October 21, 2025 • 37 mins
Mike and Wes review the victory in Arizona, including the deciding moments of the fourth quarter (6:18), Lucas Havrisik’s record-breaking field goal and other standout performances (8:39), Micah Parsons’ high-impact game (17:02), and areas to clean up moving forward (22:03). They also take a look around the NFC (31:14).
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:06):
Hi, everybody, Welcome to another edition of Packers Unscripted from
Packers dot Com. I am Mike Spaffer, joined as always
by my partner and everything Packers, Wes Hodkwitz. Coming to
you hear from our studios at lambeau Field to discuss
wes a twenty seven to twenty three victory in the
desert over the Arizona Cardinals. It wasn't pretty by any stretch.
(00:28):
But as I wrote at the very beginning of my
game recap, after getting on the bus for that long
ride to the airport out there, going from Glendale to
the stadium in Glendale to the airport in Phoenix, this
game was all about which team executed at crunch time,
(00:49):
and in this game, that was the Green Bay Packers.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Yeah, it was funny, Okay, So you and I were
sitting there at the press conference on Monday morning, so
a lot of the media are still coming back. Bill
Huber's there with us, Jason Wildey to credential journalists who
do not travel, so they were able to be there
for the press conference while a lot of the other
beatcorps were still on their way back from Arizona. And
(01:13):
it was funny listening we all kind of were just
filibustering and talking amongst ourselves about like, there's there's so
much that happened in this game, you couldn't really cover
all of it. Yeah right, I mean in that it's
the NFL. There's a lot of variables, there's a lot
of players, there's a lot of situations. I thought you
did a great job, you know, with one of your
game stories, kind of like really zeroing in on that,
you know, fourth down conversion. I mean, that might end
(01:35):
up going down as one of the biggest plays of
the Packers season. But I was just sitting there thinking
to myself, like Lucas Haversk's sixty one yard field goal
franchise record critical time, kind of gave them some juice
back a little bit at a time in which they
needed it. Micah Parsons has these three sacks, and two
of them in the fourth quarter, four pressures in the
fourth quarter, has one of the best games of his career.
(01:57):
Was a nuisance for all four quarters for Arizona to
deal with, and they were trying to match up with
him one on one. But then you think about it,
You're like, well, Rashan Gary had the strip sack that
allowed the Packers to turn the tide to ten point swing.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
They can Packers first takeaway since week three.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yes, and like the ends up becoming a Josh Jacobs touchdown.
Josh Jacobs scores two touchdowns. Josh Jacobs had a calf
injury that developed on Friday, didn't know whether he was
gonna play. He was a game time decision. The Packers
end up having a situation where they're playing doesn't leave
at the right time, so then they're delayed back in
Green Bay and they get in late, and Josh Jacobs
(02:32):
has to cancel plans with his family, and the list
goes on and on and on of stuff that happened.
But to your an intro, to me is what mattered
the most. Yeah, and that's when the Packers needed to win.
The football game wasn't perfect three first three quarters, but
the defense, after struggling to keep teams out of the
end zone the last few weeks, had some big stops.
(02:54):
And offensively, I mean, Jordan Love has just been nails man.
I mean when they've needed big moments like that fourth
down pass to Tucker Kraft for fifteen yards. That really
that's where the game was decided. Love lafleor this team
they trusted in each other. They picked up their fourth
winning the season.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
It was quite the sequence there down the stretch because
the Cardinals had taken a twenty three to twenty lead,
the Packers' offense had stalled out, they had to punt.
It was on the defense at that point to get
the ball back to not allow it to become a
two score game, and it came down to a fourth
(03:32):
and one right near midfield. The Cardinals decided to go
for it. Not a huge surprise the way the game
has played these days. I still thought, maybe just because
of how they had drawn the Packers offside a couple
of times during the game, that maybe they were gonna
bluff and see if they could just get the free
five yards on the fourth and one. But they tried
the sneak with Jacoby Burssett, got stuffed, gave the short
(03:55):
field to the Packers the fourth and two. The Packers
had lost a yard on a third and one, and
Matt Lafleur explained on Monday, it was going backwards there
from third and one to fourth and two that initially
he's like, all right, I'm just going to kick the
field goal and then he saw the look on Jordan
Love's face called the time out to reconsider, think about
(04:20):
it a little bit more like, all right, nope, let's
go for the first down. You mentioned it's the past
to Craft, who's actually the third option on the play.
It was a kind of a bunch formation to the left,
three receivers, three different routes. You got an out to
the sticks, you gotta pivot inside to the sticks, and
then you've got Craft on the corner route, which is
really the only downfield route of the combination. And he's
(04:43):
the third option on the play. Love sees the other
two guys are covered. He's got to put it out
there for Craft. He makes the catch, gets the feed
in bounds, and then Josh Jacobs finishes the deal three
straight runs, punches it into the end zone, and then
the defense then with a four point lead, as opposed
to if the Packers had kicked and tied the game,
the defense would have had to stop the Cardinals from
(05:05):
getting a field goal. They had the whole field to defend.
The Packers were up by four, Cardinals needed to get
a touchdown. Sure enough, the Cardinals got into field goal range,
but Micah Parsons third sack of the game comes out
of big time, sets them up in tough down and distance.
It eventually becomes a fourth and ten, fourth and eleven
situation and a heave to the end zone, which was act.
(05:27):
I didn't realize this at the time because it was
in the end zone that was opposite of the press box.
But the pass was actually caught. It was just caught
out the back of the end zone, you know, well
out of bounds crunch time. I said this. I said
this an insider inbox. And there's a lot to cover
from this game, as you mentioned. But in the NFL,
(05:48):
where the margins are so slim, failing in crunch time
can undo a lot of good football, yep. And succeeding
in crunch time can cover up for some bad football.
And at the end of the days, it's about getting wins.
Lafleur said it himself on Monday. This is a results
oriented business. What everyone the only thing anybody cares about
(06:11):
is whether you win or lose the game at the
end of the day. And this was one that you know,
this was one to me it felt like the Packers
quite frankly escaped Arizona because they had trailed trailed for
most of the game, and things did not look good
until that fourth and one stop on the quarterback sneak.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I'm glad it went down the way it did, though,
because we saw in Cleveland where they you know, kind
of controlled that game against the Browns the entire time,
but then had it slip away from them in the
waning moments exactly almost the same spot that the Cardinals
were in with this game. With a few more points
put on the board, this time, Green Bay had to
play the role of the comeback. And I'll tell you what, Mike,
(06:54):
when it was thirteen to three, the kind of felt
a little I don't want to say insurmountable, but it
was getting it to be a dire straight there because
it's like, Okay, well this offense with Jacoby Brissett, which
just had three hundred and twenty passing yards of the
previous week, well, now he is clicking with Trey McBride.
Marvin Harrison has a little bit of scare there with
an incomplete pass, but then he's making explosive plays. And
(07:15):
Marvin Harrison, man, there's a couple mentals, you know, concentration
things he has to get sorted out. But when that
guy figures it all out, is going to be a
real problem for this league, just like he was in college.
I mean, his talent is limitless, needless to say so Arizona,
who's had a litany of different running backs, they're on
their backup quarterback. Things are really trending in the opposite,
(07:39):
in the wrong direction, and in my opinion, I felt
like not to jump into some of stuff I'm sure
you want to talk about. For Green Bay to make
a gutsy call there, especially after everything that happened with
Dallas last month, to try to get one play with
one time out left, to give yourself a shot at
a field goal. That was the turning point in that game.
(08:05):
Romeo Dobbs, that's the guy for Jordan Love gets twenty
two yards there just enough room for Lucas Haversec and
that unit to go out there. And his Haversack was
talking to me about in the locker room afterwards. You know,
he didn't have a great pre game, he wasn't feeling awesome,
but as he said, sometimes you just have to focus
and you have to put everything away from and just
(08:25):
be like all the reps, all the time that you've
put into this thing, and the guy went out there
and hit a field goal about as solid as you
can hit one. Yeah, and the Packers go into the
halftime down only by one score.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Yeah. I mean I even thought after the completion to
Dobbs there and the time out there's one second on
the clock, I thought, oh, you know, now they'll just
try hail Mary. I mean, I just I didn't think,
you know, a substitute kicker, you know that you're going
to try a sixty one yarder. And it wasn't one
of those where he it wasn't one of those long
kicks where it's like low trajectory and maybe flutters alone
(09:00):
little bit and somehow just clears the crossbar. I mean,
it was the right type of trajectory of the kick
and everything, and he just he just nailed it.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
It looked like a kickoff.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Yeah, I mean, it was really impressive. He gets the
franchise record. There are three yards longer than any field
goal in franchise history. Mason crosby fifty eight yarder at
the Metrodome in twenty eleven against the Vikings was the
previous franchise record. Hats off to Haversick. As you said earlier,
(09:31):
I thought it did. I thought it did give the
Packers a little bit of juice, and it didn't result
in an immediate change at the start of the second
half because the Packers offense stalled out again and punted
the ball, but the defense then on the opening possession
for the Cardinals of the second half, Rashan Gary gets
(09:52):
the strips at Kolbe. Wooden gets the pressure up the middle,
which then you know, Brisset adjusts himself in the pock
and then Gary's coming at him and knocks the ball out.
Evan Williams recovers a short field there, forty four yards
and a Packers offense that was just struggling suddenly just
(10:13):
takes four plays forty four yards in the end zone.
And the combination of that with the three points on
the sixty one yard or at the end of the
first half, the thirteen to three deficits erased. It's thirteen
to thirteen. It's a brand new ballgame. You've got most
of the second half left to go, and at that
point it's like, all right, here we go. Who's going
to take this thing?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
For sure? And I'm glad you mentioned the Wooden thing too,
because Micah Parsons went out of his way to praise
Kobe Wooden after the game for not only the play
that you mentioned there, but some of the stuff that
he set up for Parsons as well. Kobe had probably
with right along with the Lions game, probably his best
game of the season inside, both against the run and
also getting some push. That's what they missed with Devonte
(10:52):
Wide is being able to collapse that pocket a little
bit and against quarterbacks that want to stand in there
and get the ball out quick, that's really what you
need most, even more than edge ushers at that point.
So that being said, the Packers have shown in affinity
in this early part of the season to get out
of the blocks quick for the most part in the
second half, that has been the probably the hallmark of
(11:13):
this team. The biggest complimentary phase of football that they've
played is their ability to win. The defenses is giving
up some points. The offense responds. When the offense has
struggled to get going, it's the defense that's keeping them minute.
And in this particular case, I thought it was the
best example of both sides picking each other up because
once again Josh Jacobs did get going out for people.
(11:35):
I kind of breezed right through that. But the situation
on Friday was he ends up tweaking his calf, you know,
and in practice it was a full participant, but it
was something he had coming out of practice, and he's
really it was touch and go whether or not he
was going to be able to play in this thing,
compounded by the fact that green Bay does have a
mechanical issue getting out, so they're waiting out in Green
(11:58):
Bay for about five hours. He said, you know, he's
direction the best he could. He was walking around, he
had a sleeve on it. It is just a nightmare
scenario for a running back to be going through this
and not being able to get treatment, you know, not
being able to get near rhythm.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
And then knowing you have a three and a half
hour flight, you've got to start in an airplane seat,
you know, before then you can get to the hotel
and get another round of treatment to see if you
can play the next day. I mean, you're right, it's
an absolute nightmare scenario from an injury standpoint.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Yeah, And he said, you know, he ended up going
out for the pregame warm up, and you know, he
credited the packers' training staff staff he credit the coaches.
He was thankful for how much they are trying to
protect him. But he did say he's like, I know
my body, I've been through this before. He tweaked his
calf before in a game in twenty twenty two, I
believe it was before they played Seattle when he was
(12:45):
with the Raiders. The guy ends up going off for
three hundred and three yards from scrimmage in that game.
So he felt confident that if he could get himself
mentally to a certain point, he was going to be
able to do it. The Packers still were somewhat cautious
with him. It's why you only saw him take I
think it was ten snaps in the first half. Saw
a lot of Emmanuel Wilson Chris Brooks involvement, but when
the game was on the line, they turned back to
their running back. And I loved Matt Leaflour's comment, this
(13:08):
is zipping ahead a little bit. But the two back
to back runs that ultimately end up putting the Packers
in the lead for the first time all day. La
floor even equipped. While the offensive line had a pretty
soliday overall, not sure if they blocked anybody. In most
particular plays the seven yard run will not go down
in any NFL films highlight reels of Josh Jacobs. But
(13:29):
I thought that that play specific really epitomize what he's
been in Green Bay, and that is, when something's not there,
he makes something happen. And he pulled seven yards out
of nowhere to then put himself in a position from
the one yard line to punch that thing in. Put
Green Bay up with a buck fifty left. And as
Laflour said afterwards, the Packers do not win this game
(13:50):
without Josh Jacobs. He came to play.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Yeah. And if you want to know, if you want
to get a sense of just the type of competitor
and passionate individual that Josh Jacobs is, take a look
on Packers dot Com at the locker room speech after
the game. Because this wasn't a locker room speech that
was just about Matt Lefuer giving out game balls, and
(14:12):
which he did to Lucas Haversick and to Uh, to
Micah Parsons and to Josh Jacobs. But look at what
Jacobs has to say, and look at how he says it,
and then take a look at what Tucker Craft has
to say. You're talking about a third year tight end
who's coming into his own makes the clutch catch on
fourth down. And the leadership that you're seeing from a
(14:37):
young guy like like Tucker Craft and what he means
to that locker room. I mean, it just it gives you.
It gives you a sense just watching that video. It's
just a couple of minutes long, but it gives you
a sense of of the the humans that are in
that locker room that they aren't just they aren't just
football players. And and for as ugly as this game was,
(14:59):
that times that win meant a lot to those guys.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Yeah, and I'm glad you brought that up by because
I got a little bit of salt and pepper in
my hair at this point. You know, I got a
couple of years under my belt, and one of the
things that's been eye opening for me the last two
seasons is much similar to probably like what you experienced
in nine and ten and eleven is you're starting to
see guys, I've I had a whole ten years on
the beat before Tucker Craft came into town, a whole
(15:26):
you know, thirteen years on the beat before Josh Jacobs
got signed. I saw Mercedes Lewis in that locker room,
Julius Pepper's in that locker room. You know, guys that
were the leaders back then. What I never experienced was,
for the most part, the young guys then picking up
those you know, those torches. Yeah, and that's what you're
(15:48):
seeing now. That's why Josh Shacobs is wearing a sea,
That's why Tucker Craft has that sea on his chest.
And when you see guys get drafted and then a
different era, a different generation of Packer players begins, it's
special to watch. And I'm sure you're gonna want to
get into it a little bit too. But I want
(16:08):
to say this. I mean the way that Micah Parsons
has brought himself into this locker room now and integrated
himself with his teammates. The fact that this guy's been
here for not even two months. Yes, he made a
lot of plays, but seeing the way that Xavier McKinney
reacted to him. So in the middle of parsons media
scrum with you know, Xavier McKinney's coming over and hooting
(16:30):
and hollering at him, you have all these guys that
are embracing him. That's where that culture comes from. That
when a new guy, doesn't matter if you're a superstar,
doesn't matter if you're an undrafted free agent. When that
guy comes into the fold, there is in opening it
and in just open arms around that individual. That's what
(16:51):
culture is and that's where the Packers are at.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Yeah, and it's definitely played a factor for Green Bay
this year. I do want to say in addition with
regard to Parsons, because there were a lot of people,
you know, I don't know, call them the skeptics or
the haters or whatever. But parsons first game, he gets
his first sack against the Detroit Lions. But then you know,
(17:15):
there's all these folks out there, Oh it was garbage time.
The game had been put away. You know, that's all
you're gonna get for your one hundred and eighty eight
million dollars. Well, Michah Parsons got a sack of Dak
Prescott in overtime that saved a tie, turned to what
could have been a loss, in helping to get a
tie there for the Packers. In this game in Arizona,
he gets two third down sacks in the red zone
(17:38):
that force field goals. Those are four point plays. That's
Micah Parsons taking eight points off the board, and then
he gets the third sack in crunch time the final
drive when the Cardinals are knocking on the door to
the red zone. They're not quite there yet, but on
first down he buries Perseet, puts him in the long
(17:59):
yarded situation, and then ultimately it becomes the turnover on downs.
With the fourth down heave to the end zone out
the back Micah Parsons. He I'm not sure why the
Cardinals decided to try to block him the way that
they did, but man, he he made plays in the
(18:22):
biggest moments of this game, and not any not players
like that. You can't do that every single week. That's
not how the league works. But when you do it
in a game like this, like Micah Parsons did, that's
why Michaeh Parsons gets the contract that he gets, because
it's games like this that you don't You don't get
the win without those plays that he made.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Bottom line, Yeah, I take a little bit of different
viewpoint about how the Cardinals defended him because or I
guess it'd be defend the offense defending the defend player.
But how they you know, they matched up with him.
I have no problem with the fact that they tried
to go one on one with him early on. I
on a respect it. I think that's the way this
game is played. I think it is trying to figure out, Hey,
comparis Johnson handled this guy, and that's your best on
(19:07):
best if you're if your left tackle can take care
of him. That The Packers won a lot of football
games over the years by David Baktiari doing that sort
of thing. What surprised me is he was giving them
all sorts of problems for the first three quarters. I
am stunned with their approach to him in the fourth quarter. Yeah,
that's where I would have thought you would have had
the added attention. Now, you gotta remember, I don't know
how much too tight end they operate in. Trey McBride
(19:29):
is basically out on every single route. He's not He
might chip here and there, but he's not staying in
as an inline blocker. And I you know, it is
what it is. But what I loved about Parsons in
this game. And I'm telling you, man, I got home
next day, I'm sitting down with my dad eating some
food and we're kind of breaking down the game a
little bit, and I said to him, I'm like, this
(19:50):
is the best defensive player I've covered. I didn't get
Charles Woodson during the NFL Defensive Player of the Year
like you did. I didn't get Klay Matthews the first
two seasons like you did. Since two thousand twelve, this
is the most impactful player I've witnessed because it's all
over the place. I mean, Sadarius Smith had some great moments.
Clay Matthews was phenomenal at times, well, phenomenal a lot,
(20:11):
but I mean like dominant at times. You know, Julius
Pepper's brought something in the mid two thousands. Micah Parsons
is one of the elite of the elite, and when
you watch that guy play snap after snap, down after down,
it is incredible. I don't know if you saw the statistic, Michael,
but right now, and I think it's through NFLGSIS or
(20:32):
in next gen stats, but pars is on pace for
over one hundred pressures this season. And if I saw
the statistic right last year with Shaun Gary led the
Packers with forty nine, Mike is almost at forty already.
The sacks, the relentlessness, I think He's been much better
against the run than people give him credit for. I
think he's been tenacious. I think he's been really gap
(20:55):
sound when the instances that he's been put in that position.
Oh and then, by the way, they were down Lucas
Vans in this game, and yet they still had twelve
quarterback hits, they still had six sacks. Kingsleyanning Bari played
a whale of a football game the Packers. When you
talk about guys that are bringing out the best not
only in themselves but the rest of the squad, Michaeh
(21:15):
Parsons is that dude, and I am so excited to
see where this season goes for him. Him and Rashan
Gary now both at five and a half sacks on
the year. I felt like that game in itself was
something Green Bay's defense can really build on, even though
there were plenty of things to clean up, you know,
throughout Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
I was asked about Parsons in the Insider inbox and
the answer that I wrote on the plane flight on
the way back was that he's the most relentless defensive
player that I've ever covered. And that's saying something because
I don't want to take anything away from Clay Matthews,
because when Clay Matthews was in his heyday, he was
awfully relentless as a pass rusher. But I think Micah
(21:53):
Parsons is another step above that, and that's saying something.
Couple things to touch on, though, and these are I
guess I would say the area is to clean up
for the Packers. The penalties were an issue in this game.
Mikeah Parsons was guilty of a couple of them. He got,
I know, we don't have time to go into the
(22:15):
whole hip drop tackle thing, but he also jumped off
side for like the third or fourth time or whatever
this year, so he's got some stuff to work on.
The offense had the pre snap penalties, so the penalties
are definitely an issue. What really hurt the defense in
this game was the third and longs. Yeah, I mean
(22:38):
you've got and the third and twenty three was a
combination in the sense of Baron Surrell, the rookie jumps
off side, Jacoby Burssett sees the flag and knows he's
got a free play on third and twenty twenty three,
so he just chucks it, you know, down the field.
Evan Williams can't quite get over there in time to
break up the deep ball, and it gets caught for
(22:59):
a forty three yard games So you give up a
third and twenty three, But you gave that up in
part because you gave the quarterback a free play. He
was able to take the deep shot downfield later in
the game a third and fourteen. I mean, that's for
the way the Packers defense is played, and particularly on
third down this season. These types of plays are the
(23:20):
highest percentage that you get for Green Bay's defense. But
we heard from Matt Lafleur on Monday is a zone
defense that was called, but Nate Hobbs was playing pressman,
so there was some sort of a miscommunication there. He
gets attacked as the pressman corner, but the rest of
the secondary's not in that type of coverage and so
you end up giving up a third and fourteen. That one,
(23:42):
as well as the third and twenty three in the
first half, both lead to touchdowns for the Cardinals. My
point in saying all this, but what gets frustrating is
it's sort of repeating some points along the way, But
it is clear and obvious the plays that are there
that the Packers' defense needs to make. So when this
(24:05):
defense is struggling, I don't think it's that far off
because it shouldn't be. They shouldn't be giving up a
third and twenty three. They shouldn't be giving up a
third and fourteen. But they've got to start making those
plays and then this defense can get back to looking
like the unit that it was in the first couple
weeks of the season. So I know there's frustration out
(24:25):
there and the players themselves. We heard from Xavier McKinney
after the game. He's not happy with how the defense
played in this game. They know they can play better,
they know that they need to play better. But I'm
to me, it's to me, it's not something where they're
just like way off. It's about certain instances situational football
where they need to hold their water at the line
(24:46):
of scrimmage and then execute the call and get and
have everybody on the same page to execute that call.
And I think this defense gets back to where it was.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah, I think what's fun for me? And I know everybody,
especially the critics of the Wes Hodquitz insider in boxes,
we'll say it's being way too you know, rose colored
glasses and sunny side up here. But I'll tell you what,
when you talk about defenses that struggle, it's given up
five hundred passing yards to Philip Rivers, right, It's you know,
(25:17):
Adrian Peterson running all over you. It's Colin Kaepernick having
an all time day in a playoff game.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
So that's why I take things with a grain of salt.
What I love about this defense is, and I wrote
about this in the column on Tuesday, it's a good defense.
It's a very good defense. They're six in total yards.
They're first and passing plays allowed, passing yards allowed per
pass play, they're first against the run. They're pretty good
(25:46):
in all the situational phases of the game. But this
group wants to be iconic. They want to be legendary,
and that's what they're trying to work towards. It's so
much different when you're trying to do that as opposed to, Hey,
how do we prevent the opposing quarterback from throwing four
hundred yards and four touchdowns against us? That's not the
problem right now. It's how can we go from being
(26:06):
a good defense to being exceptional? That that's the exciting
part about it. You're absolutely right though there's things they
got to clean up. I would like to say this,
and I know we only have so much time. Hannah's
got to get to lunch at some point. I want
everybody to be able to go about their day. But
just to touch on the hip drop tackle really quick,
because you had to edit this an insider inbox and
(26:27):
I would love to hear your take on it. I
did a lot of research on the hip drop tackle.
I was at the owner's meetings when it all got
approved and everything. My original belief, and maybe you watch
a lot more outside football than I do. I've not
seen it called yet in terms of a flag. My
original belief when that the league originally sold this was we,
much like the crown of the Helmet rule with running backs,
(26:48):
is we are going to try. We want to make
the game safer. That's why the rules there. It should
absolutely be there, but you can't make it a flagable
offense or a finable offense without making it a flaggable offense.
So they were trying to catch it on review. You.
My understanding of the rule was that this is something
to prohibit the ball carriers downfield from being susceptible or
(27:09):
a scrambling quarterback can being susceptible if I've never seen
it called at all. I've never seen it happen within
the pocket when a quarterbacks of the process of getting sacked.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Okay, no, and and I hear what I hear what
you're saying.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
That I'm happy to be wrong here, but this is
why I.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Hear what you're saying. And I need I need to
look at the play again when I when I saw
the replay and I saw the way Parsons tackled Burset,
I thought, yeah, that pretty much looks like the definition
of the hip drop tackle. I understand why they threw
the flag. For me, I thought Burssett was kind of
scrambling and had gotten out of the pocket, so that's
why they threw the flag. Now, it is the first
(27:43):
time I've seen it thrown in a in a live game,
and I've heard other comments that this is only the
second time basically over the last two years since they
implemented this rule, it's only the second time that it
that it has been flagged during a game. What I
remember hearing from the league is that they the League
(28:03):
was essentially sending a message that they were fine with
adjudicating this with the fines after the fact they wanted.
They laid out all of the specific criteria and what
they wanted. They want the officials on the field to
be absolutely one hundred percent sure that that is what
they see if they're going to throw the flag in
(28:24):
the game, because they don't have a mechanism, which I
think is where the flaw is and the rule, they
don't have the mechanism within the rules to look at
it afterwards and decide, Okay, if they threw the flag,
can they pick it up and say and say no,
it's not right. So that's why it's been called very
(28:45):
very rarely. And we'll see if we hear later in
the week if Michael Parsons does get a fine for it.
I looked at one replay in the press box at
the time that it happened, and my initial reaction was, yeah,
I kind of get it. I can see I can
see why he through the flag there.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
I just can't believe they saw it, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
With you, No, and and and it's true because it
wasn't It wasn't a scramble way out into the open
field or anything. But I thought he was kind of
scrambling up the middle and had kind of gotten out
of the pocket. And and that's why that's why the flag.
It's it's a it's a tough one. It's a tough
one for defensive players, but it's it's really a matter
of as a defensive player, you have to train yourself,
(29:23):
I think now, in order to avoid this that when
you if you're grabbing onto somebody from behind, you have
to keep your own legs. You can't, yeah, you can't,
you know it. You can't think of a tackle as
trying to grab somebody and pull them back, because if
you to pull them back, you have to lift your
(29:44):
own legs and then and as you say, become weightless
and then and then that's what's going to lead to
the to the violation as opposed to it's almost more
like you have to grab and hang on, yeah, and
and uh and try to drag him down that way.
But but anyway, interesting discussion, and we'll see, we'll see
what happens if the if on the film review, if
(30:06):
Parsons does indeed get a fine and the league confirms
that the call in the field was right or or
perhaps not. But who do have some bills to pay,
so we better get to that and let's now hear
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about all the wonders of Wisconsin at Travel Wisconsin dot
com slash Wonders. Welcome back to Packers unscripted. Last thing
before we go, Wes is just looking at the NFC
(31:13):
as a whole. Right now. There are six teams in
the NFC at five and two. Six of them are
at five and two and because of a scheduling quirk
that gave the Packers an early buy and b the
rarity of an overtime tie. The Packers are the only
(31:36):
team in the NFC with just one loss, with the
with the four one and one record. But I'm telling you,
this is already shaping up. And I know we're going
to talk all about the Pittsburgh Steelers and Aaron Rodgers
in this next matchup on our next show. And we're
only in the middle of October here, but this is
already shaping up into a situation where there are going
(32:01):
to be some good teams in the NFC that will
not be able to crack that top seven and get
into the postseason. That's just that's the way this is
looking now. Obviously, anything can change, injuries and all that
will affect lots of teams moving forward, all that kind
of stuff. But man, a four to one on one
team and then six teams at five and two all
(32:23):
in the same conference. Yeah, this is crazy.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
It's crazy. They're mostly coming out of two divisions too, right,
Like the North and the West are again going to
be just meat grinders, Right, You're going to get a
champion from the East, you know, potentially here it'll look
like it'll be Philly. You're gonna get a champion from
the South. It's definitely looking like it's gonna be Tampa, Tampa.
But my goodness, this race in those other two divisions
(32:46):
is going to be wild to watch. I mean, the
Bears took care of business against the Saints. They did
exactly what a good football team should do against a
bad football team.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
And the Bears are the team that's right below all
the five and two teams because they're at four and
two because they've also had an early buy Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
And then you know, you look at how this is
unfolded in so many different ways. It's just hilarious. Where
you know, certainly the Cowboys just went and gave it
to the Washington Commanders at the same time, so they
go to three, three and one. The same time, the
Carolina Panthers have one of the most wacky games that
you're going to see against a winless Jets team in
(33:22):
which they lose Bryce Young, so Andy Dalton has to
finish that game. It just, dude, it just shows you
we focused so much on well, it wasn't the prettiest win.
The scratching and clawing that has happened in the NFL
so far this season for victories, there have been so
few examples of like the Kansas City Chiefs just destroying
the Las Vegas Raiders. All most of these games have
(33:45):
been so down to the wire. You look at what
happened with Denver, I mean the ending of that game, as.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
The Giants man the Broncos score thirty three points in
the fourth quarter when they entered the fourth quarter with zero,
which is an NFL record for a team that was
shut out through three quarters to put up thirty three
in the fourth and get the win, mostly thanks to
the Giants kicker missing a couple of extra points. Yeah,
in that game. I mean, just you know that crazy
(34:11):
crazy stuff. Here's the other thing all throughout there when
we're talking about scheduling quirks and whatnot. That So one
of these six five and two teams in the NFC
is the Los Angeles Rams. And I think the Rams
are you know, I mean, their defense is good Stafford
and DeVante Adams, and you know what they're doing on offense,
they're they're seem to be getting it going. The Los
Angeles Rams are five and oh against the AFC and
(34:33):
oh and two against the NFC, and now all they
have left after their bye week coming back from London,
all they have left or NFC opponents the rest of
the season is because they played five AFC games, five
games against AFC teams and they've won them all. So
that so that's how they got there. They're at five
and two. There's just there's weird stuff going on. It's
(34:53):
it's weird, and there's there's all these things that are
going to be sorted out over the next I mean,
what is this going to be two and a half
months deflee before the end of the regular season. All
kinds of stuff to be sorted out. But man, this
looks like this just looks nuts.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Right now, you go over to the AFC and the
Colts are just beating the Chargers and they're at six
wins already. I wonder how many people had the Colts
for six or fewer wins on the season, right and
now they're off to the start that they're off to.
It's fun, man, it's a fun game. It's a week
to week league. Philadelphia goes from the world is against them,
Zadarius Smith is retiring, Jalen Hurts can do no right,
(35:30):
and then suddenly he goes up against Minnesota and can
do no wrong.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
One fifty eight point three maximum passer rating on the
road at us Bank Stadium, and the Eagles get a
win over Minnesota.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Yeah, and it's fun. This is the best thing about
football though, right Nobody saw Indianapolis coming. Nobody saw, I mean,
to an extent, the new New England Patriots coming. They're
fine to two right, the Baltimore is one in five.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
That's the thing. The three, the three teams right now,
the three teams in the NFL that are on the
longest current winning streaks, the Colts, the Patriots, and the Bears.
Like who would have who th middle of October, in
the middle of October that the three longest active winning
streaks in the NFL right now would be the Colts, Patriots,
(36:16):
and Bears. But that's where we are. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Four wins that are wow. Yeah, I mean, football's fun. Man.
Oh and then, by the way, the Green Bay Packers
are going to Pittsburgh on Sunday, Sunday night Footbriday Night
Football against and Aaron Rodgers.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
Against the former quarterback here, the four time MVP, the
future Hall of Famer Aaron Rodgers. We got all that
to talk about on our next show, but we got
to call it a rap on this show. So be
sure to follow all of our coverage of the team
on Packers dot com all week long, everything leading up
to the showdown with the Steelers. We'll have it for
(36:53):
you on our website for Wes. I am Mike. Thank
you for tuning in everybody. We will see you next time.
Hi, everybody, Welcome to another edition of Packers Unscripted from
Packers dot Com. I am Mike Spaffer, joined as always
by my partner and everything Packers, Wes Hodkwitz. Coming to
you hear from our studios at lambeau Field to discuss
wes a twenty seven to twenty three victory in the
desert over the Arizona Cardinals. It wasn't pretty by any stretch.
(00:28):
But as I wrote at the very beginning of my
game recap, after getting on the bus for that long
ride to the airport out there, going from Glendale to
the stadium in Glendale to the airport in Phoenix, this
game was all about which team executed at crunch time,
(00:49):
and in this game, that was the Green Bay Packers.
Speaker 2 (00:53):
Yeah, it was funny, Okay, So you and I were
sitting there at the press conference on Monday morning, so
a lot of the media are still coming back. Bill
Huber's there with us, Jason Wildey to credential journalists who
do not travel, so they were able to be there
for the press conference while a lot of the other
beatcorps were still on their way back from Arizona. And
(01:13):
it was funny listening we all kind of were just
filibustering and talking amongst ourselves about like, there's there's so
much that happened in this game, you couldn't really cover
all of it. Yeah right, I mean in that it's
the NFL. There's a lot of variables, there's a lot
of players, there's a lot of situations. I thought you
did a great job, you know, with one of your
game stories, kind of like really zeroing in on that,
you know, fourth down conversion. I mean, that might end
(01:35):
up going down as one of the biggest plays of
the Packers season. But I was just sitting there thinking
to myself, like Lucas Haversk's sixty one yard field goal
franchise record critical time, kind of gave them some juice
back a little bit at a time in which they
needed it. Micah Parsons has these three sacks, and two
of them in the fourth quarter, four pressures in the
fourth quarter, has one of the best games of his career.
(01:57):
Was a nuisance for all four quarters for Arizona to
deal with, and they were trying to match up with
him one on one. But then you think about it,
You're like, well, Rashan Gary had the strip sack that
allowed the Packers to turn the tide to ten point swing.
Speaker 1 (02:10):
They can Packers first takeaway since week three.
Speaker 2 (02:12):
Yes, and like the ends up becoming a Josh Jacobs touchdown.
Josh Jacobs scores two touchdowns. Josh Jacobs had a calf
injury that developed on Friday, didn't know whether he was
gonna play. He was a game time decision. The Packers
end up having a situation where they're playing doesn't leave
at the right time, so then they're delayed back in
Green Bay and they get in late, and Josh Jacobs
(02:32):
has to cancel plans with his family, and the list
goes on and on and on of stuff that happened.
But to your an intro, to me is what mattered
the most. Yeah, and that's when the Packers needed to win.
The football game wasn't perfect three first three quarters, but
the defense, after struggling to keep teams out of the
end zone the last few weeks, had some big stops.
(02:54):
And offensively, I mean, Jordan Love has just been nails man.
I mean when they've needed big moments like that fourth
down pass to Tucker Kraft for fifteen yards. That really
that's where the game was decided. Love lafleor this team
they trusted in each other. They picked up their fourth
winning the season.
Speaker 1 (03:12):
It was quite the sequence there down the stretch because
the Cardinals had taken a twenty three to twenty lead,
the Packers' offense had stalled out, they had to punt.
It was on the defense at that point to get
the ball back to not allow it to become a
two score game, and it came down to a fourth
(03:32):
and one right near midfield. The Cardinals decided to go
for it. Not a huge surprise the way the game
has played these days. I still thought, maybe just because
of how they had drawn the Packers offside a couple
of times during the game, that maybe they were gonna
bluff and see if they could just get the free
five yards on the fourth and one. But they tried
the sneak with Jacoby Burssett, got stuffed, gave the short
(03:55):
field to the Packers the fourth and two. The Packers
had lost a yard on a third and one, and
Matt Lafleur explained on Monday, it was going backwards there
from third and one to fourth and two that initially
he's like, all right, I'm just going to kick the
field goal and then he saw the look on Jordan
Love's face called the time out to reconsider, think about
(04:20):
it a little bit more like, all right, nope, let's
go for the first down. You mentioned it's the past
to Craft, who's actually the third option on the play.
It was a kind of a bunch formation to the left,
three receivers, three different routes. You got an out to
the sticks, you gotta pivot inside to the sticks, and
then you've got Craft on the corner route, which is
really the only downfield route of the combination. And he's
(04:43):
the third option on the play. Love sees the other
two guys are covered. He's got to put it out
there for Craft. He makes the catch, gets the feed
in bounds, and then Josh Jacobs finishes the deal three
straight runs, punches it into the end zone, and then
the defense then with a four point lead, as opposed
to if the Packers had kicked and tied the game,
the defense would have had to stop the Cardinals from
(05:05):
getting a field goal. They had the whole field to defend.
The Packers were up by four, Cardinals needed to get
a touchdown. Sure enough, the Cardinals got into field goal range,
but Micah Parsons third sack of the game comes out
of big time, sets them up in tough down and distance.
It eventually becomes a fourth and ten, fourth and eleven
situation and a heave to the end zone, which was act.
(05:27):
I didn't realize this at the time because it was
in the end zone that was opposite of the press box.
But the pass was actually caught. It was just caught
out the back of the end zone, you know, well
out of bounds crunch time. I said this. I said
this an insider inbox. And there's a lot to cover
from this game, as you mentioned. But in the NFL,
(05:48):
where the margins are so slim, failing in crunch time
can undo a lot of good football, yep. And succeeding
in crunch time can cover up for some bad football.
And at the end of the days, it's about getting wins.
Lafleur said it himself on Monday. This is a results
oriented business. What everyone the only thing anybody cares about
(06:11):
is whether you win or lose the game at the
end of the day. And this was one that you know,
this was one to me it felt like the Packers
quite frankly escaped Arizona because they had trailed trailed for
most of the game, and things did not look good
until that fourth and one stop on the quarterback sneak.
Speaker 2 (06:32):
I'm glad it went down the way it did, though,
because we saw in Cleveland where they you know, kind
of controlled that game against the Browns the entire time,
but then had it slip away from them in the
waning moments exactly almost the same spot that the Cardinals
were in with this game. With a few more points
put on the board, this time, Green Bay had to
play the role of the comeback. And I'll tell you what, Mike,
(06:54):
when it was thirteen to three, the kind of felt
a little I don't want to say insurmountable, but it
was getting it to be a dire straight there because
it's like, Okay, well this offense with Jacoby Brissett, which
just had three hundred and twenty passing yards of the
previous week, well, now he is clicking with Trey McBride.
Marvin Harrison has a little bit of scare there with
an incomplete pass, but then he's making explosive plays. And
(07:15):
Marvin Harrison, man, there's a couple mentals, you know, concentration
things he has to get sorted out. But when that
guy figures it all out, is going to be a
real problem for this league, just like he was in college.
I mean, his talent is limitless, needless to say so Arizona,
who's had a litany of different running backs, they're on
their backup quarterback. Things are really trending in the opposite,
(07:39):
in the wrong direction, and in my opinion, I felt
like not to jump into some of stuff I'm sure
you want to talk about. For Green Bay to make
a gutsy call there, especially after everything that happened with
Dallas last month, to try to get one play with
one time out left, to give yourself a shot at
a field goal. That was the turning point in that game.
(08:05):
Romeo Dobbs, that's the guy for Jordan Love gets twenty
two yards there just enough room for Lucas Haversec and
that unit to go out there. And his Haversack was
talking to me about in the locker room afterwards. You know,
he didn't have a great pre game, he wasn't feeling awesome,
but as he said, sometimes you just have to focus
and you have to put everything away from and just
(08:25):
be like all the reps, all the time that you've
put into this thing, and the guy went out there
and hit a field goal about as solid as you
can hit one. Yeah, and the Packers go into the
halftime down only by one score.
Speaker 1 (08:36):
Yeah. I mean I even thought after the completion to
Dobbs there and the time out there's one second on
the clock, I thought, oh, you know, now they'll just
try hail Mary. I mean, I just I didn't think,
you know, a substitute kicker, you know that you're going
to try a sixty one yarder. And it wasn't one
of those where he it wasn't one of those long
kicks where it's like low trajectory and maybe flutters alone
(09:00):
little bit and somehow just clears the crossbar. I mean,
it was the right type of trajectory of the kick
and everything, and he just he just nailed it.
Speaker 2 (09:09):
It looked like a kickoff.
Speaker 1 (09:10):
Yeah, I mean, it was really impressive. He gets the
franchise record. There are three yards longer than any field
goal in franchise history. Mason crosby fifty eight yarder at
the Metrodome in twenty eleven against the Vikings was the
previous franchise record. Hats off to Haversick. As you said earlier,
(09:31):
I thought it did. I thought it did give the
Packers a little bit of juice, and it didn't result
in an immediate change at the start of the second
half because the Packers offense stalled out again and punted
the ball, but the defense then on the opening possession
for the Cardinals of the second half, Rashan Gary gets
(09:52):
the strips at Kolbe. Wooden gets the pressure up the middle,
which then you know, Brisset adjusts himself in the pock
and then Gary's coming at him and knocks the ball out.
Evan Williams recovers a short field there, forty four yards
and a Packers offense that was just struggling suddenly just
(10:13):
takes four plays forty four yards in the end zone.
And the combination of that with the three points on
the sixty one yard or at the end of the
first half, the thirteen to three deficits erased. It's thirteen
to thirteen. It's a brand new ballgame. You've got most
of the second half left to go, and at that
point it's like, all right, here we go. Who's going
to take this thing?
Speaker 2 (10:31):
For sure? And I'm glad you mentioned the Wooden thing too,
because Micah Parsons went out of his way to praise
Kobe Wooden after the game for not only the play
that you mentioned there, but some of the stuff that
he set up for Parsons as well. Kobe had probably
with right along with the Lions game, probably his best
game of the season inside, both against the run and
also getting some push. That's what they missed with Devonte
(10:52):
Wide is being able to collapse that pocket a little
bit and against quarterbacks that want to stand in there
and get the ball out quick, that's really what you
need most, even more than edge ushers at that point.
So that being said, the Packers have shown in affinity
in this early part of the season to get out
of the blocks quick for the most part in the
second half, that has been the probably the hallmark of
(11:13):
this team. The biggest complimentary phase of football that they've
played is their ability to win. The defenses is giving
up some points. The offense responds. When the offense has
struggled to get going, it's the defense that's keeping them minute.
And in this particular case, I thought it was the
best example of both sides picking each other up because
once again Josh Jacobs did get going out for people.
(11:35):
I kind of breezed right through that. But the situation
on Friday was he ends up tweaking his calf, you know,
and in practice it was a full participant, but it
was something he had coming out of practice, and he's
really it was touch and go whether or not he
was going to be able to play in this thing,
compounded by the fact that green Bay does have a
mechanical issue getting out, so they're waiting out in Green
(11:58):
Bay for about five hours. He said, you know, he's
direction the best he could. He was walking around, he
had a sleeve on it. It is just a nightmare
scenario for a running back to be going through this
and not being able to get treatment, you know, not
being able to get near rhythm.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
And then knowing you have a three and a half
hour flight, you've got to start in an airplane seat,
you know, before then you can get to the hotel
and get another round of treatment to see if you
can play the next day. I mean, you're right, it's
an absolute nightmare scenario from an injury standpoint.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
Yeah, And he said, you know, he ended up going
out for the pregame warm up, and you know, he
credited the packers' training staff staff he credit the coaches.
He was thankful for how much they are trying to
protect him. But he did say he's like, I know
my body, I've been through this before. He tweaked his
calf before in a game in twenty twenty two, I
believe it was before they played Seattle when he was
(12:45):
with the Raiders. The guy ends up going off for
three hundred and three yards from scrimmage in that game.
So he felt confident that if he could get himself
mentally to a certain point, he was going to be
able to do it. The Packers still were somewhat cautious
with him. It's why you only saw him take I
think it was ten snaps in the first half. Saw
a lot of Emmanuel Wilson Chris Brooks involvement, but when
the game was on the line, they turned back to
their running back. And I loved Matt Leaflour's comment, this
(13:08):
is zipping ahead a little bit. But the two back
to back runs that ultimately end up putting the Packers
in the lead for the first time all day. La
floor even equipped. While the offensive line had a pretty
soliday overall, not sure if they blocked anybody. In most
particular plays the seven yard run will not go down
in any NFL films highlight reels of Josh Jacobs. But
(13:29):
I thought that that play specific really epitomize what he's
been in Green Bay, and that is, when something's not there,
he makes something happen. And he pulled seven yards out
of nowhere to then put himself in a position from
the one yard line to punch that thing in. Put
Green Bay up with a buck fifty left. And as
Laflour said afterwards, the Packers do not win this game
(13:50):
without Josh Jacobs. He came to play.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
Yeah. And if you want to know, if you want
to get a sense of just the type of competitor
and passionate individual that Josh Jacobs is, take a look
on Packers dot Com at the locker room speech after
the game. Because this wasn't a locker room speech that
was just about Matt Lefuer giving out game balls, and
(14:12):
which he did to Lucas Haversick and to Uh, to
Micah Parsons and to Josh Jacobs. But look at what
Jacobs has to say, and look at how he says it,
and then take a look at what Tucker Craft has
to say. You're talking about a third year tight end
who's coming into his own makes the clutch catch on
fourth down. And the leadership that you're seeing from a
(14:37):
young guy like like Tucker Craft and what he means
to that locker room. I mean, it just it gives you.
It gives you a sense just watching that video. It's
just a couple of minutes long, but it gives you
a sense of of the the humans that are in
that locker room that they aren't just they aren't just
football players. And and for as ugly as this game was,
(14:59):
that times that win meant a lot to those guys.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Yeah, and I'm glad you brought that up by because
I got a little bit of salt and pepper in
my hair at this point. You know, I got a
couple of years under my belt, and one of the
things that's been eye opening for me the last two
seasons is much similar to probably like what you experienced
in nine and ten and eleven is you're starting to
see guys, I've I had a whole ten years on
the beat before Tucker Craft came into town, a whole
(15:26):
you know, thirteen years on the beat before Josh Jacobs
got signed. I saw Mercedes Lewis in that locker room,
Julius Pepper's in that locker room. You know, guys that
were the leaders back then. What I never experienced was,
for the most part, the young guys then picking up
those you know, those torches. Yeah, and that's what you're
(15:48):
seeing now. That's why Josh Shacobs is wearing a sea,
That's why Tucker Craft has that sea on his chest.
And when you see guys get drafted and then a
different era, a different generation of Packer players begins, it's
special to watch. And I'm sure you're gonna want to
get into it a little bit too. But I want
(16:08):
to say this. I mean the way that Micah Parsons
has brought himself into this locker room now and integrated
himself with his teammates. The fact that this guy's been
here for not even two months. Yes, he made a
lot of plays, but seeing the way that Xavier McKinney
reacted to him. So in the middle of parsons media
scrum with you know, Xavier McKinney's coming over and hooting
(16:30):
and hollering at him, you have all these guys that
are embracing him. That's where that culture comes from. That
when a new guy, doesn't matter if you're a superstar,
doesn't matter if you're an undrafted free agent. When that
guy comes into the fold, there is in opening it
and in just open arms around that individual. That's what
(16:51):
culture is and that's where the Packers are at.
Speaker 1 (16:53):
Yeah, and it's definitely played a factor for Green Bay
this year. I do want to say in addition with
regard to Parsons, because there were a lot of people,
you know, I don't know, call them the skeptics or
the haters or whatever. But parsons first game, he gets
his first sack against the Detroit Lions. But then you know,
(17:15):
there's all these folks out there, Oh it was garbage time.
The game had been put away. You know, that's all
you're gonna get for your one hundred and eighty eight
million dollars. Well, Michah Parsons got a sack of Dak
Prescott in overtime that saved a tie, turned to what
could have been a loss, in helping to get a
tie there for the Packers. In this game in Arizona,
he gets two third down sacks in the red zone
(17:38):
that force field goals. Those are four point plays. That's
Micah Parsons taking eight points off the board, and then
he gets the third sack in crunch time the final
drive when the Cardinals are knocking on the door to
the red zone. They're not quite there yet, but on
first down he buries Perseet, puts him in the long
(17:59):
yarded situation, and then ultimately it becomes the turnover on downs.
With the fourth down heave to the end zone out
the back Micah Parsons. He I'm not sure why the
Cardinals decided to try to block him the way that
they did, but man, he he made plays in the
(18:22):
biggest moments of this game, and not any not players
like that. You can't do that every single week. That's
not how the league works. But when you do it
in a game like this, like Micah Parsons did, that's
why Michaeh Parsons gets the contract that he gets, because
it's games like this that you don't You don't get
the win without those plays that he made.
Speaker 2 (18:44):
Bottom line, Yeah, I take a little bit of different
viewpoint about how the Cardinals defended him because or I
guess it'd be defend the offense defending the defend player.
But how they you know, they matched up with him.
I have no problem with the fact that they tried
to go one on one with him early on. I
on a respect it. I think that's the way this
game is played. I think it is trying to figure out, Hey,
comparis Johnson handled this guy, and that's your best on
(19:07):
best if you're if your left tackle can take care
of him. That The Packers won a lot of football
games over the years by David Baktiari doing that sort
of thing. What surprised me is he was giving them
all sorts of problems for the first three quarters. I
am stunned with their approach to him in the fourth quarter. Yeah,
that's where I would have thought you would have had
the added attention. Now, you gotta remember, I don't know
how much too tight end they operate in. Trey McBride
(19:29):
is basically out on every single route. He's not He
might chip here and there, but he's not staying in
as an inline blocker. And I you know, it is
what it is. But what I loved about Parsons in
this game. And I'm telling you, man, I got home
next day, I'm sitting down with my dad eating some
food and we're kind of breaking down the game a
little bit, and I said to him, I'm like, this
(19:50):
is the best defensive player I've covered. I didn't get
Charles Woodson during the NFL Defensive Player of the Year
like you did. I didn't get Klay Matthews the first
two seasons like you did. Since two thousand twelve, this
is the most impactful player I've witnessed because it's all
over the place. I mean, Sadarius Smith had some great moments.
Clay Matthews was phenomenal at times, well, phenomenal a lot,
(20:11):
but I mean like dominant at times. You know, Julius
Pepper's brought something in the mid two thousands. Micah Parsons
is one of the elite of the elite, and when
you watch that guy play snap after snap, down after down,
it is incredible. I don't know if you saw the statistic, Michael,
but right now, and I think it's through NFLGSIS or
(20:32):
in next gen stats, but pars is on pace for
over one hundred pressures this season. And if I saw
the statistic right last year with Shaun Gary led the
Packers with forty nine, Mike is almost at forty already.
The sacks, the relentlessness, I think He's been much better
against the run than people give him credit for. I
think he's been tenacious. I think he's been really gap
(20:55):
sound when the instances that he's been put in that position.
Oh and then, by the way, they were down Lucas
Vans in this game, and yet they still had twelve
quarterback hits, they still had six sacks. Kingsleyanning Bari played
a whale of a football game the Packers. When you
talk about guys that are bringing out the best not
only in themselves but the rest of the squad, Michaeh
(21:15):
Parsons is that dude, and I am so excited to
see where this season goes for him. Him and Rashan
Gary now both at five and a half sacks on
the year. I felt like that game in itself was
something Green Bay's defense can really build on, even though
there were plenty of things to clean up, you know,
throughout Yeah.
Speaker 1 (21:32):
I was asked about Parsons in the Insider inbox and
the answer that I wrote on the plane flight on
the way back was that he's the most relentless defensive
player that I've ever covered. And that's saying something because
I don't want to take anything away from Clay Matthews,
because when Clay Matthews was in his heyday, he was
awfully relentless as a pass rusher. But I think Micah
(21:53):
Parsons is another step above that, and that's saying something.
Couple things to touch on, though, and these are I
guess I would say the area is to clean up
for the Packers. The penalties were an issue in this game.
Mikeah Parsons was guilty of a couple of them. He got,
I know, we don't have time to go into the
(22:15):
whole hip drop tackle thing, but he also jumped off
side for like the third or fourth time or whatever
this year, so he's got some stuff to work on.
The offense had the pre snap penalties, so the penalties
are definitely an issue. What really hurt the defense in
this game was the third and longs. Yeah, I mean
(22:38):
you've got and the third and twenty three was a
combination in the sense of Baron Surrell, the rookie jumps
off side, Jacoby Burssett sees the flag and knows he's
got a free play on third and twenty twenty three,
so he just chucks it, you know, down the field.
Evan Williams can't quite get over there in time to
break up the deep ball, and it gets caught for
(22:59):
a forty three yard games So you give up a
third and twenty three, But you gave that up in
part because you gave the quarterback a free play. He
was able to take the deep shot downfield later in
the game a third and fourteen. I mean, that's for
the way the Packers defense is played, and particularly on
third down this season. These types of plays are the
(23:20):
highest percentage that you get for Green Bay's defense. But
we heard from Matt Lafleur on Monday is a zone
defense that was called, but Nate Hobbs was playing pressman,
so there was some sort of a miscommunication there. He
gets attacked as the pressman corner, but the rest of
the secondary's not in that type of coverage and so
you end up giving up a third and fourteen. That one,
(23:42):
as well as the third and twenty three in the
first half, both lead to touchdowns for the Cardinals. My
point in saying all this, but what gets frustrating is
it's sort of repeating some points along the way, But
it is clear and obvious the plays that are there
that the Packers' defense needs to make. So when this
(24:05):
defense is struggling, I don't think it's that far off
because it shouldn't be. They shouldn't be giving up a
third and twenty three. They shouldn't be giving up a
third and fourteen. But they've got to start making those
plays and then this defense can get back to looking
like the unit that it was in the first couple
weeks of the season. So I know there's frustration out
(24:25):
there and the players themselves. We heard from Xavier McKinney
after the game. He's not happy with how the defense
played in this game. They know they can play better,
they know that they need to play better. But I'm
to me, it's to me, it's not something where they're
just like way off. It's about certain instances situational football
where they need to hold their water at the line
(24:46):
of scrimmage and then execute the call and get and
have everybody on the same page to execute that call.
And I think this defense gets back to where it was.
Speaker 2 (24:55):
Yeah, I think what's fun for me? And I know everybody,
especially the critics of the Wes Hodquitz insider in boxes,
we'll say it's being way too you know, rose colored
glasses and sunny side up here. But I'll tell you what,
when you talk about defenses that struggle, it's given up
five hundred passing yards to Philip Rivers, right, It's you know,
(25:17):
Adrian Peterson running all over you. It's Colin Kaepernick having
an all time day in a playoff game.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (25:26):
So that's why I take things with a grain of salt.
What I love about this defense is, and I wrote
about this in the column on Tuesday, it's a good defense.
It's a very good defense. They're six in total yards.
They're first and passing plays allowed, passing yards allowed per
pass play, they're first against the run. They're pretty good
(25:46):
in all the situational phases of the game. But this
group wants to be iconic. They want to be legendary,
and that's what they're trying to work towards. It's so
much different when you're trying to do that as opposed to, Hey,
how do we prevent the opposing quarterback from throwing four
hundred yards and four touchdowns against us? That's not the
problem right now. It's how can we go from being
(26:06):
a good defense to being exceptional? That that's the exciting
part about it. You're absolutely right though there's things they
got to clean up. I would like to say this,
and I know we only have so much time. Hannah's
got to get to lunch at some point. I want
everybody to be able to go about their day. But
just to touch on the hip drop tackle really quick,
because you had to edit this an insider inbox and
(26:27):
I would love to hear your take on it. I
did a lot of research on the hip drop tackle.
I was at the owner's meetings when it all got
approved and everything. My original belief, and maybe you watch
a lot more outside football than I do. I've not
seen it called yet in terms of a flag. My
original belief when that the league originally sold this was we,
much like the crown of the Helmet rule with running backs,
(26:48):
is we are going to try. We want to make
the game safer. That's why the rules there. It should
absolutely be there, but you can't make it a flagable
offense or a finable offense without making it a flaggable offense.
So they were trying to catch it on review. You.
My understanding of the rule was that this is something
to prohibit the ball carriers downfield from being susceptible or
(27:09):
a scrambling quarterback can being susceptible if I've never seen
it called at all. I've never seen it happen within
the pocket when a quarterbacks of the process of getting sacked.
Speaker 1 (27:17):
Okay, no, and and I hear what I hear what
you're saying.
Speaker 2 (27:20):
That I'm happy to be wrong here, but this is
why I.
Speaker 1 (27:22):
Hear what you're saying. And I need I need to
look at the play again when I when I saw
the replay and I saw the way Parsons tackled Burset,
I thought, yeah, that pretty much looks like the definition
of the hip drop tackle. I understand why they threw
the flag. For me, I thought Burssett was kind of
scrambling and had gotten out of the pocket, so that's
why they threw the flag. Now, it is the first
(27:43):
time I've seen it thrown in a in a live game,
and I've heard other comments that this is only the
second time basically over the last two years since they
implemented this rule, it's only the second time that it
that it has been flagged during a game. What I
remember hearing from the league is that they the League
(28:03):
was essentially sending a message that they were fine with
adjudicating this with the fines after the fact they wanted.
They laid out all of the specific criteria and what
they wanted. They want the officials on the field to
be absolutely one hundred percent sure that that is what
they see if they're going to throw the flag in
(28:24):
the game, because they don't have a mechanism, which I
think is where the flaw is and the rule, they
don't have the mechanism within the rules to look at
it afterwards and decide, Okay, if they threw the flag,
can they pick it up and say and say no,
it's not right. So that's why it's been called very
(28:45):
very rarely. And we'll see if we hear later in
the week if Michael Parsons does get a fine for it.
I looked at one replay in the press box at
the time that it happened, and my initial reaction was, yeah,
I kind of get it. I can see I can
see why he through the flag there.
Speaker 2 (29:00):
I just can't believe they saw it, to be honest.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
With you, No, and and and it's true because it
wasn't It wasn't a scramble way out into the open
field or anything. But I thought he was kind of
scrambling up the middle and had kind of gotten out
of the pocket. And and that's why that's why the flag.
It's it's a it's a tough one. It's a tough
one for defensive players, but it's it's really a matter
of as a defensive player, you have to train yourself,
(29:23):
I think now, in order to avoid this that when
you if you're grabbing onto somebody from behind, you have
to keep your own legs. You can't, yeah, you can't,
you know it. You can't think of a tackle as
trying to grab somebody and pull them back, because if
you to pull them back, you have to lift your
(29:44):
own legs and then and as you say, become weightless
and then and then that's what's going to lead to
the to the violation as opposed to it's almost more
like you have to grab and hang on, yeah, and
and uh and try to drag him down that way.
But but anyway, interesting discussion, and we'll see, we'll see
what happens if the if on the film review, if
(30:06):
Parsons does indeed get a fine and the league confirms
that the call in the field was right or or
perhaps not. But who do have some bills to pay,
so we better get to that and let's now hear
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about all the wonders of Wisconsin at Travel Wisconsin dot
com slash Wonders. Welcome back to Packers unscripted. Last thing
before we go, Wes is just looking at the NFC
(31:13):
as a whole. Right now. There are six teams in
the NFC at five and two. Six of them are
at five and two and because of a scheduling quirk
that gave the Packers an early buy and b the
rarity of an overtime tie. The Packers are the only
(31:36):
team in the NFC with just one loss, with the
with the four one and one record. But I'm telling you,
this is already shaping up. And I know we're going
to talk all about the Pittsburgh Steelers and Aaron Rodgers
in this next matchup on our next show. And we're
only in the middle of October here, but this is
already shaping up into a situation where there are going
(32:01):
to be some good teams in the NFC that will
not be able to crack that top seven and get
into the postseason. That's just that's the way this is
looking now. Obviously, anything can change, injuries and all that
will affect lots of teams moving forward, all that kind
of stuff. But man, a four to one on one
team and then six teams at five and two all
(32:23):
in the same conference. Yeah, this is crazy.
Speaker 2 (32:25):
It's crazy. They're mostly coming out of two divisions too, right,
Like the North and the West are again going to
be just meat grinders, Right, You're going to get a
champion from the East, you know, potentially here it'll look
like it'll be Philly. You're gonna get a champion from
the South. It's definitely looking like it's gonna be Tampa, Tampa.
But my goodness, this race in those other two divisions
(32:46):
is going to be wild to watch. I mean, the
Bears took care of business against the Saints. They did
exactly what a good football team should do against a
bad football team.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
And the Bears are the team that's right below all
the five and two teams because they're at four and
two because they've also had an early buy Yeah.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
And then you know, you look at how this is
unfolded in so many different ways. It's just hilarious. Where
you know, certainly the Cowboys just went and gave it
to the Washington Commanders at the same time, so they
go to three, three and one. The same time, the
Carolina Panthers have one of the most wacky games that
you're going to see against a winless Jets team in
(33:22):
which they lose Bryce Young, so Andy Dalton has to
finish that game. It just, dude, it just shows you
we focused so much on well, it wasn't the prettiest win.
The scratching and clawing that has happened in the NFL
so far this season for victories, there have been so
few examples of like the Kansas City Chiefs just destroying
the Las Vegas Raiders. All most of these games have
(33:45):
been so down to the wire. You look at what
happened with Denver, I mean the ending of that game, as.
Speaker 1 (33:49):
The Giants man the Broncos score thirty three points in
the fourth quarter when they entered the fourth quarter with zero,
which is an NFL record for a team that was
shut out through three quarters to put up thirty three
in the fourth and get the win, mostly thanks to
the Giants kicker missing a couple of extra points. Yeah,
in that game. I mean, just you know that crazy
(34:11):
crazy stuff. Here's the other thing all throughout there when
we're talking about scheduling quirks and whatnot. That So one
of these six five and two teams in the NFC
is the Los Angeles Rams. And I think the Rams
are you know, I mean, their defense is good Stafford
and DeVante Adams, and you know what they're doing on offense,
they're they're seem to be getting it going. The Los
Angeles Rams are five and oh against the AFC and
(34:33):
oh and two against the NFC, and now all they
have left after their bye week coming back from London,
all they have left or NFC opponents the rest of
the season is because they played five AFC games, five
games against AFC teams and they've won them all. So
that so that's how they got there. They're at five
and two. There's just there's weird stuff going on. It's
(34:53):
it's weird, and there's there's all these things that are
going to be sorted out over the next I mean,
what is this going to be two and a half
months deflee before the end of the regular season. All
kinds of stuff to be sorted out. But man, this
looks like this just looks nuts.
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Right now, you go over to the AFC and the
Colts are just beating the Chargers and they're at six
wins already. I wonder how many people had the Colts
for six or fewer wins on the season, right and
now they're off to the start that they're off to.
It's fun, man, it's a fun game. It's a week
to week league. Philadelphia goes from the world is against them,
Zadarius Smith is retiring, Jalen Hurts can do no right,
(35:30):
and then suddenly he goes up against Minnesota and can
do no wrong.
Speaker 1 (35:33):
One fifty eight point three maximum passer rating on the
road at us Bank Stadium, and the Eagles get a
win over Minnesota.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Yeah, and it's fun. This is the best thing about
football though, right Nobody saw Indianapolis coming. Nobody saw, I mean,
to an extent, the new New England Patriots coming. They're
fine to two right, the Baltimore is one in five.
Speaker 1 (35:54):
That's the thing. The three, the three teams right now,
the three teams in the NFL that are on the
longest current winning streaks, the Colts, the Patriots, and the Bears.
Like who would have who th middle of October, in
the middle of October that the three longest active winning
streaks in the NFL right now would be the Colts, Patriots,
(36:16):
and Bears. But that's where we are. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (36:18):
Four wins that are wow. Yeah, I mean, football's fun. Man.
Oh and then, by the way, the Green Bay Packers
are going to Pittsburgh on Sunday, Sunday night Footbriday Night
Football against and Aaron Rodgers.
Speaker 1 (36:31):
Against the former quarterback here, the four time MVP, the
future Hall of Famer Aaron Rodgers. We got all that
to talk about on our next show, but we got
to call it a rap on this show. So be
sure to follow all of our coverage of the team
on Packers dot com all week long, everything leading up
to the showdown with the Steelers. We'll have it for
(36:53):
you on our website for Wes. I am Mike. Thank
you for tuning in everybody. We will see you next time.
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