Twentyman in the Huddle: Training Camp Preview

On this episode of the Twentyman in the Huddle podcast presented by Microsoft, Tim Twentyman previews training camp by hosting NFL Media Senior National Reporter Stacey Dales, tight end Sam LaPorta and NFL Media Insider Tom Pelissero.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Golf works out of the gun, gives to his right,
Jared takes back looking broly got the man touch down Detroit.
Lyons Jamir Kids Football is back in Detroit, and that
means I am back with another edition of the twenty
in the Huddle podcast. We're gonna get you guys all

(00:20):
set up for training camp, and I've got a very
special guest to start out. She is very much in
touch with everything going on with the NFL and especially
the NFC North Stacey Dale's from the NFL Network. Thank
you so much for joining me, Stace. I appreciate it.

Speaker 2 (00:35):
Tim, you know how much I always love to join you.
And we're right on the costs. Man, It's about to
start the chaos, the frenzied chaos. Like I'm kind of
baking here in Chicago. It's been a really warm summer,
really hot, humid summer. But it's about to get more
intense because I think this division is going to be
even more fiery than it was last year.

Speaker 1 (00:55):
You know, it's crazy to think that July I'm already
back in training camp thirty one. The Detroit Lions are
playing a football game in July. You know, they're the
Hall of Fame Game, like there was no off season,
there was no summer, like we're back at it. But
La Lion's fans are excited obviously with what's gone down,
you know, in Allen Park here the last two years,
with the success the team has had. Let's start with

(01:17):
the stage. Can anybody in the NFC North knockoff Detroit?
Do they head in in your opinion, as the favorite,
as the top dog, the two time reigning division champion.
Is it theirs to lose?

Speaker 3 (01:30):
I think until somebody gets them it is.

Speaker 2 (01:32):
I think that's the case in a division of this magnitude.
I was just doing another deal with somebody else, and
I kind of look at this division like a truly
a marathon where you have that cluster of runners up
front and they're kind of staying together. And that's how
it was and how it all shook out, Tim as
you know last season, I mean, Detroit goes fifteen wins,

(01:54):
Minnesota fourteen, Green Bay eleven. They all go to the playoffs,
and all of a sudden, people would argue the best
play caller currently in the NFL, I mean, there's a good.

Speaker 3 (02:03):
Handful of them right now.

Speaker 2 (02:05):
He's now the coach of the team that finished five
and twelve in Chicago and Ben Johnson.

Speaker 3 (02:09):
So it's going to.

Speaker 2 (02:12):
Be a race, I think, once again, but until somebody
knocks off the Lions. Even despite the changes, right, we're
all going to talk about every year. I feel like
there's something that people come to criticize with the Detroit
Lions and Dan Campbell, but he always finds a way
to battle through some level of attrition, and I think
it's just because of you know, I go back to

(02:35):
specific calls he's made in games tim and he's the
ultimate decision maker and when he says we're going for
it on fourth down, they're going for it. And guess what,
they got most of them last year. But he's going
to tell his guys we're going for it this season.
With a new offensive coordinator in Johnny Morton and Kelvin Shephard,
who's obviously you know, coming from those linebackers over to

(02:57):
the defensive coordinator spot, it's going to keep it super aggressive,
just like.

Speaker 3 (03:01):
We saw.

Speaker 2 (03:03):
With coach Aaron Glenn and so I have all the
faith in Dan Campbell because of who he is, even
though there are some personnel.

Speaker 3 (03:11):
Changes both sides, players and coaches.

Speaker 1 (03:15):
You know, It's a good point by you, because Detroit
was really lucky over the last three years. I mean,
I think they were the only team that had the
same coordinators for three straight seasons. I mean, it's unheard
of in this league, especially when you've had the success
that Detroit has had. So it's something a little bit different.
But I think Dan has kind of talked about it's
a little bit exciting for him too. There's the newness
of it right where I think for the first time
they were in the in the coaching room at the

(03:37):
combine together, you know. I mean that was the first
time that they had all gotten in the room together
and started this journey. And so you look, they're gonna
get a ton of guys back from injury. They've got some,
you know, new coordinators. I think it's fourteen different coaches
in terms of guys that shuffled around new guys with
the position coaches and everything else. But Dan's the one constant,
right And as long as you have Dan and as

(03:59):
long as you have that message in his way of
playing football, Detroit should be just fine.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
I really do believe that.

Speaker 2 (04:08):
You know, the more time I've just been around Dan
and his energy when I'm standing down on the sideline
because I had so many Detroit games last year and
those final waning minutes, last two minute drill, and just
watching how he operates in the conviction with which he coaches.
I think he's really set a standard. And I mentioned
that word attrition what I saw last year manifest with

(04:29):
that defense to have a rash, not just a rash,
but a complete wipeout of your best players and to
still be able to and some of those play calls
offensively were because of that defensive attrition.

Speaker 3 (04:41):
We're going to go for it. So we're not going to.

Speaker 2 (04:43):
Force our defense with maybe a brand new player this week,
like is there a Desidarius Smith, for instance, to have
to go win a game for us. We're going to
force our offense that averages thirty two per game, the
highest mark in the league, over four hundred yards per game.
We're going to ask them to go do it. And
that's what he did. I also just love the fact
that Jared Goff is now truly the coach on the field.

(05:06):
I mean, he is just so savvy.

Speaker 3 (05:09):
In what he does.

Speaker 2 (05:10):
And I'm really loving some of this Netflix QB stuff
that I'm seeing clips of with him because it just
shows how brilliant he is at the position, and I
think everybody's feeding off that energy. I'm also I'm also though,
very concerned about, you know, how this team goes directionally
with their center position.

Speaker 3 (05:30):
It's a big storyline for me.

Speaker 2 (05:32):
Because of how good Frank Ragnow has always been in
the National Football League. I mean since he became a guard,
which took place he was drafted in twenty eighteen twenty nineteen.
He's graded out PFF as one of the best centers
at his position, top five every single season. So whether
that's Graham Glasgow, whether that's Tate Ratledge, the rookie, it's

(05:52):
going to be interesting.

Speaker 3 (05:53):
But I trust in Hank Fraley, Yeah, one hundred percent.

Speaker 1 (05:56):
He's one of the best position coaches there is out there,
bar none. Was great that he's back in Detroit. You
mentioned Chicago, you mentioned Ben Johnson. I know there's a
little bit of sigh from Lions fans when you talked
about the best play caller no longer in Detroit. But
look the states you live in the Chicago area. What
is the buzz right now with the Chicago Bears team,

(06:17):
Because I'm assuming it's pretty high, not only getting Ben.
But look, Caleb had a really good rookie year. Now
it was over you know, I mean it was overlooked
by because Jade Daniels was just so good. But I
think twenty touchdowns, six interceptions for a rookie who was
pressured and sacked the most in the NFL last season.
They have really good skill weapons over there. You mentioned

(06:39):
Ben Johnson. He's trying to change the culture a little bit.
They went and fixed their offensive line with three veteran
interior guys. What's the buzz in Chicago? Is this one
of those teams that you look at like, hey, maybe
this team can can make a big turn on be
one of those teams that goes from last to first
or make some noise in the NFC playoff picture.

Speaker 2 (06:57):
It's a great question, Tim, because it's it's an important
question because I've seen all the different turnover from coaching
staff changes, personnel changes over the years with the Chicago
Bears and all the coaching turmoil, and you know, every
few years it's somebody's out, somebody's in. Well, they just
extended Ryan Pohls, so you know he's going to be

(07:18):
kind of manning the fort and has done some really
good personnel things. One of those decisions was bringing in
Ben Johnson. And when you're able to, because we've seen
the Bears over the years, maybe not go out and try.
And this is with all due respect because this profession
is so hard, but Ben Johnson was not just this cycle,

(07:39):
but really the last couple cycles, arguably the leading head
coaching candidate.

Speaker 3 (07:45):
Out there, and the Bears stopped at nothing to get him.
That was their guy. That's who they wanted. They were
willing to spend the money to get that guy. Why
Ben Johnson. He's a detailed freak. You know him.

Speaker 2 (08:00):
Around him NonStop for the last however many years.

Speaker 3 (08:05):
He's he's a he isn't He's a.

Speaker 2 (08:06):
Mathematician, right, I mean, you know, a walk on quarterback
at UNC, but just really smart, very intelligent. The thing
that I think is most underrated when it comes to
Ben Johnson is we talk a lot about pure progression
offenses and how you know, how he can make a

(08:27):
quarterback comfortable. But to me, like he has a real
knack for really uncovering coverages and in game, his his
his adjustment to defensive coverages and what they're throwing at
at at his offense as a play caller and being
able to then translate that to the quarterback. And you

(08:48):
go back and watch tape, go back and watch the
Vikings games from last season, and you'll see his in
game adjustments to those coverages. A guy like Brian Flores
is gonna empty the you know, the kitchen sink on you,
and Ben was ready for it at every turn. And
I think that's how he's going to help this young quarterback,
besides getting him to play really detailed and make his

(09:09):
pocket movement more streamline and make that cadence I think
more understandable for him, and therefore the offense.

Speaker 1 (09:16):
Yeah, and that protection is going to be big for
me too early on in camp watching that. Can they
protect him better if they can do that. Ben's offense
is very much timing space, get the ball out here
on time. Now. Look, Caleb can improvise with the best
of them, and that's going to be part of his
game and Ben's going to use that. But it's a

(09:37):
timing offense. It's be here at this position at this time,
protect him, get it out. I'm going to create the
space and the matchups, you know, And so it'll be
interesting to see if they can protect him early. That'll
be one thing I'm looking at.

Speaker 3 (09:48):
There's no question.

Speaker 2 (09:49):
I mean, Braxton Jones two is coming back from an
injury on the left side of that offensive line, and
you're going to see some young players competing, maybe even
into training camp.

Speaker 3 (09:57):
We'll see when Jones is ready.

Speaker 2 (09:59):
But in Ausie Tripp Pillow their second round, I believe
pick at a Boston college.

Speaker 3 (10:04):
He is massive in frame.

Speaker 2 (10:06):
And then Karan Amagajie, who's you know, he's now had
some time here in Chicago and they've had a little
bit of a competition with Braxton Jones out, so they
think they have some depth with that offensive line. But
I would say too, Tim, I mean, you know this
one thing you have to do in this division is
you got to get the ball out and Caleb Williams

(10:26):
is responsible for holding it on, hold on, holding on
to it too long at times. So it's not just
on that offensive line. But I certainly think that because
of the veteran presences they've brought in Tony Dolman and
you know, Jonah Jackson, there's some brain power that I
think has now added to this unit that will make

(10:46):
the job of the quarterback easier. And for second year quarterbacks,
it's just so critical to have that stability and then
have a coach who's gonna give me some gimmes. And
I think Ben Johnson is going to give Caleb some gimmes.
What do I mean when I say that when it's
fourth and one, or when it's you know, third and long,
or it's third and five. He's going to have some

(11:08):
built in answers for Caleb Johnson because of his vast
understanding of what defenses want to do and because he
has been so successful calling plays. I think some of
those gimmeis are going to help Caleb and that offensive
line will kind of marry with that.

Speaker 1 (11:25):
Stacey, I have to say, your dog looks completely content
and comfortable in that spot right behind you're there. I
don't think he or she has not moved yet. That
is one of the most content She's something.

Speaker 2 (11:43):
This is my this is my like, this is my
little my dwelling of football, this room. And so she's
so soothed by football because I go into a happy
place when I talk about football.

Speaker 3 (11:54):
But yeah, she's my little sidekick.

Speaker 2 (11:56):
And watching me do it on because I'll be back
on the road.

Speaker 1 (12:01):
Again Minnesota fourteen wins obviously came down Week eighteen last
year for the division for the number one seed Stace.
When you look at that team, you know, fifth in
points allowed last year. They've got skilled weapons to rival Detroit.
Is it JJ McCarthy or bus? Is it really all
about the quarterback position in Minnesota? Because you look at

(12:22):
the roster, the defense, the coaching that they have there
with McConnell, and it all seems to be in place.
But you know as well as I do, if you
don't get great quarterback play, it really doesn't matter, especially
in this division. Is it all about JJ McCarthy in Minnesota?

Speaker 2 (12:36):
Yeah, but they sure have built a roster to make
it easy for him to slide in there and be
a good quarterback. And you can be simply because of
Kevin O'Connell. It's the Kevin O'Connell factor.

Speaker 3 (12:48):
Tim.

Speaker 2 (12:48):
I will never forget just sitting with coach O'Connell last
year at a production meeting ahead of one of the
games I was covering, and I think we were overseas,
but he was talking about Sam Darnold and his his
resurgence and we all thought, Okay, this guy's cooked. Where's
he going in the NFL. He's probably going to be
a backup along the way. Well, from the moment that

(13:10):
Sam became a Minnesota biking on that one year deal
and I think it was one year, right, and the
moment they stepped on grass together, but even meeting rooms,
it was like, how can I get this guy can
really throw the ball, he can take hits, he has
the ability to move outside the pocket, But how can

(13:31):
I get him to be disciplined and really condense have
a checklist on every play he talked about, and really
condense the pocket for him and make this thing see
through the rush he talked about. But the most important
thing is how much can I fill his cup every week?
That's Kevin O'Connell is an incredible master at teaching the

(13:53):
quarterback position. Josh McCown is there too, and then so
there's all this knowledge, but Kevin has a really good
way of making the quarterback position easy. And so I
feel really confident about his marriage with with JJ McCarthy.
And I'll tell you this, every every Minnesota game I
had last year, talking on the.

Speaker 3 (14:13):
Sidelines to coaches is a golden retriever. I mean, he
is just lapping it all up right like that that
was actually said to me. He is lapping it up.
He loves football.

Speaker 2 (14:24):
He's going to operate the offense just the way Kevin
wants him to. So he's not a quarterback that's going
to just rip it outside of script. And when you
have a retooled offensive line. They've got a brand new
offensive line. I mean Christian Darris I didn't play last
year because of his injury, so he'll be back. And
then you've added Will Fries, Bryan Ryan Kelly on the
in the middle at center, and Donovan Jackson's going to

(14:46):
be an absolute baller their first round pick to one
of those guard spots, likely left guard.

Speaker 3 (14:52):
We'll see. But I just think they got all the pieces.

Speaker 2 (14:56):
They've got justin Jefferson, They've got Hawkinson, Like, they're pretty loaded.

Speaker 1 (14:59):
I mean, Addison came on big last year. They've got
the running back. I mean, they are their skilled as
Detroit I think, and the skill position.

Speaker 3 (15:07):
Yeah, and their defense is gonna only be better.

Speaker 2 (15:09):
They've added a couple of guys there, Javon Hargrave, Jonathan
Allen via Washington Like they added more beef upfront to
an already vicious pass rush.

Speaker 3 (15:19):
So Minnesota is in good hands.

Speaker 1 (15:22):
I feel, all right, let's go to Green Bay. You
get Matthew Golden, you get Savon Williams. You look at
that Green Bay team last year, Stace, and they were
a top five defense. They were a top five rushing offense.
But they led the league in drop percentage seven point
five percent total drops twenty five. They just didn't have

(15:42):
that guy that stood up. You know, when I look
at Green Bay and I'm like, what receiver are they
going to pay? Like, who would they want long term?
You've got to think about that for a minute and
decide which one it would maybe be. That's not a
good thing. So obviously they went and got the receiver help.
Is that really what they were missing? Was that the piece?
If they can get that number one guy to step up,
if they can get a couple guys to step up

(16:04):
on the outside from that receiver position, they can be
more consistent passing. Are they as good as anyone in
this Division two? Of that part of the of their
team is much better in twenty twenty five?

Speaker 2 (16:14):
Yeah, I mean, I think with Green Bay they turned
the ball over at an extraordinary rate just defensively last year.
Gave it back to the offense, Tim, But if their
pass rush can be more effective, like just just that
front group, if they can be more effective, like get
something more out of Lucas fan Ask for instance, that
could be a whole different level.

Speaker 3 (16:36):
Of a defense if that's the case. But offensively, Jordan
lom has to be healthy.

Speaker 2 (16:40):
But here's the cool thing about Matt Lafleur, another incredible
play caller in this NFC North right, they lose them
and Malik Willa steps in and there's no drop off.

Speaker 3 (16:50):
They run the ball as well as anybody.

Speaker 2 (16:52):
In the league last year with Josh Jacobs, and you know,
now they get Marshawn Lloyd back healthy, who's going to
be a serviceable backup I think for Jacobs. So here's
what hope I kind of hope and you touched on this, Tim,
for the Packers, We've now watched this what has been
the youngest offense in football evolving for the last couple

(17:12):
of years. With this, it's almost like wide receiver by committee.
So when you say who are they going to pay?
I kind of want and hope for a declaration of
a tier in their wide receiver group.

Speaker 3 (17:26):
What do I mean?

Speaker 2 (17:28):
You've mentioned the drops they dropped the ball at an
extraordinary rate, which.

Speaker 3 (17:31):
Wasn't all on Jordan Love last season. I just think
a little.

Speaker 2 (17:35):
More certainty and clarity with who are our guys? What
plays are we going to have for those specific guys,
because they can go eleven personnel. I mean you're going
to see with the talent they have at receiver, Tucker
Craft's going to be incremental in what they do and
obviously Jacobs. So you're going to see a lot of
eleven personnel where they have three receivers. What three are
those guys going to be? Christian Watson's going to be

(17:58):
out for a little while.

Speaker 3 (17:59):
But you mentioned in Matthew Golden, he had an awesome,
awesome mini camp series with this team. The rookie. Why
they took him in the first round, I don't think
they could.

Speaker 2 (18:08):
He was probably right there on their board and they
were like, we got to get Matthew Golden. He's really
he's really technical in his routes, he's a sure player.
I think that they probably saw a lot of good
stuff with him.

Speaker 1 (18:18):
But now I'm looking four two didn't hurt either.

Speaker 2 (18:20):
I don't think yeah, yeah, right, But I'm looking at
their receivers. Tim I'm looking at Romeo Dobbs and Jaden
Reid who's a slot machine. And you mentioned Savion Williams,
the rookie who is massive in size and might be
a little bit of a developmental guy. But Dontavian Wicks,
like when when Christian Watson comes back.

Speaker 3 (18:43):
Who are your guys gonna be to? Where Dobbs knows
co Ball's.

Speaker 2 (18:49):
Coming to me like and there's no, there's It eliminates
a little bit of the of the thinking and now
it's okay, this is the play Jordan love loves.

Speaker 3 (18:57):
Let's let's get to it.

Speaker 2 (18:58):
I hope for them just some more because I think
they're heck a talented team and they've got a really
good offensive line, and I think Jordan loves a really
good quarterback.

Speaker 1 (19:07):
Good points by you, Stace. Let's finish with this. When
when you look at Detroit and what you talked about
the offensive line and that being a storyline replacing Frank
and is it gonna be Tate or Graham or you know,
who are they gonna be? Is there anything else that
you look at this team going in like, what's the
biggest question mark to me? What's one thing I'm gonna
you know, focus on maybe outside of that into your

(19:27):
offensive line spot that that you know Stacey's gonna come
into training camp and you're gonna have an eye on something.
What's maybe like a question mark for you with this
Detroit Lion team heading into twenty.

Speaker 2 (19:37):
Twenty five, I think for me is to me, they
have one of the best secondaries in football.

Speaker 3 (19:44):
Oh.

Speaker 1 (19:44):
I love that you said that, because I've been trying
to tell people that too. You are so spot on.

Speaker 2 (19:49):
I'm kind of actually obsessed with their secondary a little bit.
I'm not gonna lie. I love Kirby Joseph, I love
Brian Branch. I think they could be the best safety
tandem in the National Football League. A healthy defense is
a dynamic defense in Detroit, and you can't predict health, right,
you can't predict how.

Speaker 3 (20:10):
That's all going to unveil.

Speaker 2 (20:11):
But I'm really anxious to see how this defensive front
changes with just these guys healthy, Aiden coming back and
Tyler Williams integrated. He's a really good, big, big body
that I think is going to be really good on
the interior. I like the linebacker core. And by the way, Ahmed.

Speaker 1 (20:33):
Hassening, Yes, good job.

Speaker 3 (20:35):
I try to.

Speaker 2 (20:36):
Say Ahmed Hassening, he's going to be a fireball, a
spitfire for this team. And you know how like Brad
Holmes drafts these rookies, so they get him in the
what sixth round or whatever it was, I don't and
then like you think of a Malcolm Rodriguez and how
he was incorporated as a rookie and who's this guy?

(20:57):
You're gonna have that from Hassening in training camp. So
I think there's been some depth pieces added. But I'm
really really curious to see how this defensive front comes together.
For me, that that is the X factor, because I
think the secondary is really good. I think Kelvin Shephard
is fantastic. I mean, he's phenomenal. Just have a conversation

(21:18):
with him about football. Players love him. And then I'm
circling Aiden Hutchinson. Tim I think he can be He
had seven and a half sacks through five his five
games last season. Okay, he was on pace for fifteen
sixteen seventeen sacks?

Speaker 3 (21:34):
Are you kidding me? I mean the way he comes off.

Speaker 2 (21:38):
The edge Alah, like TJ Watt, I think he can
be the best defensive edge in the NFL. I truly
believe that I think he's he hasn't even touched his potential,
meaning what eleven and a half the year prior.

Speaker 3 (21:54):
He is. He is a game changer.

Speaker 2 (21:56):
He changes everything you can do, and he affects the
We always talk about how the interior offense defensive rush
affects the exterior defensive rush. I think he's going to
affect every gap that can be attacked for that defensive front.
That's where I want to see things shift the most
for the Detroit Lions because I think they have They're

(22:18):
kind of layered across the board, both sides, really good
and really talented.

Speaker 1 (22:22):
You know, it's so huge to get him back too,
because what that does on the opposite side too, Like
if Marcus Davenport can come back and be the player
he was a few years ago when Dan was in
New Orleans and they saw him there. Obviously he's dealt
with health. You mentioned hasan En. You know they get
Derek Barnes back, wholl they only had for three games
last year. Just who's that guy on the opposite side,
because you know Aiden's going to bring it and he's

(22:43):
going to have all the attention. There's going to be
so much of that single one on one coverage on
the other side that if they can just stay healthy
there and get some production in that, then you get
a lean back you mix him with ty Leak on
the inside. In November, you mentioned a very veteran linebacker
group and then Terry and arm It's going to take
the next step in year two. They got DJ Reid,
who fits perfect in Shep's man coverage scheme of Meek

(23:06):
Robinson proved he can be one of the top nickels
last year, so I'm on board with you. I think
this secondary is gonna be great. I think the linebacker
cord is a veteran group that obviously knows Shep and
the expectation. He was in that room for three years.
And then if they stay healthy up front, get all
their guys back and hutches Hutch. I agree with you
one hundred percent. This is a Lions team that has
been so offense oriented, at least the outside perception is

(23:28):
offense oriented, and they earn that because they have been
so good. But I think there can be a switch
this year where this Detroit defense surprises a lot of
people and they are better than people expected, and that
will be huge for this football team. I think Stace
as always. Thank you so much for doing it. You
are so in tune with the NFC North. I think

(23:48):
you're one of the best in business and I always
enjoy having you on. We're gonna have a conversation with
Sam Laporte and next, but thank you so much, Stace.
Enjoy a little bit of vacation before you get rolling,
and hopefully you'll make a stop in right. We'll see
at training camp.

Speaker 2 (24:01):
We'll definitely see there. I'll be there right out of
the gates. Always great to be with you.

Speaker 3 (24:05):
Tim.

Speaker 1 (24:09):
Welcome back to the twenty l Huddle podcast. The guy
next to me he needs a little introduction. He is
a Pro Bowl tight end Sam Laporta entering your third season.
It's a little crazy that we're back in camp in July,
on July twenty right, I mean, you're playing a football game.
You're not going to play a football game, but the
team is playing a football game July thirty first. A
little crazy, isn't it.

Speaker 4 (24:29):
Yeah, I can't believe it's the start a camp already.
It's only the twentieth of July today, and the Hall
of Fame game it's coming up quick.

Speaker 1 (24:37):
It is coming up quick, and it's probably a little
quicker just given the off season that you had. Sam,
congratulations on the marriage.

Speaker 5 (24:44):
First, thank you.

Speaker 1 (24:45):
Where did you and CALLI meet?

Speaker 4 (24:47):
We met like our first week in Iowa. She was
a rower obviously I played football there. Yeah, and just
mutual friends through the athletes, so we may.

Speaker 1 (24:54):
And now I celebrated my twentieth this year too, So congratulations.
Have fun. It's a beautiful thing. And not everybody gets
to get married and then on their honeymoon in Italy.
Oh you know, let's go ahead and just meet Pope
Leo and get get our marriage blessed. Tell everybody how
that came about, short version, Probably there's probably more to it,

(25:15):
but how crazy was that situation? How fun was that that?
I mean, not everybody gets to do that.

Speaker 4 (25:20):
Yeah, that was a blessing for sure. So a friend
of a friend put us in contact with a priest
over in Rome and he notified us that every Wednesday,
Pope Leo does a papal audience, and it was about
three weeks out at this point. He said, typically you
need some more time to get these tickets, but I
can try to, you know, get you to the front
of the line and get your tickets. In long story short,

(25:40):
we were going to Rome, going to Italy on our
honeymoon regardless, and that came up. And what a blessing
it was.

Speaker 1 (25:46):
He's a Bears fan, I know, Chicago fan. I think
none of that came up, right, There's no no controversy,
you know nothing. Were you nervous? I mean I would, yeah,
I mean a guy like that, let's like bigger than
Meetia by president of a leader of the world. Which, yeah.

Speaker 4 (26:03):
We sat out in Saint Peter's Square for like four hours.
It was every bit of ninety ninety five degrees by
the end of the day and I was very sweaty.
But yes, finally getting to meet the popa it was.
It was a blessing, getting our marriage blessed.

Speaker 1 (26:16):
I'm curious because of the honeymoon everything did were you
able to do tight end you? It was not.

Speaker 4 (26:20):
I was, Oh, I was bummed out, but I'd rather
have been on my honeymoon. Yeah, of course, yes, And
you're supposed to say that to make sure you say.

Speaker 1 (26:26):
I told her that.

Speaker 4 (26:27):
Over and over.

Speaker 1 (26:29):
But tight end you is interesting to me because I
know you've done it before, and you know Greg Olsen,
Travis Kelsey they do a great job kind of organism,
and there's some other guys too, But as a tight
end this league, how valuable is that week working with
those guys and just all you guys getting together. What's
it like and how valuable is it for especially a
young guy like you early in your career.

Speaker 4 (26:50):
Yeah, it's fun just to be around the group that
is the tight end position in the locker room. I
feel like we're such a great such great characters make
up the tight end group. So the collection of guys
that are down there at tight end you great personalities,
and then of course everything you get to learn from
the guys that have played the position at the highest

(27:10):
level over the years. You know, you get Greg Olsen
down there, you get Travis Kelcey, you get Gonkowski, you
get George Kiddo, you get Hockinson, you get Dallas. Go
down the list, right, there's a zillion guys down there
that have played at such a high level, all pro level,
gold jacket guys, and to learn from them over the
course of the week. It's the little things you get

(27:30):
to pick their brain. Hey, Trav, what do you think
about this release? Here? George, what do you think about
this footwork on this blocking scheme. What do you you know,
it's just an amazing opportunity. So guys that get that opportunity,
I really suggest they go down and do it.

Speaker 1 (27:43):
Kudos to Olsen and Kelsey and those guys two for
paying it forward right to the young guys and just
putting that together that those are trade secrets so you
don't have to do that right. Well, the fact that
that's such a close knit group of tight ends, it
was that the way Iowa to because I was becoming,
you know, the tight end you kind of play.

Speaker 4 (28:00):
Yeah, when I first got there, Dallas Clark, my first
fall camp, took a liking to me and he became
somewhat of a mentor for me in the four years
that I was there and beyond that coming into the NFL.
But like I said, there's a collection of guys, a
lot of which come from Iowa, but there's a bunch
of tight ends down there that just want to help
give back to the younger guys and push the position forward.

Speaker 1 (28:22):
Really, speaking of young guys, you know, he got a
few young guys in the mix here. Still looking for
that maybe number three tight end. How is this room
coming together? What do you think of the young guys
and once you start camp and kind of get into it,
how long does it take for that room to kind
of gel with the different personnelity. You got veterans in there,
you've got some new guys. Just how long does that take?

(28:43):
And what do you think of that competition between you know,
the young guys. Maybe a couple of vets for that
number three.

Speaker 4 (28:48):
Yeah, we have a great group of guys this year.
Two rookies and Luke dil and Zach Cordon provide a
lot of value to the group. We get a new
player in Kenny Eboa coming over from the Jets, and
experienced guy, played a lot of football, and you know
Shane and Brock of course to round out the group.
Just a fantastic group, great guys, better better friends of
mine than players. Really, at the end of the day,

(29:09):
I love lining up next to those guys and competing
with them. But by the end of camp you can
start to tell who's going to add value and in
what area. Guys start to stand out within the position group.
There's there's varieties of you know, is this guy going
to be more of an HF, Is he going to
be more of a true y inline blocking guy, What

(29:29):
what sort of value do you add? So by the
end of camp that.

Speaker 1 (29:32):
Number three spot is versatility key to that spot too.
Of course you'll not be so much of a one
trick pony, be able to do a different and play
different spots there because you never know when you're gonna
have to hop into that number three spot. What you're
gonna have to do, of.

Speaker 4 (29:43):
Course, I mean when you play the numbers game, which
they always tell us not to. The number three tight
end typically plays a lot of special teams and is
very versatile. Like you said, what do you think of
Tyler Roll?

Speaker 1 (29:56):
He's a guy that's gotten a lot of kind of
steam ahead of time when he's got in here. Popular guy.
I know Dan talked about really wanting him. Just how
is he to the room? What does he bring? First impressions?
Very fiery.

Speaker 4 (30:08):
I love the attitude that Tyler brings every day. He'll
be great in the middle of camp when days are
getting long, you're in pads for like the tenth day
in a row, maybe you don't want to push yourself.
Tyler is gonna be.

Speaker 5 (30:20):
He's gonna be for us, so he'll be amazing bringing.

Speaker 4 (30:23):
Us that motivation and just pushing us to bear best.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
And then new offensive coordinator too in John Morton's just
maybe first impressions of him as well. Uh, doesn't seem
as fiery as Ben. Maybe that's just my first impression
watching him and OTAs and in the first practice you laugh.
Maybe you have a different you obviously, but just first
impressions of him. Maybe just what you think and is,

(30:47):
is the casual fan gonna be able to see a
big difference in this offense, Because when we talked to
John in the spring, he said, look, it's number one
offensive league, but I'm not changing a whole lot. Obviously,
He's got some things that he likes to do, some
principles that he's developed over his many years in this league.
But will the common fans see the difference and maybe
just version persons of John taking over that oc? Josh sure, Yeah,
I feel like it's kind of a two part question

(31:08):
in terms of like what the common.

Speaker 4 (31:09):
Fan we'll see. We have a lot of guys back
from last year, especially like this core skill position players,
the guys that are going to see touching the ball,
you know, start with the backs, best best duo in
the league, Dave Montgomery and Jamier Gibbs, you got the
wide outs, you got Khalif, you got Jmo, you got
Saint Brown, you got Tim Patrick.

Speaker 1 (31:31):
Jamo fastest guy league. I mean, it's crazy.

Speaker 4 (31:33):
You got a new face in Tesla and then the
tight end position is basically the same as well. Yeah,
and that's that's really exciting for a coordinator like Johnny
to come into in my opinion, You've got a set
group of guys that have played at a high level,
with Jared Goff at the helm conducting the offense, and
he gets the opportunity to call what he's been learning

(31:55):
his entire life as a coach, mostly a past game
coordinator the last couple of years, and he's done a
fantastic job and asking for help from Hank Freeley, who's
been a fantastic run game guy the last couple of
years with the offensive line, you know, going falling back
on his position, coaches as well, and his players, like
what do you think of this motion? Where do you

(32:16):
want to be on the field when we're calling this play?

Speaker 5 (32:18):
How do you want as a player.

Speaker 4 (32:19):
Of course, you want to have input because you're the
one out there trying to execute your job at a
high level. And when you're getting those questions asked from
the top down with Johnny and Dan, you just have
a lot of confidence in yourself as a player.

Speaker 1 (32:32):
You almost feel like you're taking ownership of the offensive
bit too, right.

Speaker 4 (32:35):
I know Jared's talked about that and has.

Speaker 1 (32:37):
Said that over the years that he feels they built
this around him, And he asked this, heading into your
third season, Sam, there's going to be such a comfort
level having produced at that level and now just knowing
the drill, just where are you at in terms of
your comfort level heading into year three? I want to
say this. I don't know if if you heard this
or not, but we talked to Aman Ross Saint Brown
in the spring and somebody asked him, so, who's catching

(32:59):
your out here? Who looks great? The first name he said,
with zero hesitation was Sam Laport. Oh, thank you, he said,
he looks great. And so when somebody like that says
that too, and you've had the production, just your comfort
level heading into year three, it's.

Speaker 4 (33:17):
Kind of it's like angel on one shoulder, Devil on
the other. In one position, you're very comfortable and how
you fit into the offense. But then again, being comfortable
and complacent, You'll never be your best, so you kind
of have to. You have to dribble both balls at
the same time. And I'm very comfortable with how I

(33:38):
fit into the offense. The production that I've had, I
think has been fantastic. There's only one football on the field,
and you love to have it in your hands, but
we have so many guys that deserve it. So at
the end of the day, I try to do my best,
contribute as much value to the team as possible, and
continue to get better. Don't be complacent.

Speaker 1 (33:55):
I'm gonna go ahead and just ask one of those
questions that you know what the answer is going to be,
just because I know you from being around you for
two years. But you know, because I want to ask
you about goals, right and I know you, and the
first thing you're going to say is I don't care.
I want to win games. I want the super Bowl,
and that's what it's going to be, you know. But

(34:16):
I just individually, do you do you set individual goals
catches stuff like that or is it just team stuff
for you? And do you think it's important maybe for
players to do that just to have something to shoot for.

Speaker 5 (34:27):
I don't.

Speaker 4 (34:29):
Discourage guys when I hear them set statistic goals, I
want to have this many catches, this many yards. I
don't think that's a bad thing to shoot for. It's
just not what I shoot for. Like you said, the
number one goal is to always win as many games
as possible, win the division, win the super Bowl. It's
always the team goals first, and then when you when

(34:50):
you think about your own individual goals. I think there's
nothing cooler than being All Pro in the league, to
be voted upon by your peers that you're playing the
position at the highest level there that year, so to
have gotten I was second team All Pro my rookie year,
which I was really proud of. If I could do
that again, be first team All Pro, I think anybody
would want to be that well.

Speaker 1 (35:10):
According to Aman Ross Saint Brown, a lot of different
guys I talked to, you are looking really really great
out there. Obviously huge expectations for this office with all
the skill guys that you talked about back it's camp,
the grind begins, but I think everybody here is excited
about the season that you you're gonna have, the offense
is going to have, the team is going to have.
Thanks so much for joining me. Put your head down,

(35:33):
grind and uh we'll catch back up in a couple
of weeks, a couple of weeks. Thanks Mat, I appreciate you.
Welcome back to the toy Laha Podcast, and I am
very happy to welcome in Tom Pallisero. You guys know
him NFL network insider. He has his pulse on everything

(35:54):
the NFL and he's well pretty well connected here in
Detroit as well. Tom, thanks for joining the podcast. I
appreciate you.

Speaker 5 (36:01):
You got Sam.

Speaker 6 (36:01):
This is my first media obligation post vacation.

Speaker 5 (36:06):
So got back from.

Speaker 6 (36:08):
The lake having really fully shaved or gotten a haircut,
So you're getting the real This is the off season me,
but hopefully this will help my brain get into getting
into training.

Speaker 5 (36:18):
Camp mode here.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
I love that this is the podcast to preview training
camps that we're all getting in footback in football mode. Look,
it's crazy that you know we've got first practice comes Sunday.
It comes quick, but you know, I mean, you've been
doing this a long time. The NFL is really a
twenty four hour, three sixty five deal nowadays. But Tom,
let's get right into it. You look at the lines,

(36:41):
they obviously have Super Bowl aspirations. When you look at
the NFC in totality and the teams that are at
the top there, who do you think are kind of
those you know, three four teams in the NFC the
head into the season, you know, really having good Super
Bowl aspirations and good shot of being that team to

(37:01):
represent the NFC.

Speaker 5 (37:02):
Great question, Tim.

Speaker 6 (37:03):
Because I think that as you proceeded through the playoffs
a year ago, you know, it was pretty apparent if
you watch the Super Bowl that the Eagles were in
a class by themselves, though there were some other teams
that pushed them, you know, through the course of the
season and the playoffs.

Speaker 5 (37:19):
The Packers were right there.

Speaker 6 (37:21):
Obviously the Commanders reached the NFC Championship game. To me,
it starts with the Eagles, and then it's all right,
who are those other if you want three, who are
those other ones going to be? It has been the
Lions over the past couple of years. They played just
their worst game at the worst possible moment in that
playoff opener last year. But certainly you have to look

(37:43):
at them being in that mix. You look at, you know,
the Vikings coming off a fourteen win season but with
a new quarterback. That's going to be a major question
hovering over the whole division. Certainly, a team like Green
Bay is really really talented, and it's a matter of
you know, Jordan Love is banged up last year he
missed some time, but now year two, going into the
same defensive scheme should help them. And then the Bears

(38:04):
are you know, the team that everybody wants to talk about.
You know, I've seen some of the analytic projections where
all for these teams are considered likely to make the playoffs.
You know, it really to me, a big part of
it starts in the NFC North and who is going
to emerge from that battle Royale? It may well be
the Lions again. Dan Campbell has obviously had a ton

(38:25):
of staff turnover through the course of the offseason. We'll
see exactly how much their schemes evolved from year over year.
But they've got a lot of the same core players back.
They still have the opportunity to be really explosive from
an offensive perspective. And then getting back a guy that
they sorely missed Dallas stretch last season, Aden Hutchinson, who
everything seems to be on track with him. That is

(38:47):
clearly going to be a huge boost for a Lions
team that if they're going to beat those those good
teams in the NFC, they're going to need that pass.

Speaker 5 (38:54):
Rush down the stretch.

Speaker 1 (38:56):
Washington, for real? Has Jayden made them a team in
your mind? That is? You know, they obviously showed with
the win and getting to the NFC Championship game, Like
you talked about, they have staying power. Is Washington one
of those teams?

Speaker 3 (39:08):
Now?

Speaker 1 (39:08):
Maybe a lot of teams entering the season didn't think
a lot about Washington, But what Jayden did and how
far they got, are they one of those teams now
we have to think about every year in the NFC.

Speaker 6 (39:20):
Well, credit to Dan Quinn and that staff for the
culture and the shift that they were able to make.
Jane Daniels was plainly a big part of it. I
always say, the most dangerous thing that a new staff
can do in year one, a new regime can do
in year one is overachieved and the commanders, I mean, listen,
if they don't have a Hail Mary hit, they are

(39:44):
losing a game to Chicago, and I want to say
that was Week seven. It's the Bears that are in
the mix in the NFC North and the Commanders all
a sudden take this, this brutal loss at home on
national TV. Do the seasons go differently? Obviously they didn't.
The Commanders were better trained for that moment. I just
wonder now will they be able to continue to press

(40:07):
forward here or was that one of those years where
everything went their way and that maybe covered up some
of the deficiencies. You think of some of the breakthrough
teams that we've seen in recent years. I mean, the
toast of the town in twenty twenty two was the
Giants who made the playoffs and won a playoff game
in Minnesota in Brian Dables' first year. They regressed to
the mean that following season. Same thing with the Vikings.

(40:28):
We've gotten into the playoffs that year, and they regressed
in twenty twenty three, albeit with some significant injuries at
the quarterback position. You know, this could be a team
that Jayden Daniels is that good and he can elevate
the level of everybody around him. They got to sort
things out with their top wide receiver Terry McLaurin. That's
something to keep an eye on here. After he skipped
midicamp and the run up to training camp kicking off

(40:51):
next week. But certainly, you know when you have the quarterback,
tim that's a big piece of the equation, and it
sort of seems like they've got a.

Speaker 5 (40:58):
Really good one and lounched him.

Speaker 1 (41:00):
Tom. You mentioned Dan Campbell and the staff turnover here
in Detroit. Obviously, two new coordinators with John Morton taking
over the offense and Calvin Shepard the defense. I think
there's fourteen different changes, either guys in new roles or
new coaches on that staff, but the one constant is
Dan Campbell. And just you talked about the culture there
in Washington, obviously Dan has built the culture here in Detroit.

(41:22):
Just your perception on the outside looking in of the
job Dan has done, and when you've got a coach
that's as well respected as that, when you're having two
new coordinators and you've got so much turnover on the
staff with a guy like Dan, you just kind of
don't expect it to be a big issue because you
know he's going to find the right guys. Is that
kind of the impression from the outside looking into Well,

(41:43):
first of all, let's.

Speaker 6 (41:44):
Talk about how rare it is to have the staff
continuity that had.

Speaker 5 (41:49):
This is the place point. It took a few years
for them to have to pay that price.

Speaker 6 (41:54):
If I'm not mistaken, the Lions were the only team
last year that had had their offensive and defensive coordinators
in place for three straight years. So when you have that,
that just allows you to build a level of continuity
that you just don't see in the NFL a whole lot.
Having said that, yes, Dan Campbell is not just a
culture setter, but he built that offense with Ben Johnson.

(42:16):
Ben is obviously brilliant, and we'll see how brilliant two
times this year when he goes up against his old team.

Speaker 1 (42:23):
Lions fans are hoping not too brilliant.

Speaker 5 (42:27):
He's a really really smart guy.

Speaker 6 (42:28):
And the creativity and the unique plays that he would
draw up, you know, that's something that we're going to
have to see how the Lions, you know, kind of
adjust to that.

Speaker 5 (42:37):
You remember, you know, the shift began for.

Speaker 6 (42:39):
Detroit midway through Dan's first year when he took the
play calling duties from Anthony Lynn. Ben became more involved,
but Dan was calling it himself. That's when you got
that run first physical mentality, and they ran for whatever
was three hundred yards against Pittsburgh I think it was
in that opening game. Dan's going to be heavily involved,
and John Borton's been around the block. I mean, he's

(43:00):
coached with some really good people, Sean Payton certainly chief
among them. He was there in Detroit at one point
previously here. I don't think that there's going to be
you know, a beat skipped, per se. I do think
that any time that you have again this level of turnover,
because it's not just your coordinators, but there were a
bunch of other staff members, Tanna Engstran going on to

(43:20):
be the the jets OC and J. T. Barrett following
Ben to Chicago. There were other dall as well. I mean,
that's that's a lot, and so we'll see.

Speaker 5 (43:33):
The one thing I know.

Speaker 6 (43:33):
About Dan is he is never afraid to confront whatever
his realities are. And you've seen it with some of
the we might say incremental moves, but certainly they've been
swift moves. When it was you know, again taking away
the play calling duties from Anthony Lynn, whether it was
making a change to his defensive staff, you know, moving
on from Aubrey Pleasant at the time. If there's something

(43:54):
that he doesn't feel like is right, He's not going
to hesitate to change it here, but this will be
a big test, There's no doubt about it. And maybe
you would hope after this many years now, the player
leadership also is going to be able to rise up
at whatever void might need to be filled with some
of those guys, namely Aaron Glenn as well as Ben
Johnson moving on, maybe there's some of those players too

(44:15):
that can help bring that entire thing and keep it
rolling in the right direction.

Speaker 1 (44:18):
Yeah. I think that's a great point by you, because
it is a core that's now been here and established,
and you saw on the Netflix just the leadership that
Jared Golf has been in his tenth year and running
the show there. Look talking about Dan a little bit, Tom,
he doesn't get enough credit for the offensive mind that
he is. You know, everybody sees the opening press conference

(44:39):
and the grit and some of the speeches and stuff,
but he is a very apt offensive mind and he
doesn't get enough credit for it. And to your point,
that offense turned when he's started taking over the play calling,
and it's him, Ben and Jared that built this offense.
Ben deserves a lot of credit for it. But Dan
had a big part of building that offense around. He

(45:00):
doesn't need a lot credit for it, So it'll be
fun to see how this kind of goes knowing that
Dan's the constant there.

Speaker 6 (45:06):
Yeah, I think that was one of the misconceptions. I
know that was one of the misconceptions about Dan when
he came to Detroit was. Yeah, he had the press
conference that people still quote to this day. But the
thing that I kept emphasizing on TV was hink Ambill
work for Sean Payton, who is a partyment, offensive mind
and as demanding as any coach in the NFL. But
Dan was presenting parts of the game plan. Dan was

(45:27):
speaking to the team on a weekly basis. If Sean
had something else going on, Dan was the one who
was stepping in and running the show. You know, that
level of trust. I think really spoke volumes about how
smart Dan is and again we're gonna see, you know,
does his stamp come.

Speaker 5 (45:46):
Through even more this time around.

Speaker 6 (45:48):
I don't know if it's possible to run the football
more than the Lions are already, but you know, maybe
there's there's more of an emphasis into certain areas of it.
Every year is an evolution. I bumped into Dan at
the coffee shop in one of the hotels in Indianapolis
at the combine, and he was, you know, probably getting
his fifth coffee of the day, but he had been
He was like, oh man, I'm rolling with the coaches.

(46:09):
They were because they had never been in the same
room together because it took so long. The hiring process
takes so long, not just for for instance, Ag and Bendaland,
but then Ag had to hire his staffs Now Angstrand's gone.
The combine was the first time the Lions had their
new staff together. But in talking to Dan, yeah, you know,
you us talk about we lost seven coaches or whatever
it was. But it's like, but I'm fired up, Like

(46:31):
this is new, this is freshest and different challenge. I
fully expected to embrace it.

Speaker 1 (46:36):
You know, I could tend the Lions could be a
better football team in twenty twenty five than they were
in twenty twenty four. And look, they won fifteen games,
they were in the number one seed. They could be
a better football team and lose more football games. You know,
they've got one of the toughest schedules in football. But
when you look at this team, what's one thing you're
excited about what what do you think is a strength
heading into this season? So I want to give you

(46:57):
one strength and then one area maybe where you have
a question mark with this football team heading into twenty
twenty five.

Speaker 6 (47:04):
Well, the question mark, if we start there, is probably
just going to be do they have sufficient amount of
pass rush?

Speaker 5 (47:10):
I think that you saw that last year.

Speaker 6 (47:12):
They obviously, you know, brought in Zadarius to try to
help fill the void here.

Speaker 5 (47:16):
Aiden being back.

Speaker 6 (47:17):
And hopefully being himself is going to make a huge difference,
but they've sometimes lacked that that complimentary piece, and so
you know some of that going to come. You know,
Tyler Williams, who's the biggest man anyone's ever seen on
a football field. Can that internal you know, whatever you
can do in terms of pushing the pocket, can that
make a difference? What other stuff, you know, Mike Kevin
Shepard want to draw that they weren't doing previously. There's

(47:40):
a lot of different things they've They've tried different fronts
in the past. I know they've had attacking styles, they've
had more play on the block styles. You know, how
does that thing kind of evolve through the course of
this season. I think that just do they have enough
pass rush. That was the question all last year, even
before Aiden got hurt, was do they have enough you know,
around him? And then it was after he got hurt,
it was obviously, well or is it going to come

(48:00):
from that?

Speaker 5 (48:01):
To me? Is still the number one question mark?

Speaker 6 (48:03):
The biggest strength of the team, you know, I still
think is just the the offensive playmakers. You know, Frank
Wraigan now retiring, that's a big deal and you're gonna
have to, you know, do some adjusting on your offensive line.
Which if there was one strength left over from the
Bob Quinn Matt Patricia days, it was that offensive line
and they have had a lot of continuity in that group.

(48:24):
If the offensive line can come together, then you know,
you just think of the levels on which they can
beat you. You know, both in terms of running the football.
With Montgomery was healthy enough to play down the stretch,
should be a lot better this year. Obviously, Jamier Gibbs,
everyone you know in the fantasy football community is talking about,
this guy can be a top five type of performer
this year. And then it's a'm on Ross Saint Brown,

(48:45):
and it's Jamo, and it's Samuel Porter, who you'd hope
is a little bit closer to being himself now a
little bit further removed from the injury. They've got tons
of playmakers and obviously Jared Goff, who's played at a
really high level. This is the first time now too,
Jared's not going to have been around. How does that
dynamic work here in addition to having your passing game

(49:06):
coordinator moving on as well, I think they've got the
chance to be really, really dynamic again, which is saying
something because you're talking about a team that, if I'm
not mistaken, led the league in points last year.

Speaker 1 (49:16):
Well, they're really dynamic because of their general manager Brad
Holmes has done such a terrific job of building this roster.
I mean, what GM around in his first four draft
cycles drafted seven Pro Bowl players are all pros, That's what.
But Brad, did you know with guys like Hutchinson and
Saint Brown and Penny Sewell and the list goes on
and on. But you know, and Brad talked a little

(49:38):
bit about this at the league meetings. Is when you
do that, that's great and you have a nice young core,
but also you have some bills that come doue and
we're talking about hutch You know, going into his last
season next year, Brian Branch has become one of the
best safeties in the league. He's going to be on
his the final year of his deal next year. You've
got Jamison Williams, You've got Sam Laporta, You've got Jamior Gibbs.

(50:01):
These are all guys that are in line Tom for
you know, maybe set the market at their position type deals.
Some tough decisions are coming down the line. What do
you think, Hutch, let's maybe start there contract might look like.

Speaker 3 (50:15):
And then just.

Speaker 1 (50:18):
The position that Detroit's in, having so many good young players.
But our tough decisions headed headed this way.

Speaker 6 (50:24):
I mean, that's that's the problem that every team wants
to have, is you've got too many great players and
you push it as far as you can for as
long as you can, and sometimes you have to make
hard decisions. Look at the other teams that have been,
you know, in the mix for a long period of time,
the forty nine ers that Bill can do. As you
put it, this offseason, when it was we just we
can't have of whatever it was, fifteen eighteen to twenty

(50:46):
million dollars Deebo Samuel on this team and we can't
continue to paye von Hargrave. We're going to have to
make some you know, some tough moves here because now
we're paying brock Perty at the top of the market.
The Chiefs have gone through multiple different it or I mean,
who thought going into the offseason a few years ago
that they would trade maybe the most dynamic weapon in

(51:06):
the entire league in Tyreek Hill. But what they were
looking at was we need to rebuild a multi offensive
and defensive fronts. Well, if we're now paying Tyreek wants
a new deal, and he thinks DeVante Adams got twenty
eight million a year in Vegas, even though on realistically
it was like twenty two. But now he's asking for thirty.
We can save that thirty million per year and get

(51:28):
a first round pick and another pick and use those
resources to rebuild everything else. Okay, we're gonna do the
hard thing. Those are some of those types of decisions
that you have to make in terms of a Naden
Hutchinson contract. You know, the longer he waits, the more
the number is going to go up, particularly if he
comes back in camp and shows he's fully healthy. The
bar said at forty million a year, that was miles Garrett,

(51:49):
I would anticipate, I would fully expect that Naden Hutchinson
deal comes in significantly north of that because you also
have TJ. Watt, Trey Hendrickson. That one's probably not going
to be at least as of now, it's not gonna
be north of forty, but it's gonna be another top
of market deal. Master Crosby, the Neil Hunter, a bunch
of guys got in that thirty five million dollar range
through the course of this offseason. So as some of

(52:10):
these other deals start to get done Michael Parsons as well,
that's going to push into the forty two to forty
three range. Aiden Hutchinson, if they're not doing that deal
until the end of this year, that could be forty five.

Speaker 5 (52:20):
You know.

Speaker 6 (52:21):
We'll just have to see with the cap going up,
how much that market expands and what some of these
other deals end up looking like. In terms of Brad
you know, and what he's done with the roster. I
think that the Lions have done as good of a
job as anybody at being able to walk the line
between getting really good players and getting guys who fit.

(52:42):
There are times, and you saw this when Bill Belichick
had full authority over personnel in New England where they
were drafting guys who were fits. But eventually you end
up with a bunch of like average athletes from Navy
who might be really sharp and they're on time and
they can learn fast, but they're just not going to
be competitive with a team like the Bills that's just
loaded with talent. When they draft, you know, a Jack Campbell.

(53:06):
When the Lions take Jack Campbell in the middle of
the first round, and a lot of people had him
in the second, the question was, Okay, you know, can
this guy can play three downs? But they had a
vision for him. Jack Campbell's a really good and productive
football player. Is he the off the charts athlete? No,
But they saw within their scheme, this is what we
can do with this guy. Ad Hutchinson's the other one.

(53:26):
The Jaguars took Trayvon Walker over Aiden Hutchinson. Why because
of traits? Because Trayvon Walker tested, as you know, better
than anybody, better than Genevian Clowney, better than anybody who's
ever been at the combine. He didn't play a ton,
he wasn't a starter at Georgia, he didn't have a
lot of sacks, but they thought the upside is there. Well,
we're now going into year five I believe of Trayvon Walker,

(53:49):
and he's were still waiting. He was better last year,
he had like nine sacks, but we're still waiting for
him to have anything close to what Aiden Hutchinson did,
because Aiden Hutchinson may not be the athlete, but he
was much closer to being a fully foreigned football player
and also a guy the Lions knew they could count
on from a leadership perspective, from a culture perspective. You know,
Jimmior Gibbs, everyone in the league loved him, even though

(54:10):
people were shocked that they took them where they took him.
A lot of coaches loved Jamiir Gibbs. But again, it's
the fortitude to say, even if they couldn't have traded
down in that first round, they were gonna sit there.
I think they were in six or eight, they were
gonna take them there. Even if they hadn't been able
to trade down, they were gonna take Jamiir Gibbs. That's
just the you know, That's how Brad was trained with
the Rams. It was very much about we need football players,

(54:33):
we need guys who love football and they're really good
at it and they're productive. A lot of times. That's
gonna skew toward taking players from bigger programs. I mean
the guys I just listed off, almost all those are
big program types of guys, Big ten guys, SEC guys.
They they've found their bread and butter. And I don't
know that anybody, you know, just off the top of
my head, I don't know that anybody has drafted better

(54:55):
than the Lions have drafted since Brad and Dan got there.

Speaker 1 (54:59):
And they've been terrific duo. And that's so important to
a franchise into the success. And that's the most important
relationship in an organization is a relationship between your head
coach and your general manager. It's a terrific one. Here
in Detroit. They are very much in tune with what
the roster needs, get talent and develop it. That's how
you stay a winner for a long time. Tom, I
love the conversation. You are one of the best in

(55:20):
the business, sir. I thank you for being your first
media responsibility after vacation. That means a lot to me.
You did a great job and as always, we're gonna
have to have you on again. Great stuff. Tom Paellasero
from the NFL Network Insider has a touch on everything
in the league. Tom, thanks for joining the podcast. Appreciate you.

Speaker 5 (55:39):
Dim.

Speaker 6 (55:40):
I always owe you for those radio appearances you made
with me in Minneapolis like fifteen years ago.

Speaker 5 (55:44):
So anytime, anybuddy,