October 28, 2024 • 14 mins
Steelers Historian, Bob Labriola sits down with Head Coach Mike Tomlin ahead of the Steelers Week 8 matchup against the New York Giants
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
He's the Mike Tomlin Game Day Podcast with Steelers Digest
editor Bob Labriola. Okay, Coach, you often judge things such
as the quality of a week's practices, the quality of
a training camp by the outcome that follows those things.
If we use that to judge your decision to start
Russell Wilson against the Jets to see if he might
(00:20):
be the catalyst to help the offense go from good
to great, how would you evaluate that decision based on
what you saw against the Jets?
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Honestly, incomplete, it is a small sample size. Certainly, we
did what we needed to do in that venue and
win the game. But I think when I'm looking for
that clarity that knowing it'll be continually revealed to us
over the upcoming games, if you will, If really being
(00:49):
honest with ourselves, I don't know that one performance can
ever be a defining body of work in terms of
the discussion that we're having, but in terms of you
got the clock started though, Absolutely it was time for that, absolutely, Okay.
When asked about what you liked about Russell Wilson's performance
against the Jets, one of the things you mentioned was
(01:09):
his poise. How does a quarterback reveal poise during a
game in everything that they do, how they interact with
with others formally and informally, the look in their eye,
the steadiness of their demeanor. It's displayed in everything that
they do. And you know, we didn't get off to
(01:30):
the most fluidive starts. Not that I was surprised by that.
He hadn't played ball in a significant amount of time,
but he was unfazed by those short term results in
state state solid in regards to the plan, how he
led the group as a unit, and the way he
communicated with others formally and informally, players and coaches.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Last week you explained how Aaron Rodgers uses cadence has
a weapon. And then the fourth quarter last Sunday night,
Rogers tried to catch your defense with many men on
the field by going with pace right before a fourth
and five. You sabotage that with a timeout. TV caught
you and Rogers exchanging knowing looks. Are those kinds of things,
(02:13):
back and forth, kind of things fun for you during games?
Speaker 2 (02:16):
They are the competitors component of it, and particularly when
you're competing against a you know, a tenured coach or
a tenure quarterback, somebody that has a known mode of
operation like Aaron and so you know, I've been around
a while, he's been around a while. I'm familiar with
the tactic, and so we were having a little fun.
(02:36):
I was letting him know not today. So were you
looking for that from him? No doubt. It was my
job to kind of keep an eye on that throughout
the contest. We needed to be cautious about how we
rotated people, and we were largely throughout the game. But
that was kind of a unique scenario moving into those circumstances,
and I just kept an eye on him as we
(02:58):
transition throughout because I just know that's how he lives.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Even though only one of them counted officially, your special
teams blocked two more kicks against the Jets and now
has three successful blocks in the past three games, two
field goals and a punt. You allocate time in every
practice to special teams, usually a couple of three periods
interspersed over the course of the whole practice session. During
your development as a coach, what convinced you of the
(03:25):
importance of dedicating that kind of time in every practice
to special teams.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
As a position coach? I was a secondary coach, not
only in the NFL, but in the college ranks. And oftentimes,
when you're a secondary coach and your working special teams,
the guys that you coach are heavily involved. And I've
just always been a guy not to sit around and
have my hands in my pocket. And so, as a
very young coach in college and in the professional ranks,
(03:52):
always anted up and kicked in. I would coach gunners,
I'd coach returners, anything to help the special teams coordinator.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
And along the.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
Way, I developed an appetite for the space. I saw
the winning edge that it could provide if you develop
skill and intellect in that space, if you train your
guys the same way you train offense and defensive players.
And so you know, it is more than a cliche
for us, It is an approach to business. It's a lifestyle.
(04:21):
We play positions in that phase. We need to hone
our skills relative to the position that we play, just
like our quote unquote offense and defensive home positions. And
I think that's why we're having success. Man, we have
an agenda, but the efforts of the guys, the attention
to the detail that the guys display in the day
to day work that they do in that area. Make
(04:42):
that agenda real. Is the same go for meeting times.
I mean a lot of head coaches say that special
teams one third of the game, but it's not that
way on the schedule every day. No, we live that life.
We and not only in this discussion, but in every discussion.
I am so intentional making sure that our actions match
(05:02):
our words. You're right, we as coaches globally talk about
special teams being a third of the game, But do
we live that life? Do we live that life in
the classroom? Do we live that life in team development?
We make an effort here in Pittsburgh to do so
because we believe it's a legitimate winning edge, And what's
transpired over the last three weeks, it's just kind of
(05:23):
an example of it.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
When Minka Fitzpatrick is lined up in center field, what
does he provide the defense from that spot.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
He's a hub of communication and he's also a known
you know, a known talent in that space. And to
be honest with you, part of being a good defense
sometimes is the plays you don't have to defend. Quarterbacks
are really cautious about challenging his space. And when we
play him in deep middleman, you know, we eliminate the
potential of a lot of big plays. We gave up
(05:51):
one big pass last week. It was a fifty seven
yard play, but it was a checkdown where he ran
through our defense as opposed to people throwing the ball
over the top of our defense. And I think that
just speaks to the presence of him what he provides
from a talent standpoint, but equally as important as having
a central hub of communication somebody that's in the middle
(06:12):
of things on the back end, they can relay messaging
and make checks and calls and so forth, and he
does a heck of a job of that as well.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Sometimes he is judged by people on the outside solely
on the base of take solely on the basis of takeaways.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Is that fair so a rushers, you know, I think
they understand it comes with the territory, particularly the mature ones.
Certainly takeaways defined greatness. But you know, you go through
spells where where you're not getting home, whether you're a
rusher or a defensive back, and it's the takeaway game.
Any of us has been in the business any lit
(06:47):
the time kind of have an understanding of.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
That, Beanie Bishop had two interceptions against the Jets, the
first of his NFL career. During the week after that,
he mentioned that you and he watched video together. Did
you initiate those sessions or did he? I?
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Did you know? I'm a secondary coach by trade. I
love the development of Nichols. That's home base for me.
You know. I cut my teeth in this business Man
twenty five years or so ago, coaching Rondee, Barbers and
Nickel in Tampa. And over the years, I've always had
intimate relationships with those guys and been a component in
(07:27):
their growth and development. I used to do similar things
with Mike Hilton, for example. And Beanie's a guy that's
really talented with some upside and there's some nuances to
the position, and so more than anything, it's informational for him,
but it's also training in terms of approach to business.
He's a young guy, and it's important that he realizes
(07:48):
that you got to go above and beyond if you
want to, you know, if you want to carve out
a space for yourself and this thing. And so he
and I do get together routinely Friday mornings and we
give about twenty thirty minutes, just he and I to
that specific space, and we do it at the latter
part of the week because we got real good information
at the latter part of the week what our intentions are.
(08:09):
In terms of schematics. We can talk about really hardcore
situational things just to round out his readiness and give
a guy who is very young in this thing an
edge in terms of performance. Veteran guys man, guys that's
been doing it a while, they have that snap history
to hang their hat on. A young guy man. We
all got to put our hands in the pile to
(08:31):
position them to be what they want to be and
what we need them to be on game weekends.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
One of the terms I've heard used recently is spot
drop zone coverage. What's that.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
There are different types of zones. They're relatable zones where
you drop off of receivers or receivers potential locations, and
then their spot drop zones where you drop based on
locations on the field and the quarterback is your guide.
It's really six or half a dozen. If you if
you poll a bunch of defensive coaches, half of them
(09:02):
will be spot drop related and half of them will
be you know, receiver related. You know, we do a
little bit of both, to be quite honest with you,
because if you're chasing greatness, man, you better have a
diverse package. And so I understand the argument. I've been
a component of the argument all my adult life. I
(09:23):
believe in some instances spot drops are beneficial, but also
believe in other instances relatable zones are more beneficial. And
so I'm comfortably on the fence in the argument.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
So does the quarterback or the kind of quarterback you're
facing dictate one is better than the other.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Not necessarily quarterback. The offense, the schematic component of the
offense is probably the best way to describe it. Again,
if you know less about what you're getting, I probably
probably be would be feel oriented and drop off a
few locations if I got a real good understanding of
what I'm going, and then I'll be more inclined to
(10:02):
be with the relatable zones. But it is, it is
an ongoing debate, one that will never end, and really,
week to week, man, my posture in the debate might change,
to be quite honest with you.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Daniel Jones is the Giants starting quarterback tonight. He's six five,
two hundred and thirty pounds and during his career he
has rushed for two thousand, ninety eight yards on three
hundred and eighty two carries. He has thirteen touchdowns and
one hundred and forty one first downs. How do the
Giants use that part of his games and in that
part of his game and in what situations?
Speaker 2 (10:36):
You know you see design quarterback runs situations to play
the mathematic component of the game. If you got a
guy in the middle of the field, in a deep
middle like makeup for example, and they have a design
quarterback run, then you're essentially playing ten on eleven football.
And what that means is somebody has to defeat a
(10:57):
block and make a tackle. So that's one of the
reasons why you run design quarterback runs. Unless somebody's in
zero coverage, you got a man up if you will.
And so they do some of that and we got
to be prepared for it. There are some situational clues.
There's also some structural clues from a formation or a
personnel group perspective, and then there's a component of play
(11:21):
extension and that LIB and you know he brings that
call passes where he utilizes his athleticism to make the
best of a deteriorate and circumstance that's always been an
asset of his. You better be cautious in terms of
how you manage that component too. But we see a
lot of quarterback mobility. We're used to it in the
(11:43):
North with guys obviously like Lamar and Joe Burrow and
Watson Man. We deal with a lot of quarterback mobility,
and so it's not earth shattering for us, although we
respect it.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Is it accurate to call Dexter Lawrence a game wrecker
as a defensive tackle?
Speaker 2 (11:59):
That would be extremely accurate. He is a monster. He
is Freddy Krueger. He's a guy that's capable of dominating
the game in the run and in the past quite
often in both circumstances, he requires four hands on him
to neutralize him. And those guys that require four hands,
(12:19):
those are the guys that fit comfortably in that game
wrecker mode.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
I'd like to take you back to your first Monday
night football game as a head coach. It was November
the fifth, two thousand and seven against Baltimore and Pittsburgh.
James Harrison had nine tackles, three and a half sacks,
an interception, two forced fumbles and one fumble recovery on defense,
plus a tackle and a forced fumble on special teams?
Is that the most dominant individual performance by defensive player
(12:46):
you've ever seen?
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Arguably, and not to mention the six quarterback hits to
put it in perspective of how vivid that performance is.
But I've been around some sick, sick performances. That is
definitively arguably one of them. We were in the two
(13:08):
thousand and two NFC Championship and Rondee Barber stood on
his head against the Philadelphia Eagles and put up a
similar game. Those are probably the top two single individual
defensive performances that I've been in close proximity too.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Did you leave that game feeling differently about what you
had as a player in James Harrison?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
I think I probably felt it prior to then. I
think when you're around these guys day to day, you
see things that maybe the public doesn't. And his talents
were obvious, but his commitment was equally as impressive as
his talent. You know the way that James trained and
(13:48):
prepared himself has become things of legend, but when you
saw it every day, you knew it was special when
you were looking at it, his approach to his business,
the way that he readied himself for action. There's a
such thing as football justice man, and that guy positioned
himself to be fortunate in this thing. And so I
(14:09):
don't know that any of us were surprised by the
superhuman things that he did, because he brought a superhuman
commitment and process to preparation.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
That's the Mike Tomlin Game Day Podcast. Subscribe and download
new episodes every week and check out all of the
other shows we have to offer on the Steelers podcast network.
That's available on the Steelers Mobile app, the iHeartRadio app,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
He's the Mike Tomlin Game Day Podcast with Steelers Digest
editor Bob Labriola. Okay, Coach, you often judge things such
as the quality of a week's practices, the quality of
a training camp by the outcome that follows those things.
If we use that to judge your decision to start
Russell Wilson against the Jets to see if he might
(00:20):
be the catalyst to help the offense go from good
to great, how would you evaluate that decision based on
what you saw against the Jets?
Speaker 2 (00:28):
Honestly, incomplete, it is a small sample size. Certainly, we
did what we needed to do in that venue and
win the game. But I think when I'm looking for
that clarity that knowing it'll be continually revealed to us
over the upcoming games, if you will, If really being
(00:49):
honest with ourselves, I don't know that one performance can
ever be a defining body of work in terms of
the discussion that we're having, but in terms of you
got the clock started though, Absolutely it was time for that, absolutely, Okay.
When asked about what you liked about Russell Wilson's performance
against the Jets, one of the things you mentioned was
(01:09):
his poise. How does a quarterback reveal poise during a
game in everything that they do, how they interact with
with others formally and informally, the look in their eye,
the steadiness of their demeanor. It's displayed in everything that
they do. And you know, we didn't get off to
(01:30):
the most fluidive starts. Not that I was surprised by that.
He hadn't played ball in a significant amount of time,
but he was unfazed by those short term results in
state state solid in regards to the plan, how he
led the group as a unit, and the way he
communicated with others formally and informally, players and coaches.
Speaker 1 (01:51):
Last week you explained how Aaron Rodgers uses cadence has
a weapon. And then the fourth quarter last Sunday night,
Rogers tried to catch your defense with many men on
the field by going with pace right before a fourth
and five. You sabotage that with a timeout. TV caught
you and Rogers exchanging knowing looks. Are those kinds of things,
(02:13):
back and forth, kind of things fun for you during games?
Speaker 2 (02:16):
They are the competitors component of it, and particularly when
you're competing against a you know, a tenured coach or
a tenure quarterback, somebody that has a known mode of
operation like Aaron and so you know, I've been around
a while, he's been around a while. I'm familiar with
the tactic, and so we were having a little fun.
(02:36):
I was letting him know not today. So were you
looking for that from him? No doubt. It was my
job to kind of keep an eye on that throughout
the contest. We needed to be cautious about how we
rotated people, and we were largely throughout the game. But
that was kind of a unique scenario moving into those circumstances,
and I just kept an eye on him as we
(02:58):
transition throughout because I just know that's how he lives.
Speaker 1 (03:02):
Even though only one of them counted officially, your special
teams blocked two more kicks against the Jets and now
has three successful blocks in the past three games, two
field goals and a punt. You allocate time in every
practice to special teams, usually a couple of three periods
interspersed over the course of the whole practice session. During
your development as a coach, what convinced you of the
(03:25):
importance of dedicating that kind of time in every practice
to special teams.
Speaker 2 (03:29):
As a position coach? I was a secondary coach, not
only in the NFL, but in the college ranks. And oftentimes,
when you're a secondary coach and your working special teams,
the guys that you coach are heavily involved. And I've
just always been a guy not to sit around and
have my hands in my pocket. And so, as a
very young coach in college and in the professional ranks,
(03:52):
always anted up and kicked in. I would coach gunners,
I'd coach returners, anything to help the special teams coordinator.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
And along the.
Speaker 2 (04:01):
Way, I developed an appetite for the space. I saw
the winning edge that it could provide if you develop
skill and intellect in that space, if you train your
guys the same way you train offense and defensive players.
And so you know, it is more than a cliche
for us, It is an approach to business. It's a lifestyle.
(04:21):
We play positions in that phase. We need to hone
our skills relative to the position that we play, just
like our quote unquote offense and defensive home positions. And
I think that's why we're having success. Man, we have
an agenda, but the efforts of the guys, the attention
to the detail that the guys display in the day
to day work that they do in that area. Make
(04:42):
that agenda real. Is the same go for meeting times.
I mean a lot of head coaches say that special
teams one third of the game, but it's not that
way on the schedule every day. No, we live that life.
We and not only in this discussion, but in every discussion.
I am so intentional making sure that our actions match
(05:02):
our words. You're right, we as coaches globally talk about
special teams being a third of the game, But do
we live that life? Do we live that life in
the classroom? Do we live that life in team development?
We make an effort here in Pittsburgh to do so
because we believe it's a legitimate winning edge, And what's
transpired over the last three weeks, it's just kind of
(05:23):
an example of it.
Speaker 1 (05:24):
When Minka Fitzpatrick is lined up in center field, what
does he provide the defense from that spot.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
He's a hub of communication and he's also a known
you know, a known talent in that space. And to
be honest with you, part of being a good defense
sometimes is the plays you don't have to defend. Quarterbacks
are really cautious about challenging his space. And when we
play him in deep middleman, you know, we eliminate the
potential of a lot of big plays. We gave up
(05:51):
one big pass last week. It was a fifty seven
yard play, but it was a checkdown where he ran
through our defense as opposed to people throwing the ball
over the top of our defense. And I think that
just speaks to the presence of him what he provides
from a talent standpoint, but equally as important as having
a central hub of communication somebody that's in the middle
(06:12):
of things on the back end, they can relay messaging
and make checks and calls and so forth, and he
does a heck of a job of that as well.
Speaker 1 (06:19):
Sometimes he is judged by people on the outside solely
on the base of take solely on the basis of takeaways.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
Is that fair so a rushers, you know, I think
they understand it comes with the territory, particularly the mature ones.
Certainly takeaways defined greatness. But you know, you go through
spells where where you're not getting home, whether you're a
rusher or a defensive back, and it's the takeaway game.
Any of us has been in the business any lit
(06:47):
the time kind of have an understanding of.
Speaker 1 (06:49):
That, Beanie Bishop had two interceptions against the Jets, the
first of his NFL career. During the week after that,
he mentioned that you and he watched video together. Did
you initiate those sessions or did he? I?
Speaker 2 (07:03):
Did you know? I'm a secondary coach by trade. I
love the development of Nichols. That's home base for me.
You know. I cut my teeth in this business Man
twenty five years or so ago, coaching Rondee, Barbers and
Nickel in Tampa. And over the years, I've always had
intimate relationships with those guys and been a component in
(07:27):
their growth and development. I used to do similar things
with Mike Hilton, for example. And Beanie's a guy that's
really talented with some upside and there's some nuances to
the position, and so more than anything, it's informational for him,
but it's also training in terms of approach to business.
He's a young guy, and it's important that he realizes
(07:48):
that you got to go above and beyond if you
want to, you know, if you want to carve out
a space for yourself and this thing. And so he
and I do get together routinely Friday mornings and we
give about twenty thirty minutes, just he and I to
that specific space, and we do it at the latter
part of the week because we got real good information
at the latter part of the week what our intentions are.
(08:09):
In terms of schematics. We can talk about really hardcore
situational things just to round out his readiness and give
a guy who is very young in this thing an
edge in terms of performance. Veteran guys man, guys that's
been doing it a while, they have that snap history
to hang their hat on. A young guy man. We
all got to put our hands in the pile to
(08:31):
position them to be what they want to be and
what we need them to be on game weekends.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
One of the terms I've heard used recently is spot
drop zone coverage. What's that.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
There are different types of zones. They're relatable zones where
you drop off of receivers or receivers potential locations, and
then their spot drop zones where you drop based on
locations on the field and the quarterback is your guide.
It's really six or half a dozen. If you if
you poll a bunch of defensive coaches, half of them
(09:02):
will be spot drop related and half of them will
be you know, receiver related. You know, we do a
little bit of both, to be quite honest with you,
because if you're chasing greatness, man, you better have a
diverse package. And so I understand the argument. I've been
a component of the argument all my adult life. I
(09:23):
believe in some instances spot drops are beneficial, but also
believe in other instances relatable zones are more beneficial. And
so I'm comfortably on the fence in the argument.
Speaker 1 (09:35):
So does the quarterback or the kind of quarterback you're
facing dictate one is better than the other.
Speaker 2 (09:41):
Not necessarily quarterback. The offense, the schematic component of the
offense is probably the best way to describe it. Again,
if you know less about what you're getting, I probably
probably be would be feel oriented and drop off a
few locations if I got a real good understanding of
what I'm going, and then I'll be more inclined to
(10:02):
be with the relatable zones. But it is, it is
an ongoing debate, one that will never end, and really,
week to week, man, my posture in the debate might change,
to be quite honest with you.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
Daniel Jones is the Giants starting quarterback tonight. He's six five,
two hundred and thirty pounds and during his career he
has rushed for two thousand, ninety eight yards on three
hundred and eighty two carries. He has thirteen touchdowns and
one hundred and forty one first downs. How do the
Giants use that part of his games and in that
part of his game and in what situations?
Speaker 2 (10:36):
You know you see design quarterback runs situations to play
the mathematic component of the game. If you got a
guy in the middle of the field, in a deep
middle like makeup for example, and they have a design
quarterback run, then you're essentially playing ten on eleven football.
And what that means is somebody has to defeat a
(10:57):
block and make a tackle. So that's one of the
reasons why you run design quarterback runs. Unless somebody's in
zero coverage, you got a man up if you will.
And so they do some of that and we got
to be prepared for it. There are some situational clues.
There's also some structural clues from a formation or a
personnel group perspective, and then there's a component of play
(11:21):
extension and that LIB and you know he brings that
call passes where he utilizes his athleticism to make the
best of a deteriorate and circumstance that's always been an
asset of his. You better be cautious in terms of
how you manage that component too. But we see a
lot of quarterback mobility. We're used to it in the
(11:43):
North with guys obviously like Lamar and Joe Burrow and
Watson Man. We deal with a lot of quarterback mobility,
and so it's not earth shattering for us, although we
respect it.
Speaker 1 (11:54):
Is it accurate to call Dexter Lawrence a game wrecker
as a defensive tackle?
Speaker 2 (11:59):
That would be extremely accurate. He is a monster. He
is Freddy Krueger. He's a guy that's capable of dominating
the game in the run and in the past quite
often in both circumstances, he requires four hands on him
to neutralize him. And those guys that require four hands,
(12:19):
those are the guys that fit comfortably in that game
wrecker mode.
Speaker 1 (12:23):
I'd like to take you back to your first Monday
night football game as a head coach. It was November
the fifth, two thousand and seven against Baltimore and Pittsburgh.
James Harrison had nine tackles, three and a half sacks,
an interception, two forced fumbles and one fumble recovery on defense,
plus a tackle and a forced fumble on special teams?
Is that the most dominant individual performance by defensive player
(12:46):
you've ever seen?
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Arguably, and not to mention the six quarterback hits to
put it in perspective of how vivid that performance is.
But I've been around some sick, sick performances. That is
definitively arguably one of them. We were in the two
(13:08):
thousand and two NFC Championship and Rondee Barber stood on
his head against the Philadelphia Eagles and put up a
similar game. Those are probably the top two single individual
defensive performances that I've been in close proximity too.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
Did you leave that game feeling differently about what you
had as a player in James Harrison?
Speaker 2 (13:27):
I think I probably felt it prior to then. I
think when you're around these guys day to day, you
see things that maybe the public doesn't. And his talents
were obvious, but his commitment was equally as impressive as
his talent. You know the way that James trained and
(13:48):
prepared himself has become things of legend, but when you
saw it every day, you knew it was special when
you were looking at it, his approach to his business,
the way that he readied himself for action. There's a
such thing as football justice man, and that guy positioned
himself to be fortunate in this thing. And so I
(14:09):
don't know that any of us were surprised by the
superhuman things that he did, because he brought a superhuman
commitment and process to preparation.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
That's the Mike Tomlin Game Day Podcast. Subscribe and download
new episodes every week and check out all of the
other shows we have to offer on the Steelers podcast network.
That's available on the Steelers Mobile app, the iHeartRadio app,
or wherever you get your podcasts.
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