Bengals Booth Podcast: Stuck Like Glue

Dan Hoard and Dave Lapham discuss Cincinnati reaching long-term contract extensions with Ja’Marr Chase and Tee Higgins. Then Dan visits with a Bengals newcomer who has played in the last two Super Bowls – linebacker and special teams ace Oren Burks.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hi, get everybody on Dan Hoard and thanks for downloading
The Bengals Booth Podcast. The Oh Oh's the Clue. Addition,
as the Bengals reached long term contract extensions with Jamar
Chase and t Higgins coming up, we'll hear from the
NFL's best receiving duo. Then Dave Lappham joins me to

(00:24):
discuss that news and answer your ask Lap questions. After that,
it's my conversation with a newcomer who has played in
the last two Super Bowls, linebacker Orren Burks. The Bengals
Booth Podcast is brought to you by pay Corp. Proud
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(00:47):
and community to a new level, and by Kettering Health
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by subscribing wherever you get your podcasts. It's the greatest

(01:09):
thing since John Gruden Opening Boxes. The former NFL coach
is working as a content creator for Barstool Sports these days,
and in recent weeks, he's been posting videos that show
him opening boxes of swag that he's been getting in
the mail from college and pro teams. Now that in
and of itself doesn't sound that compelling, but Gruden turns

(01:33):
each box opening into a little history lesson as he
rattles off the names of his favorite players and coaches
from each team and often shares personal anecdotes. For example,
when John got a box of gear from the University
of Indiana football team, we learned how he used to
be a ball boy for Bobby Knight when his dad

(01:53):
coached the running backs there. I am under the impression
that Coach Gruden could be ripping open a Bengal box
sometime soon, and if so, it'll be fun to hear
him riff on some of his all time favorite Bengals. Now,
let's get to Jamar and T. When the Bengals franchise
tag T Higgins. Prior to last season, I'll admit that

(02:16):
I thought it would be his final year in the
Bengals uniform, and that remained my opinion for the first
three months of the season, but that changed on Monday
Night December ninth, after the Bengals beat the Cowboys on
Monday Night Football. That was the only game all year
where the Bengals really got lucky, as a Cowboys blunder
and a block punt set up a game winning Burrow

(02:38):
to Chase touchdown pass with sixty one seconds to go.
Prior to that game, Burrow, Chase, and Higgins walked out
together for the coin toss for the first time ever,
and after the game, Burrow was asked about savoring moments
like that, with the implication being that Tea would not
be his teammate much longer.

Speaker 2 (03:00):
You know, those discussions are ongoing, and I'm confident that
I think we're going to be able to do what
it takes to bring Tea back. You know, I know
that I'm going to do what it takes to get
him back, and so is he. We've had those talks,
so you know, those are those are going to be
off season discussions. But I think we're excited about that opportunity.

Speaker 1 (03:20):
I can tell you that the reporters in that room,
myself included, we're saying, did Joe really just say what
I think he said? I think most of us always
assume that the Bengals would find a way to keep
Jamar Chase, but that seemingly out of nowhere comment from
Joe about t changed the narrative about the possibility of

(03:41):
reaching a long term extension with both.

Speaker 3 (03:44):
A few days.

Speaker 1 (03:45):
Later, Burrow made the case for keeping Tea.

Speaker 3 (03:49):
It's very important.

Speaker 2 (03:50):
I think you just look at Simon just his production,
it's his presence, It's Howry comes to work every day.
It's how the defenses have to play us when he's
out there. You know, he plays such a big part
in what we do here and has for for five
years now that I don't think you can quite put

(04:13):
a value on that.

Speaker 4 (04:14):
I would say, if the final office has been able
to make that work, would you be disappointed in him?

Speaker 3 (04:21):
I'd be very disappointed in that.

Speaker 2 (04:22):
Yet, we'll see after the season and talk have those
discussions about, you know, what we feel needs to happen
and the things everybody has to do to to do
what we want, keep the guys around that we need
and bringing the guys that we to fill some holes
that we need. So those discussions will will be had,
you know, at the end of the year.

Speaker 1 (04:43):
Need, Yes, nobody wants to win more than Joe Burrow.
He didn't advocate for keeping Jamar and Tea because there
is buddies or he wants to put up numbers. He
did it because he believes it's the best path to
winning a Super Bowl ring. It basically guarantees that the
Bengals going to be one of the top scoring teams
in the league. Now they have to build the defense

(05:06):
through the draft, player development, and shrewd free agent acquisitions.
Here are Tea and Jamar on the wisdom of trying
to build a Super Bowl champ by spending heavily on
two great wide receivers.

Speaker 3 (05:21):
We believe, That's all I can say. We believe we
can get it done.

Speaker 5 (05:24):
And I mean anybody that you know that has doubts,
we're gonna try to you know, you know, flip they
mind and believe in us just how just how we
believe in ourselves.

Speaker 6 (05:36):
I mean, honestly, that's the whole goal behind signing this
at the end of the day, you know, signing both
of us together, that's the whole goal for us to
push this team, push each other, you know, as far
as we could go. And you know that one goal
is to be the best in AFC. First that's going
to give us the easiest shots to get to the
super Bowl, and if we win that first, then we're
going to take the next step.

Speaker 1 (05:54):
Jamar got a four year, one hundred and sixty one
million dollar extension that's forty point two five Mili a
year and it kicks in after this season, so he's
actually under contract for five more years. T got a
four year, one hundred and fifteen million dollar deal that's
twenty eight point seven to five milli a year, And

(06:16):
while the Bengals have been criticized for not getting a
deal done with Te earlier by tagging him last year
and extending him this year, they do wind up having
him for an additional season. T is twenty six years old,
Jamar is twenty five, and they will be spending their
primes in Bengals stripes.

Speaker 3 (06:37):
Man.

Speaker 5 (06:37):
I grew up a Bengals fan, and to have the
opportunity to sign a four year deal with my favorite
team that I grew up watching is I mean, that's
a that's a dream come true, you know what I mean?
And then you know, once I guess the announcment was out.
My favorite player I grew up watching, Congratu laying and

(07:00):
congratulating me on that is it's even more crazy. So
I couldn't be at a better place for me.

Speaker 6 (07:08):
I like Cincinnati because it gives me the opportunity to
come here and focus. You know, I'm not distracted out here.
It's not too much too many things to get me,
you know, off pace out here, you know, and it's
strictly what I'm focused on. That's really tunnel vision for
me to play football. So I mean, at the end
of the day, the food's not the best. We could
work on that. But the Orleans I'm not used to

(07:31):
the food yet. But you know, overall, I mean, honestly,
I just I just think that's the biggest picture for me,
is that is, you know, I don't have no distractions
here and I can just play football in my quarterbacks
here here.

Speaker 1 (07:42):
If Jamar needs to run down on great Cincinnati restaurants,
I can take care of it. For more on Today's
news and to answer the questions you submitted on X,
it's time to bring in my broadcast partner, Dave Lapham.
I want to start with something simple that I think
is not being emphasized enough. Joe Burrow, Jamar Chase, and

(08:04):
t Higgins want to be here. Sure, they got paid,
but they like playing in Cincinnati. They believe they can
win a super Bowl here. These guys are telling everybody
around the NFL that, at least to them, Cincinnati is
a great place to play. How important is that message
in your opinion, I think.

Speaker 7 (08:25):
It's very important. You know, I do think that. You know,
individual performance is rewarded by money, but money does not
win championships. And these guys understand that it is a business.
So when you perform at the level that they perform,
the expectation is you're going to get compensated. And they

(08:46):
have been handsomely and the Bengals have realized that they
needed to do that. But the fact that they did
keep them all intact states that not only do you
expect to win a champion I mean or hope to
win a championship, the expectation is you're gonna win a championship.
I mean, they've been to the Super Bowl. It didn't

(09:08):
quite get it done, but they got a taste of it.
And we talked about this before, Dan, you know, I mean,
the money's great, the money will take care of their
families for generations. But the big reason they're playing the
football game is to win championships and to you know,
be part of maybe a record breaking trio. And they're

(09:32):
they're already already that in terms of Bengals history in
NFL history, but they that elusive ring is what they're
what they're looking for right now. And I agree with you.
I think that they feel like, you know, the city
of Cincinnati fits them, all three of them fits. Their
lifestyle fits the you know, the the big city distractions

(09:55):
and all that stuff is not what these guys are about.
They're about focusing going out and uh and getting the
job done and winning football games, I think. And they
really do like each other, you know. I mean it's
it's it sounds corny, and but not not only are
they do they like each other's performances on a football field,

(10:17):
they like each other as human beings off the football field.
And that that's that's powerful. That can be uh, that
can be a synergistic thing, you know, and what all
is said and done, And I know it sounds cornball,
but you know, you're looking for a legacy, and guys
play to win championships and maybe when they're done now

(10:41):
they can look back and say, ah, man, remember when
we signed those deals twenty five, twenty six, twenty seven, twenty.

Speaker 4 (10:46):
Eight, did we kick some tailor?

Speaker 1 (10:47):
What?

Speaker 4 (10:48):
Man?

Speaker 7 (10:48):
Did we get it done? Look what we did and
look what the team did. The individual stuff is great,
and again you're gonna get compstated based on that. But man,
the team, folks, winning that championship is what it's really
all about.

Speaker 1 (11:03):
Let's turn the clock back to December ninth, after the
Dallas game. That was the first time that Joe, Jamar
and T walked out together for the coin toss and
when Joe was asked about it after the game and
how it felt to, you know, savor a moment like that,
he made headlines by saying that he thought that they
would be able to retain Tea. He was confident that

(11:25):
T would be back, and then a few days later
he said that T was in need. Did that twenty
second comment after the Dallas game change everything?

Speaker 7 (11:37):
I think it was the beginning, I really do you know,
I mean, I think, uh put it out there, geez,
I wonder what Joe's thinking about this. Joe put it
out there. Joe left no doubt what Joe was thinking
about this. And when you look at it, that Trio
is is so much fun to watch, you know.

Speaker 4 (11:59):
I mean when you when you.

Speaker 7 (12:00):
Watch a a ballet that's the top of its top
of its profession and you look at those people performing,
it's like, oh my gosh, man, these there's they're the
best in the world. That's what these guys are. These
three guys are really the best in the world at
what they do. And they compment each other so well.
You know, T Higgins skill set Jamar Chase the skill

(12:24):
set is different. They're both different, but they're both equally effective.
And man, they feed off each other so perfectly.

Speaker 3 (12:33):
You know.

Speaker 7 (12:33):
It's like, man, it's you couldn't go out and and
and and find a pair that compliments each other. It's
like peanut butter and jelly. I mean, separately they're good,
but together, man, they're really good. They're better together. And
and that's what that's what Jamar Chase and t Higgins are.
They're they're the peanut butter and Jelly in the NFL.

Speaker 1 (12:56):
I guess since the news broke that the Bengals were
able to get this deal done, I found some of
the commentary coming from the national media to be laughable.
But it's not unfair to ask if it's wise for
a team to spend that much money on two wide receivers.
What is your response to that argument.

Speaker 7 (13:17):
You know, when the three of them have been healthy
since they've been in the league together, what are they
like thirty four and eighteen, I think it is or
something like that. It's almost two wins for every defeat
when all three of them are on the field together.
They are a dynamic force. You know, there's no question
about it. And right now, you know, I feel like

(13:41):
with Brown and p Ryan in the backfield, you know,
I feel like they've got they've got other weapons. And
let's not let's not forget about Mike is Sticky, kind
of like the youngsung hero of this whole thing.

Speaker 4 (13:54):
He was key.

Speaker 7 (13:55):
I mean, Joe mentioned him too, that Mike is Sticky
is an important part of what they're what they're getting done,
and he is and and they I think Mike Gisiki
probably took a little bit of a hometown discount. I
think t Higgins took a bit of a hometown discount.
I think guys basically said, look, I will leave money

(14:15):
on the table as such for the for the the
the right and the pleasure of playing with each other.
You know, we want to get back and do what
we did last year. Run it back, and run it
back to even a higher level. I mean, Kasiki is is.
He's a talented dude. I mean he's he's long, tall,

(14:37):
He's got long arms.

Speaker 4 (14:39):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (14:40):
With that, with that long body, he can sink his hips,
get in and out of cuts like a guy much smaller,
like a guy under six feet tall, and he's almost
sixty six. He can separate when he gets in and
out of cuts and gets some separation, he can make
the contested catch because of his his height and uh
you know, his his length in his hands like t Higgins.

(15:01):
I mean they have two of the better contested catch
guys on the same football team. And then of course
Jamar Chase's strength is see you later. You know, I'm
after the catch. When i have the ball in my hands,
I'm a running back man, I'm gonna get yards after catch,
yards after contact.

Speaker 4 (15:18):
You know, he led the league as we know catches,
yards and touchdowns.

Speaker 7 (15:24):
The fourth area was yards after catch seven hundred and
eighty seven yards after catch. There are receivers in the
NFL would love to have seven hundred and eight seven
yards receiving and he got that after the catch of
the football man and as a result, you know, since
he's been in the NFL, the big play eighteen touchdowns
are forty yards of more thirteen or fifty yards of more,

(15:45):
twelve or sixty yards of more.

Speaker 4 (15:47):
Are you kidding me? That's freakishly good.

Speaker 1 (15:51):
Yeah, those are some crazy numbers. My feeling on this
subject has evolved and changed. I don't think it's ideal
to spend that much on two wide receivers, but the
bottom line is keeping your best players. Yeah, Jamar is
the second best player on the team, behind behind Joe Burrow.
T is probably in the top four or five certainly,

(16:13):
so you have to go cheaper somewhere else. But that's
kind of how it always works, isn't it. I mean,
if you are paying a cornerback, say twenty five million
dollars a year, then you probably can't pay a second
wide receiver that much. So it's all about keeping your
best guys and figuring out the rest. I mean, that's

(16:35):
kind of the way I've come to feel about this.

Speaker 7 (16:38):
Yeah, I agree with you, Dan, In a perfect world,
would you love to have you know, like it may
be a little bit more balanced from a position group
where your best players exist. But if your best players
to have them exist at the same position group in
today's NFL, you got to pay them both. I mean,
that's the bottom line. Let's face it. The list I saw,

(17:02):
T Higgins was the number one free agent a wide receiver.
Mike Kasiki was the number one guy at tight end
on a few lists that I saw. Uh. BJ Hill
was the number one interior defensive lineman on some lists
that I saw, never lower than number three. So now
you know, the Bengals have always had, you know, developed

(17:24):
and and retain, you know, draft, develop and retain your
your own. And these players, they weren't all drafted by
the Cincinnati Bengals. BJ Hill and get sick he weren't.
But you know they they developed with the Cincinnati Bengals
to another level. And when you've done that, keep them.
If you can keep them. I mean, they're they're amongst

(17:46):
the best players in the National Football League and free agency,
and uh, go ahead and sign them.

Speaker 3 (17:50):
You know.

Speaker 7 (17:51):
I think the other thing Dan that strikes me about
all these guys, you know that the Bengals have resigned
the resigning their own before worrying about other people's players.
They do that. And then also the second component is
the versatility. All these guys play more than one position.

(18:11):
You know, they're capable of doing multiple things for you.
Jamar Chase can line up anywhere and run any route
and not make mistakes and decipher coverage is just on
the same page as Joe Burrow. T. Higgins can line
up multiple places. Mike Kasiki can line up at the
end of the line of scrimmage or in the in
the detached or in the slot or in a bunch

(18:34):
formation as a receiver. He gives you all that versatility.
Bj Hill can line up as a three technique, you
can line up as a nose guard. He can kick
out as a defensive end and a pinch. They signed
Cody Ford, you know, another guy who can play all
five of the offensive line positions as well as be
a big tight end for sure, arnage goal line. So
it's a combination of are they not only they're not

(18:55):
only retaining their own but the versatility that their own
provide for them, I think is a valuable commodity in
this era of free agency.

Speaker 1 (19:05):
No doubt about it. You know, it's kind of an
odd twist to this whole thing, and the Bengals retaining
T Higgins. If you are thrilled about that, you love te,
you're excited that he's going to be a Bengal for
at least four more years. You should probably thank Jermaine
Burton for being immature as a rookie, because if he
came in last year and was a total pro and

(19:27):
looked like he was the guy that was going to
be able to replace t in twenty twenty five, this
deal probably doesn't get done.

Speaker 3 (19:34):
Right.

Speaker 7 (19:35):
That's a value, that's a valid point, There's no question
about that. I think that you'd have to put Jermaine
Burton's performance in the disappointment category, you know, as far
as the organization is concerned. You know, not to say
that hopefully he finds himself both as a football player

(19:56):
and continues to mature and develop as a player as
a person, not only a player, because the guy.

Speaker 4 (20:03):
Does have a skill set.

Speaker 7 (20:05):
But yeah, there's no way that they could they could
justify to the fan base in their own minds, to
anybody that this wasn't the way to go, you know
T Higgins. And the thing is, both guys went out
and proved it. Both guys went out and had seasons
that Okay, franchise tagged me.

Speaker 4 (20:27):
Yeah, all right, I'm gonna put up numbers.

Speaker 7 (20:30):
And you know, the numbers combined from these two guys
are ridiculous. Two hundred catches, two six hundred and nineteen yards,
twenty seven touchdowns. I mean, that's that's crazy, it really is.
And he's eighty nine yards short of a thousand and
missed five games. And that's that's the thing with Tea. Now,

(20:50):
you know a lot of people, I know people that
I've talked to, why would you pay a guy like
that that kind of money.

Speaker 4 (20:57):
It's like, what are you talking about? Man?

Speaker 7 (20:58):
His skill sets phenomenal. Yeah, but he's hurts so much
now he does. He has the quad problems, the hamstring problems.
I mean, he's a he's a big, big human being
with you know, long muscles in those in those muscle groups.
Got to figure out a way to, uh to maybe
prevent prevent some of that. But this guy, when he's
on the football field, I'm telling you, man, he is.

(21:22):
The Bengals have so many ways that they can create mispatches.
You know, they're they're they're such a difficult group to
handle because of the physical abilities that they have. They have,
you know, guys that aren't that big, that play bigger
than they are, like Jamar. Jamar plays like he's a
you know, two hundred and fifty pound you know, four

(21:43):
to three tailback, That's what he plays like. And and
t Higgins, you know, he'll run routes like he's a
five ft ten inch receiver, you know, with all kinds
of ability to sink his hips and the flexibility to
get in out of cuts. And I mean, these guys
are our gift a man. And I think Joe Burrow, Jamar, Chase,

(22:05):
T Higgins, Mike is sicky. They're gonna. I think they're
gonna put on a show. I mean, it's gonna be
exciting to see what the heck they do.

Speaker 1 (22:14):
So the most significant free agent additions off other rosters
so far have come on defense linebacker Orrin Burks and
defensive tackle t J. Slayton. Any thoughts on the addition
of those two.

Speaker 7 (22:25):
Guys obviously have a need for that that big body
guy and that that's exactly what they got by signing this, uh,
this this massive defensive tackle. Now this this guy, he's uh,
he's a force, and he's he's a He's not a stiff,
you know what I mean, He's he's got some athleticism

(22:47):
to him, he's got some ability ability to move.

Speaker 4 (22:50):
But he will he'll stuff it up. Now, there's no
doubt about that.

Speaker 7 (22:54):
This this guy, he will uh he will he will
cause uh cause problems for the opposition when they're trying
to establish that running game on the inside. There's there's
no two ways about that that he is. He's a
factor and need need help it linebacker. I mean, you

(23:14):
lose a team Davis Gather who is a pretty you know,
versatile guy to Arizona. I think they found one to
uh to fit right in there and and take the
place of So I think both of those signings are legit.

Speaker 1 (23:30):
Uh.

Speaker 7 (23:31):
My understanding is that that both of these guys are
are very intelligent people, you know, I mean they they
not only in general just raw intelligence, but football IQ
and coaches are going to love that, you know. It's
I think I think both signings are are going to

(23:52):
help this football team. So I do think they did
a pretty good job obviously of keeping their own, but
then when they went out and had to had to
make some moves and and get somebody else's they went
out and did that pretty darn well. I mean TJ. Slayton,
I think is a good a good deal. Two years

(24:12):
for fifteen million dollars. The thing is the defensive line
coach worked with him at Green Bay, knows about him,
know those are the things that he can do. Jerry
Montgomery is familiar with what TJ. Slayton's all about. I
think there's something to be said for that. Orrin Burks
is a guy who just when when he had to

(24:36):
play big, when there were injuries and he had to
go and and and play, he had his best games
down the stretch, in the playoffs and in the Super Bowl.
I mean he just kept getting better and better, making
more and more plays. So when the season was on
the line, he stepped up. You gotta like you gotta
like both of those signings, Dan, I think it makes
the defense.

Speaker 1 (24:56):
Better, especially TJ. Slayton. They have needed that gigantic, immovable
run stopping force in the middle of their defensive line
and and I think that's exactly what the doctor ordered.
He's not going to get after the quarterback much, but
you got to have somebody, particularly in the AFC North,
that prevents teams from just stuffing it down your throat
in the run game.

Speaker 4 (25:17):
Absolutely.

Speaker 7 (25:18):
I mean, fans are still moaning about the loss of
DJ Reader, you know. I mean, and rightfully star. I
mean DJ Reader was a force in the division stopping
the run. And like you said, everybody can run the
football in the AFC North TJ. Slayton will give you
that close the closest thing to that body type with

(25:40):
those type of movement skills. To think DJ Reader, it
was unbelievable watching him with the athleticism he played with.

Speaker 4 (25:49):
This guy.

Speaker 7 (25:50):
Look you look at him and you think, oh, man,
this he can't move? Are you kidding me? This guy
was an athlete. Man, he could move. I mean he
was hard to get off his feet. He he had
he had sweet feet. Man, he had great balance. I
mean he was hard to he was hard to get
off his pins. And Slayton has has that kind of
ability too. I mean he's hard to get on the ground.

(26:12):
And they haven't had a guy you know like that
with that kind of size that will you know, hold
the fort and uh you know when when offensive and
defensive line and come off the ball, where's the line
is the line of scrimmage moving?

Speaker 4 (26:26):
Which way is it? Moving or is it moving at all?

Speaker 1 (26:28):
T J.

Speaker 7 (26:29):
Slayton will make sure that it's not moving at all,
or if it's moving, it's moving in the uh negative direction.
For the offense, he'll make sure he's knocking guys back
and holding down the fort all right.

Speaker 1 (26:41):
Earlier today, I shined the Bengals logo into the sky
above pay Corpse Stadium and solicited some ask lap questions.
So here we go. We've got several questions about the
offensive line in general and the guard position in particular.
This question from SB eighty five. Are the angles interested
in Brandon Sheriff.

Speaker 4 (27:04):
I think they should be.

Speaker 7 (27:05):
You know, I think he's a guy that, uh, you know,
that is on everybody's list. I mean, he's of the
guys that are left at the interior.

Speaker 1 (27:15):
You know.

Speaker 7 (27:15):
I I have Brandon Sheriff, uh you know, rated right
up there. I've also, you know, there's there's a couple
of guys from the Chicago Bears, Tevin Jenkins. There's mixed reviews,
mixed reports on him. There's I guess additional film study
that I'm gonna have to have to do on him.

(27:37):
But he and Matt Pryor are both there at the
guard position with Chicago. Uh Will Hernandez out of Arizona
as well as Cologne, Uh Tristan Cologne out of Arizona
are both guys that I think, you know, you could,
you could, you could really think about Evan Brown out

(27:58):
of out of Arizona as well as is somebody that
deserves I think a little bit more film study Lake
and Tomlinson with Seattle. I mean, there there are there
are bodies there, There are people there. And should the
Bengals get one of them or two? Yeah, I'm all
I'm all for that. Uh you know, you got to

(28:21):
they they obviously have a have an opening with with
Kappa being let go. And how about Kappa signing right
away with the Las Vegas Raiders. God, that's good, really
good for him. You know, the Bengals said, uh, you know,
no Moss and they part ways and he gets a deal,
a deal right away.

Speaker 4 (28:39):
But you know we mentioned Cody Ford.

Speaker 7 (28:41):
I think Cody Ford deserves the right to battle inside
for one of those guard spots. He's got the position versatility,
but I I think he's proven that that he belongs
in that in that competition. And and yeah, Dan, I
would I would definitely say that if you if you
come out of free agency without signing one veteran guard,

(29:03):
it would be a disappointment, I would think. I mean,
if you him signed too, all the better, But if
you don't, that's going to be addressed in the draft
as well.

Speaker 1 (29:12):
I have not seen any reports about what Sheriff is
asking for. His last contract as a free agent was
a huge one, so he may be really looking for
big bucks. Still, he's not that old. He's thirty three.
He was the fifth overall pick in the draft. He
was a five time Pro bowler, although the last time
was twenty twenty one. His PFF grades last year weren't great,

(29:33):
but they were still good. He was number thirteen among
guards in pass Pro, number thirty nine overall. That was
much better than the Bengals starting guard. So again, I
don't know what his price tag is, but to me,
the guys that are still out there, if you could
work out a short term deal with him, I think
that would be a home run. It'd be interesting to
see if they can pull it off.

Speaker 7 (29:52):
Yeah, I agree, Dan, I mean, I think he obviously
is a salary cap casualty with Jacksonville, and you know Jacksonville,
they're moving on from some of their interior players and
they're signing other people's interior players, and it's it's just
kind of a kind of a shift and a lot
of its economically driven. And I guess you know that's

(30:14):
that's one thing that that we know the Cincinnati Bengals, uh,
they always try to try to get done, is the
fact that they don't let their cap get out of whack.
And if a guy is not going to be on
a football team, it's not going to be because of economics.
He may not cut the mustard anymore. His skill set

(30:34):
may have diminished, but I mean if he's still if
you have a player that can still play in this
league and you have to let him go because you
didn't hinder your salary cap properly, and to me, that
would that would just be that would be criminal. And
they do have a you know, a a history of

(30:54):
keeping everything even Steven pretty pretty flat lined in terms of,
you know, on a year to year basis with with
cap hits with these players and not have pushed to
the back end all this money where it's it's ludicrous
and you got to get rid of the guy. I mean,
they're probably not even Hall of famers that would warrant
to be paid that that kind of money. So the

(31:16):
Bengals have done a great job of that and I
think that'll continue all right.

Speaker 1 (31:21):
Jarno and Chuck have both asked questions about Matt Lee,
the center out of the University of Miami that the
Bengals drafted last year. Jarno asked, what is the status
of Matt Lee could be? Could he be in the
mix at guard? Chuck asked, is matt possibly the next
center with Ted Karris moving to guard? What are your

(31:42):
overall thoughts about Matt Lee and the possibility that he
has a more prominent role this coming season.

Speaker 7 (31:47):
Yeah, I think I think Matt Lee is is probably
another guy that if I'm an offensive lineman that was
a member of the group last year, the offensive line
coast and the assistant line coach have moved on and
there are new ones, so it's wide open. I mean,
everybody is out to win a job, so, uh, you know,

(32:11):
Matt Lee, Unfortunately, he doesn't have a whole lot of
tape that the coaches can watch in terms of snaps
last year in the in the regular season, but the
preseason he does and they can go back and look
at his college tape again, which I'm sure they already
did because they were evaluating him coming out of school
when you know they were with the New England Patriots,

(32:32):
so I'm sure they know about him.

Speaker 4 (32:35):
You know, Matt Lee has he has as good a
chance as.

Speaker 7 (32:37):
Anybody of securing more playing time or maybe winning a
job at the in the teri of the offensive line.

Speaker 4 (32:44):
I do think that.

Speaker 7 (32:47):
That is an area of improvement that is is very
obvious in terms of keeping that pocket from collapsing. The
protection pass protection has to be firming the pocket up.
And I remember Paul Brown and Tiger Johnson first to
my first year in the league.

Speaker 4 (33:08):
Men give ground grudgingly on that inside. You know, don't
don't get bull rushed, don't get knocked back, give ground grudgingly,
make a stand.

Speaker 7 (33:16):
And that's you know, you have a guy like Joe Borrow,
a quarterback you just want to keep people out of
his face. Quarterbacks at any level, high school, college or
the NFL will tell you if you ask him, what
is the biggest the biggest problem to deal with pressure
in my face when I can't see down the football field,
and then you have the yips potentially about following through

(33:38):
and you know, having an injury on somebody's helmet, be
it your teammates or the opposition. So give these guys
room to operate. Give these guys space sometimes, you know,
it's not only time, it's time and space. What kind
of space you're giving your quarterback to operate in that
pocket and feel comfortable in that pocket, because man, if
you do that for Joe Burrow, bo no telling the

(34:02):
yards and the production that that guy will put up.

Speaker 1 (34:06):
Mark has a question about Cordel Volson. Cordell, by the way,
was graded fifty fifth among guards last year out of
eighty three according to Pro Football Focus. Here's the question.
Scott Peters says he thinks he can help Cordel Volson.
What exactly can he help him with?

Speaker 7 (34:22):
You know, Cordell Volson has got some length and h
Coach Peters is real good with that long arm, you know,
and foot placement's a little bit different.

Speaker 4 (34:30):
Maybe it's a little more.

Speaker 7 (34:31):
Parallel than staggered, and it length lengthens the arm, and
and Cordel Volson has some long, strong arms to work with.
The biggest thing I think that he has to do
is is uh is is bend get his pad level lower.
You know, he has to he has to bend at

(34:52):
the knees and not at the waist. He has to
get get get that body down a little bit and
and you know, get his his targets everything lower and
player play at a lower plane. Because I think he
does have ability. I think he does have athletic ability.
I think he's plenty strong enough to play in the
National Football League.

Speaker 4 (35:11):
And again, you wipe a slate clean.

Speaker 7 (35:16):
You know, there's if he ended up going the year
ended up going tough for him last year, Frank Pollack,
who drafted him, ended up sitting him down. And you know,
Frank's not the start that does that lightly. You know,
somebody that he drafted make that kind of decision with
So Cordell is going to have a bounce back year.

Speaker 4 (35:35):
I think he's got it in him.

Speaker 7 (35:37):
And with coach Peters, he's got a clean slate, new techniques,
new things to learn. And again, everybody's everybody's a square one.
It's best man wins. Let's just go compete.

Speaker 1 (35:52):
From chastin besides guard, what other position would you like
to see the Bengals addressing free agency?

Speaker 7 (36:00):
You know, I mean, I think they've already done. They've
already gotten a defensive tackle. But I'd go multiple guards.
I'd probably go another defensive tackle. I'd like, there's always
room for an edge rusher. I mean, if in the
secondary market, there's an edge rusher out there that you
know that becomes affordable and viable.

Speaker 4 (36:21):
And honestly, Dan, when I'm when I'm.

Speaker 7 (36:22):
If I'm a free agent out there now, and you know,
I haven't maybe my price tag was too high and
some of these guys did get the big dollars, but
you're still out there. You know, you have to lower
your sites. You and your representative of your agent, your lawyer, whatever,
or trying to figure out what to do. Why the
hell not consider the Cincinnati Bengals. I mean, look what

(36:45):
they've done in free agency. Look at the football team
that they're putting together. If you're a defensive tackle or
an offensive guard, or an edge rush guy or a corner,
whatever the case may be, why why wouldn't you say, yeah, man,
let's let's uh. You know, they need help at the
position I play. They they need some help to to

(37:05):
fill that roster out.

Speaker 4 (37:07):
They do, they do have a good roster.

Speaker 7 (37:08):
They believe in their roster they brought a lot of
that roster back, and they paid them, you know, second
contracts in some cases even more than that. But you know, man,
I think when when the Bengals did what they did
in terms of paying Joe Burrow good money for the
long term and then signing both Jamar and t I

(37:31):
think you showed the rest of the league we're serious.

Speaker 4 (37:33):
Now.

Speaker 7 (37:34):
You know we're serious. We're going to try to put
together as good a roster as we possibly can, and
we're not going to let our stars that we've developed
into potential superstars walk. So if you want to be
part of this, yeah, let's talk. And I would think
that Cincinnati here in this era of the Joe Burrow era,

(37:56):
is talked about in the free agency circle as much
differently than they were before his arrival. I think it's
it's uh, from travel agency standpoint, is probably one of
the better destinations. Now, let's let's see we get done.
How about arranging a trip to Cincinnati.

Speaker 1 (38:12):
Let's go from mister B what changes do you recommend
to reverse the devastating trend of terrible starts to seasons.

Speaker 7 (38:21):
Yeah, man, boy, if I had an answer to that,
I mean that that that one it's almost like a
self fulfilling prophecy. Now, sometimes you get in that situation
and it just, you know, it can it consumes you
when you don't even realize it's consuming you. You know,
it's a it's a an odd dynamic that way. They've

(38:42):
tried to have these you know, controlled scrimmages with other
other teams and be a little bit more physical because
they're not playing guys very many snaps during the course
of the preseason that that they're going to be relying
on right away to start the regular season. But if
you don't, I mean, that becomes a major issue, and
it has been a major issue. The lack of sure

(39:05):
tackling are a big part of the equation of those
slow starts. But you know, even offensively, I mean, you
look at the Bengals offense in the first three or
four games of the season as opposed to the last
five games this past year. Oh my gosh, man, it's
like night and day. You know, you'd like to you'd
like to get off to a better start at the

(39:27):
beginning of the year, closer to the efficiency and the
level of execution you're playing with. You know, at the
end of the season, it's going to be natural, barring
injury and all that, that you are going to progress
during the course of the season.

Speaker 4 (39:40):
But man, it was a stark contrast.

Speaker 7 (39:42):
From the start of the season offensively to the end
of the season offensively.

Speaker 4 (39:47):
And you know, I don't know.

Speaker 7 (39:49):
Maybe it's as simple as playing biting the bullet and
then play more snaps, man, and let them bring people
to the ground and start that, start that bond of
what it's going to be like at all three levels.
Realizing you know how to play with each other, get
a feel for each other, get a feel for the
guy that you're playing next to, have an understanding what

(40:13):
the coordinators his expectations are. And the only way to
go out and do it is to do that, go
out and physically do it, mentally know what you're doing,
and physically accomplish what you're supposed to do.

Speaker 1 (40:26):
All right, We've got about two minutes left for a
final hard hitting question. It comes from p d y.
Are you ready, yes, describe your perfect Sunday morning breakfast.

Speaker 4 (40:42):
Perfect Sunday morning breakfast. Man.

Speaker 7 (40:46):
You know, I'm really not a huge breakfast guy, but
if I had to, it would be some form of steak.
Would be in there. I'm definitely a steak.

Speaker 1 (40:56):
Guy, steak an eggs kind of guy.

Speaker 7 (40:58):
Yeah, steak and eggs would stay, can scrambled eggs with that,
dog would hunt. I think I think I'd probably probably
lean in that direction. I'm, you know, not necessarily toast,
maybe more like an English s muffin or a Danish
kind of guy, you know, rather than just toast, you know,
get a little a little bit of something like that going.

(41:18):
I am definitely an orange juice guy, gonna have that,
but no coffee. I don't never tasted coffee. I don't
drink coffee, but I'd go for a couple of glasses
orange juice.

Speaker 3 (41:28):
Though.

Speaker 1 (41:30):
I can describe my perfect Sunday morning breakfast because I
feel like I have it about eight times a year.
It's on the road at the Bengals game day. It's you, Me,
Mike Brown, his close friend Jack Schiff.

Speaker 4 (41:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (41:45):
I don't really care about the food. It's the conversations
that we have on those Sunday mornings on the road.
That's the perfect Sunday morning breakfast for me.

Speaker 4 (41:53):
What a great call that is, Dan, There's no doubt.

Speaker 7 (41:56):
I mean the conversations football and it evolves to evolves
to life in general in some cases, but a lot
of football chat and uh, you know it is it's
very interesting, very interesting.

Speaker 4 (42:12):
I think I think the fan base.

Speaker 7 (42:13):
Would be very pleasantly surprised to be able to tune
into some of those conversations and listen to uh, you know,
to Mike and uh and then when Katie and Troy
come and when Paul Brown comes and everybody starts, uh
starts talking football. It's really pretty enlightening, pretty very interesting,

(42:35):
it really is.

Speaker 1 (42:36):
If we could make that a podcast, it would be
like the Kelsey Brothers. We would sell it for one
hundred mil.

Speaker 7 (42:44):
You're right, man, I mean I think, uh, I think
it would definitely it would definitely uh disproved, you know,
I don't know, maybe prove the fact that Mike Brown
might be as misunderstood as almost anybody in the National
Football League.

Speaker 4 (43:00):
But Mike Brown knows his football.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
Now he does. And his laugh is tremendous.

Speaker 4 (43:05):
It is, There's there's no question about it.

Speaker 7 (43:09):
And and as dry a sense of humor as I've
ever as I've ever known, and uh at an extremely
high intelligence, as we know, Dan, Mike Brown is like
that dude is Menza he's mensa in a lot of
areas that might be. That might be a smart as
smart a human being ron intelligence as I've been around,

(43:30):
he's something else.

Speaker 1 (43:31):
All right, so I said. The Sunday Morning Breakfast question
was our final question, but there was actually one other
interesting thing that came in on ask Lap. Somebody wants
to know that when the Bengals win the Super Bowl
in Santa Clara this coming year, will you add an
extra bam to coffin nails? Bam bam bam? Will you
go with a fourth for a Super Bowl?

Speaker 4 (43:51):
At least I might go for ten? I mean I
might just be bamming my butt off.

Speaker 1 (43:56):
Man. All right, that's what we got to look forward.
Appreciate you time, my man. Hope to see you soon.

Speaker 4 (44:03):
Same here. Dan, enjoyed it.

Speaker 1 (44:05):
Appreciate your man, you haven't done so already. Be sure
to check out Laps in the Trenches podcast presented by
First Star Logistics. Recent guests include BJ Hill and Mikeasicki.
The Bengals Booth Podcast is brought to you by pay Corps,
proud to be the Bengals official HR software provider. By
Alta Fiber future proof fiber Internet designed to elevate your home,

(44:28):
business and community to a new level and by Kettering
Health the best care for the best fans. Kettering Health
is the official healthcare provider of the Bengals. Now time
for my conversation with a Bengals newcomer linebacker and special
teams ace or In Burks signed a two year deal
on Monday and joins the Bengals after earning a Super

(44:51):
Bowl ring with the Philadelphia Eagles. Berks had quite a postseason.
He forced to fumble on the opening kickoff in the
eagles first playoff win over Green Bay. He forced another
fumble in the NFC Championship game against Washington, and after
getting most of his snaps on special teams during the
regular season, Berks started at linebacker in Philadelphia's last three

(45:16):
postseason wins. Or You have had quite a twenty twenty
five so far, A couple of forest fumbles in the playoffs,
starting role in a Super Bowl champ and now a
new two year deal with the Cincinnati Bengals. How would
you describe your year to date?

Speaker 3 (45:32):
Man, it's been amazing. It's been amazing.

Speaker 8 (45:34):
Definitely looking forward to the opportunity here in Cincinnati for
me and my family. I feel like it's a great
fit for us, and I'm just excited to see what
the future holds.

Speaker 1 (45:42):
I want to go back before the playoffs began, the
final game of the regular season, it was big news
nationally when the Eagles rested Saquon Barkley when he possibly
had a chance to set the rushing record. Some other
guys rested in that game as well. You stepped into
the starting lineup and had seventeen tackles to kind of
set the stage for the great postseason that came after that.

(46:04):
What do you think that game did for you your
reputation around the NFL.

Speaker 8 (46:09):
For me, it's just a big confidence piece, you know,
for the whole year, I hadn't had, you know, a
huge opportunity to play, you know, the majority of the game,
So just was ready when the opportunity came up to
you know, show showcase my talents and that that rang true,
you know when I got the opportunity in the playoffs
and throughout. But for me, it's always preparing like a
starter no matter what my role is and teams has
always been a big point of emphasis for me. So

(46:31):
exceling that role, adding value and being a great teammate
and like I said, ultimately just being ready when the
opportunity comes up.

Speaker 1 (46:37):
Nikobe Dean suffered an injury in the first playoff game.
You stepped into the starting lineup for the rest of
the playoffs for Philly and the defense didn't miss a beat.
How big of a source of pride was that for you?

Speaker 3 (46:49):
Yeah, it's huge. Like I said, like I prepare like
a starter.

Speaker 8 (46:52):
That's that's been my point of emphasis, and that's allowed
me to play in the league for a long time.
This is going into year eight and I played a
lot of games in terms of playoff games. You know,
I've been on been in the playoffs every year except
for my rookie year. And you know that that rings true,
Like that experience, you know, speaks for yourself and looking
to you know, increase that role and just I feel

(47:12):
it's a great opportunity to come here and compete and
this this team is.

Speaker 3 (47:15):
You look at the roster.

Speaker 8 (47:16):
You got talent up and down the roster and two
big ones you know yesterday with the war receiver duo,
and that's going to help us a lot to win games.

Speaker 3 (47:23):
So looking forward to it.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
That playoff track record's pretty remarkable. Six straight years with
three different teams. Five of those teams went to the
league championship Game, the last two teams went to the
Super Bowl, and you won the Super Bowl this past year.
What have you learned over the course of the last
six years about what it takes for teams to make
it that far in the postseason.

Speaker 8 (47:45):
Yeah, one thing I've noticed the biggest The best teams
I've been a part of have been the closest teams
in the locker room. So that's gonna be an emphasis
for me, you know, just to connect with the guys here.

Speaker 3 (47:54):
And I'm a vet now, so like just being able
to lead in that role is going to be really important.

Speaker 8 (48:00):
But at the same time, just the mentality that it
takes to win it all. It takes a lot of
hard work, but ultimately you got to be There's a
lot of highs, a lot of lows. You got to
find a way to stay somewhere in the middle, and
I feel like that's where the work gets done. And
looking forward to, you know, seeing what that looks like
with this team.

Speaker 1 (48:16):
I'm sure Philly didn't want to lose you. What appealed
to you about Cincinnati?

Speaker 8 (48:20):
Yeah, just opportunity, you know, the last couple of years,
they haven't you know, gotten over the barrier. I feel
like we're right there at it to make a run
at it again. So I feel like it was the
best opportunity for me and my family and a great
fit here. We're in Nashville, so right down the road,
so not too far. But yeah, just looking forward to
the future here.

Speaker 1 (48:40):
What have you been told about the opportunity? What potential
role do you think exists for you here?

Speaker 3 (48:45):
Yeah, just to come in and compete always.

Speaker 8 (48:47):
You know backburner's gonna be special teams, but you know
it's coming to compete and play at linebacker here, and
I just want to be part of a great defense.

Speaker 1 (48:57):
You spent your first four years in Green Bay Jerry Montgummer.
He was on the defensive staff. He wasn't your position coach,
but obviously you were around Jerry a lot during those years.
Did that connection have anything to do with you winding up.

Speaker 3 (49:08):
Here, Yeah, it definitely does.

Speaker 8 (49:09):
You know, familiarity with somebody on staff, a good relationship
with Jerry, and know his kids and his family very well.
And I feel like he's going to be a big
piece for our d line. And I love playing with
great defensive lines man, that makes my job a lot easier.
So knowing that they're going to be well coached on
that front is a big piece to that.

Speaker 3 (49:26):
So I'll look forward to working with him.

Speaker 1 (49:28):
The Bengals got close to a Super Bowl title in
the twenty twenty one season. You got there last year.
You got to experience what it was like when the
confetti is falling around you and it's your team Colors.
What was that high like for you?

Speaker 3 (49:40):
Yeah, it's a surreal experience.

Speaker 8 (49:42):
You know, all the work that you put in, you know,
your whole life to get to the pinnacle of the
sport and just being able to showcase it at at
the highest level is a great honor. And just going
to war, you know, with guys that you can create
a bond with over the year. I'm looking forward to
doing that this year with this team.

Speaker 1 (49:57):
You've had a tremendous track record on special teams throughout
your NFL career. Do you anticipate playing a significant role
in that department Cincinnati?

Speaker 3 (50:05):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (50:06):
I mean I feel like I always try to find
ways to add value wherever I am, special teams or defense,
and I take a lot of pride in that, you know,
just just being a pros pro and being able to
you know, be ready to go when the opportunity comes up.

Speaker 1 (50:20):
You overlapped with TJ. Slayton briefly in Green Bay your
last year there, his first. What can you tell us
about what the Bengals are getting in TJ Slayton.

Speaker 3 (50:28):
Yeah, you're getting a young guy with a lot of potential. Man.

Speaker 8 (50:30):
I feel like when I was there with TJ, like
you just showed so much athleticism and his ability to
you know, just replays and get to the ball, and
that's to nasty is going to help us on defense.
So excited to get back to work with him. Having
reunited with him in a little bit.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
So you've faced the Bengals each of the last two years,
would have been your impressions of Cincinnati being on the
opposite side of the ball?

Speaker 8 (50:51):
Yeah, Man, a high powered offense obviously, Joe leading the way.
I mean, I see him as a great leader, a
guy that can get the ball out and get into
playmaker's hands, and for me is just.

Speaker 3 (51:02):
Just don't know, just a great opportunity.

Speaker 8 (51:03):
Like I'm really like seeing this team from the far
as the first time being the AFC for me, so
a little bit different, but UH known them as a
contender the last couple of years. So that's what I
was looking for in free agency, is an opportunity to
come and compete with the contender.

Speaker 1 (51:17):
We joked before I turned on the microphone that based
on my research, nobody has played in three straight Super
Bowls for three different teams. They're having guys that have
played in three for three different teams, but not three
years in a row.

Speaker 3 (51:31):
What do you think?

Speaker 1 (51:32):
I mean, I imagine you joined this team thinking that Cincinnati
gives you a legitimate chance to do that.

Speaker 8 (51:37):
Yeah, I think it's definitely on the table. And it
starts with OTA's coming up here soon. Just building that
foundation that leads into the camp and leads, you know,
to the to the ultimate, the big one in the
super Bowl.

Speaker 3 (51:47):
So we got to take it one day at a time.
But you know, we got all the pieces that we need.

Speaker 1 (51:51):
Who do you know on this roster if anybody?

Speaker 8 (51:54):
Yeah, so Logan we have the same Logan Wilson, we
have the same agent, so I've kind of known him
from that. And Tanner Hudson he trains in Nashville every
once in a while, so have good relationship with him.
He was with the Niners when I was out there
as well, so in Devin Conquering as well as office
a lineman that was at Vandy when I was there
for a little bit.

Speaker 1 (52:12):
Your thirtieth birthday is coming up in a matter of days.
You seem like a very young thirty. You've played in
a lot of games, but haven't necessarily played a ton
of snaps on defense. Do you feel like you haven't
been exposed to as much wear and tear maybe as
some guys with your experience in the league.

Speaker 3 (52:30):
Yes, and no.

Speaker 8 (52:30):
I feel like we did physicals earlier today and that
was in and out for thirty minutes. So I was
joking with them like going into your a if you
got a quick physical, that's a great sign. So hopefully
I can crank out a couple more years.

Speaker 3 (52:40):
Here in the league.

Speaker 8 (52:41):
And it's about longevity, you know, like I said, and
just find a ways to add value taking care of
your bodies and just being a pro, you know, taking
care of everything that needs to be taken care of.

Speaker 1 (52:49):
Great to have you here in Cincinnati. Hope that Super
Bowl Street continues next year.

Speaker 3 (52:53):
Let's do it.

Speaker 1 (52:55):
N Thanks to Warren Burks, and that's going to do it.
For this episode of the Bengals Booth Podcast, brought to
you by pay Core, Proud to be the Bengals Official
HR software provider, by Alta Fiber future proof fiber Internet
designed to elevate your home, business and community to a
new level, and by Kettering Health the best care for
the best fans. Kettering Health is the official healthcare provider

(53:17):
of the Bengals. If you haven't done so already, please
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more Bengals fans find us. I'm Dan Horde and thanks
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