MJ, Greg, Juan, Winston, and Mo discuss My Cause My Cleats! | EP 8 | Dawgs Only

Host Rodney McLeod Jr. discusses My Cause My Cleats with teammates Martin Emerson Jr., Greg Newsome II, Winston Reid, Juan Thornhill, and Maurice Hurst II. Topics include mental health, youth development, gun safety, cancer awareness, and more.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's going on? Everybody?

Speaker 2 (00:01):
This is O g Rode back for another episode of
Dolls Only podcast, but today it's a special edition.

Speaker 1 (00:07):
It's a two part episode.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
We're covering my calls, my cliques, talking about guys why
their passions outside of the game of football. And in
this first part we have Greg Newsom, M j Emerson,
and Winston Reid. And then the second part we have
yan Thornhill and Mohursts talking about mental health. So stay
tuned and check out the first part.

Speaker 3 (00:31):
Of the episode.

Speaker 2 (00:36):
So obviously, man as as as players, you know, we
owe a great responsibility and I think you know to
a lot of people in the world, you know, they
they look up to us, right, idolized by a lot
of people. And I think what's special about the NFL

(00:58):
is the platform, you know, that we have. And I
think for me, what's always been important to me is
how you utilize your platform, making the most of it.
We always talk about how the NFL is not for
long and you got to maximize it. Why you have
the visibility and we know this this past a couple

(01:20):
of weeks ago, you know, we focused on my cause,
my cliques. Uh, there's a lot of great causes in
the world, and a lot of US athletes have now
taken on that responsibility to bring awareness to some of these, uh,
societal issues or things that are just near and dear
to our heart for whatever reason.

Speaker 1 (01:39):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:40):
And I know all of you guys participated in that,
including myself. So if you guys can all kind of
just you know, go around telling us a little bit
about your cause, why it was important for you to
bring awareness to that at to that specifically, and and

(02:05):
then yeah, we'll just we'll just flow from there.

Speaker 4 (02:07):
I did DNA Level Sea Boxing Club, which is h
which is something out of out of Cleveland that focused
on pretty much like mits up guns down. Being born
in the inner city of Chicago, I was able to
go to school in the suburbs, not like everybody, being
able to put myself in a in a better situation,

(02:28):
especially back then like it was, it was not really
great to go to school out there. So my dad
my mom did a great job with me. My dad
had a job in the post office in the suburbs,
so I commuted an hour every single morning from the
city to go to to go to school out there,
just putting me in the best position to be successful.

Speaker 5 (02:49):
You know.

Speaker 4 (02:50):
Obviously people know about Chicago. They used to call it
shi Raq because it was just so much gun violence,
things going wrong in the city. Uh few friends getting
caught up and things like that. But I think the
most crucial thing to me was in high school, my
cousin got killed to gun violence out in Chicago. So

(03:11):
that was pretty much like the biggest thing for me.
And I did might cause my police every single year,
but this one was the first year I actually decided
to wear the cleats, and I think this honestly, when
I wore those cleats was the craziest part. I think
I had my best game of the season, which was
which was insane. But yeah, that's kind of really the
reason why I chose it, just shedding light out there,

(03:33):
knowing that, you know, you could do other productive things,
like a lot of people from the inner city have
a lot of like fury, a lot of rage. But
I thought the DNA level Sea Boxing club was was
cool because you can use that rage in a more
positive manner, use it out there, you know, with the
mits and learning how to actually control your anger, you know,

(03:56):
in a positive way. So that's kind of why I
chose my Yeah, I liked out. That's dope.

Speaker 6 (04:02):
Yeah, for me, three years straight, I supported every time
gun safety, you know, just raising awardeness about you know,
gun safety and and just how do you know how
to use guns?

Speaker 5 (04:14):
And you know, and just not.

Speaker 6 (04:17):
Making decisions off emotions and you know, and ruining your
life and somebody else's life, and you know, and families
that have to deal with this also.

Speaker 5 (04:25):
But growing up, well not even growing up really.

Speaker 6 (04:29):
It was recent in twenty twenty on Thanksgiving, I lost
my best friend growing up.

Speaker 5 (04:35):
He was walking outside the club.

Speaker 6 (04:37):
Leaving, leaving the event, and he got shot six times,
you know, And yeah, it was a tough It was
a tough moment for me in my life. Still dealing
with it to this day, you know, but I use
it as fuel, you know, and just trying to make sure,
you know, I keep him proud, you know, I know
he watching over me. But and in another another occasion,

(04:59):
another such suition a year later, not even a year later,
July of twenty twenty one, I lost my quarterback, a
good friend of mine.

Speaker 5 (05:09):
You know, he's actually picked me up every day for.

Speaker 6 (05:12):
School, you know, my my senior year, and we just
always talking about reaching our goals together you know, and
just being productive and giving back to the city, you know,
and just being those role models. And he was actually
on a full scholarship at Kannisast State, you know, and
he came home one night and unfortunately his his his

(05:34):
car got shot up multiple times, you know, like I
want to say, fifty some rounds, you know.

Speaker 5 (05:39):
And and it.

Speaker 6 (05:42):
Was it was because he had a similar car to
some to somebody that was you know, that was in
my city, and you know that that was just doing
you know, that was just into a lot of things,
and they thought, you know that that that was that
wasn't him. So yeah, it was just tough for me, man,
and kind of still lives. But that's why I support.

Speaker 5 (06:02):
The calls, you know. And that's what. Yeah, that's that's
what man.

Speaker 1 (06:06):
I appreciate you sharing, bro.

Speaker 5 (06:09):
So my cleats they were just cancer. So my mom
had breast cancer. She passed away when I was younger,
when I was thirteen, And so I want to, i know,
you know, inform people out like getting screenings early on,

(06:32):
get a diagnosis if you do have cancer in your
in your bloodline. It's very important. That's why I did it.

Speaker 1 (06:41):
No, I appreciate you for sharing bro, sorry about your
mom too.

Speaker 5 (06:44):
Appreciate you.

Speaker 2 (06:45):
Yeah, yeah, I you know, my my cause my cleagues.
I focused on you know, my nonprofit and we do
a lot of youth development work, and you know, it
was important for my wife and how to start this
foundation just because we wanted to you know, give kids

(07:06):
that looked like us a better pathway to you know success,
recognizing that you know a lot of you know, the
education that's that's given to you know, kids of color
often sometimes it is really determined by your zip codes,
and just the resources aren't necessarily like afforded to us

(07:30):
as often, and just really wanted to like shift the narrative, man,
like start new trends, break cycles. And that's really our
you know, our sole focus is just putting kids first,
figuring like, man, we want to change the world, start
with them. And so that was that was you know,
that was my focus and what I tried to bring

(07:53):
awareness to to all the work that we're doing. But man, obviously,
like you guys have uh man, just unfortunate heartbreaking like stories,
you know, from each one of you guys, And so
I commend you for like just the bravery to be

(08:14):
able to bring people into like your world a glimpse,
you know what I'm saying, Like obviously your mom when
you know you're losing, you lost you know, a family member,
you lost close friends, and it's never easy, Like we
all get caught up in just ball and and then

(08:35):
for people to understand that we are more than just
you know, players, Like we have real feelings, we have
real emotions, and you can hear it as you guys
are talking about these causes. And I think that's why
it makes all of this like just well worth it
like that my cause my cliques is because it gives
a whole different outlook on us as players. It allows

(08:58):
us to tap into a different side of ourselves, but
also something that has made us who we are.

Speaker 1 (09:05):
And you know, Jennie, you talked.

Speaker 2 (09:06):
About it like how you know you had one of
the best games, you know what I'm saying to date,
And I'm sure like that feeling of like man who
you're honoring and recognizing in that moment made you play
just that much, you know what I'm saying, greater and
harder for him.

Speaker 1 (09:22):
And then a serious issue.

Speaker 2 (09:24):
You know, we could talk about it, like you know
a lot of kids go through a lot of trauma especially.
I know, like you said, the identity of Chicago is
Shahraq and you know, you being there, you know, you've
seen that it's a beautiful place, but to everyone on

(09:46):
the outside is deemed as war zone and all of
these things, and so you're battling against it. But for
those kids, you know, like yourself, Man, you are a hope.
You know what I'm saying that, Man, you can you
can make it out, you know, with your God gifting
abilities and be successful. So can you just talk about

(10:10):
like just what your experience was like, you know, growing
up in Chicago, how you kind of took a different
approach and to your point, maybe even you channeled like
those emotions that you spoke about and you put it
into football and it's allowed you down to stand here today.

Speaker 4 (10:28):
Yeah, I feel like, you know, when you in it,
you don't really know you in it.

Speaker 1 (10:32):
Like for me, it was just like it.

Speaker 4 (10:34):
Was just the next day, like just driving around seeing
stuff like I mean, I didn't came home before coming
from Glendell Heights where I grew up, coming back to
Chicago and just seeing like you know, on the movies,
y'all see all the caution tapes and things like that,
like right outside my house. But me, I'm just like,
that's that's Chicago, Like that's that's some of the stuff

(10:56):
that I see every day. So I didn't really think
anything of it. But you know, when I was able
to go out there and like most of my friends
were in the suburbs, like go and just see their
lives and see like what their parents do things like that,
just seeing the people they keep around them was just
like cool to see, like knowing that there's another like life,

(11:17):
there's another world outside of just being in the inner
city of Chicago. Like it's just like crazy things that
just happened. Like I remember just me and my dad
in our yard just playing catch and like three dudes
come up like throw the ball. I'm like, all right, cool,
we I'm gonna throw you the ball. Throw the ball.
They run away with it. Like like just little stuff
like that just happens all the time. But I don't

(11:38):
want people to think that Chicago all of Chicago's bad,
Like it's not.

Speaker 1 (11:42):
It's just obviously in every city.

Speaker 4 (11:44):
It's just places that you know, if you're at you're
there at the you know, wrong time, like things can happen.
But I just feel like just being able to get
out of there. Like some people would be like, oh,
you're not from Chicago, No I am. I just my
parents were just able to put me in a better situation.
So now even like when I came to Cleveland, I

(12:06):
was the first non Clevelander to have my camp in
the city in East Cleveland. That's where I had my
first football campus in East Cleveland, where everybody can see me.
That's what I kind of want to show just because
I wasn't I didn't have to grow up in those conditions.
I know what those people go through. I got friends
that have went through those conditions. So now my goal

(12:27):
is and I'm trying to like start my foundation and
see what I kind of want to do. I was
kind of waiting a little bit to see what I
wanted to do, But it's just trying to just get
myself back out there in those situations that I kind
of grew up in and just showing them like there
is a way out, Like there's always a way out,
and you know, doing those things you know on the

(12:48):
streets may seem like it's an as an easy cop out,
but I feel like there's definitely ways to get out
and that's why I commend your foundation because that's what
you're doing. You're showing them that there are ways, you know,
that you can be great. And like people don't know,
like if you literally just go about fifteen minutes out
of the city, like it's beautiful things around there, but

(13:09):
a lot of people get caught up, you know, in
the in the streets in the city.

Speaker 5 (13:12):
Yeah, that's real. Sure.

Speaker 2 (13:16):
And you you know, you talked about obviously, you know,
gun violence, and you know that's that's a subject that
we on. Most recently. For me, I lost you know,
a friend from back home to gun violence. You know,
happened two weeks two weeks ago, Uh, coming out, you know,
from a restaurant and you know, shot and killed. And

(13:42):
you know it hurt the community back home. You know
it hurt me just knowing that this is somebody who
was for the community, you know, a pillar in it,
like fighting for you know, youth, and he's trying to
save lives. And now, you know what I'm saying, somebody
took his So I can relate to you know what

(14:05):
I'm saying, your your frustration, your your pain, and again
it's a reality, you know for us. How do you,
how have you, I guess, or how do you deal
with what's happened like mentally? And also how have you

(14:30):
uh try to I guess honor those two individuals because
obviously they seem to have played a major role in
your life, Like how have you continue to honor them?

Speaker 6 (14:41):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (14:41):
Now that unfortunately you know that life was taken Michael doing.
I'm sorry here that.

Speaker 6 (14:50):
But for me, I just try to be, you know,
the best I can be, you know, honestly, you know, mentally,
I just you know, try to stay strong, you know,
for for me bosso, my family, my community, everybody you.

Speaker 5 (15:03):
Know in between.

Speaker 6 (15:06):
It's just you know, trying to try to make make
them proud at the end of the day, you know,
because I know they'll be you know right here, you know,
clapping me, you clapping, you know, paying me on the back, happy,
you know, for all the success in my young career.
But I just used it as a few Honestly, It's
like a chip on my shoulder. My rookie year when

(15:28):
we played against Tom Brady, it was the same.

Speaker 5 (15:32):
It was a year.

Speaker 6 (15:33):
It was a year from the day that uh that
my best friend was killed coming outside the club and.

Speaker 5 (15:41):
I had you know, one of my best games.

Speaker 6 (15:43):
You know, as a as a young rook you know,
went again Tom Brady. I was messed up against Mike Evans,
had nine targets, zero catchers, like so it just like
it was.

Speaker 5 (15:52):
I was just like, yeah, I'm trying.

Speaker 6 (15:54):
I'm not trying to, you know, be too sad like
I'm trying, you know, I'm trying to bring life because
that's what it's about.

Speaker 5 (15:59):
But yeah, just just just keep.

Speaker 6 (16:02):
Being me, you know, and uh and just using everything
that I've been through, you know, in the past, and
you know, everything I'm going that i'm going through, you know,
that's present and that's that I'm going going through, you know,
because you know, we all, we all you know, we
all go through things, you know, and.

Speaker 5 (16:19):
We all don't have you don't we don't have to
figure out, you know.

Speaker 6 (16:21):
So I just try to, you know, stay close, you know,
to Christ a lot, even on my down days, you know,
and just try to, you know, stay stay mentally healthy,
you know, even if I got to call my pops,
you know, that's like my mentor. I got a few
coaches back in high school that I just talked to,
you know about everything. So yeah, that's that's kind of

(16:41):
really how just like just try to keep them happy,
you know, and even on my down days or like
the days I feel like it's it's just tough to
go and push through. I'm like, man, I got people
you know that that would love to be in this
situation or you know that, you know, I got people
depending on me, you know, so you know, and I
just used that as fuel.

Speaker 1 (17:00):
Yeah you doing?

Speaker 2 (17:02):
Are you doing anything back home to bring more awareness
to gun violence?

Speaker 6 (17:10):
My father he actually started he started his own foundation.
It's called Life After High School, you know. So my
pops he's always been, you know, a guy that you
know that's close to the youth, you know, because my father,
you know, he was kind of you know, doing this
thing and.

Speaker 5 (17:30):
Just not running wild, but.

Speaker 6 (17:33):
A little define and my uh my grandfather kind of
washed his hands with him, you know, at an early age.
And he was there, you know, my whole life. So
my mom she ended up she ended up going to prison. Well,
my pops, he's actual in prison for three years. He
came home, changed his life around, and my mom she
ended up going to prison, you know, and and he

(17:54):
took custody you know.

Speaker 5 (17:55):
Of us.

Speaker 6 (17:55):
I was like six years old, and he's been in
my life like ever since, you know, since that day.
You know, I learned so much from him. You know
a lot of tough love. You know, we've been through
so much. But he's always been a guy you know
that that gives back to the youth, you know. So
he started the gym, he was actually training me and
a couple of guys I grew up with, you know, uh,

(18:15):
just just giving back to the youth and like just
even just a lot of things, like you know, a
lot of things to speak on. But yeah, he started,
he started his uh his movement life after high school,
you know, and it's just three kids, you know, that's
that's kind of feel lost, you know that maybe graduate
high school or trying to graduate high school, but doesn't

(18:37):
have that support system, you know, just being the mentor
just being there for him, you know, just motivating them.
So I support him with that, you know, and that's
kind of the way we give back to the youth.

Speaker 5 (18:48):
Man.

Speaker 1 (18:49):
Definitely shout out. That's huge. I remember we had all
pulled up to you even last year.

Speaker 2 (18:57):
Pops was right there orchestrating it all right right here. Yeah,
but I love it, man, because you know, it's unfortunate
what he had to go through early on in his life,
but you can see the transformation right the fact that
he gets it, like his decisions that he may put

(19:19):
him in an unfortunate position right where he was away
from his kids, you know, for a period of time
where he couldn't be that father figure that you may
have needed. And he made a conscious decision, you know
when he got out to now pour not only into
to you your brothers, but then into this next generation

(19:41):
to make sure that they don't, you know what I'm saying,
go down the same trail that he did. And we
need more black men like that. You feel me, to
be honest with you, that's willing to man go out
and mentored these young men because it's needed and so
man much. You know, salute salute to him, and I

(20:03):
commend you bro for breaking a cycle too, because you know,
we often find ourselves being repeat offenders of what we've
seen and what our environment has shown us. So you know,
for you to go off college now, pro man, you

(20:26):
you know what I'm saying, You didn't change like the
whole trajectory for you know what I'm saying, for your
seed and people to follow you.

Speaker 5 (20:33):
No, that's true. So you know what I'm saying, I
appreciate that.

Speaker 6 (20:36):
Yeah, I appreciate that for sure, because growing up I've
seen a lot of things you know that that I
knew that I that I didn't want to be a
part of, and that I didn't want to grow up
and be like you know certain individuals. Yeah that I
use that as few as well, you know, and just
just trying to be different and just staying on my path.
And you know, it's you know, it's a lot of

(20:57):
child tripulations, you know that that comes with and focused
but just always knowing what you want at the end,
you know, and just working toward those goals. So you know,
got a point to the youth, you know, because the future.
So it's very important to me, very important to all that.
So I slew everybody else you know here talking about
their calls love.

Speaker 2 (21:18):
When brother man, how I know, uh couldn't be easy,
you know what I'm saying, growing up without your without
your mom? Can you talk about you know, just what
like your upbringing was like and then even like you know,
fast forward to present day, like how you just continue

(21:40):
to you know, honor her, you know, in your in
your day to day upbringing.

Speaker 5 (21:48):
I mean I grew up in Utah, So I mean you.

Speaker 2 (21:51):
Exposed me to you that's foreign to me, right, Utah.

Speaker 7 (21:57):
I grew up it.

Speaker 1 (21:57):
I grew up it. Like the West.

Speaker 5 (22:02):
I mean it's nice there. Wait where are you from?
I'm from Utah West Coast. Nice four seasons there, the snow,
it's nice. It's beautiful place. But I mean my parents
were divorced when I was super young, and then I

(22:23):
grew up with my mom, with my siblings. I mean
it was cool. It was cool out there, but I
mean growing up it was just my mom someone. So
I mean growing up it was just like hard work
and I mean doing everything the right way, I guess

(22:44):
in a way just for her people, if that makes sense.
But yeah, I mean I mean, yeah, just doing everything
for her.

Speaker 2 (22:59):
I guess, yeah, that's that's you know. I can I
can't you know, even fathom. But you know, to your point,
you know, you talked about the things that she taught you,
what she instilled in you, you know, and you seem
to still be that guy today. I called you Sergeant Wins.

Speaker 5 (23:20):
You feel me like that's actally funny too. You say
that all the time, But it's just my dad was
in the military.

Speaker 2 (23:26):
To you get that vibe, it's like, you know, discipline
to the point I feel right, exactly right, you know,
I'm sure you you probably you might fold your clothes
a certain way, like.

Speaker 7 (23:39):
In high school.

Speaker 5 (23:39):
Like I moved in with my dad when I after
my mom passed, and like it was just like a
crazy transition, like living with my dad, like you know,
like making my bed in the morning, like corners for
the Greek corners, like Chris Yes, tied to school, Yeah, yeah,

(24:00):
oh yeah. I mean when you when you learn how
to tie?

Speaker 1 (24:05):
Tie was the first How old were you?

Speaker 5 (24:09):
I was, I know, three, like eight.

Speaker 2 (24:18):
I don't think I learned un till I was probably
middle school because I was getting ready to go to
high school where we had to wear uniforms, so tie
was required. So I had like my my stat pots,
I'm like, you gotta get it right before I think
I was just going with the clip ons in church. Yeah,
by then I probably was like you know what, I

(24:39):
ain't even wearing no time, no more.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
I'm just going with two buttons down real quick. But yeah,
that's hilarious, that is yeah.

Speaker 5 (24:47):
Yeah, some days just down with a collar he would
be mad that I that I wasn't wearing like get
at tired of school.

Speaker 2 (24:57):
Yeah, So like have you have you decided on you know,
as your career you know, goes further as we all,
you know, hope for that you'll continue to do more
work surrounding breast cancer and you know, honoring your mom.

Speaker 5 (25:16):
Yeah, definitely like five k runs. Yeah, that's a huge
thing for cancer at least. Yeah, starty Foundation hopefully mm
hmmm yeah.

Speaker 1 (25:28):
Yeah, sope.

Speaker 2 (25:29):
Nah, I believe you're gonna do it. Brother, you know
what I'm saying. No, she looking down on you, proud
uh you and all your accomplishments to date, and then
you know she's gonna be by your side as you
continue to have a long, prosperous career. One thing that

(25:50):
you know, we U we do on the show, We
asked everybody like their dog moment when they come on set.

Speaker 1 (25:59):
That dog moment.

Speaker 2 (26:00):
It's like just the time in your life where you
feel like you had to like channel that inner dog
to get you through maybe an adverse moment. And so
you know, I just opened the floor to you guys
to like speak on that because you know, in this world,

(26:20):
you know, I think people don't realize, you know what
success to M's point, you know, there's trials and tribulations, Like,
there's so much that goes on in between. It's not
just a smooth pathway or a smooth grounds like to

(26:41):
the mountaintop. So you know, we've all gone through something
that we can identify that it was like, yo, that
that moment, right there are those few moments like in
my life, like I could have went this way, but
I made the decision to do this, and like it's
made me better and of course I got to the
other side because of it.

Speaker 4 (27:01):
Yeah, I got one. Just I tell the story a lot.
I don't know if y'all know. But so college, when
I got to college, well, my last year high school
transferred to I AMG academy. So I wanted to get
myself ready to get to college. I was like, I'm
starting right away. I'm getting it all done. Like that's
that's what I was about. So I end up getting

(27:23):
to Northwestern my freshman year. I ain't start the first game,
but I came in the second series and then I
started from there on.

Speaker 5 (27:31):
I played six.

Speaker 4 (27:34):
No, actually I played four total games, and then I
tore four out of six ligaments in my ankle, and
at first they thought it was an ankle sprang. So
I wasn't thinking nothing. I just couldn't get back. Then
I ended up getting a MRI was torn. So the
coach was like, all right, do you want to Radshaw?
I was like, nah, not a chance because like I'm
going three and out, like we never had a three

(27:55):
and out person. I was like, I'm gonna do it.
So I come back in the Holiday Bowl and we
play Utah. Actually we played, Yeah, we played. Now we
played in San Diego playing the Holiday Bowl. Actually I
came for the Big Ten Championship first. That was my
fifth game of the season, played Ohio State. I didn't
play particularly well, still limping and things like that.

Speaker 5 (28:14):
Then I played Utah.

Speaker 4 (28:16):
Finished my freshman season, sophomore season, come back. We lost
our number one corner, so like now I'm in that
role to step in to be that guy. So week
six in the season broke my collar ball, so I'm like,
oh this again. I had a real good season. Still,
like I led the Big Ten and passed it offended
as a sophomore and I didn't play like four games,

(28:37):
but I didn't get any recognition.

Speaker 1 (28:39):
Yeah, so then.

Speaker 4 (28:40):
Junior year, I'm like, all right, cool, it's over with now.
Then I COVID hits, so I'm like, here this go.
Then the season starting two weeks before the season, it
was like a month before the season, I got a
PCL injury. I landed on my knee last reper one
on one. So in that moment, honestly, I told my parents,

(29:00):
I told my teammates. I was like, if it's my ACL,
like I'm done, Like I've been hurt, like I can't finish.
I couldn't finish the season.

Speaker 5 (29:08):
I was hurt.

Speaker 4 (29:08):
I was like, yeah, I'm like, if it's my ACL,
I prayed about it. If it's my ACL, like I'm
done playing, Like I'll be cool with it. I'm gonna
go be around the team. I was like, I made
us and told my coach like I'll be done. End
up being my PCL. First two years, I didn't do
any like no Big Ten, no awards, missed the first
two games. My junior year, I come back and literally

(29:29):
have like one of the greatest seasons ever. Gave up
like total like sixty yards the whole entire season when
first team All Big Ten, All American. I should have
won the Big Ten dB of the Year award, though
they bogus they ain't give me that. But then ultimately
I end up leaving after three years after not playing

(29:50):
a lot of collegiate games, and the Browns, you know,
gave me opportunity to get drafted in the first round.
So that was definitely my dog moment, Like I was
ready to just be like, all right, I'm done, and
then I come back and just have like one of
the greatest seasons ever and just able to be the
first Northwestern Wildcat to go three and out.

Speaker 8 (30:10):
So that was that was my dog moment for sure.

Speaker 5 (30:13):
Legacy, that's a blessing.

Speaker 9 (30:15):
Bro.

Speaker 5 (30:18):
My senior high school, I didn't play it for my
a CEO, so I was like thinking I was just
gonna be done with football, joined the military, and then
I don't know how I could started, Like my dad
started talking to the coach at Weber that I walk
on there. I read shirt and then I turned my

(30:41):
a c L again, samely maniscus everything, so it's blown
out and then I come back. I'm just on teams
and I'm trying to get a scholarship and everything, and
then just I'm not getting a scholarship, trying to do
what I can. And then earlier this time, I'm like,

(31:01):
should I like quit, I'm not on scholarship, I'm barely playing.
And then I actually do like this whole like debating
whether or not, and then I play another year and
that was in nineteen and then I actually do quit,
and then my coach called me back like two months later,

(31:23):
like we'll bring you back, We'll put you on tuition,
books and fees and stuff like that. Come back. And
then I play good obviously, and then next yeah, I mean,
I guess that's my dog moment.

Speaker 10 (31:40):
Yeah, just to get on this scholarship, Like no, wow,
none of us know to walk on life at all
in here.

Speaker 5 (31:51):
It's I mean, it's it's similar to being undrafted, just yourself.
You got to make more plays than the guys on
scholarship to be to be recognized. I guess, yeah, it's
about that.

Speaker 1 (32:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (32:05):
Absolute solute man for me, I will say easily.

Speaker 6 (32:11):
My sophomore year, true sophomore year of college, coming off
a good true freshman season, you know, didn't start until
probably what my true freshman year. I didn't start, played
a lot, but I didn't start to I want to
say week five.

Speaker 5 (32:27):
That's the year twenty nineteen. This a year when LSU one.

Speaker 6 (32:31):
So that was my first game actually started against LSU,
lined up against Lamar Chase, just just son a couple
of times. First game, you know, obviously Joe Burrow that
was loaded. But that was a fun game. Man, that
was a fun game. But fast forward to my sophomore year,
you know, just just growing, getting better from my freshman year.

(32:53):
Just so first game, we come back, we get LSU
again after the natty, So we're playing good. We bought
and actually I want to say we up third quarter,
we end up winning the game and kJ Costello he
ended up Yeah, he threw for like six hundred and
twenty three yards. He broke the HC passing record and
all this game. But so I they run the ball's

(33:15):
third quarter, I meet the running back in the hole,
but I go low and when I hit him, I
hit him with.

Speaker 5 (33:20):
My shoulder, but my shoulder popped out. It's located.

Speaker 6 (33:24):
So when I hopped up, it was a big heavy
back too, like legs were like I remember, like I
still got the video.

Speaker 5 (33:30):
You can see it on the video when I hit him,
because it was a good hit with still start, like I.

Speaker 6 (33:35):
Called him refrigerator legs, like his legs was huge, like
but yeah, it popped out and I hopped him like
come get me.

Speaker 5 (33:42):
So I run out and it was out. I couldn't move,
like my shoulder like it was out of my arm
was out of the socket.

Speaker 6 (33:48):
So I'm like, oh, man, like this is poor. This
COVID year too. Mind you like this COVID year too.
So I go go into the locker room. About like
ten minutes they popped it back in. I'm like, I
want to go back in like this lsu. I'm in
my mind.

Speaker 5 (34:03):
I'm like I was on like the same type of
time Greg was on.

Speaker 6 (34:06):
Like I'm I'm pretty sh I'm in the like I'm
on the track to leave in three years. So I'm like,
I can't let this set me back, Like I could
easily like miss half of that year however, you know,
But I just put a shoulder hornets own, went back
in the game, finished the game, made a few tackles.
Fast forward. I lead the league, I let the SEC

(34:27):
and I was like second in the country in PBu.
I had a lot of them, but I couldn't get
no pigs because I had a shoulder horn its own
and it was like restricted, so I couldn't hand noiu.

Speaker 5 (34:41):
Yeah, exactly, I couldn't go up at all.

Speaker 6 (34:43):
But I would say that was my dog moment, just
to stick out that year, you know, to play with
my guys during the COVID year.

Speaker 5 (34:51):
Dislocated shoulder. You know it was easy.

Speaker 6 (34:53):
I could have easily just sat out and just you know,
could have got surgery or whatever.

Speaker 5 (34:57):
But just you know, stuck through it. You know, that
was that was that was a good year. Yeah, for
sure moment. Yeah, that was a proud man man.

Speaker 2 (35:06):
Must respect respect man.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
That was dope.

Speaker 5 (35:11):
What about you? Huh you got a dog, mom, you.

Speaker 1 (35:17):
Got a few of them.

Speaker 2 (35:18):
But yeah, to nobody even asks you know me every time,
I always ask everybody else.

Speaker 1 (35:24):
And then we were off the set.

Speaker 2 (35:26):
Uh for me, it probably was was twenty twenty, so
COVID this was, uh three three games left in the season.
I told my uh my a cl and my other knee.
So I did the first one in twenty eighteen, and
I did that one. And I remember always telling myself like, man,

(35:48):
if like if you tell your a c L again,
like that's it, You're done. You Like, I just couldn't
really put myself back into that mode that I did
to get myself like through it like that first time,
like because everything I had to endure. So when that
happened to me, I was crushed, like I'll never forget

(36:12):
this moment. Like get into the locker room after I
get the news and at that point, you know, game's
still going on. I think I got hurt like early
in the game, maybe like the third quarter. I just
break down in tears in the locker room, like on
the phone with my wife, you know, just talking to
her like they said, it's my cl like I think
like it's over. I think it's over, you know, like

(36:32):
I'm talking career, not see I'm talking like career.

Speaker 1 (36:36):
Like this might be it.

Speaker 2 (36:37):
I'm like year ten at that point, and everything inside
of me man was saying like give up. And it
really was a combination of like my wife talking to me.
My mom kind of reminded me like that you know,
God like puts like these these challenge just like on

(37:00):
you and then not necessarily off of you, there for
the people around you to even like just see how
you respond. And that really just hit home to me.
And everything that I've like said to a kid kind
of just like hit me, you know, just real vivid

(37:21):
and in my heart, and I said, man, like I can't.
I can't allow like this, this situation to be to
be the end. Like I at least got to fight back,
you know what I'm saying, And let's let's see what
happened on the other side of it.

Speaker 1 (37:36):
And so man, I chose, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (37:38):
To fight to rehab, grind my ass off, come back.
You know, missed the first four seasons that that's kind
of you know what the plan was.

Speaker 1 (37:49):
Came back, you know, and man.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
Was able to finish out my career in Philly going
to the playoffs, got kicked out but in the first
round by Tom Brady, but it you know, it still
was a win. You know, made some good plays on
the back end of that of that season and just
was proud man of the way I again choosing to
to like to decide, Man, this this wasn't like the

(38:15):
end for me. And that took a lot. But I
credit that and a lot of my success and my
support system, you know what I'm saying, that's everything. That's
why I keep doing what I do. So that's one
of my that's one of my dog moments. You know,
I gotta fee but that's that's one for real that
always stands out to me. Yeah, but uh man, today

(38:39):
was love fellas. I appreciate y'all for for sharing y'all story.
I know not all of it was comfortable, but I
appreciate you you know what I'm saying for for being honest,
for being real more poorly man, for.

Speaker 1 (38:52):
Using your platform for good.

Speaker 2 (38:55):
So as you guys can tell, the topic of my
cause my cliques, I'm fortunately is never easy. Some of
my teammates opened up their hearts and talked about some
very uncomfortable moments throughout their life, and I.

Speaker 1 (39:09):
Appreciate them for that.

Speaker 2 (39:11):
And just a few weeks ago, I sat down with
Juan Thornhill and Mo Hers we cover mental health, and
Juan Thornhill represented depression for his mind cause my cliques.
Here is that episode on mental health. So question I
have for you guys, right like I know for me personally.

Speaker 1 (39:34):
You know, I have.

Speaker 2 (39:37):
Circles that I can rely on and I always go
back to at times of difficulty or even times of celebration.
But I think one thing that I've noticed, right, just
as as men, we tend to.

Speaker 1 (39:54):
Struggle with the ability to.

Speaker 2 (39:56):
Check in on one another, and not only and not
only that, like when somebody does ask like how are
you doing, it's always surface level, right like.

Speaker 1 (40:07):
We can't we can't give the real.

Speaker 2 (40:10):
And I think as as as men, we struggle with
find being vulnerable and then also feeling maybe a sense
of weakness, right like we always have to come from
a place of strength, especially as as athletes, like ourselves,
place of strength, place of of just like confidence, and
I got it where you know, sometimes we don't and

(40:33):
it's okay to admit that and be truthful in that moment.
And so I appreciate you guys, first of all, just
for given you know what I'm saying, just some of
the real and I know there's layers two we're gonna,
you know, talk about it, but I think I wanted
to talk about what is like a reality check for us.
And I'm gonna look at my phone because I don't

(40:53):
I don't want to.

Speaker 1 (40:55):
Misquote.

Speaker 2 (40:56):
But these are some of the stats that exist for
guys like sitting here. About twenty five percent of African
Americans seek mental health treatment compared to forty percent of
White Americans. Sixty percent rise and suicide rates among black
boys over the past two decades. Studies have suggested that
around twenty five to thirty percent of NFL players may
experience mental health issues at some point during their careers,

(41:19):
including depression and anxiety. And those stats speak directly to us,
you know what I'm saying, Like that is the real
and we come from a statistical world in sports, you know,
you know, like.

Speaker 1 (41:34):
Stats is like is what we live by. That's the code.

Speaker 9 (41:37):
With my wife, Like I would say, she's probably the
best thing that has ever happened to me, because like
growing up, I never was that kid that would, like,
you know, speak up if I'm feeling something. I'll just like,
you know, keep everything inside and let everything build it up.
And then eventually it gets to the point where like you.

Speaker 3 (41:52):
Just completely snap. You can't even control it.

Speaker 9 (41:54):
And then like ever since I've met my wife, like
she forces it out of me, like.

Speaker 3 (41:59):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 9 (42:00):
And there's times where like I'm just sitting there, like
I'll come home, like especially like last year, I was
going through a big time, you know, with that injury,
and I'll just come home and not even talk, and
then she'll like, what's wrong, and I'm just like nothing,
like I'm good, and then she'll keep asking, Like it's
gets to the point where like you're gonna keep asking,
you keep asking me. I'm gonna be honest, I'm gonna
tell you, like straight up what it is.

Speaker 7 (42:21):
Man.

Speaker 9 (42:21):
But like like you said, though, just as a young age,
like we've always been taught that like listen, don't cry.

Speaker 3 (42:29):
You know if you if you cry.

Speaker 9 (42:30):
You're not a man or things like that, and that's
that's that's not the right way to go about it,
you know, like your mental health is everything. Like if
if you're holding in, things can go south real quick.
And that's I guess today that's the point. It's just
like it's okay to tell people that it's not okay,
like you're not okay, you know. So I think that's

(42:50):
that's huge, man, just being able to speak and get
your voice out there, because I believe it or not.
Like once you you tell people what's wrong, like it
will make you feel better free, he feels free, even
if you don't, like you know, like to write it
down in a book or something if you have to,
Like when you just holding in, it's never good.

Speaker 3 (43:08):
I'm just saying that, like from experience.

Speaker 11 (43:12):
Yeah, I mean I always think back to like childhood, right,
and I always think back on some of the tough
times that me and my mom or me and my
family had gone through, and it's just one of those
things where like if you just say you're good, like
you're just kind of putting that band aid over it,
like how was your day?

Speaker 5 (43:29):
It was good?

Speaker 11 (43:30):
You might have had X, Y, and Z going wrong,
but you're just gonna say it's good instead of like
going into the details of oh, yeah, you know, we're
not sure if we're gonna be able to pay that bill.
We're not sure we're going to be able to, you know,
afford to pay for you to go play basketball. I'm
not sure if I'm going to be able to you know,
get you those shoes that you always wanted or whatever
things like that, And that for me has been my

(43:51):
biggest struggle because growing up, it was always just that
band aid over it. It was just that I'm okay,
I'm all right, I'm good will pass like. It's just
that constant like psychle on it. And for me, that's
one of my biggest challenges right now, honestly, is just
figuring out how to open up figuring out how to
be vulnerable because it's it's stoicism, It's that it's that

(44:15):
art of being a man where you know, you just
put all this stuff on your back, you put all
this weight in your back, and you know, truthfully, I
think there is something to that. I think as men,
especially as black men, there's a certain amount that we
have to shoulder that we can't let out. But it's
okay to be vulnerable at times. It's okay to pick

(44:36):
those times when you realize that you know, maybe you
put you know, just a little bit too much weight
in the bar, like maybe you were at you know,
four or five, you need to be at three seventy five.
You know, just trying to balance that out because you
don't want to just be out there, you know, crying
and all the time.

Speaker 7 (44:52):
You know what I mean, Like, that's not a man.
That's not what we do, you know what I mean.

Speaker 11 (44:56):
Like, but there there's definitely a balance, and finding that
balance is what I need to keep doing because right
now it's just like, you know, put that four or
five of my back and I'm just gonna keep keep
squad and keep going for it, keep trying to pr
keep trying to you know, just put everything on my
shoulders instead of letting it out and letting it letting
myself become vulnerable, like.

Speaker 9 (45:15):
You said with that band aid, Like just think about it.
If you got a scar, man, you put a band
aid over, it ain't never gonna heal.

Speaker 1 (45:20):
As soon as you.

Speaker 8 (45:21):
Rip that band aid off, it's still there.

Speaker 9 (45:23):
Yeah, And it ain't gonna never heal until you take
it off and let that air hit it, you know.

Speaker 8 (45:26):
So that's huge man.

Speaker 2 (45:28):
And I think, you know when you you really did
a nice illustration there and talking about the weights right
and and like how sometimes we do put too much
on that we can can bear. And I think to
Want's point, right, it's important. And we all know how
how important a spotter is, you know for us and

(45:49):
I and.

Speaker 1 (45:49):
I give like this.

Speaker 2 (45:52):
Illustration of that when I talk about mentorship, right, like
I look as mentors as spotters, like they're there to
help you know, guide you to be able to take
you know, just finish that that set for you. Give
you some words of recouragement, I get you through. And
and Juan obviously pointed to you know, his wife as
that person who do you guys kind of like contribute

(46:15):
as you know, maybe a spot or somebody that just
you know, can can get the you know most out
of you, or or have you be able to express
your thoughts and and and just be that that like
that person for you.

Speaker 11 (46:30):
For me, I didn't really have it until probably like
three years ago. I started talking to a therapist when
I was in San Francisco, and that really helped me
open up to him. Yeah, and then on top of
that realizing that I need to open up to my
friends as well, And that was the biggest thing that

(46:55):
Like I said, I've been trying to figure this thing
out along the way. But it's just like if you
open up to your friends, they're going to open up
to you. It's gonna make your friendship stronger. So having
that vulnerability is going to allow you to have closer
bonds with your friends. This is something that I just
kind of figured out with him, like just sitting down
and talking through things. And I would say that's been

(47:15):
one of the biggest blessings to me, is starting to
figure that out and figure it out, you know, how
to create these friendships that you know last a long time,
that are meaningful, that you guys understand each other.

Speaker 7 (47:25):
You understand what each other are going through.

Speaker 9 (47:27):
You know, you said something about you spoke with a therapist,
but a lot of people they're kind of scared to
do that, you know, like it's just like they feel
like it's like they have to go in there and
throw everything on the table at one time. But if
you go in and talk to a therapist, they can
pull the little things out of you.

Speaker 8 (47:42):
That you that you need, you know, to get you
through it.

Speaker 9 (47:45):
So like, how did you get to the point where
you were just like listen, I'm not gonna be afraid
to go in there and actually talk to someone, and
to talk to that therapist, you know, like how did you.

Speaker 1 (47:56):
Go about it?

Speaker 10 (47:58):
Yeah?

Speaker 7 (47:58):
They don't even know, you know.

Speaker 5 (48:00):
Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 11 (48:01):
So for me, it just was it was coming off
of my basically my second season ending injury while I
was with San Francisco, So it's basically like two years
without football, and it just gets scary at that point
because this is something that you've been doing since you
were seven. So you get to that point where you

(48:22):
started questioning like, oh, like can I still do this?

Speaker 7 (48:24):
Like it's my body gonna hold up?

Speaker 11 (48:26):
You know this and that, and you kind of have
a little bit of an identity crisis, and I could
really feel myself sort of like spindling down the whole
very fast, you know, struggling to get out of bed,
no motivation really to go work out, no motivation to
you know, talk to anybody, no motivation to go anywhere.

(48:47):
Wasn't shopping, wasn't buying clothes, wasn't playing video games. It
was just kind of loathing around the house. And I'm
just like, you know, this doesn't feel right, doesn't feel
like me. You know, I just scheduled the meeting, and
you know, we might have talked for twenty minutes, but
that twenty minutes just like changed my whole perspective on
how I was feeling, and it really allowed me to start,

(49:10):
you know, feeling back to myself and getting back to
that baseline, and you know, I just think about how
important that is and building that like rapport with somebody
and just kind of getting everything sort of off your
chest because it just makes it so much clearer. It's like,
you know, it's like you're just like blurry for a
little bit, and then you like have that conversation or
you talk a little bit and you walk out and

(49:31):
it's like a yoga session or something like that. Like
you just feel like refreshed, You feel you know, you
like have a breath of fresh air when you finish
talking about you know, what's going on, what you're dealing with,
and you know, just having someone else sympathize for you,
but also help give you the pieces of solve the answers,
because the thing with therapist is that they don't give
you the answers. They give you pieces. They give you

(49:53):
they give you all of the hints to try to
solve the issue that you're going through.

Speaker 7 (49:57):
It's not just this is what you should do.

Speaker 11 (49:59):
It's like, you know, think about it, like what you
went through, think about you know what your next steps
should be.

Speaker 7 (50:05):
Like what's important to you?

Speaker 11 (50:06):
Like they ask all these questions in a way that
help you express yourself even.

Speaker 7 (50:10):
More and realize what you really want, where you really desire.

Speaker 1 (50:14):
How did you decide on your therapist?

Speaker 2 (50:19):
Like kind of walk us through what that journey was, like,
you know, because there are maybe even some of us
here who are considering therapy but don't necessarily know how
or just talk and then even you know, the next
layer is like what is what is this your first

(50:39):
therapist or is this number five for you? And then
are you also continuing on what that uh that therapist
you know now today?

Speaker 11 (50:49):
Yeah, so this is my first like full time therapist.
Like at Michigan, we had a couple of different people
that you could basically talk to every once in a
while if you had something going on or decision to
be made. But this was my first time, and it
honestly was through the team. So I think all thirty
two NFL teams have teams psychologists and you know, you know,

(51:12):
just help from that point of view. And when I
was at the forty nine ers, they had someone there
that I worked with, and it made it really easy
because I would just be in the building and in
between meetings or something like that, I would just pop
in for twenty thirty minutes, you know, just talk about
my day and figure out a time when to talk
and then eventually we would you know, just do zooms

(51:35):
for twenty thirty minutes when I got home or whatever
like that, and you know, whenever I need.

Speaker 7 (51:40):
Them, I could just call him.

Speaker 11 (51:42):
But that was also one of the negatives of picking
it to the team, because now I end up here
and I'm not able to communicate with him, even though
this is a guy that's built rapport with for two years.
So that's kind of like one of the negatives to
like this NFL you know, team psych help. It just
makes it a little bit challenging because it's like, Okay,

(52:03):
I just build all this report. Now I gotta find
a new person and start kind of from base one,
where this person doesn't really know me, doesn't really know
what I've been working on, doesn't really know you know,
all that, all those type of things. So you know,
it's just it's tough. Like I kind of wish I
went a different round and had someone that I could
kind of keep throughout the years. But when you're like us,
like you're moving around all the time. We're playing with

(52:25):
new guys all the time, moving to new areas, new friends,
new homes, new locations. It's just like one of those
challenges that you know kind of you know, sinks about
being an NFL player.

Speaker 9 (52:36):
You know, growing up, you could come from like not
having any money at all, you know, and that could
be something that affects you big time, and a lot
of people don't understand, like we're people too, you know,
you get to the NFL you get all this money,
but y'all know that saying though, more money, more problems,
you know what I'm saying, like and that and that
could affect your family as well. You get a little
bit more money, and now everybody come in to you

(52:57):
asking you to be that problem solver and that, like you.

Speaker 3 (53:00):
Know, Mama come to you.

Speaker 9 (53:02):
They're struggling back home, you know, like paying the rent
or something like that.

Speaker 3 (53:07):
And now like their.

Speaker 9 (53:09):
Stress is your stress, and now you can't focus on
your happiness. You can't focus on what you're doing in
the game. You go out here and you play poor
on Sunday. Now the fans talking bad about you, like
all of that stuff can just you know, build up
and it can affect you like big time.

Speaker 5 (53:24):
Man speak on it.

Speaker 2 (53:26):
That's that's the truth. I've had a therapist as well.
I've gone through that that process, and it was something
that I feel like for me growing up, like hearing
a therapist meant like I had a serious problem. Yeah,
you feel me like I had a serious like medical
condition problem where I needed to seek professional guidance and support.

Speaker 1 (53:52):
And so that's why I never thought it was for me,
Like I mean, I feel.

Speaker 2 (53:56):
Like I'm fine I'm good. I don't need somebody to
rescure me, like a therapist. And it wasn't until I
had friends within my circle who told me, hey, bro,
like now I just I go to somebody because I
feel like it's okay just to talk about your issues,
your problems, your childhood experiences, your life experiences with somebody

(54:21):
that doesn't know you at all, and there's no there's
just like no real like attachment. They're just they're just
there to support you for who you are in that moment.
And it was I feel like it was nothing but God.

Speaker 1 (54:36):
Like.

Speaker 2 (54:37):
I had an event for my nonprofit going on. This
woman who's now my therapist was one of the facilitators there,
and she kind of pulled me aside and it was
almost like a like a prophet in a sense like
talking to me, and she kind of gave me a
foresight vision that she had and just how I seen.

Speaker 1 (55:01):
Her throughout that day.

Speaker 2 (55:02):
I say, you know, like, you know, what, can I
just get your you know, get your card, get your number,
you know you know, and I and I think I
didn't even address it initially. It took me maybe a
year before I circle back with her, and I was
really at a I feel like a point in my
life where I was battling like issues, like on the field,

(55:25):
like issues, like a lot what was going on, and
I was you know, I was talking to my wife,
of course, talking to my mom, but it just wasn't enough.

Speaker 1 (55:33):
And you know, it was that moment.

Speaker 2 (55:35):
I think I was in India at that time, and
I was going through a lot in the workplace, and
so I reached out and man, I've you know, been
with her since. And I'm talking not only has she
been in sessions with me individually, but I've now even
brought it over into more of a family structure where
you know, I've had uncomfortable conversations with my own mom

(55:56):
and you know, and that's and that's something else as
well that you know, I know for us that's the
challenge is, you know, parenting. You talked about, you know,
your childhood like traumas and things that you've seen. And
for us, we've been in that child role for so
long that we've held our tongue, haven't been able to
say anything or speak out on it. And now it's like, well,

(56:16):
we're adults now and I have to let you know,
what are some things that I just was uncomfortable with.
And then that gives me a better sense of why
do I, you know, respond to what I do? And
like you said, in relationships and in these sort of
you know, experiences that come about and it just it

(56:38):
just like goes back and you got to replay it,
but you got to address it, you.

Speaker 1 (56:43):
Know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (56:43):
And and you know, most of the time it does
set set you free. You know, I'm a firm believer
in that for sure. So I would say, you know,
one thing that obviously we're all talking about is the
pressures that come with the job, you know, with being

(57:03):
a NFL player, making it this far. It's an accomplishment,
but it's also there's a lot that comes with it.
And people don't don't even know half of it. They
just see, man, you got everything that you could possibly
think of. The money's good, but money doesn't cure everything.

(57:23):
We know that, Like, we know that's the truth. So
you know, we've all at this table, have you know,
gone through some adverse moments throughout our career. You know,
I kind of just opened the floor to to some
of you guys to walk us through and Mo kinda

(57:46):
did it earlier. But just walk us through you know
how maybe how it was for you one. You know,
these past like two years being here in Cleveland, you
talked about the move, I know, about leaving teams and yeah,
like feeling like, man, I should still be over there,
but you know, now I'm here, right, I got to
build this new connection relationship with these guys.

Speaker 1 (58:05):
It's great.

Speaker 2 (58:06):
And then you come here for a reason to you know,
be that guy and you know, now you've been played
by injuries and I know you know what this game
means to you, and I know how much work you
put into it. And that's the hard part that people
don't see the amount of work that we put into
it and we still might not get the outcome that

(58:26):
we want, or an injury takes place and now it
sets you back, and now it puts you just in
a mental funk. Right, So just you know, just talk,
talk a little bit. You know, you could summarize it,
you get as detailed as you want, whatever, Cliff.

Speaker 1 (58:40):
Not it, whatever, but just get people the real like
and how you felt.

Speaker 2 (58:44):
But then now how you've been able to come out
on the other side of that, you know.

Speaker 9 (58:48):
Like when I was in Kansas City, I mean I
had an ACOL tear in twenty Like at the end
of twenty nineteen my rookie season.

Speaker 8 (58:55):
You know, I was playing great.

Speaker 9 (58:57):
I'm talking about living hot, like I ain't never been injured.
Everything's going great. Last game of the season, like, yeah,
were about to We're going to the playoffs is guaranteed,
and I'm getting excited for this playoff run. I run
through the gap, whole open, wide open. I think I
was about to go make a tackle tear my ACL.
You know, like the game that just like opened my
eyes that it can be just taking away from you

(59:18):
at any moment.

Speaker 8 (59:19):
And I would say that was probably one.

Speaker 9 (59:21):
Of the toughest times that I've ever been through because
I've never been injured before, Like in college.

Speaker 8 (59:25):
I maybe had like.

Speaker 9 (59:26):
An ankle spring or a pull a muscle like a
handstring or something like that, but never had a huge
injury like that. You know, something that's going to sit
you down for a couple of months. And you know,
I got my ACL surgery and I'm sitting there. I
remember just sitting in a hotel room out in Dallas,
and I'm watching, you know, Kansas City play in the playoffs,
and then I see guys out there blowing coverages and

(59:48):
I'm sitting.

Speaker 8 (59:48):
There like, man, that should have been me out there
making that play.

Speaker 9 (59:51):
But then it got to a point, you know, we
get to the Super Bowl and I'm just sitting in
the stands, you know, like not even being able to
be on the field with my team, sitting in the
stands watching them. And I remember to this day, like
when they came out that tunnel.

Speaker 3 (01:00:05):
Like I thought I was gonna cry.

Speaker 4 (01:00:06):
Man.

Speaker 9 (01:00:06):
Like you know, growing up, you always watch that big game,
Like even if you don't even watch the NFL, You're
gonna watch the Super Bowl, you know what I'm saying.
And then all of a sudden, you know you had
an opportunity to be there, and that's like your childhood
dream is to like, you know, to go to a
Super Bowl, like not even to play, I'm saying, just
to go watch it. And then I had the opportunity
to play in it, and that was like taking away

(01:00:28):
from me and I was just sitting there just like
sick to my stomach.

Speaker 8 (01:00:32):
It was just like I feel like that moment was just.

Speaker 9 (01:00:34):
Like listen, like I have to get back here, like
this is just something I have to be able to
experience you know. Luckily I got back there twice, you know,
got back.

Speaker 8 (01:00:46):
Played in one we lost, so that one didn't really
mean too much to me. I was just kind of
like pissed off about it.

Speaker 9 (01:00:51):
But then I was just like, I have to like
get that experience, you know of you know, that coffetti
falling and you know, being able to experience that excitement
with your family, because at that point, the first one
we won, I wasn't out there playing, so it didn't
really feel like I contributed.

Speaker 3 (01:01:07):
To that at all.

Speaker 9 (01:01:08):
So it was like I was happy, but at the
same time, I was kind of like sad about it.

Speaker 3 (01:01:12):
And we got back there my last year.

Speaker 9 (01:01:14):
We wanted got the cafeti for a wife coming out there,
you know, jumping your arms. It was great and everything,
but back to the ACL injury. So I would say
like the hardest part for me, it probably was that offseason.

Speaker 8 (01:01:27):
You know, like I was.

Speaker 9 (01:01:28):
One of the most exposive players, and all of a sudden,
they come to a point where like I can't even walk,
Like I don't even know how to walk.

Speaker 8 (01:01:36):
I got to teach myself how to.

Speaker 9 (01:01:37):
Run, jump, do all the basic things over again, and
you know, and just constantly being in pain like that
was me every single day, and I know there was
a time or I was questioning, like.

Speaker 8 (01:01:47):
Listen, do I even want to do this anymore?

Speaker 9 (01:01:50):
You know, like just going through those injuries like alone,
because you know, sometimes you get these injuries and you're
in the building with your guys and you can just
talk to them, love up on them, have fun. But
it's the off season, like everybody gone, yeah, everybody's going,
it's just you and the train is doing the same
thing every single.

Speaker 8 (01:02:10):
Day, and You're just like, man, I don't want to
do this no more.

Speaker 9 (01:02:13):
It got to the point where eventually I got back
on the field, you know, and I go out there
my second year like I'm playing through pain, like you
could tell that I'm still hurt, and I was a starter.

Speaker 8 (01:02:23):
And then it got to.

Speaker 9 (01:02:24):
The point where my coach was like, listen on, like
we can see that you're in pain. We're gonna take
some of the snaps off you. You're not gonna be
a starter no more. And I'm like, oh no, We're
not doing this. And then that's where a point they
hit me. I was like, man, I can't.

Speaker 8 (01:02:38):
Like I was mad the whole season, like I should
be out there.

Speaker 9 (01:02:41):
I know I still can play, but I think my
coaches saw a little bit more in me.

Speaker 8 (01:02:45):
You know. But that's one whole story.

Speaker 9 (01:02:48):
Next thing, boom, I get to Cleveland and everybody's excited
about me, you know, because I mean, I'm a great
football player. I have confidence in myself and I'm coming
to Cleveland. I'm like, listen, I'm about to show everybody
what I'm about. And I'm talking about preseason. Got a
pick six against Kansas City. Everybody excited like this, this

(01:03:09):
guy's the truth, Like I'm ready to go.

Speaker 1 (01:03:13):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:03:15):
Man.

Speaker 9 (01:03:15):
Then I had the cash strain early in the season.
That one was you know, it was slight. I missed
one game, came back, and then later on that's what
a big one happened.

Speaker 8 (01:03:23):
You know, we played against Baltimore.

Speaker 9 (01:03:26):
I played it drove cals strain, and you know, me,
just as a competitor, I'm wanting to be on the field.
I'm trying to get back out there as soon as possible.
I said, I probably, like I would say, like a
week maybe, and then in the following week I go
back out there. I play a couple of games. You know,
I'm playing through the pain.

Speaker 8 (01:03:43):
But you could see that, like my explosiveness was not there.

Speaker 9 (01:03:46):
I'm missing plays that I know I should be making,
but the injury just hold me back.

Speaker 8 (01:03:52):
And it was like that at that point, I was
a little frustrated with that.

Speaker 9 (01:03:55):
And then all of a sudden, I get in warm
ups and against Jacksonville and like, I don't know what
it was like these calves got a minor of his own,
Like I'm telling you all that now they have a
mind of his own.

Speaker 1 (01:04:07):
I woke up.

Speaker 3 (01:04:08):
My calf was just so tight. I'm like, some I'm
not right with my calf.

Speaker 1 (01:04:11):
What's going on.

Speaker 9 (01:04:12):
I go out there, strained my calf again and warm
ups and then from that point it was just like
the calf injuries kept happening over and over again.

Speaker 12 (01:04:19):
I'll sit out the week, come back and play a game.
Then I'll get hurt again, sit out a week, come
back and play again. And at this point, everybody's like,
all right, what is this dude gonna do for us?

Speaker 9 (01:04:30):
Man, Like, this dude's always hurt, he's not making any plays,
and I'm out there frustrated because I'm missing plays because
of my calf injuries holding me back, you know, and
that I would say that was, you know, pretty tough
for me, just because like I know what type of
player I am, and the people are like a lot
of people were like doubting me, you know, like he's
really not that good.

Speaker 3 (01:04:49):
But I know what type of player, and I know
what's holding me back.

Speaker 9 (01:04:52):
And then I was just in that state of mind
where I was kind of ready for just the season
to be over.

Speaker 8 (01:04:57):
Like I wanted to win the Super Bowl last year, but.

Speaker 9 (01:05:01):
I was at a point where like, all right, I'm
just done with this season, Like I just don't want
to even be a part of it.

Speaker 8 (01:05:06):
And but I came back like the off season, like.

Speaker 9 (01:05:08):
I'm gonna do everything possible, you know, for me to
get back so this don't ever happen again. And then
all of a sudden, I play the first game gets
Dallas strain.

Speaker 3 (01:05:19):
My calf again.

Speaker 9 (01:05:20):
But what I would say what was different this year
about last year is I went through that all last
year not knowing how to really handle it. But then
when I strained it this year, like I would say,
the difference will probably be my daughter, if I'm being honest,
like I tried to, like I it was probably like
a couple of days while I went through it like
mentally like man, I know we're not about to do
this again, Like I can't, I can't deal with this

(01:05:43):
no more. But then my wife was like, listen, try
to change your mindset about this, Like the only thing
you can do now is get your treatment and try
to get back on the field, Like that's all you
can do.

Speaker 3 (01:05:54):
And then while you have this time.

Speaker 8 (01:05:56):
Off, enjoy spending time with your daughter.

Speaker 10 (01:06:00):
You know.

Speaker 9 (01:06:00):
And I just felt like that changed everything about it,
Like I just had a positive mindset about everything, didn't
really complain too much. I just did my treatment when
y'all was on the road. I mean, I just spent
time with my daughter. So I feel like she just
helped me get through a lot of the stuff that
happened to me this year.

Speaker 2 (01:06:16):
Yeah, I'm gonna try. I'm gonna push you right here.
I'm gonna try to push you right like what like
what were some of the mental hurdles though that went
on in between?

Speaker 1 (01:06:27):
Right?

Speaker 2 (01:06:28):
Like that there's the in between, right, it's the date
where you know, the acl happened, that Calf happened, whatever,
whether Calf won or the second time, and then now
this this is the end. But like nobody sees the
end between only only you, your your wife, you know,
now your daughter and God. Like that that's it, and

(01:06:49):
we might observe some of it, but like we know, right,
like we tend when we walk into this building at
times and put on the mask and like you said,
put on the smile, but deep down inside you lead
this building, you get in your car and you could
be full of tears.

Speaker 1 (01:07:04):
You feel me, you.

Speaker 9 (01:07:06):
Know, like I've alreadys spoken it a little bit. It's saying, like,
you know, just my standard for myself, you know, like
me knowing the type of player and person that I
am and just seeing other people like question it, you
know what I'm saying, Like they're talking about I'm not
as good as a player or he's nothing.

Speaker 3 (01:07:25):
Basically you're having people tell you all the time that
you're nothing.

Speaker 9 (01:07:29):
You know.

Speaker 8 (01:07:29):
That's what I feel like affected me the most.

Speaker 3 (01:07:32):
Like I've always been told I'm.

Speaker 9 (01:07:33):
Like a people pleaser, like I do love when people
love me, you know, so like that was one of
the main things for me that I struggle with because
I'm just like these people don't even love me, man,
and that that hurt me big time. But they have
to come to a point where I would just sit back.
I'll take a step back and just be like, listen.

Speaker 3 (01:07:51):
You can't make everyone happy.

Speaker 9 (01:07:54):
If you constantly just try to make everyone happy, You're
gonna tear yourself down. So I just have to like
find a to get through that, you know, and just
like focus on myself, focus on my wife, focus on
those that are closest to me, Like you guys, that's
like in this building because the things outside of this
building really don't matter.

Speaker 2 (01:08:11):
Honestly, you know, I feel like I didn't even have
to ask you know, yeall what your dog moment was,
because you already you expressed it just organically.

Speaker 1 (01:08:21):
You know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2 (01:08:23):
You guys are all living breathing dogs yourself. You know,
after all the things that you guys have been able
to overcome and still being here, strong, confident man, and
true to yourself. That is commendable as as black men,

(01:08:44):
as black athletes, as black fathers. You know, it is,
it is what we need. And so you know, I
appreciate you guys for just being vulnerable today, opening up
about you know a lot of you know, serious matters
and man, just giving people the real that is all

(01:09:05):
that we have for you today on the Dogs Only podcasts.
I first want to take the time to just thank
my teammates that sat down with me, that opened their hearts,
that shared some uncomfortable moments, and we're very vulnerable and
that takes great bravery and I'll salute you for that.

(01:09:25):
And I want to thank the viewers for showing your
support and for listening, because I think that's where everything starts,
and so we appreciate you as always, And until next
time on the Dolls on the podcasts.

Speaker 1 (01:09:42):
Og Rod signing out