August 23, 2025 • 26 mins
Promotions aren’t random—they follow patterns your boss is watching closely. In this episode of The Logical Lawyer Podcast, retired L.A. City Attorneys Bernie Brown and Susan Zimber reveal the insider’s guide to impressing supervisors and advancing your career.
With nearly 50 years of combined leadership experience supervising hundreds of attorneys, investigators, and staff, Bernie and Susan share real stories from the courtroom and the cubicle—the wins that got people promoted and the mistakes that stalled careers.
You’ll learn:
-
Why saying “yes” (and raising flags early when you can’t) earns trust.
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How to accept and apply evaluation feedback to accelerate growth.
-
The critical difference between loyalty and trust—and why trust always wins.
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Why punctuality, professionalism, and preparation still matter more than you think.
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How to avoid red flags that quietly kill careers.
Stay until the end for a rapid-fire “Promotion Wins Checklist” you’ll want to screenshot and keep.
If you’ve ever wondered how supervisors really decide who gets promoted, this episode gives you the clarity—and the tools—to take your career to the next level.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Coming up on this episode ofthe Logical Lawyer Podcast,
(00:03):
one should accept theirsupervisor's evaluation feedback.
You know, listen to your supervisor,um, so that you can learn what they're
expecting, what they want, what theyfeel is positive about what you're doing,
and so that think, that's important.
That is excellent stuff, excellent stuff.
(00:34):
Welcome all to Bernie Brown'sdelight, where legal minds unite both
day and night in uncertain times.
He's your guiding light.
So gather around, let's say.
Right.
(00:55):
Welcome to the Logical Lawyer Podcastwith attorney Bernie Brown, retired Los
Angeles assistant City attorney withdecades of legal experience and also
extensive leadership experience servingin top bar associations like the John
M Langston Bar Association and theAssociation of Black City Attorneys.
Bernie is powered by a deep personaltestimony that took him from South central
(01:19):
LA to the courtrooms of downtown la.
Bernie dives into today's toughestlegal, social, and spiritual issues.
He brings facts, answers, and sharpanalysis to cut through all the noise.
So are you ready for ano nonsense perspective?
Then let's get started withyour host attorney, Bernie
(01:39):
Brown, the Logical lawyer.
Hello there.
My name is Bernie Brown.
I am the Logical lawyer.
Today we will conduct a logical analysis.
Of how to impress your supervisorand succeed in the workplace.
I, I gotta tell you, we're lucky today.
(02:00):
We have the greatestsupervisor of all time.
We have Susan Zimber.
A retired supervising attorneyfor the Los Angeles City
Attorney's office, and guess what?
We got me.
I'm also a retired supervisingattorney for the Los Angeles City
(02:21):
Attorney's office, and you suggest
you supervise at leastfour different branches
or different branches.
And you know, the two of us together haveabout 50, almost 50 years of combined.
Supervisorial experience, man.
Are
those,
(02:41):
uh, we supervised attorneys andsecretaries, support staff, investigators,
all kinds of people, and wow, we gotsome stories to tell, don't we, Susan?
Yes we do.
We certainly do.
Uh, you know, I think peopledon't understand that, uh, or they
should understand that it is veryimportant to impress your supervisor.
(03:04):
Your supervisor can advance your career.
Or they can pretty muchdestroy your career.
So, and that's probably becausethe supervisors generally have
direct access to the bosses, tothe corporate owners, to the people
who are in control of everything.
And usually, uh, the line.
(03:26):
I should call, I don't want tocall people with line workers,
but the line workers, uh, don'tusually have access to the bosses.
So the supervisor tell the bosseswho they like and they tell the
bosses they recommend who should getpromoted and who should get raises.
And from there, life can be good.
(03:47):
Uh, or it can be just the opposite.
It can be very difficult.
Susan, I know between the twoof us, we've got some horrors.
Stories, don't we?
Yes, we
do.
We, we had some great attorneys.
I would say the majority of ourattorneys were wonderful support staff
also, but we did have some challengingattorneys that we had to deal with.
(04:11):
I think over the years, we supervisedliterally hundreds of attorneys.
I think I made, I'm not sure Isaid that, literally hundreds
because they would come and go.
New attorneys would come, newsupport staff would come and they'd
transfer out or quit or whatever.
And so we literally supervisedhundreds of attorneys.
Susan, I'm gonna do somethingout of, uh, outline.
(04:34):
Okay.
Start us off with one horror story.
Can you start off with,
you want you, you're gonna startoff with one or you want No,
I can, I would ask you to, you know,between the two of us, we've got.
Dozens of ho horror stories.
You wanna start off with one?
Okay, sure.
Well, we had an attorneywho got so many complaints.
(04:57):
Complaints from her colleagues,her other attorneys complaints
from victims, from witnesses, frompolice officers, of all things.
And even judges, and there werejudges who wouldn't have her in their
courtroom, so this was difficult.
Fortunately, at some point shedid transfer to another branch.
(05:20):
But I think the samebehavior continued there
also.
And that brings me to my first point,Susan, when I called you and said,
Susan, I want you to go on the podcastand talk about, uh, supervisors on
how to impress your supervisors.
And your first response to me was.
(05:41):
What was that responseabout what not to do?
Don't remember now,
Bernie, what was
it?
It was
Don't be a troublemaker.
And that's very true.
Very true.
That you're not gonna advanceif you're a troublemaker
and, and you'll make yoursupervisor's miserable.
Uh.
(06:01):
You know, there are a lot of thingsthat people can do that can advance
their career or destroy their career.
One of the things that I think youliked it too, was A a yes person.
A person.
When you come to 'em and you ask 'emto do something, their answer is yes.
Or if they had reason that theydidn't wanna do it or couldn't do it
(06:22):
or whatever, they could let you knowimmediately and you could discuss it
rather than just, you know, say theycouldn't do it, wouldn't do it, whatever.
Yeah.
Uh, you know, the people who droveme crazy were the ones that, oh,
I, I don't know how to do that.
They're tra trained to do it.
They basically just law school, right?
Yeah.
That they just didn't wanna do it.
(06:44):
But, you know, and so as a supervisor.
Supervisors love yes people.
And they love people who graciously andhappily assume additional assignments.
You know when you go to 'emand you say, can you do this?
Not only do they say yes, butthey say it with a good attitude.
(07:05):
Isn't that great, Susan?
That is great.
And we had some people that did that,and then some that wouldn't do it.
So we dealt with both.
Yeah, we ran into somereal, uh, weird situations.
Weird.
I had a guy once and YY this was when Itransferred to the San Pedro branch, and
(07:26):
there was a guy and he was always late.
We're gonna come to that.
Well, let's just deal with it now.
Better work on time.
Please get to work on time if you can.
But this guy was late and he wasassigned to go directly to court.
And so I, uh, he wasn't gettingthere and the court was calling me.
(07:46):
The judges would call me andsay, where's your attorney?
Why isn't he here?
Why isn't he in court?
And so, uh, one day the judge's clerkcalled me and she said, I figured
out why he's late all the time.
And she said, I'm looking out mywindow now, and I see him in the
parking lot and he's getting dressed.
And I noticed that he does that now.
I've been noticing that every day hearrives and he gets dressed in the court.
(08:10):
I mean, on the parking lot.
It's like, please, man, get towork on time and dress at home.
Not in the parking lot.
Especially when you're assigned tocourtrooms, the judges get upset
if you don't have someone there.
And if the attorney is late, you mayhave to send a different attorney.
(08:30):
So it just doesn't work out.
You've gotta be on time.
Yes.
And it's very, very frustratingand it causes anxiety, uh, for
the, for the supervisor, you know?
That and, and you know, theother thing is trustworthiness.
You know, we love somebodywho's trustworthy.
(08:51):
You know, you can't, it is, it is hardto deal with a situation where you
have a lawyer or a, or a somebody whoworks for you and they're dishonest.
You find out that they haven'tbeen telling you the truth.
And it's
certainly important when oneis appearing before a judge.
Yes.
Be trustworthy with your supervisorand with whoever you're dealing with.
(09:16):
And you know what we'velearned too recently?
Well, we didn't learn thisrecently, but we'll give you
an example after I mention it.
Loyalty.
Loyalty is a great thingthat supervisors love.
Just love, but, and that, that goes alittle hand in hand with trustworthiness
(09:37):
and we, we, I hate to throw this out,but recently we've seen how loyalty
can be rewarded to our president.
Yeah.
That seems, that seems to be the mostimportant thing to him is loyalty.
But man, uh, I honestly, andI think you agree, prefer
(09:57):
trustworthiness even over loyalty.
Yes, absolutely.
Honesty.
And also think about whether if youcall in sick that you're really sick,
don't be absent just because you need,uh, or you want a particular day off.
Especially if you call insick on a Monday or a Friday.
Over the time, if that continues, yoursupervisor will think that you're not
(10:22):
being honest about those sick days.
Absolutely.
And if you have to get up earlier,
you know, start off a little earlier,uh, I must admit, uh, there was
a lawyer who was especially late.
And he would call in late and he wouldsay, oh, I live in a certain community and
(10:46):
it's heavy traffic, and I never believedhim until later I moved to that community.
I along
right.
Yes.
And I realized he was telling the truth.
Oh, real.
Yes.
I couldn't, it was like, oh, thetraffic is terrible in this community.
But, uh, uh, you know, and another thing,Susan, following company policies, ah.
(11:15):
That goes along withstaying out of trouble.
Right?
Right.
Uh, we, we had so many disciplinaryissues with, with people over the years.
Yeah.
It, it people, uh, uh, employees.
You gotta try to, when we say stay outtatrouble, if you can avoid accusations.
(11:36):
Of sexual harassment, discrimination.
Watch when you're touching peopleremember cases where he had situations
where, oh, he touched me the wrong way.
Well, what did he do?
He rubbed my shoulders.
Like, be careful who youtouch and how you touch 'em.
It don't make sexual commentsor racial slurs or, oh, yeah.
(11:59):
You know, just stay awayfrom the controversial stuff.
Most of this makes commonsense if you think about it,
isn't it?
Isn't it true?
It's, most of it's common sense, butyou know, we're, when you're in a
workplace and you're in the middle of it.
I, you know, people sometimes dothings that, that they regret,
(12:22):
that they, they shouldn't do.
You know?
And you mentioned it earlier, Susan,working well with your colleagues.
Absolutely.
And, and like
especially with your, your supportstaff too, because sometimes
I think people forget about.
They may have a good relationship withtheir colleagues, but with the support
(12:42):
people, they may not do as well.
They may not be as interested in them.
They may not greet them.
You need to have a good relationshipwith the support people.
They really make a difference.
Yes, and, and workingwell with the public too.
Absolutely.
Really great.
When somebody from the public or like ajudge or someone calls a supervisor and
(13:05):
says, oh, this person did a great job.
I really like the way this person did.
Oh, this person treated me withcourtesy and respect and I, and
gave me the information I needed.
Uh, so I, yes, I definitely agree,Susan, that it is very, very important
to have good relations with yourcolleagues and with the public at large.
(13:28):
Uh, and, and, and like yousaid, used good judgment.
Uh, there was a guy once and whathappened was the support staff came to me.
Uh, secretaries and they said,'cause the bathroom was down the
hall and they said, somebody's inthe restroom and they're fighting.
(13:51):
And I'm like, oh yeah.
And always, whenever there's anissue, they come to the supervisor.
They said, please go downthere and see what's going on.
'cause I hear them yelling and bumming,slamming in the walls and stuff.
And so I go cautiously go down thereand I open the restroom door, and
there's only one person in there.
(14:12):
It's one of our attorneys.
He's all by himself, so he's apparentlyin there bussing and yelling at himself
and slamming in the walls by himself.
So.
Uh, use good judgment people, right?
Because we have the stories of people,uh, smoking weed in the, remember
(14:33):
the, there was, uh, one attorneywhere there was an allegation that
she went into her o her office.
She came in, she didn't say helloto anybody, she just came into
the office, went straight intoher office and shut the door.
And next thing you know, the secretariesare coming to me saying, we smell
(14:53):
marijuana coming from her office.
Just like, please.
I don't know that that's the same personwho also, uh, was, uh, lighting incense.
To get rid of evil Spirit.
I, that's the same one, or not?
I think.
Yeah.
Had an enemy's list,which I was on, so, oh,
(15:15):
no, not way to, oh, no.
An enemy's list.
And your supervisor's on the list.
That's really a way.
Yeah.
To, not to, to dis impression wesay, or depress your supervisor.
(15:37):
You know, there's so manythings that people can do to
impress their supervisors.
They can be innovative.
They can excel in office goals andyou know, there's so many things.
You know, one of the things that reallygoes over well with the supervisor is
when you make the supervisor look good.
(16:01):
That's for sure.
And and to make sure that you attendany staff meetings or any meetings
that this supervisor wants to holdbecause you can learn a lot and they
appreciate your being there, listening andparticipating in any meetings they hold.
Yes, and I held a lot of them.
Yes.
(16:23):
You know, and going back just briefly.
I know sometimes we think, oh,that being on time isn't important.
Showing up late isn't a big issue, andloyalty and honesty isn't a big issue.
But here's a story about that.
And all, every story we'retelling you, by the way, is true.
Absolutely a hundred percent true.
(16:44):
Uh, we have one lawyer and.
He wrote on his time sheet that hewas at work and that he, he wrote
on there that he was in court,but we couldn't find him in court.
And when they searched around,they found out that he was
not, obviously not in court.
(17:05):
But that he was working foranother firm at the same time.
He had written on his time sheet thathe was working for our office, so he
was double dipping at this one thingto double dip, but they, they contacted
the other firm and they said yes.
He was working for us at that timeand we're like, he told us you were
(17:26):
in court and you were working handle.
The Inc actually was incourt for another firm.
Or another office.
So I mean, it's loyalty and trustand, and, and he is the only person
that I ever knew of in our office.
Who, uh, they fired on the spot.
(17:46):
Literally, they called him in and thenext thing you know, he was cleaning
out his office and walking out the door.
So, uh, that's, these are all importantlessons, important lessons, uh,
once they accept their supervisor'sevaluation feedback, you know,
(18:06):
listen to your supervisor.
Um, so that you can learn what they'reexpecting, what they want, what they
feel is positive about what you're doing.
And so I think that's important.
That is excellent stuff, excellentstuff to really listen and, and,
and, and probably good to go toyour supervisor and, and sometimes,
(18:27):
occasionally say, Hey, how can I improve?
What can I do to, uh, make,uh, improve my performance?
You know?
That sounds like that'sreally good advice, Susan.
I think you're giving to, uh.
Uh, be in communication, conversewith your supervisor, and, and,
and work on trying to improve.
(18:48):
Uh, and I think there'sso many other things.
It helps to be innovative.
It helps to be motivated, motivated.
It's such a great thing, uh, and a
problem solver.
If you can solve some of theproblems, that helps a lot.
Yes, a problem solver.
And it, it helps to be the best.
(19:10):
You know, it helps to bewhatever you're doing.
Like we had some lawyers that were likegreat lawyers who knew the law, who
were very articulate, who won theircases, won virtually all their cases.
It helps to be the best atwhatever it is you're doing
and articulate and well spoken.
(19:33):
Uh.
And so all of this is good stuffto impress your supervisor.
Yeah.
You know, and, and the littlesmaller things, and like you said,
a lot of this is common sense, butsmaller things like don't lie, don't
(19:54):
cheat, don't steal, think about whatyour address, you, you're attire.
I mean, we've had people come into theoffice, attorneys and they were exposing.
You know, you know, you can't siton the court up there exposing,
you know, parts of their body,uh, like a see-through blouse.
(20:19):
And we do get calls from judgesabout that, that's for sure.
Yes, yes.
And like you said, once again,common sense drugs and alcohol.
Do not use drugs and alcohol.
Oh, now.
I remember my dad when I was avery young man, he took me with
him to work to his workplace.
(20:40):
It was a factory, and I saw them.
He would go out to lunchevery day with his supervisor.
And they would drink whiskey every day.
So I guess there's anexception to the rule
that you should, but that's veryrare and I'm not recommending it.
(21:02):
Right,
and don't make accusationsthat you can't prove.
Yes.
If at times there's something thatyou feel is wrong or that you were
discriminated against or whatever, justmake sure that you have the facts to
prove it, because there have been timeswhen it's been alleged but not proven.
(21:23):
Yes.
And the, the thing of it is yoursupervisors are the first ones
to get called and then, you know,uh, uh, generally we are trying to
defend the lawyers or defend thesupport staff against accusations.
So that's why it's so importantthat the staff is honest with
(21:44):
their supervisors so that thesupervisors have a ground to stand on.
To defend them when theiraccusations, uh, alleged against them.
All righty.
Anything else?
Uh, Susan.
Well, I just say that I hope at somepoint that you have a podcast where you
(22:06):
interview maybe one of our employeesor attorneys or even support staff and
ask them what makes a good supervisor.
Oh, no, we don't wanna do that.
Please.
You're gonna get me in trouble.
No.
No, they think you're great.
You're, you're very kind.
You're very kind.
(22:26):
Ah, we, uh, we had some goodold days, some good times.
I'll leave with just one last story.
One time we had, there was somecelebration I was having and so I invited
all of the staff and the attorneys.
To lunch, but it was, I thinkthey paid for themselves.
(22:51):
It was, it was many yearsago, but here's the point.
Here's what happened.
So, uh, we're all sitting there and it'sabout, for, for this particular branch,
it was about 20 people, support staff.
And I mean, and so, uh, we decide, Idecided I needed to go to the restroom.
Everybody had ordered, I had ordered.
I went to the restroom, I came back.
(23:13):
Everybody else had their foodand they were eating and I didn't
have my food, so I was waiting.
They said, well, theydidn't bring your food.
I'm like, well, what happened to my food?
And to make this a little bit shorter, along story short, I'm waiting, waiting.
I complained to, to the waitress.
I said, well, what happened to my food?
And she said.
Well, that guy over there, he tookit, the one of the lawyers, she said
(23:37):
he is eating your food and his food.
So the, the point of it is, uh,don't eat your supervisor's food.
Anyway, I thought that was hilarious.
It wasn't hilarious at the time.
It was like, what?
He took my plate and he's eating my food.
But anyway.
All righty, ladies and gentlemen.
(23:59):
Uh, I am the logical lawyer.
I welcome your comments atthe Logical lawyer@gmail.com.
Uh, my webpage is the Logical attorney.me.
I thank you so much, Susan,for joining us, for giving us
these insights of wisdom, pearlsof wisdom, as they call them.
Okay.
And oh, bye.
And yes,
(24:20):
thank you, Bernie, for having me.
And I have to mention that instead ofgetting a retirement feel or plaque
from the city, you gave me one thatmeans a lot to me that I. Calling me
the greatest supervisor in the world,which is not true, but very sweet
plaque that I have hanging by my backdoor as I leave the house every day.
(24:42):
I see it.
Thank you.
I assure you it is true because I havewatched you handle some of the most
delicate, difficult situations anddealing with crazy judges and and weird
attorneys and support staff and breakdownsand all kinds of emotional trauma.
And over the years,hundreds of lawyers, ah.
(25:03):
It is true, Susan, you arethe greatest of all time.
But before I sign off completely,let me just remember one thing.
There is a podcast called, it's that part.
It's that part.
And that's with Jesse Hammond.
And that guy is, he's right on.
(25:25):
Right on.
And I give my highestrecommendations that you check out.
It's that part 'causeit's a fantastic podcast.
Thank you Susan.
Well, that's a wrap for thisepisode of The Logical Lawyer.
If you found this insightful, be sure tolike, follow, subscribe, leave a review,
(25:46):
and share it with others who appreciatestraight talk and sharp analysis.
Got a question or a topic for Bernie.
We'd love to hear from you.
Connect with bernie@thelogicallawyer.me.
That's at the Logicallawyer.me, and you've got it.
So until next time, stay informed.
Think critically and asalways, keep it logical.
(26:08):
Oh, Bernie Brown, with knowledgeprofound in the realm he
seek the where
each.
New.
Coming up on this episode ofthe Logical Lawyer Podcast,
(00:03):
one should accept theirsupervisor's evaluation feedback.
You know, listen to your supervisor,um, so that you can learn what they're
expecting, what they want, what theyfeel is positive about what you're doing,
and so that think, that's important.
That is excellent stuff, excellent stuff.
(00:34):
Welcome all to Bernie Brown'sdelight, where legal minds unite both
day and night in uncertain times.
He's your guiding light.
So gather around, let's say.
Right.
(00:55):
Welcome to the Logical Lawyer Podcastwith attorney Bernie Brown, retired Los
Angeles assistant City attorney withdecades of legal experience and also
extensive leadership experience servingin top bar associations like the John
M Langston Bar Association and theAssociation of Black City Attorneys.
Bernie is powered by a deep personaltestimony that took him from South central
(01:19):
LA to the courtrooms of downtown la.
Bernie dives into today's toughestlegal, social, and spiritual issues.
He brings facts, answers, and sharpanalysis to cut through all the noise.
So are you ready for ano nonsense perspective?
Then let's get started withyour host attorney, Bernie
(01:39):
Brown, the Logical lawyer.
Hello there.
My name is Bernie Brown.
I am the Logical lawyer.
Today we will conduct a logical analysis.
Of how to impress your supervisorand succeed in the workplace.
I, I gotta tell you, we're lucky today.
(02:00):
We have the greatestsupervisor of all time.
We have Susan Zimber.
A retired supervising attorneyfor the Los Angeles City
Attorney's office, and guess what?
We got me.
I'm also a retired supervisingattorney for the Los Angeles City
(02:21):
Attorney's office, and you suggest
you supervise at leastfour different branches
or different branches.
And you know, the two of us together haveabout 50, almost 50 years of combined.
Supervisorial experience, man.
Are
those,
(02:41):
uh, we supervised attorneys andsecretaries, support staff, investigators,
all kinds of people, and wow, we gotsome stories to tell, don't we, Susan?
Yes we do.
We certainly do.
Uh, you know, I think peopledon't understand that, uh, or they
should understand that it is veryimportant to impress your supervisor.
(03:04):
Your supervisor can advance your career.
Or they can pretty muchdestroy your career.
So, and that's probably becausethe supervisors generally have
direct access to the bosses, tothe corporate owners, to the people
who are in control of everything.
And usually, uh, the line.
(03:26):
I should call, I don't want tocall people with line workers,
but the line workers, uh, don'tusually have access to the bosses.
So the supervisor tell the bosseswho they like and they tell the
bosses they recommend who should getpromoted and who should get raises.
And from there, life can be good.
(03:47):
Uh, or it can be just the opposite.
It can be very difficult.
Susan, I know between the twoof us, we've got some horrors.
Stories, don't we?
Yes, we
do.
We, we had some great attorneys.
I would say the majority of ourattorneys were wonderful support staff
also, but we did have some challengingattorneys that we had to deal with.
(04:11):
I think over the years, we supervisedliterally hundreds of attorneys.
I think I made, I'm not sure Isaid that, literally hundreds
because they would come and go.
New attorneys would come, newsupport staff would come and they'd
transfer out or quit or whatever.
And so we literally supervisedhundreds of attorneys.
Susan, I'm gonna do somethingout of, uh, outline.
(04:34):
Okay.
Start us off with one horror story.
Can you start off with,
you want you, you're gonna startoff with one or you want No,
I can, I would ask you to, you know,between the two of us, we've got.
Dozens of ho horror stories.
You wanna start off with one?
Okay, sure.
Well, we had an attorneywho got so many complaints.
(04:57):
Complaints from her colleagues,her other attorneys complaints
from victims, from witnesses, frompolice officers, of all things.
And even judges, and there werejudges who wouldn't have her in their
courtroom, so this was difficult.
Fortunately, at some point shedid transfer to another branch.
(05:20):
But I think the samebehavior continued there
also.
And that brings me to my first point,Susan, when I called you and said,
Susan, I want you to go on the podcastand talk about, uh, supervisors on
how to impress your supervisors.
And your first response to me was.
(05:41):
What was that responseabout what not to do?
Don't remember now,
Bernie, what was
it?
It was
Don't be a troublemaker.
And that's very true.
Very true.
That you're not gonna advanceif you're a troublemaker
and, and you'll make yoursupervisor's miserable.
Uh.
(06:01):
You know, there are a lot of thingsthat people can do that can advance
their career or destroy their career.
One of the things that I think youliked it too, was A a yes person.
A person.
When you come to 'em and you ask 'emto do something, their answer is yes.
Or if they had reason that theydidn't wanna do it or couldn't do it
(06:22):
or whatever, they could let you knowimmediately and you could discuss it
rather than just, you know, say theycouldn't do it, wouldn't do it, whatever.
Yeah.
Uh, you know, the people who droveme crazy were the ones that, oh,
I, I don't know how to do that.
They're tra trained to do it.
They basically just law school, right?
Yeah.
That they just didn't wanna do it.
(06:44):
But, you know, and so as a supervisor.
Supervisors love yes people.
And they love people who graciously andhappily assume additional assignments.
You know when you go to 'emand you say, can you do this?
Not only do they say yes, butthey say it with a good attitude.
(07:05):
Isn't that great, Susan?
That is great.
And we had some people that did that,and then some that wouldn't do it.
So we dealt with both.
Yeah, we ran into somereal, uh, weird situations.
Weird.
I had a guy once and YY this was when Itransferred to the San Pedro branch, and
(07:26):
there was a guy and he was always late.
We're gonna come to that.
Well, let's just deal with it now.
Better work on time.
Please get to work on time if you can.
But this guy was late and he wasassigned to go directly to court.
And so I, uh, he wasn't gettingthere and the court was calling me.
(07:46):
The judges would call me andsay, where's your attorney?
Why isn't he here?
Why isn't he in court?
And so, uh, one day the judge's clerkcalled me and she said, I figured
out why he's late all the time.
And she said, I'm looking out mywindow now, and I see him in the
parking lot and he's getting dressed.
And I noticed that he does that now.
I've been noticing that every day hearrives and he gets dressed in the court.
(08:10):
I mean, on the parking lot.
It's like, please, man, get towork on time and dress at home.
Not in the parking lot.
Especially when you're assigned tocourtrooms, the judges get upset
if you don't have someone there.
And if the attorney is late, you mayhave to send a different attorney.
(08:30):
So it just doesn't work out.
You've gotta be on time.
Yes.
And it's very, very frustratingand it causes anxiety, uh, for
the, for the supervisor, you know?
That and, and you know, theother thing is trustworthiness.
You know, we love somebodywho's trustworthy.
(08:51):
You know, you can't, it is, it is hardto deal with a situation where you
have a lawyer or a, or a somebody whoworks for you and they're dishonest.
You find out that they haven'tbeen telling you the truth.
And it's
certainly important when oneis appearing before a judge.
Yes.
Be trustworthy with your supervisorand with whoever you're dealing with.
(09:16):
And you know what we'velearned too recently?
Well, we didn't learn thisrecently, but we'll give you
an example after I mention it.
Loyalty.
Loyalty is a great thingthat supervisors love.
Just love, but, and that, that goes alittle hand in hand with trustworthiness
(09:37):
and we, we, I hate to throw this out,but recently we've seen how loyalty
can be rewarded to our president.
Yeah.
That seems, that seems to be the mostimportant thing to him is loyalty.
But man, uh, I honestly, andI think you agree, prefer
(09:57):
trustworthiness even over loyalty.
Yes, absolutely.
Honesty.
And also think about whether if youcall in sick that you're really sick,
don't be absent just because you need,uh, or you want a particular day off.
Especially if you call insick on a Monday or a Friday.
Over the time, if that continues, yoursupervisor will think that you're not
(10:22):
being honest about those sick days.
Absolutely.
And if you have to get up earlier,
you know, start off a little earlier,uh, I must admit, uh, there was
a lawyer who was especially late.
And he would call in late and he wouldsay, oh, I live in a certain community and
(10:46):
it's heavy traffic, and I never believedhim until later I moved to that community.
I along
right.
Yes.
And I realized he was telling the truth.
Oh, real.
Yes.
I couldn't, it was like, oh, thetraffic is terrible in this community.
But, uh, uh, you know, and another thing,Susan, following company policies, ah.
(11:15):
That goes along withstaying out of trouble.
Right?
Right.
Uh, we, we had so many disciplinaryissues with, with people over the years.
Yeah.
It, it people, uh, uh, employees.
You gotta try to, when we say stay outtatrouble, if you can avoid accusations.
(11:36):
Of sexual harassment, discrimination.
Watch when you're touching peopleremember cases where he had situations
where, oh, he touched me the wrong way.
Well, what did he do?
He rubbed my shoulders.
Like, be careful who youtouch and how you touch 'em.
It don't make sexual commentsor racial slurs or, oh, yeah.
(11:59):
You know, just stay awayfrom the controversial stuff.
Most of this makes commonsense if you think about it,
isn't it?
Isn't it true?
It's, most of it's common sense, butyou know, we're, when you're in a
workplace and you're in the middle of it.
I, you know, people sometimes dothings that, that they regret,
(12:22):
that they, they shouldn't do.
You know?
And you mentioned it earlier, Susan,working well with your colleagues.
Absolutely.
And, and like
especially with your, your supportstaff too, because sometimes
I think people forget about.
They may have a good relationship withtheir colleagues, but with the support
(12:42):
people, they may not do as well.
They may not be as interested in them.
They may not greet them.
You need to have a good relationshipwith the support people.
They really make a difference.
Yes, and, and workingwell with the public too.
Absolutely.
Really great.
When somebody from the public or like ajudge or someone calls a supervisor and
(13:05):
says, oh, this person did a great job.
I really like the way this person did.
Oh, this person treated me withcourtesy and respect and I, and
gave me the information I needed.
Uh, so I, yes, I definitely agree,Susan, that it is very, very important
to have good relations with yourcolleagues and with the public at large.
(13:28):
Uh, and, and, and like yousaid, used good judgment.
Uh, there was a guy once and whathappened was the support staff came to me.
Uh, secretaries and they said,'cause the bathroom was down the
hall and they said, somebody's inthe restroom and they're fighting.
(13:51):
And I'm like, oh yeah.
And always, whenever there's anissue, they come to the supervisor.
They said, please go downthere and see what's going on.
'cause I hear them yelling and bumming,slamming in the walls and stuff.
And so I go cautiously go down thereand I open the restroom door, and
there's only one person in there.
(14:12):
It's one of our attorneys.
He's all by himself, so he's apparentlyin there bussing and yelling at himself
and slamming in the walls by himself.
So.
Uh, use good judgment people, right?
Because we have the stories of people,uh, smoking weed in the, remember
(14:33):
the, there was, uh, one attorneywhere there was an allegation that
she went into her o her office.
She came in, she didn't say helloto anybody, she just came into
the office, went straight intoher office and shut the door.
And next thing you know, the secretariesare coming to me saying, we smell
(14:53):
marijuana coming from her office.
Just like, please.
I don't know that that's the same personwho also, uh, was, uh, lighting incense.
To get rid of evil Spirit.
I, that's the same one, or not?
I think.
Yeah.
Had an enemy's list,which I was on, so, oh,
(15:15):
no, not way to, oh, no.
An enemy's list.
And your supervisor's on the list.
That's really a way.
Yeah.
To, not to, to dis impression wesay, or depress your supervisor.
(15:37):
You know, there's so manythings that people can do to
impress their supervisors.
They can be innovative.
They can excel in office goals andyou know, there's so many things.
You know, one of the things that reallygoes over well with the supervisor is
when you make the supervisor look good.
(16:01):
That's for sure.
And and to make sure that you attendany staff meetings or any meetings
that this supervisor wants to holdbecause you can learn a lot and they
appreciate your being there, listening andparticipating in any meetings they hold.
Yes, and I held a lot of them.
Yes.
(16:23):
You know, and going back just briefly.
I know sometimes we think, oh,that being on time isn't important.
Showing up late isn't a big issue, andloyalty and honesty isn't a big issue.
But here's a story about that.
And all, every story we'retelling you, by the way, is true.
Absolutely a hundred percent true.
(16:44):
Uh, we have one lawyer and.
He wrote on his time sheet that hewas at work and that he, he wrote
on there that he was in court,but we couldn't find him in court.
And when they searched around,they found out that he was
not, obviously not in court.
(17:05):
But that he was working foranother firm at the same time.
He had written on his time sheet thathe was working for our office, so he
was double dipping at this one thingto double dip, but they, they contacted
the other firm and they said yes.
He was working for us at that timeand we're like, he told us you were
(17:26):
in court and you were working handle.
The Inc actually was incourt for another firm.
Or another office.
So I mean, it's loyalty and trustand, and, and he is the only person
that I ever knew of in our office.
Who, uh, they fired on the spot.
(17:46):
Literally, they called him in and thenext thing you know, he was cleaning
out his office and walking out the door.
So, uh, that's, these are all importantlessons, important lessons, uh,
once they accept their supervisor'sevaluation feedback, you know,
(18:06):
listen to your supervisor.
Um, so that you can learn what they'reexpecting, what they want, what they
feel is positive about what you're doing.
And so I think that's important.
That is excellent stuff, excellentstuff to really listen and, and,
and, and probably good to go toyour supervisor and, and sometimes,
(18:27):
occasionally say, Hey, how can I improve?
What can I do to, uh, make,uh, improve my performance?
You know?
That sounds like that'sreally good advice, Susan.
I think you're giving to, uh.
Uh, be in communication, conversewith your supervisor, and, and,
and work on trying to improve.
(18:48):
Uh, and I think there'sso many other things.
It helps to be innovative.
It helps to be motivated, motivated.
It's such a great thing, uh, and a
problem solver.
If you can solve some of theproblems, that helps a lot.
Yes, a problem solver.
And it, it helps to be the best.
(19:10):
You know, it helps to bewhatever you're doing.
Like we had some lawyers that were likegreat lawyers who knew the law, who
were very articulate, who won theircases, won virtually all their cases.
It helps to be the best atwhatever it is you're doing
and articulate and well spoken.
(19:33):
Uh.
And so all of this is good stuffto impress your supervisor.
Yeah.
You know, and, and the littlesmaller things, and like you said,
a lot of this is common sense, butsmaller things like don't lie, don't
(19:54):
cheat, don't steal, think about whatyour address, you, you're attire.
I mean, we've had people come into theoffice, attorneys and they were exposing.
You know, you know, you can't siton the court up there exposing,
you know, parts of their body,uh, like a see-through blouse.
(20:19):
And we do get calls from judgesabout that, that's for sure.
Yes, yes.
And like you said, once again,common sense drugs and alcohol.
Do not use drugs and alcohol.
Oh, now.
I remember my dad when I was avery young man, he took me with
him to work to his workplace.
(20:40):
It was a factory, and I saw them.
He would go out to lunchevery day with his supervisor.
And they would drink whiskey every day.
So I guess there's anexception to the rule
that you should, but that's veryrare and I'm not recommending it.
(21:02):
Right,
and don't make accusationsthat you can't prove.
Yes.
If at times there's something thatyou feel is wrong or that you were
discriminated against or whatever, justmake sure that you have the facts to
prove it, because there have been timeswhen it's been alleged but not proven.
(21:23):
Yes.
And the, the thing of it is yoursupervisors are the first ones
to get called and then, you know,uh, uh, generally we are trying to
defend the lawyers or defend thesupport staff against accusations.
So that's why it's so importantthat the staff is honest with
(21:44):
their supervisors so that thesupervisors have a ground to stand on.
To defend them when theiraccusations, uh, alleged against them.
All righty.
Anything else?
Uh, Susan.
Well, I just say that I hope at somepoint that you have a podcast where you
(22:06):
interview maybe one of our employeesor attorneys or even support staff and
ask them what makes a good supervisor.
Oh, no, we don't wanna do that.
Please.
You're gonna get me in trouble.
No.
No, they think you're great.
You're, you're very kind.
You're very kind.
(22:26):
Ah, we, uh, we had some goodold days, some good times.
I'll leave with just one last story.
One time we had, there was somecelebration I was having and so I invited
all of the staff and the attorneys.
To lunch, but it was, I thinkthey paid for themselves.
(22:51):
It was, it was many yearsago, but here's the point.
Here's what happened.
So, uh, we're all sitting there and it'sabout, for, for this particular branch,
it was about 20 people, support staff.
And I mean, and so, uh, we decide, Idecided I needed to go to the restroom.
Everybody had ordered, I had ordered.
I went to the restroom, I came back.
(23:13):
Everybody else had their foodand they were eating and I didn't
have my food, so I was waiting.
They said, well, theydidn't bring your food.
I'm like, well, what happened to my food?
And to make this a little bit shorter, along story short, I'm waiting, waiting.
I complained to, to the waitress.
I said, well, what happened to my food?
And she said.
Well, that guy over there, he tookit, the one of the lawyers, she said
(23:37):
he is eating your food and his food.
So the, the point of it is, uh,don't eat your supervisor's food.
Anyway, I thought that was hilarious.
It wasn't hilarious at the time.
It was like, what?
He took my plate and he's eating my food.
But anyway.
All righty, ladies and gentlemen.
(23:59):
Uh, I am the logical lawyer.
I welcome your comments atthe Logical lawyer@gmail.com.
Uh, my webpage is the Logical attorney.me.
I thank you so much, Susan,for joining us, for giving us
these insights of wisdom, pearlsof wisdom, as they call them.
Okay.
And oh, bye.
And yes,
(24:20):
thank you, Bernie, for having me.
And I have to mention that instead ofgetting a retirement feel or plaque
from the city, you gave me one thatmeans a lot to me that I. Calling me
the greatest supervisor in the world,which is not true, but very sweet
plaque that I have hanging by my backdoor as I leave the house every day.
(24:42):
I see it.
Thank you.
I assure you it is true because I havewatched you handle some of the most
delicate, difficult situations anddealing with crazy judges and and weird
attorneys and support staff and breakdownsand all kinds of emotional trauma.
And over the years,hundreds of lawyers, ah.
(25:03):
It is true, Susan, you arethe greatest of all time.
But before I sign off completely,let me just remember one thing.
There is a podcast called, it's that part.
It's that part.
And that's with Jesse Hammond.
And that guy is, he's right on.
(25:25):
Right on.
And I give my highestrecommendations that you check out.
It's that part 'causeit's a fantastic podcast.
Thank you Susan.
Well, that's a wrap for thisepisode of The Logical Lawyer.
If you found this insightful, be sure tolike, follow, subscribe, leave a review,
(25:46):
and share it with others who appreciatestraight talk and sharp analysis.
Got a question or a topic for Bernie.
We'd love to hear from you.
Connect with bernie@thelogicallawyer.me.
That's at the Logicallawyer.me, and you've got it.
So until next time, stay informed.
Think critically and asalways, keep it logical.
(26:08):
Oh, Bernie Brown, with knowledgeprofound in the realm he
seek the where
each.
New.
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