January 31, 2025 • 23 mins
Stay til the end for a nearly 100-year-old account from a Navajo hunter in 1920.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:16):
Strange mysteries, unexplained phenomena.
And the shadows in between.
This is The InBetween Official Podcastwith your host,
Carol Ann!
Next to dogman,
(00:37):
I think skinwalkersare the creepiest creatures on the block.
Their shape shifting abilityjust blows my mind.
Where is the best placeto find these reality-exploding evildoers?
Well, for these stories,we're traveling back to the legendary
skinwalkerhunting ground of the Navajo reservation.
(00:57):
Welcome to The InBetween.
I'm Carol Ann.
And today we have two stories for you.
One recent and one about a century oldthat will have you questioning
whether you can truly believewhat you see.
Somewhere
(01:17):
back around2009/2010, Jalen and his girlfriend
La'Kyla take a trip with their Navajofriend Shannon to visit Shannon's mom
and some of her family who live outon the Navajo reservation in Arizona.
They get there at night,and as you may or may not know,
there isn't really electricity
(01:38):
or running water for that matter,and most of the reservation.
So it gets very dark at night.
When they get to Shannon's friendLouise's Hogan, which is a traditional
Navajodwelling made mostly of dirt and wood,
they get out of the car and Jalen takesa glance up at the night sky and holy
crap, he's never seen stars like thatbefore or since.
(02:01):
He feels like he's standing at the centerof a real life planetarium.
It is just so insanely beautiful.
They go inside and Jalen noticesthat the hogan has a dirt floor
and there's only a dim light castfrom some kerosene lanterns.
Jalen has never been insidea traditional Navajo hogan
(02:23):
before, so he's kind of trippin a little,but in a good way.
La’Kyla announces, “I need a bathroom.”
Louise tells her thatshe can use the outhouse, but be careful
because they've seen some mountainlion tracks around there recently.
And she hands Jalen, a .45 revolverand some rounds to put in it.
So he loads the shells into the .45
(02:45):
and he and the Kayla head out tothe outhouse.
Jalen is on high alert,fully expecting a mountain
lion to come ripping around the cornerany minute.
So he's like super hyperfocused on his surroundings.
The first thing that he noticesis that it's extremely quiet around them.
(03:07):
And as everyone knows,this is typically indicative
of the presence of a large predator.
Jalen also thinks he sees somethingmoving through the brush,
but it's so dark he can't really tellif there's something coming
or if his eyes are just playingtricks on him.
The other thingJalen notices is a distinct odor in
(03:29):
the airsmells like rotten trash mixed with poop.
But he thinks maybe that's just becausehe's standing next to the outhouse.
La'Kyla finishes up inside and they startmaking their way back to the Hogan.
Something runs out in front of themand Jalen raises the revolver.
But doesn't shoot.
Could be a mountain lionor could just be some stray rez dog.
(03:54):
And they get back to the hoganand Jalen unloads the revolver
and puts it back up on the shelfwhere Louise had gotten it from.
Louise is there with her kids,and it's a small living space.
Plus, she's not real
hip on the idea of strangersstaying in her house with her kids there.
So Shannon, La’Kyla and Jalen,thank Louise for the restroom
(04:16):
and the chance to stretch their legsand get back in the car
because they still have to getto Shannon's mom's house.
And Shannon'smom is Hopi and lives on the Hopi
side of the fence,so they still have a ways to go.
Getting around the reservationcan be difficult in the daytime
when directionsusually include such verbiage as “take a
(04:38):
right at the old red tire”, or “whenyou get to the fork in the road, take it”.
At night?
Good luck.
The Navajo Nation is 27,000
squaremiles of dirt roads and dry wash arroyos.
And it is nighttime.
It's really easy to get lost out thereas there's just enough
(04:59):
shrubbery and topographical relief
to make it impossibleto see too far in any one direction.
They have Shannon with them,but even she's having a tough time
finding the road out to the Hopi.
The road fairly well boxed in
on either side with pinyon treesand juniper bushes.
But something runs out of the brush
(05:21):
and slaps the car with a loud boom.
Jalen's driving, so he hits the brakesthinking maybe somebody needs help.
Shannon is instantly freaked
and yells at Jalen to keep driving.
Jalen checks the rearview mirrorand can see something in the brake light.
Looks like a person, only they look likethey're crouched over in an awkward angle
(05:46):
and it looks like they're wearingsome kind of animal pelt or something.
The other thing that stands out toJalen is the two white eyes
that are reflecting the lightwith a reddish glow.
He hits the gas and peels
out of their fishtailing on the loose gravel.
He checks the rearview mirror again andcan see that thing running behind the car.
(06:09):
And it is gaining on them.
It runs up behind themand jumps into the air,
landing in front of the car.
Only it isn't a person anymore.
It's a mountain lion standingupright like a person
with regular humanlooking legs and two strong muscular arms
with black and red markingslike stripes on them.
(06:33):
Its chest and torso are also quite
jacked, like a human bodybuilder,
with rippling absand more bizarre markings.
But it has the overall tan color
and head of a mountain lion.
It's leering at themwith these ethereal white eyes,
(06:55):
and it has these long, sharp canineshanging out of its mouth,
which is twisted into an evil grin.
It also has a long mountain lion tail
that is leisurely swooshing back and forth
as it squeeze from side to side.
Shannon screamsand Jalen throws the car into reverse,
(07:18):
almost swerving off the roadbefore pulling a maneuver
that he learned in Park Ranger training,where you pop the transmission
into neutraland crank the wheel to spin around.
It's a pretty popular movie stuntthat you've probably seen a million times
because it's not that hard to do.
But it's a good one to know if you everneed to back out of somewhere quickly.
(07:41):
Jalen goes flying back down the road,
and when he looks in the rearview mirror,he doesn't see anything behind them.
They finally get back to Highway 160that leads out to Tuba City.
Jalen takes a left onto the highwayand to his horror
sees that thing running alongside them,
looking directly at him the whole time.
(08:04):
But now looks like a man againwearing a mountain lion skin
and running at like “no human ever” speed.
Now that they're back on the paved road,even if it is one that is full of potholes
and rocks, Jalen is able to pick upenough speed that the creature
finally starts to fall behind.
And with a final burst of speed,runs up alongside the car
(08:29):
and slaps it again,which freaks Jalen out so much
that he almost crashesthe car into the ditch.
It also makes a loud hissing sound
that is so terrifying that it truly putsthe fear of God in Jalen.
And it's so loud they can hear it over
(08:50):
the sound of the roadeven though the windows are rolled up.
It hisses one more time
before running off into the dark desertlandscape.
Jalen does not slow that car down
the entire rest of the way to Tuba City,
until they have to make a quick stopfor gas before
(09:10):
driving out to the Hopi reservation...thelong way
When they finally get to Shannon'smom's house, Shannon, in a quiet,
shaky voice, tells herwhat happened, visibly shaken
at having to relive the detailsof that horrific nightmare.
La’Kyla and Jalen aren't even really surewhat is just happened, but they know
(09:35):
they don't ever want to see that thingagain.
Shannon's mom burns some sageand says a prayer in Hopi, but Jalen is
pretty sure that he's not the only onewho doesn't get much sleep that night.
And he only has one thing to sayto whatever that thing was.
Skinwalker/Mountainlion man, let's never meet again.
(10:05):
This next story comes from a study
by William Morgan from the 1930’snamed “Human Wolves Among the Navajo”.
For Morgan's study,he interviewed Navajo Indians
to collect their folklore storiesand personal experiences
in an attempt to explain to everyonehow their “delusional” stories
(10:27):
are just covering for repressedFreudian impulses.
Sounds like a great guy.
This particular story from the studywas posted
by Reddit user GilgameshvsHumbaba,and comes from a man
named Hajogo, who, in the late1920s was about 23 years old.
We don't have any other namesother than Hajogo,
(10:48):
so we're going to call his little sisterWinona, and his little brother Paco.
Now, I have to admit that this one
sounds quite fantastical, but
it came directly from this Navajo memberas his experience.
I guess the real reason I want to includeit is because it is a first hand account
(11:10):
from almost a century ago.
So no Internet influences at all.
But I still don't know.
So take a listen and let me knowwhat you think in the comments below.
It used to be that
Indians would take their sheepand goats up to the mountains for winter,
but instead of carrying enough cornto feed the family for the whole season,
(11:33):
they would dig a hole next to their hogan
put their dried corn in the hole,
cover it up with a rock and disguise itso no one would know it was there.
Then they would make trips downfrom the mountain
back to the hogan to get more as needed.
Hajogo’s family does just that beforegoing into the mountains for the winter.
(11:54):
But of course, after a while they needmore corn, so they send their kids,
Winona and Paco, to go back to the hoganand get some more corn.
They both ride on one horseand when they get to the hogan,
they decide it's too late to go back.
So they'll just spendthe night in the hogan
and get the corn and returnto their parents in the morning.
(12:15):
They also had expectedto see their big brother Hajogo,but
Hajogo, who's a master with a bowand arrow, went out on a hunting trip
and also found himselftoo far away to get home for the night.
So as is common for the Navajo,
He finds another hoganin which to spend the night.
(12:36):
So back to Winona and Paco.
They tie the two front feet of their horseso he can't run anywhere
and he wanders off to eat.
But he comes back to the hoganand his ears are up.
Now he can see betterthan the children can in the dark.
So based on his skittish behavior,
Winona knows somebody out there.
(12:58):
Just that afternoon,some men had been near the hogan
and Winona is prettysure she heard one of them say,
“Now I can get that girl.” Tad bit freaky.
That night, she sees a darkshadow in the woods and immediately
knows that a human wolf, or what we now
call a skinwalker, is after her.
(13:21):
But she doesn't tell Paco.
Instead, she digs a hole under the hoganand tells Paco to get in.
And if anyone comes,he needs to crawl outside and ride fast
back to their family.
And she will try to fightas long as she can.
And she ties a blanket over the dooras much as she can,
hoping it'll slow down the wolflong enough for Paco to get away.
(13:45):
That night,Winona is woken up when she hears some mud
fall off the top of the hogan,and she knows the wolf has come.
Paco crawls out, cuts the rope aroundthe horse's feet and jumps on the horse.
The horse, sensing the impending danger,is pretty freaked out
and takes off out of therewithout any prodding from Paco.
(14:06):
He runs as fast as he can towardsthe mountains, with Paco
holding on tight to his mane.
When Paco reaches his parents,he tells them what's happening
back at home.
His mom and dadget on their horses and ride back
as fast as they can, in hopesof saving Winona.
Back at the hogan, the human wolf gets in
(14:27):
and Winona fights him as hard as she can.
That nightit snows a little, and the next morning
Hajogosays, “This is a good day for hunting.
I'm going to go shoot some rabbits.”He has on some good, new moccasins
with heavy soles, and he has his feetin burlap sacks to keep them dry.
(14:48):
Now, rememberHajogo is the Robin Hood of the Navajos.
He never misses.
He sees two rabbits, nockstwo arrows and shoots them.
As he's riding along, he sees a big track.
But the snow is covered it,so he doesn't know
whether it's a horse or a manor some other kind of animal.
(15:10):
So he gets down off his horse, kneels downand blows the snow off the track.
That'swhen he sees it's a human wolf track.
And there's blood, too.
So he follows the track.
He follows it all day and towards evening,he comes to the edge of a mesa.
He crawls slowly to the edgewith one arrow
(15:32):
in his bow and two in his mouth.
At the edge, he comes to the last
track made by that human wolf.
But there's no way to get down that cliff.
So he circles round and he finds
just one narrow path going down.
He goes along the path and seesa big stone lying against a cliff.
(15:55):
And he knows thatthis is where the human wolf went.
So he pulls back the stone,goes into the cave and sees nothing.
But he keeps goingand pretty soon comes to a black curtain.
He pulls the curtain back and keeps going.
There's a narrow passage,and he goes along for a half a mile
(16:17):
and then comes to another black curtain.
In half a mile, he comes to another,
and then comes to a fourth one.
He pulls that curtain backand finds himself
in a big room that's round like a hogan.
He sees lots of men and womensitting around, people he has seen before
at dances and ceremoniesand around the hogans.
(16:40):
He sees skeletons and bones
and jewelryand other things around the walls.
He thinks, “They're going to kill me.”There's a small room to his left,
so he ducks in therehoping they wouldn't see him.
There's one big fat manwho's the chief, and he's singing.
And all these people, even girls and boys,
(17:02):
are learning how to be human wolves.
The big fat man says there's an old ladywho has died about 200 miles from here.
And I want two men to gothere, dig her up and take her jewelry.
So two men come in front of him
and he sings over them,and then he tells them to be careful.
(17:23):
They take their skins and leave.
Then pointing to the roomwhere Hajogo’s hiding,
someone says, “There is a boy in there,and he doesn't belong to us.”
So they bring him outand put him in the middle of the room
where he is surroundedby people who clearly want to kill him.
And his mind is racing, thinking, “Howdo I get out of here?”
(17:47):
He wants to get their eagle feathersbecause those feathers
are the key to their power.
Take feathers.
take the power,and all of this will be over.
But they're all around himand they're watching him.
So for the moment at least,he has no choice but to just sit quietly.
Up on the wall.
(18:07):
In front of him is a girl's headand like a train wreck,
whether he wants to or not,he keeps looking at it.
What he doesn't knowis that it's his sister.
And then the big fat man asks Hajogo, “Do
you want to be a human wolf?” Hajogo’spretty horrified by the idea,
(18:28):
but the man says, “You can studyto be a wolf or we will kill you.”
So Hajogo says, “I will be a wolf,”
all the while still trying to formulatea plan for how to get out of there.
Looking around, he sees that on eitherside of the door sits a big dog.
So if he tries to run out, the dogswill freak out and he'll get caught.
(18:52):
they pass himsome meat, which he doesn't want to eat
because he knows the human wolveseat human meat.
He figures he better take some,so he takes a piece,
fakes tossing it in his mouth, butthen he tucks it down inside his shirt.
Soon the big fat man fallsasleep, and Hajogo lays down,
pretending he's asleep, and even snores.
(19:14):
But the whole timehis eyes are open, just a crack.
And he's looking around.
After a while, everyone is asleep,
trusting the guard dogs to do their job.
Hajogo gets up, grabs his bow and arrows,
which they had taken away from himand grabs the eagle feathers.
He takes a step toward the door,then another step
(19:36):
when one of the dogs begins to growl.
He takes the meat out of the shirt, breaksit into two pieces,
and gives a piece of meat to each dog,who must have been pretty hungry.
Because once they start eating,they forget all about guarding the door.
Hajogo runs through the curtainand keeps running as fast as he can.
(19:58):
They had put wood and rocksbehind the curtains,
so he would have a hard time.
But he gets through three of the curtainsjust fine,
when he hears noises and yelling,echoing through the corridor.
They're coming after him.
The rocks and logs piled up behindthe fourth curtain are extra thick,
(20:18):
so Hajogo has a harder timegetting through the last curtain.
But he breaks through and startsrunning like the wind.
And he is a fast runner,but not fast enough.
He soon hears a wolf over there,and then over there.
And he knows he is surrounded.
But as he's running,he sees a badger's hole.
(20:40):
Thinking fast, he pulls up a big weed,crawls into the hole
and pulls the weed down hard,so it looks like it's just growing there.
Pretty soon, the noises around him stop.
He pushes up the weed and looks around.
He hears someone coming.
So he goes back down again,just as the big fat
man comes running and runsright over the hole.
(21:02):
Hajogohears him say, ”I wish we had killed him,
like I told them to.”After a while, Hajogo comes out.
The coast is clear and he runs back home.
When he gets there, the sole of his newmoccasin is worn out and his foot is sore.
Couple of nights later,
there's a gathering for a war dancenearby, and his family goes over there.
(21:27):
But Hajogo doesn't gobecause his foot is still sore.
But later he changes his mindand uses his bow and arrows
like a cane, and decideshe's strong enough to walk over there.
When he gets there,he sees the big fat man
who is chief of the human wolvessitting on a big white horse.
(21:48):
He and his wife are all dressedin fine clothes
with lots of bracelets and necklaces.
Hajogo says, “I'mgoing to shoot that man.”
So he quietly goes aroundthe circle of wagons
and peopleuntil he is right behind the man.
He knocks an arrow and gives the bowa long pull,
(22:10):
aiming squarely at thatbig fat man's back.
He looses the arrow, which goes in so farthat only a little bit remains visible.
That, my friends,
is where Hajogo ends his story.
A big specialthanks to our newest Hoopy Frood level
(22:34):
members, Elizabeth Sisney and Nexor EH.
Thank you so much, you guys.
Your support means more than you know.
those stories were surea couple of wild rides.
But if you want to turn right back aroundand get in line
to ride again,go ahead and watch this one.
But I hope you didn't just eat lunch.
(22:55):
Be careful out there and I will see youhere again on The InBetween.
Thanks for tuning into The InBetween Podcast.
Enjoy the full visual experiencewith me over on YouTube.
Just search for @TheInBetweentales.
I'm Carol Ann,and until next time, be careful
(23:18):
out there.
Strange mysteries, unexplained phenomena.
And the shadows in between.
This is The InBetween Official Podcastwith your host,
Carol Ann!
Next to dogman,
(00:37):
I think skinwalkersare the creepiest creatures on the block.
Their shape shifting abilityjust blows my mind.
Where is the best placeto find these reality-exploding evildoers?
Well, for these stories,we're traveling back to the legendary
skinwalkerhunting ground of the Navajo reservation.
(00:57):
Welcome to The InBetween.
I'm Carol Ann.
And today we have two stories for you.
One recent and one about a century oldthat will have you questioning
whether you can truly believewhat you see.
Somewhere
(01:17):
back around2009/2010, Jalen and his girlfriend
La'Kyla take a trip with their Navajofriend Shannon to visit Shannon's mom
and some of her family who live outon the Navajo reservation in Arizona.
They get there at night,and as you may or may not know,
there isn't really electricity
(01:38):
or running water for that matter,and most of the reservation.
So it gets very dark at night.
When they get to Shannon's friendLouise's Hogan, which is a traditional
Navajodwelling made mostly of dirt and wood,
they get out of the car and Jalen takesa glance up at the night sky and holy
crap, he's never seen stars like thatbefore or since.
(02:01):
He feels like he's standing at the centerof a real life planetarium.
It is just so insanely beautiful.
They go inside and Jalen noticesthat the hogan has a dirt floor
and there's only a dim light castfrom some kerosene lanterns.
Jalen has never been insidea traditional Navajo hogan
(02:23):
before, so he's kind of trippin a little,but in a good way.
La’Kyla announces, “I need a bathroom.”
Louise tells her thatshe can use the outhouse, but be careful
because they've seen some mountainlion tracks around there recently.
And she hands Jalen, a .45 revolverand some rounds to put in it.
So he loads the shells into the .45
(02:45):
and he and the Kayla head out tothe outhouse.
Jalen is on high alert,fully expecting a mountain
lion to come ripping around the cornerany minute.
So he's like super hyperfocused on his surroundings.
The first thing that he noticesis that it's extremely quiet around them.
(03:07):
And as everyone knows,this is typically indicative
of the presence of a large predator.
Jalen also thinks he sees somethingmoving through the brush,
but it's so dark he can't really tellif there's something coming
or if his eyes are just playingtricks on him.
The other thingJalen notices is a distinct odor in
(03:29):
the airsmells like rotten trash mixed with poop.
But he thinks maybe that's just becausehe's standing next to the outhouse.
La'Kyla finishes up inside and they startmaking their way back to the Hogan.
Something runs out in front of themand Jalen raises the revolver.
But doesn't shoot.
Could be a mountain lionor could just be some stray rez dog.
(03:54):
And they get back to the hoganand Jalen unloads the revolver
and puts it back up on the shelfwhere Louise had gotten it from.
Louise is there with her kids,and it's a small living space.
Plus, she's not real
hip on the idea of strangersstaying in her house with her kids there.
So Shannon, La’Kyla and Jalen,thank Louise for the restroom
(04:16):
and the chance to stretch their legsand get back in the car
because they still have to getto Shannon's mom's house.
And Shannon'smom is Hopi and lives on the Hopi
side of the fence,so they still have a ways to go.
Getting around the reservationcan be difficult in the daytime
when directionsusually include such verbiage as “take a
(04:38):
right at the old red tire”, or “whenyou get to the fork in the road, take it”.
At night?
Good luck.
The Navajo Nation is 27,000
squaremiles of dirt roads and dry wash arroyos.
And it is nighttime.
It's really easy to get lost out thereas there's just enough
(04:59):
shrubbery and topographical relief
to make it impossibleto see too far in any one direction.
They have Shannon with them,but even she's having a tough time
finding the road out to the Hopi.
The road fairly well boxed in
on either side with pinyon treesand juniper bushes.
But something runs out of the brush
(05:21):
and slaps the car with a loud boom.
Jalen's driving, so he hits the brakesthinking maybe somebody needs help.
Shannon is instantly freaked
and yells at Jalen to keep driving.
Jalen checks the rearview mirrorand can see something in the brake light.
Looks like a person, only they look likethey're crouched over in an awkward angle
(05:46):
and it looks like they're wearingsome kind of animal pelt or something.
The other thing that stands out toJalen is the two white eyes
that are reflecting the lightwith a reddish glow.
He hits the gas and peels
out of their fishtailing on the loose gravel.
He checks the rearview mirror again andcan see that thing running behind the car.
(06:09):
And it is gaining on them.
It runs up behind themand jumps into the air,
landing in front of the car.
Only it isn't a person anymore.
It's a mountain lion standingupright like a person
with regular humanlooking legs and two strong muscular arms
with black and red markingslike stripes on them.
(06:33):
Its chest and torso are also quite
jacked, like a human bodybuilder,
with rippling absand more bizarre markings.
But it has the overall tan color
and head of a mountain lion.
It's leering at themwith these ethereal white eyes,
(06:55):
and it has these long, sharp canineshanging out of its mouth,
which is twisted into an evil grin.
It also has a long mountain lion tail
that is leisurely swooshing back and forth
as it squeeze from side to side.
Shannon screamsand Jalen throws the car into reverse,
(07:18):
almost swerving off the roadbefore pulling a maneuver
that he learned in Park Ranger training,where you pop the transmission
into neutraland crank the wheel to spin around.
It's a pretty popular movie stuntthat you've probably seen a million times
because it's not that hard to do.
But it's a good one to know if you everneed to back out of somewhere quickly.
(07:41):
Jalen goes flying back down the road,
and when he looks in the rearview mirror,he doesn't see anything behind them.
They finally get back to Highway 160that leads out to Tuba City.
Jalen takes a left onto the highwayand to his horror
sees that thing running alongside them,
looking directly at him the whole time.
(08:04):
But now looks like a man againwearing a mountain lion skin
and running at like “no human ever” speed.
Now that they're back on the paved road,even if it is one that is full of potholes
and rocks, Jalen is able to pick upenough speed that the creature
finally starts to fall behind.
And with a final burst of speed,runs up alongside the car
(08:29):
and slaps it again,which freaks Jalen out so much
that he almost crashesthe car into the ditch.
It also makes a loud hissing sound
that is so terrifying that it truly putsthe fear of God in Jalen.
And it's so loud they can hear it over
(08:50):
the sound of the roadeven though the windows are rolled up.
It hisses one more time
before running off into the dark desertlandscape.
Jalen does not slow that car down
the entire rest of the way to Tuba City,
until they have to make a quick stopfor gas before
(09:10):
driving out to the Hopi reservation...thelong way
When they finally get to Shannon'smom's house, Shannon, in a quiet,
shaky voice, tells herwhat happened, visibly shaken
at having to relive the detailsof that horrific nightmare.
La’Kyla and Jalen aren't even really surewhat is just happened, but they know
(09:35):
they don't ever want to see that thingagain.
Shannon's mom burns some sageand says a prayer in Hopi, but Jalen is
pretty sure that he's not the only onewho doesn't get much sleep that night.
And he only has one thing to sayto whatever that thing was.
Skinwalker/Mountainlion man, let's never meet again.
(10:05):
This next story comes from a study
by William Morgan from the 1930’snamed “Human Wolves Among the Navajo”.
For Morgan's study,he interviewed Navajo Indians
to collect their folklore storiesand personal experiences
in an attempt to explain to everyonehow their “delusional” stories
(10:27):
are just covering for repressedFreudian impulses.
Sounds like a great guy.
This particular story from the studywas posted
by Reddit user GilgameshvsHumbaba,and comes from a man
named Hajogo, who, in the late1920s was about 23 years old.
We don't have any other namesother than Hajogo,
(10:48):
so we're going to call his little sisterWinona, and his little brother Paco.
Now, I have to admit that this one
sounds quite fantastical, but
it came directly from this Navajo memberas his experience.
I guess the real reason I want to includeit is because it is a first hand account
(11:10):
from almost a century ago.
So no Internet influences at all.
But I still don't know.
So take a listen and let me knowwhat you think in the comments below.
It used to be that
Indians would take their sheepand goats up to the mountains for winter,
but instead of carrying enough cornto feed the family for the whole season,
(11:33):
they would dig a hole next to their hogan
put their dried corn in the hole,
cover it up with a rock and disguise itso no one would know it was there.
Then they would make trips downfrom the mountain
back to the hogan to get more as needed.
Hajogo’s family does just that beforegoing into the mountains for the winter.
(11:54):
But of course, after a while they needmore corn, so they send their kids,
Winona and Paco, to go back to the hoganand get some more corn.
They both ride on one horseand when they get to the hogan,
they decide it's too late to go back.
So they'll just spendthe night in the hogan
and get the corn and returnto their parents in the morning.
(12:15):
They also had expectedto see their big brother Hajogo,but
Hajogo, who's a master with a bowand arrow, went out on a hunting trip
and also found himselftoo far away to get home for the night.
So as is common for the Navajo,
He finds another hoganin which to spend the night.
(12:36):
So back to Winona and Paco.
They tie the two front feet of their horseso he can't run anywhere
and he wanders off to eat.
But he comes back to the hoganand his ears are up.
Now he can see betterthan the children can in the dark.
So based on his skittish behavior,
Winona knows somebody out there.
(12:58):
Just that afternoon,some men had been near the hogan
and Winona is prettysure she heard one of them say,
“Now I can get that girl.” Tad bit freaky.
That night, she sees a darkshadow in the woods and immediately
knows that a human wolf, or what we now
call a skinwalker, is after her.
(13:21):
But she doesn't tell Paco.
Instead, she digs a hole under the hoganand tells Paco to get in.
And if anyone comes,he needs to crawl outside and ride fast
back to their family.
And she will try to fightas long as she can.
And she ties a blanket over the dooras much as she can,
hoping it'll slow down the wolflong enough for Paco to get away.
(13:45):
That night,Winona is woken up when she hears some mud
fall off the top of the hogan,and she knows the wolf has come.
Paco crawls out, cuts the rope aroundthe horse's feet and jumps on the horse.
The horse, sensing the impending danger,is pretty freaked out
and takes off out of therewithout any prodding from Paco.
(14:06):
He runs as fast as he can towardsthe mountains, with Paco
holding on tight to his mane.
When Paco reaches his parents,he tells them what's happening
back at home.
His mom and dadget on their horses and ride back
as fast as they can, in hopesof saving Winona.
Back at the hogan, the human wolf gets in
(14:27):
and Winona fights him as hard as she can.
That nightit snows a little, and the next morning
Hajogosays, “This is a good day for hunting.
I'm going to go shoot some rabbits.”He has on some good, new moccasins
with heavy soles, and he has his feetin burlap sacks to keep them dry.
(14:48):
Now, rememberHajogo is the Robin Hood of the Navajos.
He never misses.
He sees two rabbits, nockstwo arrows and shoots them.
As he's riding along, he sees a big track.
But the snow is covered it,so he doesn't know
whether it's a horse or a manor some other kind of animal.
(15:10):
So he gets down off his horse, kneels downand blows the snow off the track.
That'swhen he sees it's a human wolf track.
And there's blood, too.
So he follows the track.
He follows it all day and towards evening,he comes to the edge of a mesa.
He crawls slowly to the edgewith one arrow
(15:32):
in his bow and two in his mouth.
At the edge, he comes to the last
track made by that human wolf.
But there's no way to get down that cliff.
So he circles round and he finds
just one narrow path going down.
He goes along the path and seesa big stone lying against a cliff.
(15:55):
And he knows thatthis is where the human wolf went.
So he pulls back the stone,goes into the cave and sees nothing.
But he keeps goingand pretty soon comes to a black curtain.
He pulls the curtain back and keeps going.
There's a narrow passage,and he goes along for a half a mile
(16:17):
and then comes to another black curtain.
In half a mile, he comes to another,
and then comes to a fourth one.
He pulls that curtain backand finds himself
in a big room that's round like a hogan.
He sees lots of men and womensitting around, people he has seen before
at dances and ceremoniesand around the hogans.
(16:40):
He sees skeletons and bones
and jewelryand other things around the walls.
He thinks, “They're going to kill me.”There's a small room to his left,
so he ducks in therehoping they wouldn't see him.
There's one big fat manwho's the chief, and he's singing.
And all these people, even girls and boys,
(17:02):
are learning how to be human wolves.
The big fat man says there's an old ladywho has died about 200 miles from here.
And I want two men to gothere, dig her up and take her jewelry.
So two men come in front of him
and he sings over them,and then he tells them to be careful.
(17:23):
They take their skins and leave.
Then pointing to the roomwhere Hajogo’s hiding,
someone says, “There is a boy in there,and he doesn't belong to us.”
So they bring him outand put him in the middle of the room
where he is surroundedby people who clearly want to kill him.
And his mind is racing, thinking, “Howdo I get out of here?”
(17:47):
He wants to get their eagle feathersbecause those feathers
are the key to their power.
Take feathers.
take the power,and all of this will be over.
But they're all around himand they're watching him.
So for the moment at least,he has no choice but to just sit quietly.
Up on the wall.
(18:07):
In front of him is a girl's headand like a train wreck,
whether he wants to or not,he keeps looking at it.
What he doesn't knowis that it's his sister.
And then the big fat man asks Hajogo, “Do
you want to be a human wolf?” Hajogo’spretty horrified by the idea,
(18:28):
but the man says, “You can studyto be a wolf or we will kill you.”
So Hajogo says, “I will be a wolf,”
all the while still trying to formulatea plan for how to get out of there.
Looking around, he sees that on eitherside of the door sits a big dog.
So if he tries to run out, the dogswill freak out and he'll get caught.
(18:52):
they pass himsome meat, which he doesn't want to eat
because he knows the human wolveseat human meat.
He figures he better take some,so he takes a piece,
fakes tossing it in his mouth, butthen he tucks it down inside his shirt.
Soon the big fat man fallsasleep, and Hajogo lays down,
pretending he's asleep, and even snores.
(19:14):
But the whole timehis eyes are open, just a crack.
And he's looking around.
After a while, everyone is asleep,
trusting the guard dogs to do their job.
Hajogo gets up, grabs his bow and arrows,
which they had taken away from himand grabs the eagle feathers.
He takes a step toward the door,then another step
(19:36):
when one of the dogs begins to growl.
He takes the meat out of the shirt, breaksit into two pieces,
and gives a piece of meat to each dog,who must have been pretty hungry.
Because once they start eating,they forget all about guarding the door.
Hajogo runs through the curtainand keeps running as fast as he can.
(19:58):
They had put wood and rocksbehind the curtains,
so he would have a hard time.
But he gets through three of the curtainsjust fine,
when he hears noises and yelling,echoing through the corridor.
They're coming after him.
The rocks and logs piled up behindthe fourth curtain are extra thick,
(20:18):
so Hajogo has a harder timegetting through the last curtain.
But he breaks through and startsrunning like the wind.
And he is a fast runner,but not fast enough.
He soon hears a wolf over there,and then over there.
And he knows he is surrounded.
But as he's running,he sees a badger's hole.
(20:40):
Thinking fast, he pulls up a big weed,crawls into the hole
and pulls the weed down hard,so it looks like it's just growing there.
Pretty soon, the noises around him stop.
He pushes up the weed and looks around.
He hears someone coming.
So he goes back down again,just as the big fat
man comes running and runsright over the hole.
(21:02):
Hajogohears him say, ”I wish we had killed him,
like I told them to.”After a while, Hajogo comes out.
The coast is clear and he runs back home.
When he gets there, the sole of his newmoccasin is worn out and his foot is sore.
Couple of nights later,
there's a gathering for a war dancenearby, and his family goes over there.
(21:27):
But Hajogo doesn't gobecause his foot is still sore.
But later he changes his mindand uses his bow and arrows
like a cane, and decideshe's strong enough to walk over there.
When he gets there,he sees the big fat man
who is chief of the human wolvessitting on a big white horse.
(21:48):
He and his wife are all dressedin fine clothes
with lots of bracelets and necklaces.
Hajogo says, “I'mgoing to shoot that man.”
So he quietly goes aroundthe circle of wagons
and peopleuntil he is right behind the man.
He knocks an arrow and gives the bowa long pull,
(22:10):
aiming squarely at thatbig fat man's back.
He looses the arrow, which goes in so farthat only a little bit remains visible.
That, my friends,
is where Hajogo ends his story.
A big specialthanks to our newest Hoopy Frood level
(22:34):
members, Elizabeth Sisney and Nexor EH.
Thank you so much, you guys.
Your support means more than you know.
those stories were surea couple of wild rides.
But if you want to turn right back aroundand get in line
to ride again,go ahead and watch this one.
But I hope you didn't just eat lunch.
(22:55):
Be careful out there and I will see youhere again on The InBetween.
Thanks for tuning into The InBetween Podcast.
Enjoy the full visual experiencewith me over on YouTube.
Just search for @TheInBetweentales.
I'm Carol Ann,and until next time, be careful
(23:18):
out there.
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