March 9, 2023 • 26 mins
It's episode two of NFL Draft Preview presented by Verizon. Host Ethan Greenberg and The Athletic’s Dane Brugler start by talking about the quarterback performances at the NFL Combine (3:15), what the latest buzz is around the draft order (7:00) and how the top offensive line prospects performed (9:05). Brugler then breaks down which safeties stood out at the NFL Combine (14:35), how Ohio State WR Jaxon Smith-Njigba helped his draft status (17:30) and the possibility of the Jets selecting Pittsburgh DL Calijah Kancey with the 13th pick (22:50).
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:06):
Welcome to another episode of the Draft Preview Podcast, presented
by Verizon, Ethan Greenberg Dane Brugler. The house is now
fully furnished. If you're a new listener or you're a
new watcher, you're in luck because now you get to
see this beautiful background behind Dane. In previous years he
was building his house, the house was coming in waves.
I would say, so, now can you take us through,
(00:27):
like if you're watching, I see a couple of football
I'll see a couple of helmets. And if if you're listening,
then I just did you a favor because now I
described it for you. But can you take us through,
like the decoration process behind you before we get to
the combine. Well, after last year's draft, my goal in
May and June was to get this done, and so
(00:47):
I built it from scratched in my own plans. I
carpentry is a nice little sided hobby for me, and
so it's a nice way to fill my time to
replace the draft for a month there. But but after
I built it, as like, okay, well how do I
fill this hole? Because it's wall in a wall, it's
there's a lot of space, um, and you know I've
got a few things, my Purple Raiders helmet, Proud Amount
(01:10):
Union alum. So how to get the Purple Raiders up there?
A couple you know, football signed by Roger Staubach. Roger's
been a huge mentor in my life. Um so, definitely
want to get him represented on there. Uh, pictures of
the family of course, right, I got to get the
four kiddos on there. And then yeah, you know what
little books I have just a you know. Uh so
(01:32):
it looks like I'm I'm a reader, so at least
I can, you know, say I own some books. But yeah,
I think that's it. It'll continue to fill out as
we as we keep going. You have a favorite book,
uh right, I mean it has to be, you know, Honestly,
I think it's probably the John Wooden book where it's
just front to back, just full of insight, and it's
(01:53):
it's one of the few books where actually, you know,
take a highlighter to it and say, oh I really
like this or no, I need a you know. And
so if one book stands out that I've taken more
away from, it's definitely that Jung Wooden book. I also
see a plant behind you, a little greenery and you
know my wife, you know, because I stole it from
(02:14):
I stole it from our bedroom, and you know, she
wants it back up there, but I told her it
looks better down here. So okay, all right, um, well
it looks great. We'll put it that. Thank you. We're
off to a great start here. The draft season is
officially underway. It's always underway for you, but it feels
like this is the train stop in terms of the
(02:34):
Columbine where everyone's getting on board, because it's like a
tent pole event that's pretty nationally televised if you didn't
know already. And of course storylines heading into the week,
we're about Bryce Young. He I believe he took the
under of two hundred. He waited in at two oh four, right,
that was a surprise to you. And really what I
want to do is talk about the quarterbacks first, because
(02:57):
while the Jets are in the veteran terback market, the
rookies or the soon to be rookies as in Bryce Young, CJ. Shroud,
Will Levis, Anthony Richardson, seems like Anthony Richardson really stole
the show definitely from a testing perspective in terms of
the numbers, but after this week of the of the
Combine in Indianapolis, how do you rank these guys and
(03:20):
what type of performance did Richardson have to you? Well,
you know, the Richardson performance was expected. I mean, he's
a freak show, total freak show. We knew that coming
into the season, so it wasn't a surprise, but there
is something special about seeing it with your own two
eyes on the field, the way this two hundred and
(03:40):
forty four pound athlete can move out there, that type
of speed, and not just the I mean he had
the best vertical jump we've ever seen from a quarterback
at forty and a half, the four four four forty
yard dash which is remark or four four three forty
yard dash, which is remarkable for a two hundred and
forty four pounder. But also you know his positional stuff,
the way the ball explodes off his hand. Again, we
(04:02):
see that on tape, so it wasn't a huge surprise,
but it is It is something special about seeing it
up close and personal like that. You know you mentioned
brays Young. We did not see him work out, and
you can understand why when you know this. You're talking
about the physical traits of will Levis and you know,
a guy like Anthony Richardson brays Young would have looked
(04:23):
pretty small compared to those two guys throwing one after
the other in Indianapolis. I was a little surprised he
got over two hundred pounds. I took the under I said,
we're on one nine eight. It doesn't really matter because
he plays at around one five, one ninety and every
team knows that. But for the rest of his life,
on the back of his football card, it'll say two
(04:45):
hundred pounds. So I understand why he decided, you know, hey,
I need to play the game a little bit get
over two hundred pounds. But you could probably bet he
probably won't weigh at his pro day when he actually
does run and does some of the testing. But I'll
tell you what. The guy you know that we haven't
mentioned yet, and the guy who was most impressive to
me was CJ. Stroud from Ohio State his And it
(05:05):
not of surprise when you know, after you study his
tape and you see how surgical he is from the pocket,
how accurate he is, it's all very natural for him.
It was not a surprise to see him go out
there and put on a show in Indianapolis, very pinpoint.
The timing was outstanding, the pacing, his ability to touch
up throws, we saw it all over the Ohio State tape.
(05:28):
But for him to go to Indianapolis and do it
with receivers he's ever thrown too in a high pressure situation.
That when I left Lucas Oil Stadium Saturday night, that
was the lasting impact for me was CJ. Stroud and
how impressive he was with the accuracy. But again that
that was THEMO coming in, so not a huge surprise,
but I still thought he helped himself. And not to
(05:51):
give a lot of way, but CJ. Strout is your
number one overall pick, right, So it feels like that's
kind of the anomaly in the mock draft right now.
Feels like you see predominantly Bryce Young. You've seen Anthony
Richardson start to creep up there after the testing in Indianapolis.
And if you're a Jets fan listening to this, you're
probably like, why are you guys talking about the quarterbacks
(06:13):
after you just said that the Jets are in the
veteran market. Well, if there are four quarterbacks, and you know,
everyone sees the order of the four differently, and there
are quarterback needy teams closer to thirteen, just using the
Panthers as an example at nine, that could only push
down players at other positions that the Jets might try
to add down closer to thirteen. So while the quarterback
(06:36):
is not a need for the Jets in terms of
the rookie class that's about to enter the NFL, it's
still definitely a story to watch, right because because of
what I just said that the other players like offensive
tackle very popular pick. Well, if a team goes quarterback,
then you're looking at one of the guys that might
have been drafted earlier, like Peter Scronsky, might be in
(06:59):
fact available closer to thirteen than mock drafts have right now,
and we're gonna see plenty of movement. So you know,
mock drafts right now are a really useful exercise, but
it's all gonna get shaken up when teams start to
move around, especially with the Bears sitting there at number one.
They've been pretty clear they planned to trade out and
take the best offer available, and we don't know who
(07:22):
which team that's gonna be, what's the offer gonna be,
So there's plenty of intrigue with that number one pick,
it's likely going to be a quarterback. We just don't
know which quarterback in which team, and then where does
the quarterback picking order go from there? You know we're
going to see plenty of trades in that top ten.
And if the over under is, say three quarterbacks in
(07:43):
the top ten, I think you have to take the
over with these guys. And you know, I had four
quarterbacks in my top seven in my mock draft up
on the Athletics. That's never had before. So you know,
with these four guys, there's plenty of team, there's plenty
of needs, and now it's gonna be okay, which teams
decide to go that route to top ten without looking
(08:04):
through the same lens as you, let's say, because obviously
your encyclopedia is a lot bigger than the average draft fans.
This starts to feel like it's a little bit like
twenty eighteen Baker Mayfield number one, Sam Darnold to the
Jets at number three. The Jets traded up to number
three with the Colts from six to three. Josh Allen,
Josh Rosen, Lamar Jackson, Like if beauty is in the
eye of the beholder, with the quarterback, and it feels
(08:26):
like it's going to be the same case for the
twenty twenty three draft. But for the Jets at thirteen
and even beyond thirteen, when you look at the combine
as a whole. Right now, the most popular pick position
wise is offensive tackle to the Jets. Now, whether that
is Paris Johnson, who, by the way, had no idea
he started a charity until recently when he was in
high school. Just an incredible human being, it seems like,
(08:47):
and Broderick Jones, super athletic. So those are the two
most popular picks. But even beyond that, did any of
those guys help themselves any of the top tackle prospects
or even offensive line prospects who are versatile pieces that
the Jets could add on a later round. Yeah, and
Broderick Jones, that's who I had the Jets taken in
my mock. Had the best forty yard dash of any
(09:10):
offensive line at the combine, which you know you always
like to see. I don't know that you know, it
really matters all that much. You don't see your offensive
lineman running forty yards all that often, but you know
he still had had a good ten yards split. He
goes right out. I think one seven four, which is
a good time for him. His athleticism was on full display,
and I really I thought all the top offensive lineman
(09:31):
did well, Peter Scronsky, Paris Johnson, Anton Harrison from Oklahoma.
I think everyone performed up to expectations. I thought syracuses
Matthew Bergeron looked really, really smooth, which is to be expected.
He's got good tape as a left tackle. Some teams
have him on the board as a guard. You know,
plug him in as a zone blocking guard and you
(09:51):
have a guy that's going to start from day one.
Other teams believe that he is a left tackle, so
Matthew Bergeron helped himself. I think he's in that second
round range, maybe somebody that the Jets could take a
look at. I think the freakiest offensive lineman was Blake
Freeland from BYU. The numbers he put up and not
a surprise. He was the Gatorade Utah Track Athlete of
(10:13):
the Year as a senior in high school. As a
sophomore in high school, he was a six seven hundred
ninety pound quarterback and then he moved a defensive end.
He didn't play offensive line until he got the b YU.
They really developed his body and got him in a
position to be on the NFL's doorstep like this, so
now needs struggles with power plays a little high. There's
(10:35):
plenty of areas where he needs to get better, but
you know, you don't. It's hard to teach that length,
hard to teach at athleticism, and so we'll see Blake
Freeland somewhere in those middle rounds could be a developmental
option for a team with the Jets. One of my
favorite stories of the combine was Andrew Vorhees, the USC
offensive lineman, ripping his knee up, unfortunately tearing his ACL
(10:58):
and then putting up thirty eight bench press reps with
a brace on and literally crutching himself to the bench.
I mean, that's that's gonna be the first time that
you've seen that, right, I mean, off top of my head,
you don't remember that happening, but I mean, I guess
it makes sense. So obviously your your bench Pressu're talking
about your upper body. And uh, Voorhees was a guy
(11:20):
that is known for that. I mean, he is a
workout warrior. Uh he loves the push iron in the
weight room, so coming in he was the favorite to
lift the most, and I think there was he knew that.
You know, there was a certain amount of pride that
you know, I have to go in there. People are
saying I'm gonna show out and I need to live
up to that. So, you know, kudos to him. You
(11:41):
hate it for for the player. Um, you know it's uh.
He dealt with injuries throughout his time at USC UH
went back, played through pain. Now it's another injury. But
you know, if anybody's gonna make it through, it's it's
it's a guy like this who's got his mentality, his toughness,
his work ethic. So you know, well, we'll see how
that affects my draft weekend. But I have a good
(12:03):
feeling we have not heard the last of all pies.
Where was he in your mind as like a player
based on tape, a loan, no injuries, Like what is
his tape grade in terms of around? I mean, because
of all things considered before the ACL injury, probably in
the fourth, you know, maybe there was a team. I
know some teams thought even the third was possible for him.
(12:25):
Now you know, you're probably obviously we'll have to see
how the medical rechecks go hopefully, you know, those are
in mid April. Hopefully that's enough time for doctors have
a good idea of how the knee is healing and
what the prognosis long term looks like. And as long
as everything's on schedule, he should still hear his name
drafted at some point on Day three. But yeah, he's
(12:46):
a He's gonna be a quality depth piece for a team.
So this is very much an interesting time of the year.
We are recording mark eighth. Free agency is right around
the corner. It's kind of like the combine is weird
jostling for gems because half of it is towards draft
eligible players. The other half of it is getting yourself
ready for a free agency So right now as we
(13:08):
stand here, the Jets rosters are gonna change within you know,
a week, within days, So I know this is gonna
be difficult to do. I just want to talk about
a couple other positions as well. And the reason why
tackle is so fascinating for the Jets. Let's even assume
they don't sign one in free agency, because the Jets
don't have the same kind of money that they've had
in prior years. So right now, it was reported that
(13:29):
Dwayne Brown will return for the twenty twenty three season,
McKay Beckton coming back from injury as well. He's played
like forty snaps in the past two seasons combined. So
let's say the Jet the Jets in your mock draft
ad Broderick Jones. That makes sense, right, but there's a
scenario where he doesn't really see the field in year
one because of guys like Dwayne Brown and McKay Beckton.
(13:51):
So now other positions that the Jets could look to add,
whether that is probably on draft weekend, maybe in free agency.
Let's go over a couple of them and view them
and through the lens of the draft, and guys that
play or performed well in Indianapolis, and let's say has
a improved stock. So one position I go to is safety.
(14:14):
The Jets have Jordan Whitehead. The Jets are without LaMarcus
Joiner because he has an expiring contract. He could come back,
but that's two straight seasons where his season has ended
an injury. The Jets also have Tony Adams, undrafted free
agent out of Illinois last year. The Jets like what
they have in Adams, but if they wanted to add
a player at that position. We've talked about Brian Branch
(14:38):
before at thirteen, but what about elsewhere in the draft. Yeah,
if they decided to wait till, say, you know, the
third round, fourth round. Kwan Martin. Actually, you know, let's
talk about both Illinois safeties because I think both could
be in play. And we're talking about Kwon Martin and
Sydney Brown. Quan also known as Jartavious. Martin's a He's
(14:59):
a big time athlet and he's a guy that has
played corner, has played Nicol, has played more of a
single high safety role. He has range, he has ball skills.
You know, he's that Illinois pipeline in the secondary. He's
been pumping these guys out. And Devin Witherspoon's gonna be
a first round pick. But don't overlook these two safeties.
Kawan Martin I think brings some versatility to the back end.
(15:21):
He tested really well. He was at four four six
forty yard dash, had the best vertical jump at forty
four inches, which is just ridiculous, eleven one in the
broad jump. And then Sydney Brown, He's I would argue
that few senior prospects helped themselves more from last year
to this year than Sidney Brown. He had six interceptions
(15:42):
this year for Illinois. You know, the ball just found
him and he did a really nice job being around
the ball to put himself in those positions. And then
he goes to the Senior Bowl and has a great week.
Then he goes to the Combine. A great week for
a guy that came in at five ten two hundred
eleven pounds. He ran four four seven in the forty
yard dash forty and a half inch for ten ten
(16:04):
broad also put up one of the better bench press numbers.
I'm one of the safeties with twenty three reps of
two twenty five. So this is a guy that is
always around the football. He's gonna be a core special
team at the moment he shows up the camp. You know,
both these guys from Illinois are in that third fourth
round range. Who you know just you have a good
(16:24):
feeling about them as football players. So I think of
the Jets pass on those on that position in the
first round. There's some options there. Even though I don't
I don't I wouldn't say safety is a deep position
this year. There are definitely some intriguing guys in the
top four rounds. Okay, So we could talk about the
klemine for a long time and how it impacts the Jets.
(16:45):
One guy and that comes to mind. We had talked
about him last week. Is Jackson Smith and Jig Bob.
How do you think he performed? What did he show you?
And you know, is this arrow up for him? Also
with that being said, another reason why I bring it
up is because the Jets in the past have used
premium picks at wide receiver. I'm not saying the Jets
(17:07):
are gonna do that again, but let's just say, you know,
the Jets don't go tackle. I do think receiver could
be in the mix. Because right now you're looking at
Garrett Wilson. Corey Davis will have to see the status
of him. He's making a lot of money. He's also
under contract for this year but not next year. And
then Elijah Moore as well, so the Jets and Denzel
Mim So the Jets have a couple unproven guys. If
(17:27):
they were to add a player at thirteen that wasn't
a tackle, I do think receiver could be in that mix.
I mean Jackson Smith and Jiggle was awesome. I mean C. J.
Stroud and Jackson, Smith and Jigba. Those are the two
players on Saturday, Day three of the combine where I
just left and was like, wow, those those workouts were fantastic.
And Smith and Jiggle is obviously a guy we haven't
(17:50):
really seen in a year. You know, the last time
he was healthy, he was really that Rose Bowl performance
against Utah where oh, he said, an NCAA record in
a bowl game receiving yards. I mean, he was fantastic.
So and you know, you ask Garrett Wilson, he'll he'll
tell you straight up that, uh you know, he was
Smith and Jigba is the better receiver of the two
or of the three if you include a Lovy in
(18:11):
that discussion as well. Uh. And he had a front
row seat for for Smith and Jigba the last few years. So, uh,
you know, there's a reason he didn't run the forty.
I mean he said he you know, didn't feel ready yet.
But I mean he did all the other drills his forties.
Not it's just not in a spot where he feels
comfortable putting out that four or five four number or whatever,
and it's gonna end up being he's not a burner.
(18:32):
That's that's not the what he does best as a receiver.
He's so polished as a route runner, and then his
short shuttle and his three cone that short area agility
that was outstanding. That I mean, he was elite with
those two numbers at the combine. So Jackson Smith and
Jigba not gonna blow you away with the speed, average size,
(18:53):
but ball skills and route running. That's why he's going
to be a He has has the lore of a
really good NFL player, and I think you plug him
in the slot and he's ready to go from day one.
So that's why for a team looking for that type
of profile, they're gonna look at Smith and Jigba somewhere
in the top twenty five and say he makes our
(19:14):
offense better. So he might not be for everybody, but
for that role, Smith and Jigba is a good player.
So I'm glad you brought up the slot aspect because
to me, you look at Garrett Wilson. Garrett Wilson's very
talented and obviously so he's an offensive rookie of the Year.
He played outside, he played a little inside. He's listed
on the Jets website six zero one ninety two. Smith
(19:36):
and Jigba weigh he's in at six ninety six. What
is it about Jsn's game that people lend it's to say,
you know what, he's the slot receiver, and yet his
heightweight metrics are about the same, if not a little heavier,
a little taller. Think Garrett Wilson, who plays on the
outside and the slot. Well, I mean part of it
(19:56):
is that's what he did in Ohio State, and so
that's that's what his specialty was, was working in the
middle of the field, really leaning on those mismatches and
getting open. So that's what he's a role he played
out Ohio said, and I'm not saying he can't play outside.
You know, it's kind of like, Okay, say Zach Martin
left tackle for the Cowboy or a guard for the Cowboys.
(20:18):
He was a left tackle and at Notre Dame. Could
he kick out and play left tackle for the Cowboys
tomorrow and do just fine? Yeah he could, But I
think his ceiling is the highest inside of guard. He's
on a Hall of Fame trajectory. Smith and Jigbo. If
you wanted to play him outside, he could do that.
You know, I'm not saying he can't because I think
that a lot of what he does will can translate
on the outside, but to maximize what he does best,
(20:40):
and that's beating coverage because of his routes. How sudden
he is in the underneath game finding those soft spots
and then being a catch and run target that really
lends itself to being maximizing that talent inside. So you
know it just these two guys have do two different
skill sets with what they offer. Between Garrett Wilson and
(21:01):
Jaya said, two really good players who compliment each other
really well. And hey, it'd be fun to team these
guys back up again in the NFL. Yeah, it's gonna
be interesting to see what happens with the Jets and
free agency. Obviously that will kind of crystallize the picture
for the draft as we get closer, and you know,
things change between now in April twenty eighth or twenty ninth,
(21:22):
whatever the Thursday is. So one more question for you,
because we could talk about the combine forever, I can
talk about the Jets forever. I want to talk about
a player that probably draws unfair comparisons to I'd say
the Naked Eye, and we're going to the defensive side
of the ball because Sheldon Rankins, the defensive tackle for
the Jets, is an unrestricted free agent or scheduled to be.
(21:43):
And the guy I want to talk about is Collijah Cancy.
I say that right, you got it, man, That is
a tongue twister. Colijah Cancy, one's a c in Collijah
on'es a k in Cancy anyway. So the reason why
I think he draws unfair comparisons because he's an undersized
Pitt Panther. There happens to be a future Hall of
Famer who plays for the La Rams at the same
(22:05):
position who is an undersized Pitt panther or was at
one point in time. And not to mention Aaron Donald,
the guy were talking about as the future Hall of
Famer was the thirteenth pick in the draft. Could Collijah Cancy,
if the Jets went in that direction, be worthy of
the thirteenth overall pick because a couple of things. One,
you know, the Jets want to add to the defensive
(22:27):
line every chance they can. The interior depth outside of
Quinnon Williams isn't quite there right now. Nathan Shepard's supposed
to be free agent, Shelton Rankin's supposed to be a
free agent, so a guy like Cancy makes sense. And
then twofold here Jalen Carter. Hours after we recorded the
episode last week, the news comes out that there's a
legal process that needs to play out. Obviously we don't
(22:49):
know what that result is going to be. But have
you heard anything about Carter and how this might impact
his draft status even if everything is cleared. So with Cancy, obviously,
I think you know your spot on those comparisons, they're
gonna be there. And for a guy that was six one,
two eighty one at the combine to go out there
(23:09):
and run in the four six is pretty impressive. That
guy can move. Now, I think the biggest question with
Cancy will be the lack of length thirty and five
eight since arms, which is well below average. Aaron Donald
had longer arms than that, and so he's had a
length disadvantage right off the bat, no matter whatever blocker
he's going up against in the NFL. And how will that,
(23:32):
you know, how will we be able to combat that?
You know, the tape is great, you throw on the
tape violent he's so quick with his hands, he understands
how to free himself from blocks. He doesn't get caved
in very often. You know, he there's just a lot
to like about the way he moves, the violence that
he plays with, and then it just overall ability to
be disruptive. Now, translating that to the NFL is easier
(23:54):
said than done. But I think that teams are optimistic
he can do that even with the shorter arms. I
think Cancy does go somewhere in the first round. Uh
could he go as high as their team? You don't
rule it out because you you throw on the tape,
you know you don't like the arm length number, but
then you throw on the tape and you're quickly reminded, Okay, yeah,
this guy he could maybe give us that interior rush
(24:15):
presence that we've been looking for. With Jalen Carter, it's
obviously a complicated evaluation. Um, you know, just talking to
scouts that were you know, went through Athens the last
two years, it wasn't I don't the term character concerns
is it's a little too strong. Uh That's what scouts
(24:35):
said now is was Jalen Carter a little immature? Did he?
You know? Did Kirby Smart have to ride him a
little bit to get the most out of him. Yeah,
but that's that I think that is with most nineteen
twenty twenty one year olds, as you know, they have
all this talent and it's up to the coaches to
get the most out of them. And so does he
need to learn how to be a professional? Yes, no doubt. Now,
(24:56):
the news that came out last week, that was that
the team we're inspecting expecting that that was new and
so the silver lining is this is not the Lamide
tunsil gas mask situation where that happened day of the
draft and teams are scrambling, Okay, what do we know?
What do our reports say? Let's make calls, let's try
(25:17):
to figure this out. As he would fall down the
draft board. We have fifty days for teams to exhaust
every resource they have to find out more about Jalen Carter.
You know, is this going to be a guy that
brings trouble with him as soon as he's drafted or
is just this an isolated incident where he made a
youthful mistake. It's not likely that it's going to continue.
(25:41):
It's a one time thing. Teams have to be comfortable
with that because Jalen Carter is a tremendous talent. But
to invest a top five, top ten pick into a
player like this, you better be convinced of the not
just the player, but the person you're bringing into your
building and into the community. So a lot of work
is going to be done on jailing Carter between now
(26:02):
and that last weekend in April, and so at the
end of the day, you know, each team might look
at it a little bit differently. Each team has a
different appetite for risk. So the jailing Carter situation is ongoing.
We you know, don't know enough just yet, but this
it's a situation that we'll keep close tabs on as
we get closer to the draft. A lot of domino
still need to fall between now and late April when
(26:24):
the draft occurs. Of course, the first domino seems to
be around the corner with free agencies. So that's all
we have for this episode of NFL Draft Preview, presented
by Horizon Dane. Thanks a lot, we'll talk to you
next week. Thanks Athan,
Welcome to another episode of the Draft Preview Podcast, presented
by Verizon, Ethan Greenberg Dane Brugler. The house is now
fully furnished. If you're a new listener or you're a
new watcher, you're in luck because now you get to
see this beautiful background behind Dane. In previous years he
was building his house, the house was coming in waves.
I would say, so, now can you take us through,
(00:27):
like if you're watching, I see a couple of football
I'll see a couple of helmets. And if if you're listening,
then I just did you a favor because now I
described it for you. But can you take us through,
like the decoration process behind you before we get to
the combine. Well, after last year's draft, my goal in
May and June was to get this done, and so
(00:47):
I built it from scratched in my own plans. I
carpentry is a nice little sided hobby for me, and
so it's a nice way to fill my time to
replace the draft for a month there. But but after
I built it, as like, okay, well how do I
fill this hole? Because it's wall in a wall, it's
there's a lot of space, um, and you know I've
got a few things, my Purple Raiders helmet, Proud Amount
(01:10):
Union alum. So how to get the Purple Raiders up there?
A couple you know, football signed by Roger Staubach. Roger's
been a huge mentor in my life. Um so, definitely
want to get him represented on there. Uh, pictures of
the family of course, right, I got to get the
four kiddos on there. And then yeah, you know what
little books I have just a you know. Uh so
(01:32):
it looks like I'm I'm a reader, so at least
I can, you know, say I own some books. But yeah,
I think that's it. It'll continue to fill out as
we as we keep going. You have a favorite book,
uh right, I mean it has to be, you know, Honestly,
I think it's probably the John Wooden book where it's
just front to back, just full of insight, and it's
(01:53):
it's one of the few books where actually, you know,
take a highlighter to it and say, oh I really
like this or no, I need a you know. And
so if one book stands out that I've taken more
away from, it's definitely that Jung Wooden book. I also
see a plant behind you, a little greenery and you
know my wife, you know, because I stole it from
(02:14):
I stole it from our bedroom, and you know, she
wants it back up there, but I told her it
looks better down here. So okay, all right, um, well
it looks great. We'll put it that. Thank you. We're
off to a great start here. The draft season is
officially underway. It's always underway for you, but it feels
like this is the train stop in terms of the
(02:34):
Columbine where everyone's getting on board, because it's like a
tent pole event that's pretty nationally televised if you didn't
know already. And of course storylines heading into the week,
we're about Bryce Young. He I believe he took the
under of two hundred. He waited in at two oh four, right,
that was a surprise to you. And really what I
want to do is talk about the quarterbacks first, because
(02:57):
while the Jets are in the veteran terback market, the
rookies or the soon to be rookies as in Bryce Young, CJ. Shroud,
Will Levis, Anthony Richardson, seems like Anthony Richardson really stole
the show definitely from a testing perspective in terms of
the numbers, but after this week of the of the
Combine in Indianapolis, how do you rank these guys and
(03:20):
what type of performance did Richardson have to you? Well,
you know, the Richardson performance was expected. I mean, he's
a freak show, total freak show. We knew that coming
into the season, so it wasn't a surprise, but there
is something special about seeing it with your own two
eyes on the field, the way this two hundred and
(03:40):
forty four pound athlete can move out there, that type
of speed, and not just the I mean he had
the best vertical jump we've ever seen from a quarterback
at forty and a half, the four four four forty
yard dash which is remark or four four three forty
yard dash, which is remarkable for a two hundred and
forty four pounder. But also you know his positional stuff,
the way the ball explodes off his hand. Again, we
(04:02):
see that on tape, so it wasn't a huge surprise,
but it is It is something special about seeing it
up close and personal like that. You know you mentioned
brays Young. We did not see him work out, and
you can understand why when you know this. You're talking
about the physical traits of will Levis and you know,
a guy like Anthony Richardson brays Young would have looked
(04:23):
pretty small compared to those two guys throwing one after
the other in Indianapolis. I was a little surprised he
got over two hundred pounds. I took the under I said,
we're on one nine eight. It doesn't really matter because
he plays at around one five, one ninety and every
team knows that. But for the rest of his life,
on the back of his football card, it'll say two
(04:45):
hundred pounds. So I understand why he decided, you know, hey,
I need to play the game a little bit get
over two hundred pounds. But you could probably bet he
probably won't weigh at his pro day when he actually
does run and does some of the testing. But I'll
tell you what. The guy you know that we haven't
mentioned yet, and the guy who was most impressive to
me was CJ. Stroud from Ohio State his And it
(05:05):
not of surprise when you know, after you study his
tape and you see how surgical he is from the pocket,
how accurate he is, it's all very natural for him.
It was not a surprise to see him go out
there and put on a show in Indianapolis, very pinpoint.
The timing was outstanding, the pacing, his ability to touch
up throws, we saw it all over the Ohio State tape.
(05:28):
But for him to go to Indianapolis and do it
with receivers he's ever thrown too in a high pressure situation.
That when I left Lucas Oil Stadium Saturday night, that
was the lasting impact for me was CJ. Stroud and
how impressive he was with the accuracy. But again that
that was THEMO coming in, so not a huge surprise,
but I still thought he helped himself. And not to
(05:51):
give a lot of way, but CJ. Strout is your
number one overall pick, right, So it feels like that's
kind of the anomaly in the mock draft right now.
Feels like you see predominantly Bryce Young. You've seen Anthony
Richardson start to creep up there after the testing in Indianapolis.
And if you're a Jets fan listening to this, you're
probably like, why are you guys talking about the quarterbacks
(06:13):
after you just said that the Jets are in the
veteran market. Well, if there are four quarterbacks, and you know,
everyone sees the order of the four differently, and there
are quarterback needy teams closer to thirteen, just using the
Panthers as an example at nine, that could only push
down players at other positions that the Jets might try
to add down closer to thirteen. So while the quarterback
(06:36):
is not a need for the Jets in terms of
the rookie class that's about to enter the NFL, it's
still definitely a story to watch, right because because of
what I just said that the other players like offensive
tackle very popular pick. Well, if a team goes quarterback,
then you're looking at one of the guys that might
have been drafted earlier, like Peter Scronsky, might be in
(06:59):
fact available closer to thirteen than mock drafts have right now,
and we're gonna see plenty of movement. So you know,
mock drafts right now are a really useful exercise, but
it's all gonna get shaken up when teams start to
move around, especially with the Bears sitting there at number one.
They've been pretty clear they planned to trade out and
take the best offer available, and we don't know who
(07:22):
which team that's gonna be, what's the offer gonna be,
So there's plenty of intrigue with that number one pick,
it's likely going to be a quarterback. We just don't
know which quarterback in which team, and then where does
the quarterback picking order go from there? You know we're
going to see plenty of trades in that top ten.
And if the over under is, say three quarterbacks in
(07:43):
the top ten, I think you have to take the
over with these guys. And you know, I had four
quarterbacks in my top seven in my mock draft up
on the Athletics. That's never had before. So you know,
with these four guys, there's plenty of team, there's plenty
of needs, and now it's gonna be okay, which teams
decide to go that route to top ten without looking
(08:04):
through the same lens as you, let's say, because obviously
your encyclopedia is a lot bigger than the average draft fans.
This starts to feel like it's a little bit like
twenty eighteen Baker Mayfield number one, Sam Darnold to the
Jets at number three. The Jets traded up to number
three with the Colts from six to three. Josh Allen,
Josh Rosen, Lamar Jackson, Like if beauty is in the
eye of the beholder, with the quarterback, and it feels
(08:26):
like it's going to be the same case for the
twenty twenty three draft. But for the Jets at thirteen
and even beyond thirteen, when you look at the combine
as a whole. Right now, the most popular pick position
wise is offensive tackle to the Jets. Now, whether that
is Paris Johnson, who, by the way, had no idea
he started a charity until recently when he was in
high school. Just an incredible human being, it seems like,
(08:47):
and Broderick Jones, super athletic. So those are the two
most popular picks. But even beyond that, did any of
those guys help themselves any of the top tackle prospects
or even offensive line prospects who are versatile pieces that
the Jets could add on a later round. Yeah, and
Broderick Jones, that's who I had the Jets taken in
my mock. Had the best forty yard dash of any
(09:10):
offensive line at the combine, which you know you always
like to see. I don't know that you know, it
really matters all that much. You don't see your offensive
lineman running forty yards all that often, but you know
he still had had a good ten yards split. He
goes right out. I think one seven four, which is
a good time for him. His athleticism was on full display,
and I really I thought all the top offensive lineman
(09:31):
did well, Peter Scronsky, Paris Johnson, Anton Harrison from Oklahoma.
I think everyone performed up to expectations. I thought syracuses
Matthew Bergeron looked really, really smooth, which is to be expected.
He's got good tape as a left tackle. Some teams
have him on the board as a guard. You know,
plug him in as a zone blocking guard and you
(09:51):
have a guy that's going to start from day one.
Other teams believe that he is a left tackle, so
Matthew Bergeron helped himself. I think he's in that second
round range, maybe somebody that the Jets could take a
look at. I think the freakiest offensive lineman was Blake
Freeland from BYU. The numbers he put up and not
a surprise. He was the Gatorade Utah Track Athlete of
(10:13):
the Year as a senior in high school. As a
sophomore in high school, he was a six seven hundred
ninety pound quarterback and then he moved a defensive end.
He didn't play offensive line until he got the b YU.
They really developed his body and got him in a
position to be on the NFL's doorstep like this, so
now needs struggles with power plays a little high. There's
(10:35):
plenty of areas where he needs to get better, but
you know, you don't. It's hard to teach that length,
hard to teach at athleticism, and so we'll see Blake
Freeland somewhere in those middle rounds could be a developmental
option for a team with the Jets. One of my
favorite stories of the combine was Andrew Vorhees, the USC
offensive lineman, ripping his knee up, unfortunately tearing his ACL
(10:58):
and then putting up thirty eight bench press reps with
a brace on and literally crutching himself to the bench.
I mean, that's that's gonna be the first time that
you've seen that, right, I mean, off top of my head,
you don't remember that happening, but I mean, I guess
it makes sense. So obviously your your bench Pressu're talking
about your upper body. And uh, Voorhees was a guy
(11:20):
that is known for that. I mean, he is a
workout warrior. Uh he loves the push iron in the
weight room, so coming in he was the favorite to
lift the most, and I think there was he knew that.
You know, there was a certain amount of pride that
you know, I have to go in there. People are
saying I'm gonna show out and I need to live
up to that. So, you know, kudos to him. You
(11:41):
hate it for for the player. Um, you know it's uh.
He dealt with injuries throughout his time at USC UH
went back, played through pain. Now it's another injury. But
you know, if anybody's gonna make it through, it's it's
it's a guy like this who's got his mentality, his toughness,
his work ethic. So you know, well, we'll see how
that affects my draft weekend. But I have a good
(12:03):
feeling we have not heard the last of all pies.
Where was he in your mind as like a player
based on tape, a loan, no injuries, Like what is
his tape grade in terms of around? I mean, because
of all things considered before the ACL injury, probably in
the fourth, you know, maybe there was a team. I
know some teams thought even the third was possible for him.
(12:25):
Now you know, you're probably obviously we'll have to see
how the medical rechecks go hopefully, you know, those are
in mid April. Hopefully that's enough time for doctors have
a good idea of how the knee is healing and
what the prognosis long term looks like. And as long
as everything's on schedule, he should still hear his name
drafted at some point on Day three. But yeah, he's
(12:46):
a He's gonna be a quality depth piece for a team.
So this is very much an interesting time of the year.
We are recording mark eighth. Free agency is right around
the corner. It's kind of like the combine is weird
jostling for gems because half of it is towards draft
eligible players. The other half of it is getting yourself
ready for a free agency So right now as we
(13:08):
stand here, the Jets rosters are gonna change within you know,
a week, within days, So I know this is gonna
be difficult to do. I just want to talk about
a couple other positions as well. And the reason why
tackle is so fascinating for the Jets. Let's even assume
they don't sign one in free agency, because the Jets
don't have the same kind of money that they've had
in prior years. So right now, it was reported that
(13:29):
Dwayne Brown will return for the twenty twenty three season,
McKay Beckton coming back from injury as well. He's played
like forty snaps in the past two seasons combined. So
let's say the Jet the Jets in your mock draft
ad Broderick Jones. That makes sense, right, but there's a
scenario where he doesn't really see the field in year
one because of guys like Dwayne Brown and McKay Beckton.
(13:51):
So now other positions that the Jets could look to add,
whether that is probably on draft weekend, maybe in free agency.
Let's go over a couple of them and view them
and through the lens of the draft, and guys that
play or performed well in Indianapolis, and let's say has
a improved stock. So one position I go to is safety.
(14:14):
The Jets have Jordan Whitehead. The Jets are without LaMarcus
Joiner because he has an expiring contract. He could come back,
but that's two straight seasons where his season has ended
an injury. The Jets also have Tony Adams, undrafted free
agent out of Illinois last year. The Jets like what
they have in Adams, but if they wanted to add
a player at that position. We've talked about Brian Branch
(14:38):
before at thirteen, but what about elsewhere in the draft. Yeah,
if they decided to wait till, say, you know, the
third round, fourth round. Kwan Martin. Actually, you know, let's
talk about both Illinois safeties because I think both could
be in play. And we're talking about Kwon Martin and
Sydney Brown. Quan also known as Jartavious. Martin's a He's
(14:59):
a big time athlet and he's a guy that has
played corner, has played Nicol, has played more of a
single high safety role. He has range, he has ball skills.
You know, he's that Illinois pipeline in the secondary. He's
been pumping these guys out. And Devin Witherspoon's gonna be
a first round pick. But don't overlook these two safeties.
Kawan Martin I think brings some versatility to the back end.
(15:21):
He tested really well. He was at four four six
forty yard dash, had the best vertical jump at forty
four inches, which is just ridiculous, eleven one in the
broad jump. And then Sydney Brown, He's I would argue
that few senior prospects helped themselves more from last year
to this year than Sidney Brown. He had six interceptions
(15:42):
this year for Illinois. You know, the ball just found
him and he did a really nice job being around
the ball to put himself in those positions. And then
he goes to the Senior Bowl and has a great week.
Then he goes to the Combine. A great week for
a guy that came in at five ten two hundred
eleven pounds. He ran four four seven in the forty
yard dash forty and a half inch for ten ten
(16:04):
broad also put up one of the better bench press numbers.
I'm one of the safeties with twenty three reps of
two twenty five. So this is a guy that is
always around the football. He's gonna be a core special
team at the moment he shows up the camp. You know,
both these guys from Illinois are in that third fourth
round range. Who you know just you have a good
(16:24):
feeling about them as football players. So I think of
the Jets pass on those on that position in the
first round. There's some options there. Even though I don't
I don't I wouldn't say safety is a deep position
this year. There are definitely some intriguing guys in the
top four rounds. Okay, So we could talk about the
klemine for a long time and how it impacts the Jets.
(16:45):
One guy and that comes to mind. We had talked
about him last week. Is Jackson Smith and Jig Bob.
How do you think he performed? What did he show you?
And you know, is this arrow up for him? Also
with that being said, another reason why I bring it
up is because the Jets in the past have used
premium picks at wide receiver. I'm not saying the Jets
(17:07):
are gonna do that again, but let's just say, you know,
the Jets don't go tackle. I do think receiver could
be in the mix. Because right now you're looking at
Garrett Wilson. Corey Davis will have to see the status
of him. He's making a lot of money. He's also
under contract for this year but not next year. And
then Elijah Moore as well, so the Jets and Denzel
Mim So the Jets have a couple unproven guys. If
(17:27):
they were to add a player at thirteen that wasn't
a tackle, I do think receiver could be in that mix.
I mean Jackson Smith and Jiggle was awesome. I mean C. J.
Stroud and Jackson, Smith and Jigba. Those are the two
players on Saturday, Day three of the combine where I
just left and was like, wow, those those workouts were fantastic.
And Smith and Jiggle is obviously a guy we haven't
(17:50):
really seen in a year. You know, the last time
he was healthy, he was really that Rose Bowl performance
against Utah where oh, he said, an NCAA record in
a bowl game receiving yards. I mean, he was fantastic.
So and you know, you ask Garrett Wilson, he'll he'll
tell you straight up that, uh you know, he was
Smith and Jigba is the better receiver of the two
or of the three if you include a Lovy in
(18:11):
that discussion as well. Uh. And he had a front
row seat for for Smith and Jigba the last few years. So, uh,
you know, there's a reason he didn't run the forty.
I mean he said he you know, didn't feel ready yet.
But I mean he did all the other drills his forties.
Not it's just not in a spot where he feels
comfortable putting out that four or five four number or whatever,
and it's gonna end up being he's not a burner.
(18:32):
That's that's not the what he does best as a receiver.
He's so polished as a route runner, and then his
short shuttle and his three cone that short area agility
that was outstanding. That I mean, he was elite with
those two numbers at the combine. So Jackson Smith and
Jigba not gonna blow you away with the speed, average size,
(18:53):
but ball skills and route running. That's why he's going
to be a He has has the lore of a
really good NFL player, and I think you plug him
in the slot and he's ready to go from day one.
So that's why for a team looking for that type
of profile, they're gonna look at Smith and Jigba somewhere
in the top twenty five and say he makes our
(19:14):
offense better. So he might not be for everybody, but
for that role, Smith and Jigba is a good player.
So I'm glad you brought up the slot aspect because
to me, you look at Garrett Wilson. Garrett Wilson's very
talented and obviously so he's an offensive rookie of the Year.
He played outside, he played a little inside. He's listed
on the Jets website six zero one ninety two. Smith
(19:36):
and Jigba weigh he's in at six ninety six. What
is it about Jsn's game that people lend it's to say,
you know what, he's the slot receiver, and yet his
heightweight metrics are about the same, if not a little heavier,
a little taller. Think Garrett Wilson, who plays on the
outside and the slot. Well, I mean part of it
(19:56):
is that's what he did in Ohio State, and so
that's that's what his specialty was, was working in the
middle of the field, really leaning on those mismatches and
getting open. So that's what he's a role he played
out Ohio said, and I'm not saying he can't play outside.
You know, it's kind of like, Okay, say Zach Martin
left tackle for the Cowboy or a guard for the Cowboys.
(20:18):
He was a left tackle and at Notre Dame. Could
he kick out and play left tackle for the Cowboys
tomorrow and do just fine? Yeah he could, But I
think his ceiling is the highest inside of guard. He's
on a Hall of Fame trajectory. Smith and Jigbo. If
you wanted to play him outside, he could do that.
You know, I'm not saying he can't because I think
that a lot of what he does will can translate
on the outside, but to maximize what he does best,
(20:40):
and that's beating coverage because of his routes. How sudden
he is in the underneath game finding those soft spots
and then being a catch and run target that really
lends itself to being maximizing that talent inside. So you
know it just these two guys have do two different
skill sets with what they offer. Between Garrett Wilson and
(21:01):
Jaya said, two really good players who compliment each other
really well. And hey, it'd be fun to team these
guys back up again in the NFL. Yeah, it's gonna
be interesting to see what happens with the Jets and
free agency. Obviously that will kind of crystallize the picture
for the draft as we get closer, and you know,
things change between now in April twenty eighth or twenty ninth,
(21:22):
whatever the Thursday is. So one more question for you,
because we could talk about the combine forever, I can
talk about the Jets forever. I want to talk about
a player that probably draws unfair comparisons to I'd say
the Naked Eye, and we're going to the defensive side
of the ball because Sheldon Rankins, the defensive tackle for
the Jets, is an unrestricted free agent or scheduled to be.
(21:43):
And the guy I want to talk about is Collijah Cancy.
I say that right, you got it, man, That is
a tongue twister. Colijah Cancy, one's a c in Collijah
on'es a k in Cancy anyway. So the reason why
I think he draws unfair comparisons because he's an undersized
Pitt Panther. There happens to be a future Hall of
Famer who plays for the La Rams at the same
(22:05):
position who is an undersized Pitt panther or was at
one point in time. And not to mention Aaron Donald,
the guy were talking about as the future Hall of
Famer was the thirteenth pick in the draft. Could Collijah Cancy,
if the Jets went in that direction, be worthy of
the thirteenth overall pick because a couple of things. One,
you know, the Jets want to add to the defensive
(22:27):
line every chance they can. The interior depth outside of
Quinnon Williams isn't quite there right now. Nathan Shepard's supposed
to be free agent, Shelton Rankin's supposed to be a
free agent, so a guy like Cancy makes sense. And
then twofold here Jalen Carter. Hours after we recorded the
episode last week, the news comes out that there's a
legal process that needs to play out. Obviously we don't
(22:49):
know what that result is going to be. But have
you heard anything about Carter and how this might impact
his draft status even if everything is cleared. So with Cancy, obviously,
I think you know your spot on those comparisons, they're
gonna be there. And for a guy that was six one,
two eighty one at the combine to go out there
(23:09):
and run in the four six is pretty impressive. That
guy can move. Now, I think the biggest question with
Cancy will be the lack of length thirty and five
eight since arms, which is well below average. Aaron Donald
had longer arms than that, and so he's had a
length disadvantage right off the bat, no matter whatever blocker
he's going up against in the NFL. And how will that,
(23:32):
you know, how will we be able to combat that?
You know, the tape is great, you throw on the
tape violent he's so quick with his hands, he understands
how to free himself from blocks. He doesn't get caved
in very often. You know, he there's just a lot
to like about the way he moves, the violence that
he plays with, and then it just overall ability to
be disruptive. Now, translating that to the NFL is easier
(23:54):
said than done. But I think that teams are optimistic
he can do that even with the shorter arms. I
think Cancy does go somewhere in the first round. Uh
could he go as high as their team? You don't
rule it out because you you throw on the tape,
you know you don't like the arm length number, but
then you throw on the tape and you're quickly reminded, Okay, yeah,
this guy he could maybe give us that interior rush
(24:15):
presence that we've been looking for. With Jalen Carter, it's
obviously a complicated evaluation. Um, you know, just talking to
scouts that were you know, went through Athens the last
two years, it wasn't I don't the term character concerns
is it's a little too strong. Uh That's what scouts
(24:35):
said now is was Jalen Carter a little immature? Did he?
You know? Did Kirby Smart have to ride him a
little bit to get the most out of him. Yeah,
but that's that I think that is with most nineteen
twenty twenty one year olds, as you know, they have
all this talent and it's up to the coaches to
get the most out of them. And so does he
need to learn how to be a professional? Yes, no doubt. Now,
(24:56):
the news that came out last week, that was that
the team we're inspecting expecting that that was new and
so the silver lining is this is not the Lamide
tunsil gas mask situation where that happened day of the
draft and teams are scrambling, Okay, what do we know?
What do our reports say? Let's make calls, let's try
(25:17):
to figure this out. As he would fall down the
draft board. We have fifty days for teams to exhaust
every resource they have to find out more about Jalen Carter.
You know, is this going to be a guy that
brings trouble with him as soon as he's drafted or
is just this an isolated incident where he made a
youthful mistake. It's not likely that it's going to continue.
(25:41):
It's a one time thing. Teams have to be comfortable
with that because Jalen Carter is a tremendous talent. But
to invest a top five, top ten pick into a
player like this, you better be convinced of the not
just the player, but the person you're bringing into your
building and into the community. So a lot of work
is going to be done on jailing Carter between now
(26:02):
and that last weekend in April, and so at the
end of the day, you know, each team might look
at it a little bit differently. Each team has a
different appetite for risk. So the jailing Carter situation is ongoing.
We you know, don't know enough just yet, but this
it's a situation that we'll keep close tabs on as
we get closer to the draft. A lot of domino
still need to fall between now and late April when
(26:24):
the draft occurs. Of course, the first domino seems to
be around the corner with free agencies. So that's all
we have for this episode of NFL Draft Preview, presented
by Horizon Dane. Thanks a lot, we'll talk to you
next week. Thanks Athan,
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My Favorite Murder is a true crime comedy podcast hosted by Karen Kilgariff and Georgia Hardstark. Each week, Karen and Georgia share compelling true crimes and hometown stories from friends and listeners. Since MFM launched in January of 2016, Karen and Georgia have shared their lifelong interest in true crime and have covered stories of infamous serial killers like the Night Stalker, mysterious cold cases, captivating cults, incredible survivor stories and important events from history like the Tulsa race massacre of 1921. My Favorite Murder is part of the Exactly Right podcast network that provides a platform for bold, creative voices to bring to life provocative, entertaining and relatable stories for audiences everywhere. The Exactly Right roster of podcasts covers a variety of topics including historic true crime, comedic interviews and news, science, pop culture and more. Podcasts on the network include Buried Bones with Kate Winkler Dawson and Paul Holes, That's Messed Up: An SVU Podcast, This Podcast Will Kill You, Bananas and more.
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Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com