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June 24, 2025 33 mins

In this episode of  @TheScienceofLeadership , Tom Collins is joined by Dr. Denny Lund, former Chief Medical Officer of Lucile Packard Children's Hospital Stanford and a seasoned pediatric surgeon. They delve into the crucial role of competence in leadership, especially in high-stakes environments where lives, careers, or missions are on the line.

Dr. Lund defines competence as having diverse experience and knowledge pertinent to running an orgaization, emphasizing the necessity of being a lifelong learner. The conversation highlights a common challenge: individuals often rise to leadership positions based on technical competence but lack the necessary leadership competence. Dr. Lund asserts that leadership is a learned behavior, not an intrinsic quality, and requires intentional pursuit of training and learning. He shares his own journey of seeking formal and informal leadership education while balancing a demanding medical career and family life.

Key takeaways from their discussion include:

  • The Importance of Reading: Dr. Lund recommends Leadership by James MacGregor Burns and Emotional Intelligence by Daniel Goleman as foundational texts for aspiring leaders.
  • Understanding Your Impact: Effective leaders must understand the effect they have on others, a concept central to emotional intelligence.
  • Managing High Stakes: The discussion covers how competence is vital in various "high-stakes" situations, not just life-or-death scenarios, from critical team conversations to championship moments.
  • Leading by Empowerment: Dr. Lund emphasizes valuing team members and empowering rising leaders, allowing them to confidently perform their roles. He recounts a personal experience of stepping into a CEO role unexpectedly, relying on his learned leadership principles and trusted advisors.
  • Avoiding Overconfidence: Both Dr. Lund and Tom Collins warn against the dangers of overconfidence, especially among highly trained professionals, and stress the importance of seeking wise counsel and continually re-evaluating skills. This ties into the Dunning-Kruger effect, where low-competence individuals overestimate their abilities and high-competence individuals underestimate theirs.
  • Actionable Steps for Competence: The episode concludes with practical advice for leaders to improve competence, including reading, observing effective leaders, deliberate practice under pressure, developing decision-making frameworks (like the pre-mortem), and maintaining humility and self-awareness. The power of coaching and mentorship is also underscored.

Key References:

Burns, J. M. (1978). Leadership. Harper and Row.

Collins, R. T., Purington, N. & Roth, S. J. (2022). Physician understanding of and beliefs about leadership. Journal of Healthcare Management, 67(2), 120–136.

Connelly, M. S., Gilbert, J. A., Zaccaro, S. J., Threlfall, K. V., Marks, M. A. & Mumford, M. D. (2000). Exploring the relationship of leadership skills and knowledge to leader performance. The Leadership Quarterly, 11(1), 65–86. https://doi.org/10.1016/s1048-9843(99)00043-0

Goleman, D. (1995). Emotional Intelligence: Why It Can Matter More Than IQ. Bantam Books.

Grant, A. (2021). Think again: The power of knowing what you don’t know. Viking.

Kozminski, A. K., Baczyńska, A. K., Skoczeń, I. & Korzynski, P. (2022). Towards leadership effectiveness: the role of leadership individual competencies and constraints. Introduction of the Bounded Leadership Model. Leadership & Organization Development Journal, 43(4), 596–611. https://doi.org/10.1108/lodj-04-2020-0157

Kruger, J. & Dunning, D. (1999). Unskilled and Unaware of It: How Difficulties in Recognizing One’s Own Incompetence Lead to Inflated Self-Assessments. Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, 77(6), 1121–1134. https://doi.org/10.1037/0022-3514.77.6.1121

Wisittigars, B. & Siengthai, S. (2019). Crisis leadership competencies: the facility management sector in Thailand. Facilities, 37(13/14), 881–896. https://doi.org/10.1108/f-10-2017-0100

To learn more about the Science of Leadership, visit https://www.fourstarleaders.com/ 

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