September 11, 2025 • 43 mins
On this episode of the Giants Huddle podcast, John Schmeelk is joined by Dave Helman, who is on “The Athletic Football Show”, to discuss the Giants rookies, talk about the Giants vs Cowboys matchup, and dive into the Giants defense.
:00 - Week one chat
14:30 - Cowboys preview
22:20 - Cowboys offense
29:45 - Cowboys defense
35:00 - Giants offense
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's time to get inside the Giants hut. Let's go,
Let's go Giants, get.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Out on the Giants moubul, give me some job. Part
of the Giants Podcast Network. Let's roll.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Welcome to another edition of the Giants Little Podcast, brought
to you by Citizens, the official bank of the Giants.
I am John Schmulk, thrilled to be joined by a
front of the program. You can find them now on
The Athletic Football Show with Robert Mays and Derek Class
and two guys you've also heard on our show before.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
He is Dave Hellman. Dave, good to talk to you, man.
Speaker 4 (00:26):
How are you and it's good to see you. It's
good to be talking NFC East. Obviously I cover the
whole league now, but this division is like my home,
so it's it's like a warm blanket when I get
to talk about Giants, Cowboys, Eagles, commanders love it.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Yeah, I'm sure you guys remember Dave used to be
with us a lot on our NFC East roundtables when
we did those back in the day.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
He was a team reporter for the Cowboys.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Now he's with the Athletic You might have seen him
on his stuff with Fox A couple of years ago
as well.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
So Dave, let's start here. And I thought you and.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
And Derek and Robert did a great job in The
Athletic Football Show, which I tell everyone on our podcast
the best national podcast you could find cover in the NFL,
all fan bases.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
This is week one.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Look at the problem areas understand what could be a
long term issue that you have to deal with.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
But for the most part, weird things happen in week one.
Give it a little bit of time.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Absolutely.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
I mean we say that all summer long, right, It's like, hey,
we're not going to overreact to the preseason. We're not
going to overreact to the first game or two and then,
but once you see it out there on the field, especially,
let's be honest, especially if it's not very good, it's
hard not to get a little worried, get a little antsy.
I mean, I live here in Chicago. Now, you saw
(01:40):
what happened on Monday night. I mean you try telling
very excited Bears fans not to be worried about the
way the second half of that game played out.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
So it's easier said than done.
Speaker 4 (01:51):
But yeah, by and large, we need we need a
two to four game sample size before we're really going
to form firm opinions.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
You know.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
And the funny thing, I actually went to stats and
I had them pull this for me, so I was surprised.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
I looked at it.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
So seventeen teams finished with fewer than two hundred team
passing yards in Week one, more than half of the league.
I went back since to the year two thousand, it
happened this year, last year, the year before. Other than that,
just four their time since the year two thousand has
more than half the league finished with under two hundred
team passing yards in Week one. And I think what
(02:24):
we're seeing here, Dave, with the fewer preseason games, the
guys just playing less, especially offensively, these passing games, it's
gonna take a little bit of time. I mean, just
look at Joe Burrow, Jared Goff, like real deal pro
Bowl level quarterbacks. These things just start slow top sometimes offensively,
especially through the air.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
Oh, I think, And there's several reasons you can point
to that, right, I mean, we did the whole thing
last year, and it's bound to continue. With the amount
of too high safety play, the amount of teams that
are like trying to take explosive passes away from offenses.
So you combine that with the lack of a preseason,
combine that with I'll be honest, with the exception of
(03:03):
a few teams right like the Eagles come to mind
for obvious reasons, but there are very few offensive lines
where you feel like they're working at an advantage against
what some of these defenses are doing, like not just
the skill of the pass pressures, but the disguises and
the sim pressures and the different directions things are coming from.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
You mentioned Joe Burrow, and I.
Speaker 4 (03:26):
Know he's incredible and we got to hold him to
a high standard, but Miles Garrett just wrecked their whole
thing on Sunday afternoon to the point where even he
and that high flying passing attack were struggling to find
time to get anything going. So yeah, I think I
think offenses are right now at least, and I think
(03:46):
it was probably the opposite a few years ago, where
defenses were at a disadvantage for the first few weeks.
But it kind of feels to me like offenses are
kind of playing with a hand tie behind their back
for at least a little while while they figure out
what they got.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
Now, you were not on the Hangover Show on Tuesday
and on the ODLIC Football show that was That was
Robert and Dereck, and one of the games they talked
about on that show was the Giants Commanders game. You
guys did not touch that on your Sunday night program.
And it's funny and I always like to listen to
the National Show. I was talking about the Giants because,
as you know, Dave, sometimes when you cover a team,
you don't see the farest from the trees.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Sometimes right you're so close to it, you kind of
miss some things.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
But Derek opened up the show the same way I
did on our program on Monday, is I'm not sure
it mattered who the quarterback was going to be in
that game. With the way the interior offensive line played
and the way they couldn't run the football and the
way they couldn't protect, I'm not sure who the quarterback
was for the Giants on this week really would have
mattered a ton, to be honest with you.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
It's funny, and I think there's a natural excitement to
see a first round pick, and Jackson Dart played well
in the preseason, so that adds to it.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
And so when the Giants struggle.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
That's gonna be a huge part of the conversation, especially
from outside the fan base.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Of course, at the same time, do you.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Want to throw Jackson Dart into the situation that we
saw on Sunday? I don't necessarily think that's a good idea.
And I know JJ McCarthy weathered the storm on Monday
against the Bears.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
It is doable, I suppose.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
But you want your rookies, typically your young quarterback, in
as good of a situation as possible, and that just
wasn't the case for the Giants. And I don't remember
the stats off the top of my head, but when
we did the Giants preview, we talked about the splits
with Andrew Thomas verse without Andrew Thomas, and I remember
(05:36):
thinking to myself on Sunday where I was like, I
don't want Jackson Dart playing for this team until Andrew
Thomas is available. Like, I don't know if that's a
great idea.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yeah, And look, it doesn't get much easier, right, We
got Dallas this week. We'll talk about that obviously. Then
you have the Chiefs at home, you have the Charges
at home. You finally get a little bit of a
soft landing spot with the Saints. So they played pretty
well in Week one, to be totally honest, I mean.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
They were not an easy out, which I actually because
you know, like doing a national show, you you got
to try to have an eye on ten different things
on a Sunday, and the Saints game was one where
with like eight minutes to play in the fourth, I
was like, Okay, well, at least this is a game
that I can sort of look away from, like this
is going according to script and probably not gonna be
(06:19):
a very interesting finish. And then five minutes later I
was like, never mind, the Saints are driving with a
chance to tie the game.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
And that's I mean, that's the NFL in a nutshell.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Yeah, And look they have and and the Saints defense,
especially in that building in New Orleans, is never a
fun unit or or place to play for for any team.
So I think, as you look forward here, Dave, would
you think of abdul Quarter. I know you guys are
big fans of him in his limited preseason reps, Uh,
did he match what you thought he would give you
(06:48):
in that first regular season game?
Speaker 4 (06:49):
I mean I yes, unequivocally yes, and I know it
probably considering considering the preseason hype on on Car and
justifiably so, like between who he is as a prospect
and what he did in the preseason. But if you
listen to shows like ours, I think every time we
talked about Defensive Rookie of the Year, we were like, Okay, yeah,
(07:11):
Carter's probably gonna win, but who else can we talk about?
You know, like that's a boring one, right, yeah, right,
that's sort of the expectation. And so maybe he didn't
like blow up the stat sheet and obviously the Giants
lost the opener fairly comfortably, but he.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
Looked active, he looked disruptive.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
I mean, the guy and I love the fact that
the guy blocked a punt like he was. So, you know,
he's the number three overall pick, he's the favorite to
win Defensive Rookie of the Year. You think about him
as this guy that's gonna get all these sacks on defense,
but he is a rookie. Rookies play special teams, and
to do so admirably I thought was a fun wrinkle
to his first game. So yeah, I mean, if that's
(07:50):
the starting point, then yes, I'm I'm pretty excited about
where this is going.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I don't think that's groundbreaking analysis.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Though, Before we get to the match up, specifically against
Dallas Cowboys in Week one, it was a national game
that now seems like it happened like two weeks ago.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
So much has happened since then, but we all watched it.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
What was your overall take on a team that you
were very close to, and I'm sure you still watch
them more than others. What do you think of the
Cowboys in Week one and they're lost to Philly?
Speaker 4 (08:16):
You know, moral victories aren't a thing in the NFL,
and especially like with all the baggage that comes with
Dallas the Super Bowl drought and they just traded Micah
and the fan bases is unhappy with ownership as I
can remember them ever being really, but I thought Thursday
kind of felt like a moral victory. I mean, they
(08:36):
were touchdown plus favorites. It was either seven and a
half or eight and a half points by the time
the game kicked off, which, even with everything Dallas is missing,
I was like, is that right? Like do people really
think this is that big of a mismatch? And of
course they played pretty capably. I thought the defense settled
in the run, defense got a heck of a lot
(08:58):
better in the second half, some of the young edge
rushers that they're going to be asking to replace Micah Parsons.
Certainly they didn't do that, but they looked active, they
looked promising in the second half of that game. I
thought they gave the Eagles very good offensive line at
least a little bit of trouble. And really, if I'm
trying to sell you on the Cowboys in twenty twenty five,
it's Dak Prescott winging the ball around to his receivers
(09:20):
and I got exactly what I wanted out of that.
I mean, I thought Dak played phenomenally. Like the stat
line didn't. It did not do justice to how well
he played. Obviously, Ceedee Lamb drops a couple balls that
maybe changed the outcome. But for all of the negativity
around the team, and I think coming into the year,
nobody really took them seriously as like contenders in the NFC,
(09:44):
I thought it was a good showing and if you know,
if they can build on that, then this is definitely
a team that I think could make a little more
noise in the playoff picture than I think people gave
him credit for.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
I want to get back to the Cowboys in a
second befirst. You mentioned Lamb's drops, right, that was an
epidemic around the league year. You look at the Titan
this week, you look at the Titans game eight and
a million drops of cam Ward. The Giants had a
bunch of drops. You mentioned the drops of Ceede Lamb.
I think the game goes a little faster to the receivers.
You know, you gotta worry about getting you know, hit
when you catch the ball. It's so much different than
(10:15):
practice for the wide receiver position. That's something I think
really showed up around the league in Week one.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
A lot of drops.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
I'm gonna I'm gonna sound like a drivetime radio caller
right now, but like, oh okay, Like the Titans are
a great example. I mean, Calvin Ridley did have a
couple of drops, but I don't think anybody's gonna try
to sell us that Calvin Ridley is on the level
of Ceedee Lamb. And then obviously the Titans receiver corps
behind him is kind of pieced together. The two biggest
(10:41):
culprits in the Cowboys loss were Ceedee Lamb with his
one hundred and whatever million dollar contract and Jake Ferguson,
who just got paid fifty million dollars over the summer.
I'm like, guys, these have to be caught like this,
I mean the ball. You know, if the ball touches
your hand, you should catch it. And in a few
of these it did much more than touch your hand,
(11:01):
Like you know.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
CD had one split split through the palms.
Speaker 4 (11:05):
Of his hands, the one at the end of the
game that could have changed the outcome landed in his
bread basket. Jake Ferguson he didn't need like he bobbled
it before he got hit in the end zone. I
was like, guys' we make way too much money for
these two at least not be closer to being catches.
So I mean, like I said, like Tennessee is a
team where I'm like, well, yeah, this is this is
(11:26):
a young team with a not so good roster, Like
this is the type of stuff that happens with the Cowboys.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
I'm like, you paid these guys.
Speaker 4 (11:33):
These guys are considered I mean CD is considered at
the top of his position in the league, and Jake
Ferguson is at least upper tier, like top ten, top
twelve tight.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Ends in the league. I need to see these plays
get made.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
The Giants Total podcast is brought to you by Citizens,
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(12:06):
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Speaker 1 (12:17):
Huddle up, get in here.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
If you're lined up here, you gotta go over the
middle with at the score great?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
How do we make that happen?
Speaker 4 (12:25):
I don't know, but Citizen does makes sense of your
money with Citizens Official Bank of Eli Manning.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
It's funny our our sideline reporter on our radio broadcast,
Howard Cross, who played in the league for like fifteen years.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
He is a great line.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
When a guy drops in easy pass, he likes to say, schmelk.
If that was a spear, it would have killed him.
And that was like and that was the ced Lamb place, like,
if that was a spear, he'd be dead.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Was anybody numbers?
Speaker 4 (12:52):
Does anybody have better idioms than like old krusty football
people like the stuff that they say, and they just
say it like naturally, like a matter of course. And
I'm like, where did you get that from? I'm gonna remember,
I'm gonna steal that.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
No, please steal it. Howard love that member.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Howard was in a locker room with Lawrence Teller for
a few years, so the stuff he heard, I can
only I can only bathom the stuff that he heard.
What'd you think of the Cowboys young offensive line in
that game against Tilly?
Speaker 4 (13:18):
I honestly, and obviously it comes with an enormous caveat
that Jalen Carter didn't play a snap in that game,
But I thought they handled themselves really, really well, like
Tyler Booker's obviously the rookie, and again, it must have
been nice for him to look up on the first
play of the game and be like, oh, Jalen Carter's
not gonna be here all night. Like this is way,
(13:39):
this is way better than I thought it was gonna be.
But I went back and looked at him. He looked
He looked very competent. He handled twists and stunts really well.
He was dominant at times. He saw him pancaking guys
on occasion. Tyler Geiden is the other one, second year
left tackle, I thought, handled himself really well. Again, I
don't know what that means because the Eagle are breaking
(14:00):
in several new edge rushers. Josh Sweat's not there anymore.
You're talking about guys like Jaylyxx Hunt. Not not to
say that those aren't good players, but I don't. I
just don't think it's with Jalen Carter not there, I
don't know that it was a true test of how
good they are.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
But lucky for us, we don't have to.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Wait very long because I have a feeling sexy, dexy
Brian Burns, Abdua Carter, and Kevon Thibodau. I have a
feeling that's gonna be a much stronger test than what
they saw last week. So I'm this is this one
has circled very highly on my list just to see
how this Cowboys line deals with the front Like.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
This Johnson a podcast brought to you by Citizens, the
official bank of the Giants from game day celebrations you
everyday financial needs, big Blue fans and get get the
most out of everyone with Citizens learn more a Citizens
bank dot com slash Giants. Dave Helm joining me in
the Hackensack, Britney Hell podcast video Keep getting Better and Dave,
we went, You've been through a million of these games,
covering on both sides.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
When's the last time? Usually a Giants Cowboys game in
Dallas at one o'clock. It's very strange.
Speaker 4 (15:02):
I hadn't thought about that, but you're so right, and
it's it's sad what this rivalry is right now if
we can be.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Real about it.
Speaker 4 (15:10):
Because I was thinking about that when I when I
when we talked and I knew I was going to
do your show. I was just thinking back on my
time and when I started with the Cowboys, it was
twenty thirteen, so like Eli was there, Odell showed up
soon after that, and the two Super Bowls were much
more recent, and like that was that was the rivalry
(15:32):
in the NFC East. Like right now, it's it's been
Cowboys Eagles for a couple of years. I'm sure you know,
the Commanders are going to have something to say about
that now that Jaden Daniels has shown up. But for
the first like five years of my time covering the Cowboys, Giants, Giants,
Cowboys was it. That was the one And now it's
kind of feels relegated to second class status. But maybe
(15:55):
maybe that'll change here over the next year or two.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
Those Eli Romo games were just so much fun because
both quarterbacks are so volatile, right, Like they could.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
Look terrible for a half, then all of a sudden
they go nuts.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Those were some unbelievable games going on the way back
out of you were there yet, But that two thousand
and seven you know playoff game that yeah, to win
the Super Bowl, I mean that started it, and it
was just wild.
Speaker 4 (16:16):
That was before my time, but it was an iconic
NFL moment, like just as somebody who loves football, I
remember watching that and and the Cowboys swept them during
the regular season and then the Giants did what they
did in the playoffs. Just yeah, I mean, these were
this was the stuff that the networks were like, we
gotta get this. This has to be the three thirty game.
(16:36):
It's got to be on primetime, So it kind of
stinks to see it relegated to a one pm start.
But yeah, man, I still I get a kick out
of it though. Like I said, like when I started,
it's funny to think, yeah, because I mean, since Dak
showed up, it's been rough for the Giants playing Dallas.
But when when I showed up, it was like, how
(16:57):
are we gonna beat the Giants?
Speaker 1 (16:58):
We got we gotta get past these guys.
Speaker 4 (17:00):
So yeah, it's it's been weird to see it sort
of evolve into what it is right now.
Speaker 3 (17:05):
Yeah, And to your point, the Giants have not beaten
Dak Prescott since his rookie year in twenty sixteen. It's
been a while they've struggled against him. I know there
is angst still amongst the Cowboys fan base as to
exactly how good Dak Prescott is. What's kind of like
the status of that. I know it's been kind of
up and down a little bit, But are fans still
(17:25):
just because of the contract it's so big, are they
still kind of thinking about it?
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Where are they with Dak right now? In Dallas?
Speaker 4 (17:31):
It is bizarre to see how Dak at this point
is basically just living out Tony Romo's career.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
I mean, the parallels are insane, man.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
I mean, you know, he showed up, He showed up
and was very exciting as a young player, and everybody
loved him. And then there were a couple playoff mishaps
and there's a lot of debate about what he's worth and.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Should he get paid, and now he's kind.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
Of entering into the veteran part of his career and yeah,
I mean, like no, like, not everybody is going to
be happy. He's the quarterback of the Cowboys. So A,
it's a huge fan base, so you can't please everybody,
and then b if you don't love the Cowboys, you
hate them.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
So like it's not like it's not like Dak has admirers.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
Among other fan bases because nobody loves the Cowboys. Like
that's just it's a lonely aspect of quarterbacking that team.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Uh So, no, I mean, there's always going.
Speaker 4 (18:26):
To be debate about how good he is until he
wins the Super Bowl. But it's crazy now, right because
what he's I think he's thirty two.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
That sounds about he's year ten.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
And now so his offensive line is young and and
his receivers are very young. George Pickens joins up this
year and now. It blew my mind when they traded
Micah because I was like, oh my god, this is
just like when they cut de Marcus Ware and then
when Romo sort of morphed into this MVP candidate. Over
the last couple of years of his career, he didn't
(18:57):
have a good enough defense. You know, the twenty fourteen team,
I think they had like twenty six sacks the year
that they went twelve and four, and DeMarco Murray had
eighteen hundred rushing yards and they just didn't have enough
on defense. So I was laughing when I saw that,
where I was like, is Dak gonna have like the
year of his life? And the Cowboys just aren't gonna
be good enough on the other side of the ball
(19:17):
for it to matter.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
And it is early, but watching.
Speaker 4 (19:21):
Him against the Eagles, I was like, he looks like
he's ready to have a nice year, and I just
I hope the talent around him is up to it.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
All right, So let's talk about the matchup then, And
I'm with him, by the way, DeMarcus Wing on win
a Super Bowl with the Broncos and now the way
the Packers point League one who.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Knows talk about this matchup.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
I know Schottenheimer, Bran Schottenheimer's was there as the offensive cordad,
but boy, that offense looked a lot different in Week
one with Schottenheimer that it ever did under Mike McCarthy,
with the way they ran it, some of the you know,
narrow splits.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
More motion stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
What do you think this is going to look like
with this Dallas offense trying to go against the Giant
defense with a really good defensive front.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
Yeah, I'm I'm intrigued to see see how much they
lean into that. And that's been something cowboy fans have
been clamoring for for years, is more motion, motion at
the snap, use your players to kind of suss out
what the defense wants to do. It's not been a
cowboy thing for most of the last decade to the
point where they're like people have conspiracy theories where it's like,
(20:19):
is this is this like a Jerry Jones thing? Like
does Jerry Jones not want to play this type of offense?
Or does Dak Prescott not like to play that type
of offense because he sort of likes to see the
picture in front of him and not have a whole
lot of stuff changing.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
So Thursday night was a pretty.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
Noticeable departure from what we've gotten used to, and I'm
just curious to see how they maintain that. Like Cavante
Turpin is not a guy that I expect to ever
have this crazy like eight to ten touch game, but
his speed is very interesting and they can use it
in a lot of fun ways again to like suss
(20:56):
out what a defense wants to do, or be a
field stretcher to open things up underneath. So I'm curious
to see how they continue to do that. I'm curious
to see if they, for lack of a better way
to put it, like, if they're man enough to just
kind of bow up and try to run right at
this giant's front. I don't I don't really know how
good that good of an idea that is. Like I said,
(21:19):
the interior of this offensive line looked pretty damn good
against Philly, but that's with Jalen Carter taking an early shower.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Do you want to do that against this front? Do
you like?
Speaker 4 (21:29):
Or maybe you should try just to see what you
got but how quickly are you going to pivot to that?
And so I look at this as a game where
I'd be I'd be asking my receivers to try to
uh substitute a lot of running production, get the ball
out on the edges, get the ball out of the
tackle box early and often and quickly in the in
(21:50):
the snap.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
So I'm curious to see how that works.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
But I also I wonder if they might just try
to figure out what they got and say, all right,
Tyler Booker, you got your you got your audition against
a lesser situation against Philly, but let's go see what
you can do. So I'm curious to see what the
game plan is and if they just sort of try
to avoid that fight altogether, or if they they're like, hey,
(22:14):
let's go see if we can go mono and mono
against these guys.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
My biggest concern from a Giants perspective here, Dave, is
you know, Cidie Lamb's gonna come out annoyed that he
had a national performance where he had those drops, So
I expect him to come out and play really well.
And then we did not really see the full George
Pickens experience. He had three catches, they're all relatively shorty.
They draw that one deep defensive pass interference penalty down
the field. But he seems like the perfect receiver for
(22:40):
Dak Prescott because he loves to just throw it downfield
into tight spots and that's what.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
George Pickens does.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
Is this, in your opinion, the best set of weapons
on the perimeter that Prescott has had? And how do
you think the Cowboys might try to utilize him against
this Giants defense?
Speaker 4 (22:56):
So I think it is, and there was there was
probably one year twenty twenty one Dak had young Ceedee
Lamb and Amari Cooper and that was pretty damn good.
So I think you have to mention that when you
talk about like the best receiver groups. I also think
twenty nineteen he had Amari Michael Gallup before his injury,
(23:20):
when he was a pretty good player, and they got
nine hundred yards out of Randall Cobb at the late
stage of his career. It's only week two, so I
can't say like this is definitively the best, but I
think this has the potential to be the best patch
pass catching group that Dak has ever had.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
I'm super high on Pickens.
Speaker 4 (23:39):
Funnily enough, I'm super high on him just playing his
ass off for four months to get a contract.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
But you're you're already.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
Seeing people pointing out that, like, oh, maybe maybe the
effort wasn't that great on snaps where the ball wasn't
coming to him, Like maybe George Pickens needs to to
buckle down and work on selling his routes to make
the defense honor him, work on blocking and stuff like that.
So I'm curious to see how that goes, Like if
the Cowboys saw that on tape and they're like, hey, George,
(24:08):
this this ain't gonna cut it, buddy, And you mean,
you got to have a nice season if we want
to if we want a big contract. So I got
an eye on that, But I am I'm very confident
that this could be one of the most explosive passing
games in the league, especially if the offensive line gives
Dack time, which okay, So I want to turn this
back on you, and I'll be fully I'll be fully transparent.
(24:29):
Robert and Derek, like you said, they did the hangover
show for the Giants and Commanders. I have not been
able yet to get a close eye on the Giants
Commander's game other than just what I saw on Sunday,
How did the secondary look to you? Because that's obviously
it's so easy to get excited about the front and
(24:49):
all of that talent, and it was a nice first
day for them for the most part. But what did
you think about the back end, because that is the
huge question mark.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Yeah, well, all the one thing out there first. I
don't think extra Lawrence looked the same. He barely practiced
in the off season. He came off of this located
elbow last year.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
It's completely valid by the way.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
I mean, as good as he is, it's totally not
a surprise if he needs some time to ramp up.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yeah, he did not look like himself.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
He got better as the game went along, and again
he didn't play a second in preseason, so I would
keep an eye on that too, when you have a
chance to kind of get ready for this. You know,
the secondary, I thought they allowed a little too much airspace.
Here's the thing, and I'm going to talk to Paul
Someondebo about this tomorrow on the John Tuttle podcast. I
wonder how much Jade and Daniel's mobility affected how they
(25:36):
wanted to play in the secondary right. It's hard to
play pressman against Jade and Daniels. You turn your back,
he can run. So they were on a lot of zone,
they were in a lot of off They played a
lot of soft stuff. I didn't like that they didn't
really re route the receivers at the line as much
as they should, even when they were in zone. You know,
you can press, reroute and then drop, you can do
(25:56):
that in zone defense. I didn't think they did it
quite enough of that, and they did get beat with
a lot of.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Deep incuts and dig routes. Jayden Daniels that though, was
actually awful.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Little bit he threw the ball behind a couple of
receivers over the course of the game. He miss Terry
McLaurin on a deep pass on the left sideline, which
he rarely did last year.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
So I thought they allowed a little too much airspace.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
But again I wonder how much that had to do
with just having to account for Jade and Daniel scrambling ability,
because it's so hard to play man against a team
like the Commanders.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
Jaden is one of those quarterbacks who and it's infuriating
to watch if you're a fan of the other team
because it's like we're playing so soft, like we're giving
him this big cushion. What are like, what are we doing?
We're not like pressure him, And it's like Jayden almost
forces you to play passive defense because yeah, I mean
if you if you play man, you can get burned
(26:46):
if you blitz and he gets out of it, which
is a good shot to happen with a guy that athletic,
You're gonna get burned. And so it almost forces you
into a position where you're probably not playing as aggressively
as you would prefer.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
And unfortunately for the Giants.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
I mean, Dak is an expert pat like he's going
to make plays from the pocket, that's what he does.
But it is a more traditional type of game, Like
at this point in his career, I don't think you
have to worry about Dak burning you with his feet,
at least not more than once a game or so.
So I think like this might be a more accurate
(27:22):
litmus test because this is going to be a very
traditional looking offense just from the standpoint of the quarterbacks
not trying to leave the pocket if he doesn't have to.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
If you want to know how to manage two minutes
of crunch time football. I'm your man.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
But if you're wondering about a long term financial plan,
you should talk to citizens.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Hey, I can also talk long care I'd like to
learn about an Molli routine. Yes, I knew I could
help make sense of your money with citizens.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Neil Jayden led the NFL not rookies, led the NFL
in passing yards versus the blitz last year.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
So I think the.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
Giants saw that and they're like, Eh, maybe blitzing this
guy's not the best idea, right, But I do think
the matchup that I'll watch here Dave in this game,
and I mentioned the receivers for a reason able I
think you feel okay that he can handle his business.
Is he gonna be perfect or shut somebody down, though,
But I think he'll be okay. Cordo Flott seems to
have beaten out Deonty Banks on the other side for
the second cornerback spot. He played around eighty eight percent
(28:11):
of the snaps. Deontay Banks played some like fifteen or
sixteen defensive snaps in the game and out in front
of me, but somewhere around there. So how does Flot,
who is still a little bit undersized. He's six foot,
but he's probably only l one hundred and eighty one
hundred and eighty pounds, give or take.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
How does he match up against Lamb and Pickens?
Speaker 3 (28:28):
Because those two guys are physical players, they're physical receivers,
They're on the bigger side. How does he match up
against those two guys. That's something that I would keep
an eye in terms of how the Giants handle that.
Do they put a safety over the top, do they
not trust him in man? Did they play zone? You know,
I'm curious to see how the Giants handle that side
of the field with their second cornerback spot.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Pickens made one play that kind of made me sit
up in my seat against the Eagles, and it wasn't
anything spectacular. It was it was like a comeback on
the sideline, move the sticks. But it's a exactly why
I'm excited about this partnership with Dak Prescott. Because Dak
Prescott a He's aggressive as hell. He is not afraid
(29:07):
to throw into any window. He is not afraid to
just put it on a spot and be like yeah,
like it'll be picked if you don't do your job
the right way. But I'm trusting you too. And Pickens,
you know, he's got these go go gadget arms and
he just plucked that thing and he like the DB's
swatting at him and he's just vice grip on the football.
And I was like, that is why George Pickens makes
(29:30):
sense on the Cowboys, because Dak can just put it
in a spot and this guy's gonna go get it
no matter where it is. And so yeah, I mean,
if you've got the size advantage on a dB, I
think that is something that I would want to attack
if I were Dallas, where it's like, yeah, I mean
Dak Prescott, if he feels good about that, then like
(29:51):
the coverage doesn't matter because he'll just put it in
a spot where Pickens can make it work.
Speaker 2 (29:56):
All right, Let's jump to the other side of the
matchup here.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
I'm sure Jerry Jones was happy that they did not
allow allow of rushing yards to Saquon Barkley and that's like.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Oh, petty cark justified the trade. See we stopped the run.
I'm sure he was very pumped up about that.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
And by the way, I thought they actually did a
much better job against the run than we've seen the
last couple of years.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
But what is this Cowboys front? Now?
Speaker 3 (30:16):
Are their best two players actually their defensive tackles, which
is a weird thing to say about this Cowboys defense.
And you know the Shaun's offense line struggling in League
One against the Commander's defensive front that also does not
have any stars on it spare maybe Deron Pain. What
is this Cowboys defensive front going to do? Are they
gonna blitz a lot? Are they gonna stun as much
as they used to? What do you think that matchup's
gonna look like it is?
Speaker 4 (30:38):
I saw the the pressure numbers yesterday, like just players
who lead the league in pressure, and I mean Dorrance Armstrong,
longtime Cowboy, really good player, So I'm not trying to
throw shade at him, but I was like, oh, if
Dorance Armstrong is like leading the league in anything, that's
that's not good. That doesn't say something good about what
happened against the Giant or from the GI's perspective on Sundays.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
So I've got an eye on that.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
You know it was, And I think, weirdly, I think
the answer to your question is yes, like I think
OsO Diggi Zua And obviously now new Cowboy Kenney Clark
are probably the best pieces of this front. I mean,
two young guys that I thought had nice nights, and
it started rough in the I mean the first half. Honestly,
(31:25):
the first half of that game did not look better.
The Eagles ran for like one hundred and thirty yards
at halftime, and I was like, this looks like the
same run defense guys, and then they buckled down after halftime.
I will point out I don't want to be a hater,
but I thought a lot of the Cowboys' success came
after Landon Dickerson suffered his injury and you know, he
(31:48):
got hurt and he eventually left that game, and all
of a sudden.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
The Cowboys were kind of kicking ass up front. And
I was like, I.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
Don't think that's I don't think that's a coincidence. Now,
I mean, obviously that's not the Cowboys problem, but it
something worth noting. But yeah, Donovan Azeraku, the rookie, I
thought he had a couple of nice flashes. And Marshawn Neeland,
who was their second round pick last year, also just
an impressively strong, disruptive guy. So those two are like
the edge rushers to watch. But yeah, I think Kinney,
(32:17):
Clark and Osa are where it starts. And obviously, just
watching what the Giants offensive line looked like on Sunday,
I think they probably feel super optimistic about their matchups
and what they might be capable of doing. I haven't
heard it. Have we heard anything about Thomas this week?
Do we know anything about that?
Speaker 2 (32:36):
Look?
Speaker 3 (32:36):
He took team reps in practice for the first time
all off season last Friday, Dave, and he was limited,
so I think there has to be still some measure
of build up this week. I think seeing what he
does on practice Wednesday or Thursday will be very important.
Speaker 4 (32:49):
I mean, it's all eyes on that for me, because,
like I said, I mean, and it sounds funny because,
like you said, the interior of the offensive line was
the culprit against the Commanders, but an all Pro player
can just be a stabilizing force across an offensive line.
So I will be eyeing that injury report intently because
(33:11):
I and these you know, the Cowboys pass rush I
don't think is one that you would lose sleepover compared
to some other teams on the Giant schedule. But like
I said, I'm sure those guys are watching tape of
Sunday and saying like, yeah, we we feel good about this.
I wouldn't expect a ton of blitzing all that. Well,
Matt Iberflus did start blitzing his corners in the second half.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
And that was it came, right.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
Yeah, But that's that's my point.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
It's like they had to bring pressure from weird places
and like, that's that is not the you know, Eberflus
came up under Rod Marinelli. He was on this Cowboys
defensive staff back then when Rod was there, and like,
blitzing is not his preference. Like I think the corner
blitzes came because they were like, well it's either this
or we don't pressure.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
Jalen Hurts tonight, Like what do you want it to be?
Speaker 4 (33:59):
So my guess would be they're gonna try to win
with four as often as possible, and maybe they get
exotic if they have to. But that's just that's never
been eber Flus's preference if he doesn't have to. So
I'll be curious to see how much of a push
they can get with four before they try something else.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
I had to laugh on that Trayvon Diggs blitz he
got into the backfield and he didn't know what to do.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
He's like, I'm at the quarterback. What do I do now?
I've never been asked to do this before.
Speaker 1 (34:24):
He's like, you guys don't want me in coverage?
Speaker 4 (34:26):
I got I gotta shout out Trayvon too. By the way,
I'm like I on our Athletic Football Show preview in
the summer, I was like, how are the Cowboys just
expecting Trayvon Diggs to be himself?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
Like he?
Speaker 4 (34:41):
I mean, he had a very bad injury. He's not
having a training camp, and when they activated him for
the Eagles game, I was I was like, he's gonna
this is not gonna go well. How could you possibly
be expected to cover DeVante and aj and all that
stuff in your first game back after not having a preseason.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
He was on a snap count.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
Like you know, It's not like he went out there
and just completely shut everything down himself, but just to
play and play well in that situation I thought was
really really impressive.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
I agree, and I think that's the final matchup BONE
asking you about here. Dave Milieu neighbors obviously not as
productive as he would have liked in Week one. You're
an LSU guy. So I know you are a big
Mileague neighbors guy. The Cowboys a big zone defense now team,
Now are they going to just straight up double team neighbors.
What do you think that's going to look like? Because
I'm sure he wants to have a big game after
a Week one disappointment for him.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
I would expect it to be a lot more zone.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
Again, like that's the tree that Matt Eberflus comes from,
And yes I would.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
I would expect them to blanket.
Speaker 4 (35:41):
My league neighbors as often as humanly possible and just
make somebody else be the reason why they lose. And
I mean even with Trayvon Diggs, even with Trayvon Diggs
playing well last week, there's not a corner on the
Cowboys roster that I would want to man up Moleague
neighbors on a regular basis and trust that it's gonna
(36:03):
go well.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Especially maybe if Michael Parsons.
Speaker 4 (36:07):
Is on your team and you're confident that the ball's
got to come out, that's a different story. But I
don't trust that this Cowboys pass rush is of that
caliber just yet, So I think that is a recipe
for disaster. I would expect Dallas to cloud the field
wherever Molite neighbors is and try to frustrate him as
much as possible.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Man, I'm yeah, I know, I know.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Week one was disappointing, but and I am biased because
that is where I went to school. But I'm I
think the sky's the limit for that guy. I'm so
excited to see what he's going to do this year.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
All right, So let's let's end on this. These Week
two games are always tough, David. You get these two
oh to one teams, and we know what oh and
two does to a fan base. It puts them into
a tizzy, understandably, So look after you go into the
path's very, very difficult. And I just think home opener
for Dallas, the intensity in that building, and I think
the desperation from both teams is going to be pretty
(37:00):
palpable from the get go in that game.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
I do too.
Speaker 4 (37:05):
And I mean this is not hard hitting analysis, but
I long ago I got to a point where I
was like, I will believe the Giants beat Dak Prescott
when I see it happen, because I get it again,
he's on the when he's on the field.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
It just hasn't been a thing. I was there. I think, yeah,
I was there for the last time it happened.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
They beat They beat the Cowboys ten to seven in
that twenty sixteen season, and Dak just didn't look like
he had an answer for anything that they were doing
in that game. And I think Odell broke a long
one and that was the difference. Uh. But since then,
if Dak's on the field, more often than not, like
it's been a win, and more often than not it's
been a pretty comfortable win. I don't know that that'll
(37:48):
be the case on Sunday. I'm not ready. I'm not
ready to write off the Giants. I know Sunday was
was pretty rough, but I yeah, Week one is weird.
I think there's reason for optimy, and I think there's
plenty of reason for optimism if Andrew Thomas can get
himself onto the field. But I do like Dallas in
this game until further Notice what I mean, the spreads
(38:10):
five and a half. A lot of that is because Dallas,
like you said, it's the home opener.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
It should be a pretty rowdy environment, I.
Speaker 4 (38:16):
Think, And I think, like I said, the fan base
in Dallas is pretty upset with the team. But I
do think that performance in Philly sort of galvanized people that.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
Like, Okay, like maybe this season won't.
Speaker 4 (38:27):
Be terrible, So I think there will be some enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
Yeah, I would. I would pick Dallas by like seven
or eight points in this game. Probably.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
I should point out, though, you you were pretty bullish
in the Giants before the season started.
Speaker 4 (38:39):
You thought there was a path them to actually be
much better this year, right, I like everything about this
or everything might be a stretch. I like a lot
about this Giants team, and I was really bullish on that. Honestly,
I was super bullish on the Giants until I saw
the schedule and like, like you said at the beginning,
it's you know, it's Commanders, It's Cowboys, both road games,
(39:01):
Chiefs after that Chargers. So you're playing three playoff teams
in your first four and a Cowboys team that would
have been better last year if their quarterback hadn't gotten hurt.
And then even after the Saints game, Eagles Broncos Eagles,
I'm just like, I want to believe in this team
so badly as a frisky sort of surprise wildcard team,
especially again it it kind of es that sounds a
(39:25):
little silly maybe, but like it hinges on Andrew Thomas's
health for me, like that offensive line just needs to
be a respectable unit and that's the easiest way to
get it there.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
So I said that. I mean, look at the Steelers
last year.
Speaker 4 (39:39):
It was not high flying football, but like, if you've
got a good front and Russell Wilson can get his
thing going on a little bit and the running game
is at least respectable, I think there's a path here
to like eight and nine, nine and eight for the Giants.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
But then I saw the schedule and I was like.
Speaker 4 (39:56):
Oh man, we're asking we're asking a lot here, Like
that is a lot of good teams to open the season.
So hopefully, I just I hope they can keep it
on track enough to where you know, there's still something
to feel good about when the schedule eases up a
little bit in the second half of the year.
Speaker 3 (40:11):
All right, let's close on this because both of us
are living a similar life right now. One of the
shows you hosted meeting on the Athletic Football Show is
with Dane Brugler. It's called Building the Beast, where you
guys talk about college prospects. We have draft season, well,
I do the same thing with Tony. Paul nine has
been doing the draft stuff just as long, and I
love David.
Speaker 2 (40:28):
I'm sure you've done this before.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
I'm watching a game on a Saturday and I'm like, Wow,
this guy looks awesome, you know, and you're all exciting.
You think you found somebody, and then you bring it
up to Dane and I bring out to Tony and
they're like listing their high school Oh he plays across
on the side, Like there are no secrets with guys
like Dane and Tony. They just know all these guys
and they're just an encyclopedia of knowledge and it frustrates
the hell out of me sometimes absolutely.
Speaker 4 (40:51):
And that happened this past weekend where two things happen.
Number One, I see a guy and I get excited
and I'm like do you think, like like do you
think he's pretty good? And like, you know, I don't.
I don't want to be in love with a guy,
and Dane's like, oh, yeah, like he's like a six
round pick, you know, right or and then the other
thing is I'm like, holy, holy crap, who's this guy
(41:11):
that just made this play for Auburn? And yeah, he's
just he's got the bio ready to go. He's like,
oh yeah, he was actually at Middle Tennessee State before that,
and he made a position switch and his parents wanted
him to play baseball.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
I'm just like, what do you do during the summer?
How do you already know all this stuff? It's fair.
Speaker 4 (41:31):
I'm I'm playing catch up with him, and it's very
it's very fun. It's and it's great to have a
resource like that available.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
No, absolutely, and and and and we'll have to, you know,
get together and talk some college football later in the
year too.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
As we kind of get uh week three.
Speaker 3 (41:44):
There's not a ton of great matchups, but there'll be
enough to watch and as we get more information will
be fun.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
Dave, the floor is yours.
Speaker 3 (41:51):
Tell the folks win you you find everything that you're
doing working with the athletic now.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
So I'm on the Athletic Football Show with Robert Mays
and Derek Classen. I mean, we we have something in
the feed every day of the week, but we do
a recap of every NFL Sunday that airs on Monday.
We're recapping every primetime game this year, so every Monday night,
every Thursday night, we will have something in the feed
(42:16):
breaking down what we just saw from that particular matchup
and stuff throughout the week. As John just mentioned, I
think our latest episode of Building the Beast is out
right now.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
It comes out. It comes out on Wednesdays.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
So if you're a draft nick like John and I are,
you can come find me and Dane talking all the prospects,
all the big college games, what to know for the
coming draft.
Speaker 1 (42:39):
You can get all of that wherever wherever you get
your podcasts or on YouTube, and I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
Dan.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
You guys got a fancy new studio now. Man, you
guys are in Chicago together. It's a whole other level.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Man. Congratulations, that's great.
Speaker 1 (42:52):
We're coming up in the world.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
I joke with them all the time, like I just
signed up and I'm like, I feel kind of guilty
that I'm getting all this good stuff.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
But it's pretty nice.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
Check it out, guys. It really is a fantastic show.
If you want to figure out what's going on around
the NFL.
Speaker 3 (43:05):
That's Dave Hellman and the Johns Little Podcast, brought to
you by citizens Official Bank of the Giants.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
Thanks for being with us. We'll see you next time. Everybody,
It's time to get inside the Giants hut. Let's go,
Let's go Giants, get.
Speaker 2 (00:05):
Out on the Giants moubul, give me some job. Part
of the Giants Podcast Network. Let's roll.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Welcome to another edition of the Giants Little Podcast, brought
to you by Citizens, the official bank of the Giants.
I am John Schmulk, thrilled to be joined by a
front of the program. You can find them now on
The Athletic Football Show with Robert Mays and Derek Class
and two guys you've also heard on our show before.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
He is Dave Hellman. Dave, good to talk to you, man.
Speaker 4 (00:26):
How are you and it's good to see you. It's
good to be talking NFC East. Obviously I cover the
whole league now, but this division is like my home,
so it's it's like a warm blanket when I get
to talk about Giants, Cowboys, Eagles, commanders love it.
Speaker 3 (00:42):
Yeah, I'm sure you guys remember Dave used to be
with us a lot on our NFC East roundtables when
we did those back in the day.
Speaker 2 (00:47):
He was a team reporter for the Cowboys.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Now he's with the Athletic You might have seen him
on his stuff with Fox A couple of years ago
as well.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
So Dave, let's start here. And I thought you and.
Speaker 3 (00:55):
And Derek and Robert did a great job in The
Athletic Football Show, which I tell everyone on our podcast
the best national podcast you could find cover in the NFL,
all fan bases.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
This is week one.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
Look at the problem areas understand what could be a
long term issue that you have to deal with.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
But for the most part, weird things happen in week one.
Give it a little bit of time.
Speaker 1 (01:18):
Absolutely.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
I mean we say that all summer long, right, It's like, hey,
we're not going to overreact to the preseason. We're not
going to overreact to the first game or two and then,
but once you see it out there on the field, especially,
let's be honest, especially if it's not very good, it's
hard not to get a little worried, get a little antsy.
I mean, I live here in Chicago. Now, you saw
(01:40):
what happened on Monday night. I mean you try telling
very excited Bears fans not to be worried about the
way the second half of that game played out.
Speaker 1 (01:48):
So it's easier said than done.
Speaker 4 (01:51):
But yeah, by and large, we need we need a
two to four game sample size before we're really going
to form firm opinions.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
You know.
Speaker 3 (01:58):
And the funny thing, I actually went to stats and
I had them pull this for me, so I was surprised.
Speaker 2 (02:02):
I looked at it.
Speaker 3 (02:03):
So seventeen teams finished with fewer than two hundred team
passing yards in Week one, more than half of the league.
I went back since to the year two thousand, it
happened this year, last year, the year before. Other than that,
just four their time since the year two thousand has
more than half the league finished with under two hundred
team passing yards in Week one. And I think what
(02:24):
we're seeing here, Dave, with the fewer preseason games, the
guys just playing less, especially offensively, these passing games, it's
gonna take a little bit of time. I mean, just
look at Joe Burrow, Jared Goff, like real deal pro
Bowl level quarterbacks. These things just start slow top sometimes offensively,
especially through the air.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
Oh, I think, And there's several reasons you can point
to that, right, I mean, we did the whole thing
last year, and it's bound to continue. With the amount
of too high safety play, the amount of teams that
are like trying to take explosive passes away from offenses.
So you combine that with the lack of a preseason,
combine that with I'll be honest, with the exception of
(03:03):
a few teams right like the Eagles come to mind
for obvious reasons, but there are very few offensive lines
where you feel like they're working at an advantage against
what some of these defenses are doing, like not just
the skill of the pass pressures, but the disguises and
the sim pressures and the different directions things are coming from.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
You mentioned Joe Burrow, and I.
Speaker 4 (03:26):
Know he's incredible and we got to hold him to
a high standard, but Miles Garrett just wrecked their whole
thing on Sunday afternoon to the point where even he
and that high flying passing attack were struggling to find
time to get anything going. So yeah, I think I
think offenses are right now at least, and I think
(03:46):
it was probably the opposite a few years ago, where
defenses were at a disadvantage for the first few weeks.
But it kind of feels to me like offenses are
kind of playing with a hand tie behind their back
for at least a little while while they figure out
what they got.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
Now, you were not on the Hangover Show on Tuesday
and on the ODLIC Football show that was That was
Robert and Dereck, and one of the games they talked
about on that show was the Giants Commanders game. You
guys did not touch that on your Sunday night program.
And it's funny and I always like to listen to
the National Show. I was talking about the Giants because,
as you know, Dave, sometimes when you cover a team,
you don't see the farest from the trees.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
Sometimes right you're so close to it, you kind of
miss some things.
Speaker 3 (04:22):
But Derek opened up the show the same way I
did on our program on Monday, is I'm not sure
it mattered who the quarterback was going to be in
that game. With the way the interior offensive line played
and the way they couldn't run the football and the
way they couldn't protect, I'm not sure who the quarterback
was for the Giants on this week really would have
mattered a ton, to be honest with you.
Speaker 4 (04:42):
It's funny, and I think there's a natural excitement to
see a first round pick, and Jackson Dart played well
in the preseason, so that adds to it.
Speaker 1 (04:52):
And so when the Giants struggle.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
That's gonna be a huge part of the conversation, especially
from outside the fan base.
Speaker 1 (04:59):
Of course, at the same time, do you.
Speaker 4 (05:02):
Want to throw Jackson Dart into the situation that we
saw on Sunday? I don't necessarily think that's a good idea.
And I know JJ McCarthy weathered the storm on Monday
against the Bears.
Speaker 1 (05:12):
It is doable, I suppose.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
But you want your rookies, typically your young quarterback, in
as good of a situation as possible, and that just
wasn't the case for the Giants. And I don't remember
the stats off the top of my head, but when
we did the Giants preview, we talked about the splits
with Andrew Thomas verse without Andrew Thomas, and I remember
(05:36):
thinking to myself on Sunday where I was like, I
don't want Jackson Dart playing for this team until Andrew
Thomas is available. Like, I don't know if that's a
great idea.
Speaker 3 (05:45):
Yeah, And look, it doesn't get much easier, right, We
got Dallas this week. We'll talk about that obviously. Then
you have the Chiefs at home, you have the Charges
at home. You finally get a little bit of a
soft landing spot with the Saints. So they played pretty
well in Week one, to be totally honest, I mean.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
They were not an easy out, which I actually because
you know, like doing a national show, you you got
to try to have an eye on ten different things
on a Sunday, and the Saints game was one where
with like eight minutes to play in the fourth, I
was like, Okay, well, at least this is a game
that I can sort of look away from, like this
is going according to script and probably not gonna be
(06:19):
a very interesting finish. And then five minutes later I
was like, never mind, the Saints are driving with a
chance to tie the game.
Speaker 1 (06:24):
And that's I mean, that's the NFL in a nutshell.
Speaker 3 (06:27):
Yeah, And look they have and and the Saints defense,
especially in that building in New Orleans, is never a
fun unit or or place to play for for any team.
So I think, as you look forward here, Dave, would
you think of abdul Quarter. I know you guys are
big fans of him in his limited preseason reps, Uh,
did he match what you thought he would give you
(06:48):
in that first regular season game?
Speaker 4 (06:49):
I mean I yes, unequivocally yes, and I know it
probably considering considering the preseason hype on on Car and
justifiably so, like between who he is as a prospect
and what he did in the preseason. But if you
listen to shows like ours, I think every time we
talked about Defensive Rookie of the Year, we were like, Okay, yeah,
(07:11):
Carter's probably gonna win, but who else can we talk about?
You know, like that's a boring one, right, yeah, right,
that's sort of the expectation. And so maybe he didn't
like blow up the stat sheet and obviously the Giants
lost the opener fairly comfortably, but he.
Speaker 1 (07:27):
Looked active, he looked disruptive.
Speaker 4 (07:28):
I mean, the guy and I love the fact that
the guy blocked a punt like he was. So, you know,
he's the number three overall pick, he's the favorite to
win Defensive Rookie of the Year. You think about him
as this guy that's gonna get all these sacks on defense,
but he is a rookie. Rookies play special teams, and
to do so admirably I thought was a fun wrinkle
to his first game. So yeah, I mean, if that's
(07:50):
the starting point, then yes, I'm I'm pretty excited about
where this is going.
Speaker 1 (07:54):
I don't think that's groundbreaking analysis.
Speaker 3 (07:56):
Though, Before we get to the match up, specifically against
Dallas Cowboys in Week one, it was a national game
that now seems like it happened like two weeks ago.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
So much has happened since then, but we all watched it.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
What was your overall take on a team that you
were very close to, and I'm sure you still watch
them more than others. What do you think of the
Cowboys in Week one and they're lost to Philly?
Speaker 4 (08:16):
You know, moral victories aren't a thing in the NFL,
and especially like with all the baggage that comes with
Dallas the Super Bowl drought and they just traded Micah
and the fan bases is unhappy with ownership as I
can remember them ever being really, but I thought Thursday
kind of felt like a moral victory. I mean, they
(08:36):
were touchdown plus favorites. It was either seven and a
half or eight and a half points by the time
the game kicked off, which, even with everything Dallas is missing,
I was like, is that right? Like do people really
think this is that big of a mismatch? And of
course they played pretty capably. I thought the defense settled
in the run, defense got a heck of a lot
(08:58):
better in the second half, some of the young edge
rushers that they're going to be asking to replace Micah Parsons.
Certainly they didn't do that, but they looked active, they
looked promising in the second half of that game. I
thought they gave the Eagles very good offensive line at
least a little bit of trouble. And really, if I'm
trying to sell you on the Cowboys in twenty twenty five,
it's Dak Prescott winging the ball around to his receivers
(09:20):
and I got exactly what I wanted out of that.
I mean, I thought Dak played phenomenally. Like the stat
line didn't. It did not do justice to how well
he played. Obviously, Ceedee Lamb drops a couple balls that
maybe changed the outcome. But for all of the negativity
around the team, and I think coming into the year,
nobody really took them seriously as like contenders in the NFC,
(09:44):
I thought it was a good showing and if you know,
if they can build on that, then this is definitely
a team that I think could make a little more
noise in the playoff picture than I think people gave
him credit for.
Speaker 3 (09:54):
I want to get back to the Cowboys in a
second befirst. You mentioned Lamb's drops, right, that was an
epidemic around the league year. You look at the Titan
this week, you look at the Titans game eight and
a million drops of cam Ward. The Giants had a
bunch of drops. You mentioned the drops of Ceede Lamb.
I think the game goes a little faster to the receivers.
You know, you gotta worry about getting you know, hit
when you catch the ball. It's so much different than
(10:15):
practice for the wide receiver position. That's something I think
really showed up around the league in Week one.
Speaker 2 (10:19):
A lot of drops.
Speaker 4 (10:21):
I'm gonna I'm gonna sound like a drivetime radio caller
right now, but like, oh okay, Like the Titans are
a great example. I mean, Calvin Ridley did have a
couple of drops, but I don't think anybody's gonna try
to sell us that Calvin Ridley is on the level
of Ceedee Lamb. And then obviously the Titans receiver corps
behind him is kind of pieced together. The two biggest
(10:41):
culprits in the Cowboys loss were Ceedee Lamb with his
one hundred and whatever million dollar contract and Jake Ferguson,
who just got paid fifty million dollars over the summer.
I'm like, guys, these have to be caught like this,
I mean the ball. You know, if the ball touches
your hand, you should catch it. And in a few
of these it did much more than touch your hand,
(11:01):
Like you know.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
CD had one split split through the palms.
Speaker 4 (11:05):
Of his hands, the one at the end of the
game that could have changed the outcome landed in his
bread basket. Jake Ferguson he didn't need like he bobbled
it before he got hit in the end zone. I
was like, guys' we make way too much money for
these two at least not be closer to being catches.
So I mean, like I said, like Tennessee is a
team where I'm like, well, yeah, this is this is
(11:26):
a young team with a not so good roster, Like
this is the type of stuff that happens with the Cowboys.
Speaker 1 (11:31):
I'm like, you paid these guys.
Speaker 4 (11:33):
These guys are considered I mean CD is considered at
the top of his position in the league, and Jake
Ferguson is at least upper tier, like top ten, top
twelve tight.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
Ends in the league. I need to see these plays
get made.
Speaker 3 (11:46):
The Giants Total podcast is brought to you by Citizens,
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Speaker 1 (12:17):
Huddle up, get in here.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
If you're lined up here, you gotta go over the
middle with at the score great?
Speaker 1 (12:23):
How do we make that happen?
Speaker 4 (12:25):
I don't know, but Citizen does makes sense of your
money with Citizens Official Bank of Eli Manning.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
It's funny our our sideline reporter on our radio broadcast,
Howard Cross, who played in the league for like fifteen years.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
He is a great line.
Speaker 3 (12:39):
When a guy drops in easy pass, he likes to say, schmelk.
If that was a spear, it would have killed him.
And that was like and that was the ced Lamb place, like,
if that was a spear, he'd be dead.
Speaker 2 (12:51):
Was anybody numbers?
Speaker 4 (12:52):
Does anybody have better idioms than like old krusty football
people like the stuff that they say, and they just
say it like naturally, like a matter of course. And
I'm like, where did you get that from? I'm gonna remember,
I'm gonna steal that.
Speaker 2 (13:05):
No, please steal it. Howard love that member.
Speaker 3 (13:08):
Howard was in a locker room with Lawrence Teller for
a few years, so the stuff he heard, I can
only I can only bathom the stuff that he heard.
What'd you think of the Cowboys young offensive line in
that game against Tilly?
Speaker 4 (13:18):
I honestly, and obviously it comes with an enormous caveat
that Jalen Carter didn't play a snap in that game,
But I thought they handled themselves really, really well, like
Tyler Booker's obviously the rookie, and again, it must have
been nice for him to look up on the first
play of the game and be like, oh, Jalen Carter's
not gonna be here all night. Like this is way,
(13:39):
this is way better than I thought it was gonna be.
But I went back and looked at him. He looked
He looked very competent. He handled twists and stunts really well.
He was dominant at times. He saw him pancaking guys
on occasion. Tyler Geiden is the other one, second year
left tackle, I thought, handled himself really well. Again, I
don't know what that means because the Eagle are breaking
(14:00):
in several new edge rushers. Josh Sweat's not there anymore.
You're talking about guys like Jaylyxx Hunt. Not not to
say that those aren't good players, but I don't. I
just don't think it's with Jalen Carter not there, I
don't know that it was a true test of how
good they are.
Speaker 1 (14:15):
But lucky for us, we don't have to.
Speaker 4 (14:17):
Wait very long because I have a feeling sexy, dexy
Brian Burns, Abdua Carter, and Kevon Thibodau. I have a
feeling that's gonna be a much stronger test than what
they saw last week. So I'm this is this one
has circled very highly on my list just to see
how this Cowboys line deals with the front Like.
Speaker 3 (14:37):
This Johnson a podcast brought to you by Citizens, the
official bank of the Giants from game day celebrations you
everyday financial needs, big Blue fans and get get the
most out of everyone with Citizens learn more a Citizens
bank dot com slash Giants. Dave Helm joining me in
the Hackensack, Britney Hell podcast video Keep getting Better and Dave,
we went, You've been through a million of these games,
covering on both sides.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
When's the last time? Usually a Giants Cowboys game in
Dallas at one o'clock. It's very strange.
Speaker 4 (15:02):
I hadn't thought about that, but you're so right, and
it's it's sad what this rivalry is right now if
we can be.
Speaker 1 (15:09):
Real about it.
Speaker 4 (15:10):
Because I was thinking about that when I when I
when we talked and I knew I was going to
do your show. I was just thinking back on my
time and when I started with the Cowboys, it was
twenty thirteen, so like Eli was there, Odell showed up
soon after that, and the two Super Bowls were much
more recent, and like that was that was the rivalry
(15:32):
in the NFC East. Like right now, it's it's been
Cowboys Eagles for a couple of years. I'm sure you know,
the Commanders are going to have something to say about
that now that Jaden Daniels has shown up. But for
the first like five years of my time covering the Cowboys, Giants, Giants,
Cowboys was it. That was the one And now it's
kind of feels relegated to second class status. But maybe
(15:55):
maybe that'll change here over the next year or two.
Speaker 3 (15:57):
Those Eli Romo games were just so much fun because
both quarterbacks are so volatile, right, Like they could.
Speaker 2 (16:03):
Look terrible for a half, then all of a sudden
they go nuts.
Speaker 3 (16:05):
Those were some unbelievable games going on the way back
out of you were there yet, But that two thousand
and seven you know playoff game that yeah, to win
the Super Bowl, I mean that started it, and it
was just wild.
Speaker 4 (16:16):
That was before my time, but it was an iconic
NFL moment, like just as somebody who loves football, I
remember watching that and and the Cowboys swept them during
the regular season and then the Giants did what they
did in the playoffs. Just yeah, I mean, these were
this was the stuff that the networks were like, we
gotta get this. This has to be the three thirty game.
(16:36):
It's got to be on primetime, So it kind of
stinks to see it relegated to a one pm start.
But yeah, man, I still I get a kick out
of it though. Like I said, like when I started,
it's funny to think, yeah, because I mean, since Dak
showed up, it's been rough for the Giants playing Dallas.
But when when I showed up, it was like, how
(16:57):
are we gonna beat the Giants?
Speaker 1 (16:58):
We got we gotta get past these guys.
Speaker 4 (17:00):
So yeah, it's it's been weird to see it sort
of evolve into what it is right now.
Speaker 3 (17:05):
Yeah, And to your point, the Giants have not beaten
Dak Prescott since his rookie year in twenty sixteen. It's
been a while they've struggled against him. I know there
is angst still amongst the Cowboys fan base as to
exactly how good Dak Prescott is. What's kind of like
the status of that. I know it's been kind of
up and down a little bit, But are fans still
(17:25):
just because of the contract it's so big, are they
still kind of thinking about it?
Speaker 2 (17:28):
Where are they with Dak right now? In Dallas?
Speaker 4 (17:31):
It is bizarre to see how Dak at this point
is basically just living out Tony Romo's career.
Speaker 1 (17:38):
I mean, the parallels are insane, man.
Speaker 4 (17:41):
I mean, you know, he showed up, He showed up
and was very exciting as a young player, and everybody
loved him. And then there were a couple playoff mishaps
and there's a lot of debate about what he's worth and.
Speaker 1 (17:54):
Should he get paid, and now he's kind.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
Of entering into the veteran part of his career and yeah,
I mean, like no, like, not everybody is going to
be happy. He's the quarterback of the Cowboys. So A,
it's a huge fan base, so you can't please everybody,
and then b if you don't love the Cowboys, you
hate them.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
So like it's not like it's not like Dak has admirers.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
Among other fan bases because nobody loves the Cowboys. Like
that's just it's a lonely aspect of quarterbacking that team.
Speaker 1 (18:23):
Uh So, no, I mean, there's always going.
Speaker 4 (18:26):
To be debate about how good he is until he
wins the Super Bowl. But it's crazy now, right because
what he's I think he's thirty two.
Speaker 1 (18:33):
That sounds about he's year ten.
Speaker 4 (18:36):
And now so his offensive line is young and and
his receivers are very young. George Pickens joins up this
year and now. It blew my mind when they traded
Micah because I was like, oh my god, this is
just like when they cut de Marcus Ware and then
when Romo sort of morphed into this MVP candidate. Over
the last couple of years of his career, he didn't
(18:57):
have a good enough defense. You know, the twenty fourteen team,
I think they had like twenty six sacks the year
that they went twelve and four, and DeMarco Murray had
eighteen hundred rushing yards and they just didn't have enough
on defense. So I was laughing when I saw that,
where I was like, is Dak gonna have like the
year of his life? And the Cowboys just aren't gonna
be good enough on the other side of the ball
(19:17):
for it to matter.
Speaker 1 (19:18):
And it is early, but watching.
Speaker 4 (19:21):
Him against the Eagles, I was like, he looks like
he's ready to have a nice year, and I just
I hope the talent around him is up to it.
Speaker 3 (19:27):
All right, So let's talk about the matchup then, And
I'm with him, by the way, DeMarcus Wing on win
a Super Bowl with the Broncos and now the way
the Packers point League one who.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Knows talk about this matchup.
Speaker 3 (19:37):
I know Schottenheimer, Bran Schottenheimer's was there as the offensive cordad,
but boy, that offense looked a lot different in Week
one with Schottenheimer that it ever did under Mike McCarthy,
with the way they ran it, some of the you know,
narrow splits.
Speaker 2 (19:49):
More motion stuff like that.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
What do you think this is going to look like
with this Dallas offense trying to go against the Giant
defense with a really good defensive front.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
Yeah, I'm I'm intrigued to see see how much they
lean into that. And that's been something cowboy fans have
been clamoring for for years, is more motion, motion at
the snap, use your players to kind of suss out
what the defense wants to do. It's not been a
cowboy thing for most of the last decade to the
point where they're like people have conspiracy theories where it's like,
(20:19):
is this is this like a Jerry Jones thing? Like
does Jerry Jones not want to play this type of offense?
Or does Dak Prescott not like to play that type
of offense because he sort of likes to see the
picture in front of him and not have a whole
lot of stuff changing.
Speaker 1 (20:32):
So Thursday night was a pretty.
Speaker 4 (20:35):
Noticeable departure from what we've gotten used to, and I'm
just curious to see how they maintain that. Like Cavante
Turpin is not a guy that I expect to ever
have this crazy like eight to ten touch game, but
his speed is very interesting and they can use it
in a lot of fun ways again to like suss
(20:56):
out what a defense wants to do, or be a
field stretcher to open things up underneath. So I'm curious
to see how they continue to do that. I'm curious
to see if they, for lack of a better way
to put it, like, if they're man enough to just
kind of bow up and try to run right at
this giant's front. I don't I don't really know how
good that good of an idea that is. Like I said,
(21:19):
the interior of this offensive line looked pretty damn good
against Philly, but that's with Jalen Carter taking an early shower.
Speaker 1 (21:26):
Do you want to do that against this front? Do
you like?
Speaker 4 (21:29):
Or maybe you should try just to see what you
got but how quickly are you going to pivot to that?
And so I look at this as a game where
I'd be I'd be asking my receivers to try to
uh substitute a lot of running production, get the ball
out on the edges, get the ball out of the
tackle box early and often and quickly in the in
(21:50):
the snap.
Speaker 1 (21:51):
So I'm curious to see how that works.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
But I also I wonder if they might just try
to figure out what they got and say, all right,
Tyler Booker, you got your you got your audition against
a lesser situation against Philly, but let's go see what
you can do. So I'm curious to see what the
game plan is and if they just sort of try
to avoid that fight altogether, or if they they're like, hey,
(22:14):
let's go see if we can go mono and mono
against these guys.
Speaker 3 (22:18):
My biggest concern from a Giants perspective here, Dave, is
you know, Cidie Lamb's gonna come out annoyed that he
had a national performance where he had those drops, So
I expect him to come out and play really well.
And then we did not really see the full George
Pickens experience. He had three catches, they're all relatively shorty.
They draw that one deep defensive pass interference penalty down
the field. But he seems like the perfect receiver for
(22:40):
Dak Prescott because he loves to just throw it downfield
into tight spots and that's what.
Speaker 2 (22:44):
George Pickens does.
Speaker 3 (22:46):
Is this, in your opinion, the best set of weapons
on the perimeter that Prescott has had? And how do
you think the Cowboys might try to utilize him against
this Giants defense?
Speaker 4 (22:56):
So I think it is, and there was there was
probably one year twenty twenty one Dak had young Ceedee
Lamb and Amari Cooper and that was pretty damn good.
So I think you have to mention that when you
talk about like the best receiver groups. I also think
twenty nineteen he had Amari Michael Gallup before his injury,
(23:20):
when he was a pretty good player, and they got
nine hundred yards out of Randall Cobb at the late
stage of his career. It's only week two, so I
can't say like this is definitively the best, but I
think this has the potential to be the best patch
pass catching group that Dak has ever had.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
I'm super high on Pickens.
Speaker 4 (23:39):
Funnily enough, I'm super high on him just playing his
ass off for four months to get a contract.
Speaker 1 (23:45):
But you're you're already.
Speaker 4 (23:46):
Seeing people pointing out that, like, oh, maybe maybe the
effort wasn't that great on snaps where the ball wasn't
coming to him, Like maybe George Pickens needs to to
buckle down and work on selling his routes to make
the defense honor him, work on blocking and stuff like that.
So I'm curious to see how that goes, Like if
the Cowboys saw that on tape and they're like, hey, George,
(24:08):
this this ain't gonna cut it, buddy, And you mean,
you got to have a nice season if we want
to if we want a big contract. So I got
an eye on that, But I am I'm very confident
that this could be one of the most explosive passing
games in the league, especially if the offensive line gives
Dack time, which okay, So I want to turn this
back on you, and I'll be fully I'll be fully transparent.
(24:29):
Robert and Derek, like you said, they did the hangover
show for the Giants and Commanders. I have not been
able yet to get a close eye on the Giants
Commander's game other than just what I saw on Sunday,
How did the secondary look to you? Because that's obviously
it's so easy to get excited about the front and
(24:49):
all of that talent, and it was a nice first
day for them for the most part. But what did
you think about the back end, because that is the
huge question mark.
Speaker 3 (24:58):
Yeah, well, all the one thing out there first. I
don't think extra Lawrence looked the same. He barely practiced
in the off season. He came off of this located
elbow last year.
Speaker 1 (25:05):
It's completely valid by the way.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
I mean, as good as he is, it's totally not
a surprise if he needs some time to ramp up.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
Yeah, he did not look like himself.
Speaker 3 (25:15):
He got better as the game went along, and again
he didn't play a second in preseason, so I would
keep an eye on that too, when you have a
chance to kind of get ready for this. You know,
the secondary, I thought they allowed a little too much airspace.
Here's the thing, and I'm going to talk to Paul
Someondebo about this tomorrow on the John Tuttle podcast. I
wonder how much Jade and Daniel's mobility affected how they
(25:36):
wanted to play in the secondary right. It's hard to
play pressman against Jade and Daniels. You turn your back,
he can run. So they were on a lot of zone,
they were in a lot of off They played a
lot of soft stuff. I didn't like that they didn't
really re route the receivers at the line as much
as they should, even when they were in zone. You know,
you can press, reroute and then drop, you can do
(25:56):
that in zone defense. I didn't think they did it
quite enough of that, and they did get beat with
a lot of.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Deep incuts and dig routes. Jayden Daniels that though, was
actually awful.
Speaker 3 (26:04):
Little bit he threw the ball behind a couple of
receivers over the course of the game. He miss Terry
McLaurin on a deep pass on the left sideline, which
he rarely did last year.
Speaker 2 (26:11):
So I thought they allowed a little too much airspace.
Speaker 3 (26:14):
But again I wonder how much that had to do
with just having to account for Jade and Daniel scrambling ability,
because it's so hard to play man against a team
like the Commanders.
Speaker 4 (26:25):
Jaden is one of those quarterbacks who and it's infuriating
to watch if you're a fan of the other team
because it's like we're playing so soft, like we're giving
him this big cushion. What are like, what are we doing?
We're not like pressure him, And it's like Jayden almost
forces you to play passive defense because yeah, I mean
if you if you play man, you can get burned
(26:46):
if you blitz and he gets out of it, which
is a good shot to happen with a guy that athletic,
You're gonna get burned. And so it almost forces you
into a position where you're probably not playing as aggressively
as you would prefer.
Speaker 1 (26:59):
And unfortunately for the Giants.
Speaker 4 (27:01):
I mean, Dak is an expert pat like he's going
to make plays from the pocket, that's what he does.
But it is a more traditional type of game, Like
at this point in his career, I don't think you
have to worry about Dak burning you with his feet,
at least not more than once a game or so.
So I think like this might be a more accurate
(27:22):
litmus test because this is going to be a very
traditional looking offense just from the standpoint of the quarterbacks
not trying to leave the pocket if he doesn't have to.
Speaker 1 (27:30):
If you want to know how to manage two minutes
of crunch time football. I'm your man.
Speaker 4 (27:34):
But if you're wondering about a long term financial plan,
you should talk to citizens.
Speaker 1 (27:38):
Hey, I can also talk long care I'd like to
learn about an Molli routine. Yes, I knew I could
help make sense of your money with citizens.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (27:46):
Neil Jayden led the NFL not rookies, led the NFL
in passing yards versus the blitz last year.
Speaker 2 (27:50):
So I think the.
Speaker 3 (27:51):
Giants saw that and they're like, Eh, maybe blitzing this
guy's not the best idea, right, But I do think
the matchup that I'll watch here Dave in this game,
and I mentioned the receivers for a reason able I
think you feel okay that he can handle his business.
Is he gonna be perfect or shut somebody down, though,
But I think he'll be okay. Cordo Flott seems to
have beaten out Deonty Banks on the other side for
the second cornerback spot. He played around eighty eight percent
(28:11):
of the snaps. Deontay Banks played some like fifteen or
sixteen defensive snaps in the game and out in front
of me, but somewhere around there. So how does Flot,
who is still a little bit undersized. He's six foot,
but he's probably only l one hundred and eighty one
hundred and eighty pounds, give or take.
Speaker 2 (28:26):
How does he match up against Lamb and Pickens?
Speaker 3 (28:28):
Because those two guys are physical players, they're physical receivers,
They're on the bigger side. How does he match up
against those two guys. That's something that I would keep
an eye in terms of how the Giants handle that.
Do they put a safety over the top, do they
not trust him in man? Did they play zone? You know,
I'm curious to see how the Giants handle that side
of the field with their second cornerback spot.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Pickens made one play that kind of made me sit
up in my seat against the Eagles, and it wasn't
anything spectacular. It was it was like a comeback on
the sideline, move the sticks. But it's a exactly why
I'm excited about this partnership with Dak Prescott. Because Dak
Prescott a He's aggressive as hell. He is not afraid
(29:07):
to throw into any window. He is not afraid to
just put it on a spot and be like yeah,
like it'll be picked if you don't do your job
the right way. But I'm trusting you too. And Pickens,
you know, he's got these go go gadget arms and
he just plucked that thing and he like the DB's
swatting at him and he's just vice grip on the football.
And I was like, that is why George Pickens makes
(29:30):
sense on the Cowboys, because Dak can just put it
in a spot and this guy's gonna go get it
no matter where it is. And so yeah, I mean,
if you've got the size advantage on a dB, I
think that is something that I would want to attack
if I were Dallas, where it's like, yeah, I mean
Dak Prescott, if he feels good about that, then like
(29:51):
the coverage doesn't matter because he'll just put it in
a spot where Pickens can make it work.
Speaker 2 (29:56):
All right, Let's jump to the other side of the
matchup here.
Speaker 3 (29:59):
I'm sure Jerry Jones was happy that they did not
allow allow of rushing yards to Saquon Barkley and that's like.
Speaker 2 (30:04):
Oh, petty cark justified the trade. See we stopped the run.
I'm sure he was very pumped up about that.
Speaker 3 (30:09):
And by the way, I thought they actually did a
much better job against the run than we've seen the
last couple of years.
Speaker 2 (30:13):
But what is this Cowboys front? Now?
Speaker 3 (30:16):
Are their best two players actually their defensive tackles, which
is a weird thing to say about this Cowboys defense.
And you know the Shaun's offense line struggling in League
One against the Commander's defensive front that also does not
have any stars on it spare maybe Deron Pain. What
is this Cowboys defensive front going to do? Are they
gonna blitz a lot? Are they gonna stun as much
as they used to? What do you think that matchup's
gonna look like it is?
Speaker 4 (30:38):
I saw the the pressure numbers yesterday, like just players
who lead the league in pressure, and I mean Dorrance Armstrong,
longtime Cowboy, really good player, So I'm not trying to
throw shade at him, but I was like, oh, if
Dorance Armstrong is like leading the league in anything, that's
that's not good. That doesn't say something good about what
happened against the Giant or from the GI's perspective on Sundays.
Speaker 1 (31:02):
So I've got an eye on that.
Speaker 4 (31:04):
You know it was, And I think, weirdly, I think
the answer to your question is yes, like I think
OsO Diggi Zua And obviously now new Cowboy Kenney Clark
are probably the best pieces of this front. I mean,
two young guys that I thought had nice nights, and
it started rough in the I mean the first half. Honestly,
(31:25):
the first half of that game did not look better.
The Eagles ran for like one hundred and thirty yards
at halftime, and I was like, this looks like the
same run defense guys, and then they buckled down after halftime.
I will point out I don't want to be a hater,
but I thought a lot of the Cowboys' success came
after Landon Dickerson suffered his injury and you know, he
(31:48):
got hurt and he eventually left that game, and all
of a sudden.
Speaker 1 (31:52):
The Cowboys were kind of kicking ass up front. And
I was like, I.
Speaker 4 (31:55):
Don't think that's I don't think that's a coincidence. Now,
I mean, obviously that's not the Cowboys problem, but it
something worth noting. But yeah, Donovan Azeraku, the rookie, I
thought he had a couple of nice flashes. And Marshawn Neeland,
who was their second round pick last year, also just
an impressively strong, disruptive guy. So those two are like
the edge rushers to watch. But yeah, I think Kinney,
(32:17):
Clark and Osa are where it starts. And obviously, just
watching what the Giants offensive line looked like on Sunday,
I think they probably feel super optimistic about their matchups
and what they might be capable of doing. I haven't
heard it. Have we heard anything about Thomas this week?
Do we know anything about that?
Speaker 2 (32:36):
Look?
Speaker 3 (32:36):
He took team reps in practice for the first time
all off season last Friday, Dave, and he was limited,
so I think there has to be still some measure
of build up this week. I think seeing what he
does on practice Wednesday or Thursday will be very important.
Speaker 4 (32:49):
I mean, it's all eyes on that for me, because,
like I said, I mean, and it sounds funny because,
like you said, the interior of the offensive line was
the culprit against the Commanders, but an all Pro player
can just be a stabilizing force across an offensive line.
So I will be eyeing that injury report intently because
(33:11):
I and these you know, the Cowboys pass rush I
don't think is one that you would lose sleepover compared
to some other teams on the Giant schedule. But like
I said, I'm sure those guys are watching tape of
Sunday and saying like, yeah, we we feel good about this.
I wouldn't expect a ton of blitzing all that. Well,
Matt Iberflus did start blitzing his corners in the second half.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
And that was it came, right.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
Yeah, But that's that's my point.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
It's like they had to bring pressure from weird places
and like, that's that is not the you know, Eberflus
came up under Rod Marinelli. He was on this Cowboys
defensive staff back then when Rod was there, and like,
blitzing is not his preference. Like I think the corner
blitzes came because they were like, well it's either this
or we don't pressure.
Speaker 1 (33:56):
Jalen Hurts tonight, Like what do you want it to be?
Speaker 4 (33:59):
So my guess would be they're gonna try to win
with four as often as possible, and maybe they get
exotic if they have to. But that's just that's never
been eber Flus's preference if he doesn't have to. So
I'll be curious to see how much of a push
they can get with four before they try something else.
Speaker 3 (34:15):
I had to laugh on that Trayvon Diggs blitz he
got into the backfield and he didn't know what to do.
Speaker 2 (34:20):
He's like, I'm at the quarterback. What do I do now?
I've never been asked to do this before.
Speaker 1 (34:24):
He's like, you guys don't want me in coverage?
Speaker 4 (34:26):
I got I gotta shout out Trayvon too. By the way,
I'm like I on our Athletic Football Show preview in
the summer, I was like, how are the Cowboys just
expecting Trayvon Diggs to be himself?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
Like he?
Speaker 4 (34:41):
I mean, he had a very bad injury. He's not
having a training camp, and when they activated him for
the Eagles game, I was I was like, he's gonna
this is not gonna go well. How could you possibly
be expected to cover DeVante and aj and all that
stuff in your first game back after not having a preseason.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
He was on a snap count.
Speaker 4 (35:02):
Like you know, It's not like he went out there
and just completely shut everything down himself, but just to
play and play well in that situation I thought was
really really impressive.
Speaker 3 (35:11):
I agree, and I think that's the final matchup BONE
asking you about here. Dave Milieu neighbors obviously not as
productive as he would have liked in Week one. You're
an LSU guy. So I know you are a big
Mileague neighbors guy. The Cowboys a big zone defense now team,
Now are they going to just straight up double team neighbors.
What do you think that's going to look like? Because
I'm sure he wants to have a big game after
a Week one disappointment for him.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
I would expect it to be a lot more zone.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
Again, like that's the tree that Matt Eberflus comes from,
And yes I would.
Speaker 1 (35:39):
I would expect them to blanket.
Speaker 4 (35:41):
My league neighbors as often as humanly possible and just
make somebody else be the reason why they lose. And
I mean even with Trayvon Diggs, even with Trayvon Diggs
playing well last week, there's not a corner on the
Cowboys roster that I would want to man up Moleague
neighbors on a regular basis and trust that it's gonna
(36:03):
go well.
Speaker 1 (36:04):
Especially maybe if Michael Parsons.
Speaker 4 (36:07):
Is on your team and you're confident that the ball's
got to come out, that's a different story. But I
don't trust that this Cowboys pass rush is of that
caliber just yet, So I think that is a recipe
for disaster. I would expect Dallas to cloud the field
wherever Molite neighbors is and try to frustrate him as
much as possible.
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Man, I'm yeah, I know, I know.
Speaker 4 (36:30):
Week one was disappointing, but and I am biased because
that is where I went to school. But I'm I
think the sky's the limit for that guy. I'm so
excited to see what he's going to do this year.
Speaker 3 (36:40):
All right, So let's let's end on this. These Week
two games are always tough, David. You get these two
oh to one teams, and we know what oh and
two does to a fan base. It puts them into
a tizzy, understandably, So look after you go into the
path's very, very difficult. And I just think home opener
for Dallas, the intensity in that building, and I think
the desperation from both teams is going to be pretty
(37:00):
palpable from the get go in that game.
Speaker 1 (37:04):
I do too.
Speaker 4 (37:05):
And I mean this is not hard hitting analysis, but
I long ago I got to a point where I
was like, I will believe the Giants beat Dak Prescott
when I see it happen, because I get it again,
he's on the when he's on the field.
Speaker 1 (37:20):
It just hasn't been a thing. I was there. I think, yeah,
I was there for the last time it happened.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
They beat They beat the Cowboys ten to seven in
that twenty sixteen season, and Dak just didn't look like
he had an answer for anything that they were doing
in that game. And I think Odell broke a long
one and that was the difference. Uh. But since then,
if Dak's on the field, more often than not, like
it's been a win, and more often than not it's
been a pretty comfortable win. I don't know that that'll
(37:48):
be the case on Sunday. I'm not ready. I'm not
ready to write off the Giants. I know Sunday was
was pretty rough, but I yeah, Week one is weird.
I think there's reason for optimy, and I think there's
plenty of reason for optimism if Andrew Thomas can get
himself onto the field. But I do like Dallas in
this game until further Notice what I mean, the spreads
(38:10):
five and a half. A lot of that is because Dallas,
like you said, it's the home opener.
Speaker 1 (38:14):
It should be a pretty rowdy environment, I.
Speaker 4 (38:16):
Think, And I think, like I said, the fan base
in Dallas is pretty upset with the team. But I
do think that performance in Philly sort of galvanized people that.
Speaker 1 (38:25):
Like, Okay, like maybe this season won't.
Speaker 4 (38:27):
Be terrible, So I think there will be some enthusiasm.
Speaker 1 (38:32):
Yeah, I would. I would pick Dallas by like seven
or eight points in this game. Probably.
Speaker 3 (38:36):
I should point out, though, you you were pretty bullish
in the Giants before the season started.
Speaker 4 (38:39):
You thought there was a path them to actually be
much better this year, right, I like everything about this
or everything might be a stretch. I like a lot
about this Giants team, and I was really bullish on that. Honestly,
I was super bullish on the Giants until I saw
the schedule and like, like you said at the beginning,
it's you know, it's Commanders, It's Cowboys, both road games,
(39:01):
Chiefs after that Chargers. So you're playing three playoff teams
in your first four and a Cowboys team that would
have been better last year if their quarterback hadn't gotten hurt.
And then even after the Saints game, Eagles Broncos Eagles,
I'm just like, I want to believe in this team
so badly as a frisky sort of surprise wildcard team,
especially again it it kind of es that sounds a
(39:25):
little silly maybe, but like it hinges on Andrew Thomas's
health for me, like that offensive line just needs to
be a respectable unit and that's the easiest way to
get it there.
Speaker 1 (39:36):
So I said that. I mean, look at the Steelers
last year.
Speaker 4 (39:39):
It was not high flying football, but like, if you've
got a good front and Russell Wilson can get his
thing going on a little bit and the running game
is at least respectable, I think there's a path here
to like eight and nine, nine and eight for the Giants.
Speaker 1 (39:54):
But then I saw the schedule and I was like.
Speaker 4 (39:56):
Oh man, we're asking we're asking a lot here, Like
that is a lot of good teams to open the season.
So hopefully, I just I hope they can keep it
on track enough to where you know, there's still something
to feel good about when the schedule eases up a
little bit in the second half of the year.
Speaker 3 (40:11):
All right, let's close on this because both of us
are living a similar life right now. One of the
shows you hosted meeting on the Athletic Football Show is
with Dane Brugler. It's called Building the Beast, where you
guys talk about college prospects. We have draft season, well,
I do the same thing with Tony. Paul nine has
been doing the draft stuff just as long, and I
love David.
Speaker 2 (40:28):
I'm sure you've done this before.
Speaker 3 (40:30):
I'm watching a game on a Saturday and I'm like, Wow,
this guy looks awesome, you know, and you're all exciting.
You think you found somebody, and then you bring it
up to Dane and I bring out to Tony and
they're like listing their high school Oh he plays across
on the side, Like there are no secrets with guys
like Dane and Tony. They just know all these guys
and they're just an encyclopedia of knowledge and it frustrates
the hell out of me sometimes absolutely.
Speaker 4 (40:51):
And that happened this past weekend where two things happen.
Number One, I see a guy and I get excited
and I'm like do you think, like like do you
think he's pretty good? And like, you know, I don't.
I don't want to be in love with a guy,
and Dane's like, oh, yeah, like he's like a six
round pick, you know, right or and then the other
thing is I'm like, holy, holy crap, who's this guy
(41:11):
that just made this play for Auburn? And yeah, he's
just he's got the bio ready to go. He's like,
oh yeah, he was actually at Middle Tennessee State before that,
and he made a position switch and his parents wanted
him to play baseball.
Speaker 1 (41:24):
I'm just like, what do you do during the summer?
How do you already know all this stuff? It's fair.
Speaker 4 (41:31):
I'm I'm playing catch up with him, and it's very
it's very fun. It's and it's great to have a
resource like that available.
Speaker 3 (41:37):
No, absolutely, and and and and we'll have to, you know,
get together and talk some college football later in the
year too.
Speaker 2 (41:42):
As we kind of get uh week three.
Speaker 3 (41:44):
There's not a ton of great matchups, but there'll be
enough to watch and as we get more information will
be fun.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
Dave, the floor is yours.
Speaker 3 (41:51):
Tell the folks win you you find everything that you're
doing working with the athletic now.
Speaker 1 (41:55):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
So I'm on the Athletic Football Show with Robert Mays
and Derek Classen. I mean, we we have something in
the feed every day of the week, but we do
a recap of every NFL Sunday that airs on Monday.
We're recapping every primetime game this year, so every Monday night,
every Thursday night, we will have something in the feed
(42:16):
breaking down what we just saw from that particular matchup
and stuff throughout the week. As John just mentioned, I
think our latest episode of Building the Beast is out
right now.
Speaker 1 (42:26):
It comes out. It comes out on Wednesdays.
Speaker 4 (42:29):
So if you're a draft nick like John and I are,
you can come find me and Dane talking all the prospects,
all the big college games, what to know for the
coming draft.
Speaker 1 (42:39):
You can get all of that wherever wherever you get
your podcasts or on YouTube, and I appreciate it.
Speaker 2 (42:45):
Dan.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
You guys got a fancy new studio now. Man, you
guys are in Chicago together. It's a whole other level.
Speaker 2 (42:50):
Man. Congratulations, that's great.
Speaker 1 (42:52):
We're coming up in the world.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
I joke with them all the time, like I just
signed up and I'm like, I feel kind of guilty
that I'm getting all this good stuff.
Speaker 1 (42:58):
But it's pretty nice.
Speaker 2 (43:01):
Check it out, guys. It really is a fantastic show.
If you want to figure out what's going on around
the NFL.
Speaker 3 (43:05):
That's Dave Hellman and the Johns Little Podcast, brought to
you by citizens Official Bank of the Giants.
Speaker 2 (43:09):
Thanks for being with us. We'll see you next time. Everybody,
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