March 15, 2025 • 17 mins
Chinese wine is making waves in the global market with premium producers like Silver Heights showcasing the potential of regions like Ningxia through biodynamic viticulture and French winemaking techniques. We taste and evaluate two high-end offerings that challenge our expectations and reveal the rapid evolution of China's wine industry.
• China ranks as the 12th largest wine producer in the world
• Chinese wine industry began serious development in the late 1970s when the country opened to foreign investment
• Ningxia province is gaining recognition for quality Cabernet Sauvignon production
• Silver Heights winery produces biodynamically and organically grown wines using both Western philosophies and Chinese principles
• The premium Chardonnay ($89) shows beautiful minerality, green papaya notes and well-integrated oak
• The Cabernet Sauvignon ($115) displays intriguing local character with notes of shiso leaf, shiitake and tea
• Chinese wine evolution mirrors Australia's development in the 1980s with young vines still finding their identity
• Drastic continental climate in Ningxia requires vintners to mound snow over vines during winter
• Chinese wines are increasingly available in Australian specialty wine shops like Cardwell Cellars
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:09):
Hi and welcome to Wine with Meg and Malek here to
help you navigate the world ofwine.
I'm Malek, the priest from myMaster of Wine, Meg Brotman.
Meg, we are doing something sodifferent today and it's so nice
that on Season 4, we are doingsomething that we really haven't
even touched.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
We're doing China and the reason we haven't touched
it is it's been very hard tofind wines and being you in your
organisational arc or era, I'mnot sure which one.
An importer has sent thesewines to us, and it's really
exciting because I've hadChinese wines, obviously in
(00:45):
China.
My husband's made wine in China.
He's brought wine back andwe've always sort of tried them
straight away, but it'sinteresting to see that they're
starting to be imported intoAustralia.
So congratulations on doingthat, and China is the 12th
largest producer of wine in theworld.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
That's crazy.
I feel like most people don'tunderstand how much of a big
deal the Chinese wine industryis, just because I mean I guess
they don't export much, right?
Speaker 2 (01:10):
No, they don't export much and they kind of did what
we did.
So Shandong province, which isquite humid and wet but it has
really good infrastructure, soit's near a port, it's not that
far from Shanghai and Beijing,so they planted there and it
hasn't.
You know, they can grow grapesthere, certainly, but the
(01:31):
disease pressure is quite highbecause it's humid.
But then they've obviously comein and looked at different
parts of China and I think we'relooking at Ningxia, which Mark
Robertson, who is the head ofTWI so he's a entrepreneur for
Treasury Wine Estate said to meabout 10 years ago Ningxia
(01:55):
province is probably going to bethe best Cabernet out of China
and it's extraordinarily goodWow.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Have you tasted much.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Yeah, I have.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
I've had quite a lot of Cabernet, and what's your
take on general Chinese?
Speaker 2 (02:07):
vine A little bit of an overuse of oak lighter bodied
in style.
So they're heavily oaking thembut there's not as much grunt.
But the vines are stillrelatively young, so let's give
them time.
It's like Australia in the sortof 80s and almost 90s when we
were planting, planting,planting, planting, planting.
Yeah, I've had.
There's got Cabernet Garnet I'mnot pronouncing it, it's
(02:31):
G-E-R-N-I-S-C-H-T Garnet, whichis apparently Carmenere.
Oh, not a great variety that Iwould be planting in that region
.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Let's go back a bit and talk about why even is, why
are they making wine in China?
Where's this come from?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Well, they've always made, you know, sorghum, wine
and Baijiu.
So there's spirits.
And then with the opening up ofChina, obviously in the sort of
I'd say starting in the 70syeah wasn't a big movement, but
certainly into the 90s there wasthat westernization and more of
an understanding of westernsociety and acceptance of
(03:19):
western society and aspirationalyeah and so wine was part of
that aspiration, and I wastalking to Yuri, who works with
us, and she said that the 90s inChina are considered like the
golden age.
People were increasing theirwealth.
It wasn't as crazy fast-pacedas it is now yeah, but people
(03:41):
had they could invest and byworking hard they would get
somewhere.
Yeah, okay, and now there's alittle bit of a belief that by
working hard you're going tohave to work extra hard to get
to the same place.
So the 90s are considered to bequite a good spot and I think
the information from this winery.
They said in 1978, was it MowatHennessy that went over there
(04:04):
to China and invested.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
I did read that.
So this is Silver Heights Winesis what we're going to be
tasting.
And yeah, what did they say?
So they started in the 70s.
The country opened up toforeign investment, so first
agreement signed was betweenLVMH and Remy Martin, and that's
early history of investmentfrom Bordeaux Houses, but it is
now owned by a family.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Think about China and the vast landscape.
It covers everything from theGobi Desert right through to,
you know, subtropical, down atShenzhen and Guangzhou, and then
you've got the sort of drycontinentality in Sichuan and
then it's a little bit morecoastal.
It is a massive country.
(04:48):
There's got to be great terroirin there.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
I heard that like isn't around Helen Mountain and
stuff, don't they have vineyardsin like greenhouses?
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Well, in the Helen Mountains they do have to.
They mound snow over the vines.
Speaker 1 (05:05):
Maybe that's what it was.
There was something interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
So during winter they mound the snow over the vines,
so the snow freezes, not thevine, even though the vine is in
dormancy.
That's why they do it, but itis super continental warm
summers.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
And, from what you've seen, is most Chinese wine that
you've tasted.
Is it more in the premium endor the more commercial end?
And or like, can you not?
Speaker 2 (05:31):
generalise Two things .
One and I'm talking about early2000s here and into the 2010s,
and that may not be true now.
I have not kept up with myChina law, but back in those
days you could import wine fromanywhere in the world and blend
it with Chinese wine, and aslong as there was 5% Chinese
wine in there, you could call itwine from China.
(05:53):
Surely that's not the case nowso many years ago, not so long
ago, when I was still living inChile in the 2000s, janis
Robinson said having done atasting of Chinese wine, it
amazes me how much it tasteslike Mipo Cabernet.
And I can tell you for a factthat we were exporting in bulk
container loads of barrel-agedhigh-core Mipo Cabernet from
(06:20):
Alto Mipo, so reallyhigh-quality Cabernet at back
then $18 a litre.
Oh my God, at back then $18 alitre in bulk 24,000 litres that
was going into a bottle thatweighed four kilos oh wow and
was sold at the premium end.
So yes, they tried topremiumise very early because
(06:43):
there's a lot about status andaspiration and face in the
Chinese culture.
I think now, because wine hasbecome more acceptable you're
seeing the young, cool thingsthere's more of these, what they
call bistros in China now.
So for aspirational living,it's what we would basically
call a restaurant.
(07:04):
So it has a wine list and ithas a single plate that you have
rather than share food.
So they have really good winelists and people want to buy
them.
The Chinese wine is sort ofslowly making its way there.
They're still very young, theywill get there.
They probably haven't eventapped the best place to grow
(07:24):
the grapes.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Well, this one that we're looking at today, silver
heights wines.
They are definitely in thepremium spectrum.
So apparently, in jancisrobertson's 20 you know 2010s a
while ago, but still well, thatlist of wine, this was named.
This was the highest scoredchinese wine.
Um, this is all estate grownfruit and it's also
(07:47):
biodynamically and organicallygrown.
And this is interesting.
It says using Westernphilosophies but also Chinese
principles, so it looks likeWestern philosophies might be a
selling point.
Fungicides yeah, well, true.
Well, not yet true, because itis such a dry continental
(08:09):
climate.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
They can probably do organic and biodynamic yeah, so
the disease risk is much, muchlower.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
So, for context, the Chardonnay we're going to taste
is $89 and the red, which is aCab Sav, is $115.
Wow, so we have premium Chinesestuff here.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
It's a shame you didn't.
You should have held that backfrom me before I tasted the wine
.
Is it barrel fermented?
Speaker 1 (08:37):
It is so this 100% Chardonnay made in a Burgundy
style.
It is 100% new Burgundy oak foreight months.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
New Burgundy oak for eight months.
New Burgundy oak, the Bordeauxgraduated winemaker Emma Gow.
Elegant and artisanal winesthat perfectly reflect the
terroir of Ningxia, aged foreight months in new Burgundy oak
barrels.
Someone needs to help withtheir marketing.
So obviously, the Cooper isburgundian.
(09:09):
The chardonnay reserve shows abeautiful capital b green apple,
accompanied by plenty oftropical notes, packed of papaya
, banana and apricot, along witha creamy texture on the palate.
A fantastic wine.
Fantastic wine to be servedwith poor tray or to enjoy on
itself.
(09:29):
Okay, Some English would begood.
That's pretty delicious, meg,you're so mean I know it is yum,
but the thing is, if you'regoing at the premium end, go
premium.
I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
No, it's fair, that is yum, is it worth $89?
Speaker 2 (09:42):
No, could I mistake that for a Yarra Valley
Chardonnay?
Yes.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Yeah, no, could I mistake that for a Yarra Valley
Chardonnay?
Yes, yeah, you could.
I think the oak is evident.
It's got this beautiful roundfinish which I absolutely adore,
and I actually think that youcan taste, I guess, the
premiumness through the oak.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Yeah, there's quite a bit of minerality to it.
There is that green papayawhich I really like in it.
The acid's perfectly in balance.
The oak is really wellintegrated.
It is a delicious wine.
It is, but 90 bucks is astretch for me.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
What makes me think?
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Because you're in Burgundy territory there.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
I just, if you gave me this Chardonnay, I'd be like
this is delicious, it's amazing.
I might have called Margaretover.
Oh really, yeah, I think so,but the point being it's not
setting itself apart.
I don't know how it's meant to,but I mean, what do you want
from a Chinese wine?
Do you want it to look like ourwines?
(10:40):
I almost wish it was kind ofdifferent.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Come on.
Chardonnay is an internationalgrape variety.
Chardonnay will speak oftenmore than where it's grown.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
That's why it is a grape variety that is planted
throughout the world and, to behonest, we've got nothing to
reference it against.
Yeah, yeah.
So if I was doing the marketingon this, I would put it up
against other ChineseChardonnays.
It would be hard to we say.
I say that I don't really likecomparing wines in the Yarra
(11:12):
Valley to other wines of theworld because I want them to be
standalone.
It might still be very earlydays for Ningxia, but that is a
really solid, good quality wine.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
I think it's really delicious, and so maybe we got
the LVMH stuff wrong.
Maybe it was more the region wewere talking about, because
this winery was founded in 2007by Emma Gow and her father.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Yeah, I think the LVMH stuff was the region yeah
okay, got you.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
So it's all indigenous yeast, minimal
filtration.
They are really using niceforward progressive winemaking
and I think it's a reallybeautiful expression of
Chardonnay.
Good on her, and I mean.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Emma, I've got one thing Heavy bottle Lightweight
bottle babe, and you're upagainst the taxes.
So you know this would not bethat expensive in China.
But again, aspirational, Don'taim high, Don't stuff around
Like.
That is a good wine.
It can only get better year onyear, that's delicious Yep.
I would buy it, but I'm notgoing to spend $90 on it.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Yeah, fair, and if anyone, I mean they're in the
show notes but interestinglythere are a couple of places
that you can get this.
So if you Google Silver Heights, it's not anywhere that is like
a major retailer but there aresome smaller kind of bottle
shops and stuff that you can getit delivered from.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Now we've got a Cabernet.
Is that correct?
It is a Cabernet.
Now, as I said, mark Robertsonmany years ago he's one of the
entrepreneurs at Treasury WineEstates said to me that Ningxia
makes great Cabernet.
Pete went over there a fewyears ago and did the Ningxia
(12:59):
Wine Challenge, where everyonewas given.
They brought in a whole heap ofwinemakers from around the
globe and given fruit off thesame block, theoretically, and
they all had to compete to makewine.
It's definitely continental, soone would argue that it's
better suited for Chardonnayjust going off absolute theory,
(13:20):
not having been there.
But Cabernet has a long hangtime.
So often in these continentalregions you have these long
autumns, so riesling might be abetter bet than chardonnay yeah,
that's interesting.
I wonder if it's less compatiblewith the chinese palette well,
my german reasoning's got yearand year bit sweetness, but it's
(13:42):
not as um, it's not as premium.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
Chardonnay.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Yeah, this smells so good.
I do want us to do an ultrapremium Riesling Chardonnay Mate
.
Don't even talk me into that.
Yeah, because we often drinkaround that $35 and say how
great it delivers at that point.
But let's have a look at it 80and over.
Well, I think we'll go all overthe world, okay.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Deal.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
How good does that smell?
It smells like Cabernet.
I'm a bit worried that it's.
Is that just frost in my glass?
Oh, it's not crystals, it's allgood.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
No.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
That's pretty good.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
It tastes aged.
It's a 2021.
We're in 2025.
Yeah, four years.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
It is starting to develop a tertiary touch, so
it's 100% Cabernet Sauvignon 12months in, 50% new French oak
and 50% in neutral oak.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
It's got really nice tannins as well.
They're nice and soft for a cab.
Yeah, yeah, it's got a wee bitof herbal note not herbaceous,
not underripe, but that herbalnote which you know I love
because it's kind of Yarra.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Valley-esque.
We have that, so I have tojustify it everywhere.
For me, there's a slight littlebit of bitterness at the back,
but again, this is a seriouswine that needs food.
This is not something thatyou're just going to be drinking
on its own, so that bitternessis going to support beautiful
Wagyu beef high-end steaks.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Okay, here I love this in their tasting notes.
So they kind of lead withWestern.
So they're saying coca, toastand nutmeg, but then they've
gone, complemented by, andthey've thrown in some of their
clearly more local tasting, likewhat they taste in the wine,
which is shiso, leaf, shiitakeand Prua tea savoriness.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Oh, wow, that's really lovely, I guess.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
The shiitake, yeah, yeah, absolutely More of the
dried shiitake mushrooms and Itotally I don't know what Prua
tea is, but I smell a tea.
Now that they say it, I'm likethere's a tea there.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
And the t bit black tea-y as well.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
This is a bit more interesting to me.
The Chardonnay was clearlypremium, clearly really good,
but not clearly Chinese.
There's something differentenough about this Cabernet that.
I think, if so, when we do wineshows, everyone brings a bottle
, right, and it's the mostfreaking stressful thing in the
world that there's all thesejudges and you've got to bring a
bottle of wine and be like.
(16:07):
Here's what I, you know likefor a dinner, when a bottle of
wine and be like.
Here's what I, you know, likefor dinner, when you have a
dinner the night before.
Yeah, everyone brings the mostbeautiful, amazing stuff and I'm
always like, oh, my God, I hatethat.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
I have to bring something.
You bring a magnum of Marsanfrom Tbil.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
No, that's when you go, I don't know.
I think Chinese wine.
If you rip down a Chinese wine,that's when you go really odd
around the $35 mark.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
You find the oddest wine and just say, oh look, this
wasn't very expensive, but it'ssuper interesting and no one
would have bought it.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
That's true, that's what I do, but I mean if you're
part of a wine club or if thereis, Because they're all just
putting their dicks on the table.
It's a big dick measuringcompetition, yeah, club.
Or if you're part of somethingwhere you do kind of want to
bring something different.
I feel like putting a Chinesewine on the table is going to
get you a bit of kudos.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
As I said, there is a shop in Melbourne that is
selling quite a few Chinesewines and they start at around
the $35 mark.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
I can't find anything cheaper.
Cardwell Cellars yes, is thatit?
Yeah, so.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
I think we should do an episode, but these are you
know $180.
$115.
Okay, bargain.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
No, it's a lot of money.
Yeah, look, it's a lot of money.
It is but rarity.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
we don't know how much they produce, but it's very
good wine.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Yeah, so that is it for Chinese Wine.
Maybe we'll come back withanother episode and explore it a
bit further, but until then,enjoy your next glass of wine.
Drink well Sweaty, and we'redone.
Hi and welcome to Wine with Meg and Malek here to
help you navigate the world ofwine.
I'm Malek, the priest from myMaster of Wine, Meg Brotman.
Meg, we are doing something sodifferent today and it's so nice
that on Season 4, we are doingsomething that we really haven't
even touched.
Speaker 2 (00:24):
We're doing China and the reason we haven't touched
it is it's been very hard tofind wines and being you in your
organisational arc or era, I'mnot sure which one.
An importer has sent thesewines to us, and it's really
exciting because I've hadChinese wines, obviously in
(00:45):
China.
My husband's made wine in China.
He's brought wine back andwe've always sort of tried them
straight away, but it'sinteresting to see that they're
starting to be imported intoAustralia.
So congratulations on doingthat, and China is the 12th
largest producer of wine in theworld.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
That's crazy.
I feel like most people don'tunderstand how much of a big
deal the Chinese wine industryis, just because I mean I guess
they don't export much, right?
Speaker 2 (01:10):
No, they don't export much and they kind of did what
we did.
So Shandong province, which isquite humid and wet but it has
really good infrastructure, soit's near a port, it's not that
far from Shanghai and Beijing,so they planted there and it
hasn't.
You know, they can grow grapesthere, certainly, but the
(01:31):
disease pressure is quite highbecause it's humid.
But then they've obviously comein and looked at different
parts of China and I think we'relooking at Ningxia, which Mark
Robertson, who is the head ofTWI so he's a entrepreneur for
Treasury Wine Estate said to meabout 10 years ago Ningxia
(01:55):
province is probably going to bethe best Cabernet out of China
and it's extraordinarily goodWow.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
Have you tasted much.
Speaker 2 (02:00):
Yeah, I have.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
I've had quite a lot of Cabernet, and what's your
take on general Chinese?
Speaker 2 (02:07):
vine A little bit of an overuse of oak lighter bodied
in style.
So they're heavily oaking thembut there's not as much grunt.
But the vines are stillrelatively young, so let's give
them time.
It's like Australia in the sortof 80s and almost 90s when we
were planting, planting,planting, planting, planting.
Yeah, I've had.
There's got Cabernet Garnet I'mnot pronouncing it, it's
(02:31):
G-E-R-N-I-S-C-H-T Garnet, whichis apparently Carmenere.
Oh, not a great variety that Iwould be planting in that region
.
Speaker 1 (02:47):
Let's go back a bit and talk about why even is, why
are they making wine in China?
Where's this come from?
Speaker 2 (02:56):
Well, they've always made, you know, sorghum, wine
and Baijiu.
So there's spirits.
And then with the opening up ofChina, obviously in the sort of
I'd say starting in the 70syeah wasn't a big movement, but
certainly into the 90s there wasthat westernization and more of
an understanding of westernsociety and acceptance of
(03:19):
western society and aspirationalyeah and so wine was part of
that aspiration, and I wastalking to Yuri, who works with
us, and she said that the 90s inChina are considered like the
golden age.
People were increasing theirwealth.
It wasn't as crazy fast-pacedas it is now yeah, but people
(03:41):
had they could invest and byworking hard they would get
somewhere.
Yeah, okay, and now there's alittle bit of a belief that by
working hard you're going tohave to work extra hard to get
to the same place.
So the 90s are considered to bequite a good spot and I think
the information from this winery.
They said in 1978, was it MowatHennessy that went over there
(04:04):
to China and invested.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
I did read that.
So this is Silver Heights Winesis what we're going to be
tasting.
And yeah, what did they say?
So they started in the 70s.
The country opened up toforeign investment, so first
agreement signed was betweenLVMH and Remy Martin, and that's
early history of investmentfrom Bordeaux Houses, but it is
now owned by a family.
Speaker 2 (04:27):
Think about China and the vast landscape.
It covers everything from theGobi Desert right through to,
you know, subtropical, down atShenzhen and Guangzhou, and then
you've got the sort of drycontinentality in Sichuan and
then it's a little bit morecoastal.
It is a massive country.
(04:48):
There's got to be great terroirin there.
Speaker 1 (04:51):
I heard that like isn't around Helen Mountain and
stuff, don't they have vineyardsin like greenhouses?
Speaker 2 (04:57):
Well, in the Helen Mountains they do have to.
They mound snow over the vines.
Speaker 1 (05:05):
Maybe that's what it was.
There was something interesting.
Speaker 2 (05:07):
So during winter they mound the snow over the vines,
so the snow freezes, not thevine, even though the vine is in
dormancy.
That's why they do it, but itis super continental warm
summers.
Speaker 1 (05:20):
And, from what you've seen, is most Chinese wine that
you've tasted.
Is it more in the premium endor the more commercial end?
And or like, can you not?
Speaker 2 (05:31):
generalise Two things .
One and I'm talking about early2000s here and into the 2010s,
and that may not be true now.
I have not kept up with myChina law, but back in those
days you could import wine fromanywhere in the world and blend
it with Chinese wine, and aslong as there was 5% Chinese
wine in there, you could call itwine from China.
(05:53):
Surely that's not the case nowso many years ago, not so long
ago, when I was still living inChile in the 2000s, janis
Robinson said having done atasting of Chinese wine, it
amazes me how much it tasteslike Mipo Cabernet.
And I can tell you for a factthat we were exporting in bulk
container loads of barrel-agedhigh-core Mipo Cabernet from
(06:20):
Alto Mipo, so reallyhigh-quality Cabernet at back
then $18 a litre.
Oh my God, at back then $18 alitre in bulk 24,000 litres that
was going into a bottle thatweighed four kilos oh wow and
was sold at the premium end.
So yes, they tried topremiumise very early because
(06:43):
there's a lot about status andaspiration and face in the
Chinese culture.
I think now, because wine hasbecome more acceptable you're
seeing the young, cool thingsthere's more of these, what they
call bistros in China now.
So for aspirational living,it's what we would basically
call a restaurant.
(07:04):
So it has a wine list and ithas a single plate that you have
rather than share food.
So they have really good winelists and people want to buy
them.
The Chinese wine is sort ofslowly making its way there.
They're still very young, theywill get there.
They probably haven't eventapped the best place to grow
(07:24):
the grapes.
Speaker 1 (07:25):
Well, this one that we're looking at today, silver
heights wines.
They are definitely in thepremium spectrum.
So apparently, in jancisrobertson's 20 you know 2010s a
while ago, but still well, thatlist of wine, this was named.
This was the highest scoredchinese wine.
Um, this is all estate grownfruit and it's also
(07:47):
biodynamically and organicallygrown.
And this is interesting.
It says using Westernphilosophies but also Chinese
principles, so it looks likeWestern philosophies might be a
selling point.
Fungicides yeah, well, true.
Well, not yet true, because itis such a dry continental
(08:09):
climate.
Speaker 2 (08:10):
They can probably do organic and biodynamic yeah, so
the disease risk is much, muchlower.
Speaker 1 (08:16):
So, for context, the Chardonnay we're going to taste
is $89 and the red, which is aCab Sav, is $115.
Wow, so we have premium Chinesestuff here.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
It's a shame you didn't.
You should have held that backfrom me before I tasted the wine
.
Is it barrel fermented?
Speaker 1 (08:37):
It is so this 100% Chardonnay made in a Burgundy
style.
It is 100% new Burgundy oak foreight months.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
New Burgundy oak for eight months.
New Burgundy oak, the Bordeauxgraduated winemaker Emma Gow.
Elegant and artisanal winesthat perfectly reflect the
terroir of Ningxia, aged foreight months in new Burgundy oak
barrels.
Someone needs to help withtheir marketing.
So obviously, the Cooper isburgundian.
(09:09):
The chardonnay reserve shows abeautiful capital b green apple,
accompanied by plenty oftropical notes, packed of papaya
, banana and apricot, along witha creamy texture on the palate.
A fantastic wine.
Fantastic wine to be servedwith poor tray or to enjoy on
itself.
(09:29):
Okay, Some English would begood.
That's pretty delicious, meg,you're so mean I know it is yum,
but the thing is, if you'regoing at the premium end, go
premium.
I'm sorry.
Speaker 1 (09:40):
No, it's fair, that is yum, is it worth $89?
Speaker 2 (09:42):
No, could I mistake that for a Yarra Valley
Chardonnay?
Yes.
Speaker 1 (09:47):
Yeah, no, could I mistake that for a Yarra Valley
Chardonnay?
Yes, yeah, you could.
I think the oak is evident.
It's got this beautiful roundfinish which I absolutely adore,
and I actually think that youcan taste, I guess, the
premiumness through the oak.
Speaker 2 (09:59):
Yeah, there's quite a bit of minerality to it.
There is that green papayawhich I really like in it.
The acid's perfectly in balance.
The oak is really wellintegrated.
It is a delicious wine.
It is, but 90 bucks is astretch for me.
Speaker 1 (10:15):
What makes me think?
Speaker 2 (10:17):
Because you're in Burgundy territory there.
Speaker 1 (10:19):
I just, if you gave me this Chardonnay, I'd be like
this is delicious, it's amazing.
I might have called Margaretover.
Oh really, yeah, I think so,but the point being it's not
setting itself apart.
I don't know how it's meant to,but I mean, what do you want
from a Chinese wine?
Do you want it to look like ourwines?
(10:40):
I almost wish it was kind ofdifferent.
Speaker 2 (10:44):
Come on.
Chardonnay is an internationalgrape variety.
Chardonnay will speak oftenmore than where it's grown.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Yeah, okay.
Speaker 2 (10:51):
That's why it is a grape variety that is planted
throughout the world and, to behonest, we've got nothing to
reference it against.
Yeah, yeah.
So if I was doing the marketingon this, I would put it up
against other ChineseChardonnays.
It would be hard to we say.
I say that I don't really likecomparing wines in the Yarra
(11:12):
Valley to other wines of theworld because I want them to be
standalone.
It might still be very earlydays for Ningxia, but that is a
really solid, good quality wine.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
I think it's really delicious, and so maybe we got
the LVMH stuff wrong.
Maybe it was more the region wewere talking about, because
this winery was founded in 2007by Emma Gow and her father.
Speaker 2 (11:35):
Yeah, I think the LVMH stuff was the region yeah
okay, got you.
Speaker 1 (11:39):
So it's all indigenous yeast, minimal
filtration.
They are really using niceforward progressive winemaking
and I think it's a reallybeautiful expression of
Chardonnay.
Good on her, and I mean.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Emma, I've got one thing Heavy bottle Lightweight
bottle babe, and you're upagainst the taxes.
So you know this would not bethat expensive in China.
But again, aspirational, Don'taim high, Don't stuff around
Like.
That is a good wine.
It can only get better year onyear, that's delicious Yep.
I would buy it, but I'm notgoing to spend $90 on it.
Speaker 1 (12:17):
Yeah, fair, and if anyone, I mean they're in the
show notes but interestinglythere are a couple of places
that you can get this.
So if you Google Silver Heights, it's not anywhere that is like
a major retailer but there aresome smaller kind of bottle
shops and stuff that you can getit delivered from.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
Now we've got a Cabernet.
Is that correct?
It is a Cabernet.
Now, as I said, mark Robertsonmany years ago he's one of the
entrepreneurs at Treasury WineEstates said to me that Ningxia
makes great Cabernet.
Pete went over there a fewyears ago and did the Ningxia
(12:59):
Wine Challenge, where everyonewas given.
They brought in a whole heap ofwinemakers from around the
globe and given fruit off thesame block, theoretically, and
they all had to compete to makewine.
It's definitely continental, soone would argue that it's
better suited for Chardonnayjust going off absolute theory,
(13:20):
not having been there.
But Cabernet has a long hangtime.
So often in these continentalregions you have these long
autumns, so riesling might be abetter bet than chardonnay yeah,
that's interesting.
I wonder if it's less compatiblewith the chinese palette well,
my german reasoning's got yearand year bit sweetness, but it's
(13:42):
not as um, it's not as premium.
Speaker 1 (13:44):
Chardonnay.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Yeah, this smells so good.
I do want us to do an ultrapremium Riesling Chardonnay Mate
.
Don't even talk me into that.
Yeah, because we often drinkaround that $35 and say how
great it delivers at that point.
But let's have a look at it 80and over.
Well, I think we'll go all overthe world, okay.
Speaker 1 (14:03):
Deal.
Speaker 2 (14:06):
How good does that smell?
It smells like Cabernet.
I'm a bit worried that it's.
Is that just frost in my glass?
Oh, it's not crystals, it's allgood.
Speaker 1 (14:14):
No.
Speaker 2 (14:22):
That's pretty good.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
It tastes aged.
It's a 2021.
We're in 2025.
Yeah, four years.
Speaker 2 (14:32):
It is starting to develop a tertiary touch, so
it's 100% Cabernet Sauvignon 12months in, 50% new French oak
and 50% in neutral oak.
Speaker 1 (14:39):
It's got really nice tannins as well.
They're nice and soft for a cab.
Yeah, yeah, it's got a wee bitof herbal note not herbaceous,
not underripe, but that herbalnote which you know I love
because it's kind of Yarra.
Speaker 2 (14:54):
Valley-esque.
We have that, so I have tojustify it everywhere.
For me, there's a slight littlebit of bitterness at the back,
but again, this is a seriouswine that needs food.
This is not something thatyou're just going to be drinking
on its own, so that bitternessis going to support beautiful
Wagyu beef high-end steaks.
Speaker 1 (15:10):
Okay, here I love this in their tasting notes.
So they kind of lead withWestern.
So they're saying coca, toastand nutmeg, but then they've
gone, complemented by, andthey've thrown in some of their
clearly more local tasting, likewhat they taste in the wine,
which is shiso, leaf, shiitakeand Prua tea savoriness.
Speaker 2 (15:31):
Oh, wow, that's really lovely, I guess.
Speaker 1 (15:33):
The shiitake, yeah, yeah, absolutely More of the
dried shiitake mushrooms and Itotally I don't know what Prua
tea is, but I smell a tea.
Now that they say it, I'm likethere's a tea there.
Speaker 2 (15:44):
And the t bit black tea-y as well.
Speaker 1 (15:47):
This is a bit more interesting to me.
The Chardonnay was clearlypremium, clearly really good,
but not clearly Chinese.
There's something differentenough about this Cabernet that.
I think, if so, when we do wineshows, everyone brings a bottle
, right, and it's the mostfreaking stressful thing in the
world that there's all thesejudges and you've got to bring a
bottle of wine and be like.
(16:07):
Here's what I, you know likefor a dinner, when a bottle of
wine and be like.
Here's what I, you know, likefor dinner, when you have a
dinner the night before.
Yeah, everyone brings the mostbeautiful, amazing stuff and I'm
always like, oh, my God, I hatethat.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
I have to bring something.
You bring a magnum of Marsanfrom Tbil.
Speaker 1 (16:24):
No, that's when you go, I don't know.
I think Chinese wine.
If you rip down a Chinese wine,that's when you go really odd
around the $35 mark.
Speaker 2 (16:31):
You find the oddest wine and just say, oh look, this
wasn't very expensive, but it'ssuper interesting and no one
would have bought it.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
That's true, that's what I do, but I mean if you're
part of a wine club or if thereis, Because they're all just
putting their dicks on the table.
It's a big dick measuringcompetition, yeah, club.
Or if you're part of somethingwhere you do kind of want to
bring something different.
I feel like putting a Chinesewine on the table is going to
get you a bit of kudos.
Speaker 2 (16:59):
As I said, there is a shop in Melbourne that is
selling quite a few Chinesewines and they start at around
the $35 mark.
Speaker 1 (17:03):
I can't find anything cheaper.
Cardwell Cellars yes, is thatit?
Yeah, so.
Speaker 2 (17:07):
I think we should do an episode, but these are you
know $180.
$115.
Okay, bargain.
Speaker 1 (17:19):
No, it's a lot of money.
Yeah, look, it's a lot of money.
It is but rarity.
Speaker 2 (17:24):
we don't know how much they produce, but it's very
good wine.
Speaker 1 (17:30):
Yeah, so that is it for Chinese Wine.
Maybe we'll come back withanother episode and explore it a
bit further, but until then,enjoy your next glass of wine.
Drink well Sweaty, and we'redone.
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