December 24, 2024 • 34 mins
This is a special holiday series we will be doing every Tuesday during the holiday season. We know the holidays are a hard time for grievers and wanted to create a space to share, learn and vent with each other during what can feel like a not so jolly season.
This episode discusses the First Christmas and if it is really the hardest the first year, second year or beyond.
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Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Welcome to the Two Girls with Grief podcast, the holiday season edition, episode nine,
(00:21):
the first Christmas.
We are your host.
I'm Kendall Rodgers.
And I'm Rachel Dwyer.
This is a special holiday series we'll be doing every Tuesday during the holiday season.
We know the holidays are a hard time for grievers and want to create a space to share, learn,
and vent with each other during what can feel like a not so jolly season.
In this episode, let's talk about the first Christmas.
(00:41):
We mentioned a little bit in one of our previous episodes about the first holidays, but I don't
think I even realized at the time, just a month ago, that Christmas is so much harder
for me than Thanksgiving.
While that might not be true for everyone, and of course people celebrate different holidays,
there's just something about Christmas that makes it feel so much heavier.
So what is it about Christmas that makes it feel so much harder?
Christmas is just marketed so much different than Thanksgiving.
(01:04):
Even though Thanksgiving is marketed as a family holiday, Christmas is the magical time.
It's the jolliest time of the year.
And I think that can really mess with your head because you think that you should be
jolly and happy despite anything that's going on in your real life.
And it's really not true.
And I think that might be the hardest part besides them being gone is just the stark
(01:27):
difference between how you perceive the holidays and how the world perceives the holidays and
how you personally feel about the holidays.
Yeah, I feel the same way.
And to bounce off what you're saying, I haven't always felt, it's not even sadness.
For me, it's anger and a sense of jealousy, which are not, those are grinch feelings.
Those are scroogey feelings that you have around the holidays.
(01:49):
And yet those are the feelings that often come up.
It's not even the depression or the sadness.
And those do come up, I think, like what I mentioned in the past episodes, the around
the dinner table and seeing the missing chair.
But seeing other families together, seeing them not have to endure a hardship, I get
jealous and I've worked really hard the past couple of years to kind of channel that in
(02:13):
a different way and recognize it as it's okay.
Other people are allowed to be happy.
But it's something I'm still working on currently.
Do you think the buildups of the first Christmas or the actual Christmas, Christmas Eve are
actually worse?
That's such a good question.
The traditions that we do, particularly on Christmas Eve, we don't do anymore.
(02:34):
So that's difficult when you used to do these things together as a family and you're not
doing them anymore.
Although the buildup and lead up to Christmas itself is typically harder for me just because
it's so long.
It's like two months, three months worth of advertisements on TV.
You go to Hobby Lobby and there's decor in July.
(02:56):
The parties that I think all the parties people are having between November 1 and then the
end of December.
The actual day itself I've gotten used to.
There's a bit of freedom for me.
I get to do what I want.
I don't feel obligated to do anything I don't want.
So for me, particularly the day itself is not that hard.
(03:18):
But like I said with my previous feelings around like feeling quote unquote grinchy
leading up to the holidays, those parts are difficult for me.
But what about you?
So for the first Christmas, there's so much conversations about the first Christmas is
the worst or no, it's the second Christmas.
And I think a lot of that conversation gets built up in your head.
(03:38):
I think the holiday alone without them is difficult because the holidays represent family
time.
It could be represented through gifts under the trees.
It could be represented with just the amount of family time, parties, all these different
things.
It is all represented in that.
But the holidays itself now for me years later, the holiday days I put less focus on.
(04:00):
I try to find joy throughout the holiday season and try to make myself happy throughout the
holiday season.
But in terms of the actual like first Christmas, second Christmas, I think it's almost like
it gets so built up that that's even worse than the actual experience.
Because everyone's telling you how it's going to feel.
(04:20):
Everyone's telling you that it's going to feel worse.
And Christmas Eve and Christmas Day aren't the only days.
Like we said, Christmas especially is marketed so heavily.
It's everywhere.
You can't escape it.
You don't celebrate Christmas, you can't escape the marketing of Christmas.
So you're not feeling that just on those days.
It might feel a little bit worse.
(04:40):
You might feel it more if you have a small intimate family party.
It's that dinner table chair that isn't filled that people experience.
But I don't necessarily think it's the actual days.
I think it is the buildup and what you think it's going to be because you can build it
up so much of how the day is going to feel.
(05:01):
And the reality, it's another day.
It's just any other day.
But there is something about December and we've talked to other grievers about it.
It just feels worse in general.
And unfortunately for me, I don't think that feeling really goes away.
I think you can experience pockets of joy.
You can be very active about finding joy during the holiday season, but you don't walk into
(05:22):
it with the same joy and just like effortless joy that you did before losing someone really
important to you.
So I would say that it's really the buildup more than the days, but the days do hurt.
But it's really the buildup of just everything you hear and all the marketing and what you
expect it's going to be and is it going to feel extra painful.
(05:45):
You're kind of storing so much more anxiety and grief leading up to it that it could almost
be a letdown of like, I thought this was going to be this big thing and it all just kind
of hurts.
So it's a little bit of everything.
For sure.
I agree.
And we spoke about it a little bit in a previous episode about these first holidays, but now
that it's closer, is anything coming up for you around the holiday itself?
(06:11):
We've mentioned a little bit throughout the episodes, but I think I've processed my holiday
grief the most this year because of a bunch of things, but also because of just doing
this holiday series.
We've dissected so many different pieces of the holidays and what actually feels hard
and what moments of the holidays feel really painful.
But it's like now the holidays, I'm actually acknowledging how painful it has been.
(06:35):
When I go to family parties, I see like who's missing, right?
I see different families and it just is so apparent to me.
And I think I tried to not focus on that as much, but it's hard when you're looking back
at the memories of Christmas that made you so happy and there's just like, there's no
future of that.
And even if there's things that changes and I like have my own family, I'm still always
(06:57):
going to miss my family unit and the people that I expected to get so many different Christmases
with and I think that's really hard.
I didn't even always acknowledge until recently how fake I felt trying to be happy at family
parties and different parties and acting like I'm as excited about everything that everyone
(07:18):
else is because I'm not.
And having to learn how to respect my own feelings in the holidays and accept how different
it is and how can I make it the best for me?
And that has been a big learning curve because you want to be jolly, people expect you to
be jolly.
They don't necessarily think about, she must be really sad that both her parents and her
(07:39):
sister aren't here.
Oh, she must be sad she doesn't have the gifts under the tree that she bought for them, but
also that she has from them.
She doesn't get to see them and like go home for the holidays.
Like people aren't thinking about that, but I had to realize like I need to focus on why
that feels so bad for me and do things that feel right.
(08:00):
I've really digested everything through this holiday season to almost give myself a little
bit more credit for like, wow, this really sucks.
And there's so many different pieces of why it sucks.
And there's so many different people that are missing that makes it suck and give myself
credit for like, you're doing your best and you're trying different things and you're
(08:20):
actively working on finding some joy.
And to me that's a win, but it's been a roller coaster.
And like we said, many episodes, this has been the most crying in a month that I've
done.
I haven't cried this much in a long time.
Yeah, I completely see where you're coming from.
And this holiday is, I want to say more, it's harder and not just on grievers, but for everybody,
(08:43):
particularly after what we've seen in just the past few years and things are harder on
families and inflation is higher.
There's a lot of uncertainty coming up in the next year.
There's this element of almost like nihilism in the air that I feel like grievers take
on more where it's like, not only are you thinking, okay, if we're all going to die,
(09:08):
why does it matter?
But even more so we're living in very, how do you say like odd circumstances right now.
These are very weird times everybody's experiencing.
One thing I have been confronting a lot of this holiday season is remembering how kind
and beautiful and generous my dad is slash was and missing that kind of, I don't know,
(09:33):
like a positive output, positive energy he would put out into the world.
And looking around at this cruel world, I feel like bad things are happening every day
and missing that, I don't know, that beautiful light that the people we love would put out
into the world.
And it feels like, man, once they left, things really got like turned to shit.
(09:53):
What happened?
And I miss that almost like a buffer of their kindness and their love and just a reminder
of like, there is beautiful things in the world.
There are wonderful things to look forward to.
There's a lot of hope that we can still focus on yet without these people there to remind
us of these things.
These other elements, these sadder elements, these harder elements, these darker things
(10:17):
become more apparent that we're addressing.
And it's hard to do that when you're grieving because you're just more emotional.
You're more vulnerable.
But yeah, it's not just grievers.
I feel like it's everybody right now trying to just figure out how do we keep this joy
and positivity and hope in these really weird times.
(10:40):
Do you feel being four years out from your first Christmas, does it feel significantly
different in any way than it did from your first Christmas without your dad?
Yeah, referring to my previous comment, like as a reformed nihilist, I'm trying not to
have apathy around these days.
(11:02):
I'm trying to remind myself it is worth being excited about something.
You should be excited about things.
I have, I feel like in some sense become more apathetic, but I'm trying to combat that in
my own way.
The way I would describe it is like those first holidays was like having an open wound
and you're actively in pain.
(11:23):
You're bleeding all over the place.
You don't know how to fix yourself.
That's how I see it.
It's like we were all open wounds in those first couple of years.
I can feel the scarring happening that I can talk about my dad more easier and not like
burst into tears, but that scar is always there and it's always like a reminder that
(11:44):
this won't ever be the same.
This won't ever be the same for me because he's not here.
It's like this constant reminder that you will always carry in your life.
I mean, and that's so sad.
I hate to say that, but it's true.
It's like your open wound might close.
You might not be like actively bleeding all over the place, but you still carry the signifier,
(12:05):
which I think that's really hard for grievers to recognize that this is going to carry on.
For me, it's been 10, 8, and 6 years.
I think for many of the Christmases, I kind of was just floating.
I think I was just in denial of how heavy it is that the holidays don't have them anymore,
(12:26):
how different the holidays are, how different I feel about the holidays now.
For many years, I went to the family parties and I just felt like I didn't want to be there
because it made me sad and it just felt wrong.
I even went to my friend's family party.
It was nice.
They're such a nice family, but I still felt like this isn't where I want to be either
for the holidays.
I miss my family and it's been a lot of testing out of what feels right for the holidays.
(12:54):
Like I've said, this is the most.
I've digested the holidays and how hard it is without them.
It kind of almost feels like I'm experiencing the first without them now because I was in
such denial about it and just the whole experience.
I kind of shut down a little bit, which I'm sure people that are going into their first
(13:14):
Christmases don't want to hear that someone that has lost people 10, 8, and 6 years ago
that they're going into their Christmas feeling like it feels as bad as it did for the first
holiday.
Because truthfully, you could be doing different things.
You could have busy things happening.
We talked to Taylor Hahn, an author on our book club series, and she had mentioned she
(13:39):
had a daughter right before Christmas.
Her first Christmas, she didn't have time to digest it or feel it.
I feel like that can be true for so many people.
No matter the circumstance or what happens, you might not really be feeling truly that
loss, the impact of everything that losing them includes.
You might not even realize everything it has affected.
(14:03):
It could be certain years that maybe like, oh wow, this also changed this.
It changed that.
Whether it's like they brought a certain food to the holiday party or they were the person
that organized this thing or they were the person that made this thing happen.
Someone's life is intertwined in so many different things.
You don't know exactly how it's going to affect all the different pieces and the ricochet
(14:24):
that it can have in so many different spaces.
For me, I think because I've taken so many different steps to pick apart the grief and
the different feelings of it, because when you lose your dad and then you lose your sister
and your mom, it's like I didn't even have time or the mental capacity to deal with each
(14:45):
one.
It's like, oh, I'm sad about my dad, but then okay, I'm sad about my sister.
I don't have time to think about my dad.
Then it's like, I lost my mom.
It's like, I don't have time to think about my sister and my dad, but at the same time,
I'm always, especially my sister, always feeling that.
It's a really hard thing where it's like now I'm like, okay, I am accepting all those different
pieces and how hard it is for the holidays.
(15:06):
So unfortunately, I think this is probably the hardest holiday season I've had with just
the feelings that are very upfront that I'm aware of.
And it's been many years.
So I think it could be the first Christmas.
I think it could be second, the third, the fourth, the fifth, whatever.
You could still be feeling so many different things.
(15:28):
And I think the hardest part is when people expect you to be jolly and happy and they
don't get it and they don't get what you're feeling and they don't get that the world
feels like it's spinning and you're just trying to stand when it's like you have vertigo and
you're like, how can I do this when nothing makes sense?
So I don't know that in many years past, it feels significantly different, except that
(15:53):
I'm changing my traditions.
Many years out now, I'm like, okay, this doesn't make sense for me, I'm going to do this, or
I'm going to add this.
So it looks very different, but it's taken me a lot of time to stand my ground and be
like, I don't want to do that.
So I'm going to do this.
And like, you need to respect that that's what I want.
And it's like having that confidence in what you're feeling and knowing like, I'm okay
that I have this grief during the holidays.
(16:14):
I'm okay that this is what I'm feeling and I'm going to do what's best for me during
this holiday time.
Because while you might feeling the Christmas joy, I'm not, or maybe I'm feeling a little
bit, but I don't want to do what you're doing.
And it takes a lot of time to kind of get to that place.
It's definitely just a mixed bag.
Like some people could feel really great after four years.
It really just depends on so many things like the relationship to them, how intertwined
(16:38):
they were in your life, the closeness to them.
Like there's so many different things that can affect how you feel about the first holiday,
second, third, fourth, fifth, whatever.
Should I even ask if it gets any better after six, eight and 10 years?
Oh my God.
I, at the end of the day, it really depends on the person, right?
Everyone handles it differently.
(17:00):
And I see people talk about how this is grief and how it affects people in a definite way.
This is how it goes down.
This is how you should be doing it.
And I just really don't think it's that way.
Like I really don't feel that is the way that grief works.
I think some people are better at compartmentalizing it.
I think some people are better at creating a whole new world around themselves.
(17:21):
I've seen a lot of people say I really bloomed this year because I found myself in so many
different ways.
I've grown and really focused on that.
I think in some ways things have gotten better than they have before because I've chosen
the spaces that I feel comfortable.
I have taken the steps to be like, I'm going to add more joy to my holidays and I'm going
(17:43):
to find joy and I'm going to do the things to find it.
And I didn't always have that strength or that mindset to do that.
So in some ways it's gotten better.
I do feel more overall joy in the holiday season because I'm doing all these different
things and being very active.
But there have been so many days that I just cried and I was really sad.
So it's really a balance.
(18:05):
And in some ways, yes, it's gotten better, but the feeling of missing them, the feeling
of I wish the holidays felt the way they did before.
I wish I could just do the things that I did before that just felt easy and effortless
doesn't get better for me personally.
It's like we found the tools to handle it, although the actual emotional part still exists,
(18:28):
which hopefully if that's something we can provide the listeners is like the tools and
tips and tricks that we have figured out to bear it tolerably a little bit better.
That's all we can ask for, but we can't take away that pain by any means.
But it's like the grief stays the same and then you grow around it.
(18:49):
But people's level of growth around it, right?
It varies person to person.
And I think it also can fluctuate, right?
Like the growth that you experience, you can also backtrack a little bit.
I don't think it's just like you're constantly growing.
I think that's nice to think, but we all regress in some ways.
Get pieces of ourselves that we're not as proud of, maybe be the forefront more than
(19:11):
we should.
I think in the holidays season, you can feel different things, act out in different ways.
No one's perfect.
So I don't think it's a perfect system either, but I think we're all doing our best to grow
around our grief as best as we can.
But also I know some people can't.
Some people have a really hard time with it.
It's a really hard thing.
(19:32):
There's no cure for grief and sadness and replacing someone that you love so much.
So that's the really hard part is you could do things to make it a little bit lighter,
to make the growth feel larger so that the grief doesn't feel like it's the biggest
weight over your shoulders.
But there's not just one formula that fits all for people.
(19:56):
To make it a little bit more positive, what can people do leading up to their first Christmas
to try to make it a little bit better or at least go into it with a little bit of knowledge,
preparedness, something because there's no cure for the first Christmas.
(20:19):
There's no fix for it.
But what can people do to maybe hopefully help them a little bit leading up to the first
Christmas?
In reference to what you were saying earlier, knowing what you want to do and what you don't
want to do, taking an assessment or taking stock in how you're feeling, you need to be
(20:41):
honest with yourself.
I think a lot of people are like, yeah, I want to go to the holiday party.
It's going to be festive and fun.
But if you truly know in your heart, you're not up for it, don't force yourself to do
that.
No one is telling you you have to do things you don't want to do.
But that does require you being honest with yourself in the mirror.
(21:01):
Step one, that's really hard.
It's hard to say the things that you maybe don't want to hear or have to do.
That real time assessment day by day, hour by hour, where your emotions are reacting
to the holiday season, like you and I have mentioned all throughout this, all these holiday
episodes, they're going to be sometimes you do want to go to the holiday party and you're
(21:24):
excited for it.
There's going to be other times you don't.
Both answers are fine.
The second thing that's helped me is I do celebrate the Christmas stuff, the gifts and
things.
It wasn't until after my dad's passing that I start researching the winter solstice aspect
(21:45):
because there's so much symbolism with grief and death and healing and resting.
So this episode will come out after the 21st, but you don't need to do it on the 21st.
I feel like you can do this whenever you're up for it.
There's lots of little things you can do and multiple cultures in our ancestral past and
(22:07):
humankind's past has celebrated these events in some form or fashion.
Just the celebration of the darkest night of the year, which typically is scary.
Because of years ago, people are starving, they're hopeless, and on the darkest night
of the year, they would sing and they would pray and they were building hope for themselves
(22:30):
for a brighter spring.
They would tell stories.
I think even if we are not in situations where we're starving and freezing, we can acknowledge
we might be in the darkest night of our lives when you lose somebody.
As a reminder, the spring does come.
It does get brighter.
Things get better.
But hold that space, I think, to recognize that night, the darkest night of the year,
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in the winter when everything in the world has technically died or gone to sleep, that's
time to think of your ancestors.
That's time to think of your loved ones who's passed on and to give yourself the grace to
grieve.
If you haven't grieved any other time of the year, this might be a good time to just do
it.
Do it on the darkest night.
The winter is perfect for that.
(23:15):
You're holed up at home.
You're cold.
There's little ritual things if you want to participate in that, if setting something
up in their honor helps you, if doing activities around the winter solstice helps you.
I found an article on the Shabby Creek cottage you can look up.
They're very simple little things you can do.
But I think more importantly, recognizing this is the time to grieve.
(23:39):
Winter is the time to grieve.
You can have that outpouring of emotion if you need that.
If you need permission to grieve, this is your permission to grieve.
The third thing that has helped me probably the most is to give more than I take, whether
that's donating money to an angel tree, whether that's volunteering, whether that's seeing
(24:02):
if my elderly neighbor next to me has anything going on, checking on them or helping my friend
with her newborn baby.
These are just small activities, little extensions of kindness that you put out into the world
and inherently creating good positive things in the world will send those things back to
you.
They're good distractions from your grief by doing good things in the world.
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I think it's a reminder that we should make our lives purposeful and so when we have passed
on people can look back and be like, you know, she was always doing something around the
holidays to help others.
Isn't that how we all want to be remembered in some form or fashion?
So like trying to generate and create that holiday spirit from within and not expect
(24:45):
it to be artificially created around you.
Kendall went a different route, but also similar with what my answer is going to be for this
because I do think one thing I wish I had given myself permission to was just break
down and feel the feeling.
I think I was so afraid of being sad.
So my mom, especially when I sort of passed away, my mom really, really, really leaned
(25:10):
into religion and to explain it all and to, I think, feel a little bit more at peace with
everything even though she was having a hard time.
But it also, with her not wanting to see me so sad, she was also encouraged to be like,
don't cry, stop crying.
Don't do that.
But it was her way of, you know, she lost a daughter, she didn't want her other daughter
(25:32):
to fall apart.
But it wasn't what I needed at the time.
And then I felt like, can I really break down?
Can I really, is that the right thing to do if I'm being told to stop?
And it took some reflection and time away from it to really realize what was going on
and really see my mom as like human trying to do her best and not just like my mom, you
(25:54):
know, the woman that lost her daughter.
So I wish I had just taken that time to break down if I needed to because there is so much
anxiety that leads up to the holidays and what it's going to feel like.
And that builds up in so many ways.
You hold it in your body and sometimes I just need a good cry and I feel better.
Like sometimes it's like just I feel a burn up.
(26:16):
Yeah, where I need a tear.
And once I let it just explode, I feel so much better that I just let myself really
feel those emotions and let it out.
So I think leading up to the first Christmas, I would just take time, like I can say, like
sit with it, feel your emotions, know what you're really feeling.
Of course, figure out if you need additional help, do you need professional help?
(26:41):
Do you need anything like that?
Do you need a grief support group?
Do you need other outlets to let this out in a healthy way?
That you definitely should be honest about with yourself.
But also if you just kind of want to feel sad this holiday season, that is you shouldn't
let anyone tell you that you need to feel jolly, that you need to feel amazing about
(27:01):
Christmas, that you should just be in the Christmas spirit.
It's the happiest time of the year.
You don't need to feel those things after someone that you loved is no longer here and
here to celebrate or just be in your life for the rest of your days.
Like that is the saddest thing in the world.
So if you don't feel up to embrace the Christmas joy and the Christmas holiday, then don't.
(27:23):
So I think it would really just be letting yourself feel the feelings, break down if
you need to, cry if you need to, lay in bed if you need to, not for too long, but if you
need a day or so, just to cry it out and just to not do anything.
Take that, but then check in with yourself for like, okay, am I doing this for too long?
Do I need help?
(27:44):
Do I need to be doing other things?
I think that is stuff to consider leading up to the holiday.
And then I would just figure is there anything I can look forward to this year?
Is there anything that I can do that I'm grateful for any part of this holiday?
And maybe you don't, that's fine.
But if you can find any happiness during the season, I would hope that you can, but also
(28:10):
know that sometimes you can't.
So I just don't want the holidays for grievers to always just be this dark cloud at this
hard time.
So I always encourage finding that happiness, whether like Kendall said, volunteering, doing
something, giving yourself purpose in a time that you feel like life has no purpose, I
think can be really helpful and important.
So just figure out what you're needing, but you have to be just very honest with your
(28:35):
feelings and know yourself and what outlets you need to do.
And maybe it's like, I'm just going to pretend Christmas isn't happening this year and that's
okay too.
So on that note, what are you doing to find some Christmas joy at the end of the year?
For me, it's been spending time with family and friends.
It's me setting boundaries about what I want to go to and what I don't want to.
(28:58):
It's being open to other opportunities to join and to do other things and do fun things.
It's been going to dinners with Christmas themes, like Christmas bars.
I'm going to a Christmas market later.
Decorating my place.
I've been finding things to bring me holiday joy where I can, whether it's like I'm just
being, I'm drinking hot chocolate and on our heated blanket watching Hallmark movies.
(29:21):
It's like whatever I'm finding joy in, I'm kind of leaning into because like I've said
many times, the actual Christmas eve and Christmas day isn't my favorite days of the year, but
I try to enjoy the rest of the month as best I can.
And it hasn't been perfect.
I've cried many a times this month, but I also have memories to look back where I'm
(29:42):
like, oh, I really enjoy so many things about this holiday and just like welcoming new friendships
and different things that I didn't have last year.
And I think that has been such a nice gift and something that I've been missing that
I didn't realize.
So I think by opening yourself up and allowing yourself to feel some joy, it also can bring
(30:07):
so much into your life and like new friendships and new things to try and new things to experience.
And I think that can be a beautiful thing because I think grief can really close you
up and make you feel like you don't want to care about anybody or even yourself.
So I think getting yourself out of that mindset and trying to find like, how can I make my
life so beautiful?
(30:27):
What can I do to still live a life that is worth greatness and in their honor?
I think figure out makes you happy, what makes you feel fulfilled, what makes you feel excited
for life again.
I think those things will really are really things that you should focus on into the Christmas
holiday because you need to find joy wherever you can.
(30:49):
And when Christmas is like shoved down your throats as like the happiest time of the year,
the jolliest time of the year, when you're not feeling that you need to be so proactive
to try to counteract that whole thing as much as possible and figure out like what works
with you.
And then at the same time, I'm doing all those different things.
Working out probably should work out more, but that always helps to get myself in a great
(31:11):
mood.
So yeah, being active, seeing friends, making cookies, like doing all the things.
Yeah, I agree.
And with so many extra days people have off, I think it's a great time for people to make
the most of that time that you have because most of the year you don't have that time
available to do something.
So for myself, I'm learning how to knit, which is kind of more difficult than I thought.
(31:35):
It's been very relaxing and I'm just proud that I learned something.
But for other people listening, learning something right now can help benefit you for the rest
of 2025 because you have these extra days to do it.
You're not filling it with, oh, I have all these little things I got to do around the
house.
So if you've been wanting to learn guitar, this is a great time to do that.
(31:55):
If you've been wanting to learn how like woodwork, this is a good time to do that.
I'm also just filling the time with like reading wintery books to really set the scene.
I live in Texas, so there is no white Christmas that we get down here.
So I'm going to fake it and I'm going to read about it.
And then going outside, like Rachel and I have mentioned time and time again, nature
(32:17):
is so healing and experiencing what's happening outdoors and just getting some sunshine and
getting that vitamin D can help you feel so much better.
So this is our second to last episode of the holiday series.
I hope it's been helpful to people.
Me and Kendall have really dived deep into our souls to do these episodes.
I don't think either one of us expected these episodes to be as hard as they were to record
(32:42):
as they were.
I think we both are like, these are going to be cheery episodes to help people through
grief during the holidays.
And it ended up being a lot deeper than that.
But we hope they've been helpful.
We know how hard the holidays are.
And we really put our heart and soul into these episodes to try to help people during
the holidays.
We just don't want people to feel alone or feel like you're the odd man out because the
(33:05):
holidays feel different to you, weird, like Kendall said.
We don't want you to feel like an outsider because there is a large community of people
that are feeling the same way about the holidays as you.
So we really hope these have been helpful and we have one more.
And then we're going to start our season two, but one more holiday episode.
So as always, we have resources below in the show notes so you can check it out there.
(33:29):
We have book club episodes every Monday.
So hope you're tuning in for that.
The book we've been recently reading has been phenomenal.
And then like Rachel said, we have the last holiday episode on Tuesday, December 1st.
So if you made it this far and you've been enjoying our holiday episodes, we'd really
appreciate if you can rate, subscribe, follow us.
(33:51):
It really helps boost our show.
And like I said, we're putting our heart and soul into these episodes.
We really hope that they've been useful to you as well.
And we appreciate everyone that has already done so.
Thank you and happy holidays.
Happy holidays.
We'll see you for one more holiday episode.
And then we're going into 2025.
Welcome to the Two Girls with Grief podcast, the holiday season edition, episode nine,
(00:21):
the first Christmas.
We are your host.
I'm Kendall Rodgers.
And I'm Rachel Dwyer.
This is a special holiday series we'll be doing every Tuesday during the holiday season.
We know the holidays are a hard time for grievers and want to create a space to share, learn,
and vent with each other during what can feel like a not so jolly season.
In this episode, let's talk about the first Christmas.
(00:41):
We mentioned a little bit in one of our previous episodes about the first holidays, but I don't
think I even realized at the time, just a month ago, that Christmas is so much harder
for me than Thanksgiving.
While that might not be true for everyone, and of course people celebrate different holidays,
there's just something about Christmas that makes it feel so much heavier.
So what is it about Christmas that makes it feel so much harder?
Christmas is just marketed so much different than Thanksgiving.
(01:04):
Even though Thanksgiving is marketed as a family holiday, Christmas is the magical time.
It's the jolliest time of the year.
And I think that can really mess with your head because you think that you should be
jolly and happy despite anything that's going on in your real life.
And it's really not true.
And I think that might be the hardest part besides them being gone is just the stark
(01:27):
difference between how you perceive the holidays and how the world perceives the holidays and
how you personally feel about the holidays.
Yeah, I feel the same way.
And to bounce off what you're saying, I haven't always felt, it's not even sadness.
For me, it's anger and a sense of jealousy, which are not, those are grinch feelings.
Those are scroogey feelings that you have around the holidays.
(01:49):
And yet those are the feelings that often come up.
It's not even the depression or the sadness.
And those do come up, I think, like what I mentioned in the past episodes, the around
the dinner table and seeing the missing chair.
But seeing other families together, seeing them not have to endure a hardship, I get
jealous and I've worked really hard the past couple of years to kind of channel that in
(02:13):
a different way and recognize it as it's okay.
Other people are allowed to be happy.
But it's something I'm still working on currently.
Do you think the buildups of the first Christmas or the actual Christmas, Christmas Eve are
actually worse?
That's such a good question.
The traditions that we do, particularly on Christmas Eve, we don't do anymore.
(02:34):
So that's difficult when you used to do these things together as a family and you're not
doing them anymore.
Although the buildup and lead up to Christmas itself is typically harder for me just because
it's so long.
It's like two months, three months worth of advertisements on TV.
You go to Hobby Lobby and there's decor in July.
(02:56):
The parties that I think all the parties people are having between November 1 and then the
end of December.
The actual day itself I've gotten used to.
There's a bit of freedom for me.
I get to do what I want.
I don't feel obligated to do anything I don't want.
So for me, particularly the day itself is not that hard.
(03:18):
But like I said with my previous feelings around like feeling quote unquote grinchy
leading up to the holidays, those parts are difficult for me.
But what about you?
So for the first Christmas, there's so much conversations about the first Christmas is
the worst or no, it's the second Christmas.
And I think a lot of that conversation gets built up in your head.
(03:38):
I think the holiday alone without them is difficult because the holidays represent family
time.
It could be represented through gifts under the trees.
It could be represented with just the amount of family time, parties, all these different
things.
It is all represented in that.
But the holidays itself now for me years later, the holiday days I put less focus on.
(04:00):
I try to find joy throughout the holiday season and try to make myself happy throughout the
holiday season.
But in terms of the actual like first Christmas, second Christmas, I think it's almost like
it gets so built up that that's even worse than the actual experience.
Because everyone's telling you how it's going to feel.
(04:20):
Everyone's telling you that it's going to feel worse.
And Christmas Eve and Christmas Day aren't the only days.
Like we said, Christmas especially is marketed so heavily.
It's everywhere.
You can't escape it.
You don't celebrate Christmas, you can't escape the marketing of Christmas.
So you're not feeling that just on those days.
It might feel a little bit worse.
(04:40):
You might feel it more if you have a small intimate family party.
It's that dinner table chair that isn't filled that people experience.
But I don't necessarily think it's the actual days.
I think it is the buildup and what you think it's going to be because you can build it
up so much of how the day is going to feel.
(05:01):
And the reality, it's another day.
It's just any other day.
But there is something about December and we've talked to other grievers about it.
It just feels worse in general.
And unfortunately for me, I don't think that feeling really goes away.
I think you can experience pockets of joy.
You can be very active about finding joy during the holiday season, but you don't walk into
(05:22):
it with the same joy and just like effortless joy that you did before losing someone really
important to you.
So I would say that it's really the buildup more than the days, but the days do hurt.
But it's really the buildup of just everything you hear and all the marketing and what you
expect it's going to be and is it going to feel extra painful.
(05:45):
You're kind of storing so much more anxiety and grief leading up to it that it could almost
be a letdown of like, I thought this was going to be this big thing and it all just kind
of hurts.
So it's a little bit of everything.
For sure.
I agree.
And we spoke about it a little bit in a previous episode about these first holidays, but now
that it's closer, is anything coming up for you around the holiday itself?
(06:11):
We've mentioned a little bit throughout the episodes, but I think I've processed my holiday
grief the most this year because of a bunch of things, but also because of just doing
this holiday series.
We've dissected so many different pieces of the holidays and what actually feels hard
and what moments of the holidays feel really painful.
But it's like now the holidays, I'm actually acknowledging how painful it has been.
(06:35):
When I go to family parties, I see like who's missing, right?
I see different families and it just is so apparent to me.
And I think I tried to not focus on that as much, but it's hard when you're looking back
at the memories of Christmas that made you so happy and there's just like, there's no
future of that.
And even if there's things that changes and I like have my own family, I'm still always
(06:57):
going to miss my family unit and the people that I expected to get so many different Christmases
with and I think that's really hard.
I didn't even always acknowledge until recently how fake I felt trying to be happy at family
parties and different parties and acting like I'm as excited about everything that everyone
(07:18):
else is because I'm not.
And having to learn how to respect my own feelings in the holidays and accept how different
it is and how can I make it the best for me?
And that has been a big learning curve because you want to be jolly, people expect you to
be jolly.
They don't necessarily think about, she must be really sad that both her parents and her
(07:39):
sister aren't here.
Oh, she must be sad she doesn't have the gifts under the tree that she bought for them, but
also that she has from them.
She doesn't get to see them and like go home for the holidays.
Like people aren't thinking about that, but I had to realize like I need to focus on why
that feels so bad for me and do things that feel right.
(08:00):
I've really digested everything through this holiday season to almost give myself a little
bit more credit for like, wow, this really sucks.
And there's so many different pieces of why it sucks.
And there's so many different people that are missing that makes it suck and give myself
credit for like, you're doing your best and you're trying different things and you're
(08:20):
actively working on finding some joy.
And to me that's a win, but it's been a roller coaster.
And like we said, many episodes, this has been the most crying in a month that I've
done.
I haven't cried this much in a long time.
Yeah, I completely see where you're coming from.
And this holiday is, I want to say more, it's harder and not just on grievers, but for everybody,
(08:43):
particularly after what we've seen in just the past few years and things are harder on
families and inflation is higher.
There's a lot of uncertainty coming up in the next year.
There's this element of almost like nihilism in the air that I feel like grievers take
on more where it's like, not only are you thinking, okay, if we're all going to die,
(09:08):
why does it matter?
But even more so we're living in very, how do you say like odd circumstances right now.
These are very weird times everybody's experiencing.
One thing I have been confronting a lot of this holiday season is remembering how kind
and beautiful and generous my dad is slash was and missing that kind of, I don't know,
(09:33):
like a positive output, positive energy he would put out into the world.
And looking around at this cruel world, I feel like bad things are happening every day
and missing that, I don't know, that beautiful light that the people we love would put out
into the world.
And it feels like, man, once they left, things really got like turned to shit.
(09:53):
What happened?
And I miss that almost like a buffer of their kindness and their love and just a reminder
of like, there is beautiful things in the world.
There are wonderful things to look forward to.
There's a lot of hope that we can still focus on yet without these people there to remind
us of these things.
These other elements, these sadder elements, these harder elements, these darker things
(10:17):
become more apparent that we're addressing.
And it's hard to do that when you're grieving because you're just more emotional.
You're more vulnerable.
But yeah, it's not just grievers.
I feel like it's everybody right now trying to just figure out how do we keep this joy
and positivity and hope in these really weird times.
(10:40):
Do you feel being four years out from your first Christmas, does it feel significantly
different in any way than it did from your first Christmas without your dad?
Yeah, referring to my previous comment, like as a reformed nihilist, I'm trying not to
have apathy around these days.
(11:02):
I'm trying to remind myself it is worth being excited about something.
You should be excited about things.
I have, I feel like in some sense become more apathetic, but I'm trying to combat that in
my own way.
The way I would describe it is like those first holidays was like having an open wound
and you're actively in pain.
(11:23):
You're bleeding all over the place.
You don't know how to fix yourself.
That's how I see it.
It's like we were all open wounds in those first couple of years.
I can feel the scarring happening that I can talk about my dad more easier and not like
burst into tears, but that scar is always there and it's always like a reminder that
(11:44):
this won't ever be the same.
This won't ever be the same for me because he's not here.
It's like this constant reminder that you will always carry in your life.
I mean, and that's so sad.
I hate to say that, but it's true.
It's like your open wound might close.
You might not be like actively bleeding all over the place, but you still carry the signifier,
(12:05):
which I think that's really hard for grievers to recognize that this is going to carry on.
For me, it's been 10, 8, and 6 years.
I think for many of the Christmases, I kind of was just floating.
I think I was just in denial of how heavy it is that the holidays don't have them anymore,
(12:26):
how different the holidays are, how different I feel about the holidays now.
For many years, I went to the family parties and I just felt like I didn't want to be there
because it made me sad and it just felt wrong.
I even went to my friend's family party.
It was nice.
They're such a nice family, but I still felt like this isn't where I want to be either
for the holidays.
I miss my family and it's been a lot of testing out of what feels right for the holidays.
(12:54):
Like I've said, this is the most.
I've digested the holidays and how hard it is without them.
It kind of almost feels like I'm experiencing the first without them now because I was in
such denial about it and just the whole experience.
I kind of shut down a little bit, which I'm sure people that are going into their first
(13:14):
Christmases don't want to hear that someone that has lost people 10, 8, and 6 years ago
that they're going into their Christmas feeling like it feels as bad as it did for the first
holiday.
Because truthfully, you could be doing different things.
You could have busy things happening.
We talked to Taylor Hahn, an author on our book club series, and she had mentioned she
(13:39):
had a daughter right before Christmas.
Her first Christmas, she didn't have time to digest it or feel it.
I feel like that can be true for so many people.
No matter the circumstance or what happens, you might not really be feeling truly that
loss, the impact of everything that losing them includes.
You might not even realize everything it has affected.
(14:03):
It could be certain years that maybe like, oh wow, this also changed this.
It changed that.
Whether it's like they brought a certain food to the holiday party or they were the person
that organized this thing or they were the person that made this thing happen.
Someone's life is intertwined in so many different things.
You don't know exactly how it's going to affect all the different pieces and the ricochet
(14:24):
that it can have in so many different spaces.
For me, I think because I've taken so many different steps to pick apart the grief and
the different feelings of it, because when you lose your dad and then you lose your sister
and your mom, it's like I didn't even have time or the mental capacity to deal with each
(14:45):
one.
It's like, oh, I'm sad about my dad, but then okay, I'm sad about my sister.
I don't have time to think about my dad.
Then it's like, I lost my mom.
It's like, I don't have time to think about my sister and my dad, but at the same time,
I'm always, especially my sister, always feeling that.
It's a really hard thing where it's like now I'm like, okay, I am accepting all those different
pieces and how hard it is for the holidays.
(15:06):
So unfortunately, I think this is probably the hardest holiday season I've had with just
the feelings that are very upfront that I'm aware of.
And it's been many years.
So I think it could be the first Christmas.
I think it could be second, the third, the fourth, the fifth, whatever.
You could still be feeling so many different things.
(15:28):
And I think the hardest part is when people expect you to be jolly and happy and they
don't get it and they don't get what you're feeling and they don't get that the world
feels like it's spinning and you're just trying to stand when it's like you have vertigo and
you're like, how can I do this when nothing makes sense?
So I don't know that in many years past, it feels significantly different, except that
(15:53):
I'm changing my traditions.
Many years out now, I'm like, okay, this doesn't make sense for me, I'm going to do this, or
I'm going to add this.
So it looks very different, but it's taken me a lot of time to stand my ground and be
like, I don't want to do that.
So I'm going to do this.
And like, you need to respect that that's what I want.
And it's like having that confidence in what you're feeling and knowing like, I'm okay
that I have this grief during the holidays.
(16:14):
I'm okay that this is what I'm feeling and I'm going to do what's best for me during
this holiday time.
Because while you might feeling the Christmas joy, I'm not, or maybe I'm feeling a little
bit, but I don't want to do what you're doing.
And it takes a lot of time to kind of get to that place.
It's definitely just a mixed bag.
Like some people could feel really great after four years.
It really just depends on so many things like the relationship to them, how intertwined
(16:38):
they were in your life, the closeness to them.
Like there's so many different things that can affect how you feel about the first holiday,
second, third, fourth, fifth, whatever.
Should I even ask if it gets any better after six, eight and 10 years?
Oh my God.
I, at the end of the day, it really depends on the person, right?
Everyone handles it differently.
(17:00):
And I see people talk about how this is grief and how it affects people in a definite way.
This is how it goes down.
This is how you should be doing it.
And I just really don't think it's that way.
Like I really don't feel that is the way that grief works.
I think some people are better at compartmentalizing it.
I think some people are better at creating a whole new world around themselves.
(17:21):
I've seen a lot of people say I really bloomed this year because I found myself in so many
different ways.
I've grown and really focused on that.
I think in some ways things have gotten better than they have before because I've chosen
the spaces that I feel comfortable.
I have taken the steps to be like, I'm going to add more joy to my holidays and I'm going
(17:43):
to find joy and I'm going to do the things to find it.
And I didn't always have that strength or that mindset to do that.
So in some ways it's gotten better.
I do feel more overall joy in the holiday season because I'm doing all these different
things and being very active.
But there have been so many days that I just cried and I was really sad.
So it's really a balance.
(18:05):
And in some ways, yes, it's gotten better, but the feeling of missing them, the feeling
of I wish the holidays felt the way they did before.
I wish I could just do the things that I did before that just felt easy and effortless
doesn't get better for me personally.
It's like we found the tools to handle it, although the actual emotional part still exists,
(18:28):
which hopefully if that's something we can provide the listeners is like the tools and
tips and tricks that we have figured out to bear it tolerably a little bit better.
That's all we can ask for, but we can't take away that pain by any means.
But it's like the grief stays the same and then you grow around it.
(18:49):
But people's level of growth around it, right?
It varies person to person.
And I think it also can fluctuate, right?
Like the growth that you experience, you can also backtrack a little bit.
I don't think it's just like you're constantly growing.
I think that's nice to think, but we all regress in some ways.
Get pieces of ourselves that we're not as proud of, maybe be the forefront more than
(19:11):
we should.
I think in the holidays season, you can feel different things, act out in different ways.
No one's perfect.
So I don't think it's a perfect system either, but I think we're all doing our best to grow
around our grief as best as we can.
But also I know some people can't.
Some people have a really hard time with it.
It's a really hard thing.
(19:32):
There's no cure for grief and sadness and replacing someone that you love so much.
So that's the really hard part is you could do things to make it a little bit lighter,
to make the growth feel larger so that the grief doesn't feel like it's the biggest
weight over your shoulders.
But there's not just one formula that fits all for people.
(19:56):
To make it a little bit more positive, what can people do leading up to their first Christmas
to try to make it a little bit better or at least go into it with a little bit of knowledge,
preparedness, something because there's no cure for the first Christmas.
(20:19):
There's no fix for it.
But what can people do to maybe hopefully help them a little bit leading up to the first
Christmas?
In reference to what you were saying earlier, knowing what you want to do and what you don't
want to do, taking an assessment or taking stock in how you're feeling, you need to be
(20:41):
honest with yourself.
I think a lot of people are like, yeah, I want to go to the holiday party.
It's going to be festive and fun.
But if you truly know in your heart, you're not up for it, don't force yourself to do
that.
No one is telling you you have to do things you don't want to do.
But that does require you being honest with yourself in the mirror.
(21:01):
Step one, that's really hard.
It's hard to say the things that you maybe don't want to hear or have to do.
That real time assessment day by day, hour by hour, where your emotions are reacting
to the holiday season, like you and I have mentioned all throughout this, all these holiday
episodes, they're going to be sometimes you do want to go to the holiday party and you're
(21:24):
excited for it.
There's going to be other times you don't.
Both answers are fine.
The second thing that's helped me is I do celebrate the Christmas stuff, the gifts and
things.
It wasn't until after my dad's passing that I start researching the winter solstice aspect
(21:45):
because there's so much symbolism with grief and death and healing and resting.
So this episode will come out after the 21st, but you don't need to do it on the 21st.
I feel like you can do this whenever you're up for it.
There's lots of little things you can do and multiple cultures in our ancestral past and
(22:07):
humankind's past has celebrated these events in some form or fashion.
Just the celebration of the darkest night of the year, which typically is scary.
Because of years ago, people are starving, they're hopeless, and on the darkest night
of the year, they would sing and they would pray and they were building hope for themselves
(22:30):
for a brighter spring.
They would tell stories.
I think even if we are not in situations where we're starving and freezing, we can acknowledge
we might be in the darkest night of our lives when you lose somebody.
As a reminder, the spring does come.
It does get brighter.
Things get better.
But hold that space, I think, to recognize that night, the darkest night of the year,
(22:55):
in the winter when everything in the world has technically died or gone to sleep, that's
time to think of your ancestors.
That's time to think of your loved ones who's passed on and to give yourself the grace to
grieve.
If you haven't grieved any other time of the year, this might be a good time to just do
it.
Do it on the darkest night.
The winter is perfect for that.
(23:15):
You're holed up at home.
You're cold.
There's little ritual things if you want to participate in that, if setting something
up in their honor helps you, if doing activities around the winter solstice helps you.
I found an article on the Shabby Creek cottage you can look up.
They're very simple little things you can do.
But I think more importantly, recognizing this is the time to grieve.
(23:39):
Winter is the time to grieve.
You can have that outpouring of emotion if you need that.
If you need permission to grieve, this is your permission to grieve.
The third thing that has helped me probably the most is to give more than I take, whether
that's donating money to an angel tree, whether that's volunteering, whether that's seeing
(24:02):
if my elderly neighbor next to me has anything going on, checking on them or helping my friend
with her newborn baby.
These are just small activities, little extensions of kindness that you put out into the world
and inherently creating good positive things in the world will send those things back to
you.
They're good distractions from your grief by doing good things in the world.
(24:24):
I think it's a reminder that we should make our lives purposeful and so when we have passed
on people can look back and be like, you know, she was always doing something around the
holidays to help others.
Isn't that how we all want to be remembered in some form or fashion?
So like trying to generate and create that holiday spirit from within and not expect
(24:45):
it to be artificially created around you.
Kendall went a different route, but also similar with what my answer is going to be for this
because I do think one thing I wish I had given myself permission to was just break
down and feel the feeling.
I think I was so afraid of being sad.
So my mom, especially when I sort of passed away, my mom really, really, really leaned
(25:10):
into religion and to explain it all and to, I think, feel a little bit more at peace with
everything even though she was having a hard time.
But it also, with her not wanting to see me so sad, she was also encouraged to be like,
don't cry, stop crying.
Don't do that.
But it was her way of, you know, she lost a daughter, she didn't want her other daughter
(25:32):
to fall apart.
But it wasn't what I needed at the time.
And then I felt like, can I really break down?
Can I really, is that the right thing to do if I'm being told to stop?
And it took some reflection and time away from it to really realize what was going on
and really see my mom as like human trying to do her best and not just like my mom, you
(25:54):
know, the woman that lost her daughter.
So I wish I had just taken that time to break down if I needed to because there is so much
anxiety that leads up to the holidays and what it's going to feel like.
And that builds up in so many ways.
You hold it in your body and sometimes I just need a good cry and I feel better.
Like sometimes it's like just I feel a burn up.
(26:16):
Yeah, where I need a tear.
And once I let it just explode, I feel so much better that I just let myself really
feel those emotions and let it out.
So I think leading up to the first Christmas, I would just take time, like I can say, like
sit with it, feel your emotions, know what you're really feeling.
Of course, figure out if you need additional help, do you need professional help?
(26:41):
Do you need anything like that?
Do you need a grief support group?
Do you need other outlets to let this out in a healthy way?
That you definitely should be honest about with yourself.
But also if you just kind of want to feel sad this holiday season, that is you shouldn't
let anyone tell you that you need to feel jolly, that you need to feel amazing about
(27:01):
Christmas, that you should just be in the Christmas spirit.
It's the happiest time of the year.
You don't need to feel those things after someone that you loved is no longer here and
here to celebrate or just be in your life for the rest of your days.
Like that is the saddest thing in the world.
So if you don't feel up to embrace the Christmas joy and the Christmas holiday, then don't.
(27:23):
So I think it would really just be letting yourself feel the feelings, break down if
you need to, cry if you need to, lay in bed if you need to, not for too long, but if you
need a day or so, just to cry it out and just to not do anything.
Take that, but then check in with yourself for like, okay, am I doing this for too long?
Do I need help?
(27:44):
Do I need to be doing other things?
I think that is stuff to consider leading up to the holiday.
And then I would just figure is there anything I can look forward to this year?
Is there anything that I can do that I'm grateful for any part of this holiday?
And maybe you don't, that's fine.
But if you can find any happiness during the season, I would hope that you can, but also
(28:10):
know that sometimes you can't.
So I just don't want the holidays for grievers to always just be this dark cloud at this
hard time.
So I always encourage finding that happiness, whether like Kendall said, volunteering, doing
something, giving yourself purpose in a time that you feel like life has no purpose, I
think can be really helpful and important.
So just figure out what you're needing, but you have to be just very honest with your
(28:35):
feelings and know yourself and what outlets you need to do.
And maybe it's like, I'm just going to pretend Christmas isn't happening this year and that's
okay too.
So on that note, what are you doing to find some Christmas joy at the end of the year?
For me, it's been spending time with family and friends.
It's me setting boundaries about what I want to go to and what I don't want to.
(28:58):
It's being open to other opportunities to join and to do other things and do fun things.
It's been going to dinners with Christmas themes, like Christmas bars.
I'm going to a Christmas market later.
Decorating my place.
I've been finding things to bring me holiday joy where I can, whether it's like I'm just
being, I'm drinking hot chocolate and on our heated blanket watching Hallmark movies.
(29:21):
It's like whatever I'm finding joy in, I'm kind of leaning into because like I've said
many times, the actual Christmas eve and Christmas day isn't my favorite days of the year, but
I try to enjoy the rest of the month as best I can.
And it hasn't been perfect.
I've cried many a times this month, but I also have memories to look back where I'm
(29:42):
like, oh, I really enjoy so many things about this holiday and just like welcoming new friendships
and different things that I didn't have last year.
And I think that has been such a nice gift and something that I've been missing that
I didn't realize.
So I think by opening yourself up and allowing yourself to feel some joy, it also can bring
(30:07):
so much into your life and like new friendships and new things to try and new things to experience.
And I think that can be a beautiful thing because I think grief can really close you
up and make you feel like you don't want to care about anybody or even yourself.
So I think getting yourself out of that mindset and trying to find like, how can I make my
life so beautiful?
(30:27):
What can I do to still live a life that is worth greatness and in their honor?
I think figure out makes you happy, what makes you feel fulfilled, what makes you feel excited
for life again.
I think those things will really are really things that you should focus on into the Christmas
holiday because you need to find joy wherever you can.
(30:49):
And when Christmas is like shoved down your throats as like the happiest time of the year,
the jolliest time of the year, when you're not feeling that you need to be so proactive
to try to counteract that whole thing as much as possible and figure out like what works
with you.
And then at the same time, I'm doing all those different things.
Working out probably should work out more, but that always helps to get myself in a great
(31:11):
mood.
So yeah, being active, seeing friends, making cookies, like doing all the things.
Yeah, I agree.
And with so many extra days people have off, I think it's a great time for people to make
the most of that time that you have because most of the year you don't have that time
available to do something.
So for myself, I'm learning how to knit, which is kind of more difficult than I thought.
(31:35):
It's been very relaxing and I'm just proud that I learned something.
But for other people listening, learning something right now can help benefit you for the rest
of 2025 because you have these extra days to do it.
You're not filling it with, oh, I have all these little things I got to do around the
house.
So if you've been wanting to learn guitar, this is a great time to do that.
(31:55):
If you've been wanting to learn how like woodwork, this is a good time to do that.
I'm also just filling the time with like reading wintery books to really set the scene.
I live in Texas, so there is no white Christmas that we get down here.
So I'm going to fake it and I'm going to read about it.
And then going outside, like Rachel and I have mentioned time and time again, nature
(32:17):
is so healing and experiencing what's happening outdoors and just getting some sunshine and
getting that vitamin D can help you feel so much better.
So this is our second to last episode of the holiday series.
I hope it's been helpful to people.
Me and Kendall have really dived deep into our souls to do these episodes.
I don't think either one of us expected these episodes to be as hard as they were to record
(32:42):
as they were.
I think we both are like, these are going to be cheery episodes to help people through
grief during the holidays.
And it ended up being a lot deeper than that.
But we hope they've been helpful.
We know how hard the holidays are.
And we really put our heart and soul into these episodes to try to help people during
the holidays.
We just don't want people to feel alone or feel like you're the odd man out because the
(33:05):
holidays feel different to you, weird, like Kendall said.
We don't want you to feel like an outsider because there is a large community of people
that are feeling the same way about the holidays as you.
So we really hope these have been helpful and we have one more.
And then we're going to start our season two, but one more holiday episode.
So as always, we have resources below in the show notes so you can check it out there.
(33:29):
We have book club episodes every Monday.
So hope you're tuning in for that.
The book we've been recently reading has been phenomenal.
And then like Rachel said, we have the last holiday episode on Tuesday, December 1st.
So if you made it this far and you've been enjoying our holiday episodes, we'd really
appreciate if you can rate, subscribe, follow us.
(33:51):
It really helps boost our show.
And like I said, we're putting our heart and soul into these episodes.
We really hope that they've been useful to you as well.
And we appreciate everyone that has already done so.
Thank you and happy holidays.
Happy holidays.
We'll see you for one more holiday episode.
And then we're going into 2025.
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