February 6, 2025 • 36 mins
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Today, we explore a riveting political drama unfolding in Columbus centered around Susan Wilder, the city's grant writer. A low-risk grant which could eventually make the city greener, astonishingly faces an unexpected hurdle when a 4-2 council vote initially rejects it. However, the mayor's determined intervention stirs the pot, leading to a special meeting that ultimately swings in favor of the grant. This episode questions whether Wilder is merely a pawn in a larger political game as her job security hangs in the balance.
Next, we turn our attention to a public feud between Joseph Mickens and Leroy Brooks, two stalwarts of local politics, who find themselves in a clash that transcends policy debates and dives into personal and racial provocations. Brooks accuses Mickens of threats, while Mickens fights back with a meme fraught with racial implications and a contentious video statement. We dissect the layers of this rivalry, considering the broader political and social ramifications for their campaigns and the community’s perception of leadership.
Finally, we shine a spotlight on the upcoming Columbus mayoral and city council elections, offering a strategic analysis of the candidates' positioning. We examine how candidate profiles, voter turnout, and strategic moves could shape the future of Columbus politics, leaving listeners with a clearer view of the race's stakes.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
From the Opinion Page of the Commercial Dispatch.
This is Between the Headlines.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hi, this is Peter Imes, publisher of the
Commercial Dispatch.
The goal of the Dispatch'sOpinion Page has always been to
encourage discussion on what'simportant to our community.
That's the approach we'll takewith Between the Headlines.
Your host each week will beDispatch Managing Editor, zach
Player, and local businessmanand chair of the Lowndes
(00:36):
Republican Party, david Chisholm.
Zach and David will discuss,and sometimes debate, columbus
and Lowndes County news.
They'll also invite guests onthe show from time to time.
We're excited about it.
If you have any tips orsuggestions, feel free to email
us at tips at cdispatchcom.
And now Between the Headlines.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
I'm Zach and I am David, and welcome today to our
podcast, where we're going tofocus on issues with Columbus
and Lowndes County politics ohman, oh man, I cannot wait oh
yeah as well as some of thebroader things that affect us
locally and specifically, todaywe're going to be talking about
the situation with the city'sgrant writer, we're going to be
(01:19):
talking about a beef that LeroyBrooks and Joseph Mickens played
out on Facebook, and we'regoing to be taking a look at
each of the city election racesand giving our impressions on
who may have the edge in thoseraces as of right now.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
I can't wait and before we begin, I would like to
tip my hat to you, zach.
Thank you for thinking about me.
Thank you for bringing me onhere.
I look forward to this.
Also, thank you to Peter, ourgreat publisher.
I think this is going to be agood thing for the dispatch and
it's definitely going to be agood thing for the city of
Columbus and the county ofLowndes as we get into these
(01:53):
issues and as we start gettingpeople to talk about the things
that matter.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
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Speaker 3 (02:02):
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Speaker 1 (02:45):
Now let's start the show.
Our first topic today isobviously city elections have
started.
The city election season iswell underway.
We've got our candidatesfinalized and the first casualty
of the city election season inColumbus appears to be the
city's grant writer.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Wild Right and it's developing.
It is developing, so we don'thave all the details All right.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
So the slow-moving train wreck started last
Thursday at the work sessionwhen Susan Wilder, the city
grant's writer.
She presented a grantopportunity to the city grants
writer.
She presented a grantopportunity to the city council
but presented it alongsideDarren Leach, who's running for
mayor.
At that time there was now thegrant.
(03:35):
As I understand it, it would bea planning grant that would
help the city come up with.
We're going to give you,potentially give you $250,000.
You can bring in communitypartners and you can plan how
you want to make your citygreener.
They've now applied for theplanning grant.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
But this is a zero percent.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Match yes, zero, match $250,000.
They come up with a plan formaking the city greener solar
panels on city buildings.
Like I said, none of it's beenfinalized yet because they're
just applying for a planninggrant.
Here's the rub they don'treally discuss it.
At the work session Thursdaythey hear the presentation from
Susan and from Darren Leach, whois an independent running for
(04:23):
mayor.
Fast forward to Tuesday wherethe council meets.
Ms Wilder goes up again topresent the grant, explains the
whole thing.
The council, they eventuallyvote 4-2 to reject the
application for the grant.
So the city council says by a4-2 vote no, susan, we're not
(04:44):
going to apply for this grant.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
This free grant.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Well, this, yeah, this grant with no match
required from the city Fastforward to Wednesday, the day
after the council meeting.
Keith makes two unsuccessfulattempts to veto that decision.
It just there were sometechnical issues in the law and
in Robert's Rules of Order thatkept him from vetoing it.
(05:10):
So he directs Ms Wilder toapply for the grant anyway,
against the council, against thecouncil's wishes.
This morning this would beThursday morning the city
council calls a special meeting.
They vote three to two to sayokay, we support the grant.
It's already sent anyway.
Mickens is running that meeting.
(05:32):
Vice Mayor Joseph Mickens isrunning that meeting.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Gaskin is not present .
He does not show up, okay.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
So Mickens says I support going ahead and, you
know, going for this grant sinceit's already gone.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
Might as well, might as well.
You can't unsend the email,that's correct.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
So three to two they say okay, we support the grant
application.
Since it's already gone, ward 5Councilman Stephen Jones, also
running for mayor, and Ward 4Councilman Pierre Beard vote
against it.
Then they have a fairly lengthyexecutive session where they're
very clearly dressing down MissWilder, who is in the room.
(06:12):
She comes out of the roomcrying After the executive
session lets out.
The vote that's announced fromthat executive session is that
the HR director and the chiefoperations officer for the city
are.
Now they have to come up withrecommendations for an employee
(06:33):
in the administration department, which clearly was Ms Wilder,
and bring those recommendationsfor her job performance to the
council at its next meeting.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
So obviously they're trying to ding her for
insubordination against thecouncil.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
Right.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
And so now the question is well, did Keith put
her in an ugly situation, or youknow?
You, look at this, it's almosta no-brainer.
Here we have a 0% match.
Okay, it's almost a no-brainer.
Here we have a zero percentmatch.
Okay, these are our tax dollars, and my opinion is, these
(07:15):
dollars would be really wellspent right here in our hometown
in the Golden Triangle.
Why would anyone vote noagainst that?
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Well, David let's go back to the beginning of the
story.
Who co-presented with Susanduring the work session.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
The candidate Darren Leach.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
That's correct.
So you've got Leach presentingwith Susan Wilder.
So he goes forward to the citycouncil with Susan and does this
.
Then they reject it on Tuesday.
So a couple of things here forme.
They say it's not political,they say it doesn't have
anything to do with the election.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
But I thought their chosen profession was politics
at this point.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Well, there's that, and if this is a situation where
let's just look at the issuepractically, they got a pretty
good explanation of what wasgoing on Thursday at the work
session.
They didn't have a whole lot ofdiscussion at that work session
and they could have asked thosequestions while they had Susan
(08:17):
and Darren sitting right infront of them or standing right
in front of them.
They could have asked thequestions Instead the following
Tuesday.
They you know all the deadlinestomorrow.
Well, we didn't know about this.
We didn't.
You know, the city attorneyhasn't looked at this and it
seems to me that if they weregoing to do that in good faith
(08:39):
and it wasn't meant to bepolitical, they would have.
You know, thursday, friday,saturday, sunday, monday.
They had five days to wherethey could have worked with Jeff
, worked with Susan, worked withDarren, trying to get a better
feel, for you know, what thisgrant application was and what
it was going to require of thecity and the things that they
were all of a sudden very upsetabout, very nervous about at the
(09:01):
council meeting.
They had five days that theycould have.
Speaker 3 (09:04):
They also had five days to plan on how to shoot it
down.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Right, they certainly did.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
The absolute kicker is we don't have to accept the
money.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
And even if you do, it's a planning grant, so you're
not actually getting any ofthis stuff.
It's creating a plan.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Money straight into our economy.
Exactly, it's creating a planMoney straight into our economy.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Exactly.
But why should this be apolitical issue?
Why should it be a politicalissue If you go back and look at
when they opened the shelterearlier this winter, darren
Leach, partners with theHomeless Coalition, partners
with the Homeless Coalition andthey, in a day, have this
(09:48):
temporary homeless shelter,temporary warning shelter for
the homeless out at GenesisChurch.
They did spring that on thecouncil and they had to sit
there and eat it, because whatwere they going to do?
They were going to say, no,we're not going to have a
temporary shelter because thisguy's running for mayor, we're
not going to give him temporaryshelter.
Because this guy's running formayor, we're not going to give
him that political capital.
They didn't do that.
(10:08):
What they did was they said,okay, well, we support this and
we'll even match it with somedonations.
But this time they saw Darrencoming.
So that was a political misstepon Darren's part.
But then you get into thescapegoating, susan Wilder.
You've got the council doing itfirst by voting down, rejecting
(10:28):
the opportunity to even applyfor this grant.
But let's stop there for asecond and talk about.
The council did decide four totwo were not applying for this
grant.
So now we move to the secondproblem it's very clear that
there is a 4-2 vote tellingSusan Wilder and as a city
(10:48):
council we are deciding we arenot applying for this grant.
The next day, mayor Keith Gaskinsays yes, we are.
You know, I did it myself.
I didn't actually have Susansubmit the application.
I submitted the applicationmyself because I didn't want the
(11:09):
council to harass Susan.
Well, they did, of course.
They harassed her prettyheavily, harassed her to tears,
and for what?
And so my question to you,david, is why is Keith now
telling his grant writer orhimself defying an order of the
(11:30):
council, a vote of the council?
That was done in public, novideo.
The grant writing office ishers and the council told her to
do a specific thing.
So David did Keith's scapegoatretain.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
I cannot speak for Keith Gaskin, but what I can
tell you is it never should havereally come to this.
If I were in that position, Inever would have brought it
before the city council.
You know they're going to playgames with it and in the end we
potentially lose $250,000 as aresult of it.
As a result of it the mostpeculiar thing about this in the
(12:05):
aftermath of it, one of thecouncilmen Stephen Jones, I
believe said that applying forthis grant only to reject it
later could only hurt the city'schances of landing other grants
.
I highly doubt that the samebureaucrat gets more than one
application from the same city.
I guess we'll get our listenersto comment on this.
(12:28):
I look forward to hearing,because it just blows my mind.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Well, and moving on to our next topic, this is not
the first time that the electionseason got heated.
In fact, two people who aren'teven running against each other
started in on each other onFacebook over this past weekend.
They did so.
(12:52):
You've got Leroy Brooks,district 5 County Supervisor,
who is running for mayor, as aDemocrat, and then you've got
Joseph Mickens, who is trying tobe reelected as the War II
councilman, also as a Democrat.
They got in a bit of a spat Acouple of videos on Facebook,
(13:16):
some memes, a weird claim ofassault in a public place that
hasn't been substantiated.
So what do you think of it sofar, david?
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Well, to break it down for our listeners, it's
kind of a three-part saga, ifyou will.
First, we've got Leroy's videowhere he claims that Mickens
accosted him, threatened him,threatened him, yeah, etc.
(13:48):
Etc.
And in response we got the meme.
We'll get to that in a minuteand lastly the video that joe
mickens took at probst park Ibelieve it was.
We got to break this down, butbefore we do, I just have to how
appropriate and how saddeningit is that our very first
episode of this podcast has noneother than a urination contest
(14:10):
between the likes of our sittingvice mayor, gentleman from Ward
2, joe Mickens, and in theother corner, the sitting
supervisor the longest standingsupervisor, I will add, the
candidate for Mayor, leroyBrooks.
Okay, looking at this, both ofthese leaders, I think, are in
(14:30):
the wrong here, and I dare sayto you, zach, that every single
home in Lowndes County lost $50in value as a result of this
exchange.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Well, I don't know about that, but it is certainly
so.
All of this supposedly happenedat a parks plan presentation at
Trotter Convention Center.
I was there.
So I was there at this meeting.
We were sitting beside eachother and this was a meeting for
the city and the county theirfeasibility study for parks and
how they can work together inthe future.
(15:05):
It was a really good meeting.
We get a few days later, mrBrooks drops a video where he
says that you know, mickensthreatened him at this meeting
because he was mad about Leroyputting candidates up against
him.
Leroy says he did not put thosecandidates up against him but
(15:27):
that he will not support Mickensand doesn't think Mickens
should win.
Then you have the meme dropwhere Mickens compares Leroy
Brooks to the character Stephenin Django in Chains, which is a
(15:48):
villain character, a blackvillain character in that movie.
That is sort of the plot of itis slavery-based.
And then you have Mickens goingto Probst Park and making a
claim that at the Trotter, atthe parks meeting, that Leroy
(16:11):
grabs his arm, curses him outand the sheriff and another
county official had to escorthim out of the trotter.
So you know.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Boy, oh boy, yeah, so you know since then we've let
bygones be bygones.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
We're not going to press any charges.
We've kind of Mickens has kindof walked back the version of
the story where you know it wasas bad as he had first said it
was.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Well, it's a lot to unpack.
But first you look at Leroy'svideo.
Leroy claims that Mickensaccosted him.
Okay, accosted when I hear thatword, I think of a bum, you
know, just someone coming up toyou asking for something.
But then he says he threatenedhim.
Now that heightens thesituation.
Threatened is a vague word.
(17:04):
Did he threaten?
To do what?
To embarrass him, To change thedirection of his nose by means
of physical contact.
And then, interestingly, healso says it was almost a
disruption.
Not a disruption, but almost adisruption.
Therefore, maybe not really adisruption, Therefore not a big
(17:28):
deal.
It's very, very strange.
And then we have the meme.
That was a nasty meme and Ididn't understand it at first.
Our listeners can look it up ifthey want to, but basically I
had to go in there.
I've not seen this film.
I had to use Google Lens tokind of AI this thing to break
(17:50):
it apart.
And Stephen is not a goodcharacter.
I mean, this was cutthroat, Infact I looked it up.
Samuel Jackson said of hischaracter on Yahoo Entertainment
, quote Stephen is the mostreprehensible Negro in cinematic
(18:12):
history, end quote.
So this was calibrated, thiswas cold.
And listen, I like both ofthese guys.
I'm going to call a ball whenit's a ball.
This was clearly beneath theoffice of a council member.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Well, and it also it brings race to the forefront of
the campaign as a votingstrategy, as a, you know, as a
voting impetus, and you know,and I think that the campaign
(18:51):
shouldn't be about that and thisclearly was meant to incite
black voters, specifically blackvoters, against voting for
Leroy Brooks.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
You mentioned race.
Why would you bring up HarrySanders?
Speaker 1 (19:13):
He brings up Harry Sanders and he bemoans he's
trying to align Leroy's mayoralcampaign with Harry Sanders, and
Harry Sanders has a prettynasty past in statements that
he's made about race To ourpaper.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
Well, there's no question, but to me it looks
like he almost begrudges the Ikid you, not $4,000 that he says
that Harry Sanders donated tothe campaign of Leroy Brooks,
and so I'm looking at it.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
Which I mean?
Then that'll come out in thewash when we get the campaign
finance.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Well, the law is clear, he is within his rights
to do that.
And so, basically, mickens isthrowing the book at Leroy
everything he has.
And look, I'm not here to sayyou should do this or you should
do that.
But if I were in this position,if someone quote, unquote
(20:10):
assaulted me, I would eitherfile charges or just shut up
about it.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Right Be done with it , and he didn't either he didn't
, either.
He didn't file charges and hetalked a lot about it and it's
something that I feel like youknow I'm not in the mind of
Joseph Mickens, but I feel likeit was a poor play on his part
and he probably regrets it onsome level and I think it made
(20:38):
him look a lot sillier than itdid Leroy in this case.
But it also showed the sort ofgutter war where we're going to
go into race.
We are going to.
You know this is Mickens veryclearly with the meme in
particular, he's very clearlylabeling Leroy as an Uncle Tom
or trying to, and he's trying toget that to stick and you know
(20:58):
it's.
It's kind of like.
It's kind of like what they sayabout juries in a courtroom One
lawyer says somethingoutlandish, the other lawyer
objects and then the judgesustains the objection and looks
at the jury and says you can'tremember that?
Speaker 3 (21:14):
You can't act like that was said but it's there,
but it's already been said it'sthere, it's already been said
and you can't.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
And, to be clear, mickens has endorsed Jones
Stephen Jones to be mayor, notLeroy Brooks.
So they're at odds with one.
They are at political odds withone another right now and I
think there's more of, I thinkthat there's more of this jump
where last weekend came from.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Well, we've just got to elevate the conversation.
I am a decidedly anti-racistperson and I happen to be of the
persuasion of Morgan Freeman.
And that is to say, how do westop this?
We cease talking about it.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Well, I think that there are definitely
conversations surrounding racethat need to be had, need to be
had honestly.
This is not a conversationthough this is a fight, it is
ugly, and Columbus deservesbetter.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
It's a tactic.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Columbus deserves better than that tactic being
thrown into the electionconversation.
I totally agree with that.
Mickens meme is implying thatthe voters should be thinking
(22:31):
about that.
The voters should be thinkingabout race as their number one
issue and that they should begetting into the ditch and
thinking about you know thingson that level of you know who's
an Uncle Tom and who's not.
I feel like our candidates needto give more credit to the
voters than that and I thinkthat we should have more faith
in the voters than that.
And elevating that conversation, as you say, does exactly that.
(22:54):
It gives the voters the creditthey deserve and it doesn't
expect them or force them or tryto coax them into devolving
into that or try to coax theminto devolving into that.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
That muck and mire.
Yeah, I think it's insulting toa lot of them, yeah, and I
think they are ready to move onRight, and I think that if
Mickens does not follow suit,he's going to end up with at
least a runoff.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Right?
Well, that's true.
That's true.
Moving into our last topic,we're going to take a look at
the races.
We've talked about some of themalready, but let's start with
the mayor's race.
You've got Leroy, who's run asa Democrat.
He's running against Ward 5Councilman Stephen Jones in the
Democratic primary.
The two independents awaitingthe winner of that primary in
(23:46):
the general election are DarrenLeach, who we talked about
earlier, and Bill Strauss, whodo you got Just right now?
I'm not talking about who doyou think is going to win.
Who do you think has the edge,I guess right now, in these
races right now in these races.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Well, just based on how Columbus has traditionally
voted, obviously the Democratwinner is going to be the one to
beat.
And right now Stephen Jones hasreally got his hands full,
because I think Leroy Brooksbrings in a bipartisan vote
right now.
I think it's going to be anuphill battle for Stephen Jones,
but I might be surprised bythat one.
(24:30):
And then there'll be no primary, no runoff for the primary.
So that'll be done April 1st,It'll bring it to the general
and then it'll be a three-way,at which point a plurality will
win it.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
You've got Strauss.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
Leach, and the winner of the Democrats and a very
small number of voters canactually decide the mayor's race
, as we learned last go-roundKeith Gaskin, who won with just
24 votes.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
Right, take 24 more votes than the incumbent in that
race.
To your point.
You know Leroy Brooks iscourting the Republican vote.
He's courting the whiteestablishment vote as sort of a
candidate for everyone.
That's not turning his back onthe Democratic vote I don't
think that his campaign has buthe is definitely going out of
(25:25):
his way to court everyone and Ithink that that could make a
difference.
I think on the other side of itnow, and I want to say again, I
have not seen where StephenJones has devolved into the
identity politics campaigning.
Mickens was doing that as anendorser of Stephen.
I have not seen Stephen do thatyet in any of his ads or his
(25:48):
posts or anything like thatRight, stephen Jones puts forth
a very professional demeanor.
He does, he does, and he's got alot of city experience too.
He's got a lot of experience incity government.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
Policy beliefs aside, I think that goes a long way
with voters Right now.
I'm going to be frank with youand I think that we have a
problem with the optics of ourcity hall.
I get that many of those oncity hall want to be of the
people and by the people andtherefore dress just like the
(26:22):
people.
But some of these guys, I'mwondering, do you even own a
collared shirt?
It's like every time I see themthey're in a hoodie and I think
to some extent that's fine.
But it's like Columbus is interms of a Mississippi town.
We are a town of status.
This is not Knox a painter.
(26:42):
Okay, I just think some ofthese guys need to dress for the
occasion and, to StephenJones's credit, he does that.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
He does that, he does that and he takes this job very
seriously and I think that onthe whole, he's taken his job as
a councilman seriously, hasdone a good job and has had some
well-thought-out positions andif I was going to try to pick a
winner right now between Leroyand Stephen, I couldn't.
I don't know who's going to winthat.
(27:10):
I do think that the winner ofthat primary has the edge in the
general election.
I think Leach has a lot of workto do on name recognition and
maybe not necessarilycredibility, because I don't
think that he's distrusted.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
But as we've talked about, I think Mickens helped
him this week.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Well, maybe I think he did.
That may be trueUnintentionally, but you know
you've got Leach, who's got alot of work to do on the name
recognition side.
Bill Strauss is a spoilercandidate and I think if he
spoils anybody he's going tospoil Darren Leach.
I don't think he's going totake votes away from the
Democratic winner.
I think if he is still in therace when ballots are cast in
(27:53):
June, if Bill Strauss is stillin the race, it's going to be to
Darren Leach's detriment.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Well, let's look at the wards.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Look at Ward 1.
We know who two of these peopleare.
We know, first of all a bigsort of surprise for some people
, open secret for others.
The mayor who is not going to,who's not running for
re-election for mayor, is goingto run against Ethel Stewart in
(28:20):
Ward 1.
Keith Gaskin he was in Ward 5before redistricting.
Now he's in Ward 1.
He's going to challenge anincumbentin.
He was in Ward 5 beforeredistricting.
Now he's in Ward 1.
He's going to challenge anincumbent.
He's running as an independent,so he'll be awaiting the
Democratic primary winner.
But that Democratic primary isbetween incumbent Ethel Stewart
and Democrat Tommy Smith.
Ethel Stewart's probably movingon to the general election.
(28:45):
She has some firepower.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
Okay, If you recall, she won her last election like
775 to 100, 120, something likethat.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
She won it by several hundred votes.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
And so it's very interesting to look at what
Keith Gaskin did for him to stepinto that race as something
that just typically does nothappen.
One could say that that speaksto the humility of his character
.
He just wants to help the city.
He doesn't have to beabsolutely in charge, but he
feels like he could make adifference in this particular
(29:19):
role.
I hope that his feelings don'tget too hurt if he loses to
Ethel Stewart for Ward 1.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I think he might have had a better shot, seeking
re-election for the job he'salready got.
So Keith may know somethingthat I don't and he may think
that things have shifted in hisfavor a little more, but I think
that she might be the hardestcouncil person to beat.
So, shifting over to Ward 2,the aforementioned Joseph
Mickens, the incumbent Democrat,he's running against Laisha
(29:52):
Mishishi O'Neill and RoderickSmith in the Democratic primary.
There is no Republican, so theprimary winner will take the
seat.
Obviously, mickens is worried,or he wouldn't be making videos
at Probst Park about LeroyBrooks.
He's not even running againstand he wouldn't be making videos
at Probst Park about LeroyBrooks he's not even run against
and he wouldn't be claimingthat his two opponents didn't
live in his ward.
Should he be worried?
Speaker 3 (30:13):
He should be worried, particularly after posting that
meme and particularly afterthat video.
I think at the very least hehas earned himself a runoff.
Now I don't know Ms Shishi, Idon't know Roderick Smith, but
they gained bigly after thatvideo and after that meme.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Well, I think the thing that is going to hurt
Mickens the most is you mightremember, late last year he came
after the building official,kenny Weigel, in public pretty
heavily Called him a liar,accused Kenny of calling Mickens
a liar.
He did it in a public meetingand then followed him out to the
(30:55):
lobby of the municipal complexand accosted him some more and
later came back and apologizedfor that.
It was very unpopular at thetime.
I don't think that there was acity employee or a city official
across the board that thoughtthat that was a good idea or a
good move, and I think thatMiggins had to walk that back.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
It's not a good look.
Yeah, I think that's going tohurt him.
He calls it straight talk.
He actually calls it straight.
Talk without a chaser.
But you need a chaser with someof this stuff.
Yes, you do.
Yes, you do.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
All right.
So moving on to Ward 3.
Ward 3 is unopposed.
Rusty Green, the Republican,congratulations on your
reelection.
Ward 4, we've got fourcandidates in that ward.
The incumbent, independent,pierre Beard, is running against
familiar faces in DemocratMarty Turner and Democrat Levine
(31:52):
Harris, the former chairpersonfor the NAACP, and Turner being
the former ward four councilman.
And then we've got a newcomerin Robert S Johnson IV, who's
running as a Republican and hehad a hard time deciding whether
he was going to run or not.
He qualified, then he droppedout, then he qualified again.
What do you think here, dave?
(32:13):
So is.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Robert Johnson keeping the R beside his name.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
He is.
He's running as a Republican.
Speaker 3 (32:19):
Okay, well, I don't think in that particular ward
and listen, I'm a Republican,but I don't think he has a
snowball's chance.
What's going to be interestingto me is is does Ward 4 want to
elect somebody that's going toreally put a good brand out
there for our city, or do theywant to open up the Molotov
(32:43):
cocktail and just throw it inthere and let it burn?
Okay, we've got Pierre Beard.
Pierre, if you're listening, Ilove you, you're a great guy,
you've got a good heart, butyour record is a problem.
People are ready to move alongfrom that, and if you lose it's
your fault.
You've got to stop blamingfolks every time the sheriff's
(33:07):
office has to come to your house, and I think people are tired
of that.
And Marty Turner I like him too, but he's old news.
I think LeVon Harris may holdthe seat in council ward four
when this is said and done.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
That's a hot take.
That's a hot take.
I don't know who's going to winthat Democratic primary, but I
do believe that Pierre hasenough support to right now he's
the heavy favorite to go backin.
I think, obviously the lawenforcement things have been an
issue and should be and theyshould be something that voters
should think about.
But you know, pierre has been amoderate voice on that council.
(33:44):
He's made some pretty gooddecisions on there and he's been
the adult in the room a lot oftimes when nobody else was
stepping up to do that.
That's going to be a fun raceto watch, and as will Ward 5.
We're going to get a new Ward 5councilman.
As a matter of fact, ward 5 andWard 6, we're going to get new
people.
Ward 5 and Ward 6, we're goingto get new people.
(34:06):
We've got a five-candidate racein Ward 5.
Shaquayla Clark, democrat.
Cedric Fenster, democrat.
Gregory Gary Jefferson,democrat.
So they'll be running in thesame primary.
Awaiting them will be thewinner of the Republican primary
(34:26):
in that war between Mary Jeterand Bob Raymond.
I'm going to tell you now, theRepublicans in that war have an
uphill battle.
I feel like that Democraticprimary winner is going to be
favored to take the seat.
I will be honest with you.
I don't really know enoughabout any of those candidates to
say which one I think has theedge.
Right now.
(34:46):
I see more signs for GaryJefferson, but signs don't vote.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
What I can tell you about this race is that there
will probably be I'm justguessing a runoff in the
Democratic primary, and that'snot a bad thing.
I kind of hate it.
Actually, speaking fromexperience here, I hate to see
the resources of the electionofficials and city officials and
have to go out and set thingsup just for one, shall we say,
(35:15):
goofy race over here.
So we may see multiple runoffsin the city on April 15th.
Bob Raymond might have a goodground game.
It's just one of these thingsthat is to be determined.
So, yes, I do believe thatthere potentially will be a
runoff for the Democrats onApril 15th for Ward 5.
(35:38):
Now on the Republican side,full disclosure.
I am chair of the county partyand so I am, per the bylaw of
the party, not supposed to putmy hand on the scale where this
goes.
But one interesting thing aboutthis is, because it is a
primary, it's going to be lowturnout as far as the
(36:00):
Republicans go.
Speaker 1 (36:02):
And that's especially true if Leroy Brooks is
successful in the mayor's racein pulling Republican voters
over to him.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
That's it, right, that's it.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
So, real quick, let's go over Ward 6.
We've got two Republicans therein Jason Spears and Kimberly
McCarty Davis, and then anindependent in Donald.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Pope.
Well, I look at this.
I know Jason Spears has been inthe public sphere for a long
time and his name is highlyrecognized, and name recognition
typically gives a candidatefavor.
And I frankly can't speak tothe other two.
I don't know them that well.
I would like to get to knowthem know them Well.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Ms Davis is daughter of former Councilman Mack
McCarty, so there's some namerecognition there.
You know, donald Pope is anupstart independent.
I think that your namerecognition, your greatest name
recognition, is going to beJason Spears, and so I think
that I think he has the edge andthe others will have an uphill
battle to beat.
I think he has the edge and theothers will have an uphill
battle to beat.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
Opinions expressed on this show are those of the
speakers and not necessarilythose of the commercial dispatch
.
From the Opinion Page of the Commercial Dispatch.
This is Between the Headlines.
Speaker 2 (00:14):
Hi, this is Peter Imes, publisher of the
Commercial Dispatch.
The goal of the Dispatch'sOpinion Page has always been to
encourage discussion on what'simportant to our community.
That's the approach we'll takewith Between the Headlines.
Your host each week will beDispatch Managing Editor, zach
Player, and local businessmanand chair of the Lowndes
(00:36):
Republican Party, david Chisholm.
Zach and David will discuss,and sometimes debate, columbus
and Lowndes County news.
They'll also invite guests onthe show from time to time.
We're excited about it.
If you have any tips orsuggestions, feel free to email
us at tips at cdispatchcom.
And now Between the Headlines.
Speaker 1 (00:59):
I'm Zach and I am David, and welcome today to our
podcast, where we're going tofocus on issues with Columbus
and Lowndes County politics ohman, oh man, I cannot wait oh
yeah as well as some of thebroader things that affect us
locally and specifically, todaywe're going to be talking about
the situation with the city'sgrant writer, we're going to be
(01:19):
talking about a beef that LeroyBrooks and Joseph Mickens played
out on Facebook, and we'regoing to be taking a look at
each of the city election racesand giving our impressions on
who may have the edge in thoseraces as of right now.
Speaker 3 (01:31):
I can't wait and before we begin, I would like to
tip my hat to you, zach.
Thank you for thinking about me.
Thank you for bringing me onhere.
I look forward to this.
Also, thank you to Peter, ourgreat publisher.
I think this is going to be agood thing for the dispatch and
it's definitely going to be agood thing for the city of
Columbus and the county ofLowndes as we get into these
(01:53):
issues and as we start gettingpeople to talk about the things
that matter.
Speaker 2 (01:59):
And now a brief word from our sponsors.
Speaker 3 (02:02):
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Again, that is 662-352-1560.
Speaker 1 (02:45):
Now let's start the show.
Our first topic today isobviously city elections have
started.
The city election season iswell underway.
We've got our candidatesfinalized and the first casualty
of the city election season inColumbus appears to be the
city's grant writer.
Speaker 3 (03:07):
Wild Right and it's developing.
It is developing, so we don'thave all the details All right.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
So the slow-moving train wreck started last
Thursday at the work sessionwhen Susan Wilder, the city
grant's writer.
She presented a grantopportunity to the city grants
writer.
She presented a grantopportunity to the city council
but presented it alongsideDarren Leach, who's running for
mayor.
At that time there was now thegrant.
(03:35):
As I understand it, it would bea planning grant that would
help the city come up with.
We're going to give you,potentially give you $250,000.
You can bring in communitypartners and you can plan how
you want to make your citygreener.
They've now applied for theplanning grant.
Speaker 3 (03:58):
But this is a zero percent.
Speaker 1 (04:00):
Match yes, zero, match $250,000.
They come up with a plan formaking the city greener solar
panels on city buildings.
Like I said, none of it's beenfinalized yet because they're
just applying for a planninggrant.
Here's the rub they don'treally discuss it.
At the work session Thursdaythey hear the presentation from
Susan and from Darren Leach, whois an independent running for
(04:23):
mayor.
Fast forward to Tuesday wherethe council meets.
Ms Wilder goes up again topresent the grant, explains the
whole thing.
The council, they eventuallyvote 4-2 to reject the
application for the grant.
So the city council says by a4-2 vote no, susan, we're not
(04:44):
going to apply for this grant.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
This free grant.
Speaker 1 (04:47):
Well, this, yeah, this grant with no match
required from the city Fastforward to Wednesday, the day
after the council meeting.
Keith makes two unsuccessfulattempts to veto that decision.
It just there were sometechnical issues in the law and
in Robert's Rules of Order thatkept him from vetoing it.
(05:10):
So he directs Ms Wilder toapply for the grant anyway,
against the council, against thecouncil's wishes.
This morning this would beThursday morning the city
council calls a special meeting.
They vote three to two to sayokay, we support the grant.
It's already sent anyway.
Mickens is running that meeting.
(05:32):
Vice Mayor Joseph Mickens isrunning that meeting.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Gaskin is not present .
He does not show up, okay.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
So Mickens says I support going ahead and, you
know, going for this grant sinceit's already gone.
Speaker 3 (05:46):
Might as well, might as well.
You can't unsend the email,that's correct.
Speaker 1 (05:51):
So three to two they say okay, we support the grant
application.
Since it's already gone, ward 5Councilman Stephen Jones, also
running for mayor, and Ward 4Councilman Pierre Beard vote
against it.
Then they have a fairly lengthyexecutive session where they're
very clearly dressing down MissWilder, who is in the room.
(06:12):
She comes out of the roomcrying After the executive
session lets out.
The vote that's announced fromthat executive session is that
the HR director and the chiefoperations officer for the city
are.
Now they have to come up withrecommendations for an employee
(06:33):
in the administration department, which clearly was Ms Wilder,
and bring those recommendationsfor her job performance to the
council at its next meeting.
Speaker 3 (06:44):
So obviously they're trying to ding her for
insubordination against thecouncil.
Speaker 1 (06:51):
Right.
Speaker 3 (06:52):
And so now the question is well, did Keith put
her in an ugly situation, or youknow?
You, look at this, it's almosta no-brainer.
Here we have a 0% match.
Okay, it's almost a no-brainer.
Here we have a zero percentmatch.
Okay, these are our tax dollars, and my opinion is, these
(07:15):
dollars would be really wellspent right here in our hometown
in the Golden Triangle.
Why would anyone vote noagainst that?
Speaker 1 (07:20):
Well, David let's go back to the beginning of the
story.
Who co-presented with Susanduring the work session.
Speaker 3 (07:27):
The candidate Darren Leach.
Speaker 1 (07:30):
That's correct.
So you've got Leach presentingwith Susan Wilder.
So he goes forward to the citycouncil with Susan and does this
.
Then they reject it on Tuesday.
So a couple of things here forme.
They say it's not political,they say it doesn't have
anything to do with the election.
Speaker 3 (07:50):
But I thought their chosen profession was politics
at this point.
Speaker 1 (07:53):
Well, there's that, and if this is a situation where
let's just look at the issuepractically, they got a pretty
good explanation of what wasgoing on Thursday at the work
session.
They didn't have a whole lot ofdiscussion at that work session
and they could have asked thosequestions while they had Susan
(08:17):
and Darren sitting right infront of them or standing right
in front of them.
They could have asked thequestions Instead the following
Tuesday.
They you know all the deadlinestomorrow.
Well, we didn't know about this.
We didn't.
You know, the city attorneyhasn't looked at this and it
seems to me that if they weregoing to do that in good faith
(08:39):
and it wasn't meant to bepolitical, they would have.
You know, thursday, friday,saturday, sunday, monday.
They had five days to wherethey could have worked with Jeff
, worked with Susan, worked withDarren, trying to get a better
feel, for you know, what thisgrant application was and what
it was going to require of thecity and the things that they
were all of a sudden very upsetabout, very nervous about at the
(09:01):
council meeting.
They had five days that theycould have.
Speaker 3 (09:04):
They also had five days to plan on how to shoot it
down.
Speaker 1 (09:08):
Right, they certainly did.
Speaker 3 (09:10):
The absolute kicker is we don't have to accept the
money.
Speaker 1 (09:15):
And even if you do, it's a planning grant, so you're
not actually getting any ofthis stuff.
It's creating a plan.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Money straight into our economy.
Exactly, it's creating a planMoney straight into our economy.
Speaker 1 (09:28):
Exactly.
But why should this be apolitical issue?
Why should it be a politicalissue If you go back and look at
when they opened the shelterearlier this winter, darren
Leach, partners with theHomeless Coalition, partners
with the Homeless Coalition andthey, in a day, have this
(09:48):
temporary homeless shelter,temporary warning shelter for
the homeless out at GenesisChurch.
They did spring that on thecouncil and they had to sit
there and eat it, because whatwere they going to do?
They were going to say, no,we're not going to have a
temporary shelter because thisguy's running for mayor, we're
not going to give him temporaryshelter.
Because this guy's running formayor, we're not going to give
him that political capital.
They didn't do that.
(10:08):
What they did was they said,okay, well, we support this and
we'll even match it with somedonations.
But this time they saw Darrencoming.
So that was a political misstepon Darren's part.
But then you get into thescapegoating, susan Wilder.
You've got the council doing itfirst by voting down, rejecting
(10:28):
the opportunity to even applyfor this grant.
But let's stop there for asecond and talk about.
The council did decide four totwo were not applying for this
grant.
So now we move to the secondproblem it's very clear that
there is a 4-2 vote tellingSusan Wilder and as a city
(10:48):
council we are deciding we arenot applying for this grant.
The next day, mayor Keith Gaskinsays yes, we are.
You know, I did it myself.
I didn't actually have Susansubmit the application.
I submitted the applicationmyself because I didn't want the
(11:09):
council to harass Susan.
Well, they did, of course.
They harassed her prettyheavily, harassed her to tears,
and for what?
And so my question to you,david, is why is Keith now
telling his grant writer orhimself defying an order of the
(11:30):
council, a vote of the council?
That was done in public, novideo.
The grant writing office ishers and the council told her to
do a specific thing.
So David did Keith's scapegoatretain.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
I cannot speak for Keith Gaskin, but what I can
tell you is it never should havereally come to this.
If I were in that position, Inever would have brought it
before the city council.
You know they're going to playgames with it and in the end we
potentially lose $250,000 as aresult of it.
As a result of it the mostpeculiar thing about this in the
(12:05):
aftermath of it, one of thecouncilmen Stephen Jones, I
believe said that applying forthis grant only to reject it
later could only hurt the city'schances of landing other grants
.
I highly doubt that the samebureaucrat gets more than one
application from the same city.
I guess we'll get our listenersto comment on this.
(12:28):
I look forward to hearing,because it just blows my mind.
Speaker 1 (12:32):
Well, and moving on to our next topic, this is not
the first time that the electionseason got heated.
In fact, two people who aren'teven running against each other
started in on each other onFacebook over this past weekend.
They did so.
(12:52):
You've got Leroy Brooks,district 5 County Supervisor,
who is running for mayor, as aDemocrat, and then you've got
Joseph Mickens, who is trying tobe reelected as the War II
councilman, also as a Democrat.
They got in a bit of a spat Acouple of videos on Facebook,
(13:16):
some memes, a weird claim ofassault in a public place that
hasn't been substantiated.
So what do you think of it sofar, david?
Speaker 3 (13:27):
Well, to break it down for our listeners, it's
kind of a three-part saga, ifyou will.
First, we've got Leroy's videowhere he claims that Mickens
accosted him, threatened him,threatened him, yeah, etc.
(13:48):
Etc.
And in response we got the meme.
We'll get to that in a minuteand lastly the video that joe
mickens took at probst park Ibelieve it was.
We got to break this down, butbefore we do, I just have to how
appropriate and how saddeningit is that our very first
episode of this podcast has noneother than a urination contest
(14:10):
between the likes of our sittingvice mayor, gentleman from Ward
2, joe Mickens, and in theother corner, the sitting
supervisor the longest standingsupervisor, I will add, the
candidate for Mayor, leroyBrooks.
Okay, looking at this, both ofthese leaders, I think, are in
(14:30):
the wrong here, and I dare sayto you, zach, that every single
home in Lowndes County lost $50in value as a result of this
exchange.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
Well, I don't know about that, but it is certainly
so.
All of this supposedly happenedat a parks plan presentation at
Trotter Convention Center.
I was there.
So I was there at this meeting.
We were sitting beside eachother and this was a meeting for
the city and the county theirfeasibility study for parks and
how they can work together inthe future.
(15:05):
It was a really good meeting.
We get a few days later, mrBrooks drops a video where he
says that you know, mickensthreatened him at this meeting
because he was mad about Leroyputting candidates up against
him.
Leroy says he did not put thosecandidates up against him but
(15:27):
that he will not support Mickensand doesn't think Mickens
should win.
Then you have the meme dropwhere Mickens compares Leroy
Brooks to the character Stephenin Django in Chains, which is a
(15:48):
villain character, a blackvillain character in that movie.
That is sort of the plot of itis slavery-based.
And then you have Mickens goingto Probst Park and making a
claim that at the Trotter, atthe parks meeting, that Leroy
(16:11):
grabs his arm, curses him outand the sheriff and another
county official had to escorthim out of the trotter.
So you know.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Boy, oh boy, yeah, so you know since then we've let
bygones be bygones.
Speaker 1 (16:29):
We're not going to press any charges.
We've kind of Mickens has kindof walked back the version of
the story where you know it wasas bad as he had first said it
was.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
Well, it's a lot to unpack.
But first you look at Leroy'svideo.
Leroy claims that Mickensaccosted him.
Okay, accosted when I hear thatword, I think of a bum, you
know, just someone coming up toyou asking for something.
But then he says he threatenedhim.
Now that heightens thesituation.
Threatened is a vague word.
(17:04):
Did he threaten?
To do what?
To embarrass him, To change thedirection of his nose by means
of physical contact.
And then, interestingly, healso says it was almost a
disruption.
Not a disruption, but almost adisruption.
Therefore, maybe not really adisruption, Therefore not a big
(17:28):
deal.
It's very, very strange.
And then we have the meme.
That was a nasty meme and Ididn't understand it at first.
Our listeners can look it up ifthey want to, but basically I
had to go in there.
I've not seen this film.
I had to use Google Lens tokind of AI this thing to break
(17:50):
it apart.
And Stephen is not a goodcharacter.
I mean, this was cutthroat, Infact I looked it up.
Samuel Jackson said of hischaracter on Yahoo Entertainment
, quote Stephen is the mostreprehensible Negro in cinematic
(18:12):
history, end quote.
So this was calibrated, thiswas cold.
And listen, I like both ofthese guys.
I'm going to call a ball whenit's a ball.
This was clearly beneath theoffice of a council member.
Speaker 1 (18:31):
Well, and it also it brings race to the forefront of
the campaign as a votingstrategy, as a, you know, as a
voting impetus, and you know,and I think that the campaign
(18:51):
shouldn't be about that and thisclearly was meant to incite
black voters, specifically blackvoters, against voting for
Leroy Brooks.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
You mentioned race.
Why would you bring up HarrySanders?
Speaker 1 (19:13):
He brings up Harry Sanders and he bemoans he's
trying to align Leroy's mayoralcampaign with Harry Sanders, and
Harry Sanders has a prettynasty past in statements that
he's made about race To ourpaper.
Speaker 3 (19:30):
Well, there's no question, but to me it looks
like he almost begrudges the Ikid you, not $4,000 that he says
that Harry Sanders donated tothe campaign of Leroy Brooks,
and so I'm looking at it.
Speaker 1 (19:46):
Which I mean?
Then that'll come out in thewash when we get the campaign
finance.
Speaker 3 (19:50):
Well, the law is clear, he is within his rights
to do that.
And so, basically, mickens isthrowing the book at Leroy
everything he has.
And look, I'm not here to sayyou should do this or you should
do that.
But if I were in this position,if someone quote, unquote
(20:10):
assaulted me, I would eitherfile charges or just shut up
about it.
Speaker 1 (20:15):
Right Be done with it , and he didn't either he didn't
, either.
He didn't file charges and hetalked a lot about it and it's
something that I feel like youknow I'm not in the mind of
Joseph Mickens, but I feel likeit was a poor play on his part
and he probably regrets it onsome level and I think it made
(20:38):
him look a lot sillier than itdid Leroy in this case.
But it also showed the sort ofgutter war where we're going to
go into race.
We are going to.
You know this is Mickens veryclearly with the meme in
particular, he's very clearlylabeling Leroy as an Uncle Tom
or trying to, and he's trying toget that to stick and you know
(20:58):
it's.
It's kind of like.
It's kind of like what they sayabout juries in a courtroom One
lawyer says somethingoutlandish, the other lawyer
objects and then the judgesustains the objection and looks
at the jury and says you can'tremember that?
Speaker 3 (21:14):
You can't act like that was said but it's there,
but it's already been said it'sthere, it's already been said
and you can't.
Speaker 1 (21:20):
And, to be clear, mickens has endorsed Jones
Stephen Jones to be mayor, notLeroy Brooks.
So they're at odds with one.
They are at political odds withone another right now and I
think there's more of, I thinkthat there's more of this jump
where last weekend came from.
Speaker 3 (21:36):
Well, we've just got to elevate the conversation.
I am a decidedly anti-racistperson and I happen to be of the
persuasion of Morgan Freeman.
And that is to say, how do westop this?
We cease talking about it.
Speaker 1 (21:53):
Well, I think that there are definitely
conversations surrounding racethat need to be had, need to be
had honestly.
This is not a conversationthough this is a fight, it is
ugly, and Columbus deservesbetter.
Speaker 3 (22:10):
It's a tactic.
Speaker 1 (22:10):
Columbus deserves better than that tactic being
thrown into the electionconversation.
I totally agree with that.
Mickens meme is implying thatthe voters should be thinking
(22:31):
about that.
The voters should be thinkingabout race as their number one
issue and that they should begetting into the ditch and
thinking about you know thingson that level of you know who's
an Uncle Tom and who's not.
I feel like our candidates needto give more credit to the
voters than that and I thinkthat we should have more faith
in the voters than that.
And elevating that conversation, as you say, does exactly that.
(22:54):
It gives the voters the creditthey deserve and it doesn't
expect them or force them or tryto coax them into devolving
into that or try to coax theminto devolving into that.
Speaker 3 (23:06):
That muck and mire.
Yeah, I think it's insulting toa lot of them, yeah, and I
think they are ready to move onRight, and I think that if
Mickens does not follow suit,he's going to end up with at
least a runoff.
Speaker 1 (23:21):
Right?
Well, that's true.
That's true.
Moving into our last topic,we're going to take a look at
the races.
We've talked about some of themalready, but let's start with
the mayor's race.
You've got Leroy, who's run asa Democrat.
He's running against Ward 5Councilman Stephen Jones in the
Democratic primary.
The two independents awaitingthe winner of that primary in
(23:46):
the general election are DarrenLeach, who we talked about
earlier, and Bill Strauss, whodo you got Just right now?
I'm not talking about who doyou think is going to win.
Who do you think has the edge,I guess right now, in these
races right now in these races.
Speaker 3 (24:09):
Well, just based on how Columbus has traditionally
voted, obviously the Democratwinner is going to be the one to
beat.
And right now Stephen Jones hasreally got his hands full,
because I think Leroy Brooksbrings in a bipartisan vote
right now.
I think it's going to be anuphill battle for Stephen Jones,
but I might be surprised bythat one.
(24:30):
And then there'll be no primary, no runoff for the primary.
So that'll be done April 1st,It'll bring it to the general
and then it'll be a three-way,at which point a plurality will
win it.
Speaker 2 (24:46):
You've got Strauss.
Speaker 3 (24:47):
Leach, and the winner of the Democrats and a very
small number of voters canactually decide the mayor's race
, as we learned last go-roundKeith Gaskin, who won with just
24 votes.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
Right, take 24 more votes than the incumbent in that
race.
To your point.
You know Leroy Brooks iscourting the Republican vote.
He's courting the whiteestablishment vote as sort of a
candidate for everyone.
That's not turning his back onthe Democratic vote I don't
think that his campaign has buthe is definitely going out of
(25:25):
his way to court everyone and Ithink that that could make a
difference.
I think on the other side of itnow, and I want to say again, I
have not seen where StephenJones has devolved into the
identity politics campaigning.
Mickens was doing that as anendorser of Stephen.
I have not seen Stephen do thatyet in any of his ads or his
(25:48):
posts or anything like thatRight, stephen Jones puts forth
a very professional demeanor.
He does, he does, and he's got alot of city experience too.
He's got a lot of experience incity government.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
Policy beliefs aside, I think that goes a long way
with voters Right now.
I'm going to be frank with youand I think that we have a
problem with the optics of ourcity hall.
I get that many of those oncity hall want to be of the
people and by the people andtherefore dress just like the
(26:22):
people.
But some of these guys, I'mwondering, do you even own a
collared shirt?
It's like every time I see themthey're in a hoodie and I think
to some extent that's fine.
But it's like Columbus is interms of a Mississippi town.
We are a town of status.
This is not Knox a painter.
(26:42):
Okay, I just think some ofthese guys need to dress for the
occasion and, to StephenJones's credit, he does that.
Speaker 1 (26:50):
He does that, he does that and he takes this job very
seriously and I think that onthe whole, he's taken his job as
a councilman seriously, hasdone a good job and has had some
well-thought-out positions andif I was going to try to pick a
winner right now between Leroyand Stephen, I couldn't.
I don't know who's going to winthat.
(27:10):
I do think that the winner ofthat primary has the edge in the
general election.
I think Leach has a lot of workto do on name recognition and
maybe not necessarilycredibility, because I don't
think that he's distrusted.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
But as we've talked about, I think Mickens helped
him this week.
Speaker 1 (27:29):
Well, maybe I think he did.
That may be trueUnintentionally, but you know
you've got Leach, who's got alot of work to do on the name
recognition side.
Bill Strauss is a spoilercandidate and I think if he
spoils anybody he's going tospoil Darren Leach.
I don't think he's going totake votes away from the
Democratic winner.
I think if he is still in therace when ballots are cast in
(27:53):
June, if Bill Strauss is stillin the race, it's going to be to
Darren Leach's detriment.
Speaker 3 (27:58):
Well, let's look at the wards.
Speaker 1 (28:00):
Look at Ward 1.
We know who two of these peopleare.
We know, first of all a bigsort of surprise for some people
, open secret for others.
The mayor who is not going to,who's not running for
re-election for mayor, is goingto run against Ethel Stewart in
(28:20):
Ward 1.
Keith Gaskin he was in Ward 5before redistricting.
Now he's in Ward 1.
He's going to challenge anincumbentin.
He was in Ward 5 beforeredistricting.
Now he's in Ward 1.
He's going to challenge anincumbent.
He's running as an independent,so he'll be awaiting the
Democratic primary winner.
But that Democratic primary isbetween incumbent Ethel Stewart
and Democrat Tommy Smith.
Ethel Stewart's probably movingon to the general election.
(28:45):
She has some firepower.
Speaker 3 (28:47):
Okay, If you recall, she won her last election like
775 to 100, 120, something likethat.
Speaker 1 (28:55):
She won it by several hundred votes.
Speaker 3 (28:57):
And so it's very interesting to look at what
Keith Gaskin did for him to stepinto that race as something
that just typically does nothappen.
One could say that that speaksto the humility of his character
.
He just wants to help the city.
He doesn't have to beabsolutely in charge, but he
feels like he could make adifference in this particular
(29:19):
role.
I hope that his feelings don'tget too hurt if he loses to
Ethel Stewart for Ward 1.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
I think he might have had a better shot, seeking
re-election for the job he'salready got.
So Keith may know somethingthat I don't and he may think
that things have shifted in hisfavor a little more, but I think
that she might be the hardestcouncil person to beat.
So, shifting over to Ward 2,the aforementioned Joseph
Mickens, the incumbent Democrat,he's running against Laisha
(29:52):
Mishishi O'Neill and RoderickSmith in the Democratic primary.
There is no Republican, so theprimary winner will take the
seat.
Obviously, mickens is worried,or he wouldn't be making videos
at Probst Park about LeroyBrooks.
He's not even running againstand he wouldn't be making videos
at Probst Park about LeroyBrooks he's not even run against
and he wouldn't be claimingthat his two opponents didn't
live in his ward.
Should he be worried?
Speaker 3 (30:13):
He should be worried, particularly after posting that
meme and particularly afterthat video.
I think at the very least hehas earned himself a runoff.
Now I don't know Ms Shishi, Idon't know Roderick Smith, but
they gained bigly after thatvideo and after that meme.
Speaker 1 (30:34):
Well, I think the thing that is going to hurt
Mickens the most is you mightremember, late last year he came
after the building official,kenny Weigel, in public pretty
heavily Called him a liar,accused Kenny of calling Mickens
a liar.
He did it in a public meetingand then followed him out to the
(30:55):
lobby of the municipal complexand accosted him some more and
later came back and apologizedfor that.
It was very unpopular at thetime.
I don't think that there was acity employee or a city official
across the board that thoughtthat that was a good idea or a
good move, and I think thatMiggins had to walk that back.
Speaker 3 (31:16):
It's not a good look.
Yeah, I think that's going tohurt him.
He calls it straight talk.
He actually calls it straight.
Talk without a chaser.
But you need a chaser with someof this stuff.
Yes, you do.
Yes, you do.
Speaker 1 (31:29):
All right.
So moving on to Ward 3.
Ward 3 is unopposed.
Rusty Green, the Republican,congratulations on your
reelection.
Ward 4, we've got fourcandidates in that ward.
The incumbent, independent,pierre Beard, is running against
familiar faces in DemocratMarty Turner and Democrat Levine
(31:52):
Harris, the former chairpersonfor the NAACP, and Turner being
the former ward four councilman.
And then we've got a newcomerin Robert S Johnson IV, who's
running as a Republican and hehad a hard time deciding whether
he was going to run or not.
He qualified, then he droppedout, then he qualified again.
What do you think here, dave?
(32:13):
So is.
Speaker 3 (32:14):
Robert Johnson keeping the R beside his name.
Speaker 1 (32:17):
He is.
He's running as a Republican.
Speaker 3 (32:19):
Okay, well, I don't think in that particular ward
and listen, I'm a Republican,but I don't think he has a
snowball's chance.
What's going to be interestingto me is is does Ward 4 want to
elect somebody that's going toreally put a good brand out
there for our city, or do theywant to open up the Molotov
(32:43):
cocktail and just throw it inthere and let it burn?
Okay, we've got Pierre Beard.
Pierre, if you're listening, Ilove you, you're a great guy,
you've got a good heart, butyour record is a problem.
People are ready to move alongfrom that, and if you lose it's
your fault.
You've got to stop blamingfolks every time the sheriff's
(33:07):
office has to come to your house, and I think people are tired
of that.
And Marty Turner I like him too, but he's old news.
I think LeVon Harris may holdthe seat in council ward four
when this is said and done.
Speaker 1 (33:22):
That's a hot take.
That's a hot take.
I don't know who's going to winthat Democratic primary, but I
do believe that Pierre hasenough support to right now he's
the heavy favorite to go backin.
I think, obviously the lawenforcement things have been an
issue and should be and theyshould be something that voters
should think about.
But you know, pierre has been amoderate voice on that council.
(33:44):
He's made some pretty gooddecisions on there and he's been
the adult in the room a lot oftimes when nobody else was
stepping up to do that.
That's going to be a fun raceto watch, and as will Ward 5.
We're going to get a new Ward 5councilman.
As a matter of fact, ward 5 andWard 6, we're going to get new
people.
Ward 5 and Ward 6, we're goingto get new people.
(34:06):
We've got a five-candidate racein Ward 5.
Shaquayla Clark, democrat.
Cedric Fenster, democrat.
Gregory Gary Jefferson,democrat.
So they'll be running in thesame primary.
Awaiting them will be thewinner of the Republican primary
(34:26):
in that war between Mary Jeterand Bob Raymond.
I'm going to tell you now, theRepublicans in that war have an
uphill battle.
I feel like that Democraticprimary winner is going to be
favored to take the seat.
I will be honest with you.
I don't really know enoughabout any of those candidates to
say which one I think has theedge.
Right now.
(34:46):
I see more signs for GaryJefferson, but signs don't vote.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
What I can tell you about this race is that there
will probably be I'm justguessing a runoff in the
Democratic primary, and that'snot a bad thing.
I kind of hate it.
Actually, speaking fromexperience here, I hate to see
the resources of the electionofficials and city officials and
have to go out and set thingsup just for one, shall we say,
(35:15):
goofy race over here.
So we may see multiple runoffsin the city on April 15th.
Bob Raymond might have a goodground game.
It's just one of these thingsthat is to be determined.
So, yes, I do believe thatthere potentially will be a
runoff for the Democrats onApril 15th for Ward 5.
(35:38):
Now on the Republican side,full disclosure.
I am chair of the county partyand so I am, per the bylaw of
the party, not supposed to putmy hand on the scale where this
goes.
But one interesting thing aboutthis is, because it is a
primary, it's going to be lowturnout as far as the
(36:00):
Republicans go.
Speaker 1 (36:02):
And that's especially true if Leroy Brooks is
successful in the mayor's racein pulling Republican voters
over to him.
Speaker 3 (36:09):
That's it, right, that's it.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
So, real quick, let's go over Ward 6.
We've got two Republicans therein Jason Spears and Kimberly
McCarty Davis, and then anindependent in Donald.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Pope.
Well, I look at this.
I know Jason Spears has been inthe public sphere for a long
time and his name is highlyrecognized, and name recognition
typically gives a candidatefavor.
And I frankly can't speak tothe other two.
I don't know them that well.
I would like to get to knowthem know them Well.
Speaker 1 (36:50):
Ms Davis is daughter of former Councilman Mack
McCarty, so there's some namerecognition there.
You know, donald Pope is anupstart independent.
I think that your namerecognition, your greatest name
recognition, is going to beJason Spears, and so I think
that I think he has the edge andthe others will have an uphill
battle to beat.
I think he has the edge and theothers will have an uphill
battle to beat.
Speaker 2 (37:09):
Opinions expressed on this show are those of the
speakers and not necessarilythose of the commercial dispatch
.
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