November 23, 2025 • 44 mins
Join hosts Kamala Rose and Nischala Joy Devi as they take a deep dive into the heart of Karma Yoga through the lens of Loka Sangraha—the Vedic ideal of acting for the highest good of all. Drawing on the teachings of the Bhagavad Gita, personal experiences, and practical wisdom, this episode explores how selfless service can be woven into our daily actions, attitudes, and communities. Whether through small gestures, community aid, or deep reflection, learn how living for the collective benefit uplifts us all.
Key topics covered:
- The meaning and significance of Loka Sangraha in the context of Karma Yoga
- Acting without attachment: Bringing benefit to all and harm to none
- Reciprocity and interconnectedness: How individual actions ripple through the community
- Practical ways to practice selfless service in everyday situations
- Overcoming unconscious bias and cultivating humility
- Women’s unique challenges and contributions to service
- The spiritual power of small acts of kindness
- Stories and lessons from real-life mutual aid experiences
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Kamala Rose (00:40):
Welcome to a woman's Gita Podcast. I'm Kamala
rose.
Let's start over. We can juststart from right here. I'll
clap. Oh, I just did you end it?
Okay?Clap again, and I'mNischala Joy Devi,
(01:10):
thank you so much for joining ustoday under the banyan tree,
where we continue to discussChapter Three of the Bhagavad
Gita, the chapter titled karmayoga. Today we are beginning our
discussion on the very importantverse, chapter three, verse six,
(01:32):
if while stilling the organs ofaction, the mind remains engaged
with the sense objects, there isa lack of understanding of one's
true nature. When one balancesthe senses, they are able to
engage in Karma Yoga withoutattachment. Right here, we're
(01:58):
starting to really get adefinition of karma yoga, and
I'm going to just take thatthrough to verse eight that we
can discuss together. Action issuperior to inaction, with
inaction, even caring for thebody would not be possible. Mm,
(02:22):
Eberle, all actions bind whenthey are done selfishly, turning
every action into a selflessoffering frees us from personal
attachment through the practiceof karma yoga, fulfillment will
be your constant companion.
Let's discuss these verses.
Nischala Joy Devi (02:48):
I think it's fascinating, three, six. Because
to me, it is. It's somultifaceted. Yes, they're
talking about karma yoga. Butwhat it's implying is that if
the mind is not calm, if thethoughts are running hither and
(03:09):
thither, meditation is notpossible. And without
meditation, without that thatcenteredness to make it in a
very simple, simplistic way. Howcan we serve people? Because if
(03:29):
the mind is busy, it's bringingin all the thoughts and
prejudices also. So perhapswe're seeing a person who's
homeless, and our naturalinclination from our heart would
be to go forward and help thatperson, but in the mind holds
(03:52):
judgment. So we start thinking,Well, why didn't they do this?
What happened to them? Maybe, ifI knew their story this and
that. So the purity of action ofeven handing them a sandwich or
anything that you may need theymay need is now tainted. The
(04:15):
Karma Yoga is not pure, and thiswill not then help us get out of
that wheel of birth and death,which is what we're really
looking for here.
Kamala Rose (04:27):
Well, this is a good place to, you know, to take
a look at the idea ofunconscious bias. Everyone has
ideas about people, right? This,I think, comes to that, that
essential duality of self andother, right, anyone who is not
(04:51):
me, right? We, every person, hasunconscious bias due to our
culture. Right? We live in aworld today where, fortunately,
a lot of these are beingexposed, and we're able to we're
able to acknowledge some of theeffects of systemic misogyny,
(05:15):
systemic racism, things likethis, things that our culture
has taught us things that thepatriarchy has taught us about
people who are other. And Ithink yoga wisdom gives us a
really valuable insight to seeourselves as a part of nature in
(05:38):
a way. And. And have a littlespace for investigation and
inquiry that huh, if I see thisperson as other and
differentiated from me in waysthat are clear enough that I can
hear in my own brain telling mewhy this person is deserving or
(05:59):
not deserving, worthy of my timeor not worthy of my time, worthy
of my resources, worthy of mycare, yeah, right, if we're able
to hear those voices andrecognize that, you know, even I
as much of a seriouspractitioner, even I have
(06:20):
unconscious bias, we canunderstand the human condition
in this way, and the the subtletools of separation that exist
in all of Our hearts, and thekind of barriers to togetherness
(06:41):
that everyone carries, that ourculture taught us and we see. I
think that's I think karma yogahelps us to see, gives us a
ground of practice to unearthsome of those unconscious
biases, if we're willing toadmit that they exist,
Nischala Joy Devi (07:07):
that's to even bring our attention to it
in the beginning and remind usso the thing, the thing about
karma yoga, which is so amazing,is if you take the time to
observe your experience and yourmind and your thoughts as you
(07:29):
are moving into engaging inKarma Yoga, you get incredible
insight. You start to see yourbiases. You start to see your
fears. And what is a fear? It'sjust something that we don't
understand. You walk up to aperson who may have an odor, who
(07:50):
may be dirty, and we start toproject onto that. Instead, if
we have really gotten to a placein meditation when we look at
that person, instead of seeingthe dirt, the filth and smell,
we see a divine being just likeus, because on the level that we
(08:14):
get to in meditation, where wecan experience that, that's
that's the truth. That's truthat that point. So I think that
that all these things that we'redissecting separately really
have a unification. They can'tbe done, one with, without the
(08:35):
other. It's, it's hand in glove.
So the meditation helps us seewhat we what our actions are
doing, and our actions help usbe able to sit quietly. So we
have this beautiful push me,pull me, but we're actually
moving forward in the process.
We're not just standing stilland you, I think a lot of people
(09:00):
come to me or come to teacherswith this, this problem, they've
managed to still the body, and alot of it is through the asana,
no doubt. And if they have adecent diet, they can still the
body, but they notice when thebody becomes still, the mind
(09:26):
gets the energy, and the mindstarts to then project all these
things. Had a dear friend in themonastery. She was a fellow
monk, and she would say, I sitdown every day for meditation. I
think about all the things I'mgoing to do that day, how I'm
(09:48):
going to do them. I say, closingchance, and I get up and I do
what I just thought of. And Ithink a lot of people have that,
a lot of people that we call itmeditation, because from the
outside, it looks like peopleare sitting still, but in
actuality, so much is going on.
So what we're we're faced withhere at three six, is the idea
(10:12):
that it's saying to us whilestilling the organs of action
the mind, if the mind remainsengaged with the sense objects,
there is a lack of understandingof our true nature. And that's
what you're, you're you'rementioning with all these
prejudices that we have that wedon't even know we have until
(10:35):
we're faced with it. If you'venever seen someone with green or
purple hair and you suddenly seethem, are you prejudiced? How do
you respond to them? Do yourespond to them that they are
unusual, fun to look at? Or doyou say, who? Who wants hair
(10:55):
like that? Who? What hairshouldn't be that color, right?
Kamala Rose (11:01):
Once somebody said to me, I'm so glad you changed,
because I didn't like people,like how you were.
Nischala Joy Devi (11:07):
Oh, that's really nice. Wow. Okay, all
right, but that okay, yourealize I did it just for you,
right? That's the only question.
So, yeah. So these things comeout. And I even hear people come
to me after years of practice,and they'll say to me, do I do
that? I just noticed that when Italk to people, I do this, and I
(11:30):
go, Aha, it's working. Theintrospection has now had its
lens cleaned, and we can now seeourselves. It's funny, my mother
used to always quote to me as achild, she I don't even know
where it came from, but she hadall these quotes, and she would
(11:53):
always say to me, the greatestgift is to be able to see
yourself as others see you. AndI think this applies here. We
really get that insight. Who arewe? By sitting still and by
observing, yeah. So, yeah, thisis something that the body is
(12:14):
easier to contain and the mind,the mind is very difficult, and
at least get it in a groovesomewhere that it can be in a
positive rather than a negative.
Yeah, amazing sloka. I thinkit's an amazing sloka,
Kamala Rose (12:34):
and it it really offers us so much. I think it's
one of the shlokas, you know,for every yoga teacher, we
should, we should know wherethree six is, and, you know,
read different translations ofit. This reading here from the
Winthrop sergeant, thetraditional is Krishna concludes
(12:57):
and says, Don't be a hypocrite.
Thank you, right, yeah. And hesays, So, right, if, while
stilling the organs of action,the karmendrias, right, our
hands and our feet and ourspeech, right, our genitals, our
elimination, our organs that weact on the world with. And you
(13:18):
know, in a way he's talkingabout, he's taking a dig at
monastics who sit in a ivorymonastery on the hill while not
doing the internal work to letgo of those attachment to
senses. He's building this case,that traditional renunciation
the way it was known at thistime, that's not going to cut
(13:41):
it. You still have to do themental work. You have to, you
know, actually detach the mindfrom its craving and its
aversion to the sense objectsaround it. And so there's a
level of honesty with oneselfthat's required here. I think
(14:05):
we're taking the skills fromChapter two that we built in
buddhi yoga, being able to seewith clarity, from the
discernment, the wisdom facultyof the buddhi to have a level of
self inquiry and honesty withinone's own character as a yogi,
but also not to think thatleaving the world is the way out
(14:30):
of that kind of attachment. Herewe're talking, you know, he's
saying, don't be a hypocrite.
Don't talk the talk, but notwalk the walk, right? This is
what we talk about today asspiritual bypassing, right?
Without doing the internal work.
We're saying, Look at, look athow I how much I've given up.
(14:52):
Look at how I've renounced X, Yand Z, you know? Oh no, I'm
fasting today. Oh, no, I'm only,you know, I only eat things that
fall from the trees my path and
Nischala Joy Devi (15:08):
but that's also what they would coin
spiritual materialism. It youhave the right Mala, you have
the right shawl, you have theright pillow, and your altar is
set up just right, but there'snothing there. There's nothing
there. It's, I think we forgetsometimes, because of all the
(15:32):
promotion and talk of yoga as aphysical discipline, and I.
Action that we forget that mostof yoga has nothing to do with
the external. It's all aboutinternal. That's why Sutras, the
whole last part of it, thefourth book, is Antara yoga, the
(15:54):
inner yoga. Yes, we have to getthe outside calm enough. We have
to make friends with oursisters. We have to get the
physical purity before we canbegin. But once we begin to draw
inward, that's where the realpractice is. Because, you know,
(16:17):
we're good at saying things thatare nice. Most of us can manage
to say something nice. But whatare we thinking? What are our
thoughts? You know, I laughsometimes when, when people when
I'm talking about the yogiccities, and they're we talk
about mind reading, and peoplesay, Oh, I wish I could do that.
(16:39):
I said, you actually don't youknow. You don't want to know
what's in someone else's mind.
It's bad enough we know what'sin our own mind, because we have
to remember that these citieswere developed or talked about
when people's minds were pure.
They didn't have all thisclutter and prejudice and all
(17:00):
this in it, I wouldn't hatesomeone 8000 miles away, because
I would never know that therewas someone 8000 miles away that
did anything. But now, with thisinstantaneous it's almost harder
to pull back and go intoourselves, because there's so
much outside that being quiethas become a luxury that most
(17:29):
people can't afford. So here wehave it again,
Kamala Rose (17:35):
and so much of the way we engage with our senses
now is on was electronically,and that has a very different
effect on the senses than thereal world does, right? Actually
talking to an actual person,where you can read their body
language and feel their energyright? Being outside, it's
(17:57):
summertime, and I finally gotback out to the garden, which is
where my heart lives. And sothat's been really, really
lovely. But you know, so much ofwhat we do is on Zoom, or you're
listening to us on a podcastfrom your phone in the car,
(18:18):
right? There's, you know, theseare, it's almost very addictive,
electronic and impression,isolating. Addictive, calculated
Lee, addictive by, you know, we,how many of us have lost more
than an hour down some rabbithole on YouTube or Instagram. So
(18:44):
today, we live in a differentworld. But the premise of this
idea that this that our senseengagement with the world must
be recognized and dealt withappropriately. You you can't,
you can't have everything allthe time. I mean, that's always
going to be a problem, whetherit's in the digital Anthropocene
(19:09):
that we're in right now, or ifthis was, you know, in the, you
know, in the way, way long ago,times of the Mahabharata War,
you know, the basic humanequipment remains the same in
three seven, when one balancesthe SEV, the senses, the
indriyas, then they are able toengage in Karma Yoga without
(19:34):
attachment, right? So this ideaof balancing the senses, right?
One who is able to to hold thereins? Yeah, I mean coming back
to the chariot metaphor, right?
Holding the Manas, the reigns,over the senses, so that one is
not dominant. You know, one isnot you know, what you see is
(19:59):
not going after what it wants.
What you taste is not insistingmore, right? We learn to balance
the senses. So, you know, inthese verses, we're really
getting the the structure ofkarma yoga, beginning with the
(20:21):
self inquiry, What's the motive?
What's going on inside? What arethe thoughts that are creating
the action? Right? What's themotive and what is the means? Is
being able to balance the sensesand. And it really shows us, you
know, a kind of a common way ofunderstanding this is to be in
(20:43):
the world, but not of the world.
You know, where the world doesnot have control over you, where
you are, and you don'tnecessarily have dominance over
the world, right? We can coexistin in in a balance, in a way of
(21:06):
being, and this is what KarmaYoga is all about.
Nischala Joy Devi (21:10):
Yeah, I agree. I agree with all of that.
And it comes back to us. I thinkwhat has happened, especially in
the Western countries, there's ame has come up, I would say more
(21:31):
probably in the United States, ame has come up that has taken
center stage and become capitalletters. This is something that
every single spiritualdiscipline talks about serving
others, seeing yourself andothers, etc, etc. Yet we seem to
(21:56):
be perpetuating the opposite. Weseem to be perpetuating that
it's all about us, and I thinkthis is why meditation is so
difficult for people and evenservice the organizations that
(22:17):
hold the container so that wecan just slip in and serve
somebody and then slip outwithout having to create it
ourselves. Are really giving ussomething that they're talking
about here in the Gita. They asan organization, we're hoping
and at least the ones that youmake sure that they're good.
(22:41):
Have already gone through thisprocess as an organization. Have
decided, What is Karma Yoga, forinstance, I'll just use one as
an example that that I think isa really good one, Feeding
America, right? It's a Christianbased organization who happens
to believe in the precepts ofChristianity, right? They only
(23:08):
take less than 5% of the moneythat you give, because everyone
else is a volunteer. So in mymind, when I give to an
organization like that, and inmy heart that opens to give, I
trust that they are in alignmentwith who I am when I give it to
(23:29):
them, and that this money willactually buy food and be given
to the people who need it. So Ithink that even if we're not
doing it individually orpersonally, check just make sure
who you're giving it to is inalignment with this, because
(23:51):
they've done their due diligenceon it. So if you're giving
individually, like if you justpass someone on the street and
you see that they needsomething, and you feel that
your motives are not pure, bringin a mantra. Bring in a saying,
(24:13):
if you're a Christian, bring inthat Jesus fed everybody, or
Jesus did this, if you're not aChristian, bring in that. You do
it with joy. You do it withlove. You do whatever it is,
change the thoughts so that theaction will be backed up by a
(24:33):
positive instead of a judgmentor a thought that's not clear
that way, your act will not onlyhelp that person that you're
you're working with, but it willhelp do what we've been talking
about for how many sessions, itwill purify your own karma,
(24:58):
because you're in alignment withthought, with word and deed,
Kamala Rose (25:05):
and that's so important to remind us that
that's that the yoga of karmayoga, the internal work of karma
yoga, is really the mostImportant part how you're
thinking about it, seizing theopportunity to reframe your own
(25:25):
selfishness into into a serviceto what the Gita calls over and
over again. Here in chapterthree, we'll get to loka San
Gran. Ha, a wish for the welfareof everyone everywhere. I think
it's important to remember thatthis is at the base of the Gita.
(25:50):
It's at the base of the yogatradition, right? We don't
always, I mean, it's, it's notspelled out like this in every
single verse. The sincere wishfor the welfare of all. But it
is that, you know, it's theroots of the tree. Is the
desire, the the need, thedesire, the individual
(26:14):
responsibility to contribute tothe good of the whole, right?
If, if one suffers, we allsuffer. If society is
imbalanced, we all sufferbecause of that. Therefore, the
effort that we put into creatinga just society also benefits us
(26:37):
all. And so in terms of karmayoga, these are the verses that
we're moving towards in eight.
Krishna says that action issuperior to inaction. With
inaction, even caring for thebody would be impossible, right?
So, when to act, when towithhold action, this dialog,
(26:58):
very important dialog in thearea, in the in the this, this
time of, you know, all of usinvestigating the motive behind
our actions. I think you'reagain so right to bring up, you
know, the organizations that wework with, where does your money
go? Right for many of us, thatis how or for the whole world,
(27:21):
it's how we act by which causeswe support, which products we
buy. You know, where we take ourtime and energy that's converted
into money to buy those goods.
And so we ask ourselves, do Iwant to support a mission to
(27:44):
Mars with my dollars, or do Iwant to go to book shop? Do I
want to buy from an independentretailer instead? Right? We ask
ourselves these questionsbecause it comes down, am I
withholding my action onpurpose, or am I acting? Because
I think this is a good idea thatI want to get behind right here
(28:06):
in eight. Krishna says thatalways acting is better than not
acting, which you know for allof us this, this is another
verse that should be like amantra to us with inaction, even
caring for the body is notpossible. It's not possible to
not act in reality, to removeoneself from the world, and to
(28:32):
not contribute in any way.
Again, we're we're talking a lothere about monasticism and
people leaving the world. It'sworth noting. And something in a
verse like this, Krishna is theGita is really specifically
speaking to at the time manypeople were announcing the world
(28:54):
to follow the Buddha into theearly Sangha. And Krishna is
Karma Yoga is a reaction tothat. He's saying, don't leave
the world. Participate in theworld. Be a be be a positive
footprint in the world, and doit with the integrity of knowing
(29:16):
your thoughts, knowing yourmotives, yeah, that's how we can
be unbound.
Nischala Joy Devi (29:27):
And I think the other thing is realizing
that even meditation is anaction, prayer is an action. So
when we talk about being in theworld. We also have to, and I
think especially these days, wehave to understand that there
(29:48):
are some people that just can'tbe, whether they're physically,
unable to mentally, emotionally,whatever it is. But we don't
have to discount that they'reall the people that are praying
in these caves and monasteriesand other places. They're really
(30:10):
helping to uplift the level ofconsciousness in the world, and
so not thinking of it just as aphysical movement. But
everything we do is action,except when we still the mind
and body completely inmeditation. That's the only
(30:31):
time. Otherwise, we're always inaction. There was a really funny
movie, I believe it. Was made byAndy Warhol, many years ago, and
he filmed a man sleeping, yeah,sleep, yeah. He put a man, a
camera on a man for eight hours,and then he did a speed up. I
(30:54):
forget what it's called. Whenthey speed everything up. There
was no rest in this man at all.
He was moving from the rightside to the left side, foot up,
arm up. And so we think of sleepas being this restful time, but
we also have it's also the timethat we release. And meditation
(31:15):
is a lot like that too. It's ina more subtle level, but you
start to see a bubble come up.
Maybe it's a bubble of annoyanceat your neighbor, even it starts
to come up in meditation. Butbecause you're still, and
because the organs of action arestill, you watch it, and instead
(31:43):
of holding on to it like younormally would, you watch the
bubble come up and pop and it'sgone. That's what the ability to
be still does if you try to dothat within the action of seeing
your neighbor, it probablywouldn't work. So the truth here
(32:06):
has to be understood in the inthat so many different ways, not
just holding on to our beliefs,not just letting go of our
beliefs, but really seeing whichones serve us, which ones don't
serve us. That's where thediscrimination comes in. Very
(32:26):
clearly, we have to learn that.
So, yeah, we're sitting there.
Action is superior to inaction,yeah,
Kamala Rose (32:37):
yeah, and we can't not act. And meditation is an
action, and yoga practice is anaction. It's a dharmic action,
it's a skillful action, it's anaction that is taken
intentionally for the purpose ofpurifying the body and mind,
(32:58):
right? If we look at yogapractice as really a means of
tapas, a means of heating up thesystem, reducing the impurities
that we could even see clearly,that we would be able to tell
right? So when you know, when weset the timer to meditate and
sit in one place for 20 minutesor longer, we're, you know,
(33:23):
we're taking the action to sitdown there and to do something
about self understanding andself inquiry, understanding the
way, the way I work. And innine. Krishna says that all
actions bind when they are doneselfishly. Scary. The idea of
(33:49):
selfish action, I think, is, youknow, is coming from ego. Is
coming from the sense of I theahamkara. It's really a matter
of who is, who is the agenthere. Is it the Buddhi? Is it
the wisdom faculty being theagent of You, know, seeing
(34:10):
through your own patterns andunconscious bias? Or is it the
ahamkara, the eye maker, theego, the sense of individual
self that says, I want thisbecause I It helps me in the
story. It helps me perpetuatethe story of me. I look good in
(34:33):
this light. You know? I getbenefit from this action, right?
It serves my personality. Itserves the way people see me. I
derive material and personalbenefit from it, right? These
are the kinds of actions thatare done selfishly, and again,
(34:56):
this calls us really to behonest about our motives, right?
We live in the world. We can'tavoid having to earn money, no,
right? We can't avoid that. Andsomething I'm learning every
day, having to set up my set upmy online business so I can
teach some classes and interactwith some of you out there, it's
(35:21):
a lot of work. It takes a lot ofhustle right from a certain part
of oneself. That's identity, whoam I? Who do I want to tell
people I am, and all of thosesort of things. And you know,
this karma yoga is really askingus to just be able to. So, you
know, we need, we need a senseof identity to live in the
(35:43):
world, but it doesn't have torule us, and it doesn't have to
make all of the decisions, andwe've got to keep that broader
sense of what about all of us.
Nischala Joy Devi (35:58):
Yeah, you know, when I look at those three
slokas together, I can't helpthinking that there's a secret
message embedded in them. Andthat secret message to me is,
you need to change your life.
You need to change the actionsthat you have been doing,
(36:21):
repetitiously or unconsciously,or whatever you want to say. I
think what happens we tend towant to change the practices to
fit in with the meta, with ourlife, instead of changing our
life to fit in with thepractices if we're really
looking to do to do thingsselflessly as opposed to
(36:45):
selfishly, we need to slow downa little bit. We need to do one
action and make sure it's donein that way that we want without
before we move on to the nextaction. And I think the pace of
today's life keeps us fromreally analyzing, is this a
(37:06):
selfish act? Is this is selflessact? And I think somewhere
within these scriptures that Iremember learning a long time
ago is that a selfless act isone that brings benefit to some
and harm to no one. So you can'tsay, Well, I'm bringing some
(37:31):
harm to this and but it benefitsmost people. That's not
according to what we're reallylooking for, at least have it
neutral for people. So whenwe're talking about karma yoga,
every action that we do duringthe day can be transformed into
(37:52):
that. The simplest thing youknow, I remember years ago,
someone on the somewhere in theeast coast, where they have
tollways that you have to pay togo to Drive, someone started it
rush hour traffic. They paid forthe person behind them, and then
the person behind them, and thenit turned out, it went on for
(38:16):
three hours. People paying, theygot so excited and so into it.
And what fun it would be to seethe expression on the person's
face behind you in your rearview mirror when you the toll
taker said, Oh, no, you'vealready been paid for something
so simple like that can make adifference in someone's day,
(38:39):
even their life, especiallyyours. You know, what did? It
cost you very little in money,but it gave you a lot of joy. So
this action, slow it down, makeit something that really has an
(39:00):
effect and really lasts. I'msure people I'm still talking
about it, and it was years ago.
I'm sure other people have to,yeah,
Kamala Rose (39:13):
examples like that really illustrate, and I think,
show us how important it is thatwe're we feel that there is a
way we are contributing to tothe welfare of all of us, yeah,
(39:34):
right, a sense of purpose andbelonging to the world, which,
again, I think It's an, I thinkit's inherent in the Gita and
the next shlokas that we'll talkabout after this one, we're
going to start talking about theVedic worldview, that really is
a story of an integrated whole,right, where everybody's a part
(39:55):
of it. And, you know, Iremember, you know, right after
the 2016 election, I did a talkat the the Center for Ahimsa in
Pomona on the the dharma of ayoga teacher. And as part of it,
(40:15):
I had read a lot of what theDalai Lama was had been saying
about kind of how did thishappen? How did, how did we end
up with this? And he broughtattention to the idea that
everyone needs purpose, and ifthey don't have it right, if
they feel directionless and likethey're not, they don't have
(40:38):
personal value. Value withoutpurpose, and that's what drives
people into nationalism, anddrives people into ideas that
they they feel like they cancontribute and be a part of that
in a way that their society hasnot given that to them. So in a
way, he was trying to explain,how have we gotten here? And,
(41:01):
you know, at the time, it was soimpactful thinking about a sense
of purpose and belonging to theworld, and how, as yoga
teachers, we, you know, we cometo class and we're able to
belong to our communities in acertain way, of really helping
people impacting our communitiesby, you know, helping keep more
(41:23):
people on their feet and out ofthe physical therapy offices.
We're able to help people staycalmer in times of stress like
this. We sometimes provide asanctuary. But again, that idea
of purpose and and finding waysthat we can that our actions are
(41:44):
actually uplifting, yeah, thewelfare of everyone, right? So
we say here that when we turnevery action into a selfless
offering, this is what frees usfrom our personal attachment.
You know this? This is somethingwe have to all frame for
(42:06):
ourselves. How is it that we arecontributing to our world?
Right? You brought up a lot ofexamples of you know, how we
can? We can contribute tocharities. We can just do
spontaneous acts of kindness, wecan, most importantly
investigate our motives in whywe're doing what we're doing,
(42:28):
making a selfless offering ofour actions. I think we, I think
is important that we're able toconnect to the meaning of the
tradition in serving not onlyour own practice, but serving
our society through our actions,helping to make it a better
place to uphold Dharma right, tofight corruption, by siding with
(42:54):
Dharma, by teaching dharma. Andfor me, this is very meaningful,
and it's certainly has saved mea lot of heartache in troubling
times.
Nischala Joy Devi (43:08):
And I think you can really see, if you if
you look the people who havereally earnestly gone inside.
And embraced the idea of karmayoga, have meditated and gotten
(43:30):
their mind in a balanced placethat they can perform it without
all the extraneous emotion thatdrags us down, that you can
actually go out and do a protestwith peace in your heart,
(43:50):
because if you don't bring peaceto a protest, you're Lost.
Kamala Rose (43:55):
Yeah, that's a good thought to end on. I These,
these shlokas. I I really thinkthese are some of the ones that
we should always have close by.
These are some of the mostpractical verses in the Bhagavad
Gita as yoga teachers. They'll,you know, they'll, they'll guide
(44:17):
us through a lot, they'll giveus the framework to navigate
many, many situations. And so wehope that our dialogs are
serving you, helping you to tonavigate your life and be a
better teacher. And we'd love tohear from you any questions.
Please leave us in the comments,and thanks for making time for
(44:38):
our dialog today. Namaste.
Namaste.
Welcome to a woman's Gita Podcast. I'm Kamala
rose.
Let's start over. We can juststart from right here. I'll
clap. Oh, I just did you end it?
Okay?Clap again, and I'mNischala Joy Devi,
(01:10):
thank you so much for joining ustoday under the banyan tree,
where we continue to discussChapter Three of the Bhagavad
Gita, the chapter titled karmayoga. Today we are beginning our
discussion on the very importantverse, chapter three, verse six,
(01:32):
if while stilling the organs ofaction, the mind remains engaged
with the sense objects, there isa lack of understanding of one's
true nature. When one balancesthe senses, they are able to
engage in Karma Yoga withoutattachment. Right here, we're
(01:58):
starting to really get adefinition of karma yoga, and
I'm going to just take thatthrough to verse eight that we
can discuss together. Action issuperior to inaction, with
inaction, even caring for thebody would not be possible. Mm,
(02:22):
Eberle, all actions bind whenthey are done selfishly, turning
every action into a selflessoffering frees us from personal
attachment through the practiceof karma yoga, fulfillment will
be your constant companion.
Let's discuss these verses.
Nischala Joy Devi (02:48):
I think it's fascinating, three, six. Because
to me, it is. It's somultifaceted. Yes, they're
talking about karma yoga. Butwhat it's implying is that if
the mind is not calm, if thethoughts are running hither and
(03:09):
thither, meditation is notpossible. And without
meditation, without that thatcenteredness to make it in a
very simple, simplistic way. Howcan we serve people? Because if
(03:29):
the mind is busy, it's bringingin all the thoughts and
prejudices also. So perhapswe're seeing a person who's
homeless, and our naturalinclination from our heart would
be to go forward and help thatperson, but in the mind holds
(03:52):
judgment. So we start thinking,Well, why didn't they do this?
What happened to them? Maybe, ifI knew their story this and
that. So the purity of action ofeven handing them a sandwich or
anything that you may need theymay need is now tainted. The
(04:15):
Karma Yoga is not pure, and thiswill not then help us get out of
that wheel of birth and death,which is what we're really
looking for here.
Kamala Rose (04:27):
Well, this is a good place to, you know, to take
a look at the idea ofunconscious bias. Everyone has
ideas about people, right? This,I think, comes to that, that
essential duality of self andother, right, anyone who is not
(04:51):
me, right? We, every person, hasunconscious bias due to our
culture. Right? We live in aworld today where, fortunately,
a lot of these are beingexposed, and we're able to we're
able to acknowledge some of theeffects of systemic misogyny,
(05:15):
systemic racism, things likethis, things that our culture
has taught us things that thepatriarchy has taught us about
people who are other. And Ithink yoga wisdom gives us a
really valuable insight to seeourselves as a part of nature in
(05:38):
a way. And. And have a littlespace for investigation and
inquiry that huh, if I see thisperson as other and
differentiated from me in waysthat are clear enough that I can
hear in my own brain telling mewhy this person is deserving or
(05:59):
not deserving, worthy of my timeor not worthy of my time, worthy
of my resources, worthy of mycare, yeah, right, if we're able
to hear those voices andrecognize that, you know, even I
as much of a seriouspractitioner, even I have
(06:20):
unconscious bias, we canunderstand the human condition
in this way, and the the subtletools of separation that exist
in all of Our hearts, and thekind of barriers to togetherness
(06:41):
that everyone carries, that ourculture taught us and we see. I
think that's I think karma yogahelps us to see, gives us a
ground of practice to unearthsome of those unconscious
biases, if we're willing toadmit that they exist,
Nischala Joy Devi (07:07):
that's to even bring our attention to it
in the beginning and remind usso the thing, the thing about
karma yoga, which is so amazing,is if you take the time to
observe your experience and yourmind and your thoughts as you
(07:29):
are moving into engaging inKarma Yoga, you get incredible
insight. You start to see yourbiases. You start to see your
fears. And what is a fear? It'sjust something that we don't
understand. You walk up to aperson who may have an odor, who
(07:50):
may be dirty, and we start toproject onto that. Instead, if
we have really gotten to a placein meditation when we look at
that person, instead of seeingthe dirt, the filth and smell,
we see a divine being just likeus, because on the level that we
(08:14):
get to in meditation, where wecan experience that, that's
that's the truth. That's truthat that point. So I think that
that all these things that we'redissecting separately really
have a unification. They can'tbe done, one with, without the
(08:35):
other. It's, it's hand in glove.
So the meditation helps us seewhat we what our actions are
doing, and our actions help usbe able to sit quietly. So we
have this beautiful push me,pull me, but we're actually
moving forward in the process.
We're not just standing stilland you, I think a lot of people
(09:00):
come to me or come to teacherswith this, this problem, they've
managed to still the body, and alot of it is through the asana,
no doubt. And if they have adecent diet, they can still the
body, but they notice when thebody becomes still, the mind
(09:26):
gets the energy, and the mindstarts to then project all these
things. Had a dear friend in themonastery. She was a fellow
monk, and she would say, I sitdown every day for meditation. I
think about all the things I'mgoing to do that day, how I'm
(09:48):
going to do them. I say, closingchance, and I get up and I do
what I just thought of. And Ithink a lot of people have that,
a lot of people that we call itmeditation, because from the
outside, it looks like peopleare sitting still, but in
actuality, so much is going on.
So what we're we're faced withhere at three six, is the idea
(10:12):
that it's saying to us whilestilling the organs of action
the mind, if the mind remainsengaged with the sense objects,
there is a lack of understandingof our true nature. And that's
what you're, you're you'rementioning with all these
prejudices that we have that wedon't even know we have until
(10:35):
we're faced with it. If you'venever seen someone with green or
purple hair and you suddenly seethem, are you prejudiced? How do
you respond to them? Do yourespond to them that they are
unusual, fun to look at? Or doyou say, who? Who wants hair
(10:55):
like that? Who? What hairshouldn't be that color, right?
Kamala Rose (11:01):
Once somebody said to me, I'm so glad you changed,
because I didn't like people,like how you were.
Nischala Joy Devi (11:07):
Oh, that's really nice. Wow. Okay, all
right, but that okay, yourealize I did it just for you,
right? That's the only question.
So, yeah. So these things comeout. And I even hear people come
to me after years of practice,and they'll say to me, do I do
that? I just noticed that when Italk to people, I do this, and I
(11:30):
go, Aha, it's working. Theintrospection has now had its
lens cleaned, and we can now seeourselves. It's funny, my mother
used to always quote to me as achild, she I don't even know
where it came from, but she hadall these quotes, and she would
(11:53):
always say to me, the greatestgift is to be able to see
yourself as others see you. AndI think this applies here. We
really get that insight. Who arewe? By sitting still and by
observing, yeah. So, yeah, thisis something that the body is
(12:14):
easier to contain and the mind,the mind is very difficult, and
at least get it in a groovesomewhere that it can be in a
positive rather than a negative.
Yeah, amazing sloka. I thinkit's an amazing sloka,
Kamala Rose (12:34):
and it it really offers us so much. I think it's
one of the shlokas, you know,for every yoga teacher, we
should, we should know wherethree six is, and, you know,
read different translations ofit. This reading here from the
Winthrop sergeant, thetraditional is Krishna concludes
(12:57):
and says, Don't be a hypocrite.
Thank you, right, yeah. And hesays, So, right, if, while
stilling the organs of action,the karmendrias, right, our
hands and our feet and ourspeech, right, our genitals, our
elimination, our organs that weact on the world with. And you
(13:18):
know, in a way he's talkingabout, he's taking a dig at
monastics who sit in a ivorymonastery on the hill while not
doing the internal work to letgo of those attachment to
senses. He's building this case,that traditional renunciation
the way it was known at thistime, that's not going to cut
(13:41):
it. You still have to do themental work. You have to, you
know, actually detach the mindfrom its craving and its
aversion to the sense objectsaround it. And so there's a
level of honesty with oneselfthat's required here. I think
(14:05):
we're taking the skills fromChapter two that we built in
buddhi yoga, being able to seewith clarity, from the
discernment, the wisdom facultyof the buddhi to have a level of
self inquiry and honesty withinone's own character as a yogi,
but also not to think thatleaving the world is the way out
(14:30):
of that kind of attachment. Herewe're talking, you know, he's
saying, don't be a hypocrite.
Don't talk the talk, but notwalk the walk, right? This is
what we talk about today asspiritual bypassing, right?
Without doing the internal work.
We're saying, Look at, look athow I how much I've given up.
(14:52):
Look at how I've renounced X, Yand Z, you know? Oh no, I'm
fasting today. Oh, no, I'm only,you know, I only eat things that
fall from the trees my path and
Nischala Joy Devi (15:08):
but that's also what they would coin
spiritual materialism. It youhave the right Mala, you have
the right shawl, you have theright pillow, and your altar is
set up just right, but there'snothing there. There's nothing
there. It's, I think we forgetsometimes, because of all the
(15:32):
promotion and talk of yoga as aphysical discipline, and I.
Action that we forget that mostof yoga has nothing to do with
the external. It's all aboutinternal. That's why Sutras, the
whole last part of it, thefourth book, is Antara yoga, the
(15:54):
inner yoga. Yes, we have to getthe outside calm enough. We have
to make friends with oursisters. We have to get the
physical purity before we canbegin. But once we begin to draw
inward, that's where the realpractice is. Because, you know,
(16:17):
we're good at saying things thatare nice. Most of us can manage
to say something nice. But whatare we thinking? What are our
thoughts? You know, I laughsometimes when, when people when
I'm talking about the yogiccities, and they're we talk
about mind reading, and peoplesay, Oh, I wish I could do that.
(16:39):
I said, you actually don't youknow. You don't want to know
what's in someone else's mind.
It's bad enough we know what'sin our own mind, because we have
to remember that these citieswere developed or talked about
when people's minds were pure.
They didn't have all thisclutter and prejudice and all
(17:00):
this in it, I wouldn't hatesomeone 8000 miles away, because
I would never know that therewas someone 8000 miles away that
did anything. But now, with thisinstantaneous it's almost harder
to pull back and go intoourselves, because there's so
much outside that being quiethas become a luxury that most
(17:29):
people can't afford. So here wehave it again,
Kamala Rose (17:35):
and so much of the way we engage with our senses
now is on was electronically,and that has a very different
effect on the senses than thereal world does, right? Actually
talking to an actual person,where you can read their body
language and feel their energyright? Being outside, it's
(17:57):
summertime, and I finally gotback out to the garden, which is
where my heart lives. And sothat's been really, really
lovely. But you know, so much ofwhat we do is on Zoom, or you're
listening to us on a podcastfrom your phone in the car,
(18:18):
right? There's, you know, theseare, it's almost very addictive,
electronic and impression,isolating. Addictive, calculated
Lee, addictive by, you know, we,how many of us have lost more
than an hour down some rabbithole on YouTube or Instagram. So
(18:44):
today, we live in a differentworld. But the premise of this
idea that this that our senseengagement with the world must
be recognized and dealt withappropriately. You you can't,
you can't have everything allthe time. I mean, that's always
going to be a problem, whetherit's in the digital Anthropocene
(19:09):
that we're in right now, or ifthis was, you know, in the, you
know, in the way, way long ago,times of the Mahabharata War,
you know, the basic humanequipment remains the same in
three seven, when one balancesthe SEV, the senses, the
indriyas, then they are able toengage in Karma Yoga without
(19:34):
attachment, right? So this ideaof balancing the senses, right?
One who is able to to hold thereins? Yeah, I mean coming back
to the chariot metaphor, right?
Holding the Manas, the reigns,over the senses, so that one is
not dominant. You know, one isnot you know, what you see is
(19:59):
not going after what it wants.
What you taste is not insistingmore, right? We learn to balance
the senses. So, you know, inthese verses, we're really
getting the the structure ofkarma yoga, beginning with the
(20:21):
self inquiry, What's the motive?
What's going on inside? What arethe thoughts that are creating
the action? Right? What's themotive and what is the means? Is
being able to balance the sensesand. And it really shows us, you
know, a kind of a common way ofunderstanding this is to be in
(20:43):
the world, but not of the world.
You know, where the world doesnot have control over you, where
you are, and you don'tnecessarily have dominance over
the world, right? We can coexistin in in a balance, in a way of
(21:06):
being, and this is what KarmaYoga is all about.
Nischala Joy Devi (21:10):
Yeah, I agree. I agree with all of that.
And it comes back to us. I thinkwhat has happened, especially in
the Western countries, there's ame has come up, I would say more
(21:31):
probably in the United States, ame has come up that has taken
center stage and become capitalletters. This is something that
every single spiritualdiscipline talks about serving
others, seeing yourself andothers, etc, etc. Yet we seem to
(21:56):
be perpetuating the opposite. Weseem to be perpetuating that
it's all about us, and I thinkthis is why meditation is so
difficult for people and evenservice the organizations that
(22:17):
hold the container so that wecan just slip in and serve
somebody and then slip outwithout having to create it
ourselves. Are really giving ussomething that they're talking
about here in the Gita. They asan organization, we're hoping
and at least the ones that youmake sure that they're good.
(22:41):
Have already gone through thisprocess as an organization. Have
decided, What is Karma Yoga, forinstance, I'll just use one as
an example that that I think isa really good one, Feeding
America, right? It's a Christianbased organization who happens
to believe in the precepts ofChristianity, right? They only
(23:08):
take less than 5% of the moneythat you give, because everyone
else is a volunteer. So in mymind, when I give to an
organization like that, and inmy heart that opens to give, I
trust that they are in alignmentwith who I am when I give it to
(23:29):
them, and that this money willactually buy food and be given
to the people who need it. So Ithink that even if we're not
doing it individually orpersonally, check just make sure
who you're giving it to is inalignment with this, because
(23:51):
they've done their due diligenceon it. So if you're giving
individually, like if you justpass someone on the street and
you see that they needsomething, and you feel that
your motives are not pure, bringin a mantra. Bring in a saying,
(24:13):
if you're a Christian, bring inthat Jesus fed everybody, or
Jesus did this, if you're not aChristian, bring in that. You do
it with joy. You do it withlove. You do whatever it is,
change the thoughts so that theaction will be backed up by a
(24:33):
positive instead of a judgmentor a thought that's not clear
that way, your act will not onlyhelp that person that you're
you're working with, but it willhelp do what we've been talking
about for how many sessions, itwill purify your own karma,
(24:58):
because you're in alignment withthought, with word and deed,
Kamala Rose (25:05):
and that's so important to remind us that
that's that the yoga of karmayoga, the internal work of karma
yoga, is really the mostImportant part how you're
thinking about it, seizing theopportunity to reframe your own
(25:25):
selfishness into into a serviceto what the Gita calls over and
over again. Here in chapterthree, we'll get to loka San
Gran. Ha, a wish for the welfareof everyone everywhere. I think
it's important to remember thatthis is at the base of the Gita.
(25:50):
It's at the base of the yogatradition, right? We don't
always, I mean, it's, it's notspelled out like this in every
single verse. The sincere wishfor the welfare of all. But it
is that, you know, it's theroots of the tree. Is the
desire, the the need, thedesire, the individual
(26:14):
responsibility to contribute tothe good of the whole, right?
If, if one suffers, we allsuffer. If society is
imbalanced, we all sufferbecause of that. Therefore, the
effort that we put into creatinga just society also benefits us
(26:37):
all. And so in terms of karmayoga, these are the verses that
we're moving towards in eight.
Krishna says that action issuperior to inaction. With
inaction, even caring for thebody would be impossible, right?
So, when to act, when towithhold action, this dialog,
(26:58):
very important dialog in thearea, in the in the this, this
time of, you know, all of usinvestigating the motive behind
our actions. I think you'reagain so right to bring up, you
know, the organizations that wework with, where does your money
go? Right for many of us, thatis how or for the whole world,
(27:21):
it's how we act by which causeswe support, which products we
buy. You know, where we take ourtime and energy that's converted
into money to buy those goods.
And so we ask ourselves, do Iwant to support a mission to
(27:44):
Mars with my dollars, or do Iwant to go to book shop? Do I
want to buy from an independentretailer instead? Right? We ask
ourselves these questionsbecause it comes down, am I
withholding my action onpurpose, or am I acting? Because
I think this is a good idea thatI want to get behind right here
(28:06):
in eight. Krishna says thatalways acting is better than not
acting, which you know for allof us this, this is another
verse that should be like amantra to us with inaction, even
caring for the body is notpossible. It's not possible to
not act in reality, to removeoneself from the world, and to
(28:32):
not contribute in any way.
Again, we're we're talking a lothere about monasticism and
people leaving the world. It'sworth noting. And something in a
verse like this, Krishna is theGita is really specifically
speaking to at the time manypeople were announcing the world
(28:54):
to follow the Buddha into theearly Sangha. And Krishna is
Karma Yoga is a reaction tothat. He's saying, don't leave
the world. Participate in theworld. Be a be be a positive
footprint in the world, and doit with the integrity of knowing
(29:16):
your thoughts, knowing yourmotives, yeah, that's how we can
be unbound.
Nischala Joy Devi (29:27):
And I think the other thing is realizing
that even meditation is anaction, prayer is an action. So
when we talk about being in theworld. We also have to, and I
think especially these days, wehave to understand that there
(29:48):
are some people that just can'tbe, whether they're physically,
unable to mentally, emotionally,whatever it is. But we don't
have to discount that they'reall the people that are praying
in these caves and monasteriesand other places. They're really
(30:10):
helping to uplift the level ofconsciousness in the world, and
so not thinking of it just as aphysical movement. But
everything we do is action,except when we still the mind
and body completely inmeditation. That's the only
(30:31):
time. Otherwise, we're always inaction. There was a really funny
movie, I believe it. Was made byAndy Warhol, many years ago, and
he filmed a man sleeping, yeah,sleep, yeah. He put a man, a
camera on a man for eight hours,and then he did a speed up. I
(30:54):
forget what it's called. Whenthey speed everything up. There
was no rest in this man at all.
He was moving from the rightside to the left side, foot up,
arm up. And so we think of sleepas being this restful time, but
we also have it's also the timethat we release. And meditation
(31:15):
is a lot like that too. It's ina more subtle level, but you
start to see a bubble come up.
Maybe it's a bubble of annoyanceat your neighbor, even it starts
to come up in meditation. Butbecause you're still, and
because the organs of action arestill, you watch it, and instead
(31:43):
of holding on to it like younormally would, you watch the
bubble come up and pop and it'sgone. That's what the ability to
be still does if you try to dothat within the action of seeing
your neighbor, it probablywouldn't work. So the truth here
(32:06):
has to be understood in the inthat so many different ways, not
just holding on to our beliefs,not just letting go of our
beliefs, but really seeing whichones serve us, which ones don't
serve us. That's where thediscrimination comes in. Very
(32:26):
clearly, we have to learn that.
So, yeah, we're sitting there.
Action is superior to inaction,yeah,
Kamala Rose (32:37):
yeah, and we can't not act. And meditation is an
action, and yoga practice is anaction. It's a dharmic action,
it's a skillful action, it's anaction that is taken
intentionally for the purpose ofpurifying the body and mind,
(32:58):
right? If we look at yogapractice as really a means of
tapas, a means of heating up thesystem, reducing the impurities
that we could even see clearly,that we would be able to tell
right? So when you know, when weset the timer to meditate and
sit in one place for 20 minutesor longer, we're, you know,
(33:23):
we're taking the action to sitdown there and to do something
about self understanding andself inquiry, understanding the
way, the way I work. And innine. Krishna says that all
actions bind when they are doneselfishly. Scary. The idea of
(33:49):
selfish action, I think, is, youknow, is coming from ego. Is
coming from the sense of I theahamkara. It's really a matter
of who is, who is the agenthere. Is it the Buddhi? Is it
the wisdom faculty being theagent of You, know, seeing
(34:10):
through your own patterns andunconscious bias? Or is it the
ahamkara, the eye maker, theego, the sense of individual
self that says, I want thisbecause I It helps me in the
story. It helps me perpetuatethe story of me. I look good in
(34:33):
this light. You know? I getbenefit from this action, right?
It serves my personality. Itserves the way people see me. I
derive material and personalbenefit from it, right? These
are the kinds of actions thatare done selfishly, and again,
(34:56):
this calls us really to behonest about our motives, right?
We live in the world. We can'tavoid having to earn money, no,
right? We can't avoid that. Andsomething I'm learning every
day, having to set up my set upmy online business so I can
teach some classes and interactwith some of you out there, it's
(35:21):
a lot of work. It takes a lot ofhustle right from a certain part
of oneself. That's identity, whoam I? Who do I want to tell
people I am, and all of thosesort of things. And you know,
this karma yoga is really askingus to just be able to. So, you
know, we need, we need a senseof identity to live in the
(35:43):
world, but it doesn't have torule us, and it doesn't have to
make all of the decisions, andwe've got to keep that broader
sense of what about all of us.
Nischala Joy Devi (35:58):
Yeah, you know, when I look at those three
slokas together, I can't helpthinking that there's a secret
message embedded in them. Andthat secret message to me is,
you need to change your life.
You need to change the actionsthat you have been doing,
(36:21):
repetitiously or unconsciously,or whatever you want to say. I
think what happens we tend towant to change the practices to
fit in with the meta, with ourlife, instead of changing our
life to fit in with thepractices if we're really
looking to do to do thingsselflessly as opposed to
(36:45):
selfishly, we need to slow downa little bit. We need to do one
action and make sure it's donein that way that we want without
before we move on to the nextaction. And I think the pace of
today's life keeps us fromreally analyzing, is this a
(37:06):
selfish act? Is this is selflessact? And I think somewhere
within these scriptures that Iremember learning a long time
ago is that a selfless act isone that brings benefit to some
and harm to no one. So you can'tsay, Well, I'm bringing some
(37:31):
harm to this and but it benefitsmost people. That's not
according to what we're reallylooking for, at least have it
neutral for people. So whenwe're talking about karma yoga,
every action that we do duringthe day can be transformed into
(37:52):
that. The simplest thing youknow, I remember years ago,
someone on the somewhere in theeast coast, where they have
tollways that you have to pay togo to Drive, someone started it
rush hour traffic. They paid forthe person behind them, and then
the person behind them, and thenit turned out, it went on for
(38:16):
three hours. People paying, theygot so excited and so into it.
And what fun it would be to seethe expression on the person's
face behind you in your rearview mirror when you the toll
taker said, Oh, no, you'vealready been paid for something
so simple like that can make adifference in someone's day,
(38:39):
even their life, especiallyyours. You know, what did? It
cost you very little in money,but it gave you a lot of joy. So
this action, slow it down, makeit something that really has an
(39:00):
effect and really lasts. I'msure people I'm still talking
about it, and it was years ago.
I'm sure other people have to,yeah,
Kamala Rose (39:13):
examples like that really illustrate, and I think,
show us how important it is thatwe're we feel that there is a
way we are contributing to tothe welfare of all of us, yeah,
(39:34):
right, a sense of purpose andbelonging to the world, which,
again, I think It's an, I thinkit's inherent in the Gita and
the next shlokas that we'll talkabout after this one, we're
going to start talking about theVedic worldview, that really is
a story of an integrated whole,right, where everybody's a part
(39:55):
of it. And, you know, Iremember, you know, right after
the 2016 election, I did a talkat the the Center for Ahimsa in
Pomona on the the dharma of ayoga teacher. And as part of it,
(40:15):
I had read a lot of what theDalai Lama was had been saying
about kind of how did thishappen? How did, how did we end
up with this? And he broughtattention to the idea that
everyone needs purpose, and ifthey don't have it right, if
they feel directionless and likethey're not, they don't have
(40:38):
personal value. Value withoutpurpose, and that's what drives
people into nationalism, anddrives people into ideas that
they they feel like they cancontribute and be a part of that
in a way that their society hasnot given that to them. So in a
way, he was trying to explain,how have we gotten here? And,
(41:01):
you know, at the time, it was soimpactful thinking about a sense
of purpose and belonging to theworld, and how, as yoga
teachers, we, you know, we cometo class and we're able to
belong to our communities in acertain way, of really helping
people impacting our communitiesby, you know, helping keep more
(41:23):
people on their feet and out ofthe physical therapy offices.
We're able to help people staycalmer in times of stress like
this. We sometimes provide asanctuary. But again, that idea
of purpose and and finding waysthat we can that our actions are
(41:44):
actually uplifting, yeah, thewelfare of everyone, right? So
we say here that when we turnevery action into a selfless
offering, this is what frees usfrom our personal attachment.
You know this? This is somethingwe have to all frame for
(42:06):
ourselves. How is it that we arecontributing to our world?
Right? You brought up a lot ofexamples of you know, how we
can? We can contribute tocharities. We can just do
spontaneous acts of kindness, wecan, most importantly
investigate our motives in whywe're doing what we're doing,
(42:28):
making a selfless offering ofour actions. I think we, I think
is important that we're able toconnect to the meaning of the
tradition in serving not onlyour own practice, but serving
our society through our actions,helping to make it a better
place to uphold Dharma right, tofight corruption, by siding with
(42:54):
Dharma, by teaching dharma. Andfor me, this is very meaningful,
and it's certainly has saved mea lot of heartache in troubling
times.
Nischala Joy Devi (43:08):
And I think you can really see, if you if
you look the people who havereally earnestly gone inside.
And embraced the idea of karmayoga, have meditated and gotten
(43:30):
their mind in a balanced placethat they can perform it without
all the extraneous emotion thatdrags us down, that you can
actually go out and do a protestwith peace in your heart,
(43:50):
because if you don't bring peaceto a protest, you're Lost.
Kamala Rose (43:55):
Yeah, that's a good thought to end on. I These,
these shlokas. I I really thinkthese are some of the ones that
we should always have close by.
These are some of the mostpractical verses in the Bhagavad
Gita as yoga teachers. They'll,you know, they'll, they'll guide
(44:17):
us through a lot, they'll giveus the framework to navigate
many, many situations. And so wehope that our dialogs are
serving you, helping you to tonavigate your life and be a
better teacher. And we'd love tohear from you any questions.
Please leave us in the comments,and thanks for making time for
(44:38):
our dialog today. Namaste.
Namaste.
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