December 29, 2025 • 46 mins
Matt and Wes take a look at what went wrong yesterday against the Cleveland Browns. They look into what both sides of the ball could've done differently, as well as how they can quickly move on to the Ravens coming to Pittsburgh next Sunday night. Rob King joins the guys to discuss his thoughts on the loss, and where the Steelers can go from here.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Your tunes about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Good afternoon, Steelers Nation. It's the Drive here on the Steelers'
audio network, while Shuuler and Matt Williamson with you here
on a Monday, our last Monday show of twenty twenty five. Matt,
and unfortunately, it's kind of a crappy one. I mean,
it's gonna be a depressing one. As the Steelers fall
to the Browns thirteen to six yesterday in Cleveland. It's
(00:41):
been about twenty four hours, and I am I still shocked.
I'm still surprised. I still I can't believe it. I
know that this is what's happened four straight times. They've
gone to Cleveland now and against bad quarterbacks, young quarterbacks.
You know, all kinds of reasons to win that don't
end up transpire ing. But this one felt a little bit,
(01:03):
a little bit more of a little bit bigger of
a gut punch.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I think, yes, and no, I might cheer you up
a little, cheer me up a little bit, Mike pursuit
of cheered me up a little on a show it's
gonna air later, I urge I want to check it
out on DV tonight we do with Rob King and
we'll talk to him here of what next segment. Right now,
I can't say this enough, and I hope in the
YouTube comments or on Twitter people say, Matt, you should
(01:27):
have even brought up more. It's a game they gotta win.
It's a game you gotta win. I'm gonna say it
a million times. It's a game you gotta win. Now.
What Mike mentioned that I thought was interesting is, guys,
you didn't lose the AFC North. Everything's still there. What
you lost is the opportunity for rest that which is
huge now. A team this age that has had the
(01:51):
earliest bye week of the season really could have used
the rest and the certainty that you know now you're
preparing for playoffs. You're not preparing for the Ravens, but
it's not over. And he looked at it as a fan, like, man,
what's better than a playoff game in week eighteen against
the Birdies in your building? You're like, that's great, you know,
(02:11):
And I know the Ravens are coming off a win
and they look like the better team at the moment,
but this loss, just in terms of execution and watching
play after play, didn't feel like the Bills. I just
felt like the Steelers left some opportunities on the pH.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Oh absolutely, yeah, the weight he downs, the heavy situational moment, exactly.
They probably lost seventy five percent of.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
Them in a big way. And that was the difference.
And what you knew was going to be a close
game in a place you don't have a lot of success,
and you didn't have all your horses. Now, not having
Metcalffin to a lesser degree, Austin and losing Washington all
mattered a great deal. A great deal. Yeah, I mean,
here's you. I mean, they've no man beaters. I mean,
and they're gonna see the exact same defense. You know,
why would they not run that back? But they lost
(02:53):
Fannin after he scored a touchdown. He's a leading receiver.
They didn't have Judkins, who's the guy they want to
give the ball to over and over? Like, no one's
gonna cry for your at this point. You know, that's
just how the league's going. But a couple of things
stood out to me, like when we started that show, like, Matt,
what were your big takeaways? Early defense was terrible, I mean, real.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Problem it's something you talked about last week, and.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
That's kind of a Brown strength. Now I don't I'm
not a coaching staff, but you knew this team and
Sanders is at their best with the scripted stuff and
this the Fansky stuff and the designer stuff. But you
were too soft on them. You know, like the middle
of the field zone openings were massive. You didn't disrupt
(03:36):
Sanders enough. And after that you put the clamps on there.
I mean, the defense. Doesn't defense played well enough to win?
Speaker 2 (03:44):
They did in hindsight, it's easy to say, but like
all that was missing from the defense was a pick
six or a scoop six or Sawyer takes that one
of the house holds onto that one.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Really all was missing from the whole game is a
touchdown of any sort.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Yes, because the defense gave up field goal touchdown on
the Browns first two drives. Yeah, and then that was
and then after that really didn't give up a scoring
drive though, because the last field goal was you know,
you handed them the ball and they went three and
out and kicked the field goal from like right around
your red zone area, right in that in that twenty
to thirty range. I will I will push back a
(04:21):
little bit on the optimism though, and everything, everything is
still in front of you.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
We dressed to save today. Oh wow, all.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Right, hold on, let the record show that I say.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
It used to make they all crazy if we'd happen
to wear the same polo. Well, like we ever asked.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
But since you and I got finned back from training
camp in what like mid August late August time frame,
I've been waiting for this day to happen.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
It'sound to happen.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Has happened. I'm surprised. Honestly, we made it like three
or four months to this to September, October to November.
It took us four months before we wore the same
polo here today. Hell, it was glad you mentioned that,
because every day I'm like, I wonder if that's gonna
wear this one.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
While we're not ever setting it up.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
I picked between my eight or nine different schel.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
Eighth grade together wear the same outfit.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
We just showed up to the seventh grade dance wearing
the same dress.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
So that happened to me homecoming, Me and four buds.
We went to homecoming. There's no internet back then, you know, right,
and so our best buds We all went, and the
girls all knew each other, but they weren't a group.
They were all our dates. Gotcha, my date and my
buddy Murray's date had the exact same dress on that fair.
I mean, two dudes wouldn't care like they were like
(05:35):
the girls were. Yeah, their dinner together, dressed the same. Yeah,
that's hysterical.
Speaker 2 (05:41):
That's hysterical.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Light in the mood yourafice lost.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
That's exactly right. I didn't need that laugh. Now I'm
feeling a little bit better. I everything is still in
front of them. They still have the division title to
play for the home playoff game.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
All that and.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Another continuing chapter of this league. This year has been
such a week to week proposition and a especially this
Pittsburgh Steelers team. They could beat the Ravens twenty eight
to ten in the car, wouldn't surprise me? Now, I
mean maybe with some of their limitations that they obviously
have on offense, with no number one and no number
(06:13):
two wide receiver aside and now no Darnell Washington either,
we gotta get to that they.
Speaker 3 (06:19):
Really are at some points starting wide receivers. No, I'm
not even sure Austin is one, but he'd been nice
to have them.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
So where my optimism was going into this game is
you take care of business, you win the division, you
get to rest, and that you you you touched on
it briefly, beat.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
It back capt back for the playoff game, and yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:39):
Right, that to me was the what separated this twenty
twenty five Steelers team from the last three or four. Yeah,
the last three or four limped into the playoffs and
just barely got there and was already on their last
leg and didn't have much. They kind of squeezed all
the juice out just to get into.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
The dance, and by halftime in the wild Round, you're like,
this is over this year.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
It looked like they're gonna be able to go into
Week eighteen, have a one o'clock home kickoff, put their
feet up rest. All those Super Bowl champion, All Pro
future Hall of famers that they have that are on
the other side of thirty or maybe even on the
other side of forty in the case of the quarterback
who once again was on the sideline messing with his
wrist in Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
One of which has a punctured lum.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
So again that's the bigger Yes, they can still win
the Division. They can still beat the Ravens, and by
the time we get to Thursday or Friday, I'm sure
I'll be singing a different tune. But for me, what
really sucks about yesterday is it felt like you would
finally turned a corner.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
Yeah, yeah, when.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
In reality it was just a call to sack.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
And that's the most frustrating part to me is even
if they beat the Ravens and get into the playoffs,
it's not gonna feel the same as if you would
have had a week buffer to rest, to prepare, to
put your feet up, to get your veterans a little
more juice heading into the postseason. That's the real missed
opportunity of yesterday and that's what again makes it feel
more like a call to sack than turning a corner.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
And this is maybe a little pie in the sky,
but couldn't you have been the Patriots. It just destroyed
the Jets in a division game when you're a better team,
you're the playoff team, they're the team picking in the
top five, and just have Drake May sitting at out
basically the whole second half after he threw a million times.
You are allowed to do right couldn't you.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Just yeah, Ben, if I if I hear one more
person or see one more tweet about this being scripted
just to have the Steelers and the Ravens in prime
time on Sunday night. No, like, yeah, the league's the
reason that they scored six points against against that.
Speaker 3 (08:38):
Couldn't convert on four three for what.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Three for fifteen on third downs or whatever it was.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Yeah, like Roger Goodell made them do that.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Right, exactly right. The league would have loved to have
the Bills and the Patriots and still meaningful AFC East act.
I realize those teams don't play, but I'm still playing
for the title.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
So there's a few narratives we're gonna talk about this
week that I hate that are.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
So foolish, I'm sure. The other one is the Miles
Garrett one. And we can we can, we can, we
can get to that here in the first hour. To
some now, some of them like we need to talk
about Friarmuth and and hello, see what happens when he
finally gets involved? Too little, too little, too late. But
to me, it all comes back to it felt like
(09:20):
if this was going to be different, this was going
to be different from the last handful of years of
scratch and claw, and yes, get into the playoffs, which
I never want to act like that means nothing, like
there are getting into the playoffs is is the baseline
of contending for a championship. So I don't want to
act like that means nothing.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
But to get the playoffs.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
The goal is not to get in the playoffs. The
goal is to is to go on a run. And
they've been crystal clear about that. It's why they've turned
over the quarterback position for three straight years now. It's
why they went out and got guys like Jalen Ramsey.
And that's that's what you know really had me honked
off last night in this morning, is that that would
your opportunity to prove that this edition, this twenty twenty
(10:03):
five team was different than it's three or four predecessors.
And I don't know how you can feel that way
now here twenty four hours.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
Later, Yeah, and some other venting things, you kind of
stick with your tone here is why can't you win
in Cleveland? I don' want to hear Thursday short weeks anymore.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
It is it me maybe because you realized since I
started traveling, they haven't I'm owing four in Cleveland. I'm
owing four in Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Probably getting pretty old to driving home. Yeah this stinks, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Taking that bus ride across the miserable landscape of northeast Ohio.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
If it was the Borough era and you couldn't win
in Cinci or the Lamar era and you can't win
in Baltimore, it's like, because they got a really good
player and they're really good.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
I can tell you why the Jets couldn't win in
Foxborough for twenty years when Tom Brady was in there.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
Way, Hey can't you beat this team and they're building
they're not a good franchise. Yes, right, And again it's
a game. You gotta win. Game. You gotta win game,
you gotta win. But a couple of things that it's
what you get back to the first quarter defense sort of,
the early first two drives defense was below the line.
And again you knew they were going to come out
(11:08):
with designer stuff, but still you made it too easy
on them. You're too soft in your zones. You can't
you can't spot them to nothing or whatever it is
in a game you know is not going to be
high scoring. I mean you knew that coming in, Yes,
there's going to be some folks, some of you on
Twitter are wise enough to even tweet me. But Steelers
wanted to turnover battle to nothing real. They didn't. They
(11:29):
missed a field.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Goal, not a few factor in fourth downs.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
And you row for three on fourth downs, you know,
like those were massive and any coupled, as you said,
with being horrendous on third downs, the pivotal downs you
lost dramatically.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
I mean the weighted moments, right, were a a bowling
ball around your neck that drug you to the bottom
of the ocean.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
And the biggest reason lost probably like on a down
by down basis. I don't know if the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Were the worst team, No, I think they were better
on it.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
I did do, especially once the defense got things set
if it was over.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
I like to use an analogy that you pull in
a lot of times. If that's a fifteen round boxing fight.
The Steelers won more.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Rounds they did. They did.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
The Browns just landed the Haymakers.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Yeah right, And it wasn't like the Bills game was
the worst game for me in terms of how you
how they played. You know, man, you should be embarrassed
how you played this one didn't execute the right times,
and clearly you didn't have anyone who could beat band coverage.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I mean no, I mean, I mean the past game
was was practically non existent.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
That's a big problem. And I thought Rogers it was okay,
I mean, but I didn't there's some Monday morning quarterbacking involved.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Oh, no doubt, but that's our job.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
I think he checked that I would have run the
ball at higher percentage of time.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
That might that might be complaint number one.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
It's pretty high.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
Why is he throwing the ball thirty nine times?
Speaker 4 (12:50):
Right?
Speaker 2 (12:50):
With no DK No Calvin Austin a good Browns defense
and pass rush, I mean right.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
And the run game is good. They're averaging five point
five a carry.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Arn I think had five point six at halftime if
I'm remembering correctly. Yeah, from the halftime report.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
And Rob even did the math. He said, if you
take out the Hayward, you know, long run, they still
averaged four and a half or four six. Take that
all day long, absolutely, and you rush for over.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
It felt like there were a lot of times we
got a break to get to winning the King here,
but it felt like there were a lot of times
running more move more running. That's that's week eighteen, you know,
at a top of the grease board. But it felt
like there were so many times on first down they'd
pick up four or five on the ground and then
two incomplete pat or they'd pick up How many times
did they pick up four or five yards on first
(13:35):
down and then threw short of the six on sticks
on second down and lost three or four yards and
then all of a sudden, despite having second and five,
it's third and seven and eight, it's thirt and nine.
That happened way too often.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
And we even said, not that we know better than them,
but we said Thursday, Friday, run on first run and
second run on third and maybe punt, you know, and
by the fourth quarter it'll pay off because the Browns
are not going to run away from you. And this
is the Lions game terms of prep, right, it's.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Not You're not gonna have to score twenty some points
to win this game. A lot to get to. There's
kind of your opening salvo, your scene setter. We'll talk
to the voice of the Steelers, Rob King, all his
thoughts from the game in Cleveland yesterday from his vantage
point when we return on the other side. Just getting
started here on a Monday West Hueler. Matt Williamson, It's
(14:25):
the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Your tune's about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal, Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
We'relling along here on the drive on a Monday to
the phone lines. We go to talk to the voice
of your Pittsburgh Steelers, Rob King, who was there by
the lake at Huntington bank Field. I was sitting right
behind him throughout that Brown's thirteen Steelers six discippoint performance yesterday.
They're in an opportunity for the Steelers to clench the
(15:03):
AFC North. Kinger, where are you at today? Are you
looking ahead optimistically? You know, Matt and I kind of
towed the line in the opening segment of Hey, you know,
there's still the AFC North to play for. It's such
a week to week league verse. You had a real
opportunity to wrap this thing up. You had a real
opportunity to rest and give some of your veteran guys,
(15:24):
you know, a blow on Sunday and have a one
o'clock kickoff that meant nothing against Baltimore and now it
means everything. On on Sunday night, football in primetime. Where
are you at in terms of your optimistic pessimistic glass
half full, glass half empty here you know, about twenty
four hours later.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
Yeah, it's all. It's all that my glasses medium full.
You know, I'm some of it's negative and some of
it's positive. I mean, you know, you lost three straight
games in Cleveland to go up there and beat him down,
and you know, it's a team. Look, the crowd was,
you know, it was like half a kickoff as people
(16:02):
started appearing. You know, by the end of the game,
it was full and the crowd was into it. But
it just felt like, boy, if you, if you somehow
could have gotten on top of them Merley and and
ushered him, you know, to the to the exit and
you know, just kind of won comfortably. That's what I
was hoping for, kind of a you know, a repeat
(16:22):
of the first meeting between the two teams, in which
you didn't do anything dramatic, but you just simply won
the game. You're just a better team and you sort
of slowly methodically beat them, and you know you didn't
and it's you know, highly disappointing that you didn't do that.
I'm sure they're disappointed. He didn't do that. You know,
there's some malarkey coming out of the game about oh,
(16:45):
all they cared about was, you know, not letting Miles
Garrett break the sack record, which, by the way, a
narrative that is, as far as I know, began with
Miles Garrett continued with Miles Garrett after the game, and
which I don't buy in the least. But you know
that that was disappointing. You had a real opportunity there,
and now you have to win a game, right and
(17:07):
you know with that comes the notion that you could
just play a poor game, or a call could go
against you, or something in that nature in a against
an opponent in which you're evenly matched, So you let
an opportunity to slip away. And that's just the way
it is. But you still have a chance to win
the as Nord. And by the way, and I'm sure
(17:28):
we'll get to this. I still think there were some
things that the Steelers continued to do well in this game,
but ultimately it's hard on Monday not to be disappointed
with what happened yesterday.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
Yeah, I think that I understand with the defense, I mean,
I think they got after the quarterback. Well, I thought
they stuffed the run. Well, I thought they wanted the
line of scrimmage. And you know, outside of the first
couple series, I thought the defense more than played well
enough to win this football game. They took the ball away,
they could have had probably another I mean there was
(18:00):
there for two pick sixes. One of them didn't even
end up being a pick, but I think early. I'm
not saying the game was lost, but you kind of
injected the Browns with hope right off the bat. You know,
by the way that you played defense in the first
series or two.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
It was very similar to what we saw a week
ago with them. Matt and I know you talked about this,
and certainly Max and I talked about it as well.
You know, Kevin Stefanski's a very good offensive coach. Yeah,
I don't mean to see them with faint praise, right,
He's won two Coach of the Year awards. To talk
about that however you want, but I don't want to
damn him by faint praise, by just saying he's an
(18:39):
offensive guy. But he's got a very good offensive mine.
They had a great jove. I was talking to the
guys from Cleveland before the games that it might have
been their best drive of the season, the opening drive
against the Bills. They came out and a couple of
opening drives against the Steelers and looked good. I thought
the Steelers, you know, I would have liked to have
seen them adjust maybe a little quicker earlier in the game.
(18:59):
But ultimately, when you allow a team ten points on
their home field, and then you know, they got the
late field goal when you went forward on fourth and
long from your own territory, but really you shut them
out after that. If you allow ten points, you should
win the game. There were a lot of things that
happened in this game that if you told me that
was what was going to happen, you should win the game.
(19:21):
By the same token. You're right, Matt, there was a
you know, it's a bit of a tone setter, and
tone setters there they're not statistics, but they're not irrelevant either,
and so I thought that there was I thought that
was relevant.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Oh absolutely. I think there were a lot of those
tone setters early on for Cleveland that that that kept
them believing, kept them in the game. As you mentioned,
it was a uncharacteristically flat Browns crowd, uh for as
as disappointing as that franchise has been. That crowd usually
shows up, especially when the Black and Gold are in town,
(19:55):
and it wasn't really until you know, that eight minute
drive that ended with a Chris Boswell miss that it
felt like the crowd really came alive when it was
still you know, ten to six at that point and
they were chanting Miles Garrett's name and and all that stuff. Kinger,
I wanted to ask you just about you know, kind
of piggybacking off of that though. Guys, I'm not breaking
(20:17):
any news here. You're gonna have to score more than
six points at home next week to beat the Baltimore Ravens.
I don't care if it's Huntley or Lamar Jackson at quarterback.
You're gonna need to score more than six. Dk Metcalf
isn't going to be back. Who knows on Calvin Austin
will wait and see this week. Darnault Washington broken arm,
he's not going to be there. Rob to me, this
(20:39):
is you know, it's a time where you're searching for
answers and there's not a lot of easy context clues
for this Steelers offense.
Speaker 4 (20:48):
Yeah, I agree with what you're saying, you know, by
the same token. You know there there were a number
of small plays that happened in this game that that
leave you scratching your head and leave you thinking, hey,
a different result, maybe a different approach, and who knows
what happens. So for example, you just talked about the
(21:11):
you know, the miss Chris Boswell field goal. Well, you know,
Aaron Rodgers gets sacked to play before that, right, and
you know, if you throw the ball away there or
if you know, whatever the case may be, you don't
get a sack. You know, I don't want to necessarily
describe blame because you know, I don't go back and
don't I don't get a chance to see the replay, right,
(21:32):
I don't get a chance to see what happened. But
you know, if that's six yards closer, yeah, you know,
going in that direction in which you know, watching pregame warmups,
guys were were barely making you know, long forties or
fifty yard field goals. So give that did Chris Boswell
five yards closer? Six yards closer? I think it was
(21:52):
a six yard sack? Who knows what happens. You know,
people talk about the decision to go up the sideline
to Scotty on the fourth and one, moving in the
opposite direction. Earlier in the game, I would have liked
to have seen the see that run the ball there
they're originally were going to there was third and a
foot and you know, they lined up in a spread,
then came back into an eye formation, and then they're
(22:14):
standing around at the line of scrimms trying to get
in the right uh, you know, the right formation, and
Dylan Cook jumps. You know, I wouldn't mind seeing you
just line up there and say, hey, listen, we're gonna
get a foot. Let's line up in the eye formation
and get it, or let's go steal city shove and
get it there. There were a lot of moments like that,
and when you look back at the game, yeah, you
(22:35):
got to score more than six points. They ran the
ball effectively. They were three for fifteen on third down,
three for fifteen, zero for three on fourth down. That
that's just not going to win the ball game. And
a lot of those, as I was just mentioning, were
manageables and and some plays that just you know, uh,
(22:56):
you want a second guest to play calling and whatever
whatever you want to do. It doesn't at this stage
of the game. It doesn't matter. What matters is you
were three for fifteen on third down and zero for
three on fourth down, and you're not going to win games.
And you do that, and so you only score six points.
But there were opportunities to score more than six points.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
Let's stick with Rogers real quick, Rob. I mean, I
can't remember an NFL game where a quarterback got less
help from their wide receivers. I'm not talking about their
pass catchers, they're the wide receiver position. But he also
missed some throws. He made some throws he didn't, as
he often has this year, elevate those around him against
(23:34):
a good d But and I'm not sure this is
on him or not. I think some Monday morning quarterbackings
involved here too. I would have liked to see the
higher percentage of runs that were working well, maybe more
targets to Warren and especially gain Well and Friarmouth as well,
(23:56):
maybe even John hum You know, you know I'm not
even playing.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
You know there's no short answer to this, because so
I'm gonna I'm gonna give you a longer answer, which
is that you know we're praising Aaron Rodgers for making
decisions to line of scrimmage and taking commanded things. It's
been a big part of why they've been successful. It's
been a big part of why your offense look really
(24:25):
good at Baltimore, looked really good against Miami, and looked
phenomenal against Detroit. We're we're all praising Aaron Rodgers for
when they have the audio telling Kenneth game well, motion
out right and run a go route. You know, I
mean to talk about drawing it up in the dirt
on the fly in a game. He's got those capabilities.
(24:48):
In this game, it looked to me, I'm not in
the huddle. I'm not at the line of scrimmage. I
don't know what plays are changing out of or into.
It looked to me like when they changed out of plays,
it wasn't effect as it's been. And when that happens,
what's gonna happen, you're gonna say they should have run
the ball more. I brought up this, this, uh, this,
(25:08):
and you know a similar circumstance to me where Aaron
Rodgers makes a call to line of scrimmage which has
been effective more often than it's not been effective. It's
against the Chargers late you need a score. You're starting
to run the ball more effectively. You got a second
and six. You've got to look. I think it was
a sweep to the right call. That's the way everybody moved.
But Aaron Rodgers sees DK Metcalf's can run a slant.
(25:31):
So and a quarterback has these abilities to just you know,
get the snap, stand up and make a throw, whether
it's out to the flat or what have you. He
sees dk Metcalf and Bud Duprie drops in front of
that coverage. And and now the play is not gonna work.
And and you can't anticipate that Bud's gonna do that, right,
So I want air and and that's a play that
(25:52):
didn't work. But I want Aaron Rodgers to have the
freedom to do that because it's been part of why
you've been successful. It looked to me like some of
those in instances weren't effective. Yesterday it didn't work, and
so you know, what, what are you gonna do? What
are you gonna say? Uh, hey, Hall of Fame quarterback,
You don't get to do that anymore.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
No, but but yes.
Speaker 4 (26:15):
To see the Steelers maybe make some of those decisions
running the ball look, yeah, I mean I said, matt
you know, you and I do a show and called
the matchup with Missy Matthews every week. Every week I
say the same thing. Yeah, wish the Steers run the
ball bore. You know. I like their running backs. I
like the running game. I think the running game is effective.
I thought it was effective yesterday. I would have liked
(26:36):
to have seen more of it. But it's not so
easy to say, well, you just have to do that,
because part of what has made you effective is some
of those changes and some of those things at the
line of scrimmage. I will say this the other point
you made in there. You know that receiving corps, the
five wide receivers that the students put out there yesterday
as members of the students because steel and had a
(26:58):
few catches at the vikings, but as a group, as
a collective, as Steelers pass catchers, they had twenty eight
receptions between them twenty eight Yeah, and Gainwell and Warren.
I believe the number was ninety eight between them, and
I think they had three catches between them and Warren.
I don't think was even targeted in the game, and
so you know, maybe, but again, the Browns know that too.
(27:23):
They've got an excellent defensive coordinator. Did they did they
scheme against that?
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Hey?
Speaker 4 (27:27):
Man, I leave those things up to Aaron Rodgers and
Arthur Smith. I don't know. I'm not paid to be
an offensive coordinator, and I don't Matt, you and I
were having a conversation earlier today about you know this, Hey, look,
you know, look at it. Here's a freeze frame of
Gainwell was open over the middle. They've been inducted to
him on that that last play from the goal line. Well,
(27:48):
I didn't see it that way. You didn't see it
that way. I think if he throws that pass, Delpit
and Sweeshinger come up and make the stop of the
three yard line and the game's over. So you know,
everybody can second guest the next day, right, And so
what I'd like to see the run the ball more
and stick with a run more. Yes, that's circling back.
(28:10):
I think I answered your question fourteen differently.
Speaker 3 (28:12):
Yeah, but you mentioned how they did do a lot
of good things, and I do think the running game
remains a good thing.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
Yeah, Look, they ran the ball well, they were These
are the things that I've liked. Okay, they've the in
the three game winning streak going on here. They've done
a good job against the run. That included Derrick Henry
twenty five carries ninety four yards. Signed me up right,
they've done well against the run. You know certain play
like I think Cam Heyward's playing his best football. I
(28:41):
think Alex Heismith's of course, and continues to be a force.
So I think there's a lot of things to like
about what the defense is doing. They've run the ball.
They didn't run the ball effectively against Baltimore, but they've
run it effectively ever since, including yesterday. You know the
turnover culture, right you. They'd won ten straight games in
which they won the turnover battle. That didn't happen. They
(29:03):
won the turnover battle. I know the fourth downs and
miss field goals, Matt and I agree with you should
be counted as turnovers. They're not. You'd won ten straight games,
not only did you in which you hadn't turned I'm sorry,
ten straight games in which you hadn't turned them all over.
They didn't turn them all over, and they got to turnovers.
So many things that happen in this game that if
you had told me this is what's gonna happen before
(29:24):
the game, I would have told you if Steelers are
gonna win, and so do we chuck this out the window. Well,
we'll find out Sunday night, right, Because if you're if
you're trending in the right direction, and you're good enough
to win with the way you've been playing, then you'll
win on Sunday night. And if you aren't, then you
won't and you won't make the playoffs. That's a beauty
(29:47):
about the games. You go out and play them.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
And they're gonna have to go out and play one
Sunday night in prime time. Rob King, I know you're
excited about that, baby on Sunday listen.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
Man, with with the emotions are like, you're bumming because
you're down because you had a golden opportunity against the
team that I think you should have beaten and you
were favored to beat. And I know you've had troubles
up there, but you know you're down because of that.
But as this week goes on, the knowledge in the
back of my mind is the week goes on and
(30:18):
it's going to be so exciting Sunday night at Acre Sure.
I can't wait for that, man, I can't wait.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
I would have rather had Aaron Rodgers resting that left wrist,
and too, Jalen Ramsey in sweats, and Cam Hayward and sweats.
But it will be exciting at eight point fifteen, when
the towels are swirling and the fireworks are going off
and Rob King's booming voice is ringing across the Steelers
Audio Network. Kinger, thanks for the time, as always, partner.
We'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
You got it, guys, Thanks very much.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
There he goes voice of your Pittsburgh Steelers, Rob King,
plenty to get into there that he touched on. Matt
some more specifics that I want to dive into here
in our final segment of the first hour when we
return on the other side. Shuoler, Matt Williamson. It is
the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Your tune's about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal, Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Rolling along here on the drive our final week of
shows here in twenty twenty five, as it is approaching
the new year, and a final opportunity for the Steelers
to get the hat in the T shirt and the
AFC North Division champions. Of course, it will be Sunday
night eight, twenty Sunday Night Football against the Ravens. Matt
(31:45):
more than we have to get to here. But Kinger
brought this up. But I think you and I did
want to touch on this at some point the Miles
Garrett postgame, you know, the I think the Steelers, all
that we're doing, all that they came in to stop
me from getting the record, and that ended up costing them.
And I've seen that all over the place. I'm sure
(32:05):
you've seen it and gotten tweets about It makes me crazy.
I like that far out there that, oh, it costs
the Steelers and all they wanted to do was slow
down Miles Garrett. Well, yeah, he's the defensive player of
the year in a wrecking force. You know like that,
it makes a lot of sense that you would try
and take that guy out of the game. I don't know.
(32:27):
It felt to me like the same game plan that
they had against the Browns a couple months ago. You
just didn't have DK Metcalf and Calvin Austin. You didn't
have anybody who could get open, and therefore Aaron Rodgers,
instead of throwing seven eight yard completions, was throwing for
two yard games, two yard losses. It just there was
there was a lack of rhythm there that I think
(32:48):
is easy to blame on. They were so focused on
Miles Garrett, and they were focused on Miles Garrett, there's
no doubt, but that's been every time they've played Miles Garrett.
They just they didn't have enough to overcome making taking
him and making him a focal point requires a lot
of other guys winning their one on ones. When you're
devoting extra resources to Miles Garrett, a lot of other
(33:09):
guys have to win their one on ones in five
out in routes, and nobody else was winning their one
on ones.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
Yes, exactly, so people look at it the wrong way.
You know, they were too focused on the record. I
don't think they gave a crap about the record.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
I don't know. I mean I think they did. I
think that part's.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Fair or Buffalo the week before it did. No one
wants to be the team you break the record.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Correct, but especially the Steelers against him. And that's fine,
like there's history there and feelings there, But I.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
Will contend that their game plan wouldn't have changed one
bit if he set the record last week or if
this was week two.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
I agree with you. Yes, I completely agree with you
on that right.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
I mean the way that Garrett phrased it, that everyone
ran with was they were more concerned about me not
getting the record and goes to winning the game. No,
the way to win the game is to make sure
you don't wreck it because you're awesome. You know, this
is a compliment to you. It has nothing to do
with the number in your sack category. At the moment,
(34:09):
you're gonna game plan the exact same way. The Bills did,
the exact same thing. They never ran at him, They
doubled him like mad men. Every time they threw, They
took the ball out of Josh Allen, the MVP's hands.
They just happened to end up with a win, you know.
I mean, that's smart. That's what people did. The Lawrence
Taylor and Reggie White and Aaron Donald. You're that level player.
(34:31):
I mean, Watt has gotten this in his career too,
you know what I mean. Like, it's not that we
can't stand you breaking the record against the Pittsburgh Steelers,
it's we want to win this game, and the way
to do it is to give you an extreme amount
of attention.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
And when that's the case, when you're devoting extra resources
to one guy, you gotta win your one on once.
And they didn't have any They didn't have anybody that
could do that to do it right. And you combine
that with what was not Aaron Rodgers' best game. I
think he's I think he said as much postgame, like
his guys weren't getting open for him, but there was
also some times that he missed some guys. You know,
both both of both of those things were true, and
(35:07):
that's just one of.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Those listen man coverage period.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
This is you know a lot of people tweet and
comment about how much you love Miles Garrett, and you know,
why don't you why, why don't why don't you Why
don't you go? Why don't you go? Give Miles Garrett
a big hug and a big snoochy kiss. Matt Williamson,
Here's where I'll go on the other side and put
on my black and gold glasses. Miles Garrett loves doing
this anytime the Browns beat the Steelers.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
Oh he knows what buttons he loves.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
In his postgame interview talking about how I'm better than
TJ and I'm the alpha in this league, and I
do this, and I do that. He loves to run
with a narrative when it's convenient.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
Great.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
Now they lose, and he's like, I could only do
so much. We can only do so much on the defense.
You know, we're only out there for half of the game.
Teams are teams are keying on me and taking me
out of the game plan. But then when he beats
the Steelers, he acts like he's you know, Haul Cogan
cutting a promo in the middle WrestleMania three.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
Right when I talk about Miles Garrett's because I'm his
best friend. I mean, there's probably a lot of athletes
I'm not we don't want to hang out with. But
what he does on the field is really good.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Yeah, And then he runs his mouth like an absolute
JABBRONI despite him being on a four win team that,
by the way, less than a year ago he requested
a trade from because he said, I'm never gonna win here,
and he's right there you go. Now, everybody on this
show can stop accusing us of being a bunch of
Miles Garrett fanboys.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
He but it's not about we can't allow this guy
to beat the record against this franchise. No, we're the game.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
I would I would beat Matt. I think it would
be disingenuous to think that that wasn't a conversation point
at all throughout the week for the Steelers. Oh sure, hey,
you want this. You want this guy to do this
to break TJ's record against you, Like, but.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
Dylan Cook, you want to be the one that's on
the poster. Blah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (36:45):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
It's not three or four days of practice in preparation
of like whatever, no matter what over our dead bodies
is Miles Garrett, if you got to hold onto his
leg and you know, the.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
Way Rob's phrased it on a different show was if
Garrett had two sacks and they off the game and
they award them all that, you know, all the wonderful things.
But the Steelers drive home with a win. They take
it every time. Yeah, they take it every time. Yep.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Right, And ideally you would add the best of both worlds. Right,
You find a way to win. You find a way
to limit, Miles Garrett. You get the hat.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
How you win is your limit?
Speaker 2 (37:16):
Miles Garrett, correct, correct, and again last time you were
able to do that. I mean here, if you can
give me a quick second to pull up the box
score from the last time the Steelers played the Browns,
which was of course.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
He did not yes that act every time since that too.
Now he can influence the game in other ways too.
He's got a million tackles for loss. He's good getst
a run, no doubt, double team, no doubt. It doesn't
mean like he didn't show up yesterday.
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Exactly right, exactly right. But for example, the last time
the Steelers and the Browns played, when they had a
similar game plan, uh for Miles Garrett, I thought it
was like almost a carbon copy type.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Yeah, it'll probably happen next time they played Browns too.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
DK Metcalf had ninety DK Metcalf had ninety five yards
and a touchdown. Darnell Washington had sixty two yards averaged
over twenty yards of reception. Connor Hayward had a double
digit reception. Roman Wilson had a double digit reception. Pat
Fryermouth double digit reception. Darnell had a thirty six yarder.
DK Metcalf had a twenty five yarder. You threw for
(38:17):
two hundred and thirty five yards in the air the
last time you played the Browns. That's the difference.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
That's the difference, right when you.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
Can't throw and your devoting extra resources rightfully, So to
Miles Garrett, that's the issue. You didn't really run the
ball that successfully against the Browns in that first outing.
You had one hundred yards exactly on twenty eight carries,
just three point six. But what you did have, Matt
was twenty one receptions and average of eleven point two
yards and multiple explosives and long games. You had none
(38:49):
of that.
Speaker 3 (38:50):
I don't remember that game like I do remember this
past game, but I think Rogers was checking the throws
against man coverage, against single high, because that's what the
Browns do, and and this week you do it with
guys that can't get open against band coverage, against single high,
against a really good defense at doing that, I mean,
that's the nuts and bolts of the difference between those
(39:10):
two games. Like I read this today, So when the
Steelers were in twelve personnel, one back, two tight ends,
back to two tight ends, one hundred percent of the snaps
at wide receiver were Thieling and mvs and twelve personnel
the only.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Two because there's two wide receivers on the field as well.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
One hundred percent of them in twelve were those two
guys when they went to eleven and took a tight
end off the field and added a receiver, one hundred
percent of the snaps were mvs Thelan Scotty Miller and
Scotty Miller. The only time Rooman Wilson or any other
receiver even saw the field was when they were in thirteen.
Wilson got a few snaps when there were three tight
(39:48):
ends on the field. Now, if one hundred percent of
your twelve and thirteen snaps are going to be Miller
feeling who just got cut? Who Miller could get cut
at any point and he didn't think.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
He was one of their best five coming out of
Latrobe in August, right.
Speaker 3 (40:06):
And Mvs who's been on like four teams in five
years and anyone could have had him two months ago.
It's not good enough. I mean, it's just not good enough.
And you're happy those guys are here. Would be even
worse with.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
I guess was Scotty Miller on the initial fifty three
He might have been, I think, but then he was,
but then he was demoted.
Speaker 3 (40:24):
Borderline of fifty three guys has been there's anyone on
the team. All yes, you know, and I like them.
It'd be worse off without those guys, no doubt picking them.
It's not the wrong move. It's just that's what you're
down to. What was it a couple of years ago
when they're pulling linebackers and safeties off the couch, I
mean that's kind of what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
Yeah, that was two seasons ago, I think when they
I mean they were they were getting guys that weren't
even on practice squads. Yeah, that were just you know,
at home on the couch, as Matt Williamson just said, there,
and they.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
Could be a supporting actor. They can't beat a nero.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
Yeah yeah right, And that's and then that gets exacerbated
when it's fourth and one and you throw downfield to
Scotty Miller just.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Right, and a lot of me you can blame Rogers
for that decision or sure, hey, if you want to
give them a hard time, why would you throw it
a Pro Bowl corner with Valdez scantling three times in
a row, Have at it. I'm not going to defend
them for that stuff, you know.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
Just again, those weighty moments every time they had an opportunity,
like you know the sort they came up short. You know,
you finally get that Sawyer. You know, the Browns go
turnover on downs and then the next possession, Sawyer gets
the interception, gives you the ball and plus territory. You do,
you have that fourth and one downfield to Scotty Miller.
(41:40):
You didn't run the ball. You didn't go to mouth
who was open over the middle of the field. All
that momentum that you had in that moment was that,
all right, we're down a touchdown. Here we go. Sawyer
sets us up about the tie this game before halftime.
We get the ball back at half, you get no points.
Momentum zapped. You know, you end up settling for a
field goal. Like, yeah, you didn't get down into the
red zone very often. No, I mean, did they have
(42:03):
one red zone snap until that final sequence.
Speaker 3 (42:06):
With with MVS.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
I think I rained one play in the red zone
until that final drive. That's that's not the way to
get I don't care how bad the opponent is that
you're playing, You're you're gonna struggle when that's the case. Boss,
to make the kick too, to make a kick. And
I know, I know a lot absolutely right. I know
a lot of things didn't go their way, Mack, but
some things did like that, like that that interception to
(42:31):
Kyle Duggar was terrible by Shador Sanders. The Steelers had
three fumbles that either bounced right back to them or
one that was like a pseudo pass from Aaron Rodgers
to John O. Smith n bounce. Jalen Warren fumbles on
the first drive, you get it back. M VS fumbles
out of halftime, you get it back. The Aaron Rodgers
(42:51):
one that like got hit and sacked out of his hands,
that goes right into John news Smith's arms. Like, they
had a lot of things go their way.
Speaker 3 (42:59):
Like, boy, isn't your day? You didn't get any bounces.
The refs killed Yeah, blah blah blah. I didn't love
the way the rest.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
No, I didn't either, but I thought they were bad
on both sides. I thought they were real bad on
both sides. Like that sequence. That sequence at the end
of the first quarter was a perfect example where that
really bad. They have that horrible O p I on
MVS that cost that cost the Steelers a first down,
but then the next play they run it back with
a terrible taunting call on the on the on the
(43:25):
Browns to give the to give the Steelers.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
A first down, like NHL makeup call.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
Felt exactly like an NBA or an NHL makeup call.
If we just missed this one, well we'll get it
back on the other end. No, just get it right
the first time.
Speaker 4 (43:36):
Just up.
Speaker 3 (43:37):
But yeah, that's like the the body weight same.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Even though I know that that's like the letter of
the law type thing, I still think that that was
not the right example. He's like trying to take half
of his body off of him and taking at the
time he was engaged with a defensive lineman. Like that's
just that's tough. It is, you know, two turnovers, no
points off of the Like every time you had the
(44:03):
ball and plus territory, it felt like you found a
way to go backwards or or just to stumble special teams,
uncharacteristic stuff there too, like you mentioned it. Just yeah,
it was it was a it was a kind of
masterclass of everything that could go wrong did go wrong.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
Yeah, but you're right, it's a great point about like
there were fumbles that you your fumble luck was good,
you know, like.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
This it was like go play the power ball. Yeah, yeah, good,
and then luck in that department so and and you
know you had some you had some bad luck in
some in some moments as well. But it just it
comes back to I think, really those weighty moments, so
many of those third and fourth the game.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
I know we're like up against it too. But I
didn't have a lot of respect for shut Or going in,
nor would I change my opinion greatly. But I thought
he played a good game.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Yeah, I mean he did what he did what he
needed to do to navigate them to a win.
Speaker 3 (44:54):
That Dugger interception was horrendous, but I thought played better
than I expected him to.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
I agree with you on that. I agree with you
on that. I mean, seventeen of twenty three one hundred
and eighty six yards eight point one average.
Speaker 3 (45:05):
He avoided sacks.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Yeah, yeah, I only took two sacks.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
Taking a ton of them. They got a lot of
pressure on him and they didn't get him the ground.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
And it's not like they were running the ball well either.
I mean he was kind of they're they're.
Speaker 3 (45:15):
All in stuff.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
He had a lot of fan in early Yeah, right, Yeah,
that's a great points. The new Judkins lost fan in
early was getting the ball to Tillman was getting the
ball to Judy.
Speaker 3 (45:26):
Yeah, made well over the middle.
Speaker 2 (45:28):
Yeah, I made a couple of plays with his legs.
You know, had a had twenty yards rushing, had that
one long eleven yard or to pick up a first
down I think it was, or at least maybe make
a third down manageable for Cleveland.
Speaker 4 (45:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
As a Steeler fan, I hope he.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
I hope they run it back with him.
Speaker 3 (45:43):
Oh yeah, yes, get them out of the quarterback market. Yeah,
and I'd love to see him there as long as
possible because I don't think he's the answer.
Speaker 2 (45:48):
But but he did what he had to do.
Speaker 3 (45:49):
He did well.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
I mean, again on that list of like the dt
rs and all these the Jamis Winston's, all these different
quarterbacks that we've seen these last four years at the
Steelers of lost in Cleveland. They did just enough for
their team to be able to, you know, to engineer victory.
They didn't go out and win the game, but they
didn't lose it either. There might have been one or
two questionable decisions and turnovers, but they made some plays
as well. Yeah. No, that that definitely deserves a mention.
(46:14):
And yeah, I mean they held the Browns at just
three point one yards rushing.
Speaker 3 (46:19):
I tried not to make the mistake on Mondays after
Steeler losses. The factor that the opponent had nothing to
do with it, sure, especially the opposing quarterback.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Their start was very important. Getting that ten tohing lead
out of the gate was important for them. It was
important for putting the Steelers behind the eight ball. It
really showed up in the end. Let's continue talking about
this game, dissecting all these different angles and elements and
conversation pieces. Halfway home. One hour in the books, another
hour to go, Euler Williamson. It's the Drive on Steelers
Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio netw
Your tunes about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:20):
Good afternoon, Steelers Nation. It's the Drive here on the Steelers'
audio network, while Shuuler and Matt Williamson with you here
on a Monday, our last Monday show of twenty twenty five. Matt,
and unfortunately, it's kind of a crappy one. I mean,
it's gonna be a depressing one. As the Steelers fall
to the Browns thirteen to six yesterday in Cleveland. It's
(00:41):
been about twenty four hours, and I am I still shocked.
I'm still surprised. I still I can't believe it. I
know that this is what's happened four straight times. They've
gone to Cleveland now and against bad quarterbacks, young quarterbacks.
You know, all kinds of reasons to win that don't
end up transpire ing. But this one felt a little bit,
(01:03):
a little bit more of a little bit bigger of
a gut punch.
Speaker 3 (01:06):
I think, yes, and no, I might cheer you up
a little, cheer me up a little bit, Mike pursuit
of cheered me up a little on a show it's
gonna air later, I urge I want to check it
out on DV tonight we do with Rob King and
we'll talk to him here of what next segment. Right now,
I can't say this enough, and I hope in the
YouTube comments or on Twitter people say, Matt, you should
(01:27):
have even brought up more. It's a game they gotta win.
It's a game you gotta win. I'm gonna say it
a million times. It's a game you gotta win. Now.
What Mike mentioned that I thought was interesting is, guys,
you didn't lose the AFC North. Everything's still there. What
you lost is the opportunity for rest that which is
huge now. A team this age that has had the
(01:51):
earliest bye week of the season really could have used
the rest and the certainty that you know now you're
preparing for playoffs. You're not preparing for the Ravens, but
it's not over. And he looked at it as a fan, like, man,
what's better than a playoff game in week eighteen against
the Birdies in your building? You're like, that's great, you know,
(02:11):
And I know the Ravens are coming off a win
and they look like the better team at the moment,
but this loss, just in terms of execution and watching
play after play, didn't feel like the Bills. I just
felt like the Steelers left some opportunities on the pH.
Speaker 2 (02:24):
Oh absolutely, yeah, the weight he downs, the heavy situational moment, exactly.
They probably lost seventy five percent of.
Speaker 3 (02:31):
Them in a big way. And that was the difference.
And what you knew was going to be a close
game in a place you don't have a lot of success,
and you didn't have all your horses. Now, not having
Metcalffin to a lesser degree, Austin and losing Washington all
mattered a great deal. A great deal. Yeah, I mean,
here's you. I mean, they've no man beaters. I mean,
and they're gonna see the exact same defense. You know,
why would they not run that back? But they lost
(02:53):
Fannin after he scored a touchdown. He's a leading receiver.
They didn't have Judkins, who's the guy they want to
give the ball to over and over? Like, no one's
gonna cry for your at this point. You know, that's
just how the league's going. But a couple of things
stood out to me, like when we started that show, like, Matt,
what were your big takeaways? Early defense was terrible, I mean, real.
Speaker 2 (03:12):
Problem it's something you talked about last week, and.
Speaker 3 (03:14):
That's kind of a Brown strength. Now I don't I'm
not a coaching staff, but you knew this team and
Sanders is at their best with the scripted stuff and
this the Fansky stuff and the designer stuff. But you
were too soft on them. You know, like the middle
of the field zone openings were massive. You didn't disrupt
(03:36):
Sanders enough. And after that you put the clamps on there.
I mean, the defense. Doesn't defense played well enough to win?
Speaker 2 (03:44):
They did in hindsight, it's easy to say, but like
all that was missing from the defense was a pick
six or a scoop six or Sawyer takes that one
of the house holds onto that one.
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Really all was missing from the whole game is a
touchdown of any sort.
Speaker 2 (04:00):
Yes, because the defense gave up field goal touchdown on
the Browns first two drives. Yeah, and then that was
and then after that really didn't give up a scoring
drive though, because the last field goal was you know,
you handed them the ball and they went three and
out and kicked the field goal from like right around
your red zone area, right in that in that twenty
to thirty range. I will I will push back a
(04:21):
little bit on the optimism though, and everything, everything is
still in front of you.
Speaker 3 (04:25):
We dressed to save today. Oh wow, all.
Speaker 2 (04:29):
Right, hold on, let the record show that I say.
Speaker 3 (04:32):
It used to make they all crazy if we'd happen
to wear the same polo. Well, like we ever asked.
Speaker 2 (04:36):
But since you and I got finned back from training
camp in what like mid August late August time frame,
I've been waiting for this day to happen.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
It'sound to happen.
Speaker 2 (04:46):
Has happened. I'm surprised. Honestly, we made it like three
or four months to this to September, October to November.
It took us four months before we wore the same
polo here today. Hell, it was glad you mentioned that,
because every day I'm like, I wonder if that's gonna
wear this one.
Speaker 3 (05:02):
While we're not ever setting it up.
Speaker 2 (05:04):
I picked between my eight or nine different schel.
Speaker 3 (05:07):
Eighth grade together wear the same outfit.
Speaker 2 (05:09):
We just showed up to the seventh grade dance wearing
the same dress.
Speaker 3 (05:12):
So that happened to me homecoming, Me and four buds.
We went to homecoming. There's no internet back then, you know, right,
and so our best buds We all went, and the
girls all knew each other, but they weren't a group.
They were all our dates. Gotcha, my date and my
buddy Murray's date had the exact same dress on that fair.
I mean, two dudes wouldn't care like they were like
(05:35):
the girls were. Yeah, their dinner together, dressed the same. Yeah,
that's hysterical.
Speaker 2 (05:41):
That's hysterical.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Light in the mood yourafice lost.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
That's exactly right. I didn't need that laugh. Now I'm
feeling a little bit better. I everything is still in
front of them. They still have the division title to
play for the home playoff game.
Speaker 3 (05:51):
All that and.
Speaker 2 (05:53):
Another continuing chapter of this league. This year has been
such a week to week proposition and a especially this
Pittsburgh Steelers team. They could beat the Ravens twenty eight
to ten in the car, wouldn't surprise me? Now, I
mean maybe with some of their limitations that they obviously
have on offense, with no number one and no number
(06:13):
two wide receiver aside and now no Darnell Washington either,
we gotta get to that they.
Speaker 3 (06:19):
Really are at some points starting wide receivers. No, I'm
not even sure Austin is one, but he'd been nice
to have them.
Speaker 2 (06:25):
So where my optimism was going into this game is
you take care of business, you win the division, you
get to rest, and that you you you touched on
it briefly, beat.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
It back capt back for the playoff game, and yeah.
Speaker 2 (06:39):
Right, that to me was the what separated this twenty
twenty five Steelers team from the last three or four. Yeah,
the last three or four limped into the playoffs and
just barely got there and was already on their last
leg and didn't have much. They kind of squeezed all
the juice out just to get into.
Speaker 3 (06:58):
The dance, and by halftime in the wild Round, you're like,
this is over this year.
Speaker 2 (07:02):
It looked like they're gonna be able to go into
Week eighteen, have a one o'clock home kickoff, put their
feet up rest. All those Super Bowl champion, All Pro
future Hall of famers that they have that are on
the other side of thirty or maybe even on the
other side of forty in the case of the quarterback
who once again was on the sideline messing with his
wrist in Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
One of which has a punctured lum.
Speaker 2 (07:24):
So again that's the bigger Yes, they can still win
the Division. They can still beat the Ravens, and by
the time we get to Thursday or Friday, I'm sure
I'll be singing a different tune. But for me, what
really sucks about yesterday is it felt like you would
finally turned a corner.
Speaker 3 (07:39):
Yeah, yeah, when.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
In reality it was just a call to sack.
Speaker 3 (07:43):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
And that's the most frustrating part to me is even
if they beat the Ravens and get into the playoffs,
it's not gonna feel the same as if you would
have had a week buffer to rest, to prepare, to
put your feet up, to get your veterans a little
more juice heading into the postseason. That's the real missed
opportunity of yesterday and that's what again makes it feel
more like a call to sack than turning a corner.
Speaker 3 (08:06):
And this is maybe a little pie in the sky,
but couldn't you have been the Patriots. It just destroyed
the Jets in a division game when you're a better team,
you're the playoff team, they're the team picking in the
top five, and just have Drake May sitting at out
basically the whole second half after he threw a million times.
You are allowed to do right couldn't you.
Speaker 2 (08:25):
Just yeah, Ben, if I if I hear one more
person or see one more tweet about this being scripted
just to have the Steelers and the Ravens in prime
time on Sunday night. No, like, yeah, the league's the
reason that they scored six points against against that.
Speaker 3 (08:38):
Couldn't convert on four three for what.
Speaker 2 (08:41):
Three for fifteen on third downs or whatever it was.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
Yeah, like Roger Goodell made them do that.
Speaker 2 (08:46):
Right, exactly right. The league would have loved to have
the Bills and the Patriots and still meaningful AFC East act.
I realize those teams don't play, but I'm still playing
for the title.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
So there's a few narratives we're gonna talk about this
week that I hate that are.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
So foolish, I'm sure. The other one is the Miles
Garrett one. And we can we can, we can, we
can get to that here in the first hour. To
some now, some of them like we need to talk
about Friarmuth and and hello, see what happens when he
finally gets involved? Too little, too little, too late. But
to me, it all comes back to it felt like
(09:20):
if this was going to be different, this was going
to be different from the last handful of years of
scratch and claw, and yes, get into the playoffs, which
I never want to act like that means nothing, like
there are getting into the playoffs is is the baseline
of contending for a championship. So I don't want to
act like that means nothing.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
But to get the playoffs.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
The goal is not to get in the playoffs. The
goal is to is to go on a run. And
they've been crystal clear about that. It's why they've turned
over the quarterback position for three straight years now. It's
why they went out and got guys like Jalen Ramsey.
And that's that's what you know really had me honked
off last night in this morning, is that that would
your opportunity to prove that this edition, this twenty twenty
(10:03):
five team was different than it's three or four predecessors.
And I don't know how you can feel that way
now here twenty four hours.
Speaker 3 (10:12):
Later, Yeah, and some other venting things, you kind of
stick with your tone here is why can't you win
in Cleveland? I don' want to hear Thursday short weeks anymore.
Speaker 2 (10:22):
It is it me maybe because you realized since I
started traveling, they haven't I'm owing four in Cleveland. I'm
owing four in Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (10:28):
Probably getting pretty old to driving home. Yeah this stinks, Yeah.
Speaker 2 (10:31):
Taking that bus ride across the miserable landscape of northeast Ohio.
Speaker 3 (10:36):
If it was the Borough era and you couldn't win
in Cinci or the Lamar era and you can't win
in Baltimore, it's like, because they got a really good
player and they're really good.
Speaker 2 (10:42):
I can tell you why the Jets couldn't win in
Foxborough for twenty years when Tom Brady was in there.
Speaker 3 (10:47):
Way, Hey can't you beat this team and they're building
they're not a good franchise. Yes, right, And again it's
a game. You gotta win. Game. You gotta win game,
you gotta win. But a couple of things that it's
what you get back to the first quarter defense sort of,
the early first two drives defense was below the line.
And again you knew they were going to come out
(11:08):
with designer stuff, but still you made it too easy
on them. You're too soft in your zones. You can't
you can't spot them to nothing or whatever it is
in a game you know is not going to be
high scoring. I mean you knew that coming in, Yes,
there's going to be some folks, some of you on
Twitter are wise enough to even tweet me. But Steelers
wanted to turnover battle to nothing real. They didn't. They
(11:29):
missed a field.
Speaker 2 (11:30):
Goal, not a few factor in fourth downs.
Speaker 3 (11:32):
And you row for three on fourth downs, you know,
like those were massive and any coupled, as you said,
with being horrendous on third downs, the pivotal downs you
lost dramatically.
Speaker 2 (11:43):
I mean the weighted moments, right, were a a bowling
ball around your neck that drug you to the bottom
of the ocean.
Speaker 3 (11:50):
And the biggest reason lost probably like on a down
by down basis. I don't know if the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Were the worst team, No, I think they were better
on it.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
I did do, especially once the defense got things set
if it was over.
Speaker 2 (12:00):
I like to use an analogy that you pull in
a lot of times. If that's a fifteen round boxing fight.
The Steelers won more.
Speaker 3 (12:06):
Rounds they did. They did.
Speaker 2 (12:07):
The Browns just landed the Haymakers.
Speaker 3 (12:09):
Yeah right, And it wasn't like the Bills game was
the worst game for me in terms of how you
how they played. You know, man, you should be embarrassed
how you played this one didn't execute the right times,
and clearly you didn't have anyone who could beat band coverage.
Speaker 2 (12:24):
I mean no, I mean, I mean the past game
was was practically non existent.
Speaker 3 (12:29):
That's a big problem. And I thought Rogers it was okay,
I mean, but I didn't there's some Monday morning quarterbacking involved.
Speaker 2 (12:38):
Oh, no doubt, but that's our job.
Speaker 3 (12:40):
I think he checked that I would have run the
ball at higher percentage of time.
Speaker 2 (12:44):
That might that might be complaint number one.
Speaker 3 (12:46):
It's pretty high.
Speaker 2 (12:48):
Why is he throwing the ball thirty nine times?
Speaker 4 (12:50):
Right?
Speaker 2 (12:50):
With no DK No Calvin Austin a good Browns defense
and pass rush, I mean right.
Speaker 3 (12:58):
And the run game is good. They're averaging five point
five a carry.
Speaker 2 (13:01):
Arn I think had five point six at halftime if
I'm remembering correctly. Yeah, from the halftime report.
Speaker 3 (13:06):
And Rob even did the math. He said, if you
take out the Hayward, you know, long run, they still
averaged four and a half or four six. Take that
all day long, absolutely, and you rush for over.
Speaker 2 (13:15):
It felt like there were a lot of times we
got a break to get to winning the King here,
but it felt like there were a lot of times
running more move more running. That's that's week eighteen, you know,
at a top of the grease board. But it felt
like there were so many times on first down they'd
pick up four or five on the ground and then
two incomplete pat or they'd pick up How many times
did they pick up four or five yards on first
(13:35):
down and then threw short of the six on sticks
on second down and lost three or four yards and
then all of a sudden, despite having second and five,
it's third and seven and eight, it's thirt and nine.
That happened way too often.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
And we even said, not that we know better than them,
but we said Thursday, Friday, run on first run and
second run on third and maybe punt, you know, and
by the fourth quarter it'll pay off because the Browns
are not going to run away from you. And this
is the Lions game terms of prep, right, it's.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Not You're not gonna have to score twenty some points
to win this game. A lot to get to. There's
kind of your opening salvo, your scene setter. We'll talk
to the voice of the Steelers, Rob King, all his
thoughts from the game in Cleveland yesterday from his vantage
point when we return on the other side. Just getting
started here on a Monday West Hueler. Matt Williamson, It's
(14:25):
the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (14:29):
Your tune's about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal, Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (14:43):
We'relling along here on the drive on a Monday to
the phone lines. We go to talk to the voice
of your Pittsburgh Steelers, Rob King, who was there by
the lake at Huntington bank Field. I was sitting right
behind him throughout that Brown's thirteen Steelers six discippoint performance yesterday.
They're in an opportunity for the Steelers to clench the
(15:03):
AFC North. Kinger, where are you at today? Are you
looking ahead optimistically? You know, Matt and I kind of
towed the line in the opening segment of Hey, you know,
there's still the AFC North to play for. It's such
a week to week league verse. You had a real
opportunity to wrap this thing up. You had a real
opportunity to rest and give some of your veteran guys,
(15:24):
you know, a blow on Sunday and have a one
o'clock kickoff that meant nothing against Baltimore and now it
means everything. On on Sunday night, football in primetime. Where
are you at in terms of your optimistic pessimistic glass
half full, glass half empty here you know, about twenty
four hours later.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
Yeah, it's all. It's all that my glasses medium full.
You know, I'm some of it's negative and some of
it's positive. I mean, you know, you lost three straight
games in Cleveland to go up there and beat him down,
and you know, it's a team. Look, the crowd was,
you know, it was like half a kickoff as people
(16:02):
started appearing. You know, by the end of the game,
it was full and the crowd was into it. But
it just felt like, boy, if you, if you somehow
could have gotten on top of them Merley and and
ushered him, you know, to the to the exit and
you know, just kind of won comfortably. That's what I
was hoping for, kind of a you know, a repeat
(16:22):
of the first meeting between the two teams, in which
you didn't do anything dramatic, but you just simply won
the game. You're just a better team and you sort
of slowly methodically beat them, and you know you didn't
and it's you know, highly disappointing that you didn't do that.
I'm sure they're disappointed. He didn't do that. You know,
there's some malarkey coming out of the game about oh,
(16:45):
all they cared about was, you know, not letting Miles
Garrett break the sack record, which, by the way, a
narrative that is, as far as I know, began with
Miles Garrett continued with Miles Garrett after the game, and
which I don't buy in the least. But you know
that that was disappointing. You had a real opportunity there,
and now you have to win a game, right and
(17:07):
you know with that comes the notion that you could
just play a poor game, or a call could go
against you, or something in that nature in a against
an opponent in which you're evenly matched, So you let
an opportunity to slip away. And that's just the way
it is. But you still have a chance to win
the as Nord. And by the way, and I'm sure
(17:28):
we'll get to this. I still think there were some
things that the Steelers continued to do well in this game,
but ultimately it's hard on Monday not to be disappointed
with what happened yesterday.
Speaker 3 (17:39):
Yeah, I think that I understand with the defense, I mean,
I think they got after the quarterback. Well, I thought
they stuffed the run. Well, I thought they wanted the
line of scrimmage. And you know, outside of the first
couple series, I thought the defense more than played well
enough to win this football game. They took the ball away,
they could have had probably another I mean there was
(18:00):
there for two pick sixes. One of them didn't even
end up being a pick, but I think early. I'm
not saying the game was lost, but you kind of
injected the Browns with hope right off the bat. You know,
by the way that you played defense in the first
series or two.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
It was very similar to what we saw a week
ago with them. Matt and I know you talked about this,
and certainly Max and I talked about it as well.
You know, Kevin Stefanski's a very good offensive coach. Yeah,
I don't mean to see them with faint praise, right,
He's won two Coach of the Year awards. To talk
about that however you want, but I don't want to
damn him by faint praise, by just saying he's an
(18:39):
offensive guy. But he's got a very good offensive mine.
They had a great jove. I was talking to the
guys from Cleveland before the games that it might have
been their best drive of the season, the opening drive
against the Bills. They came out and a couple of
opening drives against the Steelers and looked good. I thought
the Steelers, you know, I would have liked to have
seen them adjust maybe a little quicker earlier in the game.
(18:59):
But ultimately, when you allow a team ten points on
their home field, and then you know, they got the
late field goal when you went forward on fourth and
long from your own territory, but really you shut them
out after that. If you allow ten points, you should
win the game. There were a lot of things that
happened in this game that if you told me that
was what was going to happen, you should win the game.
(19:21):
By the same token. You're right, Matt, there was a
you know, it's a bit of a tone setter, and
tone setters there they're not statistics, but they're not irrelevant either,
and so I thought that there was I thought that
was relevant.
Speaker 2 (19:35):
Oh absolutely. I think there were a lot of those
tone setters early on for Cleveland that that that kept
them believing, kept them in the game. As you mentioned,
it was a uncharacteristically flat Browns crowd, uh for as
as disappointing as that franchise has been. That crowd usually
shows up, especially when the Black and Gold are in town,
(19:55):
and it wasn't really until you know, that eight minute
drive that ended with a Chris Boswell miss that it
felt like the crowd really came alive when it was
still you know, ten to six at that point and
they were chanting Miles Garrett's name and and all that stuff. Kinger,
I wanted to ask you just about you know, kind
of piggybacking off of that though. Guys, I'm not breaking
(20:17):
any news here. You're gonna have to score more than
six points at home next week to beat the Baltimore Ravens.
I don't care if it's Huntley or Lamar Jackson at quarterback.
You're gonna need to score more than six. Dk Metcalf
isn't going to be back. Who knows on Calvin Austin
will wait and see this week. Darnault Washington broken arm,
he's not going to be there. Rob to me, this
(20:39):
is you know, it's a time where you're searching for
answers and there's not a lot of easy context clues
for this Steelers offense.
Speaker 4 (20:48):
Yeah, I agree with what you're saying, you know, by
the same token. You know there there were a number
of small plays that happened in this game that that
leave you scratching your head and leave you thinking, hey,
a different result, maybe a different approach, and who knows
what happens. So for example, you just talked about the
(21:11):
you know, the miss Chris Boswell field goal. Well, you know,
Aaron Rodgers gets sacked to play before that, right, and
you know, if you throw the ball away there or
if you know, whatever the case may be, you don't
get a sack. You know, I don't want to necessarily
describe blame because you know, I don't go back and
don't I don't get a chance to see the replay, right,
(21:32):
I don't get a chance to see what happened. But
you know, if that's six yards closer, yeah, you know,
going in that direction in which you know, watching pregame warmups,
guys were were barely making you know, long forties or
fifty yard field goals. So give that did Chris Boswell
five yards closer? Six yards closer? I think it was
(21:52):
a six yard sack? Who knows what happens. You know,
people talk about the decision to go up the sideline
to Scotty on the fourth and one, moving in the
opposite direction. Earlier in the game, I would have liked
to have seen the see that run the ball there
they're originally were going to there was third and a
foot and you know, they lined up in a spread,
then came back into an eye formation, and then they're
(22:14):
standing around at the line of scrimms trying to get
in the right uh, you know, the right formation, and
Dylan Cook jumps. You know, I wouldn't mind seeing you
just line up there and say, hey, listen, we're gonna
get a foot. Let's line up in the eye formation
and get it, or let's go steal city shove and
get it there. There were a lot of moments like that,
and when you look back at the game, yeah, you
(22:35):
got to score more than six points. They ran the
ball effectively. They were three for fifteen on third down,
three for fifteen, zero for three on fourth down. That
that's just not going to win the ball game. And
a lot of those, as I was just mentioning, were
manageables and and some plays that just you know, uh,
(22:56):
you want a second guest to play calling and whatever
whatever you want to do. It doesn't at this stage
of the game. It doesn't matter. What matters is you
were three for fifteen on third down and zero for
three on fourth down, and you're not going to win games.
And you do that, and so you only score six points.
But there were opportunities to score more than six points.
Speaker 3 (23:12):
Let's stick with Rogers real quick, Rob. I mean, I
can't remember an NFL game where a quarterback got less
help from their wide receivers. I'm not talking about their
pass catchers, they're the wide receiver position. But he also
missed some throws. He made some throws he didn't, as
he often has this year, elevate those around him against
(23:34):
a good d But and I'm not sure this is
on him or not. I think some Monday morning quarterbackings
involved here too. I would have liked to see the
higher percentage of runs that were working well, maybe more
targets to Warren and especially gain Well and Friarmouth as well,
(23:56):
maybe even John hum You know, you know I'm not
even playing.
Speaker 4 (24:04):
You know there's no short answer to this, because so
I'm gonna I'm gonna give you a longer answer, which
is that you know we're praising Aaron Rodgers for making
decisions to line of scrimmage and taking commanded things. It's
been a big part of why they've been successful. It's
been a big part of why your offense look really
(24:25):
good at Baltimore, looked really good against Miami, and looked
phenomenal against Detroit. We're we're all praising Aaron Rodgers for
when they have the audio telling Kenneth game well, motion
out right and run a go route. You know, I
mean to talk about drawing it up in the dirt
on the fly in a game. He's got those capabilities.
(24:48):
In this game, it looked to me, I'm not in
the huddle. I'm not at the line of scrimmage. I
don't know what plays are changing out of or into.
It looked to me like when they changed out of plays,
it wasn't effect as it's been. And when that happens,
what's gonna happen, you're gonna say they should have run
the ball more. I brought up this, this, uh, this,
(25:08):
and you know a similar circumstance to me where Aaron
Rodgers makes a call to line of scrimmage which has
been effective more often than it's not been effective. It's
against the Chargers late you need a score. You're starting
to run the ball more effectively. You got a second
and six. You've got to look. I think it was
a sweep to the right call. That's the way everybody moved.
But Aaron Rodgers sees DK Metcalf's can run a slant.
(25:31):
So and a quarterback has these abilities to just you know,
get the snap, stand up and make a throw, whether
it's out to the flat or what have you. He
sees dk Metcalf and Bud Duprie drops in front of
that coverage. And and now the play is not gonna work.
And and you can't anticipate that Bud's gonna do that, right,
So I want air and and that's a play that
(25:52):
didn't work. But I want Aaron Rodgers to have the
freedom to do that because it's been part of why
you've been successful. It looked to me like some of
those in instances weren't effective. Yesterday it didn't work, and
so you know, what, what are you gonna do? What
are you gonna say? Uh, hey, Hall of Fame quarterback,
You don't get to do that anymore.
Speaker 3 (26:09):
No, but but yes.
Speaker 4 (26:15):
To see the Steelers maybe make some of those decisions
running the ball look, yeah, I mean I said, matt
you know, you and I do a show and called
the matchup with Missy Matthews every week. Every week I
say the same thing. Yeah, wish the Steers run the
ball bore. You know. I like their running backs. I
like the running game. I think the running game is effective.
I thought it was effective yesterday. I would have liked
(26:36):
to have seen more of it. But it's not so
easy to say, well, you just have to do that,
because part of what has made you effective is some
of those changes and some of those things at the
line of scrimmage. I will say this the other point
you made in there. You know that receiving corps, the
five wide receivers that the students put out there yesterday
as members of the students because steel and had a
(26:58):
few catches at the vikings, but as a group, as
a collective, as Steelers pass catchers, they had twenty eight
receptions between them twenty eight Yeah, and Gainwell and Warren.
I believe the number was ninety eight between them, and
I think they had three catches between them and Warren.
I don't think was even targeted in the game, and
so you know, maybe, but again, the Browns know that too.
(27:23):
They've got an excellent defensive coordinator. Did they did they
scheme against that?
Speaker 2 (27:27):
Hey?
Speaker 4 (27:27):
Man, I leave those things up to Aaron Rodgers and
Arthur Smith. I don't know. I'm not paid to be
an offensive coordinator, and I don't Matt, you and I
were having a conversation earlier today about you know this, Hey, look,
you know, look at it. Here's a freeze frame of
Gainwell was open over the middle. They've been inducted to
him on that that last play from the goal line. Well,
(27:48):
I didn't see it that way. You didn't see it
that way. I think if he throws that pass, Delpit
and Sweeshinger come up and make the stop of the
three yard line and the game's over. So you know,
everybody can second guest the next day, right, And so
what I'd like to see the run the ball more
and stick with a run more. Yes, that's circling back.
(28:10):
I think I answered your question fourteen differently.
Speaker 3 (28:12):
Yeah, but you mentioned how they did do a lot
of good things, and I do think the running game
remains a good thing.
Speaker 4 (28:19):
Yeah, Look, they ran the ball well, they were These
are the things that I've liked. Okay, they've the in
the three game winning streak going on here. They've done
a good job against the run. That included Derrick Henry
twenty five carries ninety four yards. Signed me up right,
they've done well against the run. You know certain play
like I think Cam Heyward's playing his best football. I
(28:41):
think Alex Heismith's of course, and continues to be a force.
So I think there's a lot of things to like
about what the defense is doing. They've run the ball.
They didn't run the ball effectively against Baltimore, but they've
run it effectively ever since, including yesterday. You know the
turnover culture, right you. They'd won ten straight games in
which they won the turnover battle. That didn't happen. They
(29:03):
won the turnover battle. I know the fourth downs and
miss field goals, Matt and I agree with you should
be counted as turnovers. They're not. You'd won ten straight games,
not only did you in which you hadn't turned I'm sorry,
ten straight games in which you hadn't turned them all over.
They didn't turn them all over, and they got to turnovers.
So many things that happen in this game that if
you had told me this is what's gonna happen before
(29:24):
the game, I would have told you if Steelers are
gonna win, and so do we chuck this out the window. Well,
we'll find out Sunday night, right, Because if you're if
you're trending in the right direction, and you're good enough
to win with the way you've been playing, then you'll
win on Sunday night. And if you aren't, then you
won't and you won't make the playoffs. That's a beauty
(29:47):
about the games. You go out and play them.
Speaker 2 (29:50):
And they're gonna have to go out and play one
Sunday night in prime time. Rob King, I know you're
excited about that, baby on Sunday listen.
Speaker 4 (29:58):
Man, with with the emotions are like, you're bumming because
you're down because you had a golden opportunity against the
team that I think you should have beaten and you
were favored to beat. And I know you've had troubles
up there, but you know you're down because of that.
But as this week goes on, the knowledge in the
back of my mind is the week goes on and
(30:18):
it's going to be so exciting Sunday night at Acre Sure.
I can't wait for that, man, I can't wait.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
I would have rather had Aaron Rodgers resting that left wrist,
and too, Jalen Ramsey in sweats, and Cam Hayward and sweats.
But it will be exciting at eight point fifteen, when
the towels are swirling and the fireworks are going off
and Rob King's booming voice is ringing across the Steelers
Audio Network. Kinger, thanks for the time, as always, partner.
We'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
You got it, guys, Thanks very much.
Speaker 2 (30:47):
There he goes voice of your Pittsburgh Steelers, Rob King,
plenty to get into there that he touched on. Matt
some more specifics that I want to dive into here
in our final segment of the first hour when we
return on the other side. Shuoler, Matt Williamson. It is
the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (31:05):
Your tune's about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal, Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (31:24):
Rolling along here on the drive our final week of
shows here in twenty twenty five, as it is approaching
the new year, and a final opportunity for the Steelers
to get the hat in the T shirt and the
AFC North Division champions. Of course, it will be Sunday
night eight, twenty Sunday Night Football against the Ravens. Matt
(31:45):
more than we have to get to here. But Kinger
brought this up. But I think you and I did
want to touch on this at some point the Miles
Garrett postgame, you know, the I think the Steelers, all
that we're doing, all that they came in to stop
me from getting the record, and that ended up costing them.
And I've seen that all over the place. I'm sure
(32:05):
you've seen it and gotten tweets about It makes me crazy.
I like that far out there that, oh, it costs
the Steelers and all they wanted to do was slow
down Miles Garrett. Well, yeah, he's the defensive player of
the year in a wrecking force. You know like that,
it makes a lot of sense that you would try
and take that guy out of the game. I don't know.
(32:27):
It felt to me like the same game plan that
they had against the Browns a couple months ago. You
just didn't have DK Metcalf and Calvin Austin. You didn't
have anybody who could get open, and therefore Aaron Rodgers,
instead of throwing seven eight yard completions, was throwing for
two yard games, two yard losses. It just there was
there was a lack of rhythm there that I think
(32:48):
is easy to blame on. They were so focused on
Miles Garrett, and they were focused on Miles Garrett, there's
no doubt, but that's been every time they've played Miles Garrett.
They just they didn't have enough to overcome making taking
him and making him a focal point requires a lot
of other guys winning their one on ones. When you're
devoting extra resources to Miles Garrett, a lot of other
(33:09):
guys have to win their one on ones in five
out in routes, and nobody else was winning their one
on ones.
Speaker 3 (33:14):
Yes, exactly, so people look at it the wrong way.
You know, they were too focused on the record. I
don't think they gave a crap about the record.
Speaker 2 (33:24):
I don't know. I mean I think they did. I
think that part's.
Speaker 3 (33:26):
Fair or Buffalo the week before it did. No one
wants to be the team you break the record.
Speaker 2 (33:30):
Correct, but especially the Steelers against him. And that's fine,
like there's history there and feelings there, But I.
Speaker 3 (33:38):
Will contend that their game plan wouldn't have changed one
bit if he set the record last week or if
this was week two.
Speaker 2 (33:44):
I agree with you. Yes, I completely agree with you
on that right.
Speaker 3 (33:47):
I mean the way that Garrett phrased it, that everyone
ran with was they were more concerned about me not
getting the record and goes to winning the game. No,
the way to win the game is to make sure
you don't wreck it because you're awesome. You know, this
is a compliment to you. It has nothing to do
with the number in your sack category. At the moment,
(34:09):
you're gonna game plan the exact same way. The Bills did,
the exact same thing. They never ran at him, They
doubled him like mad men. Every time they threw, They
took the ball out of Josh Allen, the MVP's hands.
They just happened to end up with a win, you know.
I mean, that's smart. That's what people did. The Lawrence
Taylor and Reggie White and Aaron Donald. You're that level player.
(34:31):
I mean, Watt has gotten this in his career too,
you know what I mean. Like, it's not that we
can't stand you breaking the record against the Pittsburgh Steelers,
it's we want to win this game, and the way
to do it is to give you an extreme amount
of attention.
Speaker 2 (34:44):
And when that's the case, when you're devoting extra resources
to one guy, you gotta win your one on once.
And they didn't have any They didn't have anybody that
could do that to do it right. And you combine
that with what was not Aaron Rodgers' best game. I
think he's I think he said as much postgame, like
his guys weren't getting open for him, but there was
also some times that he missed some guys. You know,
both both of both of those things were true, and
(35:07):
that's just one of.
Speaker 3 (35:08):
Those listen man coverage period.
Speaker 2 (35:11):
This is you know a lot of people tweet and
comment about how much you love Miles Garrett, and you know,
why don't you why, why don't why don't you Why
don't you go? Why don't you go? Give Miles Garrett
a big hug and a big snoochy kiss. Matt Williamson,
Here's where I'll go on the other side and put
on my black and gold glasses. Miles Garrett loves doing
this anytime the Browns beat the Steelers.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
Oh he knows what buttons he loves.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
In his postgame interview talking about how I'm better than
TJ and I'm the alpha in this league, and I
do this, and I do that. He loves to run
with a narrative when it's convenient.
Speaker 4 (35:40):
Great.
Speaker 2 (35:43):
Now they lose, and he's like, I could only do
so much. We can only do so much on the defense.
You know, we're only out there for half of the game.
Teams are teams are keying on me and taking me
out of the game plan. But then when he beats
the Steelers, he acts like he's you know, Haul Cogan
cutting a promo in the middle WrestleMania three.
Speaker 3 (36:01):
Right when I talk about Miles Garrett's because I'm his
best friend. I mean, there's probably a lot of athletes
I'm not we don't want to hang out with. But
what he does on the field is really good.
Speaker 2 (36:10):
Yeah, And then he runs his mouth like an absolute
JABBRONI despite him being on a four win team that,
by the way, less than a year ago he requested
a trade from because he said, I'm never gonna win here,
and he's right there you go. Now, everybody on this
show can stop accusing us of being a bunch of
Miles Garrett fanboys.
Speaker 3 (36:25):
He but it's not about we can't allow this guy
to beat the record against this franchise. No, we're the game.
Speaker 2 (36:31):
I would I would beat Matt. I think it would
be disingenuous to think that that wasn't a conversation point
at all throughout the week for the Steelers. Oh sure, hey,
you want this. You want this guy to do this
to break TJ's record against you, Like, but.
Speaker 3 (36:42):
Dylan Cook, you want to be the one that's on
the poster. Blah blah blah.
Speaker 4 (36:45):
It's not.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
It's not three or four days of practice in preparation
of like whatever, no matter what over our dead bodies
is Miles Garrett, if you got to hold onto his
leg and you know, the.
Speaker 3 (36:56):
Way Rob's phrased it on a different show was if
Garrett had two sacks and they off the game and
they award them all that, you know, all the wonderful things.
But the Steelers drive home with a win. They take
it every time. Yeah, they take it every time. Yep.
Speaker 2 (37:10):
Right, And ideally you would add the best of both worlds. Right,
You find a way to win. You find a way
to limit, Miles Garrett. You get the hat.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
How you win is your limit?
Speaker 2 (37:16):
Miles Garrett, correct, correct, and again last time you were
able to do that. I mean here, if you can
give me a quick second to pull up the box
score from the last time the Steelers played the Browns,
which was of course.
Speaker 3 (37:29):
He did not yes that act every time since that too.
Now he can influence the game in other ways too.
He's got a million tackles for loss. He's good getst
a run, no doubt, double team, no doubt. It doesn't
mean like he didn't show up yesterday.
Speaker 2 (37:40):
Exactly right, exactly right. But for example, the last time
the Steelers and the Browns played, when they had a
similar game plan, uh for Miles Garrett, I thought it
was like almost a carbon copy type.
Speaker 3 (37:53):
Yeah, it'll probably happen next time they played Browns too.
Speaker 2 (37:55):
DK Metcalf had ninety DK Metcalf had ninety five yards
and a touchdown. Darnell Washington had sixty two yards averaged
over twenty yards of reception. Connor Hayward had a double
digit reception. Roman Wilson had a double digit reception. Pat
Fryermouth double digit reception. Darnell had a thirty six yarder.
DK Metcalf had a twenty five yarder. You threw for
(38:17):
two hundred and thirty five yards in the air the
last time you played the Browns. That's the difference.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
That's the difference, right when you.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
Can't throw and your devoting extra resources rightfully, So to
Miles Garrett, that's the issue. You didn't really run the
ball that successfully against the Browns in that first outing.
You had one hundred yards exactly on twenty eight carries,
just three point six. But what you did have, Matt
was twenty one receptions and average of eleven point two
yards and multiple explosives and long games. You had none
(38:49):
of that.
Speaker 3 (38:50):
I don't remember that game like I do remember this
past game, but I think Rogers was checking the throws
against man coverage, against single high, because that's what the
Browns do, and and this week you do it with
guys that can't get open against band coverage, against single high,
against a really good defense at doing that, I mean,
that's the nuts and bolts of the difference between those
(39:10):
two games. Like I read this today, So when the
Steelers were in twelve personnel, one back, two tight ends,
back to two tight ends, one hundred percent of the snaps
at wide receiver were Thieling and mvs and twelve personnel
the only.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Two because there's two wide receivers on the field as well.
Speaker 3 (39:27):
One hundred percent of them in twelve were those two
guys when they went to eleven and took a tight
end off the field and added a receiver, one hundred
percent of the snaps were mvs Thelan Scotty Miller and
Scotty Miller. The only time Rooman Wilson or any other
receiver even saw the field was when they were in thirteen.
Wilson got a few snaps when there were three tight
(39:48):
ends on the field. Now, if one hundred percent of
your twelve and thirteen snaps are going to be Miller
feeling who just got cut? Who Miller could get cut
at any point and he didn't think.
Speaker 2 (40:03):
He was one of their best five coming out of
Latrobe in August, right.
Speaker 3 (40:06):
And Mvs who's been on like four teams in five
years and anyone could have had him two months ago.
It's not good enough. I mean, it's just not good enough.
And you're happy those guys are here. Would be even
worse with.
Speaker 2 (40:18):
I guess was Scotty Miller on the initial fifty three
He might have been, I think, but then he was,
but then he was demoted.
Speaker 3 (40:24):
Borderline of fifty three guys has been there's anyone on
the team. All yes, you know, and I like them.
It'd be worse off without those guys, no doubt picking them.
It's not the wrong move. It's just that's what you're
down to. What was it a couple of years ago
when they're pulling linebackers and safeties off the couch, I
mean that's kind of what they're doing.
Speaker 2 (40:39):
Yeah, that was two seasons ago, I think when they
I mean they were they were getting guys that weren't
even on practice squads. Yeah, that were just you know,
at home on the couch, as Matt Williamson just said, there,
and they.
Speaker 3 (40:51):
Could be a supporting actor. They can't beat a nero.
Speaker 2 (40:53):
Yeah yeah right, And that's and then that gets exacerbated
when it's fourth and one and you throw downfield to
Scotty Miller just.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
Right, and a lot of me you can blame Rogers
for that decision or sure, hey, if you want to
give them a hard time, why would you throw it
a Pro Bowl corner with Valdez scantling three times in
a row, Have at it. I'm not going to defend
them for that stuff, you know.
Speaker 2 (41:19):
Just again, those weighty moments every time they had an opportunity,
like you know the sort they came up short. You know,
you finally get that Sawyer. You know, the Browns go
turnover on downs and then the next possession, Sawyer gets
the interception, gives you the ball and plus territory. You do,
you have that fourth and one downfield to Scotty Miller.
(41:40):
You didn't run the ball. You didn't go to mouth
who was open over the middle of the field. All
that momentum that you had in that moment was that,
all right, we're down a touchdown. Here we go. Sawyer
sets us up about the tie this game before halftime.
We get the ball back at half, you get no points.
Momentum zapped. You know, you end up settling for a
field goal. Like, yeah, you didn't get down into the
red zone very often. No, I mean, did they have
(42:03):
one red zone snap until that final sequence.
Speaker 3 (42:06):
With with MVS.
Speaker 2 (42:08):
I think I rained one play in the red zone
until that final drive. That's that's not the way to
get I don't care how bad the opponent is that
you're playing, You're you're gonna struggle when that's the case. Boss,
to make the kick too, to make a kick. And
I know, I know a lot absolutely right. I know
a lot of things didn't go their way, Mack, but
some things did like that, like that that interception to
(42:31):
Kyle Duggar was terrible by Shador Sanders. The Steelers had
three fumbles that either bounced right back to them or
one that was like a pseudo pass from Aaron Rodgers
to John O. Smith n bounce. Jalen Warren fumbles on
the first drive, you get it back. M VS fumbles
out of halftime, you get it back. The Aaron Rodgers
(42:51):
one that like got hit and sacked out of his hands,
that goes right into John news Smith's arms. Like, they
had a lot of things go their way.
Speaker 3 (42:59):
Like, boy, isn't your day? You didn't get any bounces.
The refs killed Yeah, blah blah blah. I didn't love
the way the rest.
Speaker 2 (43:04):
No, I didn't either, but I thought they were bad
on both sides. I thought they were real bad on
both sides. Like that sequence. That sequence at the end
of the first quarter was a perfect example where that
really bad. They have that horrible O p I on
MVS that cost that cost the Steelers a first down,
but then the next play they run it back with
a terrible taunting call on the on the on the
(43:25):
Browns to give the to give the Steelers.
Speaker 3 (43:27):
A first down, like NHL makeup call.
Speaker 2 (43:29):
Felt exactly like an NBA or an NHL makeup call.
If we just missed this one, well we'll get it
back on the other end. No, just get it right
the first time.
Speaker 4 (43:36):
Just up.
Speaker 3 (43:37):
But yeah, that's like the the body weight same.
Speaker 2 (43:42):
Even though I know that that's like the letter of
the law type thing, I still think that that was
not the right example. He's like trying to take half
of his body off of him and taking at the
time he was engaged with a defensive lineman. Like that's
just that's tough. It is, you know, two turnovers, no
points off of the Like every time you had the
(44:03):
ball and plus territory, it felt like you found a
way to go backwards or or just to stumble special teams,
uncharacteristic stuff there too, like you mentioned it. Just yeah,
it was it was a it was a kind of
masterclass of everything that could go wrong did go wrong.
Speaker 3 (44:19):
Yeah, but you're right, it's a great point about like
there were fumbles that you your fumble luck was good,
you know, like.
Speaker 2 (44:25):
This it was like go play the power ball. Yeah, yeah, good,
and then luck in that department so and and you
know you had some you had some bad luck in
some in some moments as well. But it just it
comes back to I think, really those weighty moments, so
many of those third and fourth the game.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
I know we're like up against it too. But I
didn't have a lot of respect for shut Or going in,
nor would I change my opinion greatly. But I thought
he played a good game.
Speaker 2 (44:50):
Yeah, I mean he did what he did what he
needed to do to navigate them to a win.
Speaker 3 (44:54):
That Dugger interception was horrendous, but I thought played better
than I expected him to.
Speaker 2 (44:59):
I agree with you on that. I agree with you
on that. I mean, seventeen of twenty three one hundred
and eighty six yards eight point one average.
Speaker 3 (45:05):
He avoided sacks.
Speaker 2 (45:06):
Yeah, yeah, I only took two sacks.
Speaker 3 (45:08):
Taking a ton of them. They got a lot of
pressure on him and they didn't get him the ground.
Speaker 2 (45:11):
And it's not like they were running the ball well either.
I mean he was kind of they're they're.
Speaker 3 (45:15):
All in stuff.
Speaker 2 (45:16):
He had a lot of fan in early Yeah, right, Yeah,
that's a great points. The new Judkins lost fan in
early was getting the ball to Tillman was getting the
ball to Judy.
Speaker 3 (45:26):
Yeah, made well over the middle.
Speaker 2 (45:28):
Yeah, I made a couple of plays with his legs.
You know, had a had twenty yards rushing, had that
one long eleven yard or to pick up a first
down I think it was, or at least maybe make
a third down manageable for Cleveland.
Speaker 4 (45:40):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (45:40):
As a Steeler fan, I hope he.
Speaker 2 (45:42):
I hope they run it back with him.
Speaker 3 (45:43):
Oh yeah, yes, get them out of the quarterback market. Yeah,
and I'd love to see him there as long as
possible because I don't think he's the answer.
Speaker 2 (45:48):
But but he did what he had to do.
Speaker 3 (45:49):
He did well.
Speaker 2 (45:50):
I mean, again on that list of like the dt
rs and all these the Jamis Winston's, all these different
quarterbacks that we've seen these last four years at the
Steelers of lost in Cleveland. They did just enough for
their team to be able to, you know, to engineer victory.
They didn't go out and win the game, but they
didn't lose it either. There might have been one or
two questionable decisions and turnovers, but they made some plays
as well. Yeah. No, that that definitely deserves a mention.
(46:14):
And yeah, I mean they held the Browns at just
three point one yards rushing.
Speaker 3 (46:19):
I tried not to make the mistake on Mondays after
Steeler losses. The factor that the opponent had nothing to
do with it, sure, especially the opposing quarterback.
Speaker 2 (46:28):
Their start was very important. Getting that ten tohing lead
out of the gate was important for them. It was
important for putting the Steelers behind the eight ball. It
really showed up in the end. Let's continue talking about
this game, dissecting all these different angles and elements and
conversation pieces. Halfway home. One hour in the books, another
hour to go, Euler Williamson. It's the Drive on Steelers
Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio netw
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