Patriots Unfiltered 4/1: Bill Parcells to Pats HOF, NFL League Meetings, Scouting the Draft

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Some of the content of Patriots Unfiltered may not be
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Speaker 2 (00:09):
The World's a vigeonal podcast Welcome to Patriots Unfiltered.

Speaker 3 (00:20):
A hockey fan, you watch Brad Marshall and you're like,
I hate that guy, but we'll see how he is
now that we get it again.

Speaker 2 (00:24):
I don't think the BIG's gonna be licking people. I'll
not least only eleven minutes in. I'm gonna be good.

Speaker 4 (00:31):
And they got bounced in the divisional round by the Mantles.

Speaker 2 (00:33):
Because he dropped a bomb with the game on the line.

Speaker 4 (00:35):
Okay, I mean he made a bad play, Like, are
gonna well, if they're.

Speaker 5 (00:39):
Gonna bitch about getting the most targets in football, you
need to produce when you're targeting.

Speaker 2 (00:43):
You just said that, that's not what he was bitching about.
He was bitching about not getting the ball when they
were losing him.

Speaker 5 (00:48):
I'm not getting he was pitching about not getting the
ball allway.

Speaker 2 (00:51):
Are you sure about that, man? Is that true? Yes?

Speaker 5 (00:55):
Okay, okay, we can all put I didn't make it
to twelve minutes, but we can all pretend those things didn't.

Speaker 4 (01:00):
You're saying, jot a movie.

Speaker 5 (01:02):
Just to let everyone know, Evan is about thirty four
seconds away from a backhand.

Speaker 2 (01:06):
It's the length of the arms. I don't know why
it matters. I'm not. We told you why. I don't
protest matter.

Speaker 5 (01:11):
I don't pretend to know. It's it's not something that
I care to play dumb. You know I'm not dumb.

Speaker 2 (01:16):
You are.

Speaker 1 (01:17):
This is Patriots Unfiltered.

Speaker 6 (01:19):
Presented by Toyota's official website. For deals, buy a Toyota
dot com.

Speaker 2 (01:25):
All right, welcome to Patriot's Unfiltered. It is Tuesday here
at Jiless Stadium. We got a big newsday. There's a
lot to talk about. It's Evan, it's Paul, it's me,
Matt Nabooth. Deuce is down staring at the sun in Florida.
If you're not staring at my We checked his retina
after that stand up he did yesterday because he was
kind of blinded. Did you see that? You don't you're

(01:47):
not on social media so you can see.

Speaker 4 (01:49):
And I felt bad for him. Yeah, that's that's the worst.
When you're squinting and you know it looks bad.

Speaker 2 (01:54):
Anyway, he's gonna be calling in around twelve thirty or
twelve forty five, somewhere around there. But I guess I
I would think the headline today is Robert Kraft had
his annual media scrum at the Owner's meeting and chose
to use that as an opportunity to announce that he
is selecting Bill Parcells as a contributor to the Patriots

(02:14):
Hall of Fame. Reaction, I think it was the right move.

Speaker 5 (02:19):
I think sometimes you put you know, the other stuff
aside and you do what's right, and I think that
Robert Kraft recognized that.

Speaker 2 (02:26):
I know that the two people.

Speaker 5 (02:30):
That I'm joined by on this panel probably disagree, but
I just feel like you have to get in a
place that modern Patriots fans can't even fathom because you
think this is bad right now, this is nothing compared
to what it winning four games and back to back years.
The way it's gone down four and thirteen, four and thirteen,

(02:52):
this is just regular losing team stuff. Yeah, this is
a mere pittance compared to what Parcels inherited from ninety
to ninety two when they won eight games and three
total three total seasons. But it's not even just about
the record. It's about just the absolute disaster. Many felt
it was the worst organization in professional sports. Yep, Parcels

(03:15):
changed all that for a little bit.

Speaker 2 (03:18):
For his years. He changed it.

Speaker 5 (03:20):
It's never gone back to that. He changed and he
was forever he changed it. They're never going to be
considered the worst organization in the history of sports.

Speaker 2 (03:28):
Again, well, they would have been the organization in Saint
Louis if it wasn't for Robert Kraft. I didn't say that.

Speaker 5 (03:35):
Robert Craft doesn't deserve his flowers too, anybody. We're not
talking about that right now. Evan, you read my story.
Did I have that part of my story?

Speaker 2 (03:42):
Yes? You did? I did, Yes, you did. Evan.

Speaker 4 (03:46):
I'd first say I'd defer to you guys on this
because honestly, I was four when they're in the Super
Bowl in ninety six, so I'm not the best person
to ask this question too. But I just I look
at it on paper, and on paper isn't the same
as what Paul is talking about feeling it and understanding the.

Speaker 2 (04:08):
Moment, impact to the team.

Speaker 4 (04:09):
And all that kind of stuff. And I fully admit
that I just look at it on paper. He had
a five hundred record with the Patriots. I get that.
Was better than what it was before. He made a
Super Bowl and then immediately left right afterwards, and I
know that there was a lot of drama and that
exit strategy that he had, But at the end of
the day, you know, Paul is probably right. He lived it.

Speaker 7 (04:32):
I did.

Speaker 4 (04:32):
I didn't really live it in that capacity. And his
team his Hall of Fame. So mister Kraft feels like
he belongs in the then he's in, so I wouldn't
have put him in personally, But it's not it's not
all I think.

Speaker 2 (04:44):
It's the it's you said it, it's the owner's prerogative,
it's his team, his Hall of Fame. I think it's
the right move for him. It's a magnanimous move. I think,
you know, he's getting older or is old, and he
understands is what it's like to have these things happen
for you while you're still here. He's kind of going

(05:05):
through it himself with the Pro Football Hall of Fame,
and you know, I think maybe I think maybe that
kind of softened his stance. And I'm not saying I
know for a fact a lot of people said a
lot I've heard a lot of people think that the
reason why Parcells hasn't been up in the Hall of
Fame up to now is because of Kraft. That is
one hundred percent not true. Kraft has said behind the scenes,

(05:29):
two people put him in. If you want to vote
him in, vote him in. He would never stand in
the way of that. So that's the part that really
bugs me.

Speaker 5 (05:39):
And you know, I take it personally, and you and
I are been part of the committee since its inception,
and I think we both take it pretty seriously. And
that has often been written. You know, Dan Shaughnessy, who
I really really like.

Speaker 2 (05:51):
I like him personally and I think he's a great,
great columnist.

Speaker 5 (05:54):
Okay, he writes it all the time that the pettiness
at One Patriot Place is the reason why Parcels isn't
in the Hall of Fame. We've nominated him several times,
he's been a finalist five times. The fans are the
ones who aren't putting him in.

Speaker 8 (06:09):
Now.

Speaker 5 (06:10):
My assumption would be if Dan was sitting here with us,
he would say, well, I'd like to see the fan vote.
And I can tell you with certainty that the fans.

Speaker 2 (06:17):
There is no thumb on the scale.

Speaker 5 (06:19):
He's never going to get in. As long as he's
up against any of these modern players. It's the same
problems to a different scale that you know. I got
an even remember Steve BALLISTI I think that's that's his.

Speaker 2 (06:33):
Name, right, I remember he's still aliveat No.

Speaker 9 (06:35):
No.

Speaker 5 (06:36):
But like he was, I remember when he came in.
He was a great, great part of our show. I
call him part of the extended family. He sent me
a really nice note today on you know, my story
of of parcels, and he said, you know, while we're
at it, can we still see if we can do
something for like Chuck Fairbanks and Russ Francis, guys that
absolutely deserve consideration for the Hall of Fame. They're never

(06:57):
going to get in because Russ Francis is never going
to beat out Julian Edelman or Wes Welker or Logan
Mankins or Rob Gronkowski or Adam Viniti and the list
goes on and on.

Speaker 2 (07:07):
You have to get in on the Veterans Committee.

Speaker 5 (07:09):
Right, he'd have to do the same kind of thing
that we're talking about. So I understand how people can
think that, you know, and how Dan can have that, Well,
it's because Robert Kraft doesn't want it in it's because
those petty jerks that are on that committee won't won't
nominate him.

Speaker 2 (07:24):
That's not what it's not. It's not true. So you know,
Robert Craft took it in, you know, matters into his
own hands and put him in knowing that it's going
to be a long time if ever that he gets in.
So good, you know, I think it's the right move
for him personally. You know my stance, and I get it.
This is not an argument.

Speaker 5 (07:43):
I totally understand why you and he he's a polarizing candidate.

Speaker 2 (07:48):
Yeah, and I understand why. Yeah, it's a team Hall
of Fame. To me, the criteria is much different than
the Pro Football Hall of Fame, because I hear a
lot of people say, well, he's good enough for Profooball
Hall of Fame, why isn't he good enough for the
Patriots Hall of Fame. It's a for me, it's a
different criteria.

Speaker 5 (08:06):
So I would just add, and even though I'm pro
parcels being in the Patriots Hall of Fame, it's much different.
Like it's not necessarily the criteria being different, it's he
was thirty two and thirty two, like Evan said, those
are the numbers yeah, so you can make an argument
that that's not good enough to be in the Team
Hall of Fame. Now, I would strongly weigh the circumstances.

(08:31):
They were eight and thirty nine in the three years combined,
leaning into his a writer, no, I know, so I'm
gonna give him a little bit of slack. I don't
even hold that against him the record. What I hold
against him is all the behind the scenes stuff.

Speaker 2 (08:45):
Sure, the drama that he created, the year to year
uncertainty of whether he was going to be here or not,
you know, in the trouble that he caused behind the scenes,
and it was a negative thing. And that's not to
me that it's not being part of all a team
Hall of.

Speaker 5 (09:02):
Fan I get that it all depends on how much
you want to weigh on each side, and that's why
it's an individual choice.

Speaker 2 (09:08):
Yep. So but good. But I think it's a good
thing Roberts the Patriots to have him in there. It'll
be really cool to see him again, you know. I'm
assuming he's going to come up for the event hopefully,
And as Paul said, we will meet on Thursday to
do the normal nomination of a player, so Parcels will

(09:28):
go in as a contributor, but we will still have
a player this year. We'll have three players this year nominated,
and then the fans will vote and whoever gets the
highest vote will go in with parcels.

Speaker 4 (09:39):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (09:40):
I do like that stacked class by the way, Yeah, that.

Speaker 4 (09:42):
It's a contributor category. Like putting him up on the
on the ballot was getting like a little bit tiresome.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (09:49):
Yeah, he's never going to get in on fan vote,
so putting him in as a contributor doesn't feel quite
as all right, we didn't have to continue doing the nomination.
It was five times on the back.

Speaker 5 (10:01):
It almost gets to you know, in Rabel dealt with this.
You know, Rabe was a five time finalist, I believe
before he did so. Yeah, it almost becomes a point
where it's almost embarrassing, right, and it shouldn't be.

Speaker 2 (10:13):
It should be an honor. I tell the story about
going to Nashville for a conference and I was in
the first row a woman and her son sitting next
to me, and I hear the woman say, why do
they just keep nominating? He's never going to get in.
Why don't they just take his name off? And I
realized it was Rabel's wife and his son, and at
the end I introduced myself and I said, he'll get
in eventually, don't worry.

Speaker 4 (10:33):
Yeah, I know. It's a stacked class this time around, though,
I'm very interested to see because my generation of Patriot
fan Julian Edelman is one of the all time all
timer's and is still very much in the public eye
with his podcast and media career. Adam VINITERI probably should

(10:55):
get in first just on order of operations, but there's
going to be a lot of people that are twenty
tens die hards.

Speaker 2 (11:03):
Oh yeah, that are.

Speaker 4 (11:04):
Going to vote on Edelman because of his popularity sure
with the fan base, and that'll be interesting. I would
vote for Vinitary just because I think order matters.

Speaker 2 (11:14):
I'm surprised that you have that take.

Speaker 4 (11:16):
Yeah, I just think he needs to be in.

Speaker 2 (11:18):
Well, I think the Patriots Vinitaria didn't get lucky, but
the Patriots got lucky that he didn't get into the
Pro Football Hall of Fame in his first ballot, because
then it allows us to get him into the Patriots
Hall of Fame first. Yeah, so let's take advantage of
that and do it.

Speaker 4 (11:34):
Yeah, I mean, there's no dynasty with the vanitary right.

Speaker 5 (11:36):
He'd be my pick too. But yeah, I mean I
could definitely see. I mean I'd be surprised if Edelman
doesn't win. I think what Evans said is right. I
think he's a fan favorite, and I think he's much
more in the public.

Speaker 2 (11:48):
I think I give more credit to the fans. I
think they would. I'll waiting for them to prove military
is on the ballot. He will get along. We've been
doing this, I don't know fifty years. I'm waiting now.
I meant the Hall of fam So I was kidding.
I'm waiting for them to prove me wrong. Yeah, all right,
So so that's that to me. That was the headline today,

(12:08):
right is that? Would you agree? I would say that
was that was big news.

Speaker 5 (12:11):
And you got some some league matters that are that
are coming down to with some rule rule proposals and changes.

Speaker 2 (12:18):
We'll get into some rule debate rule changes. Whether you
agree with him or not, we'll talk about that. Like
I said, so we'll be calling in. Uh so maybe
we'll wait until he calls in to kind of kick
off that discussion.

Speaker 1 (12:33):
Uh.

Speaker 5 (12:33):
And you know, we heard from Vrabel yesterday and there
was some I thought some.

Speaker 2 (12:37):
Yeah, you guys getting a lot of criticism, which guy Felger.
Oh is he really? So? Felger had an exclusive, He
had a one on one because I guess he's set
up down in Florida. Well he requested that. Yeah, but
he's down in Florida. His parents' house is very close. Yeah,
so he's taken advantage of being down there, and you know,
so we set up, uh and he had very and

(13:01):
a lot of people on your station, uh criticizing him
for being a softie. It's like, you know, you're the
first person to criticize the media for being too soft
and then here you are yucking it up. Yeah. Yeah,
I thought he was Okay, I'm just gonna look that.
One said, I you know, Paul doesn't want to you know,

(13:23):
but I you know why why No, If you don't,
then I'm not gonna say anything. Okay. Well he was
soft on him. Yeah, but I thought it was fine.
Like he asked, like he talked. He said, I has
said that, or maybe that was Wolf that he said
that too. Yeah. I guess he was soft with Rabel.
He was soft with both of them. With Wolf, heily,

(13:44):
he admitted that, you know, I said that when you
when Rabel got here, all you would be doing is
checking the fax machine, getting coffee and the players and
turning off the lights at the end of the night.
So he admitted that. You know, so I don't think
he was necessarily off with Well, maybe he was a
little soft with Rabel, yucking it up a little bit.

Speaker 5 (14:05):
I thought you were making fun of him because I
guess he did an eighteen minute interview with Rabel and
they lost connectivity for like five minutes, and he didn't know,
so they lost a chunk of the audio. They got
it like it's poor quality.

Speaker 2 (14:19):
Yeah, so they.

Speaker 5 (14:22):
Were making fun of him for not having any idea
of what he's doing, Like from a tech point like me,
he'd be like me, like that would happen certainly for that.

Speaker 2 (14:31):
But before that, Rabel had his breakfast with the media
thirty four minutes. Yeah, so on extended talk, What did
you glean from that? Anything interesting? Newsworthy?

Speaker 4 (14:44):
I wrote about it on Patriots dot com. There's a
few a few things that stood out. He was asked
specifically about a few prospects, which obviously he spoke lowingly about,
Tyler Warren, Travis Hunter, Abdul Will Campbell, armand Membu didn't
get asked about Abdul Carter, but you know, all positive stuff.

(15:07):
But I thought, what was a couple of things I
thought were interesting? First one very clearly in the running
back business. In the draft, he basically said we're going
to draft a running back, and then today mister Kraft
basically said we're going to draft a running back too.
So it sounds like running back is in play. But
I wouldn't say, based off of variables and answers that

(15:30):
gent is really what they're looking at, right. You know,
I think that they he's well, every time he's been
asked about running backs, he's back from Andre Stevenson instead
of the fumbling was not just his fault. You know
that he's got guys hanging all over him and you
know there's unblocked you know, rushers, things like that.

Speaker 2 (15:48):
I don't like that.

Speaker 4 (15:49):
So he's back to Andre a handful of times now.
So I don't think that they're looking to push for
Mare completely out. But he said that they would like
to have a young running back with some juice, you know,
some speed, And mister Kraft said specifically a speedback. You know,
he said, you know someone that's got some speed, So
I think that's on the docket. There's still Will Campbell's

(16:12):
a tackle. You know, they feel like he's a tackle.
He gave the line of SEC you know, competition, and
he held up in the SEC, so why not in
the NFL. And you know, Travis Hunter just pushed piecing
together all the different media stuff that him and Wolf
did yesterday. I still feel like, pretty strongly that if

(16:33):
Travis Hunter is there at four, they are running that
card as fast as they possibly can.

Speaker 2 (16:38):
Listen, assuming he's not, though, and assuming Carter's not, I'm
all in on Will Campbell. I've decided I am all
in on Will Campbell. I like what he has had
to say. I like what his supporters have had to
say about him and his attitude and his his you know,
toughness and all that. And listen, at the end end

(17:00):
of the day, if the worst thing is that he's
a really great guard for us for ten years, then
I'm willing to take that chance, you know, in this draft,
in this particular draft. So I'm I'm all in on
Will Campbell.

Speaker 4 (17:14):
Yeah, I definitely feels you know, they pick four, so
you need four players on your on your board at four, right,
you're not gonna put eight guys because you're not. You
don't need that many guys. So, just reading through the
lines a little bit, I think Abdul Carter and Travis
Hunter are obviously going to be on that short list.
And I think the two tackles, Campbell and Membu, and
I think they're going to decide which would they rather

(17:36):
flip Membo from right to left or I'd rather have
the guy.

Speaker 2 (17:40):
That's played left tackle, you know, and has good tape,
by the way, played against good competition.

Speaker 5 (17:47):
I wouldn't argue with any either one of those mentalities.

Speaker 2 (17:51):
I don't want it.

Speaker 5 (17:52):
I if I'm going to take a tackle that high
in the draft, I needed to be a sure fire
left tackle and I don't, and there isn't one, so
I'm looking somewhere else, But I don't. This is not
one of those I'm gonna ye go to.

Speaker 2 (18:04):
The mattresses with you on. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (18:06):
I think it makes perfect sense to say he's a
really good tackle in the SEC.

Speaker 2 (18:11):
Let's make it.

Speaker 5 (18:12):
Let's let's find out if he can do it before
we just say he can't.

Speaker 2 (18:15):
But here's the thing. With all the guys after Hunter
and Carter, there's kind of stuff with all of them.
The good The thing I like about Campbell he's got
a safety net. If he doesn't play tackle, he can
play guard. If you take Tech McMillan and he's not
a good wide receiver, you're not making him a corner back.
The five other guys, you know, like like like the

(18:35):
other guys, the other guys, if they're not good at
their position, now you're screwed. So I feel like I
have a safety net.

Speaker 5 (18:43):
That's one guy, Teed McMillan, who also has a lot
of questions, but he's probably not even gonna go in
the top ten.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
If it takes Mason Graham and he's not good at
his position, what do you do with him?

Speaker 5 (18:54):
If Will Campbell is not good at his position, that's
a bust of a pick.

Speaker 2 (18:58):
He plays guard. Yeah, I know when that's not that's
not good value. But that's not good value forget about
the Mason. But we've already established that there in this draft.

Speaker 5 (19:07):
If Mason Graham is not a very good defensive tackle,
he's going to continue to play defensive tackle.

Speaker 4 (19:12):
They're not just going to cut him, but he's not
going to be good at it, Just.

Speaker 2 (19:16):
Like the guy who can't play tech, he can be
good at guard. There's a safety net, is what I'm saying.

Speaker 5 (19:22):
I don't like that reasoning for I don't want to
take a safety net pick at number four.

Speaker 2 (19:26):
But you're not going to find a guy in Tyler at.

Speaker 4 (19:29):
Four, Tyler Warren Fashton Genty.

Speaker 2 (19:31):
But all these guys, if for some reason they're not
good at their position, there's no fallback.

Speaker 4 (19:36):
But why are they not good at their position?

Speaker 2 (19:39):
Who knows? Do you know for certain thing? Do you
know for certain that Will Campbell's going to be a
really good guard? Yes? You do? Yes?

Speaker 4 (19:45):
Okay, then I know for certain that Ashton Genty is
going to be a really.

Speaker 2 (19:48):
Good Kay, Then you're gonna pick Ashton Genty. I'd rather
pick him than a guard.

Speaker 5 (19:51):
Yes, but you're not picking well okay, if you can't
play tackle, I don't want them.

Speaker 2 (19:55):
Okay, But the assumption if you take him is that
he can't have a and I'll play with that. I say,
assumption if you take Genty is that he can. But
if he can't, there's no fallback.

Speaker 5 (20:04):
See what I started this when I said to you,
I have no problem doing the Will Campbell can play
left tackle like the argument that Evan made. I think
last week strong competition in the SEC left tackle he has,
he has.

Speaker 2 (20:22):
The profile I have.

Speaker 5 (20:23):
So you're telling me the arms don't matter as much
to you as others left tackle. But I'm not doing
it because I have a safety net if it doesn't work.

Speaker 2 (20:32):
I'm just saying that doesn't make any particular draft. I
haven't heard anyone that says that's that guy's worth a
fourth pick, and so I would agree with that. So
you're compromising with everybody and at least in this compromise.

Speaker 5 (20:46):
But it might have a fallback. I get that, and
you're right. I don't think if you disagree, I jump
in like I don't think there is a guy at
the fourth pick that.

Speaker 4 (20:58):
Is usually I get that fired up about the draft.

Speaker 5 (21:01):
You know, but I agree with Fred like I, like
I said, I really go to the mattresses with you,
because there really I don't think there is a guy
at the fourth pick that's consensus you have to take him, right.

Speaker 2 (21:11):
I don't think that exists.

Speaker 4 (21:12):
This has been a pain point for me with this draft,
trying to talk about this draft for months because it's
just the talent at the top is not there this year.
The talent at the top is not there. So you
can draft. You can go through five, six, seven different names,
and all of them have warks. Whether it's the position
that they play, it's their athletic profiles, it's their arms

(21:34):
are too short, their smaller prospects for their position. One's
a right tackle that you're gonna have to play at
left tackle. One's got short arms. Ted McMillan's a slow receiver.
You know, he's a mid four to fives receiver. Like,
is that you're taking that at four overall? You know,
Tyler Warren is a really good player, but I think
his best trait is versatility. I don't think he's a

(21:54):
dominant athlete necessarily. I think he's a very versatile, very
well run tight end. That's great, but I don't think
that's worth the fourth overall pick in most drafts. That's
not this year, right. So what I've continued to say
is that this is where filling needs and improving, you know,
weaknesses in the football team comes into play more in

(22:17):
a draft like this than a draft like maybe last year,
where you could make an honest case for Malik Neighbors
or Jolt Right or you know, Marvin Harrison Junior or whatever.
This is not that class. Unfortunately, there's the talent, he's
not there at the top.

Speaker 5 (22:32):
Yeah, and like that's I would agree with you that
no one thinks that X is the guy that should
be taken fourth. So I'm okay with Will Campbell. I
don't want this. I'm a sort of proceeding. I just
would say that, like you're talking about this, no one
that has the value of the fourth overall pick. Well,
in my view, this is not like fact. This is
just my view. God would be the least valuable thing

(22:54):
that you could take at that pick. So if you
don't think you can play tackle, I wouldn't do it.

Speaker 2 (22:58):
Yeah, No, I would rather have I do think he
can play.

Speaker 5 (23:01):
I would rather have a guy who turns out to
be an average tight end or an average running back
than a good a really good guard.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
No, I agree with that. I would if he was
a guard, I wouldn't even consider him at four. So
if they want to take him as a tackle that
I won't be I want. I will be hard to
push and convince. That's what I am recommending.

Speaker 4 (23:20):
But I think what what Fred's getting at too is
let's say as a rookie, you he's your best left
tackle on the roster. Right, I think that's not debatable.
So you're gonna play him at left tackle as a rookie.
But if we go into next offseason and Rashaan Slater
is a free agent and actually hits unrestricted free agency
and you can throw twenty five million dollars at Rashawn Slater,

(23:43):
is it the worst thing in the world to then
kick Campbell inside to left guard and have a left
side for the next five years. That's Rashaun Slater and
Will Campbell.

Speaker 5 (23:51):
No, But would it be the worst thing in the
world if you just plug in somebody at left tackle
like Kayden Wallace, who vrabel said yesterday, I think will
get a look there and just you know, fill the
spot for a year and then sign Machan's later next year. Yes,
I think what's the difference. Kane Wallace might get your
quarterback killed.

Speaker 4 (24:09):
That's important.

Speaker 5 (24:10):
I mean, if if Will Campbell can't play tackle, why
is he not getting your quarterback?

Speaker 4 (24:14):
Well, because I don't think that he can't play tackle.
He just might not be as good of a tackle
as he would be at guard.

Speaker 5 (24:20):
But I'm talking he's not going to be able to
play the position.

Speaker 4 (24:23):
I don't think that that's I think he'll have a
baseline level of being able to play the position. It's
more just you know, what's what's his upside at tackle
versus what's his upside at guard?

Speaker 5 (24:32):
And I also don't love the idea of well, you know,
because we've fallen into this before, you know, well, you
have the safety that he's a great guard, Like, okay,
if you say so. I mean there's plenty of guys
that get taken that is short fire players in the
top ten that don't end up being good.

Speaker 2 (24:46):
Yeah. I think Jonathan Cooper was like a six to
overall pick. I think he's stunk.

Speaker 4 (24:52):
I wouldn't like I would just look at Will Campbell
as a tackle and leave it there. But I I
understand where he's coming from that if worst comes to worse,
then you can move him inside right, and he still
has an NFL career playing on the inside.

Speaker 2 (25:07):
This but I think there's all these reasons not to
take these guys at four. I'm looking for a reason
to take a guy at four. I don't like that reason.
I mean, in this draft, you have to I guess you're.

Speaker 5 (25:18):
Making an assumption that I'm not willing to make. Okay,
he's going to be a great guard, Like I don't
know that.

Speaker 2 (25:23):
Well, I'm looking. I'm looking for reasons. I'm looking. I'm
trying to make lemon out of lemonade. I mean lemonade
out of lemons.

Speaker 4 (25:30):
Yeah, you know what I mean. I think the biggest
thing to advocate for will camp, which I've done plenty
of so I don't have to keep doing it. But
the football character and the guy that you're getting apparently.

Speaker 2 (25:44):
Off the I love that too.

Speaker 4 (25:46):
Yeah, Like you are getting a guy that most project
will be like a year or two captain and like
a captain for your football team for like the next
ten years.

Speaker 2 (25:55):
By the way I talked about it last week, I've
come up with the fool proof measuring system for these guys.
And I mentioned like guys that block like this. I
mentioned I mentioned you should do it from So here's
how it works. Okay, he's leaning up against the wall,
his head has to be touching the wall, arms out,

(26:15):
fingers up, and then there's a measurement on the floor.
All right. Then there's a sliding thing that comes up
and meets his hand, his hands and you can't fudge it.
You can't fudge it. It is what it is. Everyone's
the same and you know exactly what is the base
of his hands, what the measurement is, and there's no

(26:36):
fudging it. There's no leaning forward because his back has
to be against the wall, head has to be touching,
and everyone is apples to apples, and there is no
inconsistency with this measuring system. Call it the Fred Kersh
Lineman arm length measuring system.

Speaker 4 (26:53):
You know it's crazy, is you could probably make some
money off of that, Like the NFL will pay you
a lot of money if you actually could manufact this.

Speaker 2 (27:00):
Oh yeah machine. It's portable, but it's full proof. It
is full proof.

Speaker 4 (27:06):
Yeah, it's a tough draft.

Speaker 10 (27:10):
WHA.

Speaker 5 (27:13):
Why are we're just gonna talk about arm length forever?

Speaker 2 (27:16):
But especially if they I want to put no, you
would you incorporate my system and you do away with
the talk forever. You don't ever have to talk about
it anymore because it's there's no controversy. It is what
it is. This is the number. There's no fudging it,
and now we don't have to talk about this arm

(27:37):
length all the time.

Speaker 4 (27:40):
I do think we talk a lot more about the
arm length than the people actually making these decisions in
the NFL do I. I don't think a lot of
people are are having these extensive conversations that actually make
decisions in the in the league about arm length. I
think this is all all, all the combine stuff. All
this stuff is always secondary to the tape, like what

(28:01):
what does you do on tape? And then you know,
we get into these other things I think are small
pieces to the puzzle, not the main pieces of the puzzle.

Speaker 2 (28:10):
But it's a tough to main pieces is tape. Yeah,
and I like what I see I do. And the
second some people agree with you. And the second piece
is his character and his football, love of football and
its toughness. I would say everybody agrees. And I love
that too. So I'm all in on Will Campbell sign
me up?

Speaker 4 (28:29):
Yeah, I'm good.

Speaker 5 (28:30):
You guys are selling me. As long as he plays tackle,
I'm good.

Speaker 2 (28:33):
If Carter or Hunter are there, now I have to
start thinking, now, I'm probably gonna take Hunter or Carter,
but I'm assuming they're not going to be there.

Speaker 4 (28:40):
Yeah. Look, there's there's outliers at everything. There there's outliers
for short arm tackles, and there's outliers for right tackles
moving to left tackle. You know Tristan Wharf's move from
right to left. Your guy, Tyrone Smith moved from right
to left us the right tackle at USC. But those
are the only two guys that have done it at
a really high level in the last like twenty years

(29:03):
or so. So you're talking about two guys that might
be in the Pro Football Hall of Fame someday as
the armand Membu comp right. You know, you were talking
about some really good players. You know, Jedrick Willis did
it too, but I don't think Jeddrick Wills is in
that category with those other two. But but you know,
both of them are kind of outliers.

Speaker 2 (29:22):
Just a funny note. I was on Peloton last night
and there's a program in Peloton where you can choose
to you can choose to ride through like cities or whatever,
and one of the options was Marseille, France. Eric would
like that. So I'm, you know, I'm I'm riding through
the city street and the like tours everywhere there's a
young kid with a Drake May North Carolina shirt on.

(29:45):
I couldn't believe it. That was so that was funny
of all the random college shirts. There's Drake May in Marseille.

Speaker 4 (29:53):
Wow, Paul wants to get them killed. But what scrub
left tackles out there? Oh?

Speaker 2 (29:58):
I think that's what. All right, careful myself, careful, all right,
just in case. So we're going to talk about rule
changes coming up. We talked about Robert Craft and Mike Vrabel,
Bill Parcells. We talked about the draft. One thing about
Robert kraft scrum that I thought was interesting, him getting

(30:19):
a little bit kind of edgy when asked about succession,
and he said, you know, that's kind of a biased question,
you know, talking about age. In other words, I'm not
going anywhere, so why I you know, we have a plan,
don't worry about it, but you know, don't kick me
out of the door before I'm ready. Did you catch
that I did?

Speaker 4 (30:40):
Yeah, I have no problem. Like I get why the
question was asked, obviously, But is anybody confused as to
who's taking over the team next? Like we all know right, Well,
that's the part that confused me about the question.

Speaker 2 (30:55):
Robert's going to outlive me, so you know, you know,
like that's not even.

Speaker 5 (30:59):
I didn't see Robert's scrum.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
Oh you didn't know, I feel like they didn't post it.
It's posted now, okay, but we didn't cover that live,
like we know.

Speaker 5 (31:10):
I knew that, but I didn't. You guys sounded like
you had all seen it.

Speaker 2 (31:14):
Well I saw it because I think somebody else posted it.
Maybe Mark Daniels is somebody else.

Speaker 4 (31:19):
I watched the whole thing before it's up on the
site and YouTube and everything.

Speaker 2 (31:23):
Now, yeah he did.

Speaker 4 (31:26):
But that was just my takeaway from the court. I mean,
like it's I think it's pretty obvious who's next in
line to run the team, right, I.

Speaker 2 (31:33):
Mean many say he's already running the team, right. So yeah,
so okay, what else?

Speaker 4 (31:41):
Anything more questions about the team plane? Fred?

Speaker 2 (31:45):
Oh, and that's a good by the way. By the way,
I'm glad that Robert addressed that because I'm we're on
the plane. You've been on the plane? Have you been
on the new plane? I have, but I don't not
like you guys every week, Like I didn't want to
come out and say it on the show because I
don't go back in the players. I've gone through it
quickly to get off the plane. But I didn't take

(32:07):
an audit. But I have never seen an ashtray on
that plane. I just didn't want to say because I
couldn't have been sure. But there's no ash trays on
that plane.

Speaker 4 (32:18):
I've never seen an ara No. I Sometimes I feel
like when the things about the plane come up, I
do get a little bit like annoyed by it because
the treatment that we get when we go on that
plane is, yeah.

Speaker 2 (32:33):
You're catered first class. But somebody's filling out that NFLPA
survey and they could have made a joke the plane
is so old that has ashtrays. It could have been
a throwaway line, but it's taken as gospel because there's
no way to like, oh, are you serious about that
or not? But there's no ashtrays on the plane.

Speaker 4 (32:51):
Not that I've seen. I mean, there's certainly things that
they could upgrade. We've talked about it, you know that
they that could be upgrade.

Speaker 2 (32:56):
Yeah, the Wi Fi can be better, for sure.

Speaker 4 (32:59):
Yeah. But the service that you get on this plane, right,
you are you are on Air Force one, like you,
The amount of food that they throw at you, the
attention that the stewardess is, it's just just yeah, they
call him flight Is that a different name?

Speaker 2 (33:19):
Yeah? It is now but anyway, I would make the
same mistake. But the whole travel, the whole travel process
itself is I think top notch. I think a few
years ago, particularly with Belichick, there were a couple like
hotels that he liked to go to because of maybe
they were a little bit more secluded that we're probably
less than a four star hotel. And I think that

(33:40):
when the last nfl PA survey came out, they said,
you know, we got to stop going of those you know,
uh hotels in New Jersey that are right on the highway.
And so all the hotels we stay at now are
at least four star hotels. Like I said, everything is
the players get catered to. It's everything they want, they

(34:00):
get the only way to travel. I say it all
the time.

Speaker 5 (34:03):
People ask me what it's like. It's like spoil you
for traveling regular.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
So I didn't understand f when it came to the travel,
I don't. I don't understand like where that came from.
But you know, I'm sure there were some other reasons.
But there's no ashtrays on the plane.

Speaker 4 (34:20):
Yeah, I definitely feel the same way.

Speaker 2 (34:22):
I just don't have anything.

Speaker 5 (34:23):
To compare it to, So I don't know what other
teams do.

Speaker 4 (34:26):
That's fair.

Speaker 5 (34:27):
I just can't imagine, you know. And I did it
for what ten twelve fifteen years with you, Freddie, I
never had any issues, right, and that was before even.

Speaker 2 (34:36):
The time that I was late. Dante scolded me when
I got on the plane. I mean, just if he
didn't really matter. He just gave me a shake.

Speaker 4 (34:44):
The amount of food alone that they give you, oh well,
even just for a flight to New Jersey to go
play the Jets is like, you know, you could eat
for a week just through all the options that they have.
So I I don't know, I don't know how you
can really complain to you.

Speaker 2 (35:00):
Yeah, but I'm glad he said that, you know, out loud,
because I wanted to say it, but I just, well,
maybe there's a couple out back that I don't know about,
you know anyway.

Speaker 4 (35:12):
Yeah, yeah, I also not that it was like it
was kind of common sense. But he had a line
in there about the draft, and he kind of picked
out some positions which I thought was interesting that they
would target in the draft.

Speaker 2 (35:28):
And then because she would leave that out, I wish
you would just say, I defer to the people that
I paid to do that stuff.

Speaker 4 (35:34):
Yeah, so you know, offensive line receiver, and he said
speed running back in particular, not not you know.

Speaker 2 (35:41):
Somebody told him that.

Speaker 4 (35:42):
That's that's sort of what I'm getting at, Like we're
not talking about Lagara Blunt. He said speed running back specifically,
and I can't imagine that he's He caught himself and said,
you know, just speaking as a fan, I was like, well, obviously,
like the.

Speaker 2 (35:57):
Year when Pete Carroll got here and they were talking
about the draft, and all of a sudden, Robert Kraft
started using this term press corner up to then, like
he hadn't really used that. Yeah, just stop, I remember that.

Speaker 4 (36:12):
Yeah, but my next mock draft will be tackle receiver
running back. I can tell you that because he basically
just told you that that's that's what they're going to do.
So yeah, it is common sense a little bit though.

Speaker 5 (36:24):
Okay, Cam Scataboo, Yeah, I want him on my Freddy
would be like, just beside himself.

Speaker 2 (36:30):
I want him on my football team. And I like
this Trapillo guy too. As a later round pick.

Speaker 5 (36:37):
He's gonna be I think, Yeah, he's you identify guys
in the seventh round that go in the second and
third all the time.

Speaker 4 (36:46):
Yeah, Skataboo worries me about longevity. You know, the way
he plays and how hard he plays, well.

Speaker 2 (36:52):
He's not going to get the reps he gets in
college here.

Speaker 4 (36:54):
Yeah, but the amount of contact that he takes.

Speaker 5 (36:57):
On he doesn't avoid contact, would worry me.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
But small shelf life. We need that toughness.

Speaker 4 (37:04):
That that game against that game against Texas.

Speaker 2 (37:08):
Paul doesn't like toughness lest grace in eliteness. Yeah, that
wins until you get hit in the mouth and then
grace goes down the tubes. Speed, speed in size sp
is good. Taekwon Thornton. No oh, he wasn't speedy. He
wasn't good, okay, but he was fast so fast alone, doesn't.

Speaker 5 (37:28):
You know what you guys all told me he was fast.
I gotta be honest with you. And I never saw
that manifested on the field he was fast. I never
saw him look fast on the field. I never saw
him run behind guys on the field.

Speaker 2 (37:39):
Fast correct, and that's not fast, And there's a difference.

Speaker 5 (37:42):
I don't care about track and field. I care about football.
And I never saw the speed that you guys told
me about that Mac Road. You'll get us Mac Rove
mac grobe.

Speaker 2 (37:51):
Remember when he figured I think it was actually you,
wasn't it you? That he was sort of teasing.

Speaker 4 (37:56):
Probably want.

Speaker 2 (38:00):
It?

Speaker 4 (38:00):
It was before you.

Speaker 2 (38:01):
And didn't he wasn't it you that asked a question
about it might not?

Speaker 4 (38:04):
I don't. I don't remembers. I don't want to say
it was me, but I think it was.

Speaker 5 (38:08):
And he said, you know, you're really grinding the tape
on that one, like he was being sucked.

Speaker 4 (38:12):
He was being discri actually probably. Yeah, So I never
saw it.

Speaker 5 (38:19):
I never saw that football speed that we were talking about.

Speaker 8 (38:22):
It.

Speaker 4 (38:22):
He was not football fast. And I think that that
was a good lesson for for everybody, myself included, when
watching a lot of these guys. You know, there are
guys that are football fast and there are guys that
are track fast.

Speaker 2 (38:33):
Also, a guy that has to run around in the
shower to get wet might be a little bit fragile.
Right yeah, yeah, fair point too. But I think, you know,
but can't we have a little bit of everything, Like.

Speaker 5 (38:42):
Can I get some can we get some some speed
and athleticism and big playability and you know.

Speaker 2 (38:48):
You know, sure get some power.

Speaker 5 (38:49):
I mean, yeah, like the Eagles, you know, they're great
on both sides of the line.

Speaker 2 (38:52):
You know, they have more than their share of power.

Speaker 5 (38:55):
But they also have a j Brown and DeVante Smith
and I think Dallas Goddard is a very underrated athletic
tight end. Saquon Barkley. I mean these guys are elad
athletes too.

Speaker 4 (39:06):
Yeah, I think you hear a lot more nowadays. Play
speed like that's like a new kind of buzzword, is like,
you know, what's his play speed? Because we have all
this JPS tracking data and on top of that, you're
just you want to see if the guy's actually football fast.
You know, I don't really care if you're in the
four two eight anymore. So that there's a lot more
of that going.

Speaker 2 (39:25):
Fred wants to bring Toby Gerhat back. Oh, I like hot, Yeah,
not a bad scataboo come, speaking of speed and power,
if I was inclined to go that way Astroon Genty,
I would. He's an impressive specimen.

Speaker 4 (39:44):
I guess his.

Speaker 2 (39:45):
Deuce has already got your beat on that one. Yeah,
he's an impressive specimen.

Speaker 4 (39:48):
He's very good.

Speaker 2 (39:49):
He saw that pro day with his shirt off and
he's like.

Speaker 4 (39:53):
My gosh, what's he's sculpted.

Speaker 2 (39:56):
He is something. Yeah, I mean, you know, like he's
a big guy. Like I think he's only like five
eight five nine, five eight, but he's thick five eight,
thick is fifteen, all muscle, all muscle, those tree trunks
and holy crap. Yeah no, I mean he's he's somebody's
gonna get themselves a good player when they speak him.

Speaker 5 (40:21):
But you don't want it because there's no safety net
if he's you know, it's just not a great running back.

Speaker 2 (40:25):
There's nothing else for him to do, so you don't
want I think he might be the one exception. I
think he's gonna be good. That was snarky. I know
it's fair enough, but I think I think whoever picks him,
I think they're gonna get good value.

Speaker 4 (40:37):
Yeah, I mean, well that's the question.

Speaker 2 (40:38):
I'm with Evan on running backs.

Speaker 4 (40:40):
The word is value. But it's hard if you draft
him that early. And he's Bjon Robinson, who's a really
good running back. But like, what has that really led
to for Atlanta? Like it hasn't turned Atlanta around that
they have a really talented running back. And I actually,
you know, Bijeon was bigger in.

Speaker 5 (40:57):
Barkley Barkley was a top five pick right and overall, and.

Speaker 2 (41:02):
You got hurt a lot though with the g Well,
that's part of it.

Speaker 5 (41:04):
I know at that position, that's that's going to happen.
And you know, Christian McCaffrey with the Panthers, like, there's
only so much you can do. But I do understand that,
you know, people push back. You know, the guys that
defend the running backs push back against against our types

(41:24):
Evan and I and you know Felger is also in
our in our class with that.

Speaker 2 (41:30):
Isn't that that the same for any position? I mean,
if you have this.

Speaker 5 (41:33):
Great wide receiver on the outside, but you don't have
any way to get them the ball, right, I mean,
what good is it? You know, Malik Neighbors was as
good as any rookie wide receiver last year, but the
Giants stunk.

Speaker 2 (41:43):
They didn't have the rest. So if it's not quarterback,
the other pieces put you over the top. They you know,
but you got to have the quarterback. You've got to
have good quarterback play in.

Speaker 4 (41:51):
This Well, that's what it might separate the Patriots from
the Giants and the Carolina Panthers. And of those two,
they have the quarterback, we think, but they have a
talented young quarterback. I just think the biggest thing with
Genty is, besides the running back value conversation, is he
carried the ball seven hundred and fifty times in college,

(42:13):
Like he was the Boise State offense. You know, they literally,
you know, gave him the ball in every way possible.
So yeah, the way I look at his career path
could be very similar to somebody like Zeke Elliott, who
was really really good out of the gate, you know,
had a really strong rookie contract and then just has
started to tail off almost completely. At this point, how

(42:34):
long are you going to have peak Ashton Genty based
off of all of that?

Speaker 2 (42:39):
Yeah, not everyone's Curtis Martin. You know that can last
for a good point for EMMITTT. Smith. Yeah, all right,
eight five to five Pats five hundred is the hot line.
We don't have a Do we have a sponsor for
the hotline yet? Nope, We're still We're still calling a
Patriots houtline. All right, today's April First? Has any been

(43:00):
any April Fools jokes?

Speaker 4 (43:03):
Tiger Woods had a good one. He said he was
going to play in the Masters.

Speaker 2 (43:06):
Oh yeah, and then he said, April fools. Yeah, oh
big head. Text me and Paul when uh Ourcell's announcement, King,
is this an April Fools joke? How cool would that
have to be to make that an April Fool's joke
that Robert like, we would get all kinds of criticism.
Oh my god, I mean that even I would say

(43:26):
that's that's too cruel. You know anyway today, Oh April Fools,
that's pretty cruel at that age. Wo yayh that's hardcore.
All right, let's get to the hotline. We'll start with
Sam in North Carolina. Hey Sam, Sam? Oh there he is?

(43:51):
What's up, Sam?

Speaker 8 (43:53):
What's going on? Guys? I just want to say that
I think Parter fall into us or towards the Travis
Hunter becomes more and more relistic. I think Cleveland might
take Shador number two. It's really my dream. I'd like
to have that quarter and then do the trade up
thing like Laaren talks about and come back get ersty
or kan.

Speaker 2 (44:13):
So what makes you think that they'll take your door?
Have you any information that you've come across or is
it just a gut feeling.

Speaker 8 (44:21):
I mean, right now, they don't have any starting quarterback.
You've got Key small hand King and you got de
Shaun Watson that ain't even going to play just towards Karvy, right,
But I mean they need a quarterback.

Speaker 2 (44:33):
Yeah, yeah, I mean I think, all right, I don't
kind of a weird connection.

Speaker 5 (44:40):
But thanks Sam, I don't see much of a chance
of that. And I'm just going by the scuttle. But
that has been going on for what two maybe three
weeks Now it seems like it's a done deal with
him in Kirk Cleveland and Kirk Cousins. Now you might say,
why are they gonna after the year that Kirk Cousins
had last year, why would they want him? Fair point,

(45:00):
fair argument, But that's what it seems like it's going to. Personally,
I would rather run it with Kenny Pickett than draft
shod with Sanders at two. Like, I don't really see
much of it.

Speaker 2 (45:13):
You know.

Speaker 5 (45:14):
It's not like you're passing on one of the guys
last year in the top three, Drake May, and you're
gonna say, oh, we're good, we got Kenny Pickett. There's
a lot of questions about you doing was this whole.

Speaker 2 (45:25):
Thing with Deshaun Watson trade and Dak Prescott was that
all bs, Yes, so there was nothing to.

Speaker 4 (45:31):
Yeah, Dak Prescott actually has a no trade cause, so
it would be that. Yeah, okay, But Kirk Cousins in Cleveland,
it seems like that's gonna happen post draft.

Speaker 5 (45:42):
Maybe it sounds like, Yeah, I guess Cousins is adamant
that he does not want to He won't agree to
a deal until after the draft. Yeah, because he doesn't
want to get Michael Pennix again.

Speaker 2 (45:51):
Jimmy Haslam was quoted, Yeah, last week is saying, and
we really screwed up.

Speaker 5 (45:55):
That's accountability. Yeah, I mean, I know, but small solace
for Cleveland fans.

Speaker 2 (45:59):
But he could have listened to a million people before
and avoided that. So, you know, I just think the
contract was I'm'm getting the player. It was the contract.

Speaker 5 (46:10):
But I've heard a ton of criticism forgetting the player,
and I don't get that.

Speaker 2 (46:13):
Oh no, no, other than the fact that he's.

Speaker 5 (46:15):
A you know, off field stuff, right, you know, like
that's a different argument. But like the problem to me
is you're giving a guy with all kinds of off
field issues a guarantee, a fully guaranteed contract that made
no sense. But who thought that the Houston version of
Jashaun Watson was done, right, I mean I didn't.

Speaker 4 (46:34):
Yeah, I didn't know, Yeah, yeah, I think you know.

Speaker 2 (46:37):
It was the contract. It was ridiculous.

Speaker 4 (46:39):
Right with the Browns and with quarterbacks, there's a school
thought that, you know, Kirk Cousins is obviously the guy.
But if you signed Kirk Cousins and then you draft
a quarterback, well, you know, why can't you do that? Right?
Why can't you do both? But I look at it
and say, the Giants, the Browns, if you know, the Jets,

(46:59):
even the Raiders, like I think they're buying time for
a better quarterback class.

Speaker 2 (47:04):
I agree, I look at it that way. But what
nobody's doing right?

Speaker 5 (47:08):
You know, I think if anybody and I think you
made this point last week, Ev and I agreed to
one thousand percent. If if you just go by what
everybody's doing, it seems like there's nobody convinced that she
Dous Sanders is the answer, right, because they're all going
out of their way to make signings that if you
liked Sanders, would seem to me to be you know, unnecessary.

Speaker 2 (47:29):
Yep, why would you take two guys? Cleveland?

Speaker 5 (47:32):
Why are you going to take two guys and then
if you planned on drafting again, it makes no sense
to me.

Speaker 2 (47:38):
All right on the phone from Florida, the Breakers resort
is deuce, deuce. What's up? Hey, guys, are good? Did
you get your eyesight back yet?

Speaker 11 (47:49):
No?

Speaker 2 (47:49):
Not yet?

Speaker 4 (47:51):
Leave me around.

Speaker 11 (47:51):
I got my cane out, so yes, I am blind
here in Florida. Yeah, but at least it's sunny from
what they tell me.

Speaker 2 (47:57):
Okay, that's good. Good job yesterday. A lot of stuff
to talk about. What's on the what's your headline that
you want to bring to us?

Speaker 11 (48:05):
Oh, I mean we're fresh off of the Bill Parcells announcement,
So that's I think most interesting today. I found myself
going back to my old past propaganda blog, and in
twenty fifteen I was against ourselves going in. But I
think I've evolved a little bit and I'm kind of
good with it. I know I heard listened to the
beginning of the show. I know you guys are a

(48:27):
little bit divided. We've talked about this before, but I
just think when you look back he and for me personally,
I just I can't ignore his hire and change this
whole franchise. It went from not to feel like we're
the NFL to you were in the NFL drafted a
bunch of great players that were foundational pieces for championships,
and I think it's the right move at this time.

Speaker 2 (48:49):
Okay, all right, what else? So we haven't really got
into the rule change. We're waiting for us, We're waiting
for you to talk about him. So why did you
talk about some of the more major rule changes that
we'll look forward to this year?

Speaker 11 (49:06):
Yeah, just a couple that stood out to me. The
overtime rules now will match what they were in overtime,
But listening to Rich McKay talk about why they shifted
it to ten minutes, putting more of time crunch on
the teams in overtime, they felt like if they kept
it at fifteen minutes for the overtime period with both
teams getting the ball, that teams will be tempted to

(49:28):
defer again and not take the ball immediately. They felt like,
statistically putting it at ten minutes, you want the ball,
You're not going to have enough time. Probably you want
to try to run the clock out. If if they
said the average drive time was five minutes, so that
was interesting to me. I know they did some research
on that, and then of course, you know, change in
the yard line to the thirty five, moving that out

(49:49):
a little bit, I think, just to encourage more kickoffs,
you know, more returns, and those are the two big
pieces so far. Was waiting to see on the Tush push,
but it sounds like they've punted that one to May.
But it does seem like there's a lot of good
discussion going on about that, and there's a lot of
people passionately for it, passionately against it. So it'll be
interesting to see where that where that goes down the road.

Speaker 2 (50:09):
What about the increase in UH review assistance, They changed
that a little replay assist replay assist.

Speaker 11 (50:19):
Oh, I haven't seen the discussion on that one yet,
so how can you get back to you on that
piece of it. I did see some of the you know,
taunting penalties. They've increased those. I think that was a
big topic to discussion today. Of course, you guys know
me love.

Speaker 5 (50:33):
The fun, so yeah, you want more of those penalties.
I can tell were you at the press conference or
I'm not sure how you know how that information was
delivered there?

Speaker 2 (50:46):
The Rich McKay comment that you made about did.

Speaker 5 (50:50):
Anybody ask a follow up is like, why would you
care who what the coin toss winner does?

Speaker 2 (50:56):
Why? Why we why are we anti deferring?

Speaker 5 (50:59):
I don't really to stand that being part of the
the decision making on overtime, we're trying to discourage teams
from deferring. What was the reason rationale behind that?

Speaker 11 (51:10):
Yeah, that question, that follow up was not asked within
the meeting.

Speaker 2 (51:14):
I mean, what happens.

Speaker 11 (51:15):
There were some questions, but that one specifically wasn't answer.
I mean, that's a good question, Paul, You're always you're
always sharp on these things.

Speaker 2 (51:22):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (51:22):
I mean, like you know, Evan and I were talking
as we came induce. You know, I kind of think
that the reason that they kept it at ten, and
Evan made this point is TV and I just don't
like that idea, but like they want to keep it
in as close to the windows as they can, you know,
for the networks, you know, one to you know, four

(51:43):
to twenty.

Speaker 2 (51:43):
Five or whatever it is. You know, you have a.

Speaker 5 (51:45):
Better chance obviously if it's only a ten minute overtime
then then going to fifteen. I just don't I can't,
for the life of me figure out why the league
would care what a team opts to do whether they
win the coin toimes.

Speaker 2 (51:56):
So I think, but see if in it they're worried
about the window, wouldn't fifteen minutes increase the odds that
by the end of fifteen there's a result rather than
we're still tied.

Speaker 5 (52:07):
So I think you're going to open the door for
more ties by doing it this way.

Speaker 2 (52:10):
So now both yet I think, yeah, both set the
ball exactly.

Speaker 5 (52:13):
And is I think if you if you keep it
at ten and the game doesn't end on the first touchdown,
I think you have a chance, a much bigger chance
for ties.

Speaker 2 (52:22):
And I don't think anybody wants to ties.

Speaker 4 (52:24):
Do so I don't want to put words in your wrap,
but I think he's saying is that the team that
possesses the ball first, there wouldn't be as much urgency
to move the football because you're trying to kill clock, right,
So like that's what they were trying to avoid, was
like they want they don't want teams sitting on the ball,
you know, so in a ten minute overtime, like maybe

(52:44):
there would be a little bit more Well.

Speaker 5 (52:46):
I think it increases the chance.

Speaker 4 (52:48):
I do too, but I feel like that's the answer
that they're giving is they don't want they want there
to there's to be an urgency to.

Speaker 5 (52:56):
I don't know because I didn't see it. I just
like du said, mentioned that that was the which McKay
comment that they're trying to discourage teams from deferring in overtime,
and I just don't understand, and I don't understand even
whatever was saying that. If that's what he meant, I
think teams now have a chance. I saw Albert Breer
earlier tweeted this. You get the ball to start overtime

(53:18):
and the other team can can match you. You want
to score and take up as much time as you can, right,
So I'm going to go in my four minute offense,
I'm going to try to go out and score while
being cognizant of chewing clock, right, and if I can
go on an eight minute touchdown drive, which is not
abnormal at all, now, I really put the other team
behind the eight ball.

Speaker 2 (53:38):
Yeah, now I will say that strategy wise, I agree,
and strategy wise, with ten minutes, you know, I do
want to get the ball first because I don't know
if I'm probably never going to get it back again,
So I would want the ball first regardless. Yeah, well overtime,
well I would too, even if it's fifteen minutes, there
might be three possessions. If I can get two of them,

(53:59):
I want that right.

Speaker 4 (54:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (54:01):
Now, I know, like.

Speaker 4 (54:02):
You know, the nerds are going to be crunching these numbers.

Speaker 2 (54:04):
With unlimited time.

Speaker 5 (54:06):
You could make an argument for deferring, like I think
it happened in the Super Bowl, like the San Francisco,
Kansas City like that to me, like, there's no time.
I'm not worried about the end of the quarter, you
know what I mean? Yeah, so that that would be
a little bit different.

Speaker 4 (54:19):
But can we ask Deuce the important questions now?

Speaker 2 (54:22):
Sure?

Speaker 4 (54:22):
So, Deuce, have you had the party yet? I know
there's always a party.

Speaker 11 (54:27):
Oh, there's there's some good tidbits from the party. Unfortunately,
it was a little bit marred by inclement weather and
we were outside to begin and then the lightning started striking,
so they had to move some of it inside, but
too highlights to share with you guys, the first one
being Serena Williams was there, who you know, pretty cool,
all that athlete, kind of kind of fun to see
her there. And then a little bit of a story

(54:50):
so we're getting ready to wrap up the night, and
you know, Matt Smith was saying, maybe we should sneak
out the back, and I said, now, you know, let's
just walk out the front. So as we're walking out
the front, I lay eyes on some spiky bleached hair,
a longer go tea, some sunglasses, and I said, oh
my god, it's one of Massimith's personal heroes, Guy Fieri

(55:11):
in the flesh here at the NFL Owners Meeting party.
So I I, you know, I know that this is
going to go over gread.

Speaker 2 (55:18):
I look at.

Speaker 11 (55:20):
I said, Matt, Guy Fieri is here. He was very excited.
He went over there, uh talk.

Speaker 2 (55:27):
You know.

Speaker 11 (55:27):
I got a little video of him like standing in line,
not in line, but just kind of getting his way
into the into the little group that that Guy Fiery
was with. Uh, and then had a nice conversation with him,
told him how much he appreciates Guy Theeryra Cannatcho.

Speaker 9 (55:42):
Uh.

Speaker 11 (55:43):
Guy Fiery very gracious. And then as Matt was after
they after they stopped speaking, that was stop briefly at
Nick Ksia's wife to say hello, and Guy Fiery came
walking by and gave out a big pat on the
bag and like, all right, buddy, I have a good one.
So Matt was on cloud nine.

Speaker 5 (56:00):
Wow, So deuce in terms of in terms of overall excitement,
the excitement level on a scale of Matt meeting Guy
Fieri and you looking long only at Mike Rabel when
he's talking, where would you put?

Speaker 2 (56:15):
Where would you put? Matt?

Speaker 11 (56:17):
I got to get Mat the edge on that one.

Speaker 2 (56:19):
Oh, I don't know about that.

Speaker 11 (56:22):
I'm always acutely where But look, Mike Rabel makes jokes.
You guys know me. I'm a laugher, I'm a smiler,
so they could audience, you know, Mike, Mike. Mike Rabel
starts flaming Felger about playing tight end and dropping the
ball in his last game and constantly team to win,
which I found delightful. Uh. And so of course I
get clicked with the pick, smiling and laughing at the
joke as everyone else was. But it seems like I'm

(56:44):
just getting there like a big idiot with a dumb
smile on my face and everything.

Speaker 2 (56:49):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (56:49):
Well no, yeah, that would be after it de sa
I have you know, I get fomo about the owner's
meetings not being there with you, so you know, how's
the media doing, you know, how has what's the temperature
right now?

Speaker 2 (57:02):
Good question, yeah, mood, question mood mood.

Speaker 11 (57:06):
I would say it's a pretty good mood. I think
everyone's pretty excited, you know, to be in some warm
weather right now. Uh So that was overall the biggest
thing for me. A little bit of a scramble this
morning doing r kk's interview. We had a location we
had to move, so we were a little bit of
a scramble going on this morning, but didn't didn't see

(57:26):
many of the media out party and too hard last night.
It was pretty low key affair compared to some of
the owner's meetings. Wild maybe because it was inside, but
it was a little bit more crowded, a little harder
to get food and drinks and stuff. So I think
everybody usually carved out a spot on a couch or
table and kind of held their own area like that.
So nothing, nothing too crazy. Everybody's here and you know,

(57:50):
excited talk to Brabel and the good stuff yesterday from
him and then again today with r KK and the
Brave and the Parcels news.

Speaker 2 (57:57):
Knowing how ultra competitive the media is is there starting
to be a little bit of resentment towards Karen her
preferential treatment. I hope not, but are you know some
of the guys starting to, like, you know, not treat
her the same.

Speaker 4 (58:12):
Like why does she always get the first question?

Speaker 2 (58:14):
Yeah, Helen, Helen Thomas, Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 11 (58:18):
Think they're I think they're following Rabel's leads from that
initial press conference that he uh that he had where
he called you know that I would have called on
Karen first, and so they're a little bit deferring to her.
But you know, we tried to stay for a seat
at the table. She's an established member.

Speaker 2 (58:32):
So I mean, I think she deserves good for her.

Speaker 11 (58:34):
But I think it's funny. I think. I don't know
if you guys watched it, but Rabel said, I'm not
finish yet. You're kind of joking with her a little bit,
so he was. He was having some fun with her too,
and you know, good questions there's always from Karen, So
no resentment yet. I don't know how you could present Karen.

Speaker 2 (58:49):
Well, you know, but these guys are they're very very competitive.
I would I almost I wish they would show it
on how they covered the team. WHOA.

Speaker 4 (58:56):
I'm only starting to feel going to Glass right over
that I'm honest to feel dad for Karen because now
you have to have a question because you.

Speaker 5 (59:03):
Know that he be read and he does it every time.
He's like he's Karen and she's like, oh, I guess
I'm up.

Speaker 4 (59:10):
Yeah, Yeah, you gotta now every press conference, like during
the season, we talked to him three four times a week,
So now is she gonna have to have a question
every single.

Speaker 2 (59:18):
I would be yeah, that'd be a lot of pressure
at that.

Speaker 4 (59:21):
Exactly.

Speaker 2 (59:21):
All right, Mike, anything else before we let you go?
Is it lunchtime? There? Are you gonna eat?

Speaker 11 (59:26):
Yeah, we just grab some food and we're getting ready
to head down to Fort Lauderdale to catch our flight back.
So I'll be back in the office tomorrow. Looking forward
to seeing you guys, getting back on the show. It's
been a quick trip, but good one as always. And
uh yeah, different, you know, just different vibe. I would
say you can feel. I mean it's kind of cliche,
but I think the excitement around the team, it just

(59:47):
feels like a renewed sense of energy. You heard Able
talk about it, you heard Robert talk a little bit
about it today. I think those things are continuing to happen,
and I think we're all getting excited to see what happens.

Speaker 2 (59:57):
A few weeks in the draft sounds good? All right, Dost,
we'll see you tomorrow.

Speaker 11 (01:00:01):
I gay you are.

Speaker 2 (01:00:05):
Safe travels.

Speaker 5 (01:00:05):
You hung up on you, You hung up safe travels, Michael.

Speaker 2 (01:00:08):
All right, good time to take a break. We're gonna
do that when we come back. More calls and emails
here on Patriots Unfiltered. Whether you're in the game or
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Speaker 13 (01:01:56):
Exclusions apply, like on the young receivers has talked about,
and also the offense right with Josh.

Speaker 2 (01:02:04):
You know that offense. You saw it for years with
Tom Van.

Speaker 13 (01:02:06):
It's been difficult for receivers, young receivers to be able
to pick it up with the side adjustments and some
of the other stuff. So how close is this offense
that Josh is gonna run gonna be to what he
ran when Brady was there?

Speaker 2 (01:02:17):
Or will you make changes to me?

Speaker 1 (01:02:20):
Be changes?

Speaker 14 (01:02:20):
There has to be changes, right, you know, there has
to be We have to start somewhere, and uh, you know,
to say that that Drake is gonna be, you know,
similar to somebody else in this system after five or
six years, I don't think that that's fair to say. So,
you know, we're gonna start with a foundation and those
are the most important things, and building and making sure

(01:02:42):
that the receivers. We're not just gonna go past something
because it says it on a schedule like the if
it takes us an extra day, then it takes us
an extra day. If it takes us an extra week
to get the first couple of installs in, then that's
what it's gonna take. We're not just gonna gloss over
things we believe strongly and teaching and helping those players

(01:03:05):
and figuring out how they learn best and making sure
that we're doing everything we can to give them a
chance to help themselves.

Speaker 2 (01:03:12):
Mike, Joe Milton.

Speaker 3 (01:03:14):
I'm just curious your thoughts on him and if there's
any sense from conversations with other teams that you might
have an asset there that could have value to you know,
and discusting any potential discussions with other teams.

Speaker 14 (01:03:27):
Yeah, I think Joe's did everything that they asked them
to do last year. It sounds like in conversations that
he worked extremely hard, and that's tough when you're quarterback.
Everybody wants to play, everybody wants to be the starter
everybody and that's great to have that attitude. And he

(01:03:48):
was ready for his opportunity there late in the season,
which I commend him on just like I would any
player that sat there and went through a long season,
a difficult season, and then got the opportunity, went out,
won a football game, played well, helped his team win,
and then you know where that leads to. We'll see
as the draft approaches or you know where where Joe

(01:04:11):
is on April seventh to start our offseason program. But
you know, you have to give Joe credit for being
ready to go with going from the third quarterback to
being able to win that football game and stay ready
and stay hungry.

Speaker 11 (01:04:24):
Well, I love that game.

Speaker 2 (01:04:26):
Your life would be easier for you right now had
they lost. Are you happy that they won? Given that
as a coach, as a.

Speaker 14 (01:04:33):
Player, yeah, I mean it's a difficult season. You know,
you want to compete and fight that those players out
there were doing everything that they could to win a
football game, and I think that's the mentality. That's the
environment that you want to create. So to say that
there's any other reason, I think that that's that's not
what you want to create. And somebody has the first pick,

(01:04:55):
somebody is going to have the second to third. But
you know those players, man, it's uh, put yourself in
their position like that. To get that opportunity to go
out there and play and to compete and put tape
out there like that, that's important. That's important for their career.
That's important to instill that in a football team. And

(01:05:16):
you know, I don't think you could have it any
other way. So I'm proud of all those guys that
did that and they fought and they won a football game.

Speaker 2 (01:05:22):
You guys matched the off sheet on Christian Ellis. Why
was that important for you guys to do.

Speaker 8 (01:05:30):
Well?

Speaker 14 (01:05:30):
And this was a difficult decision. It was one that we,
you know, ultimately decided that a young ascending player that
has this skill set and speed and you know, feel
like he can do a lot of different things for us,
and that he's his arrow was up, and that we
felt like we wanted to keep him on the roster.

(01:05:50):
So in order to do that, we had to match
the offer sheet. And you know, Christian is excited by
all accounts to be back. We're excited to have them.
You know, this is a player. The more he played,
I think, the better that he got. Was very good
on third down and fourth down, and then first and
second down. The more he played, the better he got
off first and second down.

Speaker 2 (01:06:11):
Joint practices the summer anything setting Stone there.

Speaker 14 (01:06:14):
Still waiting for the NFL, but have had conversations with Minnesota, Washington.
I think would like to come up. We'd love to
go to Minnesota if the NFL you know, gives it
those opportunities.

Speaker 3 (01:06:28):
Well to Minnesota.

Speaker 2 (01:06:33):
Uh Cheese Kurds.

Speaker 14 (01:06:40):
We practiced with them a few years ago in Tennessee.
It's a nice setup. They've got a beautiful facility. There's
a hotel close by, can walk to the field. You know,
just enjoyed working with Kevin and and b flow On
in their team.

Speaker 15 (01:07:00):
One of the most important things you have to do
leading up to the draft for you personally the next
four weeks or.

Speaker 14 (01:07:05):
So, just have enough exposure with those players in the
first few rounds that we see, you know, the top
one hundred and one hundred and fifty players that you know.
I got to have enough exposure. And our scouting department
has done a fantastic job. Our personnel department with you know,
Elliott and Ryan and Cam Williams helping a student at macroll,

(01:07:27):
everybody you know, getting out and going different places and
bringing guys in on thirty visits and making suggestions like, hey,
what do you think about this guy coming in? Let's
get some more information on this guy. And so I've
loved where the process has been. We worked well through
the free agency process and being able to have a plan,
being able to pivot off of that move quickly, be decisive.

(01:07:49):
Those were some things that we're really excited about. And
I think the balance for me is just making sure
that I'm doing everything I can with our current players,
but also making sure that stand up on you know,
the guys that we may add to our football team doesn't.

Speaker 5 (01:08:04):
Find a running back yet, is that an area like
to address in the draft?

Speaker 14 (01:08:09):
I mean, I think so having a young, good, young
runner something that's potentially something that we would like to do.
I thought the guys coming back, you know, I think
Remondre and you know, and Gibbe. I think obviously we're
a good one to two punch. You know, people are
going to talk about Remondre and putting the ball on
the ground and he knows that, but we'll help him there.

Speaker 2 (01:08:30):
And we're also you.

Speaker 14 (01:08:32):
Know, we're going to help the other make sure the
other ten players know that their job is to protect
the guy with the ball as well. You know, there
were some opportunities on there for for me to teach
the other guys that, you know, that second guy in
the guy you don't see is the one that's making
the making the making the fumble or causing the fumble.
And so it's a great opportunity for me to to

(01:08:52):
show those other players that they're guys, you know, the
one coming in there to knock the ball loose. And
so is that gonna all be on the running back.

Speaker 2 (01:09:00):
No, it's going to be on the guy.

Speaker 14 (01:09:01):
That's letting his guy get in there and and make
make the hits. So those are great opportunities for me,
but I won't love to add good young players on
offense and skill players.

Speaker 2 (01:09:13):
Was the person.

Speaker 12 (01:09:16):
And now great moments in.

Speaker 2 (01:09:20):
History. But Fred would taste better a tender or a wing.
A wing if it's done right, because the skin is
still on it and it's fried, and you know it's
all from one check. I think I think the bone
gives an extra flavor. I don't know why. It's the
fat from the skin that gives it the slave you know.

Speaker 5 (01:09:37):
I like bone in but I there's times that, hey,
I'm perfectly satisfied with my tenders right, like when we
do it right here, right, because I don't want to
be eating wings and making a mess as I'm trying
to yell at college but telling me that I call
Belichick a mediocre coach.

Speaker 2 (01:09:51):
You know it's on your face, but it's also all
in your fingers and experience. So when I wings at home,
after it's done, I just put my hand down. My
dog cleans my finger, just hangs his hand off the throat.
You fat bastard, you can't even drop them wash your
own hands immediately. He watch the TV. Let the dog

(01:10:11):
do the world.

Speaker 4 (01:10:14):
Not yet, not you can't.

Speaker 2 (01:10:15):
I'm still working. You know he likes it. You know
it's win win for both. The Little Spicy Forms story.
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(01:11:20):
So there you go. Okay, it's a.

Speaker 4 (01:11:24):
Good time a year to come to Massachusetts.

Speaker 2 (01:11:25):
It's always a good time.

Speaker 4 (01:11:26):
Starting to get a little warmer out.

Speaker 2 (01:11:28):
Yeah, although it's going to rain a lot this week.

Speaker 4 (01:11:32):
Yeah, I was trying to sell it.

Speaker 2 (01:11:35):
Got some painting in on Sunday, so that was good.
What's your pain outside? Some trim sniffs? Yeah, let's go
to the hotline. Eldred's on North Carolina. What's up? Eldred? Good?

Speaker 16 (01:11:57):
Hey, want to play book?

Speaker 8 (01:11:58):
Coming back on?

Speaker 2 (01:12:00):
It isn't we've canceled the playbook?

Speaker 16 (01:12:03):
Okay, all right, Dan?

Speaker 11 (01:12:05):
Yeah, Well two things, Paul, yes, sir.

Speaker 16 (01:12:09):
Sep on t mac evan. I love speed too, but
he gets ran a four or five in a confine
and so they Evan, but it came out better receiver.
So it's all how you play. But I think you'd
be better with Joe and he will be thick or ten.

Speaker 2 (01:12:30):
Six or ten.

Speaker 16 (01:12:31):
Both the guys, yeah, because they got some of the
draft got him going away the Daguars and.

Speaker 4 (01:12:36):
Than yeahs or nine yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, sure, Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:12:43):
I mean I think I think McMillan had a good
college career. I'm just not convinced that he's going to
be a standout wide receiver. But you're right, there are
other guys that were bigger guys that didn't necessarily have
blazing speed that have succeeded.

Speaker 2 (01:12:55):
Yeah, you're you're absolutely right.

Speaker 16 (01:12:58):
This we got rid of Bentley. You think the draft
with middle lineback in the draft and take it off there.

Speaker 2 (01:13:05):
I have a good one, all right, thanks we I
don't think have we talked about the Bentley release on
this show, doesn't I don't believe. I don't think we have.
On Friday. That took me by surprise. You know, we
talk about surprise cuts. To me, that was a surprise cut.

Speaker 4 (01:13:19):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:13:20):
I know.

Speaker 4 (01:13:22):
There's a lot that is being made about the scheme
fit and that he wasn't necessarily a scheme fit at
his size. But the way I took it and then
Rabel kind of confirmed this yesterday more or less, is
they're kind of looking for a culture reset, Like I
think they want new leaders, like they want a new
identity of the team and a new culture. And I
think part of the one foot in, one foot out

(01:13:44):
the door on the Dynasty, guys like David Andrews, Dietrich Wise,
Jonathan Jones, Juwan Bentley, like they kind of were always
hearkening back to the past with a lot of those
guys and this is how he used to do it
around here, and I think that Rabel's trying to charge
his own course and he kind of got rid of
a lot.

Speaker 2 (01:14:02):
It could be. I mean, that's stuff I'm not aware of.
But as a player, I thought his size and his
style was complimentary to the other guys, like, Okay, he's
your big guy, he's your he's your plugger, he's your
and you know, then you have your speed guys. And
I thought I thought it was a good compliment. Yeah,
I mean I was. It was definitely not expected.

Speaker 5 (01:14:27):
I would stop short of surprise only because we've been
talking a lot all off season. They are gonna be
guys that are going to go that you're not expecting.

Speaker 2 (01:14:35):
Just didn't think he'd be one.

Speaker 5 (01:14:35):
And that's another one. But that's that's what I'm saying,
not expecting to go and they're gonna go. I think
Godshaw was another one that you know that went. Now
Wise and Jones are both free agents, so I think
they're a little bit different. But you know, Andrews Bentley Godshaw,

(01:14:56):
I was a little bit surprised by that, and I
I would wonder, and you know what everything Evan said.
You know, there's a lot of talk about that in
the in Vrabel's meeting yesterday, in his breakfast, I'm not
sure that I agree.

Speaker 2 (01:15:13):
With that style.

Speaker 5 (01:15:15):
Like I'd never really looked at these these guys in
question Bentley specifically as a guy like, well, that's not
the way we used to do it. Like he's never
struck me as that kind of guy.

Speaker 2 (01:15:27):
Like I said, I maybe this stuff behind that. I
don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:15:29):
He's always struck me as a really really good leader
and role model in example.

Speaker 4 (01:15:34):
I don't think that that's not what I was saying. No, no,
I'm not.

Speaker 2 (01:15:37):
Putting it on you. I think you're right. I think
that's what Mike is doing.

Speaker 4 (01:15:40):
Yeah, I didn't mean it like he's was like a
bad teammate by any means. I just think that, you know,
he said it in his introductory press conference, like the
six banners are a good reminder, but they're not going
to help us right right, And I think that he's
trying to turn a new leaf where you know, Girod
kind of just almost made an extension of the Belichick.

Speaker 2 (01:16:00):
He's clearing the way for his guys.

Speaker 5 (01:16:02):
And I was like, you know, in fairness, I wasn't
in favor of what they did last year either by
bringing them all back, but I didn't necessarily see the need.

Speaker 2 (01:16:11):
To get rid of them all either. Yea.

Speaker 5 (01:16:13):
So I mean this is these are not moves that
are going to you know, dramatically alter the course. But
I do think, you know, it was scheme related in
a lot of ways too. I mean, I think clearly
they want to be smaller and more you know, more athletic,
more mobile at that position.

Speaker 4 (01:16:31):
Elliot Wolf said it yesterday that that he was I
think it was. Felger asked him about, you know, how
the defense is going to change under label, and he said,
not a ton, you know, other than an emphasis at
at speed at the linebacker and team speed in general.
You know, just watching some of the linebackers recently, kind
of to Eldred's second question, there's a lot of guys

(01:16:51):
that in this class in particular, it's actually a very
good linebacker class. And there's a lot of guys in
this class in particular that fit that mold, you know,
a little bit undersized, but have great speed, good coverage ability. Right,
And my only hesitation is kind of like what Fred
was saying, like, don't you have to have one guy
that's going to take up some space and it's going
to stop the run. Like, you don't want to play

(01:17:14):
two or three guys and everybody is two hundred and
twenty pounds, right like, you would probably like to have
at least one guy, you know, even if it's just
for short yardage and you know, goal line and like
all that kind of stuff that can actually come downhill
at the line of scrimmage. You know, there's a lot
of you know, Chris Paul juniors and you know, Jeffrey
Bosses and guys that are great coverage linebackers. But they

(01:17:36):
have a lot of that you know already. They have
speed and they have athleticism. So I am wondering where
they might find that dumper, if they even care right
about finding it.

Speaker 2 (01:17:46):
This email it doesn't want me to use his name,
but he is very, very upset with Robert Kraft. He says,
regarding the Parcels induction, I figured we get some of this, Yeah,
he says, one bypassing voting as Parson been on the ballot,
but we've never voted him in. He means the fans
two Parcels is not as good as both Belichick and

(01:18:07):
Chuck Fairbanks. Three. Chuck Fairbanks was a great coach and
I for talent. Please remind your audience to some of
his draft picks that set up this team with talent.
Even after he left four, Fairbanks had more wins than
any other Patriots coach until Belichick by passed him. Fairbanks
never had a Belichick with him, as Parcells did for

(01:18:28):
both Giants and Patriots. And Belichick in TB twelve is
the foundation for RKK current Foxborough fiefdom. So f and
pissed that RKK co opted the Hall of Fame process
taking our votes away in inviting Belichick ahead of I
mean Parcells, ahead of Belichick and Chuck Fairbanks. Now it's

(01:18:50):
not ahead of it's not ahead of Belichick's not he's
not eligible yet. So even you have to be four
years retired before you're eligible for the Patriots Hall of Fame.
So I guarantee when he's eligible, he will get in.
But a Fairbanks is a fair one.

Speaker 4 (01:19:08):
Yeah. I wonder you know with Belichick, Let's see he
coaches a year at North Carolina and he announces that
he's done coaching. Yep, would they bypass the waiting period
like they did with Tom Brady?

Speaker 2 (01:19:22):
I think they probably should.

Speaker 5 (01:19:24):
Yeah, I think they also could. You could just say
like two more years and that would be the four years,
because I would say last year he was out, this
year he's in college, he's not in the NFL. To me,
that's two years. Yeah, But I don't know what. I
wouldn't be opposed to just waving it altogether.

Speaker 2 (01:19:40):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:19:41):
The Fairbanks thing, we've We've talked about Fairbanks a lot
in the meetings, and there was actually one year that
I presented for Chuck Fairbanks, and I would absolutely back
up a lot of things. It's funny because I think
Evan's going to be bored to tears because this is,
you know, before he was even thought of. There's a
lot of similar it is between Parcels and Fairbanks. They

(01:20:01):
were both elite talent evaluators. They both drafted exceptionally well.
They both basically built teams by themselves in similar situations.
Everything I said about Parcels inheriting nothing is the same.

Speaker 2 (01:20:14):
For Chuck Fairbanks.

Speaker 5 (01:20:15):
The organization was just in shambles, and then he built
the team and also ended up leaving in very controversial fashion.

Speaker 2 (01:20:25):
Rights.

Speaker 5 (01:20:26):
It's uncanny how similar their candidacies are. I would absolutely
be wholeheartedly in favor of Chuck Fairbanks also being in.
But it's one of those things like, you know, can
you have it, you can't have everybody, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:20:40):
I think that's probably a built to me Bill Parcells,
because I didn't you know, like I said earlier, didn't
live the culture stuff and the changing you know that
he brought in. But the players that he drafted that
were then a part of Dynasty one point zero. I mean,
that's that's a big part of lay in the foundation.
I mean, you remember the picks better than me. But
you know Willie mc ginnis, you know that.

Speaker 5 (01:21:01):
Law Malloy, Brusk, Johnson, Uh, you know this he.

Speaker 2 (01:21:07):
But he got him, he brought it, brought inanity.

Speaker 4 (01:21:09):
Yeah. I mean that's kind of his defense, right. I
mean you just named it pretty much besides Seymour everybody.

Speaker 2 (01:21:15):
Not only his defense, it's his style of defense. Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:21:18):
You know, now again Fairbanks, you know it was Hannah Haynes, Brock, Fox, Claiborne, Morgan.
It was just like one stud after the next when
he he drafted all of those guys, Steve Nelson, Steve Drogan, Yeah,
Grogan stud for that time.

Speaker 2 (01:21:38):
Yeah, right ahead of his time Freddie has a dual threat. Yeah,
he was a running quarterback.

Speaker 5 (01:21:44):
He's really only one It was really, I mean legitimately,
he was really only a one thread quarterback.

Speaker 2 (01:21:48):
Because the Pages still hold that record for team rushing
in the season.

Speaker 5 (01:21:53):
I believe the Ravens they passed them, passed them a
couple of years ago.

Speaker 2 (01:21:57):
If I'm not mistaken, Let's go to Fidel and Tampa.
What's up Fidel?

Speaker 15 (01:22:09):
Uh So, I want to say if I'm looking board
with draft, as I really am. Okay, my only thought
for us behind it is like if Abdul Cornor and
Travis Hunter go and if you had to put your mortgage,
that one player coming out of this draft is going

(01:22:31):
to go to the Hall of Fame.

Speaker 16 (01:22:33):
To me, I.

Speaker 15 (01:22:33):
Think it's happened to be, even though I know the
positional value at four or betrayed back stick isn't there.

Speaker 2 (01:22:42):
I didn't do that.

Speaker 5 (01:22:43):
Yeah, that line was struggling, But I get the gist
of what he's saying, and I can't argue.

Speaker 2 (01:22:49):
I don't hate it.

Speaker 5 (01:22:51):
Again, I like to Evan and I disagree on a
lot of stuff, and we agree on a lot of stuff,
and this is one of the ones that we agree on.

Speaker 2 (01:22:57):
I don't think the guy that you draft, let's say,
in the top five of any draft, should have a
possibility in your mind to be a Hall of Famer.
Should that be a criteria.

Speaker 4 (01:23:08):
It's a high bar.

Speaker 2 (01:23:09):
It is a high bar. No, But like that's not
really the point of what he was saying.

Speaker 5 (01:23:13):
I know he's saying that he has the potential to
be if you had to bet on one guy, yeah,
that he would bet on.

Speaker 2 (01:23:21):
I can't argue with that.

Speaker 4 (01:23:23):
Yeah, I can't argue that either. I just I just
keep on going back to philosophically, just building a football team.
And if you put, if you draft Ashton Genty first
of all, then Day two better be all offensive lineman, like.

Speaker 2 (01:23:37):
You you better.

Speaker 4 (01:23:38):
You better throw as many darts at left tackle and
even left guard as you possibly can. Like you have
to build it, uh successfully around that style, Like you
are going to have to have a dominant offensive line
in front of Ashton Genty. I think the part that
I come back to is the notion that Ashton Genty
is going to turn a bad offensive line into a

(01:23:58):
good one is just not true. Yeah, that's not gonna happen.
He can turn a solid offensive line into a great
one or you know, elevate you know that situation. But
if they put the same product in front of him
on the line that they had last year, he's not
going to gonna be worth the pick. It's just not
gonna work out. So I just look at it that

(01:24:19):
way personally, that I just I have a tough time
envisioning them having an environment that will allow him. Like
when the Cowboys drafted Zeke, Like, they had multiple Hall
of Famers on their offensive line, they had a great
offensive line, so he came in and he was, you know,
instantly one of the best running backs in the NFL.
I just don't think the Patriots have that setup for
gent and that that would be my hesitation Antoine's and Mississippi.

Speaker 2 (01:24:44):
Hey, Antwin, Hey, how are you doing? Okay?

Speaker 11 (01:24:48):
So I have a question.

Speaker 9 (01:24:49):
So we all agree that we're in a new regime
right with the new management and the new coaching statup,
and for the past through draft, the Patriots have just
been they're waiting for the pig, like they're not aggressive
at all. And I really think there hasn't been a
narrative to where the Patriots should like trade up, not

(01:25:12):
to number one, but maybe to number two, and that
way Cleveland can stay in the midstic gif Abduill Carter,
and we can get Travis Hunter, because I think that'll
be a great option for us, and I think that
it wouldn't cost as much as people would think. Maybe
we have two thirds this year, we can give them
a third of fields, and we have three favorites. We
give us seven and maybe a second round next year,

(01:25:32):
and Nick should be enough to go up, you know,
to go and get them. But I just think that
right now we need to be more aggressive. And people
really aren't talking about trading up. They're just talking about
trading back, trading back or just waiting to see what
happens for us, And we should really be more aggressive,
like like they said that we we're gonna be.

Speaker 2 (01:25:51):
I mean, I can't argue with that either. I mean
there's a there's an argument for both. I want more players.
I don't want to give up all those assets, but
let's get somebody who can make a difference, and we
know can make a difference. Whether it's Carter or those
are Yeah, those are the two guys that are worth
trading up for now. I think it would Thanks Antoine,

(01:26:12):
I think you're.

Speaker 5 (01:26:13):
Gonna give up a lot of assets that I'm not
sure that you're can afford to.

Speaker 2 (01:26:17):
Give out going from four to two. Yeah. I think
he's right.

Speaker 5 (01:26:20):
I think it's going to cost you some draft picks
to do that, because everybody else thinks that there's only
two guys in the draft too.

Speaker 2 (01:26:26):
Yeah, yeah, right.

Speaker 4 (01:26:28):
Like I don't hate the idea of it. I don't
hate it.

Speaker 2 (01:26:31):
I don't I would.

Speaker 4 (01:26:32):
Probably prefer to try to trade up from thirty eight.
I think if you trade it up from thirty eight
back into the end of the first round, there might
be some tackles and receivers that are maybe more value there.
You know, an Arianta Nursery, Josh Connery, you know Mecca Buka,
Matthew Golden, like those guys might still be available at

(01:26:52):
that point of the draft. That, okay, we didn't have
to reach on. We don't think that Will Campbell's going
to make it at tackle, so now we don't have
to reach out.

Speaker 2 (01:26:59):
I like that idea.

Speaker 4 (01:27:00):
I probably that's still being aggressive to me, Like it's
not aggressive like the caller was talking about necessarily, but
I think actually pulling off a trade back into the
first round to make two first round picks would be
pretty enticing.

Speaker 2 (01:27:13):
Frasier in edin Bleagh, Scotland rites in after the Digs
signing last week, I've come to think that we are
almost certain to take Will Campbell. Rabel has shown in
the last few weeks that he has set on filling
as many of the gaping holes that we have on
the roster. I'd say that left tackle is the largest
of the holes that we have, so it is inconceivable
that he won't address that position this offseason. I know

(01:27:35):
there are doubts about Campbell, but we can only pick
from what's available, and it seems that he's the best
left tackle this year, so we should take him. Sounds logic, Yeah,
I agree, Yeah, I agree.

Speaker 4 (01:27:49):
Yeah. I find it hard to believe that it won't
be one of the two tackles, whether it's Membo or Campbell,
if Carter and Hunter are gone, if Carter and Hunter
make it to four, one of those guys, I think
he's the pick. But if it's not that, then I
think it's gonna be one of those two tackles. And
one of the things he said yesterday that you know
he's talking right to me when he said this, he said,

(01:28:10):
you know you want need and best available to kind
of marry up together, you know, not this notion that
it's always just best player available, best player last week.

Speaker 2 (01:28:20):
Like you don't just like ignore a need that's not
That's not how you do it.

Speaker 4 (01:28:24):
So hearing him say that and hearing him talk about
the tackles, it seems to me like they know left
tackles the biggest need on their on their roster right now,
and they have two guys that they like at that spot.

Speaker 2 (01:28:36):
H David Bethlehem writes in this draft is hard to evaluate.
So many players had stalled development during COVID in their
formative years. Vrabel is smart to bring in Multiple coaches
agree with Fred Campbell has true grit, Paul and Evan
who should be the Patriot's second round pick.

Speaker 5 (01:28:53):
I love Evan's trade with Matthew Golden. I really like him.
If you can get high enough for him, and if
you could get into the fund and do something like that,
I'd be in favor of that.

Speaker 2 (01:29:04):
But yeah, I don't know.

Speaker 5 (01:29:05):
I mean, everyone would know the particulars of the guys
that are going to be around thirty eight more than
I would.

Speaker 4 (01:29:10):
I think the three guys that I've kind of looked
a little bit extra at recently. Ursery, the left tackle
from Minnesota, big guy, you know, kind of like a
not quite as big as like Trent Brown, but a
bigger tackle. You know, that's what you're getting with him.
Connery is a smaller tackle that's a little bit more
athletic and a little bit of a better pass blocker.

(01:29:32):
So like those two guys, and then I don't know
what is going to end up happening on draft weekend
with Luther Burden. You know, there's a lot of teams
that have some off the field concerns about his makeup
and his attitude and all that kind of stuff. He
could fall out of the first round as a result,
And to me, he is a first round talent all

(01:29:53):
the way. So do you roll the dice a little
bit at thirty eight and say, you know, we really
need star power a receiver.

Speaker 2 (01:30:00):
He give me this year's ad Mitchell, yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:30:03):
Or yeah, something along those lines, you know, we really
need It's not enough like we need a needle mover
at that position. Yeah, he's got some wards with him
in terms of his character, but you know, Rabel will
be on him and they'll they'll get him you know,
to stay on the tracks, and he's a to me,
he's a top twenty player in the draft just based
off the tape. But he's got some of those.

Speaker 2 (01:30:23):
Wards Rusty and Arlin. Not sure if Paul is doing
a poll, but I am very much in favor of
Parcels being in the Hall of Fame. I'm glad they
are able to honor Parcels while he's still alive and healthy.
Can you talk about how the Bled Cell Parcels years felt.
From what I understand, Parcels left over not having enough
personnel control. I know people were angry about how he left.

(01:30:46):
Was there a sense they should have given him more control?
Were people ready for him to leave by the end
when Belchik came in. Did you genuinely believe he could
win a Super Bowl with Bled Cell?

Speaker 5 (01:30:57):
I mean I did, but I meant was my guy?

Speaker 2 (01:31:02):
Yeah? That was That was the crux of it. It
was control of personnel.

Speaker 5 (01:31:06):
I think that there was some a lack of trust because,
as Fred said earlier in the show, there was some
restlessness on Parcells' behalf that led you to believe that
he wasn't there for the long haul.

Speaker 2 (01:31:18):
And I think.

Speaker 5 (01:31:20):
The team felt we can't necessarily just continue to give
him all the control of the personnel if he's not
going to make us any insurance assurances that he's going
to stay. So that sort of led to a culmination
for the ninety six draft where they kind of undercut
him and and took took the picks away. I think

(01:31:41):
to the detriment some people would argue, but I felt like,
you know, there their plan of Brackens and Muhammad that
was parcel What Parcels wanted might have been better than
than Terry Glenn and Laurie Maloy.

Speaker 2 (01:31:57):
Yeah. I I was just they ended up there. I
was upset that he left. And I remember going to
the Super Bowl and the rumors had already started that
this was it. He was gone. Oh yeah, by the
time the Super Bowl rolled around, it was. And we
were on the plane and Parcels had his friend, longtime
coach that I think coached him in high school or something.

(01:32:18):
I forget. The name of the guy might have been
like Read something. Everybody back then was named Red. But
he was a He was a guy that, like Parcels,
had known his whole life. And he brought him along
for the Super Bowl, and I remember the guy came
up and he was going by me, and I stopped him,
and I said, can you tell Bill not to leave?
You know, tell him to stay. Freddie always always felt

(01:32:42):
like he could. Yeah. No, I wanted, like, knowing all
the the drama that he could be, he could be
a diva, But I wanted to stay. He was a
great coach, and I liked Parcels. But absolutely I was pissed.
I was pissed that he was leaving, you know. Uh
So that's that's how I felt. Spiin Fresno. Fred I'm allowed,

(01:33:04):
Am I allowed to already have a man crush? And
Mike Vrabel. Great interview at Vidya, great interview at the
league meeting yesterday. He's poised and confident without talking down
to people. He seems to provide meaningful information without giving
away company secrets, and he sounds like a coach without
overdoing the coach speak. I'm not just Bill bashing. And

(01:33:25):
we'll see what happens when the season starts. But this
is a breath of fresh air so far. I might
ask Rapes to prompt with Paul as my backup, given
how s felt he's looking these days. Oh thank you,
thank you, very much. There you go.

Speaker 4 (01:33:40):
That's true.

Speaker 5 (01:33:41):
So I I really, and I've said this a million times,
I love Mike and I really enjoyed covering him as
a player. He would be in that certainly in that
top five or so of players. So I really feel like,
you know, he's a guy that I know pretty well.
I would just caution, you know, in terms of how

(01:34:02):
he deals with the media, let's let's wait until it starts,
because I saw some of his press conferences with Tennessee
and I'm not sure all the Tennessee media would agree
with that characterization the talking down to specifically, I think
Mike is pretty fiery, oh yeah, and he could be
a smart he's pretty emotional. Yeah, right now, it's kind

(01:34:24):
of the honey, great.

Speaker 4 (01:34:26):
But I do like that it's very clear that he
has a vision for what he wants in players, like
we haven't goad him to the games yet, you right,
But in terms of what he's looking for and players specifically,
I think you could name any position on the roster
and say safeties, like what is how does a Patriot

(01:34:48):
safety play? For Mike Rabel and he would have a
full answer of you know, from my you know, details
to not you know, to more boiler plate stuff of
what exactly he would look for in an ideal safety
and I don't know if that's true for every coach.

Speaker 2 (01:35:03):
Right, let's go to Patty and aga. What's up Patty?

Speaker 11 (01:35:09):
Hey, good afternoon, gentlemen.

Speaker 10 (01:35:11):
Hey, I wanted to get into a little draft and Brett,
I was wondering if you let me complain a little
about some of the rules proposals.

Speaker 2 (01:35:20):
Sure, I'm I'm preserved to.

Speaker 10 (01:35:26):
The fact that we're probably gonna draft wool Campbell, which
is I never thought it would have been a bad pick,
you know. I all accounts, like if you look at
his numbers, to the pressures that he gave up, the
amount of time that he started, the fact that he
didn't miss games and played against top level competition in
the SCC for three years, you know, starting since the
first date that he walked on campus. All that stuff

(01:35:48):
adds up to you know, I think he'll be pretty
good tactical. You know, he's so so far, so okay,
I'm sorry to see how that goes. Evan, I'm with you, Like,
if Burdon is there at thirty eight, I would the
two guys like, I love Jalen Noel, but Polly, like

(01:36:09):
your guy, we don't have.

Speaker 11 (01:36:10):
A guy like Jayden Niggts.

Speaker 10 (01:36:12):
We don't have that typical extraceater. I wouldn't mind seeing
either one of those two guys at thirty eight.

Speaker 11 (01:36:17):
And as far as.

Speaker 10 (01:36:18):
Like the rules go, I don't mean to sound like
a grumpy old man, but I like the NFL back
before they switched to like seventeen playoffs, back when overtime
with sudden deaths. I don't like the fact that both
teams they're proposing both teams get the ball in overtime.
I propose this. I know you said it's the funk now, Frett,

(01:36:40):
but on the playbook a couple of years ago that
they should just go either one or two things, go
back to sudden deaths, or play a fifteen minute period
and whoever's who's ever in the lead, or if it's
sad at the end, just end it.

Speaker 16 (01:36:52):
That's it.

Speaker 2 (01:36:54):
I think this is pretty close to that. Yeah, this
is pretty close to that.

Speaker 5 (01:37:00):
I think if you play fifteen minutes, yeah, it's going
to be like now, unfortunately it's only ten, right, but
I think you're gonna get Yeah, with both teams getting
the ball, it's going to be kind of who wins
the quarter.

Speaker 2 (01:37:13):
Yeah, you know what I mean. I'm all for a
change if it's good change, and I think both teams
having a possession is a good change. I agree. Yeah,
football is a unique.

Speaker 5 (01:37:22):
Game, and I know the numbers don't necessarily say it
was just the team that won the toss wins all
the time. I know that doesn't back that up, but
it's an advantage.

Speaker 4 (01:37:31):
Yeah, it kind of feels more like now that it's
almost like college style, except you just have to drive
the whole field instead of getting right because it'd be
way too easy in the NFL to make it college
style where they shorten the fields, you know, down so much.
But you know, I think that's what it is now.
It's basically college like. You know, it's told surf.

Speaker 2 (01:37:49):
I think sudden death works in hockey, works in soccer,
but for other sports it's you.

Speaker 5 (01:37:55):
Know, well, because there's is possession, right, this fluid change
like having the puck in hockey, isn't the advantage that
it is Having the football and foot right in the
NFL is.

Speaker 2 (01:38:06):
Right, right, So, and basketball it doesn't make sense because
there's too many points scored.

Speaker 4 (01:38:12):
But mast money is a tweak it's overtime too. It's
too long.

Speaker 2 (01:38:15):
Too long, it takes five minutes.

Speaker 4 (01:38:17):
It's five minutes. But like now at a three point shot,
like you could build a ten point lead in the
first minute of overtime and lose it by the end
of it. It's it's too long. They got to do
something about that.

Speaker 2 (01:38:28):
I thought five minutes is pretty good. Sure, I like
I'm getting ready to start paying attention.

Speaker 4 (01:38:34):
Yeah, coming down the home stretch now, yeah, I like,
you know, like maybe it's like, you know how when
you were kids, like first to eleven, right, Like maybe
like have it be like a certain amount of points
that you have to get to, uh instead of time
to overtime.

Speaker 2 (01:38:48):
Yeah, okay, let's see. Rick writes in he's in Rhode Island.
Hope they get rid of the automatic first down for
five yard penalty. I think they already can that one, right.

Speaker 4 (01:39:00):
Yeah, that's not happening.

Speaker 2 (01:39:01):
That's for defensive holding. Also, they should combine defensive holding,
illegal contact, and passive appearance into one ten yard penalty
for passive appearance with no automatic first down same as
offensive passing appearance.

Speaker 5 (01:39:13):
Well, ten yard penalties is going to be a first
down ninety nine percent of the time. Yeah, Like, how
many times do you have third and longer than ten?

Speaker 2 (01:39:21):
I know, but I I I, and I understand why
they didn't incorporate this because there's just too much incentive
if it's you know, fourth and twelve or third and
twelve to just grab them, just grab them. Yeah, and
then ten yard penalty it's fourth down, right.

Speaker 4 (01:39:37):
Or if it's a legal contact five yard penalty, it's
third and twelve. Now it's just third and seven, which
is also still a pretty low percentage conversion rate. So
if it's too much incentive, the defense can just grab guys, right.

Speaker 5 (01:39:49):
I am very much against making passive appearance a ten
yard penalty. I think the spot follow is good. Now,
does that mean that I agree with the way they
call it? No, but it should be. Do you talk
about incentive when you're down fifty yards down and you
just say, oh, I'm beat, I'm just going to tackle, right,
because it's only going to be a ten yard penalty

(01:40:10):
that would happen constantly.

Speaker 2 (01:40:11):
And that's why the rule is the way it is.
That said, I agree with Paul, you got to call
it better and it's not where you review. Assistance comes
in the play and I think it should be a
reviewable penalty.

Speaker 5 (01:40:24):
Especially on balls, you know, significantly down the field. Make
it be passing Apperance. I was watching It's funny. I
was watching an NFL network over the weekend. They had
they were running the eighteen Conference championship, so the Patriots
Chiefs was on. I was watching that a little bit.
But before that, they had the Saints and Rams, and

(01:40:45):
that that play egregious passing appearance by the Rams that
they didn't call at the end. And I still say,
and I give Troy Aikman and Joe Bock talked about
it a little bit, but no one talked about this
in the aftermath of the game. It's just how badly
Sean Payton screwed that up. It should have never gotten
to the point where they needed that pass and appearance
to be called.

Speaker 2 (01:41:04):
Even though they got screwed.

Speaker 5 (01:41:05):
That was one of the most egregiously missed calls I've
ever seen, bar none. But they had that long pass
to Ted Ginn down there, they were in field goal range.
All they had to do is run the ball three times,
make the Rams use the rest of their timeouts, and
kick a field goal with no time left, and the
game's over instead the game of instead the.

Speaker 4 (01:41:23):
Rule of threw the ball twice.

Speaker 5 (01:41:27):
They threw it twice and in the second one was
the one that so they threw an incomplete pass and
then they got the pass in apperance that they didn't call.

Speaker 2 (01:41:34):
Now, had they called it, he would have gotten away
with it.

Speaker 5 (01:41:36):
But sure like Sean Payton did not take anywhere near
enough criticism for how he botched that down the stretch.

Speaker 2 (01:41:45):
Rick also says, as for Parcels, I believe the disgraceful
way he left was was a disqualifier. It is a
shamecraft pushed aside the selection process to induct Parcels. Yes,
he is the owner and can do what he wants,
but this is disgraceful. If Parcells couldn't get in through
the regular process, he shouldn't be in. Well, yeah, I
agree with that. Listen, I'm on record about my stance there.

(01:42:08):
But let's say that you do think he was you know,
he should get in the process hurt him because of
all the players that he's going up again. It's hurting
Wes Welker right now. Yeah, and so there is a
chance that he could get in, but post humorously, posthumously,
and that's not good, you know so, And again I

(01:42:32):
think I think maybe that's something that Robert Craft took
into consideration by doing it now. You don't want to
wait until it's too late. It's a fair point, Dave
in San Marcos, Texas. Raymond Barry deserves to get into
the Patriots Hall of Fame before Bill Parcells. He coached
here longer, has a better regular season and playoff record,

(01:42:52):
first Patriot super Bowl appearance, and coached that first NFL
team to win three road playoff games and route and
route to the Super Bowl. Also, he did not try
to screw the Patriots on his way out the door.
Raymond Berry. See, this is where the bar has gotten
too low. So I'll just say no, this.

Speaker 5 (01:43:12):
Is where no one can really eliminate their personal hatred,
because anyone that would suggest that Raymond Barry did more
for the Patriots than Bill Parcells is doing so solely
based on hatred of Bill Parcells. Like I loved Raymond
Berry as the coach. He inherited a team that had

(01:43:33):
been in the playoffs like two years earlier, and that
should have been in the playoffs the year he inherited it,
and he ended up doing a nice job with them,
They got to a Super.

Speaker 2 (01:43:42):
Bowl, they overachieved great.

Speaker 5 (01:43:45):
I had nothing bad to say about Raymond Berry. Bill
Parcells built what you think is the Patriots. Now, he
started that and Belichick obviously brought it to heights that
we never imagined. But there's no comparison between the impact
that ourselves out on the Patriots and the impact and
you have.

Speaker 2 (01:44:02):
When it comes to team Hall of Fame, you have
to take into consideration what they did for the.

Speaker 5 (01:44:07):
Team, right, and you hate him because he left you, right,
And I get that the way. You're not wrong for
feeling that way.

Speaker 2 (01:44:14):
Listen, if I was in charge of the world, we
wouldn't have to worry about this conversation because none of
them would get in. Oursels wouldn't even get into the
Pro Football Hall of Fame. He wouldn't. He wouldn't. No,
I wouldn't say no.

Speaker 5 (01:44:25):
Colleges wouldn't get into. Oh no, coaches in the Hall
of Fame.

Speaker 2 (01:44:29):
No, I'm not saying that. Oh I'm sorry. In my
in my like, in my Hall of Fame, he would not,
he doesn't. He wouldn't be in. Uh, Vince Lombardi will
get in. Bill Walsh would get in. And then after that,
it's tough. Donald will get in in mind. Joe Gibbs, Nope, okay,

(01:44:54):
I can live with that. I can live with that.
I see what you're doing. You gotta you gotta win four,
you gotta, you got to. But that's okay. But Tom Land,
you got to be up there. I don't know about
Tom Nola.

Speaker 4 (01:45:09):
Guy like created like the four to three defense. I
don't care.

Speaker 2 (01:45:14):
He changed it, like the entire landscape of the game.
All right, And by the way, one a million games.

Speaker 4 (01:45:20):
Yeah, by the.

Speaker 2 (01:45:23):
Way, why is Vince Lombardi? And that's invented by the
guy from Army.

Speaker 5 (01:45:26):
Four to three? I said four three, not three four?
Three four was actually invented by Bud Wilkinson of Oklahoma.

Speaker 2 (01:45:33):
Bud Wilkinson. No, he's been it to three four right,
three four? Yeah, right, you're right, Bud Wilkinson, you're right.
We did a story on that for PFW. Thanks, thanks
for reading.

Speaker 5 (01:45:42):
Yeah, so, why Vince Lombardi then.

Speaker 2 (01:45:47):
Because of the amount of wins that you know, because
you got to see here championship championships.

Speaker 5 (01:45:54):
So the other guys that won championships don't matter, like
Paul Brown doesn't care.

Speaker 2 (01:45:58):
Paul Brown probably would get it. We didn't get to him,
I know, because you stopped. Your list was two. It
was Bill walshon probably he should probably.

Speaker 4 (01:46:07):
I like this, to be honest, I'm more with you.

Speaker 2 (01:46:10):
I liked small. I'm a small hall. I have to
be great, great great.

Speaker 5 (01:46:13):
I just think some of those guys that you're ignoring
were great, great great. Tom Landry was great, great great.

Speaker 4 (01:46:19):
Okay, I think that some of the some of the
players that have gotten in the last couple of years,
I'm like, I don't know if he was really great,
you know, like he was a good.

Speaker 2 (01:46:31):
God.

Speaker 5 (01:46:32):
There's good players getting in there. Brian Yeah, you know,
Brian Dawkins. I loved Brian, really good player.

Speaker 2 (01:46:39):
You know. They you know, for the Canton Hall of Fame,
it's become this event that they you know, they have
to have at least four guys or this year. It's
you know, it's so like I think in my world
there's a potential that one year Tod be no one
that gets into the Pro Football Hall.

Speaker 5 (01:46:58):
Of happening Baseball a couple of years ago, right, yeah, yeah,
I mean, I I don't hate your theories. I just
would sort of where you draw the line.

Speaker 2 (01:47:08):
It's to me, it's a gut thing. Like I hear
the name, it's like Paul Brown, Hall of Fame. I
just I don't have to think about it.

Speaker 5 (01:47:14):
I just can't believe you don't hear like Tom Landry,
Chuck Nol, Don Shula and think the same.

Speaker 4 (01:47:21):
I mean, sure, I kind of agree with him Onnol,
like I can see where he's coming from. I don't
agree he.

Speaker 2 (01:47:25):
Had a longer. He coached a long time.

Speaker 4 (01:47:28):
But I don't think there's an argument against Chuck Nolan,
Tom Landry, like Shula lost.

Speaker 2 (01:47:34):
One game over a two year span.

Speaker 5 (01:47:36):
Yeah, okay, like that doesn't mean anything to.

Speaker 4 (01:47:39):
You, No, okay, I.

Speaker 2 (01:47:42):
Mean time, I appreciate it, I really do. I mean
during manning in the cults, Tony Dungee then should probably
get in because he had a lot of wins. He
never did that. No, but like what did he lose
three games in two years or something like that. I
don't know. It's incredible, but no, he never did anything
like on your one loss over I didn't say, I
said it wasn't that, but it was pretty incredible, Like

(01:48:04):
the amount of regular season wins that they racked up
an Indy.

Speaker 4 (01:48:08):
There's no free agency back then there's a different sport.

Speaker 2 (01:48:10):
But whatever, but like made it harder. You know, ask
me would just go and buy what you need. Just
winning a lot of games doesn't do it for me.
But he won titles. Friends, It's not just winning games,
like what, it's the impact on the game.

Speaker 5 (01:48:23):
I just find it odd that you like Vince Lombardi
is the guy that like stands up.

Speaker 2 (01:48:27):
I'm not a big I would.

Speaker 5 (01:48:29):
Make an argument against Vince lombardie because I kind of
agree with Bill Belichick on Vince Lain.

Speaker 2 (01:48:34):
Yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:48:34):
No, I always kind of got the feeling that he
thought he was kind of overrated.

Speaker 2 (01:48:38):
Yeah no, I I and I hear that.

Speaker 5 (01:48:39):
He's a great disciplinarian, a great structure, great program.

Speaker 2 (01:48:43):
Yeah, but I don't know. I think his contribution to
the game, there's a lot of things that he taught
that you know, got passed along and.

Speaker 4 (01:48:50):
Well that's why I would put in Tom Landry.

Speaker 2 (01:48:53):
Yeah yeah, Paul Brown for sure, innovator winner, Yeah yeah.

Speaker 5 (01:49:01):
Tom Landry's from the Vince Lombardi tree, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:49:03):
He Yeah, I did. I have gone down the Bill
Walsh rabbit hole recently and that coaching tree. If you
really yeah, you have to be a little bit generous
in some spots, but it's incredible the amount of just
a coaching talent that is all branches off the West coast.

Speaker 5 (01:49:24):
And I love those when you go back and you
see like nineteen eighty four, like you know, East Texas
State coaching staff and there's like seven guys that are
household names. Yeah, and you're like, wow, Yeah, these guys
were all nobody nothings at this time and they were
all together. It's like, you know what they try to
do with Cleveland, the Cleveland ninety four thing.

Speaker 2 (01:49:45):
He only didn't like. It's more like, you know.

Speaker 4 (01:49:48):
The Washington It's more like Bill Belichick and Nick Saban,
you know, the Washington Commanders, and then Redskins like Shanahan
with you know McVeigh and Kyle Shanahan and Bobby Slowick.

Speaker 2 (01:50:02):
Chris wather t i An writes in Happy to see
Parcels inducted, It's about time he, along with ownership, changed
everything here well deserved. And Fred was the guy you
mentioned in today's story, Mickey Corkoran. That was his high
school coach. Yes, it was absolutely Mickey Corkoran. Yeah, name
as the Red or something like that. Yeah, yep, Mick

(01:50:27):
to Robin and the Cats skills has a bone to
pick with Evan. I like these emails last week on
PU Evan smugly deigned to include Bill Russell in his
top five of all time NBA greats. He did so twice.
I can only imagine, like the rest of his video
game adult generation, what he thinks that he thinks Lebron
belongs in the top five. Lebron is a great player,

(01:50:50):
although he's allowed to travel and not get fouled. Hell,
Caitlyn Clark takes harder fouls than him. His top tier
is Jordan Russell, Jabbar Chamberlain, Magic Bird, Doctor j all
the great players, but also transformative talents that change the game.
So please Evan stick to football.

Speaker 4 (01:51:09):
Okay, First of all, haven't played a video game in
like ten years, so I don't know what.

Speaker 2 (01:51:13):
The video What is the actual issue with Evan? I
don't know. I wasn't I don't know.

Speaker 4 (01:51:18):
Say that Bill Russell, Yeah, I say he's a top
five player of all time twice?

Speaker 2 (01:51:22):
Yeah, So what's wrong with it? It sounds like he agrees, Yeah.

Speaker 4 (01:51:25):
Right, I don't know. I don't know, And I would
have Lebron as the second best Basketball Player of all time,
second behind Jordan.

Speaker 2 (01:51:32):
Yeah, Jordan, Lebron's gonna get yelled up by Lebron.

Speaker 4 (01:51:35):
You know, Jordan Lebron, Magic, Larry Bird, Bill Russell.

Speaker 2 (01:51:39):
I might be able to find a spot for Lebron.
I think Lebron.

Speaker 5 (01:51:43):
I argue with Will all the time. I go, I
might payble to squeez him in my top ten.

Speaker 2 (01:51:46):
Oh yeah, I meant listen, Jordan is the best.

Speaker 5 (01:51:50):
I still think Jordan was better, But I I you know,
Lebron's longevity, you know everything about it.

Speaker 2 (01:51:56):
Yeah, you got to give him his due.

Speaker 4 (01:51:57):
I don't. I don't know, Like the longevity doesn't do
it for me. I'm kind of with you on that. Fred, Like,
just because he played for a long time, he's.

Speaker 5 (01:52:03):
Playing at a high level, but his.

Speaker 4 (01:52:06):
His peak, I mean it's I mean he went to
eighth Street and.

Speaker 2 (01:52:10):
Anyone with multiple teams give him credit that.

Speaker 4 (01:52:15):
You know, we'll see about that. I kind of hold
that against him a little bit. Why well, I really
feel like he has one real title. So that's clel
in Cleveland, Like.

Speaker 5 (01:52:25):
And even then they needed them to suspend a player
for the other team to make sure it happened.

Speaker 4 (01:52:29):
But like, you know, the ones in Miami, like he
was on Dwayne Wade's team. I'm with one this, Yeah,
he's on and brought Chris Bosh. Can you imagine if
like Larry and Magic did this? Do you imagine how
many titles they would have won? It they just said, Hey,
why don't we both become free agents? Right, we'll go
to the same place and then we'll recruit our friends.
I know, because that's basically what he did. Yeah. Let's

(01:52:51):
also not forget that the Lakers titles in the bubble
during the COVID year, fake phony title but still the
second best player of all time. I'm just saying that
if you're going to put them up against George Yeah, Jordan,
these are flaws.

Speaker 5 (01:53:04):
But just imagine if Larry and Magic decided to play together. Yeah,
how many titles they would have won? I mean they
combined for what eight titles over a ten year span?

Speaker 2 (01:53:14):
As it was? Yep. James Pettigrew the most Interesting Pages
fan of the World says, what about this is about
the overtime? What about both defenses and offenses are on
the field. Offenses start at their own twenty yard line
and then it's the first to score. You may need
a few more officials. But Evan would love watching the
All forty four.

Speaker 4 (01:53:35):
What I get it. Yeah, it's a joke.

Speaker 2 (01:53:39):
I think, Oh it's a joke. Okay, I was thinking
he might. Okay, let's see, John is not a show.
Come on, John is not happy about Parcels. Never wanted
to see Parcels in the Hall of Fame over one
of the people from the Dynasty. Parcels ruined that super
Bowl for me, so I never wanted to see him going.

(01:53:59):
Over all the people who made super Bowls great for me,
the owner putting him in seems fair. I will never
vote for him. Yes, I know he helped the team,
but he couldn't wait to leave us. The whole calling
Terry Glenn, she bothered me, and the way he handled
leaving pretty much screwed up the two weeks of the
Super Bowl in South Carolina, all I heard was about

(01:54:19):
him leaving and how unhappy he was. Yeah, I mean,
all that is fair. I don't believe that you were
offended by the she common I don't believe that bothered you,
he said.

Speaker 5 (01:54:28):
But everything else I you know, I it absolutely was
a bummer to be flying home from the super Bowl
in ninety six knowing that he was leaving.

Speaker 2 (01:54:38):
Yeah, that was a bummer, took away from from the enjoyment. Yep.
Dave and Darry writes in I do think again over time,
I do think this increases the odds of a tie,
which I don't love. The only suit that, the only
solution I can think of while giving each team a
possession would be to add the two point attempt shootout
thing that they do in college. I'm not surprised at

(01:54:59):
all that Paul wants his first, regardless. I'm not surprised
at all that Paul wants it first, regardless. He hates
knowing what you need.

Speaker 4 (01:55:08):
Oh is this is because of the down down nine
go for two things? Yeah?

Speaker 5 (01:55:15):
Well, oh yeah, if it was if it wasn't a
ten minute limit, I would. I would, if it was
like unlimited, if it wasn't like one period.

Speaker 2 (01:55:28):
Words are very hard.

Speaker 5 (01:55:29):
If it wasn't one period of play, I would. I
would differ and I would want to know what I needed. Absolutely, Yeah.
But I think the time crunch makes it different, and
the fact that it doesn't end. Yeah, to me, I
would just go down, score a touchdown, make the other
team score a touchdown.

Speaker 2 (01:55:48):
Yep.

Speaker 5 (01:55:49):
But I don't understand why that matters to Rich McKay right.
That was my larger point. I understand, like the whole
Super Bowl thing with Kansas City and San Francis, I
would have deferred.

Speaker 2 (01:56:01):
What as Rich mcaino, he turned down parcels, I mean,
not Belichick.

Speaker 5 (01:56:06):
Yeah right, Yeah, that one really makes them look bad, now,
doesn't it.

Speaker 2 (01:56:09):
It does.

Speaker 5 (01:56:10):
Yeah, he lost out on the forty third rate recruiting.

Speaker 4 (01:56:16):
Class to the two point thing in college though, they
do that because it's not timed right, so like it
can take like this is still going to have a
time restraint on it. Where the college game, they're just
trying to get the game over, so they put the
two you have to go for two in there.

Speaker 2 (01:56:33):
So I would do different. I would do that too,
you do both.

Speaker 5 (01:56:37):
No, I would not the shootout, but make them go
for two after a touchdown.

Speaker 4 (01:56:41):
I just don't see what I guess. I mean, I
just I gu it's a little harder to match. Yeah, yeah, I.

Speaker 5 (01:56:47):
Mean if both of them get it, then all right,
we're gonna get stuck with a tie here. But I
think it increases the chances of an outcome.

Speaker 2 (01:56:53):
Now, but they that was gimmicky and.

Speaker 4 (01:56:56):
You had the ball second, would you go for two
to the win?

Speaker 2 (01:57:01):
Oh? Yeah, yeah. The Cody says, would you put John
Madden in the Hall of Fame? Yes, I have to
think about that.

Speaker 4 (01:57:10):
You would not, I know, because I'm not.

Speaker 2 (01:57:13):
Don't take that as a shot. You wouldn't because he
didn't do it long enough. I would do it, and
I didn't include the Madden game.

Speaker 4 (01:57:21):
See, I would do it for like broadcasting the video game.

Speaker 2 (01:57:24):
Yeah. But if you can, if you're allowed to, like say, oh,
somebody can do it for two things, get in for
doing two things. Then Raymond Berry, for example, Well he's in, right,
I think he's a Hall of Fame player. Yeah, he's
a Hall of Fame player. You think so? Yeah, I
think he is too. So that's not a good example.
But well, like you know, who would be another example

(01:57:47):
of that, somebody who had a good career in coaching
and in playing and both of those factors get him
into the hall, because right now, that's not that's not
what they do.

Speaker 4 (01:57:56):
It's one of the other, very better.

Speaker 2 (01:57:58):
Either a coach or a player. He's in the Yeah, yeah,
so I don't think that would be fair to count
Madden in. See, I wouldn't. I think he would be.
He should be a Hall of Fame coach. But what
do you have two titles with the Raiders one? Only one?

Speaker 5 (01:58:12):
But it was like, can I get your because his
record is phenomenal. He had a good record, but it
was short. Yeah, and to your point, you would, I
know you wouldn't put him.

Speaker 2 (01:58:21):
I would.

Speaker 5 (01:58:21):
You didn't do it long enough, and I have to
think about it. And then if you do it too long,
you're just you wouldn't go in because you did it too.

Speaker 2 (01:58:27):
Long and you didn't get all the results postseason Don.

Speaker 5 (01:58:31):
Sula, Yeah, Madden did. Yeah, Madden has like the best
postseason winning percentage of all time.

Speaker 2 (01:58:38):
I think he couldn't win a Super Bowl with Dan Marino.

Speaker 4 (01:58:43):
I do hold that against Don Sula. That's a valid point.

Speaker 5 (01:58:46):
Neither could anybody else. Jimmy Johnson any good.

Speaker 2 (01:58:50):
It was the end of his tent. He was getting
old at that point. Okay, yeah, but I do.

Speaker 4 (01:58:55):
I think that's how many super bowls ad Bill of
one with.

Speaker 2 (01:59:00):
Because he wouldn't let him throw the ball.

Speaker 5 (01:59:01):
I think John Shula is overrated, but I think he's
a Hall of Fame coach.

Speaker 4 (01:59:06):
I agree.

Speaker 2 (01:59:07):
I don't know if that those two things make sense
to me, kind of like.

Speaker 4 (01:59:10):
The Lebron Jordan conversation, where it's like if if we're
comparing him to the other great coaches.

Speaker 5 (01:59:14):
We're talking about two of the very best players ever
to play. So when you say something negative about one
of them, it sounds like you think he stinks, right, yeah,
but that's not like Lebron's. Lebron's an all time Oh.

Speaker 2 (01:59:25):
Yeah, come on, come on. But yeah, all right, that's
gonna be it for this edition of Patriots Unfiltered. We'll
be back Thursday. Paul and I might be a little
late because we have the Hall of Fame Committee at
ten o'clock. That might run a little over.

Speaker 5 (01:59:39):
I might have to help Fred not get his his
butt kicked, because sometimes Fred gets in fights at those things.

Speaker 2 (01:59:46):
He's a done deal now, I don't have to stand
up and talk about.

Speaker 5 (01:59:49):
I just want to make sure he's okay. So I
don't like to leave him by himself. Yeah, all right,
gets in a lot of a lot of boxing matches.

Speaker 2 (01:59:56):
Catch twenty two tomorrow, tomorrow. All right, we'll talk to
you Thursday.

Speaker 12 (02:00:04):
Thank you for telling me this podcast.

Speaker 1 (02:00:06):
Subscribe on Apple, Google Play, and everywhere. Else you'll listen
like the show, Please rate and review us. Listener comments
and ratings help keep us high in the podcast rankings
so new listeners can find us.

Speaker 2 (02:00:18):
Be sure to check.

Speaker 1 (02:00:19):
Patriots dot com for more news and more podcasts.

Speaker 2 (02:00:28):
The worlds of Vigein podcast.

Speaker 6 (02:00:41):
Patriots Catch twenty two will join Evan, Lizar and Alex
Bart every Thursday as they take a deep dive into
the exits and O's trends and latest New England Patriots
roster moves.

Speaker 4 (02:00:51):
And I'm usually into the numbers. Okay, we do this.

Speaker 2 (02:00:55):
I'm into the tangible numbers. There's tame here.

Speaker 4 (02:00:58):
Just give me.

Speaker 2 (02:00:58):
There's the advantage even know how to work it.

Speaker 4 (02:01:01):
I'm surprised, Like you know, an old man over here.
I thought maybe I'd have to show you, like a
tutorial or something.

Speaker 2 (02:01:06):
How am I old man?

Speaker 6 (02:01:07):
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