November 20, 2025 • 45 mins
Matt and Wes open with all the latest on the injury front for Aaron Rodgers and others. Bob Labriola joins to state his case for LC Greenwood's Hall of Fame candidacy.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Your tunes about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Goo.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Good afternoon, Stealer Nation. It's the Drive on the Steelers
Audio Network here on a Thursday, West Shuoler and Matt
Williamson with you for the next two hours, with plenty
to get into. We've got the Steelers' latest practice report
and there is I think some Aaron Rodgers tea leaves
in there.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
Matt, I think.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
So we're gonna talk to our buddy Bob Labriola in
about fifteen twenty minutes get all his thoughts on els Green.
Speaker 4 (00:51):
Yeah, I want to poke his brain about Elsie from
the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Of course, it's a big Matt stats day here on
Thursday as well, but I think it would only be
appropriate where we have to begin today, Matt. Of course,
today is November twentieth, and it is the birthday of
our late brother Dale Lolly, Yeah, who we lost just
a few months ago. I do believe, all right, correct
me if I'm wrong, give me a little grace here,
but I do believe Dale would have been fifty seven today.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
I think so. I could probably take up the year
here in a minute but I'm fifty two, semi soon
to be fifty three, and we did not overlap at
Pitt Johnstown together because well, he left the year I
after I came.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
He was like a senior in college when you were
a senior in high school.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
I think, no, no, no, no, we weren't well.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Because then he would have yeah, might freshman.
Speaker 4 (01:40):
I can't remember if it took him four or five
years because he transferred from Pitt Titusville's right, yeah, it's right.
We were never on campus together. It just missed.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Okay, yeah, so about four or five years apart, but
that sounds right. Today today would have been Dale's birthday,
and we just wanted to start and tell him happy birthday,
and we messed. And he's still these still with us
every way here and we miss him every single step.
And to his wife Amy, to his three awesome kids.
Hopefully they're finding some comfort and smiling at some happy
(02:10):
memories today.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
Yeah, I hope so too. And the Lawleys also have
a GoFundMe page out there too that you mentioned. I
would urge people to go check out please. And you know,
Dale was obviously was the bread winner in that family,
so they could use a little help as well, But no,
I missing I missed my buddy. Oh, by the way,
it's also Bill Hillgroves birth.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Is also Bill Hillgroves. Happy birthday to the legend Bill
hill Grove.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
I think he's eighty five. Today we were contemplating his
eighty four.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
Eighty five, it's I think it's I think it's eighty five.
I think you are correct.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
I think Billy and Dale, believe it or not, had
a drink or two on November twentieth from time to time.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, maybe just a couple. I'm sure
there's guys. I'm sure those guys had fun out on
the road a few times. Yeah. All the best to
Billy Hillgrove. Just an absolute legend and the guy that
we've spent a lot of time working with in the past,
who's about as kind of a human being and as
fun as a human being as you can hope to
be around. And of course, happy heavenly birthday to our
(03:08):
guy Dale Lolly missing him every day. We were in
our group chat with TV. We were sending back and
forth some funny pictures from over the years. Yeah, yeah,
I'm like going back in my phone and I'm looking
at all the Latrobe pictures over the years, and all
the Indianapolis pictures over the years, and just the random
goofy road trip pictures and all those things. Some good
(03:28):
memories that will that we hang on too tightly on
days like today.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
One thousand percent. I think that goes without saying. He's
my man.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Yeah, absolutely, and and we miss him every single day,
And happy birthday to Dale and hopefully he's looking down
and smiling and enjoying the work that we've been doing
in his absence. Matt I mentioned some tea leaves on
this Steeler's injury report ahead of Sunday's clash with the
Chicago Bears, of course at Soldier Field, and the one
(03:57):
that everybody wants to know. Aaron Rodgers today Thursday day
limited in practice, did not practice on Wednesday. Mike Tomlin
says that would be the case, but he was out
there today, and again tea leaves, I'm thinking, if he's
out there today, he's probably gonna be out there again tomorrow,
and barring something unforeseen, that seems like a green light
(04:17):
for his status on Sunday.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah. I don't want to get people too excited or
I don't have any inside scoop, but just kind of
feel like the winds are pushing for him to play,
you know.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
I think that is a good way to say it. Again,
nothing guaranteed, right, We will revisit this conversation this time
tomorrow about twenty four hours from now.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
I'm sure he took plenty of snaps and handoffs and
I mean get hit today, but I'm sure he did
things that would hurt yeah, yea.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
Yes, And so obviously how he feels tomorrow will be
a big, big indicator. If he's out there again tomorrow,
would think that that's a great sign. But after getting
a day off Wednesday, first practice, he's missed all season,
by the way, credit to him in that.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
Regard, including like veteran days off.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Yes, right, he's no vet days off, none of that
stuff since the season began. Did get one, I think
rightfully earned yesterday. Was limited back at practice today, So
good to see and obviously something we will keep an
eye on tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
And I don't think this is like a pulling back
to the I mean, I don't think this is like
the big secret. But he had something on his hand,
some sort of cast, some sort of apparatus, you know.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Of course, I think people would be shocked if he did.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Sure. Sure, and if he plays, he'll have something on
his hand, you know.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Also back to the one hundred percent. Also back to
the practice field today in a limited capacity after not
practicing yesterday. Jalen Warren with the ankle injury.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
That's a good first step and good to see.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
You don't need full participation all all week from him
and just need him trending in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
We knew we wouldn't practice Wednesday. Why would he?
Speaker 3 (05:42):
I mean, yeah, exactly right. And Matt for everybody on YouTube,
same church, different pew. Alex high Smith, after not practicing yesterday,
was limited today as well.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
I didn't see that. Okay, great, he's training the right stay.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
So high Smith and Warren both.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
Quite possible, would say yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Aaron Rodgers day. All three get a Wednesday off. I
think much deserved. They all three in a limited capacity.
Albeit we're back at practice today.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
Veterans with real injuries, they're gonna get a veteran they're
gonna get a Wednesday off.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Yes, Isaac Sayamalu limited practice again today after being limited yesterday.
I would say that was hope. I think that's probably
one of those was part of the game plan.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
Yeah, he often gets a veteran's day too, so he
didn't even get the veterans.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Exactly right, exactly right. Let's see here, Darius Slay full
participant once again with that concussion. Call Hulcom full participant
once again, back from his illness. Let's see other than that,
Keishawn Williams. He was limited yesterday with the concussion. He
was back to a full participant today.
Speaker 4 (06:43):
But they get a chance to be pretty much full.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Go.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
It looks like about as you know, other than the
ir guys.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
Yeah, and some of that SEMs like a reasonable expectation.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Looks looks like all these guys trending in the right direction.
And some some positive news here on a on a
Thursday from practice, good good. Let's see real quick for
the Bears.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Tremaine Edmonds, I haven't seen any of their stuff.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
Tremaine Edmunds still has not practiced this week with with
a groin injury. TJ. Edwards still has not practiced this
week with he's listed hand and ham string.
Speaker 4 (07:20):
Starting off the ball lineback.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
Two starting off the ball linebackers. Neither one has practiced
yet this week. Let's see here Darnell Right, West Virginia's
finest continues to be limited with Tennessee.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
But that's fine.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Well, he grew up in West Virginia. Okay, let's not
talk about Dana Holgerson refusing to recruit him. He Matt
was listed as limited yesterday with a peck list is
limited today with a peck and a hip.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
So he was my key matchup when they had the ball.
It was him versus one. I'm a big fan of
Darnold right, We'll probably talk about him.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
More top ten pick a couple of years ago.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
He's really coming in his own in a big way.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
Really coming to his own in a big way. Imagine
being the head coach that didn't want to recruit that
guy out of your own backyard. Couldn't imagine that. Uh,
let's see here. Other than that, I mean couple like
Grady Jarrett got a rest day, Joe fun he got
a rest day, Kevin Bayerd got a rest day, Jakwan
Brisker was a full participant with a shoulder injury after
(08:18):
not practicing yesterday.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
That they Mentionedane Johnson at all.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Let's see here, because I.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
Don't know if they have to list him because he
just they opened his window Monday, so they don't have
to list him.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
He was a full today, have him listed as a full.
He was limited yesterday, full today.
Speaker 4 (08:36):
Okay, so he's a very very good corner. They could
be getting him back for this game.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
We shall see something to keep an eye on there.
Speaker 4 (08:44):
Absolutely, he's a big money guy and you know.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Yeah, and he was limited yesterday, full today, so maybe
he will be. Maybe that's something will keep an eye on.
With we have to Friday's practice reported. Well, yeah, plenty
of Matt stats to get to as we roll here
in the first hour. But we're gonna catch up with
our buddy Bob Labriola on the other side. All of
that and more as we roll along. But let's get Labs'
(09:07):
thoughts on else Greenwood and his Hall of Fame candidacy.
When we return, it's the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio
on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
You are tuned about Drive on your twenty four to
seven home of the Black and Gold Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Back on the Drive here on a Thursday, and you
know what time it is. It is time to go
to the phone lines and talk to the Dean of Doom,
the Lord of Living in his fears the great Steelers
historian Bob Labriola, Labs, thank you for taking the time.
As always, we do want to get your thoughts on
the Steelers' current status of their quarterbacks, the win against
(10:06):
the Bengals, the game in Chicago this weekend, all that stuff.
But first, you know, Matt and I yesterday spent a
segment talking about Elsie Greenwood, his candidacy for the Hall
of Fame, one of nine semi finalists for the senior
Class group here in twenty twenty six, and both Matt
and I yesterday, throughout the course of that conversation a
(10:27):
couple times were like, we need to talk to Labs
about We need to talk to Labs about this tomorrow.
So tell us about Elsie Greenwood, his candidacy for the
Hall of Fame, how deserving he is and how important
he was. You know, me and Joe Green and mel
Blunt and Lambert and Ham and all those guys deservedly
get their credit on the defensive side of the football
(10:47):
for those great Steelers seventy teams. But when we talk
to people who have the depth of knowledge like U Labs,
Elsie Greenwood's name always comes up. Quickly as well.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Yeah, I mean Elsie Greenwood was an extremely sick, significant
piece of that nineteen seventies dynasty. I mean, you know,
the Steel Curtain, that actual nickname that came to be
came to be associated with the entire defense. But the
(11:17):
original Steel Curtain was the defensive line. I mean, they
were like the fearsome forsome in the Rams, the Rams,
the Purple peoples of the sixties and seventies. I mean,
in that era when they bestowed nicknames, the nicknames went
to the front, the defensive front.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
Four.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Okay, So you know my thing about Elsie Greenwood is this,
first of all, I would argue that the Steel Curtain
was this significant defensive line, impactful defensive line of that
era as either one of those two let's just call
it even Okay, and I think I'm being jenru Okay,
(12:01):
the Steel Curtain is the only one that only has
one member of it in the whole thing. Explain that
to me. So that's and and there's no question that
all due respect, I mean, what Dwight White did uh
to get himself out of the hospital and play well
(12:22):
in Super Bowl nine before the Steelers were really anything.
I mean, they were not a champion yet they were
still trying to, you know, put those pieces to the
foundation together. And he got out of the hospital, uh
and played in that Super Bowl nine and that was heroic.
Ernie Holmes was Ernie Holmes was mean. He had a
(12:44):
demeanor that I remember Myron Coke saying the only person
that Ernie Holmes was ever afraid of was Joe Green.
And and then you know Dwight White was he He
actually when he retired, excuse me, he was the franchises
(13:07):
all time leader in sex. So I mean, you know,
it's not like this guy didn't have stats. He had.
I think he batted down three or four passes in
Super Bowl nine and he had three or four sacks
and Super Bowl ten. I mean, this guy was significant.
(13:28):
And as I said, he his career statistics were good
enough as a pass rusher because that's what he was
really was an undersized athletic kind of guy for that era.
Let me say that for that era, I mean, yes, Lee,
you know, well that was the you know that was
(13:49):
he was a Chuck Nole guy, Bill Nune guy. I mean,
that's else Green would ended up with the Steelers because
of Chuck Nole going to Bill None when they were
kind of just putting this altogether. After None was hired
and decided to go with the draft, Noel said to None,
I'm paraphrasing, you know what athletes are, Bring me athletes.
(14:11):
I'll tiece them how to play.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
Answered, I'm sorry you kind of answered a lot of it,
but I was going to ask you to kind of
compare the white white in Greenwood in terms of style
and my uncle, my dad. You know, people a little
older than me, they've they've watched every one of those
games at an older age than me would have. I mean,
I know it's kind of blasphemous, but told me Arrowhead
Holmes was at times every bit of player Joe Green was.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Yeah, especially after Joe Green sustain that pinch nerve in
seventy five, I think it was. Yeah. Ernie Holmes there
for a couple of years, and I've heard I've had
people tell me, you know, who worked with team, said
(15:01):
that he was the best defensive line but best defensive
tackle in the NFL, which made him better playing better
than Joe Green. Yes, but I mean Greenwood. Greenwood was
fortunate in that when he came to the Steelers Radakovich
was the defensive line coach. George Perlis who would get
(15:26):
the job later was this is, according to Bill Nunn,
was always in favor of bigger, stouter, two gap defensive linemen. Okay,
Radikovich was. He was a little out there for the
for the era, you know, and sometimes you need that.
He was willing to play with lighter, quicker, more athletic guys.
(15:48):
And so of those two defensive ends White and Greenwood,
Greenwood was they were both athletic for the position of
the era, but Greenwood was the more athletic of the two,
you know, in that in that front four. And Jack
Ham will say to this day that he doesn't get
(16:10):
into the Hall of Fame if Elsie Greenwood isn't playing
in front of him. Well, so, yeah, he he belongs.
I don't know if he's going to get elected. I mean,
you just never know. There's there's they only pick one, okay,
some of the other ones just you know, Ken Anderson.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
I wanted to ask you about Anderson because I think
he has a pretty strong case.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
He does. Yeah, and he was a big time thorn
in the side of those seventies Steelers teams. I mean,
he win many games against him, but I don't know.
I'm remembering one where he was twenty two of twenty
four passing or something some ridiculous and that was back
in the day when Glenn Edwards could closeline you on
(16:57):
the sidewalk and that was barely a penalty. So yeah,
Ken Anderson was a tough guy. He was. I think
he belongs to Roger Craig's another guy among the semi finalists,
So you know, it's a it's a tough Otis Taylor
for AFL people, So it's you know, I believe Elsie
(17:19):
Greenwood belongs. It's unfortunate in my opinion, that only one
of these guys gets to go in, and you know,
we'll see what happens. Fingers crossed labs one of.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
The things I can still hear, you know, touching Wolf
in the back of my head, lamenting that. You know
all that they used to say it about Donnie Shell.
He should be in until he finally deservedly got elected
a few years ago. El C Greenwood being another one
of these guys. And the only reason those guys aren't
in is because they've got Steelers fatigue in the Hall
of Fame. It's been so much black and gold, and
(17:53):
particularly off those defenses, Like do you think that's a
real thing that kind of works against else Greenwood that
everybody looks around and they go, there's five guys off
that defense, six guys off that defense in the Hall
of Fame already? Can they really have another?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
Yeah? Yes, I think that's real because you know, the
people who vote for this are you know, human beings,
and that Board of Selectors Hall of Fame Board of Selectors.
I mean, it's not like Major League Baseball, where there's
hundreds of baseball writers who you know, vote for the
Hall of Fame. I mean, and I don't even know.
(18:26):
It might be more baseball writers that vote for baseball,
but you know, in the NFL, it's it's a it's
a smaller group and they get just they just get
tired of hearing it. I mean, I you know, you
look at you know, start with you know, Hall of
Fames in eighty I think eighty nine to ninety ninety one,
(18:50):
those were all multiple Steeler Hall of Fames, you know,
I mean yes, and in those days it was it
Canton out on that back, poor or whatever, and the
Steelers fans would pack that whole area. They'd be hanging
off the you know, over the highway and stuff, and
that that has an impact. I mean it was cool
(19:11):
for you know, Steelers fans, people from Pittsburgh. I mean
it was a you know, a very prideful thing. But
I can imagine, you know, guys from other NFL cities
are like, yeah, we're tired of this. So yeah, I
think Steelers fatigue is real. Again, it's unfortunate, but it's
(19:31):
an election, and that's you know, any election is a
popularity contest and people vote for who they vote for
for different reasons. I mean there are there are all
kinds of elections where people vote for a candidate not
based on that he's the best guy or woman. They
like him or or or they don't. So uh, you know,
(19:55):
that's it's just the I don't know the reality the
whole thing. And as I said, I I believe he
deserves it. I if I had a vote, I would
vote for him. If anyone wants to who matters would
listen to me. I would talk to him. You know,
we'll see how it works out.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Well, hopefully it does all work out for him. Would
be deserving for Elsie Greenwood, for his family, posthumorously to
have him inducted into the Hall of Fame. Another great
member of those Steelers seventies teams. Labs, we know you've
got to run. Thank you so much for taking the
time for us here on Thursday. We won't talk to
you next Thursday because of Thanksgiving, but looking forward to
(20:35):
hearing you on the pregame show and chatting with you
on Sunday.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Okay, fellows, have a good week you as well.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
There he goes Bob Labriola, as always, not many guys
that can paint a better picture of the history of
the zation.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
I glad we went down that road with him.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
And I'm glad too, like I'm I'm the one thing
that I love about LABS is I mean, okay, anybody
who does what LABS does, you just naturally, I think,
have a touch of Homer in you. But he was
very fourth, like very fourth, right, very upfront, like, hey,
Ken Anderson, right.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
That's on my list to ask them about. I mean,
it's a division foe. And then Craig was the one.
You know, if we narrowed it down to three, it
was Anderson, Craig.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
And I hope those are the three that it ends
up getting narrowed down to which we'll find out another week.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
You know, I mean I totally get in the case
for it, and I.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
Did I I did love that from labs of of
kind of you know, not just saying no, it's gotta
be Elsie and anything else is a farce because we
know it is. The like, these are very very tough decisions.
You're talking about, like the one percent of the one
percenters here in terms of the NFL Hall of Fame
and splitting hairs.
Speaker 4 (21:44):
All those other candidates were great football players.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Obviously there are you know, in in their markets right now.
They're talking on the radio about how they desire they
you know in Kansas City, San Francisco. Yeah, absolutely, But
hopefully it'll be good news for LC. That reminder, it
gets cut down from nine to three here in early December,
so just in like the next two weeks and then
(22:08):
one of those three for the twenty twenty six NFL
Hall of Fame class. So good to see Elsie make
it this far and hopefully that will continue, and we'll
keep an eye on all of that rolling forward. Gonna
jump back into Matt Stat's packet when we return on
the other side. West Shuler, Matt Williamson, some stats bookend
(22:29):
in each each part of the first hour here on
the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network,
your tunes.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
About Drive on your twenty four to seven home of
the Black and Goal Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Back on the Drive here, and let's close down the
first hour by finally getting into some of these Matt stats. Matthews,
of course, a weekly exercise here on the Drive.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
Just pack it end up being a little beef here,
unusual little Chicago beef. Beef Beef, the Beef, The Beef
one of one of my one of my favorite shows.
Speaker 3 (23:29):
I think it's outstanding. I think you and I have
had this conversation. I think it might be the best
like show right now.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
I think.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
On television.
Speaker 4 (23:37):
I was have you seen him in the Springsteen thing? Yet?
Speaker 3 (23:40):
Not yet?
Speaker 4 (23:40):
I was thinking the wife and I might go this weekend. Yeah,
I I assumed you would have been there by now.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
I think I've only been to one movie post Code
in the feed Oppenheimer, because I was like, I gotta
see I gotta see this. Yeah, remember when that a
bombs going off? I want to feel it in my chair.
Speaker 4 (23:58):
I'm not a big movie goo.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
It was for my teenage years and in my twenties
I was a huge moviegoer. But I you know, the
last five six.
Speaker 4 (24:07):
Years I got young kids.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
I can wait, Yeah, I would.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
I mean, you know, it's not that long to wait,
especially now. Yeah, but I'm doing to show it pur
suit at night. I'm gonna ask him if it's I'm
sure he's gone.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
I Rob King has seen it. Who else on the
plane was I talk to? Maybe Richie Walsh, Katyk Richie Walsh.
I think he might have been the other one. So yeah,
I would like to see it, certainly. I'm not a
not a huge movie guy. There's that new Leo movie
that I want to uh that I want to watch
as well.
Speaker 4 (24:37):
All that stuff I can wait nine at ten times.
I mean, I can always wait.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
One battle after another. That new Leo movie looks awesome.
But yeah, I just I'm patient. Now I don't need
to like I used to. Man, there was a movie
theater by where I grew up five dollars movie Mondays
like me and my buddies. Me and my buddies were
there every every Monday. But yes, it is Stat's packets time,
Ye's taking How did we get to the You asked
(25:02):
me about the Springsteen movie something something. Yeah, that's what
I'm trying to do in Chicago this weekend.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
That, oh you might as well, Matt.
Speaker 3 (25:12):
Let's jump into it here, Steelers Bears. It's a beefy
stats packet. That's how we round about way of uh
of getting there. And this one is very interesting to me.
Pittsburgh's two point three yards after contact per rush attempt
is seventh highest in the NFL. Yeah, but just one
point four yards before contact per per rush attempt is
(25:35):
sixth lowest.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
So then implies the blockings bad and the runners are good.
And maybe that's the short end of it. But I
also watching especially the last five games, I don't think
the run blocking is bad though, you know what I mean.
Warren is one of the best after the after the
after contact runners in the league. Frankly, you know I
(25:59):
mean that that pbably shouldn't shock people. Now. What hurts
his stats a little is he won't bounce off a
tackler and take it sixty through inflate one. But he
consistently gets yardage after contact consistently. Sure, So I think
that's not misleading because when we have a pretty big
body of work, but I think it leans a little
(26:20):
the bad parts. I think lean more towards the beginning
of the season. Just running in the back of your lineman,
not having holes, that kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
I think there is a a kind of clear point
there where it started to get better for the Steers. Yeah, yeah, run.
It might have started in Dublin with Kenneth Gainwell and
that nine goal, that ninety nine yard rushing performance, and
then out of the bye week you really build on
that and that blowout win at home against the Browns.
What game was it recently? Was it Packers Colts? But
(26:48):
one of the recent games I remember it was one
of our Tuesday rewind things that we discussed was I
think Jayalen Woren had like sixty some yards rushing. It
wasn't putrid, but right right, it was in massive. It
wasn't the varsity number that we were looking for either.
And I remember telling you, like, you go back and
you watch and it's it's bizarre because it's not like
(27:08):
the offensive line is getting pushed back. They're playing much better,
but there's still too much contact. Is Matt is part
of it? Maybe the Steelers not stretching the field as much.
Things are closer to the line of scrimmage. So even
if the linemen army safeties are key and downhill, linebackers
are keying downhill some.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
Hill somewhat, but there's always extra attention to metcalf side.
The Steelers do face a lot of too high safeties,
so it's not like it's this massive, loaded box that
just is unblockable either. Frankly, I think they need to
run about more, and starting with this week, but I've
said that for a couple of weeks in a row.
I'd like see more volume.
Speaker 3 (27:48):
I would too, And it's again, this is another one
of those where the numbers don't necessarily match the eye test.
You know this. I do the halftime reports on the
Steelers broadcasts, so things are a little crazy in the
front half. I'm doing my engineering.
Speaker 4 (28:01):
Job, yeah, trying to watch a game, trying to.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Watch the game and take notes on my laptop as
the game goes along, because you know you and I
got to do a show twenty four hours twenty four
hours later. So when I sit down at halftime to
do the show, I've got like two minutes of you know,
Tom in my ear, like two minutes here ninety seconds here,
and I'm always quickly trying to just double check the scoring, like, Okay,
(28:23):
that was a forty seven yarder from Boswell, right, and
it was a that was the second drive of the
game when Aaron Rodgers found dk Metcalfe a touchdown.
Speaker 4 (28:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
And it's the first time that I look at the
stats really as well too.
Speaker 4 (28:34):
It really dig in, right, And it seems like I
have the box scorer up while I'm watching at home,
and you know.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
It seems like the last couple of weeks I've immediately thought, man,
we're not run the ball enough. They're not giving Jayalen
Warn enough carries. But then I look at this, I
look at this the box score, and it's like, oh,
he's got eight carries in the first half. That's I'd
like it to be ten.
Speaker 4 (28:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yeah, yeah, that's not terrible.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
It's not hideous, right, But.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
It doesn't necessarily always it doesn't always seem like that,
And I think it's part of that, maybe because it.
Speaker 4 (29:01):
Doesn't seem like they're just building off it and one
after another.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
It hasn't been an early dry I think it's been
more so laid into the first quarter into the second quarter,
as opposed to bang. Here's a heavy dose of thirty
right out of the gate, right on the opening drive.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
Yeah, I feel that way too. I don't have the numbers.
Speaker 3 (29:21):
Yeah, total vibes, right.
Speaker 4 (29:24):
I think that's accurate. I do you.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Want the good news? Sure, the Chicago Bears allowed two
point sixty five yards per contact per rush. Yeah, the
worst in the national force.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Right, that was that before contact or after? For that?
Before contacts? I would say they're They're not super stout upfront.
I mean, they have some athletes. They have some guys
with good length. They have some decent pass rushers dexter
I like sweat, et cetera. Their linebackers hit well, both
of whom are on the injury report, but they're not
big power stout banging it the line of scrimmage guy,
(30:00):
which is a huge reason why I think this week,
but I've said this for a couple of weeks, I'd
really like to see a more dedication to the run game, because,
much like the Chargers, the run defense is problematic for them.
I mean the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
Everything's yes, yes it is, and the Bears are not
much better.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
They're better, no, right, They're closer to the Bengals than
the Chargers.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Honestly, though, the thing that saves the Bengals from or
the part of me, the thing that saves the Bears
from having the Bengals type reputation is their defense takes
the ball away at a crazy high level.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
Massive.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
They surrender yards, they surrender points, just like Cincinnati, but
they take the ball away. They've got the most ridiculous
in the league, right.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
And a lot. Yeah they are, and I mean them
and the Steelers are the best two.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
Yes, really wanted to.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
Part of me thinks this game. I don't have a
great vibe for this game in terms of predictions yet,
and part of me just thinks it's as simple as
who's better in turnover ratio. But that's kind of an
arbitrary thing, especially with two teams that are so good
at it. It's different if it's like Steelers are top
league team, ex at the bottom of league, you got
a better chance to win that, you know, that important category.
(31:08):
But I will say I think the Steelers offense and
the numbers don't one hundred percent reflect it value the
football better than Chicago's offense. Williams is a pretty big
risk taker, you know, I mean their ball carriers. I
wouldn't trust them as much as the Steelers to secure
the ball as much. Obviously, that's a Tomlin thing forever.
You know, ball security, and they stress it here a ton,
(31:30):
not that the Bears don't. And I also the numbers
also don't reflect this. I mean, the Bears have to
have more takeaways than the Steelers and more takeaways than everybody,
and it's really impressive. But I also think the takeaways
the If you ask me what's the first component to
being a good takeaway defense, the first might be luck,
(31:54):
But that is side pass rush. Yeah, that's where I
was going to start with. Yeah, I went pass rushers
to force the quarterback to get it out of his hands,
maybe make a decision faster than he wants to, certainly
get hit while he throws. How many strip sacks have
we seen from Watt and her Big over the years?
And no question in my mind, the Steelers pass rushers
(32:16):
are better than the Bears pass rushers.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
You know, I don't think many people would argue that.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
I mean, that's pretty cut and dry.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
I tell you what, though, when you just look at
it on paper, it's impressive. Steelers have eight takeaways this season.
That's fourth in the league. Yeah, Tampa Bay has nine,
just one ahead of them for third. Rams have ten,
just two ahead of them for second. Bears have sixteen.
I know they got double. The Steelers are in fourth,
the Bears are in first. They have double the amount
of the Steelers takeaways.
Speaker 4 (32:43):
Right and they have ten games four or five guys
four interceptions.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
That's impressive.
Speaker 4 (32:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:50):
And again, as you mentioned, pass rush being a big
part of it, Steelers are third in the league in sacks,
so fourth. One of the things you and I talked
about preseason. By the way, we want the Steelers to
be top three in sacks, top three and turnovers third
and sacks third and sacks right now, fourth and turnovers.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
Yeah, yah, you're in the neighborhood. It's great, right there.
Their second and quarterback hits second.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
QB hits the Bears. However, Matt, their passwords is okay,
it's it's okay, but it is.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
I know it's a mediocre.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
I'm gonna have to do about the math here, but
it's about twentieth in the league.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
Yeah, yeah, six seven, eight, stuff in the middle.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
I don't exactly twentieth. Okay, there we go.
Speaker 4 (33:30):
It's so I don't put stuff in the middle. That's
stat package, you know, like what's the difference between twenty
and I think.
Speaker 3 (33:35):
That makes it even more impressive, the way they're taking
away the ball when you consider they're not doing it
with an elite pass.
Speaker 4 (33:40):
Rush and they've I'm sure they stressed it as much
as anyone. But I'm not going to say that they're
fluky or lucky and the Steelers are good. They're both really, really,
really really good at That's not what I mean, but
it's not theirs is a little bit harder to put
your finger on as to how they've been so good
at it. I guess is the way it put.
Speaker 3 (33:56):
I think that's a great way to state it.
Speaker 4 (33:58):
Now, this is not disrespecting the opponent, but they've also
played bad teams. And then I mean, they're they're on
a great winning streak in the first place they are,
but their resume of wins doesn't blow you away.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
So this is one of those football dork things. If
you'll just indulge me, if you'll oblige me for a
second here, Matt Williamson, because I did a segment today
on the Steelers Standard with Jacob and ed here on
the Steelers Audio Network, and that was something that Jacob
brought up as well too. Look at how bad their
schedule's been. You know they they lost to the Ravens
(34:31):
even without by two touchdowns, without Lamar being back in
the fold yet, and I agree with that. You look
at their schedule. It's not Murderer's roll. No, no, no,
I mean it's been on.
Speaker 4 (34:40):
It's just like they beat the Eagles, Seahawks and Rams.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
You know it's been. It's been a lot of teams
with losing records. I also though, hesitate and they squeak
them out too.
Speaker 4 (34:49):
I mean they're tight wins.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
No doubt. And they've got they finished last place in
the division last year. They've got the last play schedule,
and that's a real look matters. Look how tough the
chief schedule is. Look how tough the Texans schedule.
Speaker 4 (34:58):
Is the reason the Patriots and going to shape his another.
Speaker 3 (35:02):
Great example, another great example. I also though, hesitate to
put a ton of stock into that because it's the
National Football League. Oh yeah, like it's it's not Ohio
State versus Akron.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
No, you know, it wasn't like they were fifteen point
dogs and Earth favorites in all these games. Either.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
Yes, I so I do agree that their schedule has
been easier, but I also don't think that that's just
they're fake, their fugazi. Their offense isn't really that good.
They just haven't played anybody.
Speaker 4 (35:28):
I'm not there either, Yeah, I mean there there's a
lot of positive vibes around the organization, the offense, the
coaching staff, quarterback. I think I said this yesterday. It's
probably the best time in Bears history since Dick to
be a Bears fan. I mean in terms of optimism,
and you know with.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
That long term. Rex Grossman took him to a super Bowl.
Jake Cutler took him to an moment here and there,
but those were moments.
Speaker 4 (35:50):
They were moments.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Now it's like, if we've got Caleb and Ben Johnson
for the next twelve years.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
We might be the best team in this really good division.
Yeah oh yeah, right right.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
Just a real quick mat before we get back to
the stats. This just jumped off the screen at me
talking about sacks and takeaways and all those things. So
Steelers third in the NFL and Sackson thirty three. Yeah,
Falcon second with four. They used to be for them,
is like, oh, it's the best they've been in our lifetime. Yeah, really,
I mean then they've ever been.
Speaker 4 (36:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:19):
So Steelers at thirty three, Falcons at thirty four, third
in second place there respectively, the Broncos in first place.
Speaker 4 (36:26):
Forty nine forty nine.
Speaker 3 (36:28):
They're fifteen ahead of the second place team.
Speaker 4 (36:32):
Now, Atlanta has an entire.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Miles guarant season work sex to.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
This point, So cumulative stats I always want to look
then you have your buy or not. But we're pretty
far into it. I mean, if it's nine games verse ten,
that's different than five verse four, you know what I.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
Mean, that's why. But there, I know they haven't had
their buy yet, but that's why.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
Still insane and Atlanta. I think Atlanta's buy is coming
up this week. But still teen more sacks and they
led the league last year, yes, and their number one
quarterback hits you know, and Steelers are second. But I
think they have like twelve more than the Steelers. I mean,
so yeah, it's an elite pass rush in Denver.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
It's crazy. It really.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
The hope of leading the league in sacks is probably
going to be let's go for second.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
I'm good with that. And oddly enough, Denver is in
the back half of of their their turnover differential because
they're turning it over the turn I think. And yeah,
so actually here, part of me, what I was reading
off with the takeaway numbers was just the differential. Yeah, yeah,
part of me there Bears have twenty two, not sixteen.
(37:36):
Steelers have eighteen. So it's not that big. It's not.
But that was the way I apologize Earlier I was
looking at the differential.
Speaker 4 (37:42):
But still now the Bears differentials by far the best, by.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Far the best, but still twenty two takeaways. The Steelers
tied for second with eighteen even four more like that's
it's still a lot substantial number. Yeah, substantial number. Yeah,
the Bears, I mean, the.
Speaker 4 (37:56):
Two best teams in terms of turnovers across the board,
but especially takeaways.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
The Bears have also only, in ten games coughed up
the ball six times, second best in the NFL behind
on the Eagle. Only the Eagles have done it less.
Speaker 4 (38:09):
But the second your quarterback. Pretty impressive and a brand
new head coach.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Offense, right, a lot.
Speaker 4 (38:15):
Of those guys weren't even there last year, so pretty
impressive stuff.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Uh, Matt, let's get into another stat or two here
before we break for the first hour for the halftime
gun here, and then get back into it on the
other side. This kind of plays into some of the
run game conversation. Aaron Rodgers has thrown almost thirty one
percent of his passes thirty point eight percent of his
passes at or behind the line of scribbage. That's the
(38:40):
second highest rate in the league, A league low.
Speaker 4 (38:45):
Gabriels Won, by the way.
Speaker 3 (38:47):
Not the company that you're looking right right, A league low.
Forty five percent of Aaron Rodgers passes have been five
or more yards down field league average fifty five point
one percent, so about ten percent less than the league. Noticeably,
he's attempted twenty four percent of his pass is ten
plus yards downfield, lowest rate in the NFL league average
(39:08):
is thirty three percent.
Speaker 4 (39:09):
That's the one that bothers me most. I don't mind
the quick throws at at the line of scrimmage. You
know RPOs or you oh, your corner's playing off that
that I'm gonna steal six yards off your right off
you gotta tackle Metcalf or Warren or whoever. But I
think so, I would say week three or four would
(39:32):
be doing Matt's stats, and it would be, well, Rogers
has the lowest average depth of target in the league,
and I would correct people and I'd be like, it's
not last, it's the fewest. I mean, like people like, oh,
they're last in the league in eight.
Speaker 3 (39:46):
Autumn a takeaway statistic.
Speaker 4 (39:49):
No, No, it's not like points scored, you know, like,
whoever's the yards rushed, right, Yeah, whoever's thrown at the
deepest doesn't mean they're the best quarterback.
Speaker 3 (39:57):
In the league exactly right. They're having Gary success, right.
Speaker 4 (40:01):
Like, it's not like it's Mahomes and Allen are one
and two and then there's no Bill.
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Gabors perfect way. There's no one way to skin that cat.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
One thousand percent. So there's a lot of different approaches,
but I think we are getting to the point where
if you want to be a playoff team that makes noise,
you got to be more intermediate driven. And yeah, I
think more is needed from the passing game away from
the line of scrimmage. And the stat I uncovered this
(40:28):
week that I had not put in there before was
there's a stat now that they're they've been charting, which
I think is really meaningful is yards to the sticks.
So if it's first and ten and you throw a
six yard pass, you're minus four, gotcha. If it's first
and ten you throw a fourteen yard pass, your plus four.
So it's not like everybody's mind.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
Start and four and you pick up seven yards plus three.
Speaker 4 (40:50):
Plus three air yards. Doesn't matter where the ball, just
where the target is. Like Alex Smith was always known
for always throwing short of the sticks. Sure, well, it
doesn't matter down in distance, but the Steelers as a team,
obviously ninety eight percent of it. Rogers is the one
pull in the trigger, but he's not the only one
to blame. Are the shortest of the sticks. They're like
(41:12):
three point eight yards or something on average. Throw before
the sticks. That could be first down, that could be
second and twenty. I mean, it's not all third down stuff.
But I think that needs to change, you know, like
i'd that one isn't directly whoever is the highest is
the best either. But I don't think you want to
(41:34):
be the lowest there either, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (41:35):
You're looking for a middle ground, Yeah, yeah, yeah, of
not being one dimensional, not being predictable, being able to
get it anyway you want it.
Speaker 4 (41:45):
Yeah, right, right, right.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
When it's like you said, when it's first and ten
and you could pick up an easy six yards, take
it great.
Speaker 4 (41:50):
But when it's that's stealing. Great, When it's.
Speaker 3 (41:52):
Second and four and you could pick up fifteen yards.
Speaker 4 (41:54):
Do it, yeah exactly. Or hey, it's third and two
and you complete a three yard pass. Great. I mean,
I don't mind are passing if it gets the job done.
But the world's catching on too. Yes, they are a
little more aggression I think is needed.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
Especially at this point in the season. All the film
is out there, all the studies have been done, all
the stats packets compiled. Speaking of which, before we go
to break, I meant to mention this one with our
turnovers and sacks and takeaways conversation, Steelers average five point
one sacks plus takeaways per game. Really really good, really good,
second second best in the NFL.
Speaker 4 (42:28):
That's just a defensive stat, folks, that's not what you allow.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
Yes, Chicago is allowing league low two point two sacks
plus giveaways per game. Another one of those absolutely game
within the game things to keep an eye on, and a.
Speaker 4 (42:45):
Lot of that's Williams used to be the most sacked
guy going.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
He is.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
Remember you'd say that TV is doing.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
He's got tremendously better at tremendously better and as you mentioned,
they don't turn the ball much over on offense either,
so that's part of it right real quick. On Williams,
I was listening to a friend of mine, Ross Tucker.
Him and I used to host podcasts together. Now he's
a great podcast. He has Greg co sell on, who
I've often referenced, and they were breaking down Williams today
(43:18):
on their Thursday podcast and Greg's like, he reminds me
of like second year Ben. I'm like, whoa, I mean,
because they don't really look the same. He's not six',
five he doesn't look like an oak tree in. There
but he's just like he is so much stronger than
people give him credit. For And rob AND i were
talking about this today down the facility is, like does
(43:39):
anyone ever get this guy in the ground? Anymore i'm, like,
no that's the. Thing and he's so, Fast he's he's. Twitchy,
yeah he's accelerates. Quick his top speed is really, fast
like he used to take so many. SACKS i think
because he's so. Talented he's, Like i'm better at everybody out.
Here nobody's, geting and now he's, like WELL i, am
(44:02):
Maybe i'm still better than some of these. DUDES i
was first picking the, draft BUT i know my. Limitations
but he's really really hard to get on the, ground
like maybe the best in the league in terms of
avoiding hardest to get on the ground behind the line of.
Speaker 3 (44:13):
Scrimmage you AND i always talk About lar of like
when it really took off For Josh allen and For
lamar and all these. Guys it's not just when the
highlight tape wows. You it's when the low light tape
starts to be a very short clip, Massive and For
Caleb williams this, year that low light tape has gone
from a half an hour YouTube video to about a sixty, second,
(44:37):
quick little, short.
Speaker 4 (44:38):
Probably more so than any quarterback in the league in
terms of reducing the low light. Tape it's a good.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
Call, yeah that's why he went out and Hired Ben,
johnson right.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
Right, Right and he's growing. Up you know you're in the.
League goes a long, way.
Speaker 3 (44:48):
As our Friend. Dale guys are allowed to get.
Speaker 4 (44:51):
Better guys are allowed to get. Better Kayleb williams is getting.
Speaker 3 (44:53):
Better he certainly. Is will continue to talk about more
of that as we peruse Through matt's stats to begin
our number. Two two will keep this conversation role In Williamson.
Yueler it's The drive On Steelers Nation radio on The
Steelers Audio network
Your tunes about Drive on your twenty four to seven
home of the Black and Goal Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Goo.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
Good afternoon, Stealer Nation. It's the Drive on the Steelers
Audio Network here on a Thursday, West Shuoler and Matt
Williamson with you for the next two hours, with plenty
to get into. We've got the Steelers' latest practice report
and there is I think some Aaron Rodgers tea leaves
in there.
Speaker 4 (00:45):
Matt, I think.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
So we're gonna talk to our buddy Bob Labriola in
about fifteen twenty minutes get all his thoughts on els Green.
Speaker 4 (00:51):
Yeah, I want to poke his brain about Elsie from
the Hall of Fame.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Of course, it's a big Matt stats day here on
Thursday as well, but I think it would only be
appropriate where we have to begin today, Matt. Of course,
today is November twentieth, and it is the birthday of
our late brother Dale Lolly, Yeah, who we lost just
a few months ago. I do believe, all right, correct
me if I'm wrong, give me a little grace here,
but I do believe Dale would have been fifty seven today.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
I think so. I could probably take up the year
here in a minute but I'm fifty two, semi soon
to be fifty three, and we did not overlap at
Pitt Johnstown together because well, he left the year I
after I came.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
He was like a senior in college when you were
a senior in high school.
Speaker 4 (01:34):
I think, no, no, no, no, we weren't well.
Speaker 3 (01:37):
Because then he would have yeah, might freshman.
Speaker 4 (01:40):
I can't remember if it took him four or five
years because he transferred from Pitt Titusville's right, yeah, it's right.
We were never on campus together. It just missed.
Speaker 3 (01:47):
Okay, yeah, so about four or five years apart, but
that sounds right. Today today would have been Dale's birthday,
and we just wanted to start and tell him happy birthday,
and we messed. And he's still these still with us
every way here and we miss him every single step.
And to his wife Amy, to his three awesome kids.
Hopefully they're finding some comfort and smiling at some happy
(02:10):
memories today.
Speaker 4 (02:11):
Yeah, I hope so too. And the Lawleys also have
a GoFundMe page out there too that you mentioned. I
would urge people to go check out please. And you know,
Dale was obviously was the bread winner in that family,
so they could use a little help as well, But no,
I missing I missed my buddy. Oh, by the way,
it's also Bill Hillgroves birth.
Speaker 3 (02:32):
Is also Bill Hillgroves. Happy birthday to the legend Bill
hill Grove.
Speaker 4 (02:35):
I think he's eighty five. Today we were contemplating his
eighty four.
Speaker 3 (02:38):
Eighty five, it's I think it's I think it's eighty five.
I think you are correct.
Speaker 4 (02:41):
I think Billy and Dale, believe it or not, had
a drink or two on November twentieth from time to time.
Speaker 3 (02:47):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, maybe just a couple. I'm sure
there's guys. I'm sure those guys had fun out on
the road a few times. Yeah. All the best to
Billy Hillgrove. Just an absolute legend and the guy that
we've spent a lot of time working with in the past,
who's about as kind of a human being and as
fun as a human being as you can hope to
be around. And of course, happy heavenly birthday to our
(03:08):
guy Dale Lolly missing him every day. We were in
our group chat with TV. We were sending back and
forth some funny pictures from over the years. Yeah, yeah,
I'm like going back in my phone and I'm looking
at all the Latrobe pictures over the years, and all
the Indianapolis pictures over the years, and just the random
goofy road trip pictures and all those things. Some good
(03:28):
memories that will that we hang on too tightly on
days like today.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
One thousand percent. I think that goes without saying. He's
my man.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Yeah, absolutely, and and we miss him every single day,
And happy birthday to Dale and hopefully he's looking down
and smiling and enjoying the work that we've been doing
in his absence. Matt I mentioned some tea leaves on
this Steeler's injury report ahead of Sunday's clash with the
Chicago Bears, of course at Soldier Field, and the one
(03:57):
that everybody wants to know. Aaron Rodgers today Thursday day
limited in practice, did not practice on Wednesday. Mike Tomlin
says that would be the case, but he was out
there today, and again tea leaves, I'm thinking, if he's
out there today, he's probably gonna be out there again tomorrow,
and barring something unforeseen, that seems like a green light
(04:17):
for his status on Sunday.
Speaker 4 (04:19):
Yeah. I don't want to get people too excited or
I don't have any inside scoop, but just kind of
feel like the winds are pushing for him to play,
you know.
Speaker 3 (04:27):
I think that is a good way to say it. Again,
nothing guaranteed, right, We will revisit this conversation this time
tomorrow about twenty four hours from now.
Speaker 4 (04:36):
I'm sure he took plenty of snaps and handoffs and
I mean get hit today, but I'm sure he did
things that would hurt yeah, yea.
Speaker 3 (04:43):
Yes, And so obviously how he feels tomorrow will be
a big, big indicator. If he's out there again tomorrow,
would think that that's a great sign. But after getting
a day off Wednesday, first practice, he's missed all season,
by the way, credit to him in that.
Speaker 4 (04:55):
Regard, including like veteran days off.
Speaker 3 (04:58):
Yes, right, he's no vet days off, none of that
stuff since the season began. Did get one, I think
rightfully earned yesterday. Was limited back at practice today, So
good to see and obviously something we will keep an
eye on tomorrow.
Speaker 4 (05:11):
And I don't think this is like a pulling back
to the I mean, I don't think this is like
the big secret. But he had something on his hand,
some sort of cast, some sort of apparatus, you know.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Of course, I think people would be shocked if he did.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Sure. Sure, and if he plays, he'll have something on
his hand, you know.
Speaker 3 (05:24):
Also back to the one hundred percent. Also back to
the practice field today in a limited capacity after not
practicing yesterday. Jalen Warren with the ankle injury.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
That's a good first step and good to see.
Speaker 3 (05:36):
You don't need full participation all all week from him
and just need him trending in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (05:40):
We knew we wouldn't practice Wednesday. Why would he?
Speaker 3 (05:42):
I mean, yeah, exactly right. And Matt for everybody on YouTube,
same church, different pew. Alex high Smith, after not practicing yesterday,
was limited today as well.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
I didn't see that. Okay, great, he's training the right stay.
Speaker 3 (05:54):
So high Smith and Warren both.
Speaker 4 (05:57):
Quite possible, would say yeah, and.
Speaker 3 (05:58):
Aaron Rodgers day. All three get a Wednesday off. I
think much deserved. They all three in a limited capacity.
Albeit we're back at practice today.
Speaker 4 (06:06):
Veterans with real injuries, they're gonna get a veteran they're
gonna get a Wednesday off.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
Yes, Isaac Sayamalu limited practice again today after being limited yesterday.
I would say that was hope. I think that's probably
one of those was part of the game plan.
Speaker 4 (06:19):
Yeah, he often gets a veteran's day too, so he
didn't even get the veterans.
Speaker 3 (06:23):
Exactly right, exactly right. Let's see here, Darius Slay full
participant once again with that concussion. Call Hulcom full participant
once again, back from his illness. Let's see other than that,
Keishawn Williams. He was limited yesterday with the concussion. He
was back to a full participant today.
Speaker 4 (06:43):
But they get a chance to be pretty much full.
Speaker 2 (06:45):
Go.
Speaker 3 (06:45):
It looks like about as you know, other than the
ir guys.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
Yeah, and some of that SEMs like a reasonable expectation.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
Looks looks like all these guys trending in the right direction.
And some some positive news here on a on a
Thursday from practice, good good. Let's see real quick for
the Bears.
Speaker 4 (07:06):
Tremaine Edmonds, I haven't seen any of their stuff.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
Tremaine Edmunds still has not practiced this week with with
a groin injury. TJ. Edwards still has not practiced this
week with he's listed hand and ham string.
Speaker 4 (07:20):
Starting off the ball lineback.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
Two starting off the ball linebackers. Neither one has practiced
yet this week. Let's see here Darnell Right, West Virginia's
finest continues to be limited with Tennessee.
Speaker 4 (07:32):
But that's fine.
Speaker 3 (07:33):
Well, he grew up in West Virginia. Okay, let's not
talk about Dana Holgerson refusing to recruit him. He Matt
was listed as limited yesterday with a peck list is
limited today with a peck and a hip.
Speaker 4 (07:46):
So he was my key matchup when they had the ball.
It was him versus one. I'm a big fan of
Darnold right, We'll probably talk about him.
Speaker 3 (07:53):
More top ten pick a couple of years ago.
Speaker 4 (07:55):
He's really coming in his own in a big way.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
Really coming to his own in a big way. Imagine
being the head coach that didn't want to recruit that
guy out of your own backyard. Couldn't imagine that. Uh,
let's see here. Other than that, I mean couple like
Grady Jarrett got a rest day, Joe fun he got
a rest day, Kevin Bayerd got a rest day, Jakwan
Brisker was a full participant with a shoulder injury after
(08:18):
not practicing yesterday.
Speaker 4 (08:21):
That they Mentionedane Johnson at all.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Let's see here, because I.
Speaker 4 (08:27):
Don't know if they have to list him because he
just they opened his window Monday, so they don't have
to list him.
Speaker 3 (08:32):
He was a full today, have him listed as a full.
He was limited yesterday, full today.
Speaker 4 (08:36):
Okay, so he's a very very good corner. They could
be getting him back for this game.
Speaker 3 (08:41):
We shall see something to keep an eye on there.
Speaker 4 (08:44):
Absolutely, he's a big money guy and you know.
Speaker 3 (08:47):
Yeah, and he was limited yesterday, full today, so maybe
he will be. Maybe that's something will keep an eye on.
With we have to Friday's practice reported. Well, yeah, plenty
of Matt stats to get to as we roll here
in the first hour. But we're gonna catch up with
our buddy Bob Labriola on the other side. All of
that and more as we roll along. But let's get Labs'
(09:07):
thoughts on else Greenwood and his Hall of Fame candidacy.
When we return, it's the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio
on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (09:22):
You are tuned about Drive on your twenty four to
seven home of the Black and Gold Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 3 (09:44):
Back on the Drive here on a Thursday, and you
know what time it is. It is time to go
to the phone lines and talk to the Dean of Doom,
the Lord of Living in his fears the great Steelers
historian Bob Labriola, Labs, thank you for taking the time.
As always, we do want to get your thoughts on
the Steelers' current status of their quarterbacks, the win against
(10:06):
the Bengals, the game in Chicago this weekend, all that stuff.
But first, you know, Matt and I yesterday spent a
segment talking about Elsie Greenwood, his candidacy for the Hall
of Fame, one of nine semi finalists for the senior
Class group here in twenty twenty six, and both Matt
and I yesterday, throughout the course of that conversation a
(10:27):
couple times were like, we need to talk to Labs
about We need to talk to Labs about this tomorrow.
So tell us about Elsie Greenwood, his candidacy for the
Hall of Fame, how deserving he is and how important
he was. You know, me and Joe Green and mel
Blunt and Lambert and Ham and all those guys deservedly
get their credit on the defensive side of the football
(10:47):
for those great Steelers seventy teams. But when we talk
to people who have the depth of knowledge like U Labs,
Elsie Greenwood's name always comes up. Quickly as well.
Speaker 2 (10:57):
Yeah, I mean Elsie Greenwood was an extremely sick, significant
piece of that nineteen seventies dynasty. I mean, you know,
the Steel Curtain, that actual nickname that came to be
came to be associated with the entire defense. But the
(11:17):
original Steel Curtain was the defensive line. I mean, they
were like the fearsome forsome in the Rams, the Rams,
the Purple peoples of the sixties and seventies. I mean,
in that era when they bestowed nicknames, the nicknames went
to the front, the defensive front.
Speaker 3 (11:37):
Four.
Speaker 2 (11:37):
Okay, So you know my thing about Elsie Greenwood is this,
first of all, I would argue that the Steel Curtain
was this significant defensive line, impactful defensive line of that
era as either one of those two let's just call
it even Okay, and I think I'm being jenru Okay,
(12:01):
the Steel Curtain is the only one that only has
one member of it in the whole thing. Explain that
to me. So that's and and there's no question that
all due respect, I mean, what Dwight White did uh
to get himself out of the hospital and play well
(12:22):
in Super Bowl nine before the Steelers were really anything.
I mean, they were not a champion yet they were
still trying to, you know, put those pieces to the
foundation together. And he got out of the hospital, uh
and played in that Super Bowl nine and that was heroic.
Ernie Holmes was Ernie Holmes was mean. He had a
(12:44):
demeanor that I remember Myron Coke saying the only person
that Ernie Holmes was ever afraid of was Joe Green.
And and then you know Dwight White was he He
actually when he retired, excuse me, he was the franchises
(13:07):
all time leader in sex. So I mean, you know,
it's not like this guy didn't have stats. He had.
I think he batted down three or four passes in
Super Bowl nine and he had three or four sacks
and Super Bowl ten. I mean, this guy was significant.
(13:28):
And as I said, he his career statistics were good
enough as a pass rusher because that's what he was
really was an undersized athletic kind of guy for that era.
Let me say that for that era, I mean, yes, Lee,
you know, well that was the you know that was
(13:49):
he was a Chuck Nole guy, Bill Nune guy. I mean,
that's else Green would ended up with the Steelers because
of Chuck Nole going to Bill None when they were
kind of just putting this altogether. After None was hired
and decided to go with the draft, Noel said to None,
I'm paraphrasing, you know what athletes are, Bring me athletes.
(14:11):
I'll tiece them how to play.
Speaker 4 (14:14):
Answered, I'm sorry you kind of answered a lot of it,
but I was going to ask you to kind of
compare the white white in Greenwood in terms of style
and my uncle, my dad. You know, people a little
older than me, they've they've watched every one of those
games at an older age than me would have. I mean,
I know it's kind of blasphemous, but told me Arrowhead
Holmes was at times every bit of player Joe Green was.
Speaker 2 (14:39):
Yeah, especially after Joe Green sustain that pinch nerve in
seventy five, I think it was. Yeah. Ernie Holmes there
for a couple of years, and I've heard I've had
people tell me, you know, who worked with team, said
(15:01):
that he was the best defensive line but best defensive
tackle in the NFL, which made him better playing better
than Joe Green. Yes, but I mean Greenwood. Greenwood was
fortunate in that when he came to the Steelers Radakovich
was the defensive line coach. George Perlis who would get
(15:26):
the job later was this is, according to Bill Nunn,
was always in favor of bigger, stouter, two gap defensive linemen. Okay,
Radikovich was. He was a little out there for the
for the era, you know, and sometimes you need that.
He was willing to play with lighter, quicker, more athletic guys.
(15:48):
And so of those two defensive ends White and Greenwood,
Greenwood was they were both athletic for the position of
the era, but Greenwood was the more athletic of the two,
you know, in that in that front four. And Jack
Ham will say to this day that he doesn't get
(16:10):
into the Hall of Fame if Elsie Greenwood isn't playing
in front of him. Well, so, yeah, he he belongs.
I don't know if he's going to get elected. I mean,
you just never know. There's there's they only pick one, okay,
some of the other ones just you know, Ken Anderson.
Speaker 4 (16:30):
I wanted to ask you about Anderson because I think
he has a pretty strong case.
Speaker 2 (16:34):
He does. Yeah, and he was a big time thorn
in the side of those seventies Steelers teams. I mean,
he win many games against him, but I don't know.
I'm remembering one where he was twenty two of twenty
four passing or something some ridiculous and that was back
in the day when Glenn Edwards could closeline you on
(16:57):
the sidewalk and that was barely a penalty. So yeah,
Ken Anderson was a tough guy. He was. I think
he belongs to Roger Craig's another guy among the semi finalists,
So you know, it's a it's a tough Otis Taylor
for AFL people, So it's you know, I believe Elsie
(17:19):
Greenwood belongs. It's unfortunate in my opinion, that only one
of these guys gets to go in, and you know,
we'll see what happens. Fingers crossed labs one of.
Speaker 3 (17:32):
The things I can still hear, you know, touching Wolf
in the back of my head, lamenting that. You know
all that they used to say it about Donnie Shell.
He should be in until he finally deservedly got elected
a few years ago. El C Greenwood being another one
of these guys. And the only reason those guys aren't
in is because they've got Steelers fatigue in the Hall
of Fame. It's been so much black and gold, and
(17:53):
particularly off those defenses, Like do you think that's a
real thing that kind of works against else Greenwood that
everybody looks around and they go, there's five guys off
that defense, six guys off that defense in the Hall
of Fame already? Can they really have another?
Speaker 2 (18:05):
Yeah? Yes, I think that's real because you know, the
people who vote for this are you know, human beings,
and that Board of Selectors Hall of Fame Board of Selectors.
I mean, it's not like Major League Baseball, where there's
hundreds of baseball writers who you know, vote for the
Hall of Fame. I mean, and I don't even know.
(18:26):
It might be more baseball writers that vote for baseball,
but you know, in the NFL, it's it's a it's
a smaller group and they get just they just get
tired of hearing it. I mean, I you know, you
look at you know, start with you know, Hall of
Fames in eighty I think eighty nine to ninety ninety one,
(18:50):
those were all multiple Steeler Hall of Fames, you know,
I mean yes, and in those days it was it
Canton out on that back, poor or whatever, and the
Steelers fans would pack that whole area. They'd be hanging
off the you know, over the highway and stuff, and
that that has an impact. I mean it was cool
(19:11):
for you know, Steelers fans, people from Pittsburgh. I mean
it was a you know, a very prideful thing. But
I can imagine, you know, guys from other NFL cities
are like, yeah, we're tired of this. So yeah, I
think Steelers fatigue is real. Again, it's unfortunate, but it's
(19:31):
an election, and that's you know, any election is a
popularity contest and people vote for who they vote for
for different reasons. I mean there are there are all
kinds of elections where people vote for a candidate not
based on that he's the best guy or woman. They
like him or or or they don't. So uh, you know,
(19:55):
that's it's just the I don't know the reality the
whole thing. And as I said, I I believe he
deserves it. I if I had a vote, I would
vote for him. If anyone wants to who matters would
listen to me. I would talk to him. You know,
we'll see how it works out.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
Well, hopefully it does all work out for him. Would
be deserving for Elsie Greenwood, for his family, posthumorously to
have him inducted into the Hall of Fame. Another great
member of those Steelers seventies teams. Labs, we know you've
got to run. Thank you so much for taking the
time for us here on Thursday. We won't talk to
you next Thursday because of Thanksgiving, but looking forward to
(20:35):
hearing you on the pregame show and chatting with you
on Sunday.
Speaker 2 (20:38):
Okay, fellows, have a good week you as well.
Speaker 3 (20:41):
There he goes Bob Labriola, as always, not many guys
that can paint a better picture of the history of
the zation.
Speaker 4 (20:50):
I glad we went down that road with him.
Speaker 3 (20:51):
And I'm glad too, like I'm I'm the one thing
that I love about LABS is I mean, okay, anybody
who does what LABS does, you just naturally, I think,
have a touch of Homer in you. But he was
very fourth, like very fourth, right, very upfront, like, hey,
Ken Anderson, right.
Speaker 4 (21:10):
That's on my list to ask them about. I mean,
it's a division foe. And then Craig was the one.
You know, if we narrowed it down to three, it
was Anderson, Craig.
Speaker 3 (21:17):
And I hope those are the three that it ends
up getting narrowed down to which we'll find out another week.
Speaker 4 (21:25):
You know, I mean I totally get in the case
for it, and I.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
Did I I did love that from labs of of
kind of you know, not just saying no, it's gotta
be Elsie and anything else is a farce because we
know it is. The like, these are very very tough decisions.
You're talking about, like the one percent of the one
percenters here in terms of the NFL Hall of Fame
and splitting hairs.
Speaker 4 (21:44):
All those other candidates were great football players.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Obviously there are you know, in in their markets right now.
They're talking on the radio about how they desire they
you know in Kansas City, San Francisco. Yeah, absolutely, But
hopefully it'll be good news for LC. That reminder, it
gets cut down from nine to three here in early December,
so just in like the next two weeks and then
(22:08):
one of those three for the twenty twenty six NFL
Hall of Fame class. So good to see Elsie make
it this far and hopefully that will continue, and we'll
keep an eye on all of that rolling forward. Gonna
jump back into Matt Stat's packet when we return on
the other side. West Shuler, Matt Williamson, some stats bookend
(22:29):
in each each part of the first hour here on
the Drive on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network,
your tunes.
Speaker 1 (22:47):
About Drive on your twenty four to seven home of
the Black and Goal Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Back on the Drive here, and let's close down the
first hour by finally getting into some of these Matt stats. Matthews,
of course, a weekly exercise here on the Drive.
Speaker 4 (23:19):
Just pack it end up being a little beef here,
unusual little Chicago beef. Beef Beef, the Beef, The Beef
one of one of my one of my favorite shows.
Speaker 3 (23:29):
I think it's outstanding. I think you and I have
had this conversation. I think it might be the best
like show right now.
Speaker 4 (23:34):
I think.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
On television.
Speaker 4 (23:37):
I was have you seen him in the Springsteen thing? Yet?
Speaker 3 (23:40):
Not yet?
Speaker 4 (23:40):
I was thinking the wife and I might go this weekend. Yeah,
I I assumed you would have been there by now.
Speaker 3 (23:45):
I think I've only been to one movie post Code
in the feed Oppenheimer, because I was like, I gotta
see I gotta see this. Yeah, remember when that a
bombs going off? I want to feel it in my chair.
Speaker 4 (23:58):
I'm not a big movie goo.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
It was for my teenage years and in my twenties
I was a huge moviegoer. But I you know, the
last five six.
Speaker 4 (24:07):
Years I got young kids.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
I can wait, Yeah, I would.
Speaker 4 (24:11):
I mean, you know, it's not that long to wait,
especially now. Yeah, but I'm doing to show it pur
suit at night. I'm gonna ask him if it's I'm
sure he's gone.
Speaker 3 (24:19):
I Rob King has seen it. Who else on the
plane was I talk to? Maybe Richie Walsh, Katyk Richie Walsh.
I think he might have been the other one. So yeah,
I would like to see it, certainly. I'm not a
not a huge movie guy. There's that new Leo movie
that I want to uh that I want to watch
as well.
Speaker 4 (24:37):
All that stuff I can wait nine at ten times.
I mean, I can always wait.
Speaker 3 (24:41):
One battle after another. That new Leo movie looks awesome.
But yeah, I just I'm patient. Now I don't need
to like I used to. Man, there was a movie
theater by where I grew up five dollars movie Mondays
like me and my buddies. Me and my buddies were
there every every Monday. But yes, it is Stat's packets time,
Ye's taking How did we get to the You asked
(25:02):
me about the Springsteen movie something something. Yeah, that's what
I'm trying to do in Chicago this weekend.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
That, oh you might as well, Matt.
Speaker 3 (25:12):
Let's jump into it here, Steelers Bears. It's a beefy
stats packet. That's how we round about way of uh
of getting there. And this one is very interesting to me.
Pittsburgh's two point three yards after contact per rush attempt
is seventh highest in the NFL. Yeah, but just one
point four yards before contact per per rush attempt is
(25:35):
sixth lowest.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
So then implies the blockings bad and the runners are good.
And maybe that's the short end of it. But I
also watching especially the last five games, I don't think
the run blocking is bad though, you know what I mean.
Warren is one of the best after the after the
after contact runners in the league. Frankly, you know I
(25:59):
mean that that pbably shouldn't shock people. Now. What hurts
his stats a little is he won't bounce off a
tackler and take it sixty through inflate one. But he
consistently gets yardage after contact consistently. Sure, So I think
that's not misleading because when we have a pretty big
body of work, but I think it leans a little
(26:20):
the bad parts. I think lean more towards the beginning
of the season. Just running in the back of your lineman,
not having holes, that kind of thing.
Speaker 3 (26:28):
I think there is a a kind of clear point
there where it started to get better for the Steers. Yeah, yeah, run.
It might have started in Dublin with Kenneth Gainwell and
that nine goal, that ninety nine yard rushing performance, and
then out of the bye week you really build on
that and that blowout win at home against the Browns.
What game was it recently? Was it Packers Colts? But
(26:48):
one of the recent games I remember it was one
of our Tuesday rewind things that we discussed was I
think Jayalen Woren had like sixty some yards rushing. It
wasn't putrid, but right right, it was in massive. It
wasn't the varsity number that we were looking for either.
And I remember telling you, like, you go back and
you watch and it's it's bizarre because it's not like
(27:08):
the offensive line is getting pushed back. They're playing much better,
but there's still too much contact. Is Matt is part
of it? Maybe the Steelers not stretching the field as much.
Things are closer to the line of scrimmage. So even
if the linemen army safeties are key and downhill, linebackers
are keying downhill some.
Speaker 4 (27:27):
Hill somewhat, but there's always extra attention to metcalf side.
The Steelers do face a lot of too high safeties,
so it's not like it's this massive, loaded box that
just is unblockable either. Frankly, I think they need to
run about more, and starting with this week, but I've
said that for a couple of weeks in a row.
I'd like see more volume.
Speaker 3 (27:48):
I would too, And it's again, this is another one
of those where the numbers don't necessarily match the eye test.
You know this. I do the halftime reports on the
Steelers broadcasts, so things are a little crazy in the
front half. I'm doing my engineering.
Speaker 4 (28:01):
Job, yeah, trying to watch a game, trying to.
Speaker 3 (28:03):
Watch the game and take notes on my laptop as
the game goes along, because you know you and I
got to do a show twenty four hours twenty four
hours later. So when I sit down at halftime to
do the show, I've got like two minutes of you know,
Tom in my ear, like two minutes here ninety seconds here,
and I'm always quickly trying to just double check the scoring, like, Okay,
(28:23):
that was a forty seven yarder from Boswell, right, and
it was a that was the second drive of the
game when Aaron Rodgers found dk Metcalfe a touchdown.
Speaker 4 (28:30):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
And it's the first time that I look at the
stats really as well too.
Speaker 4 (28:34):
It really dig in, right, And it seems like I
have the box scorer up while I'm watching at home,
and you know.
Speaker 3 (28:39):
It seems like the last couple of weeks I've immediately thought, man,
we're not run the ball enough. They're not giving Jayalen
Warn enough carries. But then I look at this, I
look at this the box score, and it's like, oh,
he's got eight carries in the first half. That's I'd
like it to be ten.
Speaker 4 (28:51):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:51):
Yeah, yeah, that's not terrible.
Speaker 4 (28:53):
It's not hideous, right, But.
Speaker 3 (28:54):
It doesn't necessarily always it doesn't always seem like that,
And I think it's part of that, maybe because it.
Speaker 4 (29:01):
Doesn't seem like they're just building off it and one
after another.
Speaker 3 (29:04):
It hasn't been an early dry I think it's been
more so laid into the first quarter into the second quarter,
as opposed to bang. Here's a heavy dose of thirty
right out of the gate, right on the opening drive.
Speaker 4 (29:17):
Yeah, I feel that way too. I don't have the numbers.
Speaker 3 (29:21):
Yeah, total vibes, right.
Speaker 4 (29:24):
I think that's accurate. I do you.
Speaker 3 (29:28):
Want the good news? Sure, the Chicago Bears allowed two
point sixty five yards per contact per rush. Yeah, the
worst in the national force.
Speaker 4 (29:37):
Right, that was that before contact or after? For that?
Before contacts? I would say they're They're not super stout upfront.
I mean, they have some athletes. They have some guys
with good length. They have some decent pass rushers dexter
I like sweat, et cetera. Their linebackers hit well, both
of whom are on the injury report, but they're not
big power stout banging it the line of scrimmage guy,
(30:00):
which is a huge reason why I think this week,
but I've said this for a couple of weeks, I'd
really like to see a more dedication to the run game, because,
much like the Chargers, the run defense is problematic for them.
I mean the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (30:15):
Everything's yes, yes it is, and the Bears are not
much better.
Speaker 4 (30:20):
They're better, no, right, They're closer to the Bengals than
the Chargers.
Speaker 3 (30:24):
Honestly, though, the thing that saves the Bengals from or
the part of me, the thing that saves the Bears
from having the Bengals type reputation is their defense takes
the ball away at a crazy high level.
Speaker 4 (30:34):
Massive.
Speaker 3 (30:34):
They surrender yards, they surrender points, just like Cincinnati, but
they take the ball away. They've got the most ridiculous
in the league, right.
Speaker 4 (30:41):
And a lot. Yeah they are, and I mean them
and the Steelers are the best two.
Speaker 3 (30:44):
Yes, really wanted to.
Speaker 4 (30:46):
Part of me thinks this game. I don't have a
great vibe for this game in terms of predictions yet,
and part of me just thinks it's as simple as
who's better in turnover ratio. But that's kind of an
arbitrary thing, especially with two teams that are so good
at it. It's different if it's like Steelers are top
league team, ex at the bottom of league, you got
a better chance to win that, you know, that important category.
(31:08):
But I will say I think the Steelers offense and
the numbers don't one hundred percent reflect it value the
football better than Chicago's offense. Williams is a pretty big
risk taker, you know, I mean their ball carriers. I
wouldn't trust them as much as the Steelers to secure
the ball as much. Obviously, that's a Tomlin thing forever.
You know, ball security, and they stress it here a ton,
(31:30):
not that the Bears don't. And I also the numbers
also don't reflect this. I mean, the Bears have to
have more takeaways than the Steelers and more takeaways than everybody,
and it's really impressive. But I also think the takeaways
the If you ask me what's the first component to
being a good takeaway defense, the first might be luck,
(31:54):
But that is side pass rush. Yeah, that's where I
was going to start with. Yeah, I went pass rushers
to force the quarterback to get it out of his hands,
maybe make a decision faster than he wants to, certainly
get hit while he throws. How many strip sacks have
we seen from Watt and her Big over the years?
And no question in my mind, the Steelers pass rushers
(32:16):
are better than the Bears pass rushers.
Speaker 3 (32:18):
You know, I don't think many people would argue that.
Speaker 4 (32:20):
I mean, that's pretty cut and dry.
Speaker 3 (32:22):
I tell you what, though, when you just look at
it on paper, it's impressive. Steelers have eight takeaways this season.
That's fourth in the league. Yeah, Tampa Bay has nine,
just one ahead of them for third. Rams have ten,
just two ahead of them for second. Bears have sixteen.
I know they got double. The Steelers are in fourth,
the Bears are in first. They have double the amount
of the Steelers takeaways.
Speaker 4 (32:43):
Right and they have ten games four or five guys
four interceptions.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
That's impressive.
Speaker 4 (32:49):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (32:50):
And again, as you mentioned, pass rush being a big
part of it, Steelers are third in the league in sacks,
so fourth. One of the things you and I talked
about preseason. By the way, we want the Steelers to
be top three in sacks, top three and turnovers third
and sacks third and sacks right now, fourth and turnovers.
Speaker 4 (33:06):
Yeah, yah, you're in the neighborhood. It's great, right there.
Their second and quarterback hits second.
Speaker 3 (33:11):
QB hits the Bears. However, Matt, their passwords is okay,
it's it's okay, but it is.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
I know it's a mediocre.
Speaker 3 (33:22):
I'm gonna have to do about the math here, but
it's about twentieth in the league.
Speaker 4 (33:24):
Yeah, yeah, six seven, eight, stuff in the middle.
Speaker 3 (33:27):
I don't exactly twentieth. Okay, there we go.
Speaker 4 (33:30):
It's so I don't put stuff in the middle. That's
stat package, you know, like what's the difference between twenty
and I think.
Speaker 3 (33:35):
That makes it even more impressive, the way they're taking
away the ball when you consider they're not doing it
with an elite pass.
Speaker 4 (33:40):
Rush and they've I'm sure they stressed it as much
as anyone. But I'm not going to say that they're
fluky or lucky and the Steelers are good. They're both really, really,
really really good at That's not what I mean, but
it's not theirs is a little bit harder to put
your finger on as to how they've been so good
at it. I guess is the way it put.
Speaker 3 (33:56):
I think that's a great way to state it.
Speaker 4 (33:58):
Now, this is not disrespecting the opponent, but they've also
played bad teams. And then I mean, they're they're on
a great winning streak in the first place they are,
but their resume of wins doesn't blow you away.
Speaker 3 (34:08):
So this is one of those football dork things. If
you'll just indulge me, if you'll oblige me for a
second here, Matt Williamson, because I did a segment today
on the Steelers Standard with Jacob and ed here on
the Steelers Audio Network, and that was something that Jacob
brought up as well too. Look at how bad their
schedule's been. You know they they lost to the Ravens
(34:31):
even without by two touchdowns, without Lamar being back in
the fold yet, and I agree with that. You look
at their schedule. It's not Murderer's roll. No, no, no,
I mean it's been on.
Speaker 4 (34:40):
It's just like they beat the Eagles, Seahawks and Rams.
Speaker 3 (34:43):
You know it's been. It's been a lot of teams
with losing records. I also though, hesitate and they squeak
them out too.
Speaker 4 (34:49):
I mean they're tight wins.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
No doubt. And they've got they finished last place in
the division last year. They've got the last play schedule,
and that's a real look matters. Look how tough the
chief schedule is. Look how tough the Texans schedule.
Speaker 4 (34:58):
Is the reason the Patriots and going to shape his another.
Speaker 3 (35:02):
Great example, another great example. I also though, hesitate to
put a ton of stock into that because it's the
National Football League. Oh yeah, like it's it's not Ohio
State versus Akron.
Speaker 4 (35:13):
No, you know, it wasn't like they were fifteen point
dogs and Earth favorites in all these games. Either.
Speaker 3 (35:17):
Yes, I so I do agree that their schedule has
been easier, but I also don't think that that's just
they're fake, their fugazi. Their offense isn't really that good.
They just haven't played anybody.
Speaker 4 (35:28):
I'm not there either, Yeah, I mean there there's a
lot of positive vibes around the organization, the offense, the
coaching staff, quarterback. I think I said this yesterday. It's
probably the best time in Bears history since Dick to
be a Bears fan. I mean in terms of optimism,
and you know with.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
That long term. Rex Grossman took him to a super Bowl.
Jake Cutler took him to an moment here and there,
but those were moments.
Speaker 4 (35:50):
They were moments.
Speaker 3 (35:51):
Now it's like, if we've got Caleb and Ben Johnson
for the next twelve years.
Speaker 4 (35:54):
We might be the best team in this really good division.
Yeah oh yeah, right right.
Speaker 3 (36:00):
Just a real quick mat before we get back to
the stats. This just jumped off the screen at me
talking about sacks and takeaways and all those things. So
Steelers third in the NFL and Sackson thirty three. Yeah,
Falcon second with four. They used to be for them,
is like, oh, it's the best they've been in our lifetime. Yeah, really,
I mean then they've ever been.
Speaker 4 (36:18):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (36:19):
So Steelers at thirty three, Falcons at thirty four, third
in second place there respectively, the Broncos in first place.
Speaker 4 (36:26):
Forty nine forty nine.
Speaker 3 (36:28):
They're fifteen ahead of the second place team.
Speaker 4 (36:32):
Now, Atlanta has an entire.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
Miles guarant season work sex to.
Speaker 4 (36:35):
This point, So cumulative stats I always want to look
then you have your buy or not. But we're pretty
far into it. I mean, if it's nine games verse ten,
that's different than five verse four, you know what I.
Speaker 3 (36:45):
Mean, that's why. But there, I know they haven't had
their buy yet, but that's why.
Speaker 4 (36:49):
Still insane and Atlanta. I think Atlanta's buy is coming
up this week. But still teen more sacks and they
led the league last year, yes, and their number one
quarterback hits you know, and Steelers are second. But I
think they have like twelve more than the Steelers. I mean,
so yeah, it's an elite pass rush in Denver.
Speaker 3 (37:06):
It's crazy. It really.
Speaker 4 (37:07):
The hope of leading the league in sacks is probably
going to be let's go for second.
Speaker 3 (37:15):
I'm good with that. And oddly enough, Denver is in
the back half of of their their turnover differential because
they're turning it over the turn I think. And yeah,
so actually here, part of me, what I was reading
off with the takeaway numbers was just the differential. Yeah, yeah,
part of me there Bears have twenty two, not sixteen.
(37:36):
Steelers have eighteen. So it's not that big. It's not.
But that was the way I apologize Earlier I was
looking at the differential.
Speaker 4 (37:42):
But still now the Bears differentials by far the best, by.
Speaker 3 (37:44):
Far the best, but still twenty two takeaways. The Steelers
tied for second with eighteen even four more like that's
it's still a lot substantial number. Yeah, substantial number. Yeah,
the Bears, I mean, the.
Speaker 4 (37:56):
Two best teams in terms of turnovers across the board,
but especially takeaways.
Speaker 3 (38:01):
The Bears have also only, in ten games coughed up
the ball six times, second best in the NFL behind
on the Eagle. Only the Eagles have done it less.
Speaker 4 (38:09):
But the second your quarterback. Pretty impressive and a brand
new head coach.
Speaker 3 (38:14):
Offense, right, a lot.
Speaker 4 (38:15):
Of those guys weren't even there last year, so pretty
impressive stuff.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Uh, Matt, let's get into another stat or two here
before we break for the first hour for the halftime
gun here, and then get back into it on the
other side. This kind of plays into some of the
run game conversation. Aaron Rodgers has thrown almost thirty one
percent of his passes thirty point eight percent of his
passes at or behind the line of scribbage. That's the
(38:40):
second highest rate in the league, A league low.
Speaker 4 (38:45):
Gabriels Won, by the way.
Speaker 3 (38:47):
Not the company that you're looking right right, A league low.
Forty five percent of Aaron Rodgers passes have been five
or more yards down field league average fifty five point
one percent, so about ten percent less than the league. Noticeably,
he's attempted twenty four percent of his pass is ten
plus yards downfield, lowest rate in the NFL league average
(39:08):
is thirty three percent.
Speaker 4 (39:09):
That's the one that bothers me most. I don't mind
the quick throws at at the line of scrimmage. You
know RPOs or you oh, your corner's playing off that
that I'm gonna steal six yards off your right off
you gotta tackle Metcalf or Warren or whoever. But I
think so, I would say week three or four would
(39:32):
be doing Matt's stats, and it would be, well, Rogers
has the lowest average depth of target in the league,
and I would correct people and I'd be like, it's
not last, it's the fewest. I mean, like people like, oh,
they're last in the league in eight.
Speaker 3 (39:46):
Autumn a takeaway statistic.
Speaker 4 (39:49):
No, No, it's not like points scored, you know, like,
whoever's the yards rushed, right, Yeah, whoever's thrown at the
deepest doesn't mean they're the best quarterback.
Speaker 3 (39:57):
In the league exactly right. They're having Gary success, right.
Speaker 4 (40:01):
Like, it's not like it's Mahomes and Allen are one
and two and then there's no Bill.
Speaker 3 (40:05):
Gabors perfect way. There's no one way to skin that cat.
Speaker 4 (40:08):
One thousand percent. So there's a lot of different approaches,
but I think we are getting to the point where
if you want to be a playoff team that makes noise,
you got to be more intermediate driven. And yeah, I
think more is needed from the passing game away from
the line of scrimmage. And the stat I uncovered this
(40:28):
week that I had not put in there before was
there's a stat now that they're they've been charting, which
I think is really meaningful is yards to the sticks.
So if it's first and ten and you throw a
six yard pass, you're minus four, gotcha. If it's first
and ten you throw a fourteen yard pass, your plus four.
So it's not like everybody's mind.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
Start and four and you pick up seven yards plus three.
Speaker 4 (40:50):
Plus three air yards. Doesn't matter where the ball, just
where the target is. Like Alex Smith was always known
for always throwing short of the sticks. Sure, well, it
doesn't matter down in distance, but the Steelers as a team,
obviously ninety eight percent of it. Rogers is the one
pull in the trigger, but he's not the only one
to blame. Are the shortest of the sticks. They're like
(41:12):
three point eight yards or something on average. Throw before
the sticks. That could be first down, that could be
second and twenty. I mean, it's not all third down stuff.
But I think that needs to change, you know, like
i'd that one isn't directly whoever is the highest is
the best either. But I don't think you want to
(41:34):
be the lowest there either, you know what I mean.
Speaker 3 (41:35):
You're looking for a middle ground, Yeah, yeah, yeah, of
not being one dimensional, not being predictable, being able to
get it anyway you want it.
Speaker 4 (41:45):
Yeah, right, right, right.
Speaker 3 (41:45):
When it's like you said, when it's first and ten
and you could pick up an easy six yards, take
it great.
Speaker 4 (41:50):
But when it's that's stealing. Great, When it's.
Speaker 3 (41:52):
Second and four and you could pick up fifteen yards.
Speaker 4 (41:54):
Do it, yeah exactly. Or hey, it's third and two
and you complete a three yard pass. Great. I mean,
I don't mind are passing if it gets the job done.
But the world's catching on too. Yes, they are a
little more aggression I think is needed.
Speaker 3 (42:07):
Especially at this point in the season. All the film
is out there, all the studies have been done, all
the stats packets compiled. Speaking of which, before we go
to break, I meant to mention this one with our
turnovers and sacks and takeaways conversation, Steelers average five point
one sacks plus takeaways per game. Really really good, really good,
second second best in the NFL.
Speaker 4 (42:28):
That's just a defensive stat, folks, that's not what you allow.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
Yes, Chicago is allowing league low two point two sacks
plus giveaways per game. Another one of those absolutely game
within the game things to keep an eye on, and a.
Speaker 4 (42:45):
Lot of that's Williams used to be the most sacked
guy going.
Speaker 2 (42:48):
He is.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
Remember you'd say that TV is doing.
Speaker 4 (42:53):
He's got tremendously better at tremendously better and as you mentioned,
they don't turn the ball much over on offense either,
so that's part of it right real quick. On Williams,
I was listening to a friend of mine, Ross Tucker.
Him and I used to host podcasts together. Now he's
a great podcast. He has Greg co sell on, who
I've often referenced, and they were breaking down Williams today
(43:18):
on their Thursday podcast and Greg's like, he reminds me
of like second year Ben. I'm like, whoa, I mean,
because they don't really look the same. He's not six',
five he doesn't look like an oak tree in. There
but he's just like he is so much stronger than
people give him credit. For And rob AND i were
talking about this today down the facility is, like does
(43:39):
anyone ever get this guy in the ground? Anymore i'm, like,
no that's the. Thing and he's so, Fast he's he's. Twitchy,
yeah he's accelerates. Quick his top speed is really, fast
like he used to take so many. SACKS i think
because he's so. Talented he's, Like i'm better at everybody out.
Here nobody's, geting and now he's, like WELL i, am
(44:02):
Maybe i'm still better than some of these. DUDES i
was first picking the, draft BUT i know my. Limitations
but he's really really hard to get on the, ground
like maybe the best in the league in terms of
avoiding hardest to get on the ground behind the line of.
Speaker 3 (44:13):
Scrimmage you AND i always talk About lar of like
when it really took off For Josh allen and For
lamar and all these. Guys it's not just when the
highlight tape wows. You it's when the low light tape
starts to be a very short clip, Massive and For
Caleb williams this, year that low light tape has gone
from a half an hour YouTube video to about a sixty, second,
(44:37):
quick little, short.
Speaker 4 (44:38):
Probably more so than any quarterback in the league in
terms of reducing the low light. Tape it's a good.
Speaker 3 (44:42):
Call, yeah that's why he went out and Hired Ben,
johnson right.
Speaker 4 (44:44):
Right, Right and he's growing. Up you know you're in the.
League goes a long, way.
Speaker 3 (44:48):
As our Friend. Dale guys are allowed to get.
Speaker 4 (44:51):
Better guys are allowed to get. Better Kayleb williams is getting.
Speaker 3 (44:53):
Better he certainly. Is will continue to talk about more
of that as we peruse Through matt's stats to begin
our number. Two two will keep this conversation role In Williamson.
Yueler it's The drive On Steelers Nation radio on The
Steelers Audio network
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