Are You Afraid To Die? Guest Rob of "Obsessed with Death" Podcast

In this Crossover episode,Kendel & Rachel welcome Rob from Obsessed with Death Podcast where he shares his unique take on society’s discomfort with death, the emotional complexities of grief, and the surprising role of humor. The conversation explores true crime fascination, funeral planning, and how to support loved ones without “fixing” their pain.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Are you obsessed with death?

(00:01):
Does hearing the word death make you squirm
or spark anxiety?
In this special crossover episode,
we team up with Rob,
host of the Obsessed with Death podcast
to tackle the ultimate taboo
and explore how we can normalize
the conversation surrounding death.
Let's get comfortable with the uncomfortable.
Hello, Rob.

(00:37):
Hi.
Hi. Rob, do you mind introducing yourself
to our listeners so they get a hint of who you are?
Yeah, I would love to.
My name is Rob and I host a podcast
called Obsessed with Death.
And I have a mildly unhealthy obsession with death.

(00:57):
I think about it entirely way too much.
I make my friends and my family uncomfortable
with questions and conversations
that are death related,
probably more than you're supposed to.
And so I started a podcast so that I could talk
to other people who I assumed
would be more comfortable talking about death.
And to give myself an outlet to talk about death

(01:21):
in what I guess is technically the appropriate environment
to discuss it, a podcast about death.
So yeah, I'm excited to be here.
Thanks for having me.
Yeah, Rob made us all best friends by reaching out
and then invited, basically proposed,
we're gonna do a, what do you call this?

(01:43):
We're new to this.
What do you call this?
Oh, yeah, it's a crossover episode.
So I had both of you on my podcast.
And yeah, I basically forced you both to be my friend
and have me on your podcast.
So here we are.
Yeah, and it worked out because here we are.
It all worked out.
You also, I think by making a podcast about death,

(02:03):
it's the most normal way you can go about it.
Like once it's a podcast, we're like, oh, that's cool.
You're doing like this cool thing.
Yeah, it's better than like trying to talk to strangers
in the parking lot or something about, you know,
when they think they're gonna die or, you know,
when the last time they went to a funeral was.
People aren't usually into that.

(02:24):
There definitely would be like a documentary
that would come out or I'd watch,
I find like a TikTok video,
like there's this guy in a parking lot
that's asking about death.
Like watch out for this guy.
He's in a white van.
I don't know why I have to be the creepy guy in the van, but.
You were in a parking lot.
Yeah, yeah.

(02:44):
I mean, maybe I need to start a TikTok series
where I just run up to strangers and ask them, you know,
how they feel about dying.
Get really honest answers that way.
Yeah.
I mean, I have no motivation to ever do anything like that.
If somebody, have you ever been in public?
I'm just taking over your podcast now.
Have you ever been in public?

(03:05):
Like when you watch TikToks,
there's like people that like go up to strangers
at like the grocery store.
Has that ever actually happened to either of you
where like somebody's like,
can I make a TikTok with you?
For me, no, but I feel like the old school version
was just like a camera in your face
for like random documentaries type of thing,
which was like before.

(03:25):
Did that happen to you?
Oh, okay.
That has happened.
I'm sure there's like a documentary
where they asked me like a weird history fact.
And of course, like once the camera's in your face,
like you don't know anything.
You can't think of anything.
I don't know my name.
I don't know what day it is.
I don't know anything.
So I kind of try to get out of that
as quickly as possible.

(03:46):
But yeah, that's happened to me,
but not any of the like actual TikToks now.
But there's probably my face
in like a random documentary somewhere.
I had like five 20 year old young men ask
if they could sing for me in the middle of an aisle
at Target like six months ago.
I said, sure, that would be fine.

(04:07):
But then they were like, oh, but you have to pay us.
And I was like, I'm not gonna pay
young boys money in a Target grocery store aisle
for anything, so I'm gonna leave.
But that's your accountant.
Yeah, but very strange.
Anyway.
A unique experience.
Yeah, the internet's weird.
That's why I brought that up
because that's why I don't wanna be that person

(04:28):
who goes in a parking lot.
You could cut all of this, it doesn't matter.
Why?
I'm just rambling.
Sorry.
Turning into a whole other episode.
This is a whole different podcast now.
This is how to get arrested.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
This is how to end up on a watch list.
Yeah.

(04:48):
A bonus episode.
Tips to get arrested.
Yeah.
Well, to circle back to the original next question
was what exactly made you obsessed with death?
You told us why, like you're so obsessed with it,
X, Y, Z what you do with it.
But like what inspired this?

(05:08):
I've never heard someone say that.
Mental illness, I think.
I don't know.
I remember exactly where I was
the moment I realized I was gonna die one day.
And I could still like picture the entire moment
it happened.
And I've never really been able to like escape it after that.

(05:31):
Like it's just something that has sort of consumed me
ever since the moment I realized that I'm gonna die
and everybody else is also going to die.
And it just sort of just gradually became more
of an obsession.
I mean, I don't know, obsession might not be the best word.
It was just a good title.

(05:51):
It kind of fit for a podcast.
I don't know if I'm necessarily obsessed with death,
but it does come across my mind
probably more than most people.
I think about it probably more than most people.
And I'm oddly comfortable talking about it
more than most people.
And I have no idea why.
I think it's just because it's this really scary thing
and I have anxiety and death is terrifying.

(06:14):
So it's one of the many things
I think about probably too much.
But yeah, I mean, I don't know.
It's just like, it's always been
not even in the back of my mind,
just like right in the middle of my mind.
I think about it multiple times every day.
Whether it's like I get a weird pain in my chest

(06:36):
and I'm like, this is it, I'm gonna die.
Or this is uncomfortable to talk about
or it may be embarrassing to admit.
But there was a period where I was probably
going to the emergency room
in an uncomfortable amount for an adult.
Like anything, any weird thing,
I was like, I'm dying.
And I would just go to the hospital.

(06:58):
I never was like on a first name basis
with like a doctor or anything,
but I was even realizing like, this is too much.
You're going to the emergency room way too often.
And you gotta stop assuming you're gonna die all the time.
So it was bad for a while, but shout out therapy.
Been going to therapy since 2020 and that has helped a ton.

(07:19):
And so is the podcast.
The podcast helps tremendously.
But yeah, I don't know if I could pinpoint
exactly what it is besides the fact that dying is terrifying.
And for whatever reason, the way my brain works,
I hyper-focus on the fact that this is all gonna end
and I don't want it to.
And for whatever reason, I think if I constantly
think and talk about it, it won't happen.

(07:41):
So.
I don't think like this is unusual.
I think there's a lot of people out there
that have the same, I don't want to say fear,
but have the same anxiety around death
and that it's just such an uncertainty for everybody.
But I think there's a lot of people
that don't want to admit that they're scared of it,
but like that's probably a consistent thought.
I mean, I think about it a lot.

(08:01):
I know my own family thinks about it a lot
and also has fears about their health.
And I want to touch a little bit on the thoughts
that cost your mind when you first realize
like you're gonna die.
Cause I learned that as a young child,
I think my grandma had passed
and that was the first time my parents had a conversation
with me about like you leave and you're never coming back.

(08:24):
And I wish I could capture what I must have thought
at the time, but I don't have that.
I wish I could like recollect on what that thought was.
Yeah, I mean, I would have loved my parents
to have sat me down and been like, you're gonna die.
I probably would have maybe not have been this obsessed
with it or thought about it that much
if somebody would have at some point,

(08:44):
cause it was just all me in my own head,
realizing it and then thinking about it.
I mean, I went to a funeral when I was very young,
like maybe not eight or nine years old.
I went to an open casket funeral for my great grandmother.
And looking back, I had no idea what was going on.
I didn't know I was at a funeral.
I didn't know she was dead.

(09:05):
I was just like in a room full of people
and there's this lady I met like six months ago.
And now she's, I don't know, napping in front of everybody.
Like I had no idea.
And me- Was that how it was told to you?
Like, oh, she's just sleeping.
I mean, to be fair, I don't really remember.
And I'm sure if I asked my parents,
they wouldn't remember how they handled it either.
Right.

(09:26):
I mean, it was much later in life
until I realized I was gonna die.
Like I didn't have that, the epiphany of,
you're gonna die one day after an open casket funeral.
It took so many years later.
So I think that having somebody sit you down
at a young age and tell you that you're gonna die one day

(09:48):
is probably a good thing.
It's just, I don't know,
the way you approach it is important, I would assume.
Yeah, I think all the time is I'm not a parent.
How do you even start that conversation with your kid?
Like I'm gonna die someday, you're gonna die someday.
If you ever have kids, they're gonna die someday.
Like that's such a heavy reality to put on a kid.

(10:10):
But I think I was like maybe five or six
when that happened for me.
And like I, for a while I think was like,
what do you mean?
I don't live forever.
Are you kidding?
Well, and then I don't know how deep you guys get into it
on the podcast, but I think a lot of people use religion
as a way to maybe ease the pain a little bit.

(10:31):
They're like, oh, well, you're gonna die one day,
but then you'll just go to this magical place
where grandma and grandpa and Scooter the dog
and everyone is gonna be hanging out again.
So like, it really doesn't matter.
Yeah, you're gonna die,
but then it's just gonna be like the same thing again,
just somewhere else.
So, and look, if that's what you believe, I'm jealous.
I wish I had that comfort.

(10:52):
Yeah, I agree.
I'm jealous you people who can have that hope
and faith in something.
But same thing when you watch people die
or you're around people who are dying,
it is very hard to hold onto that hope and faith
when you're watching people suffer
or when terrible accidents happen.

(11:14):
Rachel and I talk a lot,
like our experiences around death and loss
involve like medical issues and healthcare
and sudden decline from being healthy to being ill.
Whereas like, I can't,
and Rachel and I talk about this quite a bit
on we haven't lost people in like car accidents

(11:35):
or we haven't lost children.
And these are very different experiences
around death and loss.
And you know, like knock on wood,
we hope we don't experience this again.
But that's a reality for so many people
and that the way people lose people
or the person in your life that's lost,
like that adds so much context to the death itself.

(11:56):
Yeah, I mean, I interviewed this guy on my podcast,
Colin Campbell, and he wrote a book called,
"'Finding the Words'."
And it's about how him and his wife
were driving with their two children
and they were hit by a drunk driver
and both of his kids died.
And it was just, now it's just him and his wife
trying to live the rest of their lives.

(12:16):
And like I said, he wrote this incredible book.
I mean, it's kind of hard to read at times
and then even interviewing him.
I mean, we're doing a podcast about the book
that he wrote about his dead children.
And I was still like almost uncomfortable
just to talk to him about it.
It's so difficult.
And of course he was, he made it so easy

(12:38):
and he's this incredible person.
Like having a conversation with him is like life-changing.
I don't know how you keep going after that,
but to like meet somebody who like could find a way
to handle that is incredible.
But yeah, I mean, there are people that obviously,
I mean, there was, I saw something online not that long ago
where this guy was being interviewed and he's like,

(12:59):
"'Oh yeah, I got a phone call.'
And they told me that my wife and my son and my brother,
they all died in a car accident at the same time.
It was like, how do you even,
how do you keep functioning after that?'
Yeah.
I don't know.
I don't either.
I'd disappear going to the park.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, I mean, you really, you have to be a strong person

(13:21):
I think and have strong people around you.
But.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Death is something that you should probably tell
your children as soon as they, you know,
they're able to comprehend it.
But just like do it in a fun way.
Like take them to the park and find a dead animal.
And just kidding, sorry.
Go ahead.
This is the start of like serial killer type.

(13:44):
You're going to find your kid with a bunch of like
dead animals.
Like you said, this is about death.
Rob just started a way for like kids to learn
to be serial killers from a young age.
Yeah.
Look, do you want your kid to be normal or not?
Pick one.
Do you want to do the next Dexter?
And I think this like goes easily into like the next thing

(14:05):
that Rachel and I wanted to talk about is trying to
normalize the conversation around grief and death.
And obviously you have a whole podcast dedicated to
talking about death.
And we wanted to know like,
why do you think it is important to be talking about death
more either culturally or in a societal sense?

(14:26):
And how comfortable are people feeling about talking
about death?
Yeah. I mean, I think it's very, very important.
I was speaking to somebody today of just a few hours ago,
who is a hospice nurse.
And all she would talk about was basically having to

(14:47):
meet with these families of the people that are,
you know, dealing with this person in hospice.
And it was like,
she would have these conversations with them.
And it was like, they, it's like,
none of them ever thought or were talked to about death
before.
And it was clearly so difficult for them.
So yeah, I don't know.
I think obviously it's an uncomfortable thing.

(15:07):
Nobody wants to die.
It's scary.
There's, it's like the whole unknown of it.
But I think, I don't know, people,
it's so easy.
It's like this thing that we put people in hospitals
and they're like,
so you keep all of the death stuff in a building
far away from everybody, right?
Like, I don't know.

(15:27):
I think that anything scary,
nobody wants to talk about,
or you're gonna push it off until you have to,
until somebody dies and then you have to talk about it.
I mean, I'm in this odd situation where for whatever reason,

(15:48):
my brain puts it in a way that I wanna talk about it.
And I don't know what that is.
Maybe if more people were as awkward and uncomfortable as me
and forceful in death conversations,
death wouldn't be so scary.
And I think that's the main thing, right?
It's like, I don't want to be scared of this thing.
And I think, I don't know if you've ever had
a panic attack before,

(16:08):
but when you have a panic attack,
for whatever reason, one of the best ways
to stop a panic attack is to acknowledge it
and be like, all right, I'm having a panic attack.
And that's what's happening.
And I'm gonna be okay.
I've had them before, I was okay.
I'm gonna be okay now.
So it's like, for whatever reason, that helps.
Or just telling somebody that you're having a panic attack.
Just talking about it helps, talking helps.

(16:30):
So I think people don't wanna talk about it
because it is so uncomfortable and scary,
but I think we'd all be so much better off.
I mentioned this to the both of you on my podcast.
It was like, I've had some friends die recently
in the past couple of years.
And for whatever reason, I felt way more prepared
and way more comfortable with the entire situation

(16:50):
because I've been having these conversations for so long.
We also talked a little bit in your podcast,
people are so comfortable talking about true crime
and they'll talk about death.
If it's like salacious and juicy and everything,
even though it's someone's real life,
they'll talk about it.
But as soon as it's personal and it's like,
oh, I've lost somebody or you lost somebody,

(17:12):
all of a sudden it gets really awkward,
which I feel like it's an interesting thing.
You can talk about it, but not when there's actual
your feelings involved and anything personal.
It has to be very impersonal
and people feel comfortable talking about death,
which I think is the hard part.
It's like, it's so personal when you lose somebody,
you need people to be able to talk to you about it.
You need to be able to express how sad it is,

(17:35):
how hard it is, all the things.
People don't wanna talk to them about it.
People don't wanna reach out about it
because they feel awkward.
But it's like, you hear some juicy news story,
everyone will talk to you about that.
And that's just a weird, I don't know,
it's a weird thing in society.
Yeah, it is odd how comfortable people are
about talking about mass murder.

(17:58):
But when their grandma dies,
they have to quit their job.
They're in bed for two weeks and it's this hard thing.
Obviously, they're much closer to their grandma
than they are to the stranger who got murdered on television.
But yeah, I think this fascination with true crime
is probably not helping people be as prepared
as they should be for loss in their own life.

(18:20):
It just seems like this pretend thing on television
and everyone's gonna live till they're 90
and nothing bad's ever gonna happen to you.
And it's unfortunate, but people sort of have to,
I guess, learn the hard way that life is a cruel bitch.
I think media is also kind of making people desensitize.

(18:41):
Even with that CEO that got shot,
I get healthcare is absolute shit
and there needs so much to be improved.
But my first thought wasn't happy.
A lot of the comments, I was personally shocked,
all the comments were basically for him being killed,

(19:03):
which to me, I was just like-
Oh yeah, it was the party emoji,
just non-stop everywhere you look.
And people don't know him, people don't know
if he has family, if he has kids.
They don't know anything.
I don't know.
I've never looked him up to know what his really is.
Oh yeah, he's got a wife and kids, yeah.

(19:24):
I just can't imagine as the wife or the kids
seeing your dad's death, one, all over the news.
You can see the video of him actually getting shot.
And then two, people are celebrating it
and no one has empathy for that.
Because his wife and kids are just his family
that are experiencing a crazy loss, a shocking loss,

(19:47):
and no one has empathy for it.
And I get why there's so much corruption
in all these things, but maybe because I've lost people,
I would just never, that would never be my first thought
is like, oh cool, I'm glad someone did that.
And I don't know if people, if that's the real feelings
or just the desensitized people, I'm not sure.

(20:10):
But to me, it was alarming.
And I feel like that's not a great turn for society.
But I don't know.
To me, that was just a weird thing.
Because if that happened to me,
that would just make it so much harder.
And losing somebody already is just so fucking hard.
And then that, I just can't even imagine that whole thing.

(20:31):
Yeah, I mean, I try not to judge humanity on Twitter,
because I don't feel like it's the best gauge.
I think if you took a person and you asked them
their reaction to a handful of things,
and then they gave you their response,
and then you looked at their Twitter feed,
some of them would probably be different.
And being able to hide behind the internet

(20:52):
makes it a little bit easier to celebrate someone's death.
But yeah, for sure.
I think humanity is going in an odd direction
when most of the people on the internet
are high-fiving each other because some dude got killed.
I think the internet's terrifying.
It really is.

(21:12):
Yeah.
Yeah, and the conflation between
someone's public death on the streets
versus real people's issues with the healthcare system.
I think everyone agrees they've had horrible experiences
somewhere with their own insurance.
But those are, I feel like, two separate incidences

(21:34):
that we've now combined into one
very public-defining event for 2024.
It is very, very interesting.
And it's kind of like this weird pop culture moment,
because the kid was just quite an interesting person
within himself.

(21:54):
And it's also just like, everyone's like,
this is gonna be a Ryan Murphy movie.
And it's just because more details keep coming out.
But yeah, there's just true crime morbidity about it,
where we're all just like,
it's like a train wreck, you can't stop watching.
Yeah, I think part of it too is a lot of people
can relate to losing somebody
because of a denial from health insurance.

(22:16):
So it's like they lost somebody.
And now this guy who could potentially
have been responsible for them losing somebody
is now losing his life for one in the same.
So there is this weird celebratory act to it
with certain people, I guess.
But still, it's like, I don't know,

(22:37):
somebody kills your mom in a car accident.
And I guarantee you, you're gonna feel way better
if you forgive that person
than if you just hold a grudge the rest of your life.
And if you're gonna sit there
and celebrate somebody getting shot in the street,
there's probably some other things going on in your life
that are probably not so great either.

(22:59):
I can't imagine you're gonna find someone
who's healthy and happy and has a rich and successful life,
who's also on Twitter going,
God, I can't wait for them to shoot somebody else tomorrow.
You know, I don't know.
It's a certain type of person.
It is unfortunate, but we live in a weird time for sure.
Yeah, absolutely.
I'm gonna quote the great Taylor Swift though,
when she said, you don't have to forgive them.

(23:21):
You can forget them without forgiving them and move on.
Because if someone had killed my mom in a car accident,
I would probably go hunt them down.
I'm not forgiving you.
I'm sorry.
That's not who I am.
I can't.
My mom's already gone, so now if someone hurts me,
I just always think like, I'm gonna send my dad, my mom,

(23:41):
and my sister ghosts to haunt the shit out of you.
Like that makes me feel better and I want that energy.
So like if someone attacked my mom in a car,
I'd probably go punch him in the face.
Actually, I have a really good elbow.
Cause I do Muay Thai sometimes
and I feel like my elbow is really gray
and I haven't used it in a real life situation,

(24:01):
but that's where I would wanna use it.
Like she's waiting.
Yeah, I do it.
I guess it just depends on the situation.
If it was an accident,
if they accidentally killed your mom in a car crash,
are we still giving them the elbow to the face?
Even if it was an accidental thing.
I would give three elbows.
If it was a guy, I'd also do a knee.

(24:22):
Like a few knees.
Got it.
What if you accidentally killed somebody in a car accident?
You would expect the same?
You would wanna get an elbow to the face?
I would accept it.
Okay.
If I did that, if I killed someone,
I mean, if I did that, I would feel like absolute shit
to begin with.
So then getting an elbow to the face

(24:44):
would probably make it just that much worse
because you're already feel bad.
Yeah, I'd be like, whatever.
Like I did that.
Like I don't even know how that would handle that.
But back to the topic at hand,
we were just curious of like,
what is the most interesting story or fact
you've learned about death from doing?
I think you said you've been doing your podcast

(25:04):
for five years now, right?
What has stuck with you?
Either positive or dark negative.
Oh man, that is a good question.
But I would say probably one of my favorite episodes
and something that really stuck with me,
there is this neuroscientist,
her name is Mary Frances O'Connor,

(25:24):
and she studies people's brains while they're grieving.
And I just think grief is just such an interesting thing
because it's just constant.
It never goes away.
You're never gonna just stop grieving
over losing somebody.
And the fact that she decided that she wanted to

(25:44):
spend her life studying the brain
and studying people that are grieving,
I just think it's an incredible way to focus your time.
One of the things I remember bringing up to her was like,
how do you just like go out and enjoy a Friday night
after you just spent the whole day with people
that are just starting to grieve?

(26:05):
I mean, all she's doing is just talking to people
who have just lost somebody incredibly close to them,
and then they leave and she's supposed to just like skip home.
Like she's just putting so much heaviness on herself
every day for science,
just to be able to learn more about the brain,
which is something we don't even know that much about.

(26:25):
So I don't know, I think the main thing I've gotten
out of the podcast is meeting people
who are dedicating their life personally or professionally
to making death an easier thing to deal with,
making death a little less scary.
And whether that's the fear of grief

(26:45):
and the fear of being concerned about,
am I gonna feel this bad all the time forever?
Or, you know, finding different ways to grieve
or fighting ways to heal and whatever it is.
The one thing I remember from that episode, two things.
One thing, she did recommend drinking alcohol
for breakfast the day after someone dies.

(27:07):
She said that that was okay.
Her professional opinion was it's okay to have
an alcoholic beverage for breakfast
the day after you lose someone.
So I told her that I will be doing that
in all future endeavors in my life.
And if anyone asks why, I will blame it on her.
But also she compared losing someone to losing a limb,
which I just thought was so interesting

(27:29):
in the sense of like how the brain works.
And, you know, some people I think grieve harder than others
and it's harder, some people take a loss harder than others.
And everybody's different, but the brain is just
this weird, complex, terrifying, strong thing
that we're all stuck with.
And what she said basically was when people lose a limb,

(27:49):
eventually they start to feel that limb again.
You know, if they lose half their arm,
you know, maybe a year from now,
they start to feel like they have a full arm again.
And that's their brain solving this problem.
The problem being they lost half their arm.
The brain can't grow your arm back,
but it'll just trick you into thinking it's there.
With death, it's the same thing, but it can't do that.

(28:12):
You lose somebody, they're gone forever.
The brain is trying to solve that problem now,
which is grief, but there's nothing it could do.
It can't bring that person back.
So grief is forever because the brain is constantly
trying to solve a problem it cannot solve.
So I don't know, I just, that gave me comfort
in like being sad or maybe being hard on myself

(28:34):
for being sad for too long or in certain situations
or, you know, reacting a certain way
because of a thing that happened and oh,
I'm having a bad day.
It's, you know, the anniversary of a friend I lost
or whatever it is.
So stuff like that really sticks with me.
And really it just, the main thing about the podcast
is just like, it just reminds me of how important

(28:57):
like community is and how important it is to connect
with other people and have genuine conversations
for more than like five minutes, you know?
It's so nice to talk to somebody for an hour.
It's so nice to not look at your phone for an hour
and just like talk to another person.
And, you know, if that's the only way
I'm gonna really get it, then I'll do the podcast forever

(29:18):
just so that I can talk to people, you know?
I know between like Rachel and I,
and along with so many other of the friends
that we've made in this space and other friends
who are grieving, I think we all feel the same of like,
I can talk about the things that I felt I couldn't talk
about with people who are not grieving
or people who haven't lost somebody.

(29:38):
Rachel and I are in the same support group
and it's funny that one person will bring up like a thought
that crosses their mind that they think no one else
will understand or that people will think they're weird.
And then everybody else in their group is like,
no, I've had this same thought.
I have felt the same way.
I have felt guilty about feeling happy
after the loss of somebody.

(29:59):
And everyone's like, yeah, me too.
I felt that, like I feel really bad when I feel happy.
And it's weird that you can have these like connections
with people that we all have these like weird thoughts
that cross our mind about death and loss.
And then we're like, oh, you have it too?
Oh, I'm not as like weird as I thought I was.
I think that like leads really well into another question
that Rachel and I were wondering about was,

(30:20):
how can our listeners feel more comfortable
about having conversations around death
or finding ways to maybe make it less taboo in their lives?
Cause I think right now,
whenever you bring up like a personal loss,
they treat you like a fragile little egg.
Like they're scared to bring up a loss about
or someone you're grieving about.

(30:41):
And they're like, I don't wanna hurt your feelings,
but they don't know that this helps.
Yeah.
Yeah, I think making a joke helps, right?
Like if they could see that you like,
you could laugh about it a little bit,
I think that helps a little, at least for me.
And you know, with like the friends that I've lost

(31:03):
in the past couple of years,
I'm really lucky in the sense that whenever I do bring it up,
it's usually with other people who also knew them.
And so they're also sort of grieving and like they get it.
I think it's harder with a parent probably
because they're not your parents, you know?
So it's like, it's harder to navigate that stuff.
But I think making a joke might loosen them up a little bit

(31:24):
or realize that it's not so serious.
Like you can just have a conversation about it,
or you're just like, ah,
this thing just reminded me of them.
It's tough.
It really is so hard to navigate that stuff.
And it's why I think, you know,
these groups that you go to and that other people go to,
there's so much value in that because you do get that space.
I think it helps as you get older too, right?

(31:46):
Because the older you get,
the more everybody around you has probably also lost somebody
at that point.
You know, when you're younger,
it's probably harder to talk to your friends about grief
because they most likely haven't really experienced it.
And you know, you can't really fault them for that.
They've never been through this thing
that you're going through and it's hard.

(32:08):
I don't know.
For me, whenever I have like a friend,
whether it's about death or not,
if they're going through something
and they wanna talk about a thing,
I usually always go to them and just say one of two things,
whether do you want me to listen
or do you want me to help you solve the problem?
Which one is it?
Cause I'll just listen.
I'll sit here and I'll listen and you could talk.

(32:30):
And if I have to respond, I'll respond.
But if you just wanna talk, I'll just listen.
But if you wanna talk and also try and fix
whatever is going on, whether you feel like you're stuck
and you know, the grief is too hard
and you know, you're isolating too much or whatever it is,
then we could solve that problem.
So I think that might help too.

(32:52):
If you see a friend who's like struggling
to talk about something, maybe give them some options
and break it down a little bit
and let them know that you're willing to do
whatever version of this conversation
that it is that they want, you know?
So I don't know.
I think that helps.
That's very true.
I think losing somebody is a very humbling experience
because you can be like a very strong person,

(33:15):
a very independent person, a very like proactive person
and then you lose someone that's important
and then your whole life is off kilter.
And then everything that you're working towards,
like it doesn't matter anymore.
And like trying to find direction again
or purpose is really hard.
I was definitely someone that was like a planner
for everything.
And then it's like, everyone died.
And you're like, okay, well, how I thought my life

(33:36):
was gonna turn out is completely different.
Like I thought I'd be married with kids right now
and I wanna have a dog and I'm single with a dog.
And I am happy with that life,
but it's also like not at all what I was picturing
how my life was gonna be.
Definitely not without my parents or my sister around.
And it's something that like,

(33:57):
it is really hard to try to figure out like
how to stand on my own two feet
and how to figure out like what makes sense
when like everything I had thought of and imagined
and planned is just completely destroyed.
And like that I think is like the really hard part.
And it's like, when people don't talk about it,
it's a really weird thing.
Cause it's like my whole life changed.
Everything's changed.

(34:18):
I miss them all the time, especially during December,
but all the time, like that feeling's always present.
And like they're not here for everyday things.
It's like, I wanna call my sister to just like complain
and I can't do that.
And so it's weird when people act like
they can't bring it up.
It's like, it's always on my brain.
It's always in there.
So like you not talking about it is a weird thing

(34:41):
because we talk about your sisters
or we talk about your parents,
but we don't ever talk about mine or that experience
anywhere just cause they're gone.
And that's why I thought like,
oh, this would be a cool conversation
because people just need to be more comfortable
about bringing it up.
And even if it's like a swing and a miss,
like the way that you brought it up is not correct
or like, is it received well?
Like just try again, just keep trying to bring it up.

(35:03):
Maybe not, it won't be like perfect,
but there's no like really a perfect way to do it.
But like you said, allowing space for that,
I think is so important
because people act like it's this weird thing
and it's like, it's just what happened to me.
Like I didn't ask for it.
I don't want it.
If I could turn a switch and switch my situation,
I would do that.
Like that a hundred percent.

(35:25):
So I think it's a weird thing.
And I think people need to just be comfortable
to just be like, how are you doing with it?
Or like, oh, I know you did this with your sister.
Like she still exists in my head.
I still dream about her.
You know, I talked to her sometimes.
I read her letters, like all that stuff.
We're hoping like, if we talk about it more,
hopefully it makes people feel like, okay,

(35:45):
I can bring it up or I can make it a big deal
that no one in my life brings it up
because I think that's pretty shitty.
Yeah, it's so tough.
Like, I mean, so one of my friends that I lost,
I'm also very close with her brother.
He's a very good friend of mine.
He's also somebody I've known for 20 plus years.
So she died on November 26.
So like there was an anniversary recently, right?

(36:07):
And I still struggled with like, how do I,
like all I do is just send him a text, right?
And I just go, hey buddy, I'm thinking about you today.
If you need to talk, call me, you know, whatever you need.
Like I'm thinking about you.
And that's usually the text that I'm assuming
I'm going to send him for the rest of his life
and for mine too, right?
It's just like, hey, I know today sucks.

(36:29):
Here's a quick reminder that I'm thinking about you
and that I'm here for you.
And I think that that's really enough, right?
It's like, if he wants more,
I'm giving him the opening to call me or tell me, you know,
hey, let's go get lunch or whatever.
You know, I think that you don't have to be
like this superhero of a friend

(36:51):
and show up at their house on like death anniversaries
or whatever.
It's more of just letting people, at least for me,
just knowing that people are thinking about me
and that if I do need them,
that they are making themselves available.
That's really all I need.
And I think that's what a lot of people need

(37:12):
and it'll keep getting easier.
Just acknowledging stuff is just as powerful and helpful
as sitting there and listening to them for an hour, you know?
I found that like after my dad's passing
and I tried to separate my life into my grief life

(37:32):
and then my friend life and then my work life,
I was definitely fractured in all these little portions.
And I don't think ever in the past few years
after my dad's passing that I felt aligned.
And I didn't realize how unaligned I was until this year
when I started being more confident in this grief space

(37:53):
and talking about it with Rachel and exploring these feelings
and exploring all these different topics.
Rachel and I, I didn't even know existed a year ago.
And then Rachel and I have been sharing and talking
and meeting new people.
And I feel the most aligned I've ever been, I think,
because I've leaned into that grief side of me
and embraced it.
And I was like, this feels whole because in some sense,

(38:15):
I'm not hiding the love that I had for my dad in the corner
and trying not to express emotion around that.
I'm now like, I don't wanna say like living that proudly
because that sounds so weird,
but like that grief has changed me
and I'm embracing that change that has happened
and hoping that like something good comes of it.

(38:38):
I mean, good things have already come from it,
considering it really sucks.
Like these are bad situations,
but I think that's what Rachel and I try to do is like,
this sucks, like bad things happen to you
that you don't ask for,
but you still deserve like a beautiful life
and you deserve happy moments.
And how do you bring all that back
and while still acknowledging like, yeah, your grief sucks

(39:00):
and it's gonna hurt forever
and trying to align with that grief again.
I just wanted to mention something
from what you just said, Kendall,
which I thought was really interesting
is you talked about confidence, right?
And it's like, it's so interesting to equate confidence
to like talking about your grief.
Like you shouldn't have to like build up your confidence

(39:21):
to just like talk about a person that you lost in your life,
but that's sort of like where we are, unfortunately,
where you feel like you need to like pump yourself up
and like give yourself a speech in the mirror
before you go out there and talk to somebody
or mention your dad or whoever it is.
And I think that all sort of goes back to this theme

(39:43):
of like why we should be talking about death more
and why it shouldn't be so uncomfortable to talk about
because there's people who are like struggling
to even be confident enough to bring it up to their friends.
And that's crazy.
You should be more than confident enough
or comfortable enough to talk about your dad

(40:03):
and how you miss him or whatever it is.
So I think conversations like this are important
for people that are listening that are, you know,
on the other side of that conversation
that are there for their friends who are grieving,
where it's like, yes, some people really have
to like force themselves to talk about it.
And I want to live in a world

(40:26):
where you don't feel uncomfortable talking about,
you know, somebody that was one of the biggest parts
of your life is gone now, you know?
I think part of it is also the fear of people
not responding in a way that is kind or helpful.
And I've learned, you know, you don't really know me
unless you know all of my grief and my loss

(40:48):
because that's such a huge part of me.
But it's weird, I mean, like you're meeting new people now.
It's like before people would know, like, okay, they knew,
people that previously like knew me growing up,
they're like, oh, they know that my parents
are passing away and my sister,
and they like might have met my sister
or know her pretty well, but then it's like,
you meet new people and they don't know them
or they don't know that they exist.
So when you kind of broach that topic,

(41:09):
which I feel like comes up super easily
because you were like, oh, when your parents lived,
how many siblings do you have?
And you're like, oh, well, they're dead.
And it gets kind of dark really quickly,
but it is this weird thing where it's like,
you don't know how people are gonna also respond to that.
Or like if you say even just like,
I'm really sad right now,
or I'm feeling really down about like missing my sister.

(41:31):
It's like, I think it's hard when you have friends
that like don't always react,
like in a way that feels helpful
or either that or it makes you feel like
you should like make yourself smaller,
like make the grief smaller and not affect other things.
So I think it's hard,
but I hope like by having these conversations,
people that respond that way,

(41:52):
and maybe that's just like how they are,
you know, people get awkward conversations.
Sometimes you just like say the wrong thing, right?
Not even if it's what you mean to say
that like people realize like, don't say that thing.
Stop and think about what you're gonna say to somebody
because when someone's down
or feeling really low, someone telling them like,
oh, that's not a big deal or like,

(42:13):
why are you so sad about it?
Like don't say those things.
Yeah.
Out of all things, don't say that.
There are definitely a list of things
and I've seen some clips I think from your show
where you're like,
these are things you shouldn't say, right?
And I think that that's super important,
but I do sort of feel like my friends

(42:35):
don't necessarily need to be helpful.
I don't know if I need them to help me feel better
or if I need them to help solve
whatever I'm going through that day
because I don't think you should put that on them
to be like, you need to fix
whatever I'm going through right now or how I'm feeling.
I don't want anybody to feel like
they have to fix me in any moment.

(42:55):
I feel like that puts too much pressure on somebody
when they're already probably just feeling uncomfortable
or pressure from this serious conversation.
So I would say to my friends,
I don't need your help, I just need you to listen.
I think that's way more valuable
than getting any sort of help from you,
mostly because I don't think
that they can necessarily help me or fix anything.

(43:19):
There's way more value in just listening
and letting me vent than trying to come up with a solution
to a problem that they're not gonna be able to fix.
Well, there's definitely no solution or fixing that,
which I do think happens a lot
where people do try to come into the conversation
being like, oh, how do I fix this?
And it's like, that's not gonna help.

(43:40):
But I do think the things that are helpful,
because you're not,
one, no one's gonna make a grief better about yourself.
That's for sure.
But I think what makes it feel like you're more supported
is your friends can help in different ways
of just maybe it's listening,
maybe it's spending time with you,
maybe it's going to the movies with you.
It can be different things.

(44:00):
And I think you can be helpful
to them through the process,
but also know that you're not gonna be the person to fix it.
And I don't think anyone can depend on your friends
to fix your grief or anything like that.
I think that's a lot of unfair pressure.
But what I meant by helpful is if you're saying you're sad
and someone's like, why are you still sad?

(44:21):
That is not helpful.
Don't say those type of things.
But I think as a friend,
you 100% should be able to provide some type of something,
whether it's like we can just talk about it,
we can spend time together, any of that stuff.
I feel like as a friend, if it's a good friend,
that should be stuff that you can do

(44:43):
because that doesn't cost anything.
That's just you being a human, caring about another human.
But yeah, I definitely don't think you should ever expect
anyone to fix your grief.
One, you can't fix it, but also you need to figure out
by yourself or with therapy or whatever you need.
How's the best way that I can handle this
and this sadness and whatever you're going through?

(45:06):
But yeah, no one's gonna fix that for you.
But I think as friends, you can be helpful in different ways,
but not in the I'm gonna do this for you
because that part is, yeah, you can't do that.
I got you, I got you.
Yeah, no, you're totally right.
I mean, like you said, going to a movie or getting lunch,
that is helpful and that does help for sure.
I guess it's just like I'm looking at it

(45:28):
on fixing the problem sort of help.
And yeah, that doesn't exist, but I got you.
Yeah, for sure.
Definitely there are ways to help like that.
Yeah, and correct me if I'm wrong, Rachel.
I think that was like our number one tip when we were like,
if you know someone who's grieving,
here are things that will help in this deep morning time
was just like, they just need a space to express

(45:52):
the thousands of emotions they're feeling right now
because when you lose somebody,
there's a lot of things you're feeling for the first time.
I don't think it matters if you're young or if you're old,
you lose somebody and all of a sudden you're like,
I didn't know I could feel this immense pain
or this amount of anger or this amount of confusion.
And just like having like, I think like,

(46:13):
I don't wanna say a safe space in like a cushy type of way,
but like a comfortable space where these people
who are grieving can just express that emotion
and be like, I don't even know how to even process this.
I don't even know where to begin.
I don't even know like what I'm gonna do
because this person I love is now gone.
Like it just, I think that was like the number one thing,
Rachel and I were both like, man, it would have been nice.

(46:35):
And I do, I have shout out to my friends.
They did do that and they didn't know how to help me.
I admitted like, I didn't even know how to help me
because I had never gone through this before.
I had no clue what those emotions were gonna be
or how to grieve or how to communicate to other people
that I was like in this deep depression now

(46:56):
and how to have other people like get me out of that
or to be there for me.
We were all like learning together at the same time.
And there was a lot of like ups and downs,
but I'm very thankful for them for just even like
letting me cry in front of them
because before I never did that.
Yeah, crying helps.
Yeah, we're pro crying around here.

(47:18):
We cried most episodes and.
Yeah, I feel like I don't, what did I do wrong?
No one's cried this episode.
We still have a little bit of time.
Let's do one more question.
We'll see if this one triggers the tears.
So you mentioned kind of started with the fear
of dying and death, but after all these episodes,

(47:39):
after talking about death for five years,
after going through therapy, are you still afraid of death?
Oh my gosh, yeah, I'm terrified.
I mean, it's so scary.
I don't wanna die.
I wanna live forever.
If somebody told me that they have the magic pill
or whatever it is, I would do it for sure in an instant.
I don't think I'll ever not be scared of dying.

(48:01):
I think maybe I'll become more comfortable with the idea,
but it's always gonna be terrifying.
And just cause it's terrifying doesn't stop it
from also being exciting and interesting
and something that I genuinely enjoy talking about
and discussing with people and being vulnerable.

(48:26):
I think those are the best topics.
I wanna overshare with strangers forever
and let people know that I'm scared.
And I think that that's great, but yeah, I don't know.
I don't think I'll ever not be scared of dying.
Anybody who has had a near death experience,

(48:48):
I do spend way too much time reading near death experiences
on Reddit and stuff.
And most people are like, it was the most calming,
relaxing, it was euphoric.
I've never felt better in my life.
There are people that were like,
I was in a deep depression after my near death experience
because I had never felt that good before

(49:09):
and I've never felt that good since.
And that gives me a little bit of hope
that maybe it's not as scary.
And I think your brain probably does do
a little bit of protecting when you are dying.
Whatever chemicals are getting mixed up in your brain
while your life is ending,
probably make it a little bit easier.

(49:29):
But I mean, there's so many different aspects
to this idea of being scared of death.
I'm scared of death in the sense of getting hit by a car
and rolling into a ditch and just slowly dying alone
in a patch of grass.
It's very specific.
It's top five for sure.
I don't know why.
I've never come close to getting hit by a car,

(49:51):
but there's so many different aspects of the fear.
It's like, oh, you're scared of spiders.
So it's like, okay, well, you're scared of spiders.
It's like, there's not much more to it than that.
I'm scared of death in the sense of like,
I don't wanna suffer.
I don't wanna spend a month in the hospital slowly dying.

(50:13):
I don't want to get to be 90 years old
and die alone in a hospital room
with like some nurse who's like checking their TikTok
while I'm taking my last breath
and everyone I love has died already.
I mean, there's no way I'd make it till 90
and I probably will be the first person that dies
out of like all of my friends just because, you know,

(50:36):
that stress is the silent killer
and it'll probably get me first.
That's not the truth. But I try and combat that
with like other things like, oh, I'm gonna plan
a really fun funeral.
I mean, I have my funeral planned to the type of weather
that needs to be happening.
Like you can't hold my funeral

(50:59):
unless there are clouds and a light drizzle.
If that is not happening, I do not go into the ground
unless there is rain.
Like I've gotten so deep into it.
And look, my therapist doesn't necessarily think
that that's the greatest way of coping with these fears,
but I don't care and she can't stop me.

(51:22):
Yes. And a huge proponent to do your will,
plan your funeral.
Do not leave that to your beneficiaries
or the people who have to handle that after you.
That's stressful.
Because like I had to do that for my dad.
He had nothing planned.
I was like, oh dear Lord, like.
Yeah, who wants their dad to die
and then you've got to do paperwork on top of it?

(51:43):
What a fucking nightmare.
So much paperwork.
I was like, is this how he would,
what he wouldn't have wanted?
Like, I don't know.
We're just doing our best to make it happen.
And there is something to be said.
I think about having your,
having the weather be the way you want it.
Because I told Rachel, I was like,
the day we buried my dad, it was a beautiful day,

(52:06):
a beautiful October day and I was pissed.
I was pissed that the sun was out.
I was pissed the birds weren't singing.
I was like, it should be storming right now.
Like the world should just be as sad as me.
And like looking back in retrospect,
I was like, you know, my dad was like such a beautiful person.
And so I am glad he was like, you know,
put to rest on a beautiful day.

(52:27):
Cause that is totally aligned with who he is.
But at the time I'm bawling in front of all these people,
like a hundred people and I'm like streaming tears and snot.
I was like, it should be raining right now.
Like a hundred percent should be raining.
There's a rainbow behind you.
It's not the ideal funerals.
And I totally get that.

(52:48):
And it's part of, I think why I say that.
Because I'm like, I want to create a very specific ambiance
to my funeral.
And I want people, everyone needs to be crying.
There needs to be lots of emotion.
And if the sun is out,
it may be a little bit more difficult for them to dig deep

(53:08):
and pull those emotions out that I need.
So I think a cloudy rainy day is perfect.
I could do a whole podcast just about, you know,
funeral details.
I mean, I think about it a lot.
It's like the second most important day of your life.
Like other than being born.
I thought you were gonna say your wedding.
The second most important day.

(53:30):
I thought you were gonna go, it's wedding and then funeral.
It's like wedding day.
That's somewhere in there,
but like you coming into this world
and you leaving this world are pretty important.
It's your last party.
I mean, I haven't done it in a while.
I used to ask people like the type of music
they would want to hear at their funeral.
Like, I mean, I've got a full Spotify playlist

(53:51):
that I've been building for years.
Okay, Lojini too.
Yeah.
Yeah, I have a playlist as well
with just like songs I want at my funeral.
Love it.
Yeah, I mean, I'm constantly adding to that.
Oh, it's, well, you know, you live your life,
but I will say what you were saying, Kendall,
is like, yeah, you wanna make sure all that's planned
so that when you do die, all the other people

(54:13):
that are in your life don't have to think about that stuff.
They just, they're able to just hand it off to somebody
and that person, the funeral director, whoever it is,
will take care of it and that's the end of it.
If I could be the funeral director,
I would be the funeral director of it.
Yeah.
If I could preplan it as much as possible on me.
Like, I'm gonna do that cause knowing what it's like
to have to, is this the casket he would have wanted?

(54:36):
Like, does he want to be buried?
Like, we think about all the time,
he never really clarified to any of us
if he actually wanted to be buried.
And I was like, did he want to be cremated?
I don't know, like these were not things we asked
or we did not have on paper somewhere.
So if I could reduce that, like, decision fatigue
for whoever has to deal with that for me.
You just have to follow a checklist.
Like I did all the hard work for you.

(54:56):
Now just make it happen.
I want to be turned into diamonds or into a tree pod.
We love the tree pod over here.
Yeah, yeah, that's great.
My dad's a woodworker and he made his own urn
and was like, this is what I want you to put me in.
It was as simple as that.
He's like, I want to be cremated
and you could put me in this.

(55:17):
I made it myself.
And I went-
That's really beautiful.
Yeah, it was amazing.
And I think as he gets older,
he's obviously more comfortable
with discussing that stuff.
It's as simple as that, being like,
oh yeah, just so you know, I want to get cremated.
That's it.
It's not this difficult conversation.
You could just tell them.
But obviously the more specific you get,

(55:38):
the easier it is.
That just reminds me of when older people
start talking about death
and people are always like, don't say that.
Don't say that, you're not dying anytime soon.
It's not necessarily that you're dying anytime soon.
It's just that you're trying to figure a few things out
and talk about it so people know what you want.
And people are like, no, it means you're gonna die.

(55:59):
It doesn't mean you're gonna die.
It just means, I mean, you will die,
but it doesn't mean you're gonna die.
It doesn't mean that you're gonna die
because of that conversation.
It just makes it a lot more clear
because then you pass away and everyone's like,
oh, what did you want?
For Robin to plug and play,
the earth has to cry or he's not going down.
Oh yeah, no, it needs to be raining.
I mean, dark, cloudy skies.

(56:21):
It's gotta be outside.
I got the playlist.
I'm gonna have a budget.
There's gonna be money in a bank account
for food and drink and all.
I'm gonna take care of everything.
It's your last chance to throw a party.
I mean, what do you do?
And it's all about you and going through the way.
Yeah, of course.
You should just have the background at the party.

(56:42):
Just play your podcast every episode.
Just the background.
You think I haven't thought about
pre-recording a podcast for After I Die because I have.
Oh my gosh, that's brilliant.
Is it already recorded?
Well, no, so this is the idea.
God forbid I get a diagnosis in five years from now
and they're like, you got six months left to live.

(57:03):
The idea would be, yeah,
if I'm told I have six months, a year, whatever it is,
once we get to a certain point,
what I would do is I would record an episode
and then just schedule it to be released at a certain point.
And if I had to,
if I needed to let one other person be involved
in this whole plan and give them the proper account

(57:24):
and password and they could schedule it accordingly.
But yeah, for sure.
Definitely want to have been dead
for a certain amount of time
and then have everyone get the alert on their phone
that says there's a new podcast episode out.
And like I've been dead for like six weeks or whatever.
I feel like we just got an exclusive.
I'm telling you, the amount of thought

(57:47):
that I put into this shit is ridiculous.
It's a lot.
I think it helps.
I don't know.
I mean, yeah, it's silly to be like, oh yeah,
I can't wait for that podcast episode to drop
after I've been dead for six weeks, but it's like,
what the fuck else, man?
Like I'm dead, it's over.
It's gonna happen.
I'm just trying to have a little fun, you know?

(58:10):
Yeah, I used to be more
afraid of like other people dying
more than like thinking about my own death.
But like, since it happened,
it's like, okay, that felt really bad.
And it already happened, so I don't have fear of that.
I think if anything, death seems like,
oh, well I'll be reunited with my sister

(58:31):
and my mom and my dad.
So to me, it's like a reunion.
It doesn't feel scary.
I think the only thing is like, I mean, I still want to live.
I don't want, you know, I feel like I have a lot of things
I want to accomplish.
I think Kendall have a lot of things we want to accomplish.
And I think, and like the main thing I was like,
I can't explain to my dog what happened
and he's obsessed with me and I'm obsessed with him.

(58:53):
I can have a podcast obsessed with JMo.
Like that could be a podcast in itself.
And I couldn't explain to him where I went.
And to me, like that just breaks my heart
because you can't tell him anything, you know?
He just wants to be with me all the time.
But otherwise it's almost like at some point
whenever my time comes, I'll be reunited with my family.

(59:15):
So to me, it's a lot more of a calming thought
where I used to have fears of just like, oh my God,
if I'm on to pick up my phone call, what happened to her?
And I would sometimes call her like 20 times.
And then like, now that she's gone, it's like,
well, that hurt worse than I even imagined it could hurt.
But since I've dealt with that, now it's like, oh, okay,
we'll be reunited at some point.
So now my only fear is like Jameson won't know where I am.

(59:37):
Well, animals are also invited to my funeral.
Anyone is more than welcome to bring their pet
to the funeral.
I think it's important to bring animals to funerals.
If an owner of a dog dies, I think that bringing
that animal to the funeral is important.
They should get to grieve like anybody else.
I mean, dogs are incredibly intelligent.

(59:59):
They know that that person's not alive anymore.
It's better than them just like sitting at the door
waiting for them.
To like show up again forever.
But yeah, everyone's invited animals and humans
to my funeral.
Jameson, you hear that?
Jameson, you're invited, pal.
You got the invite.

(01:00:20):
We got it on record.
He's got the invite.
Well, Rob, is there anything else that you would like
to summon and like, where can our listeners find you?
Is there anything coming up that you would like to do
or anything up that you would like to share with them?
How can they learn more about you?

(01:00:40):
Give us your whole spiel.
We wanna plug you well.
Thank you.
Well, the podcast is called Obsessed with Death.
It's on all the podcasting stuff.
So you can just Google obsessed with death
and it should come up.
There's not a lot of other things on the internet
with that title, so it's pretty easy.
And you know, that's really all I got going on, you know?
Just follow the podcast.

(01:01:02):
Maybe try and talk to somebody about death.
Try and talk to your mom or your dad, friend,
maybe a stranger at the grocery store.
Just walk up to them and ask them, you know,
when they think they're gonna die.
I'm sure it'll go really well.
Full circle of having these conversations
and now Rob's gonna end up back in the parking lot
with his white van.

(01:01:22):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Just go up to strangers and ask them how they want to die.
No, so yeah, it's just the podcast.
It's called Obsessed with Death.
Please check it out.
And yeah, thanks so much for having me on.
This was really fun.
Yeah, this was.
Thank you so much.
We really appreciate it.
Of course.
Our first crossover episode has come in.

(01:01:43):
Yeah.
["Obsessed with Death"]