Patriots Catch-22 10/22: 3 Up/Down vs. Titans, Drake Maye/Offensive Breakdown, Browns Preview

Tune-in as Evan Lazar and Alex Barth breakdown the Patriots 31-13 win on the road over the Tennessee Titans. They give their three positive and negative takeaways from the game including the run game, offensive line play, Drake Maye's decision making and more. They breakdown how Drake Maye and the offense have progressed and certain areas they can improve. Plus, the preview the Patriots matchup with the Cleveland Browns and their dominant defense at Gillette Stadium on Sunday.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
On Twitter asking you this is the Patriots Catch twenty
two podcasts with Evan Lazar and Alex Bars, Bizarre and Lazarre.

Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hello, everybody nailed it?

Speaker 3 (00:15):
Joined us always by our Bara. Here is Evan Lazar
and Alex Bars.

Speaker 4 (00:23):
I think that the hardest part of breaking down tape
is breaking down the run game because it's never one thing,
Like it's always a bunch of different things on one
play that.

Speaker 2 (00:34):
Leads to a bad run.

Speaker 4 (00:36):
It's very seldom like I can just look at this
and say this one thing, if they just fix this
one thing, then the whole thing will work right. Like
It's like that really doesn't happen a whole lot with
the run game. Well, Patriots got the run game going
just a little bit, a little bit on Sunday in
the first half. I want to discuss that, Alex, you know,

(00:58):
a much better game performance. And I want to talk
about the why, because we talk about the why on
this show and how we get there and all those
different types of things. And we're gonna talk Drake May
and this Titans game. We're gonna talk a little bit
of Cleveland Browns because I I do think this is
a fun game for a defensive. You know, Drake May

(01:18):
against the Browns defense, it's probably the best defense he's
gonna face, maybe all year on Sunday. So I don't
know if Dylan Gabriel and the Browns offense is gonna
be able to go, you know, toe to toe, so
to speak, with Drake May enough to really put some
pressure on the Patriots offense to score. But I'm interested

(01:41):
in all of that. I'm jumping right into it today. Sorry,
I you know, didn't even exchange any pleasantries, you know.
We I was told Alex, and it's Alex, it's Evan,
it's Alex behind the glass, Patriots catch twenty two, here
with you for the next couple of hours. And I
was told by somebody on Twitter, Uh, just now, Alex,

(02:02):
that we bicker too much during the show, and therefore
this person feels as though that ruins some of the
vibe of the show and the show. I couldn't disagree more.
It's a talk show there. I'll take feedback. I try
my best. Sometimes I get a little snarky with feedback.
I'm not gonna lie, but I try my best to

(02:23):
take feedback. But this is one piece of feedback that
is never going to go away, like we are never
going to stop bickering like siblings.

Speaker 2 (02:31):
There's no show away, that's not a show.

Speaker 4 (02:34):
We were texting last night and we were bickering at
each other about our athletic date that you just hadsane
what means I had an insane take? You you're telling
me that you know we don't have to get into it.
It's fine, but yes we we. This is what we do.
We do it twenty four to seven. This is just
our natural existence, this is our natural state of our friendship,

(02:55):
and it's that's not going away.

Speaker 2 (02:57):
We just both like to argue. Both competitive.

Speaker 3 (02:59):
So yeah, so that's a very good point.

Speaker 2 (03:01):
You can be competitive without having been an athlete, as
you would put.

Speaker 4 (03:04):
It, that's a very good point. We are both competitive
and we both like to argue, and so then we
get into these sometimes admittedly semantics arguments that we both
are just not going to move off of our stance
on it, and we do get bogged down, and I
try to move the show along when those things happen.

(03:25):
So I just want to have a little fun with that.
That's who we are. That's the show. But anyways, to
football and to the Patriots. So one of the big
themes that I opened last week's show with when we
were talking about the run game and the way defenses
were defending Drake May and this Patriots offense, we talked

(03:47):
a lot about.

Speaker 3 (03:48):
The safety structures.

Speaker 4 (03:49):
Right, Are they playing a lot of single high Are
they playing a lot of too high safety shells in
this game? And now I'll put this caveat on this.
This is kind of what the Titans. This is their
system is to play a lot of two high shells.
The Browns, for example, play a lot of single high safety.
So this could be just simply the opponent in a

(04:10):
one week thing. But in this game, the Titans came
out first drive two high safeties, They had two high safeties,
they played with lighter boxes, And this was my whole
thing with the Patriots running game was My only concern
about the Patriots running game would be that when teams

(04:31):
start to adjust to how well Drake May is playing,
and they start to game plan the Patriots passing game,
and they start to take the Patriots passing game a
little bit more seriously and put a little bit more
respect on Stefan Diggs and Kaishan Boody and Pop Douglas
and the Patriots outside receivers. Once that happened, where the

(04:53):
Patriots gonna be able to run the football, because when
you're running into seven to eight man boxes all the time,
when there's an extra hat in the box, Like, if
you can't run against those fronts, it's not ideal. Like
I'm not saying that it's that you can never run
against the lam.

Speaker 2 (05:08):
You're just gonna have less success. When there's more defenders
in your way, You're gonna have less success.

Speaker 4 (05:11):
Right, especially on traditional runs. So the fact that they
were able to come out in this game and remondro
Stevenson on the opening drive goes for like eight yards
of carry, you know, I think it was forty two
yards on five carries on that opening drive. To me,
that really is the chess match, Like that is the
x's and o's chess match between play callers. Because now,

(05:33):
when the Titans give up all these rushing yards in
the first half, Dinard Wilson, their defensive coordinator, is kind
of playing a game of chicken with Josh McDaniels, right,
Like who is going to blink first? Is Josh McDaniels
gonna start spamming pass plays into two high shells, or
is Denard Wilson going to start playing one high to
get another defender in the box to stop the run.

(05:55):
In this case, it kind of happened, I would say,
more in the second quarter than it in the second half.
But in the second quarter they started to try to
fly that safety up and get more support in the
run game in the box, and Drake May in the
passing game opened it up and they started hitting throws
down the field. So if this is how they can

(06:17):
play offensively, it's a pick your poison league when it
comes to the scheme stuff. It's great news. Like this
is great news for the Patriots. Obviously, the way Drake
May is playing is great news on itself, but the
fact that they were able to go into this game
against the Titans, and I know it's not the eighty
five Bears, like they're not a great defense, but the
fact that they were able to go into this game

(06:38):
against the Titans and kind of play the way the
game dictated offensively and not force it one way or
another and still have success, whether it was running the
football against two high safety shells or throwing the ball.

Speaker 3 (06:51):
Once the Titans adjusted a little bit, that's good offense.

Speaker 4 (06:54):
Like that's when you know you have a really good
offense is when you can just kind of let the
game dictate what you call and how you run your offense.
So I was really encouraged by the fact that they
got the run game going a little bit in this
first half, not necessarily from a is it sustainable standpoint
or did they find something standpoint, but more because they're

(07:16):
responding to the chess match and they're able to take
advantage of the opportunities.

Speaker 2 (07:19):
And I do wonder if there was an element to
all of this of you know, becoming a mental thing.
And regardless of how they got it going against who
they got it going against, they got it going a
little bit, and it just you know, makes it easier
for everybody. Like you had, you know, you hit a
layup right right, you know, and out that running the
ball the Titans is the layup. Almost everybody pointed, well,
Jeffrey Simmons was out most of the game. He was

(07:42):
on the field for that first drive where they were
ripping it, yep. And let's not forget about Devandre Sweat.
He's also a really good player. So it's not like
you're running on both of them. But still a still
a good player. So I just think it was it
was probably helpful to just mentally that, like, hey, all right,
we got one, right, you know, we were able to
get it going, we were able to get it going

(08:03):
on the ground, We're able to lean on him up front,
and now you build on that going forward. It's gonna
be a lot harder this week. Brown's a number one
run defense in the league, which is kind of nuts
when you think about it for a team that is
losing as much as they are, yeah, and has opponents
running as much as they do to be that good
of a run defense, but they are, so I don't
think they're going for like one seventy this week like
they did against the Titans. That's probably a bit much.

(08:24):
But if they can have similar success in the in
the macro vision of it against the Browns, that would
be very encouraging.

Speaker 4 (08:32):
Yeah, you know, they were able to run the ball
early out of some three receiver sets, and I thought
in this game maccollins really stepped up and had probably
what I would say is like a peak mccollins game
when he is blocking well and he's catching some explosives
in the passing game, like that's the type of player
that he is when he's at his best, and he

(08:53):
had one of those games. I thought the tight ends
blocked a lot better in this game, Henry and Hooper
in line blocking, especially in the run game was much better.
So all of those things help, you know, when you
get those peripheral blocks and you block you know, edges,
and you block force defenders, and you block safeties and
linebackers up to the second level, like that's how you
turn some of these three four yard runs into sixteen

(09:15):
yard runs and you get those averages up that way.
And then that brings us to Drake May, who is
just continues to be on a heater. You know, I
said yesterday, and I want to get to some of it.
But you know, as we kind of unpack the good,
the bad and the stuff that gets you beat, don't
have a lot of stuff.

Speaker 2 (09:30):
To cut got them beating, really.

Speaker 4 (09:32):
But in terms of the good with Drake May, the passer,
the downfield, just the downfield throws are just really not
only are they increasing in volume, but the level of
difficulty on some of these throws it's extremely impressive to watch.
I think one of the things that's the most encouraging

(09:53):
to me from this game and just in general from
where Drake May is at right now, is how well
he's seeing the field and how well he's seen post
snap rotation. So a lot of times with the young quarterbacks,
your defenses will spin the dial and they'll put you know,
two safeties back and then they'll go into one high
safety coverage post snap, or they'll vice versa, and they're
changing the pictures constantly on them, and Drake May is

(10:16):
just seeing coverage. He's seeing rotation extremely well right now.
He's understanding where the openings are and the various coverages
that teams are throwing at him. So when you're reading
the field and you're seeing things clearly and you're playing
on time, that in itself is going to make you accurate.
Like that helps a lot in terms of accuracy in

(10:37):
terms of you know, completion percentages. And I know he's
got all sorts of records now with that Patriots records.
So I don't really have much more to add on
the on the great stuff that he's doing because it's
just every week now, and like you know, I have
some nitpicks about this game from him, But if this
is the baseline performance that they're getting out of Drake

(10:58):
May against Crappy Tea. I mean he's going to be
in the MVP conversation because this is this is right.
If this is it, like, if this is his floor
as a player now is what we saw against the Titans,
then I don't really know how you don't consider him
an MVP candidate at top five quarterback, top ten quarterback,

(11:20):
wherever you want to put that. So that's all the
nice things I have to say about Drake May because
it's getting kind of redundant at this point.

Speaker 3 (11:26):
I feel like I every.

Speaker 4 (11:28):
Week, like, yeah, I can sit here and talk about
you know, the throw to Matt Collins on the sidelines
a great one.

Speaker 3 (11:34):
The couple to Booty was a great one.

Speaker 4 (11:35):
The one to Digs later in the game was obviously
just like an extended handoff down the sideline, just Stefon Diggs,
who also you know, showed great late hands on that
play and just a great you know pitch and catch
from those two guys. It's getting a little bit boring
talking about all the good things, and that's how you
know that he's really good, because it got kind of
boring with twelve at times.

Speaker 2 (11:56):
Too. The word I it's I talked about this last week, right,
when do we go when we covered Brady, we didn't
come in here. We did we didn't come in here
because we didn't work here yet, but we didn't. We
didn't go on our shows and say, Wow, they really
have something in Tom Brady, Like he's looked at all
these things he's doing. It was just the norm. Yeah,

(12:18):
And I talked about this last week like that's kind
of the next step for Drake May. Is not that
we're ever going to stop owing and eyeing over it,
because it's really impressive, but when does it kind of
become Wow, look what Drake May's doing, and or when
does it go from look what Drake May's doing to like, oh,
that's Drake May. That's Drake May doing Drake May things right.
And I think we're getting there. The the for a

(12:41):
guy that the craziest thing for me from this game
with Drake May. I mean, the downfield stuff is bananas.
It's ridiculous. The third I didn't check actually after Monday
Night Football, but I think Jalen Hurts his third in
the league in deep ball completion percentage at like forty percent,

(13:02):
like forty seven to forty percent, which is a really
good number. On throws twenty plus yards downfield forty eight
forty nine percent. Like, wow, that's pretty good. Drake May
is at seventy seven percent, number one in the league.
Sam Darnold also randomly up in the seventies, but like
Drake May, has not a good passer rating, not a
great passer rating.

Speaker 4 (13:23):
Drake May is a perfect passer rating. On throws twenty
plus yards downfield, You're.

Speaker 2 (13:26):
Not supposed to do that. Yeah, I actually took a
spin down, you know, down the analytics way, Evan, you'll
like that because some of those numbers to just for
quarterback efficiency, what I worry, what you do. I'm actually
not gonna dump on it.

Speaker 3 (13:40):
No, I know you're not gonna dump on it.

Speaker 2 (13:42):
I just so some of those numbers correct me if
I'm wrong. I don't remember exactly which ones I looked at,
but like, they weigh different throws differently to gauge overall
quarterback efficiency because you're not supposed to be as efficient
throwing the ball twenty yards down the field as you are,
you know, throwing the ball five yards, So the deep
throws are weighted differently with the expectation that it's not
a truly efficient throw. Well, Drake May is breaking some

(14:05):
of these numbers because you're not like they're not the
formula is not written for this guy doing this this well,
so that's all to say. And the I mean the
throw to mac Hollins another one. Remember when everybody was
complaining this was a bigger thing last year, but you
still kind of hear it about how you know two
high shells Cover two's ruining the NFL and we don't

(14:28):
get as much offense anymore. Try telling that to Drake Matte.
He'll put the ball right in the right in the
cover two hole. He's cracked it, he's figured it out.
So the throw to mac Collins, throw a Kasha on
booty all that, the craziest thing is as good as
he's been deep one of the most ridiculous or one
of the things, biggest things we talked about with Drake
May in the draft. We can rewind it, you know
a year and a half. Here is his accuracy and

(14:50):
even into the summer, his short area accuracy right, and
he's dealing with the sprays and can he hit these
underneath routes and he wants to push the ball down
the field. He was what we'irteen or fourteen I think
on throws inside of ten yards, and that's not the headline.
If he did that at any point in the last
year and a half, we would have been like, oh
my god, Drake May's accuracy, Like, whoa, this is what growth.

(15:13):
And that's not to say it's not, but a guy
who we picked at more than maybe anything else. A
short area accuracy is just dotting teams underneath, and it's
the sub headline. Yeah, that's insane to me. Yeah.

Speaker 4 (15:28):
So he's eleven for fourteen right now on throws over
twenty yards, so seventy eight percent, as you I think
you said a minute ago.

Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, so he's like seventy seven change. Yeah, I'll find it.

Speaker 3 (15:40):
It's seventy eight percent.

Speaker 2 (15:41):
No, but like compared to the league.

Speaker 4 (15:43):
So it's what's crazy is that some of the incompletions
even are like catchable balls that were borderline completion. It's like,
for example, one of the incompletions is in New Orleans
to MATC Collins on the second third down bomb. The
first one gets wiped out by OPI. On Stefan Diggs,

(16:04):
he throws the same route again to Matt Collins and
it goes off mac Collins's hands, and there might have
been DPI on that play. Doesn't good you know what
I'm trying to say. That could easily have just been
in a completion. So he easily could be like thirteen
for thirteen if you look at some of the incompletions
that he has throwing the ball deep. So it just

(16:26):
he is the best deep ball thrower in the NFL.
He's number one in the league in pretty much every
stat at this point throwing the ball.

Speaker 2 (16:32):
So just for scale here and this is updated after
Monday Night Football. Top five among qualifying quarterbacks. So Jacoby, Brissett,
Lamar Jackson, and Brock pretty oddly enough qualify, but or
are up here, but they don't qualify they don't have
enough throws. Matthew Stafford fifth forty seven point two percent.
Good number, Yeah, good deep ball number.

Speaker 4 (16:51):
Tua forty seven point four percent, but it's a good
deep ball completion number. Jalen Hurts his third forty eight
point five percent.

Speaker 3 (17:01):
Good good thrower, good number.

Speaker 4 (17:03):
Good deep ball thrower, forty eight point five. Sam Donald's
at sixty eight.

Speaker 2 (17:08):
So we're jumping twenty points now, he's really good. And
then you got to jump another ten points to get
to Drake May. Yeah, passer rating Sam Donald second one
thirty seven point five, Jalen Hurts one thirty four point
two and passerating the one thirties nuts Matthew Stafford won
thirty point six, and it kind of drops off from there.
Drake May one fifty eight point three. And if the

(17:31):
number one fifty eight point three stands out to you,
is a football fin you know why? Yeah, it's a
perfect passer rating on deep passes you're not supposed to be.
It's one thing of a perfect passer rating on like
short passes that happens sometimes you're not supposed to have
a perfect passer rating here.

Speaker 4 (17:44):
Yeah, I mean he's just and that's the pale wherever
he wants. And you mentioned the whole shots, Like, I think,
out of all the quarterbacks I've watched this year, he's
the best whole shot artist in the league. Like, he
throws the cover two hole better than any quarterback in
the NFL, to the point where if I'm an opponent,
like I almost don't play cover two against the Patriots

(18:05):
anymore because he's so good at it, Like you're just
asking for him to throw it there if you play
that coverage, and he's just going to keep throwing it there.
So he's just fantastic throwing the ball deep. But in particular,
if there's one throw where you say, okay, what's like
the Drake may throw, it's the whole shot. And I
think he might be the best quarterback in the entire

(18:25):
NFL at hitting that cover two hole along the sideline
he's dealing.

Speaker 3 (18:30):
He's on an absolute heater.

Speaker 2 (18:32):
By the way, one other thing on the deep ball numbers,
so I can continue to gush for a minute here. Yeah,
turnover worthy plays yep, zero.

Speaker 4 (18:39):
Yeah, so he has one turnover worthy play over the
last four weeks. He had one throw to Pop Douglas
in New Orleans that was inside that should have been outside,
that probably could have been picked that they counted as
a turnover worthy play. So you're seeing the big time
throws continue like they were his rookie season, But the
turnover worthy plays are being shrunk to a very small level.

(19:02):
And that's hard to do because a lot of the
times when you see quarterbacks that cut down on turnovers,
it's because they're not being as aggressive as they once
were throwing the ball down the field. He's still being
aggressive throwing the ball down the field, and he's still
challenging windows down the field, but he's not turning the
ball over like crazy. So the juxtaposition there is pretty crazy.

Speaker 5 (19:23):
You know.

Speaker 4 (19:23):
I think there are some credit in that sort of
credit pie, Like, yeah, obviously probably seventy five percent of
it goes to Drake May himself. Maybe like another fifteen
percent goes to the receivers. Yeah, I think a lot
of the comp of the you know, kind of compliment
sandwich here or the pie should also just go to

(19:44):
McDaniel's slash the offensive line. Like when you're not getting
tons of pressure.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
You look at he's throwing from some very clean pipe.

Speaker 4 (19:52):
Right when you're throwing from clean pockets, you're just naturally
going to turn the ball over less. And so I
think that's a big part of his success down the
field has been they've done a great job of when
they know they're going to take a shot, Like when
they know they're going to take a shot to Kishan
Boody right before halftime there on the touchdown, you know
they have chips on the ends, right, they're chipping the edges.

(20:15):
They're helping out Will Campbell and Morgan Moses. If you
actually watch that pass protection, and I put this in
after further review, there's only one one on one across
the entire offensive line. Only one guy has no help.
It's Jared Wilson. He's one on one on the three technique.
But everywhere else the tackles have help. Brad Burry has

(20:35):
help on when he was in the slide side with
Bradbury and Moses, so the three of them are kind
of helped out. Campbell's got the chip on the end.
So when they know that they're going to push the
ball down the field, they're doing a great job of
supporting the offensive line and making sure that he stays
protected and he stays blocked. So it just is all
of it kind of coming together. It's not, you know,
I don't want to put too much all to Drake

(20:57):
May versus all the other stuff. It's kind of everything
right that that is really getting them rolling. The other
thing that you know stands out from this game run game,
obviously deep passing game, Drake May's performance, but these wide
receivers Alex just continue to make plays and this room
now we can confidently Say is having a massive turnaround

(21:18):
season where they're going to probably finish. And again, I
understand that a lot of people's reactions to these numbers
and the production from the receiver room is that when
you have great quarterback play, it helps right that you're
obviously putting the ball in good positions, and you're putting
the ball and good with good placement down the field.
The receivers are going to make catches. But now they're

(21:39):
basically a top ten receiver room production wise in the NFL.
Stevan Diggs is on pace for ninety five catches in
eleven hundred yards with the Patriots. Kashawan Boody is on
pace for like over eight hundred and fifty yards this season,
So they're probably going to have to at least eight
hundred plus yard receivers as long as both the those

(22:00):
guys stay healthy. And then Hunter Henry is you know,
not far behind too, and his production is a third
guy here. But in terms of the receivers, you know,
like I mentioned earlier, Mac Collins makes a couple of
plays in this game, Pop Douglas has the fourth down conversion.
Digs and Booty continue to just do it every single week.
This is it's been the growth in the maduration and

(22:23):
obviously adding digs makes everything easier for everybody. But it's
been a complete one eighty from what we've seen the
last two years to this year, especially last year to
this year at the wide receiver position, it.

Speaker 2 (22:37):
Really has been. And I like that they've gotten Pop
Douglas going a little bit here. I've said it before.
I think he can be a really useful part of
the offense. Matt Collins seems to be somebody that when
they do get the run game going. We saw it
in Miami and we saw it this week when they
hit some of those play action boots off, you know,
the successful run game. He's somebody that they really like
to throw to. I just think it's funny because, you know,

(22:57):
we're getting close to the trade deadline and people talk
about which is the Patriots trade for blah blah blah,
And I think there's this natural instinct. I don't blame
Patriots hands to this, but I think there's this natural
instinct after the last few years, well, they need a
wide receiver. They need a wide receiver. I don't know
that they do. I mean, long term, they need a
guy that can be at the top of the depth chart.
And I think Stefan Diggs has been fantastic, but he's

(23:20):
thirty two years old and you want to get the
guy that's going to come in and grow with Drake May.
So that's a you're not doing that at the trade deadline.
Right This is a pretty complete room right now. You know,
Kaisehan Boody's handling the exposition very well. They've it really
seems like now full time move digs into that Julian
Edelman role. He's running a little bit differently. There's some
deeper concepts in there, and then Mac Hollins and Pop

(23:43):
Douglas I feel like are in very specialized roles. Oh
and by the way, they have a top one hundred
pick they haven't really even used yet in Kyle Williams,
so there's still room to grow here. I think even
it's it's been really impressive, especially Digs and Booty Digs
coming off the injury, playing the way he is, booty
consistency that he's found in his game. I think it's

(24:03):
twelve catches in a row now have gone for first downs.
Just unbelievable stuff from him.

Speaker 4 (24:09):
Yeah, so it's not you know, obviously Diggs has been
more in that volume role that Ze's receiver role, and
they're using him on a lot of different things that
are Edelman esque. Like you said, it's you can literally
go back and I have on Twitter a couple of
times to like Edelman circa twenty eighteen nineteen and showed
the same concept of Edelman running the route that Diggs

(24:31):
is then running on Sundays now.

Speaker 3 (24:33):
So there's a lot of examples of that.

Speaker 4 (24:36):
Now, Edelman wasn't isolating on the backside and catching go
routes for you know, eighteen yards right like that. That
wasn't going to be part of his game. But they
do have a lot of you know, Diggs elements that
are Eleement elements as well, or were Edelman elements. And
then Booty, even though it's not a high volume, is
just once a game he's getting behind the defense and

(24:58):
catching a bomb from Drake may So that's just enough,
you know, if you catch, you know, keep catching twenty
plus yard chunks down the field like he has the
last couple of weeks. The production is more than enough there.
It's been a fun watch to see them kind of
grow and I think so much of this comes from

(25:18):
Stefan Diggs, I really do on and off the field.
I think his confidence, his leadership, his energy, has got
that room believing that they can make plays, and has
that room at a very very good temperament as well.
It's a selfish position, and I think this room is unselfish.
They understand that the ball is going to get spread

(25:40):
around some weeks. It's going to be a big week
for them some weeks.

Speaker 3 (25:43):
It's not.

Speaker 2 (25:44):
Really.

Speaker 4 (25:44):
The only guy that's held consistent in terms of like
target share is Dicks. Like everybody else is going to
have their peaks and valleys of games where they're getting
targeted more or less than others. They're doing dirty work.
And I mentioned Hollins with the blocking. They're doing some
of that stuff as well. It's been a real big
time growth out of that entire room. And I give

(26:07):
a lot of that credit to Todd Downing. I give
a lot of that credit to Diggs. I think Diggs
is really taken on in this last chapter of his career.
He's become a real captain like leader both in Houston
and here. He was the same exact guy in Houston.
According to a lot of you know, the Texans beat writers.

(26:28):
He was I think he was elected to captain if
I'm not mistaken for the Texans last year. So this
is not necessarily a new thing with Diggs, but he's
been phenomenal on and off the field. I want to
talk a little bit of defense in the good category,
and then we'll get to some of the bad stuff
as well from this game. On the good side, for
the defense after the first four drives, we're gonna do

(26:49):
this a lot. I feel like over the last couple
of weeks, at least first four drives thirteen points allowed,
four explosive plays, you know, plus one point three pa
per play. The rest of the game the drives five
through I think it was eight or nine zero points,
no explosive plays, negative point seventy nine epa per play

(27:15):
the Panthers. The Titans only had a thirty nine percent
success rate after the the first four drives of this game.
This is a trend. They are a slow starting defense,
they get beat by the script, then the game declares
or I think what's really happening is that the other
team kind of is running out of like the really

(27:38):
perfectly crafted plays and they're not playing offenses that have
this deep rollodecks or this deep library of plays every week.
So once Mike McCoy and Bo Hart agree got the
throwback play to DK out of their system, it was like,
well what else you got? And I think they kind
of looked around and the Titans in had anything else.

(28:00):
They kind of emptied the clip early on in this game,
they moved the ball to their credit, and the Patriots
have tightened up. So I have seen on film. You know,
they do get better as the game wears on. The
coverage improves as a result, the pass rush is improving.
The run defense is pretty steady throughout the entire game.
They have a good run defense. They're not giving up

(28:22):
much on the ground right from the beginning. But their
defense PostScript is a top ten, top ten defense in
the NFL. So I go back to this all the time,
like is this a problem, Like do we care that
their slow starting defense? I think the number one thing
is as long as they're not getting into big early

(28:45):
deficits because the offense is holding serve, then they're okay.
Now if they get into a game, and you know,
we were talking off the air a little bit about
this Tampa game coming up, not to look ahead but
if they get into a game against the Bucks and
the defense is given up, you know, a ton of
yards early on in the game, and the offense is
still trying to figure out Todd Bowles's defense and all

(29:06):
of a sudden you look up and it's seventeen to nothing. Right,
that's where it becomes a problem. But so far, and
maybe it's opponent driven, but so far that has not happened.
These slow starts really haven't burned them quite yet. Maybe
you could argue the Pittsburgh game it did, but outside
of that, it hasn't burned them. A one last stat
they've given up points on five of the seven opening

(29:27):
drives by the opponent. Now, they held the Titans in
the SATs bolt the field goals, but they're giving up
points at a pretty alarming rate on the opening drive.
So this is a defense that has a very distinct
split between the script and the nonscript. And I don't
know if I care yet we'll see it ends up
burning them. But their defense PostScript again was really good

(29:51):
this week.

Speaker 2 (29:51):
Yeah, whatever it is, it's that first drive and then
they kind of settle in and maybe they just want
to see how the opponents can play like, credit to them,
They've made some really good adjustments. They're on both sides
of the ball. They're one of the best third quarter
teams in the NFL. Outside of Week one, they're outscoring
opponents thirty nine to thirteen in the third quarter. So,

(30:12):
you know, can they start making some of those adjustments
a little bit sooner?

Speaker 6 (30:15):
Now?

Speaker 2 (30:15):
You got to see it to adjust obviously, maybe that's
part of it, but you're right, like they're surviving it
right now. When you start facing some of these higher
powered offenses, which granted they don't see a lot of
the rest of the way, but it's good. It's gonna
be Tampa, They're gonna get Buffalo, Baltimore, of healthy Baltimore,
of healthy Cincinnati. Ish, we kind of saw things click
with Joe Flacco, yeah, the other night.

Speaker 4 (30:36):
So you know, Atlanta has some wild home road splits
right now going on. But if you get the home
version of the Atlanta Falcons offense, that's a really talented group.

Speaker 2 (30:47):
We also don't who their quarterback is gonna be. For that,
we don't Kirk Cousins not a bad backup, but we
don't know who their.

Speaker 3 (30:50):
Quarterbacks right now.

Speaker 4 (30:51):
I think they're averaging like twenty seven a game at
home in like ten or thirteen a game on the road,
like they have some crazy now they play it that
is a class NFC South don't team and in like
you know, just to unpackages. I know it's not Falcons week,
but the Atlanta plays in a dome, right, Like, they
play in a very cushingy environment down in Atlanta, and
it seems like every single time they go outside that

(31:13):
offense falls apart.

Speaker 3 (31:15):
So so the Patriots have back to your.

Speaker 4 (31:17):
Point, by the way, home games twenty thirty four, twenty four,
the road games twenty two, zero and ten.

Speaker 2 (31:25):
But the twenty two was at Minnesota, right, So that's indoors.
So it's not home road splits. I'd call it indoor
outdoor splitz.

Speaker 4 (31:34):
It could so's it's twenty six points per game at
home in ten points per game right now on the
road for the Falcons. I know this is not Falcons
on catch twenty to get right next week.

Speaker 2 (31:44):
They play Miami this week, so that'll be a really
good data point because that team is terrible and falling
apart in real time. And if they can't put it
up on a Miami team whose coach seems to actively
be trying to get himself fired, and his quarterback actively
seems to be trying to get himself benched. That would
be reallytive that they just can't figure it out on
the road.

Speaker 4 (32:02):
So the good just to summarize, Drake May the passer,
excellent run game, got better, good stuff, receiver room continues
to click, continues to shine. The defense in the second half,
if you want to call it that, you know, midway
through the second quarter. Really, and one last thing on
the defensive side that I just want to mention because
we haven't been doing three up, three down as much.

(32:23):
Kaylevon chase On is just on a heater. Yeah, the
last couple of weeks between New Orleans and Tennessee. I
have him with twelve quarterback pressures over the last two weeks,
two sacks this week obviously had the fumble recovery touchdown
as well where he gets off the block there and
is able to disrupt the play from cam Ward. So
really a good performance so far. I think, you know,

(32:46):
last couple of weeks from Kaylevon Chase On, and he's
having a little bit of a heater here too, So
I just wanted to mention that going over to the bats.
I'm interested to hear what you think about this, because
we've talked briefly about it, but not a ton. Yeah,
and I am definitely in the school of thought, you know,
just to nitpick Drake a little bit, and I want

(33:08):
to caveat this with like we're talking about them being
a playoff team potentially here, Yeah, so this is not
like this is so bad that.

Speaker 2 (33:17):
This is this is not is he going to be
the guy talk? This is like how do we moved
on from that to like what do they need to
do to be the best team they can be?

Speaker 4 (33:25):
Talk exactly, And I would also add to that they
are only going to be good if Drake May is healthy.
So in this game I did not love most I
would say not most. Like three or four of his
scramble decisions in this game I thought were bad decisions
by him, you know, coming off first reads quickly, leaving

(33:50):
clean pockets. You know there's open receivers down the field.
A couple of times I thought in the red zone scramble,
he has Hunter Henry just sitting on the goal line
with the clear window. And if you're Drake May, like
you trust your six foot five tight end to just
box out there and make a play on the ball.

Speaker 2 (34:07):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (34:08):
He had Remondre Stevenson on the back side of a
concept on another scrambled where he gets tackled in bounds
and takes a hit. Obviously, he goes out of this
game for three plays with the head injury. This is
not We know Drake May can run, and I'm not
trying to put him in a box where it's only
played from the pocket and take away that superpower. But

(34:29):
you need to if you're Drake May, in my opinion,
you need to know when you need to put the
cape on and when you don't. And when you're playing
the Titans in week seven and you're blowing them out.
I don't need you to run right like just And
I get it he got hurt. It was still a
one score game. Technically they weren't in blowout territory yet.
But he needs to kind of pick his spots a

(34:52):
little bit better with this. And I know there's a
lot of conversations about sliding. I'm gonna give him some
grace on the sliding thing because I think it's so
much easier said than done to tell him he's.

Speaker 2 (35:04):
Been better about giving himself up even if it's not
a slide.

Speaker 4 (35:07):
You're you're asking him, you know, to make these slide decisions.
And it's so easy, I think, to sit here on
a podcast and tell him to slide. Like it's actually
like kind of starting to annoy me how much people
are talking about that, because it's everyone thinks that the
slide is just this like you're all to everything when
it comes to quarterbacks running.

Speaker 2 (35:28):
It's just protect yourself, right, And there's a number of
ways he can do that, and he's been better about it.
At times. It got away from him a little bit
in this game and the running more too. I think
he just maybe got in a rhythm and you know,
kind of fell out of some habits. Yeah, and he'd
been much better about this this year. If you watch
the play where he gets pulled, So what happens. There

(35:51):
one thing that they teach the or not teach, but
like one thing that the concussion spotters are trained to
look for when a guy gets after getting hit in
the head or I think just gets up in general,
if he does the quick little headshake, yeah, which you
see Drake do there, Like that is they're really looking
for that. That's been kind of shown to be a
potential symptom of a concussion, and they're gonna come get you.

(36:15):
Now in that instance, I think the reason Drake does it,
if you go back and look, his chin strap gets
pulled up to his nose and I think he's trying
to shake his helmet back down. Yeah, but the spotter doesn't.
In real time, the spotter sees you shake your head,
he's gonna come get you. So I don't think they
were wrong for pulling him hopefully, like just I think
in maybe a good wake up call for Drake because

(36:35):
if you go back and watch, and I posted both
these plays on Twitter side by side, if you go
back and watch his next scramble, which is later that
quarter after he comes back in the game, I think
it was the next drive. It was next drive because
they scored like right away. Once he came back in
the game. He gets it's this. It's a very similar
tackle where he gets kind of caught from behind and
starts to get pulled down. And I don't know exactly

(36:57):
what he's doing, but just looking at it, there seems
to be a much more concerted effort on his part.
So the on the one where he hits his head
he's fighting the tackle and he's trying to use his
momentum to push forward and get the extra yard or two,
which you teach running backs to do. You don't need
your quarterback doing it, but most ball carriers that's what
you do, right. You want to win the tackle. And

(37:18):
he does that. On the first one, he kind of
fights the tackle. It results in him kind of whipping
his head back. The second one he makes a much
more concerted effort instead of fighting for the extra yard
or two to keep his shoulders up. Because when you
keep your shoulders up and you hit the ground with
the lower your back instead of the upper your back, well,
now your head's not going to snap back and hit
the turf. And the price of it is you maybe

(37:41):
lose a yard or two because you're not fighting the tackle.
I don't mind. You know, it's not the fourth quarter
of the Super Bowl and you gotta have it. That
might be a different, you know, different conversation, but in
this in this setting, yeah, keep your head up, don't
fight the tackle as much. Tom Brady turned this into
an R four late in his career, and he wasn't

(38:02):
so much when he was scrambling, but even in the pocket,
knowing one just avoiding getting hit, and two when he
got hit, learning how to fall, how to roll with
the contact, all of that. So he fell in the
way that he wanted to fall. So is his throwing
arm wasn't at risk, his head wasn't a risk hitting
the ground anything like that. It's just one example, but
you know it's one that I look at, and you know,

(38:22):
if I'm in the room, I'm pointing at like all right,
like that's it, all right? He learned, like he he
fixed it the next time out. So I think running
a little less overall seven scramble is a bit much,
especially a game like that. But when he's gonna run,
knowing how to protect himself. And again it's not always sliding,
it's getting out of bounds or giving yourself up or
even when you get hit, knowing how to roll with

(38:43):
the hit, so you're not putting certain parts of your
product body in arms way. It's football, it's physically you're
gonna get knocked around a little bit. But again, if
you land a little weird on your non throwing shoulder
and it protects your head and it costs you a
yard or two, you take that trade off.

Speaker 3 (38:58):
He's gonna get hurt playing this.

Speaker 4 (39:00):
If he plays like he did on Sunday again, and
he keeps doing that again and again, he's gonna get hurt.
And they cannot afford for him to get hurt. So like,
this is not I understand. And I've I've in the.

Speaker 2 (39:14):
Past, well he wanted a quarterback like Josh Allen Evan
welcome to the Josh Allen experience.

Speaker 4 (39:19):
But and I've said in the past that I'm not
I don't want to take away his superpower and I don't,
but there's a difference between him extending plays in him scrambling.
So I it just he can't play like this, And
I think the most important thing is is that he
doesn't have to play like this. And if I'm if,
I'm Josh McDaniels and I'm Mike Rabel, My what I'm

(39:41):
telling him after this game isn't necessarily don't run, it's
you don't need to run in this spot, right like
when we play Buffalo at the end of the year.
And let's just say, because we're dreaming right now, the
game is for the division and it's then it's you know,

(40:02):
all bets are off, Just do what you gotta do
to win the game. But against these types of teams
in the middle of the football season, when there's not
the stakes are not quite as high that he just
has to learn when is it it's important enough to
try to take off, try to break tackles, to your point.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
So that's what I think. It's not like, yeah, there's
definitely times where he can stay a passer before becoming
a runner. But I think the bigger point is even
went because he's gonna run, there are gonna be times
he's gonna run. Being better at protecting himself, which he
had been Like this game felt like a little bit
of a step back in that regard being better at
protecting yourself well you're running, uh, and how to take

(40:44):
hits and things like that I think is important.

Speaker 4 (40:45):
Yeah, I just I keep going back to the fact
that I just feel like he didn't have to scramble
seven times against the Tennessee Titans. And I know that
might be disrespectful to the Titans, but that's the spot
that we're in with them. And you know, lastly, just
on a quarterback level, like I would just and I'm
not saying that he's like a one read and go
kind of guy. I'm not trying to put that out there,

(41:07):
but he is right now maybe being a little bit
more front side backside of concepts, Like he's not necessarily
progressing full field through the concept. So I see on
tape a couple of times a game where he's one
to two on the front side or whichever side he
decides to read the field on. But he's not going

(41:28):
all the way from right to left or left to right.
So if he stays in the pocket a little bit
longer and we can come off the front side of
a concept and get to the backside, that's when, you know,
I think that he can kind of eliminate a few
of these scrambles per game and maybe keep himself a
little bit healthier, you know, self preservation. So that's all

(41:49):
it is. It's self preservation. You just want to see
him on the field. You hate seeing him have to
get pulled from the game for any reason other than it's.

Speaker 2 (41:57):
Garbage time and they're up by three touchdowns.

Speaker 3 (42:00):
So that was just that the defense thing.

Speaker 4 (42:05):
Actually, let's stick with the offense and then we'll talk
about will unpack the defense. Yeah, offensively, we talked a
little bit about this last week, mostly with the run
game this week. It was more pass protection than it
was run game. But there are some cracks in the
foundation that are starting to show a little bit with
this offensive line, and it's mainly inside. I would say,

(42:26):
you know, Campbell's gonna have one or two rookie moments
a game. He had one blitz that came off his
edge that resulted in a quarterback hit. I would much
rather be talking about Campbell making mental errors in physical errors,
like he'll learn from those ones. I'm not too worried
about Campbell. Moses was really good in this game. I
thought he was the best lineman, especially maybe one of

(42:48):
his best games.

Speaker 3 (42:48):
Of the year.

Speaker 4 (42:49):
On Wenu still has some reps that for an eighteen
million dollar guard, I wish that he was a little
bit better, but has been solid on the most part.
Bradbury and Jared Wilson right now are having a tough time,
and I talked about Jared Wilson last week before this week.
This has been brewing for a while now. I don't

(43:10):
know if they'll make any changes personnel wise. I know
a lot of people want to see Bradberry to the bench,
Wilson to center, Ben Brown to left guard, I'm not
messing with the center quarterback exchange. Right now, Drake May
is dealing. He's playing like an MVP candidate. One of
the worst things that you could do is start pulling
Janga pieces out of the offensive line. Because now we've

(43:32):
talked about this in the past, Alex, you're changing two positions, right,
It's not one position you're changing, You're changing two positions.
That center quarterback exchange. The communication between those two guys
is so important. I think Bradberry's veteran experience is enough
to keep him in the lineup right now, Jared Wilson
for Ben Brown to me is starting to become a

(43:52):
little bit of a conversation. And this is where Mike
Rabel has a really tough job because they are five
and two. They are pushing to win the division, but
they also have a bigger picture of a long term
view here where if you develop Jared Wilson and you
stick with him and he gets better, does that long
term pay dividends for your offensive line. So it's hard.

(44:17):
It's a hard spot to be in. But pass protection wise,
I know that their numbers from an analytics standpoint are
really really good. I have not felt like that has
lined up with the eye test all the time with
some of these numbers, and I've kind of come to
the conclusion that I think a big reason why is
because of the scheme and because of Drake May. Like

(44:39):
Drake May is still performing at such a high level
under pressure, and Josh McDaniels is doing a lot of
things to help the offensive line that it's covering up
some of the week. And that's great, like that's what
good quarterbacks and good play callers do, right, But we're
starting to see a little bit more bumps in the
road here for this offensive line. Where do you stand
with that group? Where do you stand with Jared Wilson.

(45:01):
I had him with two and a half sacks allowed
in this game, and it was coming off a game
last week that I thought was a little bit subpar
as well.

Speaker 2 (45:10):
Yeah, I mean, I do think you're right. It's a
tough spot because they're five and two, they're rolling, and
there's also an element of, you know, these five guys
have worked together for most of the season. Ben Brown
did a good job when he was filling in, but
these five guys have been working together. They have chemistry,
and you know, does it become a house of cards
if you start pulling pieces here and there. But it's

(45:32):
you can't have your quarterback taking blindside shots either, which
you know whether you want to put that on on
on Wilson or Campbell. The reality is the two rookies
missed the line game. Yeah, and that's what we talked
about the beginning of the year. Having two rookies on
that left side. You'd hope Ben Brown, with a little
more experience, would help with that. So I still feel
like overall it's a representative group. We knew it was

(45:53):
going to be more than one year, and putting it
back together to come from where they were last year
to now is tremendous strides. But kind of like we
just did with Drake May, like we didn't go through
all that nitpicking Drake May because whether or not he's
going to be the guy we're talking about, how can
this team be the best version of themselves they can
be to make a run. What's you know, what's the
best version of this team to make a run. The
other thing is if you do pull Jared Wilson, I've

(46:16):
said all along, I think his long term position is
center agreed. You can have him start working on that now.
So maybe you know, you don't want to make the
change with Garrett Bradbury now, but if you need to
get to that point he started twenty twenty six or
it's twenty six, like he kind of hits the ground running,
So you know, I go back and forth on it.
It'll be interesting to see what Cleveland does this week

(46:38):
because Miles Garrett can line up wherever, and I'm sure
they're gonna run him plenty against Will Campbell, but he
can line up inside too, And do they look at
a rookie guard who's playing out of position, who's struggling
a little bit and say we want to hunt that matchup.

Speaker 4 (46:50):
So I think that's the biggest thing to me when
I watch Jared Wilson is you know, it's much easier
to play center as a little bit more undersize, like
we saw, you know, with David Andrews for a long time.
But David Andrews not a big guy as in terms
of relatively speaking for offensive lineman. Garrett Bradberry is not
a big guy, you know, relatively speaking, But at center

(47:13):
you can get away with being a little bit undersized.
Once you move out to guard, though, being a little
bit undersized can can come back to Hanji a little
bit more. And with Jared Wilson, I just see, you know,
the power, the play strength, the ability to anchor at
the point of attack. Like those types of things I
think are the biggest things that are giving him problems
right now. The other thing that gives him a little

(47:34):
bit of problem is he loves to two hand punch,
which when you get two hand punchers, the like the
combat that as a pass rusher, you usually see a
lot of swipes right hand swipes, so like he's gonna
fire his hands and then the tackle's gonna swipe his
hands away and then they are just blowbys because he
gets over extended and then now he's off balance and

(47:57):
he's coming forward. So he saw that on one of
the sacks that he gave up in this game to
Defandre Sweat. You know, he just comes out and he's
in a play action set and he just kind of
comes out of the blocks and tries to throw two
hands into his chest. Sweat just swats the hands out
of the way, and Jared Wilson is now he's you know,
leaning forward, he's off balance and sweats by him. So

(48:19):
you're seeing a couple of those a game as well.
I'm not ready.

Speaker 2 (48:23):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (48:24):
I go back and forth on it too, because I
think there is an element of Ben Brown that could
be a little bit more steady at that position, and
I like his size at that position, but I also
see the long term of it. I just wonder if
the long term of it even matters, because if it's
not on the left side, like if he's not going
to be next to Campbell for the next ten years,

(48:44):
then like what like I get, you know, we're still
getting reps in games, and that's valuable, But if he's
going to be at center, it's not like he's building
all this chemistry with Will Campbell for the next five
to ten years, right, you know, he's not going to
be in that spot. So it's something to talk about,
something to think about. Let's move over to the defense.
Let's talk a little bit about the script again. But

(49:05):
I do want to talk even more about the man
coverage stuff with the script. I do think there's an
element of them playing some more vanilla coverage early in games,
some based defense or their kind of base install defense.
So I do think there's some cat and mouse going on,
like let's just let the fancy offensive coordinator on the

(49:27):
other side, he's got to all these plays that he's
practiced all week. Let's just let him get it out
of his system, and then we'll see what happens right right,
and then we'll start to draw it up and we'll
start to dial it up. There is that element of
it with the man coverage stuff. I think this is
actually more important in a lot of ways in the script.
The Patriots right now are dead last in the league

(49:48):
and EPA and man coverage. That should not be the case.
They have too many good corners for them to be
near the bottom of the league in man coverage, especially
corners that excel in man, like in Zales and Davis
and Marcus Jones. So when I watch it, and this
is just my opinion, I think that this staff needs
to adjust how they are playing man coverage. So they're

(50:09):
playing a lot of man free, which is six man
coverage is the single high safety in the deep middle
of the field.

Speaker 3 (50:14):
There's no second level help.

Speaker 4 (50:16):
So what they're getting beat on, in my opinion, is
a lot of like inbreaking routes into the middle of
the field slants. You know, we saw Christian Gonzalez get
beat by Van Jefferson on like a five step slant.
We saw Carlton Davis the week before get beat on
a slant by Rashid Shahead in a similar coverage, similar spot.
We saw the deep post to to DK on Marcus Jones. Like,

(50:42):
that's another one of those where he's got to think
about so much because he's only has help in the
middle of the field, So he's thinking is he breaking in?

Speaker 3 (50:50):
Is he breaking out? Like is he running by me?

Speaker 4 (50:52):
Like there's a lot of different things, And when you
know the Patriots are in their heyday with man coverage,
you know, eighteen twenty nineteen, I learned a lot about
not only scheme, but how to play man coverage from
a corner perspective from Stefan Gilmore, And he talked a
lot about being able to eliminate routes based off of
where his help was, So he knew going into it

(51:16):
that like, there's only three kind of routes that this
receiver is going to run from this alignment, and I
have help on the post, and then I have a
robber in the middle of the field as well, So
I only really need to think about one route, right
and that makes it so much easier from a simplification
standpoint to play man to man, and this staff to me,

(51:37):
you know, they played a lot of zone in Tennessee.

Speaker 3 (51:39):
Maybe that's part of it. Maybe they're really more.

Speaker 4 (51:41):
Of a zone staff and haven't really been well schooled
on the man to man coverage stuff. The Patriots in
their prime and Manton man coverage are playing a lot
of robber They're cutting crossing routes. They're putting, you know,
safety help at both the second and third level of
the defense, and they were just kind of loading up
with safety help and get those corners as much help

(52:01):
as they possibly could. There's too much space in the
middle of the field. If Christian Gonzalez is getting bet
on it, then it's too much space. Like that's a
scheme problem, it's not a personnel problem. There's too much
space in the middle of the field. I would take
the rusher out of the cut you know, it's a
trade off. Right now, they're putting the extra guy in
the pass rush. So if you're gonna take the guy

(52:22):
out of the pass rush and put him in coverage,
now you're only gonna have four man pass rush instead
of five man pass rush. That's the you know, the
trade off or the decision they have to make.

Speaker 3 (52:31):
But I would do it.

Speaker 4 (52:32):
I would play a lot more you know, robber coverage,
a lot more cut coverage where there's a second level
help defender and trying to eliminate some of these rats
from the tree. For these corners, they should not be
a bad man coverage defense. And until that gets fixed,
I don't think their pass defense is gonna get fixed.

Speaker 2 (52:51):
Now.

Speaker 4 (52:51):
You could also say that they could shadow a little
bit more. I think that's true, but when you're playing
against a team like the Titans, like who is Gonzal
supposed to travel with? When Calvin Ridley is not playing right?
So it's not I don't think that they've done it
because they haven't played a guy to that caliber that
is worthy of traveling with. So maybe that changes over
the next couple of weeks, Like maybe he travels with

(53:13):
Jerry Judy on Sunday, who is a decent player. Maybe
he travels with Drake London the following week. Mike Evans
is now hurt. Maybe it's a Mecca Abuka, you know,
gets the travel treatment the following week. So that's another
way that you can kind of simplify things from man
coverage is just say, hey, just study this, like this
is the one that you got this guy, just study him.

(53:34):
That's another way to simplify it. So I think they
need to simplify the responsibilities of the corners to get
them to be better at man coverage, both with help
and with assignments. And then they will because this is
not sustainable, Like they shouldn't be this bad at man coverage.
And I put a lot of that on the scheme
and on the coaching to improve how they're drawing it up.

Speaker 3 (53:55):
Is there anything else on the defensive side that you
want to know?

Speaker 2 (54:00):
Those are all good points. The other thing is they
continue and this is a much more simplistic view, So
I apologize, but they continue to get beat by the
speed guys. They continue to have trouble with straight line speed.
And you know Tremary DK gets some They're gonna face
some of these guys wound my blanket on the Falcons,
like speed slot.

Speaker 3 (54:19):
Darnell Mooney.

Speaker 2 (54:19):
Darn it, they're gonna get Darnell Mooney. You know Tampa
has some speed. Obviously they'll get Buffalo again. They'll get
Khalil Shakira again. They got to be better about that.
I know there's been some rumblings about, like them maybe
looking for a corner at the trade deadline. I don't think,
you know, I think.

Speaker 3 (54:35):
I don't think it's personnel. I really don't.

Speaker 2 (54:37):
I don't, And I think people have been a little
too hard on Carlton Davis. He did have one really
bad rap in that game where he fell over, but
he's been solid. They don't need a guy that's gonna
come in and reset the depth chart. I know people
pointed out Steph Gilmore. Look, I'm not gonna say to
Steph know, to Steph Gilmore on the football team, because
I think he's such an elite mental player. Just getting
him in a room with some of these younger corners

(54:57):
alone would be worth a roster spot, whatever his role is.
But going to find a matchup speed guy that can
maybe help alongside.

Speaker 3 (55:06):
Like isn't that supposed to be Marcus Jones?

Speaker 4 (55:08):
And like again, like I and I know that I
tend to err on this side of the street most
of the time, but I just remember watching this defense
and when Bill Belichick really pivoted to man to man coverage,
like the way that they supported their you know man coverage,
the primary man coverage defender. They call it divider leverage.

(55:32):
It's I if I had a whiteboard, I'd probably be
able to dro it up. I don't want to confuse people,
but just the way that they use leverage and the
way that they played to help. It's man to man,
but it's like it's man to man with support, And
right now it feels like when they play man, they're
truly putting these corners on islands like they are. They
are running, you know, at all three levels on an

(55:53):
island without a much support in the middle of the field.
I just don't think that that is the right way
to do it. I don't think it's like a good
way to do it. So I get it they're probably
a little bit concerned about their four man pass rush
right now. But the trade off when you take guys
out of the rush and put them in coverage is
in theory, the quarterback should have to hold the football

(56:15):
longer because there's not going to be as many open
windows down the field for him to throw the ball.
So if you can't trust that your four man rush
is going to get home in like three seconds, then
that's a big problem. Then they should be in the
market for pass rushers, and maybe they already are. But like,
if that's truly how you feel about Chazon, Landry Barmore
and Williams, that they can't get home in three seconds,

(56:37):
then that's problematic. I don't think that's the case. I
think those guys are good enough that if you get
these quarterbacks to hold the ball for a little bit longer,
that they're going to be able to get home. But
right now they're just they're sending these blitzes at these quarterbacks.
They're playing a lot of man pressure and the man
blitzer are not working. So like you got to get
the guys out of the pass rush and you've got
to get those guys back in the secondary. I don't

(57:00):
think it's personnel driven. And I and I'm I'm really
surprised when I hear these rumors circulating and you're not wrong,
like they're all they are circulating. Well, I mean some
depth too, yeah, but they could use some depth anywhere
on the roster, so that includes corner. But like I
just I'm surprised that they would put actual assets into

(57:20):
adding another corner, Like, who are you taking off the
field that corner? If everybody's Well, that's the thing I
think to be better prepared if they lose somebody, you know, upgrade.
Maybe Alex Austin is the third corner, Well he's the
fourth corner or the third boundary corner. Okay, I guess
and in theory or like who really is the backup
slot corner to Marcus Jones, Like I kind of interpreted

(57:42):
that as like it just like any other position, they
could use the body. Just because it's a depthney doesn't
mean they're not looking for We do have a little
bit of NFL breaking news. Okay, we gotta take a
quick break and then we can talk about the breaking news.

Speaker 3 (57:53):
We gotta pay the bills.

Speaker 2 (57:54):
Not that much time.

Speaker 3 (57:54):
Well, we'll be back after the break in just a second.

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All right, let's open up the phones, let's open up
the emails. What was your little bit of breaking news?

Speaker 2 (01:01:14):
The little bit of breaking news, The NFL has announced
they are moving the Pro Bowl to Super Bowl Week.
It will be played Tuesday night in primetime somewhere in
the San Francisco area. So that's a wrap on that.

Speaker 4 (01:01:27):
Evense so the Pro Bowl is still flag football, Well,
it's the Pro Bowl they'll do.

Speaker 3 (01:01:32):
They're doing the Pro Bowls teams.

Speaker 2 (01:01:33):
We'll start at six thirty and then the flag football
game will be at eight. Just the just get rid
of it Moss Cones Center.

Speaker 3 (01:01:40):
The only way that this.

Speaker 4 (01:01:42):
Is better is and it's one event. It's the old
quarterback Skills competition. You can go back on Andrew Bledsoe
Tour that thing. You can go back and they do
it a little bit. I think they have like the
moving targets, you know, wine and I think Drake May
did it a couple of years ago.

Speaker 2 (01:02:00):
I guess it was last year. But the.

Speaker 3 (01:02:03):
That was great, you know back.

Speaker 2 (01:02:05):
In the day. Brady did it one year.

Speaker 4 (01:02:07):
Uh. And they have some really cool moments and it's
like all those guys in Hawaii just like kind of
slinging it and I you know, guys are throwing it
like seventy yards and stuff like that. Like, I guess
that's kind of cool. But other than that, this whole
event is just starting to become a mess. Like just
name the Pro Bowl roster to give the players because
the players haven't written in contracts and stuff like that,

(01:02:30):
you have to have the Pro Bowl. From a contraction standpoint,
like just name it.

Speaker 2 (01:02:33):
Baseball does like an All MLB.

Speaker 4 (01:02:35):
Team, right, well, we have the All Pro Team, but
you could do the same way. Yeah, until it's started
to not agents start to take it out of contracts
in terms of incentive packages and stuff like that. You
have to obviously have it in there for the time being,
but eventually once that gets phased out. I just have
no use for the Pro Bowl, and I don't think
players have used for it either. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:56):
I think some sort of skills event thing whatever and
turning it in maybe the week of the Super Bowl.
It because because there's nothing really on Tuesday night, team
availability doesn't start till Wednesday.

Speaker 3 (01:03:06):
Well, we have opening nights Monday.

Speaker 2 (01:03:07):
It's usually Monday, right, So Tuesday's kind of a dead spot. Now,
some people the event might want a dead spot, but
you know, it gives you something to fill out the week.
That's Saturday, there's usually you know, you're late in college
basketball season, you have some big college basketball games. NBA
and NHL are going. I think the no, the NHL
All Star Game is usually the next week, but I

(01:03:27):
think they might have the Olympics this year. Right, is
that when the Olympics.

Speaker 3 (01:03:30):
Is The Olympics are in February, right, because in.

Speaker 2 (01:03:34):
Milana February sixth, So yeah, so now it's not competing
with olymp the Olympics, right, It probably takes sense it
just it just goes yes, it is the Winter Olympics.
It goes back to my point that I think that
whole schedule is gonna get reworked because look, look they're
gonna go to eighteen games at some point, and when

(01:03:54):
they go to eighteen games, they're probably gonna go to
twenty weeks, so they're gonna be two bay it.

Speaker 4 (01:03:59):
They're gonna want if we can get the Super Bowl
to President's Day weekend. It becomes as I think everybody's
dream scenario.

Speaker 2 (01:04:06):
So I also wonder if they probably not, but I
wonder if they go back to starting on Labor Day.
The thing that I would like to see is adding
a buy once you go to So I think once
they go to eighteen games, they're gonna go to eight
teams in the playoffs per conference, and there's gonna be
no more by weeks, which I'm not in support of
any of this. I think six teams was the perfect

(01:04:28):
number and I loved that format, the two buys and
winning your division meant something, and you're standing in the
conference meant something all that and they're taking I don't
like the new format, but like, realistically, seven teams makes
no sense. One bye makes no sense. They're gonna go
to eight teams to add the extra two playoff games,
will probably get playoff Thursday night football or something. I
if they do that, I would like to see them

(01:04:50):
add a bye week before the playoffs. So you play
eight week eighteen, then you have a bye.

Speaker 3 (01:04:55):
Oh my god, this season's not gonna end till March.

Speaker 2 (01:04:57):
No, because it would well, you're gonna get rid of
a preseason game, okay, in this so starting earlier, so
you're yeah, I don't like starting.

Speaker 3 (01:05:06):
The labor Day weekend. I like my Labor Day weekend.

Speaker 2 (01:05:09):
I like it too.

Speaker 3 (01:05:09):
But even if that don't, it's a nice.

Speaker 4 (01:05:12):
Little I mean, I guess we would probably get the
weekend before now, like if it's not Labor Day weekend,
but you need that one weekend where like it's that
one calm before the storm weekend.

Speaker 2 (01:05:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:05:23):
I don't know, but I hear what you're saying. With
the playoffs going.

Speaker 4 (01:05:28):
I I hate the idea of expanding the playoffs more
because of I think it should be hard to make
the playoffs and the I.

Speaker 2 (01:05:35):
Think it should be two again, six is the perfect number, Yeah,
but I think eight is a better number than seven.

Speaker 3 (01:05:41):
I agree that makes sense. No, I agree with you there.

Speaker 4 (01:05:43):
So I think it's eight with two teams getting the bye,
and then you have like a you know, first round
of the play six with two teams getting by. Well
that's the that's the dream is You're not gonna have
a buye with eight. You have eight with two teams
getting a bye, and then they played the team's played
in six.

Speaker 2 (01:06:00):
Yeah, no, that doesn't make sense because then oh so
then two of the teams have played round one play
each other again? What or how you have eight with
the bye? So three plays?

Speaker 3 (01:06:13):
Are we just bad at math?

Speaker 2 (01:06:14):
Right now? Yeah? Three plays eight? Four play seven? Three
games five plays six?

Speaker 4 (01:06:20):
Yeah, then you'd have five coming out of it, right
so that way, Yeah, I don't like it.

Speaker 8 (01:06:25):
Then?

Speaker 2 (01:06:26):
No, no, no, you still are.

Speaker 3 (01:06:28):
We like just being done?

Speaker 2 (01:06:29):
Plays eight? Yeah?

Speaker 11 (01:06:31):
Four?

Speaker 2 (01:06:31):
There was going to be that. I would leave you
with five teams. You can't do that. Yeah, So eight
is no boys, But i'd like to see them add
the bye before the playoffs if they did, if and
when they do that.

Speaker 4 (01:06:38):
Wow, that was that was That was that ethic of college, right.
No one said there would be math or not.

Speaker 2 (01:06:46):
We're nerves and you wonder why I don't like the math, okay,
because I have to do things like I'm good.

Speaker 4 (01:06:52):
I'm good when they do the math for me. I
just don't. I'm not good at doing the math.

Speaker 2 (01:06:56):
But if they do the math for you, how do
you know they did it right? How do you know
whether or not you can trusted.

Speaker 4 (01:07:01):
I'm not like this, just like you have trust issues.
If that's serious issue, can we get to the phone?

Speaker 2 (01:07:07):
Hang on?

Speaker 3 (01:07:08):
So wait, so if you have was that that was hilarious?

Speaker 2 (01:07:10):
By the way, If you if you have a buye
before the playoffs, so that's plus one week, and then
you're adding two to the season. That's twenty so you're
now plus three. You get rid of a preseason game
that's minus one week. Now you're plus two. You're trying
to move it back anyway to get to Labor Day weekend.
Now it's so you would need one more week. You

(01:07:31):
would have to start to do twenty games, two by
weeks playoff, by Super Bowl, by President's Day weekend. You
would need to start Labor Day.

Speaker 3 (01:07:38):
We are literally going.

Speaker 2 (01:07:39):
And now you're taking on college football.

Speaker 3 (01:07:41):
Now we're going to play in March. Nobody cares about that.

Speaker 4 (01:07:43):
Luke is in. What's up, Luke? Luke, you're there? That
Fluke on hold for a while? All right, call back
in if yeah, we got our brains and pretzels.

Speaker 2 (01:07:56):
There.

Speaker 3 (01:07:57):
Mike is in Puerto Rico. It's up, Mike.

Speaker 6 (01:08:00):
Hey Ale, Hey Evan, how you doing today?

Speaker 2 (01:08:02):
Good?

Speaker 6 (01:08:05):
Evan. I know you appreciate the Bill Simmons and the
Ringer podcast, and they have a bit there that's called
like half baked ideas. I was wondering if I could
toss up I was wondering if I could toss out
some half fried ideas to y'all.

Speaker 4 (01:08:20):
Yes, sure, okay.

Speaker 6 (01:08:23):
So, first of all, given that Drake is not quite
one hundred percent protecting himself when he's going out there
and doing his runs on scrambling and stuff like that,
how would you feel about the team mandating him to
wait our guardian.

Speaker 2 (01:08:39):
Caps not necessary? No, protect yourself. Those things are heavy.

Speaker 3 (01:08:44):
I hear what you're saying, but I'm good.

Speaker 6 (01:08:47):
You're protecting an asset, additional insurance. You don't think, you know,
even if it helps him ten percent, you don't think
it's worth it, given that he might be the franchise.

Speaker 4 (01:08:57):
I think that it's football, and he's going to get
hurt and he needs to learn how to protect himself.

Speaker 2 (01:09:02):
If he wants to wear a guardian cap, I wouldn't
impose it. But also it's extra weight on your head.
It's going to change the way he turns his head
looks at the field if you don't want him to
be uncomfortable doing things he has to do on a
every snap basis, when there's ways you can coach him
around taking some of the hits.

Speaker 4 (01:09:18):
Yeah, and I'm not a like this isn't to be
like anti concussion conspiracy theory here. I would like to
see more data on the guardian caps and how much
they actually help.

Speaker 2 (01:09:28):
I think the data is that they work.

Speaker 3 (01:09:30):
It is, but it's such a good sample and practice.

Speaker 2 (01:09:33):
Where they work. You hear about this lots like the
it's the head to head collisions at the line of scrimmage, right,
it's a bunch of little ones. That's more what they're for.
That there's a reason that like the linemenough to wear
him in practice, but the wide receivers don't. It's a
fair question, Mike, what's your next Yeah, it's fair question.

Speaker 6 (01:09:49):
Okay, the next time, what do you guys think about
for quarterbacks and receivers adding a past interfering stat so
yardage that they odd because they were interfered with in
a play, because that's something that they had a chance
to get. But then obviously they were interfere so they
didn't get a chance to make that, but it benefited

(01:10:10):
the team.

Speaker 2 (01:10:11):
Yep.

Speaker 3 (01:10:11):
It's just something that the Brandon Cook's stats.

Speaker 2 (01:10:13):
So somebody does keep track of this somewhere, because when
Brandon Cooks was here, I remember seeing the stat that
receiving yards plus pass interference yards, he was the second
leading receiver in the league.

Speaker 3 (01:10:24):
Yep, I love it.

Speaker 2 (01:10:24):
So that does exist somewhere. I would be all for
making it more public, especially for receivers.

Speaker 6 (01:10:32):
Okay, and one last one, and so you guys know
the rules a lot better than I do, especially with
now the new kickoff rules and stuff like that. So
I believe you have to declare when you're gonna do
an on side kick?

Speaker 8 (01:10:45):
Correct?

Speaker 3 (01:10:46):
Correct?

Speaker 6 (01:10:48):
Okay, what happens if you declare as an onside kick
but you still kick off regular? Is there are there
any implications? Is there any strategic advantage to the kick
team if you do that?

Speaker 2 (01:11:03):
I believe you can't do that. No, I think that
they would just get the ball it wherever. Yeah, yeah,
I believe that's a penalty you can do. You can
do that, and it's popular in college, like that poocha
on sidekick, but there that really only works with a
surprise element. So I guess you could claim it's one
of those, but you wouldn't be able to get it.

Speaker 4 (01:11:23):
So yeah, I don't think. I don't think that that
is allowed, But I don't love that you have to
declare that you're going to on sidekick it. I know
everybody always goes back to, uh the Coult Saints super Bowl,
like you would never have the surprise on sidekick, Like
that doesn't exist anymore.

Speaker 2 (01:11:42):
I here it is current on side kick. If the
on side kick goes beyond the setup zone untouched, the
kicking team would be penalized for I don't know what
uns is. Oh on Sports Mike, return team would start
at the A twenty yard line, So that's a massive
penalty their own twenty the opponent's twenty yard line. Yeah,

(01:12:05):
they get it in the red zone. That's what I'm
pretty sure is what a twenty means. Yeah, is this
AI or is this like the NFL dot Com? This
is NFL dot Com. Current onside kick rules would apply
if on side kick that goes beyond the setup zone untouched.
I don't know exactly what the setup zone is. I'm
guessing it's like fifteen twenty yards. Kicking team would be
penalized for uns return team would start at the A twenty.

(01:12:26):
So the game's over.

Speaker 3 (01:12:28):
Yep? Is that the last one, Mike?

Speaker 2 (01:12:33):
I'm sorry, Sagan, Is that the last one?

Speaker 3 (01:12:35):
You got one more?

Speaker 6 (01:12:37):
Oh? That's the last one. Just just trying out my bait.
See if you guys liked it.

Speaker 4 (01:12:40):
I liked it, Thanks Mike, Thanks for the call. Appreciate that.
I hear what people are saying with the Guardian cap.
I'm just not totally convinced that's going to solve the problem.

Speaker 2 (01:12:49):
I'm never going to win multiplayer for wearing Guardian cap.

Speaker 3 (01:12:54):
But I also especially like a shame thing.

Speaker 2 (01:12:57):
No, but especially a quarterback.

Speaker 4 (01:12:58):
I don't I don't want to force it on a
guy either, you're you're I'm talking about creating a whole
other host of penalty issues there.

Speaker 3 (01:13:05):
It's not even that to me. I just don't know
if it's gonna work.

Speaker 4 (01:13:07):
Like I don't know if if he gets hit in
the head, uh, you know, a direct blow to the
head if he bounces his head off the turf, Like,
is that going to save him? Maybe it would, Like
it's obviously better than nothing, I suppose, but I just.

Speaker 3 (01:13:18):
Don't think it's gonna be.

Speaker 2 (01:13:19):
In the play against the Titans, He's still probably getting
pulled off the field because the guardian caps not preventing
the chin straft from going up. That's why he shook
his head. And again the guardian cap, from what I understand,
is more about the like play to play down to down,
like the lineman get blocking, like those collisions. It's not
about the one big hit.

Speaker 4 (01:13:37):
Yeah, So that's obviously he shouldn't be hitting his head
every single play.

Speaker 3 (01:13:40):
All right, Shawn is in Vancouver. What's up, Sean?

Speaker 12 (01:13:44):
Actually, I'm in I'm usiting my brother in South Florida.
So Evan, I hope to see the game of Champa.
I'll go up buy you a jersey mic stuff for
lunch on Saturday.

Speaker 2 (01:13:55):
Nice.

Speaker 12 (01:13:56):
But I have I have one half boiled idea and
one question. Now against opponents where the Patriots have had
the game in hand, it's layed in the game, you know,
it seems like they've won the defense has been more aggressive.
They've been putting more pressure on the quarterback. You know

(01:14:17):
against New Orleans, Carolina and the Panthers that those are
the offenses that are struggling. Cleveland has an amazing defense,
but their offense struggles. I'm just this is the idea
this week. Let's start being aggressive right away on defense
and see how that goes, see if we can actually

(01:14:39):
get off the field to start the game. My question
is step On Dicks, Like you said, it has been amazing, incredible,
just a great free agent pickup. The only thing that
I think should change is he hasn't seen the end zone.
There hasn't been enough end zone targets. First, step On,
do you think that'll change? Is that that's the quint

(01:15:00):
Then what do you think happens moving forward? Okay, and
I'll leave you with that.

Speaker 4 (01:15:03):
Thanks Sean to the first one. I had something to
say to that, and then I just totally space.

Speaker 2 (01:15:08):
Like aggressive from the beginning.

Speaker 3 (01:15:09):
So I think they tried that in New Orleans.

Speaker 4 (01:15:11):
They send a corner blitz on the very first play
of the game and they hit a fifty three yard pass.
So I think that they've tried and I you know
they they talked about this.

Speaker 2 (01:15:20):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (01:15:20):
Some of the players I've spoken about this with have
said that they feel like once they make a play
on defense, like a big play like a sack or
a turnover, big negative play, they kind of get that
gets them rolling a little bit, that gets their momentum
headed in the right direction. So I think in New
Orleans they said, well, why don't we just call blitz

(01:15:40):
on the first play of the game and if let's
see if we get a negative play and maybe that'll
get us rolling early.

Speaker 2 (01:15:46):
And they tried it, and New Orleans.

Speaker 4 (01:15:48):
Was ready for it, and they hit a fifty yard
bomb over Kyle Duggars's head. So I think that there's
I hear what Sean's saying, but I think they did
try that two weeks ago and that also didn't work.
So there's that. What was the second thing he said?

Speaker 3 (01:16:01):
Now we're doing.

Speaker 2 (01:16:05):
Grand yea were it was? Actually it was an interesting
uh question.

Speaker 3 (01:16:11):
Let's go to Aldred in North Carolina. What's that? Aldred?
How are we doing?

Speaker 13 (01:16:19):
I'm doing pretty good, doing pretty good question?

Speaker 2 (01:16:23):
Question? Yes?

Speaker 13 (01:16:24):
Uh so, so last night Cleveland rank number three against
quarterback Uh scrambles, I mean they don't scrammer that much
against him that that well, and the number one what
the past defense yep as of last night, So we
haven't problems with problems on the officers of the line.

(01:16:46):
How do you think we're gonna go and do against
their defense? Just gonna be whatever offense score first wins
the game three and our defense and day defense. And
now I take it off the air. Thanks fellas, You'll
have a good one.

Speaker 4 (01:16:57):
Thanks eld So I want to get to the brown
here in a second. Let's just go back to what
Sean was talking about with the touchdowns with Stefan Diggs.
I say this seriously, and I know sometimes we get
yelled at for mocking the fantasy football community. Is this
a fantasy football thing that you care that Stefan Diggs
doesn't have touchdowns?

Speaker 3 (01:17:14):
Ors is an actual issue?

Speaker 2 (01:17:16):
It's that that's never been a high touchdown role. Jacoby
Myers was the same way. It's just it's not a touch.

Speaker 4 (01:17:22):
Other than talking about it from a fantasy angle, I
have no idea why it would matter if Stefan Diggs scores,
or if Stefan Diggs draws two guys in the red
zone and Austin Hooper scores, Right, Like I just for
the Patriots. If the ball finds him in the end zone,
then great. If he hits a big play he gets
in the end zone, then great. I don't think they
really necessarily care about padding Stefan Diggs's touchdown stats.

Speaker 3 (01:17:46):
Let's start talking a.

Speaker 2 (01:17:47):
Little bit real quick. We're got a little more breaking
us here. The next round of Hall of Fame voting
is in. Yes, former Patriots that are moving on, Fred Taylor,
Tory Holt for a minute.

Speaker 3 (01:17:58):
Okay, can you let you from an actual former Patriots.

Speaker 4 (01:18:01):
Adam Vinitari, Yeah, Logan Mankins, Vince wolf Work, James Harrison,
Sante Samuel and Rodney Harrison.

Speaker 2 (01:18:13):
Yeah, so Roddy Harrison takes no sense. And then obviously
Bill Belichick yesterday it's the Coaches Committee separate. This was
the Modern Era committee.

Speaker 4 (01:18:20):
So the Modern era one is like on I think
this is round two. Yeah, so this is like normally
when all these Patriots show up, and then they cut
it down even further.

Speaker 3 (01:18:30):
I think at the NFL Honors is.

Speaker 4 (01:18:33):
Also go from here to I think it's twenty finalists, yeah,
twenty and then the and then that gets cut down
to eight that actually go on the ultimate ballot.

Speaker 2 (01:18:42):
And then they go on. That's where you mix in
the guys from like soa just committee the contributors.

Speaker 3 (01:18:46):
So we have quite a bit ways to go here
until they get down to the end.

Speaker 2 (01:18:50):
The finalist one is where like Vince and Rodney and
those guys have kind of fallen off.

Speaker 4 (01:18:55):
Vinitaries should keep going though. Okay, the Browns. So, so
here's the thing with the Browns A couple things. Starting
with the just the big picture. They have the biggest
discrepancy between offensive efficiency and defensive efficiency in the NFL.
They have a top five defense in the league and
they have a bottom five offense. They are really struggling

(01:19:18):
to score points, especially when the other team doesn't hand
them points like Miami did last week. It doesn't matter
if it's Dylan Gabriel or if it was Joe Flacco
early in the year. They're thirtieth in the league in points.
Dylan Gabriel right now is one of the worst downfield
passers in the NFL. He is dead last and completion
percentage on throws of ten plus yards in the air,

(01:19:40):
He's eleven for thirty one throw it. So the fact
that Drake may earlier in the show, we talked about
how good he is throwing the ball twenty plus yards
down the field. Dylan Gabriel can't even throw the ball
ten yards down the field. And I'm not trying to
be disrespectful. I'm just telling you this is a really
limited quarterback that they're facing.

Speaker 2 (01:19:59):
Now.

Speaker 4 (01:20:00):
Brown's run game and the Browns short passing game is
a formula for them. They can throw the ball underneath
the defense and they can catch and run. They can
throw the ball to their tight ends, they can throw
the ball to their backs, and quinchn Jenkins has had
a nice start. But I just find it very hard
to believe as long as the Patriots don't have like
a Pittsburgh like game where they turn the ball over

(01:20:21):
five times, that the Browns are going to be able
to score with the Patriots in this game. Now, the
fun part about this game though, is not so much
that I'm worried about the final result. Like I think
the Patriots will win this game. I think they will
win this game pretty comfortably. But it will be fascinating
to see how Drake.

Speaker 2 (01:20:39):
May plays against a really good defense.

Speaker 4 (01:20:41):
And is a lot of this MVP talk, a lot
of this efficiency stuff that's off the charts with him.
Is this a product of the schedule a little bit
or is it really that he has developed into that
good of a quarterback. And I think we're gonna find
out a little bit of that this week. A couple
of things about the Browns defense. They are a very

(01:21:03):
aggressive unit. They are very very aggressive upfront. They have
a great front. They really have great talent all three
levels of their defense. You know, on the front, you
obviously know about Miles Garrett, but Alex Wright's a really
underrated player. Malie Collins is a really underrated player. They
just drafted Mason Graham at linebacker. Carson Schweessinger, their second

(01:21:23):
round pick, is having a really good rookie season. Devin
Bush is a really solid number two linebacker there. They
still have Denzel Ward, you know, Pro Bowl corner as well,
so they have a lot of talent on the defensive side.
Jim Schwartz is one of the best schemers in the
league on the defensive side. So it's a tough test
from that standpoint. But a couple of things. I do

(01:21:45):
think that their secondary in terms of like their second
and third corner. You know, Denzel Ward's a great player,
but they just swapped corners with Jacksonville. You know, they
have Tyson Campbell now their slot corner as well. I
think they can be hacked. I think those two guys
are You can pick on those two guys now. The
obviously the big thing is is Drake Megan have the

(01:22:07):
time to do that with Miles Garrett. The aggressiveness of
this Browns defense. They struggle against moving pockets and they
struggle against play action because they just are flying downhill
every time they get a chance to. So if you
can get the quarterback on the move, if you can
get him out of the pocket, if you can hit
play action shots down the field with you know, extra protection,

(01:22:28):
you know, put six seven guys into the protection, maybe
leave the tight ends in, maybe go six to zero line,
you know sometimes and really load it up. You really
only need to run two routes at them down the
field because they play a lot of single high coverage.
So if you can do that sort of thing against
this Browns defense, then you can throw the ball. On
the Browns defense, you gotta block it and you gotta

(01:22:50):
keep the quarterback protected. But it's not a defense that
is completely has you know, zero ability.

Speaker 3 (01:22:58):
To throw the football.

Speaker 4 (01:22:59):
Against so So just to wrap that up, if I'm
the Patriots in this game, I have a couple of
schemed up shot plays where like I said, maybe it's
leaving both tight ends in and you go seven man protection,
or maybe you go tackle eligible and you put two tackles.
You know, you Will Campbell and Vederian load on Mason

(01:23:20):
Miles Garrett, and you take some shots early in this
game down the field, because if you get them into
like a ten to nothing or a fourteen nothing hole,
this game's over.

Speaker 3 (01:23:30):
Like the Browns are not coming back. So you have
to get them down on the scoreboard early and make
them throw their way back into the football game.

Speaker 2 (01:23:38):
Yeah, I'm with you. Blocking it is the key thing.
And this is a new kind of test. Miles Garrett
plays all over, but he'll play a lot.

Speaker 3 (01:23:46):
On He plays mostly over the left.

Speaker 2 (01:23:47):
He'll play on that left side. So you know, they
face TJ. Watt, they face Max Crosby, but those guys
will lining up opposite Morgan Moses and Mike w and Wenthu.
Now you're going to be testing Will Campbell. You're gonna
be testing Jared Wilson. If I'm the Browns, I'm throwing
a lot of line games at them. Now that can
make you susceptible to rollouts. Here's the question, are you
always rolling mad to the right or do you ever

(01:24:09):
roll them to the left. Now you're rolling towards Garrett.
So it's a little counterintuitive, but it also you show
it early. It forces a little more discipline on that side.
I do think the moving pockets will be a big
part of this game. And again, they got to show
that they can run the ball to upset the time
of that pass rush. I said it before. They're not
going to run for five yards of carry probably like
they did against Tennessee. It'd be great if they did.

(01:24:29):
I'm not expecting it. But it also can't be like
the New Orleans game either, where it's just completely non existent.
You have to show the Brown something to ex something
to respect.

Speaker 3 (01:24:38):
So you could you can roll both ways.

Speaker 4 (01:24:40):
Obviously, you could roll to mcgarrett's side and like try
to crack them like so you take like a tight
end or a wide receiver and as you roll, you
kind of just crack him and block him and pin
him inside, and so that helps Drake may get the edge.
The Vikings did that a couple of times and had
some success with it. The Packers was more gun rollouts.
They Aaron Rodgers in the shotgun and then they booted

(01:25:02):
off of fakes out of the shotgun, which can also
be helpful because then the quarterback can see, you know,
are they glitzeeing? Like what am I looking at? You're
not turning your back to the defense like you do
when you're under center. So there's some element of that
as well. But if you go watch their tape, especially
the tape against Pittsburgh and Minnesota, they got a little
bit better, it felt like against it last week against Miami.

(01:25:25):
But the Minnesota and the Packer that keeps saying Packers
because of Rogers. The Steelers tape is just filled with
bootlegs and chunk plays off of bootlegs. Like both teams
just had tremendous success doing that. I think that that's
the way that you go because the worst thing to
do is to drop back pass and let Miles Garrett
just tee off on Drake May and Will Campbell, Like,

(01:25:46):
you just don't want to do that. You don't want
to live in that world. To your point about running
the football, they do. They are a little bit weaker
against spread runs, like if you spread them out and
you run the ball from the shotgun, they've given up
a little bit more. They're a very stingy run defense.
They're really near the top of the league in pretty
much every category against the run. It's hard to run

(01:26:08):
on them. But if you do want to find some
success running the football, the teams have found a little
bit of it running the ball out of the gun
because I think it just spreads them out a little
bit and that allows you to run it a little
bit more inside. So if you're the Patriots, you know,
you can spread them out, run the football from the gun,
then you can boot off those runs from the gun.

(01:26:30):
And now that I think that's sort of the game
plan or the point of attack for them. Like I said,
Campbell Tyson Campbell uh. And I'll get the name of
the slock corner. I'm blanking on it right now. They're
nickel corner. Both those guys I think can be had.
You know, I wouldn't really test Denzel Ward all that
much now. They don't travel Ward, or they haven't yet,
So I'm interested to see if Denzel Ward travels with

(01:26:51):
Diggs on Sunday.

Speaker 2 (01:26:52):
If he doesn't think Greg Newsom, no, Miles Harden, Yeah,
is their nickel corner. Yep.

Speaker 4 (01:26:58):
If they if they don't travel, then like you can
just put Digs over at Tyson Campbell And I think
Diggs is gonna go to town on Tyson Campbell. So I
would just look for those types of opportunities. It's a
fun test, but I would not necessarily say, like I understand,
this is what we do. We come into the week,
we talk up the other team. We try to find
ways that they can win. I think if the Patriots

(01:27:21):
score twenty points in this game, it's game over.

Speaker 2 (01:27:23):
Like I don't. I mean, look, we've watched We've been
on the other side of this, watching the Patriots the
last few years. We know how that thing goes.

Speaker 3 (01:27:30):
Yeah, it's you know, it's a run in in short
passing game.

Speaker 2 (01:27:34):
On Quinn Shawn Judkins has started to come on, like
don't allow the big play. Don't allow you know, they
gotta be They've been much much better about tackling, but
like in this game, don't allow Quinn Shawn Judkins to
break tackles in Djok who I know is a little
banged up, but like if he plays, that's a guy
that can do some damage after the catch, but take
care of the short stuff. Wrap guys up when you
get to him. We shouldn't see an explosive offensive performance

(01:27:56):
from the Browns certainly. And there's one other thing. I
don't what it was.

Speaker 4 (01:28:00):
So they scored thirty one points last week, twenty one
of them came off turnover. Yeah, they had a hand
and they had a pick six, and then they had
essentially a pick six because the Browns were turned into
the two yard line, So they had really like two real.

Speaker 2 (01:28:14):
Scoring So that's where that's where you open the door
to me with the Browns is if the turnover problems
come back, and they've been really good about it. The
reason this game, I think we're objectively we're taking the
Browns little more serious. I think then we took the
Titans last week. Miles Garrett is a real Tuesday player.
And look, I think Jeffrey Simmons is two. Yeah, but

(01:28:36):
he's on the interior. It's a little different. He also
got hurt in that game. Yeah, and the Saints didn't
have anybody like this on defense. No, So Miles Garrett
is in this what was identified before the year, and
it's kind of bare true it's the stretch of easy games.
These three games might be the easiest three game stretch.
They have Miles Garrett. I think you'd argue, really on

(01:28:56):
either side of the ball, is the best player that
they'll face.

Speaker 4 (01:28:59):
I think you could argue that Miles Garrett is the
best defensive end in the history of football.

Speaker 2 (01:29:04):
Okay, I hate that's what? Like?

Speaker 3 (01:29:06):
Who?

Speaker 13 (01:29:07):
Like?

Speaker 3 (01:29:07):
Why is that?

Speaker 2 (01:29:07):
Crazy? Taylor?

Speaker 3 (01:29:09):
Lawrence Taylor is an outside linebacker.

Speaker 2 (01:29:10):
Oh you're talking just defensive end, hand in the dirt,
defensive end mmm jj watt. I think he's there.

Speaker 3 (01:29:18):
I mean he's I think he's up there.

Speaker 2 (01:29:21):
Yeah, because I mean the guys that he gets compared
to now are mostly linebackers, like Parsons is a linebacker.

Speaker 3 (01:29:27):
He is that good.

Speaker 4 (01:29:28):
Like when you watch him rush, he does things that
human bodies of that side should not be able to do.

Speaker 3 (01:29:36):
He is a little a legitimate alien.

Speaker 4 (01:29:38):
Like he he has that teleport move now where he
just like he wins inside in two steps. It's one
off the ball and then it's one lateral step and
he's in the backfield Like that is absolutely disgustingly sick.

Speaker 3 (01:29:52):
So I put unbelievable.

Speaker 2 (01:29:53):
I put up t J Watt or sorry J J. Watt. Yeah,
and you're gonna hate these ones, Reggie White and Michael Strahan.

Speaker 4 (01:30:01):
So I think Reggie White is probably considered the best
defensive end of all time. Yeah, I think Miles Garrett
is in the conversation.

Speaker 2 (01:30:08):
I know, I think he's in the conversation. You just
said that with such conviction. No love for Michael Strahan.

Speaker 3 (01:30:13):
No, Okay, Reggie White is a good one.

Speaker 2 (01:30:17):
Reggie, I meang is the standard. I know that. And yeah,
JJ Watt was. I think some people count J. J.
Watt as a linebacker because he didn't play standing up
a little bit, But nobody counts j No.

Speaker 4 (01:30:29):
I would actually argue that JJ Watt might be like
more of a defensive tackle. He played a lot inside
the tackle. But anyways, that's semantics. I think Miles Garrett
is probably the freakiest rusher I've ever seen, just in
terms of his movement ability, like his ability at his size,
you know, also like to his flexibility to coil his

(01:30:49):
hips underneath sys out stand with speed to power or
to dip the edge like this is we're talking about
a guy that's like six five and seventy five pounds
moving like that like Parsons moves like that at twenty
five pounds later, you know, So like it's just that's
the part of it. I think that makes him so freaky.
Will Campbell, Like this will be the hardest matchup of

(01:31:12):
Will Campbell's life. Yeah, and he will never face anybody better.

Speaker 2 (01:31:15):
And they're gonna need to give him a ton of help.

Speaker 4 (01:31:16):
Yeah, So it's a it's a tall task now. I
fully expect whether it's Austin Hooper, whether again I could
keep going back to the six o line thing, like,
whether it's one of those two things, Like I don't
think Will Campbell is going to be left alone very often.

Speaker 2 (01:31:32):
This is it's I mean, he's of the level. Remember
when they played Calvin Johnson and they just lined up
two corners opposite him every play, And yeah, Miles Garrett,
is that kind of life.

Speaker 4 (01:31:43):
Is And it's especially that true because it's like that's
how you lose the game. Yeah, Like I think that
when you go up against other teams, like I think
last week, you know what Jeffrey Simmons, As great as
Jeffrey Simmons was, and I know he didn't play the
whole game, I still didn't feel like there was a
way that Jeffery Simmons could totally take over the game
that would lose the Patriots the game. I think the

(01:32:03):
Browns have enough that they're a little bit better than
the Titans talent wise across the board that if Miles
Garrett has like a ten pressure game and he's just
taking him over, then it could turn ugly, not like
blowout ugly, but like the Patriots could. I don't think
Jeffrey Simmons was going to take over that game to

(01:32:23):
the point where the Patriots are ever going to lose.
But I think this could happen with Miles Garrett, and
I have no like this is to me is the
best player in football. Maybe he's that good now. I
think that the Patriots will be ready for him. I
think Josh McDaniels and Doug Moron will be ready for him.
They'll have things up their sleeve. They'll move the pocket,
they'll change pitches, they'll chip him, they'll double him, they'll

(01:32:46):
pull out the kitchen sink. They're not going to just
let him t off on little Campbell. They're not going
to let Jim Schwartz just move him around and do
that sort of thing either. So I'm concerned, but I
have a lot of faith in the Patriots coach staff
to be able to manage it. You know, whether it's
moving pockets, it's quick passing game, it's chips, it's double teams,

(01:33:07):
it's that sort of thing. In terms of the other pieces, well,
it's worth Miles Garrett four sacks in three career games
against the Patriots.

Speaker 2 (01:33:16):
His only two sack game against the Paper. So he
had one sack in twenty nineteen, he had one sack
in twenty twenty one. The only two sack game he
had was twenty twenty two, so Josh McDaniel's not here
for that one. So Patriots won all three of those games.

Speaker 4 (01:33:29):
The only thing that I would say about Miles Garrett
on like a slightly negative tone. His press conferences lately
had been really dark. He's been really critical of the
Browns and they're off. I mean, do you blame them, No,
But I'm just his buying and his compete checking out.
I don't know where that is, and I'm not usually that.

(01:33:50):
I don't usually go in that side of the street.

Speaker 2 (01:33:52):
It was this year, right that there was that whole
saga where they were going to trade him and then
at the last second he said he was going to
go back because they made him some assurance about being
more competitive. Obviously that didn't happen.

Speaker 4 (01:34:05):
Yeah, I could see him being a little miffed because
he's not an extension, right, Yes, some big, big extension,
and I I just.

Speaker 2 (01:34:11):
I don the Browns waste another guy like that. Joe
Thomas now him.

Speaker 4 (01:34:16):
Yeah, they they they asked him about Joe Flacco's performance
last week and he had some critical comments like I
guess that we didn't need that or something like that.
But for him, you know, so he's getting a little
spicy in the media. So I had something to monitor.

Speaker 2 (01:34:30):
I did in three career playoff games.

Speaker 4 (01:34:32):
Yeah, I thought that he was okay in this past
game against the Dolphins, but I didn't think it was
like I don't think it was like peak Miles.

Speaker 2 (01:34:40):
Just to play Devil's advocate. Or is there an element
of I guess I got to do all this myself
and he shows up like an absolute demon to warn
them the game single handedly.

Speaker 3 (01:34:47):
There's definitely that element too. He's a hell of a
football player, it really is.

Speaker 8 (01:34:52):
Now.

Speaker 4 (01:34:53):
Uh, this Browns defense is a really good defense, and
I keep repeating myself. But I'm just really I think
that this is one that I can't wait to watch
the tape of Drake May on Monday, because if he
deals against this defense, then I don't even know if
I have the words to describe like the high perpose
you only need. I mean it just that would be

(01:35:15):
an incredible thing to see. Let's get back to the calls.
We'll take a few emails here too, on you know,
trade deadline and things like that.

Speaker 3 (01:35:22):
Matt is in New Hampshire. What's up, Matt?

Speaker 1 (01:35:26):
Hey?

Speaker 2 (01:35:26):
What's up?

Speaker 13 (01:35:26):
Guys?

Speaker 11 (01:35:27):
How you doing?

Speaker 2 (01:35:27):
Hey?

Speaker 11 (01:35:30):
So this isn't really about the Browns. It's more of
just about the team coming into this year. I just
kind of want to get your guys opinion on it.
I kind of only looked at the free agent class
and I was only looking really at Marcus Shownes as
an extension candidate. But midway through the year, I'm looking
now and you have guys like Calebon chased On and
Chiros Tonga who seemed to have found homes here in

(01:35:51):
New England. So I just wanted to get your guys
opinions on those two guys. And I'm sure you guys
obviously feel the same way about Marcus Shows as well,
because he's kind of taking a step for this year.
He's got a great year so far. But just your
opinions on extending guys like Chiros Toga and Caleb On
Chase On to either team friendly deals or just you know,
a couple of years extensions for both of them.

Speaker 3 (01:36:11):
Thanks guys, Thanks Matt, thanks for the call. It was
a one year deal for Tonga. Why do I think
it was a two year deal?

Speaker 2 (01:36:17):
Maybe I thought, I know, he ye two million. I
know it was a one year deal for Chase On.

Speaker 4 (01:36:21):
Chaison's an interesting one one year deal for tongas Okay,
So I mean, look, I I'd take both those guys back.

Speaker 2 (01:36:27):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:36:27):
Absolutely. Chaison's an interesting one because.

Speaker 4 (01:36:32):
The it's kind of the josh Uja thing, where like
we all thought josh j was going to get this
massive contract coming off to his big twenty twenty two
opposite June On, we all think that Chaison is kind
of tracking for a similar contract.

Speaker 3 (01:36:46):
It didn't happen for Ja.

Speaker 4 (01:36:48):
Teams kind of saw through the production and uh, well
I don't know if that's Chase On because Jason had
good production last year too, But just it was with
Max Crosby on the other.

Speaker 2 (01:36:56):
Side, so didn't hit free agency after that. He there
was another year in there he didn't play well. Okay,
so he had eleven happened at the end of twenty
two and they were all the second half season, and
then twenty twenty three was when Judon got hurt.

Speaker 4 (01:37:09):
Okay, I thought that maybe they that was when he
signed the one year deal with the Patriots.

Speaker 2 (01:37:13):
No, he signed the one year deal after twenty three.

Speaker 4 (01:37:17):
Okay, that makes more sense. Yeah, So Jason, I think,
is you know, tracking to get paid well, you know,
could you get it done early and maybe avoid competing
in the market. Maybe, But if I'm him, I'm probably
betting on myself at this point.

Speaker 2 (01:37:31):
I think it's also a weak free agency class. So
you go in as a past twenty six year old
pass rusher coming off in two strong years and a
former first round and a former first round pick, and like,
you're gonna be in good shape.

Speaker 4 (01:37:43):
So that's one where look, I really like what he's doing.

Speaker 2 (01:37:48):
Actually, it is kind of a weaker class. But the
one spot as strong Jalen Phillips, Trey Hendrickson.

Speaker 4 (01:37:54):
Yeah, but the well Trey Henderson might because of all
the issues with the contracts. But you know, I don't
know if Jalen Jon.

Speaker 2 (01:38:00):
Philps might too. He just might want to get out
of there. He might not going anywhere. No, But anyway, Yeah,
it's it's too a look at this. I what I
was going to say is, and I really like what
calebon chase On is done. And he is only twenty
six years old. Is there a Mark Anderson element where

(01:38:23):
like he's just kind of on a heater and this
year is what it is? And maybe it's some of
it's a product of the system and instead of because
you're gonna pay him twenty million dollars a year probably right,
I don't.

Speaker 4 (01:38:34):
Think so, No, No, because I think that the market
will look at him as a complimentary rusher.

Speaker 2 (01:38:39):
What if he finishes with ten sacks and he's on
pace for ten sacks.

Speaker 4 (01:38:41):
Then you might have to pay him, you know, starter
money at that position, which is over ten. Now, I
don't think twenty million plus is you're talking about? That's
the guy, right, like that's your number one pass rusher
when you start getting into that category.

Speaker 2 (01:38:56):
But isn't that what he's probably gonna look at himself
as because he would be not one pass rusher net,
you know, and then does he go to the old market.
I just wonder, like.

Speaker 4 (01:39:04):
I I think that, and look, maybe a team gets silly,
it always happens. But smart teams are gonna say he
piled up sacks opposite the Max Crosby a year ago. Yeah,
this year, Williams and Christian Barmer are pushing quarterbacks to him.
He is a very very good, complimentary rusher, but I
don't think that he is a number ze rush.

Speaker 2 (01:39:26):
For the right price, obviously, I take him back. And
if you're telling me it's gonna take like fourteen to fifteen,
I might do that. But it's a really good year
for edge rushers in the draft. You know, you still
have those guys in the middle, So I don't we
got a long way to go. If he plays himself
in close to that twenty million dollar range, though, I
might start looking at you know, because we are getting

(01:39:48):
to the point now where you've gotta start thinking about
the money for Drake Ma and Christian Zalez. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:39:52):
I think about the money for Drake May on a
semi daily.

Speaker 2 (01:39:55):
But well, the Gonzales one comes first.

Speaker 4 (01:39:57):
But like the consalt past couple of years, a great player,
But can Zalees is going to be a maximum I
would say probably around thirty million I get.

Speaker 2 (01:40:04):
But regardless of what the ultimate number is. The last
few years we've taken this approach, I've said this a lot.
We've talked about for agency. Oh the money is this?
Oh the money is that you don't have anybody you're
paying for three years and now we're getting like the
contract comes off the books before Gonzalez goes on, before
May goes on. Is that going to be the case
if you pay kaylebon Chase on.

Speaker 4 (01:40:23):
Sure, But I'm not worried about the Gonzales money because
that's modest money by NFL standards. At this point, Drake
May is going to be a sixty million dollars a
year courter.

Speaker 3 (01:40:31):
Probably not Probably he will be well.

Speaker 4 (01:40:34):
So sixty sixty million, we'll see, I think there when
the wis media dealer like at this point, thirty million
going up, thirty million like is like kind of just
like okay, that's like Pro Bowl, all pro caliber defender money,
but it's modest money in the gran scope of things.
When you start talking about quarterbacks, like quarterbacks, thirty million

(01:40:55):
is like what like Sam Darnold is making, you know,
like that, it's like a decent starting quarterback. I know
he's playing better than that now, but that Drake May
contract is gonna be an absolute monster.

Speaker 2 (01:41:07):
Also, the media deal's run through twenty thirty three. I
don't know why I thought they were all the stuf.

Speaker 3 (01:41:11):
Because they were trying to renegotiate early.

Speaker 2 (01:41:13):
That's what it is. Well, because if that happens, the
cap spikes and then it's just.

Speaker 4 (01:41:16):
Like I yeah, I mean, I wouldn't be against bringing
him back, but I also don't We got a long
way to go.

Speaker 2 (01:41:22):
Let's see what it looks like Tonga. I think is
a realistic return. Yep. I think he likes it here.
I think Vrabel likes him here.

Speaker 4 (01:41:29):
He's a pretty scheme specific player, so I don't think
he has a massive role specific I don't know how
big his market's going to be, and he's in a
pretty good situation where where he's playing next to Milli
Williams and Christian Barmore.

Speaker 2 (01:41:42):
That one's realistic. I'd love to see him back. I
think he's been a super underrated signing. Do you remember
when we came in here for at show after free
agency or a listening off all the names. He didn't
even say kiris Tonga, I forgot. I had to.

Speaker 4 (01:41:51):
Remind you to respect many times. I apologize to kiris Tonga.
I was not familiar with your game.

Speaker 2 (01:42:00):
That's better than I thought. They reinvented his game. Yeah,
so that's what that's the awesome thing about it.

Speaker 4 (01:42:06):
So listen really quick. Last thing on Chase On. Then
I want to answer this email. Uh, there is definitely
value in being a really good complimentary So if you're
like another team, I'm trying to think of an example
off the top of my head. But if you're another team,
I mean, the Raider is a really the example Cleveland.
That okay, Cleveland, Alex writes a good player, but he's

(01:42:29):
not really like an edge true edge. He's more like
a defensive end. But if you're another team that has
one really good like a stud pass rusher, like a
Miles Garrett, Uh, you know, like his situation in Vegas
with Max Crossby having the other guy on the other side,
that's gonna just you know, kind of play really solid steady. Uh,

(01:42:50):
football is very valuable like that that that's not anything
to sniff at with Calebon Chase On.

Speaker 3 (01:42:57):
So this is an email from Todd.

Speaker 4 (01:42:58):
I think this kind of just sums up all the
trade deadline emails that we're getting, So we can just
answer this to wrap up the show. What are the
two positions that you could upgrade that will allow you
to make a deep playoff run? So basically, what are
your what are your wish lists right now at the
trade dead I just don't.

Speaker 2 (01:43:13):
Think you're upgrading starters really at this point that that
are going to make that much of an impact. Those
players don't move this time of year. If there's one,
maybe Safety, and that's more about where the Patriots are at,
then who's available. I think the deadline it just get
and there was a report from Breer that they're going
to take a more long term approach to this trade deadline,

(01:43:34):
which I like. So again that could be safety getting
another running back and they don't need Alvin Kamara, but
getting another body because you can't. We didn't really talk
that much about Reminder seems, and specifically we talked about
the run game. You have twenty touches. Yeah, when you
start getting up near that number week in and week out,
we know what that does to him come December. So
another guy that you trust ideally it becomes Travon Henderson,

(01:43:56):
but well he starts to figure it out. You know,
somebody else that that can help you move the stick there,
I think would be a really good addition. I talked
about corner earlier, and then somebody that could be a linebacker,
could be a safety, whatever. There's another one where it's
maybe a starter ish level player, rotational player. Somebody can
cover tight ends, because that thing still worries me and
Marte Moffo got a little bit of run late in

(01:44:17):
that game, look good. But if you can go out
and you get a tight end stop or it maybe
only plays on third downs but can kind of slide
into that role and sure up that role a little bit,
I think there'd be value in that.

Speaker 4 (01:44:27):
I'm still I'm still focused on the spine of the defense.
I think they have a really good first level spine
with Williams and Barmore Tonga. We know that second level.
Robert Splaine has really come in, you know, settled down,
been much better. But that spot next to Robert Spuline
feels like it's a wild card right now. Like Christian
Ellis gets some run there, Jack Gibbons gets some run there,

(01:44:48):
and now Tavia gets a few snaps a game there,
it feels like it's Robert Splaine and right now, like
that other guy is just kind of a mystery box.
Safety I think is still a position that of me.
I think Kyle Dugger's actually played pretty well. I would
like to see Kyle Dugger keep playing. It's nothing against
Jalen Hawkins, and I'm sure when they get back to

(01:45:09):
full health with Jalen Hawkins, he will slide back in
for the most part. But I actually think Kyle Duggar's
played really good outside of one play in New Orleans
where they left him out to dry on a blitz
and I don't put that play on him. Zach Korr
talked about it last week. He took the fall for
that one, as I thought he should. Like, I really
feel like Kyle Duggar has played two solid games and

(01:45:30):
for Jalen Hawkins, so maybe they get Kyle Dugger back
to like twenty two to twenty three Kyle Duggar, and
that safety room doesn't look quite as barren. But I
still watch a film, I still see the middle of
the field wide open too often, So I'm looking linebacker,
I'm looking safety and running back I think is the
other one. Look, if they have an opportunity to trade

(01:45:51):
for a real premium player, the position really doesn't matter
all that much. But I will say the talk about
the edge rusher spot to me is a little odd.

Speaker 2 (01:46:01):
Long term.

Speaker 4 (01:46:01):
Yeah, absolutely, but I find it hard to believe that
they're going to acquire somebody at the deadline better than
Landry or Chase on And we're already in this this
uh like situation with you know, Keon White and Britanny Jennings,
Like these guys can't get on the field. Well so
I but I really quickly that depth evaporated a couple
of weeks ago, right.

Speaker 6 (01:46:22):
It did.

Speaker 4 (01:46:23):
But that's but that's like true at any position. Like
if you have a rash of injuries at one position
where multiple guys go down with injuries, then you're gonna
have depth problems.

Speaker 2 (01:46:31):
I just Caleb adding Caleb Murphy to me should be
maybe I don't want to say it's enough there, but like, yeah,
I trust it. If they need Caleb Murphy to play
tense snaps a game, get after the passer, I trust
me to do that.

Speaker 4 (01:46:42):
I'm just a little bit surprised about the conversations to
like edge and wide receiver surprises me. Now if it's
Trey Hendrickson or A J. Brown, that's a different cover.

Speaker 2 (01:46:52):
So that's the thing I think people just need to
kind of look at the like note the perspective, the
Trey deadline is not about long term needs. Edge is
a long term need. Wide receivers a long term need.
Guard is a long term need. You're not getting the
players to fill those spots at the trade deadline. The
NFL doesn't work that. Most leagues don't work that way.

(01:47:15):
It's super rare that those caliber players get moved in
any We get talked about more in other leagues in
the NFL, but like you don't, you know, trade deadline,
you're talking about rounding out depths, right, rounding out depth,
maybe getting you know, a rotational player. Even rentals in
the NFL isn't that common because the nature of the
sport and you know, coming in cold to learn a

(01:47:35):
system and things like that at certain positions just really
doesn't make it realistic. So I, you know, we're really
talking about depth and rotational play. Yes, edges a long
term need. I don't know that you know, they're not
answering that here in the next two weeks, so.

Speaker 4 (01:47:50):
Really quickly, we only have two more minutes. But I
I also wonder what kind of calls they're getting for
their own players and teams that might be interested in
Patriot players. And the one player that I go to
in that category is Keon White. Keon White, to me,
just isn't built to be a four to three end
like they're trying to make him out to be. He's
not flexible enough, he's not bendy enough. It's not a

(01:48:12):
knock on him, it's just not his skill set. And
I think he's struggling a little bit to get off
blocks out there, and especially in the pass rush. He
just doesn't have to get off and the bend to
play outside the tackle consistently at a high level. He
is a really, really good interior pass rusher, Like the
numbers bear it out. Last year, he is one of
the most productive interior pass rushers in the league on

(01:48:32):
a person app basis if you're another team, And so, really,
what the point I'm getting at is right now, Keon
White is basically insurance for Milton Williams and Christian Barmore. Like,
if one of those guys goes down, you can put
Keon White on the third down pass rush in the
interior and there's not a steep drop off. Now there's
a drop off, but he's a similar player enough to

(01:48:54):
like a Milton Williams that if Milton Williams were to
miss some time, they might be able to get away
with Keon White as their three technique on third down
for a couple of snaps a game. Are other teams
that need interior pass rush help that are more desperate
for it, that don't have the bodies on the inside.
Are they calling about Keon White? And what are they offering?

(01:49:15):
Because right now he's a man with that a home
in this defense, and I just wonder if he's one
guy that might get moved. What do you what do
you think his market would be? We don't, we have
to be quick, but.

Speaker 2 (01:49:27):
Yeah, I have no idea. Probably a Day three pick.
Most of these guys end up going for Day three picks. Yeah,
it's interesting, now, like player for player, could you you know,
I don't know that you're moving him for like a
brief hall but Jerome Forward, yeah, something like that. Like
I'd be interested in moving him in a player for
player deal.

Speaker 4 (01:49:43):
I wonder if those more of those happen now that
you know, we sort of get into this trade heavy
because I do think there's gonna be a lot of
trades in the NFL.

Speaker 3 (01:49:52):
All right, we gotta go.

Speaker 4 (01:49:53):
Patriots Unfiltered will be up here at noon in just
about ten minutes. We'll be back next week. We'll be
talking about this Cleveland Browns game.

Speaker 3 (01:50:02):
But I'm really.

Speaker 4 (01:50:02):
Excited to talk about the Atlanta Falcons. We talked so
much about Michael Pennix during the draft process. Hopefully he's
healthy and playing in that game. I do think they
have a lot of talent in Atlanta and when they
put it together, mostly at home, but when they put
it together, you see that. So I'm interested in that
game as well. We'll see you guys next week.

Speaker 2 (01:50:21):
Thanks for watching.

Speaker 5 (01:50:25):
Hey this is Alex. Thanks for tuning into the show.
If you really want to help us, make sure you
like us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get
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everything else we do here at the Patriots.

Speaker 2 (01:50:40):
Thanks a lot