Patriots Catch-22 3/19: Pats Latest Moves, Resetting the O-Line, NFL Draft Talk

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan
Lazar and Alex Bars and Lazarre. Hello, everybody nailed it?
Joined us always by our bar. Here is Evan Lazar
and Alex Bars.

Speaker 2 (00:21):
What better you have two guys with rocket arms to
have a rocket scientist teach them how to go about
their their game? Right? So?

Speaker 1 (00:28):
How long he's been rehearsing that one?

Speaker 2 (00:30):
I came up with it about ten minutes after they
signed him.

Speaker 1 (00:33):
I think we have to talk about the Cooper cup
of it all? Uh cup check if you will?

Speaker 2 (00:39):
How long? Even holding on a one?

Speaker 1 (00:41):
I thought about one last night.

Speaker 2 (00:44):
A rare double cut for the open.

Speaker 1 (00:46):
A rare time where we both kind of made the
same joke, but not exactly. I feel like we don't
really have the same sense of humor. I think we
we think have very different or attempts at jokes.

Speaker 2 (01:02):
I told the joke very similar to one you told
about a week ago, and you got very annoyed. We
don't need to bring that one on the air. But
I don't even know about the fast food restaurant.

Speaker 1 (01:11):
Oh yeah, because it just wasn't funny anyway, It just
wasn't funny. Joke like some of the Josh Allen one
is funny. That's funny. Hey, Patriots, fancy if you want
to see Toyota's best offers, including those not seen on TV,
go to buy atya dot com. It's Toyota's official website
for deals for the official vehicle of the New England Patriots, Toyota.

(01:33):
Let's go places. Hello everybody, it's Evan Lazar, It's Alex Barth.
It's Patriots Catch twenty two. With you for the next
couple of hours, talking Patriots off season, free agency. Things
still happening last night, Actually something happening with the Patriots
that is notable, So we'll get to that here in
a second. I'm sure we'll talk plenty of draft and

(01:55):
we are at the point of the draft site.

Speaker 2 (01:57):
Of this draft season.

Speaker 1 (01:59):
It's it's draft season for everybody now, which is the
time where I hand up fully admit that I start
to get annoyed because you and I and I'm not
saying this to Graham stand or anything like that, but
you and I have on this show have been talking
about all these guys since like November or December, maybe
January if we wanted, When we really.

Speaker 2 (02:20):
Started to get in August for me.

Speaker 1 (02:22):
But we've been talking about these guys for a while. Yeah,
and so at this point it definitely feels like we
are all dug in on our guys. These are sort
of our opinions on this draft. This is sort of
what we would do at this draft if we were
in the general manager chair. And this is the point
where everybody just gets a little bit riled up because

(02:43):
no one's gonna get moved at this point. Like you,
all the data is in.

Speaker 2 (02:46):
Everybody has their guys.

Speaker 1 (02:47):
Yeah, all the combines over the film is in there.
You have your guys. I have my guys. So we'll
talk about all of that here in a second. But
I want to start with Garrett Bradbury reported signing by
the Patriots of the former Vikings Center, And last night
I tweeted some things about this signing. I can't really

(03:11):
get all hot and bothered by a thirty point eight
million dollars guarantee to a center. That's I think a
big part of it, and that's all reported, by the way,
but just in general, I can't get that hot and
bothered by basically a one year guarantee on a stopgap center,
which is what this is. And with Bradbury, I think

(03:31):
it's also philosophically just what I like in centers and
what I prefer in centers. I think the number one
thing to me with the center is obviously intelligence and
smarts and the ability to run the line of scrimmage
pre snap, and you can see that on film with
brad Berry, him pointing out, you know, moving the mic
points and like doing all the protections and all that

(03:53):
kind of stuff. In Minnesota's offense, he's renowned for being
a pretty intelligent pre snap center and being able to
handle all those things. The second thing that I always
like in centers, I want an athletic center. I want
a center that can set the pace of the offensive line,
that can make blocks in space, that can reach a
block on the line of scrimmage, that can climb to

(04:13):
the second level, that can pull, that can get out
in front of screens. I just those things are what
I value in centers. Bradbury I think checks a lot
of those boxes. He's a very good athlete, still is
still there on tape with him, and then it's obviously
a bonus if he's a good pass protector. Brad Berry
is not right, it's a bonus. It's a nice bonus
if he is a good pass protector. But out of

(04:36):
all the five spots on the offensive line in terms
of pass protection, I would say it's the least important
at center because most of the time, nobody's lined up
over you right, so you either have somebody that's shaded
in the a gap in the one tech, or you're
in a pass rushing front where the center is completely uncovered.
So as much as I want to say be fair

(04:58):
or objective about his struggles in pass protection, particularly last season,
I don't think that that's the most important thing for
a center because of how much help you can get
from the guards at that position. So I like the
Bradbury signing. I think that this fits the mold of
a lot of their other moves, just in terms of
we needed an answer today, like if we were to

(05:20):
play a game tomorrow, we needed an NFL caliber center
to be able to play that position. And now you
go into the draft and you don't have to be
thinking about center in the top one hundred necessarily because
you have a guy like Bradbury under contract. So I
don't mind it. I'm not trying to tell you and
tell you that he's this high end all Pro caliber center.

(05:40):
He's absolutely not. But he's an NFL player and that's good.

Speaker 2 (05:43):
Sure, i'd push back on some of that. I think
in the context of where this team is is at,
I wouldn't call pass detection ability a bonus, and I
think yes it. Centers maybe aren't at the point of
attack in pass pro as much as other positions. But
the fact that he got exposed as much as he
did tells you that he's a guy teams will hunt

(06:04):
in that regard, and so he is a weak spot.
At the same time, he is experienced, smart, veteran. It's
a very inexperienced group there, and I think having a
veteran in the room is important, regardless of if he's
starting or not. I'm not ready to put a sharpie
on the paper yet and call him the starter. I
think it should be an open competition going into camp him,

(06:26):
Cole Strange, Ben Brown. I would like to see them
draft somebody. I'm not taking center out. I don't feel
changed about where they're at at center. In terms of
the big picture. I still wouldn't hate them taking a
center on day two. The ideal center you just described,
I can think of three guys right away, off the
top of my head that fit that bill in this draft,
Jared Wilson from Georgia, Jake Majors from Texas, and then

(06:47):
Seth McLoughlin's a little different because he's coming off of
torn acl Now, maybe he's the perfect guy because you
have Brad Berry or Ben Brown? Is this bridge?

Speaker 1 (06:56):
You don't have to draft those guys on day two?

Speaker 2 (06:58):
Maybe, Wilson, I think maybe maybe, Also maybe he's right
in that.

Speaker 1 (07:02):
I don't know. I think all those guys are if
you're truly a center only player, it's hard to.

Speaker 2 (07:09):
I would like them. I would like them to still
like them to make a somewhat significant investment at center
in this draft, especially because you know Bradbury last year
was a doubt. He last year was the worst year
of his career. Right He's coming off the worst year
of his career, career high in pressures, career, high in
accepted penalties, called like, He's not a long term answer.
He's a contender to be the bridge, as is Ben

(07:30):
Brown as his col strange. I think that's a good,
healthy competition. But I don't know that any of those
guys are definitive long term answer. If you add a
guy like a Jared Wilson, or like a Jake Majors
or even McLoughlin, if you know health aside, you know
that that's an option. So I get why they made
the signing. I don't think it's a good or bad signing.
It's I'm just I'm not really moved by it. Like
I guess it's good in the sense that you're adding

(07:53):
to the competition at that spot, which I think is
always healthy. Ninety players is a lot. I don't know
that he's like taking up a roster spot, right. You're
adding a competition at that group, and you put a
veteran in the room for camp, which I think is good.
After that, we'll see what happens. That's kind of where
I'm at with it. I don't I don't know ready
that I'm I don't know that I'm ready to lock
him in, as the Week one said, I'm not ready
to lock anybody in. Is the Week one center it's

(08:14):
going to be an open competition. I don't there should
be an open competition.

Speaker 1 (08:17):
I don't disagree that every position is an open competition
in theory.

Speaker 2 (08:21):
I'm not talking in the coach speak. Term of everybody's
out here competing, I mean, like a legit.

Speaker 1 (08:24):
I would find it really hard to believe that he's
going to get beat out by Ben Brown and Cold Strange.
Like Ben Brown was kicking around practice squads, Cole Strange
is trying to transition to center if he even still
is trying to.

Speaker 2 (08:35):
Be Brown cold Strange. I have no idea what's going
to happen with col Strange.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
I don't will you that col Strange is playing guard
for this coaching staff.

Speaker 2 (08:43):
Or he's just they don't they don't plan on him
being here.

Speaker 1 (08:45):
Yeah, but I mean I assume that he's going to
be in camp, and well he's I think.

Speaker 2 (08:49):
He'll compete at both. He gives them some flexibility because
I don't know he's a fit as guard in what
McDaniels wants to do either. But is Ben Brown that
different of a player from Garret Bradbury last year?

Speaker 1 (09:01):
Different? Yeah? Last year, Yeah, significantly different, Like like Garrett
Bradbury is still a really good run blocking center, Like
Garrett Bradbury is a really good athlete. Obviously, he's got
way more experience than Ben Brown, like Ben Brown was
a nice experience difference Bren Brown. Was I a nice find.
I guess is what I would you know, like you
you poached him off a practice squad and he came

(09:23):
in for a month or so and played a respectable
center for time being.

Speaker 2 (09:28):
But it started twelve thirteen games a month.

Speaker 1 (09:32):
Yeah, And I just said a month or so, like
it started to give away for him towards the end
of what he you know, when he was playing in there.
This is in my opinion, and this is no disrespect
to Ben Brown. It's more out of respect for Garrett Bradbury.
I kind of find a little like almost disrespectful to
bet to Bradbury to say that he's in the same category.

Speaker 2 (09:53):
Well, that's why I said last year, not for his career.
I look at a guy that at Ben Brown's what
twenty five, twenty six, just played his first full he's
in NFL football, versus a guy that is going to
be thirty years old and is coming off his worst season,
like you know it's passing ships.

Speaker 1 (10:08):
I just think that he's I think this is who
Bradbury has been his entire career. So I guess, like
worst season, Yeah, I guess maybe by like the metrics
in pass protection, it was his worst season. But I
don't think that he has ever been a high level
pass protector throughout He hasn't, but it was it was
worse last year at times. At times, I mean, he
he was not the issue in that playoff game.

Speaker 2 (10:30):
No, you know, I'm not. I'm not pacing, you know.
I hate doing that where it's just one game we
single out. But just I don't know. Again, I'm not
mad they brought him in. You know, let's see, maybe
last year was a blip. Yeah, all I'm saying I
I'm more let's find out what he is than okay,
this is our starter. That's more the camp that I'm in.

Speaker 1 (10:48):
Yeah, I can understand that you like that. I don't
think I think Sharpiet is strong like I think. I'd
probably say he's penciled in as the starter. You can
always if.

Speaker 2 (10:57):
They had to play a game today, he would probably
start with you on that.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
I just don't envision a long way they're going to
find a better center for twenty twenty five. I'm not
talking about.

Speaker 2 (11:06):
If he takes another step back this year, the door
this is what we're bad.

Speaker 1 (11:11):
Because I just think he was consistent last year with
what his career has been and that that's admitting to
deficiencies in his game, right, Like, I'm not saying that
is in like he's this great player because he's always consistent.
I'm saying it as this is who he is. He's
a very good athlete at the position. He's a very
high level, not very high level. He's a good run blocker. Yeah,
and he's a and he's a you know, not great
pass protector like that. That's just who he is.

Speaker 2 (11:33):
Well, I think there's other guys that that can We'll see.
We'll see, Like they're not going to get a better
centered free agency, and that's why the signing makes sense
ultimately to add some floor to that room. I want
to see what they do in the draft. I you know,
if if you get.

Speaker 1 (11:46):
I like McLaughlin, well so McLaughlin. I know I like
McLaughlin because I think you're going to get McLoughlin, who's
the Ohio State Center Tours Achilles and November of last
year during practice tough injury. But he you're probably going
to get him a round or two later than you

(12:07):
would have normally because because of the injury, he was
tracking to be a top one hundred pick, probably third
round pick. If he doesn't get hurt. Yeah, so he
gets hurt.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
This is a guy with either just real quick, a
guy the really impressive resume. Four year player at Alabama,
started there, transferred after saved and left last year went
to Ohio State, was like a crucial part of their
offensive line. People rave about his leadership is intelligence, like
he is talent wise the best center in this draft.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
Agreed. I like that idea. I like that idea because
you put him on ice, you get him ready, Yeah,
you get him healthy. And then if it's halfway through
the year, if it's twenty twenty six.

Speaker 2 (12:44):
Might be a little because it was a torn achilles
in laid October, so maybe it's.

Speaker 1 (12:48):
Twenty twenty six that he that he takes over in
Bradbury's truly a boint, just stop gap one year play.

Speaker 2 (12:54):
I would be that's ultimately what they do, assuming that
they address the other spots that they need to address,
I would be okay with that.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
I think it all comes back to kind of bring
a big picture, because I think there's some other things
that we can discuss here too. With the offensive line.
It all comes back to the fact that in my eyes,
their goal on the offensive line, this offseason was to
get back to serviceable Can you just be a average
to below average instead of a bottom of the league

(13:24):
offensive line And we both like the Morgan Moses move,
so we're in agreement on that. I think that's a
step forward to that. I think on when who back
at right guard entrenched at right guard.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
Right side's fine. I'm not worried at all about that.
And that's like legitimate solid right side guard.

Speaker 1 (13:40):
Yeah. And if and it's a big if, but if
they go out and solve left tackle, and I solve
is probably a strong word too, Like if they have
a competent left tackle next year, then I am I
would I'm confident that Bradbury is going to be a
competent center. So that level that we're trying to reach
of just functional in that group is possible with Garrett Bradberry.

Speaker 2 (14:04):
If Bradbury's your worst offensive lineman, you're in pretty good shape.

Speaker 1 (14:07):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (14:08):
If he's your second worst, okay, if he's your third,
like now it's.

Speaker 1 (14:14):
If he's your second rumble, I agree. But I would
also just say, like he plays center right, so like
we're not talking about him being the worst offensive lineman
that they have at left tackle. We're talking about him
being the worst offensive lineman they have at center. I
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (14:28):
I think you're overrating the position thing a little bit
in the sense that smart coaches will find a weakness
and find a way to exploit it. They're not going
to care about where he is on the field or
any of that. They'll go hunt him if they feel
like that's what they need to do.

Speaker 1 (14:40):
But it's situational, like you can't. Yeah, they can hunt
him on third down. They could hunt him in their
pass rushing fronts, and so the Jets could play situation.
The Jets could put Quinn Williams right over him on
third and eight and let.

Speaker 2 (14:53):
Him rush the past games over the whole game.

Speaker 1 (14:55):
But not really like you have your base fronts and
like most teams play with true nose tackles anymore. Like so, yeah,
sure if you want to. If you were really that
dead set on Garrett Bradbury is a liability and we're
just gonna target him for four straight quarters, then yeah,
they obviously could give them some problems with that, but
like what Minnesota would do, you know, they would just

(15:16):
slide the protection, so you have a half slide or
a three man slide that Bradbury would be in and
then they would just be man to man on the
back side of the protection. And for the Patriots, I think,
what you know, just to kind of bring it back
and not get bogged down by debating the the you know,
Garrett Bradbury so much like a lot of these points

(15:36):
to me to the fact that Mike on wen Who
needs to have a really good bounced back. Yes, I
think that might regardless. I think Mike Who in general,
there's just with brad Burry especially, he's gonna have to
take on a lot of the tough assignments on the interior,
like he's gonna have to be able to pass protect

(15:57):
one on one. He's not. You're not gonna be able
to help a ton and pass protection. And when you
have a center like Bradberry, who's you know, six two
six three three hundred pounds, so he's a little undersized
for the offensive line, I think having two Bulldozers or
Malers at guard can really be helpful for a center like.

Speaker 2 (16:16):
That, which goes back to the cold strange point too.

Speaker 1 (16:18):
Yeah, and I think Minnesota didn't have that. I think
Minnesota had bad guard play on top of having a
weak center play and pass protection and so just exacerbated
all of these issues. So if you have on Wenu
on one side of Garrett Bradberry, and you have a
a Leyden Robinson or a City Sew or a draft
pick on the other side of Garrett Bradberry that's stout
and has good play strength and good anchor to him

(16:41):
and all those types of things, I could see the
interior working out that way you have. You know, Bradberry
helped buy two massive humans right on either.

Speaker 2 (16:51):
Side, and I got to get a massive human at
left guard.

Speaker 1 (16:53):
Yeah, so City So's a massive city.

Speaker 2 (16:55):
So okay, that's I was gonna say, City So could count.

Speaker 1 (16:57):
This kind of feels like a little bit all off season,
and I've kind of felt like Citi Stow's back in
play here. Yeah, back to that Bill O'Brien adjacent scheme
that he was okay in as a rookie. Back to
maybe some more downhill stuff, more gap stuff. Now Bradberry's
his zone blocking center has been all the way back
to his college career. So could this signal some sort

(17:18):
of scheme change or maybe a morphing or melding between
what Rabel did in Tennessee and what Josh McDaniels has
done historically to bring in some more zone a flavor
to this offense. I think it's possible. I wouldn't rule
it out. I also wouldn't overreact to one signing, especially
at a level like brad.

Speaker 2 (17:35):
I also think this is more about getting that veteran
and an experienced player than the scheme.

Speaker 1 (17:40):
His best trait, though, is absolutely his range and his
ability to block on the move, you know, latterly, move
latterly and reach blocks and climb and all that kind
of stuff. That's what he's good at. That typically is
more of a zone blocking thing. Like if you're expecting
Garrett Bradberry to get on a double team and move

(18:01):
the line of scrimmage like that's this is not the
center for you. This is not your guy. But if
you're asking the center to be more athletic and make
more plays in space, then he's definitely somebody that can
do that at a pretty good level. So will be
there'll be a scheme change, maybe, I doubt it. I
still am sticking to my guns that Josh McDaniels is
gonna get to do what Josh McDaniels wants to do

(18:22):
and has always done, which is, you know, run downhill
and two back and power and lead and all that
good stuff. But we'll see. The other thought that I
had with this Brad Burry signing was what I just
mentioned with the guards. This seems to me like the
Patriots are gonna have an open competition for left guard
out of those three recent draft picks Cole Strange, Leyden Robinson,

(18:46):
and City.

Speaker 2 (18:46):
So I could see him adding somebody too in the draft.

Speaker 1 (18:49):
Yeah, I could see somebody another you know, Dart thrown
in there in the middle round. So you know, I
did some guard research the other day on Monday, had
fun with it. Like, those guards in this class are good.
There's some good players in this guard class, especially when
you factor in the tackles that are going to move
inside for the college tackles. But there's some really good

(19:09):
guards that can be had in the middle round, some
guys that played tackle in college that can beat tackles
in a pinch. You know Arizona kid Jonas Sevilla. Yeah,
obviously Wyatt Milam is probably gonna move inside in Gray's
Abel and Donovan Jackson, but that's sort of the top
of the class. You know, you go into those middle rounds.
You know there's some guys like that too. Jalen Rivers

(19:29):
from Miami. He played a little the left tackle, a
little bit of left guard, so he can be in
a pinch, you can flex him outside and move him
to tackle. I could definitely see a lot of those
types of guys. Your third or fourth round guard, I
think is absolutely on the table. Maybe one of those
guys can even play a little bit of center for
you so that you know it can kind of cross

(19:49):
train him and see where he fits best once he
gets in here. But those three guys that I think Strange,
sal and Robinson are probably gonna be given a pretty
good chance to start at left guard. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (20:00):
I think it's gonna be an open competition that I
I you're gonna we're probably you're gonna have a competition
in camp at least one spot, if not too. But
left guard makes the most centrist because of how much
they've invested there, and maybe they keep investing. Maybe this
staff wants their own guy. Shouldn't be in the top
one hundred, but a guy like Carson Vincent or Clay
Webb who also has some some center guard flexibility, yeah,

(20:21):
would would make sense.

Speaker 1 (20:22):
Yeah, And I would also just say, from my perspective,
you should be able to get a left guard out
of those three guys, like if you have the right
coaching and you have you have the right coaching, like
if Doug Moron is doing his job well and if
Josh McDaniels is doing his job, those three guys are
talented enough that they should be able to find a

(20:43):
starting guard as.

Speaker 2 (20:44):
I unless stylistically the guy they want, they don't fit
what they want, right, But I kind of talked.

Speaker 1 (20:49):
About that City so should like maybe, yeah, Leyden Robinson's
a powerful player. He's not as big as City Show, right,
but he's He's a guy that I would say wins
with power, you know, like that he that is so
of his game is power oriented. But I'm with you.
I I think that they're type wise, Like col Strange
is probably not their type.

Speaker 2 (21:07):
I think he's going to be more in the mix
at center than guard.

Speaker 1 (21:09):
Yeah. I just I genuinely feel that way that they
if they have the right coaching, if they're in the
right scheme, that you invested three top twenty picks, you know,
just to be precise in three different guards, like yeah,
Robinson and so are high fourth round picks. Cole Strange
was obviously a first round pick. If you can't get

(21:31):
one starting guard out of those three guys, I think
that that that's uh, that's not good. You should you
should be able to pull that out. So that brings
us to left tackle in this offensive line reset, which
I'm also going to write about so you can hear
this exact take again on Patriots dot Com tomorrow if
you want. But uh, left tackle glaring obvious, glaring hole

(21:55):
on that side of the of the ball. Like you
can talk yourself into those three guards emerging with one
starter at left guard? Yeah, I can't really talk of
myself into the left tackle being on the roster currently.
Who even is Like if there were to be a
competition right and who I guess Kidd and Wallace trying
to play the left side again, Like it's not even

(22:16):
a competition there right, Not that there's any practices right now,
but yeah, you can't even say it's a competition there
right now, because there's what it can be. Yeah. That
being said, I don't fault them entirely for passing on
Dan Moore junior at twenty million dollars a year. I
think that one, I can understand. I he's he was
not good last year either, gave up the most sacks

(22:36):
in the league at that position. I get that one,
But that doesn't mean that that's not a cop out
like this still used to make a big investment at
left town. Cam Robinson still out there. So Cam Robinson
still out there. Something tells me that Cam Robinson still
being out there is not a good sign for Cam Robinson.
I don't know if it's you know, there are some
rumors out there. None of it's confirmed, so I don't

(22:57):
want to just throw things out there. But with Cam Robinson,
but he's still a free agent as a guy that
was considered one of the top free agents at that position,
which is a very important position, right so the fact
that he's still floating out there means his market has
not materialized the way that he expected. I would say
the other one that I would just mention at left

(23:18):
tackle and free agency that's still out there is probably
ring chasing right now. But Tyron Smith is still out there.
And Tyron Smith, at thirty three years old, played a
respectable left tackle for the Jets last year. He was solid,
he wasn't great. It was kind of like Work and
Moses like those two guys were decent right at their spots. Again,
it's another stop gap, it's another band aid on the issue.

(23:39):
But I wouldn't hate Tyron Smith with a highly drafted
left tackle. You know, maybe you don't have to go
left tackle at four. Maybe you go trade back up
into the first round or take one at thirty eight,
or whatever the case may be. But Cam Robinson and
Tyron Smith are those two options to me and to everybody.
I feel like, if you want to do that route,

(24:00):
if you don't want to be pigeonholed in to tackle
at four, and you want to take a tackle at
thirty eight or at the late first round in the
trade up, then those are your two options to kind
of bridge the gap.

Speaker 2 (24:11):
Is Tyron Smith realistically coming here though?

Speaker 1 (24:13):
No, right the only way that Tyron Smith's coming here
is if he has very little market and the Patriots
are willing to overpay.

Speaker 2 (24:20):
Well, He's also a guy I could see waiting into,
you know, the summer to sign so he doesn't have
to go through spring practices. Patriots kind of need a
guy with them working with Drake May, working with his
coaching staff from the beginning, not that Tyron Smith needs
to work, but yeah, I just I don't know that. Look,
he's better than nothing, but I don't know that he
makes a ton of sense. I don't know how realistic

(24:41):
it is. I don't know that he makes the most sense.

Speaker 1 (24:43):
So then the other the draft talk or the draft
draft conversation at tackle is it kind of comes down
to three things for me and maybe you have a
you know, a fourth thing. But I don't want to
take the chance on Will Campbell, right, like Bank on
the film with Will Campbell, that.

Speaker 2 (25:01):
It has to be in the conversation if we're just
talking about what the team might do and we're trying
to have a realistic conversation about the Patriots draft strategy,
Will Campbell at four or six, if you trade down
whatever you're not getting past six as a left tackle
has to be in the con We can't ignore it.
It's not something you can ignore.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
So Bank on the fact that Will Campbell can make
it work with the arms, yep, flip armand membo to
left tackle yeh, or target the next wave Josh Simmons,
Josh Connery, Arianti Erserie either at thirty eight oh one
of those guys falls a little bit, or go up

(25:41):
and get them in the back half of the first round.
Out of those three options, where do you stand on
March nineteen.

Speaker 2 (25:50):
What do I think they're gonna do? I think it's
gonna be Campbell.

Speaker 1 (25:52):
Okay, you where does Alex Barth stand?

Speaker 2 (25:55):
I would probably get a gro and try to move
up into the twenties and ursery. Who is the third
guys Banks? Right?

Speaker 1 (26:09):
Oh? Yeah, well so Banks is interesting?

Speaker 2 (26:11):
Who is the third guy in your second tier?

Speaker 1 (26:13):
Connor Simmons.

Speaker 2 (26:15):
I'm out on Simmons. I've said that I'm out on Simmons.
I'd rather Versary than connorly, but you know, I would
take either. I just think that's the most proudent course
of action. You got to be able to move up,
and I don't think you're getting either of those guys
at thirty eight because we saw this last year. There
is such a shortage at the tackle position. Teams are desperate,
Teams are going to be aggressive, aggressive to try to

(26:37):
fill that hole. Guys are gonna go significantly earlier. Once
once Kelvin Banks goes right, whether it be at eight,
at ten, at twelve, that's essentially a starting gun. The
race is on, and because after the three guys you named,
and to me, Simmons is a good player, but he's
not an option for the Patriots. Like there's there's a significant,

(27:00):
significant drop off to the next group. So you have
three shots and in the Patriots case, in some other
team's cases, two shots to get your guy starting it.
If I'm being realistic, Banks probably isn't going any lower
than fifteen sixteen, that's right. I left them, So yeah, no,
and you were right to do that so well. The
other option would be do you trade down to like ten,
try to get a haul and take Banks there. That

(27:21):
would be a fourth option. But to me, you're racing
up from thirty eight to try to get one of
those guys, and it's probably gonna be expensive, and you're
really gonna have to push to do it. They knew
last year they needed to do it, and they didn't.
They tried last year for both a tackle and a
receiver to do this, and they failed in doing so.
I said this on the show last night, and I

(27:42):
think I'm going to start giving this take stronger and
stronger as we go on, pending any changes to the roster.
Tell me if you agree, Ev and they should not
be picking at thirty eight. I don't think that if
they pick at thirty eight they didn't have the best
possible draft. You have two thirds, you have the flexibility
to move up. Option Number one for me at tackle

(28:03):
is getting up to where you need to get up to,
which is probably the high mid twenties. And if you package,
even if you want to do the lower third, the
Jude on third, thirty eight and seventy seven historically gets
you to like twenty three, twenty four, and you should
You might not get your choice, but you should be
able to get one of Ursery and Connery there maybe
you do get your choice. That's the move to me.

(28:25):
After that, I take the shot on Will Campbell. I
know people think I overreact to the right side to
left side thing, but and yes, if you want to
pull out a handful of examples where it's worked, you
can do that. The vast majority of the time it
hasn't worked. You can say the same thing about Will
Campbell's arm length too, because I know people will come
back at me at that. If I were to rank these,
it's one, two three, and for people listening, my arms

(28:49):
like all the way up on one and two three
were two very little little motions. So yes, either way
you're asking for an outlier, whether it's Campbell or whether
it's moving Membo. And by the way, was not exactly
the prototype left tackle either. He has the arm length,
but he's shorter, yeah, and he's not as wide as
he usually looked forward to position three hundred and thirty

(29:10):
two pounds, but it's he's built like a guard. He's
built kind of like Kelvin Banks. So either way, two
or three are looking for an outlier. To me, trust
the coaching staff to either coach up Ursery or coach
up Connory, and just looking at their preferences and their
trends and the way they've gone. If I had to guess,
Ursery's probably hired and Connory on their board.

Speaker 1 (29:28):
Yeah. So I put out a mock draft yesterday or
the day before, and I took Campbell at four overall.

Speaker 2 (29:34):
Again, if we're playing the prediction game, that's what I think, right.

Speaker 1 (29:36):
And everybody came at me and was like, you said,
you were out on Campbell, You're flip flopping, And my
take on Campbell has not flip flapped one bit. I
feel the same way that I did I personally would
not take Will Campbell at four because of the risk
with the arm length. I genuinely feel like with Will
Campbell you have to be careful there. With four overall,

(29:57):
you want to pick that you feel really good about.
With that being said, in a draft like this, it's
easier said than done to just do that because if
Travis Hunter and Abdul Carter are not there, then now
we're talking about a group of players that all have
question marks right now. They all have certain things about
them that we don't love. I saw Daniel Jeremiah tweeted

(30:18):
this out yesterday. If the Patriots or any team or
to draft Ted McMillan inside the top fifteen, he would
be the first four or five plus receiver to go
that high since Mike Evans. It's over ten years, so
Mike Evans was drafted in twenty fourteen. So you're basically
banking on the fact that he's going to be Mike Evans,
right like he's going to be that he's an outlier. Yeah,

(30:40):
drafting a four or five to five receiver at four
overall is an outlier, right, Whether you are in love
with the forty or not, it makes him an outlier. Ye,
Mason Graham is small, He's two hundred and ninety five pounds.
That makes him an outlier.

Speaker 2 (30:52):
Well, not just that, the last defensive tackle to go
in the top five was Quinn Williams in two thousand
and nine. The last one before that was Marcel Darius
in twenty eleven. Right, So that's another one where and
how both good players? How much of those guys contribute
to their teams winning? Right?

Speaker 1 (31:12):
So Ted McMillan's has the speed concerns that would make
him an outlier. Will Campbell has arm length concerns that
would make him an outlier. Mason Graham. It's a combination,
I would say, of size and position. Yep ash and
Gent's a running back. Tyler Warren is a tight end.

Speaker 2 (31:27):
Who's last tight end? And one top five those I
don't even think it's Pits Right, didn't Pitts go six?

Speaker 1 (31:31):
Those positions are typically not viewed as great positional value
at the top of the draft. So what I'm getting
at is is that it's easy to just sit here
and say I'm out on Will Campbell, which maybe I
was a little bit strong with after the combine. Pitts
went for more than I should have been, but it's
easy to say that when then you start to look
at and survey.

Speaker 2 (31:52):
The lank Right, So who were you in on? Well,
I'm just kidding, no, No, that's my point. Like, if
you're out on Will Campbell, Okay, well who are you
in right?

Speaker 1 (31:59):
So if it were me and I was picking, I
would personally I like the scenario of trading back up
into the back end of the first round. Now, I
just looked it up last last season. I think this
is kind of relevant. Marius Mims started another run of
O line at eighteen, right, he got drafted at eighteen
by the Bengals. Tyler Geiton went in the twenties to Dallas.

(32:24):
So I would say that Connorly and Ursery potentially and
then maybe Simmons if teams feel good about their his medicals,
the twenties to early thirties is probably where those three
guys are going in that sort of range. So the
Patriots are gonna have to be aggressive. They're gonna have

(32:45):
to trade back up, potentially all the way back up
into the first round. Do you like Ursery? I personally
like Connorly a little bit more. I just think he's
a higher level pass protector, and that's what I would
want at that spot. Ursery is a maler.

Speaker 2 (32:57):
I like Connor I Thinksery is there.

Speaker 1 (33:02):
I would say he would be their type at right tackle.
I think at left tackle they have typically had better
athletes and guys that pass protected. A little bit of
a higher level erser worries me just I think in
terms of foot speed and just nimbleness at that position.
He has some of those concerns a little bit like
Trent Brown, where like, he's just a bigger dude right

(33:24):
so it's a lot of weight to move when he
has to move back and forth and side to side
and change directions and get out to speed rushers and
get underneath them and leverage blocks and get his hands
on people that are twitched up rushers like that, He's
always gonna just be kind of a bigger guy, and
I feel like he moves a little bit like that.
Connorly is the total opposite. Connorly doesn't have his play strength,

(33:46):
but is a much more nimble pass protector and much
lighter on his feet. So if I had to rank
the options, I would personally try to target one of
those guys at the back end of the first round,
early second. That would be number one for me.

Speaker 2 (33:59):
By the way, real quick, last tight end and go
top five before Kyle Pits.

Speaker 1 (34:02):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (34:03):
Nineteen seventy two, Riley Odoms to the Broncos.

Speaker 1 (34:05):
Jess.

Speaker 2 (34:06):
A couple guys went six overall, but that's a significant,
significant outlier. It was Vernon Davis and somebody else went
six overall. Kellen Winslow.

Speaker 1 (34:13):
Then I'm going Will Campbell, and I want to finish this.
Will Campbell take care in a second, and then I
would go Membo like that would be my order with
Will Campbell. The thing that I mocked him to the
Patriots in my last mock draft. Like I said, what
I keep coming back to with Will Campbell is that
I cannot fathom that Mike Rabel is going to get

(34:35):
into a room with Will Campbell and sit down and
talk to this guy and have him here and host
him here on a thirty visit and talk to Will
Campbell and not fall in love. He is a Mike
Rabel football player.

Speaker 2 (34:47):
Every go look up any quote of him talking at
any point. That is leadership, accountability, all the ENTI.

Speaker 1 (34:54):
High high football character. He's gonna be captain year two,
right and I just with this regime, culture is a
big word. It seems like a lot of their moves
so far in free agency has been about establishing a
culture here in New England. And I just can't imagine
that the culture guy an offensive lineman that has that

(35:16):
kind of intangible qualities like Will Campbell. I just can't
imagine that Rabel is going to look at that and
say his arms are a little too short. So I'm asking, right,
I just can't see that. So would it be the
smartest pick in the world. Would it be a risk? Yeah,
it would be a risk. But just trying to project
what they might do now, I just think Will Campbell
is definitely on their radar.

Speaker 2 (35:38):
I'm with you what it's going to come down to.
If Travis Hunter's off the board, I think it's clearly
prediction wise, I think it's clearly Campbell.

Speaker 1 (35:46):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (35:46):
The only thing is would they pass on Travis Hunter?
Because Rabel also talked about how hard it is to
get a wide receiver and the importance of drafting at
that position, And you know, I could there an argument
to be had there based on what we've seen of
their philosophies. Now, using my own philosophies using their philosophies.
There's a real debate between Travis Hunter, assuming they fume

(36:09):
as a wide receiver, which we both think they do,
especially out the sign in Carlon Davis and uh Will Campbell.
But if Hunter's not there, how's that not the guy?

Speaker 1 (36:20):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (36:21):
How is that not their guy? He's made in a
lab to play for Mike Rabel Hunt. We've known that
since September.

Speaker 1 (36:26):
Yeah, one hundred percent. I can't imagine that they would
pass on Travis Hunter. Like we've had some opportunities to
talk to Elliott Wolfe and uh, I know there's some reporting.
I think mass Live has been has reporting on on
Travis Hunter. Yeah, more source type of stuff. And every
time that I've had the opportunity, you know when I
say every time, the one time at the table that

(36:48):
we at the combine, I mean the guy was we
had two different scouting reports about this guy, like you know,
we wrote up one receiver, one corner. I understand to
an extent that it's probably just a fascinating player from
a lifetime of you know, scouting, that you get to
scout a guy that plays both ways at such a
high level. That's probably just fascinating for a true scout

(37:11):
scout like Elliott Wolf. But at the same time, I
can't imagine that they are saying these things about Travis
Hunter publicly and privately and then they're just gonna pass
on Travis Hunter if he's there at four. I don't
think that's necessarily in play. But I'm with you. I
think it's Campbell. If it's not the other sort of
tie in, then we'll get to all these calls and emails.

(37:36):
Can we call it like forty Gate, because like Ted
McMillan's forty I have heard every's range from four four
eight to four six. Well, for his forty yard dash
is private workout. It wasn't even a pro day. He's
not participating in the big twelve Pro day. He just
did a private workout for teams.

Speaker 2 (37:52):
The majority of the reports, there's only one report that's
under four five. The majority of the reports are in
the I went back and I looked at everything and
I like averaged it out. The majority of the reports
are in the mid four fives, like four five three
to four five five is seemingly the number, which is
also pretty much what it looks like on tape. I'll Yeah,

(38:14):
he four to six would be slow even for him,
Like that would be pretty eye opening. If he ran
a four to six had a private workout, he would
have never let that number get out there. Let's be honest. Yeah,
so I'm i'm I think it's I'm open. I'm willing
to call it like a four five, three, four, five
five somewhere in there.

Speaker 1 (38:32):
So he looks to me like a low four fives guy. Yeah,
like four or five three feels right. That feels four
or five to five on the high end of the range.
Maybe if he's a little bit slower than the eye.

Speaker 2 (38:41):
I also wonder if he ran too like because most
people run to you run two with the combine, and
if people haven't been differentiating.

Speaker 1 (38:48):
So I think that there was some reporting that he
only ran once, so he must have thought it run twice.
He must have thought it was a decent enough I guess,
so run once. So the number that I was looking
for him to put up just to really be like, okay,
I need to reevaluate this. Michael Pittman Junior ran a
four or five to two. Yeah, So we talk about
you know, like ceiling floor, mid, mid, middle, mean, whatever

(39:12):
you want to call it in terms of prospects, I
think with Ted, the floor comp to me is Michael
Pittman junior with the Colts, who is pretty good floor.
He Yeah, it's a good floor. But he's a ninety
catch a thousand yard guy. Right, it's gonna be like
eleven yards per catch. Right, that's what he's gonna do.
He's in a big frame, but he's really a possession receiver.

(39:34):
He is a first and second level guy, and he
gets open at the top of the route and that's
about it, right, slants in, cuts, stop routes on the outside,
back shoulders in the occasional throw it up and let
him go get it down the field. That that's Michael
Pittman Jr. The middle is Drake London, and I think
Drake London brings what I see with Ted on film

(39:55):
a little bit. Is that burst after the catch, Right,
He's got a little bit more explo honess with the ball.

Speaker 2 (40:00):
That's why I like, did you see that? Did anybody
give a ten yard split?

Speaker 3 (40:04):
No?

Speaker 2 (40:04):
I was really curious because I bet his ten yard
split was pretty good.

Speaker 1 (40:07):
Yeah, I was.

Speaker 2 (40:08):
I was curiously what his ten yard split was because
of that that burst.

Speaker 1 (40:11):
Yeah, he has an ability, and I know some of
the analytics, like some of the player tracking will back
this up. Like when he catches the ball, he finds
another gear.

Speaker 2 (40:20):
He's the most underrated part of his game is how
good he is after the catch.

Speaker 1 (40:23):
Yeah, he's really good at it. And he's really a
really great stop on a dime change in direction to
just kind of slip out of a tackle real quick
and turn up the field. He has that really good ability.
He reverses field pretty well, you know, and he'll just
he'll run around, he'll get open on an incut and
the defender will kind of come crashing in to try
to break up the pass, and he can stop on
a dime and come right back up the field and

(40:45):
create after the catch. He's really good at that. But
what I'm getting at with Ted is that you just
need to know what you're drafting, right like and then
the high floor I guess I didn't mention, you know,
obviously be like somebody like t Higgins, right. Yeah. He
also he ran a four five three. I don't know
if he ran at the combine. I think that's like
an unofficial pro DAI remember, But needless to say, the

(41:06):
point being, you have to understand what you're getting with
Tep McMillan. You're not getting a field stretcher. You're not
getting a vertical threat. I don't think that he really
especially playing on the outside. I don't think that he
threatens vertically from the outside. He doesn't run by people,
especially on the outside against press coverage. But you're getting

(41:28):
a good first and second level receiver, and I do
think that he will stretch the field a little bit
for you in the slot. If you put him in
the big slot type of role and have him run
seams and things like that, I think that's where he
can be effective down the field because then you get
him on matchups with linebackers and safeties and stuff like that,
and he can win those foot races. So if you

(41:48):
understand the type of player that you're getting, and you're
creative enough to understand the type of player that you're getting,
then Ted McMillan has a nice floor projection. To me, like,
I don't see a path where he's a total bright.

Speaker 2 (42:01):
That's why I use Pittman. I appreciate everybody who sent in.
We did that exercise last week. What's the komfafee busted?
I got a bunch of good uhlies.

Speaker 1 (42:09):
I don't see him being like this monumental bust of
a receiver because I think he's got great body control
and route running and hands, which is a really good
baseline level of trade yacability. Right. So, uh, Ted McMillan,
My opinion on him hasn't changed. I still feel the
same way. I still think it's a little rich at four.
I probably would only entertain it at four though, the

(42:31):
only reason why I'd entertained it at four is because
he's a receiver. Yeah, And Mike Rabele gave that quote
at the Combine that it's hard to find receivers of
that caliber and most of the time you have to
draft those guys. So is there a scenario where they
just say we need playmaking on offense. He's not perfect,
but he's a playmaker. Yeah, we're draft in Ted.

Speaker 2 (42:52):
And to anybody, so we'll trade down and do it.
Maybe the trade's not there right right, or you can't
trade you know, really, So I'm gonna ask you two
questions about this. Yeah, well one question and then one
series of questions. Is Ted McMillan slow, Yes, I disagree.
I just don't think he's fast. Well, he has functional speed.

Speaker 1 (43:11):
That's the most semantics are.

Speaker 2 (43:12):
He has functional speed. No, it's not No, it's not
the same. He's not slow. For the who do you
remember the guy from It was David Bell right from Purdue.
He was a couple of years ago. Whoe everybody was
all hot and bothered by he was like a top
one hundred pick and then he ran like a four
to seven. That guy slow. Teed McMillan has functional speed.
He's not fast, but he's not slow. He has functional speed.
Here's the other party, who's your wide receiver?

Speaker 1 (43:32):
Two?

Speaker 2 (43:32):
Right now? Is at Golden or is it?

Speaker 1 (43:35):
I'm still on still like Luther Burden. I know the
league doesn't.

Speaker 2 (43:38):
But which gap is bigger? And this is Travis Hunter
being his own thing, right, which gap or actually this
is the three? Is Travis Hunter is a receiver to
tet versus TET to Burden? Which gap is bigger?

Speaker 1 (43:51):
Yeah, it's a good conversation. And I also would say
add the tackles in there too, write like it's a
bigger gap like Will Campbell and armand Membo.

Speaker 2 (43:59):
Josh to a receiver just a receiver.

Speaker 1 (44:01):
Uh, I would say that there's probably a bigger gap
between Tet and Luther Burden.

Speaker 2 (44:08):
Then yeah, okay, so let's go. Let's say Hunter's off
the board, right, Tet to Burden or Burden to Golden
Orbuka I have, I have.

Speaker 1 (44:16):
Burden, Abuca, and Golden all in the same tier. Okay,
so I view those guys as pretty equal players. I
think all three of those guys, and I think Luther
Burden's getting hurt by last season and some of the
antics last season for teams. I'm sure that there's questions
about that, But to me, those guys all belong in
the twenties of a draft, like they all there right,

(44:37):
wears A Flowers and Jackson Smith and Jigba and Jordan
Addison and Quinn Johnson were.

Speaker 2 (44:42):
So I guess this, this is kind of what I
was leading to. Let's say, so Hunter, you're uncomfortable at four,
but you acknowledge maybe you need a receiver. The trades,
I'm definitely taking McMillan. Sorry, McMillan, Yeah, yeah, sorry, Yes,
I take Hunter for McMillan.

Speaker 1 (44:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (44:56):
Maybe the trade's not there to get down to like
six or seven where you want him. You can trade
down to like fifteen, and let's say a future first,
right and get or maybe you don't because obviously, if
you can get the future first, you're taking the future first.
You trade down to like fifteen somewhere to teens knowing
you want to take a receiver and you take burden.

Speaker 1 (45:15):
Yeah, would you.

Speaker 2 (45:15):
Rather and you're maybe overdrafting burden a little bit, but
now you've gotten this hall, would you rather do that?

Speaker 1 (45:20):
Yeah, I'd rather do that. Okay, maybe it wouldn't be
burdened just because they feel they don't.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
Or Golden or whoever, right, Like, to me, Golden is
the second best wide receiver, especially like if we're talking
specifically for the Patriots, and if Josh McDaniel's gonna run
the offense, we think he's gonna run to me. Matthew
Golden's wide receiver too, And the gap between McMillan and
Golden is not as big in that regard as maybe

(45:45):
some people would make it.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
Yeah, I think there's a lot of people that agree
with you in the league on that. Like, I think
there's gonna be teams that have Matthew Golden as the
number one receiver in this class, especially teams that prioritize
speed obviously over some of the other things with Matthew
Golden or with Luther Burden. Actually, I just feel like
with Burden, mel Kiper and Daniel Jeremiah both had him
out of the first round and their mocks there this week.

(46:09):
That's not based off of tape. That's based off of
intel they're getting inside the league that teams are not
in love with the football character right in terms of
some of the answer, I don't think.

Speaker 2 (46:20):
I don't think it's a character thing with Golden. I
think he doesn't have a Golden too. Right, then Golden
outside the.

Speaker 1 (46:25):
First round, no's going the first I thought you said Golden,
and I think with Luther Burden.

Speaker 2 (46:31):
Okay, then yes, it's talent. It's not talent, which is
crazy because if you talk to people who are around
him at Missouri, yeah, you hear about what a great
kid he is and how driven he is and all
of that and what he's meant to the community. So
it's literally just getting frustrated in that broken down offense
last year.

Speaker 1 (46:49):
Yeah, that's it. Yeah, So let me ask you this question,
because now that these mocks have come out and he's
out of the first round, Yeah, are you taking Luther
Burden at thirty?

Speaker 2 (47:00):
Absolutely? I mean unless they take Ted at four double
right right, Yes, if they go tackle in the first
round and Luther Burden's there thirty eight h absolutely yeah, Yeah.
I think your camp, your comp has been bigger.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
Z A Flowers, Yeah, bigger.

Speaker 2 (47:14):
I think there's some debo there, ye, Like you plug
that guy into this offense, you're gonna have a really
good time.

Speaker 1 (47:19):
I wonder some of the reporting out there, think Tom
Kerran had it about DK Metcalf and they were worried
about the diva wide receiver calling for the ball all
the time and begging for the ball all the time.
Burden last year. You could take some of the antics
that he had and spin it that way that he

(47:40):
was mad he wasn't getting targets.

Speaker 2 (47:41):
I think that's what it was, right, so Brady cooked.

Speaker 1 (47:44):
Just maybe if they felt that way about DK, then
maybe it takes a guy like Burden off their board.
But I kind of feel the opposite way because I
trust Rabel with the culture stuff, like I trust him
to get a young player like Luther Burden to stay
on the track.

Speaker 2 (48:00):
That's the difference there. Young player. It's one thing to
talk about a twenty seven year old, you know, thirty
million dollars a year guy versus a rookie, especially guy
who has fallen in the draft.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
I would just hope that Vrabel would look at it
that way and say, you know what, like I'll texta
this kid every single morning during the season to get
his butt in the facility and make sure that he's
on his p's and q's and make sure that we
have him ready to play and all those I would
just if I was able, I would just trust myself
to like raise a guy like.

Speaker 2 (48:28):
He's also again, like I think it literally came down
to the production of the offense and his production. Don't
think it's any deeper than that. Drake may is a
much better quarterback than Brady Cook. And if you're drafting
Luther Burden in the top forty on this football team,
he should be one hundred and ten hundred and twenty
target guy. I'm not worried about him getting upset over
lack of targets, simply for the reason that if he

(48:51):
is a lack of targets, you screwed up. That's on
the team that guy. Like I've talked about certain receivers
maybe not being volume guys in this offense. Luther Burton's
one hundred and twenty target player if he's healthy in
New England. I'm not worried about him getting lack of
targets because I'm drafting him with the idea that I'm
going to feed him in the football constantly.

Speaker 1 (49:09):
Yeah, so we're both still now on ten at four.

Speaker 2 (49:14):
I'm not like a hard I'm a soft no.

Speaker 1 (49:16):
It's so hard in this I kind of feel about it.

Speaker 2 (49:18):
So I feel about Ted McMillan in the same way
I felt about Mason Grant before they added Milton Williams,
which was I don't think he'd be a bad pick,
but he's definitely not the best pick they can make.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
Yeah, I agree with that. I think in this draft
it's so hard because all these guys.

Speaker 2 (49:31):
There's out on anybody.

Speaker 1 (49:33):
Yeah, there's positive and negatives about everybody, and it's it's
a it's not a perfect draft, not that any draft's perfect,
but it's really this one's really not a perfect draft.
So it's tough to be a hard no on anybody.
I mean, if I could understand it, but I think
that it's a risk if.

Speaker 2 (49:47):
You're but they're all rich. Like this is why I
won't say I'm a no, because I think when you
say you're out on a player, you have to give
an alternative, right, So let's say, let's say we throw
that qualifyer again, Hunter and Carter off the board, right, Okay,
so you're out on Teed McMillan, you're out on Will Campbell? Like,
who are you in on? You have to have somebody
you're willing to pick.

Speaker 1 (50:07):
Yeah, I have to pick somebody, as you like, right,
So who? So who?

Speaker 2 (50:09):
If you're a no on Tech McMillan, who, I don't know? No,
you can't say you.

Speaker 1 (50:13):
Don't know who would I pick? I would take Will Campbell,
but I said you wouldn't. But in this scenario, I
would take Will Campbell.

Speaker 2 (50:20):
Okay, I thought you said you wouldn't take him before.

Speaker 1 (50:23):
I said I would take him in that scenario.

Speaker 2 (50:25):
Not projecting what they are, not projecting them. You you're
on the clock Hunter, and for this team, Hunter and
Carter are gone, and the trade isn't there. Nobody wants
to move up. You're just gonna let the clock run
out like the Minnesota Vikings and let somebody make the
decision for you.

Speaker 1 (50:43):
I might.

Speaker 2 (50:44):
Well, that's terrible.

Speaker 1 (50:45):
It's a terrible spot to be in I'm.

Speaker 2 (50:47):
Taking Campbell in that scenario, I feel great about it.
I'm probably taking can.

Speaker 1 (50:50):
I guess I'm probably taking Campbell.

Speaker 2 (50:51):
Like you, you can't just be out on everybody, is
my point. Yeah, I know you make a valid I
would take a long hard look at Tech McMillan. I
would take a long hard look at Tyler Warren. I
would still take a long hard look at Armond Membo. Honestly,
I really would. But I think, as that clock's mine
and I'm taking every second to try to make calls,
and realistically you'll probably get a trade. But I think

(51:12):
i'd end up taking Will Campbell if I was in
that situation, wouldn't feel good about it. And maybe I
don't know that there is a pick you're gonna feel
good about. But again, you're just gonna let the clock
run out, all right, you know what Jaguars you pick,
You make the decision for us, and then we'll just
take who's left. But you still might not like anybody.
You're gonna let the Raiders decide at what point. Honestly,
I'd feel pretty good about letting the Jets decide. Now,
I'd pick an eight. I'd pick an eight because whoever

(51:34):
the Jets take at seven is probably wrong. So you know,
whoever they leave is probably right.

Speaker 1 (51:38):
It's a tough spot to be in.

Speaker 2 (51:39):
It's not easy. It's not an easy draft. This is
a hard draft, and that that clip is gonna get
turned into me saying I think the Patriots should undoubtedly
take Will Campbell, but no, it's just an exercise.

Speaker 1 (51:52):
I think the only thing I come back to with
Will Campbell then and then we can stop laboring this point.
The worst case scenario is that he's a really good guard. Yeah,
that's the worst case scenario. Whereas I think the worst
case scenario with a guy like Ted is that he
can't get open, right, Yeah, and that's that's really not good.

Speaker 4 (52:11):
Right.

Speaker 1 (52:11):
So like that, that, to me, I think is a
big difference. Uh, with those two players.

Speaker 2 (52:15):
I don't know, somebody in the chat, this is a
good one, tough spot. I'm absolutely taking Campbell in that scenario.
Jihad Campbell, Oh my god.

Speaker 5 (52:23):
No.

Speaker 2 (52:25):
I think Jalen Walker is a better linebacker than Jehad
Campbell is. But that's another guy I would take a long,
hard look at. I do like John Campbell. I just
think Jalen Walker's little better.

Speaker 1 (52:34):
Yeah, like if you you know, if you really don't
like those options, then you're you're going and you're you're
taking a defensive player with some tools, right, you know,
whether it's Jalen Walker, it's Mikel Williams, who, by the way,
Michael Williams, we haven't heard anything about his pro day.
There's like a forty time that got floated out there
that wasn't so great, and we haven't heard any other
testing numbers from this prod, which makes me worried that

(52:55):
that tells me that they weren't good.

Speaker 2 (52:56):
They used to televise to Georgia Brodey.

Speaker 1 (52:58):
If they were good. If Mikel william had this great
pro day, it's like Trayvon Walker esque pro day, we
would all know about it, right, Like those numbers would
be everywhere. He also didn't can participate in the combine.
I don't remember if there was an injury with him,
but like, I don't know if if Mikyle Williams was
this like a Donnis athlete that everybody thought. Shamar Stewart
is like another one of those guys. Right, they had

(53:18):
to blew up the combine. It's a tough spot to
be in.

Speaker 2 (53:21):
All right, better hope somebody wants that pick.

Speaker 1 (53:24):
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(53:46):
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(54:06):
guys have been waiting. Let's get to these phones. Patty
is an agoam. What's up, Patty?

Speaker 2 (54:11):
It's up, Patty?

Speaker 1 (54:13):
What is up?

Speaker 2 (54:14):
Jen?

Speaker 5 (54:14):
Hey?

Speaker 1 (54:14):
How are we doing.

Speaker 6 (54:17):
Doing all right?

Speaker 7 (54:17):
Today? I had a point that I wanted to say,
and then I'm gonna end with a couple questions. So
the point I wanted to make was regarding the offensive
tackles to Alex. I know you say you'd prefer Ursery
over Connolly Junior.

Speaker 8 (54:32):
I've done.

Speaker 7 (54:33):
I'm a sick Oh, So I do like a lot
of like podcast listening reading on all these kids coming
out of college and I have, I mean I have
for like thirty plus years, right, So to me, just
from what I've gleaned, it looks like Ersery is more
of a plug and play guy. I mean, he could
start on the web side day one. Connery though, is

(54:57):
a little bit younger. I think he's only twenty one
and use a former running back and a former basketball player.
And it's a lot of the stuff that I'm reading
that I'm listening to says that he hasn't even hit
his floor, his potential floor yet as a target, I
mean as an offensive tackle. So just going by what
you guys said, like if you were to get someone

(55:18):
like Tyron Smith to be like a stop gap player,
a lot of these guys, like the PFF guys, Steve Belt,
I know he's not with them anymore, but Steve the
old guy from PFF. Yeah, they're saying that he could
be possibly the best franchise tackle out of the whole class,

(55:40):
and that's what that's kind of like, that's what I'm
looking for. And that's just my two cents on that.
So my two quick questions I have for you guys,
and these these are kind of thinkers. I can't even
like come up with them just in your guy's opinion.
The first one, who's the safer pick out of Tet
McMillan and Wild Campbell.

Speaker 2 (56:01):
I think will Will Campbell because at very least you're
getting guard Yeah right, yep.

Speaker 7 (56:06):
And I think the second question I had is, I
know I just kind of prefaced this what's talking about
Josh Connolly, but just in that same day, and I
think if Travis Hunter is there at four, TEP might
be more of a just a day one starter, plug
and play guy. You kind of see that between him

(56:28):
and Hunter because a lot of the stuff that I
hear in ridon Hunters that he's still rob like he's
still learning the position. I would take Hunter at four
and just kind of let him learn on the fly.
But I'd like to get your guys thoughts on that,
and I'll take it off the air. Guys are the best.
I'll talk to you next week.

Speaker 1 (56:43):
Thanks, Patty. Yeah, I can understand, you know, some of
those people that think Hunter's kind of still developing as
a receiver, but I'm not taking him over.

Speaker 2 (56:53):
Yeah. No, McMillan's obviously more developed at the position he's
been playing in his whole life. Flicker has never focused
full time on receiver. But the idea is once you
let him do that with his natural skills, he's gonna
truly progress at a rapid an exponential rate. So I'm
betting on the ceiling there. Like McMillan probably has a
slightly higher floor at wide receiver than Hunter, slightly higher floor,

(57:15):
but I think the ceiling for Hunters much much higher.

Speaker 1 (57:18):
Yeah. I also I think Hunter's actually got some real
natural instincts for receiver, which I really was comes from
playing corner pretty surprised by in a way. Was. Yeah,
maybe there's some like technical stuff with like his release
in the top of the route and stuff like that
that he will need to develop with more time spent
on receiver, but he's got a really good feel for

(57:39):
play for running routes against zone coverage, like finding soft
spots and pockets and zones. He has a really good
field working off script with Shador Sanders and making himself
available for the quarterback and has a great motor just
like constantly trying to get open and constantly working himself open,
which would translate nicely to Drake May and then he's
got great ball skins. So like those things are just

(58:02):
natural abilities that when you watch him at receiver that
he just has innately already. So we can maybe get
bogged down by the fact that his footwork at the
top of the route could be a little bit more efficient,
or his hand fighting against man to man and press
could be a little bit better, but like those things
are gonna come when he plays a position more often
the things that he's innately good at are naturally good at.

(58:26):
Like that's his floor. That's like where you know, I
feel safe with him as a pick, So no, I
wouldn't really panic about that. But I'm with Josh Connerly,
Like I like the idea. Now, if you're telling me
that you feel like they need to sign Cam Robinson
as a one year bridge or even a half year
bridge just to coach up Connorly before you throw him

(58:48):
in there at left tackled, And I don't hate that plan,
but I'm with Patty. I'm taking the upside, like I'm
going for the guy that I think can be a
really high level left tackle. Give me the big mall.
All right, Marcus is in South Carolina. We get a
lot of calls from North Carolina, Marcus, but you're in
South Carolina.

Speaker 9 (59:08):
Yes, yes, thank y'all for having me. I really enjoy
watching y'all, and y'all are the best endless out. It's
hard to cover this team, and y'all have a non
bitter perspective, so I really appreciate that.

Speaker 1 (59:23):
Thank you.

Speaker 9 (59:23):
But I wanted to ask about Trey Hares. You know,
Jackson Dart's getting a lot of love right now, and
I don't know, I don't know if people didn't watch
Old Miss every time Trey hair has played, Jackson Dart
looked really good.

Speaker 8 (59:39):
I mean, I'm a.

Speaker 9 (59:40):
Florida fan, and the one catch he had was a
touchdown for forty three yards. And I'll be interested to
hear thoughts about DJ Lagway once he gets close to
in the draft. But I just don't get why he's
not I get he's older and he's had some injuries,
but about a player who can come in and produce
right away. I wanted to get your thoughts on Trey

(01:00:02):
Harris and how y'all feel about him as a Patriot.

Speaker 1 (01:00:05):
Yeah, thanks for the call, Marcus. Uh, he was a
recency bias from a guy at one point when I
was making.

Speaker 2 (01:00:11):
My way out of the receiver. It's not your kind
of player.

Speaker 1 (01:00:13):
I comped into Brandon Lafel like Crafty, a good route
runner for his size, can win at the catch point,
just not gonna run by you. You're not not particularly fast.
I think that's where some people have reservations with him,
is that he just doesn't have a whole lot of
bursts or speed down the field or after the catch.

Speaker 2 (01:00:32):
So Day two Techncvillian, Yeah, he's kind of just.

Speaker 1 (01:00:34):
Going to catch the ball at twelve thirteen yards and
go down Like that's kind of think what people are
a little concerned about with Trey Harris. But he's in
that group to me in day two, you know, maybe
just you know, from let's call it sixty to one
hundred that yea, you're gonna have a slew of receivers
go there, and I think Trey Harris is probably gonna
end up.

Speaker 2 (01:00:53):
Somewhere higher than sixty. But yeah, like somewhere on do
you mean like forty to eighty.

Speaker 1 (01:01:00):
I think he can go top fifty.

Speaker 2 (01:01:01):
He could maybe, I mean if I don't know, I
don't know where teams are at with aomnor. But like
he's yeah, one of the next X guys up, got
more speed, I think so. Yeah, Trey Harris is a
solid player. So I think Jackson Dart's getting a little
too much love.

Speaker 1 (01:01:16):
That's putting it nicely.

Speaker 2 (01:01:17):
I will say to his other point, I do really
like DJ Lagway. I'm a big fan of DJ Lagway.

Speaker 1 (01:01:23):
Yeah, I know you are. He's what next year to.

Speaker 2 (01:01:26):
Know, he's a true freshman past two years or so,
he's twenty five, he's twenty twenty seven draft, So.

Speaker 1 (01:01:32):
Start tanking now, Yeah, I mean not who else?

Speaker 5 (01:01:36):
Is it? No?

Speaker 2 (01:01:37):
Somebody else too? Who's the other quarterback? There's another really
good quarterback in that draft? And that's actually that draft's
gonna be unreal because it's gonna be Lagway, It's gonna
be Jeremiah Smith, it's gonna be Ryan Williams, it's gonna
be the guy, the Dylan Stewart from South Carolina, the
pass rusher. Yeah that this freshman class is unfreaking believable.
But I really like DJ Lagway. He's my kind of quarterback. Big.

(01:02:00):
I can throw it a mile, a ton of zip
on the ball, runs runs around. You're descrireless. Yeah, he's
he is kind of day oh. I mean, we'll see.
It's too early to see where he's at. He was
kind of up and down this year, but he didn't
get the starting reps in camp. That was Graham Mertz.
Graham Mertz is gone. So I'm looking forward to see
what he can do with a full year and hopefully
some better receivers because a lot of his receivers left.

(01:02:20):
But you know who actually his top receiver is gonna
be next year? You want you're ready to feel old
Eugene Wilson, the third, the third, well, the one who
played here was j So his son, uh and DJ Lagways.
So we'll talk about him for the Pats next year.
He'll be draft eligible next year. Eugene Wilson's son. Imagine
if they ended and imagine they ended up with the

(01:02:41):
same team, ended up with the Sante Samuel and Eugene Wilson.
But one's a receiver now, so they'd be running, you know,
against each other.

Speaker 1 (01:02:48):
Just throw Jason Taylor's son in there. Too, and then
you have like an.

Speaker 2 (01:02:50):
All but Mason Taylor didn't play here.

Speaker 1 (01:02:53):
Yeah, yeah, but it's like an age.

Speaker 2 (01:02:54):
I get what you're saying.

Speaker 1 (01:02:55):
Two thousands reunion.

Speaker 2 (01:02:57):
We're getting there.

Speaker 1 (01:02:58):
Who else?

Speaker 5 (01:02:59):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (01:03:00):
I think Chad Pennington's son is playing college football? So
my god is in the FBS.

Speaker 1 (01:03:05):
Sold all right, So that's the mcnabs kid. Just just think, yeah,
all right, Chris is in Allentown. What's up, Chris.

Speaker 2 (01:03:14):
Chad Pennington's son is at Marshall Bellow makes sense?

Speaker 1 (01:03:18):
Chris?

Speaker 2 (01:03:19):
You there?

Speaker 1 (01:03:20):
Oh yeah, go for it.

Speaker 5 (01:03:23):
Thank you guys for taking my call. That's my first
time calling in. Usually I have to catch this on
the podcast afterwards.

Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
Love it.

Speaker 2 (01:03:28):
Thanks appreciating going.

Speaker 5 (01:03:30):
So my question is, since it's the time of year
for hypotheticals, if something weird happens at the top of
the draft, Let's say Carter falls to us at four,
or they fall in love with Ashton genty, or we
trip on the way up to the stage and don't
get to pick somebody.

Speaker 8 (01:03:44):
We go past the.

Speaker 5 (01:03:45):
Fourth overall pick and we don't have either a receiver
or a tackle because we had to take someone else.
Now we're looking at that that second tier trading up
into the end of this end of the first beginning
of the second for these guys, which is the bigger
drop off from your you know, your thirties to your sixties,

(01:04:06):
either wide receiver or tackle.

Speaker 2 (01:04:09):
Tackle.

Speaker 1 (01:04:09):
Yeah, I would probably say tackle too. Thanks for the call, Chris. Yeah,
after Ursery, I think is probably the one in my
mind would probably I guess Simmons with the injury maybe,
but after that group goes, you know, Connorlycery Simmons, After
that group goes, I mean, who is the next true tackle,
Like not Wyatt Milam, who's gonna move inside the guard?

(01:04:29):
But like, is it Belton? It might be Belton.

Speaker 2 (01:04:32):
I mean, there's one more guy in there at Am missing.

Speaker 1 (01:04:34):
Because it's all because that's all that that group of
Wyatt Milam, Gray Zabel, Donovan Jackson from Ohio State, all
those guys are probably gonna play guard.

Speaker 2 (01:04:45):
Oh, I guess it would be one of the true
right tackles would be Cameron Williams or Emery Jones.

Speaker 1 (01:04:51):
I think I think both those guys might play guard too,
especially Emery Jones. Emery Jones's tape it right tackles.

Speaker 2 (01:04:56):
Yeah, so then it would Yeah, I think you're probably
between Belton Pillow. I know some people like Logan Brown
from Kansas. Yeah, I put him another step down. He
got kicked what he got in a fight with the teammate. Yeah, yeah, Yeah,
it's probably Belton or Trapillo, depending on what you're looking for.
What you like.

Speaker 1 (01:05:13):
That's not a great, that's not good.

Speaker 2 (01:05:15):
Those are not definitely not day one starters, might not
be year one starters. I like Belton, I like his upside.
Trapillo is an interesting prospect too. I'm not expecting you
those guys to start early on.

Speaker 1 (01:05:25):
Yeah. It it's not a deep tackle class, and I
think this is you know, we've talked about this in
the past, but because you don't have the all it's
the Fashanos. The figwas, uh, those guys bumping down the
next tier like you did last year where you had
that Kingsley, Sue Mattier, Roger and Patrick Paul tier. That

(01:05:47):
tier doesn't really exist in this draft because all those
guys are going higher, right, So this is a tough
one in terms of tackle outside the top forty. I
think it really drops off after that.

Speaker 2 (01:05:56):
If they miss Uneursery and Connery, like they're not. Venerian
Lowe's a candidate to start week one next year, Like
that's it probably strong candidate to start week one next year,
because I don't know where else you're getting somebody. You
might bring in somebody later on who competes with them,
and maybe like Belton really pops on the left side,
but that's an open competition in camp. One hundred percent. Yeah,

(01:06:17):
So if if they get by thirty eight and they
even taken a tackle, they're not they had they didn't
address the need.

Speaker 1 (01:06:24):
There's a lot of receivers in my mind in every draft, yeah,
and this draft. I know that people are down on
the receiver class this year, especially at the top. I
don't think the league is too a gung ho about
the receiver class either, but I always feel like to
know some of those Day two guys, a couple are
gonna hit. And maybe I'm not saying that they're gonna
be Lad McConkie or be like stars, you know, but

(01:06:46):
a couple of them will be viable NFL receivers. You know,
caller called in about Trey Harris, you know, right, Jack
Betch from TCU, you know those types of guys. One
of those guys is gonna be a good player. Maybe
a couple.

Speaker 2 (01:06:58):
Just see Steve Smith thinks that Jack bet should play tight.

Speaker 1 (01:07:00):
End, Well, I would assume he plays big slot. Like,
so we're kind of splitting hairs right, Like he's gonna
be an inside predominantly receiver. If you want to call
him like a move tight end instead of receiver, then
it we're kind of yeah, we're in semantics land there.
But uh Jack Betch Trey Harris, I you man or
I don't know exactly where he's gonna end up. He

(01:07:22):
might go a little bit higher than than you know
that third round projection, if you will. I mean, there's
other guys I can't think of off the top of
my head, but I don't hate any of those guys.
Like I think, like, where's Jalen Noel gonna go? You know,
he's probably gonna go second round. You know, I think
he's a good player. Uh Higgins is probably gonna go
second round too, He's a good player. Uh. Ted Johnson
is probably gonna go undrafted. I'm just kidding. I don't

(01:07:43):
know where Ted Johnson is gonna go. I know you
want we want to talk about outliers. Yeah, that that
that's fair. Okay, So this is a good question. I
don't know if we've I addressed directly. Yeah, maybe we have.
But Andrew and Lincoln is a long time listener, so

(01:08:06):
he just emailed us asking about Will Campbell versus Peter Skaransky,
because obviously Rabel drafted Scronsky. It was his last first
round pick in Tennessee. Uh. In the first round, they
drafted Skoransky and immediately moved Skronsky inside the guard. It
wasn't even a conversation about it.

Speaker 2 (01:08:22):
They guard.

Speaker 1 (01:08:23):
Yeah, yeah, they wasn't even a conversation. He played college tackle.
Skronsky's a little shorter. Yeah, his arms are a little
bit shorter. I don't think that he moves as well
as Will Campbell. Will Campbell is an excellent athlete. But
all in all, I can understand where the emailer is
coming from. That aren't aren't those guys kind of similar?

Speaker 2 (01:08:42):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:08:42):
And in one way, if you want to be predictive
about it, it kind of says, okay, well that's a
Rabel guy, right, if you want to look at it
that way. The other way to look at it is
Rabel's gonna think Will Campbell's guard, right, because he thought
Skoransky is a guard. Do do you see any comparisons
there with Skansky and Campbell.

Speaker 2 (01:09:02):
I mean, obviously a little bit, but no, I think
Skoransky everybody kind of knew he wasn't the He was
a good tackle, he was not the level of tackle
Will Campbell was. I've said this in the lead up
to the arm measurement, right, if he comes in under
thirty three, it's about asking yourself, do you believe he
is a special kind of talent that he can be

(01:09:22):
a trend breaker and reset the margin. Skoransky's good. I
don't think anybody ever believed Skorroansky was that level of player,
that he was going to be this generational talent where
he could offset, especially how short his arms are. Campbe's
a little closer. I also think he's above thirty two
and five eighths. Just the whole thing with the combine
measurements versus the Senior Bowl and Shrine Bowl measurements. The

(01:09:46):
fact that the Senior Bowl and Shrine Bowl are similar,
and the combine it's like an equal outlier from those two.
So did the Senior Bowl and Shrine Bowl both get
the measurements equally wrong? I STI don't think Campbell's thirty three,
but I think he's probably closer thirty thirty two and
seven eighths.

Speaker 1 (01:10:01):
Yeah, maybe he that thirty two and seven eighth number
that's been out there, Yeah, more accurate.

Speaker 2 (01:10:05):
So I I mean, I understand it's it's the same,
like I it's similar. I understand where that comp's coming from.
But I think the situations are different enough. I if
anything you know is able, maybe looking at it, like
we'll try him at tackle the worst case scenario like
Skeronsky's the worst case scenario for him with Campbell more

(01:10:25):
than I guess, like a blueprint.

Speaker 1 (01:10:26):
I think I think Campbell's a better player than Scar Yeah,
oh yeah, I think he was a better player. But yeah,
I can see the comparison. All right. Alexander has two
good questions. I want to start with this one first, though,
is actually his second question, because I have to get
your take on the mock draft heard around the world
by Mike so awesome Ashton Genty fourth overall, but before

(01:10:48):
we talk about the Patriots and Ashen Denty, Alexander thinks
that the Giants at three overall could take Ashton Genty
to replace Saquon Barkley. And I got it that that's
not gonna happen.

Speaker 2 (01:11:01):
Not if they don't have a quarterback. Maybe if they
get Rogers.

Speaker 1 (01:11:04):
But if Joe Shane wasn't willing to pay Sakwon Barkley
because he doesn't believe in running backs, why would he
draft a running backs?

Speaker 2 (01:11:11):
And he learned his lesson because he's getting meaned to
death on the internet. That's why I'm all for that.
Take Ashon gent at three, I'd be great. I love
Mike's mantra. Ultimately the point of Mack drafts, which people forget. Yeah,
it's so it's two prong it's predictive, but it's also
like the exercise. The way I view it is it's
just a tool to help teach people about the prospects

(01:11:35):
in the draft. That's why I usually try to avoid
because I'll do three Patriots mock drafts and three NFL
mock drafts, so I make six first round picks for
the Patriots and make every other pick three times. I
try my best to avoid repeating players so that I
get people informed on as many players as possible as
many situations. Right, all right, so if they go this

(01:11:56):
position at the top, now what's next? Blah blah, blah,
Drake May and I think just about every one. I
think I had one Patriots one for Jane and Daniels
last year, but that was different. It was a unique scenario.
So what would it look like. It's part of the exercise.
We're just doing scenarios like we did before. Right, Hunter
and car both off the board, phones dead, no trades? Right,

(01:12:17):
who are you tay? Will that happen? I don't know.
What's an exercise? This is all about playing out different scenarios.
What if the Patriots just think there's a real chance
I've said this that, regardless of positional value, Ashton Genty
is the best football player on the board when the
Patriots are picking it for What if they just look
at that and say, it's as simple as that. Will
that happen? I doubt it? Should it happen? Probably not,

(01:12:40):
But let's play out the scenario. Let's learn something. The
crazier thing was Ursery getting all the way to sixty eight.

Speaker 1 (01:12:46):
Okay, I'm more probably we discussed that. That's a side
note obviously to the Jesse thing.

Speaker 2 (01:12:53):
You know, but you know what, my he got people
worked up. He had some fun with it. It's it's
supposed to be fun. This is all supposed to be
fun and have some fun with it, and good for
Mike for having fun.

Speaker 1 (01:13:02):
We lose the plot on that a little bit. This
is all supposed to just be.

Speaker 2 (01:13:07):
The plot on it. I love having fun with this stuff.

Speaker 1 (01:13:09):
I think the biggest argument for Ashton Genty is the
one you just made. If you truly feel like he
is the best football player on the board, then you
could make the argument. And we sat here and said,
it's a tough spot to be in if if Hunter
and Carter are off the board, because it's like who
do you take? Who do you take? At that point

(01:13:29):
that being said, what I keep coming back to with
Ashton Genty because I'm a nerd and I can't get
the positional value out of my head. I just I
find it the path to making Ashton Genty work that pick,
make him work to be hard.

Speaker 2 (01:13:47):
For this team. Yes, I agree with you. Let me
ask you this. Let's how all right, let's say, and
we're kind of idealizing things here. They sign Cam Robinson
and they go receiver with their first pick, whether it's
tet or they move back and they get Burden or
they get Golden Right. Yeah, So you have a left tackle,

(01:14:08):
you have a receiver. Okay, moving up to three whatever
you want to call it, Amari and Hampton.

Speaker 1 (01:14:17):
That's the other part about this to be that I
can't wrap my head around with Genty, Not to tease
Mike anymore than I did yesterday, but it's such a
great running back class.

Speaker 2 (01:14:26):
That's my biggest part.

Speaker 1 (01:14:27):
So like is the drop off from Genty to Amarion
Hampton to the second day two guys like it's it's
so much you can find what they need, well, somebody
to push Formandra Stevenson, like Rmandra Stevens is not a scrub.
I know he had a bad year last year, but
he's not a scrub.

Speaker 2 (01:14:42):
The drop off from Genty to Hampton is significant, but
that's more about genty being this rare prospect than it
is about any of the other guys. You're right, if
you're just trying to get a guy who's gonna push
Stevenson and and fill in, you know, give you a
really solid number two. At least you can get that

(01:15:03):
guy early on day three. Frankly, if you want to go.

Speaker 1 (01:15:05):
To twenty of those guys in this draft.

Speaker 2 (01:15:07):
That might be a little high. There's it's probably closer
to ten.

Speaker 1 (01:15:10):
There's probably it's like legit like legitimately gonna.

Speaker 2 (01:15:15):
Right, But draft well running back does not mean is
gonna push Ramondre Stevenson for the starting.

Speaker 1 (01:15:19):
Job third or fourth round. I can. If they take
one at seventy seven, I'm not gonna kill him for it.
Depends on who it is. But if they take one
at seventy seven, I'm not gonna kill him for it.
If they take one at one of six, I'm.

Speaker 2 (01:15:29):
Not gonna If they take one at seventy seven, my
guess is it's Dylan Samson from Tennessee, who is a
well rounded back, a really good in space, and that's
he'd be a good complimentary player to Stevenson because he's
he's a little better catching the football and he plays
in that widespread Tennessee offense. So they were so good
at getting him one on one with defenders. So if

(01:15:49):
you're gonna run some of that outside stuff that McDaniel's
runs right as a counter to pounding the ball with Stevenson,
you can get him one on one with slock corners
in safety.

Speaker 1 (01:15:58):
Safety.

Speaker 2 (01:15:58):
Yeah, he's gonna be really good in the The other
guy at seventy seven would be Cam Scatabo.

Speaker 1 (01:16:03):
Who who's picking up some steam again.

Speaker 2 (01:16:05):
Picking up a lot of steam. He So that's my
day two Ashton Genty. Honestly, well there's two day two
act their second round ash and Genty is quinch On Judkins,
and third round ash and genty or fringe top one hundred,
ash and genty is Cam Scadrow. The only reason Cam
Scadbow is not gonna be a top fifty pick, there's
two reasons. Late breakout player and he's twenty gonna be

(01:16:26):
twenty three, twenty four year old rookie, but his skill
set and he is underrated as a receiver. Do not
everybody wants to call him Mike Alstott, Do not sleep
on how good Cam Scatabo is in the passing game.

Speaker 1 (01:16:36):
Don't do it nothing.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
Don't do the same with genty, But he'd be he'd
be an interesting pick at seventy seven two.

Speaker 1 (01:16:44):
It makes a total sense to me that Scamp Cam
Scattaboo is picking up this late steam because this is
when the coaches get involved. Yep, right, So now all
of the they met with the common Rabels and the
Jim Harbaughs, and like all these guys are like that's
just a football play, and I just want that guy on.
I want to go to war with that dude, right,
Like that's what they're all saying.

Speaker 2 (01:17:05):
You can rally baby.

Speaker 1 (01:17:06):
So the scouts are all saying, yeah, but he's he's
not very fast, and like, you.

Speaker 2 (01:17:10):
Know, he's not very fast.

Speaker 1 (01:17:11):
He's not very big, and he's not he's kind of old,
and like.

Speaker 2 (01:17:15):
He's not tall. He is thick, he's got the muscle,
he's thick with two seas. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:17:20):
But then these coaches come in and they're like, but
he's a football player, like he's tough, and we're gonna
build a run game around him and we're gonna run
it down people's throats. And then the scouts are like, yeah,
but like he's not really very athletic, and they're like no, no, no, no,
Like it's.

Speaker 2 (01:17:35):
You don't need to run over guys. I give you
one more running back. Take look on it. You'll actually
like this one. So it was reported last week that
the Patriots met with e Equavius Marks Woody Marks from
USC at the USC Pro Day Day three pick. He's
probably gonna be somewhere. He'll sneak in the top two hundred.
It will be like one fifty two hundred range. Uh.

(01:17:57):
Woody Marks is one of the best pure pass catching
backs in this draft, so you know, the do it
all guys like Jeni and Scatabo like a guy you're
going to throw the football to. He's one of the
best receiving backs in this draft. Not a guy you're
probably gonna hand the ball off to a ton not
great in between the tackles, a little bit on the
smaller side, doesn't necessarily have that great burst, but he

(01:18:18):
is a mismatch in the past game. Am I reading
too much into it to look at that meeting and
say we're going back to early down passing down backs
and no more splitting by drive, no more splitting by fatigue.
It's gonna be Ramandre Stevenson, you know, early on, and
then when you get into those third downs, when you
get in those two minutes, it's the James White role
essentially what I'm talking about. Yeah, and it doesn't have

(01:18:40):
to be Woody marx Well. Quinn Allen from Sarah Jus
is another guy I really like. Brischard Smith from SMU
is a converted wide receiver. Maybe it's Antonio Gibson. Maybe
they're meeting with guys, But it's Antonio Gibson in the building,
another converted wide receiver, but like Woody Marks, he's I'm
not comping him to James whe because James Waite's an
unbelievable player, but like when I look at him, that's

(01:19:01):
the guy they would have drafted five years ago to
be in that role. You're not drafting him to hand
the ball off to him from under center. You're drafting
him to throw him the football. Am I reading too
much into that and saying maybe this is a sign
the running back mix is coming back.

Speaker 1 (01:19:13):
No, not not totally. And I would also just say schematically,
if they want Drake may Or, I should say, if
Drake may wants to play in the gun predominantly and
he's not as comfortable under center, yeah, and they're going
to be more of a spread offense, then you need
like a scap back like you're Remondre. I don't think

(01:19:33):
is a great fit for that type of offense. You
want to spread back at that point, it's got some
speed and got some wiggle. You mentioned the kid from
SMU Bishard Smith, right, Smithy, Yeah, I think Smith. I
like Smith a lot like explosive guy. Right, He's He's
one of those guys that when he gets a creased,
he's gonna be like, he's gonna be gone. Like Quinn
Allen is really highly regarded for his ability to and

(01:19:56):
blitz pick up.

Speaker 2 (01:19:57):
He's an unreal blocker.

Speaker 1 (01:19:59):
Probably the best blocker in the class. So he's one
side is just the best at everything.

Speaker 2 (01:20:05):
Yes, yes he is. I'm not joking. He's maybe not
straight line speed. Outside of that, he might be so,
but Quinn Allen.

Speaker 1 (01:20:13):
Quinn Allen a Day three guy probably that the range.
I think there's a handful of those guys. There's one
where I'll look it up. I can't think of off
the top of my head. For Smith quinn Allen, I
want to say like Virginia Tech or something like that.

Speaker 2 (01:20:28):
So base shall Tutton too. Yes, so he's not he
has like the physical tools, yeah, but he's not as
developed as like a route runner. Also, he has big
time ball security issues both fumbles and like drops. So
that's you need to be more reliable in that position.
To me, he he I would almost compare him more so. Again,

(01:20:51):
they had the early down passing down and people kind
of turned that into big and physical, small and fast. Yeah,
there are small and fast running backs who aren't good receivers,
which generally their early down backs were Antoine Smith, Garrett Blunt, right,
Stephen Ridley, like Damian Harris, these bruisers. They did have
a couple early down backs during the run who were

(01:21:13):
the smaller, quicker guys. Lewis, Dean Lewis. Yeah, you see going,
I Toutton to me is more in the Deon Lewis
mold than he is the James White molt. I love
people think Dean Lewis is a receiving back day Like
never threw him the ball. You didn't really need to.
He was really good.

Speaker 1 (01:21:27):
That's twenty fifteen. Dion Lewis was like some of the
best running.

Speaker 2 (01:21:31):
He was the play in Dallas where he like ducks
under the two defenders and Cory Dylon you know yea
three h four.

Speaker 1 (01:21:41):
And then Deon Lewis in twenty fifteen before he got hurt.
He was he was so that That's where I put
on some good years in there.

Speaker 2 (01:21:48):
I'd put toutt more in that group than I would
in the James White group.

Speaker 1 (01:21:52):
I like that group, Deon Lewis group.

Speaker 2 (01:21:55):
The other guy a receiver were you thinking of Marcus
Yarns from Delaware. Yeah, he fits in that group.

Speaker 1 (01:21:59):
So that's the receiving back tutorial. Yeah, I'm not gonna
try to blow you away too much here. Not the
first round. Yeah, probably wouldn't take him a running back
in the second round either, but running back in the
middle rounds is totally in play. I'm totally cool.

Speaker 2 (01:22:15):
I'm all for that.

Speaker 1 (01:22:15):
I order fourth round running back, sign me up.

Speaker 2 (01:22:18):
I would do that, you know, whether it's one of
the guys talked about, I'll throw Kyle Mnongai in there.
I feel like this is their shot to get right
on Missus and Isaiah and Pacheco. Similar player who also,
by the way, uh knows the mccardy's and has spoken
with the McCarty's Rutgers guy. But like if they I
know people want them to draft somebody to push Stevenson.
I'm kind of like he had it down here. He

(01:22:38):
was overworked. I think diminishing his workload would help. If
they get a guy like le Quinn Allen or Woody
Marx in the middle of day three, and that's the
big addition, and they're gonna go back to splitting the
carry Situationally that would be enough for me.

Speaker 1 (01:22:51):
I just they need more offense, they need more playmakers.

Speaker 5 (01:22:56):
It is.

Speaker 1 (01:22:58):
What's allowing me to overlook my hatred for running backs
is that it's such a great class. Yeah, that you're
really it's really a great marriage between They have a
little bit of a need there and you're leaning into
a strength of the class. Right, So you're getting two
for the price of one in that respect, and I

(01:23:20):
don't think you should be passing up on that. I
feel that way about defensive line. I want a defensive
lineman at some point in this draft. I don't necessarily
need it to be the first round, but at some point,
I would say in their first four picks, right, their
top one fifty picks, I would like a defensive lineman.
I like a running back, and if they can fit
it in, I would like a tight end, you know,
if that's possible. I just think these classes are just

(01:23:42):
too good at those three spots for the Patriots to
sit back and not take anybody in those three positions.
So I am surprisingly for a running back. How about that?
I like it? Do you like that? I also like
bud light because it's easy to drink, eat to enjoy
bud Light, the official beer spawns of the New England Patriots.
All right, we got a few more calls, a couple

(01:24:03):
of emails, and then I do want to go over
some of the I know you love the rule proposals
that we have, so we can go over some of
those as well. Here to wrap up the show. But
Eldred is in North Carolina? What's up, Eldred? Nice?

Speaker 5 (01:24:19):
Right?

Speaker 1 (01:24:20):
How are we doing?

Speaker 10 (01:24:22):
Oh? I'm doing pretty good. Hey, I'm like this four.
If I did get Smith to come in, I'm taking
I'm sorry, man, y'all keep seeing I know he's running
full five, but it's in my singing. Watching the game.
You watch, watching highlight, keep it in the panther, come

(01:24:42):
on back and I ain't come out on stint. I'm
come on straight away straight. And this such thing as
football speed and forty speed and Baldy gave her and fruits.
You have a good comparison.

Speaker 6 (01:24:57):
Yeah, y'all see Drake and whatever?

Speaker 10 (01:25:01):
What are the guys from the ram? He's gone, I think,
and I would taken, but wheel Cable, what do you
think about Brown? That's a gonna see Eldrid.

Speaker 1 (01:25:20):
I'm gonna I'm gonna let you go because the phone
was given.

Speaker 2 (01:25:22):
Out that was there a pooka tech McMillan comp and.

Speaker 1 (01:25:26):
I got the gist, which is why I let you go. Eldred. So,
uh he likes Tet McMillan, which I am not shot
by at all because uh, Eldred's favorite receivers since I've
known him, DK, Metcalf, Quentin Johnson, Tet McMillan. So do
you think he has the type? So I I totally
get that, Eldred. Uh, he made the Poka cop which

(01:25:47):
is picking up a little bit of steam like taller, slimmer.

Speaker 2 (01:25:51):
And I plays faster than he tests.

Speaker 1 (01:25:54):
I have to admit I kind of see it. I
kind of see it because's best that's right is catch
and run ability. Right, he can hit him over the
middle of the field on a slant or a dig
or a crosser, and he can he picks up more
speed as he runs with the football and after the catch,
and he's got great body control, He's got good hands.

(01:26:16):
He's not Pukah's shorter right like Ted's more in that
big body frame. But I I kind of if you're
don't love like copping him to Drake London like a
lot of people do, I don't hate Pokin Nakua as
a comp for him. I can see it. You can.

Speaker 2 (01:26:32):
I totally see where's coming from.

Speaker 5 (01:26:33):
Uh.

Speaker 1 (01:26:34):
The other one was the kid from Tennessee, the Burner Thompson.
The receiver ran like a four to three at the combine.
This is a fast and guy.

Speaker 2 (01:26:44):
Yeah, and well, I guess fast and big, but fast
and tall.

Speaker 1 (01:26:48):
I'll give him this. He's legit play speed fast like
he plays fast and he runs fast. It's not Taekwon
Thornton like. He is not just a forty thing with him,
I would say, but he's only fast, like he has
one thing. It's straight line speed and get down the field. Now,
if you wanted to say, late on day three, fifth

(01:27:09):
sixth round, pair of that kind of guy with a
dude that throws the deep ball like Drake May. Yeah,
he has a role on an NFL team. He's just
a role player, like he is a certain type of receiver.
He's not a high volume guy. He's going to take
the top off the defense and that's about it. But
I wouldn't totally dismiss him because I don't think that

(01:27:32):
it's just the fact that he ran fast at the combine.
I think he plays fast. I think he has legit
vertical deep speed with Thompson. But yeah, the Pukua nakua
things picking up some steam with Ted because I think
people are trying to sell tech.

Speaker 2 (01:27:46):
I think everybody over corrected to him being too bad
at the combine and so now they're trying to pull
it back the other way.

Speaker 1 (01:27:51):
Yeah, I hear that one. All right, Rio is an Exeter.
What's up? Ryo?

Speaker 5 (01:27:59):
Yep?

Speaker 8 (01:28:00):
Can you hear me?

Speaker 1 (01:28:01):
Yes? Go for it.

Speaker 8 (01:28:03):
Hey, guys, I appreciate you taking my call. Actually, uh,
I have to give Alex the credit for inspiring me
to call finally, because he likes to pick up my
My comments in the chat was the jihat Campbell guy
but I have yeah, yeah, he was at nine and
Daniel Jeremiah's latest mock draft, you know, maybe not quite
so crazy. But I had just a couple of quick questions. One, uh,

(01:28:27):
why is uh nobody talking about Kyle Williams at Washington stage.

Speaker 1 (01:28:31):
You're just you're just trying to want to double up
the receiver. You're trying to appease my guy here. This
is what you're doing. I'm just kidding.

Speaker 2 (01:28:38):
What was what was the other one going?

Speaker 1 (01:28:39):
To ask about Ben Saws.

Speaker 8 (01:28:42):
No, I'm not. My other question is actually something uh,
something Evan said on you yesterday, Uh, which is the
point I've been making for months, which is that I
think this is a pretty strong draft, actually just not
at the top, and that going from you know, pick
four to forty, they're looking at similar quality prospects. So

(01:29:02):
what do you think about completely trading out of number four? No,
I trying to get another high pick in the draft.
I'll give you a one potential scenario, but doesn't have
to be this team, but somebody like the Saints if
they wanted to move up for a quarterback and you
want to do say like forty seventy one, one, twelve

(01:29:22):
and next year's first for number four overall, so you could,
you know, really stock up on picks and you know,
build out the roster since they've got fifty one spots
they need to fill realistically.

Speaker 1 (01:29:34):
Yeah, thanks for the call. I appreciate you.

Speaker 2 (01:29:36):
Calling in the chat, finally making it to the phone.

Speaker 1 (01:29:39):
I like the outside the box thinking I need a
first round pick in this draft. I need them to
take a well.

Speaker 2 (01:29:44):
I don't know, so like the one he laid out there.
So you train with the Saints. So you're gonna have
thirty eight and forty, and you're gonna have three third
round picks, so you can get back into the first
from there. Even if the Saints get a quarterback, if
it's one of these quarterbacks, that first round pick next
year is probably still a top ten pick. I might

(01:30:04):
I don't trust the Saints to figure it out.

Speaker 1 (01:30:06):
I might do that I need a first round picking
this draft.

Speaker 2 (01:30:10):
Well, you're essentially you're getting us I think he said, second, third,
and fourth, right, So you're still gonna pick in the first,
but you just have to move We did this the
other week with DK metcalf right.

Speaker 1 (01:30:19):
About swapping picks.

Speaker 2 (01:30:21):
Well, no, remember I said, well if you move up
to twenty three and then you trade twenty three, and
then you said, well why not just give them what
they need to move up to twenty three? Right, Yeah,
So if you're just getting the Saints are giving you
the ammunition to move back up, you just have to
do that other trade. You're still gonna pick in the
first round. You just have to make another trade.

Speaker 1 (01:30:38):
Oh, you'd have to make another trade. So are they
making the other trade? I don't know.

Speaker 2 (01:30:42):
I would assume so Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like,
if I know I can get back into the twenties
and get one of the tackles, I might do that
because you're that Saints. I don't think Saints are figuring
it out. I really don't. I think that's gonna be
a high pick next year.

Speaker 1 (01:30:54):
I know you like to pick from next year. I
don't I understand where you guys are coming from. I
I think that there's a there's an energy that needs
to shift here. I don't mean to go all Jayalen
Brown on you, yeah, but I just feel like if
you don't make a pick in the first round, the
excitement level just you're still the season.

Speaker 2 (01:31:15):
Just so if I can't, if I know I can't
trade back up in the first round, I'm not doing
it right.

Speaker 1 (01:31:20):
But even if you trade back up into the first round,
I guess it's the equivalent if it's for Connery or
if Matthew Golden or someone that really moves the needle
for people, I guess people will be excited. I just
think there's a lot to be said. There's some momentum
right now with this organization, with Frable coming in, with
this free agency class that they were able to land
on defense especially. I think there's a lot to be

(01:31:42):
said for the fact that drafting and I know everybody
would would do a cart wheels for Travis Hunter. But
like drafting somebody that ILK is going to bring some juice,
So that's important.

Speaker 2 (01:31:54):
Here's the equivalent of it. And I think you said
you would do this the other week. Let's say the
Vikings call twenty three, yeah, and they get they will
give you twenty three one day two pick in their
first next year. Would you do it?

Speaker 1 (01:32:08):
Why the Viking is doing that? All right?

Speaker 2 (01:32:11):
Then the Packers at twenty two, I don't know how
about the Steelers the text all right, the Steelers at
twenty one.

Speaker 1 (01:32:15):
So Steelers at twenty one they're gonna get have no quarterback? Yeah,
they may or may not be in on Aaron Rodgers.
I think nobody's in an Aaron Rodgers and I love
by the way, let's screw.

Speaker 2 (01:32:26):
So let's say you're not getting the other pick now,
because's a little bit higher twenty one in the future
first for four? Are you doing that?

Speaker 1 (01:32:34):
And the future first for four?

Speaker 5 (01:32:35):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:32:35):
Next year's first. I need more than that twenty one
future first in like a fourth I.

Speaker 1 (01:32:41):
Would do twenty one a third in the future. First
four okay, so maybe that's going from four to twenty
one is big.

Speaker 2 (01:32:48):
Maybe maybe you could swing that. But and the other
part why is nobody talking about Kyle Williams is because
he's a little bit older and he only had one
year of significant production. But dude can play. Dude can play.
He should be talked about more. And one of the
more underrated players in this trap. By the way, Lanzerline
one of his most underrated players, and I talked to
him at the combine.

Speaker 1 (01:33:06):
Really good route runner. Yep. The Steelers thing has a
little bit legs to me. Steelers have no long term
answer at quarterback.

Speaker 2 (01:33:14):
They even have a short term answer a quarterback.

Speaker 1 (01:33:15):
They don't have a short term answer, but I assume
they will right whether it's bringing back Russ or Aaron
Rodgers for or Kirk Cousins or whatever. I'm sure they'll
have somebody and that seat for a year. Tomlin dion Chador,
like I could see that vibe working, Like I could
see that mix of characters working in Pittsburgh. He has

(01:33:40):
dk Metcalf and George Pickens to throw the ball to.
We talk a lot about with Shador that he's not
necessarily a truck. He's more of a a game manager.
He's more of a trailer like, he doesn't have to
be much of a truck, and he has those two
guys to throw two on the outside. I could see
the Steelers trying to be super aggressive and come up
for one of the quarterbacks.

Speaker 2 (01:33:59):
I could you get Steelers first round? Well no, but
they're gonna finish over five hundred because they always do,
so that's not gonna be great.

Speaker 1 (01:34:05):
Yeah, it'll be twenty it'll be nineteen twenty. Right, they're
gonna be.

Speaker 2 (01:34:09):
I guess that. Plus the pay whatever the Patriots pick
ends up being, should get you back in the top ten.
So if the Patriots pick isn't in the.

Speaker 1 (01:34:15):
Top ten, I don't know. I just keep an eye
out for the Steelers. That's all, all right, Let's go
to DeShawn in Virginia. What's up to Sean?

Speaker 2 (01:34:25):
Hold on?

Speaker 5 (01:34:25):
My god?

Speaker 6 (01:34:26):
How's it going?

Speaker 2 (01:34:26):
Hey?

Speaker 6 (01:34:28):
One thing that's the day that people are not really
talking about it is that this team has been very
very picky, very choosy when it comes to come to
come to who they want. Did you know they probably
could have turned this team into a Super Bowl team overnight.
I mean literally, because if you actually think about it,
they could have Stigne every quality free agent. It still

(01:34:51):
has a decent amount of money left over. But because
they feel like they're so entitled, they can feel like
they're so picky, they can just go about however they
want through and in a position to do that. And
that's why it is a position right now. As far
as trying to figure out who they're going to pick,
people talk about who they should think and who they
should not pick if they actually have gone at the

(01:35:13):
players instead of think about characters, because you had to
ask talk do you actually want to win or did
you autual care about winning or actually losing? So you
have to pick between the two, and character is a
bit overrated when it comes to that notion that they
want to, you know, put that ahead of production on
the field. That's all I have to say.

Speaker 1 (01:35:33):
Yeah, I hear you this, Sean, And I would say
the one real criticism I'd have of the off season
so far as passing on that DK Metcalf trade. They
could have offered a higher second round pick for DK Metcalf.
They had all the money in the world to give
DK Metcalf the same contract he signed in Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh
we literally just talked about has no quarterback. They have
no quarterback. It's not a warm weather city, like it

(01:35:55):
was rumored that he wanted to be a part of.

Speaker 2 (01:35:56):
Think Pennsylvania's decent taxes too, right.

Speaker 1 (01:35:59):
It's it's a very similar, maybe even worse situation than
the Patriots Tomlin and Rabel. I think Tomlin's got a
little bit more of a resume as a head coach,
but certainly not very far off in terms of what
their reputations are and what they're about as a football coaches.
That would be a criticism of this offseason to be

(01:36:20):
or the biggest. It's not left tackle. I don't know
really what they were supposed to do there. Like I
don't didn't like Dan Moore junior Jalen Moore from San
Francisco four get four years, twelve starts backing up Trent Williams,
Like that's not a real option. Cam Robinson's still floating,
so that means that his market is sour in some respects.

(01:36:42):
I can't really fault them for not going out there
and get a left tackle, and I wouldn't necessarily kill
them for Cooper Cup if they were trying to keep
the room a little bit younger. But DK Metcalf that
one I can't wrap my head around. I can't wrap
my head around why they wouldn't be in on that player.
And I know Tom Curran had some reporting about the
fact that they were a little bit worried about you
know what Deshaun was talking about, that he'd be begging

(01:37:04):
for targets and in Drake May's ear and stuff like that.
I think all that stuff is maybe a little bit
overrated from the outside looking in, but I think on
the inside that that stuff does matter to coaches, to teams,
and just as two people that have been around this
team for the for a last couple of years, you know,
it hasn't always been pretty, and so I can understand

(01:37:26):
why they come from that respect. But I would probably
push back on to Sean a little bit that they
could be a super Bowl team if they had done
all of this, they had.

Speaker 2 (01:37:36):
Signed with literally every player in frequency, I guess, like
you said, but that's not realistic. I mean they uh
Chris Godwin, right, Yeah, they offered him like ten million
more year in the Bucks than they couldn't say right.

Speaker 1 (01:37:47):
The criticism. The critique to me, if you have any
of their off season so far as Metcalf, like they
should have been in on Metcalf and in Metcalf barring
Dk Metcalf saying I Am not coming to New England
kind of like Brandon Ayuk did. I'm I'm kind of
can't figure out why that player is not a Patriot
right now. So that that's the one criticism. I would

(01:38:09):
not say that they would be a super Bowl team
just by adding Dk Metcalf. No, maybe better, I mean
it would certainly be yeah, yeah, absolutely all right.

Speaker 11 (01:38:17):
Uh.

Speaker 2 (01:38:18):
Jalen Milroe at his pro day, by the way, maybe
a guy that should go top three. Kidding, but completed
forty five of fifty two passes one man routes well
against air. He did have one pass broken up. It
hit the roof of the facility. Should have gone outside
like Joe Milton went outside, so wouldn't.

Speaker 1 (01:38:39):
Hit the roof.

Speaker 2 (01:38:40):
He uncorked that insane throw into the wind. It's a
great clip. You just hear some guy in the background go, yeah,
I'll play well.

Speaker 1 (01:38:50):
Mark is in Connecticut. What's up? Mark?

Speaker 2 (01:38:54):
Going on?

Speaker 10 (01:38:54):
Guys?

Speaker 1 (01:38:54):
How are we doing?

Speaker 12 (01:38:56):
They were doing?

Speaker 13 (01:38:57):
You know, it's another day. My worry right now is
that they've put themselves in a pickle or a buine
with not having a left tackle going into the draft,
so they're kind of, you know, handcuffing themselves to pick
him Will Campbell if he's there. That that's my worry
on that. If Hunter is gone and Abdul Carter are gone,

(01:39:21):
that that is my biggest worry that they're going to
do that, because I really want them to if Hunter
or Abdul Carter are gone, I really want them to
pull back out of the pick and just move down,
still stay in the top ten and maybe draft Tyler Warren.
But that's just my worry that they've put themselves into
this and they wanted to get you guys at take
on that.

Speaker 1 (01:39:41):
Yeah, thanks Mark, They have I don't know, back themselves
into a corner is the right way of putting it.
They have needs, like, yeah, every team has needs. They
have some glaring ones. I don't think, you know, we
were just kicking around trying to kind of come to
terms of the fact that about their options outside a
Hunter and Carter, and I don't I think every team's

(01:40:02):
thinking the same things about this this draft and I
one thing that I've kind of pounded the table for
since I really started to get into the draft is
this is a fits draft. This this draft is this
guy fits our culture, this guy fits our vision, this
guy fits a role for us. Like this is not
a oh, this guy is just the best darn football

(01:40:23):
player at four overall, and we're just gonna take them
above everything else. I don't feel that this is that
kind of class. I think that this is one of
those classes where you are going to have to have
a vision in place for how this player fits in
to your program, whether it's position, whether it's culture, whether
it's all those types of things, because those are gonna

(01:40:46):
be the deal breakers. Like it's not gonna be talent,
like you're gonna grade Will Campbell and Mason Graham and
Ted McMillan and Tyler Warren and armand member, we're all
gonna be on a level playing field in terms of
great based off the tape and by all the you know,
all the things that get baked into the grade, It's
gonna come down to who you like the most in
terms of positional value, in terms of need on the

(01:41:07):
football team, in terms of culture. And that's I think
what's challenging about this draft is because we aren't on
the inside, and we don't really know how they rank
these guys in those types of ways. And why I
keep coming back to Campbell because he's such an intangible guy,
right His intangibles are through the roof, and so I
think that that could be a deal breaker. Now to

(01:41:29):
Mark's point about trading down, I'll say the same thing
that I've been saying for three months. Everybody in this
draft wants to trade down. Everybody wants out of the
top five. Everyone, even the Tennessee Titans at number one overall,
would take a trade down if they could, if it
would materialize. As of right now, and it could change,
you know, we still got what five six weeks to go.

(01:41:50):
Everybody has their original draft pick in the first round,
which almost never happens. It's unheard of.

Speaker 2 (01:41:56):
I don't think it's ever happened in the modern arm.

Speaker 1 (01:41:58):
Yeah, so everybody has original pick, and everybody has their
original pick because there's no eagerness to trade up. There's
no there's nothing drawing teams to trading up in a
draft like this. So I don't mean to like labor
a point, but when it comes to trade downs, we
all would probably take a trade down. Yeah, if I

(01:42:18):
think that's option number one on everybody's Bingo card, unless
Hunter and Carter, one of those guys miraculously falls to four,
taking that out of the table. They're not on the
board at four. What are you doing. We're all picking
up the phones, right, We're all trying to materialize or
create a trade that. That's what everybody's doing. But I
think there could be some a little bit of wonkiness

(01:42:41):
in the first round because of this. This is gonna
be a draft where boards are gonna be widely different.
Like some teams are gonna have Matthew Golden as the
top receiver. Some teams are gonna have Ted McMillan. Some
people are gonna have Tyler Warren as a top tight end.
Some people might have Colson Lovelin as a top tight end. Yeah,
Like if that's more your type though, you know, Avis
Kelcey versus a Rob Gronkowski, some teams are gonna are

(01:43:03):
gonna have a higher grade on Coulson Lovelin. You know,
some people are gonna really love the tools, guys like
Shamar Stewart and you know, they're gonna might be willing
to overdraft a player like that, Like I could see
Jacksonville at five overall that's now one hundred and ten
percent run by analytics and by nerds, Like they might
like a guy like Shamar Stewart because he's a athletic

(01:43:28):
freak and he checks all of those boxes and I'm
sure he has great GPS tracking data and all that
good stuff that they all love. So we'll see. But
I think this could get a little bit weird because
it's gonna be who you like. It's a it's a
type straft, it's a fits draft, it's a flavor draft,
it's not a talent draft. So it'll be interesting to
see how it all shakes out. Uh, Tony is in Pennsylvania,

(01:43:51):
assume what's up, Tony? A?

Speaker 14 (01:43:53):
What's up?

Speaker 5 (01:43:54):
Bro?

Speaker 3 (01:43:56):
Alex? Let me just get me out on this all right,
been saying this for a few drafts now, but uh
we gotta You might not agree. I'm hoping you do,
but uh we we gotta to take the pressure off
of Drake May and to make up the lack for
our for our offensive line, which is better than last year,

(01:44:17):
we gotta go running back at number four. We gotta
get the best running back at number four, ash Jan Genty.
And I'm saying this because we could take it back
from all the way to our first Super Bowl. We
had good, almost great running backs all the way from
Corey Dylon, uh Antoine Smith, Redmond, Lawrence Maroney, Shane Vereen,

(01:44:42):
Steven Ridley, and then the last name was Michelle. But
but we gotta we gotta take a running back to
make up for the pressure that we're gonna get. And
that'll take off a lot of pressure from Drake May
if we have a run game, and then that'll open
it up for the young wide receivers and maybe sign
of veterans.

Speaker 1 (01:45:03):
Thanks for uh.

Speaker 2 (01:45:05):
Lauren didn't win a Super Bowl here.

Speaker 1 (01:45:07):
Maroni did not win a Super Bowl. Also not a
very good player. So Sony Michelle won a Super Bowl.
Also not a very good player.

Speaker 2 (01:45:13):
Maroney had a like sneaky, really good rookie year.

Speaker 1 (01:45:16):
He just fell off the Yeah, he had a really
good playoff run and those if you go.

Speaker 2 (01:45:19):
Back and you look at that, like the numbers aren't
as bad as we like they're made out to be.
He just got hurt.

Speaker 1 (01:45:25):
So Laurence Maroney and Sony Michelle had very similar careers
they have. They both had good rookie years. They both
had decent playoff runs. I think that was Maroney's second
year though, right, I.

Speaker 2 (01:45:34):
Think it's even his second regular season was solid.

Speaker 1 (01:45:40):
I think he meant me, not you, when he said
that you weren't gonna like the running back take. But
here's the thing with running backs, and there's always the chance.
You know, I'll give you an example. Your your guy,
Derrick Henry is an exception to the rule. I would
say that there's always a chance that a guy can

(01:46:00):
elevate the blocking right, like he's so elusive or he's
so powerful.

Speaker 2 (01:46:06):
But Maroney ran for had a better year his second
year than his first year.

Speaker 1 (01:46:09):
Okay, so it was just a little different thing.

Speaker 2 (01:46:11):
And then he got he got hurt in O eight
and then he just even in nine. He was solid.
He ran for eight hundred yards and ten touchdowns.

Speaker 1 (01:46:18):
Not for a first round pick, not for first round pay.

Speaker 2 (01:46:20):
He was like a solid play. He gets a little
too much crap, like people know, people put him in
terms of a draft pick. People put him in like
the Nikhil Harry Chad Jackson bust. He's not that kind
of bust. I'll give you that, Like, he wasn't worth
the pick, but he was still a solid player.

Speaker 1 (01:46:37):
He was not a draft bust back to gen d Yeah,
in the running back call, because that's what he'd called about.

Speaker 2 (01:46:42):
There here, I am defending Lawrence Moroney.

Speaker 1 (01:46:45):
Uh that there are a handful, small handful of exceptions
of guys that truly elevate blocking, that are immune to
bad situations, but the vast majority of running backs are
need functional environments.

Speaker 2 (01:47:02):
For what it's worth, the Boise State offensive line was
not good. Genty did that in now another story going
from the Mountain West the NFL. But just to give
him credit at because a lot of people what was
Boise State's line? He was probably just running open. No,
he created a lot of that on his own.

Speaker 1 (01:47:22):
But the take, my point is not even to crap
all over the take. Yeah, My point is actually you
just shouldn't make the take that way, right, So the
take shouldn't be that gent is gonna come into New
England and he's gonna make a bad offensive line look good.
That should not be the take. The takes should be
that we're gonna build it run first, right, We're gonna

(01:47:43):
draft linemen, We're gonna draft Genty and just like the
Titans with Derrick Henry, we're gonna run the football and
that Genty, his special sauce is gonna put them over
the top. Eagles with Saquon Barkley, Lions with Jamir Gibbs,
right like, it's gonna make it that much better for
nine ers with the house healthy Christian McCaffrey, Like, that's

(01:48:03):
the take. That's the vision Dallas with a young Zeke
right like that. It's that you're gonna build a line,
and you're gonna build it run first, and you're gonna
build it around Genty, and then Genty is gonna take
a good situation and make it great.

Speaker 2 (01:48:18):
Right, No, drafting Genty does not somehow diminish the need
to add to the offensive run. It doesn't more he
makes it more important. You can go that way if
you want, but say, well, you know, if you draft
Ashton Genty instead of adding a tackle, Venerian Low is
not gonna be that much better because Ashton Genty's back there, right,
So yeah, I it's even for me like Genty at

(01:48:40):
four is would be incredibly tough to justify.

Speaker 1 (01:48:43):
Yeah, if you're one again, it's not saying there isn't
a rationalization. The rationalization, though, is that then you are
building through the run game, so your investments are now
heavily on the arm.

Speaker 2 (01:48:57):
If you take Genty at four, you gotta trade back up,
trade thirty eight and seventy seven to get back into
the first round. Now you're definitely drafting Ariante. Nursery says,
you're left tackle because he's more of a road grader. Yeah,
and then you're you're you should be taking a guard
at sixty nine like that, That is what that draft
should look like. You should be a running back followed
by two or even three offensive lineman in a row
to fill that thing out. Also about a j R.

(01:49:19):
Redmond reference, shout out JR. Redmond, Listen, JR.

Speaker 1 (01:49:22):
Redmond was a good role player. But if you're gonna
see a role player, if you're gonna start listing off,
like we need to have Ashton Genty because a j R.
Redmond and uh Antoine say Hey and Lawrence Maroney and
Sony Michelle and Steven Ridley, that's not the argument you
want Ashton Genty for because of Corey Dillon.

Speaker 2 (01:49:37):
Right, Yes, yes, Ashton Genty is more he he would
be better. They don't win thirty six without j R.
Redmond though that I'm gonna drive and it came up big.

Speaker 1 (01:49:46):
I'm not throwing jars.

Speaker 2 (01:49:48):
No, I get you're saying, no, you're not like and
I'm huge Antoine Smith fan. I really am. I think
he's one of the underrated Patriots.

Speaker 1 (01:49:54):
Of all time.

Speaker 2 (01:49:55):
He was a high level platoon back. Yeah, that's like,
you don't get at Antoine Smith without Kevin Folk, Right,
Corey Dillon was the backfield. You're the famous Bill Belcher.
Are you opposed to a was it a feature back?

Speaker 1 (01:50:10):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (01:50:10):
And Bilt like that, you know, because well Cory Dylan
ran for you know, fourteen hundred yards that whatever, like
like where he's just like, well, Corey Dillon's at workhorse.
You're drafting it. You're not drafting ash and genty to
be Antoine Smith or Sony Michelle.

Speaker 1 (01:50:22):
If he's Sony Michelle, with all due respect, that's a
major problem.

Speaker 2 (01:50:27):
Well, looks like we were just talking about. He's still
a solid player, but not for what the pick was. Yeah, no,
you're drafting him to be Corey Dillon at least at
least maybe Well, apparently Corey Dillon's not a Hall of Fame,
which I don't entirely agree with, but if you're taking
the running back fourth overall, should be all of yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:50:44):
Yeah, I agree. All right, Brad is in Ohio. What's up, Brad?

Speaker 2 (01:50:49):
Hey, guys, real quick, Brat, I gotta throw my cloud
in there, shout out of my cloud.

Speaker 1 (01:50:54):
Go ahead, Oh my god, all right, Brad, go ahead.

Speaker 11 (01:50:57):
Okay, I've just got a couple of docs, guys, and
you know, see what you'll hush over because you're always
touching on good points. Evan said something about we need
to focus on players that are a best fit opposed
to worrying about anything else about you know, where we're
drafting and and all that. They need to be a
fit to our team, especially on offense. So I'm wondering

(01:51:20):
if you think we should double dip a tight end.

Speaker 12 (01:51:24):
And for me, again, the only running back that fits
our offense is Donovan Edwards. You can put him out
in the X and you know, let him run down
the field. He can run routs like a receiver, so
you can put him in the slot and there's just
so many things you can do with Donovan and he

(01:51:44):
run a four point what a four to four of the.

Speaker 1 (01:51:49):
We're both Donovan Edwards fans here.

Speaker 12 (01:51:51):
Yeah, what where do you think he'll even be picked at?
And do we have it? Do you think we'll have
a viable option opportunity to get him or And then
I was thinking off though about the only person I
would draft at four would be Travis h Oner as
a receiver, and and Graham only bench press twenty four

(01:52:13):
reps and the guy that other Michigan guy only did
twenty two. What does that m And then that's like
the ten reps eleven less than what Donald did, Aaron Donald.
So that's a big difference in strength. I mean, is
that gonna?

Speaker 8 (01:52:29):
Is that?

Speaker 11 (01:52:30):
So that's my questions, guys, So thanks.

Speaker 1 (01:52:33):
Brat, thanks for the call. We're both Donavan Edwards guys. Yeah,
good player. I think a ceiling is probably the fourth round.

Speaker 2 (01:52:39):
Fourth fifth round. I wouldn't say he's the only player
in this draft that fits that role. He might be
one of the better options on Day three, but like
Cam scattabow similar, I wouldn't double up a tight end.
To the other question too, If you want to get
one project tight end, that's fine, But you know I've
been big on this. They need their draft picks to play. Yeah,

(01:53:00):
they need guys that are gonna make an impact, and
you already have Hunter and Hooper, so you're gonna get
two rookie tight ends on the field if they want to,
like in the seventh round, take like a Gavin Bartholomew
and that's the double dip whatever. But they should be
fine in this draft taking one tight end.

Speaker 1 (01:53:16):
Yeah. I love the tight end class. I'm really high
on it. And when I did my mock draft, I
was trying to talk myself into taking tight ends, you know,
third fourth round, and I was just like, but, like,
he's not gonna play, you know, realistically, especially at that
position where typically it's it's a year one learning curve
for a lot of tight ends making the jump from
college to the NFL. There's has to do a lot

(01:53:38):
more blocking and a lot more of the details in
the NFL than they are in college and in receiving.
I mean honestly, like they don't throw the tight ends
in college. Like it's just all of it, Like all
of it is different, you know, in a higher volume
than in the college game. So if you envision a
tight end in this offense and then you think about, okay,

(01:53:59):
they're gonna have to earn playing time from two stable
veteran guys and Hunter Henry and Austin Hooper who already
have a rapport with the quarterback that have already played
in this offense before. Like, it's just hard to get there.
In my mind that that that guy would do it.
So I took Mitchell Evans from Notre Dame in the
fifth round of my of my mock a because of
where he's gonna go, you know, early day three I

(01:54:21):
think is a safe bet. And then B because he's
coming off that a CL like maybe he is a
couple of years removed from it and he's an even
better player, you know, in twenty twenty six.

Speaker 2 (01:54:30):
So Michell Mitchell Evans, yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:54:32):
From No. Dame towards a twenty twenty three.

Speaker 2 (01:54:35):
Oh okay, I was just saying he played last year.

Speaker 1 (01:54:37):
No, he played last year, but you always have that
like you're removed from the ACL, right.

Speaker 2 (01:54:41):
Okay, I was gonna say he played in the National Championship.

Speaker 5 (01:54:43):
Ye.

Speaker 2 (01:54:43):
No, I like Mitchell lobs and he can block. Yeah,
so he's gonna be able to get on the field
because he'd probably be their best blocking title.

Speaker 1 (01:54:48):
He'd probably be your third blocking tight end, third tight
end as a rookie. Maybe get him into some goal line.

Speaker 2 (01:54:54):
That's kind of got stuff. That's kind of guy they
should be looking for. Yeah, I honestly, if they want
to double up a tight end Robb Utes, that's that's
what you're doing. You take a developmental tight end, take
a Mitchell No, you take like a Mitchell Evans or
Terrence Ferguson or somebody early on day three, and then
you take robb you utes later, who's going to be
kind of a move fall back. But he can line

(01:55:15):
up on the line of scrimmage, put his hand in
the dirt and do all that if you need him
too as well. That's how I would double up a
tight end.

Speaker 1 (01:55:20):
All of a sudden, we got all these calls coming in.

Speaker 2 (01:55:22):
Great. If you a rapid rapid fire lightning round.

Speaker 1 (01:55:25):
Tyler's in Cincinnati. What's up Tyler lightning round?

Speaker 12 (01:55:29):
Guys.

Speaker 15 (01:55:31):
I just want to know if you guys had looked
potentially like late round pick, maybe like Tommy Malott or
Tommy Malow. He's a quarterback, former wide receiver from like
Montana State. I was just wondering if you guys looked
into him and all what your thoughts were for like
a late round pick.

Speaker 1 (01:55:48):
Thanks, Yeah, I've heard of Tommy Merlow. I'll give you that.

Speaker 2 (01:55:52):
I mean, no, we're still chasing Edelman and he's an
option quarterback at it's of success at the FCS level.
It's played a little bit of wide rect. He's gonna
be a late day three pick or UDFA and it's him,
and is it ft Chisholm? Right, Yeah, like that who
I think was a quarterback before more receiver he is
a receiver.

Speaker 1 (01:56:11):
Is at one of the All Star games. I don't
remember what, Yeah it was, but yeah, I've I saw
him a little bit. I don't know if it was
the Shriner, the Senior Bowl. I feel like he was
at one of those games. I could be wrong, but yeah,
I mean you know we're chasing Edelman.

Speaker 2 (01:56:27):
You're right, yeah, And I mean look bring him in
as the udf A, see what happen. Sure, Like I'm
not against.

Speaker 1 (01:56:32):
Those guys are theoretically with McDaniel's back, you know, in
play Gunner Oshsky, Riley, Mccaeron Braxon, Barrios, Julian Edelman, Like
those guys are all kind of back in play, right,
you know? Yeah? Why why are you laughing.

Speaker 2 (01:56:46):
You know why I'm laughing?

Speaker 1 (01:56:46):
All right? Uh, Chet is in Philly. What's up? Chet?

Speaker 8 (01:56:52):
Hey?

Speaker 6 (01:56:52):
What's up?

Speaker 10 (01:56:52):
Guys.

Speaker 4 (01:56:53):
I appreciate you guys taking.

Speaker 1 (01:56:54):
The call, no problem.

Speaker 2 (01:56:55):
What are you doing good?

Speaker 4 (01:56:58):
Evan bick Fanny. I follow you on Twitter. You bring
me a lot of my stuff. What I'll say is,
first off, like I really appreciate that you guys don't
do a lot of the gas lighting that we get
from the regular radio, but you know, to actually talk
football as much as you know, we're like we're going
off about the whole mac Hollands thing and all of
the lack of super high end depth. I'm happy that

(01:57:20):
you guys actually realized and talked about already that like
there's not gonna be a superstar guy that's gonna leave
their good situation to try to come to this rebuilding team,
and we're gonna actually have to build from the ground up.
And now I will also say, like we still have
a couple pieces that like we can probably take a
couple of mid round flyers, like you know, all of
those Trey Harris type guys, those around two round three

(01:57:43):
type receivers, those Jaden Higgins guys in round two, round three,
try to take a flyer on one of those and
actually hope that, like you know, a couple of these
young guys developed, like a lot of people aren't really
talking about them. But when I watched him in the
preseason last year, the guy that I would have thought
would have got cut after the preseason, they stowed to
quick Jackson away last year, and I was a really
big fan of watching him in the preseason. I was

(01:58:04):
the guy that caught the post from Joe Milton in
the preseason, if you remember him, and they kept him
around all year despite him being hurt and being like
a small school prospect. So I'm very intrigued to how
good he could be and maybe he might be that
damnfield director. He has that kind of Calvin Ridley, and
I don't know, if you notice the social media, his
name is Quae rid He played Division two football from

(01:58:25):
California University of PA and his nickname was quite ridd
because people say he used to move like Calvin Ridley.
So I don't know, I feel like maybe he could
be one of those guys that might make a little
splash as the person that nobody's really thinking about in
this offense.

Speaker 1 (01:58:38):
Thanks for the college. I appreciate it, and I appreciate
you guys following us and everything. I always say the
same thing about guys like that, like, great if it happens.
I'm not counting on it by any means, but yeah, look,
I understand that some people think I give this take,
and you know, I'm trying to carry water and things
like that, but there's just a long way to go,
and you and I are big draft guys. To us.

(01:59:00):
The draft is a big thing, you know. You know,
you add a lot of talent if you're good at
it through the draft. And I understand that people Patriots
Nation is probably a little bit skeptical about their ability
to draft, especially outside the first round. You know, Christian
Gonzales and Drake may were great picks, but they don't
really have much to show out of those two classes
outside of those two guys. So I get all of that,

(01:59:22):
but I would just say, you know, let's wait until
we overreact about the lack of weapons until after, you know,
April twenty sixth, when the draft is over. Because if
Travis Hunters on this football team, if Ted McMillan's on
this football team, if Luther Burden's on this football team.
It's gonna change how we feel about the team. And
they're gonna take a receiver in the top one hundred.

(01:59:44):
I feel confident saying that. I don't know if it'll
be first round, third round, I don't know where, but
they're gonna take a receiver and hopefully they take the
right one right And I understand that that hasn't gone
well for them. I totally do, but I just want
to I don't want to get out over my skis.
And Week one, you know, free agency, where are the weapons?
They're neglecting the offense. And then in April, all of
a sudden, you know, Travis Hunter is being presented on

(02:00:06):
the field as their first round pick. We're all gonna
look like morons. So just yeah, let's see what happened.

Speaker 2 (02:00:10):
Look, we can do you can do it all collectively,
is what I'll tell people. Why aren't you talking about it, because,
like you said, it's in process, and we even talked
about earlier. We don't love that they missed out on
DK Metcalf. If they don't have receivers to If they
don't have receivers today, they're still not gonna have receivers
on April twenty seventh. Addressing it on April twenty seventh
is no different, right, It's it's even more so.

Speaker 5 (02:00:31):
So.

Speaker 2 (02:00:32):
I mean, I'm with you. I think they'll ad somebody.
Will it be enough? I don't know. But yeah, well,
well I'm not gonna fault them for not drafting receivers
before the draft. I'll talk about DK Metcalf because I
think that was a missed opportunity, but I'm not gonna
go further than that yet.

Speaker 1 (02:00:46):
Yeah, I know, we have these two last calls and
we got to wrap it up, but just really quickly.
I also have come to terms with the fact I
guess that they might need proof of concept before they
draw the DK Metcalf the Chris God And by proof
of concept, you know, I go back to the Bills.
I know. I know. Josh Allen, YadA, YadA, YadA, gold
bye boy. Josh Allen in his second season goes ten

(02:01:10):
and six, makes the playoffs. They they don't. I think.
I don't think they won the playoff game, but they
were in the playoffs.

Speaker 2 (02:01:16):
Is that the other loss to the Ravens they.

Speaker 1 (02:01:18):
Lost in the wild card round? I believe, but don't
quote me on that. The main point is that they're
ten and six, they have proof of concept. Josh Allen
turns a corner. He looks like a franchise quarterback. The
next offseason they traded for Stefan Diggs. Yeah, right, and
Stefan Diggs opted to go to Buffalo, like he said, Yes,
I will go here because of Josh Allen and because

(02:01:39):
of the program that they were already building in the contract.
So sure, but that, yeah, goes hand in hand with everybody.
If you build that, if you build it, they will
come right. Yeah, So if they have a nice season
next year, doesn't have to be ten and six in
the playoffs. But let's say they're eight and nine.

Speaker 2 (02:01:53):
I think they might have sneaked in the playoffs for
what you're talking.

Speaker 1 (02:01:56):
But let's say they're eight and nine and Drake May
throws for four thousand yards and looks like an absolute dog.
It is just a dude, right.

Speaker 2 (02:02:03):
With this defense, they should not go eight nine. I
Drake May's thorn.

Speaker 1 (02:02:06):
For four Okay, But I'm just saying, just play on this, Okay,
they Drake May has a great second season. Mike Rabel
is what we think. Mike Rabel is as a head coach.
They are building there on this upward trajectory. That then
and maybe then you can draw the big fish at
wide receiver. So it might not be this offseason, but

(02:02:27):
maybe it's next offseason. And that's okay. That's the timeline.
That's the timeline that they're on right now. Ryan is
in Texas. What's up, Ryan? We got to be quick
with these calls. What's up?

Speaker 14 (02:02:37):
Hey, Hey, guys, I'll try to make you quick here.

Speaker 1 (02:02:39):
Thank you.

Speaker 14 (02:02:40):
Would you guys rather see Travis obviously, Travis Carter, Travis
or Carter at number four if they're available, but would
you rather see Tet at four in wait for Connolly
or Erstree potentially trading back up into the first round
with that third round pick that we have, or are
you guys taking a tackle at four to kind of

(02:03:01):
address the issues that we have on the left side
of the line.

Speaker 1 (02:03:04):
Yeah? Thanks, Ryan, that seems to be the number one question.
I think we're both in the same camp. We're taking
Hunter Carter if they're.

Speaker 2 (02:03:10):
There, Yeah, Carter Hunter won two in that order.

Speaker 1 (02:03:13):
If they're not there, I think the Patriots will take
Will Campbell. That's what I think they will do. But
I would probably take a.

Speaker 2 (02:03:21):
Receiver there still you would take Ted McMillan.

Speaker 1 (02:03:23):
I probably.

Speaker 2 (02:03:23):
Well, No, we did this exercise earlier. You said you
would take Campbell.

Speaker 1 (02:03:26):
I think they'll take Campbell.

Speaker 2 (02:03:28):
No, you said you would. We did, said you editor
on the.

Speaker 1 (02:03:31):
Climb all over the place. Now I don't know.

Speaker 2 (02:03:33):
I said, you're on the clock. We're getting we did
exact exercise. You're you personally are running the team. You're
on the clock, Carter, I said, I'm both gone, there's
no calls, okay.

Speaker 1 (02:03:44):
And you said Campbell. Okay, all right, you're right. I
did say Campbell. I'll stick with Campbell.

Speaker 2 (02:03:48):
Okay, but what.

Speaker 1 (02:03:49):
I'd rather happen would obviously be to take a Kylie
Travis Hunter and then trade back up into the first round. Yeah,
but if that's not if that's not a scenario, Campbell Campbell, Okay, Okay,
he did that exact exercise.

Speaker 2 (02:04:02):
I'm just making sure you're consistent. Yeah, I don't want
people changing your opinion.

Speaker 1 (02:04:05):
Oh, they do it all the time.

Speaker 2 (02:04:06):
I know. I'm trying to help you out. I'm looking
out for you.

Speaker 1 (02:04:09):
Okay. Ben is in Philly. What's up? Ben?

Speaker 8 (02:04:13):
Hey, guys, how are you good?

Speaker 1 (02:04:15):
How are you doing well.

Speaker 16 (02:04:18):
I'm just curious on your take. Do you think it
is possible for the Patriots to develop a wide receiver
at this point or is a player like Will Campbell
just more dependable because of their development history.

Speaker 1 (02:04:31):
Yeah, thanks for the call, Ben. This was something else
that we talked about yesterday on PU that is starting
to like, you know, I don't know if irritates the
right word, but like I don't, I don't really understand
what like their failure with Nikhil Harry or Taekwon Thoron
has anything to do with Mike Rabel. Like, Mike Rabel
is not here when those things happen. He was not
the head coach, he was not the the What I

(02:04:53):
think is the is the lead football czar in New England.
Mike Rabel, like Mike able to not draft those guys,
He did not coach those guys, and it has nothing
to do with him.

Speaker 2 (02:05:03):
Well, Josh McDaniels was here for Nikhil Harry, sure.

Speaker 1 (02:05:06):
But my point being is just I'm not gonna hold
Nikhil Harry, Taekwon Thorion, Aaron Dobson, Chad Jackson like I'm
not gonna hold Hale pol Bethel Johnson. I'm not gonna
hold those guys against Mike Rabel. I'm not.

Speaker 2 (02:05:19):
I'll say this, Todd Downing has never coached receivers before.
Very experienced offensive coach, but he's never been hands on
with receivers in that role. We'll see.

Speaker 1 (02:05:27):
It's variable. I'm I just until they burn me on
a receiver and it fails.

Speaker 2 (02:05:34):
No, it's that's absolutely fair. It is a different group,
but it's not a group. I guess it is, and
it isn't. Rabel developed a j Brown who was down
Downing wasn't the OC for that, right?

Speaker 1 (02:05:46):
That might have been Arthur Smith.

Speaker 2 (02:05:48):
How was Arthur Smith? Okay, So if Rabel has Downing
hasn't McDaniels, there's a weird track record there because missed
on guys like Harry, but also developed Jacoby Myers. So
the track record for this group, if I'm with you,
don't don't put it on the old group. This group
that's in charge is a mixed track record of doing it.
There's some hits, there's some missus. That's fair, so we'll see.

(02:06:11):
I don't think your point's not wrong. But that also
doesn't mean that they can develop.

Speaker 1 (02:06:14):
A guy if you want to go to Rabel's time
in Tennessee. I know I've got a rap, But if
you want to go to Rabel's time in Tennessee and
hold that him accountable for those picks, I don't think.
I think he was forced into trading aj Brown and yes,
drafting Traylon Burks, but we both at the time were like,
what are they doing?

Speaker 2 (02:06:30):
That was the birth of one of our favorite idioms. Yeah,
the mystery box in the boat. Yeah, Traylon Burks was
not the right pick there, he was not the boat. No,
So we can hold him accountable for all of that.
But I also am not going to.

Speaker 1 (02:06:43):
Hold nik kill Harry against him, Like I'm not going
to say that this regime has an issue with developing receivers.

Speaker 2 (02:06:49):
But Josh McDaniels was here for kil Harry, I guess,
but he was also here for Jacobe Myers, like it
goes it it depends.

Speaker 1 (02:06:55):
I know, But like I just he was here as
the offensive coordinator. We all know who was making the
calls when he was here, Like, yeah, I mean, he
wasn't the one making the picks.

Speaker 2 (02:07:04):
I don't think. My point is you can't say anything
definitive about this group and it comes to wide receiverses,
not enough evidence one way or the other.

Speaker 1 (02:07:12):
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(02:07:33):
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Thanks so much for watching and for all the phone
calls there at the end. We tried to hang on
for as long as we could, but we gotta go.
We'll be back next week right here, same time, same
place for another Catch twenty two and unfiltered tomorrow. So
we're still rolling here on Patriots dot com, so we'll

(02:07:55):
see you guys then bye.

Speaker 2 (02:07:58):
Thank you for downloading this podcast, Subscribe on Apple, Google Play,
and everywhere else you listen like the show, please rate
and review us.

Speaker 8 (02:08:06):
Listener comments and ratings help keep us high on the
podcast rankings so new listeners can find us.

Speaker 1 (02:08:11):
Be sure to check Patriots dot com for more news
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