February 29, 2024 • 19 mins
Rams Legend James "Shack" Harris joins D’Marco Farr on this episode of Rams Iconic to discuss his football journey, his career with the Rams, and what it meant to be the first black quarterback to start and win a playoff game in the NFL.
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Speaker 1 (00:07):
Welcome to the Rams Iconic presented by eighteen hundred Tequila,
the best taste in tequila.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Please drink responsibly.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I'm DeMarco far and this is the podcast where we
catch up with some of the most iconic players in
franchise history. My next guest played ten seasons in the
NFL four with your Los Angeles Rams. In nineteen seventy four,
he became the first black quarterback to start and win
a playoff game. He was twenty one and six as
it started with Los Angeles and took the Rams to
(00:34):
three straight NFC title games. He's a legend and a trailblazer.
Please welcome to Rams Iconic, The definition of iconic. James
Shaq Harris.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
What's going on, big man?
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Oh, thank you for having me in. Yeah, it's just
good to be in. Thank the RAMS organization for inviting
me here.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Well, thank you for being here. Thank you for doing
this with this. This is this is special, man, This
is RAMS Iconic. I don't think there's anybody more iconic
than you. I mean, this is this is a big
deal for the show. So thank you for sitting with us, man.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
I appreciate it. Appreciate you know, the RAMS and great
teams and mates and play that I played off.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
So, you know, doing some research on you, and it's
just so you were a high school phenom. You won
a state championship as a sophomore, right, is that true?
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Correct? I had a lot of great players.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Great players with you, but you, but you started winning
right out the gate. And then you had a scholarship
offer from Michigan State, but you decided to turn it
down because they wanted you to switch positions.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Do I have that writing?
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Got it? You had an accurate you know. But once
I got up there and realized that they're playing for
me was to switch my position, I decided that I
would go to Grandma. And it's also it was too
hard to say no to coach Eddy Robinson. How do
you say no?
Speaker 1 (01:55):
I mean you said, no one in your neighborhood, no
one you know has ever been on television. I mean
you grew up when I came up, when you came out,
But you grew up in an area full of athletes,
a bunch of pros, and nobody that you knew had
been on TV. That's why you consider going to Michigan State.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Well, you know I came up when the time where
it was segregated, so none of our players the Big
Ten was on TV and we couldn't play at the
major universes there, so no one had ever received a scholarship,
and I was the first one to be offered and
(02:30):
considered it because I thought that would give an opportunity
for some other players to get that exposure.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Wait all that pressure, I mean you didn't feel that pressure,
like you have an opportunity to break through and you
decided not to go because you wanted to be a quarterback.
What is it about being a quarterback that you were
so attached to? That's I guess that's my number one
question for you.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Well, it was my first of all, I felt that
was my best position, and I studied a position. I've
seen so many guys, almost everybody switching position some way
in my own way, that was just my way of,
you know, just trying to make a difference for others.
(03:15):
I just said I wanted to play play quarterback, and
then I resisted switching position. I realized I was maybe
in risking an opportunity to play pro ball, because if
I switched and start playing, I would be the technique
and fundamental I would have them rather than waiting until
after I finished college.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I think anybody who's ever played football at any level,
any black child, you all grew up throwing the football
pretending to be quarterbacks. But coming up there were no
people that looked like you playing the position, so you
kind of had to make those switches. And I've been
in those rooms in high school or college when they
(03:57):
would tell the kid a quarterback, we're going to switch
you to your more natural position. We're gonna put you
at corner, we're gonna put you at safety, we're gonna
put you at running back. And they always present it
in a way that says this will make us better,
not just you. It's a lot of pressure for a kid.
I saw this same conversation in college right under a
picture of Warren Moon because we went to the same school.
(04:19):
So that was kind of like one of those ironic moments.
But hang it on to that spot. Instead of getting
in where you fit in. You decided I want to
be a quarterback, and you turn down Michigan State and
you win. You wind up going to play for one
of the greatest coaches of all time. Talk about a blessing,
Talk about a blessing. Wow, no yet know to them,
(04:42):
big moment. Yes to one of the greatest coaches who
ever lived in Eddie Robinson.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Oh, no question. Yeah. I went to some other schools
and when I visit, you know, they had different ways
of telling me that I was going to play. They
wanted me to play other position. First of all, I
got an opportunity to get those scholarship is because other
coaches recommended me. They weren't necessarily really scouting, you know,
scouting our area, but because of my size was one
(05:10):
of the reasons they wanted to switch me to other position.
One team told said to me that they wanted me
to play Why I receive a defensive back while I
learned to become a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
So play here while you learn to be a quarterback.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Okay, but that's the hoodwink.
Speaker 3 (05:28):
But when coach Edi Robinson come to your home, all
my coaches had played for him. He was their hero,
and he come to your home and he promised my mother.
He said to my mother that if you allow me
to coach your son, I coach him like my very own.
(05:50):
You go to get a college degree. You'll go to
church on Sunday. Wow, you graduate and make a difference
to society, and at that time Gramlin had one of
the great teams, and I thought it was a perfect fit.
To me.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
What did they call Did they called Grambling the Notre
Dame of the South?
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Is that the word? Is that what they kind of
put out there for a minute. You guys were so dominant.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Well, because I think only Notre Dame at one point
had sent more people, more playoffs to the NFL than
Grandma Wow. Coach j Eddy Robinson sent over two hundred
players to the NFL. That was, you know when in
the early sixty had sent over two hundred players in
the NFL.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Three straight Swack titles. And then you enter the draft
in nineteen sixty nine. What were your thoughts about going
into the draft? I mean, you you've broken down barriers,
you stayed at quarterback, you turned down Michigan State, you
played there and turned it out in the Swack. But
now you're entering the NFL draft. What were your expectations
of that draft in nineteen sixty nine.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
My expectation was out going to get vepptid High. We
had played in New York, we had played in the
Orange Blossom Classic in Miami, we played in big. We
played in the Junior rose Bow in LA. We had
a very good sports information director who got my name out.
You know, I was in major news across the country.
(07:18):
I had size what they were looking for. So I fit.
I fell fit all the criterias. So I thought, and
they said that I was gonna get drafted, get drafted high.
But when it was all over and coach tried to
get me an All Star game, he could not get
me in an All Star game. So that was a message. Uh.
The year before, Eldrew Dickey was drafted in the first round.
(07:39):
I thought I was gonna get drafted high, and then
everybody started switching. He was switched, Marlon Briscoe was switched,
the Magician again, Jimmy Ray was switched. So when you
realize that the only way I would have a chance
if I got drafted first day. So I didn't get
drafted the first day, and I realized that, uh, I
(08:00):
probably wouldn't have a chance on playing in the league.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Did you think back like maybe I should switch positions
or were you just steadfast, I'm going to be a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
That's it because the dreams about to end, right.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
Yeah. They called me and offered me. They said if
I would switch positions, they would draft me earlier. Wow, okay,
but I resisted out of high school. I was just now.
I committed to playing quarterback, right like I said, I
kept my word. They kept their word. They didn't draft me.
(08:32):
It was frustrating because when I went into draft, all
I wanted other than play quarterback, was to pay my
mother J. C. Pennybille. And when I wasn't drafted, I
wasn't able to do that, and I just decided not
to play pro football. Wow. I decided it just wasn't
worth going through. And then changed to talk with coach Robinson. Yeah.
(08:56):
He felt that I represented the opportunity for some for
some others, and I felt that I owed him so
much because I remember when he came back from New
York and he had talked to Howard Cosell, and Howard
Cosell asked him, you've produced so many great players, why
(09:18):
can't you produce a quarterback? And when he came back
for New York, he came by my home and he said,
damn it to hell. He didn't curse, but he wore
damn and hell out. He said, damn it to hell.
I just come from New York and Howard Cosell. I
had a NERD asked me one of them to produce
a quarterback. He said, if you come to Grandma in
(09:42):
four years, America would be ready for a quarterback. And
I heard that and I thought that I believed in that,
and I decided when I decided to go to go
to Grandma. That's one of the things that you know
he lived up to when it was off season and
we wouldn't utilize it now. Play he would bring back
(10:04):
plays from the NFL and we'd go over trying to
get me.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
He would bring you pro style plays to run, so
he was preparing you for the NFL.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
He had a good relationship with Vince Lombardi because we
had a great play on that team. Willie Davis, Yeah,
he would always bring back and as soon as he
gets back, we'd meet and he'd go over what they're
doing in the NFL. Wow. Yeah, it was it was
a benefit.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
You're a project. I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
So you go to Buffalo drafted in the eighth round.
You wind up becoming you compete, and you win the job.
You're the opening day starter. You're the first black quarterback
to ever begin the season as the starter. Did you
know that? Was that something in your head? I'm sure
they had to write about it. How did you feel
about that?
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Well, in the beginning, all I wanted was the opportunity
to compete. I didn't think I was going to get that.
And as as I was seven on the depth chart,
was on the depth shot, and you can't they can't
work every quarterback. So the first few days I didn't
get a chance to work. But one of the challenging
things was that during that during those days, they.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Cut every day. They cut players every day every day.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
You know now they don't cut the end the training camp. Yeah,
well they cut every day and you started right off
the fourth of July. So about the on the seventh,
they cut every day, and every morning at six o'clock
they knock on somebody's door, bam, bam bam. And I
was sitting there, seventh on the depth shot, knowing, knowing,
(11:36):
I was in the line of fire. Right when I
heard I I just wait, did you ever hear it
down the hall? I heard it down the hall, and
I wait every day when they skipped my door, I
made it for another day.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
So I had to go through twenty days of that,
and but each day lucky for me, and then the
practice they'd have a little passing drill and I bad
myself another day.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
In those drills, in those drills, balling out. Okay, So
you leave Buffalo you come out to LA in nineteen
seventy three, that had to be weird, right coming out west.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
You ever been out west before?
Speaker 3 (12:15):
I knew a lot of I was more confident in
LA than Buffalo. Oh no, what because Louisiana most of
the people when they graduate, they come to LA for jobs.
Most of the people in Alabama, Mississippi go Noah. So
I knew a lot of people. I felt comfortable in
the environment. And there they had a lot of players
on the team from the Swack Conference in HBCU school.
(12:40):
So I felt comfortable when that when I got it.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
So you get an opportunity. Coach Knox, we have that
in common. He believed in you saw something and you
gave you a shot. You became the starter in nineteen
seventy four. Talk about that process, because I looked through
that season. I think you guys lost to Green Bay
the week before, and the next week you become the
and you just absolutely mop up San Francisco. How did
you become the starter? What was the process through that?
Speaker 3 (13:05):
But the process was I went from the practice squad
and the next year. The next year, John Hade, who
had been the MVP, they traded for him. He comes in.
They draft Ywaski, So those were the three quarterbacks. Yuwawski
was the second round draft choice and I just had to,
you know, find I had to find my way on
(13:26):
the roster and John Hado ended up being the MVP
of the league. Was a good playoff for the ram
in nineteen seventy two, and then we played Green Bay
seventy three, who played Green Bay early seventy four.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
And pretty good football team, not great.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
The football team. We had a good team. I think
we struggled around. They decided to make a change and
they traded John Hade and move into the starting lineup.
I was surprised. Yeah, you know, they had been the MVP.
I thought he still had some ability to play, and
they put me in the starting lineup.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
That's two in a row, two great coaches that saw
something in you and said this is our guy and
let's go forward with that. So jumping ahead to three
days before Christmas, nineteen seventy four, you become the first
black quarterback to start a postseason game and win it again.
I'll ask you, did you know about the moment going
(14:25):
into the game or was it just about ball for you?
Because it was a moment in time for a lot
of kids and a lot of people in this country.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
Well, I was aware. I was aware of why to
represent it because I was the only starting quarterback in
the league, only black starting black starting quarterback in the league.
I was aware of what it represent but I was
even more focus on making sure I play well because
(14:56):
my play could determine others getting the opportunity.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Did it dawn on you who you were playing that
day and what that team represented in the NFL in
terms of black quarterbacks and blacks participating in the NFL?
I think Washington was one of the last teams to integrate.
Does that did that factor in that you beat them
in the playoffs? Never thought, Never thought about that at all.
(15:21):
My focus, My focus had to be on my preparation. Yeah,
I think, Uh, you know, the wheel to win is
determined by the wheel to prepare. So my focus had
to be on, you know, playing well for the Rams,
getting the right people making decisions, and you went to
(15:45):
the Pro Bowl that year right after that season, Yeah,
and you were the MVP of the Pro Bowl too,
So you just keep proving along the way that wow,
I can do this.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
Hey. I was very fortunate that they have a good
team to play with, got in the Pro Bowl and
had a good day, and I was very, very very
excited about that.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
It's just a trip, man.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
I mean, coming off the Super Bowl watching Patrick Mahomes
do his thing. He goes back to back and who
he had to beat to get there. He beats Lamar.
We got Dak Prescott in Dallas and he led the
league in touchdown passes. And I'm sitting here with the
origin story. Does it ever like it began with me?
And here we are now?
Speaker 3 (16:29):
C J.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Stroud is Rookie of the Year. Black quarterbacks aren't a
thing anymore. They just say quarterbacks. Now, does that resonate
with you at all? Being the first I don't look
at it as a fan of a game and the
challenges that black quarterbacks had to go through and witnessing
(16:51):
them all, seeing Marlon Briscoe come in and have to
change from receiver, seeing Doug William win the Super.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
Bowl and one of the great games ever played. By
the way, it was a routine grambling day.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Our routine grambling day.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
Wow, one moon. You don't have to go to Canada
when you see those when you see those things and
you come down today, I'm so happy to see the
players today who are great ambassadors for the game. They
say the right things, you know, they they play well.
They got foundations to help send message, to clear message
(17:32):
to young people. And the talent on the field is extraordinary.
And today, you know, we finally reached the time where
I think young kids growing up, I feel that they
have can They can play quarterback international football.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
That's the crazy thing. Some of that humility and those
players you just mentioned is born of you. Like if
you would have cracked, if you would have switched positions,
if you would have flamed out, we wouldn't be here.
They might not playing quarterback. Mahomes might be a running
back at this point.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
I do know what you mean.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
I went through it absolutely and I heard you speak.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
You talked about your teammates, and I had Harold Jackson
in this seat. I had a lot of guys from
that era and they all say what a great time
they had playing together, like that team was special, and
you said something, it just wasn't meant to be to
be champion. But it wasn't like you guys weren't one
of the best teams in the league as far as
being teammates together and working hard.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Of course, it was one of it. One year we
go to we beat Dallas in the first round and
lose in Minnesota. Next year we beat Minnesota and lose.
The Dallas were good teams and that's one of the
things that you'll never forget having that opportunity and coming
up a little short.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Well, I'll tell you so, I will never forget this.
This has been a treat for me and I hope
it's been a treat for you. So thank you, James
Shack Harris for stopping by.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
All Right, that's a wrap on this episode of Rams
Like Kind presented by eighteen hundred Tequila, the best taste
in tequila. Please drink responsibly. I hope you enjoyed our
conversation with Rams legend Shaq Harris. I'm DeMarco Farr and
we'll see you next time.
Welcome to the Rams Iconic presented by eighteen hundred Tequila,
the best taste in tequila.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
Please drink responsibly.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I'm DeMarco far and this is the podcast where we
catch up with some of the most iconic players in
franchise history. My next guest played ten seasons in the
NFL four with your Los Angeles Rams. In nineteen seventy four,
he became the first black quarterback to start and win
a playoff game. He was twenty one and six as
it started with Los Angeles and took the Rams to
(00:34):
three straight NFC title games. He's a legend and a trailblazer.
Please welcome to Rams Iconic, The definition of iconic. James
Shaq Harris.
Speaker 2 (00:43):
What's going on, big man?
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Oh, thank you for having me in. Yeah, it's just
good to be in. Thank the RAMS organization for inviting
me here.
Speaker 1 (00:51):
Well, thank you for being here. Thank you for doing
this with this. This is this is special, man, This
is RAMS Iconic. I don't think there's anybody more iconic
than you. I mean, this is this is a big
deal for the show. So thank you for sitting with us, man.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
I appreciate it. Appreciate you know, the RAMS and great
teams and mates and play that I played off.
Speaker 1 (01:12):
So, you know, doing some research on you, and it's
just so you were a high school phenom. You won
a state championship as a sophomore, right, is that true?
Speaker 3 (01:23):
Correct? I had a lot of great players.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
Great players with you, but you, but you started winning
right out the gate. And then you had a scholarship
offer from Michigan State, but you decided to turn it
down because they wanted you to switch positions.
Speaker 2 (01:36):
Do I have that writing?
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Got it? You had an accurate you know. But once
I got up there and realized that they're playing for
me was to switch my position, I decided that I
would go to Grandma. And it's also it was too
hard to say no to coach Eddy Robinson. How do
you say no?
Speaker 1 (01:55):
I mean you said, no one in your neighborhood, no
one you know has ever been on television. I mean
you grew up when I came up, when you came out,
But you grew up in an area full of athletes,
a bunch of pros, and nobody that you knew had
been on TV. That's why you consider going to Michigan State.
Speaker 3 (02:10):
Well, you know I came up when the time where
it was segregated, so none of our players the Big
Ten was on TV and we couldn't play at the
major universes there, so no one had ever received a scholarship,
and I was the first one to be offered and
(02:30):
considered it because I thought that would give an opportunity
for some other players to get that exposure.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Wait all that pressure, I mean you didn't feel that pressure,
like you have an opportunity to break through and you
decided not to go because you wanted to be a quarterback.
What is it about being a quarterback that you were
so attached to? That's I guess that's my number one
question for you.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
Well, it was my first of all, I felt that
was my best position, and I studied a position. I've
seen so many guys, almost everybody switching position some way
in my own way, that was just my way of,
you know, just trying to make a difference for others.
(03:15):
I just said I wanted to play play quarterback, and
then I resisted switching position. I realized I was maybe
in risking an opportunity to play pro ball, because if
I switched and start playing, I would be the technique
and fundamental I would have them rather than waiting until
after I finished college.
Speaker 1 (03:36):
I think anybody who's ever played football at any level,
any black child, you all grew up throwing the football
pretending to be quarterbacks. But coming up there were no
people that looked like you playing the position, so you
kind of had to make those switches. And I've been
in those rooms in high school or college when they
(03:57):
would tell the kid a quarterback, we're going to switch
you to your more natural position. We're gonna put you
at corner, we're gonna put you at safety, we're gonna
put you at running back. And they always present it
in a way that says this will make us better,
not just you. It's a lot of pressure for a kid.
I saw this same conversation in college right under a
picture of Warren Moon because we went to the same school.
(04:19):
So that was kind of like one of those ironic moments.
But hang it on to that spot. Instead of getting
in where you fit in. You decided I want to
be a quarterback, and you turn down Michigan State and
you win. You wind up going to play for one
of the greatest coaches of all time. Talk about a blessing,
Talk about a blessing. Wow, no yet know to them,
(04:42):
big moment. Yes to one of the greatest coaches who
ever lived in Eddie Robinson.
Speaker 3 (04:47):
Oh, no question. Yeah. I went to some other schools
and when I visit, you know, they had different ways
of telling me that I was going to play. They
wanted me to play other position. First of all, I
got an opportunity to get those scholarship is because other
coaches recommended me. They weren't necessarily really scouting, you know,
scouting our area, but because of my size was one
(05:10):
of the reasons they wanted to switch me to other position.
One team told said to me that they wanted me
to play Why I receive a defensive back while I
learned to become a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (05:23):
So play here while you learn to be a quarterback.
Speaker 3 (05:25):
Right.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
Okay, but that's the hoodwink.
Speaker 3 (05:28):
But when coach Edi Robinson come to your home, all
my coaches had played for him. He was their hero,
and he come to your home and he promised my mother.
He said to my mother that if you allow me
to coach your son, I coach him like my very own.
(05:50):
You go to get a college degree. You'll go to
church on Sunday. Wow, you graduate and make a difference
to society, and at that time Gramlin had one of
the great teams, and I thought it was a perfect fit.
To me.
Speaker 2 (06:07):
What did they call Did they called Grambling the Notre
Dame of the South?
Speaker 1 (06:10):
Is that the word? Is that what they kind of
put out there for a minute. You guys were so dominant.
Speaker 3 (06:15):
Well, because I think only Notre Dame at one point
had sent more people, more playoffs to the NFL than
Grandma Wow. Coach j Eddy Robinson sent over two hundred
players to the NFL. That was, you know when in
the early sixty had sent over two hundred players in
the NFL.
Speaker 1 (06:35):
Three straight Swack titles. And then you enter the draft
in nineteen sixty nine. What were your thoughts about going
into the draft? I mean, you you've broken down barriers,
you stayed at quarterback, you turned down Michigan State, you
played there and turned it out in the Swack. But
now you're entering the NFL draft. What were your expectations
of that draft in nineteen sixty nine.
Speaker 3 (06:57):
My expectation was out going to get vepptid High. We
had played in New York, we had played in the
Orange Blossom Classic in Miami, we played in big. We
played in the Junior rose Bow in LA. We had
a very good sports information director who got my name out.
You know, I was in major news across the country.
(07:18):
I had size what they were looking for. So I fit.
I fell fit all the criterias. So I thought, and
they said that I was gonna get drafted, get drafted high.
But when it was all over and coach tried to
get me an All Star game, he could not get
me in an All Star game. So that was a message. Uh.
The year before, Eldrew Dickey was drafted in the first round.
(07:39):
I thought I was gonna get drafted high, and then
everybody started switching. He was switched, Marlon Briscoe was switched,
the Magician again, Jimmy Ray was switched. So when you
realize that the only way I would have a chance
if I got drafted first day. So I didn't get
drafted the first day, and I realized that, uh, I
(08:00):
probably wouldn't have a chance on playing in the league.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
Did you think back like maybe I should switch positions
or were you just steadfast, I'm going to be a quarterback.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
That's it because the dreams about to end, right.
Speaker 3 (08:11):
Yeah. They called me and offered me. They said if
I would switch positions, they would draft me earlier. Wow, okay,
but I resisted out of high school. I was just now.
I committed to playing quarterback, right like I said, I
kept my word. They kept their word. They didn't draft me.
(08:32):
It was frustrating because when I went into draft, all
I wanted other than play quarterback, was to pay my
mother J. C. Pennybille. And when I wasn't drafted, I
wasn't able to do that, and I just decided not
to play pro football. Wow. I decided it just wasn't
worth going through. And then changed to talk with coach Robinson. Yeah.
(08:56):
He felt that I represented the opportunity for some for
some others, and I felt that I owed him so
much because I remember when he came back from New
York and he had talked to Howard Cosell, and Howard
Cosell asked him, you've produced so many great players, why
(09:18):
can't you produce a quarterback? And when he came back
for New York, he came by my home and he said,
damn it to hell. He didn't curse, but he wore
damn and hell out. He said, damn it to hell.
I just come from New York and Howard Cosell. I
had a NERD asked me one of them to produce
a quarterback. He said, if you come to Grandma in
(09:42):
four years, America would be ready for a quarterback. And
I heard that and I thought that I believed in that,
and I decided when I decided to go to go
to Grandma. That's one of the things that you know
he lived up to when it was off season and
we wouldn't utilize it now. Play he would bring back
(10:04):
plays from the NFL and we'd go over trying to
get me.
Speaker 2 (10:07):
He would bring you pro style plays to run, so
he was preparing you for the NFL.
Speaker 3 (10:13):
He had a good relationship with Vince Lombardi because we
had a great play on that team. Willie Davis, Yeah,
he would always bring back and as soon as he
gets back, we'd meet and he'd go over what they're
doing in the NFL. Wow. Yeah, it was it was
a benefit.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
You're a project. I love it. I love it.
Speaker 1 (10:30):
So you go to Buffalo drafted in the eighth round.
You wind up becoming you compete, and you win the job.
You're the opening day starter. You're the first black quarterback
to ever begin the season as the starter. Did you
know that? Was that something in your head? I'm sure
they had to write about it. How did you feel
about that?
Speaker 3 (10:48):
Well, in the beginning, all I wanted was the opportunity
to compete. I didn't think I was going to get that.
And as as I was seven on the depth chart,
was on the depth shot, and you can't they can't
work every quarterback. So the first few days I didn't
get a chance to work. But one of the challenging
things was that during that during those days, they.
Speaker 2 (11:12):
Cut every day. They cut players every day every day.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
You know now they don't cut the end the training camp. Yeah,
well they cut every day and you started right off
the fourth of July. So about the on the seventh,
they cut every day, and every morning at six o'clock
they knock on somebody's door, bam, bam bam. And I
was sitting there, seventh on the depth shot, knowing, knowing,
(11:36):
I was in the line of fire. Right when I
heard I I just wait, did you ever hear it
down the hall? I heard it down the hall, and
I wait every day when they skipped my door, I
made it for another day.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Wow.
Speaker 3 (11:49):
So I had to go through twenty days of that,
and but each day lucky for me, and then the
practice they'd have a little passing drill and I bad
myself another day.
Speaker 1 (12:03):
In those drills, in those drills, balling out. Okay, So
you leave Buffalo you come out to LA in nineteen
seventy three, that had to be weird, right coming out west.
Speaker 2 (12:13):
You ever been out west before?
Speaker 3 (12:15):
I knew a lot of I was more confident in
LA than Buffalo. Oh no, what because Louisiana most of
the people when they graduate, they come to LA for jobs.
Most of the people in Alabama, Mississippi go Noah. So
I knew a lot of people. I felt comfortable in
the environment. And there they had a lot of players
on the team from the Swack Conference in HBCU school.
(12:40):
So I felt comfortable when that when I got it.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
So you get an opportunity. Coach Knox, we have that
in common. He believed in you saw something and you
gave you a shot. You became the starter in nineteen
seventy four. Talk about that process, because I looked through
that season. I think you guys lost to Green Bay
the week before, and the next week you become the
and you just absolutely mop up San Francisco. How did
you become the starter? What was the process through that?
Speaker 3 (13:05):
But the process was I went from the practice squad
and the next year. The next year, John Hade, who
had been the MVP, they traded for him. He comes in.
They draft Ywaski, So those were the three quarterbacks. Yuwawski
was the second round draft choice and I just had to,
you know, find I had to find my way on
(13:26):
the roster and John Hado ended up being the MVP
of the league. Was a good playoff for the ram
in nineteen seventy two, and then we played Green Bay
seventy three, who played Green Bay early seventy four.
Speaker 2 (13:43):
And pretty good football team, not great.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
The football team. We had a good team. I think
we struggled around. They decided to make a change and
they traded John Hade and move into the starting lineup.
I was surprised. Yeah, you know, they had been the MVP.
I thought he still had some ability to play, and
they put me in the starting lineup.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
That's two in a row, two great coaches that saw
something in you and said this is our guy and
let's go forward with that. So jumping ahead to three
days before Christmas, nineteen seventy four, you become the first
black quarterback to start a postseason game and win it again.
I'll ask you, did you know about the moment going
(14:25):
into the game or was it just about ball for you?
Because it was a moment in time for a lot
of kids and a lot of people in this country.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
Well, I was aware. I was aware of why to
represent it because I was the only starting quarterback in
the league, only black starting black starting quarterback in the league.
I was aware of what it represent but I was
even more focus on making sure I play well because
(14:56):
my play could determine others getting the opportunity.
Speaker 1 (15:01):
Did it dawn on you who you were playing that
day and what that team represented in the NFL in
terms of black quarterbacks and blacks participating in the NFL?
I think Washington was one of the last teams to integrate.
Does that did that factor in that you beat them
in the playoffs? Never thought, Never thought about that at all.
(15:21):
My focus, My focus had to be on my preparation. Yeah,
I think, Uh, you know, the wheel to win is
determined by the wheel to prepare. So my focus had
to be on, you know, playing well for the Rams,
getting the right people making decisions, and you went to
(15:45):
the Pro Bowl that year right after that season, Yeah,
and you were the MVP of the Pro Bowl too,
So you just keep proving along the way that wow,
I can do this.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
Hey. I was very fortunate that they have a good
team to play with, got in the Pro Bowl and
had a good day, and I was very, very very
excited about that.
Speaker 2 (16:09):
It's just a trip, man.
Speaker 1 (16:10):
I mean, coming off the Super Bowl watching Patrick Mahomes
do his thing. He goes back to back and who
he had to beat to get there. He beats Lamar.
We got Dak Prescott in Dallas and he led the
league in touchdown passes. And I'm sitting here with the
origin story. Does it ever like it began with me?
And here we are now?
Speaker 3 (16:29):
C J.
Speaker 1 (16:30):
Stroud is Rookie of the Year. Black quarterbacks aren't a
thing anymore. They just say quarterbacks. Now, does that resonate
with you at all? Being the first I don't look
at it as a fan of a game and the
challenges that black quarterbacks had to go through and witnessing
(16:51):
them all, seeing Marlon Briscoe come in and have to
change from receiver, seeing Doug William win the Super.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
Bowl and one of the great games ever played. By
the way, it was a routine grambling day.
Speaker 2 (17:09):
Our routine grambling day.
Speaker 3 (17:10):
Wow, one moon. You don't have to go to Canada
when you see those when you see those things and
you come down today, I'm so happy to see the
players today who are great ambassadors for the game. They
say the right things, you know, they they play well.
They got foundations to help send message, to clear message
(17:32):
to young people. And the talent on the field is extraordinary.
And today, you know, we finally reached the time where
I think young kids growing up, I feel that they
have can They can play quarterback international football.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
That's the crazy thing. Some of that humility and those
players you just mentioned is born of you. Like if
you would have cracked, if you would have switched positions,
if you would have flamed out, we wouldn't be here.
They might not playing quarterback. Mahomes might be a running
back at this point.
Speaker 2 (18:03):
You know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (18:04):
I do know what you mean.
Speaker 2 (18:05):
I went through it absolutely and I heard you speak.
Speaker 1 (18:08):
You talked about your teammates, and I had Harold Jackson
in this seat. I had a lot of guys from
that era and they all say what a great time
they had playing together, like that team was special, and
you said something, it just wasn't meant to be to
be champion. But it wasn't like you guys weren't one
of the best teams in the league as far as
being teammates together and working hard.
Speaker 3 (18:30):
Of course, it was one of it. One year we
go to we beat Dallas in the first round and
lose in Minnesota. Next year we beat Minnesota and lose.
The Dallas were good teams and that's one of the
things that you'll never forget having that opportunity and coming
up a little short.
Speaker 1 (18:49):
Well, I'll tell you so, I will never forget this.
This has been a treat for me and I hope
it's been a treat for you. So thank you, James
Shack Harris for stopping by.
Speaker 3 (18:56):
Thank you very much.
Speaker 1 (18:57):
All Right, that's a wrap on this episode of Rams
Like Kind presented by eighteen hundred Tequila, the best taste
in tequila. Please drink responsibly. I hope you enjoyed our
conversation with Rams legend Shaq Harris. I'm DeMarco Farr and
we'll see you next time.
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