May 5, 2025 • 44 mins
On this episode of the Giants Huddle podcast, John Schmeelk chats with former Giants quarterback, Kurt Warner, about the quarterback position, the development of Jaxson Dart, and the Giants’ quarterback room.
:00 - NFL QB characteristics
5:26 - Jaxson Dart’s college play
15:00 - Quarterback progressions
22:30 - Dart’s traits
31:45 - Giants quarterback room
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
It's time to get inside the Giants Hut. Let's go.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Let's go Giants on the Giants Mobul, give me some
join part of the Giants Podcast Network's.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Welcome to another edition of the Giants Litle Podcast, brought
to you by Citizens, the official bank of the New
York Football Giants. I am John Schmult, Thank you for
being with us today. Everybody we welcome in a I
think third or fourth time guest. You might know him
NFL Network, but if you're a little bit older like me,
you'll know him as Super Bowl champion and Pro Football
Hall of Famer Kurt Warner. Kurt, it's good to see
(00:31):
you man. Thanks for being with us again. And once
a Giant, always a Giant.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Got it. Good to see you as well.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
All right, Kurt, let's get into it.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
The Giants decided to trade up into the first round
to draft Jackson Dark. Before we get into Jackson specifically,
I gotta admit I've referenced our conversation last year before
the draft, probably more than any other one we've had
here on our Giants Hottle podcast, and the lesson that
I learned from you last year. As we were talking
about Jayden Daniels and I said to you, Kurt, you know,
he just doesn't throw over the middle of a ton.
And you said to me, John knock a quarterback. If
(01:01):
you don't know if his quarterback was asking him to
do that, he might have been not have been asked
to do that.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
And I just thought that was a really valuable lesson.
I thought, I want to.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Kind of give that back to you and say thank you,
because I think we all learn watching Jamee Tangils this year.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
He could do that pretty darn well.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Yeah, yeah, no, he was phenomenal this year. And again,
you know, it's one of the hardest things about, you know,
trying to evaluate these guys from college because offenses are
so different and what these quarterbacks are asked to do
is so different. So it's why to me, you know,
I'm not a huge draft guy because I do believe
(01:37):
so much of it is just projection. We don't know
who's going to get better. We don't know what a
player is capable of. You know, we could go a
couple of years ago to c J. Stroud. I thought
he was better as a rookie in Houston than I
ever saw him at Ohio State. Not that he wasn't
good at Ohio State, but they were asking him to
play a different way, and I didn't know if he
could play that way. And in Houston I got to
(01:59):
see that in the year, and you know, he was
phenomenal in his first year. And so that's the hard
thing about evaluating these guys, especially when you're just watching tape, right,
you don't have a chance to really sit in a
room and decipher what they know and what they see
and what their process is. You're basically going off of
what the coach lays out there. Okay, this is our offense.
(02:20):
Now you have to try to determine, Okay, does he
have enough or have I seen enough to project him
forward to the NFL to be a great player. And
it's really really hard with a lot of these guys,
and so, you know, so again it just kind of
a word of caution for everybody as you're trying to
evaluate this position. You don't really know until you know.
(02:41):
And it's why it's such an inexact science.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Yeah, I mean, I think, and then we'll get to
Jackson in a second.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
I think this is why the Giants take the process
that they go through with the quarterbacks from January to April.
So seriously, I had a long conversation with Joe Shane
about this a couple of weeks ago, and he just said, look,
you can watch the tape, but you don't really know
how they progress their decision making, how they're seeing the
field until you actually talk to their coaches and find
(03:07):
out what they're being taught, getting them in front of
a monitor and a whiteboard and going through plays with
them and seeing how they think about things. And if
you don't have that for someone like me, especially who's
never played the position, even someone like you who done
this for a living at the highest level, it's just
gonna be hard to know how these guys process the game, which, Carl,
let's be honest, that really is, in a lot of ways,
the most important.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
You can have the best arm in the world. If
you can't process the game, it really isn't gonna.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Matter, right, Yeah, I mean, there's no doubt to me,
it's the most important thing, without a doubt, without question.
And again, you know, it's even hard when you get
them in a room like I've been around a lot
of guys that you can put them on a board
and they can answer every question. But the next process
or part of it becomes can you process all that
(03:52):
information in four seconds and do the right thing, you know,
And so there's even layers to that where it's nice
to hear and it's nice to know. And you know,
I've even been around other guys that, you know, I
can watch them on tape and then I get them
and talk to them about that play after the fact,
and I know that they're just coaching me up off
of the tape that they watched. I know it wasn't
(04:13):
what they did because I've watched their eyes. I was
either body. But it's easy to do. So you get
a quarterback in a room, and you know, you take
them back to a certain play. They've already seen that
play four or five times, and so they can go and, oh, well,
here's what I was saying, you know, and they can
come up with an answer that sounds really, really good,
which may not actually be what happened in the moment.
(04:34):
It's just now I know. So now I'm going to
tell you what I know. And so again, there's so
many layers to this that you try to, you know,
you try to peel back as many layers as you
possibly can. But what we know is none of it
really matters. You can think you know, but you don't
know until they do it, and they do it at
this level and they do it consistently at the NFL level,
(04:58):
and you know, that's that's the beauty of it, and
that's the struggle of it and the frustration of it.
You know that we can say whatever we want and
we can blame evaluators at the end of the day.
Bottom line is, we don't know until we know. We
don't know until they're between the lines at this speed
with the complexity of what they're seeing and they can actually,
you know, do the things they need to do to
(05:19):
be successful. You know. But that's what makes this whole
process fun. You know, as we project forward and we
hope that you know what, all the things that the
Giants did, will you know, we'll we'll equal great success
on the football field.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Okay, so now let's get into darts specifically, and to
your point, you have to talk about the environment he
was in college. You know, Lin Kiffin, great offensive coach
right in the college. He sets things up for the
quarterback really nicely. And you're and by by the way,
folks go to Kurt's Quarterback Confidential YouTube page. He did
a great breakdown of Jackson about a month ago. I
think it's it's must watch. Go check it out. It's fantastic.
(05:56):
And you talk about how so many of these plays
and you see it on tape. Hey, they spam the
same concept like seven to ten times every game. Right,
it's either the they run that play where the flag
runs underneath, the go route outside, they had to deep
over and they try to get the safety out. But
a lot of it is the quarterback reading one player, right,
and you highlight that in your breakdown. A lot of
times it's the safety or the corner. Are you going
(06:17):
to the flat? Are you going over him into the flag?
Or is the safety? You know, who is he going
to on a specific play what they're asking him to
do at Ole Miss? Sorry for the one question, how
do you think that might translate to what he's going
to be asked to the NFL? And what were you
able to see from the environment he was in at
Ole Miss?
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Well, some of the things. You know, they did a
lot of RPOs. So when you go and watch the tape,
there's a lot of hitches thrown in that sort of stuff,
which is fine. You know, NFL teams are running that
to a degree, so be it. You know, I mean
not that I hate that stuff, but again, you kind
of expect every quarterback to be able to do that
sort of stuff. So you got to eliminate that part
(06:59):
of it, and then you've got to try to decipher
from the rest of it. And you know, the things
that I really liked is that there were pro concepts
within their offense. There were a number of what I
call chunk or second level throws, which to me is
always the biggest difference maker at the NFL level is
can you read and make those second level throws consistently?
(07:21):
You know, those fifteen to thirty five yard throws that
changed the complexion of games or series or field position.
Got to be able to make those at a healthy
clip to me, for me to be a really special
player at the NFL level, they asked him to do that.
I thought he was one of the better intermediate throwers
(07:41):
in this raft. So you know, I really like that
about him. You know, he's got a little bit of
athleticism to him. And when I say a little bit,
you know, obviously way more than I ever had. But
when I say a little bit. I mean, not a
guy that can live in the athletic world. You know,
we have some guys that major more in the athletic
world at the ENDFL level. He's not that kind of guy.
(08:02):
But he gives you enough athleticism that, you know, and
I think about Brian dabol and I think about what
he did with Josh Allen, especially like in the red zone,
uh you know, the r P O s or that,
or the quarterback run game, those kinds of things that
I believe he gives you enough there that he gives
you a nice little change up with what coach Dabo
likes to do, what he did with Daniel Jones. You
(08:24):
know that that that you don't major in that, but
but that can be an element of your offense, you know.
So so there were things that I definitely liked about
Jackson Dart. There were things that, you know, easy for
me to see why the Giants thought he was the
number two quarterback and went up and got him, you know,
(08:45):
but still questions, you know, when he's asked to carry
a team playing quarterback, and again that's a throw out
the r pos throw out the athletic part of it.
When you got to play quarterback, and you got to
play in the pocket, and you've got to deliver, and
you've got to make throw after throw, as you saw
in the breakdown. And again, you know, when I do
my breakdowns, you know it's tough because I don't get
(09:05):
to do a number of breakdowns on each of these guys.
Top guys, I did a couple, and everybody else I
did one. So when I go back and look at
the tape, I never take their best game and I
never take their worst game because it's like, Okay, we're
all gonna have great games at times, we're all gonna
have you know, stinkers at times. I want to know
who they are consistently. So you try to find a
game that showcases kind of everything, including the questions you
(09:28):
have at the next level. So in that game when
they were down to Florida in that game and he
was asked to make throw after throw after throw, he
was a little careless with the football. He was a
little careless. Is decision making in those moments, And so
again it's to me, just hey, this is what I saw.
This is something I'm watching moving forward. Is in those
(09:50):
moments when you're asked to carry the team with your
right arm. Can you make those throws consistently? You know,
you go back to Jayden Daniels. That to me was
what made him so is that in the biggest moments
he played exactly the same way he played the other
three quarters. And that's what separated him last year. And
that's what I want to see with the Jackson dark
(10:12):
that wasn't necessarily asked to do that. You know, a
lot where it's just play drop that quarterback, you know,
play within the scheme and make throw after throw at
the throw to bring us back in a football game.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
All right, I want to dig into a bunch of
stuff you talked about there, Curus.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
I thought it was great.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
And one of the things you look at right away
is can you play on time and on schedule? That's
one of the big important things for you as a
quarterback in that regard. Did you see that consistently from
Jackson being on time, getting where you're supposed to go
with the ball at the right time, with the right
pace and all that stuff.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Yeah, not too bad. But again, you know, the one
thing about their offense is I felt like, you know,
their offense was either really quick throws, yeah, or those
second level throws. And so the reason I say that
is because quick throws just come out as soon as
they can come out. You know, the timing element is
not you know, there is a timing element, but it's
(11:05):
more catch and shoot. And then the deeper throws there's
not as much of a timing element either, because you know,
there's not a this is going to be a twelve
yard route and you've got to hit him on the
turn and you got to hit him between. Those things
can play out a little bit differently depending on the scenario.
And so they didn't have a great deal of those
(11:28):
kind of fifteen and under type throws, at least the
ones that I saw that are really timing oriented type throws.
Get back, you got to see it. Balls got to
come out, yeah, you.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Know yeah, like slid is right, like slants, slants, curls.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
You know, quick in routes, you know things like that,
you know pop routes where it's sick seven yards, boom boom,
you read it, pop balls out of your hands. There
wasn't quite as many of those kind of quick read,
decision making ball out type concepts that I hold from
from the tape, And so a little bit harder to
tell in that world. But again, you know, a lot
(12:06):
of it's going to depend on what kind of world
the giants have to live in and you know, and
where they have to play from that perspective, but I
just didn't see a whole bunch of those, you know,
to be able to kind of glean Okay, he's really
good at at these timing quick hitches, ball out of
his hands, seeing it getting it into the tight windows.
(12:28):
Didn't see that quite as much from Jackson Darky.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
Now I'm with you, but to your point, we saw
a ton of the intermediate stuff. And what jumped out
to me watching and you brought up on the tape too,
you know, his ability to put touch on the ball
and get it over the linebacker level in front of
the safety level. I just thought it was was really
good because a lot of times, you know, you know,
you have to you don't want to get it too high,
and I think we saw it and there was a
Georgia game, I think where he tried to do that
(12:52):
on an in cut. He got a little bit too
high and it went over the receivers head to a safety.
But for the most part, his ability to layer the
balls in between defenders. I thought was was pretty consistent
throughout his tape.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Yeah, I mean, I you know, I'm big on not
having to throw the ball hard, you know, I know,
we fall in love with the physical talent and how
far and hard a guy can throw it. I always
use the term firm but soft, you know. And I've
got a son who plays college football as a quarterback,
and he's like, Dad, that's not physics. You can't do that.
You can't be firm. And I've said, I'll show you
(13:22):
what that looks like. And what that is is it's
the ability to have the pace on the football where
it doesn't die and it doesn't hang on you, but
it gets from point A to point B. But also
the ability to put touch on it so you can
get the ball up and down and you can layer
it over the linebackers and before the safeties like you're
talking about, but still have good pace on the football.
(13:43):
And you're right. I think Jackson does that really really well.
That he doesn't ever overthrow it. You don't ever feel
like he's throwing the ball hard. You know, it's easy
throws from him, but the ball it gets there, you know,
it's got the right pace on it and makes it
easy to catch for his guys on the second life.
So I always think that that's really really important. I
mean again, I'm gonna go back to Jaden Daniels just
(14:04):
because you brought him up. I think that's the one
thing that jumped off the tape last year. I don't
think I ever saw Jadan Daniels throw the ball hard,
like I don't even know how strong his arm is,
Like I know again strong, I don't look at strong
as the ability to throw it really far, because everybody
can throw it far up it's you know, do you
you know throw these lasers. I didn't see him have
(14:26):
to throw those kind of balls. Everything had a nice
touch on it was easy to catch, a great piece
on the football, always got there. And those are the
kind of throwers that I think make it easier for
everybody around him. And you know that those were the
kind of things that I saw from Jackson Dart to college.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Puddle up, get in here. If you're lined up here,
you gotta go over the middle with at the score great.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
How do we make that happen? I don't know, But
Citizens does makes sense of your money with Citizens Official
Bank of Eli Manning The Giants.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Totle podcast has brought to you by Citizens, the official
bank of the Giants. From game day celebrations to your
everyday financial needs, Big Blue fans can get the most
out of every moment with Citizens. Learn more at citizens
bank dot com slash Giants. Yeah, and I think at
times we saw him go through those full field progressions
from one side of the field or the other. And
I think you highlighted one where he went through a couple,
(15:19):
he went through a shallow cross a guy in the flat,
and then he hit the deep over over the top.
But again, I think that's one of those deals where
you have to really look for those right and you
can find them. But it's just not a very common
thing that they were asking him to do in that
offense or so much of Instagram.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
I'll say this too, I'm not a big you know,
you say full field, and so there's lots of different
ways to look at that. There's the pure progression type
stuff which a lot of teams run, which is, you know,
start to your right, read one, read two, come back
to the middle, then work all the way to the left.
I'm not a big fan of those kind of plays,
and so when I think of full field reads. What
(15:55):
I think of is being able to take the snap,
read the coverage, and then decipher am I going right
or am I going left? Am I reading the concept
to the right? Or am I reading the concept to
the left, and then simplifying it from there as you
were mentioning, Hey, I'm reading the flat defender. This is
a high low on the flat defender. So that's how
I like to play the game. So I don't even
like the pure progression where it's like go from here
(16:17):
to here, to hear to hear. Now, it's nice to
be able to see a quarterback process information. Okay, one's
not here, two's not here. I'd like to see a
guy get to three. Once you get beyond three, that's
not realistic football anyways. The number of quarterbacks that actually
get to four and five in any progression, if there
is a four and five, is slim to none. But
I like to see guys in a timely fashion get
(16:38):
to three or look at one or two and get
to their checkdown. But a lot of times in college
you've got to see this full field, pure progression type read,
which I'm not a huge fan of. So I don't
like to get too hung up with Hey, we didn't
see a lot of that. Hey. When I played the game,
I tried to simplify it as quickly as possible to Hey,
it's this guy high low boat balls out of my hands.
(16:59):
I don't need to do all of this and spend
all this time. But a lot of that comes from
pre snap processing, knowing where to go and then being
able to play on time.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Okay, so let me follow up then, I imagine then
it's important to be able to quickly identify coverages, right,
because that'll tell you where you want to go at
the ball and where you want to target. Or identifying
a blitz and you, I know you featured one play
there where he twice I think where dB blitz is
a linebacker blitzes, he replaces them, gets a right to
the ball, right to the guy who was where the
guy was blitzing from. So do you feel like from
watching him that he has a pretty good feel for
(17:29):
identifying not just blitzeres, but also coverages, so he is
looking at the right places to deliver the ball.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
You know, again, such a hard thing to know, because
again in college football, with pure progression stuff, your eyes
can end up in the right place or a particular read,
but it may have been dictated ahead of time, like hey,
you're starting over here. No matter what you know, the
hot throws. Always am looking for that from every quarterback.
I want to see they bring pressure, What do you do?
(17:57):
What's your answer? And he did answer it well. So
a couple times in that tape again did he see it?
You know? Was that a built in? Was that his
first read where he was going? Anyway? So was an
easy process for him, which is fine. Again, sometimes it's easy.
I got no problem with that, but it doesn't always
tell you what did he identify? How much did he
(18:19):
see on the snap? And you know how much did
he have to answer in his mind? But the times
that I saw him do it, he didn't panic. He
made the right play, he got a positive play against pressure.
All of those things are good within the structure that
I saw him play.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
And then you talked about consistency of reads. Right, it
does a quarterback consistently make the right decision? And I
think what passes down the field specifically with him, and
I think we saw this throughout the year. He loves
throwing it deep. He's very willing to be a vertical passer.
But I think and you saw it a couple of
times in that Florida game. You see it a couple
of times out of the games too, where sometimes he
will throw the ball into a little bit of a
team meeting, which is not ideal for a quarterback. And
(18:58):
for you, does that come by come down to him predetermined?
Speaker 1 (19:02):
You think where he wants to go with the football?
What do you think?
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Yeah, I mean, I think at times it can because
that's what again you'd like to see is that, you know,
all of us as quarterbacks will make a bad decision.
You know, we'll you know, throw it up and a
guy comes over here and now it's two on one,
or you know, or we read it wrong. Whatever that
always happened. What you're trying to look for is consistency
when you're seeing the same play over and over again, like, okay,
(19:26):
how often is he reading this right? You know it is?
His eyes are his eyes on the safety to see
if the safety holds on the corner. So we could
throw the post over the top and some of those things,
and then especially in critical moments, and that was kind
of what I was pointing out in that game. And
again we could have probably pulled up another game where
he was better in the critical moments, but that was
a game they were down he was forced to have
(19:48):
to throw to bring them back, and I thought he
made you know, a number of just really questionable like
I couldn't quite figure out, like why why are you
throwing this one up when the safety did absolutely not
thing on the snap and he's just standing back there,
you know, Or the late interception where he just kind
of throws it down the sideline where there's only a
defender there, there's no you know. So yeah, again, I
(20:11):
thought he did a good job in the tape that
I watched of making those throws. But I want to
know in the most critical moments, you're going to make
the best decisions that you make throughout the course of
the game in those moments. And I didn't necessarily see
it in the game that I broke down, you know,
in one of those games that was a tighter game,
or when they were down late. So it's just again
(20:32):
when when you know, I tweeted not too long ago,
just you know, this idea in college what's so hard too,
is there's there's not there's a lack of parody in
college and so when you play for Ole Miss, you know,
eight games out of twelve, you're going to be the
better football team across the board. Maybe the quarterback, yeah,
(20:54):
maybe even more. Right, So the quarterback doesn't have to
be great. Yes you have to make plays, and yes
you have to, but the margin of there is going
to be greater because your guys are better than their
guys are. And so, you know, when you get into
those critical tight games and you're not used to that,
I want to know who you are, I want to
know how you play. I want to know, you know,
(21:15):
do you give your team a chance more times than
not in those kind of moments, because you're usually not
going to have as many of those, you know, when
you're the best teams in the you know, in college football,
whereas in the NFL, most games are going to come
down to one score, you know, a tight game, lad
and the quarterback is going to have to play well,
you just don't know in college football. And so again,
(21:38):
you know, you can always say, well, you took this
tape and maybe that skewed a little bit, and it
might be. But again, you've got to try to pull
as many different scenarios into one breakdown of a tape
as you possibly can, because a lot of times they're
not playing that way, and Jackson Dark doesn't have to
make every throw because they're up by two touchdowns, or
(21:58):
he can take an extra time to throw the football
because his guy's opened by you know, ten yards as
opposed to a tight throw that you got to make
at the NFL level. And so you're just trying to
glean as much possible from those situations and really again
project forward some questions. Not that they don't have the
answers to those questions, not that they're not, you know,
better than what they showed on tape, but just the
(22:20):
questions that I have going in with all of these guys,
because I don't think any of them are finished product,
not even cam Mordon was a number one overall pick.
I think they all have things to work on and
they have to get better at if they want to
be great at the next level. So part of my
breakdown is to point out what those questions are for
me and the things that I'm going to be watching
for when they get under center at the NFL level.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
What do you think of his traits just just basic
quarterback one on one arm strength, athleticism, pocket movement, things
like that.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Good enough, because again I'm not I'm not a traits guy,
you know, And maybe it's because I didn't have those
traits and was able to be really successful. I mean,
you guys know Eli Manning didn't have those trades. Nope,
was able to be really successful. There's Tom Brad Like,
there's a lot of guys, and I know the trend
is moving towards athleticism. I get that, but I still
(23:10):
believe when you watch in critical moments of games, you
have to be able to play from inside the pocket.
And it's not about traits. It's about the mental ability
to make decisions, get the ball to the right guy,
and then having good enough traits to make the throws
that you're going to be asked to make or to make,
you know, a five yard run when you have to
(23:32):
make a five yard run, like and Jackson Dart to me,
has all of you know, the skills to be good enough,
Like he's got good enough arm strength, he's got good
enough mobility, he's got all of that stuff. To me,
is good enough to be a really good quarterback in
the National Football League. So it's not anything that I'm
concerned about. You know, from a skill standpoint, you.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Mentioned his mobility.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
The one thing I was kind of impressed by court
And we see some college quarterbacks and they get pressure,
they'll roll out, they'll run backwards. Jacksonville tends to step
up and through the pressure, which I really like. Now,
a lot of times he just runs off of that which,
by the way, if you can get ten twelve yards
on the run, that's great. But I thought his pocket
presence in that way was actually pretty good for a
young player.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, I mean, I think he does a nice shot.
You know, he's willing to run, and a lot of
people have made the comparison to a Jalen Herbs and
I actually like that comparison. You know that Jalen isn't
off the charts, you know, skill set wise. You know,
whether that's athletically or speed or arm strength. But you know,
but he's good in all of those areas. He's got
enough in all of those areas. And you know when
(24:37):
he runs, you know, very seldom is it going to
be a forty yard run. But he does a great
job of picking up eight to ten yards. He's got
a nice feel when the pocket opens up, and a
big body to be able to run through somebody if
he needs to score down in the red zone and
do those things. And I think Jackson Dart is very
similar to that. Maybe not quite as good an athlete
(24:58):
as as Jalen, but I think in the same vein
of you know, of what he brings to the table.
And so I think when you watch Jalen play, I
look at this and say, I think Jackson Dark could
be a very similar type player within that offense to
what Jalen does. You know, Jalen's a big time thrower
(25:20):
in big time moments and those things, and I want
to see that from Jackson, But just skill set wise,
those I think that's a pretty accurate comparison when we're
just talking about the physical skills of Jackson to somebody
that's playing in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
All right, Gret, finally, now let's talk about him in
the Giants building. You're a young quarterback that had to
come in and earn his way. Nothing was given to
you or in a first round pick. So what does
this developmental process now look like for Jackson? Now that
he gets in the building, he's in meetings with Mike Kafka,
who's a former NFL quarterback, He's done it. Shae Tierney,
the quarterbacks coach Brian Dable, who knows how to develop
a quarterback.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
What does he need to focus on?
Speaker 3 (25:56):
What does he need to do in the spring of
the summer when he gets right, so then when the
season gets here, maybe he's not getting the reps to
continue develop as a quarterback to earn his way onto
the field.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
I mean, I think it's it's understanding the process that
he has to go through in those four to five seconds,
you know, when he gets the ball in his hands.
Is that again with this whole class, I don't believe
any of them are athletic enough to live in that
world and be really successful in the NFL. They are
going to have to play more traditional pocket quarterback in
(26:29):
my opinion, to be really good quarterbacks in the NFL.
And so for Jackson, that to me is the is
the step is I've got to learn. I've got to process,
I've got to talk to as many people as possible.
I've got to come up with my plan on how
to play on schedule, on time, within the structure of
the offense, because That's where I'm going to be ultra successful.
(26:52):
I don't think it's going to be in the other
areas where you know, we'll use Russell Wilson since he's
in New York. When he was playing in the stages
in Seattle, he didn't do all of the stuff I'm
talking about. He was a guy that played athletic play,
you know, like he can make, of course a throw
on time and if number ones open, he can make
that throw. But he lived very much in the world of, hey,
(27:14):
we got a good defense in a good run game,
and I'm a complimentary piece, and so my goal is
to make six or seven or eight plays a game,
you know, run around, make a throw down the field,
run around and make a run. And he was good
enough to play and live in that world in the
early stages of his career. Ben Roethlisberger another guy that
(27:36):
was able to do that early on, had the benefit
of again, good run game, good defense, so you only
had to make so many plays a game of those
special plays and it gave your team a chance to win.
I just don't think Jackson is quite that guy. So
I do believe he's going to have to play traditional football.
He's going to have to, you know, up his game
(27:57):
in terms of processing, getting the ball out or even
just show us again. I don't want to say up
his game because we talked about that earlier. Maybe it's
in there and we just didn't see it and so,
but he's going to have to play more in that vein.
So to me, that's the process, learning the offense, understanding
the nuance, understanding the reads, knowing where to get his eyes,
seeing the coverages, and understanding what his keys are so
(28:19):
he can play on time and get the ball out
of his hands and then allow the athleticism to be
a complementary piece, you know, to those other things.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
And just to follow up.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
I think it's pretty easy to do that in the
spring of the summer, right, just in terms of because
you have the reps to do it right. You're running
in your offense, you're getting practices, you're going to get
into some games in the preseason to show it on
the field. What is it like, Kurt for a quarterback
when you get to the regular season, right and Russell's
getting all of the first team snaps in practice, maybe
Jackson's running the scout team. Maybe he could do some
(28:50):
walk through with some of the practice squad guys in
the Giants offense after practice, how does he continue to
learn to do the things you're talking about when maybe
you're not getting those full speed reps again defenses like
you are on the spring in the summer, you know, and.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
It can vary by team, you know. So a lot
of it depends on how much does a team game
plan during the season. So when you get into preseason games,
you've got your base offense, and you've been running your
base offense for three or four weeks, and it's you know, normal, basic,
kind of easy concept plays, and then you get into
the season and you can't always run those plays every week. Oh,
(29:26):
this team does this, this play is not as good.
We're gonna have to add another play. We're gonna have
to do this, and and our game plan starts to
change throughout the season. And so that's part of that process,
is being able to pick up the nuances and the
different defenses that you're going to see and what are
the keys against those defenses And Okay, we're putting in
a new play. What's different about this play than the
(29:47):
base play that we're running. And so, you know, in
preseason again it's base plays offensively a lot of times
for you it's base defenses. A lot of times for
the teams that you're playing, everything ramps up and ratchet
up in regular season because now they're preparing for you.
They've watched your tape. Oh, these are their base plays.
We're going to run defenses to take away the base plays.
(30:10):
So now you've got to put in secondary or complimentary plays,
and so that's where the volume starts to add up.
You've got four or five days to do all of this.
You've got to get comfortable with the defenses you're seeing,
and so that's where it gets harder in the regular season,
especially if you don't have a lot of reps. You
don't get a lot of reps. And so for me
(30:30):
when I was when I wasn't the starter, I would
try to you know, I would try to take every
scout team rep that I could, and I would always
try to see where I could take a play from
another team's offense and somehow place it into our offensive
playbook and go, Okay, this play is very similar to
that play out, maybe not exact, but very similar. I'm
(30:53):
going to go back and read this the way I
would read that play that's in our game plan this week.
So I'm going to try to get a mental rep
and a physical rep on that play, even though I'm
running the scout team, And so that to me was
how I liked to do it. Is you know, I
had a really good vision for how plays were connected
and what I was looking at with different coverages, and
(31:13):
so I was always trying to do that. So although
not completely apples to apples, it was trying to get
those mental reps. So when I did get my opportunity,
I had somewhat seen or gone through the process besides
just standing behind the huddle and trying to mentally walk
through my you walk myself through you know, that mental
(31:35):
rep without physically seeing it and doing it, you know,
because I wasn't giving those reps. If you want to
know how to manage two minutes of crunch time football,
I'm your man. But if you're wondering about a long
term financial plan, you should talk to Citizens.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Hey, I can also talk long care. I'd like to
learn about AMLIA routine. Yes, I knew I could help
make sense of your money with Citizens. Great answer and
curt final question.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
And I don't mean to bring back a bad memory,
but you're on the other side of this when the
Giants drafted Eli Manning. Right, you're here, You're over five
hundred of the starter. You were five and four, right,
the team was five and four. They were playing good football,
but the Giants decided to go.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
With elive midseason.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
What does this look like in that quarterback room for
a veteran quarterback like Russell Wilson, who I'm sure still
thinks he's a lot of good football left in him.
He played pretty well for the Steelers last year until
he played some really tough team at the end of
the year and they lost a few games. And know
what happens, What are you going to do? What is
this going to be like for him? And how does
he work with the young guy in this situation? And
then how does this decision get made by Brian Dable
(32:33):
when he's not seeing Jacksonville having a lot of you know,
reps and figuring out when he actually is ready. Just
kind of taking me inside of that from someone that
lived in a little bit.
Speaker 2 (32:41):
Yeah, you know, I actually know Russell, you know, quite
a bit. And actually I'm really close with Jamis as well,
and I think both those guys will be great for Jackson,
you know, in terms of their willingness to help him.
However they can help him. Now, those two guys are
two different kinds of quarterbacks. Again, Russell less of the
(33:02):
more traditional drop back, you know, read play on time
type quarterback, you know. But there's things that he's really
good at seeing and throwing and the way he throws
things that I think he can really help Jackson with
that stuff. I think Jamis is really good mentally at
processing information and reading coverages and and getting to the
right guy. And so I think combination wise, they could
(33:25):
be you know, a great combination for Jackson to help
him with the two facets of his game, you know,
in terms of coach Dave Ball and just like when
I was there, I think it becomes a variety of
different things that you're looking at in making the decisions
on playing. You know. So when I went to New York,
(33:45):
you know, the team was born twelve the year before
you know, new coach there wasn't you know, a lot
of excitement about the team and what we could be
because of everything that it transpired, and so you know,
and without a doubt, I was the better player at
that time too, but I had been there and I
have led and so when I got inserted, you know,
(34:07):
into the offense there. It wasn't anything like offenses that
I ran, and it didn't necessarily play to my strengths.
But my job was to uh get the guys to
believe in the possibilities and to find ways to win
because we weren't a great football team, and so we
were able to do that. You know, we started five
(34:28):
and two, and as you said, we were five and four.
But you know what I think, you know, came to
you know, came to pass, you know after those nine games,
was there was a couple of things that first, we
weren't a great football team. You know, even though we
were a playoff team at the time, I think everybody
that involved realized we were manufacturing wins. We weren't a
(34:52):
great football team, you know that was going to go
out and really have a chance to win a championship.
And I know, you know, giants have been there before.
You get in as a wild card and you get hot,
and it can happen. But I think that was the
first part to what they saw was Okay, we're not
a great football team. And so even if we keep
(35:12):
kind of sitting around five hundred a little bit of
better than five hundred, even sneaking to the playoffs? Is
that worth you know, not developing our young quarterbacks so
in two or three years, because we feel like we've
got some pieces, in two or three years, when we
feel like we're ready, will he be ready? And so
I think that was the first part of the process.
And I think part of a process that could happen,
(35:35):
you know, with the Giants this year is you've got
your veteran that's not your future, and you may get
to a point where you're kind of muddling around winning
some games, and does it become more advantageous to go
to the young guy? And then I think the second
part of the equation was I wasn't able to be
who I was in that offense, and I think they
(35:58):
understood that as well, and so it was a struggle
for me to do the things that I wanted to
do and the things that I was accustomed to doing,
and so, you know, they didn't want to do those
sorts of things. And there's a couple examples from that season.
He got the time. Yeah, but so we played against
Baltimore and this was after you know, Eli had taken over,
(36:21):
and you know, one of his first couple of games,
and he really struggled in the game.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
Oh, he got obliterate. I remember that game was that.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
It was a rough game for him, and so they
put me in late in the second half. You know,
in like three series, we threw for one hundred and
sixty yards and we put up two touchdowns and like
because they were playing my brand of football, but that's
not how they wanted to play. So you could see
the glimpse of that. You know. My last game that
I started was in Arizona with the Giants, and we
(36:48):
started in the no huddle, and we drove down and
scored two touchdowns right off the bat in the no huddle,
and we're up like fourteen to nothing or fourteen to
seven in that game. And then we got out of
the no huddle and we went back to doing what
we do and we lost seventeen to fourteen in that game.
And so that was a good indication for me that
I know I can still play, but they don't want
(37:08):
me to play the way that I play my best
and so I was never able to put my best
foot forward. We were not built u to play to
really my mindset and what I wanted to do. And uh,
you know, so there was a number of fumbles that
I had that year because there were times that I'm
trying to hold onto the ball and you know, get
(37:29):
guys open and make plays that I had made earlier
in my career. We just weren't built that way, and
so I think they ultimately saw that too, Like not
that Kurt's not the better quarterback, but we're just not
going to play to Kurt strength. We're not going to
play that brand of football. And so having Kurt in there, it's, yeah,
(37:50):
it's been great. We you know, we won early on
and we've got guys to believe, but he's not going
to be able to elevate us, you know, to this
other level because we're not gonna let them and were
not built that way. So all of those things I
think played into maybe it's best to just make the
move now and take our lumps, you know, the last
(38:11):
seven games of the season. You know, let Eli take
his lumps. Let's figure out who we're going to be
with Eliser quarterback, so we can come back next year
and you know and kind of hit the ground running
with knowing who our quarterback is, knowing how we want
to play and being able to put the pieces around
them to be successful. And ultimately, obviously it worked out
(38:33):
great for Eli and the Giants and what they did and.
Speaker 1 (38:36):
So and for you, by the way, you ended up
going to the Superowl in Arizona.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
Yet no, no, And yeah, I mean I was able
to do enough to parlay that into another opportunity for sure.
But I say all that to go, the Giants are
going to have to figure out who they are throughout
this season and what they're capable of, and what they're
capable of With Russell Wilson as their quarterback playing the
(38:59):
way he does, does it fit their skill set? And
you know, he's a good deep ball thrower, right, he's
a good off schedule thrower. Do they have the pieces
there to do that sort of stuff or do they
have to be more of a you know, ten yard
fifteen yard pass offense that maybe plays to Jamis or
(39:20):
even Jackson maybe a little bit better than Russell. And
so those are the questions that I think will have
to be answered, barring the fact that they don't come
out of the blocks and win seven straight and look
like world beaters. If they're kind of you know, middle
and you know, through everything. I think that's when you
have to start asking those different questions and what's the
(39:42):
best for the future, what's the best for our system,
what's the best with the pieces we have, what gives
us the best opportunity? And again, you know, I love
coach Stable and I think he does a great job.
And but you know a lot of people are talking.
You know, are they a little bit more on the
hot seat? Do they need to win? How much do
they need to win? Do they get some extra time
(40:04):
now that they have a young quarterback to be able
to play this out the way that they want to,
or do they have to force the vets a little
bit more because they have to win right now? So
I think those are factors as well. But I think
at the end of the day, it really comes down
to what do we see our future and you know,
how do I feel like we're built now? What's the
(40:26):
best way for us to have success and then possibly
get our young quarterback ready if we think, you know,
that time is coming sooner rather than later.
Speaker 3 (40:37):
So in conclusion, having any sort of discussion now about
when the best time is to slide Darta in is
pretty useless until you see how the season goes right
and how Russell plays, except for maybe putting him in
there right away, which I don't think anyone is considering
that at all.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
Joe Shane said in his first.
Speaker 3 (40:52):
Press conference after the draft for Russell's all starter, I
think that's the right way. But basically, until you see
how this plays out, knowing when the right time is
is pretty impossible.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
Huh yeah. I mean, first of all, seeing who the
quarterback is and where he's at at the time. I
mean because again, even with the Giants that year, Eli
wasn't ready to be the starter yet. You know, he
wasn't ready. But you know, again with all the other
things that were going on, they said, we have we
know he's not ready, but we're hoping that through these
seven games he can get ready. You know, we can
(41:22):
throw enough at him and he can see enough and
he can handle enough that he'll be ready, you know,
when the season. So I think all those things are factors.
But I've always believed that the easiest way to always
go is to start the veteran. It's so much easier
to start the vet and go to the young guy
than it is with any other scenario. Starting the young
guy and then having to go to the bed and
(41:42):
then trying to come back to the young guy or
just struggling through things early with the young guy, it's
always easier to go with the vet. And if things
aren't working or working the way you want them to,
or you feel that the young guy you know is
ready to some degree, then it's easy to just look
for an opportunity. Oh oh, we've lost a couple of games,
(42:02):
then it's easy to find that transition point to the
young guy. And so I think the Giants are in
a great position from that standpoint that they've got two
guys that have started a lot of football in the NFL.
They don't have to force this issue and put extra
undue pressure on Jackson Dart. They can let it play out,
and then when the pressure's at its least, that can
(42:23):
be the time that they insert in. Whether that's halfway
through the year, whether that's the end of the year,
whether that's next year where we've alleviated some of that, Hey,
come in and be the savior for this team when
there's a lot of parts that need to be need
to be fixed.
Speaker 3 (42:36):
Yeah, maybe slide them in when the Raiders as the
upcoming opponent and not the Eagles something like that. Of course.
Speaker 1 (42:41):
Yeah, you are the absolute best man, You're great. Tell
the folks obviously you.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
Can find them NFL Network, Quarterback Confidential, tell them about
YouTube page, everything you're doing that you want the fans
to know about, Kirk.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
Yeah, you know, I'm all over doing all kinds of
different things. You know, I'm a football junkie, So yeah,
qbconfidential dot Com is my teaching web site. I've created
a teaching website for quarterbacks and coaches and fans to
really get inside the quarterback position and learn in a
whole different way. So that's that website. I've got QB Confidential,
which is my YouTube page, which I'm always doing different
(43:14):
breakdowns on different things, you know, quarterbacks as you were
talking about leading into the draft, certain plays, certain things
that become trends in the NFL, which is kind of fun.
As you said, I'll be on NFL Network doing the
morning shows. I'll be doing you know, broadcasts in different ways,
some on TV, some some on radio. So yeah, just
(43:34):
kind of will be all over doing all kinds of
different things, and and always look forward to having an
interaction and talking.
Speaker 3 (43:41):
Well, absolutely, Kurt, enjoy the rest of your spring. This
is our downtime. Enjoy it with the family.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
I will do the same and look forward to the
football season start up in a few months. Thank you
very much for the top someome.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Maybe we'll cross pass in the fall. Take care of it.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
We thank Kurt Warner for joining us right here on
the Giants Huddle podcast, brought to you by Citizens Official
Bank of the Giants. Is invaluable inside from Kurt, he
does his work, he knows his quarterbacks, and getting his
insight on Jackson Dart I think was really invaluable as
we get him in the building here and see what
he can do once his feet touch the grass here
in East Rutherford, New Jersey. Thanks to Kurt for joining us.
(44:14):
I'm John Schmulk. We'll see you next time with the
Johnsontle Podcast, brought to you by Citizens, the Official Bank
of the Giants
It's time to get inside the Giants Hut. Let's go.
Speaker 2 (00:03):
Let's go Giants on the Giants Mobul, give me some
join part of the Giants Podcast Network's.
Speaker 3 (00:10):
Welcome to another edition of the Giants Litle Podcast, brought
to you by Citizens, the official bank of the New
York Football Giants. I am John Schmult, Thank you for
being with us today. Everybody we welcome in a I
think third or fourth time guest. You might know him
NFL Network, but if you're a little bit older like me,
you'll know him as Super Bowl champion and Pro Football
Hall of Famer Kurt Warner. Kurt, it's good to see
(00:31):
you man. Thanks for being with us again. And once
a Giant, always a Giant.
Speaker 2 (00:34):
Got it. Good to see you as well.
Speaker 1 (00:36):
All right, Kurt, let's get into it.
Speaker 3 (00:38):
The Giants decided to trade up into the first round
to draft Jackson Dark. Before we get into Jackson specifically,
I gotta admit I've referenced our conversation last year before
the draft, probably more than any other one we've had
here on our Giants Hottle podcast, and the lesson that
I learned from you last year. As we were talking
about Jayden Daniels and I said to you, Kurt, you know,
he just doesn't throw over the middle of a ton.
And you said to me, John knock a quarterback. If
(01:01):
you don't know if his quarterback was asking him to
do that, he might have been not have been asked
to do that.
Speaker 1 (01:07):
And I just thought that was a really valuable lesson.
I thought, I want to.
Speaker 3 (01:09):
Kind of give that back to you and say thank you,
because I think we all learn watching Jamee Tangils this year.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
He could do that pretty darn well.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Yeah, yeah, no, he was phenomenal this year. And again,
you know, it's one of the hardest things about, you know,
trying to evaluate these guys from college because offenses are
so different and what these quarterbacks are asked to do
is so different. So it's why to me, you know,
I'm not a huge draft guy because I do believe
(01:37):
so much of it is just projection. We don't know
who's going to get better. We don't know what a
player is capable of. You know, we could go a
couple of years ago to c J. Stroud. I thought
he was better as a rookie in Houston than I
ever saw him at Ohio State. Not that he wasn't
good at Ohio State, but they were asking him to
play a different way, and I didn't know if he
could play that way. And in Houston I got to
(01:59):
see that in the year, and you know, he was
phenomenal in his first year. And so that's the hard
thing about evaluating these guys, especially when you're just watching tape, right,
you don't have a chance to really sit in a
room and decipher what they know and what they see
and what their process is. You're basically going off of
what the coach lays out there. Okay, this is our offense.
(02:20):
Now you have to try to determine, Okay, does he
have enough or have I seen enough to project him
forward to the NFL to be a great player. And
it's really really hard with a lot of these guys,
and so, you know, so again it just kind of
a word of caution for everybody as you're trying to
evaluate this position. You don't really know until you know.
(02:41):
And it's why it's such an inexact science.
Speaker 1 (02:44):
Yeah, I mean, I think, and then we'll get to
Jackson in a second.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
I think this is why the Giants take the process
that they go through with the quarterbacks from January to April.
So seriously, I had a long conversation with Joe Shane
about this a couple of weeks ago, and he just said, look,
you can watch the tape, but you don't really know
how they progress their decision making, how they're seeing the
field until you actually talk to their coaches and find
(03:07):
out what they're being taught, getting them in front of
a monitor and a whiteboard and going through plays with
them and seeing how they think about things. And if
you don't have that for someone like me, especially who's
never played the position, even someone like you who done
this for a living at the highest level, it's just
gonna be hard to know how these guys process the game, which, Carl,
let's be honest, that really is, in a lot of ways,
the most important.
Speaker 1 (03:28):
You can have the best arm in the world. If
you can't process the game, it really isn't gonna.
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Matter, right, Yeah, I mean, there's no doubt to me,
it's the most important thing, without a doubt, without question.
And again, you know, it's even hard when you get
them in a room like I've been around a lot
of guys that you can put them on a board
and they can answer every question. But the next process
or part of it becomes can you process all that
(03:52):
information in four seconds and do the right thing, you know,
And so there's even layers to that where it's nice
to hear and it's nice to know. And you know,
I've even been around other guys that, you know, I
can watch them on tape and then I get them
and talk to them about that play after the fact,
and I know that they're just coaching me up off
of the tape that they watched. I know it wasn't
(04:13):
what they did because I've watched their eyes. I was
either body. But it's easy to do. So you get
a quarterback in a room, and you know, you take
them back to a certain play. They've already seen that
play four or five times, and so they can go and, oh, well,
here's what I was saying, you know, and they can
come up with an answer that sounds really, really good,
which may not actually be what happened in the moment.
(04:34):
It's just now I know. So now I'm going to
tell you what I know. And so again, there's so
many layers to this that you try to, you know,
you try to peel back as many layers as you
possibly can. But what we know is none of it
really matters. You can think you know, but you don't
know until they do it, and they do it at
this level and they do it consistently at the NFL level,
(04:58):
and you know, that's that's the beauty of it, and
that's the struggle of it and the frustration of it.
You know that we can say whatever we want and
we can blame evaluators at the end of the day.
Bottom line is, we don't know until we know. We
don't know until they're between the lines at this speed
with the complexity of what they're seeing and they can actually,
you know, do the things they need to do to
(05:19):
be successful. You know. But that's what makes this whole
process fun. You know, as we project forward and we
hope that you know what, all the things that the
Giants did, will you know, we'll we'll equal great success
on the football field.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
Okay, so now let's get into darts specifically, and to
your point, you have to talk about the environment he
was in college. You know, Lin Kiffin, great offensive coach
right in the college. He sets things up for the
quarterback really nicely. And you're and by by the way,
folks go to Kurt's Quarterback Confidential YouTube page. He did
a great breakdown of Jackson about a month ago. I
think it's it's must watch. Go check it out. It's fantastic.
(05:56):
And you talk about how so many of these plays
and you see it on tape. Hey, they spam the
same concept like seven to ten times every game. Right,
it's either the they run that play where the flag
runs underneath, the go route outside, they had to deep
over and they try to get the safety out. But
a lot of it is the quarterback reading one player, right,
and you highlight that in your breakdown. A lot of
times it's the safety or the corner. Are you going
(06:17):
to the flat? Are you going over him into the flag?
Or is the safety? You know, who is he going
to on a specific play what they're asking him to
do at Ole Miss? Sorry for the one question, how
do you think that might translate to what he's going
to be asked to the NFL? And what were you
able to see from the environment he was in at
Ole Miss?
Speaker 2 (06:36):
Well, some of the things. You know, they did a
lot of RPOs. So when you go and watch the tape,
there's a lot of hitches thrown in that sort of stuff,
which is fine. You know, NFL teams are running that
to a degree, so be it. You know, I mean
not that I hate that stuff, but again, you kind
of expect every quarterback to be able to do that
sort of stuff. So you got to eliminate that part
(06:59):
of it, and then you've got to try to decipher
from the rest of it. And you know, the things
that I really liked is that there were pro concepts
within their offense. There were a number of what I
call chunk or second level throws, which to me is
always the biggest difference maker at the NFL level is
can you read and make those second level throws consistently?
(07:21):
You know, those fifteen to thirty five yard throws that
changed the complexion of games or series or field position.
Got to be able to make those at a healthy
clip to me, for me to be a really special
player at the NFL level, they asked him to do that.
I thought he was one of the better intermediate throwers
(07:41):
in this raft. So you know, I really like that
about him. You know, he's got a little bit of
athleticism to him. And when I say a little bit,
you know, obviously way more than I ever had. But
when I say a little bit. I mean, not a
guy that can live in the athletic world. You know,
we have some guys that major more in the athletic
world at the ENDFL level. He's not that kind of guy.
(08:02):
But he gives you enough athleticism that, you know, and
I think about Brian dabol and I think about what
he did with Josh Allen, especially like in the red zone,
uh you know, the r P O s or that,
or the quarterback run game, those kinds of things that
I believe he gives you enough there that he gives
you a nice little change up with what coach Dabo
likes to do, what he did with Daniel Jones. You
(08:24):
know that that that you don't major in that, but
but that can be an element of your offense, you know.
So so there were things that I definitely liked about
Jackson Dart. There were things that, you know, easy for
me to see why the Giants thought he was the
number two quarterback and went up and got him, you know,
(08:45):
but still questions, you know, when he's asked to carry
a team playing quarterback, and again that's a throw out
the r pos throw out the athletic part of it.
When you got to play quarterback, and you got to
play in the pocket, and you've got to deliver, and
you've got to make throw after throw, as you saw
in the breakdown. And again, you know, when I do
my breakdowns, you know it's tough because I don't get
(09:05):
to do a number of breakdowns on each of these guys.
Top guys, I did a couple, and everybody else I
did one. So when I go back and look at
the tape, I never take their best game and I
never take their worst game because it's like, Okay, we're
all gonna have great games at times, we're all gonna
have you know, stinkers at times. I want to know
who they are consistently. So you try to find a
game that showcases kind of everything, including the questions you
(09:28):
have at the next level. So in that game when
they were down to Florida in that game and he
was asked to make throw after throw after throw, he
was a little careless with the football. He was a
little careless. Is decision making in those moments, And so
again it's to me, just hey, this is what I saw.
This is something I'm watching moving forward. Is in those
(09:50):
moments when you're asked to carry the team with your
right arm. Can you make those throws consistently? You know,
you go back to Jayden Daniels. That to me was
what made him so is that in the biggest moments
he played exactly the same way he played the other
three quarters. And that's what separated him last year. And
that's what I want to see with the Jackson dark
(10:12):
that wasn't necessarily asked to do that. You know, a
lot where it's just play drop that quarterback, you know,
play within the scheme and make throw after throw at
the throw to bring us back in a football game.
Speaker 3 (10:25):
All right, I want to dig into a bunch of
stuff you talked about there, Curus.
Speaker 1 (10:28):
I thought it was great.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
And one of the things you look at right away
is can you play on time and on schedule? That's
one of the big important things for you as a
quarterback in that regard. Did you see that consistently from
Jackson being on time, getting where you're supposed to go
with the ball at the right time, with the right
pace and all that stuff.
Speaker 2 (10:43):
Yeah, not too bad. But again, you know, the one
thing about their offense is I felt like, you know,
their offense was either really quick throws, yeah, or those
second level throws. And so the reason I say that
is because quick throws just come out as soon as
they can come out. You know, the timing element is
not you know, there is a timing element, but it's
(11:05):
more catch and shoot. And then the deeper throws there's
not as much of a timing element either, because you know,
there's not a this is going to be a twelve
yard route and you've got to hit him on the
turn and you got to hit him between. Those things
can play out a little bit differently depending on the scenario.
And so they didn't have a great deal of those
(11:28):
kind of fifteen and under type throws, at least the
ones that I saw that are really timing oriented type throws.
Get back, you got to see it. Balls got to
come out, yeah, you.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
Know yeah, like slid is right, like slants, slants, curls.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
You know, quick in routes, you know things like that,
you know pop routes where it's sick seven yards, boom boom,
you read it, pop balls out of your hands. There
wasn't quite as many of those kind of quick read,
decision making ball out type concepts that I hold from
from the tape, And so a little bit harder to
tell in that world. But again, you know, a lot
(12:06):
of it's going to depend on what kind of world
the giants have to live in and you know, and
where they have to play from that perspective, but I
just didn't see a whole bunch of those, you know,
to be able to kind of glean Okay, he's really
good at at these timing quick hitches, ball out of
his hands, seeing it getting it into the tight windows.
(12:28):
Didn't see that quite as much from Jackson Darky.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
Now I'm with you, but to your point, we saw
a ton of the intermediate stuff. And what jumped out
to me watching and you brought up on the tape too,
you know, his ability to put touch on the ball
and get it over the linebacker level in front of
the safety level. I just thought it was was really
good because a lot of times, you know, you know,
you have to you don't want to get it too high,
and I think we saw it and there was a
Georgia game, I think where he tried to do that
(12:52):
on an in cut. He got a little bit too
high and it went over the receivers head to a safety.
But for the most part, his ability to layer the
balls in between defenders. I thought was was pretty consistent
throughout his tape.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Yeah, I mean, I you know, I'm big on not
having to throw the ball hard, you know, I know,
we fall in love with the physical talent and how
far and hard a guy can throw it. I always
use the term firm but soft, you know. And I've
got a son who plays college football as a quarterback,
and he's like, Dad, that's not physics. You can't do that.
You can't be firm. And I've said, I'll show you
(13:22):
what that looks like. And what that is is it's
the ability to have the pace on the football where
it doesn't die and it doesn't hang on you, but
it gets from point A to point B. But also
the ability to put touch on it so you can
get the ball up and down and you can layer
it over the linebackers and before the safeties like you're
talking about, but still have good pace on the football.
(13:43):
And you're right. I think Jackson does that really really well.
That he doesn't ever overthrow it. You don't ever feel
like he's throwing the ball hard. You know, it's easy
throws from him, but the ball it gets there, you know,
it's got the right pace on it and makes it
easy to catch for his guys on the second life.
So I always think that that's really really important. I
mean again, I'm gonna go back to Jaden Daniels just
(14:04):
because you brought him up. I think that's the one
thing that jumped off the tape last year. I don't
think I ever saw Jadan Daniels throw the ball hard,
like I don't even know how strong his arm is,
Like I know again strong, I don't look at strong
as the ability to throw it really far, because everybody
can throw it far up it's you know, do you
you know throw these lasers. I didn't see him have
(14:26):
to throw those kind of balls. Everything had a nice
touch on it was easy to catch, a great piece
on the football, always got there. And those are the
kind of throwers that I think make it easier for
everybody around him. And you know that those were the
kind of things that I saw from Jackson Dart to college.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Puddle up, get in here. If you're lined up here,
you gotta go over the middle with at the score great.
Speaker 2 (14:49):
How do we make that happen? I don't know, But
Citizens does makes sense of your money with Citizens Official
Bank of Eli Manning The Giants.
Speaker 3 (14:59):
Totle podcast has brought to you by Citizens, the official
bank of the Giants. From game day celebrations to your
everyday financial needs, Big Blue fans can get the most
out of every moment with Citizens. Learn more at citizens
bank dot com slash Giants. Yeah, and I think at
times we saw him go through those full field progressions
from one side of the field or the other. And
I think you highlighted one where he went through a couple,
(15:19):
he went through a shallow cross a guy in the flat,
and then he hit the deep over over the top.
But again, I think that's one of those deals where
you have to really look for those right and you
can find them. But it's just not a very common
thing that they were asking him to do in that
offense or so much of Instagram.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
I'll say this too, I'm not a big you know,
you say full field, and so there's lots of different
ways to look at that. There's the pure progression type
stuff which a lot of teams run, which is, you know,
start to your right, read one, read two, come back
to the middle, then work all the way to the left.
I'm not a big fan of those kind of plays,
and so when I think of full field reads. What
(15:55):
I think of is being able to take the snap,
read the coverage, and then decipher am I going right
or am I going left? Am I reading the concept
to the right? Or am I reading the concept to
the left, and then simplifying it from there as you
were mentioning, Hey, I'm reading the flat defender. This is
a high low on the flat defender. So that's how
I like to play the game. So I don't even
like the pure progression where it's like go from here
(16:17):
to here, to hear to hear. Now, it's nice to
be able to see a quarterback process information. Okay, one's
not here, two's not here. I'd like to see a
guy get to three. Once you get beyond three, that's
not realistic football anyways. The number of quarterbacks that actually
get to four and five in any progression, if there
is a four and five, is slim to none. But
I like to see guys in a timely fashion get
(16:38):
to three or look at one or two and get
to their checkdown. But a lot of times in college
you've got to see this full field, pure progression type read,
which I'm not a huge fan of. So I don't
like to get too hung up with Hey, we didn't
see a lot of that. Hey. When I played the game,
I tried to simplify it as quickly as possible to Hey,
it's this guy high low boat balls out of my hands.
(16:59):
I don't need to do all of this and spend
all this time. But a lot of that comes from
pre snap processing, knowing where to go and then being
able to play on time.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Okay, so let me follow up then, I imagine then
it's important to be able to quickly identify coverages, right,
because that'll tell you where you want to go at
the ball and where you want to target. Or identifying
a blitz and you, I know you featured one play
there where he twice I think where dB blitz is
a linebacker blitzes, he replaces them, gets a right to
the ball, right to the guy who was where the
guy was blitzing from. So do you feel like from
watching him that he has a pretty good feel for
(17:29):
identifying not just blitzeres, but also coverages, so he is
looking at the right places to deliver the ball.
Speaker 2 (17:36):
You know, again, such a hard thing to know, because
again in college football, with pure progression stuff, your eyes
can end up in the right place or a particular read,
but it may have been dictated ahead of time, like hey,
you're starting over here. No matter what you know, the
hot throws. Always am looking for that from every quarterback.
I want to see they bring pressure, What do you do?
(17:57):
What's your answer? And he did answer it well. So
a couple times in that tape again did he see it?
You know? Was that a built in? Was that his
first read where he was going? Anyway? So was an
easy process for him, which is fine. Again, sometimes it's easy.
I got no problem with that, but it doesn't always
tell you what did he identify? How much did he
(18:19):
see on the snap? And you know how much did
he have to answer in his mind? But the times
that I saw him do it, he didn't panic. He
made the right play, he got a positive play against pressure.
All of those things are good within the structure that
I saw him play.
Speaker 3 (18:35):
And then you talked about consistency of reads. Right, it
does a quarterback consistently make the right decision? And I
think what passes down the field specifically with him, and
I think we saw this throughout the year. He loves
throwing it deep. He's very willing to be a vertical passer.
But I think and you saw it a couple of
times in that Florida game. You see it a couple
of times out of the games too, where sometimes he
will throw the ball into a little bit of a
team meeting, which is not ideal for a quarterback. And
(18:58):
for you, does that come by come down to him predetermined?
Speaker 1 (19:02):
You think where he wants to go with the football?
What do you think?
Speaker 2 (19:05):
Yeah, I mean, I think at times it can because
that's what again you'd like to see is that, you know,
all of us as quarterbacks will make a bad decision.
You know, we'll you know, throw it up and a
guy comes over here and now it's two on one,
or you know, or we read it wrong. Whatever that
always happened. What you're trying to look for is consistency
when you're seeing the same play over and over again, like, okay,
(19:26):
how often is he reading this right? You know it is?
His eyes are his eyes on the safety to see
if the safety holds on the corner. So we could
throw the post over the top and some of those things,
and then especially in critical moments, and that was kind
of what I was pointing out in that game. And
again we could have probably pulled up another game where
he was better in the critical moments, but that was
a game they were down he was forced to have
(19:48):
to throw to bring them back, and I thought he
made you know, a number of just really questionable like
I couldn't quite figure out, like why why are you
throwing this one up when the safety did absolutely not
thing on the snap and he's just standing back there,
you know, Or the late interception where he just kind
of throws it down the sideline where there's only a
defender there, there's no you know. So yeah, again, I
(20:11):
thought he did a good job in the tape that
I watched of making those throws. But I want to
know in the most critical moments, you're going to make
the best decisions that you make throughout the course of
the game in those moments. And I didn't necessarily see
it in the game that I broke down, you know,
in one of those games that was a tighter game,
or when they were down late. So it's just again
(20:32):
when when you know, I tweeted not too long ago,
just you know, this idea in college what's so hard too,
is there's there's not there's a lack of parody in
college and so when you play for Ole Miss, you know,
eight games out of twelve, you're going to be the
better football team across the board. Maybe the quarterback, yeah,
(20:54):
maybe even more. Right, So the quarterback doesn't have to
be great. Yes you have to make plays, and yes
you have to, but the margin of there is going
to be greater because your guys are better than their
guys are. And so, you know, when you get into
those critical tight games and you're not used to that,
I want to know who you are, I want to
know how you play. I want to know, you know,
(21:15):
do you give your team a chance more times than
not in those kind of moments, because you're usually not
going to have as many of those, you know, when
you're the best teams in the you know, in college football,
whereas in the NFL, most games are going to come
down to one score, you know, a tight game, lad
and the quarterback is going to have to play well,
you just don't know in college football. And so again,
(21:38):
you know, you can always say, well, you took this
tape and maybe that skewed a little bit, and it
might be. But again, you've got to try to pull
as many different scenarios into one breakdown of a tape
as you possibly can, because a lot of times they're
not playing that way, and Jackson Dark doesn't have to
make every throw because they're up by two touchdowns, or
(21:58):
he can take an extra time to throw the football
because his guy's opened by you know, ten yards as
opposed to a tight throw that you got to make
at the NFL level. And so you're just trying to
glean as much possible from those situations and really again
project forward some questions. Not that they don't have the
answers to those questions, not that they're not, you know,
better than what they showed on tape, but just the
(22:20):
questions that I have going in with all of these guys,
because I don't think any of them are finished product,
not even cam Mordon was a number one overall pick.
I think they all have things to work on and
they have to get better at if they want to
be great at the next level. So part of my
breakdown is to point out what those questions are for
me and the things that I'm going to be watching
for when they get under center at the NFL level.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
What do you think of his traits just just basic
quarterback one on one arm strength, athleticism, pocket movement, things
like that.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
Good enough, because again I'm not I'm not a traits guy,
you know, And maybe it's because I didn't have those
traits and was able to be really successful. I mean,
you guys know Eli Manning didn't have those trades. Nope,
was able to be really successful. There's Tom Brad Like,
there's a lot of guys, and I know the trend
is moving towards athleticism. I get that, but I still
(23:10):
believe when you watch in critical moments of games, you
have to be able to play from inside the pocket.
And it's not about traits. It's about the mental ability
to make decisions, get the ball to the right guy,
and then having good enough traits to make the throws
that you're going to be asked to make or to make,
you know, a five yard run when you have to
(23:32):
make a five yard run, like and Jackson Dart to me,
has all of you know, the skills to be good enough,
Like he's got good enough arm strength, he's got good
enough mobility, he's got all of that stuff. To me,
is good enough to be a really good quarterback in
the National Football League. So it's not anything that I'm
concerned about. You know, from a skill standpoint, you.
Speaker 1 (23:54):
Mentioned his mobility.
Speaker 3 (23:56):
The one thing I was kind of impressed by court
And we see some college quarterbacks and they get pressure,
they'll roll out, they'll run backwards. Jacksonville tends to step
up and through the pressure, which I really like. Now,
a lot of times he just runs off of that which,
by the way, if you can get ten twelve yards
on the run, that's great. But I thought his pocket
presence in that way was actually pretty good for a
young player.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, I mean, I think he does a nice shot.
You know, he's willing to run, and a lot of
people have made the comparison to a Jalen Herbs and
I actually like that comparison. You know that Jalen isn't
off the charts, you know, skill set wise. You know,
whether that's athletically or speed or arm strength. But you know,
but he's good in all of those areas. He's got
enough in all of those areas. And you know when
(24:37):
he runs, you know, very seldom is it going to
be a forty yard run. But he does a great
job of picking up eight to ten yards. He's got
a nice feel when the pocket opens up, and a
big body to be able to run through somebody if
he needs to score down in the red zone and
do those things. And I think Jackson Dart is very
similar to that. Maybe not quite as good an athlete
(24:58):
as as Jalen, but I think in the same vein
of you know, of what he brings to the table.
And so I think when you watch Jalen play, I
look at this and say, I think Jackson Dark could
be a very similar type player within that offense to
what Jalen does. You know, Jalen's a big time thrower
(25:20):
in big time moments and those things, and I want
to see that from Jackson, But just skill set wise,
those I think that's a pretty accurate comparison when we're
just talking about the physical skills of Jackson to somebody
that's playing in the NFL.
Speaker 3 (25:35):
All right, Gret, finally, now let's talk about him in
the Giants building. You're a young quarterback that had to
come in and earn his way. Nothing was given to
you or in a first round pick. So what does
this developmental process now look like for Jackson? Now that
he gets in the building, he's in meetings with Mike Kafka,
who's a former NFL quarterback, He's done it. Shae Tierney,
the quarterbacks coach Brian Dable, who knows how to develop
a quarterback.
Speaker 1 (25:55):
What does he need to focus on?
Speaker 3 (25:56):
What does he need to do in the spring of
the summer when he gets right, so then when the
season gets here, maybe he's not getting the reps to
continue develop as a quarterback to earn his way onto
the field.
Speaker 2 (26:06):
I mean, I think it's it's understanding the process that
he has to go through in those four to five seconds,
you know, when he gets the ball in his hands.
Is that again with this whole class, I don't believe
any of them are athletic enough to live in that
world and be really successful in the NFL. They are
going to have to play more traditional pocket quarterback in
(26:29):
my opinion, to be really good quarterbacks in the NFL.
And so for Jackson, that to me is the is
the step is I've got to learn. I've got to process,
I've got to talk to as many people as possible.
I've got to come up with my plan on how
to play on schedule, on time, within the structure of
the offense, because That's where I'm going to be ultra successful.
(26:52):
I don't think it's going to be in the other
areas where you know, we'll use Russell Wilson since he's
in New York. When he was playing in the stages
in Seattle, he didn't do all of the stuff I'm
talking about. He was a guy that played athletic play,
you know, like he can make, of course a throw
on time and if number ones open, he can make
that throw. But he lived very much in the world of, hey,
(27:14):
we got a good defense in a good run game,
and I'm a complimentary piece, and so my goal is
to make six or seven or eight plays a game,
you know, run around, make a throw down the field,
run around and make a run. And he was good
enough to play and live in that world in the
early stages of his career. Ben Roethlisberger another guy that
(27:36):
was able to do that early on, had the benefit
of again, good run game, good defense, so you only
had to make so many plays a game of those
special plays and it gave your team a chance to win.
I just don't think Jackson is quite that guy. So
I do believe he's going to have to play traditional football.
He's going to have to, you know, up his game
(27:57):
in terms of processing, getting the ball out or even
just show us again. I don't want to say up
his game because we talked about that earlier. Maybe it's
in there and we just didn't see it and so,
but he's going to have to play more in that vein.
So to me, that's the process, learning the offense, understanding
the nuance, understanding the reads, knowing where to get his eyes,
seeing the coverages, and understanding what his keys are so
(28:19):
he can play on time and get the ball out
of his hands and then allow the athleticism to be
a complementary piece, you know, to those other things.
Speaker 1 (28:28):
And just to follow up.
Speaker 3 (28:29):
I think it's pretty easy to do that in the
spring of the summer, right, just in terms of because
you have the reps to do it right. You're running
in your offense, you're getting practices, you're going to get
into some games in the preseason to show it on
the field. What is it like, Kurt for a quarterback
when you get to the regular season, right and Russell's
getting all of the first team snaps in practice, maybe
Jackson's running the scout team. Maybe he could do some
(28:50):
walk through with some of the practice squad guys in
the Giants offense after practice, how does he continue to
learn to do the things you're talking about when maybe
you're not getting those full speed reps again defenses like
you are on the spring in the summer, you know, and.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
It can vary by team, you know. So a lot
of it depends on how much does a team game
plan during the season. So when you get into preseason games,
you've got your base offense, and you've been running your
base offense for three or four weeks, and it's you know, normal, basic,
kind of easy concept plays, and then you get into
the season and you can't always run those plays every week. Oh,
(29:26):
this team does this, this play is not as good.
We're gonna have to add another play. We're gonna have
to do this, and and our game plan starts to
change throughout the season. And so that's part of that process,
is being able to pick up the nuances and the
different defenses that you're going to see and what are
the keys against those defenses And Okay, we're putting in
a new play. What's different about this play than the
(29:47):
base play that we're running. And so, you know, in
preseason again it's base plays offensively a lot of times
for you it's base defenses. A lot of times for
the teams that you're playing, everything ramps up and ratchet
up in regular season because now they're preparing for you.
They've watched your tape. Oh, these are their base plays.
We're going to run defenses to take away the base plays.
(30:10):
So now you've got to put in secondary or complimentary plays,
and so that's where the volume starts to add up.
You've got four or five days to do all of this.
You've got to get comfortable with the defenses you're seeing,
and so that's where it gets harder in the regular season,
especially if you don't have a lot of reps. You
don't get a lot of reps. And so for me
(30:30):
when I was when I wasn't the starter, I would
try to you know, I would try to take every
scout team rep that I could, and I would always
try to see where I could take a play from
another team's offense and somehow place it into our offensive
playbook and go, Okay, this play is very similar to
that play out, maybe not exact, but very similar. I'm
(30:53):
going to go back and read this the way I
would read that play that's in our game plan this week.
So I'm going to try to get a mental rep
and a physical rep on that play, even though I'm
running the scout team, And so that to me was
how I liked to do it. Is you know, I
had a really good vision for how plays were connected
and what I was looking at with different coverages, and
(31:13):
so I was always trying to do that. So although
not completely apples to apples, it was trying to get
those mental reps. So when I did get my opportunity,
I had somewhat seen or gone through the process besides
just standing behind the huddle and trying to mentally walk
through my you walk myself through you know, that mental
(31:35):
rep without physically seeing it and doing it, you know,
because I wasn't giving those reps. If you want to
know how to manage two minutes of crunch time football,
I'm your man. But if you're wondering about a long
term financial plan, you should talk to Citizens.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
Hey, I can also talk long care. I'd like to
learn about AMLIA routine. Yes, I knew I could help
make sense of your money with Citizens. Great answer and
curt final question.
Speaker 3 (31:58):
And I don't mean to bring back a bad memory,
but you're on the other side of this when the
Giants drafted Eli Manning. Right, you're here, You're over five
hundred of the starter. You were five and four, right,
the team was five and four. They were playing good football,
but the Giants decided to go.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
With elive midseason.
Speaker 3 (32:13):
What does this look like in that quarterback room for
a veteran quarterback like Russell Wilson, who I'm sure still
thinks he's a lot of good football left in him.
He played pretty well for the Steelers last year until
he played some really tough team at the end of
the year and they lost a few games. And know
what happens, What are you going to do? What is
this going to be like for him? And how does
he work with the young guy in this situation? And
then how does this decision get made by Brian Dable
(32:33):
when he's not seeing Jacksonville having a lot of you know,
reps and figuring out when he actually is ready. Just
kind of taking me inside of that from someone that
lived in a little bit.
Speaker 2 (32:41):
Yeah, you know, I actually know Russell, you know, quite
a bit. And actually I'm really close with Jamis as well,
and I think both those guys will be great for Jackson,
you know, in terms of their willingness to help him.
However they can help him. Now, those two guys are
two different kinds of quarterbacks. Again, Russell less of the
(33:02):
more traditional drop back, you know, read play on time
type quarterback, you know. But there's things that he's really
good at seeing and throwing and the way he throws
things that I think he can really help Jackson with
that stuff. I think Jamis is really good mentally at
processing information and reading coverages and and getting to the
right guy. And so I think combination wise, they could
(33:25):
be you know, a great combination for Jackson to help
him with the two facets of his game, you know,
in terms of coach Dave Ball and just like when
I was there, I think it becomes a variety of
different things that you're looking at in making the decisions
on playing. You know. So when I went to New York,
(33:45):
you know, the team was born twelve the year before
you know, new coach there wasn't you know, a lot
of excitement about the team and what we could be
because of everything that it transpired, and so you know,
and without a doubt, I was the better player at
that time too, but I had been there and I
have led and so when I got inserted, you know,
(34:07):
into the offense there. It wasn't anything like offenses that
I ran, and it didn't necessarily play to my strengths.
But my job was to uh get the guys to
believe in the possibilities and to find ways to win
because we weren't a great football team, and so we
were able to do that. You know, we started five
(34:28):
and two, and as you said, we were five and four.
But you know what I think, you know, came to
you know, came to pass, you know after those nine games,
was there was a couple of things that first, we
weren't a great football team. You know, even though we
were a playoff team at the time, I think everybody
that involved realized we were manufacturing wins. We weren't a
(34:52):
great football team, you know that was going to go
out and really have a chance to win a championship.
And I know, you know, giants have been there before.
You get in as a wild card and you get hot,
and it can happen. But I think that was the
first part to what they saw was Okay, we're not
a great football team. And so even if we keep
(35:12):
kind of sitting around five hundred a little bit of
better than five hundred, even sneaking to the playoffs? Is
that worth you know, not developing our young quarterbacks so
in two or three years, because we feel like we've
got some pieces, in two or three years, when we
feel like we're ready, will he be ready? And so
I think that was the first part of the process.
And I think part of a process that could happen,
(35:35):
you know, with the Giants this year is you've got
your veteran that's not your future, and you may get
to a point where you're kind of muddling around winning
some games, and does it become more advantageous to go
to the young guy? And then I think the second
part of the equation was I wasn't able to be
who I was in that offense, and I think they
(35:58):
understood that as well, and so it was a struggle
for me to do the things that I wanted to
do and the things that I was accustomed to doing,
and so, you know, they didn't want to do those
sorts of things. And there's a couple examples from that season.
He got the time. Yeah, but so we played against
Baltimore and this was after you know, Eli had taken over,
(36:21):
and you know, one of his first couple of games,
and he really struggled in the game.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
Oh, he got obliterate. I remember that game was that.
Speaker 2 (36:27):
It was a rough game for him, and so they
put me in late in the second half. You know,
in like three series, we threw for one hundred and
sixty yards and we put up two touchdowns and like
because they were playing my brand of football, but that's
not how they wanted to play. So you could see
the glimpse of that. You know. My last game that
I started was in Arizona with the Giants, and we
(36:48):
started in the no huddle, and we drove down and
scored two touchdowns right off the bat in the no huddle,
and we're up like fourteen to nothing or fourteen to
seven in that game. And then we got out of
the no huddle and we went back to doing what
we do and we lost seventeen to fourteen in that game.
And so that was a good indication for me that
I know I can still play, but they don't want
(37:08):
me to play the way that I play my best
and so I was never able to put my best
foot forward. We were not built u to play to
really my mindset and what I wanted to do. And uh,
you know, so there was a number of fumbles that
I had that year because there were times that I'm
trying to hold onto the ball and you know, get
(37:29):
guys open and make plays that I had made earlier
in my career. We just weren't built that way, and
so I think they ultimately saw that too, Like not
that Kurt's not the better quarterback, but we're just not
going to play to Kurt strength. We're not going to
play that brand of football. And so having Kurt in there, it's, yeah,
(37:50):
it's been great. We you know, we won early on
and we've got guys to believe, but he's not going
to be able to elevate us, you know, to this
other level because we're not gonna let them and were
not built that way. So all of those things I
think played into maybe it's best to just make the
move now and take our lumps, you know, the last
(38:11):
seven games of the season. You know, let Eli take
his lumps. Let's figure out who we're going to be
with Eliser quarterback, so we can come back next year
and you know and kind of hit the ground running
with knowing who our quarterback is, knowing how we want
to play and being able to put the pieces around
them to be successful. And ultimately, obviously it worked out
(38:33):
great for Eli and the Giants and what they did and.
Speaker 1 (38:36):
So and for you, by the way, you ended up
going to the Superowl in Arizona.
Speaker 2 (38:39):
Yet no, no, And yeah, I mean I was able
to do enough to parlay that into another opportunity for sure.
But I say all that to go, the Giants are
going to have to figure out who they are throughout
this season and what they're capable of, and what they're
capable of With Russell Wilson as their quarterback playing the
(38:59):
way he does, does it fit their skill set? And
you know, he's a good deep ball thrower, right, he's
a good off schedule thrower. Do they have the pieces
there to do that sort of stuff or do they
have to be more of a you know, ten yard
fifteen yard pass offense that maybe plays to Jamis or
(39:20):
even Jackson maybe a little bit better than Russell. And
so those are the questions that I think will have
to be answered, barring the fact that they don't come
out of the blocks and win seven straight and look
like world beaters. If they're kind of you know, middle
and you know, through everything. I think that's when you
have to start asking those different questions and what's the
(39:42):
best for the future, what's the best for our system,
what's the best with the pieces we have, what gives
us the best opportunity? And again, you know, I love
coach Stable and I think he does a great job.
And but you know a lot of people are talking.
You know, are they a little bit more on the
hot seat? Do they need to win? How much do
they need to win? Do they get some extra time
(40:04):
now that they have a young quarterback to be able
to play this out the way that they want to,
or do they have to force the vets a little
bit more because they have to win right now? So
I think those are factors as well. But I think
at the end of the day, it really comes down
to what do we see our future and you know,
how do I feel like we're built now? What's the
(40:26):
best way for us to have success and then possibly
get our young quarterback ready if we think, you know,
that time is coming sooner rather than later.
Speaker 3 (40:37):
So in conclusion, having any sort of discussion now about
when the best time is to slide Darta in is
pretty useless until you see how the season goes right
and how Russell plays, except for maybe putting him in
there right away, which I don't think anyone is considering
that at all.
Speaker 1 (40:51):
Joe Shane said in his first.
Speaker 3 (40:52):
Press conference after the draft for Russell's all starter, I
think that's the right way. But basically, until you see
how this plays out, knowing when the right time is
is pretty impossible.
Speaker 2 (41:00):
Huh yeah. I mean, first of all, seeing who the
quarterback is and where he's at at the time. I
mean because again, even with the Giants that year, Eli
wasn't ready to be the starter yet. You know, he
wasn't ready. But you know, again with all the other
things that were going on, they said, we have we
know he's not ready, but we're hoping that through these
seven games he can get ready. You know, we can
(41:22):
throw enough at him and he can see enough and
he can handle enough that he'll be ready, you know,
when the season. So I think all those things are factors.
But I've always believed that the easiest way to always
go is to start the veteran. It's so much easier
to start the vet and go to the young guy
than it is with any other scenario. Starting the young
guy and then having to go to the bed and
(41:42):
then trying to come back to the young guy or
just struggling through things early with the young guy, it's
always easier to go with the vet. And if things
aren't working or working the way you want them to,
or you feel that the young guy you know is
ready to some degree, then it's easy to just look
for an opportunity. Oh oh, we've lost a couple of games,
(42:02):
then it's easy to find that transition point to the
young guy. And so I think the Giants are in
a great position from that standpoint that they've got two
guys that have started a lot of football in the NFL.
They don't have to force this issue and put extra
undue pressure on Jackson Dart. They can let it play out,
and then when the pressure's at its least, that can
(42:23):
be the time that they insert in. Whether that's halfway
through the year, whether that's the end of the year,
whether that's next year where we've alleviated some of that, Hey,
come in and be the savior for this team when
there's a lot of parts that need to be need
to be fixed.
Speaker 3 (42:36):
Yeah, maybe slide them in when the Raiders as the
upcoming opponent and not the Eagles something like that. Of course.
Speaker 1 (42:41):
Yeah, you are the absolute best man, You're great. Tell
the folks obviously you.
Speaker 3 (42:45):
Can find them NFL Network, Quarterback Confidential, tell them about
YouTube page, everything you're doing that you want the fans
to know about, Kirk.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
Yeah, you know, I'm all over doing all kinds of
different things. You know, I'm a football junkie, So yeah,
qbconfidential dot Com is my teaching web site. I've created
a teaching website for quarterbacks and coaches and fans to
really get inside the quarterback position and learn in a
whole different way. So that's that website. I've got QB Confidential,
which is my YouTube page, which I'm always doing different
(43:14):
breakdowns on different things, you know, quarterbacks as you were
talking about leading into the draft, certain plays, certain things
that become trends in the NFL, which is kind of fun.
As you said, I'll be on NFL Network doing the
morning shows. I'll be doing you know, broadcasts in different ways,
some on TV, some some on radio. So yeah, just
(43:34):
kind of will be all over doing all kinds of
different things, and and always look forward to having an
interaction and talking.
Speaker 3 (43:41):
Well, absolutely, Kurt, enjoy the rest of your spring. This
is our downtime. Enjoy it with the family.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
I will do the same and look forward to the
football season start up in a few months. Thank you
very much for the top someome.
Speaker 2 (43:51):
Maybe we'll cross pass in the fall. Take care of it.
Speaker 3 (43:53):
We thank Kurt Warner for joining us right here on
the Giants Huddle podcast, brought to you by Citizens Official
Bank of the Giants. Is invaluable inside from Kurt, he
does his work, he knows his quarterbacks, and getting his
insight on Jackson Dart I think was really invaluable as
we get him in the building here and see what
he can do once his feet touch the grass here
in East Rutherford, New Jersey. Thanks to Kurt for joining us.
(44:14):
I'm John Schmulk. We'll see you next time with the
Johnsontle Podcast, brought to you by Citizens, the Official Bank
of the Giants
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Special Summer Offer: Exclusively on Apple Podcasts, try our Dateline Premium subscription completely free for one month! With Dateline Premium, you get every episode ad-free plus exclusive bonus content.
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!