Patriots Playbook 12/18: Cardinals Recap, Bills Preview

Tune in as John Rooke recaps the Patriots 30-17 loss to the Cardinals and previews their upcoming matchup with the Bills! Guests today are Evan Lazar from Patriots.com, Maddy Glab from buffalobills.com, and Russell Baxter from ProFootballGuru.com.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:30):
Patriots Catch twenty two. We'll join Evan Lazar and Alex
Bart every Thursday as they take a deep dive into
the Exit the Nose trends and latest New England Patriots
roster moves.

Speaker 2 (00:40):
And I'm usually into the numbers.

Speaker 3 (00:43):
Okay, we do this.

Speaker 4 (00:44):
I'm into the tangible numbers. There's there's time here.

Speaker 2 (00:46):
Just give me.

Speaker 4 (00:47):
There's the advantage if they haven't know how.

Speaker 2 (00:49):
To work it. I'm surprised. You know an old man
over here. I thought maybe i'd have to show you
like a pictorial or something.

Speaker 4 (00:55):
How am I old man?

Speaker 1 (00:56):
Search for Patriots Catch twenty two? Anywhere you get your podcast?

Speaker 3 (01:16):
Patriots Flame Legends, some more pleasing railstorm from praise.

Speaker 5 (01:24):
Goes to news starts rising, the flame looks over, it's
so rising, inser the.

Speaker 3 (01:30):
Famouk pre Fabo.

Speaker 6 (01:33):
Here's your host, John rock lessend voice of the New
England Patres.

Speaker 7 (01:39):
Time Patrians, Tame of La Long.

Speaker 2 (02:16):
And we're here.

Speaker 4 (02:17):
The funniest thing that's happened all year. So first thing
that I have to say is we haven't heard that
version before.

Speaker 1 (02:26):
You made a brand that's brand new for this show,
and I was allowed ladd for it.

Speaker 2 (02:29):
That's awesome, that's so excited that he forgot to plug
the box.

Speaker 4 (02:37):
Except for the microphone part. Oh my god. That's well,
that's funny, that's absolutely funny. He's so he's so into
the creative part. Marine is so integret in, which we
appreciate because this is, you know, it's cool, this is
you know, it can be a grind, as we all
know around here, especially around these times. So we try
to do something different every show and try to you know,
spice things up. And so he's all geeked about, you know,

(02:58):
putting together a new open and I got to plug in.

Speaker 2 (03:04):
I mean that is why we love him though, right,
because he's just.

Speaker 4 (03:13):
He does it all. You know, he does this, he
does that, He shoots terrorists, I mean, come on. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (03:21):
We had a really great conversation before we hit record.

Speaker 4 (03:24):
About see now this is this is the problem, right.
The problem here is is that the best stuff takes place.

Speaker 2 (03:32):
I can't even say. I can't even say because it
was about Marine his his bathroom time while again the
Marines in Afghanistan, and let me just tell you it
was I can't repeat say.

Speaker 4 (03:48):
For Air, I would not say no, it would not
be definitely an s f w right, but actually he
kind of you know, raised my eyebrown. And I was
a boy scout, so you know, I'm used to digging
latrines and doing things like that back in the day,
and I'm kind of like, whoa, I never did that,
So so I gotta give him a little credit where
that's concerned, right, you do. I just don't even know

(04:11):
what to say, because I don't want to say, you know.

Speaker 2 (04:13):
What to say either.

Speaker 4 (04:14):
I Oh, my goodness, for.

Speaker 2 (04:18):
Once in my life, I I I got nothing.

Speaker 4 (04:22):
I think that's probably yeah, no, it's probably a good idea.
All right, Welcome into the playbook We love to digress.
To begin the program, I'm John. That's Evan. Maddy glab
who is the multimedia beat reporter, if you will, for
the Buffalo Bills. She's gonna join us at the top
of the second hour, right Marie, Yeah, okay, and then

(04:43):
Doug Kyde from the Boston Herald will join us at
the bottom of or two uh at three thirty okay,
very good, and then Russell Baxter will be along as well.
A lot of things to get off to, at least
here to begin with, and not the least of which
is that you know, the persistent uh chatter you know,
uh concerning uh Gerrod, concerning the coaching staff, concerning the

(05:07):
direction of the team and the program based on you know,
what transpired this last week against Arizona, you know, and
and the shot of you know, from the television cameras
of ownership sitting in the box and saying things and
taking notes and YadA YadA. I mean, look, you can
really glean out of this any number of things. Okay.

(05:28):
The fact of the matter is is that I gotta
got stick with my original premise, which we've probably been
talking about now for six to eight weeks at the
very least now, because I don't think Gerad's going anywhere
right now. I suppose, and we talked about this, what
two weeks ago before the bye week, right that if
this team just flattens out over the last four games

(05:48):
and they are non competitive, that we could see some movement,
or at least could see a waffling or maybe some
tire caking or whatever it might be. We're down one
week of the fourth. Yeah, it was not a good week.
It was awful. In fact, In fact, you had a
week off, you had a week to try to clean

(06:10):
things up. You had a week to try to work
on some fundamentals. You had a week to work on discipline,
I don't know what, and it was worse. And so
it's kind of led to me to believe that I'm
just not sure that there's and this is honestly, it's
gonna sound terrible. It's my opinion, my opinion alone. Nobody

(06:32):
told me to say this. Nobody told me I couldn't
say this, So I'm gonna say it. But I would
tell you that I don't blame Gerd so much as
I blamed the entire operation because they I just don't
believe he's been supported the way that a rookie head
coach should be supported. Yeah, you know, and and and
you know, and I don't. I'm not taking an individual

(06:54):
shot at at a VP, at DeMarcus, coming to at
any of the coaches. I'm not even really taking a
shot at Elliott Wolf, although I guess you probably could,
but that's kind of a cheap shot right now. It's
a low blow, you know, it's too easy, low hanging fruit,
whatever you want to call it. Right, we know, we know,
we can see and we really underscored it this past week.

(07:17):
There's enough talent on this team. There should have been more.
We talked about there being more. I told you all along,
I thought this team was probably worth five or six wins,
you know, And if you developed Drake May and won
five or six games, okay, then you could say that
this was a step in a right direction. Right now,
I believe that they have begun to take a step backward.

(07:38):
And I'm not sure anything can be done over the
last three weeks, especially since two of these games are
against the Buffalo Bills, which we'll begin to talking about
here just shortly. I'm just not sure you can take
a positive step forward. I'm getting to the opinion now
where I don't think it's gonna happen. But there's some
merit to just wiping the slate clean, cleaning house and

(08:00):
starting over and bringing in new and whether or not
that means going out and and trying to uh, you know,
uh get the you know, some of the old gang together,
and and and and bringing Mike Brabel or bringing to
Josh McDaniels to bring in this or bring in that. Okay,
that's fine. You can bring in all the coaches you
want have, but the bottom line is that this team
has serious personnel issues, and so you probably then if

(08:23):
you're gonna if you're really thinking about coaches, uh and
and and and the teaching and and and the mentor
and all that kind of stuff, you also got to
think about personnel. And you also have to think about,
you know, bringing in somebody, whether it's you know, Thomas
de Betrau or Scott Pioli or those guys would even
entertain coming back, but guys who have been here before
and been a part of the success here, so they

(08:44):
certainly know what it was like during the successful period
and they could draw on that from experience. I think
that's fine, and I think that was what the hope
was with Girrod, is that you know, he's here's a player,
and here's a coach he's learned under, you know, one
of the best who have ever done it. And it's
not translating for one reason. And of course, I think

(09:06):
we talked about this one last week. Gerard was kind
of behind the eight ball anyway, and and I think
this was a fundamental flaw in what the Crafts allegedly
decided four or five years ago when they earmarked him
or you know, spotted him as potential head coaching talent.
They should have sent him on his way to you know,
get experience under somebody else and to learn how to

(09:26):
call plays and to learn strategies and to learn, you know,
schemes and pick things up from other guys and then
come back to New England with all this knowledge and
combine that with what he learned here under coach Bill
and then voila. You might have you might have had
a puncher's chance here. But I think that's that's a
real issue. And and uh, if we're if we're gonna

(09:47):
take a step forward sooner rather than later, I'd like
to see mister Clean come in with his magic eraser
and just scrub it all. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:58):
It's it's tough because the things that we were sold
with your Odd Mayo on were more leadership qualities, relationships
relating to players because he was a player, and frankly,

(10:19):
a lot of that type of stuff is just not tangible, right,
Like you're not gonna see it if you're not in
the building. And we're in the building. But I always
like to say, we're not really in the building, right,
like being in the building.

Speaker 4 (10:35):
Yeah, we're in the building, but we're not in the
building right.

Speaker 2 (10:38):
So like exactly like literally physically sitting in the but
we might as well be in two different all this
construction going around us.

Speaker 4 (10:44):
And by the way, they didn't build a doorway to
the bathroom.

Speaker 2 (10:49):
Well that's what the hell is that. That's how we
got on the topic of how that's.

Speaker 4 (10:53):
How we got on and how he had to go
take care of business in Afghanistan because we were talking
about how they're building you know, the new you know,
outside facility. Here they're redoing our studio, which you can
see now you know, this is the Uh they did
the end part very first so that you get on
the air. But now they're building all this stuff around us.
They forgot a doorway to the bathroom.

Speaker 2 (11:16):
This is above my pay grade. I got nothing to
do with this.

Speaker 4 (11:19):
They're cutting the doorway. Don't worry. All right, Well I
was gonna say, you're gonna provide the bucket. I can't
if you need it.

Speaker 2 (11:28):
No, uh, back to the point of end, it's okay.
So I think it's difficult because the that type of
stuff is really difficult to see. It's really difficult to
report on. It's really difficult for fans that are watching

(11:49):
games on Sundays at home to really see that, you
know that this is a people person, that he's got
those skills. And you're talking to Dietrich Wise early today,
and I know that a lot of people say, oh, okay, well,
he's just going to defend his coach, like what is
he supposed to do? But Dietrich Wise, you know, said
that Gerard is one of the best leaders he has
ever been around. And that's what I think a lot

(12:13):
of people saw in him. But the issues that we're
seeing are football related. It's x's and o's, it's fundamentals.
It's defensively, are you sound? Are you playing as eleven
guys on a string? Are you you keyed into your
run fits? Do you know your coverage assignments? Do you

(12:35):
play the proper techniques on the line of scrimmage? Like that?
That's that type of stuff. Is not let's get everybody
in a room and sing kumbaya right like that. That
that's not what we're talking about now. And when I
look at sort of a microcosm of what's happening right
now with this team and with this coaching staff, the

(12:57):
precipitous drop off of the defense I believe to be
a snapshot into what's going on with this team because
that's his side of the ball. Yeah, and that's the
side of the ball that had the continuity from a
personnel perspective, that had the continuity from a coaching perspective.

(13:18):
I didn't necessarily think it was going to be as
good as it was with Bill, but I did not
expect that it would drop off without Bill, that it
would completely tank. Nobody expect the creator without Bill. So
that to me is the biggest indictment right now on
Girod Mayo is that the defensive side of the ball
has completely lost its way. And I look at DeMarcus

(13:42):
Covington and I look at Girard Mayo, and I see
two guys that maybe weren't one hundred percent ready for
the positions that they're in, and now they've like exacerbated
that issue by having two of them in important roles.
So when I look at Covington, I say, he's a

(14:03):
defensive line coach, yet a defensive minded head coach. And
Bill Belichick the play caller was Steve, then it was Girard,
who is you know, the co defensive coordinator with Steve,
so at best we're talking about Covington being like the
fourth lieutenant on the defense last year, and now he's

(14:23):
become the first lieutenant overnight, and now Gerrod's become the
head coach, so his hands are less on the defense
because his hands have to be elsewhere, and.

Speaker 4 (14:33):
So and then automatically leads us to disappointment because we
thought that was his his.

Speaker 2 (14:38):
Thing, right, right right. And this is also, you know,
the second point I wanted to make on this was
just you hear a lot of it didn't work out
with a lot of coaches in year one. You know,
Deetro Gwis himself brought up Dan Campbell today and said,
didn't work out in your one with Dan Campbell, and
Detroit didn't work out for in year one for Bill
here you know, two thousand didn't work out for Kyle Shanahan,

(15:01):
who had a bad record his first year with the
San Francisco forty nine ers. But all three of those guys,
you could point to something tangible and see say I
see it with this guy, like I see where we're
going with this guy. Bill, it was obviously defense, right,
and in his acumen on defense, Kyle Shanahan, it was
obviously the other side of the ball. If I could

(15:22):
sit here and point to that's good scheme. That unit
looks buttoned up. You know, this is the way it
supposed to be. So yeah, the press conferences and the
game management. I would be willing to live and learn
and like kind of allow Jerrod to grow in those

(15:42):
other aspects if I thought that they were well coached
on the defensive side of the ball, because I could
at least hang my hat on that's what he's bringing
to the table, like that's his specialty. The other stuff
like that learning and had a handle being a head coach.
That stuff will come with experience. But I don't see that.

(16:03):
To me, they are not innovative or schematically creative on
either side of the ball. They don't do anything schematically
that stresses the opponent, that makes the opponent think, that
puts the opponent in binds. Like, they don't do anything
on either side where I watch their film on Mondays

(16:24):
and I say, neat wrinkle, you know, like cool little
scheme here, you know this, if this build up, this
you know sinnquencing of plays was creative or was innovative.
I don't see any of that. Is it possible?

Speaker 4 (16:38):
We don't see it because the caliber player doesn't get it, Yeah.

Speaker 2 (16:44):
It's possible. And I think that this sort of speaks
to maybe the combination of physical and also smarts, like
in savvy talent. You know, I'm talking about players right,
Like physical talent is one thing, but you also have
to have savvy in order to go out there and
execute a certain blitz or to execute a read option

(17:06):
play with Drake Mayet quarterback. But I look at other
teams that are young teams, you know, the Washington Commanders.
The Washington Commanders didn't say, you know, we're gonna wait
a year to run Jayden Daniels, like we're gonna turn
Jayden Daniels into a pocket passer for his rookie season
because we just don't have the horses to run that

(17:28):
kind of offense or we want him to learn to
play conventional quarterback. They didn't do that. Cliff Kingsbury is
running LSU's offense, right. They have bells and whistles all
over the place, and they have scary Terry Terry McLaurin.
But look at the rest of the receivers, look at
the offensive line. You know, they have a rookie starting

(17:48):
at left tackle, like they are off their team is
not in they were. There was a reason why they
were the second overall picking the Patriots or the third
overall pick in last year's draft. So that, to me
is the is the part that I'm most concerned about
with this team moving forward. There's a lot I get
that there's a lot of concerns from people about the program,

(18:09):
you know, like his handling a press conferences, you know,
the talent and the personnel side of things. Uh, the
just the media in general and how the media is
being handled in the building. I get there's a lot
of concerns about all that. As a football guy, my
concerns are when you get to Sunday, does anybody fear you?

(18:31):
Is there anything that you are doing as coaches to
elevate what's being put out there on the field? And
right now it's I have to admit I have I
have a tough time seeing it.

Speaker 4 (18:41):
Yeah, I don't see it either, And I think you
kind of you know, touched on. You know. The real
issue here that if he had lost the locker room,
if the players were questioning him, then there would be
no reason to keep him. But because he has the
respect of the players, because the players like him, love him,

(19:01):
in some instances, they because they know of who he
is and where he's come from, and he's paid his
dues and what have you. Because he still commands that
respect in the locker room. That's the one thing that's
to me, it's got to be the only thing really
that's kind of saving his opportunity here, and that might
be enough to kind of hang your head on. Again.

(19:21):
I think we need to wait, in all honesty for
these final three weeks to play themselves out because if
we see, you know, and again it's going to be tough.
Two of these games Buffalo and against the Charters team,
it's you know, playing over the postseed as well, so
you are up against it. This was your last, in
my opinion, your last best chance to win a game,
and you didn't even come close. Yeah. That just wow.

(19:46):
I mean I'm just boggles the mind. Number one. But
number two, So after three weeks, is that love in
the locker room still going to be as strong as
it is now? I mean, I don't know. And even
if he has that love and respect in the locker room,
which is great, that's no small thing. That's everything really,
because it has to start there. It's just the guys

(20:07):
against the world, right, that's against them. But isn't this
the also the time where a true leader's got to
step up and say, Hey, this is my responsibility. I'm
the leader here. We need to make a change that
belongs to the Crafts. Yeah, and you know, maybe they've
already just said you're good for this year. We don't

(20:28):
know that we can assume that potentially. Uh. And of course,
if nothing happens, certainly I would say by Black Monday,
then it's not gonna happen. So that's why these next
three weeks are gonna be really interesting. A to see
how the Patriots play, b see how they compare to
their composition, See how is the locker room going to

(20:49):
react if they do get you know, you know, their
hats handed to them over these last three weeks, especially
with the one game left at home, uh and and
d with these rumors out there that Mike vrabel now
wants to come back and coach the Patriots, you know,
and those rumors, those those are out that's out there.
And so if he does, and then there's the talk

(21:10):
about maybe getting at least some of the band back together, Okay,
how real is it? And if you're really overlooking and overseeing.
You know this group, you know, do you you know,
succumb to you know them, you know the familial pressures,
you succumb to the fan pressures. I mean, what's in
the interest of the franchise. You got you know, sponsors,

(21:33):
you know, and we love our sponsors here, but you
got sponsors that are questioning, you know, recommitments, reinvestments. You
got season ticket holder base that you know has been
an extra stadium size for a number of years, is
beginning to dwindle a little bit. That's a matter of
public record, so or at least a matter of record
based on what I've seen this far. So I mean,
I don't think anybody's in dire straits here. But at

(21:55):
the same time, when you start to see slippage, and
if you own something and you know it's valuable, and
the Patriots are valuable, we know this, They're the second
or third most valuable franchise on the planet, all right,
So when you see slippage in that, you know, if
you own that asset, aren't you going to want to
try to show it up to keep you know, any
more tarnished from appearing on the on the armor so

(22:17):
to speak.

Speaker 2 (22:18):
Yeah, yeah, it's a fair point. And I think just
you know, even smaller than that, you have this rookie
quarterback who's playing pretty good, and you can see the
talent with Drake and and look, I know it's only
first year right now, but time goes by really quickly
and all of a sudden, you're gonna wake up one
morning and he's gonna be three seasons in and he's
gonna be Trevor Lawrence and he you know, he's gonna

(22:40):
be in one playoff game if you're lucky, right like,
And that's that's the part that when we start to
talk about is it fair you know, to have these conversations,
and I just want to put it out there too,
Like I find it a little bit interesting that this
has been the week like this was like this was
the week that it was too much right, Like these

(23:02):
things that have been going on with the team. We've
been talking about John for for months time, and now
all of a sudden, it's like this is the week
where you know the fire is being is burning. But
with that being said, you have to start to think
about the window that you have right now with Drake
May and coming up this offseason, you have one hundred

(23:23):
and thirty two million dollars in cap space projected, which
would be a league high. If that number holds, you
are probably going to have a top five draft pick
in the draft again next year, maybe even top three.
And as the crafts, you have to ask yourself, are
these the people that we are confident in spending one

(23:44):
hundred and thirty two million dollars of our money and
then also having another really really important draft And they're
the ones picking the groceries. That's a question only they
can answer. But that's a really difficult question. And I
I'm weary, Like we're all weary, right, We're all we're
all concerned about whether or not this is the right

(24:07):
course to chart. But you have a bad draft again
next year, you have a bad free agency again next year.
Now he's in your three and he has nobody around him,
and I'm talking about Drake right, and now at that point,
now you probably are cleaning house. So now he's on
regime two year three, right, like you know, head coach
number two, offensive coordinator number two. And these are the

(24:29):
things that unform. Fortunately, this is this is the cycle.
This is the cycle that you get in that bad
teams get in that you could have Trevor Lawrence, who's
gonna be on what coach number three? Four at this
point if you want to count the interim coach, assuming
that Doug Peterson is is blown out there, you know,

(24:50):
Urban Meyer, the interim coach, Doug Peterson, like, now he's
going to be number four, and so that that's when
I look at Drake. That's my biggest fear is that
they're gonna end up in a They're gonna be the
Jacksonville Jaguars with Trevor Lawrence. Yeah, you have a talented guy,

(25:10):
but you just can't put the right pieces around him.

Speaker 4 (25:13):
Yep. That's what it looks like, doesn't it. Yeah? Yeah,
you know, I I've kind of gone back and forth
on this more times than I really care to count.
This year. We shouldn't have to be dealing with this.
It really shouldn't have to be, but we are. Yeah,
and we're dealing with it because of the overall you know,
one loss record of this of this team, this franchise,
and I think you could even settle for the one

(25:33):
lost record if you saw incremental move toward something positive.
And last week again it was just it was just
you know, mother, may I take three steps backwards. That's
basically kind of how I viewed it, especially coming off
of bye week. Bye week. You're supposed to clean things up.
Bye week, you're supposed to tweak. Bye week. You're supposed

(25:55):
to you know, reteach and learn. Nothing. Got I mean,
I don't want to say nothing because we weren't there.
We don't know, We don't know. But that begs a
larger question. If they did try to clean things up,
if they did teach, if they did try to instructive,
they did try to clean things up, it didn't take
very well. So what is it with the teaching and

(26:16):
the coaching aspect of here that's not getting through? Yeah?

Speaker 2 (26:20):
Yeah, And like to specifically talk about this Cardinals games.

Speaker 4 (26:25):
Some of the.

Speaker 2 (26:26):
Offensive linemen in the locker room after the game spoke
about this with a bunch of us, and they the
Cardinals do a nice job up front defensively of changing
up their fronts right like some teams the Colts. A
couple of weeks ago, the Bills. The Bills are a
four to three over defense. They run a four to
three over nickel. They're gonna be in four to three

(26:47):
over nickel for most of the game.

Speaker 4 (26:49):
So they're a.

Speaker 2 (26:50):
Team that you kind of know where everybody is and
like it's still they have good talented players.

Speaker 4 (26:56):
So explain four to three over nickel.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
Yeah, so like nickel defense being five defensive back right
four to three four down defensive linemen. They play not
the complicated further, but they play an over g front.
So they're gonna put the nose tackle is gonna be
shaded on the inside of the guard right, so they're
gonna have two guys on one side of the formation.
They're gonna have a bubble, and then they're gonna have
the the tackle and in the end right. And so

(27:23):
they play that front since Sean McDermott's gotten there. That
is the only front that they play on for since
second down. That is their base defensive front. So the
Cardinals are a team that mixes it up up front.
They're gonna move guys around, they're gonna make it difficult
for you to set your mic points and all that
kind of stuff. And so when we saw not to

(27:45):
say that not to this isn't absolving anybody. But when
we see like Vederian load just blocking nobody, it's because
they're they're in a mental pretzel, right of well, I
have this gap, but there's nobody in this gap, So like.

Speaker 4 (28:00):
What what am I supposed to do?

Speaker 2 (28:02):
What am I supposed to do?

Speaker 4 (28:03):
And that's my point. Yeah, this should have been I
your that weeks ago.

Speaker 2 (28:07):
Yeah, they had a tough time with Buddha Baker because
Buddha Baker is one of these players that, like the Patriots' safeties,
is a hybrid, so he's gonna play at multiple levels
of the defense. So like when Buddha, they play a
lot of big nickel with Buddha Baker in the box.
So like when Buddha Baker's in the box, is he
a linebacker? Is he a safety? Like how are we

(28:29):
treating him when he's in the game. And they just
didn't have a great plan of how are you have
to have a plan of like how are we going
to declare this player? Is the line responsible for him?
Is the back? Is the quarterback? Like who's responsible for
blocking this guy? And that is a plan that you

(28:51):
go in before the game and you have a plan.
It doesn't necessarily mean that the plan is always going
to work, but you have a plan and everybody is
on the same page. Which said plan. So when you
go and you watch Vederien Lowe a couple of times
where he just flat out whiffs and just looks like
he's not blocking anybody that's up here. That's not like

(29:12):
he's not physically he's physically losing a block, like he's
falling off a block. It wasn't that, it's mentally he's
like opening to his gab or to his his spot
that he's supposed to be blocking, and there's nobody in
that spot and he's looking around being like, you know,
who am I supposed to block here? So I think

(29:33):
coming into this game with the Cardinals, I think they
were they were not prepared. They were not well prepared
for their fronts.

Speaker 4 (29:40):
And how do you not get prepared with two weeks.

Speaker 2 (29:42):
Yeah, they weren't well prepared for the fronts. And I
don't think that they were well prepared for the man
coverage either. I think they were surprised by how much
man coverage the Cardinals played in this game, and so
they got into the first quarter. The Cardinals played fifty
percent man in the first quarter, which is a tendency breaker.
That's not typically what they do. And I think they
were full mixed. I think they were surprised and that's

(30:04):
the issue. Yeah, I mean that's the issue on the offense.

Speaker 4 (30:07):
Right.

Speaker 2 (30:07):
Defensively, it's a whole different set of issues. Well, but
offensively there you go.

Speaker 4 (30:12):
You know, defensively, you know, we kind of touched on
it just because you know, this is a team that was,
you know, according to all the the DVA numbers, was
you know, one of the top defenses in the league
a year ago. Now they're down at the bottom of
the league. Yeah, and I know that they've you know,
had injury issues and they've lost one of their team
leaders and one of their main anchors, you know, in
Jawan Bentley. All season long, they were without you know,

(30:33):
you know, you know, tackles and safeties and corners and
things like this throughout the course of the year. But
everybody has issues. Everybody has injuries, you know, and the
Patriots have actually probably come through some of those, would
Bentley being the lone exception, as well as you know,
almost anybody, and yet we've still seen continued regression. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (30:53):
Defensively, to me, it's all about fundamentals, Like I don't
they really simplified their scheme, I would say probably like
early on in the season. They started to simplify really
after that Rogers Jets game on that Thursday Night, that
debacle where they couldn't stop Aaron Rodgers at all. They've
gotten into a lot back to a lot of their

(31:15):
bread and butters, you know, just we're gonna play man coverage.
We're gonna, you know, play two gap, We're gonna three
four two gap. You know, we're gonna do all these
types of things that we've done for years here in
New England that have been successful. But what I look
at with them defensively right now is that their fundamentals
are not very good. They're tackling is not very good.

(31:39):
They do not rally to the football. They don't bring
hats to the football.

Speaker 4 (31:43):
I don't understand that that's stuff that should have been
training camp material.

Speaker 2 (31:46):
Yeah, yeah, you know, tackling. What I say, tackling. It's
not necessarily that they are fat, flat out missing tackles,
although that is happening. It's also that, you know, it's
the National Football League. These skill players are really really
talented guys. So if you don't bring multiple hats to
the football, then like you're one on one in space

(32:08):
with James Connor, Like, that's a difficult play to make
when he's moving at full speed and he's coming at you,
and you he can go either he has a both
directions are open and you have to square him up
and tackle him. You know, they don't rally to the
ball on this defense right now. They don't fit the
run very well defensively, so guys are not in the

(32:31):
right gaps. Like go watch the touchdowns near the end
of the game on the goal line. There's nobody even
in the gap that he's going through. And I get it,
it's a goal line run from the one yard line.
You're probably not going to stop him anyways, but can
we at least have a right so they they don't.

(32:52):
They don't line up right correct, they're not tuned together defensively,
so we can get on the fact that they have
guys with limitations, Like I don't think that Jelani Tavai
is the is the best linebacker in the world. I'm
not trying to take a shot at him, but like
he's not you know, Prime Ray lewis right, I don't
think Kyle Duggars, Rodney Harrison, okay, but they're better football

(33:16):
players than what they've shown this season. We've seen them
be better football players last year. So like, when I
look at their defense, the defense side of the ball,
do I think that they're a top five defense based
on talent? Certainly not and not with the injuries in
the situations that they've had to pull guys out. But
are they the thirtieth ranked defense in the league talent alone, I'd.

Speaker 4 (33:39):
Like to think that they're not. Yeah, I'd like to
think that they're not based on what we've seen from
a lot of these guys in their previous career. I
would also tell you that, again it's not an excuse,
but I think the loss of Juwan Bentley meant more
to this defense than we originally thought it would.

Speaker 2 (33:55):
Absolutely from a communication standpoint, certainly, And then I would
also say from you know, he was a really did
a really good job bottling.

Speaker 4 (34:04):
Up the ball.

Speaker 2 (34:06):
Like even if Juwan Bentley wasn't making the tackle himself,
he was really good at compressing the space that the
running back had to work with, so that it was
you know, I'd mentioned earlier, like Connor had a two
way go like he could go left or he could
go right, like Juwan Bentley would make him commit right
like he would compress the space that he was working in.

(34:27):
So that way there, like Jabriel Peppers doesn't have to
cover the entire sideline for James Connor, he only maybe
has to cover like a couple yard bocks instead, right,
and it makes it so much easier to get the
guy on the ground. They have had that player, Juwan
Bentley's style linebacker for twenty five years, right, like just
going Ted Johnson, Dante high Tower landon Roberts, Juwan Bentley,

(34:53):
Like they've always had the sledgehammer because they play this
two gapping system. They play with bubbles on the line
of scrimmage, meaning the guards are uncovered a lot on
the line of scrimmage, so those guards can come up
to the second level. If you don't have a sledgehammer
that can take on that guard, then there's gonna be
a whole lot of space. And right now, I look
at the way that they try to fit it, like

(35:16):
Jilani Tavai and Christian Ellis and Sioni Taki Taki are
not those types of players. They are not sledgehammers. They
are I don't want to call them for nests, but
they're just different kinds of players in that, and especially
Ellis and Taki Taki who are really past game or
like even special teams linebackers like these guys are are

(35:37):
not truly every down linebackers in the NFL.

Speaker 4 (35:40):
Weren't we critical though, of Juwan Bentley for being one
dimensional and being Justice sledgehammer and wondering whether or not
there was a place for a player like him in
a modern day NFL because you had to have a
linebacker that I had, you know, some side to sideline,
you know, you know, capability, And yet here it is.
It turns out what he brings to the Patriots defensively
is the very thing that the Patriots are missing most.

Speaker 2 (36:01):
Yeah, it's with Bentley. And this is why I always
would push back on that sometimes, is because Bentley it's
about scheme fit. He plays a role in a certain
way that makes the rest of the pieces fit together
from a front perspective. And I'm not trying to overrate
Juwan Bentley again, he's Ray Lewis, Like, I'm not trying

(36:21):
to tell you that he's he's dick buckets. Okay, like
he's a good player, but he's he's not going to
the Hall of Fame. I get that. But it's the
style of play that he plays the position at that's
so key for the way that they want to fit
it the rest of the in the rest of the front,
Like if you don't have somebody like that, then it's
really difficult to be a three to four two gapping defense.

(36:44):
So the one adjustment that I still haven't seen from
them that you know, let those guys get up the field,
like Christian Ellis is, you know, two hundred and thirty five,
two hundred and thirty pounds and you're asking him to
try to get off a three hundred and twenty pound guard,
you know, or stand up, but three hundred and twenty
pound guard in the hole, like he's he can't do that,

(37:05):
Like it's nothing. It's not Christian Ellis's fault. He's just
not built that way. Like he's just not built that way.
So I've been disappointed a lot on defense that they
they haven't really had any answers of like how can
we do this differently? You know, with this personnel like
Bill would have would have had a different way of
doing things where he would have said, Okay, I don't

(37:25):
have Juwan Bentley anymore, so I have to play to
the guy's strengths that are on the field now, and
I just feel like they haven't been able to make
that adjustment.

Speaker 4 (37:34):
You know, they have not. And before we jump back
into the into the bills, you mentioned Billy and when
we spoke last week, he hadn't yet officially taken the job.
And now that he's taken the job and we've kind
of seen things, do you have you changed your mind
or whether or not this could potentially be a good
fit or a misfit.

Speaker 2 (37:52):
I haven't changed my mind. I would say that, you know,
watching him in a little bit that they've shown down
at North Carolina, you know, I think he's at the
basketball game the other which I think is just crazy,
like the fact that they're like marching him out there
at a North Carolina basketball game and I'm here.

Speaker 4 (38:08):
I don't think he looks that great in Carolina blue anyway.
Literally sitting there, I mean, now, I just used to
seeing him with the hoodie and the you know, I'm
just like, sorry, can't.

Speaker 2 (38:19):
I'm just sitting there. I'm like, what world are we living?

Speaker 4 (38:22):
I don't know. Yeah, right, this is like Bizarrow world, Yes, yes, yes, yeah,
like Bizarro Superman, right, am I right? About that marine.

Speaker 1 (38:30):
Trailer for the new Superman movie out tomorrow.

Speaker 4 (38:32):
There you go nice, Okay, good.

Speaker 2 (38:33):
He knew that right off the top of his head.

Speaker 4 (38:34):
Course she did.

Speaker 2 (38:35):
But I would say the one thing that I not
changed my mind. But the one thing I see is
that I think he just wants to coach. And I
know he wanted to coach on his terms and that
was probably a big reason why it went this way.
But I think he just wants to coach, and that
was the place that he felt gave him the most
comfort in terms of it's gonna be my staff, it's

(38:57):
gonna be my program, it's gonna be my way of
doing things. And so that's where he went. You know,
I still hate it, like as a fan, as a
fan of his and as a fan of football, it's
hard to get used to. I I hate that he's
not in the league. I hate it. I think that's
a joke. I think it's a joke, and I think
it's a joke to all the other teams. Frankly, you

(39:19):
know the thirty one other teams Like here, I get it,
it ran its course, it was time. I get why
they felt that way, But the other thirty one teams.
Like it's kind of like remember when when Brady was
a free agent and he joked that there was like
an anonymous quarterback and he's like, really, you're gonna keep
that guy over me, like you would rather keep him,
and there's all this speculation of who he was talking about.

(39:40):
I feel like there's like ten teams in the NFL
where that it's it's the same thing, right where it's
like you're really you're gonna you're gonna keep that coach
instead of hiring Bill Belichick. You know you're gonna keep
you know whoever? Yeah, name the name right. Yeah, it's bizarre.

Speaker 4 (39:55):
It's totally, uh bizarre, but you know, be that as
it may. I think they they decided all these other
teams decided that it would just be too much of
an internal struggle for a relatively short amount of time. Yeah,
you know, to bring in someone who's seventy two years
old as a rookie coach in college to you know,
come in and basically do it. He wanted control, and

(40:16):
and there wasn't an NFL team that was willing to
give him the kind of control that he was looking for.
That he essentially, I guess he has you know, on
the college ranks. Yeah, totally.

Speaker 2 (40:25):
I think it had to have been a really unique
situation for him in the NFL where really the only
team maybe two teams ironically, both NFC East teams like
Dallas and Philly. I felt like it could have worked
because you have really strong you know, Howie Roseman's a
really strong figure in Philadelphia, and obviously Jerry Jones is

(40:46):
a really strong figure in Dallas. So like could they
had hired Bill just to coach, right and said to Bill.

Speaker 4 (40:54):
But apparently that wasn't good enough.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
Yeah, and maybe but if they had said to Bill,
we feel like we're a great coaching away from winning
a super Bowl in Philly, you know, if we're really
we're a great coaching away from winning a super Bowl
in Cincinnati. But we're gonna keep the personnel infrastructure in place,
and we just want you to come here and coach.

Speaker 4 (41:17):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (41:17):
That that That's the only way I think it worked
in the NFL. And now he's in uh, North Carolina
with Michael Lombardi and Cha Hill and he's probably gonna
bring his sons and bring Matt Patricia and I'm you know,
Barriage is next.

Speaker 4 (41:32):
Right, Like you know, they all hail the gangs all here. Yeah, right, yeah,
So all right, let's get back now to the Buffalo Bills,
because here's a team that you know has you know,
we we thought, at least initially. First of all, it's
weird as hell that we're in December and you're playing
a team for the first time.

Speaker 8 (41:48):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (41:49):
But nevertheless, this is a team that we thought might
have its supremacy in the AFC East over the recent
years challenged. They did not, in fact, far from it.
They've answered the bell and then some and and that's
to the Bills. I think credit that's just you know, uh,
you know, coach McDermott's credit. That's too. That's to the
credit to you know, everybody who's basically on the team.

(42:11):
And Josh Allen, let's face it, I mean, I think
he's played at an MVP caliber level, uh for the
Bills this year to have them in that realm, and
I know that there are a lot of people, and
we've talked about it on this program, that you know,
would really love to see and think that we might
ultimately see that the whole Buffalo you know, Detroit, you know,
potential super Bowl between teams that have never won it.

(42:32):
Maddi glab covers the Bills as there multi media journalists
for the Buffalo Bills dot Com, and she joins us
here in the playbook. Maddie, it's a John and Evan
here in Foxborough. How are you.

Speaker 6 (42:43):
Today, Hey, guys?

Speaker 9 (42:45):
Doing good.

Speaker 5 (42:46):
I'm sitting in one of our sweets in the stadium
doing this phone call, and I'm watching some snowfall on
the stadium right now. But don't worry. I don't think
it's going to be anything too bad for Sunday, and
the stadium is looking like it's pretty cleared out from
that last snow game that we had against the forty
nine ers just a few weeks ago here, right.

Speaker 4 (43:08):
You know, I don't think it would bother anybody here
if there were extreme conditions, to be quite honest with you,
except except for people like Evan who have to be
in the middle of it.

Speaker 5 (43:16):
Think back to that game against where we played against
Mac Jones and she had just a few pass attempts
and you guys won that game.

Speaker 4 (43:22):
Yes, I think that you know we're talking extreme conditions,
has a way of kind of evening things out, because
I think it's going to take something kind of weird
like that for the Patriots to get their puncher's chance
in here.

Speaker 5 (43:33):
To be honest, I mean a game and the conditions
and the elements in Buffalo, whether it's snow, whether it's rain,
whether it's the wind, you have to abandon what you
thought you were going to do if it's something you're
not completely prepared for, which Sean mcshermott talked about that
in our conference day. You know, it's supposed to be
a cold weather game like eighteen degrees, which these guys

(43:56):
live here. You guys know what it's like to be
in winter, so that shouldn't affect the group as much.
But he says, you know, at this point in the season,
we are trying to prepare for whatever is going to
be happening outside so that when the game happens, we're
not surprised for snow or wind or rain. That shouldn't
be the case on Sunday, but you never know here

(44:18):
in Buffalo with what could happen with the weather. But yeah,
if it's going to be a weather game, your game
plan does change a little bit, and maybe the team
you're about to play against their game and also changes
for better. So weather can definitely be something that evens
the playing field between the two teams.

Speaker 4 (44:37):
Yeah, an equalizer. Maddie, What do you feel like is
the best attribute for this Buffalo team and do you
feel like it is a better team now than maybe
at this stage a year ago.

Speaker 5 (44:50):
I think it's their quarterback, Josh Allen. I think everything
runs through him. His leadership this year has taken a
step up. He spoke to media today and just talked
about his confidence and how he's never felt better and
he's never been more confident in himself, and he spoke
about having fun in the building. He's doing this press

(45:12):
conference as about ten players are throwing a NERF football
that has a whistle found on it, so every other
question you hear the whip of the whistle in the background.
Is he's answering these questions and he goes, we're having
fun here. And I think that's a big part of
this group is they've lost a lot of leadership and

(45:33):
a lot of those guys are missed, and there were
great players in the building here last year and this
year it was about how are we going to put
the pieces back together without some huge prominent roles on
offense and on defense. Without a bunch of captains, and
they've figured out a way to make it work. I'm
not saying that, you know, it's it's better without those

(45:53):
guys at all, but it's different, and they found a
way to put those pieces together and make it work
with new players on offense, with new players on defense.
Joe Brady as a new offensive coordinator, I think really
has a handle on this group right now. I feel
like the offense as a whole of hitting their stride.
The defense, while they have allowed quite a few points

(46:13):
in the last two games they've had, they've played against
high powered offenses. I would hope that changes, you know,
in the future as we close out the regular season,
they kind of get back to their capable what they're
capable of, what we've seen from them at the beginning
of the season. The group that is getting healthier. There
were some injuries in last week's game. But to answer

(46:34):
the question, yeah, I do think this group is in
a better place right now than they were last season.
And I mean last season they didn't know they were
playing in the playoffs until the whistle blew in that
final game. This year, they've locked up the AFC East
and they have a chance at the one seed. They
can control their ability to win these games by playing

(46:58):
as hard as possible. But it's also about the Chiefs
and what happens in the last three games of their
regular season. They have to drop two of their last
three in order for the Bills to get a one seed,
the Bills have to win out. But Josh Allen spoke
about that today. You know, there's a little bit of
ease to the building right now because we have clinched
that playoff spot. Not saying that we're taking our foot

(47:20):
off the gas, but it's nice to know, hey, we're
in the dance and we do still have a chance
at the one seed. I think that's the cat being
dangled in front of them right now, keeping them pushing
at a high level and keeping them motivated and super focused.

Speaker 4 (47:36):
Let's kind of let's kind of start with that for
just a second, only because you know, the fact remains
is that you know you're in the dance. As you
know the players suggested earlier today, everybody knows that it
might be somewhat problematic to leap over Kansas City at
the stage of the game with so little time left
in the regular season. Is it possible at some point

(47:59):
in time, because you know you're gonna be kind of
where you're at here that there might be some saving
of some people. If not this week, certainly, I would
think by the January five game, when you guys are
gonna play the Patriots again, to you know, in a sense,
give yourself a bye week to make sure that you're
as healthy as you can be for the postseason.

Speaker 5 (48:22):
Yeah, I think that definitely could be an option. Depending
on what happens over the next two weeks with the Chiefs,
I think that will impact Buffalo's plan as they move
forward to close out the regular season. But if they're
at a place where the Chiefs have just won the
next two games and they're not in the spot where
that one seed is still within reach, I.

Speaker 10 (48:44):
Could see either.

Speaker 5 (48:45):
I could see our head coach and Sean McDermott deciding, hey,
let's give some of these veterans a rest, let's have
them be ready for the postseason. Or maybe let's give
some of these guys who are still dealing with injuries
who would be able to go if we had them,
if we needed them to go, but let's give them
a week arrest here. So I could see it going
either way. But I know, you know, this is week

(49:09):
sixteen that we have ahead of us, and right now
they're still playing with a mindset of, hey, we could
get the one seed in the playoffs, so we're going
to put our guys out there who are willing, capable,
and able to go. So it should be a good
matchup against against this Patriots team. I know you guys
haven't had the wins this season, but you do have
a rookie quarterback who looks like, hey, we can build

(49:32):
a team around this guy, and you have a defense
that has some strong areas to it.

Speaker 4 (49:38):
I'm sure that's what you're hearing from from the Buffalo
players anyway. To be honest with you, Matty, this team
is just it's it's rife with issues, but you know,
we take them kind of as they come around here.
I wanted, though, to touch on the offense because you
mentioned the points that have been scored the last couple
of weeks, and honestly, you know, clearly Josh is the
straw that stirs that particular drink, But I mean, what

(50:00):
are their aspects to this to this team. Have you
seen perform especially over the last couple of weeks that
have even been a little bit surprising, not to you,
but to other observers, maybe within the locker room. Hey,
we didn't know we were capable of that, you know kind
of thing. I'll start by just saying to me, I
think the Buffalo running game might be a little bit

(50:21):
more underrated than a lot of people give it credit for.

Speaker 5 (50:25):
Totally. That's where I was gonna start. Sean mcgermerally says,
the starts of the line of scrimmage, so let's start there.
I think our offensive line has been unbelievable this season.
This has been a healthy group of five players again
for the second year in a row. Seasons prior to that,
I feel like every year there was a guy in
the offensive line who was injured, and there was shifting
and shuffling that was happening in the middle of the

(50:47):
season and didn't make things easy for the group as
a whole or for our quarterback in Josh Allen. And
I feel like this year they've got a really solid
group out there. They haven't allowed a stack in four weeks.
Josh Allen has only been sacked thirteen times this entire season.
That ties not ties. That is the lowest amount in
the league. In terms of quarterbacks who've played in every

(51:09):
single game this season. So just that alone, he's got
time in the pocket to make decisions. And also because
of that offensive line, you're seeing a run game that
we haven't seen with Josh Allen yet. And I think
when you pair him as a quarterback and his steel
sets together with a efficient run game, you're getting a

(51:32):
team that's scoring thirty points in eight straight games, over
forty points in the last two. The run game's been
averaging over one hundred and seventy rushing yards in the
last two games. So when you have a run game
that's working, and you have three running backs who are
all doing good things on the field and doing it
different ways, you have an offense. I think that's just

(51:55):
really hard to stop because it's hard to know how
do we scheme for this. I mean, our running back
Ty Johnson was the leading receiver.

Speaker 4 (52:02):
Last week, right exactly? Those numbers sound like the Patriots
from a decade ago, isn't it.

Speaker 11 (52:08):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (52:09):
Yeah, absolutely. I said two questions along those lines for you, Maddie,
and you know, one of them was just about Joe Brady,
who I think is people are starting to recognize him
as a potential head coaching candidate down the line, and
just with his creativity and his play design all that stuff.
So what do you observe from being around Joe Brady
a little bit in his relationship Josh Allen.

Speaker 5 (52:32):
He's been here, you know, as the quarterbacks coach before
the offensive coordinator, and I think it's it's great to
get somebody like that in the building before they're calling plays,
because you then get a feel for how does how
does your quarterback act, what makes him pick, what are
the things he likes, what are the things he doesn't like.
So you build that relationship before the job of Okay,

(52:56):
now I'm gonna go call plays for you. And I
think that was essential in a relationship, and I think
you now see that with those two connected on the field.
I also think a big part of Joe Brady this
season the first part of the season was kind of
feeling these new players out. Kalusha kir was the only
wide receiver on this roster from last that was left

(53:18):
from last season that's caught a pass from Josh Allen.
So they have an entirely new cast of characters who
you're trying to figure out, how are we going to
fit them into this playbook? What do we need to
act to this playbook? How can I make these guys shine?
And now at this point in the season, over the
last few weeks, I think you've really seen this offense shine.

(53:39):
And in addition to Josh Allen playing out of his mind,
I think it's also been Joe Brady getting a really
good feel of everybody and kind of hitting his groove.
And Sean McDermott has said, you know, he's done a
phenomenal job, and it's been about feeling everybody out and
now feeling like you're in a place where you really
understand things, you really feel comfortable with the people around you.

(54:00):
So that's what I've seen out of Joe Brady. And
then just from like a personality standpoint, he's just like
a guy's guy. You watch this offensive twitator on the
field during practices. He's wearing shorts when it's twenty degrees
outside and is in a short sleeved T shirt and
he's joking with the guys and he's having a good time.

(54:21):
So I think that adds to the chemistry as a
whole for this offense. Is it just looks like this
group loves being around each other, and I think you
have a coach that's enjoying that as well.

Speaker 2 (54:31):
Yeah, and just with the sticking with the run game
and the line of scrimmage and all that kind of stuff.
You know, from the outside looking in, it looks to
me like this was like concerted effort for the Bills
to build a team that could win in the postseason.
You know, like obviously that's the last hurdle, and just
watching them their run game, it feels like, Okay, that's

(54:53):
going to work in January, you know, in Buffalo or
Kansas City or you know wherever they have to go.
And do you feel like that was you know, purposeful
for them to really build up this run game and
build it through the trenches.

Speaker 5 (55:06):
One hundred percent covering this team for the last six seasons.
One thing that you consistently hear Sean McDermott say, whether
it's the praise or whether it's that we need to
get better at it, it's running the football. And it's
it's running the football in December and January and November
when it starts to get colder, when we start to

(55:26):
play in these snowy or rainy games, when the weather
is not great. When the conditions aren't great, we have
to be able to lean on our run game, and
I think for the first time we're really able and
capable of leaning on the run game. And it's been
not just James Cook. It's been Ray Davis who's become
a bruiser for this team. It's been Ky Johnson who

(55:48):
has showcased how he can do so many different things
with that running back position, whether it's catching passes or
whether it's being somebody who can beat guys with his legs.
I mean, James Cook has the second most rushing touchdowns
this season with thirteen. He's right next to Derrick Henry.
And the only guy who has more than that is
a quarterback in Jalen Hurts. So he's having a great season,

(56:11):
averaging four point eight yards per carrie. I think that
the rushing offense is such an important part to this
offense as a whole, and it's something that Sean McDermott
I think has preached regardless of who's been the offensive coordinator.
And I think right now you've got the right guys
in the building in an offensive course nator who knows
how to get the most out of his running backs.

(56:32):
And a group of running backs who are really coexisting
well together. And we've got a running backs coach who's
been here since Josh Allen walked through these doors. So
you have a guy who also understands who they have
at quarterback and kind of what will help him from
that position.

Speaker 4 (56:51):
All right, let's flip the script here real quick defensively,
because it seems like the best way to describe this
Buffalo defense is opportunistic. You know, they've kept your team,
that kept the team in position to win games, even
though they might have given up a lot of points,
especially over the last couple of weeks. You know, every
once in a while, your offense has got to carry
every once while your defense has got to carry it.

(57:12):
And it seems like they're opportunistic. They're doing what they
have to do at the time they need to do.
It's the what's the one thing about this defense that
you feel like Buffalo can kind of hang its head on.

Speaker 5 (57:24):
We've talked about it all year, calling this defense a
splash play defense. They've got twenty five takeaways, that fifth
in the league. They've been able to get takeaways at
very important times within a game where you need the
football the offense needs another drive to win the game,
and the defense is there to force a fumble to
grab an interception. It happened against the Lions. I mean,

(57:48):
they were able to force an important fungle and recover
it at the right point in the game thanks to
Christian Benford, our cornerback and our linebacker who recovered it.
And then at the end of the game special teams,
when the Lions tried for an onside kick with twelve
seconds left in the game, you got a nickel cornerback
who grabs the ball and the game is over. So

(58:11):
I think from that end of things, you have a
defense who can make those flash plays and that's been
something that this defense has done a good job of
since Sean McDermott took over as head coach. If you
look at some of the stats since twenty seventeen, they
ranked pretty high in some of those categories in terms
of like passing, touchdowns, loud, takeaway points per game. And

(58:32):
I think we're seeing that on another level this season.
I mean, their turnover margin is plus eighteen. So when
you couple that together, the fact that they're taking away
the football with the fact that Josh Allen isn't throwing
interceptions this year, he only has this.

Speaker 7 (58:46):
Five so far.

Speaker 5 (58:47):
You have a huge turnover margin, which they do have,
so they're taking advantage of that. And this offense has
been really good at pouring points off of those takeaways.
So that's kind of what I think is like the
lifeblood of this defense this season is their ability to
take the football away. But in the last two games
they only have one takeaway, so that's something they need
to get back to. I think that's one reason why

(59:10):
we've seen in two straight weeks teams have scored over
forty points on this.

Speaker 4 (59:14):
Defense, and therein lies the challenge for the New England
Patriots Show this weekend. One final thing for you, Manny,
and I got a rag on the bills for just
a second because I saw the uniform combo.

Speaker 2 (59:24):
Everybody's really upset about it.

Speaker 4 (59:26):
I saw the uniform combo, and I'm not happy. There's
nobody here that happy because it is an out and
out steal of the Patriots throwback unis you are aware
of that, right.

Speaker 7 (59:39):
That was?

Speaker 5 (59:41):
I couldn't believe that we hadn't worn that combo before.
I'm like, we're announcing a new combo. What do you
mean we haven't worn a red tap and the white pants,
and it was well, everybody thinks that's that's like the
Patriots colors and the Patriots combo. So you know, people
are aware of it here. So I'm sorry if we're

(01:00:03):
stealing the thunder the Patriots had, but I'm excited to
see them rocket. We don't because it's not a game.
Of course, it's not in a game. But we've done
it before in our return of the Blue Red practice.

Speaker 4 (01:00:15):
It's a good looking uniform. I totally understand why you'd
want to copy it.

Speaker 2 (01:00:19):
He wore then, Josh Allen wore the helmet, right, was
that what it was? It was like the season ticket
holder practice. I remember that because on Twitter that the
helmet all they were going crazy about about how good
he looked in the helmet.

Speaker 4 (01:00:34):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally understand that. Hey, thank you very much, Maddy,
appreciate thanks Ny. Good stuff today and uh continued success.
I hope you guys got to get the long run
in the playoffs. We'll be pulling for you.

Speaker 5 (01:00:48):
Thank you, We'll see you if you're on Sunday.

Speaker 4 (01:00:50):
You got it, all right, Maddy glab who covers the
Patriot Excuse me, covers the Bills for Buffalo Bills dot Com.
She's at mad glab m A d G l A
B on X if you want to follow her on X.
But you know, I thought her her rundown and breakdown
really of number one. The running game that the Bills are,

(01:01:11):
you know right now tuning to last couple weeks, almost
two hundred yards, one hundred and ninety yards whatever, great
balance last week, I thought against the Lions, I think
they had thirty four passes thrown by Allen and thirty
four rushes. I don't know if you can get any
more balance in that. Yeah, but that and and coupled
with what she thought was the defining characteristic by the
defense that's allowing them win these high powered games. They're

(01:01:32):
you know, they're getting takeaways.

Speaker 2 (01:01:34):
Yeah, I'll leave you with this on the Bills offense,
the watching their film last week against Detroit, the way
that they leverage Josh Allen's mobility and use that as
a schematic advantage to the defense is fantastic to watch.
You know, Joe Brady does a fantastic job of designing

(01:01:56):
those plays. And I know this has been a conversation
around here about Drake May and I'll continue to pound
the table for Drake May being incorporated more as a
rushing threat. It's not necessarily that he has to run
the football. It's being a threat to the defense that
he could run the football by design. We're not talking

(01:02:18):
about scrambles and things like that. So watching them use
Josh Allen and leverage his mobility against the defense. You know,
go watch the forty one yard touchdown that James Cook
has in the game. That's all because Josh Allen is
holding the backside of the of the play with the

(01:02:38):
fact that he could keep the ball himself, and then
their just hat on a hat to the run side
and it's just a walk in touchdown.

Speaker 4 (01:02:45):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:45):
Like, those are the types of things that you see
in this Bill's offense. You know, on the goal line,
Josh Allen went untouched on the goal line for a
jogging in touchdown because they have so many different bells
and whistles off of him being the point guard of
this offense. That's the type of stuff from a play
design perspective that the Patriots sorely lack for a quarterback

(01:03:08):
that has a lot of the same physical talents.

Speaker 4 (01:03:10):
My brother, bring your mittens, bring your woolens.

Speaker 2 (01:03:13):
Get some wings, that's true, So that'd be good you.

Speaker 4 (01:03:17):
Honestly, every time I've ever been to.

Speaker 2 (01:03:19):
There, that's always my one thing about going to Bubble.
I'm like, I'll get some wings.

Speaker 4 (01:03:22):
And so how many times you've been to Buffalo?

Speaker 2 (01:03:24):
Oh man?

Speaker 4 (01:03:24):
How many different times have you been?

Speaker 2 (01:03:26):
At least four or five?

Speaker 4 (01:03:27):
All right? And how many different places have you tried
for wings? At least four or five? Okay?

Speaker 2 (01:03:31):
All right, I try to go someplace in there, and.

Speaker 4 (01:03:33):
I think that's a wise idea. I mean, there's the
standbys and you know, you know, the anchor bar and all.
I totally understand all that, been there several times myself.
But that's the one thing that I look forward to
is I would always ask someone either who's lived there
or a hotel concierge whatever, said, all right, where do
the townies go? Right? Okay? Where is everybody headed today?
I know where they were going five ten years ago?

(01:03:55):
But today, where does everybody go? Get a wing? You know?

Speaker 12 (01:03:58):
Okay, that's what you have to I'll have a report
next week. Yes, yes, please, well, yes, all right, thank
you appreciate Jeff. All Right, The one and only Easy
lazare is where you find him on X eight five
five PATS five hundred, the toll free telephone number, as
you well know, eight five five p A t S
five hundred. Patriots fans, if you want to see Toyota's
best offers, including those not seen on TV, well, you

(01:04:21):
can go to buy at toyota dot com. It's Toyota's
official website for deals from the official vehicle of the
New England Patriots, Toyota. Let's go places, Well we're going
now is try to look more of this at a
New England point of view. Doug Kyde, who's a friend
of the program, long friend of the program and covers
the Patriots for the Boston Herald, is going to join

(01:04:45):
us now here in the in the playbook.

Speaker 4 (01:04:46):
And I got to get the phone thing working. Sorry, Doug,
Oh there he goes, got you, Doug? How are you?

Speaker 11 (01:04:52):
I'm doing well? How are you doing?

Speaker 4 (01:04:53):
John hanging in? Brother hanging in? We just got the
low down on why Buffalo was Buffalo right now, and
and I gotta admit, why are we playing these just
it's kind of like, oh, man alive, you got to
play the game. I understand this is what the schedule

(01:05:14):
calls for But boy, I gotta tell you, just if
there was ever a potential mismatch on paper, it would
seem like one is kind of stacking up for this weekend.

Speaker 11 (01:05:25):
Yeah, it seems like bad timing for the Patriots to
have to face the Bills toys in three weeks. Yeah,
I mean, I guess you could say that the Patriots
should be improving at this point, so there's no better
time for them to play than right now against the Bills.
They're certainly pretty healthy. I would say I saw a

(01:05:46):
couple of guys missing from practice. We'll see what happens
with those guys. But obviously you've got Barmore back, You've
got Peppers back, most of the most of the key
pieces on offense and defense are healthy right now. So
in that regard, I guess it's not the worst thing.
But at least for girod Mayo, if indeed, you know,
he's potentially coaching for his job, you know, other coordinators

(01:06:07):
coaching for the jobs. It's tough when this last three
week stretch has the Bills twice.

Speaker 4 (01:06:12):
Yeah, so let let me let's let's just talk about
the elephant in the room. Evan and I dealt with
it a little bit earlier in the show. How much
do you feel Jerrod first and then Alex and DeMarcus
after how much are they coaching for their jobs over
the last three weeks? Is that legitimate or are you

(01:06:34):
kind of of our opinion? We still kind of feel like,
you know, all right, Gerond's probably safe, but the coordinators
that's where the change could really be.

Speaker 6 (01:06:43):
Yeah.

Speaker 11 (01:06:44):
I think I'm on board with that overall, because at least,
you know, a week or two ago, whatever it was,
I had still heard, you know, people from within the
building expected draw, beat back and obviously you have one
of your worst losses of the season though against the Cardinals,
and I can't expect things will be much better against

(01:07:05):
the Bills this week in week eighteen.

Speaker 4 (01:07:06):
Yeah, that's why. Yeah, that's why I asked the question,
because I mean, it doesn't look like over the last
three weeks here the things are going to get better.
And we talked about coming over of the bye week. Hey,
these last four games, this is an opportunity to show
what you got and blah blah blah, and if they
don't fall flat, everybody should be back, or at least,
you know, at least head coach back, but I mean,
this could get ugly before he gets better.

Speaker 11 (01:07:28):
I think that you just can't have three more games
in a row like you did it against the Cardinals.
I think you have to show some improvement. And offensively,
I know, we saw the crafts on shown on TV
or all these Philip readers, you know, believing what they
had the craft staying on TV, so we kind of
know about the offensive coordinator situation right now. But defensively, yeah,

(01:07:50):
I think that, you know, Drug Mayo and de Marcus
Comington perhaps deserve him even more blame than Alex dan
Pelt because at least with Dan Pelt you can point
to Drake Made's development. You can point to the fact
that the offense has improved under Drake May that they're
continuing to improve. Pretty efficient performance against the Cardinals obviously
not good on third down, but I mean may had
foreign completions running backs for averaging four point eight yards

(01:08:13):
per carries, So at least things are getting better on
in on offense. On defense, if anything, things are getting
worse as more guys come back. So that's that's more
damning to me.

Speaker 4 (01:08:26):
Well, you put out earlier today, you know about you
know Gerad and his press conference earlier about how he
had to answer questions about job security and whether or
not this is the right time or the right place,
and you know, he said, hey, you know, there's never
been an issue. In my mind, I talked to these
guys multiple times per day, and there's never once been,
you know, anything that's really been said about it. And

(01:08:48):
I'm kind of paraphrasing, what was your reading between the
lines here? And is it just because maybe we're asking
the questions and I say media as that we hear
the media is asking questions, does it make it legitimate
that there's a shot he might not come back?

Speaker 11 (01:09:06):
Not necessarily. I do think that his answers are at
least interesting. You know, he's not saying like, oh no, yeah,
the crafts have told me I'll be back, which I
wouldn't necessarily expect him to do anyway. But you know,
sometimes Drod Mayo does shoot from the hit more than
Bill Belichick obviously, for example, or other other head coaches,
So he is kind of leaving his answers up for
interpretation a little bit. But I don't know. I will

(01:09:29):
say that there's been no definitive report that Mayo's coaching
for his job, yes, and there have been more definitive
reports that the Crafts are expecting to have him back
next season, So overall I would still lean towards him
being back in twenty twenty five, but I really do.
I mean, if I were ownership, I would certainly want

(01:09:51):
to make that decision after these last three games.

Speaker 4 (01:09:55):
So if there is still a decision to be made,
what is more likely a clean house or picking and
choosing spots where, you know, maybe we need to get
the broom them out and kind of pick up the dust.

Speaker 11 (01:10:07):
I think the latter, And I think that you know,
even if you're just talking about assistant coaches, I think
that there will certainly be some changes. You have to
have some changes this offseason, whether it's as much as
cleaning house or as little as just you know, moving
on from some of the assistants. And and I think
that that's to be expected with a first year head

(01:10:29):
coach anyway, especially one where the staff was kind of
thrown together to some degree because jard Mayo just didn't
have a lot of experience around the NFL, didn't have
a lot of you know, he's not out there networking
all the time, he's working under Bill Belichick, where he
also played under, so he just didn't know that many coaches.
So I do feel like this the staff was probably
throwing together a little bit. Now as you see some

(01:10:50):
of the staffs getting fired around the league, maybe they
start to poach some of those coaches replace a little bit.
I would probably advise against a full cleaning house, especially
as it relates to the front office as well, just
because I've said this before, But I don't know how
you would fire Elliott Wolf after he's drafted Drake May.

(01:11:11):
I know that some people think that that was an
easy decision to make. He was the third quarterback at
number three overall in a three quarterback class, But.

Speaker 4 (01:11:19):
I mean other Doug, wouldn't that situation might trade down. Doug,
wouldn't you have drafted Drake at that point? Yes, Okay,
all right, so look, I mean I'm really not trying
to diminish anything. But the fact of the matter is
that that was the easiest pick of all to make
it number three, That was the home run hit, That
was the one that you had to have, and they
did that. It's everything else that came after is that

(01:11:41):
deserves scrutiny.

Speaker 11 (01:11:44):
It definitely does. I just I think it would be giving.
It would be a raw deal to stay. Thanks for
the quarterback, see you later, and.

Speaker 8 (01:11:57):
You know what.

Speaker 11 (01:11:57):
And certainly, like I've been critical of the draft class,
seems like at least so far, jale and Polk has
been a mess, Ken Walls has been hurt Leydon Robinson
and Javon Baker mixed results with Laydon Robinson, Javon Baker's
down little. I think that you should expect to be
more than one year out of a draft class before
you can fully judge it. Free agency wise, Antonio Gibson

(01:12:22):
and Austin Hooper were hits Chakuma A Corps for Nick LeVert.
All these other guys weren't. At the same time, they're
spending more million dollars a year on these guys. You know,
it's not like these were fifteen million dollar investments that
they've lost out on. I think the plan here was
a let's stay at the cap room, spend it when
we're ready to be competitive, and once again to not

(01:12:45):
let that go to fruition and say like, all right,
here's the year that we expected to spend to compete.
Let's see how you can do Once again would feel
a little bit unfair to me, right.

Speaker 4 (01:12:56):
All right, Well, the task at hand is obviously a
large one. Over these last three weeks of the regular season,
two of these games against Buffalo, which you know, it's
amazing to me that, you know, the NFL scheduling, you know,
folks you know did this. But at the same time,
we didn't realize the Patriots is going to be where
they are. I think there was more of a chance
for Buffalo to be where they are than for the

(01:13:18):
Patriots to kind of meet them at that stage. But
you got to play these games, and I wonder if
there's an opportunity, and we kind of talked about this earlier,
but if if we get you know, a good solid,
you know, Buffalo day, then maybe the weather figures out
a way to kind of even things out. I don't
know if even that helps this team right now. Maybe

(01:13:40):
complacency also helped even this thing out, because this team
has been hitting on all cylinders over the last couple
of weeks. I you know, watched the whole game, even
though it was up against the Patriot game against Arizona
last week. I watched the whole game in review for
Buffalo Detroit and I just sat there and shook my
head through the whole thing. I'm like, man, it doesn't

(01:14:02):
seem like it was that long ago that it was
New England at this point of view, that literally could
do anything they wanted to. You know, they had the
offense on the end of a string like a yo yo,
you know, you could just play it. And they did
that against a really good Lions team. That was scary,
dangerous is what it was. And Josh Allen, I'm not
sure there's an individual that's playing better in the NFL
than he is right now, especially a quarterback.

Speaker 11 (01:14:25):
Yeah, I mean Drod Mayo called him, you know, the
the MVP.

Speaker 8 (01:14:28):
Candidate, the MVP candidate.

Speaker 11 (01:14:30):
Yeah, it's one hundred percent of legit. And I mean
for that reason, the fact that the Lions, who's played
really well this season, just we're absolutely not able to
stop the Bills at all. It feels like this one
could turn pretty ugly, right. I mean, the Bills only
punted one time against the Lions forty eight points, firing

(01:14:51):
on all cylinders, passing attack and rushing attack. Like if
the Lions are going to be giving that up, this
Patriots defense just has to improve really fast. To be
able to win with them at all. And yes, certainly
seems like weather it's going to be a factor. Low
of two degrees high as sixteen really cold. I know

(01:15:11):
it's supposed to know the day before. I haven't checked
out the winds too much. Obviously, it's tough to predict
that at this point, so maybe that plays a factor.
But like the Bills are a team that should be
built for that anyway, and they haven't been afraid to
throw the ball in windy conditions or or in tough conditions,
so I think if anyone's built for it is the Bill,

(01:15:32):
So I don't expect that to play a major contributing
factor in this game. It just I hate to be
so negative about this, but it really feels like, for
the first time this season, this could be a really
ugly game for the Patriots. And obviously we've seen them
get blown out. We just saw them get blown out
by the Cardinals. They got blown up the Niners earlier,

(01:15:53):
I think the Jets early in the season, but not
one of those like fifty to ten games, and it
really truly does feel like this could be.

Speaker 4 (01:16:01):
One of them. Well, this is why I think, as
we look at the longer term picture. This is why
everything has to be on the table, from you know,
a little bit of a mild dusting to a clean
sweep of the house. Just because of the way you know,
you know, the schedule is born out, you're probably not
physically equipped the match up against a team that has,

(01:16:23):
especially the kind of offensive talent that Buffalo has right now.
I mean, I'm like, wow, what time of year to
be facing you know, the medal of the NFL. And again,
one of the topies we were talking about earlier is
it could be maybe not this week, but depending upon
what happens between now and January five, the last game

(01:16:44):
that's played between the two, if that's not flexed off
into oblivion somewhere, and we don't know about that one yet,
but because that's happened for the next two weeks anyway,
the best Patriots opportunity might be is if Buffalo sits
and rest everybody.

Speaker 11 (01:17:00):
Yeah it is. And I mean maybe it's interesting because
I think a lot of people saw the Patrick Mahomes
injury and said, okay, well maybe that increases the chances yep,
that the Bills will be competitive and week a team because.

Speaker 4 (01:17:15):
They know now that Kansas City is susceptible loss. Kansas
City has to lose two of their last three and
they got to sweep to get the one seed.

Speaker 11 (01:17:22):
Yep, exactly. And but now with Mahomes, I think he
was a full participant in practice yesterday, But I mean
it obviously comes women him as well if he does
play in these games. So Patriots really have to be
hoping offer some Chiefs wins before a Week eighteen, because
I do think that would make things a little bit easier,
because like, like, let's say this is a complete blow out,

(01:17:44):
like a fifty ten type matchup on Sunday, and then
the Bills have something to play for in Week eighteen
and that's another one at that point, then I think
it does become a little bit more difficult to not
clean house. And I think that obviously it's not only
Craft's decision, you know, him believing in it, but it's

(01:18:06):
also you do obviously have to factor in fans as well.
And if the Patriots lose as badly as they did
against the Cardinals in the next three weeks, I just
I can't imagine that fan interest would be extremely high
this offseason if everyone's coming back, if you're bringing the
whole game back together.

Speaker 4 (01:18:25):
Well, that's that's I mean, that has to be a
consideration here. You know, we have our diehards here, you
have your die hard readers and followers as well. But
the fact of the matter is is you're not getting
any of the periphery because you're not the hot commodity
like you were five, six, seven years ago, and and
and how do you get back to that stage? And
the only way I know to get back to that
stage is to you know, he put the good product

(01:18:47):
back on the field b win games. That's that's that's
that's the only way to do it.

Speaker 11 (01:18:54):
And you know, you would think that they were a
hot commodity since this game got flexed and next week's
game got flexed the Staturday. Apparently the NFL still thinks
that the Puture a hot commodity.

Speaker 4 (01:19:04):
But because they have one marketable commodity in number ten.

Speaker 11 (01:19:07):
At quarterback, right, and then I mean that is and
that's what is going to be keeping fan interest obviously,
is that I mean, I'm writing about it right now.
Like Drake May as a rookie has been significantly better
than Josh Allen was as a rookie. YEP, Obviously there's
some different circumstances there, but that's got to give Patriots fan,

(01:19:31):
you know, a lot of promise for the future. There
is that like are they exactly the same player? No,
but May is much more developed already as far as
you know, not turn the ball over, as higher rate accuracy,
even some of the ways that he's able to make
plays with his legs, like almost everything's better than Josh Allen.

(01:19:51):
So that really does just speak to the potential that
Drake May has and really what this team has moving forward.
You're seeing what Josh Allen has done three four, five,
six years after he was drafted. I do believe that
Drake May's the type of player could be the same
thing with the Patriots.

Speaker 4 (01:20:06):
Yeah, I gotta admit that that does leave me kind
of like going, wow, let's hurry up and get there.

Speaker 8 (01:20:12):
You know.

Speaker 4 (01:20:12):
The problem is, oh, absolutely, yeah, what steps do you
take in order to get there? Because the promise is
definitely there. So Doug, hey, thanks be safe travel this
week on. Like I said, bring your mittens and you know,
and bring you a long John's. And because I understand
is Cotton fitz Simmons once told me rookie it's always
rough in the buff.

Speaker 11 (01:20:34):
Yeah, I'm planning on bringing the heaviest jacket I own,
certainly some gloves, and I'll also be eating some wings this.

Speaker 4 (01:20:41):
Weekend at a boy. All right, all right, well I've
looked forward to the wings. I mean you know that.
Believe me. I love to be a good buffalo wings.
So there's nothing wrong with that.

Speaker 11 (01:20:50):
I just hope they don't get cold before I can
eat them.

Speaker 4 (01:20:52):
Oh no, no, no, there's although if I'm gonna eat
cold food out of the fridge, buffalo wings are one
of my choices.

Speaker 11 (01:20:59):
Oh yeah, no, that's a good, that's a good that Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:21:01):
Absolutely, they don't have to be hot to be good.
In fact, I think a cold wing is pretty close,
not quite close to cold pizza.

Speaker 11 (01:21:12):
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's fair. I think that's absolutely
fair to say.

Speaker 4 (01:21:14):
Yeah, yeah, you're on someone, all right, way to go, Thanks, Doug,
appreciate you.

Speaker 9 (01:21:19):
Yep, absolutely, you got it.

Speaker 4 (01:21:21):
The One and only Doug Kyde at Doug Kyde k
y e d the spelling of his last name at
Doug Kyite on x SO. The Weather Channel has it
at eight degreeze after sunset. Whoa, yes, eight plus eight
in Buffalo.

Speaker 1 (01:21:37):
Yeah, seventeen degrees with the sunhow eight after the sunset?

Speaker 4 (01:21:42):
Nice? So the chill factor's gotta be blow zero, right,
gotta be the feel like temperature, right? Oh yeah, football
football weather, Yes, what it was, come on, weather in Matt.
Let's get at the wrong number. That was a four
percent chance of snow. Oh four percent chance? That's all.

(01:22:03):
Oh that's nothing, Yeah, that's nothing, all right? Eight five
five Pats five hundred. This program, of course, says well
as all of our Patriots dot com programming, brought to
you by bud Light, Easy to drink, easy to enjoy.
Bud Light is the official beer sponsor of the New
England Patriots. Russell Baxter on what is the week sixteen?
And the NFL is coming up in just a little bit.
Let's get back, let's get to the telephones. Sam has

(01:22:25):
been hanging on a kinetic for a while. Sam, you
still with us.

Speaker 8 (01:22:30):
On how's it going to?

Speaker 4 (01:22:30):
Hey? Sam? Yeah, we got you. Thanks for hanging in there, brother,
Oh yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 10 (01:22:36):
I just had a question I want to ask you.
I actually asked it on a Patriots unfiltered as well.

Speaker 8 (01:22:41):
Yep, but pretty much what the question is?

Speaker 2 (01:22:46):
All right?

Speaker 10 (01:22:46):
Our guess the counter arguments to a very popular opinion.
A lot a lot of people seem to think that
the Patriots should take the best player available in the
draft because there's obviously, you know, a ton of holes,
you know, with the offensive line, with the receivers, with
the linebackers, with the corners. So yeah, the general consensus

(01:23:07):
has pretty much been, you know, best player available.

Speaker 8 (01:23:10):
But I personally believe.

Speaker 10 (01:23:12):
That we should get a offensive tackle and try to
prioritize that. And my reasoning is is that I feel
like offensive line, specifically offensive tackles is one of the
only positions or maybe you know, the only position that
you can only really improve through the draft, because I
know there's a shortage in the NFL of you know,

(01:23:33):
good offensive tackles and teams rarely trade for them. But
I just kind of wanted to hear your thoughts on that.
I have heard that, you know, some people say that,
you know, there might not be a tackle in the
first round you know, worthy of that pick, which is
where I bring in the ideas of potentially trading back

(01:23:54):
and kind of kind of off that do you think
any teams will be willing to trade, uh trade up?
Because I've heard that there's kind of a lack of
you know, elite talent this draft. I don't think there's
a ton of you know, big name quarterbacks where teams,
you know, will desperately try to get them. So I
just kind of wanted to hear your thoughts on that.

(01:24:15):
And yeah, that's that's really all I have.

Speaker 4 (01:24:20):
Okay, Well you asked a ton there. My my personal
thought is I would love to see them take a tackle.
I don't know what you consider worthy of the pick,
and the real depends on where the Patriots are picking.
I mean, you know, the kid at LSU, the kid
at Texas. I mean, those are a couple of tackles
that are probably in the upper half I would think

(01:24:40):
of the first round. So if you're in there in
the first round, I mean, look to each his own.
You know, one man's trash is another man's treasure. You know,
not that anything is really gonna be trash in the
upper half of the first round. I personally believe the
greatest need of all of the needs, the greatest need
is it on the offensive line. You need a bonafide

(01:25:02):
starter at left tackle, you know. And and so I'm
still leaning that way. Now that having been said, if
they feel like they can get that equivalent through free
agency before the draft, then obviously that takes looking. In
a perfect world, I'd say, find out what you can
get through free agency, who's going to make themselves available,

(01:25:22):
and then uh sure, I would be happy to you know,
jump on the Heisman train, you know, for you know,
the kid from Colorado. I'd be happy to try Hunter.
I'm not sure though, the Travis Hunter is going to
be a wide receiver in the NFL like everybody thinks
he might be, because to me, having seen him play
the little that I've seen him play, he screams corner

(01:25:44):
and you know for the NFL because of his size
and his ability, that doesn't mean you couldn't use him
like the Patriots are using Marcus Jones right now, you know,
use him a little, you know, create a you know,
you know, three to five, you know, play set for
him offensively per game. Turn him into a kick or
a punt returner as well. I mean, can you imagine
kickoff returners with Marcus Jones and Travis Hunter. I mean,

(01:26:05):
I don't think the Patriots unless the balls kick through
the back of the end zone, I don't think they're
going to be letting the ball go down for the
you know, for a touchback with those two guys back there,
and I'd love to see, you know, two shut down
corners defensively, somebody to pair up, you know, with Gonzo
back in the backfield and then create a little package.
So I think I'd be hard pressed to go away
from the best athlete available, although if he's the first

(01:26:28):
pick in the draft, I don't know, the pay is
gonna be bad enough. They'd have to trade up to
get him and probably give up things to move up,
and they're not in a position to do that. So
I think realistically, Travis Hunter is likely out of the question.
I don't know if he slips to three, if that's
where the Patriots pick, I just I don't see that
right now. And so I'm thinking, well, all right, I'm

(01:26:51):
still gonna go after the free agent market and see
what we can come up with. Maybe we can come
up with alignment, and we can come up with that
wide receiver and then go for you know, the the
best athlete available, or maybe you just look for extra
depth on the line. I'm just this is two years
in a row, Sam, two years in a row that
there has been a glaring need on the on the

(01:27:13):
offensive front, and they have yet really to address it,
and the moves they made last year were woefully underwhelming.
That has to be a priority.

Speaker 10 (01:27:23):
Yeah, that's that's too, you know, because a lot of people,
you know, are bashing on the Patriots, you know, for
not getting alignment you know, last off season, but they're
in my opinion, you know, I'm not an expert. I
don't really dive too deep into the offensive lineman, but
it seems like there really wasn't you know, a ton
of good options really available in pre agency or or

(01:27:44):
for trade. And I appreciate you answered my question. I
just have one small thing kind of off that and
I'll be brief. Yeah, so obviously, you know, the options
we have to make additions to our offensive line are
limited by by what's available right in the in the draft,
free agency, trade, whatever. But if you personally had a choice,

(01:28:05):
would you rather get alignment who's better at pass blocking
or rush blocking? Or would you kind of try to
find one in the middle. Again, if you know you
had the personal choice, you know, regardless of the available options.

Speaker 4 (01:28:17):
Well, I'm kind of wanted to hear, sure, no problem, sham,
I look that's sort of like picking your poison. Uh
and and and you know, I mean, you got to
find somebody that's got to be a to both. I
don't know that you can do. You know, have somebody
who just adepted pass blocking, but be allows he run
blocker and be effective in today's NFL. I'm gonna look

(01:28:40):
at the the measurables. I'm gonna look at the metrics.
I want a guy that's got you no longer arms.
I want guy that's got quick feet. And if he
doesn't have his long arms, he better have quick feet.
You know what I'm saying. So I guess I guess
to me, if you're looking at a tackle, I'd probably
favor pass blocking over run blocking. But I know, to

(01:29:01):
a man, every offensive lineman I've ever known, and I've
been very very good friends for a long time with
Pete Brock, who many you know, you know, was on
the Super Bowl twenty team for the Patriots, is starting center,
playing alongside John Hannah. It's been one of my good
friends for a number of years, and we've had this conversation,
you know, over beers, and you know, on football philosophy,

(01:29:22):
and you know, in in public, you know, scenarios and
speaking engagemental kinds of thing. What would you rather do
if you're an offensive lineman? And he looks at me
every time like I've got three heads, he said, if
you're an offensive lineman, you'd much rather run block than
pass block, because when you run block, you're the one
creating the contact. You're the one with the mission at hand.

(01:29:43):
You're the one that knows which way the play is
gonna go. When you're in pass block, you're backpedaling. You
don't know what the defensive lineman is going to do
in front of you. You don't know what kind of
a stunt he's gonna make. You don't even know if
he's gonna come right at you and bull rush you
and try to, you know, put you down on the ground.
And then again, are you in the way of the
running back based on what play is called, you'd much

(01:30:05):
rather be a run blocker. So most offensive linemen, the
really good ones, are really good already at run blocking.
I just don't think a guy could be an effective
offensive lineman in today's NFL without already being an adequate,
if not good, run blocker. And that's why you see
so many defensive fronts largely you know, playing you know,

(01:30:29):
two gap with major size. You know, the three hundred
and twenty thirty forty pound guys, you know, you know,
nose tackle as opposed to defensive tackle. You see a
lot of these, you know, these gapping guys because they're
just trying to take up space and let their linebackers
and ends make plays. And it's harder for the run blockers,

(01:30:51):
who are already good to clear those guys out of
the way literally because of a size factor. I mean,
it's just it's just physics more than anything else. So
I kind of think that, you know, run blocking has
to be a given past blocking elite past blocking is
something that can be developed if you've got the right tools.

Speaker 11 (01:31:12):
All right, cool, Yeah that makes sense.

Speaker 10 (01:31:14):
And yeah, thanks again for taking this time to explain that.

Speaker 8 (01:31:17):
I'll let you get back to the podcast now, No
no worries.

Speaker 4 (01:31:21):
Appreciate you, Sam. Thanks. You know, I'm not even sure
how to take those because you know, now now that
you know, Sam, and I think you meant well. But
now that you know know, Sam's you know, heard my answer.
I wonder if he's you know, saying at home, shaking
his head, saying God, think guy, knows nothing. I mean,
you know, look, I've covered I've covered football for a

(01:31:42):
long time. I've covered the NFL for better than forty years.
You know, I can only tell you what I've observed.
I can only tell you what you know. Lineman tell
me what defensive linemen tell me what coaches tell me.
And there are a lot of smarter people than I am.
And I don't think I'm an idiot about football, but

(01:32:02):
you know, I mean, you know, but I don't pretend
to know everything, Okay. I'm always open to you know, uh, suggestions, criticism,
constructive criticism, whatever it might be. And I find sometimes
the modern day you know, football technology fascinating and so yeah,

(01:32:23):
I love, you know, listening sometimes to hear guys like
Evan talk because Evan is so into it and he's
up on the latest stuff, and it's because that's his
full time job, and so I'm totally ensconced by that stuff.
I think in another lifetime, I think, in another lifetime,
I would have been a coach. I think I could
have been a coach. I think I would have enjoyed

(01:32:44):
being a coach, even with all the pitfalls, because the
competition is is such that I think it would have
been something for me to jump into. I wished I
had been talented enough to play. I stopped playing football,
you know, right before high school because guys started getting
bigger than me. And it was, just like I said,
as a matter of physics, I decided I had a

(01:33:05):
better jump shot, that I had the ability to you know,
catch a ball or knock the ball away. I don't
think there's anything wrong with that. Doesn't mean you can't
know something about football. You know, look at Evan five
foot nothing, weighs one hundred and nothing, and yet he
knows a lot about football.

Speaker 8 (01:33:21):
Right.

Speaker 4 (01:33:22):
That's what they used to say about me too. So
at any rate, there it is on the table. We'll
see if it's We'll see if it develops from this
point forward. Let me get to Kendall in North Carolina. Hey, Kendall,
you're in the playbook.

Speaker 8 (01:33:38):
Hey, what's going on in time?

Speaker 4 (01:33:39):
You doing? Kend All?

Speaker 8 (01:33:41):
Right?

Speaker 9 (01:33:41):
All right, I'm joined this North Carolina weather right now?

Speaker 4 (01:33:44):
So what's the tamp outside?

Speaker 7 (01:33:49):
Uh?

Speaker 11 (01:33:50):
Think you so?

Speaker 8 (01:33:51):
Any good question?

Speaker 9 (01:33:52):
I think it's like it's uh one, it's seveny degrees
right now?

Speaker 4 (01:33:57):
Come on, all right, well rub it in. Yeah, as
much as I can. It's usually about once or twice
a year.

Speaker 3 (01:34:06):
Uh.

Speaker 4 (01:34:06):
And and a lot of it is basketball related for me,
just because of my my college basketball duties. But but
uh uh it depends. Sometimes Charlotte, sometimes Greensboro, uh sometimes
Winston Salem, what else? What else has been Big League?
Those have been the three. Uh, those are the three
main areas that I usually get to.

Speaker 9 (01:34:28):
Yeah, I'm closed to Raleigh, North Carolina.

Speaker 4 (01:34:29):
Okay, Well, I actually enjoy Raleigh, and I like the
NC State campus in Raleigh, too, So that's good.

Speaker 9 (01:34:35):
Yeah, it's a really nice. My question is I see
a lot of people talking about, you know, that we
eighteen game against the Bills. They might risk their starters,
but ain't they still trying to get the number two seed?

Speaker 8 (01:34:45):
Two?

Speaker 9 (01:34:45):
I don't think they was officially sure that of yet
ain't Picksbury right on their tails for that?

Speaker 4 (01:34:50):
Yeah? Yeah, no, that two home games, Yeah, that's true.
And you know, we won't know for sure until we
get to that point because it depends on what Cancie does.
If the Chiefs, you know, let's say they split the
next two. Just let's just say they go one and
one in the last two, all right, So then I
fully expect the Bills to field a reputable roster in

(01:35:11):
that last game, because if the Bills win and the
Chiefs lose, then the Bills could still swipe the number
one seed. Now that being said, if the Chiefs win
their next two or if the Chiefs lose their next two.

Speaker 9 (01:35:26):
So let's just say, let's just say, let's just say
the Chiefs beat the take on starat Day then and
the Chiefs the Texans. I mean, the Chiefs would have
to lose the last two games.

Speaker 4 (01:35:37):
That's true. That's true. Yeah, that's true, and so and
so if that happens, then you know, then I you know, look,
the fact of the matter is is that right now,
when you look at these two rosters, I mean, you know,
the one guy that can really do the most damage,

(01:35:57):
you know, to the Patriots has been the guy that's
given them trouble even when they had a really good
defense a year ago. And that's Josh Allen. So the
only the only guy to me that wouldn't play that
would give the Patriots maybe better than a puncher's chance,
would be Josh Allen. So if they sat Josh Allen,
then I'd say I had the Patriots actually might be
in this game for a while.

Speaker 9 (01:36:18):
And you know, and then if they do want them
to win that final game in turns because I know you,
I know you're a big Just win the game, guy,
I know that point I am the past couple of years. Yes, sir,
would you want them to win that game or would
you rather? Would you rather than lose it for the
draft position? Because I think if you're at three right now,
I think if they win, I don't think they're I mean,
I think they'll be more competive against the Charger. I
don't think the Chargers are got a team that come

(01:36:40):
into Osbury and blow us out.

Speaker 4 (01:36:41):
Right.

Speaker 9 (01:36:42):
I think they got much better chance next week against
the Chargers than this week. This game here just looks
like a lot tide of blowout. But the Week eight
the Week eighteen game, if they was to lose that game,
I mean, if they were to win that game, they're
at three right now, and assume what happened with the
Giants and the Raiders wanted two. If they win one game,
I don't think they'll fall that far. I'm not sure.

(01:37:03):
Just the pain, I think they probably go from three,
like to six or seven. Probably, Yeah, I don't think
they'd go outside top ten.

Speaker 4 (01:37:08):
Yeah, no, they wouldn't go outside top ten. Look, we
won't know until we get there last week. You know
what happens we now and then And look, I'm a
guy that you know. The players don't care where they draft,
players don't care what they get. The players just want
to win football games, all right. So I looked at
this from strictly a player's point of view and a
coach's point of view is we're gonna go out there

(01:37:31):
and try to win a game, you know. And and
so in other words, if they lost a game, they've
got the three pick, and if they won the game,
they dropped to the five or whatever it would end
up being. I don't know, I really don't know that
that makes a heck of a lot of difference to
the guys that it matters most to down the hallway
from where I am right now. So I think you

(01:37:54):
got to go play to win the game. That's why
you play. Herm Edwards right you Hello, You play to
win the game, and that's what you got to do.
You can't really worry about I mean to win the game, yes,
thank you, coach. You just you have to you can't
operate any other way. You really can't kindle. It's it's
impossible to operate that way because you know, if you

(01:38:16):
if you hold guys back thinking you might get a
better draft pick, well something else can end up happening
that would end up not getting you that draft picked,
or maybe that draft pick turns out to be a bust.
And we've seen this team struggle in the draft over
the last few years. They have, that's documented it. And
you know, and I kind of agree with what Doug
Kaide said earlier in the show. You got to give
at least two years for a draft class to determine

(01:38:40):
whether or not it was a good one, a bad one,
a mediocreum, a bidioga one, a good guy, a bad guy,
a bus to star. You got to give it two years,
all right, And so this is only year one. The returns,
the early returns are not trending good. But that doesn't
mean that somehow, some way, someone can light a fire
under somebody's butt and then this way they you know,

(01:39:02):
they end up you know, contributing in a major factor
next year. It could happen. We don't know. That's why
you got to play these games, to give these guys
an opportunity to develop and learn that.

Speaker 9 (01:39:12):
And we last. Yeah, I appreciate that. Let's just say, okay,
this case scenario, the Pages go out this off season
and they spend some money, like the reports already in
the caffeine, some reports earlier the week that we're willing
to spend big and for agency, we have a good
draft class, we address all of our major needs, we
check all the boss of this offseason. All right, what

(01:39:33):
do you think if we go out and spend money
this off season and if we have a good draft
and the early returns on it is good, what is
the if this year the bar was just, you know,
just be comparitive, win about four or five games and
nobody really cares about this year. What is the born
next year? If you do all day, you think, it's like,
I think you got to be at least a playoff
spot or at least eight nine wins fighting for the playoffs.

(01:39:54):
I would think, just go spend all that money out
and just be win a four or five win team
to be assentable.

Speaker 4 (01:40:01):
I think, honestly, Kendall, you are speaking for the majority
of Patriots fans in this regard. I think, and my
expectation would be similar if you get you know, largely
uh plauded, let's say, and applause, you know for your
draft class and people think that you know, you did well,

(01:40:21):
you know, picking up some key free agents to plug
you know, holes in some of the gaps of this
team obviously has in talent and you know, so in
other words, you get it. You know, a general B
plus to an A minus to an A you know
report card.

Speaker 8 (01:40:34):
Yeah, you could give.

Speaker 4 (01:40:35):
You gotta be a potential playoff contender. A number of winns.

Speaker 7 (01:40:40):
You have to make it.

Speaker 9 (01:40:41):
But at least like on week eighteen, you should be
like it should be like a winning in the scenario.
It shouldn't be what.

Speaker 4 (01:40:46):
We are right now going into week eighteen. Going into
week eighteen, you should have eight or nine wins with
a chance to get yourself in the dance.

Speaker 9 (01:40:53):
I think that's the floor for next year. Like it
has to be. It can't be this four or five win.
I don't think the rebuild be that bad if they
address I think if the draft is key and I
think you know, free agency, kid, I don't think it.
I mean, some people say we're four or five years away.

Speaker 8 (01:41:05):
I don't know.

Speaker 9 (01:41:06):
If you don't you shouldn't take that one. There's no way.

Speaker 4 (01:41:09):
I listen, I'm going to join you on that one.
I have high expectations, you know, and I think.

Speaker 9 (01:41:18):
Definitely about twenty twenty six you should be competing in
the playoffs. But I think next year, oh, no question
should be a weapon.

Speaker 8 (01:41:23):
No question should be eight.

Speaker 9 (01:41:24):
If if you're not competing by twenty twenty six something
something's not.

Speaker 4 (01:41:27):
Right now, well that should be Yeah. I agree with you.
I'm listening. I'm on the I'm on your same pathway here.

Speaker 9 (01:41:33):
You should be eight eight nine wins next year. There's
no way you should before it. You should be at
least eight nine wins if everything goes that's playing now.
I know injuries happened and and other things happened, and
like this past all they tried to get there, and
what happened they didn't want to come here?

Speaker 5 (01:41:46):
Right?

Speaker 4 (01:41:46):
And what happens if you don't make any changes and
you're the same spot this time next year that they
are now or worse than that. Let's say they make
changes and this team hasn't gotten any better, then what
do you do? Then you got to start all over.
Then I think you're probably the position where you got
to wipe the slate clean, and that means bringing in
new everybody again, and and then it's going to be

(01:42:06):
another Then it's gonna be another two to three years.

Speaker 9 (01:42:09):
Likely that's the worst game, because I think Nick to,
you should at least because Pete in the vision. I mean,
if you split with the if you I haven't lived
on the scheduled yet, I'm sure they're gonna have a
They're gonna have a pretty good schedule.

Speaker 4 (01:42:20):
The schedule. Yeah, we know already the opponents they'll play, but.

Speaker 9 (01:42:23):
They just the schedule n and they're playing the AFC North.
So if you split your division opponent, it if next
year you should be you should be competing. You don't
have to win the visionators, but you should be. You
shouldn't be where you are. That you should split with
the division next year and you plan the NC staff.
You're playing the AFC North. Whatn't you're playing a few
more opponents. You should be. There's no way you should

(01:42:45):
be eight wins, eight nine wins, it's the bar, it's
the floor next year.

Speaker 4 (01:42:48):
I'm not I'm not going to disagree with that. I
have high expectations too. I mean, everybody wants to get
back to the you know, or close at least to
the way things were, and and and I think that
would probably be the way to do it, so you
can understand how big an off season this really is.
This is everything.

Speaker 9 (01:43:03):
You got the most important position field, you got quarterback,
and you just got to surround them.

Speaker 4 (01:43:07):
Very true. I'm I'm I'm right there with you. I'm
right there with you. Hey, Kendall, thank you. I appreciate you.
Eight five five pats five hundred. I'm gonna get back
to the phones, probably just a little bit. But right
now I think we found are we on flish? Fishing
founder out there?

Speaker 8 (01:43:24):
Real woman could stop you from drinking, A real big woman.

Speaker 3 (01:43:29):
It's time to go around the NFL with football guru
Russell Baxter.

Speaker 4 (01:43:33):
Now what.

Speaker 11 (01:43:35):
The name is flounder?

Speaker 3 (01:43:36):
On Patriots playbook?

Speaker 4 (01:43:40):
There's no fishing where this guy comes when he comes
to call mister Baxter, how are you today, jess um
or something?

Speaker 8 (01:43:48):
John? You can tune a piano, but you can't tune
a fish.

Speaker 4 (01:43:50):
That's very true. I've heard that one many times, but.

Speaker 8 (01:43:53):
It's all it's also plastic album title.

Speaker 4 (01:43:55):
Of tune a piano, you can't tune a fish. I
know so uh, you know, uh, we've been talking about,
you know, this week largely about you know, what's been
surmised over the course of I don't know, the last
couple of weeks, maybe, I mean, but it was just
it just magnified itself this last week with really just

(01:44:16):
a lackluster, almost embarrassingly uh poor performance against Arizona this
past weekend Russell and and and it's you know, Girodmeo
today had to answer questions about his job security. Uh.
And you know, of course he's answering you know, the
only way that you really would expect him to answer that,
you know, he has to answer to you know, the
crafts every day, and he's not been given any indication

(01:44:40):
that anything is any different. I kind of tend to
believe that that's probably the case. That I still don't
believe that they're ready to pull the trigger on removing
him after only one year, for several reasons, but not
the least of which continuity where Drake May is concerned.
And I also mean that that's likely that Alex Van
Pelt is probably going to remain as of as a

(01:45:03):
coordinator or quarterbacks coach simply because of that nurturing, because
they should have learned a very hard lesson when it
came to, you know, messing around with Mac Jones, you know,
a few years ago, and we can see that, you know,
he's probably never going to climb out of that, you
know now that he's in Jacksonville. So whatever it takes,
these last three weeks don't look like they're stacking up

(01:45:25):
in New England's favor to gain any positive momentum for
the off season, give anybody a real reason to think positively.
So I'm just kind of curious what your viewpoint is
from your vantage point because you cover and follow all
thirty two teams in the NFL, and what teams who
are clearly looking at change do for the last few

(01:45:46):
weeks of a regular season. What should the focus be
and what typically do you see the focus on.

Speaker 8 (01:45:54):
Well, I think the one thing that's very important, at
least for me, and of course my vast experience is
working with NFL teams from afar course, yes to me,
watching how your potential free agents play the final three games.

(01:46:14):
That's one thing. Okay, people love to throw out the
tank work word. Tanking doesn't work, No, Okay, this idea
that you're going to ask professional, you know, and John,
you know my background. I've worked with a lot of players, coaches, scouts, gms,
you know, my years with ESPN and one year with CBS,

(01:46:39):
just affiliations.

Speaker 6 (01:46:41):
You know.

Speaker 8 (01:46:42):
It's funny to hear people throughout the tank word and
I don't hear it from the coaches and the players,
And I mean, it's almost an insult to their integrity
that you think you would go out there and try
to lose a game on purpose. And if you're a player,
becomes a free agent, and if you put in a
lackluster final months, that's not going to help your cause

(01:47:05):
if you plan on moving on or getting some offers
from other clubs. So that's something I definitely watch. Does
a team continue to play hard even though the season
you've been eliminated from the playoffs. That's one thing I
would look at, especially a young team like this. I mean, listen,
the Patriots made some moves earlier in the season, you know,

(01:47:27):
the Matt Judon trade which they pick up.

Speaker 4 (01:47:29):
What A.

Speaker 8 (01:47:31):
From the Falcons next year, and so on, So they
mean they you know, they took some steps and so on.
I'm with you to pull the plug on Gerrod Mayor
after one year. The one thing you don't want to
get into a habit of is going through coaches and
like on an every one or two year basis. It
just doesn't work. You know, there's enough changes in an

(01:47:52):
off season by personnel for every team, much less start
changing systems and changing coordinators and changing head coaches and
so on. You know, I think you really have to
fall flat on your face and listen when you have
to play the Buffalo Bills twice in three weeks. It

(01:48:14):
doesn't necessarily, it doesn't lend to a lot of positives.

Speaker 4 (01:48:19):
I'm not sure. Yeah, listen, I think that may have
been just you know, I don't know if that was
a cruel joke, or if that was payback from you know,
earlier years of success or whatever it was. I know
the Buffalo from a Buffalo standpoint, and hey, let's let's
feature you know, divisional rivalry late in the year, when
something's liable to be on the line, and certainly it's

(01:48:40):
on the line for Buffalo the Patriots, they're gonna figure
out a way to survive these games.

Speaker 8 (01:48:46):
Well, listen, go back to when the schedule come out
came out, we heard about Pittsburgh playing six of their
final eight games in the division. We heard about the
Bears playing six of their final eight games in the division.
There was the divisional schedule was very backloaded. Even more so,

(01:49:06):
we already know that Week eighteen will feature sixteen divisional games.
But we're now in Week sixteen and the Bills and
the Patriots haven't played each other this year at all. Okay. Meanwhile,
I believe it's now twenty of the forty eight series

(01:49:28):
have been completed, only twenty and if and if you
won the first meeting, you won the second meetingeena of
the twenty times. Wow, okay, So and that's kind of
standard course people. You know, we'll talk about how hard
it is to beat the team twice in the season
or three times in the season. Man, not really, Yeah,
and it's more times, you know, I've been sharping this

(01:49:50):
for about thirty years, and many more times than not
there are sweeps rather than split.

Speaker 4 (01:49:58):
So it is it more a sweep than split if
the two games are played close together like these two
games are going to be, or or because there are
different teams. Really, uh, if one you played one played
the first one early on the second one late I'm
just kind of curious if there's any science done on that.

Speaker 8 (01:50:17):
I didn't do a deep dive on that and so on.
But we have seen over the years, you know, kind
of this sudden that having to play each other. I
think Pittsburgh and Cleveland played each other twice in three
weeks this year. One was on a Thursday night and
then the Sunday a couple of weeks ago. Yeah, okay,
and they wound up splitting, you know, So I mean

(01:50:39):
was that because Pittsburgh was on a short week or whatever.
You know, there's there's so many dynamics, and you know,
the schedule, the way is set up this year, the
final three weeks, I mean, we have football this week, John,
I want to tell you if football on four different days, okay,
next week we have football on five different days. Okay.

(01:51:01):
We have football on what next week? Wednesday, Thursday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday.
You know, we have a Christmas doubleheader, which is on
a Wednesday. This year they have to do that. And
if you notice the schedule, the two Saturday games are
Houston Kansas City and Pittsburgh at Baltimore. The reason they

(01:51:23):
did that is because those four identical teams are playing
on Christmas. Houston is playing Baltimore in Pittsburgh's play Kansas City.

Speaker 4 (01:51:31):
That's crazy.

Speaker 8 (01:51:31):
They at least gave them one extra day of prep
and so on.

Speaker 4 (01:51:36):
So but.

Speaker 8 (01:51:41):
You know, I'm a little when I think about've been
disappointed with the Patriots this year. And it was almost
as if you know, again from afar when they beat
Cincinnati this year in Week one, and week one is
week one, okay, but it was the style in which
they did it, the sixteen to ten win. They ran

(01:52:03):
the ball, They played good defense against a very good offense.
I mean, Cincinnati's problems is not the Cincinnati's problem is
not their offense. Okay, we see them in these wacky games.
Although listen, they've lost four games this year where they
scored thirty three points. Okay, And there was a you
could sense it and you heard it from some people.

(01:52:23):
Oh you know, there's that Bill Belichick physical style, relying
on defense, grinding it out. You heard all that. Yeah,
and that's that's, you know, other than beating the Bears
in Chicago about a month or so ago. That's we
really haven't seen a lot of that. And you know,
so I think in some ways the Patriots are still

(01:52:45):
trying to figure out what kind of football team they
want to be. Yeah, they see they certainly seem like
they have the young man behind center, but what else
do they have to really build on So far they
they were they almost look like it's it's a weekly experiment.

Speaker 4 (01:53:04):
Yeah, Yeah, that's that's the issue right now. And and
that's why I think there's a little bit of a
concern over the way they came out following the bye week,
you know, on the road, you know, in playing the
Cardinals this past weekend, and they're just there just wasn't
a whole lot of rock them soccerm there, No, not.

Speaker 8 (01:53:22):
At all they got And listen, Arizona is a much
improved team. They're on the verge of doubling their win
total from the year ago memory or thirteen.

Speaker 4 (01:53:31):
Right, And yes, Arizona still technically has you know, a
chance to get in so they had much more to
play for. But it just the Patriots. It was more
of the same. And with the week off, you'd think
you'd sees some improvement in some of the areas that
have plagued them all year long. And not only did
we not see some, we saw none.

Speaker 8 (01:53:48):
Yeah, it was a bit. I mean, it was a
very surprisingly fat, flat effort.

Speaker 4 (01:53:54):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:53:54):
You know you're supposed to come back from this off
week a little rejuvenated.

Speaker 4 (01:53:57):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:53:58):
Okay, and you know we saw some wacky we saw
some wacky football this week. Let's be on there.

Speaker 4 (01:54:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 8 (01:54:05):
One of the things I was pointing out in the
you know, food for thought, that's sweeping the country. Well
maybe not this country, but you know, maybe some other country.
How's this done? Last week? Down the stretch? Teams are
really fun with them home teams last week five and eleven.

Speaker 4 (01:54:21):
Wow.

Speaker 8 (01:54:23):
Okay, here's my favorite. And if if the Pillsbury people
are listening, you should be excited. Thirty two teams played
last week. Fifty eight turnovers.

Speaker 4 (01:54:35):
Wow.

Speaker 8 (01:54:37):
Forty one by the losers, seventeen by the way winners.

Speaker 4 (01:54:40):
Wow, that's crazy.

Speaker 8 (01:54:42):
I mean, Cincinnati turned over the ball four times, but
Tennessee's turned it over six. Okay, Denver got three interceptions
from Bonette, right, but I believe Indianapolis had five turnovers. Okay,
the Browns had seven points and six turnovers, So it
was Hey, now we're rounding in the forum. Huh. Really

(01:55:05):
certainly didn't look like that last week. You know, we
saw we saw some real, real craziness as far as
ball control and I'm I'm sorry, ball security and so on.
It surprised me a little because as I'm watching the
games and I'm watching the miscues and so on, it
was a little it was a little strange because this

(01:55:27):
is a time of year supposed to be fine tuning.
But meanwhile, you know, the good teams are still the
good teams, and you know, low and behold, we have
three teams that already have twelve wins, another team that's
got thirteen wins, yep, And meanwhile we have all these
teams with you know, ten or eleven losses. There's no

(01:55:50):
real middle ground so much, right so far this year,
you're he's either pretty damn good or less than mediocre.

Speaker 4 (01:55:58):
Yeah, that's very true. You know, it looks like this week,
you know, all the games that really seem like they're
going to have some meaning or early. We got the
Thursday game, you know, the Broncos are playing at the Chargers.
Of course, the Chargers the next Patriots opponent after they
take on the Bills this weekend Saturday, Texans and Chiefs.
Chiefs have to you know, win to continue to work
toward you know, home field advantage of the AFC Steelers

(01:56:21):
playing at the Ravens. Those are three pretty good games
with a lot riding on them in the outcome.

Speaker 8 (01:56:26):
Yeah. Yeah, and the Denver wins. Denver's in the playoffs, which,
by the way, they do. You know, the last time
the Broncos were in the playoffs, Tom, right off the
top of your.

Speaker 6 (01:56:34):
Head, I'm thinking, honestly, no, when they beat the when
they beat the Panthers in the Super Bowl Super that
was the last one.

Speaker 8 (01:56:45):
Yeah, that's their last playoff game.

Speaker 4 (01:56:46):
Holy crud. Wow.

Speaker 8 (01:56:48):
Yeah, even Robin would say, holy.

Speaker 4 (01:56:51):
Crud, Holy crud, Batman. Yeah, right, exactly.

Speaker 8 (01:56:56):
You know, you talked about the chief You know, it's
funny about the Chiefs. They won the Super Bowl last
year they only won they were eleven and six. Yeah, okay,
so now they're getting ready if I believe, if they win,
if they win this week, they all won fourteen games
for the third time in five years. Wow, that's that's
pretty impressive and it's very impressive. Yeah, Pittsburgh can win

(01:57:18):
the division on Saturday if they beat the Ravens, which
they've had a habit of doing. But uh boll, that
was that was a disappointingly. Pittsburgh was looked like they
conceded the game in the fourth quarter. Last week they
had kind of a mid season surge and you know,
a questionable punt call by Mike Tomlin and then you know,

(01:57:38):
it's like, but I also want to give credit to Philadelphia,
which she's on a major, major tear right now for
a team that was two and two and had lost
badly to Tampa early, they lost to Atlanta on a
Monday night. They you know, squandered the lead and so on,
and they found themselves and so on. So it's so

(01:58:02):
you got you have Philadelphia, you have Detroit in Minnesota
or all twelve and two, and nobody's won a division.
Think about that. You know, none of those teams have
won a division. You know they're all going into the
playoffs and that can change this week. But that should
also tell you something about how top heavy the NFC

(01:58:24):
is compared to the AFC.

Speaker 4 (01:58:26):
This right so and again I have to I have
to think this is why the NFL did things the
way they did it as far as the scheduling and
holding on or announcing game times and actual dates and everything,
because they're trying to build up the suspense here, and
it looks like, as much as I might hate to
admit it personally because it's wreaking havoc on my home life,

(01:58:48):
they're They're doing what they set out to do. Well.

Speaker 8 (01:58:52):
Listen, the Saturday games and the Christmas games should tell
you something about the NFL and how you know how
much the ratings are important to that. I'm not freaking yeah, okay.
I find it interesting all four teams that are playing
Saturday and then Wednesday, the Texans, Chiefs, Steelers, and the

(01:59:15):
Ravens were all in the playoffs last year. What's funny
is three of those teams are division champions and the
Steelers were a wild card in third place. That should
tell you something about the popularity of the Pittsburgh Steelers
and what a TV draw they are regardless of what's
going on with them. And face it, they're a little

(01:59:38):
bit of a surprise this year. People weren't sure what
they were going to be. I heard many pundits, some
of the greatest experts in their own minds, forecasting that
Mike com was his first losing season. Are they going
to lose six straight games and left seven straight goings
and go ten and eleven. I don't think so, so,

(02:00:00):
you know, but again story franchise. And by the way,
Sunday night, they didn't flex the Cowboys at a Sunday
night even though they're six and eight. They didn't flix
the Cowboys on Monday night a couple of weeks. That's right,
Regardless of you and I could be in the backfield,
and the Cowboys are not going to get flexed out.

(02:00:22):
Now next week you'll notice Miami and Cleveland got flexed out, okay,
and so on.

Speaker 4 (02:00:28):
But you know, the Patriots and the Chargers. Patriots and
Chargers got moved to one o'clock on Saturday.

Speaker 8 (02:00:34):
So right right, yeah, and Miami, listen, Miami's certainly disappointed, disappointment,
but we're forgetting. You know, the Brands went from eleven
wins to eleven losses in the blink of an eye. Yeah,
they're a playoff team. Last year. Yeah, you know, they
had the Coach of the Year, they had the comeback
Player of the Year, and now you know, maybe in

(02:00:57):
twenty twenty five they can buy for both of those
awards again.

Speaker 4 (02:01:00):
Yeah, I think they'll probably be a candidate. As it
now sounds Russell, thank you, listen, Merry Christmas. I'm hoping
that we can touch base. I'll let Marine take care
of the nitty gritty with you for next week, but
listen to you and your family. I hope, I hope
Santa is good to you. I'll put it that way.

Speaker 8 (02:01:19):
Listen. I just hope seeing they can get down the chymney. Okay, Yeah,
I have my own issues.

Speaker 4 (02:01:25):
It gets harder where they trust me.

Speaker 8 (02:01:28):
Again. Yeah, and girth. Ya know if that's the stage
of our lives now, I know why there's the twelve
days of Christmas. We started the chimney at the top. Yeah,
he will give us twelve days to get the hell down.

Speaker 4 (02:01:44):
To the twelve days to get to the bottom. Yes, sir,
thank you, my friend. Talk to you soon.

Speaker 8 (02:01:50):
Great Christmas to you and yours, John, talk to you
so thank you.

Speaker 4 (02:01:53):
Sir, the one and only at Backs football Guru on
x uh final word today, I'm gonna leave right here
with our friend Trey and Memphis Trey. You're still there, yeah, man,
I'm still here.

Speaker 7 (02:02:05):
John always man, glad to hear you. And the legend well, no,
he's the great Russell Bagster and like it is, and
always call you the legend.

Speaker 3 (02:02:18):
Kill me.

Speaker 4 (02:02:19):
I'm sorry, legend, legend in my own mind, Trey. That's
all I can tell you. But I wanted to get
to you last week and we ran out of time,
so you got today's last week.

Speaker 7 (02:02:29):
Good man. It's all good and just done. Man. You know,
I've been tuning into the favorite mass show and then
I do, Uh, those guys get very very very very
interested in takes man h and uh. They I mean
they're beating I mean they're beating the French eyes to

(02:02:49):
to to They're tearing the French eyes just red. And
they really want to you know, they want to run
drop meo out of town. And so the Beatle sometimes
I just have to I you know, I try to
tune into Soolager birch Ran sometimes and then I had

(02:03:10):
to turn it off.

Speaker 4 (02:03:11):
Well, I would tell you, Trey. And in that regard,
you know, most of the talk shows here in Boston,
uh are negative for a reason because that's just kind
of the way the fandom here thinks. And and I
would tell you that goes back to suffering through eighty
six year years of you know, the Red Sox losing

(02:03:32):
that it was almost like, hey, we're going to lose
and how do we keep from losing again? And we
just know we're going to lose, And so I think
that mentality has just sort of crept into all of
the other teams, all the other professional teams, at least
in this area where the Patriots are concerned. You know,
take you know, the old school way of thinking, which
is certainly the old school way of thinking now because
the Red Sox obviously ended the curse back in o

(02:03:52):
forth and we've won what eleven twelve championships since two
thousand and one in New England overall, when you count
the Patriots Super Bowls and everybody else. The reason that
they're like that with the Patriots because more is expected
of this franchise, More is expected of this team. And
when you know, we like to think we know what

(02:04:13):
it takes to be successful as fans, we can see it.
We know what makes a good football team.

Speaker 7 (02:04:18):
But done, if anybody extinct it eight seven, eight wins
this year, you haven't got to be out of your
bleeping mind. You have gotten to be crazy. Well, eight wins,
I mean because I didn't yeah, I didn't see it done.

Speaker 4 (02:04:39):
I mean I thought five or six, Trey, I actually
thought five or six because I didn't think that this
team Okay, well maybe okay, whatever, we're we're sort of
we're nitpicking here. But but I can tell you based
on the talent that I thought would be back, and
a lot of that talent has underachieved, and some of
that talent has been injured. That's why they've fallen short

(02:05:01):
of five or six wins. Now, uh, I would have
considered that a step at least in the right direction.
But this team hasn't done that. This team has regressed.
It is taking a step backward. So now how do
we move forward? And this is part of what you know,
the Boston talk shows and everybody else, is what they're
all talking about. Now, some of it is, you know,
overtly negative, which you know, it's it's it's easy to

(02:05:23):
go negative because everybody wants to have a fresh take.

Speaker 7 (02:05:27):
They want to run him out of town.

Speaker 4 (02:05:29):
Yes they do, and I'm telling you, no, it's not.

Speaker 9 (02:05:34):
But it's done.

Speaker 7 (02:05:35):
And I think it's a thousand pounds of I haven't
said it all year bull crap.

Speaker 4 (02:05:41):
Yeah, I understand that, and I agree with you on
that one, which is why I tend to believe he
isn't gonna lose his job again. I'm gonna leave the
window open crack just a little bit based on how
this team finishes the final three weeks of the regular season,
which is how we actually started the show today. And

(02:06:03):
that's what but but, but but Trey. If this team
gets blown out, you know, fifty two to ten, you know,
twice by Buffalo, who's gonna stomach that? And I would say,
you rightfully shouldn't stomach that. And I think then that's
where ownership has to do a job of some soul
searching here to decide really what is in the best

(02:06:24):
short term as well as long term interest. Long term
interests maybe, but long term entry just isn't gonna pay
the bills and bring fans and put bunts in the seats.
You gotta also think in the short term interest as well.
If this team gets blasted the last three weeks that
it plays, and that's really where we are right.

Speaker 7 (02:06:43):
Now, Well, John, I've already got set in my mind.
Like I said, I'm die hard pages being but man,
looking at how the bill's been operating, and look at
how the page has been operating. I mean, unless this defense,
unless the guys themselves, I mean, because you only Gerald Mayo. Man,

(02:07:07):
he can't for the guys. I mean, hell man, the
only thing they can do anything put the game playing
in and and and say you got this what we're
gonna do? Yeah, I mean so John, in my opinion,
looking at this past Sunday, I'm not too I've been

(02:07:30):
mystic about this. Beef is showing up the plate. I'm
just gonna be honest that I'm not gonna lie to you.
I mean, like I said, we got some pieces now.
But you know, John, Oh my god, yeah, I know
if we're gonna hang out, if the if the Crams
are gonna look to the last three weeks and that

(02:07:54):
man was just going on this fire mail to Daty.

Speaker 4 (02:07:57):
Yeah, I can't really disagree with that one at all. Trey.
I wish you and yours a very happy holiday, Merry Christmas.
Our thanks to uh, you know, Evan Lazaar, Uh to
Russell Baxter uh for our ru Who the hell else
did we have on today? Thank you? Maddy Clap been

(02:08:19):
nipping at the egg too much already. Come on, rook,
what are we doing here? Maddie Clapp from Buffalo bills
for reporting here today. A reminder, Bridge Stone is the
official Tire of the New England Patriots and proud depart
with Sullivan Tire, New England's headquarters for quality Bridgestone tires.
Visit Sullivantire dot com to find a location near you
and Easy to Drink, Easy to enjoy its bud Light,

(02:08:41):
the official beer sponsor of the New England Patriots. My
thanks to the one on the other side of the
glass too, in the Marine, Matt. We're doing everything next week.
We are going to do a playbook on Christmas Eve.
It's gonna be at a different time so that way
we can have the afternoon in the evening to be
with our families on the holiday here in the States.

(02:09:02):
So New Time next week ten a m. Eastern Time
on Christmas Eve Day next Wednesday, Next Tuesday, right the
twenty fourth, So we're gonna move the show to Tuesday
next week. We're gonna go from ten to noon before
Patriots Unfiltered, So we're gonna be the lead into Patriots

(02:09:22):
Unfiltered next Tuesday, where we'll recap the bills and we'll
look ahead to the Chargers. Okay, so there we go.
Stay tuned for that next week New Time. See you then,
Happy holidays.

Speaker 3 (02:09:36):
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Speaker 1 (02:09:59):
Patriots Unfiltered, the world's original podcast. Patriots Unfiltered brings you
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Speaker 2 (02:10:17):
He's a redshirt rookie at that point, so it's really
that's his work. He season essentially too, so now we're
really not talking about them, really knowing.

Speaker 1 (02:10:26):
Search for Patriots Unfiltered anywhere you get your podcasts.