June 3, 2025 • 45 mins
Steelers' running back Jaylen Warren sits down with the SNR crew as Tuesday's practice comes to an end.
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
This is The Drive with Dale Lolly and Matt Williamson
on your twenty four to seven home of the Black
and Gold Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Final Hour on this beautiful Tuesday from the South side
of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania at the upmc rooney Sports Complex, day
number four of OTA's for our special three hour edition
of The Drive. Of course, Dale Lolly and Matt Williamson,
this is their program. I am helping and assisting throughout
this process a little bit more so than today.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Because my voice will not allow me to lift anybody higher.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
You're like the like the you know, like the eighth
graders who just start lifting and they're like in there
just working just the bench with no weights on it
to get their form right and everything right.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
You just have if I can get words out.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Sounded pretty good, right now, let's let's I don't want
to jinx it. So yeah, final hour here today. Like
I said, a few more minutes left in practice. May
about fifteen twenty minutes from now. Will be joined by
Jalen Warren for a few minutes as well. But Matt,
I did want to look because I mean I think
that this is a again one fun exercise too. It's
this time of year and we've got the kind of
(01:16):
time to focus on these things. A little bit on
what you touched on there at the end of the segment,
NFL regular season wins since two thousand. But did you
have and I'm sorry, I know I kind of put
you on the spot here. You said the Steelers had
the fifth most playoff wins since two thousand? Correct? Yes,
do you do you know like exactly what the number
(01:37):
was and the other teams that were around him. I
do believe. I remember I saw you put in was
its fifteen playoff wins for the Steelers. I want to
say in that time period. Okay, yeah, rolling through my
fifth most since two thousand with fifteen if you do it?
How about this? Because I saw you retweet this and
people and your mentions. Of course, some people were saying,
(01:57):
all right, well, now just do it. In the Mike
Tomlin era, they actually moved to third most playoffs right
as an organization in the Mike Tomlin era. Again, this
is like, this is the the context of high expectations.
Like I just laid out, I would rather expect my
team to be the New York Yankees and the Dodgers
than the Pittsburgh Pirates. I would rather have those expectations,
(02:20):
but I think it is important to, you know, at
times and in the offseason again, differentiate the forest through
the trees.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
No question about it. I mean, when it's hard to
win games, and this is not an excuse, but winmen
playoff games is really really difficult in this sport. I
mean they're one shot. You get one shot. And I
talk about this all the time that the Super Bowl
(02:47):
champ either won three or four games, the Super Bowl
runner up won three or two. I think there's only
thirteen playoff wins to give out every year. There's total
of thirteen of them, right right, right, I mean everyone
that wins round one and then you know the half
of them are limited after that. I mean there's only
thirteen playoff wins a given out by the league per year.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
And I was gonna say playoffs, right yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
And it's harder now than ever. I mean to So
if you're five hundred as a quarterback or a coach
in your playoff career, that's pretty good. It's really good.
I mean it's really really good. If you can win
half of them is really really good. And that doesn't again,
none of this excuses how things have gone in the
(03:36):
playoffs with Late in the season of late. But when
you really look at these numbers too, since like two
thousand and who has the playoff wins and who doesn't,
or so much of it as quarterback driven. I mean,
they win playoff games with Ben, they don't without them,
you know. I mean, I cited Belichick. He Belichick has
a losing record when Brady's not his starter. He's got
(03:59):
the best wreck or you've ever seen with Brady as
a starter. Now one has something to do with the other.
Noel Bradshaw's, Montana Walsh, whatever. But man, when you looked
at these numbers, you know, Rogers with Green Bay was third,
you know, I mean the Colts are really high with
Manning and then Lock. I mean, like none of them
are super successful over a long stretch without great quarterback play.
(04:23):
I mean, I'm not even talking about league average.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
And even with that, nothing is still guaranteed. Because as you,
I know said on this show, you and I have
talked about it when we've done crossover shows and stuff.
You think Josh Allen might bring him up one of
the best playoff quarterbacks you've ever seen in your life. Yes,
and he's got a losing record and he still hasn't
been to a super Bowl.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
Yeah, I mean so even over the.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Losing record in the postseason, I believe, I think so,
I think just fit. Yeah, it does ever rang, Yes,
we know that has he ever hasn't even been has
even gotten there.
Speaker 4 (04:50):
So there was a Warren Sharp in a deep study.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
On seven and six. Josh Allen is in the playoffs,
so one game above.
Speaker 4 (04:56):
Fives as of last year he was below.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Correct.
Speaker 4 (04:59):
You know, people would assume over these last five six,
seven years the Chiefs era that Mahomes has been the
best playoff quarterback in football. It's Allen and it's really
not even close. I mean, Mahomes is phenomenal to playoffs,
but with just postseason numbers advanced.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
At just isolating, just isolating, not look at the win
loss record and all that stuff, it's.
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Like some of the best. It's he's one of the
best playoff quarterbacks. Ever, does that make him a loser?
You know? And like if he never gets a ring
or if he'd retire today, I mean, like it makes
me crazy, you know, Like a big thing I always
talk about, especially these AFC quarterbacks, is like they draft,
Caleb Williams the first overall, or even like Jayde Daniels did,
(05:43):
Jane Daniels will get a ring, Yeah, he probably will.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
I get where you're going with.
Speaker 4 (05:48):
Yeah, the best is the AFC lately though, Like.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
You only give away one ring a year, you.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
Only give one away a year. And if Mahomes and
Brady have twelve of them between them, just do the math,
you know, like even at this point of their career,
if I told you Josh Allen will get a ring,
yes or no?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Yes, but but again you've got to look every year, right, Lamar,
I mean I would lean towards alone.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
I would lean let alone.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
Let alone too or multiple appearances You mentioned towards no,
and he's been he's been to one, you know. And
and you mentioned like a guy like Aaron Rodgers, who
you said the third most playoff wins in that period.
He got the one super Bowl, he's got the one
super Bowl.
Speaker 4 (06:31):
And Rogers of two that really stand out to me
when you compare them to Bend, like they each have
one ring, which is really an unbelievable accomplishment, and all
those postseason wins. But people don't realize how hard it
is in the postseason. I mean again, only one of
those AFC quarterbacks can win it every year. Correct, and
Mahomes has been awfulized it a little bit.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
It has it's it's it's it is interesting when you
look at that and you go, okay, just in a vacuum,
you think this quarterback's got the juice to win a
Super Bowl. We'd probably say yes, about four or five guys.
You haven't to this point, right, Burrow and Allen and
Lamar and you know the Dave Lawrence was.
Speaker 4 (07:04):
Drafted win a super Bowl. Yeah, he's gonna play fifteen years.
He'll get one, you know, or after Stroud's rookie year,
unbelievable rookie year, he'll get one. Well that means Allen
didn't that year, or Borrow or Lar or you know,
no doubt.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Or Mahomes didn't get another you know, right Jalen Hurts
who now has one as well too. Yeah, it's it
is and it's the whole. Like you said, there's there's
one game, you know, and there's it's a very short tournament.
There's one game you play bad for sixty minutes, see
you later. You know it is you catch you.
Speaker 4 (07:33):
The week that your best guys are hurt.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
Or you know, it's not a bad quarter or whatever.
Speaker 4 (07:37):
You yeah, yeah, dude, your kicker hits you up right,
and we lost by.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
One, right, the Chicago Bears double dooint, right, and you
and you're still kind of trying to recover from.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
There's less luck involved when there's seven game series. I
can have a bad Tuesday night and get blown out
and come back and win the series.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Oh, absolutely, you see you you see that all the time.
To use the local example like that those years was
a sixteen and seventeen when the Pens went to the Cup.
They had a couple of game against San Jose, game
against Nashville where they got crushed. But it's fine. You
come back to you come back two nights later, you go,
you know baseball like you might. You might get shallax
seven to one the one night, but the next night
you come back, new pitcher on the mound, go out
(08:13):
and get a victory, and it's a different story. Yeah,
the the one and done.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
The Mazarowski year, every loss to the yes, right, they
lost by crushed.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
They lost in the run differential in that series. Didn't
they buy like the substantial amount, but.
Speaker 4 (08:29):
The game they squeaked out by one run, but they
won four of the seven.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
But exactly right, it's it's a it's a completely different beast,
you know in the NFL postseason. I think that's part
of the reason why you know, we as a country
all love March madness so much. Right, it's that same
kind of pressure cooker, won and done. We've seen now
multiple times where a sixteen seed is beaten a one
seed now because you got you got one team plays
well for a day. One team doesn't exactly have it.
(08:52):
You have a slow first half something like that, and.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Jalen Warren making his way off the field here.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
So excellent, sounds good. Let's yeah, let's we'll stay here then,
since we've still got some time in this thank you
for the for the heads updal We will be talking
to Steelers running back Jalen Warren momentarily. Yes, practice number
four in the books here of OTA's first one of
this week. It'll be the same Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday schedule.
I didn't say this at the top of the show.
(09:20):
We will be here with you for the just like
we had last week, three hours every single day from
ten until one o'clock for all these Ota practices next
week for Mini camp as well too. I'm not sure
if our broadcast schedule will be exactly the same for
Many camp next week, but we will be down here
in terms of the same hours and and everything. I'm
not sure if there's any if there's any shift in
in the Steelers timing or anything like that. As as
(09:44):
we get ready here here it comes for Steelers running
back number thirty. Here Jalen Warren sitting down with us
after practice number four. Jalen, thank you for taking the
time to be here, and good getting out there in
the sunshine in the war weather today, right.
Speaker 5 (10:01):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it was good. It was great to
be with the team.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Have you excuse me?
Speaker 4 (10:10):
That's like I was like, you looked from it, but
not the boy.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
So, you know, your first couple of years you're splitting
time with Naugy, do you approach things a little differently
this year with him going uh?
Speaker 6 (10:25):
I mean, you know, as a baseline, you know, first
and foremost, I'm gonna just play the game. I know,
you know, play same football that I've been playing since
I was eight years old, but maybe with a little
bit more urgency and knowing that there's younger dudes you know,
such as kJ that I gotta you know, I want
to show the ropes to you know, have him have
a you know, a good uh, a good start to
the NFL.
Speaker 5 (10:46):
And so yeah, like I'll do my thing.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
I become that guy. You know they're gonna follow.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 6 (10:52):
So I know if they look up to me, I
don't want to you know, put put them in the
in the wrong point them in the wrong direction.
Speaker 5 (10:58):
I want to do what I can to put them
in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (11:01):
You mentioned Caleb. How's he adjusting? I mean, how's he
in the running back meeting room? Is the understanding protections.
Speaker 6 (11:07):
And yeah, yeah, and he's definitely Yeah, he's definitely adapting,
very attentative, Like yeah, you can see the growth.
Speaker 5 (11:14):
You know.
Speaker 6 (11:15):
I'm glad, you know, seeing him come in and take
on that role, knowing like he's not bs and around.
He knows like we he's a great player and we
want to use that player on the field. And so
I'm glad he's come in with that approach.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
I'm saying it in terms of your your situation and
where you're at in your career, did you approach this
season or this offseason differently.
Speaker 5 (11:41):
Yeah, one d P. Yeah, I approached this off season differently.
Speaker 6 (11:44):
I did a lot of you know, a lot more
things to you know, for longevity wise, instead of my
old school training, you know, just get cleats on the
run thirty hills. You know, I had to adapt to
you know, this game is about longevity, and like they say,
the best availability or the best ability is availability.
Speaker 4 (12:01):
That's really interesting. How much I mean, now you've been
in the league several years, how much is your body
and training habits changed since your rookie year or year
to year.
Speaker 6 (12:09):
I mean I still I still you know, I'm still
I still go hard, as you know, in training, I
exert myself. Uh. The only thing I've incorporated was you know, recovery.
My recovery has been a major factor of my training.
So it's keeping up with Yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:28):
Okay, have you added weight? Gain weight since your rookie year?
You're trying to keep your body basically.
Speaker 6 (12:32):
Oh since my yeah, my, since my rookie year, I
probably gained more. I definitely gained more muscle, you know, definitely.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
Uh, without losing quickness or speed or.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
Yeah, yeah, yes, sir, great, I feel great.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
This is obviously a run first offense and It's one
that I'm sure running backs left the play. As Arthur says, Look,
there's five hundred carries or the five hundred touches. Do
you feel like you're ready to get three hundred of those?
Speaker 5 (13:00):
Yes? Or yes not, no doubt about it. And that's
that's the way I'm training.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Not only a run first offense. But I got to
think it's pretty exciting. You see over the last couple
of seasons, the investment in that offensive line in free
agency and high you know, capital draft picks. You excited
to run behind that group this year with more continuity,
more experience.
Speaker 6 (13:20):
Yeah, yeah, more the chemistry you know obviously is building.
You know they worked together last year. I'm excited to
run behind them this year.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
So you've been a huge force in the passing game.
And I don't even know if you're aware of this,
but some of the real like advanced numbers have you
right there with like Christian McCaffrey as a receiver. I
mean some of the really breakdown numbers. You're at the
absolute top of the league. But I think people don't
realize how important and how good you are in pass
protection and how much pride and how much time do
(13:48):
you have to put into knowing your assignment and actually
getting that guy blocked.
Speaker 6 (13:53):
Yeah, you know, I've been told that I'm grad I've
been told that i'm you know, not so great as
far as uh you know, an idle look forward too,
because sometimes my techniques as not as you know, clinic,
just because when it comes to past protection, I look
at it as like mano, I mano, Like I'm in
a fight and I don't want to. You know, every
(14:16):
five percent of the league's taller than me, but I'm
a I'm a hey, hey, I'm a I'm gonna pack
that punch.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 6 (14:22):
Like, I look at it like I'm not losing man
against man. I'm willing to if I got whatever I
gotta do to protect my quarterback. I'm just my technique
might not be good, but he gonna fill my pop.
Speaker 4 (14:33):
Is that a constant challenge to keep your technique improving? Yeah?
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Yeah, yeah, you work it every day.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
I thought.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
So, yeah, that's one thing Caleb actually said about you.
It's like I want to be as good in past
protection as Jalen. And so I watched that and is
that kind of cool to think the guys are watching.
Speaker 5 (14:53):
You Yeah, that's cool.
Speaker 6 (14:54):
Uh, you know, and I think that speaks more about
Kleb because you know he's that's to my point, like
he's coming. He's really trying to get, you know, work
on the things that he feels like, you know, he needs.
And I can see that, like all of us can
see him trying to him doing whatever it takes to
get better.
Speaker 3 (15:10):
Kenneth in that room.
Speaker 4 (15:12):
Yeah, just won a super Bowl. That has to have
some Yeah, yeah, a little bit.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
Yeah, he brings that knowledge, he brings the you know,
like does he ever.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
Bring the written around That's probably somewhere.
Speaker 6 (15:26):
Yeah, yeah, right now he hasn't done that. But no,
Kenn's is definitely a great fit for you know what
we got going on here too.
Speaker 4 (15:32):
True professional Ye see why you be part of a
super Champion Yeah, yeah, I'm sure a lot.
Speaker 5 (15:37):
Of in bought into the process everything.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Jayalen Warren kind enough to give us a few minutes
of his time here after OTA practice number four, Thank
you so much for taking the time here for us.
Speaker 5 (15:48):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
We have got to get to a break. When we
come back on the other side. We will continue our
final hour here of O t A's coverage on Steelers
Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
At least is the Drive with Dale Lolly and Matt
Williamson on your twenty four to seven home of the
Black and Gold Steelers Nation.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Radio back on the South Side here as practice number
four in the books for your Pittsburgh Steelers. As this
week underway, we will be back with you. As I mentioned,
Wednesday and Thursday, same time frame from ten to one.
(16:31):
We will again have the Tuesday, Wednesday Thursday shows next week.
I don't want to promise you it's at the same
time because I'm not sure of that, but we will
obviously keep everybody posted and updated.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
I promise you my voice will be better, I hope.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I promise you. I hope you know. I hope so too, Dale,
Not because you know, today has been extra strenuous or anything.
I like hanging out and doing shows down here with
you guys. And I mean I do work in radio, right,
so I do at least somewhat like the sound of
my own voice. But yes, I hope you, for your
sake and for your loyal listener's sake here on the Drive,
(17:05):
get back to it feeling like yourself. Matt Jalen Warren
is certainly a guy who's looking like himself and what
is obviously I'm not landing on the moon here, I'm
not breaking any news, but a huge year for him
and not just his Black and Gold future, but his
NFL future.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
Yeah, and I don't think people look at him in
this light, but since he's been a Steeler, I absolutely
think he's been one of their top three offensive weapons.
I mean in terms of just big playability, consistency, versatility,
you know who you want to get the ball in
their hands and good things happen. He's really really high
on that list of wide receivers tight ends that he's
(17:41):
played with, you know, since you just been here, and
I expect that to be very much the same this year.
I Mean, we're all excited about Caleb Johnson and he's
a powerful, explosive player that fits the scheme really well.
But I know what you're getting at Warren, right, you know,
And yeah, the receiving game stuff is off the charts.
He's a heck of a back just hnd them the
football too, no matter what the scheme is.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
And I like the fact that he said he's ready
for those three hundred touches. Yeah, because he's never had that.
Speaker 4 (18:06):
Yeah, what do you say, something along the lines of
training more for endurance in the long hall, you know,
which I think is I'm sure trickled down from the
front office and coaching staff that hey, maybe you're gonna
have to have a little bit higher workload this year.
We'll see what the rookie has. But we don't know.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
I mean if yeah, if you look at it, you know,
seventy seven carries his first season, one hundred and forty
nine a year or two one twenty last year. But
even in that one forty nine season hit sixty one catches,
so just over.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Two hundred touchdowns touches.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Yeah, so I would think he's around that number this year.
I mean, assuming health, which he never can, you know,
and last year he wasn't. When aske Hi about it,
I knew he'd be like, oh, I was fine, but
he was backed up last year. Yeah for a portion.
I mean, you ask an athlete that he's gonna be like, well,
I was out there, I was fine, you weren't.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
But that'sciate them.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
We appreciate the mentality and there's a lot of warrior
to you, but you are playing compromise and He's not
the only one on a football field. It's not one
hundred percent. I get that.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
But you know, I like to do a lot of
this with you guys when we do these type of
things again, particularly this time of year, when you can
have these conversations. If you go pie in the sky,
perfect scenario, right, everyone is healthy, everyone performs.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Yeah, what's up to? What you think they could be type?
Speaker 2 (19:24):
What's the what's the delegation look like at running back
this year?
Speaker 4 (19:28):
Hmmm? If we just do carries, I would say ten
percent to.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
Gain Well, I don't even if I guess it's ten.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
How about ten percent to other gain well or other
backs Jeff sweeps, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3 (19:45):
Yeah, if they have five hundred Yeah, you know you're
talking fifty Okay.
Speaker 4 (19:49):
Yeah, I mean if ninety, if ninety percent goes to
Johnson and Warren, I'd probably like carries to be fifty
three to Johnson percent Okay, you know, thirty seven, thirty
eight for Warren, but a way higher percentage of targets.
(20:09):
I might always be even say receptions, but targets to
Warren out of the Johnson Yeah, yeah, in the receiving game.
So I mean he's he just might end up being equalish.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
He's gone from twenty eight catches his first year sixty
one in year two.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
I don't think that's crazy to get the sixty.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
Ish, Yeah, thirty number thirty eight last.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Year, eight point two yards per reception.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
List, but they yeah, he makes he always seems to
have that knack. Yeah, definding the first down, that's a
big part of it.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Yeah, you know, like the nose for the first down.
Defensive guy's got a nose for the football. He's got
a nose for the first down. Yeah, you need six
yards to get you seven type type guy. And yeah,
I I I think that there's there's a real opportunity
for him at the start of the season. I would
feel like to make that a more difficult quite Yeah.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
No question. And again, the first segment we did today
was about trust, and he has that. I mean, like
so he definitely has the leg up. And it's not
even they're like a competition. I mean they're both going
to be in the mix no matter what. I mean,
assuming they're healthy, and.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
It's not gonna be one guy gets ninety of the car.
Speaker 4 (21:17):
Right and Johnson doesn't fall in his face, you know,
I mean that could happen to any rookie, of course,
but I mean I think he's in for a substantial year.
And I cited it like if you really break it down,
and I didn't want to nerd out too much with him,
but like yards per target, he's at the top of
(21:38):
the league. I mean, like again like McCaffrey levels. I
mean in terms of like the best receiving numbers in
all of football compared to other running backs.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Even that was six point six yards per target.
Speaker 4 (21:50):
It's great. I mean it's a huge number. R and
the yards after first contact things like that are really
really good for him, especially in the passing game. And
I'm trying to think, you know, what's rogers proclivity to
throw into backs. I don't think he's I think he'll
(22:11):
kind of just throw the open guy and be smart
with the football, you know.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
I do think he does like to throw the ball
off the backs, probably a little bit more than the
guys they had last year.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
I would say. I mean they did do a lot
of Wilson dump offs. I mean when in the big One,
the big shot wasn't there, he did a lot of
dump offs. They actually all forded Again, I nerded out
that Fields, Wilson, Rogers, and Rudolph were all high in
what PFF calls dump off percentage, which people be like, oh,
(22:42):
that's things. Sometimes a smart move, I mean, like dumping
into the back is better than Aaron Rodgers, Rudolph or
Wilson scrambling. I want to I want to get the
ball run.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Of his thirty eight catches last year, sixteen produced first half.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I was just looking at that, you know, So, yeah.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
If you don't know, if the change move changed, that's.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
That's the plan.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
No.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
I think he's one of the most important and best
Steelers offensive players. Yeah. Uh.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
Falling up on what Dale said, there, every all of
his three years close to about forty three forty four
to forty percent of his forty five percent of his
receptions have been for first downs. So his first season,
twenty eight receptions, fourteen of them were for first downs,
exactly fifty percent. I can do the math on that one.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
And he's out there on third and seven plus a lot.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Right right, it's not third and two. Yeah, second season,
sixty one receptions, nineteen of those were for first downs.
So that's thirty thirty a little under thirty three percent,
but still about one out of three. And then last season,
as Dale mentioned, thirty eight receptions for sixteen first downs.
That's a little over forty percent as well too, So
(23:48):
kind of in that range there of every other touch,
every third touch, and that's pretty substantial. And again you
look at the yards per reception seven point six, six
point one, eight point two, Like, I don't think it's
I don't think it's kind of a secret that the
trade is the train is a big fan of Jalen Warren.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
As it goes by the other thing, it changed man
of us over the last couple of years. People might say,
why why is that number down since his rookie year,
they actually have worked him more in on first and
second down. He's not just the third down back exactly.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
Yeah, And gain Well was very much a third down
back returner type. So I don't think he'll cut into
Warren's third third down stuff, but maybe a little which
might allow Warren to do more first time, so you
know what I mean, Like, I don't think Warren's workload
will shrink, but maybe when Gainwell's out, the usages little
(24:46):
would have been time would have been usual war in time.
And again it's a small percentage I mean again, I
think he gets up with ten percent of the touches
at most. You know, yeah, assuming health, which we should
never do.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Which we should wish we should never do. But at
the same time, I think it is more fun to
have these kind of pie in the sky.
Speaker 4 (25:01):
Yeah, what's the plan the blueprint going in?
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Everything's all, everything's all sunshine and rainbows, right, Yeah, it's
exciting in that regard. It feels like, and we talked
about this a little bit when we were having the
Arthur Smith offense conversation. This is like, I don't think
this is an insult to Naji. There was just some
square peg round hole stuff there of what Nause does well,
what Arthur Smith wanted the run game to be in
(25:25):
the balance that they were striking there, whereas you know now,
it feels like they are much more able to run
the full playbook in the way that Arthur Smith envisions
the run game.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Yeah, and again, Nause has some great strengths, no doubt.
It doesn't fumble, he plays every game, He's super consistent.
He is no fun at all to tackle. I mean,
he is bigger and looks better than any of their
backs right now. I mean like when they would do
running back drills right in front.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
Of him stand last couple of years like whoa.
Speaker 4 (25:53):
I mean, like he is a standout body type. He
has crazy long arms. But two of his weaknesses to me,
compared to lead backs vision and the ability to just
stick your foot in the ground home run too, but
the ability to stick your foot in the ground when
you do find that b gap and hit it and
(26:15):
accelerate like crazy. And he's not going to run away
from defensive backs in the open field. Now, I'm not
sure if any of the guys are going to run
away from open backs in the in the open field.
Johnson did it to college level, and his mouths per
hour stuff's really good. But Johnson's vision and the ability
to find that hole and hit it are his strengths.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
You know, he reads that zone run perfectly.
Speaker 4 (26:38):
At college in the Big ten. I mean, I'll do
it against the Ravens and Begels, you know what I mean.
So there's a learning curve, but those are his strengths.
I mean, he's the round peg in a round hole.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
The bang, the bend or the bounce right. That's the
zone read run game. That's what you're looking for, is
the running back correct.
Speaker 4 (26:53):
Yeah, wait for the you're not there's not a designed hole.
You pick one and then you attack it. You know, yes,
you stick that in the ground. I mean, Shanahan won't
always talk about Daddy Shanahan. You know, Clinton Portis and
those guys. Is you got a real athletic line that
that running back patient patient patient, page patient watch Yeah,
go now, yep, you know, and then you see what
(27:16):
you get.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
You know, I think, uh, it is it's it's a
very unique skill set that, like I said, I think, yeah,
that's the term that I always hear a bang bang,
bend bounce either you bang up inside right, you bend
around the tackle, or you bounce outside. That's kind of
the zone read and yeah, that ability to be decisive
in that moment, stick your foot in the ground and
(27:37):
go is a huge trait in vision and acceleration important.
Speaker 4 (27:43):
Yeah, they weren't nausey strengths.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Correct correct, and so that's you know again, maybe that's
kind of the theme of the day with some of
these conversations, is uh, the offense moving more towards the
square peg, square hole, round peg.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
And they've had a couple of years to build, right,
you know, right.
Speaker 4 (27:58):
And I'm sure Coach Smith would even tell you I couldn't.
I chose not to, not that I couldn't run as
much zone as I would have liked. Raft, Yeah, as
I thought he did see it. Actually, you know, so
I would think, assuming these guys are true, sometimes you
draft a round peg and you're like, well, he's kind
of oval. Yeah, you know, but assuming they are what
(28:22):
you think, you've added Gainwell and Johnson in particular, and
the lineman, you're going to see a higher percentage of
what he's most comfortable calling, and then the subsequent play
looks better off of it, you know. Then he set
up the next play better you set up you know,
maybe you're instead of third and four, you're in third
and three, and that adds up over the year. We
talked to me a long conversation last week about.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
The different four point one and four point four.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Yeah. I mean, if they could go a point two
yards per carry over the course of the year, it
might be two more wins. And when it's you know,
when you really put the bottom line.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
It's a lot more snaps for your offense. It's a
lot more time zession, it's a lot more first downs,
it's a lot of t. J. Watt and Alex high
Smith getting water on the sideline and resting.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
Yeah. Yeah, I mean less third and longs, et cetera,
et cetera. I mean it doesn't sound like much, but
when you break it down to yards per carry, you
can't be at the bottom of the league, and they
were at the bottom of the league. You know.
Speaker 3 (29:16):
That's especially if you're at the top in.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
Carries exactly because they're going to be in the top carries.
I think we know that. So it is even larger
ripple effect because of the volume.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
Just about a clear practice field here at the upmc
roody Sports Complex is day four is a wrap A
couple players, Miga Fitzpatrick over there talking to some media,
a couple other guys, just getting some last few extra
snaps in out here on a beautiful day in western Pennsylvania.
We have got to get to our last break. We'll
put a bow on today's coverage when we return on
(29:48):
the other side. This special edition of the Drive West
Yuler with Matt Williamson and Dale Lawley. It's all happening
right here on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
This is the Drive with Dale Lolly and Matt Williamson
on your twenty four to seven Home of the Black
and Gold Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
Final segment here of our Tuesday coverage, day number four
of OTAs, of course, practice four of six of the
OTAs the optional organized team activities before they will have
three mandatory capital M mandatory mini can't practices next week
as well on Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
That's making them an offer they can't refuse.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
Now, you can't leave.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
Somebody say on Twitter that I sound like the Godfather.
I could hear. I can see them come to me
on the day of the wedding. De Niro had to
work or not de Niro?
Speaker 2 (30:56):
Oh yeah, what was Yeah?
Speaker 4 (30:57):
I always forgiend.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
His name Brandrando, Marlon.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
Brando had to work to get this voice, had the
stuff his cheek. Yeah, I've not had to do that.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
And I think, like I remember reading that like one
of the things he used was almost like a similar
thing that they put in the mouth of horses to
like mess up his and like I guess, I guess,
I guess it gave well one of it was like
a metal piece thing, and I guess it gave him
like some some gum issues the rest of his like
the metal and the thing that he was, you know,
chewing on was good for his health.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Giving it up for your craft.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
That's what exactly right, Yeah, that's what.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
They Just sit here and.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
Don't lose your hair, though, then you'll be doing Doctor
Evil instead instead of Marlon Branda.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
It was just a cat runner on.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
Yeah, he just grabbed it.
Speaker 4 (31:41):
Make him a little more.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
Fantastic. I love it. No, Dale, Michael, we appreciate you.
We appreciate you toughing it out today. Dale. All right, gentlemen,
put a boat on this thing. Big picture conversation. I
feel like we talked to Jalen Warren today. We talked
a lot about the Arthur Smith offense. You know, some
of the reports of Gabe Davis coming here for a
visit this week. So big picture, open book question. As
(32:05):
we sit here today, Tuesday, June third, obviously a long
time away from September, well sometime away from September. Still,
which position group or the offense are you most confident.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
In running back, running back and tight end?
Speaker 3 (32:22):
I feel pretty confident in the offensive line.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Actually, I was hoping we were going to get some
different answers here. So let's let's dig into it, Matthew, I.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
Almost said the starting five offensive line. But I still
think there's a lot of questions, concerns, unknowns, depth of
the depth. Okay, in most years I've felt, certainly most
Omar team or built team years, I have felt better
about six through twelve than I do now.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Maybe felt like at least last year, like he had
eight potential starters in that hope at one point, right,
you know.
Speaker 4 (32:59):
The herbigs, you know, the guys that have been around
the block.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
Or and you still had Dan Moore with with the
two young tackle.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
Daniels, you know, and like McCormick was a fourth round
pick unknown that you know you're just hopeful for you
haven't seen yet. Right, But I will say to Flip
that I guess that's the best way I could put
it is, let's just just navigate the Omar years of
this time of year. I think I'm most confident today
(33:28):
compared to other years of one through five, sure, but
least confident of six through twelve.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
And I think that's a fair affair, you know, difference
to lay out there.
Speaker 4 (33:38):
Yeah, because I trust the young guys more than that word.
I mean, Fraser was an unknown last year. Now I
think he's a top five center.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
You know, we should talk about that a little bit,
moving up right now?
Speaker 4 (33:47):
Yeah, it might have moved up a spot. Yeah, it's
just in the last twenty four hours.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Absolutely, And you know what that short list might be
mostly in the AFC now that I'm thinking about Linderbaum
and Humphrey. Yeah, exactly, Okay, Dale offensive line? Was that
the group for you?
Speaker 3 (34:04):
I just have a lot of confidence in that. As
you guys said that young nucleus, I think they're going
to be really good, And to me, I just think
it's a group that's going to continue to improve as
they play more and more together.
Speaker 4 (34:21):
I think. I know a lot of people listening are
concerned about Roderick Jones too. And I'm not just saying
this to try to be optimistic, but he was a
lot better after the bye. I think his mind settled
down a lot. I do think left tackle, left tackle,
left tackle from here on out is good for him.
It can't be bad, for sure, you know what I mean.
And I'll be shocked if this isn't. I'll even set
(34:45):
the bar pretty low that this isn't clearly his best
season in the NFL. That would shock me if this
is not sure best season, you know, and the ceiling
is much higher.
Speaker 2 (34:55):
Than that, no doubt, no doubt. Okay, quick before we
get into confidence levels, because you mentioned the running back
in the tight end groups as well too, I gotta
follow up with you on your glowing Zach Fraser comment there.
It might be one of the best in the league,
particularly in the retirement of Frank Ragnow. For those who
have missed it, who might have been the best center
in the league was what a seven time pro bowler
at age twenty nine, just retiring with the Detroit Lions.
(35:19):
What's your give me, give me your I know this
is a little bit of a right turn, but you're
you got a pecking order of the centers right now,
like number one is, number two is? And where kind
of Zach would be on that for you going into
this year, I.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
Would say Creed Humphreys won. But I also think he
gets a little overrated because of his situation and always
being there.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Him running a lot of games right right right, Yeah,
Like I.
Speaker 4 (35:45):
Don't think he's dirt or webby, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3 (35:47):
I thought rag Now is number one? For me?
Speaker 4 (35:50):
Yeah, I think it was a competition between the two
for me and rag Noow's battles. That's why he retired.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
He said that in his statement, I just like to
say a great Frank Irrac. Now.
Speaker 4 (36:02):
Linderbaum's not for everyone because of his size, but I
think he's an exceptional player too. I mean, his movement's great,
his leverage is great.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
I would take Frasier over Linderbaumb just for team fit
across the league.
Speaker 4 (36:16):
Yeah, that's what you're saying.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
I just think he fits fits more schemes that Yep.
I get what you're saying.
Speaker 4 (36:20):
They both have a great wrestling background, which isn't uncommon
for that position.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
One hundred and fifty nine and two. That was Zach
Fraser's high school wrestling record.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
And did you say his first los?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
His first loss? Was it his freshman year? He got
DQ because he didn't understand the rules, and then he
beat that same guy again in the I think the
state semi finals.
Speaker 4 (36:37):
So maybe you could throw that one out.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
So I think one true loss his his entire high
school wrestling career. Yeah, but you think he could be
in that next group right behind those guys this year
or is he maybe already In that conversation.
Speaker 4 (36:48):
He'll be a perennial pro bowler. If not all pro,
I mean, I think he'll be an occasional all Pro
and a perennial pro bowler.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
The stuff that he does the kind of separates him
to me is getting that initial block and then getting
to the second, getting that secondary block as well, and
just finishing.
Speaker 4 (37:09):
Yeah, I'd say finishing is as certainly a strength. Yeah,
his highlight tape is really fun.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
If you're playing against Zach Fraser as a defensive lineman
or an inside backer, you know you're gonna end up
on your back.
Speaker 2 (37:25):
He's gonna get hands all the times.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Yeah, a couple of times, There's no question about it.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
And you guys say that too. I still remember when
Andy Widel spoke for the first time last year post draft,
he talked about that. He was like, I went down
to Morgantown for that BYU game. He was like those
those poor BYU players, Zach Fraser was getting hands on
all of them, just mauling dudes on every player. They
had two hundred and ten rushing yards in the first
half type thing. And Yeah, I think I think he'll
(37:50):
really endear himself.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
The thing about the b YU guys excuse.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Me, think about the twenty five year old men.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
There are twenty five year old man.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
Right.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
It's not Mormon missions, a bunch of eighteen year olds.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
Right right, And they're not Ohio State or Iowa, but
they're they're a pretty pretty solid program every year to
putting putting good dudes in the NFL. And yeah, his
his tape against them was exceptional.
Speaker 4 (38:11):
And of course there's other good centers we didn't mention,
you know, like Barton with with Tampa's really really promising
after his rookie year, the rare first round pick that
and he lived up to it. And but that being said,
I mean to Dale's point, if I'm picking up, I mean,
if I can take any center from here on out,
Fraser's definitely in the conversation.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
And you've got you've got him after one year, but
you've got him clearly ahead of Barton and Jackson, Powers Johnson.
Speaker 4 (38:38):
Ahead of Powers Johnson for sure. I think Barton's in
that same tier. I mean, he was part of a
really really good line. Sure, And to give Barton credit,
he's only been a center for one year, I mean, true, true, Yeah,
I was making a case for Barton, who's like well,
he probably had to iron a lot out. I mean,
I haven't studied, but they're extremely promising.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Yeah, Zach Frasier played the second most I want to say,
had the second most starts I believe for an offensive
lineman in program history at W and all of them
except for his first he had his first two guard
and then was center from freshman year on the rest
of the way.
Speaker 4 (39:17):
Okay, but many of those draft prospects are like, oh,
he's an interior lineman. I mean he was. He was
a center, right right, which is part of the reason
I think he got him where you did. I think
so too, right, I mean, how many teams really needed
a center only?
Speaker 2 (39:29):
But also I think why he was such a good
fit for the Steelers because they needed a center.
Speaker 4 (39:32):
And they also value that position. Going back to Webby, yep,
maybe more than anything.
Speaker 2 (39:36):
Elaite and dirt, pouncy and hardings. I mean, they've had
it's crazy, They've had four guys that have been all pros,
right right, super Bowl champions.
Speaker 4 (39:45):
Yeah, rare stuff.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
Okay, Matt, we got a few minutes left here. You
initially before getting an offensive line, when I asked that
kind of confidence question, you quickly mentioned running back and
tight end as well too.
Speaker 4 (39:56):
Yeah, I don't have a lot of worries there. I
don't know that there's pro galore. I'm not sure that
Franco Bettis. You know, those guys are in those two rooms.
But I keep coming back to Darnel Washington is one
of the harder players to play against in the league.
I mean, honestly, I.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Mean just from a matchup standpoint, the rightness.
Speaker 4 (40:17):
Of his body type, his physicality, and it's not just
he's only a blocker and can't do anything else. I
still think he's got a lot left in the tank.
I thought he's one of the most improved Steelers from
rookie year to last year. I think you know what
you have in Friarmuth, and frankly, I'm hoping his targets
and usage is trending up. And I know a lot
(40:38):
of people will look at the Friarmuth and be like,
he probably is what he is at this point, and
I beg to differ because I can't. There's so many
studies that age twenty seven is about when tight ends
start to really hit their stride. I think he's twenty six.
He's getting in that neighborhood and.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Now middle linebackers. Oh, like, they don't typically come out
and set the world on fire right away.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
It's a really hard adjustment period. Like I'll never forget
its one of the first years I was invited to
do mini camps or these camps, and they always give
you the new guy. And Vance McDonald sat down with us, yep,
just like Jenn Warren did, and I told him that,
I'm like, so, you know, the average tight end starts
to hit their stride at like age twenty seven, but
(41:20):
then they usually fade away slow. I mean think of
like Gates, Witten, Gainst, Alliss, Heith. You know, like once
you kind of figure it out.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
There's not a real gradual declay. It's a quick takeoff
and a quick landing.
Speaker 4 (41:31):
Right, you know. I mean Kelsey, I mean like these
guys last a long time once they hit their stride
around age twenty seven. McDonald didn't know that. He's like, wow,
that's really interesting, and he's like, boy, does that make sense.
I mean it was.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
Like got to got to get your grown man's strength
and body and yeah, you.
Speaker 3 (41:48):
Just has to do so many different things, yeah, you know.
Speaker 4 (41:50):
And understanding the holes and zones at this level, and
you know how I can use my body and man
coverage and things like that too and do enough as
a blocker. But it was like I hit him in
the face with a shovel. Oh that makes a lot
of sense. And he was like twenty six at the
time or whatever, kind of got a smile like that.
All right, Yeah, yeah, I get it.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Yeah, Yeah, that that's I'm with you on. I think
that's I think the way you put that was good.
We're not necessary, it's not necessarily looking at the running
back room or the tight end room and saying there's
a perennial All Pro and maybe even a future gold
jacket guy in there.
Speaker 4 (42:24):
A lot of worry.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
But but it feels like the floor is very high.
You know what you've got, right, You know what ingredients
you're cooking with, and they're pretty good ingredients. They might
not be U you know Michelin chef five star ingredients, right,
but you can make a really stinking good meal. At
the same time, it's a it's a good.
Speaker 4 (42:39):
Burger exact burger season now, not to like rain on
the parade, but go ahead, pre pickings trade.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
I would have said, wide receiver, I think so too.
Speaker 4 (42:49):
Yeah, I mean without a question, because you.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
Would have had the proven perennial Pro Bowl or All
Pro type and DK.
Speaker 4 (42:55):
Now I would have had some concerns with Pickings volatility
as a human being and on the field, but that
was a real strength that now would to be determined,
you know what I mean, playing against those two with
Austin and Wilson as your three or Woods or whoever.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
Okay, and that how that has kind of flipped and
gone the opposite direction. I think we can easily see
the quarterback position flipping and going north. Whereas if you
get the guy that that we've all been talking about,
as you're number one, you feel really good about Mason
as your number two, then you've got a guy like
Will Howard who you can bring along and see what
he's got over the course of a couple.
Speaker 4 (43:30):
Of years where they're supposed to go right.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Yeah, right, I think that would be a similar kind
of you could see in the way that the wide
receiver group we maybe felt a little differently about, I
think we could in a better way feel that about
the quarterback position still obviously as well. Yeah, gentlemen, good
stuff here today, so far from down at the facility.
It was stuff. Listen, I got I gotta, I gotta,
(43:57):
I gotta give you, I gotta give you credit. Yeah,
especially when you you know, when you knew that. It's
not like if you would have called off, you'd be
leaving Matt hanging. I mean, you know him, him and
I him and I would have been here. But we
do appreciate your valiant efforts here today, certainly.
Speaker 5 (44:11):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (44:11):
That will do it for our coverage for day number
four here of OTA's same thing the next two days,
your knuckleheads Wednesday and Thursday ten to one here on
Steelers Nation Radio, on the Steelers Audio Network, and on
Fox Sports Pittsburgh three hours of coverage because you already
know nobody covers your Pittsburgh Steelers like we do on
Steelers Nation Radio. But that will do it for today.
(44:32):
We will talk to Yen's tomorrow for CJ down here
on site newly engage CJ two by the way, relations
to young CJ uh and of course our guy justin
back at the ranch for producing it and punching all
the buttons for.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
Us who is not engaged.
Speaker 2 (44:49):
I don't know things got change in the last couple
hours here or whatever. No but yes, who is still
available and handsome out there ladies For Matt Williamson and
Dale Lawley. I'm Wes Euler. We'll talk to you tomorrow.
As always, you know where to find us. It's been
a special edition of The Drive on your twenty four
to seven home of the Black and Gold Steelers Nation
Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
This is The Drive with Dale Lolly and Matt Williamson
on your twenty four to seven home of the Black
and Gold Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:18):
Final Hour on this beautiful Tuesday from the South side
of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania at the upmc rooney Sports Complex, day
number four of OTA's for our special three hour edition
of The Drive. Of course, Dale Lolly and Matt Williamson,
this is their program. I am helping and assisting throughout
this process a little bit more so than today.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
Because my voice will not allow me to lift anybody higher.
Speaker 2 (00:44):
You're like the like the you know, like the eighth
graders who just start lifting and they're like in there
just working just the bench with no weights on it
to get their form right and everything right.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
You just have if I can get words out.
Speaker 2 (00:55):
Sounded pretty good, right now, let's let's I don't want
to jinx it. So yeah, final hour here today. Like
I said, a few more minutes left in practice. May
about fifteen twenty minutes from now. Will be joined by
Jalen Warren for a few minutes as well. But Matt,
I did want to look because I mean I think
that this is a again one fun exercise too. It's
this time of year and we've got the kind of
(01:16):
time to focus on these things. A little bit on
what you touched on there at the end of the segment,
NFL regular season wins since two thousand. But did you
have and I'm sorry, I know I kind of put
you on the spot here. You said the Steelers had
the fifth most playoff wins since two thousand? Correct? Yes,
do you do you know like exactly what the number
(01:37):
was and the other teams that were around him. I
do believe. I remember I saw you put in was
its fifteen playoff wins for the Steelers. I want to
say in that time period. Okay, yeah, rolling through my
fifth most since two thousand with fifteen if you do it?
How about this? Because I saw you retweet this and
people and your mentions. Of course, some people were saying,
(01:57):
all right, well, now just do it. In the Mike
Tomlin era, they actually moved to third most playoffs right
as an organization in the Mike Tomlin era. Again, this
is like, this is the the context of high expectations.
Like I just laid out, I would rather expect my
team to be the New York Yankees and the Dodgers
than the Pittsburgh Pirates. I would rather have those expectations,
(02:20):
but I think it is important to, you know, at
times and in the offseason again, differentiate the forest through
the trees.
Speaker 4 (02:27):
No question about it. I mean, when it's hard to
win games, and this is not an excuse, but winmen
playoff games is really really difficult in this sport. I
mean they're one shot. You get one shot. And I
talk about this all the time that the Super Bowl
(02:47):
champ either won three or four games, the Super Bowl
runner up won three or two. I think there's only
thirteen playoff wins to give out every year. There's total
of thirteen of them, right right, right, I mean everyone
that wins round one and then you know the half
of them are limited after that. I mean there's only
thirteen playoff wins a given out by the league per year.
Speaker 2 (03:11):
And I was gonna say playoffs, right yeah.
Speaker 4 (03:15):
And it's harder now than ever. I mean to So
if you're five hundred as a quarterback or a coach
in your playoff career, that's pretty good. It's really good.
I mean it's really really good. If you can win
half of them is really really good. And that doesn't again,
none of this excuses how things have gone in the
(03:36):
playoffs with Late in the season of late. But when
you really look at these numbers too, since like two
thousand and who has the playoff wins and who doesn't,
or so much of it as quarterback driven. I mean,
they win playoff games with Ben, they don't without them,
you know. I mean, I cited Belichick. He Belichick has
a losing record when Brady's not his starter. He's got
(03:59):
the best wreck or you've ever seen with Brady as
a starter. Now one has something to do with the other.
Noel Bradshaw's, Montana Walsh, whatever. But man, when you looked
at these numbers, you know, Rogers with Green Bay was third,
you know, I mean the Colts are really high with
Manning and then Lock. I mean, like none of them
are super successful over a long stretch without great quarterback play.
(04:23):
I mean, I'm not even talking about league average.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
And even with that, nothing is still guaranteed. Because as you,
I know said on this show, you and I have
talked about it when we've done crossover shows and stuff.
You think Josh Allen might bring him up one of
the best playoff quarterbacks you've ever seen in your life. Yes,
and he's got a losing record and he still hasn't
been to a super Bowl.
Speaker 4 (04:40):
Yeah, I mean so even over the.
Speaker 2 (04:41):
Losing record in the postseason, I believe, I think so,
I think just fit. Yeah, it does ever rang, Yes,
we know that has he ever hasn't even been has
even gotten there.
Speaker 4 (04:50):
So there was a Warren Sharp in a deep study.
Speaker 2 (04:53):
On seven and six. Josh Allen is in the playoffs,
so one game above.
Speaker 4 (04:56):
Fives as of last year he was below.
Speaker 2 (04:58):
Correct.
Speaker 4 (04:59):
You know, people would assume over these last five six,
seven years the Chiefs era that Mahomes has been the
best playoff quarterback in football. It's Allen and it's really
not even close. I mean, Mahomes is phenomenal to playoffs,
but with just postseason numbers advanced.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
At just isolating, just isolating, not look at the win
loss record and all that stuff, it's.
Speaker 4 (05:23):
Like some of the best. It's he's one of the
best playoff quarterbacks. Ever, does that make him a loser?
You know? And like if he never gets a ring
or if he'd retire today, I mean, like it makes
me crazy, you know, Like a big thing I always
talk about, especially these AFC quarterbacks, is like they draft,
Caleb Williams the first overall, or even like Jayde Daniels did,
(05:43):
Jane Daniels will get a ring, Yeah, he probably will.
Speaker 2 (05:47):
I get where you're going with.
Speaker 4 (05:48):
Yeah, the best is the AFC lately though, Like.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
You only give away one ring a year, you.
Speaker 4 (05:51):
Only give one away a year. And if Mahomes and
Brady have twelve of them between them, just do the math,
you know, like even at this point of their career,
if I told you Josh Allen will get a ring,
yes or no?
Speaker 2 (06:04):
Yes, but but again you've got to look every year, right, Lamar,
I mean I would lean towards alone.
Speaker 4 (06:13):
I would lean let alone.
Speaker 2 (06:15):
Let alone too or multiple appearances You mentioned towards no,
and he's been he's been to one, you know. And
and you mentioned like a guy like Aaron Rodgers, who
you said the third most playoff wins in that period.
He got the one super Bowl, he's got the one
super Bowl.
Speaker 4 (06:31):
And Rogers of two that really stand out to me
when you compare them to Bend, like they each have
one ring, which is really an unbelievable accomplishment, and all
those postseason wins. But people don't realize how hard it
is in the postseason. I mean again, only one of
those AFC quarterbacks can win it every year. Correct, and
Mahomes has been awfulized it a little bit.
Speaker 2 (06:51):
It has it's it's it's it is interesting when you
look at that and you go, okay, just in a vacuum,
you think this quarterback's got the juice to win a
Super Bowl. We'd probably say yes, about four or five guys.
You haven't to this point, right, Burrow and Allen and
Lamar and you know the Dave Lawrence was.
Speaker 4 (07:04):
Drafted win a super Bowl. Yeah, he's gonna play fifteen years.
He'll get one, you know, or after Stroud's rookie year,
unbelievable rookie year, he'll get one. Well that means Allen
didn't that year, or Borrow or Lar or you know,
no doubt.
Speaker 2 (07:15):
Or Mahomes didn't get another you know, right Jalen Hurts
who now has one as well too. Yeah, it's it
is and it's the whole. Like you said, there's there's
one game, you know, and there's it's a very short tournament.
There's one game you play bad for sixty minutes, see
you later. You know it is you catch you.
Speaker 4 (07:33):
The week that your best guys are hurt.
Speaker 3 (07:34):
Or you know, it's not a bad quarter or whatever.
Speaker 4 (07:37):
You yeah, yeah, dude, your kicker hits you up right,
and we lost by.
Speaker 2 (07:41):
One, right, the Chicago Bears double dooint, right, and you
and you're still kind of trying to recover from.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
There's less luck involved when there's seven game series. I
can have a bad Tuesday night and get blown out
and come back and win the series.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Oh, absolutely, you see you you see that all the time.
To use the local example like that those years was
a sixteen and seventeen when the Pens went to the Cup.
They had a couple of game against San Jose, game
against Nashville where they got crushed. But it's fine. You
come back to you come back two nights later, you go,
you know baseball like you might. You might get shallax
seven to one the one night, but the next night
you come back, new pitcher on the mound, go out
(08:13):
and get a victory, and it's a different story. Yeah,
the the one and done.
Speaker 4 (08:18):
The Mazarowski year, every loss to the yes, right, they
lost by crushed.
Speaker 2 (08:23):
They lost in the run differential in that series. Didn't
they buy like the substantial amount, but.
Speaker 4 (08:29):
The game they squeaked out by one run, but they
won four of the seven.
Speaker 2 (08:32):
But exactly right, it's it's a it's a completely different beast,
you know in the NFL postseason. I think that's part
of the reason why you know, we as a country
all love March madness so much. Right, it's that same
kind of pressure cooker, won and done. We've seen now
multiple times where a sixteen seed is beaten a one
seed now because you got you got one team plays
well for a day. One team doesn't exactly have it.
(08:52):
You have a slow first half something like that, and.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Jalen Warren making his way off the field here.
Speaker 2 (08:59):
So excellent, sounds good. Let's yeah, let's we'll stay here then,
since we've still got some time in this thank you
for the for the heads updal We will be talking
to Steelers running back Jalen Warren momentarily. Yes, practice number
four in the books here of OTA's first one of
this week. It'll be the same Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday schedule.
I didn't say this at the top of the show.
(09:20):
We will be here with you for the just like
we had last week, three hours every single day from
ten until one o'clock for all these Ota practices next
week for Mini camp as well too. I'm not sure
if our broadcast schedule will be exactly the same for
Many camp next week, but we will be down here
in terms of the same hours and and everything. I'm
not sure if there's any if there's any shift in
in the Steelers timing or anything like that. As as
(09:44):
we get ready here here it comes for Steelers running
back number thirty. Here Jalen Warren sitting down with us
after practice number four. Jalen, thank you for taking the
time to be here, and good getting out there in
the sunshine in the war weather today, right.
Speaker 5 (10:01):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it was good. It was great to
be with the team.
Speaker 3 (10:05):
Have you excuse me?
Speaker 4 (10:10):
That's like I was like, you looked from it, but
not the boy.
Speaker 3 (10:16):
So, you know, your first couple of years you're splitting
time with Naugy, do you approach things a little differently
this year with him going uh?
Speaker 6 (10:25):
I mean, you know, as a baseline, you know, first
and foremost, I'm gonna just play the game. I know,
you know, play same football that I've been playing since
I was eight years old, but maybe with a little
bit more urgency and knowing that there's younger dudes you know,
such as kJ that I gotta you know, I want
to show the ropes to you know, have him have
a you know, a good uh, a good start to
the NFL.
Speaker 5 (10:46):
And so yeah, like I'll do my thing.
Speaker 3 (10:48):
I become that guy. You know they're gonna follow.
Speaker 5 (10:51):
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 6 (10:52):
So I know if they look up to me, I
don't want to you know, put put them in the
in the wrong point them in the wrong direction.
Speaker 5 (10:58):
I want to do what I can to put them
in the right direction.
Speaker 4 (11:01):
You mentioned Caleb. How's he adjusting? I mean, how's he
in the running back meeting room? Is the understanding protections.
Speaker 6 (11:07):
And yeah, yeah, and he's definitely Yeah, he's definitely adapting,
very attentative, Like yeah, you can see the growth.
Speaker 5 (11:14):
You know.
Speaker 6 (11:15):
I'm glad, you know, seeing him come in and take
on that role, knowing like he's not bs and around.
He knows like we he's a great player and we
want to use that player on the field. And so
I'm glad he's come in with that approach.
Speaker 3 (11:27):
I'm saying it in terms of your your situation and
where you're at in your career, did you approach this
season or this offseason differently.
Speaker 5 (11:41):
Yeah, one d P. Yeah, I approached this off season differently.
Speaker 6 (11:44):
I did a lot of you know, a lot more
things to you know, for longevity wise, instead of my
old school training, you know, just get cleats on the
run thirty hills. You know, I had to adapt to
you know, this game is about longevity, and like they say,
the best availability or the best ability is availability.
Speaker 4 (12:01):
That's really interesting. How much I mean, now you've been
in the league several years, how much is your body
and training habits changed since your rookie year or year
to year.
Speaker 6 (12:09):
I mean I still I still you know, I'm still
I still go hard, as you know, in training, I
exert myself. Uh. The only thing I've incorporated was you know, recovery.
My recovery has been a major factor of my training.
So it's keeping up with Yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:28):
Okay, have you added weight? Gain weight since your rookie year?
You're trying to keep your body basically.
Speaker 6 (12:32):
Oh since my yeah, my, since my rookie year, I
probably gained more. I definitely gained more muscle, you know, definitely.
Speaker 4 (12:37):
Uh, without losing quickness or speed or.
Speaker 5 (12:40):
Yeah, yeah, yes, sir, great, I feel great.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
This is obviously a run first offense and It's one
that I'm sure running backs left the play. As Arthur says, Look,
there's five hundred carries or the five hundred touches. Do
you feel like you're ready to get three hundred of those?
Speaker 5 (13:00):
Yes? Or yes not, no doubt about it. And that's
that's the way I'm training.
Speaker 2 (13:06):
Not only a run first offense. But I got to
think it's pretty exciting. You see over the last couple
of seasons, the investment in that offensive line in free
agency and high you know, capital draft picks. You excited
to run behind that group this year with more continuity,
more experience.
Speaker 6 (13:20):
Yeah, yeah, more the chemistry you know obviously is building.
You know they worked together last year. I'm excited to
run behind them this year.
Speaker 4 (13:27):
So you've been a huge force in the passing game.
And I don't even know if you're aware of this,
but some of the real like advanced numbers have you
right there with like Christian McCaffrey as a receiver. I
mean some of the really breakdown numbers. You're at the
absolute top of the league. But I think people don't
realize how important and how good you are in pass
protection and how much pride and how much time do
(13:48):
you have to put into knowing your assignment and actually
getting that guy blocked.
Speaker 6 (13:53):
Yeah, you know, I've been told that I'm grad I've
been told that i'm you know, not so great as
far as uh you know, an idle look forward too,
because sometimes my techniques as not as you know, clinic,
just because when it comes to past protection, I look
at it as like mano, I mano, Like I'm in
a fight and I don't want to. You know, every
(14:16):
five percent of the league's taller than me, but I'm
a I'm a hey, hey, I'm a I'm gonna pack
that punch.
Speaker 5 (14:21):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 6 (14:22):
Like, I look at it like I'm not losing man
against man. I'm willing to if I got whatever I
gotta do to protect my quarterback. I'm just my technique
might not be good, but he gonna fill my pop.
Speaker 4 (14:33):
Is that a constant challenge to keep your technique improving? Yeah?
Speaker 5 (14:36):
Yeah, yeah, you work it every day.
Speaker 4 (14:38):
I thought.
Speaker 3 (14:38):
So, yeah, that's one thing Caleb actually said about you.
It's like I want to be as good in past
protection as Jalen. And so I watched that and is
that kind of cool to think the guys are watching.
Speaker 5 (14:53):
You Yeah, that's cool.
Speaker 6 (14:54):
Uh, you know, and I think that speaks more about
Kleb because you know he's that's to my point, like
he's coming. He's really trying to get, you know, work
on the things that he feels like, you know, he needs.
And I can see that, like all of us can
see him trying to him doing whatever it takes to
get better.
Speaker 3 (15:10):
Kenneth in that room.
Speaker 4 (15:12):
Yeah, just won a super Bowl. That has to have
some Yeah, yeah, a little bit.
Speaker 5 (15:17):
Yeah, he brings that knowledge, he brings the you know,
like does he ever.
Speaker 4 (15:21):
Bring the written around That's probably somewhere.
Speaker 6 (15:26):
Yeah, yeah, right now he hasn't done that. But no,
Kenn's is definitely a great fit for you know what
we got going on here too.
Speaker 4 (15:32):
True professional Ye see why you be part of a
super Champion Yeah, yeah, I'm sure a lot.
Speaker 5 (15:37):
Of in bought into the process everything.
Speaker 4 (15:40):
Absolutely.
Speaker 2 (15:42):
Jayalen Warren kind enough to give us a few minutes
of his time here after OTA practice number four, Thank
you so much for taking the time here for us.
Speaker 5 (15:48):
Thank you.
Speaker 2 (15:49):
We have got to get to a break. When we
come back on the other side. We will continue our
final hour here of O t A's coverage on Steelers
Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (16:01):
At least is the Drive with Dale Lolly and Matt
Williamson on your twenty four to seven home of the
Black and Gold Steelers Nation.
Speaker 2 (16:10):
Radio back on the South Side here as practice number
four in the books for your Pittsburgh Steelers. As this
week underway, we will be back with you. As I mentioned,
Wednesday and Thursday, same time frame from ten to one.
(16:31):
We will again have the Tuesday, Wednesday Thursday shows next week.
I don't want to promise you it's at the same
time because I'm not sure of that, but we will
obviously keep everybody posted and updated.
Speaker 3 (16:41):
I promise you my voice will be better, I hope.
Speaker 2 (16:45):
I promise you. I hope you know. I hope so too, Dale,
Not because you know, today has been extra strenuous or anything.
I like hanging out and doing shows down here with
you guys. And I mean I do work in radio, right,
so I do at least somewhat like the sound of
my own voice. But yes, I hope you, for your
sake and for your loyal listener's sake here on the Drive,
(17:05):
get back to it feeling like yourself. Matt Jalen Warren
is certainly a guy who's looking like himself and what
is obviously I'm not landing on the moon here, I'm
not breaking any news, but a huge year for him
and not just his Black and Gold future, but his
NFL future.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
Yeah, and I don't think people look at him in
this light, but since he's been a Steeler, I absolutely
think he's been one of their top three offensive weapons.
I mean in terms of just big playability, consistency, versatility,
you know who you want to get the ball in
their hands and good things happen. He's really really high
on that list of wide receivers tight ends that he's
(17:41):
played with, you know, since you just been here, and
I expect that to be very much the same this year.
I Mean, we're all excited about Caleb Johnson and he's
a powerful, explosive player that fits the scheme really well.
But I know what you're getting at Warren, right, you know,
And yeah, the receiving game stuff is off the charts.
He's a heck of a back just hnd them the
football too, no matter what the scheme is.
Speaker 3 (18:01):
And I like the fact that he said he's ready
for those three hundred touches. Yeah, because he's never had that.
Speaker 4 (18:06):
Yeah, what do you say, something along the lines of
training more for endurance in the long hall, you know,
which I think is I'm sure trickled down from the
front office and coaching staff that hey, maybe you're gonna
have to have a little bit higher workload this year.
We'll see what the rookie has. But we don't know.
Speaker 3 (18:23):
I mean if yeah, if you look at it, you know,
seventy seven carries his first season, one hundred and forty
nine a year or two one twenty last year. But
even in that one forty nine season hit sixty one catches,
so just over.
Speaker 2 (18:40):
Two hundred touchdowns touches.
Speaker 4 (18:41):
Yeah, so I would think he's around that number this year.
I mean, assuming health, which he never can, you know,
and last year he wasn't. When aske Hi about it,
I knew he'd be like, oh, I was fine, but
he was backed up last year. Yeah for a portion.
I mean, you ask an athlete that he's gonna be like, well,
I was out there, I was fine, you weren't.
Speaker 2 (18:59):
But that'sciate them.
Speaker 4 (19:00):
We appreciate the mentality and there's a lot of warrior
to you, but you are playing compromise and He's not
the only one on a football field. It's not one
hundred percent. I get that.
Speaker 2 (19:08):
But you know, I like to do a lot of
this with you guys when we do these type of
things again, particularly this time of year, when you can
have these conversations. If you go pie in the sky,
perfect scenario, right, everyone is healthy, everyone performs.
Speaker 4 (19:22):
Yeah, what's up to? What you think they could be type?
Speaker 2 (19:24):
What's the what's the delegation look like at running back
this year?
Speaker 4 (19:28):
Hmmm? If we just do carries, I would say ten
percent to.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
Gain Well, I don't even if I guess it's ten.
Speaker 4 (19:37):
How about ten percent to other gain well or other
backs Jeff sweeps, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3 (19:45):
Yeah, if they have five hundred Yeah, you know you're
talking fifty Okay.
Speaker 4 (19:49):
Yeah, I mean if ninety, if ninety percent goes to
Johnson and Warren, I'd probably like carries to be fifty
three to Johnson percent Okay, you know, thirty seven, thirty
eight for Warren, but a way higher percentage of targets.
(20:09):
I might always be even say receptions, but targets to
Warren out of the Johnson Yeah, yeah, in the receiving game.
So I mean he's he just might end up being equalish.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
He's gone from twenty eight catches his first year sixty
one in year two.
Speaker 4 (20:25):
I don't think that's crazy to get the sixty.
Speaker 3 (20:27):
Ish, Yeah, thirty number thirty eight last.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Year, eight point two yards per reception.
Speaker 3 (20:33):
List, but they yeah, he makes he always seems to
have that knack. Yeah, definding the first down, that's a
big part of it.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Yeah, you know, like the nose for the first down.
Defensive guy's got a nose for the football. He's got
a nose for the first down. Yeah, you need six
yards to get you seven type type guy. And yeah,
I I I think that there's there's a real opportunity
for him at the start of the season. I would
feel like to make that a more difficult quite Yeah.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
No question. And again, the first segment we did today
was about trust, and he has that. I mean, like
so he definitely has the leg up. And it's not
even they're like a competition. I mean they're both going
to be in the mix no matter what. I mean,
assuming they're healthy, and.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
It's not gonna be one guy gets ninety of the car.
Speaker 4 (21:17):
Right and Johnson doesn't fall in his face, you know,
I mean that could happen to any rookie, of course,
but I mean I think he's in for a substantial year.
And I cited it like if you really break it down,
and I didn't want to nerd out too much with him,
but like yards per target, he's at the top of
(21:38):
the league. I mean, like again like McCaffrey levels. I
mean in terms of like the best receiving numbers in
all of football compared to other running backs.
Speaker 3 (21:47):
Even that was six point six yards per target.
Speaker 4 (21:50):
It's great. I mean it's a huge number. R and
the yards after first contact things like that are really
really good for him, especially in the passing game. And
I'm trying to think, you know, what's rogers proclivity to
throw into backs. I don't think he's I think he'll
(22:11):
kind of just throw the open guy and be smart
with the football, you know.
Speaker 3 (22:14):
I do think he does like to throw the ball
off the backs, probably a little bit more than the
guys they had last year.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
I would say. I mean they did do a lot
of Wilson dump offs. I mean when in the big One,
the big shot wasn't there, he did a lot of
dump offs. They actually all forded Again, I nerded out
that Fields, Wilson, Rogers, and Rudolph were all high in
what PFF calls dump off percentage, which people be like, oh,
(22:42):
that's things. Sometimes a smart move, I mean, like dumping
into the back is better than Aaron Rodgers, Rudolph or
Wilson scrambling. I want to I want to get the
ball run.
Speaker 3 (22:52):
Of his thirty eight catches last year, sixteen produced first half.
Speaker 2 (22:56):
I was just looking at that, you know, So, yeah.
Speaker 3 (22:59):
If you don't know, if the change move changed, that's.
Speaker 4 (23:01):
That's the plan.
Speaker 3 (23:02):
No.
Speaker 4 (23:02):
I think he's one of the most important and best
Steelers offensive players. Yeah. Uh.
Speaker 2 (23:07):
Falling up on what Dale said, there, every all of
his three years close to about forty three forty four
to forty percent of his forty five percent of his
receptions have been for first downs. So his first season,
twenty eight receptions, fourteen of them were for first downs,
exactly fifty percent. I can do the math on that one.
Speaker 4 (23:24):
And he's out there on third and seven plus a lot.
Speaker 2 (23:27):
Right right, it's not third and two. Yeah, second season,
sixty one receptions, nineteen of those were for first downs.
So that's thirty thirty a little under thirty three percent,
but still about one out of three. And then last season,
as Dale mentioned, thirty eight receptions for sixteen first downs.
That's a little over forty percent as well too, So
(23:48):
kind of in that range there of every other touch,
every third touch, and that's pretty substantial. And again you
look at the yards per reception seven point six, six
point one, eight point two, Like, I don't think it's
I don't think it's kind of a secret that the
trade is the train is a big fan of Jalen Warren.
Speaker 3 (24:07):
As it goes by the other thing, it changed man
of us over the last couple of years. People might say,
why why is that number down since his rookie year,
they actually have worked him more in on first and
second down. He's not just the third down back exactly.
Speaker 4 (24:25):
Yeah, And gain Well was very much a third down
back returner type. So I don't think he'll cut into
Warren's third third down stuff, but maybe a little which
might allow Warren to do more first time, so you
know what I mean, Like, I don't think Warren's workload
will shrink, but maybe when Gainwell's out, the usages little
(24:46):
would have been time would have been usual war in time.
And again it's a small percentage I mean again, I
think he gets up with ten percent of the touches
at most. You know, yeah, assuming health, which we should
never do.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Which we should wish we should never do. But at
the same time, I think it is more fun to
have these kind of pie in the sky.
Speaker 4 (25:01):
Yeah, what's the plan the blueprint going in?
Speaker 2 (25:04):
Everything's all, everything's all sunshine and rainbows, right, Yeah, it's
exciting in that regard. It feels like, and we talked
about this a little bit when we were having the
Arthur Smith offense conversation. This is like, I don't think
this is an insult to Naji. There was just some
square peg round hole stuff there of what Nause does well,
what Arthur Smith wanted the run game to be in
(25:25):
the balance that they were striking there, whereas you know now,
it feels like they are much more able to run
the full playbook in the way that Arthur Smith envisions
the run game.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Yeah, and again, Nause has some great strengths, no doubt.
It doesn't fumble, he plays every game, He's super consistent.
He is no fun at all to tackle. I mean,
he is bigger and looks better than any of their
backs right now. I mean like when they would do
running back drills right in front.
Speaker 2 (25:51):
Of him stand last couple of years like whoa.
Speaker 4 (25:53):
I mean, like he is a standout body type. He
has crazy long arms. But two of his weaknesses to me,
compared to lead backs vision and the ability to just
stick your foot in the ground home run too, but
the ability to stick your foot in the ground when
you do find that b gap and hit it and
(26:15):
accelerate like crazy. And he's not going to run away
from defensive backs in the open field. Now, I'm not
sure if any of the guys are going to run
away from open backs in the in the open field.
Johnson did it to college level, and his mouths per
hour stuff's really good. But Johnson's vision and the ability
to find that hole and hit it are his strengths.
Speaker 2 (26:35):
You know, he reads that zone run perfectly.
Speaker 4 (26:38):
At college in the Big ten. I mean, I'll do
it against the Ravens and Begels, you know what I mean.
So there's a learning curve, but those are his strengths.
I mean, he's the round peg in a round hole.
Speaker 2 (26:47):
The bang, the bend or the bounce right. That's the
zone read run game. That's what you're looking for, is
the running back correct.
Speaker 4 (26:53):
Yeah, wait for the you're not there's not a designed hole.
You pick one and then you attack it. You know, yes,
you stick that in the ground. I mean, Shanahan won't
always talk about Daddy Shanahan. You know, Clinton Portis and
those guys. Is you got a real athletic line that
that running back patient patient patient, page patient watch Yeah,
go now, yep, you know, and then you see what
(27:16):
you get.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
You know, I think, uh, it is it's it's a
very unique skill set that, like I said, I think, yeah,
that's the term that I always hear a bang bang,
bend bounce either you bang up inside right, you bend
around the tackle, or you bounce outside. That's kind of
the zone read and yeah, that ability to be decisive
in that moment, stick your foot in the ground and
(27:37):
go is a huge trait in vision and acceleration important.
Speaker 4 (27:43):
Yeah, they weren't nausey strengths.
Speaker 2 (27:45):
Correct correct, and so that's you know again, maybe that's
kind of the theme of the day with some of
these conversations, is uh, the offense moving more towards the
square peg, square hole, round peg.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
And they've had a couple of years to build, right,
you know, right.
Speaker 4 (27:58):
And I'm sure Coach Smith would even tell you I couldn't.
I chose not to, not that I couldn't run as
much zone as I would have liked. Raft, Yeah, as
I thought he did see it. Actually, you know, so
I would think, assuming these guys are true, sometimes you
draft a round peg and you're like, well, he's kind
of oval. Yeah, you know, but assuming they are what
(28:22):
you think, you've added Gainwell and Johnson in particular, and
the lineman, you're going to see a higher percentage of
what he's most comfortable calling, and then the subsequent play
looks better off of it, you know. Then he set
up the next play better you set up you know,
maybe you're instead of third and four, you're in third
and three, and that adds up over the year. We
talked to me a long conversation last week about.
Speaker 2 (28:44):
The different four point one and four point four.
Speaker 4 (28:47):
Yeah. I mean, if they could go a point two
yards per carry over the course of the year, it
might be two more wins. And when it's you know,
when you really put the bottom line.
Speaker 2 (28:57):
It's a lot more snaps for your offense. It's a
lot more time zession, it's a lot more first downs,
it's a lot of t. J. Watt and Alex high
Smith getting water on the sideline and resting.
Speaker 4 (29:06):
Yeah. Yeah, I mean less third and longs, et cetera,
et cetera. I mean it doesn't sound like much, but
when you break it down to yards per carry, you
can't be at the bottom of the league, and they
were at the bottom of the league. You know.
Speaker 3 (29:16):
That's especially if you're at the top in.
Speaker 4 (29:19):
Carries exactly because they're going to be in the top carries.
I think we know that. So it is even larger
ripple effect because of the volume.
Speaker 2 (29:28):
Just about a clear practice field here at the upmc
roody Sports Complex is day four is a wrap A
couple players, Miga Fitzpatrick over there talking to some media,
a couple other guys, just getting some last few extra
snaps in out here on a beautiful day in western Pennsylvania.
We have got to get to our last break. We'll
put a bow on today's coverage when we return on
(29:48):
the other side. This special edition of the Drive West
Yuler with Matt Williamson and Dale Lawley. It's all happening
right here on Steelers Nation Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
This is the Drive with Dale Lolly and Matt Williamson
on your twenty four to seven Home of the Black
and Gold Steelers Nation Radio.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
Final segment here of our Tuesday coverage, day number four
of OTAs, of course, practice four of six of the
OTAs the optional organized team activities before they will have
three mandatory capital M mandatory mini can't practices next week
as well on Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday.
Speaker 3 (30:37):
That's making them an offer they can't refuse.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
Now, you can't leave.
Speaker 3 (30:41):
Somebody say on Twitter that I sound like the Godfather.
I could hear. I can see them come to me
on the day of the wedding. De Niro had to
work or not de Niro?
Speaker 2 (30:56):
Oh yeah, what was Yeah?
Speaker 4 (30:57):
I always forgiend.
Speaker 2 (30:57):
His name Brandrando, Marlon.
Speaker 3 (30:58):
Brando had to work to get this voice, had the
stuff his cheek. Yeah, I've not had to do that.
Speaker 2 (31:04):
And I think, like I remember reading that like one
of the things he used was almost like a similar
thing that they put in the mouth of horses to
like mess up his and like I guess, I guess,
I guess it gave well one of it was like
a metal piece thing, and I guess it gave him
like some some gum issues the rest of his like
the metal and the thing that he was, you know,
chewing on was good for his health.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Giving it up for your craft.
Speaker 2 (31:26):
That's what exactly right, Yeah, that's what.
Speaker 3 (31:29):
They Just sit here and.
Speaker 2 (31:33):
Don't lose your hair, though, then you'll be doing Doctor
Evil instead instead of Marlon Branda.
Speaker 4 (31:38):
It was just a cat runner on.
Speaker 2 (31:39):
Yeah, he just grabbed it.
Speaker 4 (31:41):
Make him a little more.
Speaker 2 (31:43):
Fantastic. I love it. No, Dale, Michael, we appreciate you.
We appreciate you toughing it out today. Dale. All right, gentlemen,
put a boat on this thing. Big picture conversation. I
feel like we talked to Jalen Warren today. We talked
a lot about the Arthur Smith offense. You know, some
of the reports of Gabe Davis coming here for a
visit this week. So big picture, open book question. As
(32:05):
we sit here today, Tuesday, June third, obviously a long
time away from September, well sometime away from September. Still,
which position group or the offense are you most confident.
Speaker 4 (32:15):
In running back, running back and tight end?
Speaker 3 (32:22):
I feel pretty confident in the offensive line.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Actually, I was hoping we were going to get some
different answers here. So let's let's dig into it, Matthew, I.
Speaker 4 (32:30):
Almost said the starting five offensive line. But I still
think there's a lot of questions, concerns, unknowns, depth of
the depth. Okay, in most years I've felt, certainly most
Omar team or built team years, I have felt better
about six through twelve than I do now.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
Maybe felt like at least last year, like he had
eight potential starters in that hope at one point, right,
you know.
Speaker 4 (32:59):
The herbigs, you know, the guys that have been around
the block.
Speaker 2 (33:01):
Or and you still had Dan Moore with with the
two young tackle.
Speaker 4 (33:05):
Daniels, you know, and like McCormick was a fourth round
pick unknown that you know you're just hopeful for you
haven't seen yet. Right, But I will say to Flip
that I guess that's the best way I could put
it is, let's just just navigate the Omar years of
this time of year. I think I'm most confident today
(33:28):
compared to other years of one through five, sure, but
least confident of six through twelve.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
And I think that's a fair affair, you know, difference
to lay out there.
Speaker 4 (33:38):
Yeah, because I trust the young guys more than that word.
I mean, Fraser was an unknown last year. Now I
think he's a top five center.
Speaker 2 (33:45):
You know, we should talk about that a little bit,
moving up right now?
Speaker 4 (33:47):
Yeah, it might have moved up a spot. Yeah, it's
just in the last twenty four hours.
Speaker 2 (33:51):
Absolutely, And you know what that short list might be
mostly in the AFC now that I'm thinking about Linderbaum
and Humphrey. Yeah, exactly, Okay, Dale offensive line? Was that
the group for you?
Speaker 3 (34:04):
I just have a lot of confidence in that. As
you guys said that young nucleus, I think they're going
to be really good, And to me, I just think
it's a group that's going to continue to improve as
they play more and more together.
Speaker 4 (34:21):
I think. I know a lot of people listening are
concerned about Roderick Jones too. And I'm not just saying
this to try to be optimistic, but he was a
lot better after the bye. I think his mind settled
down a lot. I do think left tackle, left tackle,
left tackle from here on out is good for him.
It can't be bad, for sure, you know what I mean.
And I'll be shocked if this isn't. I'll even set
(34:45):
the bar pretty low that this isn't clearly his best
season in the NFL. That would shock me if this
is not sure best season, you know, and the ceiling
is much higher.
Speaker 2 (34:55):
Than that, no doubt, no doubt. Okay, quick before we
get into confidence levels, because you mentioned the running back
in the tight end groups as well too, I gotta
follow up with you on your glowing Zach Fraser comment there.
It might be one of the best in the league,
particularly in the retirement of Frank Ragnow. For those who
have missed it, who might have been the best center
in the league was what a seven time pro bowler
at age twenty nine, just retiring with the Detroit Lions.
(35:19):
What's your give me, give me your I know this
is a little bit of a right turn, but you're
you got a pecking order of the centers right now,
like number one is, number two is? And where kind
of Zach would be on that for you going into
this year, I.
Speaker 4 (35:34):
Would say Creed Humphreys won. But I also think he
gets a little overrated because of his situation and always
being there.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
Him running a lot of games right right right, Yeah,
Like I.
Speaker 4 (35:45):
Don't think he's dirt or webby, you know what I mean?
Speaker 3 (35:47):
I thought rag Now is number one? For me?
Speaker 4 (35:50):
Yeah, I think it was a competition between the two
for me and rag Noow's battles. That's why he retired.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
He said that in his statement, I just like to
say a great Frank Irrac. Now.
Speaker 4 (36:02):
Linderbaum's not for everyone because of his size, but I
think he's an exceptional player too. I mean, his movement's great,
his leverage is great.
Speaker 3 (36:10):
I would take Frasier over Linderbaumb just for team fit
across the league.
Speaker 4 (36:16):
Yeah, that's what you're saying.
Speaker 2 (36:17):
I just think he fits fits more schemes that Yep.
I get what you're saying.
Speaker 4 (36:20):
They both have a great wrestling background, which isn't uncommon
for that position.
Speaker 2 (36:24):
One hundred and fifty nine and two. That was Zach
Fraser's high school wrestling record.
Speaker 4 (36:27):
And did you say his first los?
Speaker 2 (36:29):
His first loss? Was it his freshman year? He got
DQ because he didn't understand the rules, and then he
beat that same guy again in the I think the
state semi finals.
Speaker 4 (36:37):
So maybe you could throw that one out.
Speaker 2 (36:39):
So I think one true loss his his entire high
school wrestling career. Yeah, but you think he could be
in that next group right behind those guys this year
or is he maybe already In that conversation.
Speaker 4 (36:48):
He'll be a perennial pro bowler. If not all pro,
I mean, I think he'll be an occasional all Pro
and a perennial pro bowler.
Speaker 3 (36:55):
The stuff that he does the kind of separates him
to me is getting that initial block and then getting
to the second, getting that secondary block as well, and
just finishing.
Speaker 4 (37:09):
Yeah, I'd say finishing is as certainly a strength. Yeah,
his highlight tape is really fun.
Speaker 3 (37:16):
If you're playing against Zach Fraser as a defensive lineman
or an inside backer, you know you're gonna end up
on your back.
Speaker 2 (37:25):
He's gonna get hands all the times.
Speaker 4 (37:26):
Yeah, a couple of times, There's no question about it.
Speaker 2 (37:28):
And you guys say that too. I still remember when
Andy Widel spoke for the first time last year post draft,
he talked about that. He was like, I went down
to Morgantown for that BYU game. He was like those
those poor BYU players, Zach Fraser was getting hands on
all of them, just mauling dudes on every player. They
had two hundred and ten rushing yards in the first
half type thing. And Yeah, I think I think he'll
(37:50):
really endear himself.
Speaker 3 (37:51):
The thing about the b YU guys excuse.
Speaker 2 (37:54):
Me, think about the twenty five year old men.
Speaker 3 (37:56):
There are twenty five year old man.
Speaker 5 (37:58):
Right.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
It's not Mormon missions, a bunch of eighteen year olds.
Speaker 2 (38:01):
Right right, And they're not Ohio State or Iowa, but
they're they're a pretty pretty solid program every year to
putting putting good dudes in the NFL. And yeah, his
his tape against them was exceptional.
Speaker 4 (38:11):
And of course there's other good centers we didn't mention,
you know, like Barton with with Tampa's really really promising
after his rookie year, the rare first round pick that
and he lived up to it. And but that being said,
I mean to Dale's point, if I'm picking up, I mean,
if I can take any center from here on out,
Fraser's definitely in the conversation.
Speaker 2 (38:33):
And you've got you've got him after one year, but
you've got him clearly ahead of Barton and Jackson, Powers Johnson.
Speaker 4 (38:38):
Ahead of Powers Johnson for sure. I think Barton's in
that same tier. I mean, he was part of a
really really good line. Sure, And to give Barton credit,
he's only been a center for one year, I mean, true, true, Yeah,
I was making a case for Barton, who's like well,
he probably had to iron a lot out. I mean,
I haven't studied, but they're extremely promising.
Speaker 2 (39:01):
Yeah, Zach Frasier played the second most I want to say,
had the second most starts I believe for an offensive
lineman in program history at W and all of them
except for his first he had his first two guard
and then was center from freshman year on the rest
of the way.
Speaker 4 (39:17):
Okay, but many of those draft prospects are like, oh,
he's an interior lineman. I mean he was. He was
a center, right right, which is part of the reason
I think he got him where you did. I think
so too, right, I mean, how many teams really needed
a center only?
Speaker 2 (39:29):
But also I think why he was such a good
fit for the Steelers because they needed a center.
Speaker 4 (39:32):
And they also value that position. Going back to Webby, yep,
maybe more than anything.
Speaker 2 (39:36):
Elaite and dirt, pouncy and hardings. I mean, they've had
it's crazy, They've had four guys that have been all pros,
right right, super Bowl champions.
Speaker 4 (39:45):
Yeah, rare stuff.
Speaker 2 (39:46):
Okay, Matt, we got a few minutes left here. You
initially before getting an offensive line, when I asked that
kind of confidence question, you quickly mentioned running back and
tight end as well too.
Speaker 4 (39:56):
Yeah, I don't have a lot of worries there. I
don't know that there's pro galore. I'm not sure that
Franco Bettis. You know, those guys are in those two rooms.
But I keep coming back to Darnel Washington is one
of the harder players to play against in the league.
I mean, honestly, I.
Speaker 2 (40:15):
Mean just from a matchup standpoint, the rightness.
Speaker 4 (40:17):
Of his body type, his physicality, and it's not just
he's only a blocker and can't do anything else. I
still think he's got a lot left in the tank.
I thought he's one of the most improved Steelers from
rookie year to last year. I think you know what
you have in Friarmuth, and frankly, I'm hoping his targets
and usage is trending up. And I know a lot
(40:38):
of people will look at the Friarmuth and be like,
he probably is what he is at this point, and
I beg to differ because I can't. There's so many
studies that age twenty seven is about when tight ends
start to really hit their stride. I think he's twenty six.
He's getting in that neighborhood and.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
Now middle linebackers. Oh, like, they don't typically come out
and set the world on fire right away.
Speaker 4 (41:00):
It's a really hard adjustment period. Like I'll never forget
its one of the first years I was invited to
do mini camps or these camps, and they always give
you the new guy. And Vance McDonald sat down with us, yep,
just like Jenn Warren did, and I told him that,
I'm like, so, you know, the average tight end starts
to hit their stride at like age twenty seven, but
(41:20):
then they usually fade away slow. I mean think of
like Gates, Witten, Gainst, Alliss, Heith. You know, like once
you kind of figure it out.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
There's not a real gradual declay. It's a quick takeoff
and a quick landing.
Speaker 4 (41:31):
Right, you know. I mean Kelsey, I mean like these
guys last a long time once they hit their stride
around age twenty seven. McDonald didn't know that. He's like, wow,
that's really interesting, and he's like, boy, does that make sense.
I mean it was.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
Like got to got to get your grown man's strength
and body and yeah, you.
Speaker 3 (41:48):
Just has to do so many different things, yeah, you know.
Speaker 4 (41:50):
And understanding the holes and zones at this level, and
you know how I can use my body and man
coverage and things like that too and do enough as
a blocker. But it was like I hit him in
the face with a shovel. Oh that makes a lot
of sense. And he was like twenty six at the
time or whatever, kind of got a smile like that.
All right, Yeah, yeah, I get it.
Speaker 2 (42:09):
Yeah, Yeah, that that's I'm with you on. I think
that's I think the way you put that was good.
We're not necessary, it's not necessarily looking at the running
back room or the tight end room and saying there's
a perennial All Pro and maybe even a future gold
jacket guy in there.
Speaker 4 (42:24):
A lot of worry.
Speaker 2 (42:24):
But but it feels like the floor is very high.
You know what you've got, right, You know what ingredients
you're cooking with, and they're pretty good ingredients. They might
not be U you know Michelin chef five star ingredients, right,
but you can make a really stinking good meal. At
the same time, it's a it's a good.
Speaker 4 (42:39):
Burger exact burger season now, not to like rain on
the parade, but go ahead, pre pickings trade.
Speaker 2 (42:47):
I would have said, wide receiver, I think so too.
Speaker 4 (42:49):
Yeah, I mean without a question, because you.
Speaker 2 (42:51):
Would have had the proven perennial Pro Bowl or All
Pro type and DK.
Speaker 4 (42:55):
Now I would have had some concerns with Pickings volatility
as a human being and on the field, but that
was a real strength that now would to be determined,
you know what I mean, playing against those two with
Austin and Wilson as your three or Woods or whoever.
Speaker 2 (43:10):
Okay, and that how that has kind of flipped and
gone the opposite direction. I think we can easily see
the quarterback position flipping and going north. Whereas if you
get the guy that that we've all been talking about,
as you're number one, you feel really good about Mason
as your number two, then you've got a guy like
Will Howard who you can bring along and see what
he's got over the course of a couple.
Speaker 4 (43:30):
Of years where they're supposed to go right.
Speaker 2 (43:33):
Yeah, right, I think that would be a similar kind
of you could see in the way that the wide
receiver group we maybe felt a little differently about, I
think we could in a better way feel that about
the quarterback position still obviously as well. Yeah, gentlemen, good
stuff here today, so far from down at the facility.
It was stuff. Listen, I got I gotta, I gotta,
(43:57):
I gotta give you, I gotta give you credit. Yeah,
especially when you you know, when you knew that. It's
not like if you would have called off, you'd be
leaving Matt hanging. I mean, you know him, him and
I him and I would have been here. But we
do appreciate your valiant efforts here today, certainly.
Speaker 5 (44:11):
Uh.
Speaker 2 (44:11):
That will do it for our coverage for day number
four here of OTA's same thing the next two days,
your knuckleheads Wednesday and Thursday ten to one here on
Steelers Nation Radio, on the Steelers Audio Network, and on
Fox Sports Pittsburgh three hours of coverage because you already
know nobody covers your Pittsburgh Steelers like we do on
Steelers Nation Radio. But that will do it for today.
(44:32):
We will talk to Yen's tomorrow for CJ down here
on site newly engage CJ two by the way, relations
to young CJ uh and of course our guy justin
back at the ranch for producing it and punching all
the buttons for.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
Us who is not engaged.
Speaker 2 (44:49):
I don't know things got change in the last couple
hours here or whatever. No but yes, who is still
available and handsome out there ladies For Matt Williamson and
Dale Lawley. I'm Wes Euler. We'll talk to you tomorrow.
As always, you know where to find us. It's been
a special edition of The Drive on your twenty four
to seven home of the Black and Gold Steelers Nation
Radio on the Steelers Audio Network.
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