your head that
Jesminara Rahman (15:20):
I was
just so confident in my
knowledge and skills. I
if I may not be as
confident in other areas,
but in this, I am so
confident in my
knowledge, and that is
one thing that I didn't
have any insecurities
about. And I knew because
of what of my expertise
(15:42):
that I could do it, there
just wasn't any doubt in
in that area at all. The
issue was, how was I
going to do it in? What
way was I going to do it
and and that's where I
had to teach myself, you
know, about how to target
your audience, which
direction, what skills do
you need, which direction
you need to go? So there
(16:03):
are some things that
obviously we're not
taught in HMRC. So
managing client
relationships, just
engagement papers,
because we never done
anything like that, and
how to, yeah, had how to
bring the clients in. So
these were things that I
had to learn. Excuse
Lea Turner (16:25):
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(17:27):
guest and what would you
say of the skills that
you've had to learn?
Because we all start
there, right? And we've
talked about this, I
think it's come up in
most of the conversations
we've had. We all have
the skill that we're
going to sell, which is,
for you, tax expertise,
and for me, you know,
LinkedIn, training,
marketing communities,
but we have to learn all
these extra skills of all
(17:47):
of the other skills that
you've put your mind to
learning. What do you
think has been the the
most valuable one in
terms of maintaining and
growing your business?
Because there's, you
know, if we're talking to
somebody who's just
starting out, or thinking
about moving from side
hustle to taking a
business full time, or,
(18:08):
you know, jumping
straight into business
ownership from uni,
whatever it might be,
what is, if they know
from us, like, what
skills you consider the
most valuable? Which one
do you which one or two
do you think? Well, the
first
Jesminara Rahman (18:22):
thing
you need to have, like an
expertise, you need to be
selling something, yeah,
which is, in my case, is
my expertise. And second
thing is the approach to
sales. Now, I'm not a
salesy person. You when
you think of it, you
think of maybe a double
glazing, you know, you're
fitting suit on your
doorstep or, you know,
(18:44):
just a very aggressive
marketing approach, which
we kind of do have on
LinkedIn, with all those
in mails that they don't
work. Yeah, I think the
key thing is not to think
of it as sales. I don't
think of it that way. I
think of it as flagging
yourself up and saying,
Hey, I'm here, yeah, and
this is what I do. And I
(19:05):
think that approached,
approach helped me the
most in that this is not,
so I'm not doing sales.
This is not I'm just
flagging myself up to say
I am here with what
Lea Turner (19:17):
you do. And I
know this because I
actually worked with an
insolvency practitioner a
few years back when I was
doing LinkedIn training,
and that approach,
especially for what you
do, is so crucial,
because you're not going
to necessarily know who's
in trouble. And the
people who might be in
trouble are probably in a
state of emotional
(19:38):
dysregulation, fear,
panic. They just need to
know that they can trust
you, and that you know
who, if that happened,
who is out there that I
would trust. And we
actually switched this
guy's headline and it
just said licensed
insolvency practitioner.
And we switched the
headline to ready to talk
(19:58):
about insolvency when
you. Are, and we've just
made a tiny little
switch, but it said, I'm
not going to try and sell
to you, but I'm here for
you when you need me. And
it made him 60 grand in
the first six weeks. Oh,
wow, which was wild,
because people just that
one little switch in his
marketing was not here to
push you into working
with me, but when you're
when you need me, I'm
here, and I'm imagining
(20:19):
that it's a very similar
approach with you is you
are consistently showing
up on LinkedIn and
correct me if I'm wrong,
but that's where you get
a large amount of your
business.
Jesminara Rahman (20:29):
I do
now before, I mean, it's,
it's all word of mouth,
but I've also seen the
level of clients is gone
to a bigger, kind of a
bigger range of clients
and bigger companies as
well. So that is,
LinkedIn has definitely
(20:50):
had an impact. Well,
Lea Turner (20:51):
you've got an
exceptional reputation on
that, because the content
that you put out is it's
trusted. You're very
matter of fact, I
Jesminara Rahman (21:01):
don't
go keep my knowledge,
Lea Turner (21:03):
and that's
really rare, especially
in I find in the
financial industry,
there's a lot of cloak
and dagger. People don't
want to share
information. There's so
much compliance
surrounding all the
financial sector when it
comes to social media,
understandably, but it
creates a lot of fear and
anxiety around people in
(21:25):
the financial sector
creating concept, you're
obviously not. You're
not. I'm quite
Jesminara Rahman (21:29):
transparent
about it, and I put
advice out there that
people would have to pay
for. You know that people
just weren't. You
Lea Turner (21:38):
share your
results as well, within
the limitations of
Jesminara Rahman (21:42):
i, i
redact it, take all the
names out, but it's,
it's, it's definitive
evidence of of my audit
trail, of all the, all
the success I've had.
I've also had clients
willing to do video
testimonies, because
that's where Tommy comes
in as well, on that on
that side, and in my
(22:03):
area, I've been quite
blessed, because not many
clients tend to come
forward in this area and
to say I've been
subjected to a tax
investigation because of
the
Lea Turner (22:13):
reputation,
there's a huge amount of
shame attached to that,
which I mean, it can
happen to anybody, and
you don't have to have
done anything terribly
wrong to or certainly not
intentionally wrong to
come up exactly and so it
shouldn't have the shame
around
Jesminara Rahman (22:27):
No,
they shouldn't. And I've
got several video
testimonies where clients
are so happy that they're
willing to go on video to
say,
Lea Turner (22:36):
What amazing,
great
Jesminara Rahman (22:39):
service
I provide, do you find?
Lea Turner (22:42):
And you said
that you know you're
really confident in your
abilities now, and you
were even from the very
beginning of running your
business, has that leaked
out into other areas of
your life now? Do like do
you find? Because, from
my point of view, having
known you for what, four
years now, I would say
that you you are a more
confident person
holistically, like in all
(23:03):
your in all the areas,
all your
Jesminara Rahman (23:05):
networking
stuff, isn't it? I've had
no choice. Yes, we would.
Every time I come up, I
have to do the like the
rounds, and
Lea Turner (23:14):
she's there
with bells. Otherwise I
Jesminara Rahman (23:17):
was
just standing the corner,
like with Billy, no
mates.
Lea Turner (23:21):
It's
wonderful to see that
you've grown like that.
And I think a lot of
younger entrepreneurs,
especially when we we I'm
not putting myself in a
younger category, I wish,
but we come into business
expecting things to just
go brilliantly straight
away. And actually, for
you, it did start
extremely strong. You had
a lot of amazing
(23:42):
connections and a lot of
respect in your industry.
Jesminara Rahman (23:44):
So it
was built up very slowly.
It didn't happen straight
away, no, but, I
Lea Turner (23:48):
mean, you
were making, you're
profitable.
Jesminara Rahman (23:50):
I was,
yeah. I mean, in that I
wasn't earning loads and
loads of money, but in
the beginning, but it was
enough that I was
comfortable to pay my
bills at the end of the
day, and confident. Yeah,
exactly. So that was fine
in that regards. So,
yeah, it's true in in
other areas, you know,
(24:10):
other business owners,
they may be in a lost
position, which means
they have to be even more
careful with my with the
finances, but with the
finances of my company
from year one, we weren't
really in a lost position
as such.
Lea Turner (24:26):
That's
really, really strong,
isn't it? That's not the
same road that a lot of
business owners take.
We've got you here, and
we know from what you've
said, You are an
incredible tax expert,
and you're fighting on
our side, so with a view
to the fact that
predominantly the
listeners to this podcast
are going to be small
business owners, side
hustlers, people thinking
(24:47):
about starting a
business. Are there some
key pieces of advice that
you could share, or you'd
be, you'd be happy to
share, and you know, you
are such an open book
with business owners that
would help them to avoid
need? Someone like you,
and I'm not trying to do
you out of clients.
Jesminara Rahman (25:02):
No, no,
but that's the whole
point of my LinkedIn
post. Your whole
Lea Turner (25:05):
your whole Mo
is so that business
owners don't need you. So
you're trying to make
yourself unemployed
basically.
Jesminara Rahman (25:11):
Well,
what I'm actually trying
to do is, where it's
small cases, they can be
resolved easily. You
don't need somebody like
me. So if I can put that
advice out there where
they can resolve it
themselves easily, that's
great. Then you don't
need somebody like me to
come along. But if it's
(25:33):
quite complicated, and
where it gets quite
complicated, complicated,
have you reached an
impasse and it's just not
budging with HMRC, and in
fact, or it's gone
through a few hands, even
it might have gone
through a couple of
encounters and maybe
another tax investigation
specialist phone
Lea Turner (25:50):
call with
HMRC without my my blood
sugar, my blood pressure,
like shooting through the
roof. I get so stressed,
even just the hold music
gets me stressed. So the
idea of actually having
to go through a tax
investigation? Well,
Jesminara Rahman (26:03):
I don't
need to go through that
kind of channel, listen
to the music direct
route. Exactly. I talk to
a caseworker directly, so
I've got a phone number
and I talk to them
directly. So that's not,
you know, that's not the
same issue. So
Lea Turner (26:16):
how could I,
as a business owner or
multiple business owner,
what should I be putting
in place now in my
business, so that I I
minimize my risks?
Jesminara Rahman (26:28):
Firstly,
you need a good qualified
accountant, right? Okay,
right. That's important.
What? What
Lea Turner (26:35):
does that
mean? What's What does it
how do I know if I'm
speaking to a good
accountant, that
accountant,
Jesminara Rahman (26:40):
they
should be transparent
with all their costs. So
you if they add, you
know, additional bills at
the end of it, and you
find yourself paying in
piecemeal, and it's
actually increasing your
cost, right? So you want
them clear price
breakdown, so it's all
upfront. Secondly, you
they need to be
approachable. So you need
(27:00):
to feel like you can ask
them anything, and it
will never be a dumb
question, yeah, and that
is key, and that you're
Lea Turner (27:07):
not going to
have to wait a week for
an answer. No, and we're
not. We're not expecting,
like, immediate
responses, but no, but
Jesminara Rahman (27:14):
there
should be a response, and
you should be able to if
your accountant is not
responding or explaining
your tax affairs clearly
to you, then there's a
problem, yeah, because
there's going to be a
time when you're going to
have to explain that to
HMRC. And if, especially
if you're subjected to a
tax investigation, your
accountant is not going
(27:35):
to be responsible for
your position. It's going
to be you. And so you
need to be in a position
where you can answer
those questions,
Lea Turner (27:42):
yeah, yeah,
that's really good
advice, because I, I
mean, I'm definitely know
that I'm guilty of not
really understanding it,
and I have an accountant
I absolutely trust, and
she's fantastic, Pauline.
She literally saves my
life and saves me so much
money because she's an
expert and because she
knows I save more a year
in tax than it costs me
(28:03):
to have her. And I think
that's, that's that makes
sense. That's a mark of a
good accountant. But when
I first started out, I
think I was paying a guy
20 pounds a month, and I
knew that at the end of
the year my tax return,
it was all very, very
basic and
straightforward. My tax
return will be done. But
then the next time I had
a new accountant, I went
from, I didn't know, you
(28:23):
know, I was paying for, I
was paying per month, but
I didn't know what that
actually covered. And
then I needed to register
for VAT, and suddenly the
bill went right up. And
then I was a limited
company, and it had gone
up with that as well. And
then it was extra for the
bookkeeping, and then it
was extra to have the
Xero account set up. And
I was there going, I hold
on a minute, like, what's
my monthly fee covering?
(28:45):
Why is it not covering
the bookkeeping? Why am
I? That makes sense for
you, because, but I
didn't. I should have, I
should have got those
price breakdowns at the
Yeah,
Jesminara Rahman (28:52):
that
that as well. But if you
think, if you delegate
that task to somebody
else to do, right? It
makes sense, because what
you can earn in that
time, rather than you
actually carrying out
those tasks yourself. It
doesn't make sense, and
HMRC doesn't expect you
to be a tax expert, but
they do expect you to
(29:13):
take reasonable care over
your tax affairs. So if
you're just signing off
your tax returns, and you
know, roughly, you've
earned, you know, maybe
like 500,000 pounds a
year. But for some
reason, it's 300,000 or
two, you know, 350
there's like 50, 100k
missing. For whatever
(29:34):
reason, these are things
that HMRC would expect
you to be able to notice
straight away that
there's something wrong
with the turnover, or
there's something wrong
with the expenses
claimed, and the
accountant should be
providing you a
breakdown, because at the
end of the day, the prime
records are being
provided by yourself or
(29:54):
business owner and you
and you're signing them
off, and it's not the
accountant who's going to
be responding.
Responsible for any
additional tax
liabilities or the tax
bill is going to be
yourself. So they're not
going to get the penalty.
It's going to be yourself
who gets the penalty.
Lea Turner (30:08):
So good
accountant is definitely,
like step one,
definitely, and I would
say from the beginning,
not just you start your
business, like get an
accountant. That should
be the first,
Jesminara Rahman (30:18):
not
just get a good
accountant, because you
can have qualified
accountants, but they're
not so great, yeah, but
accountants who will
answer your questions are
transparent and Will are
able to break down your
tax affairs in a way that
you will understand
that's a good accountant,
clean, clear,
Lea Turner (30:35):
plain
language that's not,
yeah, full of jargon,
because I get
overwhelmed. I mean, I'm
very honest about my
complete blind spot when
it comes to managing my
finances, and which is
why I have a financial
advisor, Ian and a
wonderful accountant,
because I I need them to
explain and re explain
and re explain, because
it just don't go in my
(30:56):
head. And I need to be
able to turn to them and
ask a question, and I'm
very lucky that they
answer me almost
immediately, and they've
really got my back with
it, but I would be lost
without them. And I can't
imagine running my
business and then having
to worry about all of
that, all the
bookkeeping, all the
accounting, all the tax
returns of the 85 it's
just it's a lot. So I
(31:16):
would, I would say to
anyone starting a
business like that,
should be the first thing
you outsource the minute
you can afford to
outsource the bookkeeping
and the accounting. And I
think
Jesminara Rahman (31:25):
the
other common mistake the
business owner makes is
they take everything on.
They do everything in
their business. And you
have to think that if you
engage somebody else to
do those admin roles or
those bookkeeping roles
and so on. How much money
could you be earning when
that time is freed up?
But they see from the
(31:46):
other perspectives, as
in, I don't I'm not
bringing enough in, so I
can't afford these
additional services. But
it's you get stuck in a
rut by doing that,
because then it's a
vicious circle, and you
never give yourself the
time you need in order to
build up the business and
by doing all of the admin
(32:07):
work, which is not
actually adding value.
Lea Turner (32:10):
So what does
your team look like now
in your business? How
many like how did you
grow it?
Jesminara Rahman (32:16):
I think
quite early on, I had a
bookkeeper and I had an
assistant that was like,
quite early on. So like,
admin, admin, I didn't, I
don't do admin. I don't,
I don't do admin stuff.
It doesn't make sense for
me to do it. So, yeah, I
have two admin people. I
(32:37):
also have two who helps
with the case, just there
and an analysis side of
things. So I have two
people there. I have a
social media person as
well, and and I have a
few case workers, you
know, who specializes in
specific areas. They're
(32:58):
contractors. They work
with me, right? See,
that's,
Lea Turner (33:01):
that's the
model that I'm I've
worked with. What was the
decision? Why did you
make the decision to have
I actually
Jesminara Rahman (33:07):
gave
them the, you know, I
gave them the choice. You
can either come on board
as an employee, which is
fine, or you can come in,
on board, on as a as a
contractor, and they
prefer the flexibility of
a contractor, right? So
because in your decision,
no, I gave them the
decision, and it's just
(33:28):
the, it's it's just when
they want to work, how
they want to work, and so
on. I mean, my employees
have that flexibility in
that. I don't. It's not
set hours. I say, this is
your task. This is what
you need to do, but when
you want to do it, it's
up to you. So they have
the freedom to take time
off whenever, as long as
(33:48):
the task is done at it by
a specific deadline.
That's all I care about.
They can do it at home.
They can do it at the
office, because majority
of my staff is actually
female, and so we've all
got caring
responsibilities as well,
and so we need to. It
doesn't make sense that
my lifestyle is adjusted
(34:08):
to that, but not to them,
because that's unfair.
Yeah,
Lea Turner (34:11):
and I
actually so I noticed
this. And there's a few
people on LinkedIn that I
notice it with, and it's
no shade to them, but I
see them like living
their best lives. They're
flexible. They work
anywhere. They do
whatever they want, and
yet they've got staff who
are in the office nine to
five or eight to six or,
you know, three days a
week they have to be in
(34:32):
the office, and their
staff are being paid, you
know, a set amount. And I
think I wonder how I
would feel if I was their
member of staff, and I
can see my boss
gallivanting off doing
all these fun things,
amazing things. I don't
know how I'd feel about
that.
Jesminara Rahman (34:46):
I don't
know. I don't I know
Lea Turner (34:50):
that they're
the boss, but I wonder
if, like, that's not a
particularly motivating
way to run the business.
If you're being seen to
be, you know they're I'm
paying them this. Wage,
and it's a bit flexible,
but here I am, and that's
giving me my best life. I
don't know if that that
feels like good
leadership to me, and to
do what you've done in
(35:10):
creating kind of an equal
plane, where, if you get
the flexibility to work
when you want and where
you want, they should
have that as well, and
have the control over
whether they want the
employed life or the
contractor life. And, you
know, they then be
flexible and able to work
for other people if they
wanted to take on more
work, I assume as well.
(35:31):
Obviously, maybe there's,
you know, not not
competing with other
people doing what you're
doing, but they've got
the ability to do that. I
Jesminara Rahman (35:38):
think
even then. I mean, I've
had LinkedIn posts where
I say, I don't see
competitors, I see
colleagues. So I think
there's more than enough
work for everybody in
this fohc That's creating
this I don't think we
need to come into
conflict or be
competitors over the work
(35:59):
and that I've seen
because we've had
collaborations as well.
So I've worked with other
companies. I've worked
with other tax
investigation
specialists. One of my
areas is alternative
dispute resolution was
which is a mediation and
that's my like, my niche,
My expertise is there. So
I've had other tax
(36:19):
investigation specialist,
bring me in just to deal
with the ADR side, to
help them through it,
which I've got no issues
with doing that. I've got
no issues in providing
advice over the phone to
other tax investigation
specialists. And I've
done that as well as you
Lea Turner (36:36):
know that
that's my my MO as well
when I'm working with
people is I want to
support people within my
own industry. You know,
I've got a community a
business owner. Yeah,
there's other LinkedIn
training. You have other
LinkedIn I've seen them,
probably five or six
different LinkedIn
trainers in there, and
people like, oh, you
know, can I join your
community? Because I'm a
LinkedIn trainer as well.
I'm like, Yeah, it's
Jesminara Rahman (36:54):
fine,
because you're confident
in your skills. That's
why you you know what you
can do,
Lea Turner (36:59):
and learn
something from me that
helps them to become
better as a LinkedIn
trainer, or maybe I'll
learn things from them.
You know, it that's,
that's a good thing for
all of us. I don't so I'm
absolutely on your page.
I'm curious to know,
though, as as a business
owner, you've been doing
this for nine years.
It's, it's a fairly tough
industry. Like, what
would you say have been
the, maybe, the negatives
(37:20):
of becoming a business
owner, like, Where have,
where is it maybe not
been what you thought it
might be. Or, you know,
where, where have you
experienced more sort of
turbulence with it?
Jesminara Rahman (37:31):
I think
the pressure is all on
you. You don't at the end
of the day, you're the
decision owner, and you
got your and the decision
maker, yeah,
Lea Turner (37:42):
that's a lot
of extra. The mental load
of having four children
is, well, is huge, right?
Jesminara Rahman (37:46):
Well,
they come first, and so
sometimes my business has
to take a back seat. And
I have done that. And I
in 2019 when my dad
passed away that year,
was I spent time going to
the hospital, and that
was because of the
flexibility of my
business, but my business
definitely took a back
seat, because family is
(38:07):
more important than the
company, and that's
something I've held
throughout throughout all
these years, that if
there's if your family
needs you, and you just
have to be there for
them, and
Lea Turner (38:22):
it can be a
real struggle as a
business owner when you
know you're obviously in
a position where, where
you you were earning All
right at the time that
would allow you to do
that. And I know there
have been times where
I've been torn because I
haven't had the financial
backup that if I don't
work, and I was panicking
(38:43):
because I had to make a
really tough choice. I've
had, you know, sick baby
tied to my, you know,
wrapped up on my chest
trying to cuddle him
because he's poorly, and
I still need to get the
work done, and all I want
to do is lie on the sofa
and cuddle him. It's,
it's really, really tough
as a business owner to
make calls like that. And
I'm glad that you
obviously created a
(39:04):
business where you could
be by your dad's side.
When, yes,
Jesminara Rahman (39:07):
I think
because when at the stage
you was at with your
children, I was actually
employed by HMRC, so I
had my children while I
was in HMRC, so I had
that support. So I mean,
as an organization, HMRC
is, is quite family
friendly, and they're
quite flexible, yeah, but
the amount of knowledge
(39:28):
that I have gained since
I've left is is more.
It's just more than
triple.
Lea Turner (39:35):
Nothing can
compare for that, though,
right? Because I, I
literally put it in a
LinkedIn post, I think
last week, saying the
knowledge that I have
gained in the past four
years far exceeds what I
learned in the last 35
including all the years I
was at school. Because
you have to learn on your
feet quickly as a
(39:55):
business owner, because
it's learn or fail. And.
Sometimes you fail to
learn, but like you fail,
and then you learn from
the failure, but you have
to do it all
Jesminara Rahman (40:05):
fast.
One of my friends,
actually, and she's on
LinkedIn, Katie Hampton,
she said to me that the
universe keeps sending
you the same lessons
again again, until you
learn it,
Lea Turner (40:19):
which is why
we need to learn it the
first go, right? I
definitely am one of
those people that I very
rarely take two failures
to learn a tough lesson.
I'm like, right? We
learned that one onto the
next. Where am I going to
fail next? And you have
but that's where the
resilience comes in,
right? As a business
owner, you have to be
resilient, because you're
not going to get it right
all the time, and you
have to bounce, taking a
(40:41):
month off licking your
wounds and going poor me,
but
Jesminara Rahman (40:44):
you
have to forgive yourself
as well be forgiving,
though, can't it? It can
be. It can be, but, you
know, you have to be a
bit forgiving and kind to
yourself. Yeah, you know,
things happen and just
step forward. I
Lea Turner (40:57):
think the
older I get as well, the
harder it becomes to be
bad at something because
the last time I started
something brand new,
prior to these
businesses, was learning
to drive when I was 17.
And I haven't really just
started something new
that I've been rubbish at
since then. And the older
you get, the harder it
becomes to start from
(41:18):
nothing and go, yep,
well, I'm going to suck
at this for a while, and
I just have to take that
on the chin, because we
just tend to do things
that we're we're already
good at, or that we know
we're going to be quite
good at.
Jesminara Rahman (41:28):
You've
already established your
base, yeah, and that's
where you're leaping
from, and it
Lea Turner (41:34):
sucks for the
ego as well, right?
Because you're just like,
wow, I'm really bad at
this, and everyone can
laugh at me. That's why I
don't go in a gym. I
won't walk in a gym
because I know that I'm
gonna feel really self
conscious because
Jesminara Rahman (41:45):
you did
that comedy show.
Lea Turner (41:47):
Oh yeah, one
off. I mean, that was
like I was saying, wasn't
it was, well, outside my
comfort zone. But there
was money,
Jesminara Rahman (41:56):
a large
amount of money, comedian
with you as well. Yeah,
yeah. I have. She was the
one that cracked the
Lea Turner (42:01):
joke. She she
was the one that made me
she was my Bronson. I
knew she was my emotional
support lesbian. I'm
gonna call her that. She
watches Beth, I'm sorry,
but if she watches it,
yeah, that that was I'm
very good at pushing
outside of my comfort
zone. That's when I'm
getting paid. If I'm not
getting paid. I'm not
(42:21):
doing it, which is why I
probably failed to walk
up Kilimanjaro, because I
was raising money for
someone else. If they
paid me 50 grand to walk
up Kilimanjaro, I'd have
made it to the top, but
the 50 grand is already
in the charity pocket by
then, so it was fine.
Jasmine, it's been such a
pleasure chatting to you.
And you know what? We
actually haven't done
this properly since we
(42:42):
had our one to one all
those years ago, actually
on sofas having a good
old chinwag. So it's been
really lovely to chat to
you and actually find out
more about the journey
and what it's taken to
get to where you are. So
thank you for sharing.
You're welcome, and I
shall see you again soon.
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need to tell you about
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My
(00:00):
employees have that
flexibility in that it's
not set hours. I say,
this is your task. This
is what you need to do.
But when you want to do
it, it's up to you. So
they have the freedom to
take time off whenever,
as long as a task is
done, at it by a specific
deadline. That's all I
care about. They can do
it at home. They can do
it at the office, because
majority of my staff is
(00:21):
actually female, and so
we've all got caring
responsibilities as well.
It doesn't make sense
that my lifestyle is
adjusted to that, but not
to them, because that's
Lea Turner (00:32):
Jesmin, thank
unfair. You.
you so much for being on
the whole Survival Guide
for small businesses. I'd
love to find out a little
bit more. Why don't you
tell everybody a little
(00:52):
bit about who you are and
and how we came to be
here today.
Jesminara Rahman (00:56):
Okay?
My name is Jesminara
Rahman, Jesmin for short,
because I know it's a bit
of a mouthful, and I was
originally a taxi
inspector for HMRC for
about 15 years. I left
and then set up my own
consultancy in 2015 and
(01:21):
ever since now, I provide
specialist or expert
advice on tax
investigations. So you're
Lea Turner (01:30):
now on our
side as business owners.
You're fighting our
corner when, when things
go wrong with HMRC, I
Jesminara Rahman (01:36):
represent
clients in disputes with
tax disputes with HMRC.
So you switch sides. I
have gamekeeper turned we
don't
Lea Turner (01:47):
want to lose
the listeners when they
think you work for HMRC
now, very much on our
side.
Jesminara Rahman (01:51):
I very
much represent taxpayers.
Lea Turner (01:54):
And it's,
it's really interesting,
because we've known each
other for a fair few
years now, and I've, I
can definitely say that
I've seen your confidence
massively increase in the
time that I've known you
as a business owner, but
in conversations that
we've had before, you've
said to me that, you
know, starting a business
wasn't ever really in
your plan, and you've
kind of never had much of
a business plan, and you
(02:15):
were kind of dragged
kicking and screaming
into and I think this is
a really interesting. It
interests me because when
I first started my first
business, it was to make
a little bit of extra
money so I could travel,
and then it went really
well. And I say really
well financially, it
didn't make much money,
but it made me the same
(02:36):
amount as I made when I
worked full time. So I
was earning two full time
wages, which was lovely,
but I was killing myself
and managing both. And I
had to give my business a
chance, and I really
didn't want to, I did not
want to leave employment,
and I didn't want to be a
business owner. And I
found it all very, very
scary, but I took that
risk, and I never had a
(02:56):
business plan. And even
now, even with the
businesses that I run
now, which arguably have
been very successful. I
don't have a business
plan. And I think we all
get very bogged down when
we're starting
businesses. We think we
have to have it all
planned out, and we have
to know exactly what the
goals are. And I'd love
to hear a little bit more
about that when you
started, and how you
(03:17):
muddled through and
winged it without, and
how nine years later
we're here. You've got a
very successful business,
but you haven't taken
that traditional route
that we all are told. We
need business plans and
and we need to have a map
of exactly what we're
going to do. You've not
done
Jesminara Rahman (03:34):
it. So
I think we've got that in
common. You and I, we we
have.
Lea Turner (03:38):
So how did
you manage that? Like,
how did you start out and
make it successful
without all of those
things?
Jesminara Rahman (03:46):
One of
the common barriers, I
think, between in setting
up in your own business
is people are afraid to
leave their secure jobs,
and so that's the first
hurdle for a lot of
people in in that it's
very difficult to take
that all out risk in
(04:06):
setting up on your own
and leaving a secure
income behind. So what do
Lea Turner (04:13):
you think the
fear is? You think it's
the fear of I'm not going
to make enough money, it
definitely, and the fear
of everyone's going to
realize that I failed and
and judge me for it
definitely. Yeah. And did
you feel those things?
Jesminara Rahman (04:23):
Actually, my reason was, one of my reasons, main reasons was I wanted to go into lecturing. So I was I left that, and I wanted to fulfill one of my dreams, which was to be a university lecturer. So I actually did my teaching qualification, and it was and then I started looking for vacancies. And I did actually achieve that dream, but I met up with my ex, one of my ex directors from HMRC, now she had retired. Her name was May Anderson, and she's Scottish. I can't I'm very awful at accent. Accent, so I'm not going to do the Scottish, Scottish people watching, yeah, and lovely accent, though it is, but I just can't mimic it. And she we met up over lunch, and in spit of spitter feels, and she just said to me in her very brusque way, you don't be stupid, Jesmin, go back into tax. And it was literally her that made me pivot what I was going to do. Abandoned the dream, because she said you can go into lecturing anytime you want. Give it, give it one year tax. Give that one year. And if you don't like being on this side in tax, go back into what you want to do, but you can't keep leave it for a few years, because you need to be up to date with your knowledge in tax. So you can't have a gap and then go back in because it's it's difficult and and she said, You try it. Take my advice and try it. So It's all her fault, then it is her fault. Yeah, that I, I literally it was because of her. I went back into
(06:06):
tax.
Lea Turner (06:08):
And I'm
assuming you don't regret
it, no,
Jesminara Rahman (06:12):
so I
don't it was actually the
best decision I could
have made at
Lea Turner (06:17):
the time,
different for you,
because obviously you
went from working for
HMRC to totally switching
sides. What was the like
emotional switch that you
made? Like, did you feel
more job satisfaction?
Was there more motivation
and passion for it when
you were arguably on the
kind of little guys side,
(06:38):
I
Jesminara Rahman (06:38):
felt
the the small medium
businesses were not
represented in the way
they needed to be, and in
HMRC tax gap reports,
you'll see the majority
of the gap In taxes
collected is allocated to
(07:00):
small medium businesses.
So a lot of the targets,
targeted activities
actually on small and
medium businesses. And I
felt that there needed to
be a fair representation,
and if I could cascade my
knowledge, which is what
I do on LinkedIn, and
help to knit that in the
bud disputes, that could
get to somebody like me
(07:22):
and knit that in the at
the beginning and help
with my advice and that I
felt it was, it was worth
it, yeah,
Lea Turner (07:30):
so kind of
like a little tax
superhero for people. And
yeah, I try, and I don't
think it's me blowing
smoke to say that you are
exceptionally good at
what you do, you have
created incredibly strong
reputation for being very
good at what you do and
the results that you get
for people. Yes, and I
think that speaks to your
passion for helping
people. And you know, we
(07:52):
all get, need to get paid
for the work that we do,
but having the passion
for helping people has
been is that, would you
say that's one of the key
things that's kept you
going for nine years?
Definitely
Jesminara Rahman (08:04):
gives
me great satisfaction
when I managed to uphold
a case for the client.
Great, because these tax
investigations have such
a heavy toll on business
owners and and
Lea Turner (08:20):
it's not just
financial, right? It's
not it flows out to every
area of that.
Jesminara Rahman (08:24):
Majority
are in depression. By the
time they've come to me,
they're overworked,
they're stressed, and
they're in depression,
and they've been
medically diagnosed with
depression, wow, that's
tough. That must
Lea Turner (08:34):
be really
tough on you, though, to
to take that emotional
load on, because I know
you're you're the
specialist when it comes
to the money, but there's
got to be some of that.
The emotional toll that
comes out in there
Jesminara Rahman (08:49):
is, but
that's where you have to
be careful as well,
because at the end of the
day, you can't play
mother. Yeah, and there's
a there's a barrier,
there's a you have to be
careful to because you
can't replace that role
in their lives and and
become the complete
emotional support because
(09:10):
you're not their mom,
they're an adult, yeah,
but you can signpost them
to the services that they
need, but you cannot
provide the complete
emotional support that
maybe their family should
be providing. But I
definitely have had those
moments. I've had those
times when you know a
(09:30):
client is suicidal, and
they're in the car park
and they're talking from
their car and saying
that, you know they can't
they can't bear it
anymore. And I think that
also shows in my reviews
as well and testimonies.
There's the times when
they've been in a dark
(09:51):
space, and I have guided
them out of it, and
Lea Turner (09:55):
that's not
something that you would
necessarily expect. You
know, when you went into
this. This, you probably
weren't expecting to have
to have that level of
compassion and empathy
with the people that you
work with. So it's, it's
amazing skill that you've
you must have honed to be
able to but also to be
able to keep yourself
safe from that, because
it's quite easy to let
that ebb into your life
(10:16):
and put a lot of extra
pressure and stress on
you, and thinking about
that like as a business
owner for nine years, and
you had two youngish
children at the time when
you took this risk of
going out on your I've
got four children. Sorry,
four children. That's
alright, times 10
children. My goodness,
for some reason, maybe
it's we've only talked
(10:37):
about the younger
Jesminara Rahman (10:37):
two.
The younger two, yeah,
because I normally talk
about Mason and Armand,
the ones
Lea Turner (10:42):
that still
are at home, yeah. So
they all know. How did
you like when
Jesminara Rahman (10:46):
they're
all at home? All at home,
all four of them. Oh,
Lea Turner (10:49):
my goodness,
I can't even imagine
that. I said, What's the
age range on them? From
Jesminara Rahman (10:53):
25 to
1325? To 30? Yeah, 1313,
I
Lea Turner (10:58):
was going to
say 25 to 30 year old. 30
year old. No, Goodness
me. So with those, those
kids at home, like, what,
what went through your
head as you took that
risk into like, was, was
the family supportive?
Was it frightening to
you? What about the
people in your wider
circle beyond the family?
Jesminara Rahman (11:19):
I just
think that one door
closes, another door
opens. And I didn't look
back. I looked forward.
And I just, I'm very task
orientated, so I just
think I have to do this,
this and this. So I
didn't even look
backwards at all.
Lea Turner (11:36):
Did you have
any kind of like around
you, the people around
you friends, not
necessarily the
colleagues, that were
well aware about how good
you are or what you do.
And I can imagine, were
very encouraging. My
Jesminara Rahman (11:47):
great
my colleagues were great
and I, and in fact, I
remember putting a
WhatsApp group together
with my ex colleagues as
well, and we and we
proposed some names, and
I, and we had a poll, and
we all, majority of them,
chose tax resolute. I
Lea Turner (12:06):
mean, it's a
good name. It's a really
good name, because it's
so good for SEO, right?
That must be extremely
good for it. But the word
Jesminara Rahman (12:13):
resolute,
resolute absolutely
works. You stand by your
stand by this your client
side,
Lea Turner (12:19):
and that's
you like that is you, in
a in a nutshell, isn't
it? Because you're a very
you don't let anything
get by you, if you can
help it, and you've got a
real strength to you. Was
there pushback from like,
the family and the people
that maybe weren't,
because I know that, I
had people that that were
around me were going, Are
you sure this is a big
right? Yeah,
Jesminara Rahman (12:40):
no,
Lea Turner (12:41):
no one.
Jesminara Rahman (12:42):
I'm a
bit stubborn. I think so
Lea Turner (12:43):
they knew
that whatever you told
your I will do it. Yeah,
I
Jesminara Rahman (12:46):
will do
it. But,
Lea Turner (12:47):
I mean, that
goes with resolute,
doesn't it? Well, the
thing is,
Jesminara Rahman (12:51):
I, when
I did my I flunked my A
levels. I didn't do very
well. I gotten I did well
enough to get into
university, but I did not
do well. And I'm not
going to say what I get,
because my children could
be listening, and I don't
want to. I don't want to
provide that example to
them. I just want to keep
them like yet go for the
best. I don't want them
(13:12):
to say, well, Mum, you
got this so we can do
what I didn't get
Lea Turner (13:14):
any A levels
at all, so you still do
better than me.
Jesminara Rahman (13:18):
And at
that time, I think I just
learned that resilience.
My dad actually stopped
talking to me for about
three weeks when I got my
results. He was so
disappointed in me. And
my mom was like, from one
moment she she was see
sawing, from this moment
to that, Oh, I saw you
tried to revise really
(13:38):
hard, and then to, how
could you do this kind of
thing? And I think that
just taught me, right?
You're on your own, and
you have to clear up this
mess and do what you can
and and go forward. And
so I think my resilience
really came from that
situation. My dad
afterwards, he did become
(14:00):
very proud of me. I got
my two one in my degree
and so on, but it
actually did teach me to
be very emotionally
resilient, but that I can
do it and stand on my own
two feet belief as well
yourself. And
Lea Turner (14:13):
it takes a
lot of self belief, and
we have to dig deep
inside someone sometimes
to find it. But when you
do decide to go out on
your own as a business
owner, there are
absolutely, very likely
going to be people around
you that don't get it.
And I certainly found
that I had friends that
then risk averse, and I'm
a risk taker by nature.
Throughout my life, I've
(14:34):
been the kind of person
that will jump into
things head first and
figure out the details
later, and that's almost
when we were talking
about, like, the jump
that you made into self
employment, you knew you
were going to make it
work, because that's the
kind of person that you
are. Well, I
Jesminara Rahman (14:50):
was
cautious. I do it with a
bit. I did have money
saved. I did have a
fallback. So it's not as
if you did have gone back
into lecturing. I could.
And even I went into
lecturing, but I came out
of it again because it
just wasn't earning as
much as I could in my tax
investigation consultant,
it didn't make sense at
the end. That gave
Lea Turner (15:10):
you more
confidence, though,
knowing that there was a
plan B, should it not
succeed, or was there
just never any question
in your head that
Jesminara Rahman (15:20):
I was
just so confident in my
knowledge and skills. I
if I may not be as
confident in other areas,
but in this, I am so
confident in my
knowledge, and that is
one thing that I didn't
have any insecurities
about. And I knew because
of what of my expertise
(15:42):
that I could do it, there
just wasn't any doubt in
in that area at all. The
issue was, how was I
going to do it in? What
way was I going to do it
and and that's where I
had to teach myself, you
know, about how to target
your audience, which
direction, what skills do
you need, which direction
you need to go? So there
(16:03):
are some things that
obviously we're not
taught in HMRC. So
managing client
relationships, just
engagement papers,
because we never done
anything like that, and
how to, yeah, had how to
bring the clients in. So
these were things that I
had to learn. Excuse
Lea Turner (16:25):
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and side hustlers could
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(17:27):
guest and what would you
say of the skills that
you've had to learn?
Because we all start
there, right? And we've
talked about this, I
think it's come up in
most of the conversations
we've had. We all have
the skill that we're
going to sell, which is,
for you, tax expertise,
and for me, you know,
LinkedIn, training,
marketing communities,
but we have to learn all
these extra skills of all
(17:47):
of the other skills that
you've put your mind to
learning. What do you
think has been the the
most valuable one in
terms of maintaining and
growing your business?
Because there's, you
know, if we're talking to
somebody who's just
starting out, or thinking
about moving from side
hustle to taking a
business full time, or,
(18:08):
you know, jumping
straight into business
ownership from uni,
whatever it might be,
what is, if they know
from us, like, what
skills you consider the
most valuable? Which one
do you which one or two
do you think? Well, the
first
Jesminara Rahman (18:22):
thing
you need to have, like an
expertise, you need to be
selling something, yeah,
which is, in my case, is
my expertise. And second
thing is the approach to
sales. Now, I'm not a
salesy person. You when
you think of it, you
think of maybe a double
glazing, you know, you're
fitting suit on your
doorstep or, you know,
(18:44):
just a very aggressive
marketing approach, which
we kind of do have on
LinkedIn, with all those
in mails that they don't
work. Yeah, I think the
key thing is not to think
of it as sales. I don't
think of it that way. I
think of it as flagging
yourself up and saying,
Hey, I'm here, yeah, and
this is what I do. And I
(19:05):
think that approached,
approach helped me the
most in that this is not,
so I'm not doing sales.
This is not I'm just
flagging myself up to say
I am here with what
Lea Turner (19:17):
you do. And I
know this because I
actually worked with an
insolvency practitioner a
few years back when I was
doing LinkedIn training,
and that approach,
especially for what you
do, is so crucial,
because you're not going
to necessarily know who's
in trouble. And the
people who might be in
trouble are probably in a
state of emotional
(19:38):
dysregulation, fear,
panic. They just need to
know that they can trust
you, and that you know
who, if that happened,
who is out there that I
would trust. And we
actually switched this
guy's headline and it
just said licensed
insolvency practitioner.
And we switched the
headline to ready to talk
(19:58):
about insolvency when
you. Are, and we've just
made a tiny little
switch, but it said, I'm
not going to try and sell
to you, but I'm here for
you when you need me. And
it made him 60 grand in
the first six weeks. Oh,
wow, which was wild,
because people just that
one little switch in his
marketing was not here to
push you into working
with me, but when you're
when you need me, I'm
here, and I'm imagining
(20:19):
that it's a very similar
approach with you is you
are consistently showing
up on LinkedIn and
correct me if I'm wrong,
but that's where you get
a large amount of your
business.
Jesminara Rahman (20:29):
I do
now before, I mean, it's,
it's all word of mouth,
but I've also seen the
level of clients is gone
to a bigger, kind of a
bigger range of clients
and bigger companies as
well. So that is,
LinkedIn has definitely
(20:50):
had an impact. Well,
Lea Turner (20:51):
you've got an
exceptional reputation on
that, because the content
that you put out is it's
trusted. You're very
matter of fact, I
Jesminara Rahman (21:01):
don't
go keep my knowledge,
Lea Turner (21:03):
and that's
really rare, especially
in I find in the
financial industry,
there's a lot of cloak
and dagger. People don't
want to share
information. There's so
much compliance
surrounding all the
financial sector when it
comes to social media,
understandably, but it
creates a lot of fear and
anxiety around people in
(21:25):
the financial sector
creating concept, you're
obviously not. You're
not. I'm quite
Jesminara Rahman (21:29):
transparent
about it, and I put
advice out there that
people would have to pay
for. You know that people
just weren't. You
Lea Turner (21:38):
share your
results as well, within
the limitations of
Jesminara Rahman (21:42):
i, i
redact it, take all the
names out, but it's,
it's, it's definitive
evidence of of my audit
trail, of all the, all
the success I've had.
I've also had clients
willing to do video
testimonies, because
that's where Tommy comes
in as well, on that on
that side, and in my
(22:03):
area, I've been quite
blessed, because not many
clients tend to come
forward in this area and
to say I've been
subjected to a tax
investigation because of
the
Lea Turner (22:13):
reputation,
there's a huge amount of
shame attached to that,
which I mean, it can
happen to anybody, and
you don't have to have
done anything terribly
wrong to or certainly not
intentionally wrong to
come up exactly and so it
shouldn't have the shame
around
Jesminara Rahman (22:27):
No,
they shouldn't. And I've
got several video
testimonies where clients
are so happy that they're
willing to go on video to
say,
Lea Turner (22:36):
What amazing,
great
Jesminara Rahman (22:39):
service
I provide, do you find?
Lea Turner (22:42):
And you said
that you know you're
really confident in your
abilities now, and you
were even from the very
beginning of running your
business, has that leaked
out into other areas of
your life now? Do like do
you find? Because, from
my point of view, having
known you for what, four
years now, I would say
that you you are a more
confident person
holistically, like in all
(23:03):
your in all the areas,
all your
Jesminara Rahman (23:05):
networking
stuff, isn't it? I've had
no choice. Yes, we would.
Every time I come up, I
have to do the like the
rounds, and
Lea Turner (23:14):
she's there
with bells. Otherwise I
Jesminara Rahman (23:17):
was
just standing the corner,
like with Billy, no
mates.
Lea Turner (23:21):
It's
wonderful to see that
you've grown like that.
And I think a lot of
younger entrepreneurs,
especially when we we I'm
not putting myself in a
younger category, I wish,
but we come into business
expecting things to just
go brilliantly straight
away. And actually, for
you, it did start
extremely strong. You had
a lot of amazing
(23:42):
connections and a lot of
respect in your industry.
Jesminara Rahman (23:44):
So it
was built up very slowly.
It didn't happen straight
away, no, but, I
Lea Turner (23:48):
mean, you
were making, you're
profitable.
Jesminara Rahman (23:50):
I was,
yeah. I mean, in that I
wasn't earning loads and
loads of money, but in
the beginning, but it was
enough that I was
comfortable to pay my
bills at the end of the
day, and confident. Yeah,
exactly. So that was fine
in that regards. So,
yeah, it's true in in
other areas, you know,
(24:10):
other business owners,
they may be in a lost
position, which means
they have to be even more
careful with my with the
finances, but with the
finances of my company
from year one, we weren't
really in a lost position
as such.
Lea Turner (24:26):
That's
really, really strong,
isn't it? That's not the
same road that a lot of
business owners take.
We've got you here, and
we know from what you've
said, You are an
incredible tax expert,
and you're fighting on
our side, so with a view
to the fact that
predominantly the
listeners to this podcast
are going to be small
business owners, side
hustlers, people thinking
(24:47):
about starting a
business. Are there some
key pieces of advice that
you could share, or you'd
be, you'd be happy to
share, and you know, you
are such an open book
with business owners that
would help them to avoid
need? Someone like you,
and I'm not trying to do
you out of clients.
Jesminara Rahman (25:02):
No, no,
but that's the whole
point of my LinkedIn
post. Your whole
Lea Turner (25:05):
your whole Mo
is so that business
owners don't need you. So
you're trying to make
yourself unemployed
basically.
Jesminara Rahman (25:11):
Well,
what I'm actually trying
to do is, where it's
small cases, they can be
resolved easily. You
don't need somebody like
me. So if I can put that
advice out there where
they can resolve it
themselves easily, that's
great. Then you don't
need somebody like me to
come along. But if it's
(25:33):
quite complicated, and
where it gets quite
complicated, complicated,
have you reached an
impasse and it's just not
budging with HMRC, and in
fact, or it's gone
through a few hands, even
it might have gone
through a couple of
encounters and maybe
another tax investigation
specialist phone
Lea Turner (25:50):
call with
HMRC without my my blood
sugar, my blood pressure,
like shooting through the
roof. I get so stressed,
even just the hold music
gets me stressed. So the
idea of actually having
to go through a tax
investigation? Well,
Jesminara Rahman (26:03):
I don't
need to go through that
kind of channel, listen
to the music direct
route. Exactly. I talk to
a caseworker directly, so
I've got a phone number
and I talk to them
directly. So that's not,
you know, that's not the
same issue. So
Lea Turner (26:16):
how could I,
as a business owner or
multiple business owner,
what should I be putting
in place now in my
business, so that I I
minimize my risks?
Jesminara Rahman (26:28):
Firstly,
you need a good qualified
accountant, right? Okay,
right. That's important.
What? What
Lea Turner (26:35):
does that
mean? What's What does it
how do I know if I'm
speaking to a good
accountant, that
accountant,
Jesminara Rahman (26:40):
they
should be transparent
with all their costs. So
you if they add, you
know, additional bills at
the end of it, and you
find yourself paying in
piecemeal, and it's
actually increasing your
cost, right? So you want
them clear price
breakdown, so it's all
upfront. Secondly, you
they need to be
approachable. So you need
(27:00):
to feel like you can ask
them anything, and it
will never be a dumb
question, yeah, and that
is key, and that you're
Lea Turner (27:07):
not going to
have to wait a week for
an answer. No, and we're
not. We're not expecting,
like, immediate
responses, but no, but
Jesminara Rahman (27:14):
there
should be a response, and
you should be able to if
your accountant is not
responding or explaining
your tax affairs clearly
to you, then there's a
problem, yeah, because
there's going to be a
time when you're going to
have to explain that to
HMRC. And if, especially
if you're subjected to a
tax investigation, your
accountant is not going
(27:35):
to be responsible for
your position. It's going
to be you. And so you
need to be in a position
where you can answer
those questions,
Lea Turner (27:42):
yeah, yeah,
that's really good
advice, because I, I
mean, I'm definitely know
that I'm guilty of not
really understanding it,
and I have an accountant
I absolutely trust, and
she's fantastic, Pauline.
She literally saves my
life and saves me so much
money because she's an
expert and because she
knows I save more a year
in tax than it costs me
(28:03):
to have her. And I think
that's, that's that makes
sense. That's a mark of a
good accountant. But when
I first started out, I
think I was paying a guy
20 pounds a month, and I
knew that at the end of
the year my tax return,
it was all very, very
basic and
straightforward. My tax
return will be done. But
then the next time I had
a new accountant, I went
from, I didn't know, you
(28:23):
know, I was paying for, I
was paying per month, but
I didn't know what that
actually covered. And
then I needed to register
for VAT, and suddenly the
bill went right up. And
then I was a limited
company, and it had gone
up with that as well. And
then it was extra for the
bookkeeping, and then it
was extra to have the
Xero account set up. And
I was there going, I hold
on a minute, like, what's
my monthly fee covering?
(28:45):
Why is it not covering
the bookkeeping? Why am
I? That makes sense for
you, because, but I
didn't. I should have, I
should have got those
price breakdowns at the
Yeah,
Jesminara Rahman (28:52):
that
that as well. But if you
think, if you delegate
that task to somebody
else to do, right? It
makes sense, because what
you can earn in that
time, rather than you
actually carrying out
those tasks yourself. It
doesn't make sense, and
HMRC doesn't expect you
to be a tax expert, but
they do expect you to
(29:13):
take reasonable care over
your tax affairs. So if
you're just signing off
your tax returns, and you
know, roughly, you've
earned, you know, maybe
like 500,000 pounds a
year. But for some
reason, it's 300,000 or
two, you know, 350
there's like 50, 100k
missing. For whatever
(29:34):
reason, these are things
that HMRC would expect
you to be able to notice
straight away that
there's something wrong
with the turnover, or
there's something wrong
with the expenses
claimed, and the
accountant should be
providing you a
breakdown, because at the
end of the day, the prime
records are being
provided by yourself or
(29:54):
business owner and you
and you're signing them
off, and it's not the
accountant who's going to
be responding.
Responsible for any
additional tax
liabilities or the tax
bill is going to be
yourself. So they're not
going to get the penalty.
It's going to be yourself
who gets the penalty.
Lea Turner (30:08):
So good
accountant is definitely,
like step one,
definitely, and I would
say from the beginning,
not just you start your
business, like get an
accountant. That should
be the first,
Jesminara Rahman (30:18):
not
just get a good
accountant, because you
can have qualified
accountants, but they're
not so great, yeah, but
accountants who will
answer your questions are
transparent and Will are
able to break down your
tax affairs in a way that
you will understand
that's a good accountant,
clean, clear,
Lea Turner (30:35):
plain
language that's not,
yeah, full of jargon,
because I get
overwhelmed. I mean, I'm
very honest about my
complete blind spot when
it comes to managing my
finances, and which is
why I have a financial
advisor, Ian and a
wonderful accountant,
because I I need them to
explain and re explain
and re explain, because
it just don't go in my
(30:56):
head. And I need to be
able to turn to them and
ask a question, and I'm
very lucky that they
answer me almost
immediately, and they've
really got my back with
it, but I would be lost
without them. And I can't
imagine running my
business and then having
to worry about all of
that, all the
bookkeeping, all the
accounting, all the tax
returns of the 85 it's
just it's a lot. So I
(31:16):
would, I would say to
anyone starting a
business like that,
should be the first thing
you outsource the minute
you can afford to
outsource the bookkeeping
and the accounting. And I
think
Jesminara Rahman (31:25):
the
other common mistake the
business owner makes is
they take everything on.
They do everything in
their business. And you
have to think that if you
engage somebody else to
do those admin roles or
those bookkeeping roles
and so on. How much money
could you be earning when
that time is freed up?
But they see from the
(31:46):
other perspectives, as
in, I don't I'm not
bringing enough in, so I
can't afford these
additional services. But
it's you get stuck in a
rut by doing that,
because then it's a
vicious circle, and you
never give yourself the
time you need in order to
build up the business and
by doing all of the admin
(32:07):
work, which is not
actually adding value.
Lea Turner (32:10):
So what does
your team look like now
in your business? How
many like how did you
grow it?
Jesminara Rahman (32:16):
I think
quite early on, I had a
bookkeeper and I had an
assistant that was like,
quite early on. So like,
admin, admin, I didn't, I
don't do admin. I don't,
I don't do admin stuff.
It doesn't make sense for
me to do it. So, yeah, I
have two admin people. I
(32:37):
also have two who helps
with the case, just there
and an analysis side of
things. So I have two
people there. I have a
social media person as
well, and and I have a
few case workers, you
know, who specializes in
specific areas. They're
(32:58):
contractors. They work
with me, right? See,
that's,
Lea Turner (33:01):
that's the
model that I'm I've
worked with. What was the
decision? Why did you
make the decision to have
I actually
Jesminara Rahman (33:07):
gave
them the, you know, I
gave them the choice. You
can either come on board
as an employee, which is
fine, or you can come in,
on board, on as a as a
contractor, and they
prefer the flexibility of
a contractor, right? So
because in your decision,
no, I gave them the
decision, and it's just
(33:28):
the, it's it's just when
they want to work, how
they want to work, and so
on. I mean, my employees
have that flexibility in
that. I don't. It's not
set hours. I say, this is
your task. This is what
you need to do, but when
you want to do it, it's
up to you. So they have
the freedom to take time
off whenever, as long as
(33:48):
the task is done at it by
a specific deadline.
That's all I care about.
They can do it at home.
They can do it at the
office, because majority
of my staff is actually
female, and so we've all
got caring
responsibilities as well,
and so we need to. It
doesn't make sense that
my lifestyle is adjusted
(34:08):
to that, but not to them,
because that's unfair.
Yeah,
Lea Turner (34:11):
and I
actually so I noticed
this. And there's a few
people on LinkedIn that I
notice it with, and it's
no shade to them, but I
see them like living
their best lives. They're
flexible. They work
anywhere. They do
whatever they want, and
yet they've got staff who
are in the office nine to
five or eight to six or,
you know, three days a
week they have to be in
(34:32):
the office, and their
staff are being paid, you
know, a set amount. And I
think I wonder how I
would feel if I was their
member of staff, and I
can see my boss
gallivanting off doing
all these fun things,
amazing things. I don't
know how I'd feel about
that.
Jesminara Rahman (34:46):
I don't
know. I don't I know
Lea Turner (34:50):
that they're
the boss, but I wonder
if, like, that's not a
particularly motivating
way to run the business.
If you're being seen to
be, you know they're I'm
paying them this. Wage,
and it's a bit flexible,
but here I am, and that's
giving me my best life. I
don't know if that that
feels like good
leadership to me, and to
do what you've done in
(35:10):
creating kind of an equal
plane, where, if you get
the flexibility to work
when you want and where
you want, they should
have that as well, and
have the control over
whether they want the
employed life or the
contractor life. And, you
know, they then be
flexible and able to work
for other people if they
wanted to take on more
work, I assume as well.
(35:31):
Obviously, maybe there's,
you know, not not
competing with other
people doing what you're
doing, but they've got
the ability to do that. I
Jesminara Rahman (35:38):
think
even then. I mean, I've
had LinkedIn posts where
I say, I don't see
competitors, I see
colleagues. So I think
there's more than enough
work for everybody in
this fohc That's creating
this I don't think we
need to come into
conflict or be
competitors over the work
(35:59):
and that I've seen
because we've had
collaborations as well.
So I've worked with other
companies. I've worked
with other tax
investigation
specialists. One of my
areas is alternative
dispute resolution was
which is a mediation and
that's my like, my niche,
My expertise is there. So
I've had other tax
(36:19):
investigation specialist,
bring me in just to deal
with the ADR side, to
help them through it,
which I've got no issues
with doing that. I've got
no issues in providing
advice over the phone to
other tax investigation
specialists. And I've
done that as well as you
Lea Turner (36:36):
know that
that's my my MO as well
when I'm working with
people is I want to
support people within my
own industry. You know,
I've got a community a
business owner. Yeah,
there's other LinkedIn
training. You have other
LinkedIn I've seen them,
probably five or six
different LinkedIn
trainers in there, and
people like, oh, you
know, can I join your
community? Because I'm a
LinkedIn trainer as well.
I'm like, Yeah, it's
Jesminara Rahman (36:54):
fine,
because you're confident
in your skills. That's
why you you know what you
can do,
Lea Turner (36:59):
and learn
something from me that
helps them to become
better as a LinkedIn
trainer, or maybe I'll
learn things from them.
You know, it that's,
that's a good thing for
all of us. I don't so I'm
absolutely on your page.
I'm curious to know,
though, as as a business
owner, you've been doing
this for nine years.
It's, it's a fairly tough
industry. Like, what
would you say have been
the, maybe, the negatives
(37:20):
of becoming a business
owner, like, Where have,
where is it maybe not
been what you thought it
might be. Or, you know,
where, where have you
experienced more sort of
turbulence with it?
Jesminara Rahman (37:31):
I think
the pressure is all on
you. You don't at the end
of the day, you're the
decision owner, and you
got your and the decision
maker, yeah,
Lea Turner (37:42):
that's a lot
of extra. The mental load
of having four children
is, well, is huge, right?
Jesminara Rahman (37:46):
Well,
they come first, and so
sometimes my business has
to take a back seat. And
I have done that. And I
in 2019 when my dad
passed away that year,
was I spent time going to
the hospital, and that
was because of the
flexibility of my
business, but my business
definitely took a back
seat, because family is
(38:07):
more important than the
company, and that's
something I've held
throughout throughout all
these years, that if
there's if your family
needs you, and you just
have to be there for
them, and
Lea Turner (38:22):
it can be a
real struggle as a
business owner when you
know you're obviously in
a position where, where
you you were earning All
right at the time that
would allow you to do
that. And I know there
have been times where
I've been torn because I
haven't had the financial
backup that if I don't
work, and I was panicking
(38:43):
because I had to make a
really tough choice. I've
had, you know, sick baby
tied to my, you know,
wrapped up on my chest
trying to cuddle him
because he's poorly, and
I still need to get the
work done, and all I want
to do is lie on the sofa
and cuddle him. It's,
it's really, really tough
as a business owner to
make calls like that. And
I'm glad that you
obviously created a
(39:04):
business where you could
be by your dad's side.
When, yes,
Jesminara Rahman (39:07):
I think
because when at the stage
you was at with your
children, I was actually
employed by HMRC, so I
had my children while I
was in HMRC, so I had
that support. So I mean,
as an organization, HMRC
is, is quite family
friendly, and they're
quite flexible, yeah, but
the amount of knowledge
(39:28):
that I have gained since
I've left is is more.
It's just more than
triple.
Lea Turner (39:35):
Nothing can
compare for that, though,
right? Because I, I
literally put it in a
LinkedIn post, I think
last week, saying the
knowledge that I have
gained in the past four
years far exceeds what I
learned in the last 35
including all the years I
was at school. Because
you have to learn on your
feet quickly as a
(39:55):
business owner, because
it's learn or fail. And.
Sometimes you fail to
learn, but like you fail,
and then you learn from
the failure, but you have
to do it all
Jesminara Rahman (40:05):
fast.
One of my friends,
actually, and she's on
LinkedIn, Katie Hampton,
she said to me that the
universe keeps sending
you the same lessons
again again, until you
learn it,
Lea Turner (40:19):
which is why
we need to learn it the
first go, right? I
definitely am one of
those people that I very
rarely take two failures
to learn a tough lesson.
I'm like, right? We
learned that one onto the
next. Where am I going to
fail next? And you have
but that's where the
resilience comes in,
right? As a business
owner, you have to be
resilient, because you're
not going to get it right
all the time, and you
have to bounce, taking a
(40:41):
month off licking your
wounds and going poor me,
but
Jesminara Rahman (40:44):
you
have to forgive yourself
as well be forgiving,
though, can't it? It can
be. It can be, but, you
know, you have to be a
bit forgiving and kind to
yourself. Yeah, you know,
things happen and just
step forward. I
Lea Turner (40:57):
think the
older I get as well, the
harder it becomes to be
bad at something because
the last time I started
something brand new,
prior to these
businesses, was learning
to drive when I was 17.
And I haven't really just
started something new
that I've been rubbish at
since then. And the older
you get, the harder it
becomes to start from
(41:18):
nothing and go, yep,
well, I'm going to suck
at this for a while, and
I just have to take that
on the chin, because we
just tend to do things
that we're we're already
good at, or that we know
we're going to be quite
good at.
Jesminara Rahman (41:28):
You've
already established your
base, yeah, and that's
where you're leaping
from, and it
Lea Turner (41:34):
sucks for the
ego as well, right?
Because you're just like,
wow, I'm really bad at
this, and everyone can
laugh at me. That's why I
don't go in a gym. I
won't walk in a gym
because I know that I'm
gonna feel really self
conscious because
Jesminara Rahman (41:45):
you did
that comedy show.
Lea Turner (41:47):
Oh yeah, one
off. I mean, that was
like I was saying, wasn't
it was, well, outside my
comfort zone. But there
was money,
Jesminara Rahman (41:56):
a large
amount of money, comedian
with you as well. Yeah,
yeah. I have. She was the
one that cracked the
Lea Turner (42:01):
joke. She she
was the one that made me
she was my Bronson. I
knew she was my emotional
support lesbian. I'm
gonna call her that. She
watches Beth, I'm sorry,
but if she watches it,
yeah, that that was I'm
very good at pushing
outside of my comfort
zone. That's when I'm
getting paid. If I'm not
getting paid. I'm not
(42:21):
doing it, which is why I
probably failed to walk
up Kilimanjaro, because I
was raising money for
someone else. If they
paid me 50 grand to walk
up Kilimanjaro, I'd have
made it to the top, but
the 50 grand is already
in the charity pocket by
then, so it was fine.
Jasmine, it's been such a
pleasure chatting to you.
And you know what? We
actually haven't done
this properly since we
(42:42):
had our one to one all
those years ago, actually
on sofas having a good
old chinwag. So it's been
really lovely to chat to
you and actually find out
more about the journey
and what it's taken to
get to where you are. So
thank you for sharing.
You're welcome, and I
shall see you again soon.
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