July 2, 2024 • 35 mins
In this episode, we sit down with the inspirational Renee, founder of Flourish Mama, to discuss her journey from corporate life to creating a supportive fitness community for women. Renee shares her personal story of overcoming anxiety through movement, the importance of mental health, and how making small steps can be the start of a self healing process.
Renee offers practical tips for incorporating movement into your daily life, no matter how busy you are, and shares insights on breaking down the barriers and misconceptions about fitness. Whether you're a new mum, a busy professional, or simply looking for ways to start moving, this episode is packed with valuable advice and inspiration. She's a pocket rocket with a side of cuteness, you're going to love her! You can find Renee at 'Flourish Mama' on the following platforms: Website: www.flourishmama.com.au Instagram: @flourishmama_ Facebook: @flourishmama_ Her 4 Week Online Exercise Series "Her Spark" mentioned in this episode: https://www.flourishmama.com.au/copy-of-she-moves
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Music.
(00:09):
Okay all right beautiful ren what is your nickname what do people call you for
a nickname oh i have a few renee is obviously that's actually my name friend,
this is off to a great start i love it you're awesome all right nickname let's
(00:36):
go No, Ren. Does someone? Ren Tizzle.
Ren Tizzle is one of them. Wow. Reno is another one. Oh.
There's an old friend and he randomly calls me Cogsy.
So I have a few. That's so cute. But I never had any growing up. Oh, really?
(00:59):
No, it wasn't until I met my now husband that I met people around him and ta-da, I have a nickname.
Far out I had so many grown up like obviously Mel was the most common one and
in high school I was called Melon Melon I don't remember where it came from.
(01:21):
But I was Melon did you answer to it I did answer to it but I'm one of those
people that if someone called me so my full name is Melanie yeah but most people
would only ever know me as Mel like I don't ever call myself Melanie but if
someone called me Melissa I'd answer to it,
(01:42):
someone called me Melody I'd answer to it Melinda anything
with Mel I'll answer to it I don't want I don't like correcting yeah I wouldn't
like that awkwardness you know when someone calls you the wrong name totally
you can call me Amanda and I'll be like okay I had a conversation with my husband
than the other day and I was like,
(02:02):
I keep calling this guy this name and I'm actually not 100% sure that that's his name.
I'm like, I've said it so many times, they're never going to correct me.
You can't go back now. Yeah, you can't. You can't even ask.
It's too awkward to even bring it up and find out you have been wrong.
I know, just get with it. You will be Gary from now on.
(02:24):
Yeah, that's it. All right, well, beautiful Renee, or I'm going to call you
Lemon I mean, because it actually reminds me of like an 80s computer game. Yeah.
No, I'll call you Ren. I wanted you to come on this amazing podcast because
(02:45):
I think you are super inspirational and I love your passion and your heart for
all things, physical movement,
health, all sorts of things like that.
I've known you, I feel like I met you on Instagram.
Yeah, probably. probably I think we did I think you might have come to play
(03:05):
group a couple of times after that yes where we like met in person I feel like
it was like I follow you on Instagram,
I know we have a few of those I have a few of those conversations and you're
like I feel like I really know you but I've never seen you in real person I've
had a lot of those conversations too with people I haven't met yet but I'm sure
(03:27):
I will in the future which I love that actually about Yeah, it's so true.
But yeah, so we met through that and then I've always like been really jealous
because I've always wanted to come to one of your classes and it just never lines up with my life.
So I just like follow along to all your online things that you do instead.
But do you want to tell the crowd of people that are listening to this podcast?
(03:52):
Yeah. Your name and maybe we'll go right back to the start. Where you grew up
because I actually don't even know that.
So, I'm Renee. I grew up in a town called Mossvale in the Southern Highlands.
It was quite small and not as, like, fancy as it is now.
Yes, it's quite fancy now. Very fancy now.
(04:16):
Yep. So, I grew up with my mum and dad and my brother,
and I went to a very small school, and mum and dad were always really supportive
of us getting into sport and running us around to our sport from a pretty young age. Yeah.
They were sport people before they had kids.
(04:38):
So that was really important to them, which was good.
I was a netballer forever. I did netballers. Yeah.
My knees hate netball too.
They're a breed where I grew up though. I feel like you don't fit the breed,
so it's okay. I'm not sure what that is. What's the breed? It's not very nice.
(05:01):
I hope I don't fit that breed. Continue on, continue on. So then,
yeah, so I kind of had a, I would say a normal childhood, I guess.
Yeah. yeah moved through in my
hsc got that was kind
of the year when i can remember getting involved in like a gym for the first
(05:22):
time yeah and using movement to help relieve stress so my parents bought me
a gym membership and i went to the gym and it really helped in,
yeah just supporting me through that period yeah of
course at that time it was like you go in on
(05:42):
the treadmill you sit on the bike you find
a little corner hiding it to do your ab but never went into the weights room
because it was I was like 17 at the time it was very overwhelming and it really
wasn't a time then when you would do any sort of resistance kind of training
you You weren't welcome in that kind of space. Yeah. Yeah.
(06:04):
So then I studied sports management and moved to Canberra for a little while, which was freezing.
So cold. Oh, man. Hello to all the Canberra people. Yeah. It's amazing.
It's like literally living in like Finland or something. Like I see sometimes
them post things. It's like great day today and it's like minus two.
(06:27):
I'm such a winder in the cold. I couldn't do it. Yeah, so am I.
And I've just always been like a coast person.
Yeah. And so even growing up not near the coast, I never thought that I would
live away from the coast.
So my first, when I first moved, it was down to a coastal town.
So, well, when I moved back from Canberra from studying, I basically had a year
(06:52):
or two and then moved straight to the coast. So I was like, I need the warmth.
I totally get it. I grew up like in Sydney, like around eastern beaches.
And so I moved from there and
then when my husband and I were dating and also
I just needed a sea chains because I'd grown up in
Sydney my whole life I was not sheltered you're not
(07:12):
sheltered in Sydney but like in a way I was
like to just city life and so I remember I just picked up and moved one day
to Narromine which is like a little town west of Dubbo wow real west yeah like
no ocean Like the closest thing to water to go swimming in is the Macquarie River,
(07:34):
which is so cold. Yeah.
But I loved it too. Like I still even love the country, like going back to visit.
I don't miss the lack of places to go at night and go out of your house.
But I still like, yeah, we still have lots of amazing, beautiful connections
(07:56):
with country. But it's fun to come back, isn't it? Yeah.
Yeah. it's definitely the ocean is definitely
my like calming happy place
yeah and I feel like I look at
it and it both reminds me that I'm small
in comparison to the world which is a really good feeling
(08:17):
although it sounds scary and it's not
that it's telling me that I'm not important it's just
telling me that there's like a whole world
and that you know and also that
the ocean has so many different sides to
it like on a beautiful sunny day it
can look sparkly and on another day it
(08:39):
can be like awful looking and big and grumbling and but all of that is okay
yeah yeah and so all and it kind of just reminds me like all of who I am is
okay because that you know there's just different elements of who we are and
on different days they come out and that is totally fine you you know?
(08:59):
So it's, yeah, that's why I just love the ocean. So off the back of that, I'm going to use that.
Off the back of that, you have this amazing business.
Yeah. It's funny calling it even
a business, but it obviously it is like a business called Flourish Mama.
So how did that come about for you? Like what season of your life were you in
(09:23):
maybe prior to that? Yeah.
And what What made you want to start that? And then just give us a bit of a
lowdown about what it is. I know, so I'm totally biased.
Yeah, so it's a long story. I'll try and tell it a bit quickly.
Yeah. So when I finished studying, got into my, like, working career,
(09:46):
went into my typical, like, people-pleasing perfectionism,
them like working really hard
wanting to be good at everything so I
worked really hard found like
my husband which was amazing which was like the
he is such a special man like I can't say how much he's been you know just there
(10:14):
he's amazing but then I found at a point when I was like okay so So I'm in my
corporate career, I'm working really hard.
I got married and then I was like, oh, how about I just add another degree?
So I'm working full time.
I want to, now I want to be again at uni.
And I was commuting at like halfway through that. I started commuting to Sydney
(10:38):
for like the work, two hours each way.
And there was a few things that had happened a year or two prior that I hadn't
dealt with emotionally.
Emotionally and so there it
all kind of culminated in a complete
like anxious I call it a breakdown because it literally broke me down to every
(11:01):
like the last part of who I was so how many years had you been married three
oh oh I don't know what this is guys I'm sorry yeah and who knows how to get rid of it.
A like thumb just came up on the screen in case you're wondering why we're laughing. Okay, so three.
Yeah, please watch the video and you'll see why we're laughing because Zoom
(11:22):
just gave us a thumbs up in the middle of her saying three, like as if it was going to be incorrect.
So three years you've been married, that's a lot. You didn't have any kids then?
No kids. Thank goodness. I often think, man, I'm so, this is a strange thing
to say, but I'm glad that I had that before I had children.
(11:43):
Oh, that's what I was asking. Yeah, that's what I was asking because that's
a whole another dynamic to jump in. Totally, yeah.
And you've got to jump in yourself but then you're also responsible for other
humans. You've got to like dive.
Yeah, exactly. And so what it did give me was the ability to really understand.
So it went, I don't even know really how long it went for,
(12:06):
like it was months and it was slowly coming on and it wasn't until like I was
getting these random thoughts in my head and I was like, I don't even know,
this doesn't sound like me, I don't know what it is. Yeah.
And I was crying and didn't want to go out and it wasn't until I was brave enough
(12:26):
to tell someone and that was my husband. Yeah. Bitch.
It's horrible to hold it all inside, to be like, what is wrong with me?
I don't feel like myself. I don't know what's happening.
I can't function like a human.
And so when I finally was able to just be like, I need to get this out of my
(12:47):
body, like tell someone about it. You're brave.
Yeah. And it is brave. Like anyone that's dealt with mental health stuff,
you're just like, how is this person going to hear this? Yeah. You know?
And so he, as I said, he's amazing.
He listened to everything. He didn't flinch. He was just like,
(13:10):
I'm here. I know who you are.
Like, I know who you are. And so I remember.
So he validated that how you felt wasn't who you were? Is that?
Yeah, because there was a bit in there about like, yeah, it's kind of.
Because you would have thought, what is wrong with me?
Yeah. Yeah, it was a complete unduly. That there's something not right.
(13:34):
So what you're feeling is right, but it doesn't mean that that's who you are. Yeah.
Yeah, that's cool. Yeah. And so we were like, all right, what help do we get
from here? How do, what's the plan?
And I remember, this is very specific, but people might resonate with this,
at that moment of just being in the shower and being like
(13:56):
sobbing and thinking where what
happens now like I don't know who I am I don't know what my what thoughts are
accurate what is not what what do I do and I just remember hearing this voice
that just said like we just rebuild from here one step at a time and I'm like
all right which you know within months
(14:17):
of work so went to the physio didn't go to the physio okay whole picture,
went to the psychologist.
Went to a psychologist and she really gave me tools to.
Was it hard to get, because I think there is like stigma, even still today,
(14:39):
I think, about that initial appointment.
Yeah, I was. Psychologist. Like, was that hard?
Like, number one, practically, was it hard to get into one? Then it wasn't as hard as it is now. Yeah.
But it was like, I thought, what am I going to go and tell this person?
Yeah like what do you actually say like
(15:01):
what I'm dealing with like I don't have any reference I've
never dealt with this before yeah I think I'm going
a bit crazy yeah like how do
I tell this to somebody yeah and I
just thought I kept just thinking I just
need it not to be in the dark parts and inside of
me like I'm not dealing with it inside of
(15:23):
me it's not helping so it needs to be out of my body yeah and
I really do believe that like when we shine a
light on these dark places they're not
as hard to handle yeah they can go back to the dark once the shine like you
shine exactly on a light on it once it comes it has to kind of be dealt with
yeah yeah and so I just I saw her for ages I remember saying at one point I
(15:47):
can't imagine not ever feeling like this It's, you know,
I just don't, are you sure that I'm going to be okay?
Yeah, this isn't it for me forever. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah. And so all of that, yeah, that's right. I'm like, okay,
this is just where I am now.
(16:08):
So all of that to say that was kind of, when I look back on my life,
there's like a few stakes in the ground where I can be, you know,
that, oh, that is why I'm where I am right now.
There's lots that I think shivers. That would be good if I didn't experience
that. Can't see why I experienced that.
That was fine to be a bit traumatic. Yeah.
(16:29):
And I haven't figured those ones out yet. But this one is. And I feel like sometimes
we actually don't. Oh, totally.
And I think you get stuck in trying to figure too much stuff out, I think.
Yeah, absolutely. Sometimes you will never know, I don't think,
why you went through sometimes things you did.
They definitely probably sucked, like, to have to have gone through it.
Like, you can be positive, like, oh, everything's positive, but sometimes you actually can't.
(16:55):
It's like it was actually awful.
Yeah, and there was no reason for it and you didn't deserve it.
And you've learned like you yeah you kind
of haven't learned from it because it's not something you learn from you just endure
like yeah yeah yeah valid yeah
so all of that I think to
say that is the time when I realized that movement was
(17:17):
one of the biggest tools in helping support my mental health yeah
so aside from the support
that I had from obviously my husband and my family and
my friends all of those things in
in sharing my what I was going
through with those that support network was also quite hard
and sometimes people didn't understand the depth of it and that could be really
(17:41):
frustrating yeah but then years later something they'll experience something
and they're like oh I will talk to this person because she knows what I'm going
through yeah and so yeah Yeah, aside from,
like, my network that supported me and music and,
you know, the tools that the psychologist gave me, movement was the biggest
(18:03):
one that I knew that I could control in a certain way.
Yeah. And so through that period, I think being the achieving type was like,
maybe because I'm doing so much research about movement, I should do a personal
training course to understand more about movement with the idea that I would
(18:26):
stay in corporate and I would never use it. It was just to be there, right?
Like an outlet, yeah. Yeah, just an interest.
And so that's what – Oh, wrong you were, friend. Yeah, that's right.
Oh, dear. And so that's kind of what moved me into personal training and then
(18:46):
I happened to fall pregnant to do my prac and realised that I hadn't actually
learnt much about exercise in pregnancy and postpartum.
So anything through that perinatal period was.
You're not taught. And I was just like, I've just studied this and I don't know.
I actually still think it's really hard to find.
(19:07):
Yeah. Yeah. And thankfully in the places that I kind of hang out online and
the mentors that I have, I feel like it's getting heaps better. Heaps better.
But. There was nothing around my first kid and that was 14 years ago.
Yeah. No, there wouldn't have
been. But compared to now, it's definitely like a lot more accessible.
(19:29):
Yeah. Yeah. or even just research but
yeah there was nothing it was kind of like you have a baby you don't
you don't work out yeah yeah exactly that was the kind of mentality like because
it could be dangerous to the baby yes yeah like and that's the thing like I
still have people who who they they fall pregnant they're like can I still exercise
(19:51):
and I'm just like even if you have fallen pregnant and you
have never exercised they now recommend to start because it's so helpful obviously
that's you know if you cleared for from a doctor and all of those sort of things
yeah if there's other underlying yeah yeah but generally like movement is so
helpful across the span of a woman's life.
(20:12):
From my point of view I thought well I'm pregnant and I'm
not sure how to move my body in this pregnant
body and then postpartum I
was just like I had bits of information that I thought I
needed to consider but I didn't know how
it all fit together so really straight away I kind of specialized in pre and
(20:33):
postnatal movement and did more certifications around that just so that I could
train my body first and not do
any damage and feel confident in like rebuilding from where I was yeah um.
And that kind of, so then my passion was, that was around when my eldest, she's seven, was born.
(20:53):
And from there, I worked at a gym for six years.
And then I thought, oh, when I move, for some reason, I always knew when I moved
down further south, that's when the opportunity would be to create something.
And that's where Flourish Mama has kind of come from. Yeah.
Yeah, which is create like, so I do outdoor fitness and personal training.
(21:17):
And online stuff as well for mums
and women yeah they don't have to be mums to
work with me yeah but it was about creating a space
that's for women that is about
showing up as you are on the day doesn't matter if
you've got you know what you look like doesn't matter if
you haven't three hours sleep yeah it doesn't matter
(21:39):
if you show up late because you've got a hundred thousand things to do
in the morning just to get there you know like yeah
you know on your shirt i had one mom the other day who's
like i've got vomit all over my shirt i shampoo yeah
so i was like how can we create these spaces for mom to share their stories
to be themselves learn about a different way of exercising that isn't about
(22:04):
just smashing yourself till you die yeah and doing it in a safe and fun way.
So that's what I've created in Kiama.
Yeah, and so that's where my passion lies. So cool because, like,
I'll see, like, you know, little things that you post and stuff.
Like, it's so great, guys. So if anyone's local and they're,
(22:25):
The thing I love about it is that you can take your kids. What?
That's actually, I wish that I had known you when I had the two because like
first baby was a bit of a breeze. I reckon I had it so easy.
Yeah. And it was like the second one was just a walking nightmare.
(22:46):
And I would have loved to have had something like what you have in Flourish
Mama around because I think it's so important,
like you said like movement yes but also mental
health yeah like because I look back
on like my second baby and for sure I had postnatal depression
yeah like and that was even just because I couldn't I didn't leave the house
(23:07):
you know I would have but it was actually nothing for me to take my kids to
yeah but then I love that what you do when you have kids in like you know when
you work out your little like obstacles and things you said is even you're also then.
Modeling as a mom and the importance
of like what you were saying you learned as a kid like sport
(23:30):
and physical like fitness to then your
kids so I love seeing the little snippets where it's like
the mom doing it and then the one
or two year old doing it too or even like
ones where you had like her using the baby as
a way yeah yeah very safe it was safe it
was safely being news doesn't wait I just need to make sure
(23:50):
I say that on the podcast but like but that's
like everyday things like yeah day hacks
yes and make sure if you're like
local but even if you're not local jump on and follow what is your instagram
flourish mama m-a-m-a underscore yeah and become so educational like so you
(24:13):
don't have to only be a member like attending for her to share stuff I I love.
And that was one of the reasons I wanted to get you on because I think you're so great at just...
Like providing knowledge that sounds dumb but
like sharing your knowledge that's better
sharing your knowledge with like others
(24:33):
because you genuinely want people to see the benefit
of it yeah I think that's the
thing with the fitness
industry has done such a disservice
to women as a whole there's just
so much wrapped up in what we
would think of fitness and exercise exercise initially yeah and
(24:55):
you know this this space
that i aim for flourish to mama
to be is that space that we can look at
movement and exercise in a whole different way and
in a way that as i said with my story.
My the exercise and movement started to
(25:16):
become really important to me in supporting my
mental health yeah and so that is
a lens through which apart from obviously all the
other physical benefits of exercise and how I really believe
that it can support us through our mothering and how
it can how we can help demonstrate that to our kids and
all of those things so I don't come
(25:38):
at it from the typical fitness industry base
because I don't believe that yeah but don't
believe that that's helpful but it's really refreshing that there's
another perspective I think that you know I
think that's really important it's you know fitness and movement and even mental
health there's there's so many ways that and like once again that's why I wanted
(26:02):
to get you on because I think it's such a great expression of looking after
yourself like as a homemaker,
yeah, whether you've got kids or not, even like only this year,
like in another episode,
I'm like with you, I'm going to like share a couple of like things from myself
that kind of like was kind of scary at the time but kind of shook me up a bit
(26:27):
that I'm terrible at looking after myself because I'm so busy.
And I don't say that in a bad way because that's just the reality of our season of life as well.
I'm not saying that like a pity party, but like the reality of life is we have
so many responsibilities when you're like a mom, like building your home.
(26:50):
But even I look back when I didn't even have kids and I was like,
you know, that unconventional homemaker, like I would be honest and real enough
to say that I still don't think I was looking after myself back then.
And even in fitness, I was just kind of, you know, reactionary. Yeah.
Not just genuinely going for a walk or, you know, just to get out,
(27:13):
but also, like you say, like move your body. Yeah.
But now I've even found movement and things like that are really great,
like common thing that my husband and I have in common, which I never used to
because he's really big in the sports, whereas I'm quite uncoordinated.
I can do stuff. I'm more of like I'm so not competitive like in sport.
(27:38):
So I would be the worst person to be on your team because I would be like,
we've all had a great time.
Don't have bags yes I hear you yeah
I'm like so bad but all like quite a lot of my kids are quite competitive and
they're happy for me do you think that we struggle with taking care of ourselves
(28:00):
in regards to a it's not even framed anymore that we take care of ourselves
just because we're human,
yeah totally not even when it suggested that we should move our bodies it's.
Exercise so that you can look after
your kids better or so that you can do this more or so
(28:22):
that you can be better you know rather than I'm a
human and my body likes to move and I'm worth taking time to move my body and
it makes me feel better yeah for no other reason selfish yeah you know and it's
like a false humility I think is a card that I definitely have played I don't
(28:44):
have time to look after myself.
And it is hard, you know, it is hard, especially to begin with.
To create space and boundaries around these and
believe that it's okay for us to either you
know invest money to go to the gym or
to find a coach or whatever or to invest time 10 minutes in your lounge room
(29:06):
or to you know if you're someone like I was before I had kids like I'm never
using tv and then I realized shivers
I don't have like I need to do my exercise I'm going she's going in
front of the TV for 20 minutes and I'm going to exercise.
And the benefit of that to me is much more than the harm from the TV for 20 minutes.
(29:31):
Yeah, thanks. Thanks, Bear in the Big Blue House. Yeah. It's educational.
And I had this conversation with my seven-year-old. What would you say is a hack then?
Like practically, because I think all those points you just shared were so good.
So if you're someone listening to this podcast and they're like,
(29:51):
okay, I can't afford to go to
the gym at the moment because I think it's a reality for a lot of people.
I'm very blessed that I can afford that.
But what would be a practical hack or even where do I start then, Renee?
I have a baby at home. I can't afford to sign up for a gym and I actually wouldn't
(30:15):
have time to even go to the gym because I've got a baby or maybe even I'm working
full-time, I don't even have kids.
Yeah. Like what would you say is an easy, practical way to start?
Because I think that's often the hardest. Yeah. Like just do it.
And I think sometimes the story we tell about what it has to look like is enough
(30:36):
to stop us from doing anything.
Yeah, that's good. And so if we break down what we've kind of been told our entire life,
right, so if I would imagine that most of us used to or currently consider exercise
as having to be 45 minutes to an hour, it has to be hard and fast and strong,
(31:00):
and you need to be a sweaty mess afterwards.
Hot mess. So that doesn't sound like it's fun,
and it doesn't sound appealing to fit
into your already busy schedule agreed you
know especially at the beginning so yes with
exercise there is a part that can be uncomfortable right yeah some people don't
(31:23):
like doing squats and getting sweaty yeah so there is a bit that we need to
tolerate in order to just do the thing anyway yeah but we can change the story
in that okay so I don't have have 45 minutes?
Do I have 10 minutes? Can I choose three exercises and do them three times through in the lounge room?
(31:46):
I don't have any equipment, cool, let's slow that movement down and make it
harder because you're going slower.
Can you have bands which cost like $10 at Kmart?
Yeah. Or can you use your baby or hands or milk bottles or any books.
In a backpack? Yeah. Have any resistance? If you're just starting out,
(32:11):
you don't need any resistance.
We just want to build the habit. bit so that could even you know to even take
it right back I'm gonna do 10 squats today yeah,
like that's it and then we go okay cool we've done that we can do that I'm gonna
do 10 squats every day for the next seven days so it's like simplifying it totally
(32:32):
take it all the way back yeah and you know when when you think cool I'm going
on a health kick I'm gonna overhaul all my
food all my movement we're going to sleep like an angel and then you do it for
a week and you just go far out I didn't have time before I feel I live this
(32:53):
so it is about it literally is about.
Building those small parts into our day where
we get used to it and we go all right so
for as I said if if it's 10 squats
for example that then you go
oh I can do 10 squats yeah so then you think okay can I add another exercise
(33:16):
onto that you build your self-belief that you can include it into your day that's
cool yeah yeah and then other ways that I've done I've had baby sitting in their
high chair with all the snacks.
Yes, a queen. Yeah, yeah. Put a video on YouTube and then just follow along.
(33:37):
Then if they need something, you just pause it or you allow yourself,
You give yourself the permission to do five minutes and to be able to stop if you need to.
It only has to be five minutes to start. That's good.
We just need to start somewhere because I think the stories we tell ourselves
can really, and that we've been, you know, it's not our fault that we carry
(33:58):
most of the stories that we do.
No. Especially around fitness. Yeah, probably not.
But, yeah, if we can question it and bring it right back to the start,
Like if you're not going to do a 45-minute session a week.
Yeah. Like that's, you're better off doing little ones. Yeah, that's cool.
(34:19):
Oh, I love it. Oh, well, thank you, Renee. I feel like you've given us some
great practical tips and hacks for how to move our body.
But also if anyone interested is
keen to go and join the amazing
Flourish Mama classes you can jump on
(34:39):
her Instagram also you have a website I'm assuming flourishmama.com.au yeah
and then you also subscribe because you send out like a blog yeah yeah I love
to write yeah that's really great I love seeing it pop up in my emails oh that's
good I'm glad yeah so jump I'm on the email list.
(35:00):
I have a few online programs. One of them is called Spark, which is about taking
time for yourself and it's got like four weeks' worth of exercises, so three days a week.
So if you're looking for somewhere where you can just start something,
then that might be interesting.
(35:20):
But otherwise, even just DM me. I'm more than happy to chat.
Yes, she's such a good chatter. Such a good chatter.
Yes. All right. Thank you.
Music.
Music.
(00:09):
Okay all right beautiful ren what is your nickname what do people call you for
a nickname oh i have a few renee is obviously that's actually my name friend,
this is off to a great start i love it you're awesome all right nickname let's
(00:36):
go No, Ren. Does someone? Ren Tizzle.
Ren Tizzle is one of them. Wow. Reno is another one. Oh.
There's an old friend and he randomly calls me Cogsy.
So I have a few. That's so cute. But I never had any growing up. Oh, really?
(00:59):
No, it wasn't until I met my now husband that I met people around him and ta-da, I have a nickname.
Far out I had so many grown up like obviously Mel was the most common one and
in high school I was called Melon Melon I don't remember where it came from.
(01:21):
But I was Melon did you answer to it I did answer to it but I'm one of those
people that if someone called me so my full name is Melanie yeah but most people
would only ever know me as Mel like I don't ever call myself Melanie but if
someone called me Melissa I'd answer to it,
(01:42):
someone called me Melody I'd answer to it Melinda anything
with Mel I'll answer to it I don't want I don't like correcting yeah I wouldn't
like that awkwardness you know when someone calls you the wrong name totally
you can call me Amanda and I'll be like okay I had a conversation with my husband
than the other day and I was like,
(02:02):
I keep calling this guy this name and I'm actually not 100% sure that that's his name.
I'm like, I've said it so many times, they're never going to correct me.
You can't go back now. Yeah, you can't. You can't even ask.
It's too awkward to even bring it up and find out you have been wrong.
I know, just get with it. You will be Gary from now on.
(02:24):
Yeah, that's it. All right, well, beautiful Renee, or I'm going to call you
Lemon I mean, because it actually reminds me of like an 80s computer game. Yeah.
No, I'll call you Ren. I wanted you to come on this amazing podcast because
(02:45):
I think you are super inspirational and I love your passion and your heart for
all things, physical movement,
health, all sorts of things like that.
I've known you, I feel like I met you on Instagram.
Yeah, probably. probably I think we did I think you might have come to play
(03:05):
group a couple of times after that yes where we like met in person I feel like
it was like I follow you on Instagram,
I know we have a few of those I have a few of those conversations and you're
like I feel like I really know you but I've never seen you in real person I've
had a lot of those conversations too with people I haven't met yet but I'm sure
(03:27):
I will in the future which I love that actually about Yeah, it's so true.
But yeah, so we met through that and then I've always like been really jealous
because I've always wanted to come to one of your classes and it just never lines up with my life.
So I just like follow along to all your online things that you do instead.
But do you want to tell the crowd of people that are listening to this podcast?
(03:52):
Yeah. Your name and maybe we'll go right back to the start. Where you grew up
because I actually don't even know that.
So, I'm Renee. I grew up in a town called Mossvale in the Southern Highlands.
It was quite small and not as, like, fancy as it is now.
Yes, it's quite fancy now. Very fancy now.
(04:16):
Yep. So, I grew up with my mum and dad and my brother,
and I went to a very small school, and mum and dad were always really supportive
of us getting into sport and running us around to our sport from a pretty young age. Yeah.
They were sport people before they had kids.
(04:38):
So that was really important to them, which was good.
I was a netballer forever. I did netballers. Yeah.
My knees hate netball too.
They're a breed where I grew up though. I feel like you don't fit the breed,
so it's okay. I'm not sure what that is. What's the breed? It's not very nice.
(05:01):
I hope I don't fit that breed. Continue on, continue on. So then,
yeah, so I kind of had a, I would say a normal childhood, I guess.
Yeah. yeah moved through in my
hsc got that was kind
of the year when i can remember getting involved in like a gym for the first
(05:22):
time yeah and using movement to help relieve stress so my parents bought me
a gym membership and i went to the gym and it really helped in,
yeah just supporting me through that period yeah of
course at that time it was like you go in on
(05:42):
the treadmill you sit on the bike you find
a little corner hiding it to do your ab but never went into the weights room
because it was I was like 17 at the time it was very overwhelming and it really
wasn't a time then when you would do any sort of resistance kind of training
you You weren't welcome in that kind of space. Yeah. Yeah.
(06:04):
So then I studied sports management and moved to Canberra for a little while, which was freezing.
So cold. Oh, man. Hello to all the Canberra people. Yeah. It's amazing.
It's like literally living in like Finland or something. Like I see sometimes
them post things. It's like great day today and it's like minus two.
(06:27):
I'm such a winder in the cold. I couldn't do it. Yeah, so am I.
And I've just always been like a coast person.
Yeah. And so even growing up not near the coast, I never thought that I would
live away from the coast.
So my first, when I first moved, it was down to a coastal town.
So, well, when I moved back from Canberra from studying, I basically had a year
(06:52):
or two and then moved straight to the coast. So I was like, I need the warmth.
I totally get it. I grew up like in Sydney, like around eastern beaches.
And so I moved from there and
then when my husband and I were dating and also
I just needed a sea chains because I'd grown up in
Sydney my whole life I was not sheltered you're not
(07:12):
sheltered in Sydney but like in a way I was
like to just city life and so I remember I just picked up and moved one day
to Narromine which is like a little town west of Dubbo wow real west yeah like
no ocean Like the closest thing to water to go swimming in is the Macquarie River,
(07:34):
which is so cold. Yeah.
But I loved it too. Like I still even love the country, like going back to visit.
I don't miss the lack of places to go at night and go out of your house.
But I still like, yeah, we still have lots of amazing, beautiful connections
(07:56):
with country. But it's fun to come back, isn't it? Yeah.
Yeah. it's definitely the ocean is definitely
my like calming happy place
yeah and I feel like I look at
it and it both reminds me that I'm small
in comparison to the world which is a really good feeling
(08:17):
although it sounds scary and it's not
that it's telling me that I'm not important it's just
telling me that there's like a whole world
and that you know and also that
the ocean has so many different sides to
it like on a beautiful sunny day it
can look sparkly and on another day it
(08:39):
can be like awful looking and big and grumbling and but all of that is okay
yeah yeah and so all and it kind of just reminds me like all of who I am is
okay because that you know there's just different elements of who we are and
on different days they come out and that is totally fine you you know?
(08:59):
So it's, yeah, that's why I just love the ocean. So off the back of that, I'm going to use that.
Off the back of that, you have this amazing business.
Yeah. It's funny calling it even
a business, but it obviously it is like a business called Flourish Mama.
So how did that come about for you? Like what season of your life were you in
(09:23):
maybe prior to that? Yeah.
And what What made you want to start that? And then just give us a bit of a
lowdown about what it is. I know, so I'm totally biased.
Yeah, so it's a long story. I'll try and tell it a bit quickly.
Yeah. So when I finished studying, got into my, like, working career,
(09:46):
went into my typical, like, people-pleasing perfectionism,
them like working really hard
wanting to be good at everything so I
worked really hard found like
my husband which was amazing which was like the
he is such a special man like I can't say how much he's been you know just there
(10:14):
he's amazing but then I found at a point when I was like okay so So I'm in my
corporate career, I'm working really hard.
I got married and then I was like, oh, how about I just add another degree?
So I'm working full time.
I want to, now I want to be again at uni.
And I was commuting at like halfway through that. I started commuting to Sydney
(10:38):
for like the work, two hours each way.
And there was a few things that had happened a year or two prior that I hadn't
dealt with emotionally.
Emotionally and so there it
all kind of culminated in a complete
like anxious I call it a breakdown because it literally broke me down to every
(11:01):
like the last part of who I was so how many years had you been married three
oh oh I don't know what this is guys I'm sorry yeah and who knows how to get rid of it.
A like thumb just came up on the screen in case you're wondering why we're laughing. Okay, so three.
Yeah, please watch the video and you'll see why we're laughing because Zoom
(11:22):
just gave us a thumbs up in the middle of her saying three, like as if it was going to be incorrect.
So three years you've been married, that's a lot. You didn't have any kids then?
No kids. Thank goodness. I often think, man, I'm so, this is a strange thing
to say, but I'm glad that I had that before I had children.
(11:43):
Oh, that's what I was asking. Yeah, that's what I was asking because that's
a whole another dynamic to jump in. Totally, yeah.
And you've got to jump in yourself but then you're also responsible for other
humans. You've got to like dive.
Yeah, exactly. And so what it did give me was the ability to really understand.
So it went, I don't even know really how long it went for,
(12:06):
like it was months and it was slowly coming on and it wasn't until like I was
getting these random thoughts in my head and I was like, I don't even know,
this doesn't sound like me, I don't know what it is. Yeah.
And I was crying and didn't want to go out and it wasn't until I was brave enough
(12:26):
to tell someone and that was my husband. Yeah. Bitch.
It's horrible to hold it all inside, to be like, what is wrong with me?
I don't feel like myself. I don't know what's happening.
I can't function like a human.
And so when I finally was able to just be like, I need to get this out of my
(12:47):
body, like tell someone about it. You're brave.
Yeah. And it is brave. Like anyone that's dealt with mental health stuff,
you're just like, how is this person going to hear this? Yeah. You know?
And so he, as I said, he's amazing.
He listened to everything. He didn't flinch. He was just like,
(13:10):
I'm here. I know who you are.
Like, I know who you are. And so I remember.
So he validated that how you felt wasn't who you were? Is that?
Yeah, because there was a bit in there about like, yeah, it's kind of.
Because you would have thought, what is wrong with me?
Yeah. Yeah, it was a complete unduly. That there's something not right.
(13:34):
So what you're feeling is right, but it doesn't mean that that's who you are. Yeah.
Yeah, that's cool. Yeah. And so we were like, all right, what help do we get
from here? How do, what's the plan?
And I remember, this is very specific, but people might resonate with this,
at that moment of just being in the shower and being like
(13:56):
sobbing and thinking where what
happens now like I don't know who I am I don't know what my what thoughts are
accurate what is not what what do I do and I just remember hearing this voice
that just said like we just rebuild from here one step at a time and I'm like
all right which you know within months
(14:17):
of work so went to the physio didn't go to the physio okay whole picture,
went to the psychologist.
Went to a psychologist and she really gave me tools to.
Was it hard to get, because I think there is like stigma, even still today,
(14:39):
I think, about that initial appointment.
Yeah, I was. Psychologist. Like, was that hard?
Like, number one, practically, was it hard to get into one? Then it wasn't as hard as it is now. Yeah.
But it was like, I thought, what am I going to go and tell this person?
Yeah like what do you actually say like
(15:01):
what I'm dealing with like I don't have any reference I've
never dealt with this before yeah I think I'm going
a bit crazy yeah like how do
I tell this to somebody yeah and I
just thought I kept just thinking I just
need it not to be in the dark parts and inside of
me like I'm not dealing with it inside of
(15:23):
me it's not helping so it needs to be out of my body yeah and
I really do believe that like when we shine a
light on these dark places they're not
as hard to handle yeah they can go back to the dark once the shine like you
shine exactly on a light on it once it comes it has to kind of be dealt with
yeah yeah and so I just I saw her for ages I remember saying at one point I
(15:47):
can't imagine not ever feeling like this It's, you know,
I just don't, are you sure that I'm going to be okay?
Yeah, this isn't it for me forever. Yeah, yeah.
Yeah. And so all of that, yeah, that's right. I'm like, okay,
this is just where I am now.
(16:08):
So all of that to say that was kind of, when I look back on my life,
there's like a few stakes in the ground where I can be, you know,
that, oh, that is why I'm where I am right now.
There's lots that I think shivers. That would be good if I didn't experience
that. Can't see why I experienced that.
That was fine to be a bit traumatic. Yeah.
(16:29):
And I haven't figured those ones out yet. But this one is. And I feel like sometimes
we actually don't. Oh, totally.
And I think you get stuck in trying to figure too much stuff out, I think.
Yeah, absolutely. Sometimes you will never know, I don't think,
why you went through sometimes things you did.
They definitely probably sucked, like, to have to have gone through it.
Like, you can be positive, like, oh, everything's positive, but sometimes you actually can't.
(16:55):
It's like it was actually awful.
Yeah, and there was no reason for it and you didn't deserve it.
And you've learned like you yeah you kind
of haven't learned from it because it's not something you learn from you just endure
like yeah yeah yeah valid yeah
so all of that I think to
say that is the time when I realized that movement was
(17:17):
one of the biggest tools in helping support my mental health yeah
so aside from the support
that I had from obviously my husband and my family and
my friends all of those things in
in sharing my what I was going
through with those that support network was also quite hard
and sometimes people didn't understand the depth of it and that could be really
(17:41):
frustrating yeah but then years later something they'll experience something
and they're like oh I will talk to this person because she knows what I'm going
through yeah and so yeah Yeah, aside from,
like, my network that supported me and music and,
you know, the tools that the psychologist gave me, movement was the biggest
(18:03):
one that I knew that I could control in a certain way.
Yeah. And so through that period, I think being the achieving type was like,
maybe because I'm doing so much research about movement, I should do a personal
training course to understand more about movement with the idea that I would
(18:26):
stay in corporate and I would never use it. It was just to be there, right?
Like an outlet, yeah. Yeah, just an interest.
And so that's what – Oh, wrong you were, friend. Yeah, that's right.
Oh, dear. And so that's kind of what moved me into personal training and then
(18:46):
I happened to fall pregnant to do my prac and realised that I hadn't actually
learnt much about exercise in pregnancy and postpartum.
So anything through that perinatal period was.
You're not taught. And I was just like, I've just studied this and I don't know.
I actually still think it's really hard to find.
(19:07):
Yeah. Yeah. And thankfully in the places that I kind of hang out online and
the mentors that I have, I feel like it's getting heaps better. Heaps better.
But. There was nothing around my first kid and that was 14 years ago.
Yeah. No, there wouldn't have
been. But compared to now, it's definitely like a lot more accessible.
(19:29):
Yeah. Yeah. or even just research but
yeah there was nothing it was kind of like you have a baby you don't
you don't work out yeah yeah exactly that was the kind of mentality like because
it could be dangerous to the baby yes yeah like and that's the thing like I
still have people who who they they fall pregnant they're like can I still exercise
(19:51):
and I'm just like even if you have fallen pregnant and you
have never exercised they now recommend to start because it's so helpful obviously
that's you know if you cleared for from a doctor and all of those sort of things
yeah if there's other underlying yeah yeah but generally like movement is so
helpful across the span of a woman's life.
(20:12):
From my point of view I thought well I'm pregnant and I'm
not sure how to move my body in this pregnant
body and then postpartum I
was just like I had bits of information that I thought I
needed to consider but I didn't know how
it all fit together so really straight away I kind of specialized in pre and
(20:33):
postnatal movement and did more certifications around that just so that I could
train my body first and not do
any damage and feel confident in like rebuilding from where I was yeah um.
And that kind of, so then my passion was, that was around when my eldest, she's seven, was born.
(20:53):
And from there, I worked at a gym for six years.
And then I thought, oh, when I move, for some reason, I always knew when I moved
down further south, that's when the opportunity would be to create something.
And that's where Flourish Mama has kind of come from. Yeah.
Yeah, which is create like, so I do outdoor fitness and personal training.
(21:17):
And online stuff as well for mums
and women yeah they don't have to be mums to
work with me yeah but it was about creating a space
that's for women that is about
showing up as you are on the day doesn't matter if
you've got you know what you look like doesn't matter if
you haven't three hours sleep yeah it doesn't matter
(21:39):
if you show up late because you've got a hundred thousand things to do
in the morning just to get there you know like yeah
you know on your shirt i had one mom the other day who's
like i've got vomit all over my shirt i shampoo yeah
so i was like how can we create these spaces for mom to share their stories
to be themselves learn about a different way of exercising that isn't about
(22:04):
just smashing yourself till you die yeah and doing it in a safe and fun way.
So that's what I've created in Kiama.
Yeah, and so that's where my passion lies. So cool because, like,
I'll see, like, you know, little things that you post and stuff.
Like, it's so great, guys. So if anyone's local and they're,
(22:25):
The thing I love about it is that you can take your kids. What?
That's actually, I wish that I had known you when I had the two because like
first baby was a bit of a breeze. I reckon I had it so easy.
Yeah. And it was like the second one was just a walking nightmare.
(22:46):
And I would have loved to have had something like what you have in Flourish
Mama around because I think it's so important,
like you said like movement yes but also mental
health yeah like because I look back
on like my second baby and for sure I had postnatal depression
yeah like and that was even just because I couldn't I didn't leave the house
(23:07):
you know I would have but it was actually nothing for me to take my kids to
yeah but then I love that what you do when you have kids in like you know when
you work out your little like obstacles and things you said is even you're also then.
Modeling as a mom and the importance
of like what you were saying you learned as a kid like sport
(23:30):
and physical like fitness to then your
kids so I love seeing the little snippets where it's like
the mom doing it and then the one
or two year old doing it too or even like
ones where you had like her using the baby as
a way yeah yeah very safe it was safe it
was safely being news doesn't wait I just need to make sure
(23:50):
I say that on the podcast but like but that's
like everyday things like yeah day hacks
yes and make sure if you're like
local but even if you're not local jump on and follow what is your instagram
flourish mama m-a-m-a underscore yeah and become so educational like so you
(24:13):
don't have to only be a member like attending for her to share stuff I I love.
And that was one of the reasons I wanted to get you on because I think you're so great at just...
Like providing knowledge that sounds dumb but
like sharing your knowledge that's better
sharing your knowledge with like others
(24:33):
because you genuinely want people to see the benefit
of it yeah I think that's the
thing with the fitness
industry has done such a disservice
to women as a whole there's just
so much wrapped up in what we
would think of fitness and exercise exercise initially yeah and
(24:55):
you know this this space
that i aim for flourish to mama
to be is that space that we can look at
movement and exercise in a whole different way and
in a way that as i said with my story.
My the exercise and movement started to
(25:16):
become really important to me in supporting my
mental health yeah and so that is
a lens through which apart from obviously all the
other physical benefits of exercise and how I really believe
that it can support us through our mothering and how
it can how we can help demonstrate that to our kids and
all of those things so I don't come
(25:38):
at it from the typical fitness industry base
because I don't believe that yeah but don't
believe that that's helpful but it's really refreshing that there's
another perspective I think that you know I
think that's really important it's you know fitness and movement and even mental
health there's there's so many ways that and like once again that's why I wanted
(26:02):
to get you on because I think it's such a great expression of looking after
yourself like as a homemaker,
yeah, whether you've got kids or not, even like only this year,
like in another episode,
I'm like with you, I'm going to like share a couple of like things from myself
that kind of like was kind of scary at the time but kind of shook me up a bit
(26:27):
that I'm terrible at looking after myself because I'm so busy.
And I don't say that in a bad way because that's just the reality of our season of life as well.
I'm not saying that like a pity party, but like the reality of life is we have
so many responsibilities when you're like a mom, like building your home.
(26:50):
But even I look back when I didn't even have kids and I was like,
you know, that unconventional homemaker, like I would be honest and real enough
to say that I still don't think I was looking after myself back then.
And even in fitness, I was just kind of, you know, reactionary. Yeah.
Not just genuinely going for a walk or, you know, just to get out,
(27:13):
but also, like you say, like move your body. Yeah.
But now I've even found movement and things like that are really great,
like common thing that my husband and I have in common, which I never used to
because he's really big in the sports, whereas I'm quite uncoordinated.
I can do stuff. I'm more of like I'm so not competitive like in sport.
(27:38):
So I would be the worst person to be on your team because I would be like,
we've all had a great time.
Don't have bags yes I hear you yeah
I'm like so bad but all like quite a lot of my kids are quite competitive and
they're happy for me do you think that we struggle with taking care of ourselves
(28:00):
in regards to a it's not even framed anymore that we take care of ourselves
just because we're human,
yeah totally not even when it suggested that we should move our bodies it's.
Exercise so that you can look after
your kids better or so that you can do this more or so
(28:22):
that you can be better you know rather than I'm a
human and my body likes to move and I'm worth taking time to move my body and
it makes me feel better yeah for no other reason selfish yeah you know and it's
like a false humility I think is a card that I definitely have played I don't
(28:44):
have time to look after myself.
And it is hard, you know, it is hard, especially to begin with.
To create space and boundaries around these and
believe that it's okay for us to either you
know invest money to go to the gym or
to find a coach or whatever or to invest time 10 minutes in your lounge room
(29:06):
or to you know if you're someone like I was before I had kids like I'm never
using tv and then I realized shivers
I don't have like I need to do my exercise I'm going she's going in
front of the TV for 20 minutes and I'm going to exercise.
And the benefit of that to me is much more than the harm from the TV for 20 minutes.
(29:31):
Yeah, thanks. Thanks, Bear in the Big Blue House. Yeah. It's educational.
And I had this conversation with my seven-year-old. What would you say is a hack then?
Like practically, because I think all those points you just shared were so good.
So if you're someone listening to this podcast and they're like,
(29:51):
okay, I can't afford to go to
the gym at the moment because I think it's a reality for a lot of people.
I'm very blessed that I can afford that.
But what would be a practical hack or even where do I start then, Renee?
I have a baby at home. I can't afford to sign up for a gym and I actually wouldn't
(30:15):
have time to even go to the gym because I've got a baby or maybe even I'm working
full-time, I don't even have kids.
Yeah. Like what would you say is an easy, practical way to start?
Because I think that's often the hardest. Yeah. Like just do it.
And I think sometimes the story we tell about what it has to look like is enough
(30:36):
to stop us from doing anything.
Yeah, that's good. And so if we break down what we've kind of been told our entire life,
right, so if I would imagine that most of us used to or currently consider exercise
as having to be 45 minutes to an hour, it has to be hard and fast and strong,
(31:00):
and you need to be a sweaty mess afterwards.
Hot mess. So that doesn't sound like it's fun,
and it doesn't sound appealing to fit
into your already busy schedule agreed you
know especially at the beginning so yes with
exercise there is a part that can be uncomfortable right yeah some people don't
(31:23):
like doing squats and getting sweaty yeah so there is a bit that we need to
tolerate in order to just do the thing anyway yeah but we can change the story
in that okay so I don't have have 45 minutes?
Do I have 10 minutes? Can I choose three exercises and do them three times through in the lounge room?
(31:46):
I don't have any equipment, cool, let's slow that movement down and make it
harder because you're going slower.
Can you have bands which cost like $10 at Kmart?
Yeah. Or can you use your baby or hands or milk bottles or any books.
In a backpack? Yeah. Have any resistance? If you're just starting out,
(32:11):
you don't need any resistance.
We just want to build the habit. bit so that could even you know to even take
it right back I'm gonna do 10 squats today yeah,
like that's it and then we go okay cool we've done that we can do that I'm gonna
do 10 squats every day for the next seven days so it's like simplifying it totally
(32:32):
take it all the way back yeah and you know when when you think cool I'm going
on a health kick I'm gonna overhaul all my
food all my movement we're going to sleep like an angel and then you do it for
a week and you just go far out I didn't have time before I feel I live this
(32:53):
so it is about it literally is about.
Building those small parts into our day where
we get used to it and we go all right so
for as I said if if it's 10 squats
for example that then you go
oh I can do 10 squats yeah so then you think okay can I add another exercise
(33:16):
onto that you build your self-belief that you can include it into your day that's
cool yeah yeah and then other ways that I've done I've had baby sitting in their
high chair with all the snacks.
Yes, a queen. Yeah, yeah. Put a video on YouTube and then just follow along.
(33:37):
Then if they need something, you just pause it or you allow yourself,
You give yourself the permission to do five minutes and to be able to stop if you need to.
It only has to be five minutes to start. That's good.
We just need to start somewhere because I think the stories we tell ourselves
can really, and that we've been, you know, it's not our fault that we carry
(33:58):
most of the stories that we do.
No. Especially around fitness. Yeah, probably not.
But, yeah, if we can question it and bring it right back to the start,
Like if you're not going to do a 45-minute session a week.
Yeah. Like that's, you're better off doing little ones. Yeah, that's cool.
(34:19):
Oh, I love it. Oh, well, thank you, Renee. I feel like you've given us some
great practical tips and hacks for how to move our body.
But also if anyone interested is
keen to go and join the amazing
Flourish Mama classes you can jump on
(34:39):
her Instagram also you have a website I'm assuming flourishmama.com.au yeah
and then you also subscribe because you send out like a blog yeah yeah I love
to write yeah that's really great I love seeing it pop up in my emails oh that's
good I'm glad yeah so jump I'm on the email list.
(35:00):
I have a few online programs. One of them is called Spark, which is about taking
time for yourself and it's got like four weeks' worth of exercises, so three days a week.
So if you're looking for somewhere where you can just start something,
then that might be interesting.
(35:20):
But otherwise, even just DM me. I'm more than happy to chat.
Yes, she's such a good chatter. Such a good chatter.
Yes. All right. Thank you.
Music.
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