November 27, 2024 • 33 mins
Welcome back to the Vikings Tailgate presented by Ticketmaster - The official ticket marketplace of the Minnesota Vikings. It's Thanksgiving week and even though the Vikings are facing the Cardinals Sunday, the NFC North is fully in the spotlight all day Thursday. Cy brings back show favorite and Lions fan Zach Martina to review the insanely competitive NFC North and the implications of the 2 most critical games on Thursday. The guys break down the Lions facing the Bears at home, the Packers facing the Dolphins Thursday night, the prosect of the Vikings and Lions having everything on the line in week 18, why the 'Campbell Gamble' could be the boom or bust factor for the Lions, and why Cy feels the Vikings are entering a moment to make a strong run in the 2024 NFL playoffs. All of this and more is on episode 47 of The Vikings Tailgate presented by Ticketmaster - The official ticket marketplace of the Minnesota Vikings.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
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(00:21):
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Hey everybody, Welcome into the Vikings Tailgate, brought to you
(00:42):
by Ticketmaster, the official ticket marketplace of the Minnesota Vikings.
I'm your host, Cy Aminson, and it's Thanksgiving week. Seeing
as our Minnesota Vikings are not playing on Thursday, they'll
be playing on Sunday, we thought we would bring one
of our favorite guests back, who experience is a Thanksgiving
game every single year. The Great Zach Martina, die hard
(01:06):
Lions fan, is in to talk about Thanksgiving and the
NFC North Race. I think you guys are gonna love
this one. Enjoy the show. The recket Rocket im here
(01:28):
welcome everybody to the Thanksgiving week edition of the Tailgate
and joining me. I know we play the Arizona Cardinals,
but I wanted to talk about Thanksgiving. And who better
to discuss Thanksgiving with than a man whose team plays
every year on Thanksgiving than a man whose team is
(01:49):
in first place in the NFC North and relevant for
the first time in fifty years. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome
back to the program. Fan favorite Zach Martin.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Hello, Zachary high sidh and I just want to you
you forgot tied for first place in the NFL.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
You forgot I mean with some more of an NFC
you know, an NFC North conversation. We were talking a
little bit off air before we started the show, and
I realized we needed to bring it onto the air.
You are right now riding high with a level of
confidence that is foreign to me, and I am curious.
(02:29):
Are you not concerned about the let down like you?
You seem so in and why not? You've got the
best team in football potentially, But is there is there
no worry that the more you climb this mountain, the
harder the fall could possibly be.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Come January February time or is it just a lack
of success historically that you're just enjoying the ride.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I mean, it's all of the above.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
And I know that's kind of a cop out answer,
but you said confident, yes, but it's you also said
the word concerned. I would say it is a concerned
confidence because we have been hurt before. Now I've never
now listened. Think about the Lion King and Pride Rock
where Rafiki holds Simba up to the sky and it's
a beautiful thing. I mean, that's about the height we
(03:18):
would fall from. Yeah, circle of life, and that would
and that would definitely be painful.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Last year, there.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Was disappointment when we h when we blew it there
in the second half of the NFC Championship game.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
However, this year.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Like we were over all last year, proud, like excited,
like no one expected that to happen so quickly, this
year will feel a little bit different. I mean, just
the way the offense is destroying people. Our defense has
given up eleven second half points in the last five games,
and all of those were to Green Bay.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Our team is very good, and it will it will hurt.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
I saw a stat the other day that said betting
sites are really really pulling against the Lions because there
has never been a team that had more futures bet
placed on them.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
So they still to lose a lot of.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Money because the the interesting thing from an outsider's perspective,
I look over at your team and I think often
I think we're so tricked by Tom Brady and Patrick
Mahomes into this idea that you can be a perennial contender,
you know, through over the course of decades. It's just
(04:31):
not really reality in the NFL. And unless you have
a surefire first ballot Hall of Fame quarterback, and so
you are the Buffalo Bills. The Buffalo Bills are doing
some sneaky stuff right now.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
Yeah, let me do it here.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Sneaky but sneaky good where Joe Brady is coming there
and they've always been a downfield passing attack and now
it's all short intermediary. Josh Allen has thrown like touchdowns
to eleven people. It's just there's something, there's something different
and interesting over there.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
And Amari Cooper has not been one hundred for them
since that first game there. I mean, he is going
to change the game for that's.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
That's one hundred that's that's absolutely correct. And so I'm
looking at you guys. I do think you're the best
team in the NFL right now. But I think this
is a seize the moment for you situation because Goff's
contract is gonna it's gonna click in, right and that's
gonna change your roster. You've got Ben Johnson who seems
(05:29):
like almost unwilling to consider being a head coach anywhere else.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
At some point he's and I hope that meantime.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I just can't imagine it does. But at some point
we're both in that situation. We both have coordinators who
we know should be head coaches right now. Sure, and
it's just a matter of time. And I think we're
both sitting there going, you know, there's this window. So
that's that's what I'm curious about, where I think when
(05:55):
I talk to you, you act like you're just walking
into the beginning of the hey day, and me, as
a sports fan, I'm going, I mean, I hope, So,
I mean, this might be the year. This might be it.
It has to be, this might be, this might be.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
That's the worry I have every week is that it's
I hope we don't buy into our hype and so
far we have not. It seemed like Houston we may
have bought in a little bit. And then Dan Campbell
did what Dan Campbell does and and rallied a group
of men in the locker room to come back and
win that game. Then Jacksonville, I mean that was that
(06:29):
was rough for any Jag fan.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
And then this past.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Week against the Colts away, I mean, we're six and
zero away right now, which is bananas.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
It's a pretty crazy number. I have. Everybody who's listening
to the show forever knows that I'm a worrying fan.
I tend to think the bottom is going to fall out. Well, also,
that doesn't keep me from enjoying the big moments. I
don't in the big moments, I don't go oh no,
like I still enjoyed. I just like I'm more of
a worrier. But I've been quietly saying this and now
(07:03):
I'm starting to loudly say it. I also think the
Vikings are in a moment here. Okay, I don't know
that I'm right, but they're just showing pieces of everything. Right.
So this weekend, Hockinson and Addison finally get going right.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
I mean, Aaron Jones had a great game.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
But here's the thing, if you actually watch the game,
it was like a little at the beginning and a
little at the end when it was important. So they
haven't really put the run game together the end. It's
like different weeks. They've had different pieces of the offense,
and at some point, I'm telling you, man, if an
offense doesn't truly figure this defense out at some point,
(07:43):
if coach O'Connell is as good as we all believe
he is, at some point he's gonna pull all these
pieces together. And dude, I think there is a chance
that they make a run. I think there is a
chance they beat the Lions. I think this is a
unique moment for them as a team as well, given
what Brian Flores is doing and the fact that he
(08:04):
probably will be somewhere else next year. And you look
at the last two games. This is the most underrated
thing with the Vikings. Sam Donald was phenomenal against the
Bears because they've been playing this too high safety stuff.
You know, they've been trying to make and he had
those run of games where he turned the ball over
a bunch and everybody freaked out. He was forcing it
to Jefferson. Now you are actively seeing Sam Donald when
(08:28):
he drops back on these long drops, with these long
developing plays, and you see him, Oh, there's nothing, there's nothing.
He is taking the sacks and he's throwing the ball
out of bounds and he's not forcing it anywhere.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
I think the same thing about Jared Goff that you
said a very interesting thing.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
And I the way that you.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Describe sacks being put upon a quarterback is very very
interesting because I think the verb makes a difference. And
what you just said about Donald, I fully believe about golf,
he is not getting sacked. He is taking sacks because
he is a like that's his choice, that's what's best
for the offense. It's not necessarily the defense. I mean,
(09:05):
the defense is winning, but he's not making a home
run mistake, if that makes sense. And I think the
ability to take sacks, and I think what you're saying
about Sam Darnold, like he's at a time now where
it's a brand new team. He's you know, this is
his first year in that system. I think it's starting
starting to click. I think he's just starting to see
(09:25):
things with a wider scope.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Yeah, I think so. And I think figuring out. It
almost is like, uh, when you warm up in tennis,
this is gonna be the dumbest metaphor in the history
of the world. Right, So you know, at least when
I would warm up when I played tennis, I would
never go back to the service line, right. I stretch
(09:48):
a little bit, you know, I take some groundstrokes from
the baseline. Then you come up and you play them
that a little bit, get your arm loosened up, so
you kind of dial some things in, and then you'd
go back and you'd start serving. But when you serve
to me, I always put the first handful of serves.
I just uncorked them, and I you know, I shot
past the box, right sure, I intentionally overshot, and then
(10:13):
I dialed things in.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
The same thing in pickleball.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
It's that's what the Sam Darnold season has felt like, though,
Right he goes out the first few games and they're
just kind of taking groundstrokes and and and working the net.
And they can do that because the defense was on
a historic run, right. You know that that Texans game,
that Packers game, the whole game was tilted against the
other team because of all the turnovers, like missed field goals,
(10:39):
fourth down stops, all this stuff. Then they kind of
turned on. They pushed it a little bit, and here
he is that you know, you lose Christian Darisaw, you're
making some mistakes. They they out, they pushed out a
little far, and now they're reeling it back in where
it should be. I think the real test is you
would have loved to, as a Vikings fan see in
this run of what I think some people would call
(10:59):
subpar opponents right the AFC South into the Bears. You
would have liked to have seen a more complete offensive performance.
But I would argue the last two weeks with how
well Sam played, they were a moment away in each
game from feeling that way. If Jalen Naylor catches the
touchdown against the Titans, that's a thirty point game. It's
a block. Sure. If Brandon Powell doesn't set a literal
(11:23):
basketball screen, I think the play still works. Jefferson scores
a touchdown and it's the same thing there. So they're
just so close, and with the Cardinals and the Falcons
coming up, I think if you're a Lions fan, and
I don't talk like this, but if you're a Lions fan,
what you absolutely don't want to see in the next
two games is what you saw last night from the
(11:45):
Philadelphia Eagles, where you go, oh, the Eagles have an identity.
They're really like this Barkley thing was a thing, but
it really is. You just really don't want to see
the Vikings offensive identity gel the next two weeks.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
If you're you no, I don't.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Well, ultimately, what I don't want to see in the
next few weeks is any kind of loss from the
Lions because right now we are ten and one, the
Packers are what nine and two, and you're eight and three.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
Oh flip pop, we're nine and two. They're eight and three.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
You're nine and two, they're eight and three. The NFC
North is I mean, this is the league right now.
This is the hottest division, the toughest division. I mean,
the Bears record doesn't reflect it, but they're playing a
lot of teams tough. So I mean you take that
as you will. I don't want to see losses because
I don't want to see us potentially lose what we
(12:37):
have in this moment, which is the number one seed
and the bye. Now, when you speak about the Philadelphia
Eagles and their identity, as far as running the ball,
our defensive identity is stopping the run. And I know
you're speaking of the Minnesota Vikings. The passing attack in particular,
for me, is always the strong suit for your team.
Not that Aaron Jones is a subpar running back, He's
(12:59):
a great running back. I just think what you have
in the receiving corps is something special. We are also
top five in the in the past defense. So I'm
I'm worried constantly of what could happen with the Lions
because in the past we have lost games in an
instant and this is the first time in my life
(13:22):
this year and last year where we have been winning
those games. So I'm still way too familiar with the
one play going the other direction.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
And it's it's it is. You have an interestingly difficult
this So it's Thanksgiving week. You guys play on Thanksgiving
every year. You need to send a postcard to the
Minnesota Vikings organization for breaking the Bear's spirit in that game,
like that loss, that loss after getting a field goal
block to so those last two losses, you go, Okay,
(13:50):
that's a tough thing to recover from because if they'd
have been picking up some momentum, you know, with the new.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
Coordin, especially with the locker room turmoil they have.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Yeah, with the new coordinator is helping. Like, I think,
this is a sneaky, big moment in your season. You
gotta go out and you gotta do exactly what you're
supposed to do. If something goes weird and something goes
wrong and you lose this game, goodness, gracious, buddy, you
go Packers Bills Bears again, and who knows what that
(14:18):
Niners will be before you get us to get to
the end of season. You are in that situation where's
there's no weirdly at ten and one, and as the
best team in football, you have a no room for
error game because of how good the division is. On
Thanksgiving we have now, I do think, I do think
that Dolphins are gonna come in and smack the Packers around.
(14:40):
I really think that. I know too, it doesn't play
well in the cold weather, but I think we're gonna be.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
He's been playing lights out since he got back.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
We are gonna be enjoying pie. Well, green Bay gets
smacked around.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
I really really hope that is.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
I just need to believe that if green Bay is
getting smacked around by Miami. Come that night, I will
make some sort of margarita and top it with spray cheese.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
All right, That's what I will do.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Let me tell you what the most Viking thing in
the history of being a Viking fans. You somehow blow
it against the Bears. The Dolphins go in and smack
around the Packers, and we walk into Sunday against the
Cardinals with everything in front of us at this state, Mike,
And I'm not saying they should be I'm just telling
you the mental makeup of this state as sports fans,
(15:31):
they're like I think, if they somehow win that game
against the Cardinals, you'll just hear the whole stadium instead
of the skull chant, You'll just hear them go oh,
and it's just them exhaling after a three and a
half hour breath.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Hold. Well, I don't think you have to worry about
I'm very confident going in against the Bears own for.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
A few reasons.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
I love that for you.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
It's home. It's a home game, which obviously huge. It
is up until these past few years, like the Thanksgiving
game was the only nationally televised game we had. It
was It's always been a big deal for Lions fans,
and the last few years on Thanksgiving, we have lost
at the end of the game. We have lost at
(16:12):
the end of the fourth quarter on some crazy kick
or some blown cover like we have just this is
a game that Dan Campbell is like, we are winning
this and then we're going and we're handing out turkeys
to the community. I'm confident we're winning this game.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Is there any part of you that's sitting around wondering
if and so with the Vikings, it's always the kicker,
Like I know every as Parker Romo lined up to
kick the even I was going, just go get the touchdown.
Why do we got to risk it? Like yeah, you're
just waiting for the kicker thing to happen. Is there
(16:47):
any part of you in Detroit that is just sitting
there going when is Dan Campbell gonna Dan Campbell? When
is that? Because I would argue, now, I think you're
giving me a look right now, so you're not gonna
lie what I'm about to say.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
I'm hoping to understand what you're saying, because Dan Campbell
always is Dan Campbell's.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Yes, but there's a you can Campbell good and you
can Campbell bad, and so I think the Campbell gamble,
the Campbell gamble, that's how is that not a t s?
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Not a thing?
Speaker 1 (17:17):
How? Yeah, that's Jay? Can we trademark that? Go ahead? Well,
the show's going, can we go ahead and trademark that.
So we were talking about the Bills and that big
Bills Chiefs game.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
We played last year on Thanksgiving, which is why you
lost really excited for that Bill's game coming in the
last seconds.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
So when Josh Allen what I believe to be the
play of the year thus far, fourth and two, they
go for it in their own zone, Josh Allen picks
it up on a scramble, gets all the way in
the inn zone, scores a touchdown. You know, Nick Wright
said this thing where he's like he thinks Josh Allen
is the greatest scrambling quarterback of all time, not running
but like on a design pass play, the most devastating
scrambler of all time, which is kind of hard to
(17:54):
argue with.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
But I got a real issue with Nick Wright his
hair that he called Jared Goff.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
He's like, any civilian could run the Lions offense, and
I'm like, you're obviously not looking at statistics.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
I love that you've joined the real NFL world where
your team is relevant enough that you can start hating
certain analysts. That's how you know.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
Before we just hated all of them because they were right.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
That's how you know it matters. We're like, we hate
Nick right in Detroit.
Speaker 3 (18:24):
I hate him.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
No other, no other quarterback in the league is getting chanted.
Just Disney World broke out in a Jared Goff chant
last night. It's awesome. Don't you talk about that, Nick.
I'm sorry, go on, I'm upset.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
So when you are in that fourth and two, I
think analytics conventional with him. They all have to be
set on top of the reality of the situation. And
that reality is you cannot give Patrick Mahomes the ball back.
You can't. You can't give him the ball back. Like
who you are playing against matters. And the interesting thing
(19:02):
about Dan Campbell is he and his Campbell gamble have
been immune to influence by situation or opponent. And I
thought that is what cost them the game last year
against the San Francisco forty nine ers. But I haven't
seen it this year. I've seen it in a Vikings game.
I've watched him, I've watched him cost them a Vikings game,
(19:25):
but I haven't seen it this year. So are do
you guys believe because of how good Ben Johnson's been
and all this, do you do you believe that the
that is behind you? Or are you kind of wary
of a moment where the Campbell gamble doesn't recognize its
surroundings and starts screaming in a room full of people.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
I can't I cannot go against the Campbell gamble because
of how often it has worked out for us. If
I I feel like if I get mad at once
situation where he gambles and it doesn't.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
Know why, why can't you say why can't you say
we want you to Campbell gamble? But also recognize the
gravity of the moment.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
I think he believes. I think he believes in his team.
I think he believes in I mean that's why you
constantly see us running on third down and twelve, because
he knows we can get six yards and then we
can convert on a fourth and six. Like he believes
in our offensive line. He believes in Jared Goff's command
of the offense. I mean, you've seen far less. I
mean when he's when he came to Detroit. The Campbell
(20:33):
gamble was I'm gonna fake punt. I'm gonna fake punt
and we're gonna get a first down that way. And
then as the years have progressed, it is no longer
like hey, I mean, there's a fake punt in there
every once in a while, but it's not a special
teams gamble. It is my offense is gonna run it
down your throat or I'm gonna make you think you
are and then I'm gonna dump it off across the middle.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
I just I can't.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
It's worked far too many times to where I if
it goes bad once.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
So if he makes a decision in an AFC champion
or in an NFC championship game or a super Bowl
when there's a high level opponent on the other side,
like like the like the last year with this forty
nine ers, when he should have taken those field goals,
in my opinion, are punted, you will you And I'm
not I'm not pushing, I'm not bullying. It's just a
genuine question from a fan psychology standpoint, if he does
(21:25):
that in an NFC championship or a super Bowl, you
will take solace in the idea like, well, we wouldn't
be here if he didn't do that every time. That's
that's what you can walk away with.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
I do believe that we wouldn't have been in the
u NFC Championship if we didn't have a few Campbell gambles.
I mean, it just it just wouldn't have happened. So
the fact that Dan Campbell, like I said, Dan Campbell
is always going to Dan Campbell, that that is exactly
what he does, I would be I would be more
concerned if he changed his mentality because that's not this
(21:59):
team that's at all.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Well, tough boys play tough because when they're tough, they
need to be tough, and it ain't no room for
not being tough. Like, isn't there some nuance? Isn't there
when you have a coaching staff large enough to fill
an entire jet, which is what most professional sports organizations are.
Don't don't you wonder as a fan, don't you go, Okay,
who's the guy you have hired? Delane and the coaches
(22:20):
here and go, hey, Dan, they're the best defensive football
And you go up ten here and there's only four
minutes to play, let's go ahead and go up ten here, Dan, like,
isn't that.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
Well, it's it's not. I will.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
I know for a fact that it is not just
Dan Campbell riding his hunch. I know that there is
an entire section of their coaching box that is dedicated
to analytics and the particular situations like he's informed.
Speaker 3 (22:44):
Dan Campbell will have you believe he.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Is just some guy who throws bills a hay in
his spare time. But that is Dan Campbell is an
educated dude, Dan Campbell. He may not, be, in my opinion,
the greatest x's and o's guys, but I think Dan
Campbell situationally does not get enough credit for how good
he is.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
He just sees the game a little differently.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
Does your defensive coordinator? They call plays? Right?
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Both of our coordinators call plays?
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Yeah? See I really to me, that's my favorite part
about Dan Campbell. I like the old school like CEO
of a football team, Like I love what we have.
But I was a Denny Green fan. I like the
old days where you're like Brian Billick's your O coordinator,
Tony Denji's your decordinator. I do think there's something to
(23:31):
be said for that, because I think everything you hear
about Campbell is he's a good leader, and he's a
good motivator. It's like being you know, yeah, it's like
being a president. It's all who you put in charge
of stuff, right, and how you support them. Sure, and
so I do. I will give you that. I do
really like that about him. And then I think that
allows him to succeed at what he's very good at
(23:54):
and keeps him from not succeeding at the things he's
not good at.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
What you have to consider too with Dan Campbell is
once you've earned Dan Campbell's trust, you have it. When
we when we first hired Dan Campbell, Anthony Lynn came
in and he was our offensive coordinator, and that offense
was not hummin it was not doing great. Ben Johnson
was on that staff as the tight ends coach. He
took over as the interim offensive coordinator, not even like
just outright got the job, and Dan Campbell called the
(24:22):
plays for a few times, like for I don't know,
a few games until close to the end of the season,
and then he started just slowly giving Ben Johnson right,
you call it here, you call it here, and we
would we would get big, big yards all of a sudden.
Ben Johnson is calling the game, and now he's this
mad scientist who's built the entire offense around Jared Goff.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
I think that's why.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
I think that's why Nick Wright is an idiot, because
they built this offense around.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
All roads lead Nick Right.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
They built this offense around Jared Goff, so like, I
don't think any civilian could run it. And I think
I think he did exactly what he wanted to do.
He wanted someone to talk about some bad opinion that
he has instead of just saying this is just a
guy with hair, like I know what it's like to
be a guy with hair.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
That he's an idiot.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Here here, here's the thing. We're just gonna find out
because he's got the contract, and over the next couple
of years, the roster is gonna change.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I agree, But that contract is gonna look good as
the years go on, maybe comparatively, maybe, I think so.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
I'm saying it might, you know, depends how much the
cap goes up. I'm not smart about that stuff, but
I mean it's one of two things. They voted Josh
Allen in the Players Survey the most overrated quarterback in
the NFL. I think everybody thought Diggs was gonna leave
and they were gonna fall apart, and it just turns
out the exact opposite has happened, and he's one of
those guys.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
The mahomes Hill situation.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Yeah, he can carry a team through his big salary,
and it'll be really interesting to see if he's one
of those guys if Ben Johnson finally decides he wants
to be a pro football head coach somewhere. But I
don't know, man. Here's what I will tell you. Here's
what I know what you want. I know that you
want to win every game the rest of the way,
finish sixteen in one and be the one seed. I
(26:10):
think that makes a lot of sense to me. What
I would like is I would like the Vikings to
win the next couple of games, and I'd like you
to drop one of the next two, preferably to I
think green Bay is who you have af does it
go Bears and then green Bay.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
Green Bays just before the Niners. Yeah, Green So December fifth,
we have the Packers, we have two Thursday games.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Yeah, So I would like the Packers to drop one
to the Dolphins. Then I would like them to beat
you I'd like us to win two and a couple
of weeks from now, I'd like this just to be
a big, gross, ugly meat grinder with four games to
play and four games in which we play. We play
(26:55):
the Packers and the Lions. There's two games there you play.
I think at least us do you play the that'll
be have you played the Packers yet?
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Let's we got to go back to the Dan Campbell mentality.
We are playing the Bears twice, those are division games.
Dan Campbell gets up for those games. We are then
playing the Packers, who I'm and Ross Saint Brown has
really lit a fire under this team as far as
like f the Packers, you know, like that's the whole mentality,
that's our I mean, that's they're They're trying to make
(27:25):
this rivalry like a thing. But we're at home. Our
home games are different. So we've got home this week
against Chicago. That's gonna make a difference. The hatred for
Green Bay, especially since like elgind Jenkins or something after
the last time we played him. They go, I mean, yeah,
the team that made more plays one, but the better
team didn't win. That is bulletin board material that they've
(27:45):
been looking at ever since the Bills. We play thereafter
they just barely beat us last year during Thanksgiving. Dan
Campbell is going to make sure that they know that.
Then after the Bills, we've got the Bears again, which
is going to be at Chicago.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
That's a trap game. May then we have the forty
nine ers.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
Who I mean, can you talk about a more revenge
game than the NFC Championship? The Chicago Bears game away
is the is the scariest one.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
For me more than the Bills.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
I think the Lions get up for the Bills, and
I think we're playing at home. The Bills are certainly
maybe the best team that we have left. But I
think that I think that the team gets up for
that game, especially at home.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
What are you gonna do? You go to the Thanksgiving game?
Speaker 2 (28:30):
No, I have we go over to my wife's family's house,
of which there are like twenty seven people.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
There and we're all watching the game.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
That'd be a terrible like that alone, like a giant
family gathering where it used to be like we all
go there, we watched the Lions lose and we eat.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
Now it's like we did that last year against the bills, dude.
It was one of my greatest memories on a holiday.
My entire family, like from my in laws who are
seventy to my youngest nephew who like eight at the time,
There's twenty seven people all around the TV collectively breathing
the same way big inhales, huge xhals, disappointment, excitement. It
(29:10):
was wonderful and I'm hoping that this year it ends
with the dub because that will be a friggin' party.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Well, I hope a couple of weeks from now, we're
just in a big gross meat grinder between the three
of us.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
The phrase, I just want to say, the phrase big
gross meat grinder is super gross.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Yeah, no problem. That's actually the name of your guys' offense.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
I don't know meat grinder.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Sure you know I am not a trash talker, but
I will be texting you on thanks Staven. I don't
have a good I don't have a good feeling about
this game for you, guys.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
That's your heart speaking. That's your heart speaking.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
Can I tell you why?
Speaker 3 (29:48):
Absolutely? I hope you do.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
The most likely outcome here is that the Bears season
just falls apart. It's already there but it just completely
falls apart and it tumbles to the end. Right, But
they have a pretty good defense.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Their defense is very good, but no defense has really
been able to have our offense.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
So you know, we did pretty well against you. But
there's this other scenario where I think Caleb Williams is
gonna have a day.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
He has to.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
At some point, he's gonna have a day, and at
some point, you guys aren't gonna have a day.
Speaker 3 (30:23):
And I think that was Houston.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
Yeah, maybe, but Houston also didn't have a day. I
think there's a chance I said it on last week's show.
I'm gonna say it again. A confluence of events creates
a very tricky Thanksgiving for you. Now. I'm sure you'll
text me when you guys win fifty two to eight.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
I'm a very humble fan. I won't do that.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
No, I don't think you'll be cocky about it, but
I think you'll be like, hey, about that confluence of events.
I guess there wasn't one.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
I love that you're saying confluence events of events right
after you said big gross meat grinder, thank you. That
could not be two more different speaking spells so intelligent
but so blue collar.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
Both ends, but.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
I'm gonna tell you, if you put them both in
a drawl, they sound like they matter together. Well, it
was just a confluence of event advance that put us
in a big, gross meat grinder.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
And that's how we lost Uncle Bill her chewed him up.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
And then and that is why we will. We bought
this year's turkey in honor of Uncle Bill. Zach thank
you for joining us. I hope, I I hope I
see you shortly on this show and discussing a game
that matters just a whole.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
I do hope it matters. I do hope it matters.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
I know you want that one seed, But can I
tell you how fun would it be if the last
game of the season between our two teams, because it's
in Detroit, right in Detroit, is the one seed and
the bye and the division on the line. God damn,
(31:56):
that'd be good.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Oh dude, I think Week seventeen is going to matter,
like I don't think that where either of us are
playing second stringers.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
We will see. I hope that's right. I hope that's right.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
Happy Thanksgiving, sig, enjoy your Thanksgiving.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
What's your prediction? Give me the score prediction for your
Bears game.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
For the Bears game, now, we didn't say there are
injuries on our team right now, so that is a concern.
What my prediction for the Bears game is going to
be twelve thirty families across the nation watching as the
Aal Honolulu Blue and who I believe to be the
true America's team is. Oh, by the way, that Giant's
(32:33):
Cowboys game is gonna be awful to Veto versus Cooper
Rush stop it. But I think the Bears Lions game
is going to end up being probably forty two to sixteen.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
I love that and I will see you soon.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Bye, buddy.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
Thanks again to Zach Martinez for joining the show. Thank
you guys for listening to our podcas cast feed while
you're here. Give us a review a rating. It helps
a ton. Also big thanks to Ticketmaster, the official ticket
marketplace of the Minnesota Vikings, for helping make this show happen.
We will see you all again next week.
Tis the season. Join the Vikings, Shields and KFA n
at the Eden Prairi Shiels on December third to support
Toys for Tots. Check out Vikings dot com for more details.
Unreal is back with their limited edition Vikings drop, so
head over to unrl dot com for more details. As
(00:21):
the official ticket marketplace of the Minnesota Vikings and the NFL,
Ticketmasters the safest and most convenient marketplace to score fully
verified Viking tickets, So get those touchdown celebrations ready and
score your tickets today at ticketmaster dot com slash Vikings.
Hey everybody, Welcome into the Vikings Tailgate, brought to you
(00:42):
by Ticketmaster, the official ticket marketplace of the Minnesota Vikings.
I'm your host, Cy Aminson, and it's Thanksgiving week. Seeing
as our Minnesota Vikings are not playing on Thursday, they'll
be playing on Sunday, we thought we would bring one
of our favorite guests back, who experience is a Thanksgiving
game every single year. The Great Zach Martina, die hard
(01:06):
Lions fan, is in to talk about Thanksgiving and the
NFC North Race. I think you guys are gonna love
this one. Enjoy the show. The recket Rocket im here
(01:28):
welcome everybody to the Thanksgiving week edition of the Tailgate
and joining me. I know we play the Arizona Cardinals,
but I wanted to talk about Thanksgiving. And who better
to discuss Thanksgiving with than a man whose team plays
every year on Thanksgiving than a man whose team is
(01:49):
in first place in the NFC North and relevant for
the first time in fifty years. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome
back to the program. Fan favorite Zach Martin.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Hello, Zachary high sidh and I just want to you
you forgot tied for first place in the NFL.
Speaker 1 (02:07):
You forgot I mean with some more of an NFC
you know, an NFC North conversation. We were talking a
little bit off air before we started the show, and
I realized we needed to bring it onto the air.
You are right now riding high with a level of
confidence that is foreign to me, and I am curious.
(02:29):
Are you not concerned about the let down like you?
You seem so in and why not? You've got the
best team in football potentially, But is there is there
no worry that the more you climb this mountain, the
harder the fall could possibly be.
Speaker 2 (02:48):
Uh?
Speaker 1 (02:48):
Come January February time or is it just a lack
of success historically that you're just enjoying the ride.
Speaker 3 (02:55):
I mean, it's all of the above.
Speaker 2 (02:56):
And I know that's kind of a cop out answer,
but you said confident, yes, but it's you also said
the word concerned. I would say it is a concerned
confidence because we have been hurt before. Now I've never
now listened. Think about the Lion King and Pride Rock
where Rafiki holds Simba up to the sky and it's
a beautiful thing. I mean, that's about the height we
(03:18):
would fall from. Yeah, circle of life, and that would
and that would definitely be painful.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Last year, there.
Speaker 2 (03:26):
Was disappointment when we h when we blew it there
in the second half of the NFC Championship game.
Speaker 3 (03:31):
However, this year.
Speaker 2 (03:33):
Like we were over all last year, proud, like excited,
like no one expected that to happen so quickly, this
year will feel a little bit different. I mean, just
the way the offense is destroying people. Our defense has
given up eleven second half points in the last five games,
and all of those were to Green Bay.
Speaker 3 (03:51):
Our team is very good, and it will it will hurt.
Speaker 2 (03:56):
I saw a stat the other day that said betting
sites are really really pulling against the Lions because there
has never been a team that had more futures bet
placed on them.
Speaker 3 (04:07):
So they still to lose a lot of.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
Money because the the interesting thing from an outsider's perspective,
I look over at your team and I think often
I think we're so tricked by Tom Brady and Patrick
Mahomes into this idea that you can be a perennial contender,
you know, through over the course of decades. It's just
(04:31):
not really reality in the NFL. And unless you have
a surefire first ballot Hall of Fame quarterback, and so
you are the Buffalo Bills. The Buffalo Bills are doing
some sneaky stuff right now.
Speaker 3 (04:45):
Yeah, let me do it here.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Sneaky but sneaky good where Joe Brady is coming there
and they've always been a downfield passing attack and now
it's all short intermediary. Josh Allen has thrown like touchdowns
to eleven people. It's just there's something, there's something different
and interesting over there.
Speaker 2 (05:03):
And Amari Cooper has not been one hundred for them
since that first game there. I mean, he is going
to change the game for that's.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
That's one hundred that's that's absolutely correct. And so I'm
looking at you guys. I do think you're the best
team in the NFL right now. But I think this
is a seize the moment for you situation because Goff's
contract is gonna it's gonna click in, right and that's
gonna change your roster. You've got Ben Johnson who seems
(05:29):
like almost unwilling to consider being a head coach anywhere else.
Speaker 3 (05:32):
At some point he's and I hope that meantime.
Speaker 1 (05:35):
I just can't imagine it does. But at some point
we're both in that situation. We both have coordinators who
we know should be head coaches right now. Sure, and
it's just a matter of time. And I think we're
both sitting there going, you know, there's this window. So
that's that's what I'm curious about, where I think when
(05:55):
I talk to you, you act like you're just walking
into the beginning of the hey day, and me, as
a sports fan, I'm going, I mean, I hope, So,
I mean, this might be the year. This might be it.
It has to be, this might be, this might be.
Speaker 2 (06:08):
That's the worry I have every week is that it's
I hope we don't buy into our hype and so
far we have not. It seemed like Houston we may
have bought in a little bit. And then Dan Campbell
did what Dan Campbell does and and rallied a group
of men in the locker room to come back and
win that game. Then Jacksonville, I mean that was that
(06:29):
was rough for any Jag fan.
Speaker 3 (06:31):
And then this past.
Speaker 2 (06:33):
Week against the Colts away, I mean, we're six and
zero away right now, which is bananas.
Speaker 1 (06:40):
It's a pretty crazy number. I have. Everybody who's listening
to the show forever knows that I'm a worrying fan.
I tend to think the bottom is going to fall out. Well, also,
that doesn't keep me from enjoying the big moments. I
don't in the big moments, I don't go oh no,
like I still enjoyed. I just like I'm more of
a worrier. But I've been quietly saying this and now
(07:03):
I'm starting to loudly say it. I also think the
Vikings are in a moment here. Okay, I don't know
that I'm right, but they're just showing pieces of everything. Right.
So this weekend, Hockinson and Addison finally get going right.
Speaker 3 (07:21):
I mean, Aaron Jones had a great game.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
But here's the thing, if you actually watch the game,
it was like a little at the beginning and a
little at the end when it was important. So they
haven't really put the run game together the end. It's
like different weeks. They've had different pieces of the offense,
and at some point, I'm telling you, man, if an
offense doesn't truly figure this defense out at some point,
(07:43):
if coach O'Connell is as good as we all believe
he is, at some point he's gonna pull all these
pieces together. And dude, I think there is a chance
that they make a run. I think there is a
chance they beat the Lions. I think this is a
unique moment for them as a team as well, given
what Brian Flores is doing and the fact that he
(08:04):
probably will be somewhere else next year. And you look
at the last two games. This is the most underrated
thing with the Vikings. Sam Donald was phenomenal against the
Bears because they've been playing this too high safety stuff.
You know, they've been trying to make and he had
those run of games where he turned the ball over
a bunch and everybody freaked out. He was forcing it
to Jefferson. Now you are actively seeing Sam Donald when
(08:28):
he drops back on these long drops, with these long
developing plays, and you see him, Oh, there's nothing, there's nothing.
He is taking the sacks and he's throwing the ball
out of bounds and he's not forcing it anywhere.
Speaker 2 (08:38):
I think the same thing about Jared Goff that you
said a very interesting thing.
Speaker 3 (08:42):
And I the way that you.
Speaker 2 (08:45):
Describe sacks being put upon a quarterback is very very
interesting because I think the verb makes a difference. And
what you just said about Donald, I fully believe about golf,
he is not getting sacked. He is taking sacks because
he is a like that's his choice, that's what's best
for the offense. It's not necessarily the defense. I mean,
(09:05):
the defense is winning, but he's not making a home
run mistake, if that makes sense. And I think the
ability to take sacks, and I think what you're saying
about Sam Darnold, like he's at a time now where
it's a brand new team. He's you know, this is
his first year in that system. I think it's starting
starting to click. I think he's just starting to see
(09:25):
things with a wider scope.
Speaker 1 (09:27):
Yeah, I think so. And I think figuring out. It
almost is like, uh, when you warm up in tennis,
this is gonna be the dumbest metaphor in the history
of the world. Right, So you know, at least when
I would warm up when I played tennis, I would
never go back to the service line, right. I stretch
(09:48):
a little bit, you know, I take some groundstrokes from
the baseline. Then you come up and you play them
that a little bit, get your arm loosened up, so
you kind of dial some things in, and then you'd
go back and you'd start serving. But when you serve
to me, I always put the first handful of serves.
I just uncorked them, and I you know, I shot
past the box, right sure, I intentionally overshot, and then
(10:13):
I dialed things in.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
The same thing in pickleball.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
It's that's what the Sam Darnold season has felt like, though,
Right he goes out the first few games and they're
just kind of taking groundstrokes and and and working the net.
And they can do that because the defense was on
a historic run, right. You know that that Texans game,
that Packers game, the whole game was tilted against the
other team because of all the turnovers, like missed field goals,
(10:39):
fourth down stops, all this stuff. Then they kind of
turned on. They pushed it a little bit, and here
he is that you know, you lose Christian Darisaw, you're
making some mistakes. They they out, they pushed out a
little far, and now they're reeling it back in where
it should be. I think the real test is you
would have loved to, as a Vikings fan see in
this run of what I think some people would call
(10:59):
subpar opponents right the AFC South into the Bears. You
would have liked to have seen a more complete offensive performance.
But I would argue the last two weeks with how
well Sam played, they were a moment away in each
game from feeling that way. If Jalen Naylor catches the
touchdown against the Titans, that's a thirty point game. It's
a block. Sure. If Brandon Powell doesn't set a literal
(11:23):
basketball screen, I think the play still works. Jefferson scores
a touchdown and it's the same thing there. So they're
just so close, and with the Cardinals and the Falcons
coming up, I think if you're a Lions fan, and
I don't talk like this, but if you're a Lions fan,
what you absolutely don't want to see in the next
two games is what you saw last night from the
(11:45):
Philadelphia Eagles, where you go, oh, the Eagles have an identity.
They're really like this Barkley thing was a thing, but
it really is. You just really don't want to see
the Vikings offensive identity gel the next two weeks.
Speaker 3 (12:00):
If you're you no, I don't.
Speaker 2 (12:03):
Well, ultimately, what I don't want to see in the
next few weeks is any kind of loss from the
Lions because right now we are ten and one, the
Packers are what nine and two, and you're eight and three.
Speaker 1 (12:14):
Oh flip pop, we're nine and two. They're eight and three.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
You're nine and two, they're eight and three. The NFC
North is I mean, this is the league right now.
This is the hottest division, the toughest division. I mean,
the Bears record doesn't reflect it, but they're playing a
lot of teams tough. So I mean you take that
as you will. I don't want to see losses because
I don't want to see us potentially lose what we
(12:37):
have in this moment, which is the number one seed
and the bye. Now, when you speak about the Philadelphia
Eagles and their identity, as far as running the ball,
our defensive identity is stopping the run. And I know
you're speaking of the Minnesota Vikings. The passing attack in particular,
for me, is always the strong suit for your team.
Not that Aaron Jones is a subpar running back, He's
(12:59):
a great running back. I just think what you have
in the receiving corps is something special. We are also
top five in the in the past defense. So I'm
I'm worried constantly of what could happen with the Lions
because in the past we have lost games in an
instant and this is the first time in my life
(13:22):
this year and last year where we have been winning
those games. So I'm still way too familiar with the
one play going the other direction.
Speaker 1 (13:29):
And it's it's it is. You have an interestingly difficult
this So it's Thanksgiving week. You guys play on Thanksgiving
every year. You need to send a postcard to the
Minnesota Vikings organization for breaking the Bear's spirit in that game,
like that loss, that loss after getting a field goal
block to so those last two losses, you go, Okay,
(13:50):
that's a tough thing to recover from because if they'd
have been picking up some momentum, you know, with the new.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
Coordin, especially with the locker room turmoil they have.
Speaker 1 (13:56):
Yeah, with the new coordinator is helping. Like, I think,
this is a sneaky, big moment in your season. You
gotta go out and you gotta do exactly what you're
supposed to do. If something goes weird and something goes
wrong and you lose this game, goodness, gracious, buddy, you
go Packers Bills Bears again, and who knows what that
(14:18):
Niners will be before you get us to get to
the end of season. You are in that situation where's
there's no weirdly at ten and one, and as the
best team in football, you have a no room for
error game because of how good the division is. On
Thanksgiving we have now, I do think, I do think
that Dolphins are gonna come in and smack the Packers around.
(14:40):
I really think that. I know too, it doesn't play
well in the cold weather, but I think we're gonna be.
Speaker 3 (14:45):
He's been playing lights out since he got back.
Speaker 1 (14:47):
We are gonna be enjoying pie. Well, green Bay gets
smacked around.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
I really really hope that is.
Speaker 2 (14:55):
I just need to believe that if green Bay is
getting smacked around by Miami. Come that night, I will
make some sort of margarita and top it with spray cheese.
Speaker 3 (15:05):
All right, That's what I will do.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Let me tell you what the most Viking thing in
the history of being a Viking fans. You somehow blow
it against the Bears. The Dolphins go in and smack
around the Packers, and we walk into Sunday against the
Cardinals with everything in front of us at this state, Mike,
And I'm not saying they should be I'm just telling
you the mental makeup of this state as sports fans,
(15:31):
they're like I think, if they somehow win that game
against the Cardinals, you'll just hear the whole stadium instead
of the skull chant, You'll just hear them go oh,
and it's just them exhaling after a three and a
half hour breath.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
Hold. Well, I don't think you have to worry about
I'm very confident going in against the Bears own for.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
A few reasons.
Speaker 1 (15:51):
I love that for you.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
It's home. It's a home game, which obviously huge. It
is up until these past few years, like the Thanksgiving
game was the only nationally televised game we had. It
was It's always been a big deal for Lions fans,
and the last few years on Thanksgiving, we have lost
at the end of the game. We have lost at
(16:12):
the end of the fourth quarter on some crazy kick
or some blown cover like we have just this is
a game that Dan Campbell is like, we are winning
this and then we're going and we're handing out turkeys
to the community. I'm confident we're winning this game.
Speaker 1 (16:26):
Is there any part of you that's sitting around wondering
if and so with the Vikings, it's always the kicker,
Like I know every as Parker Romo lined up to
kick the even I was going, just go get the touchdown.
Why do we got to risk it? Like yeah, you're
just waiting for the kicker thing to happen. Is there
(16:47):
any part of you in Detroit that is just sitting
there going when is Dan Campbell gonna Dan Campbell? When
is that? Because I would argue, now, I think you're
giving me a look right now, so you're not gonna
lie what I'm about to say.
Speaker 3 (17:01):
I'm hoping to understand what you're saying, because Dan Campbell
always is Dan Campbell's.
Speaker 1 (17:05):
Yes, but there's a you can Campbell good and you
can Campbell bad, and so I think the Campbell gamble,
the Campbell gamble, that's how is that not a t s?
Speaker 3 (17:16):
Not a thing?
Speaker 1 (17:17):
How? Yeah, that's Jay? Can we trademark that? Go ahead? Well,
the show's going, can we go ahead and trademark that.
So we were talking about the Bills and that big
Bills Chiefs game.
Speaker 2 (17:27):
We played last year on Thanksgiving, which is why you
lost really excited for that Bill's game coming in the
last seconds.
Speaker 1 (17:32):
So when Josh Allen what I believe to be the
play of the year thus far, fourth and two, they
go for it in their own zone, Josh Allen picks
it up on a scramble, gets all the way in
the inn zone, scores a touchdown. You know, Nick Wright
said this thing where he's like he thinks Josh Allen
is the greatest scrambling quarterback of all time, not running
but like on a design pass play, the most devastating
scrambler of all time, which is kind of hard to
(17:54):
argue with.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
But I got a real issue with Nick Wright his
hair that he called Jared Goff.
Speaker 2 (18:01):
He's like, any civilian could run the Lions offense, and
I'm like, you're obviously not looking at statistics.
Speaker 1 (18:06):
I love that you've joined the real NFL world where
your team is relevant enough that you can start hating
certain analysts. That's how you know.
Speaker 3 (18:15):
Before we just hated all of them because they were right.
Speaker 1 (18:19):
That's how you know it matters. We're like, we hate
Nick right in Detroit.
Speaker 3 (18:24):
I hate him.
Speaker 2 (18:25):
No other, no other quarterback in the league is getting chanted.
Just Disney World broke out in a Jared Goff chant
last night. It's awesome. Don't you talk about that, Nick.
I'm sorry, go on, I'm upset.
Speaker 1 (18:39):
So when you are in that fourth and two, I
think analytics conventional with him. They all have to be
set on top of the reality of the situation. And
that reality is you cannot give Patrick Mahomes the ball back.
You can't. You can't give him the ball back. Like
who you are playing against matters. And the interesting thing
(19:02):
about Dan Campbell is he and his Campbell gamble have
been immune to influence by situation or opponent. And I
thought that is what cost them the game last year
against the San Francisco forty nine ers. But I haven't
seen it this year. I've seen it in a Vikings game.
I've watched him, I've watched him cost them a Vikings game,
(19:25):
but I haven't seen it this year. So are do
you guys believe because of how good Ben Johnson's been
and all this, do you do you believe that the
that is behind you? Or are you kind of wary
of a moment where the Campbell gamble doesn't recognize its
surroundings and starts screaming in a room full of people.
Speaker 2 (19:47):
I can't I cannot go against the Campbell gamble because
of how often it has worked out for us. If
I I feel like if I get mad at once
situation where he gambles and it doesn't.
Speaker 1 (20:04):
Know why, why can't you say why can't you say
we want you to Campbell gamble? But also recognize the
gravity of the moment.
Speaker 2 (20:11):
I think he believes. I think he believes in his team.
I think he believes in I mean that's why you
constantly see us running on third down and twelve, because
he knows we can get six yards and then we
can convert on a fourth and six. Like he believes
in our offensive line. He believes in Jared Goff's command
of the offense. I mean, you've seen far less. I
mean when he's when he came to Detroit. The Campbell
(20:33):
gamble was I'm gonna fake punt. I'm gonna fake punt
and we're gonna get a first down that way. And
then as the years have progressed, it is no longer
like hey, I mean, there's a fake punt in there
every once in a while, but it's not a special
teams gamble. It is my offense is gonna run it
down your throat or I'm gonna make you think you
are and then I'm gonna dump it off across the middle.
Speaker 3 (20:53):
I just I can't.
Speaker 2 (20:55):
It's worked far too many times to where I if
it goes bad once.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
So if he makes a decision in an AFC champion
or in an NFC championship game or a super Bowl
when there's a high level opponent on the other side,
like like the like the last year with this forty
nine ers, when he should have taken those field goals,
in my opinion, are punted, you will you And I'm
not I'm not pushing, I'm not bullying. It's just a
genuine question from a fan psychology standpoint, if he does
(21:25):
that in an NFC championship or a super Bowl, you
will take solace in the idea like, well, we wouldn't
be here if he didn't do that every time. That's
that's what you can walk away with.
Speaker 2 (21:36):
I do believe that we wouldn't have been in the
u NFC Championship if we didn't have a few Campbell gambles.
I mean, it just it just wouldn't have happened. So
the fact that Dan Campbell, like I said, Dan Campbell
is always going to Dan Campbell, that that is exactly
what he does, I would be I would be more
concerned if he changed his mentality because that's not this
(21:59):
team that's at all.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
Well, tough boys play tough because when they're tough, they
need to be tough, and it ain't no room for
not being tough. Like, isn't there some nuance? Isn't there
when you have a coaching staff large enough to fill
an entire jet, which is what most professional sports organizations are.
Don't don't you wonder as a fan, don't you go, Okay,
who's the guy you have hired? Delane and the coaches
(22:20):
here and go, hey, Dan, they're the best defensive football
And you go up ten here and there's only four
minutes to play, let's go ahead and go up ten here, Dan, like,
isn't that.
Speaker 3 (22:29):
Well, it's it's not. I will.
Speaker 2 (22:30):
I know for a fact that it is not just
Dan Campbell riding his hunch. I know that there is
an entire section of their coaching box that is dedicated
to analytics and the particular situations like he's informed.
Speaker 3 (22:44):
Dan Campbell will have you believe he.
Speaker 2 (22:46):
Is just some guy who throws bills a hay in
his spare time. But that is Dan Campbell is an
educated dude, Dan Campbell. He may not, be, in my opinion,
the greatest x's and o's guys, but I think Dan
Campbell situationally does not get enough credit for how good
he is.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
He just sees the game a little differently.
Speaker 1 (23:06):
Does your defensive coordinator? They call plays? Right?
Speaker 3 (23:09):
Both of our coordinators call plays?
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Yeah? See I really to me, that's my favorite part
about Dan Campbell. I like the old school like CEO
of a football team, Like I love what we have.
But I was a Denny Green fan. I like the
old days where you're like Brian Billick's your O coordinator,
Tony Denji's your decordinator. I do think there's something to
(23:31):
be said for that, because I think everything you hear
about Campbell is he's a good leader, and he's a
good motivator. It's like being you know, yeah, it's like
being a president. It's all who you put in charge
of stuff, right, and how you support them. Sure, and
so I do. I will give you that. I do
really like that about him. And then I think that
allows him to succeed at what he's very good at
(23:54):
and keeps him from not succeeding at the things he's
not good at.
Speaker 2 (24:00):
What you have to consider too with Dan Campbell is
once you've earned Dan Campbell's trust, you have it. When
we when we first hired Dan Campbell, Anthony Lynn came
in and he was our offensive coordinator, and that offense
was not hummin it was not doing great. Ben Johnson
was on that staff as the tight ends coach. He
took over as the interim offensive coordinator, not even like
just outright got the job, and Dan Campbell called the
(24:22):
plays for a few times, like for I don't know,
a few games until close to the end of the season,
and then he started just slowly giving Ben Johnson right,
you call it here, you call it here, and we
would we would get big, big yards all of a sudden.
Ben Johnson is calling the game, and now he's this
mad scientist who's built the entire offense around Jared Goff.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
I think that's why.
Speaker 2 (24:43):
I think that's why Nick Wright is an idiot, because
they built this offense around.
Speaker 1 (24:48):
All roads lead Nick Right.
Speaker 2 (24:51):
They built this offense around Jared Goff, so like, I
don't think any civilian could run it. And I think
I think he did exactly what he wanted to do.
He wanted someone to talk about some bad opinion that
he has instead of just saying this is just a
guy with hair, like I know what it's like to
be a guy with hair.
Speaker 3 (25:09):
That he's an idiot.
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Here here, here's the thing. We're just gonna find out
because he's got the contract, and over the next couple
of years, the roster is gonna change.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
I agree, But that contract is gonna look good as
the years go on, maybe comparatively, maybe, I think so.
Speaker 1 (25:25):
I'm saying it might, you know, depends how much the
cap goes up. I'm not smart about that stuff, but
I mean it's one of two things. They voted Josh
Allen in the Players Survey the most overrated quarterback in
the NFL. I think everybody thought Diggs was gonna leave
and they were gonna fall apart, and it just turns
out the exact opposite has happened, and he's one of
those guys.
Speaker 3 (25:46):
The mahomes Hill situation.
Speaker 1 (25:48):
Yeah, he can carry a team through his big salary,
and it'll be really interesting to see if he's one
of those guys if Ben Johnson finally decides he wants
to be a pro football head coach somewhere. But I
don't know, man. Here's what I will tell you. Here's
what I know what you want. I know that you
want to win every game the rest of the way,
finish sixteen in one and be the one seed. I
(26:10):
think that makes a lot of sense to me. What
I would like is I would like the Vikings to
win the next couple of games, and I'd like you
to drop one of the next two, preferably to I
think green Bay is who you have af does it
go Bears and then green Bay.
Speaker 2 (26:27):
Green Bays just before the Niners. Yeah, Green So December fifth,
we have the Packers, we have two Thursday games.
Speaker 1 (26:33):
Yeah, So I would like the Packers to drop one
to the Dolphins. Then I would like them to beat
you I'd like us to win two and a couple
of weeks from now, I'd like this just to be
a big, gross, ugly meat grinder with four games to
play and four games in which we play. We play
(26:55):
the Packers and the Lions. There's two games there you play.
I think at least us do you play the that'll
be have you played the Packers yet?
Speaker 2 (27:04):
Let's we got to go back to the Dan Campbell mentality.
We are playing the Bears twice, those are division games.
Dan Campbell gets up for those games. We are then
playing the Packers, who I'm and Ross Saint Brown has
really lit a fire under this team as far as
like f the Packers, you know, like that's the whole mentality,
that's our I mean, that's they're They're trying to make
(27:25):
this rivalry like a thing. But we're at home. Our
home games are different. So we've got home this week
against Chicago. That's gonna make a difference. The hatred for
Green Bay, especially since like elgind Jenkins or something after
the last time we played him. They go, I mean, yeah,
the team that made more plays one, but the better
team didn't win. That is bulletin board material that they've
(27:45):
been looking at ever since the Bills. We play thereafter
they just barely beat us last year during Thanksgiving. Dan
Campbell is going to make sure that they know that.
Then after the Bills, we've got the Bears again, which
is going to be at Chicago.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
That's a trap game. May then we have the forty
nine ers.
Speaker 2 (28:02):
Who I mean, can you talk about a more revenge
game than the NFC Championship? The Chicago Bears game away
is the is the scariest one.
Speaker 1 (28:11):
For me more than the Bills.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
I think the Lions get up for the Bills, and
I think we're playing at home. The Bills are certainly
maybe the best team that we have left. But I
think that I think that the team gets up for
that game, especially at home.
Speaker 1 (28:27):
What are you gonna do? You go to the Thanksgiving game?
Speaker 2 (28:30):
No, I have we go over to my wife's family's house,
of which there are like twenty seven people.
Speaker 3 (28:36):
There and we're all watching the game.
Speaker 1 (28:38):
That'd be a terrible like that alone, like a giant
family gathering where it used to be like we all
go there, we watched the Lions lose and we eat.
Speaker 2 (28:47):
Now it's like we did that last year against the bills, dude.
It was one of my greatest memories on a holiday.
My entire family, like from my in laws who are
seventy to my youngest nephew who like eight at the time,
There's twenty seven people all around the TV collectively breathing
the same way big inhales, huge xhals, disappointment, excitement. It
(29:10):
was wonderful and I'm hoping that this year it ends
with the dub because that will be a friggin' party.
Speaker 1 (29:17):
Well, I hope a couple of weeks from now, we're
just in a big gross meat grinder between the three
of us.
Speaker 2 (29:23):
The phrase, I just want to say, the phrase big
gross meat grinder is super gross.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
Yeah, no problem. That's actually the name of your guys' offense.
Speaker 3 (29:35):
I don't know meat grinder.
Speaker 1 (29:37):
Sure you know I am not a trash talker, but
I will be texting you on thanks Staven. I don't
have a good I don't have a good feeling about
this game for you, guys.
Speaker 3 (29:45):
That's your heart speaking. That's your heart speaking.
Speaker 1 (29:47):
Can I tell you why?
Speaker 3 (29:48):
Absolutely? I hope you do.
Speaker 1 (29:50):
The most likely outcome here is that the Bears season
just falls apart. It's already there but it just completely
falls apart and it tumbles to the end. Right, But
they have a pretty good defense.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
Their defense is very good, but no defense has really
been able to have our offense.
Speaker 1 (30:05):
So you know, we did pretty well against you. But
there's this other scenario where I think Caleb Williams is
gonna have a day.
Speaker 3 (30:11):
He has to.
Speaker 1 (30:12):
At some point, he's gonna have a day, and at
some point, you guys aren't gonna have a day.
Speaker 3 (30:23):
And I think that was Houston.
Speaker 1 (30:25):
Yeah, maybe, but Houston also didn't have a day. I
think there's a chance I said it on last week's show.
I'm gonna say it again. A confluence of events creates
a very tricky Thanksgiving for you. Now. I'm sure you'll
text me when you guys win fifty two to eight.
Speaker 3 (30:38):
I'm a very humble fan. I won't do that.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
No, I don't think you'll be cocky about it, but
I think you'll be like, hey, about that confluence of events.
I guess there wasn't one.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
I love that you're saying confluence events of events right
after you said big gross meat grinder, thank you. That
could not be two more different speaking spells so intelligent
but so blue collar.
Speaker 3 (31:00):
Both ends, but.
Speaker 1 (31:01):
I'm gonna tell you, if you put them both in
a drawl, they sound like they matter together. Well, it
was just a confluence of event advance that put us
in a big, gross meat grinder.
Speaker 2 (31:11):
And that's how we lost Uncle Bill her chewed him up.
Speaker 1 (31:16):
And then and that is why we will. We bought
this year's turkey in honor of Uncle Bill. Zach thank
you for joining us. I hope, I I hope I
see you shortly on this show and discussing a game
that matters just a whole.
Speaker 3 (31:33):
I do hope it matters. I do hope it matters.
Speaker 1 (31:35):
I know you want that one seed, But can I
tell you how fun would it be if the last
game of the season between our two teams, because it's
in Detroit, right in Detroit, is the one seed and
the bye and the division on the line. God damn,
(31:56):
that'd be good.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
Oh dude, I think Week seventeen is going to matter,
like I don't think that where either of us are
playing second stringers.
Speaker 1 (32:04):
We will see. I hope that's right. I hope that's right.
Speaker 3 (32:06):
Happy Thanksgiving, sig, enjoy your Thanksgiving.
Speaker 1 (32:09):
What's your prediction? Give me the score prediction for your
Bears game.
Speaker 2 (32:11):
For the Bears game, now, we didn't say there are
injuries on our team right now, so that is a concern.
What my prediction for the Bears game is going to
be twelve thirty families across the nation watching as the
Aal Honolulu Blue and who I believe to be the
true America's team is. Oh, by the way, that Giant's
(32:33):
Cowboys game is gonna be awful to Veto versus Cooper
Rush stop it. But I think the Bears Lions game
is going to end up being probably forty two to sixteen.
Speaker 1 (32:49):
I love that and I will see you soon.
Speaker 3 (32:54):
Bye, buddy.
Speaker 1 (32:55):
Thanks again to Zach Martinez for joining the show. Thank
you guys for listening to our podcas cast feed while
you're here. Give us a review a rating. It helps
a ton. Also big thanks to Ticketmaster, the official ticket
marketplace of the Minnesota Vikings, for helping make this show happen.
We will see you all again next week.
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