March 5, 2025 • 41 mins
What does it take to transform your life when you feel all is lost? Join us as we delve into the heartwarming journey of Jon Ponder, a man who escaped the clutches of addiction and crime to find purpose and hope. Raised in challenging circumstances in New York, John grappled with the realities of a fatherless family and the harsh streets, leading him to a life of crime from a young age. After multiple incarcerations, it was in the darkest hours of his life that he would encounter a message of faith that would change everything.
Jon's story illustrates the immense power of redemption and divine intervention as he recounts his time in prison and the pivotal moment when he chose to embrace a new path. With prayer guiding him, he turned his life around and devoted himself to helping others who had walked similar paths. As the founder of Hope for Prisoners, Jon's mission focuses on preparing incarcerated individuals for life beyond the walls of the prison system. Through mentorship and community support, he actively works to ensure that transitioning back to life outside is empowering, holistic, and sustainable.
This episode is a testament to the transformative power of faith and the importance of second chances. Listeners will take away not only inspiration from Jon’s life but practical insights into how we can help others in their journeys. Explore how Jon has built paths of opportunity for formerly incarcerated individuals and learn how you can be part of this life-altering journey of hope and recovery. Let’s engage in meaningful conversations about redemption, community impact, and making a difference. Don't forget to subscribe, share your reviews, and engage with us to help spread the message of transformation!
Follow Jon Ponder here: https://www.instagram.com/jondponder/
Check out the incredible work he is doing at Hope for Prisoners! https://www.instagram.com/hopeforprisoners/
Website: https://hopeforprisoners.org/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
What's up, guys?
This is Matt with A Vota Talk,or the Real Matt Walton.
This is your hub for all thingsKingdom business business as
ministry business strategy.
My goal is to provide as muchvalue, minute by minute, each
podcast that you listen to.
So let's get to it.
What's up guys?
This is Matt Walton with A VotaTalk, or the Real Matt Walton,
(00:21):
depending on how you found me.
And today I've got a veryspecial guest which I'll
introduce here in a moment.
But, man, I, just God, is doingsome incredible things and I
would really want to encourageeverybody with this man.
I've been waking up early andexercising, really focused on
dieting or my diet not so muchdieting and really dialing in my
(00:42):
sleep and dialing in the thingsthat I am consuming, whether if
we're talking food or content,and it's equating into me being
more present with my daughter,me having more present time with
my wife and some incredibletimes with the Lord, and so, man
, it's awesome, feel incredible,and so just want to encourage
everybody with that.
And today I want to get into.
(01:03):
We've got a really specialstory today of just redemption
and the power of God'sredemption, redemptive power,
and John Ponder is who isvisiting us today, man, so
welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Matt, thank you so much for having me.
I'm honored to be here.
Hey brother, thank you forbeing here.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
So we met at one of my guys.
So most of you know I hire.
Pretty much all of my guys arecoming from prison and most of
them are coming through aprogram called Hope for
Prisoners, which John founded,and he's a CEO of it now and
he's operating on a day-to-daybasis, and so all of my or most
of my guys are coming from there.
I was actually at a fatherhoodgraduation that was affiliated
(01:41):
with Hope for Prisoners and thatwas where me and John met.
So I was getting a laptop fromone of my guys while John walked
up to my family and I thinky'all gifted them a laptop at
graduation.
And then I come walking up andI had a kingdom-minded shirt on
and the next thing, you know,john and I were out to breakfast
and we've just stayed in touchever since.
(02:01):
And so, man, it's awesome towatch how you know in touch ever
since.
And so, man, it's awesome towatch how we have very similar
hearts in regards to people thatare incarcerated.
I am a big believer on if we canimpact those that are
incarcerated.
That's where we really canaffect this world, because for
some reason, we are wired if weknow somebody's got a crazy past
(02:23):
or some felonies.
We respect that or look up tothat, even before the radical
change can happen in their life.
And so I believe that when wepour into these guys, that we
can affect families first, weaffect the man first, the
families second, and then thataffects the neighborhoods and
the cities and the states andour world, and so this is a
(02:43):
world changer right here, man.
So thanks again for coming on.
So I really want to get intothe early years and talk about
kind of what happened in yourearly years, briefly, before you
were incarcerated, where youmet the Lord and then what it
looked like kind of leading upto you being released.
Right, okay, Well.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
Again, thank you so much for the opportunity.
Let's talk about the earlyyears, because I think that that
is really important.
You know, I grew up in thestreets of New York, product of
a single parent home.
Dad left home at a very earlyage, leaving my mom to raise
five knucklehead boys and oneknucklehead girl all by herself,
and growing up in thatenvironment without the father
in the home.
(03:23):
My story is not much differentfrom other stories in other
urban communities.
Without that father in the home,we turned to the streets at a
very early age to kind ofvalidate masculinity and for me,
the streets led me to the drugs.
Drugs led me to the gangs.
Gangs led me to the criminalactivity and that criminal
activity led me to my very firstset of handcuffs at the tender
(03:44):
age of 12 years old and lifejust kind of spiraled out of
control from there.
I caught my first felonyconviction at 16 years old,
didn't learn my lesson in andout of jails and in prisons.
I had became addicted toeverything known to man at a
very early age and I left NewYork back in 1989, and I moved
(04:08):
out to Las Vegas, right andhoping that the grass was
greener on the other side.
But for me I tell everybody thatI went from the frying pan
smack dab into the middle of thefire and all those things that
Las Vegas is famous for.
That became a very big part ofmy life and I became a very big
part of it Continued on thattrajectory in and out of the
(04:31):
Clark County Detention Center.
You know criminal thinking,criminal behavior.
I did two prison terms here inthe state of Nevada, didn't
learn my lesson and then I gotstretched out in the maximum
security United States federalpenitentiary.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
OK, and that's where.
Is that where you met the Lord?
Was in there while you'refighting the case, or when did
you meet the Lord and what wasthat?
I don't know if this is alittle bit before, but what was
that prayer that you prayed?
Oh, absolutely For God.
Yeah, I know unmistakably theday that I met the Lord Right.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
No, unmistakably.
The day that I met the Lordright, it was before I got
sentenced in prison.
I'm in the detention center andI'm upset.
I'm withdrawing from a drugaddiction and I'm facing the
potential of spending the next23 years of my life in prison.
And I'm sick, I'm angry, I'mfighting everybody.
(05:21):
They threw me into solitaryconfinement and in that moment I
had the chance to look backover the last 37 years of my
life.
And not only did I neveraccomplish anything of great
significance, but I'm playingthese thoughts out of my mind
that I left the path ofdestruction.
You know, I destroyed the livesof people that I profess with
(05:43):
my mouth that I love and I'llnever forget.
One day was a chaplain who cameby my door and I'm upset.
He opened up the tiny littlefood flap, looked through the
door and said something like youknow, hey, brother, jesus loves
you.
And I cursed him out and ranhim away from my door.
I wasn't trying to hear it, butbefore he left and closed the
food flap, he dropped the Biblethrough the food flap and was
(06:08):
set on the floor.
I left it on the floor.
I'm on a hunger strike.
I'm facing.
My life is over.
I have the you know, thepotential to spend practically
the rest of my life in prison.
And I left the Bible on thefloor.
Two weeks later, chapman comesback again and he opened up the
food flap, said hey, jesus lovesyou, brother.
And I cursed him out again andchased him away from the door.
(06:28):
But before he left he droppedanother book through the door.
It was a daily devotional.
I didn't even know what a dailydevotional was back then.
It was a daily devotional byKenneth Copeland and the title
of this book was the Pursuit ofHis Presence, and I left it on
the floor.
And then two, three weeks afterthat, out of complete boredom,
(06:50):
I picked up the Daily Devotional.
I opened it up to what date Ithought it was, and I read the
little story and something beganto leap on the inside of me.
And then at the top cornerthere was oh my gosh, it was
this passage of scripture thatwas in there.
And I reached out on the floorand I picked up the Bible and
turned to that passage ofscripture and I began to read
(07:12):
the Bible.
And as I began to read theBible, man, I couldn't put it
down.
The next day I got up and Igrabbed the daily devotional
again and I went back to theBible and I started reading the
Bible.
And then something began to theBible and I started reading the
Bible and then something beganto crack wide open in me.
But I have to tell you that backwhen we lived in New York, in
an effort for my mom to get abreak, she used to send us down
(07:34):
to Mississippi, right to mygrandmother's house.
Her name was Medea and this wasthe real Medea, it wasn't this
Tyler Perry and we used to getdown to Mississippi and Medea
had this incredible love forJesus and we'd be going back and
forth to church and I canremember the days of her sitting
us in front of that dusty blackpiano and she's cracking open
(07:55):
these hymn books and we'resinging these songs Jazz, jesus
Loves Me and Amazing Grace.
What Medea was doing all thoseyears ago is Medea was sowing
seeds into us every summer, butat the end of the summer we'd be
back on the Greyhound bus backup to New York and back into the
streets.
But it wasn't until that moment, when I cracked that Bible open
(08:17):
, that all those seeds thatMedea was sowing began to bring
forth the harvest and I couldn'tput my Bible down and I stood
in that holding cell and I askedGod to forgive me for all those
things that I've done andunmistakably I know he did.
But then I made the qualitydecision.
I changed my life.
(08:38):
I asked Jesus to come into myheart and be the Lord of my life
.
A month after that, it's timefor me to go to court.
And I'm at the federalcourthouse down in Las Vegas
Boulevard and I'm shackled by myhands and feet and I played
let's make a deal with God.
And what I said was God, listen, I know that.
I know that.
You know that you're realbecause you revealed yourself to
(09:01):
me in that solitary confinement.
And what I'm asking you to dois to go before me in this
courtroom right, move the judgeout of the way, judge James
Mahan, who is my dear friendtoday.
And what I asked God was toclimb into the robe of Judge
Mahan and I said God, you be myjudge.
(09:21):
And then I said to him whatevertime I get, whether it's 10
years or 50 years, I said God,search the meditation of my
heart.
I am going to spend the rest ofthis life, into eternity,
serving you.
Let whatever time I get comefrom you and I stepped up in
that courtroom and, unmistakably, I stepped up into the presence
(09:42):
of God, right, you just feltthe presence of God in this
courtroom.
And after I got finished sayingwhat it was I was saying, judge
Mahan said to me you know, mrPonder, I've sat on this bench
for X amount of years.
I've never heard anybody saywhat it is you're going to say.
Right, and I had not known atthe time that Judge Mahan had a
relationship with Jesus.
And he said to me that listen,and I'm not.
(10:05):
And he says I'm going to dothis and I don't know why I'm
doing it.
But he said to me I'm not goingto give you what you deserve.
And it was in that moment thatI know that my father heard my
prayers because he sent his sonthat I might not get what I
deserve.
So he said, instead of megiving you this, I'm going to
give you this.
And oh my gosh, it's not the 50years, 23 years.
(10:27):
I thought it was going to be.
My God showed up and then, asthe US Marshals were escorting
me back into the holding cell, Iheard them behind me saying man
, I don't know what happened inthere and I said I know I did.
My father showed up.
So, as they put me back in theholding cell, took the shackles
off my feet and my hands, I felldown on the floor and I'm
thanking God and I'm saying, ohmy goodness, god, thank you, and
(10:50):
I'm weeping and I'm crying.
I'm on this stainless steelfloor and thank you, jesus.
Thank you, jesus, thank you forshowing up.
And I felt God like the lips ofGod came right to my ear and he
said to me my son, I honoredwhat you asked me to do.
He said never forget thepromise that you made to me that
(11:11):
I'm going to spend the rest ofthis life, into eternity,
serving you.
And I got up off that floor andJesus took my life in a 180
degree turn and never lookedback.
Now I still got to go to amaximum security United States
federal penitentiary because Ihave to pay my debt to society.
But in my mind, in my heart andin my spirit, I did not walk
into a United States federalpenitentiary.
(11:33):
I walked into a United StatesBible college and I walked up in
there and I went to school.
I spent every waking moment ofmy time, number one, getting to
know this God that I justsurrendered my life to, and the
more and more I began tounderstand who he is and the
magnitude of what it was thathe's done for me, the more and
(11:54):
more I began to understand aboutme and who it is that he
created me to be.
And that's when I had come tothe realization that I'm not the
name that the streets gave me.
I'm not the name that thosegirls thought I was.
I'm not the name that thestreets gave me.
I'm not the name that thosegirls thought I was.
I'm not the name that the gangthought I was.
I am who my God says that I am,and I can do everything that my
(12:16):
God says that I can do.
And it was in that moment thathe impregnated me with this
vision of Hope for prisoners tobe able to turn right back
around and help the other menand women that were in bondage
to the same things that I was inbondage with, and give me the
opportunity to be his hands andhis feet, to untie them from
(12:40):
them things and help to escortthem up to the next level of
life.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
So then you still had to finish out the sentence
right there You're basically inBible college at this time,
continuing to pursue after theLord every single day.
Yeah, and then you get released.
Was that all of a sudden thing?
Did you have a target date?
Did you know how did thathappen?
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Oh yeah, I had to finish out the rest of my
sentence and I was released fromfederal prison May 9th of 2009.
And that's when I began to hitthe ground, running, you know,
digging trenches in thiscommunity, trying to give birth
to this thing that God gave me,and it was a challenge.
You know, much like womengiving birth, this is a struggle
(13:20):
and pain.
It's just that my labor lastedfor the next two years and it
was.
It was when I when I tell youit was challenging, whereas
every door that I was trying toopen up listen, I come home.
I'm fired for Jesus.
I'm on fire for this vision,and every door that I tried to
open up got slammed in my face.
I couldn't raise any funding,nobody wanted to touch me
(13:42):
because I had all these X's onmy back.
And here I am telling peopleI'm starting this reentry
organization and I had nothingcoming.
But I share that and I'd liketo encourage people this
whenever God gives you a visionand you know that it's a vision
and God said yes when the worldaround you is telling you no
(14:02):
one's slamming doors, you got toalways hold on to that yes that
God gave you.
Amen, speaking probation.
(14:28):
There's probation in the feds.
I got a job working full-time ata local company here in town
that we partnered with and theyhire people to this day, and
this was an incredible familythat had given me the
opportunity that when I startedputting Hope for Prisons
together and I have to takemeetings, they would give me the
flexibility to come in a littlebit late or have an extra long
(14:50):
lunch and I'm having meetingsand put it together.
And I worked for this companyfor about a year and a half and
I'll never forget the day I'm inthe office and I'm working and
I hear clearly from God you know, get up and give you a two
weeks notice.
I'm like, wait, what you know?
Here I am sitting here sayingyou know, I just got married, I
have a new wife, I got a familyto support, and here it is God
(15:14):
telling me to get up and givethem my two weeks notice.
I'm like, oh my goodness.
And when I heard it again, Isaid, okay, I'm going to do this
, but first I had to call mywife and I had to say honey,
listen, this is what, right,right.
I got to get her to confirm it.
And when I shared that with mywife, my wife said hey, listen,
I heard the same thing two weeksago but I did not want to tell
(15:37):
you because I don't want you tothink it was coming from me.
She said I was waiting for youto hear it from the Lord.
But I'm good with it, because Iheard the same thing and I get
up that's the scariest thing Iever did and went in this office
and gave my two weeks noticeand then I leaped full fledged
into Hope for Prisoners andstarted, you know, putting
(15:59):
everything together, okay,completely stepping out in faith
.
Right, and not that I had themoney to do it, because I didn't
, I just got married.
We're practically broke, livingpaycheck to paycheck.
But I think that when God wantsyou to step out in faith in
something, if you're going tohave true faith in him, you
(16:20):
don't make the decision basedoff of what it is you have in
the bank account.
You don't make it based off ofwhat you can see.
Because you step out in to whatGod is calling you to do based
on what you have in there, thenyou have faith in that.
That true faith is stepping outto the edge of a cliff and
(16:41):
looking down at the bottom andyou can't see the bottom.
You're staring into the abyssand when you do a Peter Pan off
that cliff, blindfolded, can'tsee the bottom, and as you're
jumping off the cliff, you justclose your eyes and say God, I'm
doing what it is that you haveasked me to do.
(17:05):
I need you to show up right now, because if you don't show up
right now, it's over.
That's the true faith.
I think that that's the faiththat God wants us to be able to
move in.
So it's nothing that John Ponderdid.
It's not anything that I savedup in this bank account.
I know that.
I know that.
I know God gave me.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
Yeah, so did you have at this time?
Did you have mentors?
Did you have people that werecoming alongside you, that were
helping you formulate businessplans?
How did that look?
Or were you simply going offthe vision, making relationships
, networking, but prior to megetting out, god was revealing
to me, even in biblicalprinciples, right?
Speaker 2 (17:57):
that I needed to surround myself with people that
were getting the results that Iwanted to get out of life.
I hit the ground and I soughtthose people out Even before I
took my wife's hand in marriage.
Right, I sought out people thatwere married, that getting
results, that I wanted to get alife.
And I sought out those peoplein the church.
(18:19):
This person was married 40years.
This person married 25, 18.
And I slid up underneath themand I walked with them for a
period of time as they allowedme to come into their life and I
had to learn from them Because,to be transparent, I didn't
know how to love my wife.
Every relationship that I hadbeen into up to that moment,
(18:41):
either two things happened itended in destruction or ended in
divorce.
So what would happen if I wouldhave taken my wife's end in
marriage?
The only reference point that Ihave up in here is destruction
and divorce.
So I had to put things ontimeout and slide up into the
lives of people so they can showme how men ought to love their
(19:04):
wife, so they could show me howto have conflict but bring
resolution, until I learned wellfrom them.
That's when I said to my wifetime in, let's go do this.
But it was important to keepthose people there to help me to
navigate those differentchoices.
So what I had to do when I wasputting together Hope for
Business, I had to take thatmechanism that I learned and
(19:28):
then drop that into everycompartment of my life, every
compartment of the ministry.
I have a phenomenal board ofdirectors, right that you know
they're my go-to people.
You know Hope for Prison's gotall this national attention and
all this success and everythinglike that.
I do nothing without going tomy go-to people and saying, hey,
listen, what do you think right?
(19:48):
And I take their advice.
Now, sometimes, even in mymarriage mentors, just like in
the ministry mentors when I goto those people, sometimes they
don't tell me what I want tohear, right, but they always
tell me the truth.
But I always do what it is thatthey tell me to do Right
Because you know you surroundyourself with people that are
(20:10):
getting those results that youwant to get out of life.
My personal life, the ministryitself and other compartments of
my life would not be what it istoday had I not had my I still
have my go to people to be ableto tell me what it is that that
you know to do.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
I want to park there real quick, because just some of
the things that I take is theobedience, and the obedience
comes from like pursuing theLord, and one of the things that
happened whenever I came outhere was I started to go to the
mountains and just get alongwith the Lord.
Early in the mornings or latein the afternoons I'll go up
there and just pursue the Lord.
That was when God gave me thevision which ultimately landed
you and I having a relationshipAbsolutely.
(20:53):
And so you know it's that.
It's understanding that I don'thave all the answers.
I don't want to be the smartestguy in the room, I want to be
the dumb guy in the room, I wantto be surrounded by people that
have been there, done that, andthat's one of the.
That's one thing that it takessomebody with arrogance or with
ego or pride.
It's nearly impossible for usto progress in life whenever we
can't get through and can't getover our flesh, and impossible
(21:17):
for us to progress in lifewhenever we can't get through
and can't get over our flesh,and that manifests itself with
ego and pride.
But when we actually lay thatdown at the foot of the cross
and whenever we say, okay, god,it's not my will, but it's your
will.
Show me who you want me to bearound, what you want me to say,
give me questions to ask andgive me the heart to hear what
it is that they have to say.
Oh, absolutely, and trustingthat God's going to speak
through other people.
Yeah, not just speaking to you,that's right.
That was a struggle for mine.
Yeah, like, for some reason, Ihad it in my mind that God was
(21:38):
only speaking to me about myvision that God had given me.
Yes, and I could not be furtherfrom the truth.
That's right.
And so I want to park there inthe sense of what did?
Did your relationship like yourrelationship with God?
How did that look?
You were pursuing God, likewhat did that look like?
Now, I'm not talking aboutchurch and all of that I'm
talking about those, those quiettimes, right, those, those
(22:00):
times along the road, oh,absolutely.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
And I I say that, usp , allenwood, in the hills of
Pennsylvania, right, was, was,was my, was my, my, my learning
time, that was my time with theLord, where I spent every waking
moment of my time and God wastraining me.
I was being trained to get downon my knees every morning and
surrender my to the Lord.
(22:21):
I was trained to still myselfin the busyness of what's
happening in a tough prison, tostill myself to be able to
always, always, hear from theLord.
God taught me in that time thathe is always speaking.
It's just sometimes it's usthat we're not listening.
(22:41):
You know my dear friend ScottHarold, who used to be with SOS
Radio.
Right, it was 90.5 on the radiostation and it's set on 90.5
all times.
And in my house, in my car, andI'm listening to my friend
Scott Harreld in the morning.
And if one morning I got in thecar and my daughters, as I'm
taking to school, turned it notoff 90.5, but they turned it to
(23:05):
90.6.
And I get in the car and I canstill hear Scott Harreld
speaking it might be a littlefuzzy, right, because it's not
dialed in.
And if one day I get in the carthey turn to the 98.8, right, I
still might be able to hear him, but it's not so clear because
I'm not dialed in.
And if one day they get in andturn it to 89.3, I can't hear my
(23:28):
friend Scott Harrell becauseI'm not dialed in.
Well, the kingdom, and justbecause I can't hear him, that
doesn't mean he's not talking.
The kingdom of God works thesame way.
God is always talking, but it'sup to us to make sure that we
are completely dialed in.
So I learned in prison how toshut the noise off from the
(23:50):
world around me and just staydialed in to God, because he is
always talking and I always wantto be in a place where I'm
going to hear from him.
I don't even want to take astep.
I take a step in anything, matt, on my own, I'm going to crash.
Does that make sense?
Oh, percent.
So I too escape up to Red RockCanyon and climb up on the
(24:11):
backside of the Spring MountainPreserves.
Man, I put my earplugs in andthere's a little ledge there.
I sit there, look over thatSpring Mountains Reserve, crack
my Bible open and I have thisalone time with my Lord.
See, that's what it is that Godcalls us to do, because when
you look throughout the Bible,before Jesus started doing
(24:31):
miracles, the Bible said that hedisappeared and went into the
mountains and prayed, and thenhe came home.
And when he came down, this iswhen he said hey, lazarus, come
out.
Right, blind man, get up.
When he called Lazarus out ofthe tombs, jesus didn't go like
this Lazarus come out.
He knew what it was, because hesays that I always hear from my
(24:56):
father.
Speaker 1 (24:59):
I know, for me, when I'm not hearing from the Lord,
it's because I have sin in mylife, and that is the thing, the
very thing that I'm stillhearing from the Lord.
Hey, matt, I need you to stopthis.
I need you to stop this.
No, no, no, no.
But come on.
We're doing so many good thingsover here, we're doing this, I
mean everything's kingdom.
You got a sin in your life, matt.
You need to stop.
You need to stop.
(25:28):
And when we rid ourselves ofthat by being covered with the
stage of repentance, and then itopens up the floodgates.
This is like a personal storyin my life.
Whenever God just startsspeaking and speaking and
showing me visions of what'scoming next and it says in John
that the Holy Spirit will gobefore you, it will tell you
what is coming next, and so it'sbeing dialed into that.
How can we be dialed into that?
(25:49):
And it starts with obedience ofridding ourselves of our flesh
and the sin.
That that's incredible.
So now I want to go to the kindof those beginning years of
when Hope for Prisoners started.
I would imagine there was a lotof difficult times, maybe
making payroll, maybe gettingsome money.
How did that look?
(26:10):
What was the tipping pointthere?
And then we'll get to the otherside of that.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Matt tell you a great story in that I remember I quit
a thousand times.
I quit a thousand times andquestions like God, was this you
or was this me that was doingthis?
I'll never forget the time Iquit.
I remember I'm in my office andwe're expecting this money to
come in and I got some.
I don't even have people on thepayroll this time.
(26:35):
I got volunteers in the officeand I was supposed to get this
email on Monday.
It didn't come and I'm startingto get discouraged, waiting for
it all day.
Tuesday it didn't come.
Wednesday, it didn't come.
Now.
Thursday I told the volunteersthat you know, don't even come
in today, Right, and I stayed inthe office by myself and I'm
praying.
And Friday I get the email andit said the money ain't coming.
And in that moment, man, I quit, I'm not doing this.
(26:56):
I stopped playing theseconversations off in my head.
That number one what am I goingto say to my wife?
Right?
And number two what am I goingto say to the people that I'm
accountable to?
That's holding me accountable,right?
So I get up and I start walkingover to the door and I went to
shut the light off to go.
And I hear clearly from theLord to sit down.
And I sit down on the couch andthen God hit me with this.
(27:17):
Remember when.
Then God hit me with this,remember when.
And he took me back to a timewhen I first got out of prison,
in my very first meeting withMetro, inside the Clark County
Detention Center.
There was a chaplain there thatI knew.
Her name was Bonnie Polly, whoworked in CCDC, and I knew
Bonnie Polly from all the timesI'm in and out, but they invited
me in to build something outfor them, a reentry portion of
(27:41):
it.
I was like, yeah, I'm all in.
And then she asked me you know,can you, you want to go
upstairs and let me show youwhere you're going to be working
?
I was like, oh sure, and theytake me over and they give me a
little escort badge up in here.
I clip this thing on and I startwalking over this elevator and
the elevator that was using togo upstairs.
I was like, oh my gosh, I'vebeen in this elevator 67 times,
(28:10):
but every time I walk in thiselevator you have to face the
wall.
But this time I'm looking atthe door and I hear God say to
me do you see how.
I turned you around and as theelevator's going up and Bonnie
Polly and a couple of programsoff, they're talking, the higher
this thing goes up.
I can't hear anything they'resaying, I'm just watching their
lips move.
And we get up to the floor thatwe're going to go to, right,
and I step out and I look downthe hall and I was like, oh my
(28:33):
gosh, I see a line of inmateswalking, being escorted by the
officers to go where they'regoing, and I walk right past
them and, matt, I get into thesally port of the unit that
we're going and they're standingthere having a conversation
with me and I can't hear nothingthey're saying.
But it's in that sally port.
(28:53):
You have the ability to seewhat's happening in all the
units, right?
So as I'm standing there nowlisten, I'm watching people do
jail.
I'm watching to see peoplesitting over there drinking
coffee.
I see people under the pillline, people waiting for the
telephone.
I see guys leaning up againstthe door having a conversation
(29:16):
with somebody as they're sippingthat little cup of coffee.
And I heard God say to me doyou see what I set you free from
?
And I'm like my gosh.
And then he said to me thatthere are people that are in
there that are just like theprodigal son and I love them and
(29:37):
I want them.
Then he said to me that thereare people in there that don't
even know my name.
He says I love them too.
And he said John Ponder, Ichose you, go in there, untie
them and bring them to me.
And he said I know it's a toughtime right now it says that no
(29:58):
good soldier engaged in warfareentangles himself with the
affairs of this life.
That he might please him.
Who enlisted him as a soldier?
So, sitting in that officewhere I quit that day, and God
said to me that you're in themiddle of this war, if you walk
off the battlefield right now,you're going to be absent
(30:21):
without leave.
And he said, since I'm the onlyone who ordered you in, only
one can order you out.
And I got up off that couch,matt, and I never quit again,
understanding that,understanding that as people get
into the ministry with you,that there comes a time that
they're not even on thebattlefield with you, no more.
They were only there for aseason, but until I hear clearly
(30:43):
from God, it's time to tap out.
Man, I got to stay hard in thepaint to please him.
Who enlisted me as a soldier inthis army of the Lord?
Speaker 1 (30:53):
And I'm reminded I was reading Psalm 51 and I was
reading in the NASB and it hashis loving kindness, it combines
those two words, yes, and it's,it symbolizes in the Hebrew
it's I think it's calledShishesh or something like that
in the Hebrew but it's his, it'shis covenant loyalty, right,
right.
And there's times whenever wewe think about it in our worldly
(31:15):
minds and we forget about thesupernatural power of this book
and the words that he has givento us, and it's so easy for us
to look and for us to give upand just say you know what?
Yeah, I don't see it happening.
But he says that he's the alphaand the omega, he knows our
beginning and he knows our end.
So why not trust him?
He's sovereign and good tobring to fruition.
(31:36):
And we see this happen withJoseph, I mean, it took 13 years
.
It happened with Daniel, withDavid, I mean, there was
incredible visions and promisesthat were given to them.
Absolutely, it took a lot oftime.
Yep, and man, that's justspeaking to my soul.
Yeah, for the sake of time, man.
I want to go to two more things.
I want to go to kind of afterthat, in the vision of where
things are at right now, what'sbeing worked on right now, and
(31:59):
then if there's something thatis coming that y'all are working
on, absolutely, and then maybemix in there, if you can, maybe
a supernatural something thiswhole thing has been
supernatural, right, butsomething along those lines and
then we'll start to, we'll getto the end of it, yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:13):
Yeah, so we're in an incredible spot right now.
One of the things that we'rereally proud of is we, because
we've learned that.
We know that that reentrystarts day one right, and a lot
of times in prison systems wherethey're failing miserably, they
come up with these pre-releaseprograms and it starts 90 days
before the person gets out.
Right, it's too late If thatperson is laid down in prison
(32:36):
for 10, 15 years and doneabsolutely nothing to prepare
himself for them get for him toget out and all of a sudden, 60,
90 days you're going to put himthrough some pre-release
program.
It's not going to work right.
So we start working.
We built the program out atSouthern Desert Correctional
Center where Governor JoeLombardo had given us the
(32:57):
opportunity.
We have our own unit out there,so we have 120 men inside a
unit where we have a chance towork with them up to 18 months
before they get released.
And we go in and we doleadership development,
substance abuse counselor,marriage, family therapy,
addressing trauma 101, biblestudies.
We stream church in there andjust being able to connect with
(33:21):
them, to have them address allthe issues surrounding the
circumstances that led to theirincarceration and help them to
arm themselves against thosethings never happening again so
they can get back to thebusiness of life.
The thing that we're reallyproud of is that at the six
month from release mark right,we have them 18 months, but six
(33:43):
months to the gate we get themenrolled in our vocational
village, matt, where we stood upin HVAC, electrical welding,
plumbing, masonry, warehouselogistics and we dropped the
commercial driver's licenseschool in the prison and that
gives us the ability to numberone first get their mind right
and then, from the training, getthose certifications so that we
(34:06):
can tie that directly withemployment where they're going
to earn a sustainable wage,where they can take care of
themselves and be able to takecare of their family.
But when they walk out the backdoor they're not just out in
the community by themselves.
Now they get dropped into the18-month post-release that God
has built up and we've beenrunning for 14 years.
(34:26):
We're truly, truly excitedabout that.
We know that it was somesupernatural things that made
that happen because you know,anytime you're dealing with
corrections, it's this custodything and this safety and
security thing.
But you know we're verygrateful that they thought
outside the box and enabled usto be able to build that up.
(34:47):
So that was phase one.
Phase two that we're working on, we're going to build out a
diesel and auto mechanic schoolright there at that facility and
then simultaneously, god iscalling me up to Northern Nevada
to build another one up inNorthern Nevada.
We're going to be up there atthe end of the second quarter of
this year doing someexploratory things.
(35:07):
But we know that the minute thatwe break around on it, god does
things at an accelerated rate.
Because how many times in theBible does it say that there was
a suddenly Right?
Because I just feel thesuddenly coming.
And once we get that done, matt, we're going to pluck that up
out.
It's a statewide model now andthat's when we're going to pluck
that up out of that model, upout of Nevada, and begin to drop
(35:30):
that in jurisdictions allacross the country.
Dallas-fort Worth is probablynext.
You know, I know that God iscalling us there.
It's opportunity, there'speople there, there are funders
that want to fund it and I willnot move until I hear from God
so we can make the perfect time.
Because you move before youhear from God, you run the
potential of creating an Ishmaeland we don't want to.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
Yeah, wow, okay.
Well, I know we're up on time,but before we go I just want to
honor you because this was whenI came out here.
It paves the way for me to dowhat I do and because of what
God is doing in your life andthrough the ministry and all the
people that serve and that workwith you and work for you, it's
(36:15):
most of my guys are comingthrough Ponder's program and so
and now that we're talking aboutgoing into other states, as I
buy businesses in other statescome on this ecosystem we're
going to be following.
But it's because of that thatwe have the ability to bring
these guys in and to continueand compliment the mentoring and
(36:37):
discipleship that they'realready doing and give these
guys and eventually women anddiscipleship that they're
already doing and give theseguys and eventually women.
Like I cannot wait till thisgrows and we have nonprofits and
we're able to start bringing inwomen to the mix as well.
But this is the whole reason whywe have the ability to pull
them from prison.
Like, while they are in prison,like most of my guys are going
to take public transportation Iget goosebumps Public
(36:58):
transportation back to prisontoday at 2.30, 3 o'clock value,
and it's just one of the mostincredible things I want to
(37:23):
encourage everybody out there toreally, if you don't have a
program like this available inyour state, but you are able to
bring people, maybe from otherprograms or off of the streets,
to start to explore hiringpeople based on their values
instead of based on theirskillset, and grow them like do
on the job training.
That is the way that we canreally get to those people that
(37:44):
nobody else is going to get tobecause it's too much work,
absolutely, and I welcome thatand I know you welcome that a
little bit like bring it on,like I'm willing to do that out
of obedience to God, for gloryto God, because I know his word
and I know God is sovereign.
So, man, I thank you for that.
And these men I know I toldthem this morning you were
coming.
They were so excited, yeah,yeah, yeah, and I'm just honored
(38:05):
that you would come on and dothat.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
And so, man, thank you for what it is that you do
with these men and mentoringthem and so forth and so on.
And you know, because the thingthat I've learned and I speak
from my own personal experienceis that the vast majority of
people from this segment of thepopulation they want to change,
they want to do better.
They have no idea how to do it.
So when we come alongside themand provide them with the tools
(38:32):
to not only be able to get agood job and maintain that job
and grow in that job, but whenwe lay down the foundation and
that's what it is that you'redoing here, helping to lay down
the foundation to where they canbuild up this brand new life,
and we blow wind underneaththeir wings, release them into
(38:52):
their destiny, and by doing thatwatch this we have the ability
to reach down and touch the nextgeneration of the family.
That's the level of impact,because children are going to
grow up and they're going to dowhat they see mom and dad doing.
So when we help them to makethe decision to improve the
(39:12):
caliber of how they're going tolive the rest of their life, we
got little eyes watching them.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Come on, amen, if you don't mind.
I would like to, if you don'tmind, praying for everybody
that's listening share a 30second story.
Two of my guys that were comingfrom your program Surrender to
Life to the Lord.
We were on the clock.
We were a part of the last onewith Taylor, and that's so
special because I know you'veknown him for a long time.
(39:42):
But I believe that we're goingto start seeing just this wave
of salvations happen in themarketplace and I believe that
God is calling those that arelistening to step up to the
plate.
And I know there's a vision onetime that was given of this
warehouse that was full of thesecrowns of people that did not
answer the call.
And so just some encouragementthere to listen, seek the Lord
(40:03):
and answer that call and justmove out of obedience and know
that you're gonna run into a lotof uncertain times You're gonna
struggle with how are we gonnado this?
But seek the Lord, analyzeeverything and then act on it
and just be obedient to God.
So, man, if you don't mind, man.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Oh, absolutely, father.
We just come before you thismorning in the name of Jesus,
god.
We first and foremost want tothank you for waking us up this
morning with you in our mind,god, and you in our heart,
giving us another breath of lifeto live for you, father.
We want to thank you, lord, god, for the positions that you
have placed us in, both Matt andI, god, and the great privilege
(40:39):
that we have to love one, toserve, to help to grow the
people that you have entrustedus with.
God, father, I want to pray forMatt's endeavors and his
visions.
Lord, god, we pray that youjust open up heavens, god, over
the visions that you have givenhim.
Lord, god, I pray for a doubleportion of your anointing to be
(41:01):
on his flesh, god, and let thatanointing on his flesh be you on
his flesh, enabling his fleshto do the things that are
possible for his flesh to do.
God, we want to pray for thepeople that might be listening
right now.
If there was something that hasleaped up into your spirit, we
just ask you to take that to theLord in prayer.
And, God, we ask you tocontinue to breathe on them.
(41:24):
Breathe on businesses, god.
Let the businesses thrive herein 2020.
As those businesses begin tothrive, you open up doors to be
able to serve more people.
Bring people in from thissegment of the population, god,
and help those businesses makedecisions to be able to grow
them.
God, we just love you, weworship you.
God, pray this prayer in thematchless name of your son,
(41:47):
jesus Christ.
In Jesus' name we said amen,amen, all right, All right,
brother, oh yeah, absolutely.
God bless you, brother.
Bless you as well, man.
What's up, guys?
This is Matt with A Vota Talk,or the Real Matt Walton.
This is your hub for all thingsKingdom business business as
ministry business strategy.
My goal is to provide as muchvalue, minute by minute, each
podcast that you listen to.
So let's get to it.
What's up guys?
This is Matt Walton with A VotaTalk, or the Real Matt Walton,
(00:21):
depending on how you found me.
And today I've got a veryspecial guest which I'll
introduce here in a moment.
But, man, I, just God, is doingsome incredible things and I
would really want to encourageeverybody with this man.
I've been waking up early andexercising, really focused on
dieting or my diet not so muchdieting and really dialing in my
(00:42):
sleep and dialing in the thingsthat I am consuming, whether if
we're talking food or content,and it's equating into me being
more present with my daughter,me having more present time with
my wife and some incredibletimes with the Lord, and so, man
, it's awesome, feel incredible,and so just want to encourage
everybody with that.
And today I want to get into.
(01:03):
We've got a really specialstory today of just redemption
and the power of God'sredemption, redemptive power,
and John Ponder is who isvisiting us today, man, so
welcome.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Matt, thank you so much for having me.
I'm honored to be here.
Hey brother, thank you forbeing here.
Speaker 1 (01:19):
So we met at one of my guys.
So most of you know I hire.
Pretty much all of my guys arecoming from prison and most of
them are coming through aprogram called Hope for
Prisoners, which John founded,and he's a CEO of it now and
he's operating on a day-to-daybasis, and so all of my or most
of my guys are coming from there.
I was actually at a fatherhoodgraduation that was affiliated
(01:41):
with Hope for Prisoners and thatwas where me and John met.
So I was getting a laptop fromone of my guys while John walked
up to my family and I thinky'all gifted them a laptop at
graduation.
And then I come walking up andI had a kingdom-minded shirt on
and the next thing, you know,john and I were out to breakfast
and we've just stayed in touchever since.
(02:01):
And so, man, it's awesome towatch how you know in touch ever
since.
And so, man, it's awesome towatch how we have very similar
hearts in regards to people thatare incarcerated.
I am a big believer on if we canimpact those that are
incarcerated.
That's where we really canaffect this world, because for
some reason, we are wired if weknow somebody's got a crazy past
(02:23):
or some felonies.
We respect that or look up tothat, even before the radical
change can happen in their life.
And so I believe that when wepour into these guys, that we
can affect families first, weaffect the man first, the
families second, and then thataffects the neighborhoods and
the cities and the states andour world, and so this is a
(02:43):
world changer right here, man.
So thanks again for coming on.
So I really want to get intothe early years and talk about
kind of what happened in yourearly years, briefly, before you
were incarcerated, where youmet the Lord and then what it
looked like kind of leading upto you being released.
Right, okay, Well.
Speaker 2 (03:03):
Again, thank you so much for the opportunity.
Let's talk about the earlyyears, because I think that that
is really important.
You know, I grew up in thestreets of New York, product of
a single parent home.
Dad left home at a very earlyage, leaving my mom to raise
five knucklehead boys and oneknucklehead girl all by herself,
and growing up in thatenvironment without the father
in the home.
(03:23):
My story is not much differentfrom other stories in other
urban communities.
Without that father in the home,we turned to the streets at a
very early age to kind ofvalidate masculinity and for me,
the streets led me to the drugs.
Drugs led me to the gangs.
Gangs led me to the criminalactivity and that criminal
activity led me to my very firstset of handcuffs at the tender
(03:44):
age of 12 years old and lifejust kind of spiraled out of
control from there.
I caught my first felonyconviction at 16 years old,
didn't learn my lesson in andout of jails and in prisons.
I had became addicted toeverything known to man at a
very early age and I left NewYork back in 1989, and I moved
(04:08):
out to Las Vegas, right andhoping that the grass was
greener on the other side.
But for me I tell everybody thatI went from the frying pan
smack dab into the middle of thefire and all those things that
Las Vegas is famous for.
That became a very big part ofmy life and I became a very big
part of it Continued on thattrajectory in and out of the
(04:31):
Clark County Detention Center.
You know criminal thinking,criminal behavior.
I did two prison terms here inthe state of Nevada, didn't
learn my lesson and then I gotstretched out in the maximum
security United States federalpenitentiary.
Speaker 1 (04:46):
OK, and that's where.
Is that where you met the Lord?
Was in there while you'refighting the case, or when did
you meet the Lord and what wasthat?
I don't know if this is alittle bit before, but what was
that prayer that you prayed?
Oh, absolutely For God.
Yeah, I know unmistakably theday that I met the Lord Right.
Speaker 2 (05:00):
No, unmistakably.
The day that I met the Lordright, it was before I got
sentenced in prison.
I'm in the detention center andI'm upset.
I'm withdrawing from a drugaddiction and I'm facing the
potential of spending the next23 years of my life in prison.
And I'm sick, I'm angry, I'mfighting everybody.
(05:21):
They threw me into solitaryconfinement and in that moment I
had the chance to look backover the last 37 years of my
life.
And not only did I neveraccomplish anything of great
significance, but I'm playingthese thoughts out of my mind
that I left the path ofdestruction.
You know, I destroyed the livesof people that I profess with
(05:43):
my mouth that I love and I'llnever forget.
One day was a chaplain who cameby my door and I'm upset.
He opened up the tiny littlefood flap, looked through the
door and said something like youknow, hey, brother, jesus loves
you.
And I cursed him out and ranhim away from my door.
I wasn't trying to hear it, butbefore he left and closed the
food flap, he dropped the Biblethrough the food flap and was
(06:08):
set on the floor.
I left it on the floor.
I'm on a hunger strike.
I'm facing.
My life is over.
I have the you know, thepotential to spend practically
the rest of my life in prison.
And I left the Bible on thefloor.
Two weeks later, chapman comesback again and he opened up the
food flap, said hey, jesus lovesyou, brother.
And I cursed him out again andchased him away from the door.
(06:28):
But before he left he droppedanother book through the door.
It was a daily devotional.
I didn't even know what a dailydevotional was back then.
It was a daily devotional byKenneth Copeland and the title
of this book was the Pursuit ofHis Presence, and I left it on
the floor.
And then two, three weeks afterthat, out of complete boredom,
(06:50):
I picked up the Daily Devotional.
I opened it up to what date Ithought it was, and I read the
little story and something beganto leap on the inside of me.
And then at the top cornerthere was oh my gosh, it was
this passage of scripture thatwas in there.
And I reached out on the floorand I picked up the Bible and
turned to that passage ofscripture and I began to read
(07:12):
the Bible.
And as I began to read theBible, man, I couldn't put it
down.
The next day I got up and Igrabbed the daily devotional
again and I went back to theBible and I started reading the
Bible.
And then something began to theBible and I started reading the
Bible and then something beganto crack wide open in me.
But I have to tell you that backwhen we lived in New York, in
an effort for my mom to get abreak, she used to send us down
(07:34):
to Mississippi, right to mygrandmother's house.
Her name was Medea and this wasthe real Medea, it wasn't this
Tyler Perry and we used to getdown to Mississippi and Medea
had this incredible love forJesus and we'd be going back and
forth to church and I canremember the days of her sitting
us in front of that dusty blackpiano and she's cracking open
(07:55):
these hymn books and we'resinging these songs Jazz, jesus
Loves Me and Amazing Grace.
What Medea was doing all thoseyears ago is Medea was sowing
seeds into us every summer, butat the end of the summer we'd be
back on the Greyhound bus backup to New York and back into the
streets.
But it wasn't until that moment, when I cracked that Bible open
(08:17):
, that all those seeds thatMedea was sowing began to bring
forth the harvest and I couldn'tput my Bible down and I stood
in that holding cell and I askedGod to forgive me for all those
things that I've done andunmistakably I know he did.
But then I made the qualitydecision.
I changed my life.
(08:38):
I asked Jesus to come into myheart and be the Lord of my life
.
A month after that, it's timefor me to go to court.
And I'm at the federalcourthouse down in Las Vegas
Boulevard and I'm shackled by myhands and feet and I played
let's make a deal with God.
And what I said was God, listen, I know that.
I know that.
You know that you're realbecause you revealed yourself to
(09:01):
me in that solitary confinement.
And what I'm asking you to dois to go before me in this
courtroom right, move the judgeout of the way, judge James
Mahan, who is my dear friendtoday.
And what I asked God was toclimb into the robe of Judge
Mahan and I said God, you be myjudge.
(09:21):
And then I said to him whatevertime I get, whether it's 10
years or 50 years, I said God,search the meditation of my
heart.
I am going to spend the rest ofthis life, into eternity,
serving you.
Let whatever time I get comefrom you and I stepped up in
that courtroom and, unmistakably, I stepped up into the presence
(09:42):
of God, right, you just feltthe presence of God in this
courtroom.
And after I got finished sayingwhat it was I was saying, judge
Mahan said to me you know, mrPonder, I've sat on this bench
for X amount of years.
I've never heard anybody saywhat it is you're going to say.
Right, and I had not known atthe time that Judge Mahan had a
relationship with Jesus.
And he said to me that listen,and I'm not.
(10:05):
And he says I'm going to dothis and I don't know why I'm
doing it.
But he said to me I'm not goingto give you what you deserve.
And it was in that moment thatI know that my father heard my
prayers because he sent his sonthat I might not get what I
deserve.
So he said, instead of megiving you this, I'm going to
give you this.
And oh my gosh, it's not the 50years, 23 years.
(10:27):
I thought it was going to be.
My God showed up and then, asthe US Marshals were escorting
me back into the holding cell, Iheard them behind me saying man
, I don't know what happened inthere and I said I know I did.
My father showed up.
So, as they put me back in theholding cell, took the shackles
off my feet and my hands, I felldown on the floor and I'm
thanking God and I'm saying, ohmy goodness, god, thank you, and
(10:50):
I'm weeping and I'm crying.
I'm on this stainless steelfloor and thank you, jesus.
Thank you, jesus, thank you forshowing up.
And I felt God like the lips ofGod came right to my ear and he
said to me my son, I honoredwhat you asked me to do.
He said never forget thepromise that you made to me that
(11:11):
I'm going to spend the rest ofthis life, into eternity,
serving you.
And I got up off that floor andJesus took my life in a 180
degree turn and never lookedback.
Now I still got to go to amaximum security United States
federal penitentiary because Ihave to pay my debt to society.
But in my mind, in my heart andin my spirit, I did not walk
into a United States federalpenitentiary.
(11:33):
I walked into a United StatesBible college and I walked up in
there and I went to school.
I spent every waking moment ofmy time, number one, getting to
know this God that I justsurrendered my life to, and the
more and more I began tounderstand who he is and the
magnitude of what it was thathe's done for me, the more and
(11:54):
more I began to understand aboutme and who it is that he
created me to be.
And that's when I had come tothe realization that I'm not the
name that the streets gave me.
I'm not the name that thosegirls thought I was.
I'm not the name that thestreets gave me.
I'm not the name that thosegirls thought I was.
I'm not the name that the gangthought I was.
I am who my God says that I am,and I can do everything that my
(12:16):
God says that I can do.
And it was in that moment thathe impregnated me with this
vision of Hope for prisoners tobe able to turn right back
around and help the other menand women that were in bondage
to the same things that I was inbondage with, and give me the
opportunity to be his hands andhis feet, to untie them from
(12:40):
them things and help to escortthem up to the next level of
life.
Speaker 1 (12:43):
So then you still had to finish out the sentence
right there You're basically inBible college at this time,
continuing to pursue after theLord every single day.
Yeah, and then you get released.
Was that all of a sudden thing?
Did you have a target date?
Did you know how did thathappen?
Speaker 2 (12:58):
Oh yeah, I had to finish out the rest of my
sentence and I was released fromfederal prison May 9th of 2009.
And that's when I began to hitthe ground, running, you know,
digging trenches in thiscommunity, trying to give birth
to this thing that God gave me,and it was a challenge.
You know, much like womengiving birth, this is a struggle
(13:20):
and pain.
It's just that my labor lastedfor the next two years and it
was.
It was when I when I tell youit was challenging, whereas
every door that I was trying toopen up listen, I come home.
I'm fired for Jesus.
I'm on fire for this vision,and every door that I tried to
open up got slammed in my face.
I couldn't raise any funding,nobody wanted to touch me
(13:42):
because I had all these X's onmy back.
And here I am telling peopleI'm starting this reentry
organization and I had nothingcoming.
But I share that and I'd liketo encourage people this
whenever God gives you a visionand you know that it's a vision
and God said yes when the worldaround you is telling you no
(14:02):
one's slamming doors, you got toalways hold on to that yes that
God gave you.
Amen, speaking probation.
(14:28):
There's probation in the feds.
I got a job working full-time ata local company here in town
that we partnered with and theyhire people to this day, and
this was an incredible familythat had given me the
opportunity that when I startedputting Hope for Prisons
together and I have to takemeetings, they would give me the
flexibility to come in a littlebit late or have an extra long
(14:50):
lunch and I'm having meetingsand put it together.
And I worked for this companyfor about a year and a half and
I'll never forget the day I'm inthe office and I'm working and
I hear clearly from God you know, get up and give you a two
weeks notice.
I'm like, wait, what you know?
Here I am sitting here sayingyou know, I just got married, I
have a new wife, I got a familyto support, and here it is God
(15:14):
telling me to get up and givethem my two weeks notice.
I'm like, oh my goodness.
And when I heard it again, Isaid, okay, I'm going to do this
, but first I had to call mywife and I had to say honey,
listen, this is what, right,right.
I got to get her to confirm it.
And when I shared that with mywife, my wife said hey, listen,
I heard the same thing two weeksago but I did not want to tell
(15:37):
you because I don't want you tothink it was coming from me.
She said I was waiting for youto hear it from the Lord.
But I'm good with it, because Iheard the same thing and I get
up that's the scariest thing Iever did and went in this office
and gave my two weeks noticeand then I leaped full fledged
into Hope for Prisoners andstarted, you know, putting
(15:59):
everything together, okay,completely stepping out in faith
.
Right, and not that I had themoney to do it, because I didn't
, I just got married.
We're practically broke, livingpaycheck to paycheck.
But I think that when God wantsyou to step out in faith in
something, if you're going tohave true faith in him, you
(16:20):
don't make the decision basedoff of what it is you have in
the bank account.
You don't make it based off ofwhat you can see.
Because you step out in to whatGod is calling you to do based
on what you have in there, thenyou have faith in that.
That true faith is stepping outto the edge of a cliff and
(16:41):
looking down at the bottom andyou can't see the bottom.
You're staring into the abyssand when you do a Peter Pan off
that cliff, blindfolded, can'tsee the bottom, and as you're
jumping off the cliff, you justclose your eyes and say God, I'm
doing what it is that you haveasked me to do.
(17:05):
I need you to show up right now, because if you don't show up
right now, it's over.
That's the true faith.
I think that that's the faiththat God wants us to be able to
move in.
So it's nothing that John Ponderdid.
It's not anything that I savedup in this bank account.
I know that.
I know that.
I know God gave me.
Speaker 1 (17:24):
Yeah, so did you have at this time?
Did you have mentors?
Did you have people that werecoming alongside you, that were
helping you formulate businessplans?
How did that look?
Or were you simply going offthe vision, making relationships
, networking, but prior to megetting out, god was revealing
to me, even in biblicalprinciples, right?
Speaker 2 (17:57):
that I needed to surround myself with people that
were getting the results that Iwanted to get out of life.
I hit the ground and I soughtthose people out Even before I
took my wife's hand in marriage.
Right, I sought out people thatwere married, that getting
results, that I wanted to get alife.
And I sought out those peoplein the church.
(18:19):
This person was married 40years.
This person married 25, 18.
And I slid up underneath themand I walked with them for a
period of time as they allowedme to come into their life and I
had to learn from them Because,to be transparent, I didn't
know how to love my wife.
Every relationship that I hadbeen into up to that moment,
(18:41):
either two things happened itended in destruction or ended in
divorce.
So what would happen if I wouldhave taken my wife's end in
marriage?
The only reference point that Ihave up in here is destruction
and divorce.
So I had to put things ontimeout and slide up into the
lives of people so they can showme how men ought to love their
(19:04):
wife, so they could show me howto have conflict but bring
resolution, until I learned wellfrom them.
That's when I said to my wifetime in, let's go do this.
But it was important to keepthose people there to help me to
navigate those differentchoices.
So what I had to do when I wasputting together Hope for
Business, I had to take thatmechanism that I learned and
(19:28):
then drop that into everycompartment of my life, every
compartment of the ministry.
I have a phenomenal board ofdirectors, right that you know
they're my go-to people.
You know Hope for Prison's gotall this national attention and
all this success and everythinglike that.
I do nothing without going tomy go-to people and saying, hey,
listen, what do you think right?
(19:48):
And I take their advice.
Now, sometimes, even in mymarriage mentors, just like in
the ministry mentors when I goto those people, sometimes they
don't tell me what I want tohear, right, but they always
tell me the truth.
But I always do what it is thatthey tell me to do Right
Because you know you surroundyourself with people that are
(20:10):
getting those results that youwant to get out of life.
My personal life, the ministryitself and other compartments of
my life would not be what it istoday had I not had my I still
have my go to people to be ableto tell me what it is that that
you know to do.
Speaker 1 (20:28):
I want to park there real quick, because just some of
the things that I take is theobedience, and the obedience
comes from like pursuing theLord, and one of the things that
happened whenever I came outhere was I started to go to the
mountains and just get alongwith the Lord.
Early in the mornings or latein the afternoons I'll go up
there and just pursue the Lord.
That was when God gave me thevision which ultimately landed
you and I having a relationshipAbsolutely.
(20:53):
And so you know it's that.
It's understanding that I don'thave all the answers.
I don't want to be the smartestguy in the room, I want to be
the dumb guy in the room, I wantto be surrounded by people that
have been there, done that, andthat's one of the.
That's one thing that it takessomebody with arrogance or with
ego or pride.
It's nearly impossible for usto progress in life whenever we
can't get through and can't getover our flesh, and impossible
(21:17):
for us to progress in lifewhenever we can't get through
and can't get over our flesh,and that manifests itself with
ego and pride.
But when we actually lay thatdown at the foot of the cross
and whenever we say, okay, god,it's not my will, but it's your
will.
Show me who you want me to bearound, what you want me to say,
give me questions to ask andgive me the heart to hear what
it is that they have to say.
Oh, absolutely, and trustingthat God's going to speak
through other people.
Yeah, not just speaking to you,that's right.
That was a struggle for mine.
Yeah, like, for some reason, Ihad it in my mind that God was
(21:38):
only speaking to me about myvision that God had given me.
Yes, and I could not be furtherfrom the truth.
That's right.
And so I want to park there inthe sense of what did?
Did your relationship like yourrelationship with God?
How did that look?
You were pursuing God, likewhat did that look like?
Now, I'm not talking aboutchurch and all of that I'm
talking about those, those quiettimes, right, those, those
(22:00):
times along the road, oh,absolutely.
Speaker 2 (22:00):
And I I say that, usp , allenwood, in the hills of
Pennsylvania, right, was, was,was my, was my, my, my learning
time, that was my time with theLord, where I spent every waking
moment of my time and God wastraining me.
I was being trained to get downon my knees every morning and
surrender my to the Lord.
(22:21):
I was trained to still myselfin the busyness of what's
happening in a tough prison, tostill myself to be able to
always, always, hear from theLord.
God taught me in that time thathe is always speaking.
It's just sometimes it's usthat we're not listening.
(22:41):
You know my dear friend ScottHarold, who used to be with SOS
Radio.
Right, it was 90.5 on the radiostation and it's set on 90.5
all times.
And in my house, in my car, andI'm listening to my friend
Scott Harreld in the morning.
And if one morning I got in thecar and my daughters, as I'm
taking to school, turned it notoff 90.5, but they turned it to
(23:05):
90.6.
And I get in the car and I canstill hear Scott Harreld
speaking it might be a littlefuzzy, right, because it's not
dialed in.
And if one day I get in the carthey turn to the 98.8, right, I
still might be able to hear him, but it's not so clear because
I'm not dialed in.
And if one day they get in andturn it to 89.3, I can't hear my
(23:28):
friend Scott Harrell becauseI'm not dialed in.
Well, the kingdom, and justbecause I can't hear him, that
doesn't mean he's not talking.
The kingdom of God works thesame way.
God is always talking, but it'sup to us to make sure that we
are completely dialed in.
So I learned in prison how toshut the noise off from the
(23:50):
world around me and just staydialed in to God, because he is
always talking and I always wantto be in a place where I'm
going to hear from him.
I don't even want to take astep.
I take a step in anything, matt, on my own, I'm going to crash.
Does that make sense?
Oh, percent.
So I too escape up to Red RockCanyon and climb up on the
(24:11):
backside of the Spring MountainPreserves.
Man, I put my earplugs in andthere's a little ledge there.
I sit there, look over thatSpring Mountains Reserve, crack
my Bible open and I have thisalone time with my Lord.
See, that's what it is that Godcalls us to do, because when
you look throughout the Bible,before Jesus started doing
(24:31):
miracles, the Bible said that hedisappeared and went into the
mountains and prayed, and thenhe came home.
And when he came down, this iswhen he said hey, lazarus, come
out.
Right, blind man, get up.
When he called Lazarus out ofthe tombs, jesus didn't go like
this Lazarus come out.
He knew what it was, because hesays that I always hear from my
(24:56):
father.
Speaker 1 (24:59):
I know, for me, when I'm not hearing from the Lord,
it's because I have sin in mylife, and that is the thing, the
very thing that I'm stillhearing from the Lord.
Hey, matt, I need you to stopthis.
I need you to stop this.
No, no, no, no.
But come on.
We're doing so many good thingsover here, we're doing this, I
mean everything's kingdom.
You got a sin in your life, matt.
You need to stop.
You need to stop.
(25:28):
And when we rid ourselves ofthat by being covered with the
stage of repentance, and then itopens up the floodgates.
This is like a personal storyin my life.
Whenever God just startsspeaking and speaking and
showing me visions of what'scoming next and it says in John
that the Holy Spirit will gobefore you, it will tell you
what is coming next, and so it'sbeing dialed into that.
How can we be dialed into that?
(25:49):
And it starts with obedience ofridding ourselves of our flesh
and the sin.
That that's incredible.
So now I want to go to the kindof those beginning years of
when Hope for Prisoners started.
I would imagine there was a lotof difficult times, maybe
making payroll, maybe gettingsome money.
How did that look?
(26:10):
What was the tipping pointthere?
And then we'll get to the otherside of that.
Speaker 2 (26:14):
Matt tell you a great story in that I remember I quit
a thousand times.
I quit a thousand times andquestions like God, was this you
or was this me that was doingthis?
I'll never forget the time Iquit.
I remember I'm in my office andwe're expecting this money to
come in and I got some.
I don't even have people on thepayroll this time.
(26:35):
I got volunteers in the officeand I was supposed to get this
email on Monday.
It didn't come and I'm startingto get discouraged, waiting for
it all day.
Tuesday it didn't come.
Wednesday, it didn't come.
Now.
Thursday I told the volunteersthat you know, don't even come
in today, Right, and I stayed inthe office by myself and I'm
praying.
And Friday I get the email andit said the money ain't coming.
And in that moment, man, I quit, I'm not doing this.
(26:56):
I stopped playing theseconversations off in my head.
That number one what am I goingto say to my wife?
Right?
And number two what am I goingto say to the people that I'm
accountable to?
That's holding me accountable,right?
So I get up and I start walkingover to the door and I went to
shut the light off to go.
And I hear clearly from theLord to sit down.
And I sit down on the couch andthen God hit me with this.
(27:17):
Remember when.
Then God hit me with this,remember when.
And he took me back to a timewhen I first got out of prison,
in my very first meeting withMetro, inside the Clark County
Detention Center.
There was a chaplain there thatI knew.
Her name was Bonnie Polly, whoworked in CCDC, and I knew
Bonnie Polly from all the timesI'm in and out, but they invited
me in to build something outfor them, a reentry portion of
(27:41):
it.
I was like, yeah, I'm all in.
And then she asked me you know,can you, you want to go
upstairs and let me show youwhere you're going to be working
?
I was like, oh sure, and theytake me over and they give me a
little escort badge up in here.
I clip this thing on and I startwalking over this elevator and
the elevator that was using togo upstairs.
I was like, oh my gosh, I'vebeen in this elevator 67 times,
(28:10):
but every time I walk in thiselevator you have to face the
wall.
But this time I'm looking atthe door and I hear God say to
me do you see how.
I turned you around and as theelevator's going up and Bonnie
Polly and a couple of programsoff, they're talking, the higher
this thing goes up.
I can't hear anything they'resaying, I'm just watching their
lips move.
And we get up to the floor thatwe're going to go to, right,
and I step out and I look downthe hall and I was like, oh my
(28:33):
gosh, I see a line of inmateswalking, being escorted by the
officers to go where they'regoing, and I walk right past
them and, matt, I get into thesally port of the unit that
we're going and they're standingthere having a conversation
with me and I can't hear nothingthey're saying.
But it's in that sally port.
(28:53):
You have the ability to seewhat's happening in all the
units, right?
So as I'm standing there nowlisten, I'm watching people do
jail.
I'm watching to see peoplesitting over there drinking
coffee.
I see people under the pillline, people waiting for the
telephone.
I see guys leaning up againstthe door having a conversation
(29:16):
with somebody as they're sippingthat little cup of coffee.
And I heard God say to me doyou see what I set you free from
?
And I'm like my gosh.
And then he said to me thatthere are people that are in
there that are just like theprodigal son and I love them and
(29:37):
I want them.
Then he said to me that thereare people in there that don't
even know my name.
He says I love them too.
And he said John Ponder, Ichose you, go in there, untie
them and bring them to me.
And he said I know it's a toughtime right now it says that no
(29:58):
good soldier engaged in warfareentangles himself with the
affairs of this life.
That he might please him.
Who enlisted him as a soldier?
So, sitting in that officewhere I quit that day, and God
said to me that you're in themiddle of this war, if you walk
off the battlefield right now,you're going to be absent
(30:21):
without leave.
And he said, since I'm the onlyone who ordered you in, only
one can order you out.
And I got up off that couch,matt, and I never quit again,
understanding that,understanding that as people get
into the ministry with you,that there comes a time that
they're not even on thebattlefield with you, no more.
They were only there for aseason, but until I hear clearly
(30:43):
from God, it's time to tap out.
Man, I got to stay hard in thepaint to please him.
Who enlisted me as a soldier inthis army of the Lord?
Speaker 1 (30:53):
And I'm reminded I was reading Psalm 51 and I was
reading in the NASB and it hashis loving kindness, it combines
those two words, yes, and it's,it symbolizes in the Hebrew
it's I think it's calledShishesh or something like that
in the Hebrew but it's his, it'shis covenant loyalty, right,
right.
And there's times whenever wewe think about it in our worldly
(31:15):
minds and we forget about thesupernatural power of this book
and the words that he has givento us, and it's so easy for us
to look and for us to give upand just say you know what?
Yeah, I don't see it happening.
But he says that he's the alphaand the omega, he knows our
beginning and he knows our end.
So why not trust him?
He's sovereign and good tobring to fruition.
(31:36):
And we see this happen withJoseph, I mean, it took 13 years
.
It happened with Daniel, withDavid, I mean, there was
incredible visions and promisesthat were given to them.
Absolutely, it took a lot oftime.
Yep, and man, that's justspeaking to my soul.
Yeah, for the sake of time, man.
I want to go to two more things.
I want to go to kind of afterthat, in the vision of where
things are at right now, what'sbeing worked on right now, and
(31:59):
then if there's something thatis coming that y'all are working
on, absolutely, and then maybemix in there, if you can, maybe
a supernatural something thiswhole thing has been
supernatural, right, butsomething along those lines and
then we'll start to, we'll getto the end of it, yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:13):
Yeah, so we're in an incredible spot right now.
One of the things that we'rereally proud of is we, because
we've learned that.
We know that that reentrystarts day one right, and a lot
of times in prison systems wherethey're failing miserably, they
come up with these pre-releaseprograms and it starts 90 days
before the person gets out.
Right, it's too late If thatperson is laid down in prison
(32:36):
for 10, 15 years and doneabsolutely nothing to prepare
himself for them get for him toget out and all of a sudden, 60,
90 days you're going to put himthrough some pre-release
program.
It's not going to work right.
So we start working.
We built the program out atSouthern Desert Correctional
Center where Governor JoeLombardo had given us the
(32:57):
opportunity.
We have our own unit out there,so we have 120 men inside a
unit where we have a chance towork with them up to 18 months
before they get released.
And we go in and we doleadership development,
substance abuse counselor,marriage, family therapy,
addressing trauma 101, biblestudies.
We stream church in there andjust being able to connect with
(33:21):
them, to have them address allthe issues surrounding the
circumstances that led to theirincarceration and help them to
arm themselves against thosethings never happening again so
they can get back to thebusiness of life.
The thing that we're reallyproud of is that at the six
month from release mark right,we have them 18 months, but six
(33:43):
months to the gate we get themenrolled in our vocational
village, matt, where we stood upin HVAC, electrical welding,
plumbing, masonry, warehouselogistics and we dropped the
commercial driver's licenseschool in the prison and that
gives us the ability to numberone first get their mind right
and then, from the training, getthose certifications so that we
(34:06):
can tie that directly withemployment where they're going
to earn a sustainable wage,where they can take care of
themselves and be able to takecare of their family.
But when they walk out the backdoor they're not just out in
the community by themselves.
Now they get dropped into the18-month post-release that God
has built up and we've beenrunning for 14 years.
(34:26):
We're truly, truly excitedabout that.
We know that it was somesupernatural things that made
that happen because you know,anytime you're dealing with
corrections, it's this custodything and this safety and
security thing.
But you know we're verygrateful that they thought
outside the box and enabled usto be able to build that up.
(34:47):
So that was phase one.
Phase two that we're working on, we're going to build out a
diesel and auto mechanic schoolright there at that facility and
then simultaneously, god iscalling me up to Northern Nevada
to build another one up inNorthern Nevada.
We're going to be up there atthe end of the second quarter of
this year doing someexploratory things.
(35:07):
But we know that the minute thatwe break around on it, god does
things at an accelerated rate.
Because how many times in theBible does it say that there was
a suddenly Right?
Because I just feel thesuddenly coming.
And once we get that done, matt, we're going to pluck that up
out.
It's a statewide model now andthat's when we're going to pluck
that up out of that model, upout of Nevada, and begin to drop
(35:30):
that in jurisdictions allacross the country.
Dallas-fort Worth is probablynext.
You know, I know that God iscalling us there.
It's opportunity, there'speople there, there are funders
that want to fund it and I willnot move until I hear from God
so we can make the perfect time.
Because you move before youhear from God, you run the
potential of creating an Ishmaeland we don't want to.
Speaker 1 (35:53):
Yeah, wow, okay.
Well, I know we're up on time,but before we go I just want to
honor you because this was whenI came out here.
It paves the way for me to dowhat I do and because of what
God is doing in your life andthrough the ministry and all the
people that serve and that workwith you and work for you, it's
(36:15):
most of my guys are comingthrough Ponder's program and so
and now that we're talking aboutgoing into other states, as I
buy businesses in other statescome on this ecosystem we're
going to be following.
But it's because of that thatwe have the ability to bring
these guys in and to continueand compliment the mentoring and
(36:37):
discipleship that they'realready doing and give these
guys and eventually women anddiscipleship that they're
already doing and give theseguys and eventually women.
Like I cannot wait till thisgrows and we have nonprofits and
we're able to start bringing inwomen to the mix as well.
But this is the whole reason whywe have the ability to pull
them from prison.
Like, while they are in prison,like most of my guys are going
to take public transportation Iget goosebumps Public
(36:58):
transportation back to prisontoday at 2.30, 3 o'clock value,
and it's just one of the mostincredible things I want to
(37:23):
encourage everybody out there toreally, if you don't have a
program like this available inyour state, but you are able to
bring people, maybe from otherprograms or off of the streets,
to start to explore hiringpeople based on their values
instead of based on theirskillset, and grow them like do
on the job training.
That is the way that we canreally get to those people that
(37:44):
nobody else is going to get tobecause it's too much work,
absolutely, and I welcome thatand I know you welcome that a
little bit like bring it on,like I'm willing to do that out
of obedience to God, for gloryto God, because I know his word
and I know God is sovereign.
So, man, I thank you for that.
And these men I know I toldthem this morning you were
coming.
They were so excited, yeah,yeah, yeah, and I'm just honored
(38:05):
that you would come on and dothat.
Speaker 2 (38:07):
And so, man, thank you for what it is that you do
with these men and mentoringthem and so forth and so on.
And you know, because the thingthat I've learned and I speak
from my own personal experienceis that the vast majority of
people from this segment of thepopulation they want to change,
they want to do better.
They have no idea how to do it.
So when we come alongside themand provide them with the tools
(38:32):
to not only be able to get agood job and maintain that job
and grow in that job, but whenwe lay down the foundation and
that's what it is that you'redoing here, helping to lay down
the foundation to where they canbuild up this brand new life,
and we blow wind underneaththeir wings, release them into
(38:52):
their destiny, and by doing thatwatch this we have the ability
to reach down and touch the nextgeneration of the family.
That's the level of impact,because children are going to
grow up and they're going to dowhat they see mom and dad doing.
So when we help them to makethe decision to improve the
(39:12):
caliber of how they're going tolive the rest of their life, we
got little eyes watching them.
Speaker 1 (39:18):
Come on, amen, if you don't mind.
I would like to, if you don'tmind, praying for everybody
that's listening share a 30second story.
Two of my guys that were comingfrom your program Surrender to
Life to the Lord.
We were on the clock.
We were a part of the last onewith Taylor, and that's so
special because I know you'veknown him for a long time.
(39:42):
But I believe that we're goingto start seeing just this wave
of salvations happen in themarketplace and I believe that
God is calling those that arelistening to step up to the
plate.
And I know there's a vision onetime that was given of this
warehouse that was full of thesecrowns of people that did not
answer the call.
And so just some encouragementthere to listen, seek the Lord
(40:03):
and answer that call and justmove out of obedience and know
that you're gonna run into a lotof uncertain times You're gonna
struggle with how are we gonnado this?
But seek the Lord, analyzeeverything and then act on it
and just be obedient to God.
So, man, if you don't mind, man.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Oh, absolutely, father.
We just come before you thismorning in the name of Jesus,
god.
We first and foremost want tothank you for waking us up this
morning with you in our mind,god, and you in our heart,
giving us another breath of lifeto live for you, father.
We want to thank you, lord, god, for the positions that you
have placed us in, both Matt andI, god, and the great privilege
(40:39):
that we have to love one, toserve, to help to grow the
people that you have entrustedus with.
God, father, I want to pray forMatt's endeavors and his
visions.
Lord, god, we pray that youjust open up heavens, god, over
the visions that you have givenhim.
Lord, god, I pray for a doubleportion of your anointing to be
(41:01):
on his flesh, god, and let thatanointing on his flesh be you on
his flesh, enabling his fleshto do the things that are
possible for his flesh to do.
God, we want to pray for thepeople that might be listening
right now.
If there was something that hasleaped up into your spirit, we
just ask you to take that to theLord in prayer.
And, God, we ask you tocontinue to breathe on them.
(41:24):
Breathe on businesses, god.
Let the businesses thrive herein 2020.
As those businesses begin tothrive, you open up doors to be
able to serve more people.
Bring people in from thissegment of the population, god,
and help those businesses makedecisions to be able to grow
them.
God, we just love you, weworship you.
God, pray this prayer in thematchless name of your son,
(41:47):
jesus Christ.
In Jesus' name we said amen,amen, all right, All right,
brother, oh yeah, absolutely.
God bless you, brother.
Bless you as well, man.
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