There’s an anxiety humming beneath everything—like tinnitus that never stops. You feel it in leadership meetings where reactions explode out of proportion. In hair-trigger responses to small disruptions. In that 3am wakefulness that’s become a collective companion.
In this second conversation, Rob McNamara and I go deep into the question: How do we metabolize the poly-crisis, both personally and relationally—rather than being consumed by it?
We explore why survival mode has already lost the game, how intimacy with death becomes intimacy with life, and why relational space holds untapped generative power. We also discuss a simple practice to let life move through you, rather than against you.
This episode is especially for leaders, founders, and coaches ready to navigate complexity beyond survival—those seeking to develop the sensitivity to dance with uncertainty and access the intelligence that emerges between us.
About Rob McNamara: Rob is an expert in adult development, performance, and transformational leadership. He is the author of The Elegant Selfand teaches at the intersection of human development, relational intelligence, and inner work. Learn more at robmcnamara.com
Key quote: “Enlightenment isn't intimacy with all things—it’s intimacy AS all things.”
Topics include:
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The grip and the open hand: how contraction blocks clarity
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What it means to be radically available to life
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Reclaiming presence and potency in relational space
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Why doing less can create more impact in complexity
Episode Highlights:
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00:02:05 – Why complexity feels so personal
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00:07:43 – The grip and the open hand: contraction vs clarity
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00:17:15 – Intimacy with death and the generativity of mortality
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00:27:40 – The intelligence arising in relational space
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00:36:12 – A somatic practice for metabolizing overwhelm
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00:49:00 – Redefining leadership in complex times
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00:57:30 – Becoming radically available to life
To explore the Pivot Podcast or my coaching work, visit daveschoof.com.
If this episode resonated, please subscribe—or forward it to someone navigating these times.
Production and Music composition: Phil Schoof
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