October 20, 2025 • 46 mins
Rob, Mike, and Matt discuss the difficult loss for the black and gold against the Bengals in Cincinatti as the Steelers cling on to their division lead.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:07):
Hello, and welcome to the Point After presented by your
neighborhood Forwards Tour and by the students pro Shop get
It directed the team at shop dot Steeers dot com.
Here on DVE and Steelers Audio Network. We are coming
to you following the steerers thirty three to thirty one
loss to the Bengals, and guys, uh, this was this
(00:29):
was not a fun one. Mike Persudo. Let's start with
you manning the phones at the postgame show and you
said not as more despondent than angry from Steelers fans.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Absolutely, And I think if I'm kind of reading the
tea leaves correctly, I think people looked at the Bengals
with a two and four record and the Steelers at
four and one, and they saw that if the Steelers win,
you got a four game lead in the loss column
on everybody else in the division. And they were ready
to start printing their AFC North Champ T shirts and
(01:01):
people were aghast at that opportunity got away.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
I think what everybody missed that was.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Thinking that way was if Joe Burrow did to the
Steelers what Joe Flacco did, I think this would be
going down a lot differently.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
It would just be kind of well, he's Joe Burrow,
and then you know he's really good.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Joe Flacco played as well as Joe Burrow has on
a lot of Joe Burrow's best days. Yeah, and they
were unable to deal with it.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I just did a national podcast and my co host
had no skin in the game, you know, we were
just reacting the game, and I've been quoting him a
little bit, saying this was advanced level, master class quarterbacking
by both guys, you know, like they showed their age
in wisdom and experience and where to go with the football.
(01:48):
And yes, all of us love Mahomes Lamar Allen, these
physical freaks, but there's still something to be said for
knowing where to go with the football and putting it there.
And amen, that does not dismiss the Steelers defense at all.
But it's also pretty clear that Jamar Chase was the
best player on the field.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
Yeah, he's really good, you know, just not a revelation, right, hello,
Captain obvious. You know, so okay, matt let's get right
back to that defense. You and I do the Matchup
show on Thursday and with Missy Matthews usually on a Thursday.
(02:26):
This week. We this past week, we did it on
a Tuesday because of the short week, and you have
to pick, you know, three items, and sometimes you go
into a game and there's like four or five things.
How I'm gonna pick what to do on offense? What
are the key matchups on offense and defense? This was
pretty obviously chasing Higgins. And this is why you go.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
It's hard to come up with matchups this week.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Now, I will say this, I went with this, you
know not I wouldn't say half heartedly, but my key
on offense was stopping Chase Brown. We'll get to the again,
we'll get to the obvious Chase and Higgins stuff in
a minute. My feeling was that, you know, look, Chase Brown,
who I thought was a dynamic player for them in
the latter half of last season. He started the last
(03:12):
ten games they really started to click offensively. He was
part of that. He was held the two point seven
yards per carry. They hadn't gotten him going. And again,
why is that? Well, a lot of it is because
you're one dimensional. You're being forced as you fall behind
to get one dimensional in games. You can't stick with
the run. You know, teams aren't respecting your ability to
(03:35):
throw and beat you, and so they're you know, maybe
giving up some of that to come after your running game.
Whatever the reasons are, you know, they're going to be
able to throw the ball with Flacco to some degree,
maybe not the degree we saw, but you can't allow
both to happen. So to me, the fact that the
Bengals running game, I know, I'm not leading with the
(03:55):
lead here, which is Chase and Higgins, but the fact
that the running game was going now, the Bengals just
were completely able to dictate to the Steelers as opposed
to the Steelers defense dictating to the Bengals. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
And there's a lot to unpacked there. I mean, going
into this game, the Bengals were the past heaviest team
in the league. The running game was not working at.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
All, work by far by far far by far.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
Right, had no explosive runs until last night. I mean,
nothing good on the ground.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
They were so bad running.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
I didn't even in all the analysis I did before
this game, I didn't talk about stopping the run.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
I just thought it was a ridiculous league. They stick.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:37):
And to your point though about game script too, Kinger,
is they score so few points in the first half
that they would just scrap the run. Even when they tried,
they scored zero or three, like four weeks in a row.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Four straight weeks without a touchdown in the first half.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
Yeah, I mean nuts so and then they just abandoned
it and throw all over the place and not do
that well either at the time.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
But I don't think you're burying the lead.
Speaker 4 (04:59):
I mean, Mike and I have talked about this a
lot that going back to camp. You know, Tomlin and
the whole group were pretty excited about the corners they
acquired so they could play man coverage.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
And didn't say the Bengals, but.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Sure hinted that the Bengals, and I think needless to say,
that's not a good matchup at the moment, you know,
and based off last night's evidence, and to some degree
it was hard to watch. But I can live with
Higgins and Chase being superstars, especially Chase. I can't live
with the run defense though. I mean the run defense
(05:33):
to me is that's the one that's like whoa, I mean,
that can't happen.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Yeah, I well said, And you know, I've gone back
and forth because there's so much to complain about and
be concerned about.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Yeah, if you're the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
But I almost had kind of a philosophical starting point
going into the game that it should be easier for
the Steelers offense to light up the Bengals defense, then
it will be for the Steelers defense to stop the
Bengals offense. I wasn't anticipating what we ended up seeing, sure,
(06:10):
but I thought there was some points were gonna need
to be scored. I thought this game would resemble forty
four to thirty eight last year in Cincinnati because I
watched Flaco in the second half against Green Bay. They
scored every possession. That's where we were a little different.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
I didn't have respect for Flaco, but I did think, boy,
he's starting to heat up in this game.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Well, and that was and he was with him for
ten minutes for that, right, right, I mean, But the
difference there was the Packers scored every possession, and.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
This one was a little different. The way it started.
Speaker 2 (06:39):
The Steelers got to that seven to nothing lead, and
I thought it could have been fourteen to nothing, seventeen nothing,
twenty one nothing, and instead it was ten to nothing.
And they left some stuff out there early in the game,
and you just can't do that in a shootout. You know,
if you're playing make it, take it. You don't get
the ball when you miss. Yeah, and it sounds stupid
(07:02):
on the drive that they torpeded themselves. They had a
second and three and they ran the aborted flea flicker
which wasted a play. And then Aaron Rodgers, who had
a really good game but he wasn't perfect. Shame on him.
He wasn't perfect. I guess you gotta be perfect with
this defense. You know, he overthrew John news Smith could
(07:23):
have been a big play. Then they drive down fourth
and one in that's silly tush push. I mean, can
you not just go seventy four is eligible and run
behind Mount Washington? Then Spencer Anderson and run a traditional
running playing fourth down and gaining yard. It's not like
they're the Chiefs. They don't do this all the time.
And they screwed it up and they settled for three. Okay,
so there's four more points possibly leave on the field.
(07:48):
And then the two Metcalf plays. Rogers I thought he
missed his spot his ball place when he placed it
inside on the first deep ball which should have been
on the sideline, and they get a pick, But then
the one I got ripped out of Metcalf's hands, that's
like the twenty four yard line. How many points did
you leave on the field there? So what are we
talking now? Seven ten thirteen and they lost by two.
Speaker 4 (08:10):
Now, I don't argue anything he said because and you
didn't know you were getting into a shootout right away.
I mean, but that's how this league is. You can't
screw things up against professional quarterbacks and his team, as
dangerous as that is through the air. I will say
that Turner play was a great defensive play though, too,
but you can't have it.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
Everybody seems to think that Kinger thinks that. You think
it's just because he went to Michigan. You can't give him. No, No,
it's not.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
It's it's because DK Metcalf is twice the size of him.
He's like, yeah, and he's making a lot of money
to not do that. And I give DK Metcalft full
credit for after the game he said, and I quote,
I need to hold onto the f and ball.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
I don't think he was just being magnanimous.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
I expect him to finish that play.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
I said, we did. Everything's true. I said, was the
best corner before give me a little credit.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Yeah, and look, we can break down. We can break
down sort of the semantics. But by the way, two
things about the quarterback position that I want to point out.
So I was talking to some folks from Cincinnati before
the game about you know, like I'm I saw Flacco
with Cleveland. I thought he looked really bad, and I
was surprised when they made the trade, you know, And
(09:31):
so I asked some people in Cincinnati, was there ever
any talk about Russ Wilson, Like I thought Russell Wilson
would have been a better guy there, And they said no,
they wanted Flacco. They didn't want Russell Wilson, they didn't
want Jameis Winston. There was no talk about those guys.
And then I saw Flacco in the second half of
the game against the Packers, in particular, I thought he
(09:52):
looked better in the in the first half, and then
in particular in the second half against Green Bay he
looked better. So that that's the guy they wanted at
the controls and we'll talk in a moment about what
this win means for them. And I also asked them, hey,
you know, I've been I feel like I've been more
bullish on the Steelers. And I know I have been
than anybody nationally that I've read, and we've had this
(10:14):
conversation said, I thought, I thought they were better across
the board, and you know, especially at quarterback. And I
think that you know, at least this is some insight
from somebody who's not in Pittsburgh. By the way, there's
a lot of people in Pittsburgh don't pick the Steelers
to do anything. I think that there was a there
was a sort of a narrative that Aaron Rodgers is cooked,
(10:36):
he's washed up, He's just another guy. You know, Kenny Pickett,
you know Duck Hodges, you know, you know Russell Wilson,
just another guy. Right. Well, if if you hadn't seen
the first games for the Steelers, and you can understand
that why although the one game against Minnesota was a
was a national game, the only game on no competition,
(10:56):
but last night, Thursday night football, everybody watching that game,
you can't watch the Chargers game. You can't watch that's
the only game on. You had to come away from
that game thinking, whoa Rogers still has plenty in the tank,
had to.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
One thousand percent. I mean, we opened with the negative
because they lost. But one side of the ball was
pretty darn good and led by him, and he checks
every box week after week. Mike mentioned, okay, there was
he wasn't perfect. Well, I mean we're splitting hairs here.
He was pretty darn good and he always gets him
in the right play. To me, the mental stuff is great.
(11:33):
He almost got them a twelve men on the field again,
you know, like that kind of stuff. He's in complete command.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
He got the ball in the end zone on the
hil Mary from a mile and a half away. Yeah, yeah, right,
you know, game a chance. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
No, I think it's been great too, guys. But here's
my concern now is they're gonna waste this. They've they've
been waiting for this kind of quarterback play since twenty
eighteen and they've really accomplished nothing significant since then.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
And now by this profound set of circumstances.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
And waiting them out and everything they went through in
the offseason and finally getting them here for mandatory veteran
mini camp, and he's just been lights out since then,
and they're I'm concerned that they're not going to take
advantage of this because they just can't do the other
simple stuff around it well enough consistently to take advantage.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Of it well and again to get to your point,
I'm going to use it a really extreme example because
I spend the week, you know, prior to a game,
watching every opponent's game leading up to that game. So
I'm watching the Bengals game against the Vikings. Right, you
see the score forty eight to ten. It's a blowout.
(12:42):
It's either the Bengals are two and zero at that point.
Jake Browning is the quarterback. Well, you talk about a
player two here or there. So last, Mike, I totally
agree with you. I thought, you know, well, first let's
talk about a player too. I don't know which order
to do this, and so I'll do this in this order.
The Bengals are playing the Vikings. You look at forty
eight to ten, Okay, it's seven nothing, Vikings. Bengals are
(13:06):
marching down the field in Vikings territory, ready to score
a touchdown. You throw a pick six. Now it's fourteen
to nothing. Okay, So think about that. Think about the
swing there. Instead of seven to seven, it's fourteen nothing.
That's a twenty eight point swing. Later in the game,
you kind of claw back in it a little bit,
(13:26):
and it's seventeen to three and you're marching again, and
now you get a fumble return for a touchdown, and
it's twenty four to three. So let's, just for giggles,
take away fourteen points from Minnesota and give those to
Cincinnati instead of being down twenty four to three.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
It's a little Jesus.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
It's okay, I'm making. I'm making.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
I see where're going this.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
You understand.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
I watched that same game. They also fumbled. P Ran
fumbled when they were trying to run the clock out
at the end of the half.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
After those disasters, right, that's right.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
The Viking's guy banged a sixty yard field goal, that's right.
They give up seventeen points in like forty seconds, right right.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
And you don't score any points too, right, not all
are they scoring points. So the point being that you
know there's there's certain point things you can look at,
and you know everyone's gonna look at the at the
Bengals and tearing it up. But Mike, I agree with you.
I thought that the the Steelers were a player two
(14:27):
away from maybe running the Bengals out of the building.
What happens if it is seventeen.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Nothing, completely different ballgame.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
Completely different ball the greater opportunities.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
They had a chance for a first round knockout and
they ended up losing on points.
Speaker 4 (14:42):
Yeah yeah, they looked tired, and I don't want to
blame the short week on the road, but I mean
all of a sudden, like the second quarter hit and
the defense looked like they were spent.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
I was like, what happened, Mike? That was beautifully put.
They had a chance for a first round knockout and
lost a fifteen round decision. Ye, I'll put And.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
Also show until to the face it's.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Been years since fights went fifteen rounds.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
I gotta break it.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
We're just getting started, uh more. Still the come following
a disappointing loss for this Steelers. The Point After is
presented by your neighborhood Ford Store and the Steelers Pro Shop.
Get it direct from the team at shop dot Steelers
dot com. You're listening on DVE and the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Back to the Point After on DVD.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Rogers under center turns play action pass, rolling to his right,
throws back and fine Tarnell Washington touchdown Pittsburgh Steelers. Four
touchdown passes for Rogers all of them to tight ends.
And Mike, let's start with you on this one. You know,
I just think and and I know Matt uh is
(15:52):
in the get another receiver camp and listen. Of course
I wouldn't discourage getting another receiver. I was happy to
see Roman Wilson have a decent performance with a couple
of catches. Nice to see him get involved a little bit.
I still think this Steelers are pretty bullish on his future.
I understand Mike, you're talking about, Look, you're afraid they're
gonna not cash in. Maybe you do want to go
(16:12):
out and get another receiver. I don't know. I do
think this. I've thought this all year. It's why Matt
and I probably I don't think we have a difference
of opinion. I just think that I think, barring an injury,
the Steelers have enough to be able to get the
job done offensively. We saw Pat Fryermuth in this game.
He was the guy I wanted to talk about. Five receptions,
(16:34):
one hundred and eleven yards, two touchdowns. I was asked
on DVE, hey, do you think this is the sign
that Pat's back, as you know, part of the offense.
I just think it's gonna be week in week out.
Metcalf's gonna get his targets. Jalen Warren's gonna get his rushes,
and then Gainwell might lead you in receiving Behind DK Metcalf.
(16:55):
It might be John Smith. We've seen Darnel Washington was
just coming off his career best game sixty two receiving yards.
Darnell had that touchdown, but he only had three catches
for two yards. I just think it's gonna be with
Aaron Rodgers at the control. He's gonna get to the
line of scrimmage, he's gonna find the mismatch. There's enough
talent there where. There's gonna be a mismatch somewhere, and
(17:16):
he's gonna find it. And I think it's gonna be
a different hero every week in the passing game.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
I agree with all that. My only concern is that
Metcalf gets hurt. It's gonna be like Miss Chickens last year.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
It'll just stop. That's right.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
But you know, at this point, I think they'd like
to add at the position, but I'm pretty sure they're
not gonna do anything that they think threatens their ability
to trade up in the first round next year. I
think I think that is the untouchable associated with how
this team is moving forward. They are not gonna threaten that.
(17:50):
So if you can get a guy and still be
able to do what you you think you're gonna need
to do next April, they'll do it.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
If not, they won't.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
But under that context, they're not going to get aj
Brown or a Lave.
Speaker 4 (18:04):
So I'm not going to fight you on this, but
it makes me a little crazy because they do have
a wealth of picks. By no means should they consider
moving a first or second round pick, or any future
first or second round picks, but especially like a fourth
or a fifth, but even a third, just the way
that the NFL draft works in round one, let's say
they picked twenty again for to make it easy, and
(18:25):
they need to get to eight, a third round pick
doesn't hardly even do move the needle, you know what
I mean? Thirds and fourth and fifths. I always equate
it to like money, like tens. You know, ten pennies
equals a dime or a hundred of them equals a dollar.
But thirty two to seventh round picks doesn't equal first nobody, you.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Know what I mean? Right right? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:46):
And you know I love playing the big picture game
and it's part of an evolution of a football team.
And I'm not ready to make any blanket statements yet.
But if you went into this season and thinking, Okay,
Aaron Rodgers is one and done, and the more he plays,
the more I'm like, there, looks like there's there's some football,
(19:07):
plenty of football still left in that guy, we'll see.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
And maybe whether he might yeah, he might ye.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
Yeah. So you know, uh, if let's say Isaac Ciamala leaves, right,
I don't think you have to spend a first round
pick on a guard, and you might even have Spencer
Anderson be your guy, right, you know, I don't think
you have to first spend a first round pick there,
you know, if you want to get younger at the
safety position, I don't think you have to spend the
first round or there. But there are other positions. Uh.
(19:37):
And and you've just signed Jaalen Warning, you drafted Caleb Johnson.
You're probably not going to be looking for a running back.
There are certain things.
Speaker 4 (19:43):
Left tackles the issue, right, if you don't pick up
the fifth of year option, you can't get a left
tackle in round three.
Speaker 3 (19:48):
You can get a guard, get a safety, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Can't can't probably get a corner, right, So Darius Slay
if he has to be, you know, if he if
he's if he leaves after this year, you're you know,
on the outside looking and you're hoping for one year
out of Darius, who's had a great career, is getting
up in years. You know, if you're thinking, hey, we
got to replace him. Now you're looking at gif Corey
Trice or Brandon Eckls or is there somebody on the roster.
(20:11):
But I know this. You can't go into a draft thinking, well,
we need a quarterback, we need a left tackle, and
we need a corner. Right. Good luck, you can't get there.
All those are first round pick type of players. And
so when you see the offensive line improving, when you
see guys beginning to settle in, if Broderick Jones can
(20:34):
be this guy, and you think about picking up that
fifty year option or extending the contract for Broderick Jones,
it does mitigate a need. And so there are important.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
And you can still use a third round pick on
a left tackle that's developmental from.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Apps, absolutely right, and probably you're gonna need a young
swing tackle anyway. Maybe even a guy versat do enough
to pop in and play guard for you as well.
But but you know, these are things that you watch
as to see and you know unfolds Matt and I.
You know you're the draft guy obviously, but also just
from a team development standpoint, you know, it's hard to
(21:09):
maybe parse out where you're going with Spencer Anderson. How
much is that helping the pass game. Mike pointed out
how well the Studers threw the ball with Spencer Anderson
in there as an extra blocker. Still, it feels to me,
third straight game over one hundred yards rushing. Three of
the last four Aaron Rodgers has not been sacked. It
had been what twenty twenty two since he'd had a
(21:30):
single game in which he hadn't been sacked. It's now
three of the last four. You can say, okay, jumbo
guy in there, you can say, Aaron Rodgers is getting
rid of the ball quickly. I'm sure those have have
factors in it. But I've got to believe this offensive
line is improving as well, and that's one of those
underlying things you needed to have happen, and hopefully we'll
pay off in December for.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
You thousand percent agree. I think the offensive line is
definitely rounding in the forum, and I don't think it's
put an asterisk by it. If you have to put
Anderson in the game, that's just good football. Or if
he's getting it out of his hands quickly, that's just
good football. And frankly, Flacco got the ball out of
his hands remarkably quick last night, which contributed a lot
of the problems. But Rogers didn't. I mean, he held
(22:13):
the ball. There were some snaps where he went four
or five seconds.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
It felt like, now touchdown to John who took a
tour of the playing Yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Think it was eight seconds.
Speaker 4 (22:23):
Somebody said, now, I think since he's pass rushed, has
something to do with that too. I mean the Hendricks
in fact, I mean that's a bad defense. But still
I'm with you. I do think the offensive line is promising.
And I didn't even imply that Proderick's definitely out of here.
I mean he might be worthy of picking them that
fifth round option.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
Mike, I'm on the fence there. I mean, I'm not
down on him, but that's going to require a little
bit of an investment. I guess kick it down the
can another year.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
We might just buy a year prospect and see what happens.
You know, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
But to Matt's point about the ball coming out quick
with Flacco, did you guys see the quotes from Flaco
after the game?
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Let me read the two and.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
I saw his comments, But I don't know what you're
referring to. Yeah, put it that way.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Sometimes, especially as a quarterback, you got to take the
emotions and the want to, like the looking ahead and
the results. You just got to take that out of
play and just go play football. We've got Jamar on
an out route and they're off, just throw it.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Just the simple thing.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
And then he talked about quote at the end of
the first half, we just called it out route. I
don't think it was anything crazy, pretty simple stuff underneath
getting them one on one.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
And when he talked called like five out routes in
a row is what it felt like, repeated repeatedly.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Is in parentheship, okay, but it's It reminded me of
the Kansas City game last year when they're playing off
and Mahomes just catches the ball and throws it sideways
to get four five seven yards.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
They can't stop it.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
I didn't see enough disruption at the line.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
Spent these a large majority of the offseason redoing the
secondary that this stuff was going to be a thing
in the past.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
If you can't stop the run and you can't cover,
you got you got some issues.
Speaker 4 (24:10):
You got some issues.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
Yeah yeah. And they had been they had been better
obviously at both. But you know, the look, these are
all intertwined. It's one of the beauties of football to me, guys,
is that, like everything is part of it. Right. So
if you're stouter up front and stopping to run, then
(24:32):
you've got to force him to throw. And guess what.
Now you can bring blitz packages and now you can
roll that man coverage up tight to the line of scrimmage,
throw off their timing. You got a blitz coming. You're
one clutch away or or one look off your primary
receiver because he's not open yet in man to being
sacked or you know, being hit from behind and the
ball comes loose, and now you've got a turnover. Conversely,
(24:54):
if you're stopping their passing game and you're forcing them
to run, you know, the students has been dictating a
little bit lately and you know, you know, I was
watching the game and thinking, man, maybe they should should
they just leave the fifty front up there and say
we're gonna stop the run. And on the way to
stop and the run, we're gonna at least collapse the
pocket back into Joe's lap. I don't know, but I
(25:17):
do know that they tried to blitz a couple of
times early. And this this Bengals line that has been
under you know, has faced a lot of criticism. It
held up. The Bengals offensive line did a good job
last night. Unable to dictate. They couldn't dictate.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
They played well at Green Bay two Kinger the.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Old line.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Save quarterback hits, and you know, Park they were blitzing
in the entire second half and Parsons is running up
the gut and their.
Speaker 4 (25:46):
Young linemen are getting better, you know, the guys they
drafted and Mims and you know, they're getting better.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
Yeah, that's a problem. That's a future that's potentially a
future problem. And by the way, I want to take
a look during next segment and talk about what the
lost means, because to me, it changes the complexion. It's
only one game, but it changes the complexion of the
AFC North considerably and what teams might think they're in it.
(26:11):
One other guy, I just I just want to mention
it's you know, look, I think Rogers, you know, look
two picks. But just again, a huge you know, a
huge impact on a factor to me, that's going to
be there for the Stealers moving forward. I've almost taken
(26:32):
it for granted now. In fact, I kind of have
Aaron Rodgers is just he's he's really really good still,
Jalen Warren, the good running game, you know, the throwing
it around of the different receivers. I'm not going to
talk about anybody on defense. You guys can if you
want that stuck out. But I know it's not huge,
but man Keishawn Williams is when he gets the ball
(26:53):
in his hands, he's he's exciting.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
He had the forty seven yard punt return Matt last week,
scrubbed out by by a penalty the Steelers certainly didn't
think was a penalty. He has the longest kickoff return
for the Steelers yet this season, with a thirty seven
yard or Gainwell did have a thirty six yard or too.
By the way, that's a pretty dynamic duo back there
because Gainwell was a fine kick returner last year. But
(27:16):
I know it's not gonna be the front of people's minds.
But I liked, I like what I've seen. If Keshawn
Williams had of two games in the return game.
Speaker 4 (27:23):
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think he has a
lot of big play potential. He has not factored in
the offense for one snap yet, and that makes me
worry that when Austin comes back, he's gonna get kind
of screwed. And it screwed in a numbers game. But
I think he's their best return or period. I'm a
kick an punt returner.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
You know he had a good training camp, can Yeah,
he kept showing up every day, But he just doesn't
look to me like a guy. He could be on
an NFL team and play on an NFL offense and
he'll be out there and he'd be serviceable, he'd be okay, average, whatever.
But if DK Metcalf gets struck by bolt of lightning,
he's not the guy who going to put in a
wide receiver one and say next man.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Up right right? For sure? And like I said, it's
not a it's not a major one. And I don't
know if he gets but you know what, you know,
what it does make me wonder is to see the
guys sent back to the practice squad if and when
Calvin Austin is healthy. Hopefully coming up next week Calvin
will be back. But that at least be u at
(28:23):
least he's kind of put himself on the radar a little.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
Biting camp next year, right yeah, hopefully with the Steelers,
right right, right, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
So at Clearview Federal Credit Union, they are always upping
your game for those in need through touchdowns for hope.
Clearview will donate five hundred dollars to the Light of
Life Rescue Mission for every black and goal touchdown scored
this season. Visit Clearview FCU dot org slash touchdown to
learn more. So the complexion of the AFC North has changed.
We will talk about that. We will look forward to
(28:57):
the Steelers' upcoming slate of games, which looks pretty challenging.
When we continue on the Point After, presented by your
neighborhood Forward Store and the Steelers Pro Shop, get it
direct from the team at Shop dot Steelers dot com
on DVE and the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 3 (29:13):
Back to the Point After on DV e.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Rogers get to snap, they bring four Rogers throws towards
the end zone. Touchdown. He finds Pat pryor mood for
his first four of the season touchdown. Pittsburgh Steelers. Oh,
great to see Pat Fryarmuth have a big game and
be part of this offense. He's been so reliable. I
mean in his career, you give him sixteen seventeen games,
(29:38):
he's gonna catch sixty balls. Touchdowns might vary a little bit,
but nice to see guys, Pat Fryarmouth, you know, have
a big game because he's been a little bit of
a forgotten guy just because the Steelers have gone in
a different direction schematically, and you know.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Back to Rogers. He called that play at halftime. Yeah,
that was late in the thir quarter. And then he
explained after the game he saw something on a sideline
photograph and he pulled Friar Muth aside at halftime and
he said, if we get this I'm paraphrasing, but if
we get this, look.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
Again, be ready and boom.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And then it was also similar on a similar set
of circumstances on what became the sixty eight yarder.
Speaker 3 (30:18):
But I mean, that's that's pretty cool. This is the
kind of.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
Quality, high level, yeah, intellectual above the next quarterback play
you're getting and plus great arm and enough mobility and god,
can you not.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
Make this work? Yeah? Seriously? And he fell out of
this guy?
Speaker 2 (30:34):
You got this and you can't stop the run? Still,
come on, what are we doing here?
Speaker 3 (30:39):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:39):
They were making it work until this game. They were
four and one. Yeah, and they're not five and one.
So with that in mind, guys, I do want to
take a look at where the AFC North is. And
right now you're the Bengals, and at two and five,
it is pretty much bye bye, right, yeah, pretty much.
(31:03):
But it's not two and five, it's three and four.
You're two and zero in the division. You have the
best record in the division. You've beaten the Steelers, and
you've beaten the Browns, and here's your schedule coming up
before you're by two home games against the Jets in Chicago.
Chicago is certainly an intriguing team. Look, we don't know
what's gonna happen, but if you're in Cincinnati and you're
(31:24):
a fan, just like a lot of fans in Pittsburgh,
expecting to wake up to a five and one Steelers team.
You might be expecting to wake up on November three
to a five and four Bengals team and thinking, how
do we get two more wins in our next five
games until Joe Burrow can come back. When we're playing Miami,
(31:44):
Arizona and Cleveland to end the season. Hey, we're going
ten and seven, We're going to the playoffs. That's what
one win has done. I think if you're a Bengals fan, agreed,
and it could be.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
The difference of we're gonna trade trade Henderson or now
we'll right.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (32:01):
Big games like that point, great point. Yeah, No, that
was their that was their alamo. If they were going
to have a rest of the season, they had to
win last night.
Speaker 4 (32:11):
How often do you think a mere Hodges are in
that game? The show we do, you don't count a
team down, you know. And I thought about it a
million times.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Yeah, Robert and I have done the previous show with
Merrill for a while now, and one of his go
to talking points is never underestimated professional who's been embarrassed?
And I take that to heart. Now he's coach that
into me. Yeah again, I expected the Bengals to score
some points last night and play hard and play with emotion,
(32:40):
and it was up to the Steelers to match it.
They had to do it on a short week on
the road, coming off a physical game against Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
They didn't do it.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
You know, the best this defense has looked is the
Minnesota game in the Cleveland game. And in both of
those games, they the Steelers were playing from ahead and flying,
and the defense was able to fly and dictate and
be violent on and it looked like a team. To
get back to your point, Rob, about what's gonna happen
moving forward here, they looked like they were really starting
(33:08):
to develop and you could you could see the vision
of what they wanted to be and were they going
to be more than a nine and eight one and
done in the playoffs type of team. I got serious
concerns now, because we're not talking about September football anymore.
We're talking about it's October football, and it's almost November football,
and the defense an effort like that.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
I don't think they're gonna be great.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Enough on offense to overcome that, because I don't think
they can be perfect enough on offense to overcome that.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
Yeah, I was really in the camp twenty four hours ago,
you know, just not long ago. About this is gonna
be a four or five six sack a game type
of defense, two takeaways. Yeah, they may allow some yardage
and people might move the ball on them, but they're
gonna have big plays and splash and force fumbles and
batted passes at the line of scrimmage. And short week
(34:02):
on the road, I mean, they just looked weary and
not as into it or as aggressive or violent. And
I don't want to just blame short week on the road,
you know. And they got a rebound and be flying
around Sunday night at Akasher.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
You know, and the Bengals. The Bengals will look back
at early drops. You know, Josebash got a Bronx cheer
when he held onto one, and of course he had
one of the biggest plays in the game. And that
third and four when Flacco found him deep up the
middle of the field to keep a drive alive, but
the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Brown dropped one that would have been a big play
over the middle.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Yep. Yeah, they they on the first couple of drives.
They stopped themselves more than the Steerers stopped them. And
you're just kind of rolling along thinking, well, that's the Bungles.
And you know, as Mike outlined earlier, you know, the
flea flicker, the holding penalty, the aborted tush push that
leaves points out on the field instead of it being
(34:56):
seventeen nothing were may or you know, thirteen nothing, but
hopefully seven team nothing where you could you could dictate
to them how they had to play. That never happened,
and we would.
Speaker 5 (35:06):
Take that would have taken Jim Brown out of the
Excuse me, Brown, You're right, and you know what, those
things didn't happen even late in the game.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
You know you need one stop. I mean, at one
point it felt like they could blow them out, and
at the end of the game, I'm thinking, this would
feel like you stole a win if you could stop
them here in this last possession, and they couldn't. So
a lot of plays sandwiched in between, none of which
went the Steeler's way. And now once again you're there,
you're the Bengals, and you're thinking, hey, uh right around,
(35:38):
we're gonna be five and four going into our break.
We're gonna be eyeing a return of Joe Burrow. We
are we are back right and and you can't blame
them for thinking that way. And by the way, the
game the teams they lost to, They've got a lot
of the tough games out of the way. The four
teams they lost to, and they do have a Buffalo
(35:59):
and they got Baltimore coming up. They have some tough
games coming up. The four teams they lost to at
a combined record of fourteen to seven and one. Right,
So those teams are out of the way.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
Now Detroit, Minnesota, and Green Bay right right?
Speaker 1 (36:11):
And Denver, Denver? Uh wait, who am I? Who was
I missing? Minnesota? Yeah, Denver and Detroit and h and
Green Bay. So yeah, those are those are out of
the way. So now let's let's go to the Ravens.
Right one and five. I said, I've said this before.
I've never thought the Ravens were quite out of it
(36:33):
because I think they're a better team all around when
they're healthy than the Bengals. Mattabek is not coming back
seven Pro bowlers, I believe on the shelf. Well, the
buy comes at a good time. You have an opportunity
to get healthy. You have some tough games in the
rearview mirror. You know you've already played Buffalo, Detroit, Kansas City,
Houston and the Rams. That's a that's a murderer. So
(36:55):
now let's put yourself in in the Ravens shoes. Right,
you're one five, you come out of the sing Lamar's healthy.
You're healthy. You have a home game against the Bears. Okay,
now again we're just you know, playing along. Now you're
two and five, you're at Miami. You're gonna win that
one at Minnesota. Tough game, but hey, now you're starting
to feel your mojo. Then you're at Cleveland. Then you've
(37:15):
got the Jets, and now all of a sudden, you're
the six and five Ravens waiting to take on Cincinnati
at home on Thursday night Division games. Now you're feeling
pretty good about yourselves too. You know, instead of the
Steelers being five and one, this four and two. Not
that these teams wouldn't have had pep in their step,
but if I'm the Ravens or I'm the Bengals, after
(37:39):
one game that lost last night, I'm thinking, hey, you
know what, man, I can find a way to getting
this done.
Speaker 3 (37:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
I believe, and I said it before the game that
if the Steelers win, the Bengals are shot. They trade
Hendrickson you know, we threw something to flacout didn't work.
Go well, you know, we'll wait till next year with Joe,
Browns were already shot. Browns are done. They're already cooked.
And if the Steelers win, the Ravens have to be
close to perfect. I mean maybe two losses at most
(38:11):
post buy and not one. Definitely both can't be against
Steelers and probably you probably have to sweep the.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Steelers more likely. Look at wildcard, Yeah yeah, yeah, more
realistically looking at the wildcard.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
I'll say this about Baltimore.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
I was not as high on Baltimore coming into the
season as a lot of people were, and they were
playing lousey defense when they were healthy.
Speaker 4 (38:32):
We need to acknowledge that both lines scrimmage were bad.
Speaker 2 (38:35):
They're down a little bit of the same dynamic the
Steelers got going on. Right now, you get to a
point where it doesn't matter what you do on offense
because your defense isn't good.
Speaker 4 (38:44):
Now they have fundamental problems pre injuries.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
So now those teams are are jumping with joy right there.
They're bouncing around. We're back at the fan base anyway,
and now let's let's go to the Steelers. Right you're
four and two, and what's been one of the big
criticisms of the Steelers. Well, you haven't really beaten anybody,
and New England's pretty good. Minnesota's a you know, you're
three and three and two, right.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
I think Minnesota's very good and so today's standard very good.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
I think the win yeah, I think they're pretty much quality.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
But now and I think better than McCarthy.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
And that is yes, right now, yes, right now, maybe
not in the future. Okay, So uh why is that? So?
If you are the Steelers and you're a Steelers fan,
here's what you're looking at now. Green Bay once beaten
(39:42):
Indianapolis and then at the LA Chargers. Are you starting
to go three? You were playing the schedule game you
were five and one. The biggest thing that happened to
me Thursday night last night for the Steelers and their
the future of this season is they've lost the cushion.
They've lost the wiggle room that you'd like to have,
(40:04):
say in late November, you know, a month from now,
you wouldn't mind having that wiggle room of winning the
games your quote unquote supposed to win and having a
win stored away in a game. A cushion game in
the AFC North standings, So if you lose one, you
can say that's okay, We're still in pretty good shape.
To me, that's the biggest thing as far as the
(40:25):
overall standings and everything that got taken away last night
was the cushion.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
You know what. I'm seeing it a little differently.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
If they had pulled that one out, say they get
that last defensive stop and they win the game, the
way they got to stop against the Jets, the way
they got to stop against the Vikings, the way they
got to stop against the Patriots, you're five to one.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
I still wouldn't be filling like it would be.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
Time to plan a parade after they played the Packers,
Colts and.
Speaker 3 (40:54):
At the Chargers.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
I think these next three games are going to define
this team. Mike Tomlins said after the Bengals game. This
does not define us, Okay, I'll give you that, but
the next the next three will and it's time to
get it together.
Speaker 3 (41:09):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (41:10):
I mean long week at home Sunday night football, screams Tomlin,
win no matter who's coming here, let alone.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
Yeah, you know all that stuff.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Rogers with the petty game ball potential, all right.
Speaker 3 (41:21):
One of the comments be.
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Bad in that one.
Speaker 4 (41:22):
It's like, oh No.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
One of the comments I made on the post game
show after the Bengals game was Jonathan Taylor was probably
watching that reaching for the Colts media guys to see
what the franchise record for rushing yards is.
Speaker 4 (41:35):
Yeah, Josh Jacobs a probably prett happy about it day.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
I didn't see a lot last night that leads you
believes they're gonna get all the roll and win.
Speaker 4 (41:42):
The run defense is really the thing that worries me
most Watchamar Chase being a total superstar.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
It's the run defense.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
So we'll see if they if they're you know, if
they're better, great, Uh they they they This is clearly
not what they had planned. They put a lot of
effort into you know, Derek Harmon is drafted to help
stop the run. All these secondary changes were made to
help start stop the pass, start stopping a run and
stopping the past.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
So one other thing I wanted to get to you guys.
Technical No no, no, no, no, no no no no.
Uh And I love the fact you have a little
different take too, and I agree with everything you're saying.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
So let's uh, Mike, Mike slept in the station last Yeah,
he's a little ornery dude.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
Yeah, we like ordinery, Mike. Yeah, yeah, So I just
wanted to say this. You know, I don't think uh
And guys, you know you've you've followed the league for
a long time. I've been a fan for a long
time obviously as well. I cannot remember a season in
which there was more parody than there is now and
(42:48):
no team And I always figure, you know, winning the
first third, kind of start to jockey for position in
the second third, and then hone your game into late
November into December, get yourself ready for the playoffs, go
win on a crescendo. That's kind of a simplistic way.
Obviously there's injuries, strength to schedule, all kinds of other
things that go into that. But in the recent power rankings,
(43:12):
all three power rankings I saw had Tampa Bay one
and Texas of Houston Texans twenty. No Bengals, no Ravens.
By the way, they're deep into the twenties, and I
still think they're good football teams. If you told me
the Super Bowl is going to be the Buccaneers versus
the Texans right now, I wouldn't be shocked. And I
(43:33):
think all the other teams in between are feeling like
they've got a chance. I don't see a super team
out there. I don't remember at this point of the season. Matt.
Let's start with you seeing this much parody in the NFL.
Speaker 4 (43:48):
Yeah, I agree with almost all that. I mean, it
looked like Eagles, Bills, you know, those type of teams.
What I fear is it might be the Chiefs, which
is so boring. If I had to put a chip
down right now, who ends up winning the Super Bowl?
Probably the team that goes every year. The only thing
I know is who the bad teams are. I mean,
there's seven or eight dreadful teams.
Speaker 1 (44:11):
Are the Giants bad?
Speaker 3 (44:13):
I wouldn't call them dreadful?
Speaker 1 (44:14):
Right three weeks ago, I thought they at least there's
some hope. Yeah. Yeah, they beating the Chargers and the
Eagles and two out of the last three games there.
Speaker 4 (44:23):
I don't know who the best teams are, but I
know who the worst teams are.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, right, I'm with you. I'm with you, Mike.
Speaker 2 (44:29):
Yet, No, I think you're on the right track. I
would deviate, just ever so slightly.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
I'm not again, Houston.
Speaker 3 (44:39):
But I think this is kind of the time of
the year.
Speaker 2 (44:41):
I mean, weren't the Eagles two and two last year
after four games and they were getting the Yeah, what's
what's the golf days? Is it the Masters? Saturday's Moving
Day or Saturday again? This stretch they're they're about to
be defined. It's a lot of the teams are.
Speaker 3 (45:00):
But these three.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
Games, I think Kansas City has sent the word out
that don't forget about us.
Speaker 3 (45:06):
So, yeah, don't forget us.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
I still think Philly's going to be there at the end.
If the Steelers are going to do something, they got
to start doing it. Man, just now's the time. And
Terell Austin talked in the early going about how, hey,
I think we have good players, we'll get it together.
I'm willing to I was willing to accept that up
until this game. Now it's can't have this anymore. You
just can't. No, you just can't disappointing too much in
(45:32):
the players are failing and the plans are failing. Straighten
it out or not. And we've seen what it looks
like when they don't.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
Thirty three to thirty one loss to the Bengals on
Thursday night, that's changed the complexion of the AFC North,
and perhaps it's the other season as well. We shall
see as we look at this game from Thursday night
to loss at Cincinnati at pay Court Stadium. Four Mike
Pursuda for Matt Williamson. For our producer Justin Miller, I'm
Rob King. We thank you for listening to the point
(46:02):
after presented by your neighborhood Forward Store and by the
Steelers Pro Shop. Get it direct from the team at
shop dot Steelers dot com, on DVE and the Steelers
Audio Network.
Hello, and welcome to the Point After presented by your
neighborhood Forwards Tour and by the students pro Shop get
It directed the team at shop dot Steeers dot com.
Here on DVE and Steelers Audio Network. We are coming
to you following the steerers thirty three to thirty one
loss to the Bengals, and guys, uh, this was this
(00:29):
was not a fun one. Mike Persudo. Let's start with
you manning the phones at the postgame show and you
said not as more despondent than angry from Steelers fans.
Speaker 2 (00:40):
Absolutely, And I think if I'm kind of reading the
tea leaves correctly, I think people looked at the Bengals
with a two and four record and the Steelers at
four and one, and they saw that if the Steelers win,
you got a four game lead in the loss column
on everybody else in the division. And they were ready
to start printing their AFC North Champ T shirts and
(01:01):
people were aghast at that opportunity got away.
Speaker 3 (01:04):
I think what everybody missed that was.
Speaker 2 (01:06):
Thinking that way was if Joe Burrow did to the
Steelers what Joe Flacco did, I think this would be
going down a lot differently.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
It would just be kind of well, he's Joe Burrow,
and then you know he's really good.
Speaker 2 (01:19):
Joe Flacco played as well as Joe Burrow has on
a lot of Joe Burrow's best days. Yeah, and they
were unable to deal with it.
Speaker 4 (01:28):
I just did a national podcast and my co host
had no skin in the game, you know, we were
just reacting the game, and I've been quoting him a
little bit, saying this was advanced level, master class quarterbacking
by both guys, you know, like they showed their age
in wisdom and experience and where to go with the football.
(01:48):
And yes, all of us love Mahomes Lamar Allen, these
physical freaks, but there's still something to be said for
knowing where to go with the football and putting it there.
And amen, that does not dismiss the Steelers defense at all.
But it's also pretty clear that Jamar Chase was the
best player on the field.
Speaker 1 (02:05):
Yeah, he's really good, you know, just not a revelation, right, hello,
Captain obvious. You know, so okay, matt let's get right
back to that defense. You and I do the Matchup
show on Thursday and with Missy Matthews usually on a Thursday.
(02:26):
This week. We this past week, we did it on
a Tuesday because of the short week, and you have
to pick, you know, three items, and sometimes you go
into a game and there's like four or five things.
How I'm gonna pick what to do on offense? What
are the key matchups on offense and defense? This was
pretty obviously chasing Higgins. And this is why you go.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
It's hard to come up with matchups this week.
Speaker 1 (02:49):
Now, I will say this, I went with this, you
know not I wouldn't say half heartedly, but my key
on offense was stopping Chase Brown. We'll get to the again,
we'll get to the obvious Chase and Higgins stuff in
a minute. My feeling was that, you know, look, Chase Brown,
who I thought was a dynamic player for them in
the latter half of last season. He started the last
(03:12):
ten games they really started to click offensively. He was
part of that. He was held the two point seven
yards per carry. They hadn't gotten him going. And again,
why is that? Well, a lot of it is because
you're one dimensional. You're being forced as you fall behind
to get one dimensional in games. You can't stick with
the run. You know, teams aren't respecting your ability to
(03:35):
throw and beat you, and so they're you know, maybe
giving up some of that to come after your running game.
Whatever the reasons are, you know, they're going to be
able to throw the ball with Flacco to some degree,
maybe not the degree we saw, but you can't allow
both to happen. So to me, the fact that the
Bengals running game, I know, I'm not leading with the
(03:55):
lead here, which is Chase and Higgins, but the fact
that the running game was going now, the Bengals just
were completely able to dictate to the Steelers as opposed
to the Steelers defense dictating to the Bengals. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:08):
And there's a lot to unpacked there. I mean, going
into this game, the Bengals were the past heaviest team
in the league. The running game was not working at.
Speaker 1 (04:16):
All, work by far by far far by far.
Speaker 4 (04:20):
Right, had no explosive runs until last night. I mean,
nothing good on the ground.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
They were so bad running.
Speaker 2 (04:25):
I didn't even in all the analysis I did before
this game, I didn't talk about stopping the run.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
I just thought it was a ridiculous league. They stick.
Speaker 1 (04:36):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (04:37):
And to your point though about game script too, Kinger,
is they score so few points in the first half
that they would just scrap the run. Even when they tried,
they scored zero or three, like four weeks in a row.
Speaker 1 (04:49):
Four straight weeks without a touchdown in the first half.
Speaker 4 (04:51):
Yeah, I mean nuts so and then they just abandoned
it and throw all over the place and not do
that well either at the time.
Speaker 3 (04:57):
But I don't think you're burying the lead.
Speaker 4 (04:59):
I mean, Mike and I have talked about this a
lot that going back to camp. You know, Tomlin and
the whole group were pretty excited about the corners they
acquired so they could play man coverage.
Speaker 3 (05:10):
And didn't say the Bengals, but.
Speaker 4 (05:12):
Sure hinted that the Bengals, and I think needless to say,
that's not a good matchup at the moment, you know,
and based off last night's evidence, and to some degree
it was hard to watch. But I can live with
Higgins and Chase being superstars, especially Chase. I can't live
with the run defense though. I mean the run defense
(05:33):
to me is that's the one that's like whoa, I mean,
that can't happen.
Speaker 2 (05:40):
Yeah, I well said, And you know, I've gone back
and forth because there's so much to complain about and
be concerned about.
Speaker 3 (05:48):
Yeah, if you're the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (05:49):
But I almost had kind of a philosophical starting point
going into the game that it should be easier for
the Steelers offense to light up the Bengals defense, then
it will be for the Steelers defense to stop the
Bengals offense. I wasn't anticipating what we ended up seeing, sure,
(06:10):
but I thought there was some points were gonna need
to be scored. I thought this game would resemble forty
four to thirty eight last year in Cincinnati because I
watched Flaco in the second half against Green Bay. They
scored every possession. That's where we were a little different.
Speaker 4 (06:26):
I didn't have respect for Flaco, but I did think, boy,
he's starting to heat up in this game.
Speaker 2 (06:30):
Well, and that was and he was with him for
ten minutes for that, right, right, I mean, But the
difference there was the Packers scored every possession, and.
Speaker 3 (06:37):
This one was a little different. The way it started.
Speaker 2 (06:39):
The Steelers got to that seven to nothing lead, and
I thought it could have been fourteen to nothing, seventeen nothing,
twenty one nothing, and instead it was ten to nothing.
And they left some stuff out there early in the game,
and you just can't do that in a shootout. You know,
if you're playing make it, take it. You don't get
the ball when you miss. Yeah, and it sounds stupid
(07:02):
on the drive that they torpeded themselves. They had a
second and three and they ran the aborted flea flicker
which wasted a play. And then Aaron Rodgers, who had
a really good game but he wasn't perfect. Shame on him.
He wasn't perfect. I guess you gotta be perfect with
this defense. You know, he overthrew John news Smith could
(07:23):
have been a big play. Then they drive down fourth
and one in that's silly tush push. I mean, can
you not just go seventy four is eligible and run
behind Mount Washington? Then Spencer Anderson and run a traditional
running playing fourth down and gaining yard. It's not like
they're the Chiefs. They don't do this all the time.
And they screwed it up and they settled for three. Okay,
so there's four more points possibly leave on the field.
(07:48):
And then the two Metcalf plays. Rogers I thought he
missed his spot his ball place when he placed it
inside on the first deep ball which should have been
on the sideline, and they get a pick, But then
the one I got ripped out of Metcalf's hands, that's
like the twenty four yard line. How many points did
you leave on the field there? So what are we
talking now? Seven ten thirteen and they lost by two.
Speaker 4 (08:10):
Now, I don't argue anything he said because and you
didn't know you were getting into a shootout right away.
I mean, but that's how this league is. You can't
screw things up against professional quarterbacks and his team, as
dangerous as that is through the air. I will say
that Turner play was a great defensive play though, too,
but you can't have it.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
Everybody seems to think that Kinger thinks that. You think
it's just because he went to Michigan. You can't give him. No, No,
it's not.
Speaker 2 (08:35):
It's it's because DK Metcalf is twice the size of him.
He's like, yeah, and he's making a lot of money
to not do that. And I give DK Metcalft full
credit for after the game he said, and I quote,
I need to hold onto the f and ball.
Speaker 3 (08:52):
I don't think he was just being magnanimous.
Speaker 2 (08:55):
I expect him to finish that play.
Speaker 3 (08:59):
I said, we did. Everything's true. I said, was the
best corner before give me a little credit.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Yeah, and look, we can break down. We can break
down sort of the semantics. But by the way, two
things about the quarterback position that I want to point out.
So I was talking to some folks from Cincinnati before
the game about you know, like I'm I saw Flacco
with Cleveland. I thought he looked really bad, and I
was surprised when they made the trade, you know, And
(09:31):
so I asked some people in Cincinnati, was there ever
any talk about Russ Wilson, Like I thought Russell Wilson
would have been a better guy there, And they said no,
they wanted Flacco. They didn't want Russell Wilson, they didn't
want Jameis Winston. There was no talk about those guys.
And then I saw Flacco in the second half of
the game against the Packers, in particular, I thought he
(09:52):
looked better in the in the first half, and then
in particular in the second half against Green Bay he
looked better. So that that's the guy they wanted at
the controls and we'll talk in a moment about what
this win means for them. And I also asked them, hey,
you know, I've been I feel like I've been more
bullish on the Steelers. And I know I have been
than anybody nationally that I've read, and we've had this
(10:14):
conversation said, I thought, I thought they were better across
the board, and you know, especially at quarterback. And I
think that you know, at least this is some insight
from somebody who's not in Pittsburgh. By the way, there's
a lot of people in Pittsburgh don't pick the Steelers
to do anything. I think that there was a there
was a sort of a narrative that Aaron Rodgers is cooked,
(10:36):
he's washed up, He's just another guy. You know, Kenny Pickett,
you know Duck Hodges, you know, you know Russell Wilson,
just another guy. Right. Well, if if you hadn't seen
the first games for the Steelers, and you can understand
that why although the one game against Minnesota was a
was a national game, the only game on no competition,
(10:56):
but last night, Thursday night football, everybody watching that game,
you can't watch the Chargers game. You can't watch that's
the only game on. You had to come away from
that game thinking, whoa Rogers still has plenty in the tank,
had to.
Speaker 4 (11:12):
One thousand percent. I mean, we opened with the negative
because they lost. But one side of the ball was
pretty darn good and led by him, and he checks
every box week after week. Mike mentioned, okay, there was
he wasn't perfect. Well, I mean we're splitting hairs here.
He was pretty darn good and he always gets him
in the right play. To me, the mental stuff is great.
(11:33):
He almost got them a twelve men on the field again,
you know, like that kind of stuff. He's in complete command.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
He got the ball in the end zone on the
hil Mary from a mile and a half away. Yeah, yeah, right,
you know, game a chance. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (11:46):
No, I think it's been great too, guys. But here's
my concern now is they're gonna waste this. They've they've
been waiting for this kind of quarterback play since twenty
eighteen and they've really accomplished nothing significant since then.
Speaker 3 (11:59):
And now by this profound set of circumstances.
Speaker 2 (12:04):
And waiting them out and everything they went through in
the offseason and finally getting them here for mandatory veteran
mini camp, and he's just been lights out since then,
and they're I'm concerned that they're not going to take
advantage of this because they just can't do the other
simple stuff around it well enough consistently to take advantage.
Speaker 1 (12:22):
Of it well and again to get to your point,
I'm going to use it a really extreme example because
I spend the week, you know, prior to a game,
watching every opponent's game leading up to that game. So
I'm watching the Bengals game against the Vikings. Right, you
see the score forty eight to ten. It's a blowout.
(12:42):
It's either the Bengals are two and zero at that point.
Jake Browning is the quarterback. Well, you talk about a
player two here or there. So last, Mike, I totally
agree with you. I thought, you know, well, first let's
talk about a player too. I don't know which order
to do this, and so I'll do this in this order.
The Bengals are playing the Vikings. You look at forty
eight to ten, Okay, it's seven nothing, Vikings. Bengals are
(13:06):
marching down the field in Vikings territory, ready to score
a touchdown. You throw a pick six. Now it's fourteen
to nothing. Okay, So think about that. Think about the
swing there. Instead of seven to seven, it's fourteen nothing.
That's a twenty eight point swing. Later in the game,
you kind of claw back in it a little bit,
(13:26):
and it's seventeen to three and you're marching again, and
now you get a fumble return for a touchdown, and
it's twenty four to three. So let's, just for giggles,
take away fourteen points from Minnesota and give those to
Cincinnati instead of being down twenty four to three.
Speaker 3 (13:43):
It's a little Jesus.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
It's okay, I'm making. I'm making.
Speaker 3 (13:49):
I see where're going this.
Speaker 1 (13:50):
You understand.
Speaker 2 (13:52):
I watched that same game. They also fumbled. P Ran
fumbled when they were trying to run the clock out
at the end of the half.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
After those disasters, right, that's right.
Speaker 2 (14:00):
The Viking's guy banged a sixty yard field goal, that's right.
They give up seventeen points in like forty seconds, right right.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
And you don't score any points too, right, not all
are they scoring points. So the point being that you
know there's there's certain point things you can look at,
and you know everyone's gonna look at the at the
Bengals and tearing it up. But Mike, I agree with you.
I thought that the the Steelers were a player two
(14:27):
away from maybe running the Bengals out of the building.
What happens if it is seventeen.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
Nothing, completely different ballgame.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
Completely different ball the greater opportunities.
Speaker 2 (14:38):
They had a chance for a first round knockout and
they ended up losing on points.
Speaker 4 (14:42):
Yeah yeah, they looked tired, and I don't want to
blame the short week on the road, but I mean
all of a sudden, like the second quarter hit and
the defense looked like they were spent.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
I was like, what happened, Mike? That was beautifully put.
They had a chance for a first round knockout and
lost a fifteen round decision. Ye, I'll put And.
Speaker 3 (15:00):
Also show until to the face it's.
Speaker 1 (15:06):
Been years since fights went fifteen rounds.
Speaker 3 (15:08):
I gotta break it.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
We're just getting started, uh more. Still the come following
a disappointing loss for this Steelers. The Point After is
presented by your neighborhood Ford Store and the Steelers Pro Shop.
Get it direct from the team at shop dot Steelers
dot com. You're listening on DVE and the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Back to the Point After on DVD.
Speaker 1 (15:30):
Rogers under center turns play action pass, rolling to his right,
throws back and fine Tarnell Washington touchdown Pittsburgh Steelers. Four
touchdown passes for Rogers all of them to tight ends.
And Mike, let's start with you on this one. You know,
I just think and and I know Matt uh is
(15:52):
in the get another receiver camp and listen. Of course
I wouldn't discourage getting another receiver. I was happy to
see Roman Wilson have a decent performance with a couple
of catches. Nice to see him get involved a little bit.
I still think this Steelers are pretty bullish on his future.
I understand Mike, you're talking about, Look, you're afraid they're
gonna not cash in. Maybe you do want to go
(16:12):
out and get another receiver. I don't know. I do
think this. I've thought this all year. It's why Matt
and I probably I don't think we have a difference
of opinion. I just think that I think, barring an injury,
the Steelers have enough to be able to get the
job done offensively. We saw Pat Fryermuth in this game.
He was the guy I wanted to talk about. Five receptions,
(16:34):
one hundred and eleven yards, two touchdowns. I was asked
on DVE, hey, do you think this is the sign
that Pat's back, as you know, part of the offense.
I just think it's gonna be week in week out.
Metcalf's gonna get his targets. Jalen Warren's gonna get his rushes,
and then Gainwell might lead you in receiving Behind DK Metcalf.
(16:55):
It might be John Smith. We've seen Darnel Washington was
just coming off his career best game sixty two receiving yards.
Darnell had that touchdown, but he only had three catches
for two yards. I just think it's gonna be with
Aaron Rodgers at the control. He's gonna get to the
line of scrimmage, he's gonna find the mismatch. There's enough
talent there where. There's gonna be a mismatch somewhere, and
(17:16):
he's gonna find it. And I think it's gonna be
a different hero every week in the passing game.
Speaker 2 (17:21):
I agree with all that. My only concern is that
Metcalf gets hurt. It's gonna be like Miss Chickens last year.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
It'll just stop. That's right.
Speaker 2 (17:28):
But you know, at this point, I think they'd like
to add at the position, but I'm pretty sure they're
not gonna do anything that they think threatens their ability
to trade up in the first round next year. I
think I think that is the untouchable associated with how
this team is moving forward. They are not gonna threaten that.
(17:50):
So if you can get a guy and still be
able to do what you you think you're gonna need
to do next April, they'll do it.
Speaker 3 (17:56):
If not, they won't.
Speaker 2 (17:57):
But under that context, they're not going to get aj
Brown or a Lave.
Speaker 4 (18:04):
So I'm not going to fight you on this, but
it makes me a little crazy because they do have
a wealth of picks. By no means should they consider
moving a first or second round pick, or any future
first or second round picks, but especially like a fourth
or a fifth, but even a third, just the way
that the NFL draft works in round one, let's say
they picked twenty again for to make it easy, and
(18:25):
they need to get to eight, a third round pick
doesn't hardly even do move the needle, you know what
I mean? Thirds and fourth and fifths. I always equate
it to like money, like tens. You know, ten pennies
equals a dime or a hundred of them equals a dollar.
But thirty two to seventh round picks doesn't equal first nobody, you.
Speaker 3 (18:43):
Know what I mean? Right right? Yeah?
Speaker 1 (18:46):
And you know I love playing the big picture game
and it's part of an evolution of a football team.
And I'm not ready to make any blanket statements yet.
But if you went into this season and thinking, Okay,
Aaron Rodgers is one and done, and the more he plays,
the more I'm like, there, looks like there's there's some football,
(19:07):
plenty of football still left in that guy, we'll see.
Speaker 4 (19:10):
And maybe whether he might yeah, he might ye.
Speaker 1 (19:15):
Yeah. So you know, uh, if let's say Isaac Ciamala leaves, right,
I don't think you have to spend a first round
pick on a guard, and you might even have Spencer
Anderson be your guy, right, you know, I don't think
you have to first spend a first round pick there,
you know, if you want to get younger at the
safety position, I don't think you have to spend the
first round or there. But there are other positions. Uh.
(19:37):
And and you've just signed Jaalen Warning, you drafted Caleb Johnson.
You're probably not going to be looking for a running back.
There are certain things.
Speaker 4 (19:43):
Left tackles the issue, right, if you don't pick up
the fifth of year option, you can't get a left
tackle in round three.
Speaker 3 (19:48):
You can get a guard, get a safety, you know.
Speaker 1 (19:50):
Can't can't probably get a corner, right, So Darius Slay
if he has to be, you know, if he if
he's if he leaves after this year, you're you know,
on the outside looking and you're hoping for one year
out of Darius, who's had a great career, is getting
up in years. You know, if you're thinking, hey, we
got to replace him. Now you're looking at gif Corey
Trice or Brandon Eckls or is there somebody on the roster.
(20:11):
But I know this. You can't go into a draft thinking, well,
we need a quarterback, we need a left tackle, and
we need a corner. Right. Good luck, you can't get there.
All those are first round pick type of players. And
so when you see the offensive line improving, when you
see guys beginning to settle in, if Broderick Jones can
(20:34):
be this guy, and you think about picking up that
fifty year option or extending the contract for Broderick Jones,
it does mitigate a need. And so there are important.
Speaker 4 (20:43):
And you can still use a third round pick on
a left tackle that's developmental from.
Speaker 1 (20:47):
Apps, absolutely right, and probably you're gonna need a young
swing tackle anyway. Maybe even a guy versat do enough
to pop in and play guard for you as well.
But but you know, these are things that you watch
as to see and you know unfolds Matt and I.
You know you're the draft guy obviously, but also just
from a team development standpoint, you know, it's hard to
(21:09):
maybe parse out where you're going with Spencer Anderson. How
much is that helping the pass game. Mike pointed out
how well the Studers threw the ball with Spencer Anderson
in there as an extra blocker. Still, it feels to me,
third straight game over one hundred yards rushing. Three of
the last four Aaron Rodgers has not been sacked. It
had been what twenty twenty two since he'd had a
(21:30):
single game in which he hadn't been sacked. It's now
three of the last four. You can say, okay, jumbo
guy in there, you can say, Aaron Rodgers is getting
rid of the ball quickly. I'm sure those have have
factors in it. But I've got to believe this offensive
line is improving as well, and that's one of those
underlying things you needed to have happen, and hopefully we'll
pay off in December for.
Speaker 4 (21:52):
You thousand percent agree. I think the offensive line is
definitely rounding in the forum, and I don't think it's
put an asterisk by it. If you have to put
Anderson in the game, that's just good football. Or if
he's getting it out of his hands quickly, that's just
good football. And frankly, Flacco got the ball out of
his hands remarkably quick last night, which contributed a lot
of the problems. But Rogers didn't. I mean, he held
(22:13):
the ball. There were some snaps where he went four
or five seconds.
Speaker 2 (22:17):
It felt like, now touchdown to John who took a
tour of the playing Yeah, I.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
Think it was eight seconds.
Speaker 4 (22:23):
Somebody said, now, I think since he's pass rushed, has
something to do with that too. I mean the Hendricks
in fact, I mean that's a bad defense. But still
I'm with you. I do think the offensive line is promising.
And I didn't even imply that Proderick's definitely out of here.
I mean he might be worthy of picking them that
fifth round option.
Speaker 3 (22:42):
Mike, I'm on the fence there. I mean, I'm not
down on him, but that's going to require a little
bit of an investment. I guess kick it down the
can another year.
Speaker 4 (22:50):
We might just buy a year prospect and see what happens.
You know, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
But to Matt's point about the ball coming out quick
with Flacco, did you guys see the quotes from Flaco
after the game?
Speaker 3 (23:06):
Let me read the two and.
Speaker 1 (23:09):
I saw his comments, But I don't know what you're
referring to. Yeah, put it that way.
Speaker 2 (23:12):
Sometimes, especially as a quarterback, you got to take the
emotions and the want to, like the looking ahead and
the results. You just got to take that out of
play and just go play football. We've got Jamar on
an out route and they're off, just throw it.
Speaker 3 (23:25):
Just the simple thing.
Speaker 2 (23:26):
And then he talked about quote at the end of
the first half, we just called it out route. I
don't think it was anything crazy, pretty simple stuff underneath
getting them one on one.
Speaker 3 (23:36):
And when he talked called like five out routes in
a row is what it felt like, repeated repeatedly.
Speaker 2 (23:42):
Is in parentheship, okay, but it's It reminded me of
the Kansas City game last year when they're playing off
and Mahomes just catches the ball and throws it sideways
to get four five seven yards.
Speaker 3 (23:55):
They can't stop it.
Speaker 4 (23:56):
I didn't see enough disruption at the line.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
Spent these a large majority of the offseason redoing the
secondary that this stuff was going to be a thing
in the past.
Speaker 1 (24:06):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
If you can't stop the run and you can't cover,
you got you got some issues.
Speaker 4 (24:10):
You got some issues.
Speaker 1 (24:11):
Yeah yeah. And they had been they had been better
obviously at both. But you know, the look, these are
all intertwined. It's one of the beauties of football to me, guys,
is that, like everything is part of it. Right. So
if you're stouter up front and stopping to run, then
(24:32):
you've got to force him to throw. And guess what.
Now you can bring blitz packages and now you can
roll that man coverage up tight to the line of scrimmage,
throw off their timing. You got a blitz coming. You're
one clutch away or or one look off your primary
receiver because he's not open yet in man to being
sacked or you know, being hit from behind and the
ball comes loose, and now you've got a turnover. Conversely,
(24:54):
if you're stopping their passing game and you're forcing them
to run, you know, the students has been dictating a
little bit lately and you know, you know, I was
watching the game and thinking, man, maybe they should should
they just leave the fifty front up there and say
we're gonna stop the run. And on the way to
stop and the run, we're gonna at least collapse the
pocket back into Joe's lap. I don't know, but I
(25:17):
do know that they tried to blitz a couple of
times early. And this this Bengals line that has been
under you know, has faced a lot of criticism. It
held up. The Bengals offensive line did a good job
last night. Unable to dictate. They couldn't dictate.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
They played well at Green Bay two Kinger the.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
Old line.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Save quarterback hits, and you know, Park they were blitzing
in the entire second half and Parsons is running up
the gut and their.
Speaker 4 (25:46):
Young linemen are getting better, you know, the guys they
drafted and Mims and you know, they're getting better.
Speaker 1 (25:50):
Yeah, that's a problem. That's a future that's potentially a
future problem. And by the way, I want to take
a look during next segment and talk about what the
lost means, because to me, it changes the complexion. It's
only one game, but it changes the complexion of the
AFC North considerably and what teams might think they're in it.
(26:11):
One other guy, I just I just want to mention
it's you know, look, I think Rogers, you know, look
two picks. But just again, a huge you know, a
huge impact on a factor to me, that's going to
be there for the Stealers moving forward. I've almost taken
(26:32):
it for granted now. In fact, I kind of have
Aaron Rodgers is just he's he's really really good still,
Jalen Warren, the good running game, you know, the throwing
it around of the different receivers. I'm not going to
talk about anybody on defense. You guys can if you
want that stuck out. But I know it's not huge,
but man Keishawn Williams is when he gets the ball
(26:53):
in his hands, he's he's exciting.
Speaker 3 (26:55):
You know.
Speaker 1 (26:55):
He had the forty seven yard punt return Matt last week,
scrubbed out by by a penalty the Steelers certainly didn't
think was a penalty. He has the longest kickoff return
for the Steelers yet this season, with a thirty seven
yard or Gainwell did have a thirty six yard or too.
By the way, that's a pretty dynamic duo back there
because Gainwell was a fine kick returner last year. But
(27:16):
I know it's not gonna be the front of people's minds.
But I liked, I like what I've seen. If Keshawn
Williams had of two games in the return game.
Speaker 4 (27:23):
Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think he has a
lot of big play potential. He has not factored in
the offense for one snap yet, and that makes me
worry that when Austin comes back, he's gonna get kind
of screwed. And it screwed in a numbers game. But
I think he's their best return or period. I'm a
kick an punt returner.
Speaker 2 (27:42):
You know he had a good training camp, can Yeah,
he kept showing up every day, But he just doesn't
look to me like a guy. He could be on
an NFL team and play on an NFL offense and
he'll be out there and he'd be serviceable, he'd be okay, average, whatever.
But if DK Metcalf gets struck by bolt of lightning,
he's not the guy who going to put in a
wide receiver one and say next man.
Speaker 1 (28:02):
Up right right? For sure? And like I said, it's
not a it's not a major one. And I don't
know if he gets but you know what, you know,
what it does make me wonder is to see the
guys sent back to the practice squad if and when
Calvin Austin is healthy. Hopefully coming up next week Calvin
will be back. But that at least be u at
(28:23):
least he's kind of put himself on the radar a little.
Speaker 4 (28:26):
Biting camp next year, right yeah, hopefully with the Steelers,
right right, right, yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:33):
So at Clearview Federal Credit Union, they are always upping
your game for those in need through touchdowns for hope.
Clearview will donate five hundred dollars to the Light of
Life Rescue Mission for every black and goal touchdown scored
this season. Visit Clearview FCU dot org slash touchdown to
learn more. So the complexion of the AFC North has changed.
We will talk about that. We will look forward to
(28:57):
the Steelers' upcoming slate of games, which looks pretty challenging.
When we continue on the Point After, presented by your
neighborhood Forward Store and the Steelers Pro Shop, get it
direct from the team at Shop dot Steelers dot com
on DVE and the Steelers Audio Network.
Speaker 3 (29:13):
Back to the Point After on DV e.
Speaker 1 (29:16):
Rogers get to snap, they bring four Rogers throws towards
the end zone. Touchdown. He finds Pat pryor mood for
his first four of the season touchdown. Pittsburgh Steelers. Oh,
great to see Pat Fryarmuth have a big game and
be part of this offense. He's been so reliable. I
mean in his career, you give him sixteen seventeen games,
(29:38):
he's gonna catch sixty balls. Touchdowns might vary a little bit,
but nice to see guys, Pat Fryarmouth, you know, have
a big game because he's been a little bit of
a forgotten guy just because the Steelers have gone in
a different direction schematically, and you know.
Speaker 2 (29:53):
Back to Rogers. He called that play at halftime. Yeah,
that was late in the thir quarter. And then he
explained after the game he saw something on a sideline
photograph and he pulled Friar Muth aside at halftime and
he said, if we get this I'm paraphrasing, but if
we get this, look.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
Again, be ready and boom.
Speaker 2 (30:12):
And then it was also similar on a similar set
of circumstances on what became the sixty eight yarder.
Speaker 3 (30:18):
But I mean, that's that's pretty cool. This is the
kind of.
Speaker 2 (30:20):
Quality, high level, yeah, intellectual above the next quarterback play
you're getting and plus great arm and enough mobility and god,
can you not.
Speaker 3 (30:31):
Make this work? Yeah? Seriously? And he fell out of
this guy?
Speaker 2 (30:34):
You got this and you can't stop the run? Still,
come on, what are we doing here?
Speaker 3 (30:39):
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (30:39):
They were making it work until this game. They were
four and one. Yeah, and they're not five and one.
So with that in mind, guys, I do want to
take a look at where the AFC North is. And
right now you're the Bengals, and at two and five,
it is pretty much bye bye, right, yeah, pretty much.
(31:03):
But it's not two and five, it's three and four.
You're two and zero in the division. You have the
best record in the division. You've beaten the Steelers, and
you've beaten the Browns, and here's your schedule coming up
before you're by two home games against the Jets in Chicago.
Chicago is certainly an intriguing team. Look, we don't know
what's gonna happen, but if you're in Cincinnati and you're
(31:24):
a fan, just like a lot of fans in Pittsburgh,
expecting to wake up to a five and one Steelers team.
You might be expecting to wake up on November three
to a five and four Bengals team and thinking, how
do we get two more wins in our next five
games until Joe Burrow can come back. When we're playing Miami,
(31:44):
Arizona and Cleveland to end the season. Hey, we're going
ten and seven, We're going to the playoffs. That's what
one win has done. I think if you're a Bengals fan, agreed,
and it could be.
Speaker 4 (31:56):
The difference of we're gonna trade trade Henderson or now
we'll right.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
You know what I mean?
Speaker 2 (32:01):
Big games like that point, great point. Yeah, No, that
was their that was their alamo. If they were going
to have a rest of the season, they had to
win last night.
Speaker 4 (32:11):
How often do you think a mere Hodges are in
that game? The show we do, you don't count a
team down, you know. And I thought about it a
million times.
Speaker 2 (32:18):
Yeah, Robert and I have done the previous show with
Merrill for a while now, and one of his go
to talking points is never underestimated professional who's been embarrassed?
And I take that to heart. Now he's coach that
into me. Yeah again, I expected the Bengals to score
some points last night and play hard and play with emotion,
(32:40):
and it was up to the Steelers to match it.
They had to do it on a short week on
the road, coming off a physical game against Cleveland.
Speaker 3 (32:46):
They didn't do it.
Speaker 2 (32:47):
You know, the best this defense has looked is the
Minnesota game in the Cleveland game. And in both of
those games, they the Steelers were playing from ahead and flying,
and the defense was able to fly and dictate and
be violent on and it looked like a team. To
get back to your point, Rob, about what's gonna happen
moving forward here, they looked like they were really starting
(33:08):
to develop and you could you could see the vision
of what they wanted to be and were they going
to be more than a nine and eight one and
done in the playoffs type of team. I got serious
concerns now, because we're not talking about September football anymore.
We're talking about it's October football, and it's almost November football,
and the defense an effort like that.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
I don't think they're gonna be great.
Speaker 2 (33:32):
Enough on offense to overcome that, because I don't think
they can be perfect enough on offense to overcome that.
Speaker 4 (33:37):
Yeah, I was really in the camp twenty four hours ago,
you know, just not long ago. About this is gonna
be a four or five six sack a game type
of defense, two takeaways. Yeah, they may allow some yardage
and people might move the ball on them, but they're
gonna have big plays and splash and force fumbles and
batted passes at the line of scrimmage. And short week
(34:02):
on the road, I mean, they just looked weary and
not as into it or as aggressive or violent. And
I don't want to just blame short week on the road,
you know. And they got a rebound and be flying
around Sunday night at Akasher.
Speaker 1 (34:15):
You know, and the Bengals. The Bengals will look back
at early drops. You know, Josebash got a Bronx cheer
when he held onto one, and of course he had
one of the biggest plays in the game. And that
third and four when Flacco found him deep up the
middle of the field to keep a drive alive, but
the Steelers.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Brown dropped one that would have been a big play
over the middle.
Speaker 1 (34:35):
Yep. Yeah, they they on the first couple of drives.
They stopped themselves more than the Steerers stopped them. And
you're just kind of rolling along thinking, well, that's the Bungles.
And you know, as Mike outlined earlier, you know, the
flea flicker, the holding penalty, the aborted tush push that
leaves points out on the field instead of it being
(34:56):
seventeen nothing were may or you know, thirteen nothing, but
hopefully seven team nothing where you could you could dictate
to them how they had to play. That never happened,
and we would.
Speaker 5 (35:06):
Take that would have taken Jim Brown out of the
Excuse me, Brown, You're right, and you know what, those
things didn't happen even late in the game.
Speaker 1 (35:16):
You know you need one stop. I mean, at one
point it felt like they could blow them out, and
at the end of the game, I'm thinking, this would
feel like you stole a win if you could stop
them here in this last possession, and they couldn't. So
a lot of plays sandwiched in between, none of which
went the Steeler's way. And now once again you're there,
you're the Bengals, and you're thinking, hey, uh right around,
(35:38):
we're gonna be five and four going into our break.
We're gonna be eyeing a return of Joe Burrow. We
are we are back right and and you can't blame
them for thinking that way. And by the way, the
game the teams they lost to, They've got a lot
of the tough games out of the way. The four
teams they lost to, and they do have a Buffalo
(35:59):
and they got Baltimore coming up. They have some tough
games coming up. The four teams they lost to at
a combined record of fourteen to seven and one. Right,
So those teams are out of the way.
Speaker 3 (36:08):
Now Detroit, Minnesota, and Green Bay right right?
Speaker 1 (36:11):
And Denver, Denver? Uh wait, who am I? Who was
I missing? Minnesota? Yeah, Denver and Detroit and h and
Green Bay. So yeah, those are those are out of
the way. So now let's let's go to the Ravens.
Right one and five. I said, I've said this before.
I've never thought the Ravens were quite out of it
(36:33):
because I think they're a better team all around when
they're healthy than the Bengals. Mattabek is not coming back
seven Pro bowlers, I believe on the shelf. Well, the
buy comes at a good time. You have an opportunity
to get healthy. You have some tough games in the
rearview mirror. You know you've already played Buffalo, Detroit, Kansas City,
Houston and the Rams. That's a that's a murderer. So
(36:55):
now let's put yourself in in the Ravens shoes. Right,
you're one five, you come out of the sing Lamar's healthy.
You're healthy. You have a home game against the Bears. Okay,
now again we're just you know, playing along. Now you're
two and five, you're at Miami. You're gonna win that
one at Minnesota. Tough game, but hey, now you're starting
to feel your mojo. Then you're at Cleveland. Then you've
(37:15):
got the Jets, and now all of a sudden, you're
the six and five Ravens waiting to take on Cincinnati
at home on Thursday night Division games. Now you're feeling
pretty good about yourselves too. You know, instead of the
Steelers being five and one, this four and two. Not
that these teams wouldn't have had pep in their step,
but if I'm the Ravens or I'm the Bengals, after
(37:39):
one game that lost last night, I'm thinking, hey, you
know what, man, I can find a way to getting
this done.
Speaker 3 (37:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:48):
I believe, and I said it before the game that
if the Steelers win, the Bengals are shot. They trade
Hendrickson you know, we threw something to flacout didn't work.
Go well, you know, we'll wait till next year with Joe,
Browns were already shot. Browns are done. They're already cooked.
And if the Steelers win, the Ravens have to be
close to perfect. I mean maybe two losses at most
(38:11):
post buy and not one. Definitely both can't be against
Steelers and probably you probably have to sweep the.
Speaker 1 (38:17):
Steelers more likely. Look at wildcard, Yeah yeah, yeah, more
realistically looking at the wildcard.
Speaker 3 (38:22):
I'll say this about Baltimore.
Speaker 2 (38:24):
I was not as high on Baltimore coming into the
season as a lot of people were, and they were
playing lousey defense when they were healthy.
Speaker 4 (38:32):
We need to acknowledge that both lines scrimmage were bad.
Speaker 2 (38:35):
They're down a little bit of the same dynamic the
Steelers got going on. Right now, you get to a
point where it doesn't matter what you do on offense
because your defense isn't good.
Speaker 4 (38:44):
Now they have fundamental problems pre injuries.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
So now those teams are are jumping with joy right there.
They're bouncing around. We're back at the fan base anyway,
and now let's let's go to the Steelers. Right you're
four and two, and what's been one of the big
criticisms of the Steelers. Well, you haven't really beaten anybody,
and New England's pretty good. Minnesota's a you know, you're
three and three and two, right.
Speaker 2 (39:07):
I think Minnesota's very good and so today's standard very good.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
I think the win yeah, I think they're pretty much quality.
Speaker 3 (39:16):
But now and I think better than McCarthy.
Speaker 1 (39:19):
And that is yes, right now, yes, right now, maybe
not in the future. Okay, So uh why is that? So?
If you are the Steelers and you're a Steelers fan,
here's what you're looking at now. Green Bay once beaten
(39:42):
Indianapolis and then at the LA Chargers. Are you starting
to go three? You were playing the schedule game you
were five and one. The biggest thing that happened to
me Thursday night last night for the Steelers and their
the future of this season is they've lost the cushion.
They've lost the wiggle room that you'd like to have,
(40:04):
say in late November, you know, a month from now,
you wouldn't mind having that wiggle room of winning the
games your quote unquote supposed to win and having a
win stored away in a game. A cushion game in
the AFC North standings, So if you lose one, you
can say that's okay, We're still in pretty good shape.
To me, that's the biggest thing as far as the
(40:25):
overall standings and everything that got taken away last night
was the cushion.
Speaker 3 (40:32):
You know what. I'm seeing it a little differently.
Speaker 2 (40:35):
If they had pulled that one out, say they get
that last defensive stop and they win the game, the
way they got to stop against the Jets, the way
they got to stop against the Vikings, the way they
got to stop against the Patriots, you're five to one.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
I still wouldn't be filling like it would be.
Speaker 2 (40:51):
Time to plan a parade after they played the Packers,
Colts and.
Speaker 3 (40:54):
At the Chargers.
Speaker 2 (40:55):
I think these next three games are going to define
this team. Mike Tomlins said after the Bengals game. This
does not define us, Okay, I'll give you that, but
the next the next three will and it's time to
get it together.
Speaker 3 (41:09):
Uh.
Speaker 4 (41:10):
I mean long week at home Sunday night football, screams Tomlin,
win no matter who's coming here, let alone.
Speaker 3 (41:16):
Yeah, you know all that stuff.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
Rogers with the petty game ball potential, all right.
Speaker 3 (41:21):
One of the comments be.
Speaker 1 (41:22):
Bad in that one.
Speaker 4 (41:22):
It's like, oh No.
Speaker 2 (41:23):
One of the comments I made on the post game
show after the Bengals game was Jonathan Taylor was probably
watching that reaching for the Colts media guys to see
what the franchise record for rushing yards is.
Speaker 4 (41:35):
Yeah, Josh Jacobs a probably prett happy about it day.
Speaker 2 (41:37):
I didn't see a lot last night that leads you
believes they're gonna get all the roll and win.
Speaker 4 (41:42):
The run defense is really the thing that worries me
most Watchamar Chase being a total superstar.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
It's the run defense.
Speaker 2 (41:48):
So we'll see if they if they're you know, if
they're better, great, Uh they they they This is clearly
not what they had planned. They put a lot of
effort into you know, Derek Harmon is drafted to help
stop the run. All these secondary changes were made to
help start stop the pass, start stopping a run and
stopping the past.
Speaker 1 (42:10):
So one other thing I wanted to get to you guys.
Technical No no, no, no, no, no no no no.
Uh And I love the fact you have a little
different take too, and I agree with everything you're saying.
Speaker 4 (42:20):
So let's uh, Mike, Mike slept in the station last Yeah,
he's a little ornery dude.
Speaker 1 (42:27):
Yeah, we like ordinery, Mike. Yeah, yeah, So I just
wanted to say this. You know, I don't think uh
And guys, you know you've you've followed the league for
a long time. I've been a fan for a long
time obviously as well. I cannot remember a season in
which there was more parody than there is now and
(42:48):
no team And I always figure, you know, winning the
first third, kind of start to jockey for position in
the second third, and then hone your game into late
November into December, get yourself ready for the playoffs, go
win on a crescendo. That's kind of a simplistic way.
Obviously there's injuries, strength to schedule, all kinds of other
things that go into that. But in the recent power rankings,
(43:12):
all three power rankings I saw had Tampa Bay one
and Texas of Houston Texans twenty. No Bengals, no Ravens.
By the way, they're deep into the twenties, and I
still think they're good football teams. If you told me
the Super Bowl is going to be the Buccaneers versus
the Texans right now, I wouldn't be shocked. And I
(43:33):
think all the other teams in between are feeling like
they've got a chance. I don't see a super team
out there. I don't remember at this point of the season. Matt.
Let's start with you seeing this much parody in the NFL.
Speaker 4 (43:48):
Yeah, I agree with almost all that. I mean, it
looked like Eagles, Bills, you know, those type of teams.
What I fear is it might be the Chiefs, which
is so boring. If I had to put a chip
down right now, who ends up winning the Super Bowl?
Probably the team that goes every year. The only thing
I know is who the bad teams are. I mean,
there's seven or eight dreadful teams.
Speaker 1 (44:11):
Are the Giants bad?
Speaker 3 (44:13):
I wouldn't call them dreadful?
Speaker 1 (44:14):
Right three weeks ago, I thought they at least there's
some hope. Yeah. Yeah, they beating the Chargers and the
Eagles and two out of the last three games there.
Speaker 4 (44:23):
I don't know who the best teams are, but I
know who the worst teams are.
Speaker 1 (44:26):
Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, right, I'm with you. I'm with you, Mike.
Speaker 2 (44:29):
Yet, No, I think you're on the right track. I
would deviate, just ever so slightly.
Speaker 1 (44:34):
I'm not again, Houston.
Speaker 3 (44:39):
But I think this is kind of the time of
the year.
Speaker 2 (44:41):
I mean, weren't the Eagles two and two last year
after four games and they were getting the Yeah, what's
what's the golf days? Is it the Masters? Saturday's Moving
Day or Saturday again? This stretch they're they're about to
be defined. It's a lot of the teams are.
Speaker 3 (45:00):
But these three.
Speaker 2 (45:01):
Games, I think Kansas City has sent the word out
that don't forget about us.
Speaker 3 (45:06):
So, yeah, don't forget us.
Speaker 2 (45:08):
I still think Philly's going to be there at the end.
If the Steelers are going to do something, they got
to start doing it. Man, just now's the time. And
Terell Austin talked in the early going about how, hey,
I think we have good players, we'll get it together.
I'm willing to I was willing to accept that up
until this game. Now it's can't have this anymore. You
just can't. No, you just can't disappointing too much in
(45:32):
the players are failing and the plans are failing. Straighten
it out or not. And we've seen what it looks
like when they don't.
Speaker 1 (45:40):
Thirty three to thirty one loss to the Bengals on
Thursday night, that's changed the complexion of the AFC North,
and perhaps it's the other season as well. We shall
see as we look at this game from Thursday night
to loss at Cincinnati at pay Court Stadium. Four Mike
Pursuda for Matt Williamson. For our producer Justin Miller, I'm
Rob King. We thank you for listening to the point
(46:02):
after presented by your neighborhood Forward Store and by the
Steelers Pro Shop. Get it direct from the team at
shop dot Steelers dot com, on DVE and the Steelers
Audio Network.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist
It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.