November 7, 2024 • 23 mins
Team insiders Ryan Mink and Clifton Brown talk about Lamar Jackson's status, how the Ravens offense can stay hot, how Baltimore's defense could switch its approach vs. the Bengals, and much more before 'Thursday Night Football' against the Bengals.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
Welcome into the Lounge presented by DraftKings. I'm Ryan Mink
here with cliff Don Brown, and we are going to
preview the Ravens big Thursday night football game against the
Cincinnati Bengals, the Purple Rising Game. Cliff, I know you've
got all your Purple Rising year ready to go. You've
got the Matt what Matt Reporter's notebook, the pen. What
(00:25):
do you come an outfit? Do you come into all purple?
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Cliff Man, I don't have any purple shoes. I'm gonna
have to add that to my game.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Cliff has a better shoe collection than I do. So
you got the hook up from your son in law.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
You got to get some purple shoes I got to
get You're right.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Well, that's always a pleasure to be with you, buddy,
And you know, this is a huge AFC North game
in tight a tight race. You know, it's not just
the Ravens and the Steelers that are in this race.
The Bengals are still very much in this and it's
a big opportunity for the Ravens to hand them their
six loss. Cincinnati were going to lose this game, which
(01:03):
would really kind of put them behind the eight ball. Conversely,
with a Ravens loss, you know, the Ravens have dropped
to six and four, the Bengals we be right back
in it at five and five, and now you have
a three way dog fight in the AFC Norse. So
this is I feel like Cliff, one of those games
that we're going to look back on and say, this
is kind of a hinge game. You know that the
(01:26):
season kind of went one way or the other.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah, I mean you want to get the Bengals in
your rear view mirror and keep them there if you can.
We all know how dangerous they are, how they can score.
Joe Burrow great quarterback, and they're used to winning. I
mean they've started slowly before and have come back to
make the playoffs. So even with their own three start,
they have now gotten themselves in a position if they
(01:49):
can win this game tomorrow right then, yes, I mean
that puts them right back in the picture. Ween mile
of Ravens, though, could almost make it a two team
raised with a victory. They'd have two wins over the Bengals.
So you know, even the Bengals don't fall apart, you
figure the Ravens will win a tiebreaker they could kind
of just focus on trying to beat the Steelers to
(02:11):
win the division.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
So it's a huge.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Game, yeah, for sure, And certainly one of the talking
points about this game will be is it going to
look like the last one? The Ravens out last of
the Bengals in a forty one to thirty eight overtime
shootout in Cincinnati in Week five? Cliff, what's your gut
tell you or should fans expect another shootout on Thursday
night football?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Well, I mean your gut and your eyes would tell
you yes, And I do think it will be high scoring,
but I would say not to the degree of that game.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
That's just my guess.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
I just think that, you know, the second time you
play someone in the season, they've got, you know, a
few more tricks in their sleeve to kind of maybe
slow these offensive down. But it's hard for me to
see as being a defensive struggle. I just think that
both of these offenses have so much firepower and the
quarterback is so good, they're going to figure out a
way to score points.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
And you know, the thing to remember in this game,
if either team.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Gets a double digit lead, it's still not over. They're
both capable I think of coming back on each other.
So that's gonna make I think for probably another game
that comes down in the last five minutes.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Yep, for sure. So you know, a big, big storyline
in this obviously will be how the Ravens top ranked offense,
can they keep cooking against the Bengals defense. And you know,
it was a shootout last time, and the Ravens kind
of hit those big plays. There's the big play to
Charlie Kohler. Derrick Henry had a fifty one yard run.
You know, Lamar obviously had the highlight of the day
(03:38):
with the you know, stiff arm touchdown pass. And so
I think this Ravens offense right now looks pretty darn
hard to stop. Do you think is there any reason
for Youcliff, to believe that that the Bengals could slow
them down?
Speaker 2 (03:56):
I think the only way that would happen is if
Trey Henderson, who had his last game, really has a
big game, you know, pressuring Lamar Jackson and make him
get rid of the ball before he wants to, even
if he doesn't always get the sack. I thought, you know,
Max Crosby when the Ravens played the Raiders was able
to do that, and you know, it kept Lamar from
(04:19):
dominating the game, and the Ravens were able to put Raiders,
excuse me, we're able to pull off the upset. So
if they can, the Ravens can keep Henderson under control.
I don't see the Bengals being able to stop the
Ravens from, you know, having another big night offensively. I
think Derrick Henry, you know, even though he didn't have
a monster game against the Bengals, gets capable of doing that.
(04:42):
If you don't pay a lot of attention to Derrick Henry,
he will have a big game and his presence. The
way the Ravens are clicking through the air, too many weapons,
I just think they present too many problems with the
Bengals to really contain.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Yeah, I agree with that. On Hendrickson. I think that
he can have a Max Crosby like effect. To me,
I think a big storyline for the Ravens offense going
into this is Lamar Jackson right, And I mean he
played an unbelievable last game. We already talked about the
Sam Hubbers stif arm touchdown. He threw for three hundred
and forty eight yards and four touchdowns against them. But
he also ran them ball twelve times for fifty five yards,
(05:21):
and I don't think you should lose focus on that.
I think you know Lamar's Lamar's health status. He missed
the practice this week because of knee injury. He is
going to play, you know, but he didn't run hardly
at all last week. He had zero scripted runs. He
scrambled just to get away from pressure once last week
in the Ravens win. But if he can't, you know,
(05:43):
the Ravens and Lamar says he feels fine. But if
he is not going to run as much against the Bengals,
that takes away a pretty big weapon. And he would
have to beat this secondary that has some players in
that secondary with his arm, and certainly he's able capable
of doing that. Just saw him do that against the
Denver Broncis last week. Now, the the Bengals are also
(06:05):
another team that are gonna put a lot of pressure
on you. So Ken Lamar keeps slicing and dicing teams
beating him with his arm, even if he doesn't run
as much, maybe as he did last time when he
faced the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Yeah, I think he can.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Now it's always better if he can run not only
for yards, but to be able to escape pressure, to
extend blades, which he has gotten so good at, and
the Ravens receivers have gotten so good at, you know,
freeing themselves when he does extend plays. So we don't
know how hampered Lamar is gonna be, if at all,
(06:37):
But as long as he's able to get away from
the rush like he was against the Broncos, I think
he can slice and dice without you know, running a
lot using his legs again yards and that's just part
of evolution of him as a quarterback. I really believe that,
you know, many people when he came into the league
(06:58):
never thought that he could be this dangerous from the pocket.
That was something that I think that people the kind
of rationale with Lamar or what people I think mostly
thought that even if he was a dynamic quarterback in
the NFL, he would have to be using his legs
on a pretty regular basis. That no longer is the case.
(07:21):
He can have a huge game now, you know, barely
running for any yards at all he did against Denver.
So yeah, I think that he can slights and diets
as long as he's healthy enough to avoid the rush.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah. I mean, as it stands right now, Lamar Jackson
has the third most passing yards in the league. Were
more than halfway through the season. It's it's not Fluke's
a pretty sizable large sample size there, you know. And
that just tells you right then and there, like Lamar Jackson,
I don't know that. A lot of people, a lot
of people, I think, when he came into this league thought,
(07:55):
all right, even if Lamar Jackson becomes a good passer
and improves his passing and all that stuff, like it's
about efficiency, he's never going to be one of those
guys that leads the league in passing yards. Well, guess what,
he ain't far from it right now. I mean, it's
conceivable to think that Lamar could finish atop the league
in passing yards, which would be incredible, right And I
(08:16):
don't even know part of that was because the offense
the Ravens put around him, you know, would they ask him,
would they put enough on his plate to even allow
him the opportunity to lead the league in passing yards.
It's all on his plate. He's got the fool buffet.
It's golden corral up in here, all right, Cliff and
I think Lamar Jackson is up to the task. He's
(08:39):
like me in a golden crow man, I'm up to
the task.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
Yeah, And I give Todd Monkin, the Ravens coaching staff,
credit for allowing Lamar giving Lamar the full menu, which
is something that he always wanted. A few years back
at this story on Lamar and talk to Bobby Petrino,
his college coach at Louisville. He told a story about
(09:04):
Lamar's first year starting. He wasn't the starter when the
season began, so they just gave him kind of like
the plays that he was good at and went the
rest of the season and did well. But after the
season was over, Lamar came to him and in Lamar's words,
he said, I want to be a complete quarterback.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
I want the whole offensive playbook. I want all of it.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
And so Petrino told him, well, fine, but in order
to do that, you're going to have to show up
in the offseason every day at six o'clock. We're going
to go over film and you know you're going to
put in the work. He did, and then that next
season they had the full playbook at their display, and
you know it's a much different situation. But still, when
(09:47):
Todd Moncam became the offensive coordinator, his goal, or one
of his beliefs, was that Lamar give.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Him everything and he's able to handle it.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
And you know, I think that he's obviously proven that
this year to me, having his best season after winning
two MVPs, which is really kind of hard pull off.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Yeah, absolutely, so it'll be. You know, Lamar's had a
little success against the Bengals. He's nine to one against
him as a starter in his career. Some of his
best highlights have been against them. Some of his best
games have been against them. Something about the Bengals that
just he's Lamar sees those stripes and he turns it up.
So I expect another good one from Lamar. But you're
(10:29):
talking about Derrick Henry before and in the last game
against the Bengals, you know, like you said, he had
a good game as fifteen carries for ninety one yards,
But of those ninety or I'm sorry, ninety two yards
of those ninety two, fifty one came on one carry, right,
So the other forty one yards came on fourteen carries,
So it wasn't a highly efficient game on a down
(10:53):
in and down out basis for Derrick Henry. I think
that there's a big factor going into this game regard
and that's the health of BJ Hill, the Bengals big
old nose tackle who's dealing with a rib injury. We
are recording this as of Wednesday afternoon.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
PJ.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Hill did not practice on Monday or Tuesday. Again, these
are estimated to walk throughs in some part, but his
status is very much up in the air. If BJ
Hill does not play in this game, and he had
a strong game against the Ravens in Week five, I
think that's another opportunity for the Ravens to really lean
on Derrek Henry reaggressive in the ground game, and it
remains to be seen whether Keaton Mitchell will even join
(11:33):
this ground attack. So could this be a game where
the Ravens really tried to lean on that ground attack.
Keep the ball away from Joe Burrow, keep the ball
out of his hands, and look at some You know,
they thrived on kind of the big play last time
against the Bengals. Can they just march on the Bengals
defense this time around?
Speaker 3 (11:50):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (11:51):
I mean it's going to be interesting because even though
wasn't that long ago, when they faced the Bengals. You know,
at that point in the season, Mark Andrews had hadn't
started getting rolling yet, but Shaan Bateman wasn't, you know,
involved in offense as much as he has been the
last four or five weeks. The Ravens just keep spreading,
spreading more to keep giving you more to worry about it.
(12:14):
And now, if I'm the Bengals, I don't even know
what your approach is.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
I think in that game, Deontay Johnson, now too exactly,
I think that right right.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
I think they really put a lot of emphasis on
stopping Derrick Henry, which obviously makes a lot of sense,
but weren't as worried about some of the other weapons
beyond Lamar and Derek Henry. Now it's it's almost here
like like Lamar I loves to say, pick your poison
if they decided to, really, you know, whether BJBJ players
(12:47):
or not, really you know, load the box. That doesn't
seem the way that to be the way to go
against the Ravens anymore. It's almost like, now, maybe you
don't want to load the box and maybe hope that
Henry doesn't hit some home runs against you and focus
on keeping the big plays out of their passing offense.
So it's just a major problem when you face the Ravens,
(13:08):
now how to stop them and they've already scored forty
one points three times, where like a halfway through the season.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
That's you're really rolling when you're doing that.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, absolutely, I do think though, I think it could
be a heavier dose to the King. I think I
think fifteen carries last time. Would not be surprised if
we get more Derrick Henry in this game coming up
on Thursday night. All right, when we come back, we'll
flip it over the other side of the ball and
talk about what the Ravens need to do defensively to
slow down this Bengals offense. In Joe Burrow, thank you
(13:39):
for listening to the Lounge for coming to you from
the seat Geek Studio. We also want our listeners to
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(14:00):
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or call Oney hundred. Gambler must be twenty one or
older to play well. We were just talking about injuries, Cliff.
I should have noted off the top here that clearly
the voice, my voice is not fully recovered. I'm so questionable.
(14:21):
I would say on I'm improving. Do I sound a
little better?
Speaker 3 (14:25):
You do sound a little better?
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Man.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
You're good to now.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
I respect you because, yeah, earlier in the week you
would not sounded too good much.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
Yeah, you know you're welcome to everybody that I work with.
When I lose my voice, you don't have to hear
me flapping my gums in the office. But unfortunately for you,
I'm on the road to recovery cliffs. So we'll see,
all right.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Now.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
The Ravens defense Joe Burr is coming off a game
through five touchdown passes, Bengals put up forty one points.
Now do you think it should be noted? Okay, the
Bengals have not beaten a team as good as the
Ravens this year. Okay, all of the Bengals victories have
come against two and seven teams, teams that have a
(15:07):
record of two and seven, all four of them against
teams that are two and seven. They have not beaten
a team like the Ravens. Now, the Ravens feel like
and Marlin Humphrey said at point blank felt like they
should have beaten him, that the Bengals should have won
that game in Week five. So a large part of
that is because of the damage that Joe Burrow and
Jamar Chase did together. Jamar Chase had one hundred and
(15:27):
ninety three yards receiving in two touchdowns in Week five.
How do the Ravens slowed down Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, I think it starts with Chase trying to slow
him down. You know in this game, you know te
Higgins and another great wide receiver they have, but he's
been hampered this week. If he plays, he's not going
to be one hundred percent. So certainly, in a situation
like this, I think that you do whatever it takes
to try and keep Chase from making those game breaking plays.
(15:57):
You know, much like Zay Flowers, he chased when he
catches the ball to play is not over and if
you don't take the right angle with him or miss
a tackle. As he showed in week five, he will
take it all the way to the house. So those
type plays are game changers. If you can eliminate those,
your chances of beating the Bengals improved greatly. So Yeah,
(16:20):
I think priority as not a secret, but certainly in
this case where Higgins is hobbled that you do try
and take him his big playability out of the game.
And if you know Mike Joesechi or somebody else has
a big game, you kind of live with it and
hope it's not enough to beat you.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Yeah, I agree that. I think t higgins health status.
He's dealing with a quad injury that held him out
of both practices earlier this week, that's a big deal
whether he plays or not, because I mean, A, he's
just a great player. B. You got fourteen targets the
last time these two teams played, right, that's more than
Jamar Chase Scott. So when you have to really worry
(16:56):
about both those guys, it makes the task that much harder.
And to your point, I think if it's just Jamar
Chase out there, all right, you know, it's not like
they don't have any other weapons, but they're hampered offensively.
Zach Moss is on IR Eric all Junior, their talented
tight end who's been pretty big piece of their running
game also on IR now and so if it's Jamar
Chase out there without t Higgins, that comma becomes a
(17:19):
little less dangerous. I think another kind of x's and
o's point to this cliff is, so Week five, Jamar
Chase was targeted on eleven of his twenty one routes
against single high safety coverage that the Ravens played. On
those eleven targets, he caught nine balls for one hundred
and eighty four yards and two touchdowns. When the Ravens
(17:42):
played split safety coverage just two safeties high. Kind of,
he got one target, one catch, nine yards. Okay, So
that's certainly would indicate let's go two safeties high. Let's
leave Kyle Hailton, get Kyle Hailton out of the box
a little bit more, him play a little higher, and
that also gives the ability to shade towards, you know,
(18:05):
Jamar Chase a little bit, have a little more cloud
coverage over him, kind of have another guy that's able
to monitor Jamar Chase. So I think that the Ravens
probably shift up shift their defensive approaching their secondary a
little bit for this game.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Right. As we mentioned at the top that you know
round two of these, you know, inter division matchups, you
see different things, you see both teams doing different things,
and what you just mentioned obviously is something that the
Ravens know. And we'll try and see if the Bengals
can can beat them if they give them another look
that was more successful than what they tried in game one.
(18:42):
And this is going to be, to me a litmus
test of how much progress the Ravens defense is really making.
You know, I'm not going to take anything away from
their from their performance against Denver, but the Bengals are
that's another level of offense with Joe Burrow and the.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Weapons he has.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
If you contain the Bengals in a game that they
are viewing as a must win, then that's an indication that, yes,
this defense of the Ravens is making progress.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
I think you know, the Ravens talk this week about
the the need to not let Joe Burrow feel comfortable
in the pocket. You know, he felt a little too
comfortable out there in Week five, for sure. And when
when Joe's feeling it, when he's not feeling pressured, he
can just kill you. I mean, the guy can make
every arm or every throw.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
I mean.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
And so the Ravens in Week five they only blitzed
sixteen point seven percent of the time. They're already the
sixth lowest team in terms of blitz rate in the league,
and that's twenty two percent, So they were lower than
their low mark. Then their conservative approach. They were ultra
conservative in terms of the blitz in Week five, by
(19:56):
the way, just to put sixteen point seven percent blitz
rate in perspective, jack Ville blitz is at the lowest
rate in the league at sixteen point nine percent, So
it's below the Wors the lowest right. So I think
another question going into this game is to the Ravens
blitz at a higher rate.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
It'll it'll be interesting to see because as you know,
if you if you do blitz more than you're leaving
your secondary more a man the man coverage, allowing those
playmakers to make plays.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Loal and Humphrey also talked about how.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Frustrating it is with Burrow that even if you're a
covering your guy tight he'll still throw it to your guy.
He trusts Jason Higgins and those guys to make contested catches.
So if you're gonna blitz Borrow, particularly if he knows
the blitz is coming, he's gonna throw it to the
right spot to one of his weapons who believes that
they can win it and often do win in man
(20:50):
the man. So you always, to me, want to be
able to pressure a quarterback, not being able to blitz.
That's the ultimate and allows your defense to really be
at his best. But yeah, you can let Burrow just
stand back there and survey the field. So that's kind
of like the you know, push pull that you face
if you don't get pressure with four people. So I'll
(21:13):
be interested see the Ravens blitz more when they were
so reluctant to do it the first time they played.
But if they don't blitz, or whether they do blitz,
they've definitely got to play a better game defensively in
Week one.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
I think that, you know, this is a type of game.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
I feel that if the Ravens don't play well defensively
this time, they could get burned.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Oh for sure, the Bengals are certainly capable of burning
yet absolutely do you think that one factor in terms
of the Ravens pass rush, which you know you look
at the sack numbers and yeah, the Ravens are still
among the NFL leaders. Are they getting enough pressure?
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Now?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
I'm not going to like sit here in sugarcoat that
you know, the pass rush has been on fire. They
need to get more consistent pressure. When you look at
pressure rates and things like that, you know, it's not
as rosy of a picture as their sacked would portray.
One thing that I think that is a factor certainly
in this game is Orlando Brown Junior, the Bengals left tackle,
and obviously the former raven is dealing with knee and
(22:11):
fibula injuries. He was limited in practice on Tuesday, didn't
practice on Monday, So again another case of if he plays,
is he playing at one hundred percent? You know, Dafeoway
and some of these top Ravens pass rushers they need
to kind of get on the board a little bit
more here. It's they've been on a little bit of
a of a slower pace in recent games. If that's
(22:34):
the right where for Kyleve and NOI came out you
know on fire, slowed down a little bit. So I
think this is a game the Ravens need to get
some pressure on Joe Burrow. They need to rely on
those guys that front. Nomni has two sacks this year.
You know, like they got to win some of those
battles up front and get some pressures on Joe Burrow
because they are not getting enough on these quarterbacks in
recent weeks. And Joe Burrow, like we're saying, he will
(22:57):
kill you if you don't. So are the factors that
Ravens fans should be watching this game, Cliff. I really
look forward to it. This is gonna be an electric
atmosphere at M and T Banks Stadium on Thursday night football.
The Ravens they know how to play all prime time, okay,
this they they bring it, okay, and I think I
(23:18):
think that's legit. Like those again, you talk about sample size.
Sample size is large enough that the Ravens usually step
up to the plate and play some pretty good football
in these environments, and I expect them to do so. Again,
it's gonna be my my throat's gonna kill me for
this one, Cliff. But it's a big game, Okay, It's
gonna be the b when Thursday Night oh god, oh
(23:46):
I just I'm shot. I'm shot, Cliff. That was it,
but we had to do it. It's gonna be the
big one, Cliff get ready. Thanks for listening to Ravens fans.
Welcome into the Lounge presented by DraftKings. I'm Ryan Mink
here with cliff Don Brown, and we are going to
preview the Ravens big Thursday night football game against the
Cincinnati Bengals, the Purple Rising Game. Cliff, I know you've
got all your Purple Rising year ready to go. You've
got the Matt what Matt Reporter's notebook, the pen. What
(00:25):
do you come an outfit? Do you come into all purple?
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Cliff Man, I don't have any purple shoes. I'm gonna
have to add that to my game.
Speaker 1 (00:32):
Cliff has a better shoe collection than I do. So
you got the hook up from your son in law.
Speaker 3 (00:37):
You got to get some purple shoes I got to
get You're right.
Speaker 1 (00:42):
Well, that's always a pleasure to be with you, buddy,
And you know, this is a huge AFC North game
in tight a tight race. You know, it's not just
the Ravens and the Steelers that are in this race.
The Bengals are still very much in this and it's
a big opportunity for the Ravens to hand them their
six loss. Cincinnati were going to lose this game, which
(01:03):
would really kind of put them behind the eight ball. Conversely,
with a Ravens loss, you know, the Ravens have dropped
to six and four, the Bengals we be right back
in it at five and five, and now you have
a three way dog fight in the AFC Norse. So
this is I feel like Cliff, one of those games
that we're going to look back on and say, this
is kind of a hinge game. You know that the
(01:26):
season kind of went one way or the other.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yeah, I mean you want to get the Bengals in
your rear view mirror and keep them there if you can.
We all know how dangerous they are, how they can score.
Joe Burrow great quarterback, and they're used to winning. I
mean they've started slowly before and have come back to
make the playoffs. So even with their own three start,
they have now gotten themselves in a position if they
(01:49):
can win this game tomorrow right then, yes, I mean
that puts them right back in the picture. Ween mile
of Ravens, though, could almost make it a two team
raised with a victory. They'd have two wins over the Bengals.
So you know, even the Bengals don't fall apart, you
figure the Ravens will win a tiebreaker they could kind
of just focus on trying to beat the Steelers to
(02:11):
win the division.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
So it's a huge.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
Game, yeah, for sure, And certainly one of the talking
points about this game will be is it going to
look like the last one? The Ravens out last of
the Bengals in a forty one to thirty eight overtime
shootout in Cincinnati in Week five? Cliff, what's your gut
tell you or should fans expect another shootout on Thursday
night football?
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Well, I mean your gut and your eyes would tell
you yes, And I do think it will be high scoring,
but I would say not to the degree of that game.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
That's just my guess.
Speaker 2 (02:42):
I just think that, you know, the second time you
play someone in the season, they've got, you know, a
few more tricks in their sleeve to kind of maybe
slow these offensive down. But it's hard for me to
see as being a defensive struggle. I just think that
both of these offenses have so much firepower and the
quarterback is so good, they're going to figure out a
way to score points.
Speaker 3 (03:03):
And you know, the thing to remember in this game,
if either team.
Speaker 2 (03:06):
Gets a double digit lead, it's still not over. They're
both capable I think of coming back on each other.
So that's gonna make I think for probably another game
that comes down in the last five minutes.
Speaker 1 (03:18):
Yep, for sure. So you know, a big, big storyline
in this obviously will be how the Ravens top ranked offense,
can they keep cooking against the Bengals defense. And you know,
it was a shootout last time, and the Ravens kind
of hit those big plays. There's the big play to
Charlie Kohler. Derrick Henry had a fifty one yard run.
You know, Lamar obviously had the highlight of the day
(03:38):
with the you know, stiff arm touchdown pass. And so
I think this Ravens offense right now looks pretty darn
hard to stop. Do you think is there any reason
for Youcliff, to believe that that the Bengals could slow
them down?
Speaker 2 (03:56):
I think the only way that would happen is if
Trey Henderson, who had his last game, really has a
big game, you know, pressuring Lamar Jackson and make him
get rid of the ball before he wants to, even
if he doesn't always get the sack. I thought, you know,
Max Crosby when the Ravens played the Raiders was able
to do that, and you know, it kept Lamar from
(04:19):
dominating the game, and the Ravens were able to put Raiders,
excuse me, we're able to pull off the upset. So
if they can, the Ravens can keep Henderson under control.
I don't see the Bengals being able to stop the
Ravens from, you know, having another big night offensively. I
think Derrick Henry, you know, even though he didn't have
a monster game against the Bengals, gets capable of doing that.
(04:42):
If you don't pay a lot of attention to Derrick Henry,
he will have a big game and his presence. The
way the Ravens are clicking through the air, too many weapons,
I just think they present too many problems with the
Bengals to really contain.
Speaker 1 (04:58):
Yeah, I agree with that. On Hendrickson. I think that
he can have a Max Crosby like effect. To me,
I think a big storyline for the Ravens offense going
into this is Lamar Jackson right, And I mean he
played an unbelievable last game. We already talked about the
Sam Hubbers stif arm touchdown. He threw for three hundred
and forty eight yards and four touchdowns against them. But
he also ran them ball twelve times for fifty five yards,
(05:21):
and I don't think you should lose focus on that.
I think you know Lamar's Lamar's health status. He missed
the practice this week because of knee injury. He is
going to play, you know, but he didn't run hardly
at all last week. He had zero scripted runs. He
scrambled just to get away from pressure once last week
in the Ravens win. But if he can't, you know,
(05:43):
the Ravens and Lamar says he feels fine. But if
he is not going to run as much against the Bengals,
that takes away a pretty big weapon. And he would
have to beat this secondary that has some players in
that secondary with his arm, and certainly he's able capable
of doing that. Just saw him do that against the
Denver Broncis last week. Now, the the Bengals are also
(06:05):
another team that are gonna put a lot of pressure
on you. So Ken Lamar keeps slicing and dicing teams
beating him with his arm, even if he doesn't run
as much, maybe as he did last time when he
faced the Bengals.
Speaker 3 (06:16):
Yeah, I think he can.
Speaker 2 (06:17):
Now it's always better if he can run not only
for yards, but to be able to escape pressure, to
extend blades, which he has gotten so good at, and
the Ravens receivers have gotten so good at, you know,
freeing themselves when he does extend plays. So we don't
know how hampered Lamar is gonna be, if at all,
(06:37):
But as long as he's able to get away from
the rush like he was against the Broncos, I think
he can slice and dice without you know, running a
lot using his legs again yards and that's just part
of evolution of him as a quarterback. I really believe that,
you know, many people when he came into the league
(06:58):
never thought that he could be this dangerous from the pocket.
That was something that I think that people the kind
of rationale with Lamar or what people I think mostly
thought that even if he was a dynamic quarterback in
the NFL, he would have to be using his legs
on a pretty regular basis. That no longer is the case.
(07:21):
He can have a huge game now, you know, barely
running for any yards at all he did against Denver.
So yeah, I think that he can slights and diets
as long as he's healthy enough to avoid the rush.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
Yeah. I mean, as it stands right now, Lamar Jackson
has the third most passing yards in the league. Were
more than halfway through the season. It's it's not Fluke's
a pretty sizable large sample size there, you know. And
that just tells you right then and there, like Lamar Jackson,
I don't know that. A lot of people, a lot
of people, I think, when he came into this league thought,
(07:55):
all right, even if Lamar Jackson becomes a good passer
and improves his passing and all that stuff, like it's
about efficiency, he's never going to be one of those
guys that leads the league in passing yards. Well, guess what,
he ain't far from it right now. I mean, it's
conceivable to think that Lamar could finish atop the league
in passing yards, which would be incredible, right And I
(08:16):
don't even know part of that was because the offense
the Ravens put around him, you know, would they ask him,
would they put enough on his plate to even allow
him the opportunity to lead the league in passing yards.
It's all on his plate. He's got the fool buffet.
It's golden corral up in here, all right, Cliff and
I think Lamar Jackson is up to the task. He's
(08:39):
like me in a golden crow man, I'm up to
the task.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
Okay.
Speaker 2 (08:43):
Yeah, And I give Todd Monkin, the Ravens coaching staff,
credit for allowing Lamar giving Lamar the full menu, which
is something that he always wanted. A few years back
at this story on Lamar and talk to Bobby Petrino,
his college coach at Louisville. He told a story about
(09:04):
Lamar's first year starting. He wasn't the starter when the
season began, so they just gave him kind of like
the plays that he was good at and went the
rest of the season and did well. But after the
season was over, Lamar came to him and in Lamar's words,
he said, I want to be a complete quarterback.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
I want the whole offensive playbook. I want all of it.
Speaker 2 (09:26):
And so Petrino told him, well, fine, but in order
to do that, you're going to have to show up
in the offseason every day at six o'clock. We're going
to go over film and you know you're going to
put in the work. He did, and then that next
season they had the full playbook at their display, and
you know it's a much different situation. But still, when
(09:47):
Todd Moncam became the offensive coordinator, his goal, or one
of his beliefs, was that Lamar give.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Him everything and he's able to handle it.
Speaker 2 (09:58):
And you know, I think that he's obviously proven that
this year to me, having his best season after winning
two MVPs, which is really kind of hard pull off.
Speaker 1 (10:08):
Yeah, absolutely, so it'll be. You know, Lamar's had a
little success against the Bengals. He's nine to one against
him as a starter in his career. Some of his
best highlights have been against them. Some of his best
games have been against them. Something about the Bengals that
just he's Lamar sees those stripes and he turns it up.
So I expect another good one from Lamar. But you're
(10:29):
talking about Derrick Henry before and in the last game
against the Bengals, you know, like you said, he had
a good game as fifteen carries for ninety one yards,
But of those ninety or I'm sorry, ninety two yards
of those ninety two, fifty one came on one carry, right,
So the other forty one yards came on fourteen carries,
So it wasn't a highly efficient game on a down
(10:53):
in and down out basis for Derrick Henry. I think
that there's a big factor going into this game regard
and that's the health of BJ Hill, the Bengals big
old nose tackle who's dealing with a rib injury. We
are recording this as of Wednesday afternoon.
Speaker 3 (11:10):
PJ.
Speaker 1 (11:11):
Hill did not practice on Monday or Tuesday. Again, these
are estimated to walk throughs in some part, but his
status is very much up in the air. If BJ
Hill does not play in this game, and he had
a strong game against the Ravens in Week five, I
think that's another opportunity for the Ravens to really lean
on Derrek Henry reaggressive in the ground game, and it
remains to be seen whether Keaton Mitchell will even join
(11:33):
this ground attack. So could this be a game where
the Ravens really tried to lean on that ground attack.
Keep the ball away from Joe Burrow, keep the ball
out of his hands, and look at some You know,
they thrived on kind of the big play last time
against the Bengals. Can they just march on the Bengals
defense this time around?
Speaker 3 (11:50):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (11:51):
I mean it's going to be interesting because even though
wasn't that long ago, when they faced the Bengals. You know,
at that point in the season, Mark Andrews had hadn't
started getting rolling yet, but Shaan Bateman wasn't, you know,
involved in offense as much as he has been the
last four or five weeks. The Ravens just keep spreading,
spreading more to keep giving you more to worry about it.
(12:14):
And now, if I'm the Bengals, I don't even know
what your approach is.
Speaker 1 (12:18):
I think in that game, Deontay Johnson, now too exactly,
I think that right right.
Speaker 2 (12:25):
I think they really put a lot of emphasis on
stopping Derrick Henry, which obviously makes a lot of sense,
but weren't as worried about some of the other weapons
beyond Lamar and Derek Henry. Now it's it's almost here
like like Lamar I loves to say, pick your poison
if they decided to, really, you know, whether BJBJ players
(12:47):
or not, really you know, load the box. That doesn't
seem the way that to be the way to go
against the Ravens anymore. It's almost like, now, maybe you
don't want to load the box and maybe hope that
Henry doesn't hit some home runs against you and focus
on keeping the big plays out of their passing offense.
So it's just a major problem when you face the Ravens,
(13:08):
now how to stop them and they've already scored forty
one points three times, where like a halfway through the season.
Speaker 3 (13:14):
That's you're really rolling when you're doing that.
Speaker 1 (13:17):
Yeah, absolutely, I do think though, I think it could
be a heavier dose to the King. I think I
think fifteen carries last time. Would not be surprised if
we get more Derrick Henry in this game coming up
on Thursday night. All right, when we come back, we'll
flip it over the other side of the ball and
talk about what the Ravens need to do defensively to
slow down this Bengals offense. In Joe Burrow, thank you
(13:39):
for listening to the Lounge for coming to you from
the seat Geek Studio. We also want our listeners to
know that this week the Draft Kings Sportsbook, an official
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(14:00):
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or call Oney hundred. Gambler must be twenty one or
older to play well. We were just talking about injuries, Cliff.
I should have noted off the top here that clearly
the voice, my voice is not fully recovered. I'm so questionable.
(14:21):
I would say on I'm improving. Do I sound a
little better?
Speaker 3 (14:25):
You do sound a little better?
Speaker 2 (14:26):
Man.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
You're good to now.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
I respect you because, yeah, earlier in the week you
would not sounded too good much.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
Yeah, you know you're welcome to everybody that I work with.
When I lose my voice, you don't have to hear
me flapping my gums in the office. But unfortunately for you,
I'm on the road to recovery cliffs. So we'll see,
all right.
Speaker 2 (14:45):
Now.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
The Ravens defense Joe Burr is coming off a game
through five touchdown passes, Bengals put up forty one points.
Now do you think it should be noted? Okay, the
Bengals have not beaten a team as good as the
Ravens this year. Okay, all of the Bengals victories have
come against two and seven teams, teams that have a
(15:07):
record of two and seven, all four of them against
teams that are two and seven. They have not beaten
a team like the Ravens. Now, the Ravens feel like
and Marlin Humphrey said at point blank felt like they
should have beaten him, that the Bengals should have won
that game in Week five. So a large part of
that is because of the damage that Joe Burrow and
Jamar Chase did together. Jamar Chase had one hundred and
(15:27):
ninety three yards receiving in two touchdowns in Week five.
How do the Ravens slowed down Joe Burrow and Jamar Chase.
Speaker 2 (15:35):
Yeah, I think it starts with Chase trying to slow
him down. You know in this game, you know te
Higgins and another great wide receiver they have, but he's
been hampered this week. If he plays, he's not going
to be one hundred percent. So certainly, in a situation
like this, I think that you do whatever it takes
to try and keep Chase from making those game breaking plays.
(15:57):
You know, much like Zay Flowers, he chased when he
catches the ball to play is not over and if
you don't take the right angle with him or miss
a tackle. As he showed in week five, he will
take it all the way to the house. So those
type plays are game changers. If you can eliminate those,
your chances of beating the Bengals improved greatly. So Yeah,
(16:20):
I think priority as not a secret, but certainly in
this case where Higgins is hobbled that you do try
and take him his big playability out of the game.
And if you know Mike Joesechi or somebody else has
a big game, you kind of live with it and
hope it's not enough to beat you.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Yeah, I agree that. I think t higgins health status.
He's dealing with a quad injury that held him out
of both practices earlier this week, that's a big deal
whether he plays or not, because I mean, A, he's
just a great player. B. You got fourteen targets the
last time these two teams played, right, that's more than
Jamar Chase Scott. So when you have to really worry
(16:56):
about both those guys, it makes the task that much harder.
And to your point, I think if it's just Jamar
Chase out there, all right, you know, it's not like
they don't have any other weapons, but they're hampered offensively.
Zach Moss is on IR Eric all Junior, their talented
tight end who's been pretty big piece of their running
game also on IR now and so if it's Jamar
Chase out there without t Higgins, that comma becomes a
(17:19):
little less dangerous. I think another kind of x's and
o's point to this cliff is, so Week five, Jamar
Chase was targeted on eleven of his twenty one routes
against single high safety coverage that the Ravens played. On
those eleven targets, he caught nine balls for one hundred
and eighty four yards and two touchdowns. When the Ravens
(17:42):
played split safety coverage just two safeties high. Kind of,
he got one target, one catch, nine yards. Okay, So
that's certainly would indicate let's go two safeties high. Let's
leave Kyle Hailton, get Kyle Hailton out of the box
a little bit more, him play a little higher, and
that also gives the ability to shade towards, you know,
(18:05):
Jamar Chase a little bit, have a little more cloud
coverage over him, kind of have another guy that's able
to monitor Jamar Chase. So I think that the Ravens
probably shift up shift their defensive approaching their secondary a
little bit for this game.
Speaker 2 (18:19):
Right. As we mentioned at the top that you know
round two of these, you know, inter division matchups, you
see different things, you see both teams doing different things,
and what you just mentioned obviously is something that the
Ravens know. And we'll try and see if the Bengals
can can beat them if they give them another look
that was more successful than what they tried in game one.
(18:42):
And this is going to be, to me a litmus
test of how much progress the Ravens defense is really making.
You know, I'm not going to take anything away from
their from their performance against Denver, but the Bengals are
that's another level of offense with Joe Burrow and the.
Speaker 3 (19:00):
Weapons he has.
Speaker 2 (19:03):
If you contain the Bengals in a game that they
are viewing as a must win, then that's an indication that, yes,
this defense of the Ravens is making progress.
Speaker 3 (19:14):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (19:14):
I think you know, the Ravens talk this week about
the the need to not let Joe Burrow feel comfortable
in the pocket. You know, he felt a little too
comfortable out there in Week five, for sure. And when
when Joe's feeling it, when he's not feeling pressured, he
can just kill you. I mean, the guy can make
every arm or every throw.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
I mean.
Speaker 1 (19:34):
And so the Ravens in Week five they only blitzed
sixteen point seven percent of the time. They're already the
sixth lowest team in terms of blitz rate in the league,
and that's twenty two percent, So they were lower than
their low mark. Then their conservative approach. They were ultra
conservative in terms of the blitz in Week five, by
(19:56):
the way, just to put sixteen point seven percent blitz
rate in perspective, jack Ville blitz is at the lowest
rate in the league at sixteen point nine percent, So
it's below the Wors the lowest right. So I think
another question going into this game is to the Ravens
blitz at a higher rate.
Speaker 2 (20:14):
It'll it'll be interesting to see because as you know,
if you if you do blitz more than you're leaving
your secondary more a man the man coverage, allowing those
playmakers to make plays.
Speaker 3 (20:25):
Loal and Humphrey also talked about how.
Speaker 2 (20:27):
Frustrating it is with Burrow that even if you're a
covering your guy tight he'll still throw it to your guy.
He trusts Jason Higgins and those guys to make contested catches.
So if you're gonna blitz Borrow, particularly if he knows
the blitz is coming, he's gonna throw it to the
right spot to one of his weapons who believes that
they can win it and often do win in man
(20:50):
the man. So you always, to me, want to be
able to pressure a quarterback, not being able to blitz.
That's the ultimate and allows your defense to really be
at his best. But yeah, you can let Burrow just
stand back there and survey the field. So that's kind
of like the you know, push pull that you face
if you don't get pressure with four people. So I'll
(21:13):
be interested see the Ravens blitz more when they were
so reluctant to do it the first time they played.
But if they don't blitz, or whether they do blitz,
they've definitely got to play a better game defensively in
Week one.
Speaker 3 (21:26):
I think that, you know, this is a type of game.
Speaker 2 (21:28):
I feel that if the Ravens don't play well defensively
this time, they could get burned.
Speaker 1 (21:35):
Oh for sure, the Bengals are certainly capable of burning
yet absolutely do you think that one factor in terms
of the Ravens pass rush, which you know you look
at the sack numbers and yeah, the Ravens are still
among the NFL leaders. Are they getting enough pressure?
Speaker 2 (21:49):
Now?
Speaker 1 (21:49):
I'm not going to like sit here in sugarcoat that
you know, the pass rush has been on fire. They
need to get more consistent pressure. When you look at
pressure rates and things like that, you know, it's not
as rosy of a picture as their sacked would portray.
One thing that I think that is a factor certainly
in this game is Orlando Brown Junior, the Bengals left tackle,
and obviously the former raven is dealing with knee and
(22:11):
fibula injuries. He was limited in practice on Tuesday, didn't
practice on Monday, So again another case of if he plays,
is he playing at one hundred percent? You know, Dafeoway
and some of these top Ravens pass rushers they need
to kind of get on the board a little bit
more here. It's they've been on a little bit of
a of a slower pace in recent games. If that's
(22:34):
the right where for Kyleve and NOI came out you
know on fire, slowed down a little bit. So I
think this is a game the Ravens need to get
some pressure on Joe Burrow. They need to rely on
those guys that front. Nomni has two sacks this year.
You know, like they got to win some of those
battles up front and get some pressures on Joe Burrow
because they are not getting enough on these quarterbacks in
recent weeks. And Joe Burrow, like we're saying, he will
(22:57):
kill you if you don't. So are the factors that
Ravens fans should be watching this game, Cliff. I really
look forward to it. This is gonna be an electric
atmosphere at M and T Banks Stadium on Thursday night football.
The Ravens they know how to play all prime time, okay,
this they they bring it, okay, and I think I
(23:18):
think that's legit. Like those again, you talk about sample size.
Sample size is large enough that the Ravens usually step
up to the plate and play some pretty good football
in these environments, and I expect them to do so. Again,
it's gonna be my my throat's gonna kill me for
this one, Cliff. But it's a big game, Okay, It's
gonna be the b when Thursday Night oh god, oh
(23:46):
I just I'm shot. I'm shot, Cliff. That was it,
but we had to do it. It's gonna be the
big one, Cliff get ready. Thanks for listening to Ravens fans.
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