Patriots Catch-22 4/9: Draft Buzz, Positional Draft Favorites on Offense

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:13):
This is the Patriots Catch twenty two podcasts with Evan
Lazar and Alex Barth.

Speaker 2 (00:20):
And Lazarre.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
Hello, everybody nailed it, joined us Always buy our bark.

Speaker 1 (00:27):
Here is Evan Lazar and Alex Barr The only coach
you can get away with that technique. There's one coach.
The answers, but that way p one question it love it,
that was good. That was good.

Speaker 3 (00:42):
That made me feel good.

Speaker 1 (00:43):
That was a good.

Speaker 3 (00:45):
That was my favorite SoundBite to come from the owner's meetings.

Speaker 1 (00:48):
Oh, I'm sure it was favorite sound bite. Nothing, nothing,
but the coach that coaches, you're the team you cover said, certainly.

Speaker 3 (00:56):
There's very well had a good You had a good presser.

Speaker 1 (00:59):
I talked about building a tough, physical football team, didn't
he Not only that, nobody talked I'd rather hear about
that than ep a Ian. Rather hear about how you're
gonna win football games. And as long as the math lines.

Speaker 3 (01:12):
Up, how you're gonna win football games is by building
a good passing game. That's how that's the point that
he was making.

Speaker 1 (01:18):
By building good football team. Good passing game equals wins,
and good football team equals wins.

Speaker 3 (01:25):
I don't understand that they're they're the same thing.

Speaker 1 (01:27):
There's I believe it or not, there's more to football
than just throwing the ball. Yes, there is, for balance purposes. Sure, sure,
there's more to football than throwing the ball. All right,
I promise you watch a football game sometime. You'll be surprised.

Speaker 3 (01:41):
Oh wow, Okay, that's where you're going. Yeah, okay, yeah, yeah, Evan,
watch a football game that never happens. All right, Hello, everybody,
Evan Lazar, Alex Bars Patriots Catch twenty two. Two weeks
Alex two weeks to go until the NFL Draft. Two
weeks in a day. But I'm gonna call it two weeks.

(02:02):
I'm gonna round down and call it two weeks. Look,
the hay is not quite in the barn for me personally,
but it's getting there. We're we're we're getting to hayes
in the barn status, Like we got a few more
was it biales?

Speaker 1 (02:14):
Right?

Speaker 3 (02:14):
Bales of hay to go? Yeah, but we're very very close.

Speaker 1 (02:18):
And now is how many players? Would you say you're
up to?

Speaker 3 (02:22):
Probably about one thirty?

Speaker 1 (02:24):
Yeah, okay, I'm probably not range.

Speaker 3 (02:25):
Yeah, I'm trying to get to one fifty this year.
Usually I get to around between one twenty five and
one fifty. But this year, I'm trying to get to
that one fifty more because they have those two fifths
and you just, you know, you kind of want to
know a little bit more about early day three in
a year like this. But we're getting to the point
now where the intel's changing daily. It almost feels like, right,

(02:51):
you know, last week it was a lock that, uh,
the Cleveland Browns are gonna take Abdual Carter at number two.
Now it's a lock that Travis Hunters is going to
go to to the Browns. It feels like we're in
that part of the off season, which I think is
interesting because now is the time where the scouting staffs,

(03:11):
the coaching staffs, the heads of department, if you will.
Now they have their final draft meetings, and really, up
until this point, the board hasn't been set yet truly,
and I know people find that hard to believe, but
the board outside of maybe Tennessee, who might know exactly
who they're taking because they're taking somebody first. Overall, it

(03:33):
takes a minute to set the board in terms of
all these visits and workouts and all that kind of stuff.
So we're in the next week or so, I would
say in set the board territory now for NFL teams,
and when that happens, you often start to hear some
trickling out of more information that might be more accurate.
I think it was two drafts ago, maybe it was

(03:53):
last year's draft that Bill Belichick's is.

Speaker 1 (03:55):
Last year on McAfee. I was going to bring this
up last year on McAfee, Bill Belichick said, the accurate
information from teams doesn't really start leaking out until about
twelve hours before the draft. Yeah, and I remember looking
at it last year. Remember it was JJ McCarthy to
Patriots JJJJJJ. By the way, JJ McCarthy's agent I hopefully
got a raise after last year. But it was about

(04:19):
ten hours out last year that we started getting those
reports that, Hey, it's Drake may yeh, it's gonna be
Drake may So. Because, like you said, the scouts have
been doing their thing, the coaches have been doing their thing.
This is where they all come together. These next two
weeks two and a half weeks. We call this time
of your silly season. This is the silliest time of
silly season because and I love and hate this part

(04:42):
of the draft process. This is the most like exhausting
part in a good way, in a bad way. As
we go on early, right, you have the Senior Bowl,
the Shrine Bowl, you have the Combine, you have Pro Days,
you have free agency, Like we're getting all this new
information and there's changing takes and it's all evolving because
there's new things you have to consider that you have

(05:02):
to involve. At this point, I don't know when the
deadline is for thirties. I think it's the end of
this week, so there's still mighty it's next week, it's
next week. Yeah, but most teams have them done, Like
there's still gonna be some thirties trickling in. But outside
of that, for the teams, the hey is in the
barn like they're done. So we're not really gonna get
any unless it gets confirmed who the Browns are gonna take,

(05:23):
which won't happen until twelve hours for the draft. We're
not gonna get externally any new information here in these
next two weeks. So now it's just the same thoughts
churning through your head over and over. But it's two weeks.
We need stuff to talk about, and now's when the
real ridiculous stuff starts to come out.

Speaker 3 (05:42):
Yeah, one hundred percent. And this is a part of
the draft where I hate this part. Honestly, this is
my least favorite part because you just start to hear
a lot of silliness. You also start to have people
that and I'm guilty of this too, that are just
so dug in on their take and there's so take
ordered well to put certain players. Right now, you're just

(06:02):
at the point where it's almost argumentative because it's you
just have your guys, I have my guys, and we're
just not gonna be well, they're not gonna find a
common ground.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
It's the same arguments over and over because again there
is no new information. But so you get some people
who are so dug in. You also get some people who, uh,
you know, want something new to talk about. So now
we're just pulling these random what if ashion. Genty goes
to Evan with the brown stick ash and genty.

Speaker 3 (06:27):
Second, I haven't even heard that.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
I just hear I haven't either, But I bet you
in the next two weeks we're gonna hear somebody bring
up what if, Like what if the not necessarily as
a report, but again because we have this time to
fill and there's nothing new, so we're gonna create something new.
What if fashion genty goes second?

Speaker 3 (06:43):
Yeah, I've heard, you know for the Patriots. You know,
we've seen some mock drafts recently, Jalen Walker as I
picked up a little bit of steam. You know, obviously
all the trade down scenarios and stuff like that have
been popular. So you hear a lot of that kind
of stuff. And we're gonna get into some of the
new use for the Patriots with the draft or the
Patriots adjacent news at least as well here in a second.

(07:05):
And then we're also gonna do My Guys starting today.
So My Guys is a fun segment we like to
do if you're not familiar. Basically, these are just the
guys at Alex and I independently will stand on the
table for right. We're pounding the table for these guys.
We're planting our flags like these are our guys. We're
gonna do offense today, so we'll go every position, quarterback, receiver,

(07:26):
running back, tight end, offensive line. Actually I did guard
and were doing into your end tackles right with the
offensive line, and we just do an offensive line doesn't matter.

Speaker 1 (07:35):
I can split it up.

Speaker 3 (07:36):
We'll get into all the my guys for the offense.
Next week we'll do defense, and the following week we'll
just kind of do a general preview slash, you know,
rap show on the pre draft process.

Speaker 1 (07:46):
If you will.

Speaker 3 (07:47):
So that's the agenda for today. We'll obviously take all
your calls and emails as well.

Speaker 1 (07:52):
It's at.

Speaker 3 (07:54):
Podcasts I always Forget What It is now podcast at
Patriots dot com. And obviously the Patriots Catch twenty two Hotline,
not the Unfiltered Hotline because that's a different show. So
the eighty five to five pass five hundreds of phone number.
We see you guys lining up on the phones already.
But hey, Patriots fans, if you want to see Toyota's
best offers, including those not seen on TV, go to

(08:15):
buy at toyota dot com. It's Toyota's official website for
deals for the official vehicle of the New England Patriots, Toyota.
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saying this, but having two Jewish people read an Easter
promo is kind of ironic. Anyways, the big thing I

(08:58):
wanted to start with today is that there's some rumblings
and again, this is silly season. This is we start
to get, uh, you know, a little bit tired whatever
of all the draft talk. But I think Abdul Carter
is starting to become a little bit of a hot
button topic of you know, could Abdul Carter be the
one that falls to four. I think we've talked a

(09:18):
lot about Travis Hunter falling to four, but after his
pro day and and after some of the news that
trickled out from Cleveland's side following Travis Hunter's pro day,
I think they're their GM fight out said like, can
I draft both? In terms of shador in Travis Hunter, So.

Speaker 1 (09:36):
There's obviously Ken if he wants come up to four.

Speaker 3 (09:39):
Yeah, there's obviously an infatuation with with Travis Hunter across
the league, which is not surprising, but with Abdul Carter specifically, Uh,
if he's there at four, I think there's an interesting
discussion that comes to that one. It's another defensive player
on that side of the ball. But what I continued
to say is that it is a player that is

(10:02):
so far above the rest of the pack that you
have to take talent where the talent is right. And
I would not sweat it one bit to sit at
four and have Abdul Carter fall in their laps, But
I do want to talk about some of the things
with the abdual Carter that might be causing him to fall.
But what are just your general impressions right now of

(10:22):
all this chatter surrounding Abdul Carter?

Speaker 1 (10:24):
So I don't know. Maybe I'm in the minority here
because there's been a lot of reporting that the Browns
were there for Travis Hunter. But and I get they
sent a big group. I understand that, and Travis Hunter's
a great player. Is the owner really traveling for a
wide receiver? Is the owner traveling to see a wide receiver.

Speaker 3 (10:41):
Like now he did go to Penn State.

Speaker 1 (10:43):
Okay, so, but just the whole party is reminiscent to
me of what the Patriots sent to LSU and two
UNC last year. I'm like, this is what teams generally
send for quarterbacks. So maybe that means that they're going
to try to move up and get Sanders in, like
the teens move up from the second round and get
Sanders in the teens. And they are going to take

(11:04):
Hunter at two, and they do want to pair them up.
But I still think if Sanders goes too, this is
the part I feel stronger about my conviction. I'm not
necessarily one hundred percent sold on the Browns doing anything
right now. I do feel like if it is Sanders
at two, which is admittedly a big if, if it
is Sanders a two, Travis Hunter is gonna go three. Yeah.

(11:26):
I do think that's the path too.

Speaker 3 (11:28):
It happening, yeah, yeah, And I feel like that's that's
where I'm at. I'm trying to think about this realistically.
You know, if the draft is Ward Sanders Hunter, then
I think that's probably now the most realistic way this goes.
That one of those two guys falls to the Patriots.
Hunter Carter falls to the Patriots is if the draft
goes Ward Sanders one and two. I don't think if

(11:51):
the draft goes Ward Hunter, that the Giants are going
to pass over Abdul Carter. So the Giants were then
I would believe would would draft Carter. So he's not
on the board for you anyways. The one thing that
I wanted to talk about it I always want to
be careful with this kind of stuff, obviously, but it's
not my reporting, it's just what's out there about Abdul Carter.

(12:13):
Bob McGinn does a great job every single year of
really digging up the true feelings of the NFL on
each problem.

Speaker 1 (12:19):
He is the draft boogeyman. You don't want to see
Bob mcgainn writing about a player, do you like?

Speaker 3 (12:24):
Yeah, So he comes out every single year, position by
a position, and he's got scouts on the record anonymously
talking about these players.

Speaker 1 (12:33):
And he was the one for Reference last year. Remember
like a week before the draft and we were big
Ady Mitchell guys that put out there that Ady Mitchell
was going to fall because teams didn't like the way
he managed his diet his diabetes. Right, Is that what
it was? And I so Adie Mitchell then falls on
draft night way beyond where anybody thought. I don't think
it was ever confirmed that that's why. But like you

(12:54):
tie those two together, it's like, Okay, here's a guy
a week before, two weeks before that said he was
going to have the significant fall and then he had
a significant fault. Yeah, So I don't think we're we're
quite with the things that McGain is reporting or is sourcing.
I don't think we're quite in Jailen Carter territory where
there was an actual legal incident. Well that wasn't a
report that just happened right.

Speaker 3 (13:15):
Well, that's what I'm saying in terms of I don't
think we're in that territory because I know he had
the incident a year ago with the total truck driver
and all that he's been cleared of any charges of
that in that case, unless there's more cases that we
don't know about that weren't you know, risen to the
legal level, you know, where he's getting charged with anything,

(13:37):
Like I guess maybe that could happen. But my point being,
Jalen Carter had the it was speeding right or reckless
driving yea drag racing that that happened like the spring
of the draft, right like that happened that year. So
Jalen Carter ended up falling ten uh to Philadelphia obviously,
and that looks like a home run pick for them.

(13:58):
But here's what McGinn wrote, you know, just kind of
I'm not gonna read the whole thing, but here here's
an excerpt from m again on Abdul Carter. That scout
was one of four personnel people to express reservations about
Carter's makeup. He's not a great worker, said one plays
his butt off on Saturday, but he's not a great
guy during the week because he's so gifted. So I

(14:19):
think the bit the general gist of what McGinn wrote
from all these different scouts about Carters. He's a little
high maintenance.

Speaker 1 (14:26):
He's kind of a diva.

Speaker 3 (14:27):
He's a little high maintenance, you know, and he's one
of those guys that Monday through Saturday might not give
it as all, but Sunday he obviously, you know, when
you turn on the tape, you can see what he
can do on Sundays or Saturdays, you know, in college football.
So I think the number one thing to me with
all of this, I always take this type of stuff
with a grain of salt. You know, you never know

(14:48):
if anybody has a motive or an axe to grind
or whatever with a certain player. I tried not to
look too much into any of that kind of stuff
and just stick to the to the football and stick
to the tape. But when Rabel's here and Elliot Wolf
and Ryan Cowden, and we can see it with their
actions that they have been big culture evaluating us, you know,

(15:09):
effort and finish on the football field, getting the right
kind of football players, getting the culture. Guys in this
locker room, getting former captains, you know, guys that are
gonna circle the wagons for them with guys like Harold Landry,
like just they're big on culture. Yeah, they're big on
that word. And if Carter is there again, it's a

(15:29):
talent grab. It's a situation where you can't hesitate in
my opinion, but it is a test. It's a little
bit of a test of how much are they willing
to bend in that department Because to me, the reason
why Travis Hunter is getting some number two buzz now
over Abdul Carter is that Travis Hunter is a perfect

(15:53):
off and on the field football player he is. He
eats breeze football. He always says like I have eight
hours of sleep in sixteen hours to work on football,
and like that's the type of guy that he is.
He's a worker. He's very prepared. He does a lot
of film study. His character is very well thought of.

Speaker 1 (16:12):
All he does. All he does is study football and
play video games. That's really it. Yeah, Like he talked
about this on College Game Day last year where he
was like, I'm in the film room, I'm Matt practice,
I'm in the workroom, and they're like, you must do
something else. He's a streamer, that's you know what a
lot of these kids do. That's what he does. But
usually like he plays CFB twenty five like it's still
a football game. So that he is it is really underrated.

(16:36):
I would say the most underrated part about his game
right now, just the general consensus what I read about
him is how much of a student of the game
he truly is.

Speaker 3 (16:45):
Yeah, yeah, and if Abdol Carter isn't that And we're
looking at the two of these players, and I think
most people would agree either they're one two or two one,
and they're both kind of equally graded. In that blue
chip terrritory. Like these types of things, when you're making
a pick that high can certainly sway you towards one
player versus another. Do you think that Vrabel would concede

(17:09):
on the culture stuff because Carter is just so overwhelmingly talented.

Speaker 1 (17:13):
Well, this is kind of a I don't want to
do that. It's a catch twenty two. On one hand,
he doesn't necessarily fit the culture that you're looking for,
and that might be a red flag. On the other hand,
isn't this part of why you build that strong culture
Because if there is a guy that's so monumentally talented,

(17:35):
and Bill did this again and again and again. If
there is a guy that's so monumentally talented but maybe
isn't exactly the person you wanted to be, the idea
is you can get him in a room that's ninety
ninety five percent guys that are all pulling in the
same direction. You hope he's going to buy into that,
that the culture will support him and uplift him. So now,

(17:56):
it's one thing to do that ten years in. It's
another thing to do what you're right. If we were
having this conversation ten years into the raable tenure, i'd say,
and things go the way we think they're gonna go,
or he thinks they're gonna go, absolutely right. You bring
them in and okay, like the culture is there, the
program is instilled, and it's just gonna what is it,
high tides, lift all boats or whatever, like it's gonna

(18:18):
help me out year one. It's a little more of
a risk. But the other argument is, this is why
you build a strong culture. So when a guy like
Abdull Carter is available with his talent, even if he's
maybe he doesn't isn't as motivated as you want him
to be, he's gonna have no choice but to change
the way he operates when he gets in this building,
because that's just how things are done in this building.

Speaker 3 (18:38):
Yeah, I agree, and and I think the other you know, conversation,
I don't want to spend too much time on the
character still because I don't know Abdul Carter, Like it's
not my reporting, Like I don't know the guy's when
you start to talk about why could he be falling?
And that's sort of a conversation that's going around right now.
This is the only reason why it's obviously not the
tape right, like it's it's obviously not the foot player

(19:00):
because we can all see how talented he is, but
it might be some of this other stuff. I don't
think it's the foot I I think that that's that's
something that is.

Speaker 1 (19:08):
Oh no, he can't, he can't do half a mini camp.
We got drive somebody else.

Speaker 3 (19:12):
Like, No, I don't think it's that. This to me
is is one hundred percent.

Speaker 1 (19:17):
Uh. If there's anything going on, it might be care
I hate doing this stuff, but it also is it's
important context, like we because we're projecting off the tape, right,
but the one part piece of information that we don't have.
We're not in the meeting rooms with these guys. Yeah,
we and you hear coaches talk here and there, but
everybody has an agenda, right, We don't have necessarily the

(19:39):
full personality, mental makeup picture that the teams do. So
we this happens every year. There's one or two guys
I really like that fall and it's why do they fall?
If if you thought they were so good? Has happened
with Deman Jones a couple of years ago. You know,
I thought he's gonna be an early second round pick.
He went what mid fourth like early forth, Sometimes guys
fall a little bit and it's like, already felt a

(20:00):
little bit. Maybe I was wrong. There's a certain point
where a guy falls to a level where it's like,
clearly somebody knows something I don't know. And at this
point I'll go with the somebody. Nolan Smith. We thought
Nolan Smith was a clear cut first round pick and
we were shocked when he felt like beyond the top twenty.
What do you end up going third round? Right? You mean?

Speaker 4 (20:18):
Ni?

Speaker 1 (20:19):
Kobe Dean? N Kobe Dean, thank you? Yeah? Na Kobe
Dean goes like very late in the draft, and then
it comes out he had a shoulder injury that nobody
knew about. And it's like if I had known that,
I would have adjusted, but it wasn't out there. So yeah,
I hate talking about this stuff, but it all it's
the part of the picture that we don't have. So

(20:39):
when we get these little nuggets of it, I do
think it's worth the dressing. And it goes the other
way too. It's not just to beat on guys like
we've talked about, but the good things usually those are
put out there because they're good and they want you
to know, when we hear about like the leadership of
certain players or things like that, how they are as
a teammate. Like, the good stuff is going to be
put out there, so we have a little bit more
of that to talk about.

Speaker 3 (21:00):
Whether you think it's overblown or not with some of
this stuff that comes out in these you know, McGinn
style articles. Dan Brukler released the Beasts today. Usually Dan's
a little bit more timid with some of this stuff.

Speaker 1 (21:14):
But if there is honest.

Speaker 3 (21:16):
Concerns about a player's you know, mental makeup. You know
Javon Baker, I remember last year, you know, some of
this stuff about his maturity and all that kind of
stuff came in the Beast like that that he'll come
out and say it too, right, And it's important because,
like you said, we're on the outside looking in to
this puzzle. We don't have all the information at hand,

(21:36):
and when we will, you know, get our takes out.
It's about the tape, it's about the film, it's about
the player, and we have to realize that this other
stuff is just as important to teams as the football.

Speaker 1 (21:49):
Yeah, and we did. The only reason we don't talk
about it is is we don't have it right, right,
we will look and sometimes it ends up being Psyeah.
Two years ago, teams were worried Christian Zalez was soft yeah,
and he wouldn't make it, and he fell to fourteen,
and then he fell to seventeen, and Annual fourteen he
went over him. Kean White too, Kean waves another one.
So sometimes it ends up being bs yeah in the
at the end. But it impact we're talking about when

(22:11):
we're talking about draft stock. It matters. And then you
know I said it about Gonzales at the time, all right,
it impacted this draft stock. I understand that. I didn't
think it was going to impact him as a player.
Those are two different conversations. Team screwed the draft up
all the time. You have to consider that.

Speaker 3 (22:26):
So the other thing, as we segue into the next
news item I wanted to bring up, I have zero
hesitations about Abdul Carter playing defense, like not being like
a tackle or a receiver an offensive player. I think
the bad teams stay bad by passing on better players
for needs. Right, any if you have a chance to

(22:46):
get Abdul Carter now, you might look at me and
say you think Mason Graham's a better prospect than Will
Campbell or you think Jalen Walker is a bet. Those
guys to me are in the same cluster. They're in
the same stack, so need andsosition and positional value might
be a little bit more heavily weighted when you're within
a tier of players. Abdul Carter is in his own tier,

(23:08):
different tier, right, So when we're talking about Abdul Carter
over Will Campbell, or Abdul Carter over Ted McMillan or
Tyler Warren or whatever the case may be, we're talking
about a different level of prospect.

Speaker 1 (23:18):
Gent is in that tier with Kit, with Carter and Hunter.
To me, he's just it's sure the running back thing.
But like I so to case in point for the Giants,
if it goes quarterback quarterback, they get to do the
whole positional value and fit thing. Yeah, with Carter and Hunter.
And that's why I think they would take Travis Hunter,
even though Carter might be a little bit of a prospect.

(23:40):
The one thing that kind of haves edge, So they
get to do that. If you're the Patriots and it's
Abdul Carter or the field, you don't get to do
that or Travis Hunter in the field. You don't really
get to do that because they're such different levels of player.

Speaker 3 (23:54):
And I like what the Patriots have done on the
defensive line. Milton Williams is obviously a great player, a
good sign Harold l Anders, a solid signing that's gonna
be an NFL caliber starter that's gonna be plug and
play and a defense he's familiar with. But they don't
have it. They don't have a sack artist, like, they
don't have a finisher. They to me Abdull Carter completes
the defense like that's a cherry on top of the Sunday.

Speaker 1 (24:16):
We've talked so much about the coverage dictating wide receiver. Yeah,
the blocking, dictating pass rusher. They don't have the Matthew Judon.

Speaker 3 (24:25):
Right, the jude On, you know, the pure one on
one winner on the outside that's gonna have double digit sacks, right,
I don't know if they have that.

Speaker 1 (24:32):
Who's the guy that's going to force offenses to do
things differently? And boy, you drop Carter into the thing. Carter,
Milton Williams, Christian Barmore. He is healthy, which probablys great
to seem in the building this week. Ye can right for workouts? Well,
I was just going to say, at all three levels, right,
you talk about cornerstone players. Kean White will see you
can get there, He's not there yet. Milton Williams, Christian Barmore,

(24:53):
Abdul Carter, Christian Gonzales. That's a defensive core. Yeah, that
is a true core that you can build around. And like,
those guys are going to give you a really solid floor.

Speaker 3 (25:03):
When I look at the Patriots and then I promise
we'll move on because and I spend a lot of
time on this, but when I look at the Patriots
in terms of, you know what, there are pillars of
this team moving forward, Drake May, Christian Gonzalez and potentially
Abdul Carter. Doesn't that feel a little bit like Stroud,

(25:24):
Stingly and Will Anderson in Houston a little bit?

Speaker 1 (25:27):
Right?

Speaker 3 (25:27):
Like it's very similar. Obviously, Drake May hasn't risen quite
yet to the C. J. Stroud level. I wouldn't say
Stingley and Gonzales both all pro corners. I think Will
Anderson and Abdull Carter are adjacent in terms of talent
and you know, just ceiling as prospects coming out of college.
The Texans just did this right. The Texans just kind

(25:48):
of put set themselves up for the next at least
five years of being a playoff contending team.

Speaker 1 (25:55):
Well before they tore their offensive line apartment.

Speaker 3 (25:57):
Yeah yeah, Now the difference is, and this is where
we get into defense and some of the guys I'm
I'm gonna mention with some of these recent visits that
have been reported, the little bit of difference is that
the Texans hit on Day two picks right, so that
they hit on Dave two picks specifically on offense. I
know he's been you know it hurt at times, but
you know, tant Dell, Nico Collins, you know, players like

(26:18):
that like you need to if you're gonna draft best available,
which is what I think Houston pretty much did with
Stingley and will Anderson.

Speaker 1 (26:26):
Well they moved up to get and.

Speaker 3 (26:28):
Yeah, but they he was the best player available and
they moved up and got him. When you draft those
types of players on one side of the football, you
got to hit in rounds two through seven on some
of the other positions that are going to be important
to your offense. And Nico Collins is like a mid
round draft pick that turns into one of the best
receivers in football. You know, that's right, that's the type

(26:50):
of thing you have to do. So along those same lines,
the Patriots reportedly again over the last week or so,
have met host did Mikel Williams and Shamar Stewart on
thirty visits. Now, my instant reaction to that was, oh, well,
they're stacking a trade down, right, Like if a trade
down is their best option at four. And I'm not

(27:13):
saying that they want a trade down or they have
a trade down in place. I'm just saying if like,
you have to come up with all the contingencies and
be prepared for every single possible contingency that could come
your way. So let's say they get the draft night,
Abdul Carter and Travis Hunter go in the top three.
They're sitting at four. The New Orleans Saints call, right,

(27:34):
and they want Shador Sanders, So they're trading up for
Shador Standers. You go back to nine. Who are what's
your stack at nine?

Speaker 1 (27:41):
Right?

Speaker 3 (27:42):
Like, who are the guys that you would be comfortable
with taking at nine? And Mikel Williams and Shamar Stewart
to me, would fit into that stack that range of
the draft. Now, I'm definitely mikel over Shamar Stewart. I
think Mikyle Williams is a much better football player than
Shamar Stewart.

Speaker 1 (28:00):
Williams said McKay like the safety.

Speaker 3 (28:02):
I said, I don't know. Mike hal Williams.

Speaker 2 (28:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (28:08):
Uh, he's a better football player to me than Stuart.
Stewart's a better athlete. Stuart's a one to one athlete,
you know, absolutely rare tools and athleticism. But I didn't
love what I saw on tape from Stewart. I thought
he was stiff. It doesn't have a ton of bend
off the edge, not gonna win with much finesse. You know,
I really actually thought watching him that Will Campbell, you know,

(28:29):
kind of ate his lunch. Like he really didn't give
Will Campbell very many problems at all. You know, Guys
like Kyle Knard, you know, his teammate Nick Scot and
like some more twitched up guys that can you know,
win with more speed and win with more finesse. Like
those guys tended to give Will Campbell some problems. But
to me right now, Shamar Stewart's a ball play. He's
a risk I think for the Patriots shore to your

(28:51):
point earlier if we were two, three, four years into
this thing and they had somehow got into the you know,
a top ten pick or a late top ten pick,
and they want to give Rabel and Terrell Williams this
ball of clay, you know, raw toolsy athletic pass rusher,
you know, have at it. But I think the Patriots
need to get on base with this draft pick as

(29:11):
much as anything. They need to hit one right down
the fairway. Mikel Williams, I think does that a little
bit more, a little bit more college production, a little
bit more translatable. I think to a four to three
and you know he's a four to three base end,
like that's what he is. Great length, you know, above
average length in terms of arm length, and also stride
length as well. I think is a good strength of

(29:33):
his really good film against Kelvin Banks Junior. A trade
down to nine ish in drafting Mikel Williams or you know,
Jalen Walker, I know is getting some buzz as well.

Speaker 1 (29:44):
To get a nine. I feel like he's heat. That guy,
screams Carolina Panther.

Speaker 3 (29:48):
Yeah, yeah, either one of those guys, though, I'd be
okay with in that scenario but what are your thoughts
in the meeting with those guys, because I think Williams
and again, I think Williams and Stewart are kind of
in the no man's land for them, like it doesn't
really feel like they're going to be in a position
to draft those guys.

Speaker 1 (30:05):
Well, so, Stuart, I've seen some mocks that put them
down into the twenties. Now, some of that is Mike
Green going higher than expected with that, that's another guy
that has some non football concerns. Yeah, some of those
mocks have some other edge guys going earlier, but no,
they're they're they want to be ready if a trade
down comes. You can't get to nine and be like, shoot,

(30:25):
we don't know anything about any of these guys, right,
so you want to be prepared in that situation. It
also might be something we've heard of this. Both those
guys played in the SEC, right, Yeah, Hey, what you
what did you think of well Campbell? Yeh? What was
it like facing him? Kelvin Banks? What was that like?
Going up against him like that? That's the best that
can be some of the best intel you get literally

(30:46):
talking the guys who are lined up on the other side.
So it doesn't have to be one of the other.
It could be both. Hey, we want to know about
a trade back and also we're kind of interested in
what this guy is to say about some of the tackles.
So I don't hate it they're doing. They're due diligence.
I see people freak out some time they're burning thirty visits.
Thirty is a lot of visits, especially when you consider that, well,

(31:07):
they don't have as much help with the local pro
dates as like, there's no reason for the Cowboys to
have a thirty Yeah, because you can. You can host
players who are either I think it's what within ninety
miles of your team facility.

Speaker 3 (31:19):
There's some like outside the lines with that in terms
of like the lines, I mean literally like drawing the
mileage lines, Like Yukon is a local visit for the Patriots,
So I don't know if it exactly fits into the mileage,
but they stretch it because they know there isn't a
ton of college football.

Speaker 1 (31:35):
The Cowboys have the university, they have all those schools
in Dallas, plus all the kids that are from that
area that ARECU Baylor. Yeah, some of the Florida teams too,
the Dolphins, the Jags. They have a nice advantage there.
But yeah, that's a side rant. Yeah, no, I think
it's just due diligence.

Speaker 3 (31:51):
Yeah, I would agree with that.

Speaker 1 (31:53):
And it's also you know, it's a smoke screen too,
like if they only met with Will Campbell, do they
meet with Membo? So I don't.

Speaker 3 (32:03):
I'm sure they have, but I don't know if.

Speaker 1 (32:04):
For thirty, But if you have Will Campbell visit and
that's it, you kind of lose a lot of leverage
if you're trying to make a trade or what have you.
So yeah, get to know the top guys on the board.

Speaker 3 (32:17):
I think it's interesting. Uh, you know, we hear these
thirty visits and you mentioned that them knowing the opponents
that they've gone up against. You know, Calvin Banks Junior
is a good one. I don't know if if Williams
ever faced Campbell maybe two years ago. They didn't play
Georgia last year. I know that, But anyways, yeah, uh,

(32:37):
maybe he has along the line. But I've heard that
before that guys will get hosted for visits and they'll
spend the entire visit talking about their teammate or talking
about a guy they went up against. Usually it's a teammate.
Like usually you're you bring in like you know, a
quarterbacks receiver, recorder, you know, vice versa, and like you

(32:57):
kind of use them to get to know the other player.
But there's times where like they'll say, yeah, like they
didn't ask me any questions about me, that they're asking
me all questions about you know, Shador, They're asking me
all questions about Travis Hunter. Like you know, it's something
totally different. But I looked at that in my at
face value and said, you know, if they if they
orchestrated trade down here than those two guys. And I

(33:19):
think in general, just having interesting interest in edge in
general makes a lot of sense. And I know some
people look at it and and want other positions and
want them to fill other needs early in the draft.
But it's a great edge class. And I would say
that the Patriots still could use a young, you know,
developing player there. You know, Harold Landry I think is

(33:41):
good for now. He's he's going to be a good
starter for them in the short term. Really opposite of Landry,
you know, is it Kean White, you know, is he
an outside guy? Is he really more just a rotational
inside guy? You know, Chase On I think is really
a situational pass rusher. I don't think he's a starting
end for them, So drafting somebody at that position, I again,

(34:04):
like going back to the Abdual Carter thing. I don't
think it's crazy, Like I don't.

Speaker 1 (34:08):
I'm with you, but I think in this draft, like
they don't need to take that guy in the first
round and get that guy. There's some really good Day
two edge guys.

Speaker 3 (34:15):
All right, let's get into my guys, and then we'll
take the calls in the emails for the last hour
or so here. Let's start with quarterback as we can
kind of probably.

Speaker 1 (34:24):
Go pretty quickly. Just go to the first round. Yeah,
first round, guys are out let me at real quick.
Just aside from the Patriots. Who ends up being QB
three and where does he go?

Speaker 3 (34:35):
Jackson Dart yep, mid to eight first like twenties.

Speaker 1 (34:42):
So I when I did my mock draft, I added,
as Jackson Dart, I had the Giants moving up to
I think twenty six to take them. I had them
taking Hunter right and then Jackson Dart makes the most sense.
Jalen Miller accepted that invite to the draft, so so
I'm not se was surprising some people. I think he's no, no.

Speaker 3 (35:02):
I just quarterback. I gotta be honest. I just didn't
really care too much about quarterbacks. So, uh, I liked
what I saw.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
At Jillian Milroe though.

Speaker 3 (35:11):
And you know, most of these guys I just watched
because I was watching other guys, and you obviously the quarterbacks,
so you see them. I just look at Jalen Milroe. Uh,
he's such a great athlete and uh he's got some
zip on the ball. Like he's not a bad thrower either.
That I think you can build an offense with Jalen Milroe. Like,
it's gonna have to be specific to Jalen Milroe. It's

(35:32):
gonna have to be, you know, similar to what the
Eagles do with her, you know, and stuff like that,
even you know, the Commanders with Jayden Daniels. It's gonna
have to be specific to the player, and it's gonna
have to be different, uh than you know, you're not
gonna just plug him into a pro style NFL offense
that goes under center and uh and does what NFL
pocket quarterbacks do and expect it to work. But if

(35:54):
you're crafty enough, if you're creative enough as an offensive mind.

Speaker 1 (35:57):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (35:57):
I think that there's so much raw talent there and
raw ability, especially with his athleticism and his mobility, that
I'd be willing to take a bet on Jalen Hurts
in the second round.

Speaker 1 (36:08):
So, Jen, I'll give you a couple fits for Jalen
Milroe for me. Yeah, one is the Saints if they
move up in the late first right, Kellen Moore just
did that with Jalen Hurts. The other one is the
Browns because when Jaln Milroe had that breakout your album
in twenty twenty three, who was his offensive coordinator? That
wasn't Bill O'Brien Nope, twenty three. Oh Tommy Reese, who's

(36:31):
now the OC in Cleveland. Yeah. I think Jaln Milroe
or Will Howard should be the QB three in this
draft because one has immense ceiling, one has a very
solid floor. Jackson Dart to me is splitting the difference.
I have no interest in splitting the difference. On day two.
Give me an extreme, which extreme we could debate that
and that's probably Team New Team. I think it should
be Milroe. I really like Will Howard.

Speaker 3 (36:51):
I do I have Will Howard on my list too,
as day two obviously as well. I don't know where
Milroe is gonna fall in exactly, but I watched his
doing like the QB school stuff. Again, he's great on
the whiteboard, A smart kid, you know, can conceptually understands
the game really well. I thought he throws a great
ball like it you know, it's he's a pocket passer's

(37:12):
big you know, six foot five, two hundred and thirty
pound pocket passer. Throws a really good ball again, understands
conceptually what the offense is trying to achieve, what he's reading,
what he's seeing out there from the defense. I mean,
he's probably not the most creative offscript guy or most
mobile guy. He doesn't really.

Speaker 1 (37:29):
Have that in him move around a little bit.

Speaker 3 (37:32):
But I think that he's you know, like you said,
maybe I don't know if you know, high floor, but
like I just think that you run an offense with
him right like you cat, he can really come in
and step in and run an offense. Now, he's obviously
going to have the concerns if you will, you know,
similar to like Mac Jones at Alabama, Like was it
just you know, Jamari Smith and all all these different
people you know around him.

Speaker 1 (37:53):
He was pretty good at at Kansas State. Yeah he
didn't have Ye, there's some guys on that team, but
not the same level of talent.

Speaker 3 (37:58):
Yeah, so I get that concern. Yeah, he's he's got
a great offensive line, he's got Chip Kelly calling plays,
he's got all worldwide receivers all over the place at
Ohio State. But I just like the skill set and
I think he's a guy that will make it work
in the NFL. Probably won't be a ceiling quarterback. He's
probably never gonna be like a top five quarterback in

(38:19):
the league, but I think he could be a starter.

Speaker 1 (38:21):
I think so too.

Speaker 3 (38:22):
Yeah, should we do like Patriots guys? Now, Well, I
was just I don't. I don't think the Patriots have
any interest in any of these quarterbacks.

Speaker 1 (38:29):
I well, they're gonna add a quarterback because Josh McDaniels
usually wants foreign camp, so that's they're gonna get their
Trace McSorley veteran camp are right, I wouldn't be surprised
they draft another guy to have him around imagency emergency
third quarterback. Obviously, he's not gonna have the same physical
tools as a guy like Joe Milton, so there's less
concern there. There's two guys. I look at one and

(38:50):
I know you hate this, and I've kind of dumped
on this guy during the process. But for where the
situation is now, it makes sense, and that's Brady Cook.
Brady Cook was terrible in twenty twenty four. He was
not good.

Speaker 3 (39:01):
Why Luther Burnden is not gonna go in the first round.

Speaker 1 (39:03):
Brady Cook in twenty twenty three was a baller. Brady
Cook was awesome in twenty twenty three ball stretch. He
was really he was better. He was he was one
of the best quarterbacks in the SEC. In twenty twenty four.
He was better. Teams are gonna look at it and say,
what happened in twenty twenty four. If Elliott Wolf wants
to repeat what he did with Joe Milton, Okay, we're
gonna find a guy with some tools, with some sneaky upside,

(39:24):
see if we can flip him. Brady Cook's got some mobility,
he's got a big arm. It's not in the same
stratosphere as Joe Milton, but nobody is right. Yeah, you
want to try to bet on somebody that maybe can
have a couple of good preseason games, you can flip.
Brady Cook has flashed more than any of those guys
late on Day three or the udfas are gonna flash.
The other one is Max Brosmer from Minnesota, very experienced quarterback,

(39:46):
a local guy, played at UNH for a few years,
was dominant at UNH. Transferred to Minnesota last year and
held his own. He looked like a solid. He wasn't unbelievable.
But again, if you're just looking for somebody to be
that emergency third quarterback on game day that maybe you
can flip in a year or two, Brasmer is a
little interesting to me. All right, Well that's your quarterbacks.
You don't have anybody they're gonna go late in the draft.

(40:08):
You must have one. Come on, now, watched all these
wide receivers.

Speaker 3 (40:11):
I have no appeal for any of them, his quarterback
coast thinks, And I have no appeal for any of them.

Speaker 1 (40:17):
Churizma.

Speaker 3 (40:17):
Now like maybe maybe, like you know, I could get
talked into like a Curtis Roke or Brady Cook, like
as like a seventh round you do.

Speaker 1 (40:25):
That's what I'm saying, Like I'm not taking these guys, Curtis,
I think.

Speaker 3 (40:28):
To me, kinder Minds reminded me a little bit of
like Aidan O'Connell, Like he's just like gonna be like
an NFL backup.

Speaker 1 (40:34):
Well he also he played all of last year on
a twenty cl Yeah.

Speaker 3 (40:37):
So if you're looking for somebody that is totally non
threatening and is going to just fit into a back
of what I'm saying, then Curtis Rourke I think makes
the most sense.

Speaker 1 (40:46):
Curtis Rourke. Brady Rabel's gonna like Curtis Rourke, excuse me,
because he has the intangibs. Let me give you one
more quarterbacks.

Speaker 3 (40:53):
I think Brady Cook. It not that I don't want
to do the whole Juem Milton thing again, but I.

Speaker 1 (40:57):
Think Brady He's not on that level.

Speaker 3 (40:59):
Brady Cook, though, has is more of like the tools upside.

Speaker 1 (41:03):
Yeah, pick here.

Speaker 3 (41:05):
Curtis Rourke to me, is if you want a draft
Chase Daniel, Like if you want to draft a career backup,
who could back up? Who could back up Drake May
for the next five years? Like this is Curtis Rurke.
That that's Curtis Rourke and Bros. Murder me Brady Cooks
a little more. If they want to see if they
can flip another quarterback.

Speaker 1 (41:21):
Yeah, one more quick quarterback take because I've seen people
bring up Garrett Green from West Virginia and Tommy Mellett
from Montana State and say, hey, you can bring these
guys in. They can be the third quarterback and maybe
they can play receiver. Garrett Green's like five to eleven.
Tommy Mellett's a smaller guy who was an option quarterback
in Atanta State. Again, well, so here's what I'd say.
I don't think either of those guys are gonna be

(41:42):
Julian Needelman because Julian Edelman's wonted to mill. But if
you want to try it and they're both, I don't
think either one's gonna get drafted. If you want to
try it as UDFA, I'm not opposed to it, fine,
but there if you're doing that for them to play
wide receiver, in them to learn how to play wide receiver,
you can't do Malie Cunningham again, where all right, we're
gonna play a little bit of quarterback are and to
play them a little bit of No, if you want

(42:02):
to develop those guys a wide receiver, you develop them
as a wide receiver, they're not playing quarterback. They're not
gonna wear non contact jors e. They're not going to
be the emergency third quarterback on game day. If you're
adding those guys, you're adding them as receivers.

Speaker 3 (42:14):
Okay, that's enough quarterback. That's that's there's the last point
I want to get out. Let's get to running backs.
So we did day one, Day two, Day three. That's
how we kind of split this up with each position.
This is my guy and a take all in one.
Oh boy, okay, you're ready for this. Yeah, So my
Day one running back is Travon Henderson because I think

(42:34):
Travon Henderson might go in.

Speaker 1 (42:36):
The first round.

Speaker 3 (42:36):
Okay, because two reasons just for the Patriots are in general,
just in.

Speaker 1 (42:40):
General, but I also love him.

Speaker 3 (42:41):
For the Patriots, it's probably doesn't make sense for them
to draft him just where he's gonna go. You know,
they at best are gonna get him at thirty eight, right, So,
like you know, I think it's gonna be long gone
by the time you wrap back around into the third round.
But Travon Henderson, to me, for two reasons, I think
that he might get drafted in the late fur round. One,

(43:02):
he's just a fluid, explosive, big play machine, right. You know,
he's got all of the the tools in the world
to be just breaking off big play after big play
in the run and in the past game, you know, screens,
routes out of the backfield, like he can do all
of that. This is, you know, coupled with the fact
that it's a it's a copycat league. Yea, the Lions

(43:25):
just did this with Jamiir Gibbs. And I look at
Traveon Henderson, I don't think he's quite as.

Speaker 1 (43:30):
Fast as Jamiir Gibbs.

Speaker 3 (43:32):
Like I think Jamior Gibbs had a little bit more
juice than Henderson, but Henderson's close. And I think that
the best cop for him is probably more like bris
Hall than it is Jamiir Gibbs. But I think that
he's got some shades of Jamiir Gibbs in his game.
And if you're one of these teams copycat League, I
would not be surprised if somebody grabs Trevon Henderson thinking
that he's the next Jamier Gibbs. And also just quickly

(43:54):
Jamier Gibbs got overdrafted.

Speaker 1 (43:56):
Yeah, you know, relatively consensus.

Speaker 3 (43:58):
He got drafted a lot higher than people expected. So
I think that that could also be happening here with
trade first.

Speaker 1 (44:05):
Round running backs from Evan I love it. Yeah, so
I did this more with Patriots in mind. First round guy,
Amari and Hampton, you want to make your young quarterback happy.
We've talked a lot about trading up from thirty eight
for a tackle or a receiver whatever. If he falls,
you know, twenty two, twenty three, twenty four, move up
get him in addition of you know, a tackle or
whoever at the top of the first round, and that

(44:27):
that would be my first round guy. I don't think
Anderson's going to go that high, so I guess he's
my first round guy too. Genty just feels Genty's not
the kind of guy that can be my guy because
everybody knows how good Ashon Genty is.

Speaker 3 (44:38):
I wouldn't be surprised and is going to blow you away.
This is just like a like a bold prediction. Yeah right,
this isn't an actual take. It's just kind of a
bold prediction. I love amar and Hampton. I've loved him
since I saw him, you know, last year, But he
is more of like a linear runner. He's a little
bit tighter hipped he doesn't quite have the game breaking
speed that Traveon Henderson does. Like, I just wouldn't be

(44:59):
shocked if Travon Henderson goes a lot earlier than people
are expecting, because somebody wants a speedback in particular, right,
not you know, a work course like Omrion Hampton's. The
appeal of Amario and Hampton is the volume that he's
going to be able to take on. If you're looking
for somebody that's going to be more of a game
changer in terms of play speed and big playability, then

(45:20):
that's more like like Travon Henderson all right, Day two
running backs, I think you would know this for me.
I love Dylan Samson from Tennessee. I really think that
he's the best Day two running back in the range
for the Patriots, maybe with their first third round pick
if they get lucky and he makes it that far.
I just think he's a really efficient runner, but he

(45:41):
also has plenty of creativity and plenty of speed to
break off big plays. There are some concern there with
the wonky offense at Tennessee and the light boxes and
all that kind of stuff, but he grated out really
well against all different types of boxes. And I think
the one thing about Tennessee's offense is they underutilize past
catching running backs thrount of the running back a ton.
I think in the NFL, Dylan Sampson's gonna be an

(46:04):
even better pass catcher than he was in college, just
because teams will use him in that vein. He's probably
at his best in like a David Montgomery Jamir Gibbs
style platoon right where he's got like a thunder and
lightning thing going on with somebody. And that's from Andre
Stevenson for the Patriots. So if they're gonna go round
three running back and they want to find a compliment

(46:24):
to Remandre, I feel like Dylan Samson's the best ball
of both worlds there.

Speaker 1 (46:28):
So my guy on day two, I think people can
guess this is Quinn Shawn Judkins. I just think he's
I love the way he runs. He's old school man.
For the Patriots specifically, though it has to be Sampson. Yeah,
I think you put him with Dermandre Stevenson. That's that's
just such a dynamic backfield. You're getting a little bit
of everything with those two. I think he can probably
play that pass catching back role and then do a

(46:48):
little bit more on top of that. So for me,
it's it's Sampson at sixty nine. Makes all the sense
in the world. Yeah, So day three, I don't know,
there's so many options.

Speaker 3 (46:59):
There's gonna be a run of running backs at somewhere
in the late third, early fourth round. So that's the
cutoff for day two day three, So I don't know
how specific you want to get with that.

Speaker 1 (47:09):
You know, if r J.

Speaker 3 (47:09):
Harvey is there on day three though, like that's my guy.

Speaker 1 (47:12):
I think RJ.

Speaker 3 (47:13):
Harvey reminds me a ton of Dion Lewis, right, just
a low center of gravity, a great jump cut ability,
really elusive, thirty two runs of over fifteen yards last year.
Explosive guy. I think he's going to be able to
do that in the passing game as well. Smaller, like
not a volume back necessarily, but I think he's someone
that really has a lot of explosiveness and can still

(47:34):
run between the tackles. If you want to go a
little bit later because you feel like Harvey might be
third round pick and not again into the fourth round.
Brishard Smith from SMU is really appealing coverage. Yeah, converted
wide receiver goes to SMU, turns into a running back
ran a four to three nine, but still has all of
the wide receiver skill, ball skills, route running ability, can

(47:55):
right run routes from the slots. How about you know,
I see a little bit of Jared McKinnon, Well, Jet McKinnon.
Niam Hines like another one that I kind of thought
of a little bit of.

Speaker 1 (48:05):
Him as well. I mean, like obviously not when he
was here, but like prime time time Montgomery.

Speaker 3 (48:09):
Yeah, I can see that too.

Speaker 1 (48:10):
I have another converted receiver.

Speaker 3 (48:12):
I don't know if he's quite as as bouncy as
as Jet McKinnon. Like McKinnon is like a jitterbug. I
don't know if he quite has that.

Speaker 1 (48:18):
He's more straight line. Yeah, So that's why I kind
of thought of Niame Hines. So I'm just gonna because
there's so many running backs, I'm just gonna use this
opportunity to ask why more people are not talking about
Kyle Manong. Guy. I feel like it's Isaiah Pacheco all
over again. Yeah, Like, come on, he runs mean, he
runs angry, He's faster than people think he can handle

(48:38):
himself in the passing game. I really like Kyle mno
on guy, but my guy for the Patriots. You know,
I gotta go with laquin Dallen Syracuse or Wood he
marks like Luquindallen, Wood, he marks Purshard Smith. Give me
one of those three guys to play the James White role.
I will be very happy if they get one of
those three guys and he catches sixty balls in a season. Awesome,

(48:59):
Like that's what I want from that. And then they
had a bowling ball back later, great like a film
offa But just give me one of those pass catching guys.

Speaker 3 (49:05):
It's interesting because you know we're doing our big boards.
Douce and I do dueling big boards. And when I
started to do the running backs, I don't worry. I
put a lot of running backs on there. I know
they're gonna draft a running back. We all know it
because I put a lot of running backs on there.
And I just can't get mister Kraft out of my head.
Speedback right? Not not Damien Martinez.

Speaker 1 (49:25):
Right, We're not going Davian Martinez would be fun.

Speaker 3 (49:28):
We're not going power between the tackles here.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
I even I won't. Why not both? You don't think
I think there's a real chance they draft two running backs, Yeah,
bigger Bowl high.

Speaker 3 (49:40):
Like in the four to third fourth, like a Pierre
Strown Kevin Harris Reducks, but better.

Speaker 1 (49:43):
Yeah, I do you get because the past catching backs
are all later unless they want Simpson Samson. Yeah, the
pass catching backs all projected to go later. Yeah, I
mean get Damien Martinez are an allibordonate one oh six
or even maybe at seventy seven, or even Caleb Johnson
if he falls right at seven. He said, that's a fall,
but somebody's gonna Caleb.

Speaker 3 (50:02):
Johnson is a little bit more of his own back
by here, and then.

Speaker 1 (50:05):
You get that passing down back later. And now you
have if McDaniels is going to go back to splitting them.
Stevenson Rookie one is your early down, Gibson Rookie two
is you're passing down and your set like that's I
think that's if it were up to McDaniels. Not if
it were up to McDaniels, but like all other things aside,
if McDaniels could set the running back room up like that,
he'd be very happy. Now, there's other things you have

(50:27):
to do that may prevent you from doing that, but
I think that's what McDaniels would like to runningack room
to look like all.

Speaker 3 (50:31):
Right, wide receiver, Day one, Day two, Day three again
at wide receiver. I'm just gonna take this opportunity to
do once again to say Travis Hunter is a wide
receiver like that, that's.

Speaker 1 (50:41):
My I think that's clear.

Speaker 3 (50:42):
That's my Day one guy, Travis Hunter, wide receiver. I
think one of the big things that has irked me
the most this draft season is hearing that Travis Hunter
is a raw route runner, Like this is just drive
me up a wall.

Speaker 1 (50:57):
Show me a college receiver that isn't.

Speaker 3 (51:00):
But it's different buckets, right, Like there's wide there's wide
receivers that win as technicians, yeah, and there's wide receivers
that win because they're built different, Like Travis Hunter is
in the built different category.

Speaker 1 (51:11):
You know.

Speaker 3 (51:12):
I think a lot of the things that you hear
about him and read about him as a wide receiver,
you know, they right remind me a lot of like
Molik Neighbors, Odell Beckham Junior like guys like that when
they were coming out that no, if you wanted to
put teach tape up of how to run a dig like,
they might not be the ones that you would put
up on the film, like maybe you'd go up and
get like a Ladd McConkey right to run a route

(51:33):
and show a sixth grader how to run an out
right Like that might not be your guy, but if
you want guys that have unreal place to be, great
ball skills, great ability to change directions in suddenness, a
gear changes, I think is a really underrated skill for
wide receivers or guys that can tempo routes and have
different gears that they can get to, because that can

(51:54):
really make corners uncomfortable. Travis Hunter does all of those
different things as a wide receiver, So I'm just excited
that that take is becoming more popular and becoming a
lot more of a head of steam, especially after his
pro day when he only ran routes and didn't do
any cornerback drills. So one last time, in my guys,
Travis Hunter is a wide receiver at the next level.

Speaker 1 (52:16):
So Travis is like Genty, like Travis Hunter is Travis Hunter.
He's not like my guy because it would be like
Travis Hunter. So I'll go to talk about somebody You're
gonna put the TEP tape on teach tape on, I'll
go Matthew Golden. I'm to keep pounting the table for him.
I understand the production is not there compared to your
typical first round wide receiver. This is not your typical draft,
and I just think he showed up big in the

(52:37):
biggest games and I value that.

Speaker 3 (52:40):
Yeah, he's a great route runner and he might be
in in the doughnut as a deuce, and I have
been calling it like right in between picks right four
and thirty eight. But if you had to come up
with the wide receiver for Josh McDaniels, like, Matthew Golden
is kind of that kind of guy because he's a
really good route runner and he's a smart round runner,

(53:00):
is very technically sound, but he still has a ceiling
to him because of his speed and the ball skills.
So I like Matthew.

Speaker 1 (53:07):
Everybody likes very competitive, like he's I think he's wired right.

Speaker 3 (53:11):
So on day two, yeah, I think we're both going
to say names that we both really liked. That we're
both in contention for my guy. For me, at least,
I won't speak for you.

Speaker 1 (53:19):
One x one slot.

Speaker 3 (53:20):
Uh No, I just had one Day two guy. Oh
maybe maybe you could say, but no, I just feel
like you're going to say a name and that I
I almost said, anyways, Jayalen Noel is my guys. Oh okay,
so maybe I'm surprised you.

Speaker 1 (53:34):
Thought I was gonna sayway I did? All right, Well,
yeah those are the two.

Speaker 3 (53:37):
Yeah, so it was between those two. Yeah, you know,
similar but different. You know, Jaylen Nowell I think is
a pure zer, pure slot receiver. But I just I
was blown away by his tape the first time through
that I watched it. I was not expecting that kind
of athlete or that kind of separator at the third
level of the defense. I thought that this was going
to be Lad mcconkee, reducs right, like a just a

(54:00):
good crafty wide receiver. That's good route runner, that's heady,
that's smart, that's tough. He is a lot of those things.
But this is a guy that has true vertical stretch,
like he has three level speed. He's very very fast.
He's a great athlete. Tested through the roof, I think
that took a lot of people by surprise. The you know,
aris score that he put up and all that kind

(54:21):
of stuff. He was fantastic throughout the whole process, great
Senior Bowl Week, great combine, great tape at o Iowa State,
his final season. The only knock on Jalen Noel is
that he's more of an inside guy, right, Like he's
probably not going to give you the outside reps full.
I still stick to Tyler Lockett as my com I
still feel like that's the speed slot com for him.

(54:44):
But I was close with Kyle Williams. I just wish
that I had gotten to him earlier and kind of
discovered him right to the hesitation that I had with
Kyle Williams. And this is probably unfair, and this probably
is just a was a me thing, not a himn thing.
I just didn't come away from Senior Bowl Week with
him circles like I didn't notice him as much as
I wanted to notice him. You know, I noticed with

(55:06):
strepbo for the wrong reasons, no offense. I noticed the
tow Iowa State guys for.

Speaker 1 (55:10):
The right reasons.

Speaker 3 (55:11):
I just felt like I never saw Kyle Williams.

Speaker 1 (55:13):
I'll tell you why, because he was like the last
guy up on every rep. Maybe that was why you
were like mentally checking. I'm telling you, I bet that's
what it was. I bet that's what.

Speaker 3 (55:21):
I don't remember Kyle Williams being there.

Speaker 1 (55:23):
I'll beat you wouldn't know if you watched it on
TV that kept cutting away from him. Again.

Speaker 3 (55:27):
I literally don't remember him being there.

Speaker 1 (55:29):
The honest knocks on Kyle Williams. For me, as big
of a fan as I am, his an older prospect.
He's a late breakout guy. He has kind of four
years old right, twenty three years old. He was decent
in twenty twenty three. Last year was the year that
he really took off, and his numbers are insane. But
this is a guy that can get open at all
three levels, can create after the catch. He's probably a

(55:50):
little bit of a higher floor, lower ceiling player, but
I still think he's a decent ceiling. But I'll take
the high floor for this team at this point. But
with Noel like as much as I like Kyle Williams,
you give Josh McDaniels Jalen Nowell and you put him
in that Julian Edelman role with the pop he has
after the catch. I just think that this ceiling there
is tremendous. I really do. And I don't know if

(56:12):
this is a hot take at this point or not
specifically for the Patriots. I guess it could be different
for different teams. I'll take Jalen Noel over Jaydon Higgins
if they're debating between the Iowa State guys, Like Noel's
higher on my list for them than Higgins is.

Speaker 3 (56:24):
So I have all three of these guys, you know
that you mentioned Higgs and Higgins, like in one tier,
I haven't Noel Higgins Kyle Williams, but like I have
Noel over Higgins, and I'm surprised that that's not a
more popular take. I just think Noel runs her out
so a lot more urgency and a lot more dynamic movement, right,
Like he's not an outside guy. Yeah, and maybe that's

(56:46):
why people just like the size outside with Jayden Higgins.
But Jayden Higgins does not play to a four four seven.
I'm sorry, he just doesn't. He doesn't play that fast.
And so you know, I thought he was gonna be
a mid four fives guy. I thought if he ran
a four or five to two, that was gonna be
a great time for him. He ran a four four
seven on a fast track. But I just I look
at these two guys with Williams and Noel, their route

(57:07):
running ability, their separation, it's different. I think Noel is
a technician. I think Williams is a pure separation.

Speaker 1 (57:12):
Williams is that like he and he's not Travis Hunter.
But like what you were talking about before, he just
he it's not technical. He just gets open. Yeah, he
reads it, well, he moves well all of that. One
more day too, receiver before you move on. Yeah, now
that you've actually watched, because we've talked about the sky
a few times, but I don't think you had gotten
him yet, at least not in depth. Saving on Williams.
Where are you at with Savian?

Speaker 3 (57:33):
I love Save On Williams. I watched him in the
in the first run. Interesting, I'm a big fan of
Saveon Williams. It's gonna take some creativity, it's gonna take
right the right fit in terms of the offensive coordinator
to get the most out of him. Like if the
forty nine ers took uh Save On Williams and turned
him into Deebo Samuel like, he would be a problem.

(57:54):
I mean, yeah, that's gotta be the comp absolute problem.
I think Cordell Patterson's a decent as well in terms
of that, but he's got a little bit more ball skills,
I would say, then Cordero Patterson did.

Speaker 1 (58:08):
I didn't.

Speaker 3 (58:09):
We were not into the draft yet with Patterson, but
from well that was eighteen, right, Well that I mean
when he was with the Patriots.

Speaker 1 (58:16):
Yeah, but you're right, yeah, why do I remember doing
a draft show about Cordero Patterson?

Speaker 3 (58:20):
But Patterson I don't remember him having the contested catchability
and the stuff that save On Williams puts on tape.
But Cordero Patterson was probably a little bit faster in
a straight line than Savion Williams. But Williams got juice,
he's got size, he's got contested catchability. He's just not
a great route runner, and he's got a lot of

(58:41):
focus drops on tape. He's got way too many drops.
But he's a fun, fun player, you know, if you
have him in the right role, And maybe Josh McDaniels
remembers Cordial Patterson in twenty eighteen and can kind of
do the similar thing. I like Xavion Williams a lot.
It's just this specific type of player.

Speaker 1 (58:57):
We might have to do early day three, late day
three for vers.

Speaker 3 (59:00):
Okay, so, uh my late my day three guy, which
was kind of a joke and then kind of also serious.

Speaker 1 (59:08):
Is it? Uh Thornton? Dante Thornton. No, it was close.
He was on the short list. I'm coming around on
Nante Thornton.

Speaker 3 (59:17):
Okay, so let's do early day three and late so
we can get to that. Ted Johnson, I still believe.
I will not quit Tez Johnson, I will not quit.

Speaker 1 (59:28):
I will not quit.

Speaker 3 (59:29):
He's gonna. I think Dante Jordan Thornton is gonna get
drafted later, uh than than Tess. I still think Ted
is like a fourth round pick.

Speaker 1 (59:37):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (59:37):
He's quick, not fast. We've confirmed that. Yes, he's tiny,
I get that. Uh, he's quick, not fast. I still
feel like he's Tank Dell, and I still feel like
he is going to overcome all these doubts about him
and have a nice NFL career. What he's gonna happen
is exactly what's happened with Tank Dell. He's gonna get drafted,
he's gonna have it awesome, like first eight weeks of

(59:58):
his rookie season, and he's gonna tear every single ligament
in his knee and that's gonna be it.

Speaker 1 (01:00:03):
For him the end of the year. And that's a
good pick. No.

Speaker 3 (01:00:05):
I just think that he's a good football player and
if he.

Speaker 1 (01:00:08):
Can stay healthy, good college football player.

Speaker 3 (01:00:10):
If he can stay healthy, and I know it's amazing
major if, but if he can stay healthy, I think
he's gonna be a good football player.

Speaker 1 (01:00:16):
My early day three guy, I could go to Dante
Thornton kind of coming around. I think he'll go early
day three. To me, he's like one seventy five and up.

Speaker 3 (01:00:23):
Yeah, I have a good Dante Thornton Colm for you.

Speaker 1 (01:00:26):
Okay, So, but we haven't talked a lot about this guy.
I thought we were gonna talk a lot about him
throughout the draft, and we really haven't. I'm still believe
in Tory Horton. Yeah, he got hurt this year. That
hurt his stock. He probably should have transferred out of
Colorado State. I respect him for not doing it, but
he probably should have. He's a true X. He plays
with some pop, he's hyper competitive. He's worth a flyer.

(01:00:48):
To me, he's worth a flyer. You know it. It
Maybe one oh six is a little high, but maybe
with one of those one forty picks, if he's still
on the board, he'd probably need a trade and get
into like the one twenties one thirties. I like Tory.
I'm not totally out on Tory Horton. I don't think
he's gonna be a top one hundred pick like he
was projected to be, nor should he. But I'm not
totally out on Tory Horton like some people are.

Speaker 3 (01:01:07):
I think, Okay, that's fair enough. Alright, let's get the
Dante Thorton who was on my list, Yeah, a short list.
I think it was between him and Tes Johnson, but
I wanted to get the Tes Johnson, uh Shenanigans in there.
Dante Thorton is the Joe Milton of wide receivers.

Speaker 1 (01:01:22):
No, Savian Williams is the Joe No, I've made this comparison.
Williams an interesting player in the draft.

Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
Save On Williams is way more refined as a receiver
than Joe Milton.

Speaker 1 (01:01:32):
But he's the most interesting player in the draft. That's
Dante Thorpon beside Travis Hunter. Is Joe Milton of wide receivers.
Explain it.

Speaker 3 (01:01:40):
He has all of the tools, Like, if you wanted
to program a wide receiver in a lab, it would
be Dante Thornton. But he's not actually very good at football.

Speaker 1 (01:01:49):
All right, So this is that he's good at all
the individual things you need to be good at football.
He's not good at football.

Speaker 3 (01:01:55):
He's got legitimate breakaway speed, like not not like, oh,
he just runs a good forty breakaway speed. He has
a legitimate NFL you know, football speed play speed. He's
six foot four, two and five pounds. He's not Taekwon Thornton.
He's not one hundred and eighty pounds soaking wet. He's
got size.

Speaker 1 (01:02:14):
He's got speed laterally better than Thornton can. Can he
get over them? No? All right, well that's a skill.

Speaker 3 (01:02:20):
But he My point is is that there's a ton
of raw talent with this player. He played at Tennessee,
so that also fits a little bit true. He has
a Waukee offense just like Joe Milton did at Tennessee.
He runs like three routes. He runs a shallow, he
runs an in or it under or a slant, and
he runs a go like that's it. That's his entire route.

(01:02:40):
Tree are slants and go balls in the in the occasion,
you know, a hitch route as well.

Speaker 1 (01:02:45):
Yeah, right, so those are his four routes.

Speaker 3 (01:02:48):
But he takes a slant, you know, he takes a
five step slam, a glance route, skinny post and he
takes that thing eighty yards to the house when you
hit him in stride with it. And there's only so
many people on planet Earth can do that, just like
there's only so many people that can throw the ball
as far in as heard as Joe Milton. There's only
so many people that run as fast as as Dante Thornton.

Speaker 1 (01:03:07):
Look if he can, if the plan is to bring
him in and have him be like tamere Bird, Nelson
Agilor just running go routes on the side to keep
other teams honest, and you're getting him at like one
forty something in yeah, and we got it, not not
above me, get not above that. And I don't think
that he solves any long term issues at Receiver, but

(01:03:27):
for this year where they don't have a true X
and they don't have a lot of speed, you want
somebody to keep teams on again, Uh to mere Bird,
that's the comp and de mere Bird was just kind
of out there to keep teams. He's much bigger, but
role wise wise, right, Nelson aguil Or that role and
he's doing it with more size and maybe run a
couple of rounds to him, fine in.

Speaker 3 (01:03:47):
Yeah, he that that. That's the take with Thornton though,
because I think a lot of people, first of all,
like I want to hang on.

Speaker 1 (01:03:54):
If they draft a tall, fast guy named Thornton, you
know what it takes. He's not saying they're right, but
you know what's gonna happen.

Speaker 3 (01:04:01):
He's Dante Smith from now on, because I don't want
to hear about the stupid thing about his last name.
But I'm just picked a generic last name because all
you people are making such a big deal out of
the fact that his last.

Speaker 1 (01:04:12):
Name is Thornton.

Speaker 3 (01:04:13):
Again, Thornton's crazy. He's like twenty five pounds heavier than
Taekwan Thornton.

Speaker 1 (01:04:19):
Like, he's like, look, you're not wrong, they're different players,
but it's gonna be objectively funny.

Speaker 3 (01:04:24):
He to me is like late round fire DK metcalf Right,
Like he's He's obviously not DK.

Speaker 1 (01:04:31):
Meckis just twitched up, big.

Speaker 3 (01:04:33):
Fast, big explosives outside of Joe Milton comp I don't
hate Oh no, it's he's it's still saving Williams. No,
it's definitely not all right. Let's get the tight ends.
Ago Wall late late day three Okay, I thought we're
doing Dante Thorton.

Speaker 1 (01:04:47):
Oh no, that was like in the middle. No. I
have one more guy that's not getting talked about enough. Okay,
and I've talked about a lot on Patriots pet I
haven't talked a lot about him. Here, Isaac Taslot from Arkansas.

Speaker 3 (01:04:55):
Yeah, he's getting some buddy.

Speaker 1 (01:04:56):
So another guy, big six four two twelve, great straight
line speed, excellent job tracking the ball. Sounds like an
X right. Yeah, he almost exclusively plays the slot, so
you're gonna have to teach him to do some more
things underneath. But he's good down the field, he brings
good speed, he's great on special teams. This is again

(01:05:19):
a late later pick, one of those one seventy picks. Right,
if you can develop his underneath game, you're talking about
a guy who profiles profiles. Now the mental side of it.
This other guy had in leaps and bounds, so that
would have to catch up profiles like a faster Jakobe Myers.
There's gonna be some work for him to get there,

(01:05:39):
but that's kind of what the path would be for
me for Isaac to sloth. And he's gonna be really
good on special teams. I got a com Okay, Andre
Yoshivas with the Bengals. I think he's faster, but that's
not a bad comp Yeah, that's what I saw. I
think he's maybe I'm underrating how fast Yoshavas.

Speaker 3 (01:05:55):
Is, but yeah, Yoshavas is like a big slot that
can stretch the field vertically up the seam. You know,
he's not going to run by people on the outside,
but he has enough juice to do it inside.

Speaker 1 (01:06:07):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:06:07):
That was that was sort of what I saw. Uh
with Tesla, I think you're right though, he's he's picking
up some steaks, and.

Speaker 1 (01:06:13):
You know what if you get that guy and he
ends up in the one seventies and he ends up
being your third wide receiver. Again, this isn't the guy
that's going to solve all their wide receiver problems. Yeah,
I'm just looking up. So Yoshavas he has sixt three
two O five. He ran a four to fourth He
ran a four to fourth three. Okay, reduce to slot.
Literally ran a four to four three? Did you pull
that off? Off? Mock draftable? I mean, you know, did

(01:06:33):
you I do? I did? Okay, I do my homework, Yeah,
you did? I do my homework. Six three two five
versus six four two fourteen for uh tesla.

Speaker 3 (01:06:41):
Okay, yep, there's your comp All right, let's get to
the phones and then we'll come back to the rest
of the positions because we still got a little ways
to go, and these people have been waiting online for
on hold, I should say for a while. Patty is
an agu on what's up?

Speaker 1 (01:06:53):
Patty?

Speaker 5 (01:06:55):
What is gentlemen?

Speaker 1 (01:06:57):
So how we doing?

Speaker 5 (01:06:57):
I'm doing good? So I just want to I just
want to make it clear, like I'm on record thinking
that Hunter and Carter are gonna be gone by the
time we pick, and I'm all in on Will Campbell
if that's gonna be the pick at for if we
can't move down. Actually, I don't like the I don't

(01:07:20):
like the thought of moving down because I think we
might miss out and I don't mind Jalen Walker, like
if we do move down and miss Will Campbell. But
I just wanted to read you guys a couple just
a couple of things real quick. And this is from
why It Brooks sec Scout. The tape shows that technically
or fine blocker who's ready to start from day one
at tackle, not not guard tackle, and like at the

(01:07:45):
end of his breakdown, and I got this at NFL
draft blows dot com. So the very the very last
paragraph he rights after studying the film, moving Campbell inside
would be a mistake. Despite this, shorter arms, the exceptional technique,
recovery ability, demand a shot at tackle. And I know
that's just one man's opinion, and we're kind of getting

(01:08:07):
you know, some people that are sitting on the fence.
And then you got guys like Daniel Jeremiah who says, yeah,
plant tackle. The short arms don't like really pose a
threat or like a concern to me. And really before, Evan,
you said this weeks ago, a couple of weeks ago,
and you brought it up last week too, Like there's
never been a discussion about wingspan until this year. You know,

(01:08:29):
this prospect why why, you know, why is the big picture?

Speaker 4 (01:08:35):
I'm not seeing it?

Speaker 5 (01:08:36):
You know, why why is all this craft coming out now?
And you know, I think if we get him Noel,
I've you know, I've said this on PU Evan, Noel's
my guy. I want him in the second round. If
we can get those two guys and possibly Mason Taylor
on day on day two, I'll walk away from this
draft a happy man, that is, with the caveat of

(01:08:57):
Hunter and Carter gone. And last night I want to
touch on Alex Yep little Quick none, your co host
on PEB. If he ever starts his own podcast, I
think he should call it Hindsight or Patriots hind Site.

Speaker 3 (01:09:14):
That's it, is that, Brian?

Speaker 1 (01:09:17):
Yeah? Nice? Nice? Uh?

Speaker 3 (01:09:19):
I think, uh, you know, the Carter thing with wingspan
or Campbell so many names.

Speaker 1 (01:09:25):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:09:25):
The Campbell thing with wingspan is brought up because it's
such an outlier, right Like if it wasn't such a
major outlier, you know of mock draft, uh, mock draftible
had another tackle that was in the same you know,
stratosphere as him in terms of our of wingspan, then
we wouldn't be talking about it as much.

Speaker 1 (01:09:42):
But it is.

Speaker 3 (01:09:43):
And I think that the number one thing that I
keep coming back to with Will Campbell, I've been you know,
pretty consistent other than the stupid combine, I've been pretty
consistent about about about him playing at tackle and sticking
at tackle. And I think the one thing that I
would just say about it is that is he going
to be Jonathan Ogden? Is he going to be Orlando Pace?

Speaker 1 (01:10:02):
No?

Speaker 3 (01:10:02):
No, he's not going to be one of those types
of guys. But what, in my opinion, he's going to
be is a very solid NFL left tackle for the
future for a long term. And in this draft, in
this level of talent class, that's a good.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
Pick, and that's a good pick at that.

Speaker 3 (01:10:20):
Position because he is, uh, you know, a comp that
I came up with recently I liked a little bit better,
you know, like a Jake Matthews type. Jake Matthews is
not a future Hall of Famer, he's not a ever
been like a multi time All Pro or anything like that.
But he's been a quality starter for like a decade
in Atlanta and the Falcons have not thought twice about

(01:10:44):
left tackle since the day that they drafted him, And that,
to me is is all you're looking for in this
kind of draft, and I think that Will Campbell can
be that.

Speaker 1 (01:10:51):
At that position where there's there's not enough think about
it this way, there's not enough human beings on the
planet needed to fully staff the NFL for left tackle. Yeah,
they're just aren't. So if you get a guy that
can do it for eight to ten years at least,
who is of that level, maybe not above it, but
of that level, that's a win in this draft especially,

(01:11:14):
that's a win. I told Nate Solder Matt Light like,
just guys that you're not gonna talk about replacing them.
He's there, he's good. Set it and forget it. You
move on. You can build the rest of the team.
It's been seven years they've trying to been trying to
find a guy to play there. They have a guy,
and they did before, but they have a guy now too.
They really need to protect. Yeah, it's yeah, just get them,

(01:11:36):
Just just get them and we can stop work about this.

Speaker 3 (01:11:39):
So I've been looking around for a comfort for Campbell
for a while.

Speaker 1 (01:11:43):
It's Jake Matthews.

Speaker 3 (01:11:44):
It is Jake Matthews. Is what I'm settled on. And
I'll pull up the number because Jake Matthews. It wasn't
quite Will Campbell short in terms of wingspan, but his
wingspan was also under under eighty inches, right, So he
was on the shorter side in terms of wingspan, on
the shorter side in terms of armlane. He's been in
the league for eleven years, he's made one Pro Bowl.

(01:12:04):
So this is not this is not Jonathan Ogden, right, like,
this is not Joe Thomas. This is not an all
time great player at the position. But again, for eleven years,
the Atlanta Falcons have not thought about who's our left tackle. Right,
they know who their left tackle is. And if that's
what Will Campbell ends up being, then I'm perfectly fine
with that. I said earlier that you know, something that's

(01:12:25):
irking me is with Travis Hunter and the rawness and
the unpolished receiver label that he's getting. Something that is
irking me right now about the Will Campbell discourse is well,
he's not Jonathan Ogden or Joe Thomas, and you don't
you know that's what you want if you're drafting at four.

Speaker 1 (01:12:41):
Cool, if that guy was in the raft, I'll tell
you to take him right.

Speaker 3 (01:12:44):
It was great to want things right. That's not the
talent pool that we're working with. It's irrelevant that he's
not that kind of pross just as a hole across
the board like, well he's not.

Speaker 1 (01:12:53):
And you hear it with him, You hear it with
with Keat McMillan, you hear it with Mason Graham. You
hear what the lot he said. If he's not really
what you want at the fourth overall pick, Yeah, if
Malik Neighbors was in this draft, I'd be pounding the
table for them to take him it for right, I
would that guy doesn't exist. If you can trade down, great,
but if you can't. Once again, you can't just tell

(01:13:16):
Roger Goodell Pencilson for next year, right, we're gonna we're
gonna pass, We're gonna take up. But you can't. You
got it. You can only pick from the players who
are available. Right. That's and yeah, it sucks that that
they're picking high in a crucial year and a year
where the draft isn't great. That sucks. You can't. It's
not mad and where you can go load in another
draft file. This is what it is.

Speaker 3 (01:13:38):
I don't really understand that reference, but mad for it.

Speaker 1 (01:13:41):
Like, you can upload custom draft, but you can either
have it generate one for you, or you can upload
custom ones. So some people if they're doing a franchise
and like the custom draft isn't good, you can have it.
You can either upload one somebody made or just have
it create a new one. You obviously can't do that.

Speaker 3 (01:13:55):
So you can just say you can. You can create
a new one that has like all ninety.

Speaker 1 (01:13:59):
Nine if you want or won this year lady. But yeah,
but then what's the fun in it? All? Right?

Speaker 3 (01:14:04):
Kendall is in North Carolina? What's up, Kendall?

Speaker 5 (01:14:09):
Hey, how you guys doing good?

Speaker 1 (01:14:11):
Hey?

Speaker 6 (01:14:12):
Yes, just but both of y' all want to know
what's y'all good feeling right now? I'll have the first
three picks to go. And my second question is we
visit with a wide receiver today from Auburn. I got
his name or y'all familiar with it, and I'll take
it up there. I appreciate it.

Speaker 3 (01:14:27):
Thanks for the call, Kendall. My gut feeling right now
on one two three. Ward Carter Hunter same, that's my
gut feeling. I don't totally buy into, you know, the
thing we spent the first twenty minutes of the show
talking about with Abdual Carter falling in this draft. I

(01:14:48):
don't totally buy into that totally yet. If it's not
Ward Carter Hunter LB, Ward Hunter Carter, I think those
three guys are the first three picks in the draft.
I do not think the Browns are the Giants. Are
anny get duped by drafting quarterback, you know, with Shador
I think at this point everybody says people get silly
with quarterbacks, you know, they use Pennix and bo Nick's

(01:15:09):
going higher than expected last year. I almost think at
this point that the Browns and the Giants need to
look They feel like they might look sparterer by passing
on Shadore than taking Shador because if they take Shadoor,
everybody's gonna be It's gonna be Daniel Jones right like
it's on draft night. Everybody's gonna be like, what are
this is a bad pick?

Speaker 1 (01:15:27):
Like what are you doing?

Speaker 5 (01:15:28):
Right?

Speaker 3 (01:15:28):
They might end up being right in three years, but
like Brian Dable and Joe Shane aren't gonna be there
in three years to be right about it, like they're
gonna be out. So I just wonder if maybe, you know,
they end up just passing. There's a lot of buzz
right now on those two teams, specifically, you know, doing
their homework on Jackson Dart, doing their homework on Jalen Milrow,
doing their homework on Will Howard. You know, those guys

(01:15:50):
are all been in thirty visits in all those places too,
And I wonder if they're one or both of those
teams is gonna say, let's just get the guy at
the top of the second around. You know, let's try
Will Levis Right. It doesn't worked out, but it's a
you're thrown a dart and let's just try something else,
all right.

Speaker 1 (01:16:08):
Also, the guy they met with projected late day three
picks fast guy from Auburn.

Speaker 3 (01:16:13):
I mean there's a lot, there's a lot of that.
Remember Anthony Schwartz.

Speaker 1 (01:16:16):
Oh you you were big on Anthony Schwartz.

Speaker 3 (01:16:18):
Sast guy from Auburn. Yeah, all right, Brad is in Ohio.
It's up, Brad.

Speaker 7 (01:16:24):
Hey you doing guys? Hey talk.

Speaker 2 (01:16:29):
A couple of quick days. I want to run by
the players, and he looked into them.

Speaker 8 (01:16:36):
I'll just spit some out.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
First of all, the cornerback cast and found three ms
birk and then a defensive tax was getting west from
Indiana and then running back my first pick. He's I've
gotten slower running backs like John from Iowa just because

(01:16:58):
I watched him play, and I would like hand junk
and from you from the state and tell me he's gonna.

Speaker 9 (01:17:11):
Be a.

Speaker 1 (01:17:14):
Brad.

Speaker 3 (01:17:14):
I got sorry there, Brad, if you want to email us.
In the names, I heard some of them. I think
he was mentioned Denzel Burke from all.

Speaker 1 (01:17:24):
So Denzel Burke's really interesting one.

Speaker 3 (01:17:26):
Yeah, he's kind of one of those guys that kind
of reminded me of like Sean Wade's career arc right
where there was a lot of hype for him and
then he didn't have the year that the people were
expecting last year. The only thing that I you know,
I I did watch him, and the only thing that
I had a little bit of concerns about was was
top end speed, Like, I don't know if he's Yeah,
I don't know if he's quite the fastest guy on

(01:17:47):
the outside.

Speaker 1 (01:17:47):
I had a lot of penalties too.

Speaker 3 (01:17:49):
Yeah, and I think that might have been because of that,
you know, him grabbing and him getting a little bit antsy.
But uh, he he's well versed in different coverages, certainly
seen a lot of really good competition over the years.
He's kind of a solid guy. I just wouldn't necessarily
say that he's got a highest ceiling. He's probably more
of a floor.

Speaker 1 (01:18:07):
So I think it's the opposite. He's one of these
guys like Bill would have drafted him. Bill absolutely, because
one of the things that Patriots would do on Day three,
they drafted a couple guys like this. They would go
find and this Honestly, this kind of player is gonna
sort of become extinct in the draft because of the
transfer portal. They would go find the guys that were

(01:18:27):
high ranked recruits where it didn't work out in college
for one reason or another and see if they could
tap into that. Denzel Burke was a four star recruit
ninety one composite graded at twenty four to seven, and
he had a really good first couple of years and
he was supposed to be like a first round pick,
and then in the last year and a half it
kind of fell off and he had a really bad
year last year. So he's a guy to me you

(01:18:49):
take kind of banking on or looking to, all, right, well,
what went wrong last year and is it something we
can fix and can we get him back on track
to where he was supposed to be. I don't know
how very Bolt necessarily feels about those players. Like I'm
not saying he's off the Patriots board, Yeah, I don't.
It's more a thing where like if it was Bill,
I think it's he's somebody we would have talked about

(01:19:10):
a lot more. But he's a really interesting one. Yeah,
because he he was I think he was a projected
first round pick a year ago.

Speaker 3 (01:19:17):
I feel like you just you just described Sean Waite
like that, like like Sean Wade was really similar to me.

Speaker 4 (01:19:22):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:19:23):
I also had who was the defensive lineman from Auburn
who he went to Florida State and they just ruined him.
And then hear No from Maryland. He transferred around to
Byron Coward. Byron Coward was the number one recruit in
the country, and he forget the order was a Maryland
he was at Florida State, he was at Auburn, but
like it just the schools he was at did not

(01:19:44):
know how to use him. They turn him from a
stand up edge rusher into a nose tackle and Bill
drafted him and it was just like, well, let's see
what's there. Yeah, So Denzel Burk's not as extreme of
the case. I think Coward was the number one recruit
in the country, but it's it's a similar sort of thing.

Speaker 3 (01:19:57):
Do you remember when Bill dunked on me about Byron Cower? No,
I still I still remember that to this day. I
forget these are there's certain like little things that happened
to me when when I got you know, belichicked early
on in my my beat career, and that one like
it kind of sticks with you, right, like you kind
of remember these things. I misspoke and I said that

(01:20:18):
Coward was like a run player when he was a
pass player, or a pass player when he was a
run player. It just like I obviously got my my
wires crossed, and.

Speaker 1 (01:20:26):
Bill just roasted me. Bill was just like I think.

Speaker 3 (01:20:31):
I said, like, you know, you guys have talked about
him being this and it was totally off. And Bill
was like, I talked about that, Like.

Speaker 1 (01:20:37):
I remember that.

Speaker 3 (01:20:39):
I didn't say that. Yeah, oh god, was I embarrassed
to work. I thought they might have had something.

Speaker 1 (01:20:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:20:45):
I those types of things stick with you, all right
before we get back to the phone. So let let's
try to finish up my guys, because we we we
got bobbed down there a little bit with some of these.

Speaker 1 (01:20:54):
Coward is still in the league. Good for him. He's
on the Jets.

Speaker 3 (01:20:56):
Yeah, I feel like he'll kick it.

Speaker 1 (01:20:57):
Still hanging around.

Speaker 3 (01:20:59):
So we're at tight end, quarterback, running back, receiver, Day one,
Day two, Day three, tight ends. Day one tight End.
I put down Colson Lovelan. I just I love Colson
Lovelyn's tape. I think that it's a risk, sample size risk.
You know, he got injured, he doesn't have a ton
of volume to stats. But you watch the tape man

(01:21:19):
and he's the closest thing to Brock Bauers in this draft,
like in terms of explosiveness and dynamic route running ability
and just a real uh he just plays at a
different speed and other people really pops off the tape
like that. You know, Tyler Warren's more well rounded. He is,
you know, more productive in college, a little bit of
a cleaner prospect, a cleaner evaluation, which is why I

(01:21:40):
assume he'll go ahead of Loveland. The Patriots are not
in a position to risk it on a guy like Loveland.
So that's why I don't even think I'm gonna have
him in my top fifty because of that. But I
think that he's going to be a good NFL player.
I just don't know if you're you have that margin for.

Speaker 1 (01:21:55):
So I'm gonna do kind of what you did with
the running backs. Call it top forty, maybe not first round. Yeah,
I'm seeing Mason Taylor projected in the sixties. What are
we doing. I think he's gonna go much higher than
people think. I don't know that he sneaks into the
first round. Does he sneak into the top forty, I
could see it. He's clearly the third best tight end
in this draft. Copycat league. People are gonna want their

(01:22:15):
their brock Bowers and stylistically is a different player, but
just that rookie upstart tight end. And we talked about this,
I think last week. Part of what made brock Bauer
is so impressive was tight end is generally a longer
developing position. There's so few tight ends that are impact
players as rookies. Mason Taylor's young, but he's so polished
for his age. It really stands out that I think

(01:22:36):
he's a guy that can come in and contribute year one.
If you're mocking Mason Taylor to the Patriots at sixty nine,
I think you're kidding yourself. He's a top fifty pick
to me at least, and I think he might even
sneak up higher than that.

Speaker 3 (01:22:50):
Young too, right like twenty right now, he'll be twenty
one as a rookie.

Speaker 1 (01:22:53):
Early breakout ton of runway to go.

Speaker 3 (01:22:55):
Yeah, really high upside player, really fast and straight line
and you know, stretch the field vertically and horizontally. You know,
slide routes, you know, dumpops in the flat, he can
turn those into big plays. I think he's got some
route running, you know, technique stuff that he's got to
work on to be able to win a little bit
more on angular routes. You know, I don't think he's
gonna you see a ton of like, you know, real angles,

(01:23:17):
you know, slants, digs, you know that type of stuff
with it on his tape. But once he gets to
that point, maybe you know, he kind of excels at
that a little bit more. I just I look at
him right now, I see a little bit of Tucker Craft,
Like I see that you know, straight line speed and
the gimmicky speed on the scheme touches and things like that.
But I think that he has a ceiling that's much higher,

(01:23:38):
like maybe even like a Sam Laporta like level ceiling
once he gets into the league. I'm with you on
Mason Taylor. My day two guy other than Taylor, who
I think you know will be early day two. I
really like Terrence Ferguson from Oregon. I just feel like
he didn't really get a chance to show off all
the things that he can do down the field. He

(01:23:59):
was kind of there their dump off security blanket, like,
you know, kinda near the line of scrimmage kind of
guy doesn't have a high average depth of target, you know,
find some soft spots over the middle, you know that
sort of thing. But I think there's some untapped potential
there in terms of running seams and verticals, and he'll
maybe do that a little bit more at the other level,
at the next level the other guy, because I like

(01:24:20):
both of them kind of equally. Gunner Helm, Like, I
think gunner Helm is being slept on. He should not, right,
he ran that forty and like throw the forty out
like it doesn't exist, Like it is irrelevant that on
a you know, a torn ankle, he ran a bad forty,
Like it doesn't matter, you know, it doesn't. It's not
going to impact his NFL stays. He reminds me of
Hunter Henry a lot, Like I think that, yeah, I

(01:24:41):
have really similar players. I just think that he's gonna
be a quarterback's best friend. He's gonna find the soft
spots over the middle of the field. He's gonna be
quarterback friendly. He's gonna have great hands, he's gonna have
great reliability, he's gonna be able to block. You know,
I don't think he's going to be a great blocker,
but he'll be a solid, you know, adequate NFL blocker
in line. If I had to pick anybody out of

(01:25:02):
this class on day two, I think it would be
Gunner Helm.

Speaker 1 (01:25:04):
Yeah. Those are my two guys kind of in that
range and not as high on Fannin for the Patriots.
Arroyo is like fine, doesn't again not necessarily a Patriots
fit for me. Yeah, Day three though, there's some interesting ones.

Speaker 3 (01:25:16):
All right, give me your day three.

Speaker 1 (01:25:17):
Okay, So my guy for day three is Mitchell Evans. Yeah.
I think he's gonna come in be the best blocking
tight end right away, and he has the upside to
be a plus receiver, but you have a year or
two to kind of get him there. Behind certainly behind
Austin Hooper is the second tight end, and then you
hope eventually he takes over for Hunter Henry as your
starting tight end. So I've kind of been on Mitchell
Evans for a while. I think he's a good fit

(01:25:39):
for them. I also, because we're doing tight ends slash fullbacks,
I got to bring up robbi Oots here. I really
want him to bring in Robbie Oots kind of hybrid
between I've settled on my com for him. He's halfway
between Kyle used Check and Patrick McCard.

Speaker 3 (01:25:54):
You can never just give a comp like just give
a straight comp. But he's not.

Speaker 1 (01:26:01):
He's not as athletic as you used chat and he's
not as big as a card.

Speaker 3 (01:26:04):
He's like somewhere in the middle. So who's that wrong? No,
but there's a guy on the Chargers.

Speaker 1 (01:26:09):
Oh, well, Matt Locke. He also doesn't play defense.

Speaker 3 (01:26:12):
He's like three hundred pounds.

Speaker 1 (01:26:13):
He might be able to say. I think he's bigger too.

Speaker 3 (01:26:15):
There's another guy though. I look up the Chargers in
the second there's it. They have Matt Locke, but they
have another guy too, who's like the same kind of guy,
because like the Hardbuzz have to have like seventeen of
the same kind of Yeah, I feel I feel like
maybe that's your Robbie utz Khan.

Speaker 1 (01:26:30):
But I want I want Robbiots on the Patriots. Okay,
so help me with his last name? No idea who
McCallan Castles? No? Uh?

Speaker 3 (01:26:38):
Is it CJ.

Speaker 1 (01:26:39):
Dipp I think it's Drippy. I think Drippy from Alabama?

Speaker 3 (01:26:44):
Uh, just looking late Day three, you know, six seventh
round guy. But if you want a blocking tight end,
like just a guy that's gonna be able to come
in and be a third tight end and block really
well in line. Uh CJ Depri was the most impressive guy.
I saw him more than Jackson Hawes.

Speaker 1 (01:26:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:27:00):
I really like to pre Hawse. I think has a
little bit more of a receiving upside, and it's probably
gonna go a little earlier, it would be my guest.
But if you're really looking for, like this is a
we know what he's gonna be. He's just gonna come
in and block on red zone and goal line and
short yarded situations, being a third tight end in the
league for a long time because he's a great blocker.

(01:27:20):
I think Dupre's here's a comp for you.

Speaker 1 (01:27:23):
It's simple compa Lee Smith. Sure you remember Lee Smith?

Speaker 2 (01:27:26):
Yeah?

Speaker 1 (01:27:26):
Yeah, Lea Smith. He was the the only tight end
the Patriots drafted between Rob Gronky. They drafted Gronk and Hernandez.
The next year they drafted Lee Smith, and they didn't
drafted tight end for like ten years until they double
dipped in whatever year that was. Did you get a
chance to watch Roonda Gadson.

Speaker 3 (01:27:41):
No, I got to do all the rest of the
tight ends. That's that's my I'm still curious thought.

Speaker 1 (01:27:45):
That's one of my last bails to go into the bar,
is it. See? I just go in order. I go
in like I call it alphabetical order. It's not alphabetical order,
but like the order that positions have always been listed
in since at the beginning of time.

Speaker 3 (01:27:56):
I try to go in order of the draft board.

Speaker 1 (01:28:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:28:01):
So because of all the content that we do surrounding
the draft, like knowing the top one hundred is really
what I got I need.

Speaker 1 (01:28:07):
To be able to ace, yeah, in.

Speaker 3 (01:28:09):
Terms of the draft. So I literally go through our
the mock draft database. I put the consensus board up
at each position, and anybody that's in the top one hundred,
I just watch all ten of those go okay, and
then I watched the next ten, and the next ten
and the next I just do.

Speaker 1 (01:28:23):
I guess it's because like I kind of figure out
the top one hundred guys just watching college football in
the fall. So yeah, I'll go just position by position.

Speaker 3 (01:28:30):
All right, Uh, did you do tackle in into your up?

Speaker 1 (01:28:35):
All right?

Speaker 3 (01:28:35):
So I did tackleing into your offensive line? So day
one tackle is Will Campbell. Like I it's I've been
on Will Campbell since the beginning. I know that I
got a little flaky there for a second, but I've
been on Will Campbell since the beginning. I'm not going
to come off it now. If the Patriots draft Will
Campbell in two weeks, I will not be upset. I'll

(01:28:55):
be happy. I'll feel good about it. I will think
they gotta left tackle, so Will Campbell. You know, I
don't have to go too deep into it. We've been
over Will Campbell a thousand times. But if I have
to pick a my guy on day one at tackled
I can't. I gotta go with Will Campbell.

Speaker 1 (01:29:10):
Yeah, I wish I had his middle name to hammer
the point home. I don't. I was just looking. I
can't find it. William Campbell sounds like a general all right.
Day two, Day two. So I still don't think Ariante
Airstory's gonna fallah. I don't so when I say this,
not including Ariante Airstory in his group. It's Ozzy Trapilla.

(01:29:31):
We have the same because he's he's swing tackle potential.
Long term, he could be your starting right. I don't
think he's gonna start on the left side in the NFL,
But if you need him to pitch in there for
a game or two, I think he can. But I
think ideally he's your swing tackle this year, and then
next year it's him Kane Wallace battling it out for
the right or whenever Morgan Moses moves on year, two
years whatever. So obviously not I'm excited for Morgano's but

(01:29:53):
he's obviously not a young guy. Yeah, one of those
two guys becomes your starting right time big oz.

Speaker 3 (01:29:57):
I think Ozzy Trapla is going to be a starting
right tw tackle in the NFL, not before long. I
think he's better than Cayden Wallace in terms of a prospect.
You know, Cadan Wallas barely played last year. So like
right now, if I had to take a bet on
who would be a starting right tackle in the NFL,
Caiden Wallace or Ozzie Trapillo, I'm taking Azzy but all day,
and I just think he's really technically savvy, really good

(01:30:19):
hand fighter. He's got great size at the position, great
length at the position. I just feel like he's a
very good prospect all around. Like I really feel very
strongly about Trapillo being a good NFL player.

Speaker 1 (01:30:32):
He's probably right tackle.

Speaker 3 (01:30:33):
I would agree with that he maybe can play swing
tackle early on in his career as the backup, your
third tackle, swing tackle, whatever you want to call it.
Maybe you let that happen for a year. You know,
he develops underneath Morgan Moses for a year, year and
a half, or whatever the case may be. As long
as Moses can can go, you know, you let him go.
I think there's gonna be opportunities. Although Moses has been

(01:30:55):
really really durable, durable, it's not been perfect. You know,
he's missed some games, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:31:01):
Not the last couple of years. Yeah, it's never.

Speaker 3 (01:31:03):
It's never been major, like he's missing an entire season
or half a season.

Speaker 1 (01:31:06):
You might need a game or two, might need a
game or two.

Speaker 3 (01:31:08):
I think Trapillo could get some chances to play as
a rookie that way, and I would take him on
Day two of the draft them or probably in the
double dip. You know, it would be ideal. My question
is is like how long can you wait on Trapillo?
Like I think thirty eight is a little bit high,
but I think sixty nine is really you're starting to
talk about you gotta take them.

Speaker 1 (01:31:26):
I think it's sixty ninety be a good pick. I've
said this like, I strongly believe that any players they
take in the top one hundred, they need those guys
to play this year, and they need those guys to
contribute this year. The one exception I have to that
rule for me, it's not there role. It's my rule.
I guess rule isn't the right word. The one exception
I have to that take for me is if they
draft a right tackle to be in the pipeline to

(01:31:49):
replace Morgan Moses. And I came up with that take
basically around Ozy Tripillo. YEA, maybe they end up doing
it with somebody else, maybe it's Anthony Belton, maybe it's
Cameron Williams. But like that's why I have that that
it's like a carve out for Ozzie Trapillo. That is
the one guy I think I'd be comfortable with him
taking the top one hundred who's not playing a significant
role in twenty twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:32:10):
Agreed day three.

Speaker 1 (01:32:12):
So I think everybody expects me to say haul in
Pierce because that's my kind of guy. He's huge, he's massive,
he's not necessarily great at football, but he hasn't he
can't teach size. I'm actually gonna go away from that.
I wouldn't hate Hall and Pierce, don't get me wrong.
I just think Carson Vincent's getting slept on. Yeah. Now,
he probably isn't a right tackle, and for a guy
going that low, he's projected later day three, you kind

(01:32:34):
of want some positional versatility, So he's an outlier there.
I think he might be able to play some guard,
which helps. But I think he's got he has the
size and the sense that he's tall and long. I
think he's only like three hundred and ten pounds, but
he is. He can add to his frame like he
can get up to three twenty I think relatively easily,
and it won't impact him that much. Five year starter

(01:32:54):
at Alabama A and M played well at the Senior Bowl,
held his own against that higher level of competition, and
he's just I think he's got the mentality down. It
looks like a smart football player. Definitely plays with a
lot of nastiness. He's older, he's coming from a smaller school.
He doesn't have that positional versatility. I think that's why
he's gonna go where he's going to go. But in
a double dip because they might want a backup left

(01:33:16):
tackle too if they're not sold on uh Vederian Lowe's
the backup definitely. I think can be a backup left
tackle in the NFL, and then you see just kind
of what happens with him down the road. But a
good backup left tackle is not nothing. And if you
can get that guy, I certainly think you can get
him at the one seventies. You might even be able
to get him with that two twenty pick, depending on
how it goes. You get a backup left tackle there, great, awesome,

(01:33:38):
solid pick. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:33:40):
I really liked him at the Seapral.

Speaker 1 (01:33:41):
Everybody did.

Speaker 3 (01:33:42):
I mean he had that one spotlight drill in the
middle of the field. Who did he go up against?
It was a top one hundred rusher? Was Umin me
Ellen or was it one of the text I think
it's one of text Amain Stewart.

Speaker 1 (01:33:53):
It was an SEC guy.

Speaker 3 (01:33:54):
Yeah if shut him down, Yeah, yeah, you won the REP.
So I do like him a little bit. I really
like Jealen Rivers from Miami to another Senior Bowl guy
that I thought stood ute. He could play, probably play
inside as well, you know, played a little bit of
both at Miami. It's weird the like com almost went
like drive to drive with it at times where he
played left tackle and left guard, and he would just

(01:34:14):
kind of flip flop in and out, which was interesting.
Uh So I think that long term, you know, he
could play guard and be your starting left guard. I
think you could also have him play you know, swing tackle,
backup left tackle, that sort of thing as well. I
just like his game. You know, big, big dude, good size,
really good length. He has like thirty five inch arms
and then a short tackle class at the Combine. He

(01:34:37):
was like the one guy that measured in with long arm.

Speaker 1 (01:34:39):
He mentioned with thirty five of the combine. They're probably
closer like thirty eight.

Speaker 3 (01:34:42):
Yeah, he's got freaking tree trunks. And I just think
he's a big dude, moves people, great length, a little
bit of positional versatility. I just think those are the
types of guys that the league needs. You know, every
team needs that kind of guy that has the functional
strength the as your bulls in versatility. Like, yeah, he
might not be you know, he's not going to go

(01:35:04):
to you know, any all pro teams or Pro Bowls,
but those types of linemen can be really valuable.

Speaker 1 (01:35:09):
What are your thoughts on Holland Pierce. I just need
that real quick.

Speaker 3 (01:35:13):
He's a raw ball clay. He's a big raw ball clay.
I feel the same way, almost similar with him as
I do with Anthony Belton. Like I think Anthony Belton
is kind of three. Yeah, Anthony Belton, I feel like
is getting a really hyped up in the in like
the media boards and stuff like that for a guy
that's got a long way to go and past.

Speaker 1 (01:35:33):
My ceiling cam for him is Trent Brown.

Speaker 3 (01:35:35):
That's he's got a lot of He's he's raw. He's raw.
Anthony Belton. I'm surprised by how much Anthony you know,
Belton buzz there is.

Speaker 1 (01:35:42):
Yeah, that's usually the guy that I like that nobody
else likes. And I'm wondering why he's not ranked higher.
Now I'm like almost suspicious that everybody likes him, Like, yeah,
this is supposed to be my guy.

Speaker 3 (01:35:50):
All right, So we have a you have any guards
or slash centers?

Speaker 1 (01:35:53):
Yeah, I have some interior guys, all right.

Speaker 3 (01:35:55):
Day one grays Abel. I think Gray's Abel is going
to be Joe Toney to point. Oh, I think he's
going to be a really good football player. He's gonna
play guard. I think he's gonna play left guard.

Speaker 1 (01:36:07):
I think Bruger Adam is a center and the Beast today.

Speaker 3 (01:36:09):
Okay, so there's some center flex there. Yeah, and he
did some center stuff at the comm at the Senior Bowl.
Excuse me, but I think that guard's a little bit
more valuable. I think he can play left guard at
a really high level. He's going to pass protect at
a really high level at that spot, be extremely athletic
at that spot as well. But either interior spot, left
guard or center, I could see grays Abel excelling at

(01:36:32):
and I think there's a lot of value in that.
Do you have any day one, guys.

Speaker 1 (01:36:36):
Yeah, I'm gonna again approaching this from a Patriots point
of view. Yeah, and we I think we talked a
little bit about this last week. You know, we've talked
about tackle, trade up, receiver, receiver, trade up tackle, what
about just hammering the offensive line? And some of this
take too is I think grays Abel might go too
high for them to do this. Yeah, and I know
he's a right guard. I would love to see them

(01:36:56):
Will Campbell trade up Tyler Booker. Yeah, that whole offensive
line Campbell Booker, I guess, question Mark, but we you
know you think you're at Bradberry, mike O and Lenu
Morgan moses that that is a mean offensive line. You
are gonna hate your life as a defensive linemen playing

(01:37:17):
against those guys for sixty minutes. And yeah, it leads
them short change in some other spots. But I think
Booker team captain at Alabama, tone setter. You know, played
a couple he'll be a guard in the NFL, but
he played some left guard for them, even played a
little tackle for them. But just again, a guy that
sets the tone for the Alabama offensive line and didn't
understand that not just his past year. You bring that

(01:37:37):
guy in, you put him next to Will Campbell. Holy Molly,
you're gonna have a lot of fun on the left
side of the offensive line. I don't know that it's
like my ultimate favorite thing that they would do, but
I would like sneaky love that. Oh I'd love it too.

Speaker 3 (01:37:48):
I've come around, not I never needed to.

Speaker 1 (01:37:52):
If they did it was able, i'd be cool with
it too. But I really like Tyler Booker.

Speaker 3 (01:37:55):
I didn't need to be sold on Tyler Booker, but
I just didn't think he was gonna be there, but
after the Combine and the fact the intestary.

Speaker 1 (01:38:00):
With DoD Combine. But I don't care like with.

Speaker 3 (01:38:03):
He's an interior offensive line right. But at the same time,
you know, you know how teams are, and now Gray
Zabel might go ahead of him because he had a
better pre draft process than Tyler Booker. Teams might overthink
Tyler book Yeah, and I don't think it's totally out
of the question that a quote unquote unathletic guard falls
to thirty.

Speaker 1 (01:38:24):
I even think of thirty eight. See, so I look
at it. The Seahawks are at what eighteen, right, Yeah,
and then the Texans are at twenty five. Those are
two clear guard teams. Yeah, so I could see them
both going in the first round. But yeah, if Tyler
Booker is there a thirty eight, you don't have to
trade up for him, all the better.

Speaker 3 (01:38:39):
So Seattle not Seattle tends to be uh in love
with with the with the numbers, with the measurables. Casario
and Houston makes a lot of sense, like Booker.

Speaker 1 (01:38:49):
Yeah, it'sable at eighteen, I think is what I have
in my last Monksable at eighteen Booker in twenty five.

Speaker 3 (01:38:53):
They won't overthink Booker, like they won't overthink the combine
and all that kind of stuff. You put Tyler Booker
and Josh McDaniel's gap scheme like a downhill run Scham, Yeah,
that's where happens.

Speaker 1 (01:39:04):
One.

Speaker 3 (01:39:05):
I think that's the other thing with Booker. You know,
there's so many uh you know, Kyle Shanahan inspired on
outside zone teams. He's not an outside zone's offensive. He's
a he's a gap downhill. Get him on a double team,
have him pull, you know, like that's what he does.

Speaker 1 (01:39:19):
Imagine the Tyler Brook Booker White one on ones in camp.

Speaker 3 (01:39:23):
I just I think it's great too. Just the fit
because Bradberry is a smaller center. Yeah, he's undersized, and
he's you know, his play strength is a big concern.

Speaker 1 (01:39:33):
Or even if you're gonna try Cold Strange, there also applies.

Speaker 3 (01:39:36):
Right, So if you put Booker in on when WU
on either side of Garrett Bradberry or Cold Strange, like
you give them some some girth next to them, that
might help the center, you know, be able to handle
power a little bit better and be able to hold
the middle of the pocket a little bit better. If
he's got to just boulders on either side of him,

(01:39:57):
that would make the most sense. It's what kind of
why I've I've been a little bit back in on
city so lately lately, just because I feel like he's
a big guard too, you know, kind of can do
the same sort of thing. But with Tyler Booker, yeah,
you know, if he's there, if he falls for all
these combine, you know, athletic profile concerns, I could definitely

(01:40:18):
see that. Day two I had Wyatt Milam. I think
Wyatt Milems is getting slept on because he's probably gonna
move inside at the next level. But I think he's
gonna be a very very good guard in the NFL.
I don't see a real path for him.

Speaker 1 (01:40:32):
You don't think city center. I think he's be center.

Speaker 3 (01:40:34):
He's a little tall to be a center, but it's possible.

Speaker 1 (01:40:37):
Team seem to be less bothered by that now and
they used to.

Speaker 3 (01:40:39):
I just love moving these guys to guard, like I
feel like guard is a There's still a ton of
value in pass blocking at guard because you have all
these interior defensive linemen that rushed the pass or at
a high level, like if you go up against you know,
Quentin Williams twice a year and Ed Oliver twice a year.
And you know, I'll go on down the line of
all the guys in the AFC that you're gonna maybe

(01:41:00):
put potentially see if you're the Patriots, like you have
to have guys on the interior that can pass block.

Speaker 1 (01:41:06):
You just do.

Speaker 3 (01:41:07):
And I think whyatt Milam is gonna be a really
good one. Like he's a power oriented player. His game
definitely fits a lot better in a phone booth. But
he's gonna play really well at guard in the league.
And he's gonna have a little bit of tackle feet
and tackle, you know, just experience blocking people that I
think is going to help him a lot in pass protection.
I don't have any doubts that guys like Zabel and

(01:41:29):
Mylam are going to follow in the footsteps of you know,
Tooney and Sheriff and Martin and all those guys that
transitioned inside from being college left tackles. I think all
those guys are gonna check those boxes if you want
to throw, you know, Donovan Jackson.

Speaker 1 (01:41:42):
So that was gonna be my guy again. If they're
gonna do the tackle guard boom boom, at the top.
Donovan Jackson, I like, yeah, my day two centers obviously,
Jared Wilson, I've been very high on him. Limited sample size,
but smart player, athletic player, little similar to David Andrews
now David Andrews obviously didn't get drafted, but maybe the
league learned something the last times. A little bit bigger,
but it's a little bit bigger, but he's still undersized

(01:42:03):
size there quotes the center and the other guy gotta
mention her. On Day two Marcus Mabou, who got hosed
by the combine, going from thirty three and an eighth
in charms all the way down to thirty two. He
is a tackle, but he'll probably move. He's played both perdue.
He can probably right tackle guard, flex right tackle guard. Yeah, yeah,
he uh. He wouldn't be a bad pick for the Patriots.

Speaker 3 (01:42:21):
He's got some of the most bizarre hand fighting I've
ever seen. Like he's like literally like the karate kid,
but it works like he gets it done. But like
he is, he's like wax on wax off. Like you know,
most times you want those stiff hands, like inside hands.
This guy's like doing all sorts of like mister Miagi
stuff and it somehow gets the job done.

Speaker 1 (01:42:41):
It's it's fun to watch, like.

Speaker 3 (01:42:42):
It's it's a little different, like when you're going through
all these tackles. Then you get to him and you're like, oh,
this is cool.

Speaker 1 (01:42:47):
This is a little fun. Thirty three and Charms. Don't
forget it all right?

Speaker 3 (01:42:50):
Uh day three, Big deal and fairchild guy from Georgia.
A pure left guard right He played left guard at
Georgia and he's gonna play left guard in the NFL.
You were high upside high school wrestler, like all world
high school wrestler, and you can see that. You know,
he knows how to grapple, he knows how to leverage,
he knows how to win with body positioning, can get
underneath guys. Very versatile blocker, just in terms of all

(01:43:13):
the different things you can ask him to do. He
can zone block, he can gap block, he can double team,
he can pull, he can get up to the second level.
He's really versatile in that way. Even though he's not
positional flex necessarily, he's versatile within the scheme, which I
think is really important. High level mover, high level pass protector.
He's gonna he he just screams, Josh McDaniel's guard to me, like,

(01:43:37):
I just feel like that when they look at left
guard specifically, like Touney's obviously like the pinnacle of what
they want in the left guard. But I think that
fair Child's kind of in that same mold and I
like him a lot. And then obviously, you know you
got to mention Drew Kendall. You know you gotta talk.

Speaker 1 (01:43:52):
Well, there's a lot of good Day three centers Drew Kendall.
Jake Majors is a very Josh McDaniels sort of center,
very cerebral player. Eth McLoughlin would be really interesting coming
off that injury. The guy all mention those center guard
is Clay Webb from Jacksonville State. So he was a
five star recruit. I believe he's like a high rank recruit.

(01:44:13):
Went to Georgia for a couple of years, wasn't playing
it as a center. He was a recruited highly as
a center, transferred to Jacksonville State, moved to guard, played
it well, went to the Senior Bowl, played it well.
A lot of people think he's going to move back
to center in the NFL. I'm certainly not ruling that out.
I just wouldn't sleep on him as a guard either.
Little undersize, but kind of fits more for that McDaniels thing.
And he's projected to go late, so that could be

(01:44:35):
kind of like we talked about Denzil Burke, another one
of these guys that all right now, I think he
played at a higher level than Burke. He's just at
a less valuable position. That's why he's lower. But it's like,
all right, he was highly tauted out of high school.
Why didn't work out in college? And is it something
we can work around and get him back to being
the player he was projected to be? Fair enough? All right?

Speaker 3 (01:44:54):
So that's my guys. There's a lot of them in there,
but I think you know, those are the guys, uh,
you know, on offense, and next week we'll do defense.
Let's wrap up the show, get back to the phones,
and then we have a ton of emails. I'll try
to go through those as fast as we can as well.
But Aldrid, our good friend is in North Carolina. What's up, Eldred?

Speaker 4 (01:45:15):
Hey, how y'all doing?

Speaker 1 (01:45:16):
Hey?

Speaker 7 (01:45:17):
Hey, I'm about the receivers. I'm glad y'all talked about
my guy do a Doordan, yep, and ever and you're right,
you got those three routes, but he beats man Fress
only we can do the stay field over the top.
But my question is we ain't never developed receive it
no matter what coaching cre we have. Do you think

(01:45:37):
they can develop one this year?

Speaker 1 (01:45:41):
I mean, I believe it's kind of one of those
things where like I got to see it, right, Yeah,
I gotta see it. You know, Todd Downing's background is
and quarterbacks, and he kind of talked about this last
week that like he'll have them ready and knowing the
playbook and all of that, But when it comes to
the footwork and the technique, that's where where we're gonna
see what they can do with some of these guys.
That's right. I think you hope maybe Stephan Diggs helps

(01:46:02):
out a little bit. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 7 (01:46:04):
And the other thing is they're hosting that that that
cornerback I talked about last time. He supposed to be coming
to New England like I think today or tomorrow. I
got his name, but he's six to two run at
four to three forty and I think he objected to
go in the third or the fourth round. And I
think he's meeting with us today, Ali from I got

(01:46:27):
I think it's I think his last name is Thornton too.

Speaker 4 (01:46:29):
But he's but that girl Ali from Chatsport.

Speaker 7 (01:46:33):
She was mentioned missioned yesterday that people have been meeting
today with the Patriot.

Speaker 4 (01:46:38):
He got a thirty visits.

Speaker 7 (01:46:39):
But he's go later in the round though. But there
you go, Corey Thorton, Okay.

Speaker 4 (01:46:45):
You go.

Speaker 7 (01:46:46):
I couldn't think of this guy. I couldn't think of
his name.

Speaker 4 (01:46:48):
But uh uh, his background coach, he's the one that
did Chambers Ward and with Chikov and he got good.

Speaker 7 (01:46:57):
Corners and a good corner coach. But him and I
hope we don't sleep on but he's out.

Speaker 4 (01:47:04):
And how did you? Thank you?

Speaker 3 (01:47:07):
Thanks Elder, thanks for the call as always. And yeah, Eldred,
uh you know Alex was was first to Kyle Williams.
Elder was first to Dante Thorton. He's been on Dante
Thornton for a while, so props Eldred. You nailed that one.
Well we'll see if he's a good football player in
the NFL. But you nailed the draft stock going up?

Speaker 1 (01:47:24):
Who's did you do? You know? Anythink? I don't know,
it's not about Corey Thorton.

Speaker 3 (01:47:27):
Yeah, all right, Uh, Alex is in DC. What's up Alex?

Speaker 8 (01:47:32):
Hey guys, thanks for taking the call.

Speaker 3 (01:47:35):
No problem.

Speaker 1 (01:47:37):
Uh.

Speaker 8 (01:47:37):
So, yesterday Batards set on his podcast citing a scouting
report by Bob McGinn of The Athletic that of Duel
Carter has some character concerns that he's a bit of
an a whole high maintenance, isn't a hard worker. Have
you heard anything about this? Do you have any concerns
around Carter? And do you give any weight to what
mcginnon says since he's the same guy that said barmore

(01:47:57):
head character concern.

Speaker 1 (01:47:59):
Thanks for the call, Alex.

Speaker 3 (01:48:00):
Yeah, we actually talked about this exact thing at the
top of the show, So I don't want to go
too long on it, but you can go back and
listen to some of that. You know, we we talked
to in depth about it. You know, I don't have
much more.

Speaker 1 (01:48:11):
To add to that, so now I just say go
back to the top of the show.

Speaker 3 (01:48:14):
Yeah, absolutely, all right, let's get into some of these emails.
We have a ton of them. I am a little
disappointed in the listeners though, and I'll get to that.
And here in a second, stopping me to the listener. No, no,
I'm not being mean to them. I'm just a little
disappointed that there's no emails about our are I'll get
to it in a second, but just a couple of questions.
It's sort of about the tackles. And I think one
of the things that's going around right now is just

(01:48:36):
like how confident are we that you know, a Connerly
or an nursery or even a Simmons is going to
be there for them at thirty eight? And you know,
is there a risk there? And I think the answer
is there's always a risk that just like last year,
they're not able to orchestrate a trade out, they missed
the run, and they missed the run.

Speaker 1 (01:48:56):
Yeah, it's and I think we're going to see a
similar run this year because there's still that shortage of
tackles and that shortage alignment. No I'm not caught. Maybe
one of them gets there. You're certainly not gonna have
your choice. Maybe one of them gets there. And honestly,
if Simmons is the one that falls, and they'll know
what internally like externally, I worry that the medicals aren't good. Yeah,
if Simmons is the only one that falls. I look
at that and say, his knees is not in great shape. Yeah,

(01:49:18):
So I'm not confident that they're gonna get one of
those guys at thirty eight. If it's not Campbell or
Membu or Banks at the top of the draft. They
have to be moving up. They have to be moving up. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:49:29):
And look, I like we say all the time with trades,
and I've been kind of pounding the table about how
hard it might be to trade back in this draft
before trade it takes two to trade tango with the trade,
but I think it's worse a team to trade out
with you, Right, I should.

Speaker 1 (01:49:44):
Be able to trade up because every everybody wants to
trade down. This is what we're talking about. A Ford.
Nobody wants to trade up. Everybody wants to trade down.
If you're trying to trade up, you should be in
good shape. Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:49:53):
This is a good question from Ashton in Canada. He
writes in about Jaden Higgins and Ted McMillan. This is
something that we've talked to a little bit that like
Ted McMillan is kind of Day one and Jayden Higgins
is sort of the early Day two X in this draft.
And he was just asking, you know, if we felt
like there's a chance that Jaden Higgins is a better
pro than Ted McMillan, and like, kind of whatever, the

(01:50:14):
you know, who is better at what in certain areas.
I think the biggest thing to me that maybe separates
McMillan a little bit is the yards after the catch.

Speaker 1 (01:50:23):
Yeah, Like I don't necessarily.

Speaker 3 (01:50:24):
See that speed or that ability and that fluidity after
the catch that McMillan has out of Higgins, and I
think that that might elevate his ceiling. But in terms
of what they do in their routes, in the way
that they play, in the way that they win, the
fact that both of them are probably going to have
to play a little bit in the slot to get
some vertical stretch out of them, I think they play

(01:50:47):
very similarly. I think they're kind of comparable in a
lot of ways. I just would give Tet the edge
just because of the yards after the catch ability.

Speaker 1 (01:50:54):
I think his ball skills are also a little bit better.
I mean, they're both good in that regard, but that's
why Yet's projector goes high as he has got unbelievable balls.

Speaker 3 (01:51:00):
Yeah that's fair, all right, you want to play a
quick would you rather game?

Speaker 1 (01:51:04):
Oh boy, here we go. Yeah one.

Speaker 3 (01:51:06):
Have the Patriots trade back the fourth page to trade
back up in the or trade back up in the
first round. So would you rather trade back from four
or trade up from thirty eight?

Speaker 1 (01:51:16):
Up from thirty eight?

Speaker 3 (01:51:17):
Yeah, I'm with you. I'm up from thirty eight as well.
Have Giodd Campbell or Walter Nolan fall to thirty eight?

Speaker 1 (01:51:23):
Oh? John Campbell, Yeah that's not even close.

Speaker 3 (01:51:26):
Yeah, Walter noan.

Speaker 1 (01:51:27):
I like Walter Nolan, but like John Campbell in Rabel's defense,
would be unbelievable.

Speaker 3 (01:51:32):
They have, they have the three technique, they have Milton Williams.

Speaker 1 (01:51:34):
Yeah, yeah, that's part. I don't think they need another.
I feel like that was disrespectful to Walter Nolan the
way I reacted, But like, I like Walter Nolan, but
like John Campbell is so freaking good.

Speaker 3 (01:51:43):
I didn't spend a ton of time on Walter Nolan
just because of where he's gonna go and and the
fact that the Patriots Simon.

Speaker 1 (01:51:48):
Milton will see him plenty when he's in Buffalo.

Speaker 3 (01:51:50):
I thought he was a little streaky, like it's a
little hot and cold on the tape, for me personally.
You know, there's moments where you're like, wow, like there
it is, and but then there's like stretches of games
where he kind of just was there like and just
kind of running into the line of scrimmage.

Speaker 1 (01:52:05):
You want my defensive tackle take, Yeah, Kenneth Grant's the
second best defensive tackle in the draft. And I think
Kenneth Grant projected first round pick. I still think people
are sleeping on him.

Speaker 3 (01:52:13):
Good athlete, yeah, Jalen Walker Mason Graham at four.

Speaker 1 (01:52:18):
I'm going jail Walker Walker.

Speaker 3 (01:52:20):
Yeah, Jalen Walker, more versatile, better.

Speaker 1 (01:52:21):
Player, fits a need better Yeah, Jalen Walker.

Speaker 3 (01:52:24):
Have Gray's Abel or Marian Hampton fall to thirty eight?

Speaker 1 (01:52:28):
Ooh, that's a good one. Hmmm.

Speaker 3 (01:52:31):
I'm going Hampton.

Speaker 1 (01:52:32):
Yeah, I'm siding with the quarterback on this one. You
can get a guard later on. I'm going Hampton.

Speaker 3 (01:52:36):
It's a little bit more value even at running back.

Speaker 1 (01:52:38):
Yeah, I'm going Hampton. That's a close one though, Yeah,
I could be. I could be. There's an argument for Zabel.
That's a good question.

Speaker 3 (01:52:45):
Okay, so this is this is more open ended, but
what player with the first round grade are you predicting
the fall what player with.

Speaker 1 (01:52:53):
The first round gride? I gotta like pull up the
list real quick. Hang on, I don't know if I
thought of something similar. Say what you're gonna say that
I thought of something similar.

Speaker 3 (01:53:03):
I don't know if everybody's gonna call I technically feel
that he's a first round grade kind of guy. But
Luther Burden falling out of the first round, Luther Bird.

Speaker 1 (01:53:11):
Would be one very likely. Mike Green would be another. Yeah,
So what I was thinking is kind of I'll say
I had Mike Green at like twenty eight. I think
my last mock, so I'll say Mason Graham's are going
to go in the first but every mock right now
has him like six is his floor. I think you
get down like nine or ten. Yeah, that wouldn't surprise me.
Here's what I was gonna say. I was thinking about

(01:53:33):
this week. I was gonna write something about it later on,
but I'll test it here. What is this year's Michael
Pennock's pick? And what I mean by that is what
is the pick that nobody is talking about that happens
in the first round. That's a good one. I'd have
to think about that.

Speaker 3 (01:53:51):
I mean, I had to trade on Henderson thing earlier,
Like I feel like that could happen. Yeah, but I
don't know if that's like quite on Michael Pennock's level.

Speaker 1 (01:53:58):
It's more r nabs, right, but just completely out of nowhere.

Speaker 3 (01:54:05):
I think Milroe in the first round would be kind
of a stunner. Now he's invited to the draft, so
obviously there's there's some ruzz that he might go in
the first round, but that, to me, I think would
be a little bit of a stunner, like where he
was at the end of the college football season, Like
he's made that much ground up, you know, in the
pre draft process, and now all of a sudden he
goes in the first round.

Speaker 1 (01:54:25):
I'd be pretty stunned about that. Yeah, So I was
gonna say, like Millroe going like top twenty, Yeah, and
maybe it's a trade up. But yeah, the other oh,
the other one I had it. I put this in
my last mock. I don't think I'm alone in this.
I've seen a couple other people do it, but like
Matthew Golden of the Steelers. Yeah, so he plays the

(01:54:45):
inside with Pickens and Metcalf on the outside, and then
Pickens on expiring contract, like it and this is this
was this takes under the assumption that they finally signed Rogers,
but like it's a lot of wide receiver in one offseason.

Speaker 3 (01:54:58):
But all right, speaking of receivers, then I have my
little thing I want to get you here at the end.

Speaker 1 (01:55:03):
Uh.

Speaker 3 (01:55:05):
Will Wrights in and mentions that there just haven't been
a ton of buzz about Patriots thirty visits with wide
receivers specifically, I think Jalen Noel.

Speaker 1 (01:55:14):
Or Noel Yeah, I got that.

Speaker 3 (01:55:17):
I think he's maybe been reported now that he's.

Speaker 1 (01:55:20):
Come in and posted himself in the bill.

Speaker 3 (01:55:22):
Right, all right, but we haven't. We haven't seen you know,
Golden Murden, McMillan and Will just ask like, do they
always draft based off the thirty visits?

Speaker 1 (01:55:31):
No, definitely not pretty rare. Ac Yeah, I think all
visits thirty combined Senior Bowl? Was it last year they
like for their picks? Yeah, before that, I think it
was two.

Speaker 3 (01:55:40):
It's very it's a it's a low percentage. There's a
lot of intel information gathering that goes on at these
types of things that isn't anything beyond just doing your
due diligence on players. I'd also mentioned with the thirty visits. Uh,
you're just getting what's leaked, so you don't know. We
don't know all thirty guys.

Speaker 1 (01:56:00):
Ta Thornton was one we didn't known till after the
draft we met with them.

Speaker 3 (01:56:03):
I remember also, you know, Christian Gonzales, like they sent
at the time Drawd Mayo out to like personally spend
like a weekend with Christian Gonzales in Oregon, uh, before
the draft, and nobody knew about it, you know, and
nobody knew about it till afterwards. So I would just
caution that, you know, don't overreact to the thirty visits. Yeah,
all right, last thing here, you and I got got

(01:56:26):
put on blast a little bit on social Like we
got put on blast a little bit. I think it's
I think, yeah, I think we should do it. We
got put on blast a little bit because we Uh,
it was a class A felony that you and I
said that we would not take a trade down with
the Saints going from four for nine and forty and
we both said we wouldn't do it. It doesn't feel like

(01:56:46):
enough to me. It still doesn't feel like enough to me.
But my main takeaway with this is one, you know,
like it kind of caused a little bit of a
start for no reason over like a take content on
a podcast like Let's calm down. Second of all, if
the Saints are gonna trade up with the Patriots just
becoming a popular take.

Speaker 1 (01:57:07):
Which is banks on the idea that they want Sanders.

Speaker 3 (01:57:10):
Yeah, which banked on the idea that they want Sanders,
then that means that the fourth overall pick is going
to be Shador Sanders. So you are now selling the
fourth overall pick for a quarterback, which in my opinion
changes the value of the trade.

Speaker 1 (01:57:25):
Yes, right, not your opinion, that's generally how it's done. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (01:57:28):
So if it's Shador Sanders going at four, and that's
who's gonna go at four, that means if the Raiders
want you door Sanders, if the Saints want you door Sanders, Steelers,
if the Steelers want you door Sanders, if any of
these teams wants you to door Sanders, then they need
to get up to pick four to get Shador Sanders,
which just inherently will increase the mark.

Speaker 1 (01:57:47):
As a quarterback tacks.

Speaker 3 (01:57:48):
It's a quarterback tax. And so when I heard that
trade proposal, it didn't feel like enough, and I still
don't feel like it feels like enough. I want to
trade down if you can. If Harder and Hunter aren't there,
I would trade down, But I'm not trading down just
to trade down.

Speaker 1 (01:58:04):
It's gotta be worth while.

Speaker 3 (01:58:06):
It's gotta be worthwhile, And just the last thing I'll
say on it, I would be pretty disappointed if the
Patriots came out of this draft without one of Carter, Hunter,
Campbell or Membu.

Speaker 1 (01:58:20):
Like I'll put Jalen Walker in there.

Speaker 3 (01:58:22):
I feel like all four of those guys. To me,
I want one of those four guys in the first round. Now,
if you can still get that guy by trading down,
then I get that there's a ton of value.

Speaker 1 (01:58:31):
I'm not super confident that all four of those guys
make it tonight, and I'll put Walker in there. But
I think for the grading it as a whole, they're
all similar. But for the Patriots, specifically Ted McMillan, Mason Graham, Taler,
Warre and those guys are a step back. So and
I think that's just what it comes down to. Like,
and some people put it in the replies to that video,
like I'm just a little less confident in some of
those guys falling, and it doesn't mean I wouldn't do.

(01:58:53):
He just have to make it worth the while. Like
borish friend of the show put in, like he added
another trade, and I think Patriots are giving up like
a fifth or six or something, but another top one hundred. Okay,
if I'm getting three top one hundred picks back, I'm
more interested what I would really like to see if
they were going to make that trade. So we use
the same basis four for nine and forty. If I'm

(01:59:14):
the Patriots, the first thing I'm asking for on top
of that is a future top one hundred pick early second.
You're not going to get a first, You're just not
Can you get a future second. I might even take
a future third because the idea is, all right, I'm
moving down this year, give me the ammunition to move
back up next year in a better draft. I think
I've talked about a little bit on this show. I've

(01:59:35):
talked about it on other shows. The mathematics of the
future picks and trades in this draft specifically is going
to be fascinating. They're going to be worth less or
they're going to be worth more in this draft because
our team's going to be willing to borrow from future
better drafts to improve their standing in this one. So

(01:59:56):
and on the flip side, they're more valuable to acquire.
So if I'm the Patriots, not moving back, I want
a future for I want a future pick. I want
a future pick. So okay, I'm gonna move back this year.
Next year when it's better class, I want more top
one hundred ammunition so I can move back up the board.

Speaker 3 (02:00:11):
Yeah, I would just be really careful. This is a
draft to me with the Patriots, they have to nail
their first round pick.

Speaker 1 (02:00:18):
They have any draft, but yeah.

Speaker 3 (02:00:20):
But they but this is a big draft for them.
It's a big draft, and I have to nail that pick.
I wouldn't get cute with it.

Speaker 1 (02:00:26):
Yeah, I'm with you on that.

Speaker 3 (02:00:27):
And all of a sudden, when you start trading down,
I'm not saying don't trade down if the trade down
is there, and it's the value is there for the pick,
but we're not bit don't trade down just to trade down. Yeah,
because you're gonna put yourself into a position in a
weaker top of the draft that you might not nail
the pick.

Speaker 1 (02:00:44):
If you believe in a guy, take them, if it's like, well,
you know, I feel more comfortable at nine than four,
then you don't really believe in the player, right, And
if you don't believe in any of the players truly,
which you might not in this draft, and that's Hunter
and Carter off the board obviously, then like, yeah, just
by defaul, you have to believe in one more than
the rest. So just that's the guy.

Speaker 3 (02:01:04):
I just I keep coming back to the same thing
with them. You have to be careful about the fact
that this is a you gotta be able to get
on base with this pick. Yeah, And I just I'm
not jones in to just give away the pilk and.

Speaker 1 (02:01:21):
That's it to be fair. In twenty twenty three, they
knew the board, they knew they can move down three
spots and still get Christian Zales, and we gave them
a ton of praise for that. Yeah, if you know,
if you read the board, and you know, and this
is including teams that might trade up, and like Miami's
lurking there at thirteen. They're a trade up team for
a tackle. They worry me. The Bears are a trade
up team for an offensive lineman. Certainly the Colts might

(02:01:43):
be too. Like if you know, all right, one of
these guys is gonna get to nine if you read
the board like, yeah, go for it. I just don't
feel super confident that again that group, if Carter Hunter
are there, you're not trading, so they're relevant. Yeah, Campbell,
Membo and Walker. I'll put Walker in a group. I
know you didn't. I will. And maybe you're okay ending

(02:02:04):
up with Kelvin Banks, I guess, But like you're if
you're not super confident in those guys falling, you get
nervous about a trade like that.

Speaker 3 (02:02:12):
Yeah, absolutely, all right. So that does it for today.
We'll be back next week. We're gonna do my guys
on defense. We'll try to get the more of the
phones and the calls and the emails and stuff. I
know you guys emailed in a ton of we didn't
get it to a ton of them today, so I
apologize for that. But before we sign off, confidence is
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(02:02:32):
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(02:02:52):
Catch twenty two is sponsored by Massachusetts to fifty campaign,
commemorating a history of possibility. Plan your revolutionary weekend at
Massachusetts two fifty dot org. All right, two weeks out.
We'll see you guys next week.

Speaker 1 (02:03:04):
Bye.

Speaker 9 (02:03:08):
Thank you for downloading this podcast. Subscribe on Apple, Google Play,
and everywhere else you listen. Like the show, please rate
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