December 2, 2025 • 53 mins
Paul Dottino and Lance Medow recap the Giants vs Patriots game on Monday night, talk about the Giants defense, and take calls from fans.
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28:50 - Calls
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48:00 - Giants defense
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It is presented by Cadillac, the official luxury vehicle of
the New York Giants, and we are broadcasting from the
Giants Podcast Studio presented by Hackensack Meridian Health. Keep getting
better so The Giants entering the buy on a seven
game skid after falling to the Patriots on Monday Night,
football last night, thirty three to fifteen special teams clearly
(01:11):
a huge storyline. So Paul and I will provide some
takeaways before we open up the dialogue on other fronts.
And Paul, that's where I want to start, because this
was really the first game, at least from a big
picture perspective, where it just didn't seem as if the
Giants were going to be in the thickes things as
the game progressed once that first quarter unraveled. Whereas every
(01:33):
other game this season, regardless of the result, you would say,
all right, the Giants have been in it, they've kept
themselves competitive.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Correct, last night was the first.
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Time that it was really overall a non competitive game.
And while you could point the finger at a variety
of different facets, it's hard to overlook special teams. And
before I get your reaction, I just want to go
over starting field positioning for New England. To me defined
the first half the open and kickoff, they had a
(02:02):
huge return for thirty nine yards, they started their own
forty seven. It stalls out in the red zone, but
they get three points. Then the punt return for a
touchdown ninety four yards for Marcus Jones. Then after that
the Giants punted. So you had actually decent field positioning
that the Giants put the Patriots in and no surprise,
(02:25):
they actually forced them to punt. But then after that
it became just a theme where the starting field positioning
was humongous for the Patriots. It was either a short
field as a result of a turnover on downs, you
had the Botch field goal attempt, you had the fourth
down conversions that did not pan out, and New England
made the Giants pay time and time again.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
The Patriots all season long have made a living playing clean, sound,
fundamental football. They did it again last night. I mean
the Botch field goal. At that point, it's seventeen to seven. Okay,
(03:07):
the Giants get that field goal. It's a seventeen to
ten to one score game. Now, I'm not going to
suggest the Giants come back and win the game. They
were beaten at all three phases throughout the entire evening.
This was not their night. From the opening kickoff, the
Patriots were fowling at the mouth. Rabel clearly wanted to
prove to a national television audience that the Patriots deserve
(03:31):
to have the best record in the NFL, regardless of
how soft their schedule is, regardless of how their red
zone offense and defense is very poor, blah blah blah,
blah blah. He was tired of hearing about how they
were a paper lion, and if you listen to the
quotes or read the quotes from the Patriots and him
after the game, he made it a point to have
(03:53):
his Patriots sky high and souped up and to show
the NFL that you better start thinking about us as
a team that's going to go far into the playoffs.
This was, in my opinion, this was an absolute statement
game by the Patriots. They showed it from the first
(04:17):
snap and that's why it was not the Giants night.
I don't think they would have come back and won
the game. But had coub been able to connect on
the field goal, had the snap been cleaned, and had
he kicked it and at seventeen ten, maybe you got
a chance to make that game competitive. Maybe you do,
maybe you don't. But from that point forward, the damn broke.
(04:43):
It was Niagara Falls and it went all downhill.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
Yeah, because you gave the football to the Patriots at
the Giants forty five yard line after the botchfield goal,
attempt and then they were able to turn it into
a touchdown probably one of the best passes that Drake
May made to Kyle Williams in the left corner of
the end zone where it was either going to be
an incomplete pass or it was going to be a touchdown,
which is exactly how it played out. And now to
(05:08):
your point, instead of maybe seventeen to ten, all of
a sudden, it's now twenty four to seven. And that's
how quickly a game can change.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
And the one thing that I think, you know you
have to take into account here is that the Pats
the Pats, they've got this momentum going right now that
once they seem to get that ball rolling, they don't
(05:41):
give it up. They just don't give it up. And
we've seen some games have some ebb and flow. This
game didn't have an ebb and flow. Even when the
Giants had a chance to take some of that flow
and they didn't do it. The Patriots just kept pushing
the pedal to the metal. It's my opinion, and you
can disagree if you like. As they rolled through the
(06:03):
second half of this game, had they wanted to, I
think they could have piled it up even more, I
really do as possible was that one sided.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
Yeah, I don't know if I would classify to say
that they took their foot off the pedal, because if
you saw on the second half, Rabel was keeping his
offense on the field on a fourth down or two, yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
He had them go for it.
Speaker 4 (06:23):
So I think they had the intent that we still
want to put as many points on the board. You know,
maybe when it got to a fourth and down situation,
he said, listen, let's not roll the dice. Let's at
least get some padding attempt to field go. Remember there
was one missfield goal in the second half, so they
could have easily had thirty six points. But I still
so touchdown taken back to correct the one to Hunter
(06:45):
Henry where they were offsetting penalties. But I would think
that from watching that game, Mike Vrabel still was emphasizing
to his team, hey, this game is not necessarily over.
Even though it may seem as if were up comfortably,
and I thought they did keep in a aggressive pursuit
in the second half. I just don't think the Giants
could match it in any manner, and that was problematic
(07:06):
also given the fact that this was one of the
first times we talked about off the top pall where
the Giants were playing from behind right, they've actually been
playing ahead and have not been able to maintain leads
or have been right within striking distance. They got behind
by double digits. And what had the Giants done the
last two weeks that I had been mentioning. They ran
the ball nearly forty times in each of the last
(07:27):
two games right thirty eight thirty nine respectively. Now they
finished with twenty seven runs in singletary we saw in
the second half, but the flow of the game doesn't
give you the luxury to continually pound the football, so
that also proved to be problematic, where whether Kafka intended
or not, it was going to be a pass happy
game in the second half, just based on what the
(07:50):
situation called for, and the strength right now of the
Giants is upfront with the offensive line playing fairly well,
being able to run block and then being able to
stay in manageable third downs as a result of a
variety of different running backs. That luxury was not afforded
them last night because of how quickly they got down
(08:10):
and had to play catch up.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
And the only two chunk plays with the touchdowns Singletary
on the direct snap when he ran twenty two yards
around the right side. That was a really nice play
and certainly an exciting play, and it was executed very well.
And Slayton did a really nice job thirty yards to
run through the secondary on that catch and run for
(08:32):
thirty yards. Ironically, you know, you talk about two guys
who were really pros, pros, very well liked by the staff,
very well liked by their teammates. For Slayton, that was
his first touchdown catch I noticed that season.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
I tweeted that out as happened. Yeah, okay, hard to
believe a little bit.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
His last one was against the Colts the second to
last game of last year. And for Singletary, that was
his season high in yard at sixty eight I think
was his number last night. He had not run for
that many yards in a game since Week two last
year against Washington. Now, of course, Tyrone Tracy pretty much
(09:11):
took that job. Opportunity was Singlitary got hurt, Tracy took
the job and ran with it. But you know, these
are two guys who you know, they were the light
glimmer of hope in the flashlight in terms of positivity
coming out of that game.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Well.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Interestingly, speaking of numbers in a bats as I like
to call it, in each of the last three weeks,
Singletary has had double digit carries. Prior to that poll,
he never had a game with at least ten. Eight
was his high. So you're seeing, all right, you're using
him more. He has been able to take advantage as
a result of the play up front. So it's just
the fact that he now has been afforded a chance
(09:50):
to capitalize on these additional carries. He just he was
third on the depth chart, right, you had Scataboo, you
had Tracy, and now all of a sudden, with both
of those guys banged up, and Tracy it's being labeled
as a hip injury. We'll see coming out of the
buy where he stands. Singletary's number was called again. He
has familiarity given his ties to Dable going back to Buffalo,
(10:12):
and he's been with Kafkan and so forth, so it's
no surprise that they would turn to him. And I
think it's also a product of even though he's been
in the league for several years, bit of fresh legs.
Now he's operating with right Paul because there wasn't a
lot of wear and tear on his body. I mean,
think about it, You'd have to go two games combined
San Francisco and Chicago to equate to the total amount
(10:35):
of carries that he had in the Green Bay game,
and then you'd have to take three or four games
prior to that to get to what he did in
the Lions game. So he's probably feeling as if he's
a second year players out right at this stage in
the season, just because the usage hasn't been there.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
I'm glad for him because he's soft spoken, you know,
he doesn't make a lot of noise, certainly never complain
about his situation and his role on the team. He
just goes out there and does what he's told, does
his job. Again, we hear the term pros pro all
the time, class act and you know, I've talked to
(11:13):
him several times after losses. He always handles himself in
a top of the line matter. So I'm glad for
him to get a little more chance to play and
whatever happens from now till the end of the season
for him, if he wants to keep playing in the NFL,
I hope that there's a spot for him next year,
whether or not it's on the Giants or with somebody else.
(11:35):
I think he's a quality NFL guy to have in
your locker.
Speaker 4 (11:39):
Room and still can be productive depending on how you
utilize it. He's not going to bring him in to
be the number one back now, he could be a
complimentary weapon. I think there's a place for him in
the NFL. Few of the things I want to get
into just in terms of decision making and plays in
the game. And you and I were talking about this
even before the show. Kafka has proven to be very
aggressive since he took over as the headman in the
(12:03):
first two games that he was the coach, and it
was it just seemed a little bit out of character.
And he did address this after the game when they
had the possession late in the second quarter. It was
twenty seven to seven and they're set up for a
fourth and one, and they ultimately decided to bring out
Jamie Gillen to punt and the Patriots. But you want
(12:23):
to talk about textbook how to run a one minute
drill with one time out left? Wow, Drake May five
plays sixty seven yards. They salvaged that one time out
to help set up the.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Field goal late.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
Whether you have any rooting interest, I mean, that's the
film you want to review in terms of how to
take advantage of a small period of time and still
wind up walking away with points on the board and oh,
leaving no time left for the opposition to get possession.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
They kicked that field goal.
Speaker 4 (12:51):
That was the last play of the first half, So
whether it was a make or amiss, that was going
to be it. I think New England deserves a lot
of credit. But I want to flip the script here
to theions.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Hold on, yeah, hold on, okay, busted coverage in the
right flat. Stevenson goes, yeah, the wide open, sure, okay,
but that's a that's a bust. Well, that has nothing
to do with the Patriots Schematically, that was a busted
coverage and they got a chunk play of over thirty
five yards out of it. Without that play, they're not
(13:21):
pulling off what you're pulling. What you're talking about, well, they.
Speaker 4 (13:23):
Still could have very well got in a field goal opportunity,
depending on what would have happened. I'm not saying they
would a touchdown, but I'm just talking about how they
managed the clock.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
They waited, I know, but let's not get the time out.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Let's not glow too much over because there was a
there was clearly a busted coverage that really was the
big chunk of it.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
I mean, listen, you're not apologizing. Hold on, you gave
a whole dissertation okay at the beginning about and Mike
Rabel wanted to prove that the schedule you know, may
have been not the touch.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
They took advantage of it, all right, they took it.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
I'm not gonna sit here and apologize for broken down
coverage from the opposing team.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
They took advantage of absolutely every flaw in the Giant's armor.
It was ugly, yeah, to be honest.
Speaker 4 (14:03):
Well, and one of the things they did take advantage here,
and this was my main point, was they took over okay,
at their own twenty three. So you figured, even though
you need gopher it on fourth and one, you're still
not putting your defense in a precarious spot.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
That wasn't the issue.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
It was just if you would have picked up the
one yard what that could have done to help extend
the drive, maybe milk the clock, you walk away with
maybe a scoring opportunity at New England, doesn't get a
field goal, and Kafka, he and his press conference did
say it was one of those things that he went
back and forth with. Yes, in the moment, he admitted
and he acknowledged that it wasn't cut and dry. He
(14:38):
was going back and forth, and ultimately field positioning was
what he determined influenced him to say, Hey, we're gonna punt.
Is opposed to go for it and then give New
England even more favorable field positioning because of what transpired
earlier in the first hand.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Well, also he knew he was getting the third quarter kickoff. Sure, yep,
I'm sure that was part of it, no detail.
Speaker 4 (15:02):
But I guess my one counter to that would have been,
but maybe here's an opportunity to double dip.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
You get the ball right to start the third quarter.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
If you actually do hold onto the ball, maybe you
get two scoring opportunities.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
So I think there's two ways of looking.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
At it, at least through the lens of how Kafka
was thinking about it. But that was just it was
interesting to me only because he's proven to be a
guy that's going to keep his foot on the pedal
and be aggressive. Remember, he was answering questions against the
Lions the previous week, where many people were saying you
should have taken the field goal, and he said, no,
(15:35):
we were in this position multiple times during the season,
and I talked about this on last Wednesday show, and
I had no issue with that aggressive approach. It didn't
work out, but that doesn't necessarily make the decision ill informed.
So if you look at how he's gone through his
decision making process, I was a.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Little bit surprised that he didn't go thraight forth in one.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
That's fair and I and I appreciate his honesty. Yeah,
after the game saying that it was a close call,
he actually thought that both options were viable. So look again,
whatever happens on that play, I just think it was
the Patriots night all around. I don't know that the
Giants necessarily we're going to be in position to win
(16:16):
this game. I thought New England habited them, they did
what they wanted to do.
Speaker 4 (16:21):
They were outplayed in every facet. Special teams I think
is the one at the forefront, just because of the
field positioning. And remember it wasn't just the Botch field goal,
it was also and hopefully Gunner Oschewsky will recover him,
and that was a really hard hit he took.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
But you know that fumble also set them up, destroyed
his helmet.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
Yeah, hard, sure destroyed his helmet.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
Now, it's important to note, and this was discuss also
on the broadcast, because I'm sure a lot of people
saw the.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Helmet to helmet hit and there was no doubt about
it. It was a helmet to helmet hit.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Yeah, but on that play because he's an established runner
by that point, and this is maybe issues that you
could have with how the NFL rules are written, but
that was officiated correctly that it was not a personal
foul based on how it is broken down in terms
of where he is on that special team's return. I
just wanted to clarify that because I'm sure a lot
(17:12):
of viewers saw that and said, how is a flag
not thrown? Well, there was a reason why it wasn't.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
You know.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
That's one of those plays where the optics are bad
and your feeling makes you sick to your stomach. It's like,
this guy just got absolutely smashed to the head. But legally,
the rules of the league say that that's an okay
play and you have to live by that. Now, whether
(17:40):
or not you like it, that's another story. You don't
have to like it. But as we've all said, it's
very very very difficult, if not impossible, to legislate helmet
to helmet hits on the basis that the game is
played so quickly, so fast, sang Bank angles are very
(18:02):
very difficult to ascertain geometrically in terms of a player's intent,
very very difficult to do. So it's a rough game,
and they were going to be inherent plays that are
going to be ugly, that will turn your stomach, that
will make you wins, but are also going to be legal.
And that's just it.
Speaker 4 (18:23):
And that brings us to two other plays that I
want to address before we open up the lines. And
of course, Jackson Dart first game back after missing the
last two due to a concussion, and he took some
hits in this game. Harold Landry was the first hit,
though to me, there was nothing wrong with it.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
He was slid.
Speaker 4 (18:42):
Dart gave himself up and Landry basically hurtled over him.
And I know people want to break down every frame
by frame. First of all, the officials don't have the luxury.
They're not X men. Okay, they don't have super elements
in terms of their vision. They can't process things. It's
like slow motion replay that were being when we're all
on our couches. So I didn't have an issue with
(19:02):
that play. And then the Ellis hit on the sideline.
It was a hard hit, there's no doubt about it.
But you watch the replay, Dart was still in bounds
when it happened. And again textbook definition of a legal hit.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Yes, that's true. The textbook says that's a legal hit.
Was it unnecessary? Was it over zealous? I totally agreed
that it was unnecessary and that it was over zealous,
But I also totally agreed that it was legal within
the framework of the NFL rules. In that case, It's
one of those plays that can be both it's legal,
(19:36):
but it also makes you wins because you feel like,
oh wow, I mean, did he really have to launch
himself into the neck and shoulder area and send the
guy horizontally into the air and several feet out of bounds. No.
I think it's pretty clear that he easily could have
shoved him out of bounce. He could have hit him
(19:59):
in the midsection and put him out. He could have
gone for his legs and knocked his legs out. He
did not have to hit him coming one hundred and
fifty miles an hour horizontally across the field and literally
launch into him and send him flying. He did not
have to do that. But is it legal, Yes, it
(20:20):
is legal.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
So it was one of those plays.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
And I told you this off air where I thought
the optics were a lot worse than perhaps the actual
play because he did take flight dart and you could
tell his response to the hit. But once again, the
job of the officials and it's not an ideal formula,
but this goes back to the play we were talking
about with Oshevski. They need to interpret the play in
(20:44):
real time, very fast, based on the Ridden rule. Okay,
that's their job. They not supposed to take intent into consideration.
It's not their jump to get into the head of
the player and what the player was thinking, whether or
not they were looking to hurt. It's the Ridden rule
that they're supposed to know backwards and forwards and applying
that to what they're seeing in real time. That's the
(21:06):
process of officiating. But this is also the human element
of the game. But I actually thought under those circumstances
that we just laid out. They did a pretty good job,
because Paul, you put anybody else in that situation, bang
bang play. That is hard in that moment to know
whether or not the officials had every reason to throw
the flag on the Dart hit. They had every excuse
(21:27):
in the book to throw that flag as a personal
foul because of how Dart took flight and how hard
he was hit. They had every reason to throw the flag.
But the official in the moment noticed that Dart was
still in play, and that's hard to officiate.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I would argue, well to your point, and this is
a very little known fact that I don't know about
the television broadcast because obviously I was at the game.
But in twenty twenty four, the NFL put a new
rule in place to specifically address this kind of play.
If a player gets plastered, if you will, hammered crushed
(22:06):
right along the sideline, they use expedited replay to potentially
pick up a flag. So, in other words, in the
interest of safety, the official has the room to throw
the flag if he thinks it's close enough that the
player may or may not have touched the sideline. He's
(22:30):
got the ability under the expedited replay rule, and this
only started in twenty twenty four. Throw the flag, they
kick it upstairs, real quick. Expeduided replay says, Okay, we've
reviewed the replay. He is within the field of play.
He was not out of bounds, he was not going out.
(22:51):
We can pick up the flag. Now, you can't add
a flag with this rule after you can only pick
it up. So to your point, if you want to
error on the side of caution to promote safety and
to protect the player, you could have argued and maybe
in many cases an official would have thrown that flag.
(23:13):
I think we've all heard the stories and we've all
seen them where some of your Brady's and your Mahomes's
and some of your superstar quarterbacks Lamar Jackson, they've been
in that spot and the flag comes out, and in
other cases maybe it doesn't. There's that whole judgment thing
which makes it really sticky, and that's why the league
(23:35):
put this rule in twenty twenty four. If you do it,
we're gonna expedite the review and we'll pick it up.
If you were let's just say a little too cautious
and you try to blur the line of the rule book.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
Well, judgment is a great turn poll. I couldn't have
said it better because it is a judgment call. That's
what all of these things are. It's more of a
reason why I've never been in face of pass interference
being reviewed, because that's also a judgment call. And you're
going to create more controversy. On a related note, real
quickly before we open up the lines, I don't know
how much you caught because obviously after the game you're
roaming around in the locker room. But Dart was peppered
(24:15):
with a lot of questions about his style of play.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
Paul yes, after the.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
Game, and I don't want to say it was different
than maybe other press conferences, but he got you know,
he fought.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Back, pushed back. I think is fair right in terms.
Speaker 4 (24:28):
Of the narratives that he needs to do a better
job of giving himself up, not taking hits. And the
point he made was he says, listen, if you go
back and you watch me back in my high school
career and in college, this is who I am.
Speaker 1 (24:42):
This is my DNA. I'm going to fight for the
extra yardage.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
I'm going to specifically on first down to get a
first down correct. That's his situational asterisk. Yeah, I will
always try to get the first down correct.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
And then he also brought up and he had said
this previously. He had said the Bears hit that he took,
what led to the concussion was because the ball was
being bobbled and he could embrace himself. So he said
that that was more of a rare occurrence as opposed
to when he's taken other hits in the field of play,
he's been able to protect himself.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
He told us during the week that that concussion against
Chicago was when he actually hit the ground. He said
the hit did not cause it, but.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
The fact that he could embrace himself for absorbing the ground.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
So I just thought that was a little bit interesting
because I thought we saw a little bit more emotion
out of Dart maybe in comparison to other press conferences.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Not to say that he was combative.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
I don't want to misinterpret it, but we did see
him get, you know, a little bit more fiery in
terms of not just accepting what is being painted out there.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That's his perspective.
Speaker 4 (25:47):
I mean, you could still argue when he's running up
the sideline, maybe you run out of play two yards earlier,
and you don't give Ellis an opportunity to put a
hit on you. You'll live to see another dowb gonna
make or bring the Giants offense. But I will defend him.
The play with Landry, he was giving himself up.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
He was sliding.
Speaker 4 (26:06):
So you can't really criticize Dart and say, oh, that
was an unnecessary hit. No, he was in the process
and Landry obviously was in the process of going for
the ball and trying to hit the quarterback. So those
two things can happen simultaneously. And what are you supposed
to tell Dart to do?
Speaker 2 (26:20):
The one flag was on Jalen Hawkins on the double
team against THEO Johnson on the sideline. Yeah, that went
under the unnecessary roughness well.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Because there was clearly a helmet to helmet contact on
that one.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
And you know, and by the way, THEO stood up
and so did a couple of other guys stood up
for Dart on that hill.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
Yeah, a lot of the offensive linemen, you know, run
Yin and Van Veran, I mean, all those guys, and
I don't blame them.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
I don't blame them for doing that.
Speaker 4 (26:46):
You like to see that now in the moment, you
know they're not going back and looking at the replay
to determine whether or not Dart was still in play.
So I have no issue with teammates coming to the
defense of others. I'll go back to not to get
off topic, and hard knocks actually starting up again tonight
on the NFC East Front. But when Mike Smith was
the head coach of the Falcons, Paul real quickly the
(27:06):
Falcons were on hard knocks. He starts off the season
in training camp, he puts film up. This always stood
out to me. It was Matt Ryan on the ground
after getting sacked. No one helped Matt Ryan get up,
none of the offensive lineman, none.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Of the team.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
And Mike Smith he starts off training camp, he goes,
We're not gonna have a team where our quarterback is
on the ground and you don't walk over and assist
him up. And that always stood out to me, And
I thought about that in the context of last night,
and this was maybe a little bit deeper, but it's
just getting in the process of guys on the ground,
you help him up, and you get in that habit
(27:42):
where you're gonna come to the defense and it builds.
I hate culture. Okay, it's a pet peeve of mine.
I'm not gonna use that, Okay, but you know I
don't like that word, so I'll use routine. Okay, can
we agree routine of this is what we do when
we're on the football field. We come to the defense
of others. We make sure that everybody's in good shape,
playing and play out. So the routine I thought was
(28:04):
very well executed.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
I think I totally agree with what you just said.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
I like that you can adopt it, just like the
spider Web. I borrowed it here or there?
Speaker 4 (28:14):
Okay, the quicksand of you know what, I'll let you
fill in the blank. We can be in a giving Yes,
I'll leave the foods to you. All right, let's open
up the phone lines as we move forward. We got
let's go to James in Georgia here with us on
Big Blue Kickoff Live.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
What's happened to James? What do you got for us?
Speaker 4 (28:33):
Hey?
Speaker 5 (28:33):
What's going on?
Speaker 6 (28:34):
Guys?
Speaker 3 (28:34):
You're right?
Speaker 1 (28:34):
What's on your mind?
Speaker 5 (28:36):
My last time I called, I was in Greece and
I was meaning the callback ever since, right before we
beat the Eagles. And there's to mean the callback ever
since just to okay, you know, say that you know,
everything that's been going on with the team and the
firing that came you know, a week or two too
(28:59):
late on all front. Just a lot going on with
this team that needs to be corrected. I actually called
the day just the I know. During the off season,
one of the topics was how do we close the
gap between just teams in our division, the quickest way
(29:19):
to the playoffs and all that. I don't know, this
season being a loss, I just called the you know
vent my frustrations.
Speaker 7 (29:29):
On the gap.
Speaker 5 (29:32):
Guess in general in the NFL, and the broadcast team
last night actually stole some of my thunder for the
day on how we have to get the right guy
in here at general manager and a head coach because
(29:53):
in the same time period, you know that we have
gone to a super Bowl with the Patriots, the Patriots
of seeming to turn themselves around, and we are still
in the in the dumpster.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
You know, if you.
Speaker 5 (30:08):
Want to compare yourself to more than just the NFC
East and look as.
Speaker 6 (30:13):
The as a whole.
Speaker 5 (30:15):
You know, John Merraking to play his fantasy football, we
are we're grossly failing and it's not because you know,
we pick from a different talent pool. Yeah, maybe the
scouting team, your your actual team evaluators might be missing
on evaluating who they're bringing into the building. But we
(30:39):
all picked from the same talent pool. Uh, you know,
the draft and free agents trained change hands. One guy,
you know, he could be on your team and then
go to another team and be a superstar. I'm just
calling data, say how how important it is to get
(31:00):
the right guy, the right guy in the building.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
Well, and also developing on that front too, I mean
New England and I saw the broadcast and James, we
just we want to get to a number of call
so we'll let you go on that point. But one
of the things that they were pointing out, Paul, because
obviously you were at the game, they put up a
graphic of all the free agent signings that the Patriots made,
and they hit on a bunch of them this year.
A lot of those guys came in and made an impact.
And then like Treveon Henderson in the draft class, who
(31:28):
now is getting more playing time, and how both of
those facets, along with Mike Rabel taking over and Josh
McDaniel's coming back as oc. It was a combination of
a variety of reasons why they were able to go
from four and thirteen to where they are right now.
Speaker 7 (31:41):
Now.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Of course, one of the ways you do that is
you set up your caps so where you have an
extensive amount of fun.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
Oh, they spent a boatload of money and they did
I a lot of guaranteed the Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
I don't remember the number, but there were six high
caliber veteran free agents that they brought in during this
offseason who were legit players. Yeah, I mean legit guys.
And quite frankly, Milton Williams wasn't even available last night.
He's injured, correct, how about that?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
And he's one of the guys they had big money on.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Yeah, you know I thought he was. To me, he
was the number one defensive tackle on the market.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
Well, they spent I believe it was about two hundred
million dollars in guaranteed money.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
But I'm just getting it was huge.
Speaker 4 (32:23):
Stefan Diggs okay, eighty percent completion rate between him.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
And Drake Now to be fair about Diggs, right, yeah,
he had had the horrible injury. Correct with the Texans, right,
Houston was like, Okay, we're not dealing with that, and
to New England's credit, they roll the dice on that
one because there was no way to tell. And quite frankly,
he's not the Stefan Diggs that he was before the injury.
He's definitely not the same caliber of player. But they've
(32:51):
certainly gotten a good version of him. Not a great version,
but a good version.
Speaker 4 (32:54):
Well, he's a great veteran wide receiver to give a
young quarterback who can make the big catches and help
move the chains. So I think that's what he services.
Harold Landry who we brought up earlier in the program.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Oh, it's one of Rabel's guys from Tennessee.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (33:09):
Robert Splaine who they brought up from the Steelers linebacker.
So he's a Carlton Davis who was all over the
place last night. Boy, him and Christian Gonzales excellent tacklers
by the way, for cornerbacks.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
Now, I've always been a Carlton Davis fan. I mean
he's been around those league now what good seventy eight years?
I think ya, he's with the Bucks. Always been a
big fan of his. But last night he was terrific.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
Yeah, the secondary overall, and that's the difference, by the way,
when those guys are engaged in stopping the run and
the short passing game, that's how you all of a
sudden take your defense to another level. Morgan Moses at
their right tackle position, venter offensive line.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
We thought of him more as a journeyman, but he's
certainly getting the job done right now. That look isn't
that kind of uh, It's more than a coincidence. It's
what happens is when you pay guys and you say, listen,
you got to come in here and be the back
of your football card, and they give you the back
of their football card. You know you need to get
(34:10):
what you paid for, or, if you're lucky, more than
what you paid for. Not one of these guys that
you mentioned have they come up short and given them
less than what the Patriots paid for. Every guy gave
him what they were supposed to give him.
Speaker 4 (34:28):
And then some Kiris Tanga who didn't play last night,
defensive lineman. He's another guy that has made an impact.
Jalen Hawkins, who you brought up earlier to the safety
calebon Chason, who was tied with Landry for the team
leading saxon half entering last night. So all of these guys,
some of them are big names, some of them are compliments.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
Hey Jason had been considered a bust until this year.
Speaker 4 (34:51):
Correct, But you know what we've seen that how many
times were a guy who at pan out with his
originally drafted team, he goes elsewhere all of a sudden,
it's a nice fit. Fus Veryble even talked about.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
Dirden, who was with the Giants.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
I comment, I saw.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
The so yeah, they certainly hit I though, just real quick.
I would not compare the Patriots and the Giants though,
because New England has been pretty steady with the exception
of the two four and thirteen seasons and back to
back years, so the Giants have gone lengthier with issues.
I don't think they're in the same boat. New England
could be utilized as a mirror image in terms of, okay,
(35:28):
this is what you need to do to get a
turnaround accomplished, But New England they didn't go through as
long as the Giants have been in terms of trying
to get this on the right track and the right page.
So I don't know if that's an ideal comparison both
of the organizations. From that standpoint, let's head back to
the phone lines. Let's check it with Marcus in California. Marcus,
(35:50):
welcome aboard. What do you got for us?
Speaker 3 (35:52):
Hey? I just wanted to say, man, that everything looks
so much better now that Davon got fired. The team
is doing so good.
Speaker 6 (36:02):
Man.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
You know, it's just become unbearable to watch. There is
a deep rooted incompetence in that building. I don't even
really have much more to say other than I hope
that you know next year is better. A bunch of
first round picks not playing put up to their potential.
(36:23):
You've got a staff they can't get anything out of anybody.
You've got Mike Kafka, who says he's going to come
in and be the great discipliner. But you benched at
duels parter when Cavon's not playing, and then what happens
seventeen points in the first quarter. We weren't getting blown
out thirty to seven in a first half when Dable
was here. The right move would have been to fire
(36:45):
him at the end of the season instead of turning
the Giants into a circus. And I feel like the
players are very upset the Dable's gone, and they quit
on the team. So I just hope that we get
somebody in there that knows what they're doing, and next
year we should be good. There's no football players. There's
(37:06):
better athletes, but there's no two football players like Jackson,
Darton camp Scattabow and they must be protected at all costs.
So I think you got to get rid of everybody,
and I hope everybody makes it out of the season healthy.
Thanks guys.
Speaker 4 (37:20):
All right, Marcus, I could have sworn he start off
saying that things look better without table and then went
the complete opposite direction. But maybe I'm hearing things necessarily
wise guy. Okay, yeah, because I picked up on that,
I was like, I don't really understand where we're going
with this. But that's all other story. We need another
show to explain that. Let's go back to the fault lines.
Marvin is at Delaware. What's happening, Coach Marvin?
Speaker 6 (37:42):
How you doing?
Speaker 2 (37:43):
Guys?
Speaker 1 (37:44):
You're right, what's on your mind?
Speaker 6 (37:47):
I used to say this every year and I'm saying
it again, and I see it. The Giants have three
people in that locker room that's causing this problem, and
that those three people are me, myself and I and
when those two those three people come in the locker room,
you're gonna have issues. And they do definitely have issues.
(38:10):
Last night, I'm with Paul. They got hammered and they
couldn't even recover from that the mistakes that they were making.
The guy that run a ninety four yard punt back,
there was no one around him. I think he didn't
even get touched or anybody got close to him. I
think Marcus what was that?
Speaker 1 (38:32):
No, Marcus Jones was the player that returned the punt
that you're referring to.
Speaker 6 (38:36):
Yeah, yeah, but the player that thirty one? I think
there's Jones for the Giants. Whoever was thirty one?
Speaker 2 (38:41):
Yeah? Nick Jones backup slot.
Speaker 6 (38:44):
Asked the punter. I met the punt returner, he was
behind him, and it was just it was just crazy.
Speaker 2 (38:55):
And coach, to be fair, those special teams from most
of the season, they've been really pretty done good. Excuse me,
I'm sorry. The kit the kicking situation has been kind
of weird because of the injuries and everything else, but
in terms of the kick coverage and the kick returns,
the Giants have had a strong season there. That's not
(39:17):
one unit that we really want to pick on They're
entitled to have a really bad day, and they did
have a really bad day. This was a total collapse
of the special teams unit, no question about that. But
for most of the season they've been really doing good.
Speaker 6 (39:34):
I don't I'm not disputing that. I'm just talking about
last night, because last night it was like clown is
type of special teams. Last night, there was a time
I seen Banks running behind the kick return return. He
wasn't in front of them blocking, he was behind him.
It was the weirdest thing I ever seen. And then
(39:55):
we have a kicker who actually well he kind of
looked like he kicked the ground, but he was trying
to stop himself from kicking, which becomes clownish. It just
I mean, Mike phone was blowing up.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Yeah, well, you know it's interesting.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Kafka after the game mentioned from his perspective, he thought
the exchange wasn't as clean as it should have been,
and that's why Coup sort of held up because he
didn't think that Gillan was going to put it in time,
and then obviously that's what led to a very awkward exchange.
There's no doubt about it. I don't think any of
us have seen that in the history of the National
Football League until last night.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
Yeah, I just saw.
Speaker 6 (40:30):
I just saw it on McAfee. He just went over it.
What happened is when he laid the kick down. When
he laid the ball down, the point on the ground
slipped just as he was going in motion to kick it,
so the ball kind of killed it underneath.
Speaker 1 (40:47):
Yep.
Speaker 6 (40:47):
And he thought they were it was going to be
a fire drill, and that's why he kind of tried
to stop himself from kicking it. So as I looked
at it just a few minutes ago, it looks like
it's not that he kicked the ground. He tried to
stop himself from My last part is they the Patriots,
(41:09):
tried to punish them. And dark have to understand people
are watching him. I hear people talking stupid stuff out.
He's wearing a necklace here, he got this. He thinks
he has this swag and how he's coming off. When
those guys start talking that way from the other team,
you better be aware they're aware of you and they're
coming to get you. Because if a deer keeps running
(41:33):
around lions, eventually he's going to get eaten. And we've
seen this with Carson Wentz. We've seen this with Luck.
Michael Vick went through this a little bit. These guys
on the defensive end, these are not high school dudes,
and these are not college guys. College guys don't have
(41:53):
as many of these types of players on the defense.
High school definitely don't have that many guys. So if
he's looking at it like I did this in my
high school in college years, you're gonna learn the hard way.
And there's no way we're fighting guys for hitting him. Legally,
(42:14):
everything that happened on that play was Dart's fault. The
hit was his fault, the fighting was his fault. And
at the end he says, I don't care. I'm gonna
play it the way I play it, and then that's
gonna be fine. But I don't think he's going to last.
I really don't. I have quarterbacks on lower levels and
(42:37):
I've seen them take hits, and I tell you, you better
get your butt down because those guys they are hunting
and you better be aware that they're hunting. And he
just saw his boy get hurt a few weeks ago.
Speaker 4 (42:51):
Scottish scattab but I mean that's a completely different play though,
I don't know if that's.
Speaker 6 (42:55):
Standpoint a lance, but you can't cut me off the day.
Speaker 4 (42:58):
I'm not coach, I'm not I'm not cutting you off.
We were just jumping in. I just don't think that's
a fair comparison. That's all I was pointing out.
Speaker 6 (43:05):
The comparison is not the hit. The comparison is that
when you run out there, you are in danger every
time you're out there. I'm not saying there that's saying it.
I'm saying that they are hunting you.
Speaker 4 (43:19):
Well, I mean, once again, you're jumping into the heads
of the opposition. That may be true for some, and
we'll let you go on that note. I don't know
if it's necessarily.
Speaker 6 (43:28):
You don't know who I am. You never know who
I dealt with in my life.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
Marvin.
Speaker 4 (43:32):
I'm not you're You're you're getting very You're making this
a battle royale. I'm not fighting back. I'm just saying
that you're jumping short, Okay. I'm not trying to get
into a battle royale with you. I'm just saying you're
jumping into the head of most of the players, and
I don't know if that's a fair assumption, is what
I'm saying what I'm not.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
But that doesn't make any of us right or wrong.
It's just a different perspective. That's what it is.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
You're looking to be the end all be all, and
that's not how conversation goes all the time.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
That's all.
Speaker 6 (44:01):
I'll tell you this. I'll tell you this. When I
was coaching, I made them hunt.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
Okay, And that's and your perspective is allowed.
Speaker 6 (44:10):
When somebody that played is on the show I'm calling
and I'm going to ask them, do any of their
players hunt? You speaking for all.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
I'm not speed for all.
Speaker 4 (44:18):
I'm just saying that it be it be ill informed
to label everybody under that part.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
That's all I'm saying. That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 6 (44:25):
On the defensive line, on the defensive side of the ball,
when a quarterback is running, they are hunting, and that
HiT's a hunt.
Speaker 2 (44:34):
Well, you know, coach, coach, to your point, let's address
the specific play, because I think moving forward, the better
idea is to discuss how he could have better handled
the situation. It's a second and thirteen and Dart has
to scramble out of the pocket and run up the
right sideline. Now, I don't know what his field division
(44:58):
was did he see the lineback coming in horizontally? I
hope that he would have seen him with his peripheral vision,
because had he done that, the perhaps wise play, and
I'll use wise as the adjective. The wise play is
it's a second and thirteen. Maybe the wise play is
(45:18):
go twelve yards and step out of bounds, which is
what we talking about earlier, and not get hit. For
go the extra yard, make it a third and one
and live for another play, and don't take the risk
of getting yourself popped, whether illegally or legally. That's one
less hit you have to take if you can just
(45:39):
turn yourself out of bounds one yard in front of
the marker. And that's the kind of thing I expect
that you or suspect you're trying to allude to, Right,
Coach Paul, you hit.
Speaker 6 (45:53):
It on the nose. You gave it a different perspective.
Speaker 2 (45:56):
I'm just describing the play because I think that's the
easiest way to do it. But describe the play, and
how how would you like to see it better done?
Speaker 3 (46:05):
Well?
Speaker 6 (46:05):
I looked at the play not too long ago. I'm
watching on McAfee, and you're right, maybe the way. It
looked like he looked like he could because there was
a I think it was one Dell in front of
two Patriot.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yes, absolutely in between.
Speaker 6 (46:21):
He was in between dark. Maybe Dark didn't see him.
Speaker 2 (46:26):
I don't know. Yeah, I don't know either.
Speaker 6 (46:29):
But as I'm coaching, I'm always saying, and you heard this,
you got to keep your head on the swim.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
You do you do.
Speaker 6 (46:37):
People are running everywhere and it coming from every angle.
But you may have a point there which I can understand.
I can understand that point, but they just not my
vision of what I see and what I experienced and
have dealt with people that I dealt with to say, oh, ye,
you're just hallucinating that. That's not everybody. That's not that's true,
(47:00):
and that's not right to do.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
Well, that wasn't said Marvin in fairness, that we weren't generalizing, well,
I think you're misclassifying that. I appreciate the phone call.
We'll let you go on that note. We were not
telling you that you were hallucinamy. Those words never came
out of my mouth. I simply said that I think
it's unfair to classify that all defensive players are hunting
quarterbacks when they're out in the open field. I just
don't think that's a fair classification. And I'll bring my
(47:24):
perspective from working shows and talking to a lot of
former defensive players and having conversations on and off the air,
that has never come up that they have said when
a quarterback takes off and runs, they always had the
mindset to go hunting after them. So that's the perspective
that I'm coming from. You're entitled to your perspective. I'm
entitled to my perspective. There's no right or wrong answer.
There's some of you you call up and you want
(47:45):
to have like an end all be all judgment of Okay,
he's right, he's wrong. That's not how dialogue and conversation goes.
So that's where I was coming from. I don't think
it was personal at all. If you want to take
it that way, that's fine, but that's not how I
was coming from. Let's head to the phone lines. Lou
Is in Pennsylvania, lou welcome aboard. What do you got
for us?
Speaker 3 (48:05):
Thank guys.
Speaker 7 (48:05):
I just want to toention on the what what coach
Barvin said he was his respect was wrong because he
classified the Jackson Dart and the camp catabole hit at
the same thing, which is two different things. Anyway, Yep,
my question I wanted to ask with the cornerbacks, it
(48:25):
seems like, I know we're not playing it's not press coverage,
but it seems like when they're giving them a free release,
and not only they give them a free release as
soon as the bone has set, they dropped back five
yards or ten yards in coverage and that the receiver
is just going on a car route and get a
short pass. I don't want Is that something Am I
(48:48):
seeing that wrong? Or that happens a lot with this team?
Is it happened in Dallas in the beginning of the season.
Speaker 2 (48:55):
Well, I know, I know then.
Speaker 7 (48:58):
Went in the middle to catch in the middle of
the field. It's just it seems like whatever it is
taught and it's press coverage.
Speaker 2 (49:06):
We had this conversation at least I did with Jonathan
on one of the shows last week. I invite you
to go back and take a listen to that one.
There is Yeah, you don't have to play press coverage
and jam a guy at the line in order to
be five yards off the line of scrimmage and then
rerouting him. There are different ways to do that. It's
(49:27):
not always the same, and I do agree with you
that over the last two years the Giants have allowed
way too many free releases and not done enough to
impede reroute receivers and throw off the timing of the
other team's passing game. In general, I totally agree with
what you're saying, and so did Jonathan specifically last night. Look,
(49:52):
I got back at four am in the morning. I
have not rewatched the game tape yet. Okay, I'm being
perfectly honest with you. I will pick this single part
play by play. It's within the next twenty four hours.
But so I'm not gonna comment any further on last
night's game about that at that particular aspect of it.
Speaker 7 (50:09):
I just have onemal thing to say, yeah, real quickly,
And sometimes I tell my kids, hey, don't do this.
You're gonna get hurt. Sometimes you have to let them
get hurt to understand. After Guard had the interview after
the game and somebody asked, why don't you run out
of bounce and his comment was, it's football, gonna get hit. Yes,
(50:31):
that's a given, but sometimes you just have to run
out of bounce. It's like he has to get hurt,
and that's the only way he's gonna understand the team
needs him more on the field than injured off the field.
Like he's young and necessarily understands that it would never change. Unfortunately,
he has that mindset, but he has to get hurt.
(50:53):
And it hurts me to say it. It sucks, but
it's never gonna change. All right, guys, I listened to the.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
Foot Thank you very much, you got it.
Speaker 4 (51:01):
Appreciate the phone call well, And that's why I brought
up what he had mentioned in the press conference.
Speaker 1 (51:06):
Whether or not, you know, God forbid, he has to
get hurt.
Speaker 4 (51:09):
I mean, you could argue he already has dealt with
a concussion, so I'm sure that at least has served
as a reminder. But it's a little bit different, you know,
once again, when it's the old story. When Joe Burrow,
not to get off topic, was asked about why is
he coming back on the field Paul to play in
the last game when he could pretty much just say
take the rest of the season off, right the Bengals,
(51:29):
it's hard for them to make the playoffs. He said,
I'm a football player, I'm paid to play football. Okay,
it's routine. So it's the same thing with Tart. His
routine has been he's going to fight for the extra yardage,
and it's hard to reprogram. I guess is what I'm
getting a player to think differently when they've been doing
it this way for a very long period of time.
Speaker 2 (51:51):
Jim Brown used to talk about Franco Harris the same way, right.
He would criticize Franco for avoiding hits and maybe getting
out of bounds, and Franco was like, Okay, well, guess what.
I've lasted a long time in this league. I've won
championships and he's going to the Hall of Fame. So
different strokes for different folks.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
Yeah, absolutely, all right, we're gonna leave it at that.
Speaker 4 (52:11):
We've got a press conference coming up in a little
bit as Joe Shane will be speaking with reporters as
the Giants prepare for the bye week, So we'll have
full coverage coming up on Giants dot Com.
Speaker 1 (52:23):
And it's important to note we are going to take a.
Speaker 4 (52:25):
Brief hiatus here on Big Blue Kickoff Live for the
remainder of the week with the team on buy and
the office closed, so we'll be back up and running
on Monday of next week with the next new episode.
So I just want everybody to be alert in terms
of the programming for the next few days. With that
being said, certainly appreciate everybody for tuning in to Big
(52:46):
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It is presented by Cadillac, the official luxury vehicle of
the New York Giants, and we are broadcasting from the
Giants Podcast Studio presented by Hackensack Meridian Health. Keep getting
better so The Giants entering the buy on a seven
game skid after falling to the Patriots on Monday Night,
football last night, thirty three to fifteen special teams clearly
(01:11):
a huge storyline. So Paul and I will provide some
takeaways before we open up the dialogue on other fronts.
And Paul, that's where I want to start, because this
was really the first game, at least from a big
picture perspective, where it just didn't seem as if the
Giants were going to be in the thickes things as
the game progressed once that first quarter unraveled. Whereas every
(01:33):
other game this season, regardless of the result, you would say,
all right, the Giants have been in it, they've kept
themselves competitive.
Speaker 1 (01:40):
Correct, last night was the first.
Speaker 4 (01:41):
Time that it was really overall a non competitive game.
And while you could point the finger at a variety
of different facets, it's hard to overlook special teams. And
before I get your reaction, I just want to go
over starting field positioning for New England. To me defined
the first half the open and kickoff, they had a
(02:02):
huge return for thirty nine yards, they started their own
forty seven. It stalls out in the red zone, but
they get three points. Then the punt return for a
touchdown ninety four yards for Marcus Jones. Then after that
the Giants punted. So you had actually decent field positioning
that the Giants put the Patriots in and no surprise,
(02:25):
they actually forced them to punt. But then after that
it became just a theme where the starting field positioning
was humongous for the Patriots. It was either a short
field as a result of a turnover on downs, you
had the Botch field goal attempt, you had the fourth
down conversions that did not pan out, and New England
made the Giants pay time and time again.
Speaker 2 (02:47):
The Patriots all season long have made a living playing clean, sound,
fundamental football. They did it again last night. I mean
the Botch field goal. At that point, it's seventeen to seven. Okay,
(03:07):
the Giants get that field goal. It's a seventeen to
ten to one score game. Now, I'm not going to
suggest the Giants come back and win the game. They
were beaten at all three phases throughout the entire evening.
This was not their night. From the opening kickoff, the
Patriots were fowling at the mouth. Rabel clearly wanted to
prove to a national television audience that the Patriots deserve
(03:31):
to have the best record in the NFL, regardless of
how soft their schedule is, regardless of how their red
zone offense and defense is very poor, blah blah blah,
blah blah. He was tired of hearing about how they
were a paper lion, and if you listen to the
quotes or read the quotes from the Patriots and him
after the game, he made it a point to have
(03:53):
his Patriots sky high and souped up and to show
the NFL that you better start thinking about us as
a team that's going to go far into the playoffs.
This was, in my opinion, this was an absolute statement
game by the Patriots. They showed it from the first
(04:17):
snap and that's why it was not the Giants night.
I don't think they would have come back and won
the game. But had coub been able to connect on
the field goal, had the snap been cleaned, and had
he kicked it and at seventeen ten, maybe you got
a chance to make that game competitive. Maybe you do,
maybe you don't. But from that point forward, the damn broke.
(04:43):
It was Niagara Falls and it went all downhill.
Speaker 4 (04:46):
Yeah, because you gave the football to the Patriots at
the Giants forty five yard line after the botchfield goal,
attempt and then they were able to turn it into
a touchdown probably one of the best passes that Drake
May made to Kyle Williams in the left corner of
the end zone where it was either going to be
an incomplete pass or it was going to be a touchdown,
which is exactly how it played out. And now to
(05:08):
your point, instead of maybe seventeen to ten, all of
a sudden, it's now twenty four to seven. And that's
how quickly a game can change.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
And the one thing that I think, you know you
have to take into account here is that the Pats
the Pats, they've got this momentum going right now that
once they seem to get that ball rolling, they don't
(05:41):
give it up. They just don't give it up. And
we've seen some games have some ebb and flow. This
game didn't have an ebb and flow. Even when the
Giants had a chance to take some of that flow
and they didn't do it. The Patriots just kept pushing
the pedal to the metal. It's my opinion, and you
can disagree if you like. As they rolled through the
(06:03):
second half of this game, had they wanted to, I
think they could have piled it up even more, I
really do as possible was that one sided.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
Yeah, I don't know if I would classify to say
that they took their foot off the pedal, because if
you saw on the second half, Rabel was keeping his
offense on the field on a fourth down or two, yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (06:22):
He had them go for it.
Speaker 4 (06:23):
So I think they had the intent that we still
want to put as many points on the board. You know,
maybe when it got to a fourth and down situation,
he said, listen, let's not roll the dice. Let's at
least get some padding attempt to field go. Remember there
was one missfield goal in the second half, so they
could have easily had thirty six points. But I still
so touchdown taken back to correct the one to Hunter
(06:45):
Henry where they were offsetting penalties. But I would think
that from watching that game, Mike Vrabel still was emphasizing
to his team, hey, this game is not necessarily over.
Even though it may seem as if were up comfortably,
and I thought they did keep in a aggressive pursuit
in the second half. I just don't think the Giants
could match it in any manner, and that was problematic
(07:06):
also given the fact that this was one of the
first times we talked about off the top pall where
the Giants were playing from behind right, they've actually been
playing ahead and have not been able to maintain leads
or have been right within striking distance. They got behind
by double digits. And what had the Giants done the
last two weeks that I had been mentioning. They ran
the ball nearly forty times in each of the last
(07:27):
two games right thirty eight thirty nine respectively. Now they
finished with twenty seven runs in singletary we saw in
the second half, but the flow of the game doesn't
give you the luxury to continually pound the football, so
that also proved to be problematic, where whether Kafka intended
or not, it was going to be a pass happy
game in the second half, just based on what the
(07:50):
situation called for, and the strength right now of the
Giants is upfront with the offensive line playing fairly well,
being able to run block and then being able to
stay in manageable third downs as a result of a
variety of different running backs. That luxury was not afforded
them last night because of how quickly they got down
(08:10):
and had to play catch up.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
And the only two chunk plays with the touchdowns Singletary
on the direct snap when he ran twenty two yards
around the right side. That was a really nice play
and certainly an exciting play, and it was executed very well.
And Slayton did a really nice job thirty yards to
run through the secondary on that catch and run for
(08:32):
thirty yards. Ironically, you know, you talk about two guys
who were really pros, pros, very well liked by the staff,
very well liked by their teammates. For Slayton, that was
his first touchdown catch I noticed that season.
Speaker 1 (08:46):
I tweeted that out as happened. Yeah, okay, hard to
believe a little bit.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
His last one was against the Colts the second to
last game of last year. And for Singletary, that was
his season high in yard at sixty eight I think
was his number last night. He had not run for
that many yards in a game since Week two last
year against Washington. Now, of course, Tyrone Tracy pretty much
(09:11):
took that job. Opportunity was Singlitary got hurt, Tracy took
the job and ran with it. But you know, these
are two guys who you know, they were the light
glimmer of hope in the flashlight in terms of positivity
coming out of that game.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Well.
Speaker 4 (09:28):
Interestingly, speaking of numbers in a bats as I like
to call it, in each of the last three weeks,
Singletary has had double digit carries. Prior to that poll,
he never had a game with at least ten. Eight
was his high. So you're seeing, all right, you're using
him more. He has been able to take advantage as
a result of the play up front. So it's just
the fact that he now has been afforded a chance
(09:50):
to capitalize on these additional carries. He just he was
third on the depth chart, right, you had Scataboo, you
had Tracy, and now all of a sudden, with both
of those guys banged up, and Tracy it's being labeled
as a hip injury. We'll see coming out of the
buy where he stands. Singletary's number was called again. He
has familiarity given his ties to Dable going back to Buffalo,
(10:12):
and he's been with Kafkan and so forth, so it's
no surprise that they would turn to him. And I
think it's also a product of even though he's been
in the league for several years, bit of fresh legs.
Now he's operating with right Paul because there wasn't a
lot of wear and tear on his body. I mean,
think about it, You'd have to go two games combined
San Francisco and Chicago to equate to the total amount
(10:35):
of carries that he had in the Green Bay game,
and then you'd have to take three or four games
prior to that to get to what he did in
the Lions game. So he's probably feeling as if he's
a second year players out right at this stage in
the season, just because the usage hasn't been there.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
I'm glad for him because he's soft spoken, you know,
he doesn't make a lot of noise, certainly never complain
about his situation and his role on the team. He
just goes out there and does what he's told, does
his job. Again, we hear the term pros pro all
the time, class act and you know, I've talked to
(11:13):
him several times after losses. He always handles himself in
a top of the line matter. So I'm glad for
him to get a little more chance to play and
whatever happens from now till the end of the season
for him, if he wants to keep playing in the NFL,
I hope that there's a spot for him next year,
whether or not it's on the Giants or with somebody else.
(11:35):
I think he's a quality NFL guy to have in
your locker.
Speaker 4 (11:39):
Room and still can be productive depending on how you
utilize it. He's not going to bring him in to
be the number one back now, he could be a
complimentary weapon. I think there's a place for him in
the NFL. Few of the things I want to get
into just in terms of decision making and plays in
the game. And you and I were talking about this
even before the show. Kafka has proven to be very
aggressive since he took over as the headman in the
(12:03):
first two games that he was the coach, and it
was it just seemed a little bit out of character.
And he did address this after the game when they
had the possession late in the second quarter. It was
twenty seven to seven and they're set up for a
fourth and one, and they ultimately decided to bring out
Jamie Gillen to punt and the Patriots. But you want
(12:23):
to talk about textbook how to run a one minute
drill with one time out left? Wow, Drake May five
plays sixty seven yards. They salvaged that one time out
to help set up the.
Speaker 1 (12:35):
Field goal late.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
Whether you have any rooting interest, I mean, that's the
film you want to review in terms of how to
take advantage of a small period of time and still
wind up walking away with points on the board and oh,
leaving no time left for the opposition to get possession.
Speaker 1 (12:50):
They kicked that field goal.
Speaker 4 (12:51):
That was the last play of the first half, So
whether it was a make or amiss, that was going
to be it. I think New England deserves a lot
of credit. But I want to flip the script here
to theions.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
Hold on, yeah, hold on, okay, busted coverage in the
right flat. Stevenson goes, yeah, the wide open, sure, okay,
but that's a that's a bust. Well, that has nothing
to do with the Patriots Schematically, that was a busted
coverage and they got a chunk play of over thirty
five yards out of it. Without that play, they're not
(13:21):
pulling off what you're pulling. What you're talking about, well, they.
Speaker 4 (13:23):
Still could have very well got in a field goal opportunity,
depending on what would have happened. I'm not saying they
would a touchdown, but I'm just talking about how they
managed the clock.
Speaker 1 (13:30):
They waited, I know, but let's not get the time out.
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Let's not glow too much over because there was a
there was clearly a busted coverage that really was the
big chunk of it.
Speaker 4 (13:39):
I mean, listen, you're not apologizing. Hold on, you gave
a whole dissertation okay at the beginning about and Mike
Rabel wanted to prove that the schedule you know, may
have been not the touch.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
They took advantage of it, all right, they took it.
Speaker 4 (13:52):
I'm not gonna sit here and apologize for broken down
coverage from the opposing team.
Speaker 2 (13:56):
They took advantage of absolutely every flaw in the Giant's armor.
It was ugly, yeah, to be honest.
Speaker 4 (14:03):
Well, and one of the things they did take advantage here,
and this was my main point, was they took over okay,
at their own twenty three. So you figured, even though
you need gopher it on fourth and one, you're still
not putting your defense in a precarious spot.
Speaker 1 (14:16):
That wasn't the issue.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
It was just if you would have picked up the
one yard what that could have done to help extend
the drive, maybe milk the clock, you walk away with
maybe a scoring opportunity at New England, doesn't get a
field goal, and Kafka, he and his press conference did
say it was one of those things that he went
back and forth with. Yes, in the moment, he admitted
and he acknowledged that it wasn't cut and dry. He
(14:38):
was going back and forth, and ultimately field positioning was
what he determined influenced him to say, Hey, we're gonna punt.
Is opposed to go for it and then give New
England even more favorable field positioning because of what transpired
earlier in the first hand.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Well, also he knew he was getting the third quarter kickoff. Sure, yep,
I'm sure that was part of it, no detail.
Speaker 4 (15:02):
But I guess my one counter to that would have been,
but maybe here's an opportunity to double dip.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
You get the ball right to start the third quarter.
Speaker 4 (15:09):
If you actually do hold onto the ball, maybe you
get two scoring opportunities.
Speaker 1 (15:12):
So I think there's two ways of looking.
Speaker 4 (15:14):
At it, at least through the lens of how Kafka
was thinking about it. But that was just it was
interesting to me only because he's proven to be a
guy that's going to keep his foot on the pedal
and be aggressive. Remember, he was answering questions against the
Lions the previous week, where many people were saying you
should have taken the field goal, and he said, no,
(15:35):
we were in this position multiple times during the season,
and I talked about this on last Wednesday show, and
I had no issue with that aggressive approach. It didn't
work out, but that doesn't necessarily make the decision ill informed.
So if you look at how he's gone through his
decision making process, I was a.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
Little bit surprised that he didn't go thraight forth in one.
Speaker 2 (15:53):
That's fair and I and I appreciate his honesty. Yeah,
after the game saying that it was a close call,
he actually thought that both options were viable. So look again,
whatever happens on that play, I just think it was
the Patriots night all around. I don't know that the
Giants necessarily we're going to be in position to win
(16:16):
this game. I thought New England habited them, they did
what they wanted to do.
Speaker 4 (16:21):
They were outplayed in every facet. Special teams I think
is the one at the forefront, just because of the
field positioning. And remember it wasn't just the Botch field goal,
it was also and hopefully Gunner Oschewsky will recover him,
and that was a really hard hit he took.
Speaker 1 (16:34):
But you know that fumble also set them up, destroyed
his helmet.
Speaker 2 (16:38):
Yeah, hard, sure destroyed his helmet.
Speaker 4 (16:43):
Now, it's important to note, and this was discuss also
on the broadcast, because I'm sure a lot of people
saw the.
Speaker 1 (16:49):
Helmet to helmet hit and there was no doubt about
it. It was a helmet to helmet hit.
Speaker 4 (16:52):
Yeah, but on that play because he's an established runner
by that point, and this is maybe issues that you
could have with how the NFL rules are written, but
that was officiated correctly that it was not a personal
foul based on how it is broken down in terms
of where he is on that special team's return. I
just wanted to clarify that because I'm sure a lot
(17:12):
of viewers saw that and said, how is a flag
not thrown? Well, there was a reason why it wasn't.
Speaker 3 (17:17):
You know.
Speaker 2 (17:17):
That's one of those plays where the optics are bad
and your feeling makes you sick to your stomach. It's like,
this guy just got absolutely smashed to the head. But legally,
the rules of the league say that that's an okay
play and you have to live by that. Now, whether
(17:40):
or not you like it, that's another story. You don't
have to like it. But as we've all said, it's
very very very difficult, if not impossible, to legislate helmet
to helmet hits on the basis that the game is
played so quickly, so fast, sang Bank angles are very
(18:02):
very difficult to ascertain geometrically in terms of a player's intent,
very very difficult to do. So it's a rough game,
and they were going to be inherent plays that are
going to be ugly, that will turn your stomach, that
will make you wins, but are also going to be legal.
And that's just it.
Speaker 4 (18:23):
And that brings us to two other plays that I
want to address before we open up the lines. And
of course, Jackson Dart first game back after missing the
last two due to a concussion, and he took some
hits in this game. Harold Landry was the first hit,
though to me, there was nothing wrong with it.
Speaker 1 (18:41):
He was slid.
Speaker 4 (18:42):
Dart gave himself up and Landry basically hurtled over him.
And I know people want to break down every frame
by frame. First of all, the officials don't have the luxury.
They're not X men. Okay, they don't have super elements
in terms of their vision. They can't process things. It's
like slow motion replay that were being when we're all
on our couches. So I didn't have an issue with
(19:02):
that play. And then the Ellis hit on the sideline.
It was a hard hit, there's no doubt about it.
But you watch the replay, Dart was still in bounds
when it happened. And again textbook definition of a legal hit.
Speaker 2 (19:14):
Yes, that's true. The textbook says that's a legal hit.
Was it unnecessary? Was it over zealous? I totally agreed
that it was unnecessary and that it was over zealous,
But I also totally agreed that it was legal within
the framework of the NFL rules. In that case, It's
one of those plays that can be both it's legal,
(19:36):
but it also makes you wins because you feel like,
oh wow, I mean, did he really have to launch
himself into the neck and shoulder area and send the
guy horizontally into the air and several feet out of bounds. No.
I think it's pretty clear that he easily could have
shoved him out of bounce. He could have hit him
(19:59):
in the midsection and put him out. He could have
gone for his legs and knocked his legs out. He
did not have to hit him coming one hundred and
fifty miles an hour horizontally across the field and literally
launch into him and send him flying. He did not
have to do that. But is it legal, Yes, it
(20:20):
is legal.
Speaker 1 (20:21):
So it was one of those plays.
Speaker 4 (20:23):
And I told you this off air where I thought
the optics were a lot worse than perhaps the actual
play because he did take flight dart and you could
tell his response to the hit. But once again, the
job of the officials and it's not an ideal formula,
but this goes back to the play we were talking
about with Oshevski. They need to interpret the play in
(20:44):
real time, very fast, based on the Ridden rule. Okay,
that's their job. They not supposed to take intent into consideration.
It's not their jump to get into the head of
the player and what the player was thinking, whether or
not they were looking to hurt. It's the Ridden rule
that they're supposed to know backwards and forwards and applying
that to what they're seeing in real time. That's the
(21:06):
process of officiating. But this is also the human element
of the game. But I actually thought under those circumstances
that we just laid out. They did a pretty good job,
because Paul, you put anybody else in that situation, bang
bang play. That is hard in that moment to know
whether or not the officials had every reason to throw
the flag on the Dart hit. They had every excuse
(21:27):
in the book to throw that flag as a personal
foul because of how Dart took flight and how hard
he was hit. They had every reason to throw the flag.
But the official in the moment noticed that Dart was
still in play, and that's hard to officiate.
Speaker 2 (21:40):
I would argue, well to your point, and this is
a very little known fact that I don't know about
the television broadcast because obviously I was at the game.
But in twenty twenty four, the NFL put a new
rule in place to specifically address this kind of play.
If a player gets plastered, if you will, hammered crushed
(22:06):
right along the sideline, they use expedited replay to potentially
pick up a flag. So, in other words, in the
interest of safety, the official has the room to throw
the flag if he thinks it's close enough that the
player may or may not have touched the sideline. He's
(22:30):
got the ability under the expedited replay rule, and this
only started in twenty twenty four. Throw the flag, they
kick it upstairs, real quick. Expeduided replay says, Okay, we've
reviewed the replay. He is within the field of play.
He was not out of bounds, he was not going out.
(22:51):
We can pick up the flag. Now, you can't add
a flag with this rule after you can only pick
it up. So to your point, if you want to
error on the side of caution to promote safety and
to protect the player, you could have argued and maybe
in many cases an official would have thrown that flag.
(23:13):
I think we've all heard the stories and we've all
seen them where some of your Brady's and your Mahomes's
and some of your superstar quarterbacks Lamar Jackson, they've been
in that spot and the flag comes out, and in
other cases maybe it doesn't. There's that whole judgment thing
which makes it really sticky, and that's why the league
(23:35):
put this rule in twenty twenty four. If you do it,
we're gonna expedite the review and we'll pick it up.
If you were let's just say a little too cautious
and you try to blur the line of the rule book.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
Well, judgment is a great turn poll. I couldn't have
said it better because it is a judgment call. That's
what all of these things are. It's more of a
reason why I've never been in face of pass interference
being reviewed, because that's also a judgment call. And you're
going to create more controversy. On a related note, real
quickly before we open up the lines, I don't know
how much you caught because obviously after the game you're
roaming around in the locker room. But Dart was peppered
(24:15):
with a lot of questions about his style of play.
Speaker 1 (24:18):
Paul yes, after the.
Speaker 4 (24:19):
Game, and I don't want to say it was different
than maybe other press conferences, but he got you know,
he fought.
Speaker 1 (24:25):
Back, pushed back. I think is fair right in terms.
Speaker 4 (24:28):
Of the narratives that he needs to do a better
job of giving himself up, not taking hits. And the
point he made was he says, listen, if you go
back and you watch me back in my high school
career and in college, this is who I am.
Speaker 1 (24:42):
This is my DNA. I'm going to fight for the
extra yardage.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
I'm going to specifically on first down to get a
first down correct. That's his situational asterisk. Yeah, I will
always try to get the first down correct.
Speaker 4 (24:55):
And then he also brought up and he had said
this previously. He had said the Bears hit that he took,
what led to the concussion was because the ball was
being bobbled and he could embrace himself. So he said
that that was more of a rare occurrence as opposed
to when he's taken other hits in the field of play,
he's been able to protect himself.
Speaker 2 (25:14):
He told us during the week that that concussion against
Chicago was when he actually hit the ground. He said
the hit did not cause it, but.
Speaker 1 (25:23):
The fact that he could embrace himself for absorbing the ground.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (25:27):
So I just thought that was a little bit interesting
because I thought we saw a little bit more emotion
out of Dart maybe in comparison to other press conferences.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Not to say that he was combative.
Speaker 4 (25:36):
I don't want to misinterpret it, but we did see
him get, you know, a little bit more fiery in
terms of not just accepting what is being painted out there.
Speaker 1 (25:46):
That's his perspective.
Speaker 4 (25:47):
I mean, you could still argue when he's running up
the sideline, maybe you run out of play two yards earlier,
and you don't give Ellis an opportunity to put a
hit on you. You'll live to see another dowb gonna
make or bring the Giants offense. But I will defend him.
The play with Landry, he was giving himself up.
Speaker 1 (26:05):
He was sliding.
Speaker 4 (26:06):
So you can't really criticize Dart and say, oh, that
was an unnecessary hit. No, he was in the process
and Landry obviously was in the process of going for
the ball and trying to hit the quarterback. So those
two things can happen simultaneously. And what are you supposed
to tell Dart to do?
Speaker 2 (26:20):
The one flag was on Jalen Hawkins on the double
team against THEO Johnson on the sideline. Yeah, that went
under the unnecessary roughness well.
Speaker 1 (26:29):
Because there was clearly a helmet to helmet contact on
that one.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
And you know, and by the way, THEO stood up
and so did a couple of other guys stood up
for Dart on that hill.
Speaker 4 (26:39):
Yeah, a lot of the offensive linemen, you know, run
Yin and Van Veran, I mean, all those guys, and
I don't blame them.
Speaker 1 (26:44):
I don't blame them for doing that.
Speaker 4 (26:46):
You like to see that now in the moment, you
know they're not going back and looking at the replay
to determine whether or not Dart was still in play.
So I have no issue with teammates coming to the
defense of others. I'll go back to not to get
off topic, and hard knocks actually starting up again tonight
on the NFC East Front. But when Mike Smith was
the head coach of the Falcons, Paul real quickly the
(27:06):
Falcons were on hard knocks. He starts off the season
in training camp, he puts film up. This always stood
out to me. It was Matt Ryan on the ground
after getting sacked. No one helped Matt Ryan get up,
none of the offensive lineman, none.
Speaker 1 (27:21):
Of the team.
Speaker 4 (27:22):
And Mike Smith he starts off training camp, he goes,
We're not gonna have a team where our quarterback is
on the ground and you don't walk over and assist
him up. And that always stood out to me, And
I thought about that in the context of last night,
and this was maybe a little bit deeper, but it's
just getting in the process of guys on the ground,
you help him up, and you get in that habit
(27:42):
where you're gonna come to the defense and it builds.
I hate culture. Okay, it's a pet peeve of mine.
I'm not gonna use that, Okay, but you know I
don't like that word, so I'll use routine. Okay, can
we agree routine of this is what we do when
we're on the football field. We come to the defense
of others. We make sure that everybody's in good shape,
playing and play out. So the routine I thought was
(28:04):
very well executed.
Speaker 2 (28:05):
I think I totally agree with what you just said.
Speaker 1 (28:08):
I like that you can adopt it, just like the
spider Web. I borrowed it here or there?
Speaker 4 (28:14):
Okay, the quicksand of you know what, I'll let you
fill in the blank. We can be in a giving Yes,
I'll leave the foods to you. All right, let's open
up the phone lines as we move forward. We got
let's go to James in Georgia here with us on
Big Blue Kickoff Live.
Speaker 1 (28:31):
What's happened to James? What do you got for us?
Speaker 4 (28:33):
Hey?
Speaker 5 (28:33):
What's going on?
Speaker 6 (28:34):
Guys?
Speaker 3 (28:34):
You're right?
Speaker 1 (28:34):
What's on your mind?
Speaker 5 (28:36):
My last time I called, I was in Greece and
I was meaning the callback ever since, right before we
beat the Eagles. And there's to mean the callback ever
since just to okay, you know, say that you know,
everything that's been going on with the team and the
firing that came you know, a week or two too
(28:59):
late on all front. Just a lot going on with
this team that needs to be corrected. I actually called
the day just the I know. During the off season,
one of the topics was how do we close the
gap between just teams in our division, the quickest way
(29:19):
to the playoffs and all that. I don't know, this
season being a loss, I just called the you know
vent my frustrations.
Speaker 7 (29:29):
On the gap.
Speaker 5 (29:32):
Guess in general in the NFL, and the broadcast team
last night actually stole some of my thunder for the
day on how we have to get the right guy
in here at general manager and a head coach because
(29:53):
in the same time period, you know that we have
gone to a super Bowl with the Patriots, the Patriots
of seeming to turn themselves around, and we are still
in the in the dumpster.
Speaker 3 (30:07):
You know, if you.
Speaker 5 (30:08):
Want to compare yourself to more than just the NFC
East and look as.
Speaker 6 (30:13):
The as a whole.
Speaker 5 (30:15):
You know, John Merraking to play his fantasy football, we
are we're grossly failing and it's not because you know,
we pick from a different talent pool. Yeah, maybe the
scouting team, your your actual team evaluators might be missing
on evaluating who they're bringing into the building. But we
(30:39):
all picked from the same talent pool. Uh, you know,
the draft and free agents trained change hands. One guy,
you know, he could be on your team and then
go to another team and be a superstar. I'm just
calling data, say how how important it is to get
(31:00):
the right guy, the right guy in the building.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
Well, and also developing on that front too, I mean
New England and I saw the broadcast and James, we
just we want to get to a number of call
so we'll let you go on that point. But one
of the things that they were pointing out, Paul, because
obviously you were at the game, they put up a
graphic of all the free agent signings that the Patriots made,
and they hit on a bunch of them this year.
A lot of those guys came in and made an impact.
And then like Treveon Henderson in the draft class, who
(31:28):
now is getting more playing time, and how both of
those facets, along with Mike Rabel taking over and Josh
McDaniel's coming back as oc. It was a combination of
a variety of reasons why they were able to go
from four and thirteen to where they are right now.
Speaker 7 (31:41):
Now.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
Of course, one of the ways you do that is
you set up your caps so where you have an
extensive amount of fun.
Speaker 4 (31:48):
Oh, they spent a boatload of money and they did
I a lot of guaranteed the Yeah.
Speaker 2 (31:53):
I don't remember the number, but there were six high
caliber veteran free agents that they brought in during this
offseason who were legit players. Yeah, I mean legit guys.
And quite frankly, Milton Williams wasn't even available last night.
He's injured, correct, how about that?
Speaker 1 (32:10):
And he's one of the guys they had big money on.
Speaker 2 (32:12):
Yeah, you know I thought he was. To me, he
was the number one defensive tackle on the market.
Speaker 4 (32:18):
Well, they spent I believe it was about two hundred
million dollars in guaranteed money.
Speaker 2 (32:22):
But I'm just getting it was huge.
Speaker 4 (32:23):
Stefan Diggs okay, eighty percent completion rate between him.
Speaker 2 (32:27):
And Drake Now to be fair about Diggs, right, yeah,
he had had the horrible injury. Correct with the Texans, right,
Houston was like, Okay, we're not dealing with that, and
to New England's credit, they roll the dice on that
one because there was no way to tell. And quite frankly,
he's not the Stefan Diggs that he was before the injury.
He's definitely not the same caliber of player. But they've
(32:51):
certainly gotten a good version of him. Not a great version,
but a good version.
Speaker 4 (32:54):
Well, he's a great veteran wide receiver to give a
young quarterback who can make the big catches and help
move the chains. So I think that's what he services.
Harold Landry who we brought up earlier in the program.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
Oh, it's one of Rabel's guys from Tennessee.
Speaker 1 (33:09):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (33:09):
Robert Splaine who they brought up from the Steelers linebacker.
So he's a Carlton Davis who was all over the
place last night. Boy, him and Christian Gonzales excellent tacklers
by the way, for cornerbacks.
Speaker 2 (33:20):
Now, I've always been a Carlton Davis fan. I mean
he's been around those league now what good seventy eight years?
I think ya, he's with the Bucks. Always been a
big fan of his. But last night he was terrific.
Speaker 4 (33:32):
Yeah, the secondary overall, and that's the difference, by the way,
when those guys are engaged in stopping the run and
the short passing game, that's how you all of a
sudden take your defense to another level. Morgan Moses at
their right tackle position, venter offensive line.
Speaker 2 (33:46):
We thought of him more as a journeyman, but he's
certainly getting the job done right now. That look isn't
that kind of uh, It's more than a coincidence. It's
what happens is when you pay guys and you say, listen,
you got to come in here and be the back
of your football card, and they give you the back
of their football card. You know you need to get
(34:10):
what you paid for, or, if you're lucky, more than
what you paid for. Not one of these guys that
you mentioned have they come up short and given them
less than what the Patriots paid for. Every guy gave
him what they were supposed to give him.
Speaker 4 (34:28):
And then some Kiris Tanga who didn't play last night,
defensive lineman. He's another guy that has made an impact.
Jalen Hawkins, who you brought up earlier to the safety
calebon Chason, who was tied with Landry for the team
leading saxon half entering last night. So all of these guys,
some of them are big names, some of them are compliments.
Speaker 2 (34:49):
Hey Jason had been considered a bust until this year.
Speaker 4 (34:51):
Correct, But you know what we've seen that how many
times were a guy who at pan out with his
originally drafted team, he goes elsewhere all of a sudden,
it's a nice fit. Fus Veryble even talked about.
Speaker 1 (35:01):
Dirden, who was with the Giants.
Speaker 2 (35:03):
I comment, I saw.
Speaker 4 (35:06):
The so yeah, they certainly hit I though, just real quick.
I would not compare the Patriots and the Giants though,
because New England has been pretty steady with the exception
of the two four and thirteen seasons and back to
back years, so the Giants have gone lengthier with issues.
I don't think they're in the same boat. New England
could be utilized as a mirror image in terms of, okay,
(35:28):
this is what you need to do to get a
turnaround accomplished, But New England they didn't go through as
long as the Giants have been in terms of trying
to get this on the right track and the right page.
So I don't know if that's an ideal comparison both
of the organizations. From that standpoint, let's head back to
the phone lines. Let's check it with Marcus in California. Marcus,
(35:50):
welcome aboard. What do you got for us?
Speaker 3 (35:52):
Hey? I just wanted to say, man, that everything looks
so much better now that Davon got fired. The team
is doing so good.
Speaker 6 (36:02):
Man.
Speaker 3 (36:02):
You know, it's just become unbearable to watch. There is
a deep rooted incompetence in that building. I don't even
really have much more to say other than I hope
that you know next year is better. A bunch of
first round picks not playing put up to their potential.
(36:23):
You've got a staff they can't get anything out of anybody.
You've got Mike Kafka, who says he's going to come
in and be the great discipliner. But you benched at
duels parter when Cavon's not playing, and then what happens
seventeen points in the first quarter. We weren't getting blown
out thirty to seven in a first half when Dable
was here. The right move would have been to fire
(36:45):
him at the end of the season instead of turning
the Giants into a circus. And I feel like the
players are very upset the Dable's gone, and they quit
on the team. So I just hope that we get
somebody in there that knows what they're doing, and next
year we should be good. There's no football players. There's
(37:06):
better athletes, but there's no two football players like Jackson,
Darton camp Scattabow and they must be protected at all costs.
So I think you got to get rid of everybody,
and I hope everybody makes it out of the season healthy.
Thanks guys.
Speaker 4 (37:20):
All right, Marcus, I could have sworn he start off
saying that things look better without table and then went
the complete opposite direction. But maybe I'm hearing things necessarily
wise guy. Okay, yeah, because I picked up on that,
I was like, I don't really understand where we're going
with this. But that's all other story. We need another
show to explain that. Let's go back to the fault lines.
Marvin is at Delaware. What's happening, Coach Marvin?
Speaker 6 (37:42):
How you doing?
Speaker 2 (37:43):
Guys?
Speaker 1 (37:44):
You're right, what's on your mind?
Speaker 6 (37:47):
I used to say this every year and I'm saying
it again, and I see it. The Giants have three
people in that locker room that's causing this problem, and
that those three people are me, myself and I and
when those two those three people come in the locker room,
you're gonna have issues. And they do definitely have issues.
(38:10):
Last night, I'm with Paul. They got hammered and they
couldn't even recover from that the mistakes that they were making.
The guy that run a ninety four yard punt back,
there was no one around him. I think he didn't
even get touched or anybody got close to him. I
think Marcus what was that?
Speaker 1 (38:32):
No, Marcus Jones was the player that returned the punt
that you're referring to.
Speaker 6 (38:36):
Yeah, yeah, but the player that thirty one? I think
there's Jones for the Giants. Whoever was thirty one?
Speaker 2 (38:41):
Yeah? Nick Jones backup slot.
Speaker 6 (38:44):
Asked the punter. I met the punt returner, he was
behind him, and it was just it was just crazy.
Speaker 2 (38:55):
And coach, to be fair, those special teams from most
of the season, they've been really pretty done good. Excuse me,
I'm sorry. The kit the kicking situation has been kind
of weird because of the injuries and everything else, but
in terms of the kick coverage and the kick returns,
the Giants have had a strong season there. That's not
(39:17):
one unit that we really want to pick on They're
entitled to have a really bad day, and they did
have a really bad day. This was a total collapse
of the special teams unit, no question about that. But
for most of the season they've been really doing good.
Speaker 6 (39:34):
I don't I'm not disputing that. I'm just talking about
last night, because last night it was like clown is
type of special teams. Last night, there was a time
I seen Banks running behind the kick return return. He
wasn't in front of them blocking, he was behind him.
It was the weirdest thing I ever seen. And then
(39:55):
we have a kicker who actually well he kind of
looked like he kicked the ground, but he was trying
to stop himself from kicking, which becomes clownish. It just
I mean, Mike phone was blowing up.
Speaker 1 (40:06):
Yeah, well, you know it's interesting.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
Kafka after the game mentioned from his perspective, he thought
the exchange wasn't as clean as it should have been,
and that's why Coup sort of held up because he
didn't think that Gillan was going to put it in time,
and then obviously that's what led to a very awkward exchange.
There's no doubt about it. I don't think any of
us have seen that in the history of the National
Football League until last night.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
Yeah, I just saw.
Speaker 6 (40:30):
I just saw it on McAfee. He just went over it.
What happened is when he laid the kick down. When
he laid the ball down, the point on the ground
slipped just as he was going in motion to kick it,
so the ball kind of killed it underneath.
Speaker 1 (40:47):
Yep.
Speaker 6 (40:47):
And he thought they were it was going to be
a fire drill, and that's why he kind of tried
to stop himself from kicking it. So as I looked
at it just a few minutes ago, it looks like
it's not that he kicked the ground. He tried to
stop himself from My last part is they the Patriots,
(41:09):
tried to punish them. And dark have to understand people
are watching him. I hear people talking stupid stuff out.
He's wearing a necklace here, he got this. He thinks
he has this swag and how he's coming off. When
those guys start talking that way from the other team,
you better be aware they're aware of you and they're
coming to get you. Because if a deer keeps running
(41:33):
around lions, eventually he's going to get eaten. And we've
seen this with Carson Wentz. We've seen this with Luck.
Michael Vick went through this a little bit. These guys
on the defensive end, these are not high school dudes,
and these are not college guys. College guys don't have
(41:53):
as many of these types of players on the defense.
High school definitely don't have that many guys. So if
he's looking at it like I did this in my
high school in college years, you're gonna learn the hard way.
And there's no way we're fighting guys for hitting him. Legally,
(42:14):
everything that happened on that play was Dart's fault. The
hit was his fault, the fighting was his fault. And
at the end he says, I don't care. I'm gonna
play it the way I play it, and then that's
gonna be fine. But I don't think he's going to last.
I really don't. I have quarterbacks on lower levels and
(42:37):
I've seen them take hits, and I tell you, you better
get your butt down because those guys they are hunting
and you better be aware that they're hunting. And he
just saw his boy get hurt a few weeks ago.
Speaker 4 (42:51):
Scottish scattab but I mean that's a completely different play though,
I don't know if that's.
Speaker 6 (42:55):
Standpoint a lance, but you can't cut me off the day.
Speaker 4 (42:58):
I'm not coach, I'm not I'm not cutting you off.
We were just jumping in. I just don't think that's
a fair comparison. That's all I was pointing out.
Speaker 6 (43:05):
The comparison is not the hit. The comparison is that
when you run out there, you are in danger every
time you're out there. I'm not saying there that's saying it.
I'm saying that they are hunting you.
Speaker 4 (43:19):
Well, I mean, once again, you're jumping into the heads
of the opposition. That may be true for some, and
we'll let you go on that note. I don't know
if it's necessarily.
Speaker 6 (43:28):
You don't know who I am. You never know who
I dealt with in my life.
Speaker 1 (43:31):
Marvin.
Speaker 4 (43:32):
I'm not you're You're you're getting very You're making this
a battle royale. I'm not fighting back. I'm just saying
that you're jumping short, Okay. I'm not trying to get
into a battle royale with you. I'm just saying you're
jumping into the head of most of the players, and
I don't know if that's a fair assumption, is what
I'm saying what I'm not.
Speaker 1 (43:53):
But that doesn't make any of us right or wrong.
It's just a different perspective. That's what it is.
Speaker 4 (43:56):
You're looking to be the end all be all, and
that's not how conversation goes all the time.
Speaker 2 (44:00):
That's all.
Speaker 6 (44:01):
I'll tell you this. I'll tell you this. When I
was coaching, I made them hunt.
Speaker 1 (44:06):
Okay, And that's and your perspective is allowed.
Speaker 6 (44:10):
When somebody that played is on the show I'm calling
and I'm going to ask them, do any of their
players hunt? You speaking for all.
Speaker 1 (44:17):
I'm not speed for all.
Speaker 4 (44:18):
I'm just saying that it be it be ill informed
to label everybody under that part.
Speaker 1 (44:23):
That's all I'm saying. That's what I'm saying.
Speaker 6 (44:25):
On the defensive line, on the defensive side of the ball,
when a quarterback is running, they are hunting, and that
HiT's a hunt.
Speaker 2 (44:34):
Well, you know, coach, coach, to your point, let's address
the specific play, because I think moving forward, the better
idea is to discuss how he could have better handled
the situation. It's a second and thirteen and Dart has
to scramble out of the pocket and run up the
right sideline. Now, I don't know what his field division
(44:58):
was did he see the lineback coming in horizontally? I
hope that he would have seen him with his peripheral vision,
because had he done that, the perhaps wise play, and
I'll use wise as the adjective. The wise play is
it's a second and thirteen. Maybe the wise play is
(45:18):
go twelve yards and step out of bounds, which is
what we talking about earlier, and not get hit. For
go the extra yard, make it a third and one
and live for another play, and don't take the risk
of getting yourself popped, whether illegally or legally. That's one
less hit you have to take if you can just
(45:39):
turn yourself out of bounds one yard in front of
the marker. And that's the kind of thing I expect
that you or suspect you're trying to allude to, Right,
Coach Paul, you hit.
Speaker 6 (45:53):
It on the nose. You gave it a different perspective.
Speaker 2 (45:56):
I'm just describing the play because I think that's the
easiest way to do it. But describe the play, and
how how would you like to see it better done?
Speaker 3 (46:05):
Well?
Speaker 6 (46:05):
I looked at the play not too long ago. I'm
watching on McAfee, and you're right, maybe the way. It
looked like he looked like he could because there was
a I think it was one Dell in front of
two Patriot.
Speaker 2 (46:19):
Yes, absolutely in between.
Speaker 6 (46:21):
He was in between dark. Maybe Dark didn't see him.
Speaker 2 (46:26):
I don't know. Yeah, I don't know either.
Speaker 6 (46:29):
But as I'm coaching, I'm always saying, and you heard this,
you got to keep your head on the swim.
Speaker 2 (46:35):
You do you do.
Speaker 6 (46:37):
People are running everywhere and it coming from every angle.
But you may have a point there which I can understand.
I can understand that point, but they just not my
vision of what I see and what I experienced and
have dealt with people that I dealt with to say, oh, ye,
you're just hallucinating that. That's not everybody. That's not that's true,
(47:00):
and that's not right to do.
Speaker 4 (47:02):
Well, that wasn't said Marvin in fairness, that we weren't generalizing, well,
I think you're misclassifying that. I appreciate the phone call.
We'll let you go on that note. We were not
telling you that you were hallucinamy. Those words never came
out of my mouth. I simply said that I think
it's unfair to classify that all defensive players are hunting
quarterbacks when they're out in the open field. I just
don't think that's a fair classification. And I'll bring my
(47:24):
perspective from working shows and talking to a lot of
former defensive players and having conversations on and off the air,
that has never come up that they have said when
a quarterback takes off and runs, they always had the
mindset to go hunting after them. So that's the perspective
that I'm coming from. You're entitled to your perspective. I'm
entitled to my perspective. There's no right or wrong answer.
There's some of you you call up and you want
(47:45):
to have like an end all be all judgment of Okay,
he's right, he's wrong. That's not how dialogue and conversation goes.
So that's where I was coming from. I don't think
it was personal at all. If you want to take
it that way, that's fine, but that's not how I
was coming from. Let's head to the phone lines. Lou
Is in Pennsylvania, lou welcome aboard. What do you got
for us?
Speaker 3 (48:05):
Thank guys.
Speaker 7 (48:05):
I just want to toention on the what what coach
Barvin said he was his respect was wrong because he
classified the Jackson Dart and the camp catabole hit at
the same thing, which is two different things. Anyway, Yep,
my question I wanted to ask with the cornerbacks, it
(48:25):
seems like, I know we're not playing it's not press coverage,
but it seems like when they're giving them a free release,
and not only they give them a free release as
soon as the bone has set, they dropped back five
yards or ten yards in coverage and that the receiver
is just going on a car route and get a
short pass. I don't want Is that something Am I
(48:48):
seeing that wrong? Or that happens a lot with this team?
Is it happened in Dallas in the beginning of the season.
Speaker 2 (48:55):
Well, I know, I know then.
Speaker 7 (48:58):
Went in the middle to catch in the middle of
the field. It's just it seems like whatever it is
taught and it's press coverage.
Speaker 2 (49:06):
We had this conversation at least I did with Jonathan
on one of the shows last week. I invite you
to go back and take a listen to that one.
There is Yeah, you don't have to play press coverage
and jam a guy at the line in order to
be five yards off the line of scrimmage and then
rerouting him. There are different ways to do that. It's
(49:27):
not always the same, and I do agree with you
that over the last two years the Giants have allowed
way too many free releases and not done enough to
impede reroute receivers and throw off the timing of the
other team's passing game. In general, I totally agree with
what you're saying, and so did Jonathan specifically last night. Look,
(49:52):
I got back at four am in the morning. I
have not rewatched the game tape yet. Okay, I'm being
perfectly honest with you. I will pick this single part
play by play. It's within the next twenty four hours.
But so I'm not gonna comment any further on last
night's game about that at that particular aspect of it.
Speaker 7 (50:09):
I just have onemal thing to say, yeah, real quickly,
And sometimes I tell my kids, hey, don't do this.
You're gonna get hurt. Sometimes you have to let them
get hurt to understand. After Guard had the interview after
the game and somebody asked, why don't you run out
of bounce and his comment was, it's football, gonna get hit. Yes,
(50:31):
that's a given, but sometimes you just have to run
out of bounce. It's like he has to get hurt,
and that's the only way he's gonna understand the team
needs him more on the field than injured off the field.
Like he's young and necessarily understands that it would never change. Unfortunately,
he has that mindset, but he has to get hurt.
(50:53):
And it hurts me to say it. It sucks, but
it's never gonna change. All right, guys, I listened to the.
Speaker 1 (50:59):
Foot Thank you very much, you got it.
Speaker 4 (51:01):
Appreciate the phone call well, And that's why I brought
up what he had mentioned in the press conference.
Speaker 1 (51:06):
Whether or not, you know, God forbid, he has to
get hurt.
Speaker 4 (51:09):
I mean, you could argue he already has dealt with
a concussion, so I'm sure that at least has served
as a reminder. But it's a little bit different, you know,
once again, when it's the old story. When Joe Burrow,
not to get off topic, was asked about why is
he coming back on the field Paul to play in
the last game when he could pretty much just say
take the rest of the season off, right the Bengals,
(51:29):
it's hard for them to make the playoffs. He said,
I'm a football player, I'm paid to play football. Okay,
it's routine. So it's the same thing with Tart. His
routine has been he's going to fight for the extra yardage,
and it's hard to reprogram. I guess is what I'm
getting a player to think differently when they've been doing
it this way for a very long period of time.
Speaker 2 (51:51):
Jim Brown used to talk about Franco Harris the same way, right.
He would criticize Franco for avoiding hits and maybe getting
out of bounds, and Franco was like, Okay, well, guess what.
I've lasted a long time in this league. I've won
championships and he's going to the Hall of Fame. So
different strokes for different folks.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
Yeah, absolutely, all right, we're gonna leave it at that.
Speaker 4 (52:11):
We've got a press conference coming up in a little
bit as Joe Shane will be speaking with reporters as
the Giants prepare for the bye week, So we'll have
full coverage coming up on Giants dot Com.
Speaker 1 (52:23):
And it's important to note we are going to take a.
Speaker 4 (52:25):
Brief hiatus here on Big Blue Kickoff Live for the
remainder of the week with the team on buy and
the office closed, so we'll be back up and running
on Monday of next week with the next new episode.
So I just want everybody to be alert in terms
of the programming for the next few days. With that
being said, certainly appreciate everybody for tuning in to Big
(52:46):
Blue Kickoff Live. It's presented by Cadillac, the official luxury
vehicle of the New York Giants. We're broadcasting for the
Giants Podcast Studio, presented by Hacket Sack Murdy in health
keep getting better for Paul Theatino. I'm Lance Medo signing
off here on Big Blue Kickoff Live. Stay locked Giants
dot com, fro the latest, and we'll speak to you
on Monday right here on BBKALE.
Speaker 2 (53:03):
Have a good one
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