March 4, 2025 • 54 mins
Got a question or a tip? Send us a text
Zack and David discuss how Ward 2 councilman Joseph Mickens is not acting like a four term incumbent, especially considering his challengers. They also talk about Jason Spears' and Mary Beth Jeter's appearances at Columbus Exchange Club. And mayoral candidate Stephen Jones suggests borrowing money to finish the Amphitheater.
Golden Triangle Development LINK CEO Joe Max Higgins also joins the guys for a wide ranging discussion, including his take on Mickens' public suggestion that the city of Columbus doesn't need the LINK. Then Joe Max updates us on Aluminum Dynamics, the new CINCO Megasite and how tariffs may affect our local industries. Finally, the guys discuss the changing dynamics of where industry executives are choosing to live.
Got feedback for us? Email tips@cdispatch.com.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
From the opinion page of the Commercial Dispatch.
This is Between the Headlines.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
This is Peter Imes, publisher of the Dispatch.
One of our hosts of Between theHeadlines is the managing
editor of our newsroom.
Typically we try to keep newsand opinions separate, but
reporters have a unique insightinto the workings of local
government and their analysiscan be helpful for readers and
listeners.
The Dispatch remains committedto journalistic integrity and
(00:38):
our reporting will alwaysreflect that.
And now between the headlines.
Speaker 4 (00:43):
This week's headlines , as you recall, regarding the
residency challenge of hispolitical opponents, we advised
Joe Mickens to either get offthe can or drop the deuce.
Well, comes now none other thanJoseph W Mickens Sr before the
Supreme Court of Mississippi.
Having chosen option number two, and with the clock ticking for
(01:09):
MSMS and MUW, what is the fateof our fine institutions?
I've got words, as does ourspecial guest for today, none
other than Mr Joe Max Higgins.
Retirement looks different foreveryone, so your plan should be
built around you.
For over 40 years, financialConcepts has helped people
(01:30):
create retirement strategiesthat fit their lives.
Our team in Columbus takes thetime to understand your goals
and build a plan that works foryou.
Wherever you are in yourjourney, we're ready to help.
We plan retirement.
Financial Concepts is aregistered investment advisor.
Do you need help achieving theright look in your house?
(01:51):
At Lighting, unlimited andUncommon Living, you'll find
quality, unique pieces that willelevate your home instantly.
Great furniture and lightingnot only reflect a style, they
also define a home.
With lighting, unlimited anduncommon living.
You can expect more.
Visit them at 1116 GardnerBoulevard or online at
(02:12):
lighting-columbuscom.
Benton's Maintenance andMechanical makes easy work out
of plumbing, electrical heatingand air conditioner problems.
You can book an appointment byphone or online and rest assured
they will show up at theappointed time.
Call Benton's at 662-657-2583or visit them online at
(02:34):
bentonsinccom.
That is bentonsinccom.
And now a message frompolitical candidate Bill Strauss
.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
I want to thank the Commercial Dispatch for this
podcast, bringing differentviews in an open discussion.
I'm Bill Strauss, humbly askingfor your vote as next mayor of
Columbus.
You deserve transparency andaccountability for your tax
dollars.
I'm business friendly andcharitable.
Vote Bill Strauss mayor ofColumbus 2025.
Paid for by campaign to electBill Strauss Mayor of Columbus
(03:05):
2025.
Paid for by campaign to electBill Strauss.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
And now a message from political candidate Jason
Spears.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
I am Jason Spears, candidate for City Council, Ward
6.
Over the past 20 years, Ifaithfully and effectively
served our community in manydifferent ways.
If elected, I will bringstructure and strategy to the
city's finances, help develop ablueprint to capitalize on the
growing economic activity in ourcity and work to strengthen
relationships with LowndesCounty officials, the Golden
Triangle Development Link and,most importantly, you, the
(03:33):
citizens of Columbus.
I approve this message and, onApril 1st, vote Jason Spears for
Ward 6, paid for by thecampaign to elect Jason Spears.
Campaign to elect Jason.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
Spears, Thanks for joining today.
You are listening to Betweenthe Headlines hosted by the
omnipresent managing editor ofthe Commercial Dispatch, Mr Zach
Player.
Something different every weekand I am David Chisholm.
Hey, you ready to talk politics?
Oh, absolutely, well, what you?
Speaker 1 (03:59):
got Okay.
So I don't know if you saw this, but oh, I did.
The Columbus vice mayor, Ward 2Councilman, Joseph Mickens, has
taken the residents of hisopponent's show on the road to
the Supreme Court and he iscontinuing to challenge whether
(04:20):
they can even run against him.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
Why are we still doing this?
Well, first off, this is a wildmove.
Like I didn't even know, youcould jump that high immediately
.
Is there nobody in between theDemocrat Party of Lowndes County
and the Mississippi SupremeCourt?
I saw that release and I waslike holy cow.
First off, let me ask you whatdo we think about the merits of
this?
I mean, is there going to beany standing?
(04:46):
He lost the hearing.
And he lost the hearing becausehe didn't have any evidence.
He didn't have any evidence andI was like he really needs to
stop talking about this.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
This is really ugly.
Well, I mean, this is a.
It reeks of a lack ofconfidence in his position here.
I mean, you don't want to bearrogant when you're running for
office, but if you're afour-term incumbent, one would
think you would at least besomewhat confident.
Speaker 4 (05:18):
My question is this okay, what if he wins?
Like, what if he actually hasmerit and he comes before?
What?
Do we call them justices orjudges on that level?
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Right.
Speaker 4 (05:30):
Yeah, and and well, it's actually a special special.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
And it'll happen here in the county.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Right, I'm going to crash that party.
What if it is found that theDemocrat Party facilitated,
perhaps with the help of LeroyBrooks?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
and put forth— that's a conspiracy theory, David.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
But does he believe this or is he just—?
Speaker 1 (05:56):
The only thing that a four-term incumbent has to
really fear is if they've done abad job, which I know people
are going to argue that Mickens.
Some people are going to arguethat Mickens has done a bad job.
Some people are going to arguethat he's done a good job.
That's going to be every race,or that people are tired of you
and he's done everything wrongin the run up to this election
(06:19):
and since qualifying was overwith to remind people why they
might should be tired of him,because let's look at who he's
running against.
Let's look at who he's runningagainst and I'm not taking
anything away from either MsShishi O'Neill or Roger Smith.
But they're newbies.
Yeah, they're newcomers to thepolitical landscape and I
haven't seen I mean, they bothmay be doing phenomenal things
(06:43):
in their ward as far as theirground campaign, but publicly
that everybody could see.
You know there's signs MissShishi is out there, but I
haven't seen her really.
You know, overshadow Mickens inthe public sphere.
Roderick Smith has actuallydisplayed a lot of the tactics,
(07:05):
a lot of the practices that youwould think would be good in a
burgeoning leader.
He shows up to everything buthe sits in the back, he listens
more than he talks.
Like I said, a lot of thethings that you might want in a
leader, but as a campaigner hehas been fairly quiet.
These are not two candidatesthat a four-term incumbent with
(07:27):
a record should be afraid of, tothe point to where he's
sabotaging his own campaign totry to get them off the ballot.
And I think that what it showsus is he is really worried.
I think he's worried about, Ithink he's desperate, I think
he's worried about how the KennyWeigel thing affected him.
If you remember, he dresseddown a very popular department
(07:49):
head in the middle of a citycouncil meeting.
He was in on that Susan Wildermass with the grant writer and
he keeps making mistakes and Ithink that this may be the
biggest one that he's makingbecause, to your point, he's
making very relevant these twolargely politically unknown
people and I want to get them onthe show at this point yeah,
(08:12):
absolutely zach.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
This is absolutely wild if you look at it at face
value.
He is calling his own partycorrupt right.
He is throwing his peers thathe's going to have to work with
under the bus and rolling backover them.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
And instead of running against them, instead of
just running a race against hisopponents, he's trying to get
them off the ballot and I thinkthat tactic is.
I think the tactic, tactic isdesperate and I think it smacks
of a man who's probably going tofinish.
Third, in his primary.
And that is wild for afour-term incumbent.
Speaker 4 (08:50):
I guess we'll see him in court.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Well, something else that has kind of happened in the
political sphere over the pastweek two of your folks, two
Republicans, gop elephant folk,went to the Exchange Club, ward
5 Councilman candidate MayorBeth Jeter and Ward 6 Council
candidate Jason Spears.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
So I wasn't at this meeting.
They both spoke at the sameoccasion.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
That is correct and I was there.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
And Jason spoke first .
Speaker 1 (09:19):
He did, he spoke no, no, no, no, no.
Jason spoke last.
Miss Jeter spoke last.
Speaker 4 (09:24):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Miss Jeter spoke first, but I want to address
Jason first.
Now he had a really funny jokein this presentation where he
talks about the only person thatcould possibly be sure If he
writes something down.
The only person that couldpossibly be sure of what is
written down in front of themwould be Moses coming out of the
mountain.
I thought that was a funnycomparison.
Speaker 4 (09:49):
But the guy knows numbers, yeah, and well, the
thing about it is, if he's goingto—he has the money, knowledge,
as you say but the challengefor him is going to be when he
brings those tablets down fromthe top of Mount Sinai.
He is going to discover thegolden calf, he is going to
discover the monetary debaucherythat's happening at the bottom
(10:13):
of the hill here, and I'mwondering if he is going to have
the answer there, if he's goingto be able to help the people
to read the tablets.
Shall we say Right, there arecertain members of that council
not going to call names thatmaybe don't know how to read a
balance sheet, and so is whathe's going to sell going to go
(10:38):
over people's heads, or is hegoing to be able to bring people
to the table in a way that theycan understand and move forward
with him?
Speaker 1 (10:46):
CCMSD.
He's on that board.
You know that was a financiallycompromised organization at the
beginnings of the time.
When he was on that board hekind of took the reins of the
bean counting and he, you knowthey, you know refinanced debt,
they built a capitalimprovements fund, they started
making sound financial decisionsand he did a good job
(11:08):
explaining them.
I thought, I mean, he knowsthose questions to ask and he
knows how to pursue thoseavenues.
And I think one thing that I wasconcerned about with Jason's
candidacy when he started was ishe just going to be seen as a
bean counter?
Is he a one-trick pony?
And I really think I mean theexchange club.
He talked about crime, hetalked about recreation, he
(11:30):
thoughtfully talked about otherissues that weren't related to
the cost of things and he did.
I mean he leaned very heavilyinto the cost of things and the
bean counting because that'swhat he does professionally.
But he was very good speakingfrom a citizen standpoint on,
you know, thoughtfully talkingabout other issues that weren't
just money related, and I thinkthat's going to resonate.
(11:53):
And I was pleasantly surprisedhe has credibility even with the
existing council.
Members of this existingcouncil appointed him to the
school board, later appointedhim to the CRA board Columbus
Redevelopment Authority boardwhere he serves now.
So he's familiar with whatevermakeup of this council ends up
being.
He's familiar with those guys.
(12:14):
He does not carry with him thatABC a better Columbus baggage
that the current sittingcouncilwoman, jacqueline DiCicco
, did Fair or not, accurate ornot, she was seen in 2021 as an
ABC candidate, which reallyhelped her win.
(12:35):
That helped her beat Bill Gavinin a Ward 6 race where that ward
was just succumbing toanti-incumbent fervor.
But when she got on the council, the very thing that got her
there hurt her with hercolleagues.
They've shut her out.
She's on the losing end of alot of 4-2 votes on that council
(12:59):
and a lot of it is acredibility challenge that she
never overcame because of fairor not, accurate or not.
She was seen as the ABCcandidate that beat Bill Gavin
and they didn't trust her andhaven't trusted her.
Jason Spears won't quite havethat issue.
I don't think.
If he wins and he gets on thatcouncil with Rusty Green, who's
(13:22):
also been on the back end or thelosing end of some for a lot of
4-2 votes, yeah, you get thecombination of Rusty and Jason
and I think that thatcombination, that combination,
with their credibility withtheir colleagues and and
otherwise, could very mucheasier and much more often pull
(13:43):
a third vote on an issue andeven maybe move the voting
blocks around a littledifferently than they have been
over the past four years, whichcan't be a bad thing.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
That's definitely what the voters want.
I know that there is a sense ofupheaval and wanting to just
completely overthrow the currentsystem.
Now, different people willpoint at different incumbents,
but the overwhelming consensusin this town is we're just not
doing a good job, and so it allamounts to who they trust, and I
(14:17):
do think that Jason has trustbuilt Right, and camaraderie can
be everything.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
You know I want to go to Jeter for a second and
listen to her presentation andshe's running as the Republican
in Ward 5.
That's Stephen's ward right now, but of course he's running for
mayor, so there are threeDemocrats.
She's the Republican running inthat race, so she'll be on the
June ballot.
Something bothers me about hercampaign.
(14:43):
Essentially, if you want tolead something, you have to
believe in it.
If you want to lead the city, Idon't think that you can ignore
the negative.
I don't think that you canignore the things that need to
be changed, the challenges thatyou see ahead.
But doom and gloom campaignsdon't really do much for me.
Whatever organization thatyou're wanting to run, you
(15:07):
should be able to say threepositive things about it and the
theme of her campaign.
Her presentations have all been.
You know, columbus is fallingapart, the streets are unsafe,
somebody broke my window.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
Well, I can see that side of the argument.
But at the same time, thenegativity is there and the
negativity sells.
And I mean, if you look even at, let's just say, the
presidential campaign, we weretalking about what?
Inflation?
Just sky high.
World War III, all this kind ofstuff.
People just had their heads inthe absolute dirt and they were
(15:40):
angry and they were bitter andthey voted accordingly.
In the absolute dirt, and theywere angry and they were bitter
and they voted accordingly.
I can see that happening in thecity.
So, even though it might not bea sexy thing to be a doom and
gloom candidate, but what areyour solutions.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
Propose some Because, ok, leroy Brooks has gotten a
little bit of flack in themayor's race for the same kind
of thing, like, oh well, he'svery negative in some of his
campaigning and I think thatthere's an argument to be made
there.
I think sometimes he does slapColumbus upside the head a
little bit harder than you know,maybe is merited.
(16:19):
But with every time he does that, what does he do behind it?
He offers good, bad orindifferent what he sees as a
solution.
Other candidates have done thesame thing.
They've acknowledged somethingbad about Columbus.
But behind each of those, thosecampaigns are offering and if
I'm elected then this is how Ithink that we should approach it
.
You know, leroy's campaign isoffering that, bill's campaign
(16:42):
is offering that, darren'scampaign is offering that.
Stephen's campaign is offeringthat.
Darren's campaign is offeringthat Stephen's campaign is
offering that.
Many of the council campaignsare offering that.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Well, I think that she will reflect upon this and I
think she'll digest it and Ithink that over time, she will
form a more concerted opinionabout this and that and have
those solutions that you'rerequesting, because I do agree,
there was not a lot of contentthere, but what she did have is
(17:11):
that she was personable, she washonest, she brought up her own
divorce, which is I think ahumble thing to do and I don't
want to take away from theability for that to resonate
with people, because, let metell you this, speeches will not
win elections.
okay, I'm just going to be realand say if speeches won
(17:32):
elections, I would be in jacksonright now.
Okay, I'm not going to callnames, uh, either one of the but
, but what I'm saying to you isthat people vote for who they
can trust.
Okay and Okay.
And I got my ass handed to meby New Hope because they trusted
someone else, and I'm okay withthat.
I'm sitting here smiling.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
And this is when you ran for representative.
That is correct.
Speaker 4 (17:54):
I'm just saying that people vote for who they trust,
and that's just the way thisgame works.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
But there are positive things about the city
of Columbus.
I don't want to sound like I'mrunning for CVB board right now,
(18:21):
but there are positive thingsabout the city of Columbus and
if you are wanting to be aleader in the city of Columbus,
you need to.
Stephen Jones he listens to thepodcast and we appreciate his
listenership.
You may remember, a couple ofweeks ago, when we were talking
about the amphitheater we weretalking about, I suggested that
the city should either go withKeith's plan, which it would be
using the amphitheater for localevents while looking for third
party funding, or, if they'regoing to go with Stephen's plan
(18:43):
and insist that the thing becompletely finished and ready to
roll before they let anythinghappen there, then you know, get
off your duff and fund thething.
You got a capital improvementfund.
Well, at the work sessionThursday he floats that idea.
He says let's look at whetherto do that.
He's asking questions aboutthat or he's even bringing up
(19:04):
borrowing money which I don'tknow about either one of those.
But all I was saying was youknow, the status quo can't
remain.
At least this is some movement,one direction or the other.
What do you think?
Speaker 4 (19:17):
Well, to borrow money you have to have credit and you
have to have good credit.
And, if I recall, he votedagainst the forensic audit and
as a consequence of that, thereare things that we've been
uneligible for.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
There's grant monies this and that we have to be
financially solid, and one ofthe reasons that we're
ineligible for that the city isineligible for grant money in
certain cases is not because ofthe forensic audit, but because
the annual audits are too farbehind, and so they've got to
catch those up before they canbe an applicant for certain
(19:52):
grants.
Got to fix it.
Well.
And I've got one more questionfor you on Stephen.
Have you seen his Facebookposts where he's out on city
work sites looking at a map,pointing off?
Speaker 4 (20:05):
Are you talking about ?
Speaker 1 (20:06):
the one with the sidewalk.
Well, yeah, there's two of themthat I've seen.
There's one where he's standingon Blue Cut Road.
He's looking at a map he'spointing off into the distance.
Speaker 4 (20:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
And then there's the most recent one, where he's
standing over a place where asidewalk is about to be poured.
Yes, and he points off into thedistance somewhere, points off
into the distance somewhere.
Wrong answers only.
What is Stephen?
Speaker 4 (20:24):
pointing at?
It's obvious to me that he'spointing to an ugly-ass cell
phone pole We've already talkedabout that but I mean he may not
be pointing toward anything.
Okay, check it out.
I'm a fan of historicalpaintings and I just think he's
pointing forward.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Trying to touch the angel's finger on the top of the
.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
Sistine.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Chapel.
Oh, no, yeah, the SistineChapel.
No, I was thinking more.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
He's George Washington, but with better
teeth.
Okay, he's crossing the Lux,okay.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Okay, all right, Going to fix our town.
My wrong answer.
He's pointing at Waldo from thecartoon books with the glasses.
Yeah, I think he's fine inWaldo, or Waldo's fine in him,
and he can't believe his luck.
So it's a good thing he'sfollowing Jones and not Mickens,
and that's all I have to sayabout that.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Before we get to our next thing, let me ask you this
Do you need a space for yournext event?
The seventh street center hasjust what you're looking for.
We can accommodate groups ofany size.
Call today.
We can accommodate groups ofany size.
Call today, 928-255-7836 toreserve your space.
Do you have knee pain, muscleweakness, swelling or cold feet?
(21:33):
Call King Associates Cardiologyfor an appointment today at
662-368-1169.
No-transcript.
Well, I need to open this nextsegment with really bad news for
Mississippi.
The fate of MUW and ourhistorically black colleges and
(21:55):
universities hangs in thebalance.
I hate to say it, but unlessthere is a major change in our
legislative trajectory, muw,along with several of our
smaller colleges, they're goingto get axed.
They're going to be done.
Ok, it's a possibility.
Msms is just the beginning ofthis.
(22:17):
Here we have the finestresidential school in the South.
Ok, the numbers are out there.
The numbers are wild.
I mean.
These kids are absolutelysomething else.
They're going to be engineers,big time scholars.
They're going to stay here.
They're going to be engineers,big time scholars.
They're going to stay here.
They're going to invest theirmoney here.
They're going to invest theirbrain power here.
You've got a future Elon Muskof the South.
(22:39):
I mean, all this stuff couldhappen, maybe Richard Branson.
Regardless politicians in darkrooms filled with cigar smoke
are plotting to dig it up andmove it.
Where these teenagers will have, shall we say, close fellowship
with 23,000 college students,half of which are male?
(23:02):
How is that safe MSMS?
The bright beacon that it is,will get reduced to being the
nerd wing of Starkville High,where they will be bullied, they
will lose their ID and theywill fizzle away.
And, zach, this made absolutelyno sense to me.
I had to go out there and checkthings out for myself.
(23:23):
So the exact proposed site forthis contraption.
You can't make this stuff up.
It is currently a frog pond.
It is surrounded by woods onall fours.
Well, you've got a four lane onone.
It's got woods all around it.
It's right there, next to theschool.
There is a hundred feet dropfrom every direction.
(23:47):
And so I'm looking at this andnot only am I thinking you know,
some dirt man is going to getfilthy rich, but this is a
scandal, this is ugly, this is anasty chapter in our state
history, and the plans don'teven have a basketball arena or
anything.
There's no ball.
This is something really stinksabout this.
(24:08):
$174 million versus $35 million, all the while MSU has 10 acres
ready to roll.
It is a boondoggle.
And 81 out of 82 counties willfoot the bill for an enormous
school built over a frog pondthat is not in their county.
(24:29):
And I'm not done.
I wish I was.
Muw will not survive this and atsome point a bill will be
proposed and without enoughpressure it will pass both
houses.
And just before Tate Reevessigns it into law, he's going to
think about that moment whenLowndes County went for Brandon
(24:50):
Presley Just saying the MSMSpeople and the W people are
going to have to come togetherBecause, following this, there
will be a long blue line tocircle around the Ginkgo tree
for a final singing of Serene isthe Dawning mark my words.
(25:11):
After that you'll have vacanthistorical buildings overtaken
with vines and these people haveto come together with the same
fire and fury that they had overthat name change or even more.
They're going to have to callup their old roommate.
They're going to have to calltheir local lawmaker elsewhere
in the state.
(25:31):
Andy Boyd can't save us.
Kabir can't save us.
Dana, it's not going to happen.
They need to hear the gentlemanfrom Pontotoc, coffey County,
yalabusha, all these places.
They all need to hear from thealumni and if they don't, zach,
the 140-year-old tradition ofexcellence for women and men
(25:53):
will fade off into the night,followed by Alcorn Jackson State
, rust College, you name it, andI wish that weren't the case,
but that's exactly where this isheaded.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
Well, I mean, they may end up hearing from the
people of Octobahaw Countybefore it's over with, and that
may be the voices that areloudest of all.
I was doing a little bit ofnapkin math here.
So, looking at this bond thatwould build Starkville High
School, that's an $87 millionbond.
They've got it built into whereit can be stopped by a reverse
(26:32):
referendum.
So that's 2,500 or whateverpercentage of voters have to
sign a petition to get it on theballot to be voted on at all.
So what are some reasons whythey would do that?
Well, $87 million.
When you try to add interest injust napkin math, we're talking
about 12, 13, 14 mils thatyou're adding to the rate at the
(26:55):
school district.
You want to know what else ishappening.
The same time that tax is goingto be going on the books,
ocktippahaw County is going tobe reassessed.
Now you may remember whathappened in Lowndes County last
year when it was reassessed Taxbills went up 20% Organically,
if all the millages stay thesame in the city, in the county,
(27:18):
and then the school ends upadding the bond millage and over
on top of what they've alreadygot.
Just organically, with themillages the same, you're going
up 20%.
And so who's going to bite thatbullet?
Who's going to go down?
Who's going to go down onbehalf of the school?
Is it going to be the city?
Is it going to be OctoballCounty?
(27:38):
Which one's going to do it?
And I bet you it's going to beneither.
So 20% is going to happen in2026.
Okay, so you add this 14 mils orwhatever 14, 15 mils that
you're going to have to add toservice this bond for this high
school over 15 years.
(27:59):
So if you're paying okay, ifyou're paying $1,000, if you
last year, if your tax bill was$1,000 property tax, just the
reassessment is going to bumpthat up to $1,200.
You add the school on top ofthat.
You're talking $1,300, $1,400,$1,500 that you're going to be
(28:19):
paying on the same property thatyou're paying $1,000 on.
Now I think they're going toget those when that gets out
there.
I think they're going to getthose signatures on that
petition and I think it's goingto go to a ballot.
And if it goes to a ballot, Idon't think it can get 60
percent.
Which brings us to the nextquestion of if SHS isn't built
because Octavio Hall Countydoesn't want it and you've
(28:42):
already said that MSMS is goingto be part of this is there a
contingency plan for MSMS to bemoved over to MSU without SHS?
Speaker 4 (28:52):
I don't think there is one.
The only thing I hear of is theidea floating out there of
giving them the deed to the landwhere they current exist, and I
am not opposed to that at all.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Oh, I think that's a great idea, and that was
something that Senator ChuckYounger suggested.
Speaker 4 (29:05):
Yeah, but you're right, the math ain't mathing.
And I'll tell you somethingelse.
The people of Octobahaw Countyare still a little bit but hurt
over the hike in 2016.
Okay, they didn't want to payfor that school.
A lot of them, I mean they theyended up doing it but that bill
was low compared to 87.
Oh my goodness, absolute boondoggle.
(29:29):
And then when you add to thatthe fact that there's there's
not really any sports facilitiesin that drawing, Right.
I mean, where are they going toplay?
Are they going to put them on abus and take them to the old
complex?
It makes zero sense and I hateto be conspiratorial, but it
really really looks curatorial,but it really, really looks dude
(29:55):
.
it looks like they're reachinginto the legislative pot, all
these other counties to help digthem out of a trench right here
, both figuratively andliterally.
If you look at that plot ofland, I have never seen a more
uglier place to build a highschool in my life.
How are you going to do it?
Speaker 1 (30:11):
place to build a high school in my life.
How are you going to do it?
My sticking point is you'regoing to add this bond to the
tax rolls the same year thatyou're going to get reassessed
in the county and your taxes aregoing to go up 20% already if
nothing happens, and then anadditional 14 mils.
I don't see that happeningwithout any very substantial
resistance from the locals there.
Speaker 4 (30:32):
You've been listening to Between the Headlines with
Zach and David.
Next special guest, mr Joe MaxHiggins himself.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Joe Max, thanks for being with us today.
Speaker 6 (30:43):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
All right, I just want to jump right in Councilman
Joseph Mickens.
He's had a lot to say about thelink lately.
I mean, as you're aware and hehas said publicly, he was the
vote against Rural King, the taxincentives for Rural King
coming in when the city startedtalking about whether to keep
their lobbyist.
Mickens said on the record nowhe said it twice.
(31:06):
He said on the record to thedispatch we need to look at not
just the lobbyists but we needto look at that $100,000 that
we're giving to the link,because I don't think we're
getting anything out of it.
He said that.
He repeated that again Thursdayat the work session.
So I just want to start there.
What's his beef and what's yourresponse?
Speaker 6 (31:24):
You know, I'm not sure what Mickens' beef is.
You know, if you watch him he'spretty colorful.
He'll have one opinion one day,another opinion, another
changes his mind frequently.
There's, I think, a clinicalphrase for that.
But what I'm going to tell youis it makes not a difference to
me which position he takes.
I just wish he would take one.
(31:44):
I don't think the generalpublic knows.
The contracts we have foreconomic development services
are not at the city level.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Right the contracts with the county and then the
city pays into the countycontract.
Speaker 6 (31:55):
And if Mr Mickens and his peers think that they're
not getting the value that theyneed to get because they
basically write a check to thecounty and become a subset, they
get a seat on the board.
On the board, uh, uh, theirappointee is bill west, fine
businessman in town, good, goodknowledge, good capability, good
(32:16):
judgment.
Uh, all you get for the moneyis a seat on the board and and
those board members representthe area and the region.
But if he doesn't think he'sgetting his hundred thousand
dollars, it doesn't matter tothe link, because our contracts
with the county just means thecounty board supervisors will
write a, a, a check, a,000larger, and they'll have another
board seat on there.
And if that's what he and hispeers want to do, that's fine.
(32:40):
I'd like for them to have avote on it so he would either be
shut up or put up, kind of likeyou just said about off the can
or not.
I mean, is you in or is you out?
Because here's the deal.
The rural king thing was a totalembarrassment.
It was an executive session andthe general public didn't see
much of that and he was rude tothe consultant that came here
(33:01):
that represented at that timewas representing 40 deals around
the country.
He was rude to him the secondmeeting when they approved it.
He was rude to him the secondmeeting when they approved it.
The first meeting he basicallytold the developer that he
didn't trust the link.
The city didn't trust the linkbecause they didn't have a good
relationship with the link.
You don't tell a consultantthat.
(33:22):
At the next meeting, when itwas approved 5-1 and he was not
in the room, I told him.
I said hey guys, when company'sin the house you need to be on
your best behavior.
And he tried to pull a KennyWeigel on me and Joe Max Higgins
ain't going to get Kenny Weigelin a public meeting or a
private meeting, so he's the onethat left the room.
Speaker 1 (33:42):
Other candidates are running.
You've got Mickens who's sayinglet's dump the link or let's
reevaluate our relationship withthe link.
Let's dump the link or let'sreevaluate our relationship with
the link.
You've got other candidates whoare running for mayor, for
council positions, that aresaying if I win we're going to
improve the relationship withthe link.
We're going to.
You know, bill Strauss issaying that.
(34:03):
Leroy Brooks is saying that.
There are others that aresaying we've got to improve the
nature of our partnership withthe link and get more out of
that by having a seat at thetable and better leveraging that
relationship.
Y'all don't have a retailcontract with Columbus.
Speaker 6 (34:18):
Any of the towns.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
Right, y'all provide technical assistance when asked,
and I want you to go into whatthat actually means.
But how, if, say, leroy or billor some of these others, uh,
what they're talking aboutimproving the relationship with
the link what does that looklike in practice?
Speaker 6 (34:39):
with the city.
Well, I mean, use the useallowance county board of
supervisors as an example.
Uh, all of them are routinelyin our office contacting,
talking to us about stuff.
You know, of all the candidates, Leroy knows how it works.
We've been doing it for 21years.
But you know I will be honestwith you.
(34:59):
I was exchanging emails withthe city of Starkville's mayor
last night on some issues we'reworking on.
I talk to Rod Bobo probablythree or four times a month in
West Point.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
How often do you talk to Keith?
Speaker 6 (35:13):
Probably a handful of times in the time he's been
mayor.
Speaker 1 (35:17):
Okay.
Speaker 6 (35:18):
Probably a handful of times.
I think he's been in our officetwo or three times.
The others are frequent flyers,even though they've got to
drive over here.
You know, okay, but therelationship is, you know a it's
a two-way street but but we getasked on those from those other
communities when they've gotproblems.
We get brought in and said, hey, what are the solutions to this
(35:39):
?
How do you think we can fixthis?
Uh, mayor bobbo called me theother day, said I was somewhere
a retailer talked about locating.
He said I need a care, that'swhat we call it.
I need a care package.
Can betsy do me one?
It, I need a care package.
Can Betsy do me one?
I said, absolutely Withinprobably two hours.
We had it to him.
He had it to them.
We followed up with them and Ithink they're going to come to.
It's a retailer.
So I think it's going to cometo West Point.
But he worked the deal and theyjust asked us to get
(36:01):
technically involved.
Our extent on that is adifferent.
Example is example is when theyfirst started talking about the
annexation of that part of townsoutheast part of town when
they started talking about it.
Betsy in our office, she's ourdemographer she is our numbers
expert started running all ofour software and said it's a bad
decision.
The educational level is below,the home ownership is below,
(36:24):
the incomes are below.
You don't do anything but takeColumbus down if you annex it.
Well, we just had that in ourpocket and Mickens called me one
day, said can you go to lunch?
I said sure, I'll go to lunch.
And we met at Prophet's Porchand he said I want to talk about
this idea I've got.
And I said it's a bad idea,joseph.
And I told him why.
And I said you don't improveyour stature at all if you do it
(36:46):
.
And he said okay, then we'renot going to do it.
I said good, well then, lo andbehold, they decided to do it.
That's when our informationbecame public.
And you know, in all of thatstuff you're talking about
relationships.
We only had three people thatasked for that information Leroy
Brooks, a supervisor, asked forthe information, kabir Kareem
(37:06):
asked for the information andJackie DiCicchio asked for the
information.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
When Columbus is brought up, especially in its
relationship with the link anddevelopment and things like that
.
What kind of industrialposition do you see Columbus in
for industrial recruitment?
Landing anything, what can itland?
Is that something that itshould even be focused on, right
(37:33):
?
Speaker 6 (37:33):
now.
Well, again, it probably shouldbe okay.
There's limitations.
You're not going to findsomebody that wants a thousand
acres inside of the city ofColumbus.
It doesn't exist.
You're not going to see anybig-time commercial solar like
we have out in Dunster Park orbeing built in West Point.
Right now You're not going tosee that.
But there's some smallerbuildings that can be occupied.
(37:55):
The port is a location thatprovides a bulk breaking point,
but there's only about less than90 acres out there that's
available and right now I thinkthe port board is really going
through some thinkings aboutdeciding if they just want to be
a bulk breaking point and usemore land for bringing materials
in and loading them in, loadingthem in, loading out.
If we do, the land goes down.
(38:17):
Ironically, the city of Columbushad a chance to be a major
player in industrial developmentback years ago.
About 21 years ago they wereasked to be a partner in the
first megasite out at theindustrial park and the Board of
Supervisors offered them 40%ownership of the first meg site
where the steel mill is nowabout $3.3 billion investment
(38:40):
there, and they declined.
Had they been a partner in that, they would have been a partner
in the mega site where PACCARis located.
They would have probably been apartner where the steel
aluminum mill is being builtright now and they would
probably be a partner in thefixed-to-be-announced Senco mega
site.
But they couldn't see how theycould come up with 40% of $6.25
(39:00):
million.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Well, and that's I mean that's a lot of money at
the time, but not nearly as muchmoney as what would have been
generated on the back endMillions.
Speaker 6 (39:06):
I mean the steel mills check on their taxes.
This year was $14 million.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Wow, that's quite a lot.
Well, transitioning intoanother element of this, you
have talked publicly severaltimes about executives from
Steel Mill Aluminum Mill movingto Octavall County.
Living in Octavall County, lynnSpruill, the mayor in
Starkville, is actively openlytalking about when the ADI
(39:36):
workers get here, we're going tocapture them as residents in
Starkville.
What's holding Columbus backfrom being a residential
destination for those workersand how can they compete better?
Speaker 6 (39:47):
Well, you know, historically in the last 21
years, you know, when I got herewhen the steel mill came, it
seemed like almost all theexecutives moved to New Hope.
Now I think that was Corrineand Terry Brown's relationship.
You know Terry was pro-New Hopeguy.
He was y'all move out here,y'all move out here.
But people migrate okay, andschools drive a lot of the
choices okay.
But something weird hashappened in the last just couple
(40:13):
of years that did not exist.
I can't remember when we had anexecutive from a plant we
located that did not live inLowndes County, but that has
changed.
The administrator of BaptistHospital lives in Starkville.
Pat Carr's general managerlives in Starkville.
Aluminum Dynamics lives inStarkville.
The biochar lives in Starkville.
(40:34):
We were in a meeting yesterdaywith the biochar folks and I
think there are two, three andfour live in Starkville.
The biochar lives in Starkvilleand we were in a meeting
yesterday with the biochar folksand I think there are two,
three and four live inStarkville.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
So the worm has changed.
Speaker 6 (40:44):
Yeah, but housing is more expensive.
In Starkville Housing is moreexpensive.
I think the school options theylike better public and private
because both I think they'redoing both.
I think both sides arerepresented there.
But you know, there's a lot ofthings that come into factor
when somebody moves and youthink about you You're not from
here, I'm not from here Schools,churches, neighborhoods all
(41:06):
come into play and people aregoing to go where they feel the
safest, where they think theycan be integrated, where they
can have things to do.
All those things come intoeffect and the worm has turned
and unless something changes itwill continue.
And we track the rank and fileemployees and the executives of
(41:31):
all the facilities that have 50employees or more, that have 50
employees or more, and what wesee is the trend is pretty
strong that the executiveseither go to Caledonia or to
Starkville.
Speaker 4 (41:42):
Joe Max, the question was asked during the mayoral
Democrat debate.
Well, it ended up being anindependent debate what helps
Columbus to stand apart?
And the answer given was well,it's our people, which is a good
, pious answer, I thought.
But but what was not mentionedis what actually sets us apart,
(42:03):
and that is our river.
Okay, we're a water town.
You mentioned the portauthority.
Um, what do we have in theworks, in your opinion, in the
way of development on the tomand the lux.
Speaker 6 (42:16):
Well, we've got, uh, ironically, tomorrow we've got
an all hands on deck meeting onsome improvements that we're
making to the west bank.
Uh, rail, that's where thesteel scrap comes in.
Uh, and we've got a meetingwith neil schaefer and the steel
, the steel mill and and and andthe uh waterway operator.
Uh, we're going to put railinto the west bank, into the
west bank to allow us to get ridof the trucks bringing the
(42:38):
scrap.
Uh, once we get that rail in, Ithink it's going to open up
more possibilities on the westbank side.
But, uh, that's probably all in.
That's probably a 12, 13million dollar project, be my
guess.
Um, so that we're working onthat.
And again, uh, we're workingwith will and his team at the at
the port of.
Do we make it a bulk breakingpoint?
(42:58):
Okay, because there's someargument for agricultural
products to be shipped in andout.
We met not too long ago with aconcrete company that wanted to
bring in cement by barge Notconcrete cement a mixer and
store it in bulk there anddistribute it out of there to
their facilities, grains, moreand more aggregate products.
(43:21):
So they're trying to decide dowe take this 90 acres and put
buildings and plants on it or dowe use it for bulk breaking,
and it's a hard decision to make.
They can probably make moremoney using it as a bulk
breaking point.
Speaker 1 (43:33):
Well, I want to get into the ADI project ongoing.
Just want to get a statusupdate on that from you and also
a status update on, across theroad, the Cinco mega site that
y'all are trying to put together.
Speaker 6 (43:48):
At ADI.
They're making test aluminum.
They're going through testingand so is Biochar.
Biochar did some systems checkstwo weeks ago, but we expect
that the aluminum mill willstart running product by summer.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Okay.
Speaker 6 (44:02):
You know you've got a lot of kinks to work out on
something big like that.
They'll tell you oh, in amatter of weeks we'll be running
it full production.
That's probably not right butwe see that they're going.
We're now starting to see theircustomers starting to call Okay
.
So we've got our first customerthat we're working with that
will go in their customer parkthat will take product from them
(44:23):
.
I think most people willunderstand that I'm not going to
come build a plant to takealuminum for you until you get
your aluminum plant built andmake an aluminum.
But we've got a.
There's about a 700-acre parkthere, about 20-something.
Lots have been platted.
Water, sewer, roads are inplace and we've got our first
tenant and already in discussionwith our second and third.
So that's going well.
(44:44):
Cinco Megasite we will close onthat before the end of the
month.
It's a Friday 26th, I think, isthe tentative closing date for
purchase.
We've got our applications forthe water and the sewer pending
with the feds.
We went down and met with MDADirector Bill Cork, with an
(45:04):
entourage Stanley Spradling,elizabeth that works for me and
Tripp Harrison and I went downand met with them and his team
last week.
I think we're going to get somehelp from them and grants to
help us on our water and oursewer part.
So we're already marketing thesite.
It's already been shown forthose out there that are that
(45:25):
are nerds the Andrew projectthat went to Ohio.
That was announced at Ohio acouple of weeks ago.
The new drone people we wereone of the third.
Speaker 1 (45:32):
The Cinco site was one of the 13 sites that they
looked at for that and I think aquestion that's on a lot of
people's minds right now, or itwill be, especially where SDI
and ADI are concerned what'skind of your view of how the
tariffs are going to impactthose places?
Speaker 6 (45:50):
Well, not just those two, all of them.
I mean it'll help and it'llhurt if that makes any sense.
I mean you know it can probablyhelp those steel and aluminum
producers, largely, I would say.
But we've got othermanufacturers that it probably
could hurt.
You know, remember Yokohamabrings raw rubber in from Brazil
(46:15):
and into the port of NewOrleans and that's probably
going to have a tariff on it.
People think about PACCAR andKenworth and Peterbilt being
American companies, but theyalso have truck plants in Mexico
and in Canada and those trucks,the American company that
builds them there's importingthem.
(46:37):
They'll take a hit there.
Also, on components, you know,little parts that go in things
are made somewhere.
Well, they got a tariff on them.
You know you may sit there andsay, well, we've got to do
something else.
One of the plant captains toldme the other day said it takes
about 18 months for us to decideto get a new part supplier.
By the time they build amock-up, they test it, they send
(46:57):
it to us, we use it, they toolup.
About 18 months.
Speaker 1 (47:01):
Well, some people think this tariff thing won't
last 18 months so they'reprobably not going to bite the
bullet to go find anothersupplier.
Well, I mean, do you seeemployment shrinkage in any of
those plants?
Speaker 6 (47:13):
No, not because of the tariffs, I think markets I
mean some of them have had aslowdown around the end of the
year presidential election, allthose kind of things, but all of
them are running pretty well.
Their stocks are all holdingreal well.
Had a bad day yesterday butlargely their stocks are up and
their profits are up.
You know, those companies outthere make a lot of money.
Speaker 1 (47:36):
Well, completely switching gears here.
How do you see the MSMS-MUWissue playing out?
Speaker 6 (47:44):
Well, first of all, you know everybody wants us to
get involved and we just simplycan't.
I mean, I work for threecounties.
I work for Starkville, I workfor West Point, I work for
Columbus in the three countiesreally, who we work for?
I had a Columbus leader that Ithink is probably top five of
solid citizen in this countycame to me and said you've got
to get involved in this and Isaid I can't, we've got to take
(48:05):
a neutral position.
It will have an impact, that'sfor sure.
Maybe a bigger impact or alesser impact, depending on what
happens where it goes.
A bigger impact or a lesserimpact, depending on what
happens where it goes.
I think, that it generallystands to be.
That, depending on where youlive, is a side drone, and in my
(48:27):
discussions that I've had withpeople, it's pretty clear to me
that everybody has theirposition and they don't want to
listen to why it might not bethe right position Right, and
nobody wants to talk about planB because Plan B might be a
defeatist deal.
What does it mean?
How does it work?
What's the long-term benefit?
Speaker 1 (48:44):
All those things play into the role Well, one of the
things that's been suggested iscan MUW survive, as say, a
workforce development hub of MSU?
Speaker 6 (48:56):
Yeah, that's one of the things they talk about.
I mean, you know, you reallygot to look at their strength
and you know, I've been here 21years and I've heard well, it's
a top nursing school, it's a topnursing school, and you've
heard that too right, yeah.
Do you know the numbers?
Okay, you know.
We looked them up the other dayand they're ranked 39th.
And one of my staffers said,well, that's not all that good.
And I said, well, wait a minute.
(49:17):
There's over 800 nursingschools.
It's in the top four, betweenfour and five percent in the
country.
Speaker 4 (49:23):
Right, their education department is
something you don't want toshake a stick at.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that'srigorous and legit and speech
pathology okay.
Speaker 6 (49:33):
Now everybody pimps the culinary arts.
I just don't think there'senough majors there.
I think there's too much onthat.
I don't think long-term, butthere are probably some programs
that they do exceedingly well.
Okay, that you would.
I would hate for our state ofMississippi to lose those things
Right, just absolutely.
But you know it's years agothey invited Robert Smith, harry
Sanders, bart Wise, allegraBrigham and I to serve on focus
(49:55):
groups over there and they putus at different tables.
And they did this typicalstrength, weaknesses,
opportunities and threats.
And there was, I will say, ayoung lady she was probably
40-something at our table andpeople were talking about some
of the good things.
Well, the buildings arehistoric and the campus is
beautiful, and that's all trueand she said.
(50:15):
But she said, let me disclose,I sit on the IHL board.
And she said you have no ideahow much these old buildings
cost to maintain.
I imagine that's right, and shesaid it's a big number and so
you know there's pros and consfor either one.
You know I have a sneakingsuspicion the decision is
already made and we're justgoing through the motions, but
(50:37):
everybody's going to stay spunup until that decision is made
Sure.
Speaker 1 (50:41):
Does MUW survive in its current form if MSMS is
relocated?
Speaker 6 (50:47):
Yeah, I mean, I don't know.
I think you're going to have toask the question.
The last legislative session,some of the data that we got was
if the MSMS students 240, 50kids aren't there, it doesn't
make sense to have food serviceson campus.
Well, that's pretty damning.
I would think if you need thehigh school to keep your
(51:10):
residential dining services openI don't know if it's true or
not okay, but those are some ofthe things that if they do leave
, if that happens, you got tofigure this out.
Speaker 1 (51:21):
Switching gears again .
City elections who do you gotin the mayor's race, joe Max?
Speaker 6 (51:26):
Yeah well, I'm just not, I don't live in the city.
I live in the county, so I'mnot eligible.
I'm not eligible to vote, but Iwill tell you this county, so
I'm not eligible.
I'm not eligible to vote, uh, I, but I will tell you this, and
and and probably we haven't seenthis opportunity uh, uh or
issue out in in past years.
You know we, we're guaranteedto get a new mayor in the city
(51:46):
of clemence, absolutelyguaranteed, because current
mayor's not running, uh, he'snot running for mayor well,
that's right, he's running forcity council.
But we've got a chance.
Uh, rusty green is the only oneyou know is coming back.
So we've got a chance to have anew mayor and almost a
completely brand-new citycouncil.
At minimum, you're going to gettwo new ones.
Speaker 4 (52:04):
There's definitely an appetite for that.
Speaker 6 (52:07):
Yeah, well, but Jackie's not running.
Stephen's not he's running formayor, so he's not running.
So those two spots will be new.
And then, you're right, theappetite for the other.
I mean, I think there could bea lot of change.
We'll just have to wait and see.
Speaker 1 (52:23):
Last question I have for you.
Rumor mill swirling around.
I know you're working on acontract.
I know that that contract has acertain length.
Speaker 6 (52:32):
Oh, I've got a new contract.
Speaker 1 (52:33):
Oh you do.
Speaker 6 (52:34):
Yeah, five years, five and a quarter years,
starting in October.
So if you want to say January,five years.
So five years.
Okay, I'll be 70 years old.
I know I don't look it, I'll be70 years old and time to go to
the house, but I think that'sprobably the time that we'll
need.
I did this in West Point withtheir mega site.
(52:57):
I said I think in two yearsyou'll get a major development
there.
I won't do that on Cinco MegaSite.
I'm not going to make aprediction, but I think in that
five years we can get Cincobought, we can get it
infrastructured, we can have adang good chance of getting a
tenant for it and that'll be agood time to say adios.
Speaker 4 (53:11):
Mr Joe Max, I just thank you for being here today
and I thank you for your inputand for what you do for our area
, and I also want to thank ourlisteners for joining in.
Please help us talk it upSubscribe rate and share, and I
hope you'll also join in theconversation.
Talk to us, let us know wherewe're wrong.
Tips at cdispatchcom.
Again, that is tips atcdispatchcom.
(53:32):
You can also follow me onFacebook or X at the Chisholm 00
.
You've been listening toBetween the Headlines signing
off from Catfish Alley Studio inhistoric downtown Columbus.
Your host has been Zach Playerand I am David Chisholm.
Speaker 3 (54:02):
Until next time, keep it real and love the city in
which you live.
Opinions expressed on this showare those of the speakers and
not necessarily those of theCommercial Dispatch.
From the opinion page of the Commercial Dispatch.
This is Between the Headlines.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
This is Peter Imes, publisher of the Dispatch.
One of our hosts of Between theHeadlines is the managing
editor of our newsroom.
Typically we try to keep newsand opinions separate, but
reporters have a unique insightinto the workings of local
government and their analysiscan be helpful for readers and
listeners.
The Dispatch remains committedto journalistic integrity and
(00:38):
our reporting will alwaysreflect that.
And now between the headlines.
Speaker 4 (00:43):
This week's headlines , as you recall, regarding the
residency challenge of hispolitical opponents, we advised
Joe Mickens to either get offthe can or drop the deuce.
Well, comes now none other thanJoseph W Mickens Sr before the
Supreme Court of Mississippi.
Having chosen option number two, and with the clock ticking for
(01:09):
MSMS and MUW, what is the fateof our fine institutions?
I've got words, as does ourspecial guest for today, none
other than Mr Joe Max Higgins.
Retirement looks different foreveryone, so your plan should be
built around you.
For over 40 years, financialConcepts has helped people
(01:30):
create retirement strategiesthat fit their lives.
Our team in Columbus takes thetime to understand your goals
and build a plan that works foryou.
Wherever you are in yourjourney, we're ready to help.
We plan retirement.
Financial Concepts is aregistered investment advisor.
Do you need help achieving theright look in your house?
(01:51):
At Lighting, unlimited andUncommon Living, you'll find
quality, unique pieces that willelevate your home instantly.
Great furniture and lightingnot only reflect a style, they
also define a home.
With lighting, unlimited anduncommon living.
You can expect more.
Visit them at 1116 GardnerBoulevard or online at
(02:12):
lighting-columbuscom.
Benton's Maintenance andMechanical makes easy work out
of plumbing, electrical heatingand air conditioner problems.
You can book an appointment byphone or online and rest assured
they will show up at theappointed time.
Call Benton's at 662-657-2583or visit them online at
(02:34):
bentonsinccom.
That is bentonsinccom.
And now a message frompolitical candidate Bill Strauss
.
Speaker 2 (02:44):
I want to thank the Commercial Dispatch for this
podcast, bringing differentviews in an open discussion.
I'm Bill Strauss, humbly askingfor your vote as next mayor of
Columbus.
You deserve transparency andaccountability for your tax
dollars.
I'm business friendly andcharitable.
Vote Bill Strauss mayor ofColumbus 2025.
Paid for by campaign to electBill Strauss Mayor of Columbus
(03:05):
2025.
Paid for by campaign to electBill Strauss.
Speaker 4 (03:07):
And now a message from political candidate Jason
Spears.
Speaker 5 (03:11):
I am Jason Spears, candidate for City Council, Ward
6.
Over the past 20 years, Ifaithfully and effectively
served our community in manydifferent ways.
If elected, I will bringstructure and strategy to the
city's finances, help develop ablueprint to capitalize on the
growing economic activity in ourcity and work to strengthen
relationships with LowndesCounty officials, the Golden
Triangle Development Link and,most importantly, you, the
(03:33):
citizens of Columbus.
I approve this message and, onApril 1st, vote Jason Spears for
Ward 6, paid for by thecampaign to elect Jason Spears.
Campaign to elect Jason.
Speaker 4 (03:43):
Spears, Thanks for joining today.
You are listening to Betweenthe Headlines hosted by the
omnipresent managing editor ofthe Commercial Dispatch, Mr Zach
Player.
Something different every weekand I am David Chisholm.
Hey, you ready to talk politics?
Oh, absolutely, well, what you?
Speaker 1 (03:59):
got Okay.
So I don't know if you saw this, but oh, I did.
The Columbus vice mayor, Ward 2Councilman, Joseph Mickens, has
taken the residents of hisopponent's show on the road to
the Supreme Court and he iscontinuing to challenge whether
(04:20):
they can even run against him.
Speaker 4 (04:24):
Why are we still doing this?
Well, first off, this is a wildmove.
Like I didn't even know, youcould jump that high immediately
.
Is there nobody in between theDemocrat Party of Lowndes County
and the Mississippi SupremeCourt?
I saw that release and I waslike holy cow.
First off, let me ask you whatdo we think about the merits of
this?
I mean, is there going to beany standing?
(04:46):
He lost the hearing.
And he lost the hearing becausehe didn't have any evidence.
He didn't have any evidence andI was like he really needs to
stop talking about this.
Speaker 1 (04:57):
This is really ugly.
Well, I mean, this is a.
It reeks of a lack ofconfidence in his position here.
I mean, you don't want to bearrogant when you're running for
office, but if you're afour-term incumbent, one would
think you would at least besomewhat confident.
Speaker 4 (05:18):
My question is this okay, what if he wins?
Like, what if he actually hasmerit and he comes before?
What?
Do we call them justices orjudges on that level?
Speaker 1 (05:30):
Right.
Speaker 4 (05:30):
Yeah, and and well, it's actually a special special.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
And it'll happen here in the county.
Speaker 4 (05:35):
Right, I'm going to crash that party.
What if it is found that theDemocrat Party facilitated,
perhaps with the help of LeroyBrooks?
Speaker 1 (05:49):
and put forth— that's a conspiracy theory, David.
Speaker 4 (05:52):
But does he believe this or is he just—?
Speaker 1 (05:56):
The only thing that a four-term incumbent has to
really fear is if they've done abad job, which I know people
are going to argue that Mickens.
Some people are going to arguethat Mickens has done a bad job.
Some people are going to arguethat he's done a good job.
That's going to be every race,or that people are tired of you
and he's done everything wrongin the run up to this election
(06:19):
and since qualifying was overwith to remind people why they
might should be tired of him,because let's look at who he's
running against.
Let's look at who he's runningagainst and I'm not taking
anything away from either MsShishi O'Neill or Roger Smith.
But they're newbies.
Yeah, they're newcomers to thepolitical landscape and I
haven't seen I mean, they bothmay be doing phenomenal things
(06:43):
in their ward as far as theirground campaign, but publicly
that everybody could see.
You know there's signs MissShishi is out there, but I
haven't seen her really.
You know, overshadow Mickens inthe public sphere.
Roderick Smith has actuallydisplayed a lot of the tactics,
(07:05):
a lot of the practices that youwould think would be good in a
burgeoning leader.
He shows up to everything buthe sits in the back, he listens
more than he talks.
Like I said, a lot of thethings that you might want in a
leader, but as a campaigner hehas been fairly quiet.
These are not two candidatesthat a four-term incumbent with
(07:27):
a record should be afraid of, tothe point to where he's
sabotaging his own campaign totry to get them off the ballot.
And I think that what it showsus is he is really worried.
I think he's worried about, Ithink he's desperate, I think
he's worried about how the KennyWeigel thing affected him.
If you remember, he dresseddown a very popular department
(07:49):
head in the middle of a citycouncil meeting.
He was in on that Susan Wildermass with the grant writer and
he keeps making mistakes and Ithink that this may be the
biggest one that he's makingbecause, to your point, he's
making very relevant these twolargely politically unknown
people and I want to get them onthe show at this point yeah,
(08:12):
absolutely zach.
Speaker 4 (08:14):
This is absolutely wild if you look at it at face
value.
He is calling his own partycorrupt right.
He is throwing his peers thathe's going to have to work with
under the bus and rolling backover them.
Speaker 1 (08:29):
And instead of running against them, instead of
just running a race against hisopponents, he's trying to get
them off the ballot and I thinkthat tactic is.
I think the tactic, tactic isdesperate and I think it smacks
of a man who's probably going tofinish.
Third, in his primary.
And that is wild for afour-term incumbent.
Speaker 4 (08:50):
I guess we'll see him in court.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Well, something else that has kind of happened in the
political sphere over the pastweek two of your folks, two
Republicans, gop elephant folk,went to the Exchange Club, ward
5 Councilman candidate MayorBeth Jeter and Ward 6 Council
candidate Jason Spears.
Speaker 4 (09:12):
So I wasn't at this meeting.
They both spoke at the sameoccasion.
Speaker 1 (09:16):
That is correct and I was there.
Speaker 4 (09:17):
And Jason spoke first .
Speaker 1 (09:19):
He did, he spoke no, no, no, no, no.
Jason spoke last.
Miss Jeter spoke last.
Speaker 4 (09:24):
Okay.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Miss Jeter spoke first, but I want to address
Jason first.
Now he had a really funny jokein this presentation where he
talks about the only person thatcould possibly be sure If he
writes something down.
The only person that couldpossibly be sure of what is
written down in front of themwould be Moses coming out of the
mountain.
I thought that was a funnycomparison.
Speaker 4 (09:49):
But the guy knows numbers, yeah, and well, the
thing about it is, if he's goingto—he has the money, knowledge,
as you say but the challengefor him is going to be when he
brings those tablets down fromthe top of Mount Sinai.
He is going to discover thegolden calf, he is going to
discover the monetary debaucherythat's happening at the bottom
(10:13):
of the hill here, and I'mwondering if he is going to have
the answer there, if he's goingto be able to help the people
to read the tablets.
Shall we say Right, there arecertain members of that council
not going to call names thatmaybe don't know how to read a
balance sheet, and so is whathe's going to sell going to go
(10:38):
over people's heads, or is hegoing to be able to bring people
to the table in a way that theycan understand and move forward
with him?
Speaker 1 (10:46):
CCMSD.
He's on that board.
You know that was a financiallycompromised organization at the
beginnings of the time.
When he was on that board hekind of took the reins of the
bean counting and he, you knowthey, you know refinanced debt,
they built a capitalimprovements fund, they started
making sound financial decisionsand he did a good job
(11:08):
explaining them.
I thought, I mean, he knowsthose questions to ask and he
knows how to pursue thoseavenues.
And I think one thing that I wasconcerned about with Jason's
candidacy when he started was ishe just going to be seen as a
bean counter?
Is he a one-trick pony?
And I really think I mean theexchange club.
He talked about crime, hetalked about recreation, he
(11:30):
thoughtfully talked about otherissues that weren't related to
the cost of things and he did.
I mean he leaned very heavilyinto the cost of things and the
bean counting because that'swhat he does professionally.
But he was very good speakingfrom a citizen standpoint on,
you know, thoughtfully talkingabout other issues that weren't
just money related, and I thinkthat's going to resonate.
(11:53):
And I was pleasantly surprisedhe has credibility even with the
existing council.
Members of this existingcouncil appointed him to the
school board, later appointedhim to the CRA board Columbus
Redevelopment Authority boardwhere he serves now.
So he's familiar with whatevermakeup of this council ends up
being.
He's familiar with those guys.
(12:14):
He does not carry with him thatABC a better Columbus baggage
that the current sittingcouncilwoman, jacqueline DiCicco
, did Fair or not, accurate ornot, she was seen in 2021 as an
ABC candidate, which reallyhelped her win.
(12:35):
That helped her beat Bill Gavinin a Ward 6 race where that ward
was just succumbing toanti-incumbent fervor.
But when she got on the council, the very thing that got her
there hurt her with hercolleagues.
They've shut her out.
She's on the losing end of alot of 4-2 votes on that council
(12:59):
and a lot of it is acredibility challenge that she
never overcame because of fairor not, accurate or not.
She was seen as the ABCcandidate that beat Bill Gavin
and they didn't trust her andhaven't trusted her.
Jason Spears won't quite havethat issue.
I don't think.
If he wins and he gets on thatcouncil with Rusty Green, who's
(13:22):
also been on the back end or thelosing end of some for a lot of
4-2 votes, yeah, you get thecombination of Rusty and Jason
and I think that thatcombination, that combination,
with their credibility withtheir colleagues and and
otherwise, could very mucheasier and much more often pull
(13:43):
a third vote on an issue andeven maybe move the voting
blocks around a littledifferently than they have been
over the past four years, whichcan't be a bad thing.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
That's definitely what the voters want.
I know that there is a sense ofupheaval and wanting to just
completely overthrow the currentsystem.
Now, different people willpoint at different incumbents,
but the overwhelming consensusin this town is we're just not
doing a good job, and so it allamounts to who they trust, and I
(14:17):
do think that Jason has trustbuilt Right, and camaraderie can
be everything.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
You know I want to go to Jeter for a second and
listen to her presentation andshe's running as the Republican
in Ward 5.
That's Stephen's ward right now, but of course he's running for
mayor, so there are threeDemocrats.
She's the Republican running inthat race, so she'll be on the
June ballot.
Something bothers me about hercampaign.
(14:43):
Essentially, if you want tolead something, you have to
believe in it.
If you want to lead the city, Idon't think that you can ignore
the negative.
I don't think that you canignore the things that need to
be changed, the challenges thatyou see ahead.
But doom and gloom campaignsdon't really do much for me.
Whatever organization thatyou're wanting to run, you
(15:07):
should be able to say threepositive things about it and the
theme of her campaign.
Her presentations have all been.
You know, columbus is fallingapart, the streets are unsafe,
somebody broke my window.
Speaker 4 (15:18):
Well, I can see that side of the argument.
But at the same time, thenegativity is there and the
negativity sells.
And I mean, if you look even at, let's just say, the
presidential campaign, we weretalking about what?
Inflation?
Just sky high.
World War III, all this kind ofstuff.
People just had their heads inthe absolute dirt and they were
(15:40):
angry and they were bitter andthey voted accordingly.
In the absolute dirt, and theywere angry and they were bitter
and they voted accordingly.
I can see that happening in thecity.
So, even though it might not bea sexy thing to be a doom and
gloom candidate, but what areyour solutions.
Speaker 1 (15:54):
Propose some Because, ok, leroy Brooks has gotten a
little bit of flack in themayor's race for the same kind
of thing, like, oh well, he'svery negative in some of his
campaigning and I think thatthere's an argument to be made
there.
I think sometimes he does slapColumbus upside the head a
little bit harder than you know,maybe is merited.
(16:19):
But with every time he does that, what does he do behind it?
He offers good, bad orindifferent what he sees as a
solution.
Other candidates have done thesame thing.
They've acknowledged somethingbad about Columbus.
But behind each of those, thosecampaigns are offering and if
I'm elected then this is how Ithink that we should approach it
.
You know, leroy's campaign isoffering that, bill's campaign
(16:42):
is offering that, darren'scampaign is offering that.
Stephen's campaign is offeringthat.
Darren's campaign is offeringthat Stephen's campaign is
offering that.
Many of the council campaignsare offering that.
Speaker 4 (16:49):
Well, I think that she will reflect upon this and I
think she'll digest it and Ithink that over time, she will
form a more concerted opinionabout this and that and have
those solutions that you'rerequesting, because I do agree,
there was not a lot of contentthere, but what she did have is
(17:11):
that she was personable, she washonest, she brought up her own
divorce, which is I think ahumble thing to do and I don't
want to take away from theability for that to resonate
with people, because, let metell you this, speeches will not
win elections.
okay, I'm just going to be realand say if speeches won
(17:32):
elections, I would be in jacksonright now.
Okay, I'm not going to callnames, uh, either one of the but
, but what I'm saying to you isthat people vote for who they
can trust.
Okay and Okay.
And I got my ass handed to meby New Hope because they trusted
someone else, and I'm okay withthat.
I'm sitting here smiling.
Speaker 1 (17:52):
And this is when you ran for representative.
That is correct.
Speaker 4 (17:54):
I'm just saying that people vote for who they trust,
and that's just the way thisgame works.
Speaker 1 (18:00):
But there are positive things about the city
of Columbus.
I don't want to sound like I'mrunning for CVB board right now,
(18:21):
but there are positive thingsabout the city of Columbus and
if you are wanting to be aleader in the city of Columbus,
you need to.
Stephen Jones he listens to thepodcast and we appreciate his
listenership.
You may remember, a couple ofweeks ago, when we were talking
about the amphitheater we weretalking about, I suggested that
the city should either go withKeith's plan, which it would be
using the amphitheater for localevents while looking for third
party funding, or, if they'regoing to go with Stephen's plan
(18:43):
and insist that the thing becompletely finished and ready to
roll before they let anythinghappen there, then you know, get
off your duff and fund thething.
You got a capital improvementfund.
Well, at the work sessionThursday he floats that idea.
He says let's look at whetherto do that.
He's asking questions aboutthat or he's even bringing up
(19:04):
borrowing money which I don'tknow about either one of those.
But all I was saying was youknow, the status quo can't
remain.
At least this is some movement,one direction or the other.
What do you think?
Speaker 4 (19:17):
Well, to borrow money you have to have credit and you
have to have good credit.
And, if I recall, he votedagainst the forensic audit and
as a consequence of that, thereare things that we've been
uneligible for.
Speaker 1 (19:31):
There's grant monies this and that we have to be
financially solid, and one ofthe reasons that we're
ineligible for that the city isineligible for grant money in
certain cases is not because ofthe forensic audit, but because
the annual audits are too farbehind, and so they've got to
catch those up before they canbe an applicant for certain
(19:52):
grants.
Got to fix it.
Well.
And I've got one more questionfor you on Stephen.
Have you seen his Facebookposts where he's out on city
work sites looking at a map,pointing off?
Speaker 4 (20:05):
Are you talking about ?
Speaker 1 (20:06):
the one with the sidewalk.
Well, yeah, there's two of themthat I've seen.
There's one where he's standingon Blue Cut Road.
He's looking at a map he'spointing off into the distance.
Speaker 4 (20:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (20:14):
And then there's the most recent one, where he's
standing over a place where asidewalk is about to be poured.
Yes, and he points off into thedistance somewhere, points off
into the distance somewhere.
Wrong answers only.
What is Stephen?
Speaker 4 (20:24):
pointing at?
It's obvious to me that he'spointing to an ugly-ass cell
phone pole We've already talkedabout that but I mean he may not
be pointing toward anything.
Okay, check it out.
I'm a fan of historicalpaintings and I just think he's
pointing forward.
Speaker 1 (20:43):
Trying to touch the angel's finger on the top of the
.
Speaker 4 (20:45):
Sistine.
Speaker 3 (20:46):
Chapel.
Oh, no, yeah, the SistineChapel.
No, I was thinking more.
Speaker 4 (20:49):
He's George Washington, but with better
teeth.
Okay, he's crossing the Lux,okay.
Speaker 1 (20:54):
Okay, all right, Going to fix our town.
My wrong answer.
He's pointing at Waldo from thecartoon books with the glasses.
Yeah, I think he's fine inWaldo, or Waldo's fine in him,
and he can't believe his luck.
So it's a good thing he'sfollowing Jones and not Mickens,
and that's all I have to sayabout that.
Speaker 4 (21:11):
Before we get to our next thing, let me ask you this
Do you need a space for yournext event?
The seventh street center hasjust what you're looking for.
We can accommodate groups ofany size.
Call today.
We can accommodate groups ofany size.
Call today, 928-255-7836 toreserve your space.
Do you have knee pain, muscleweakness, swelling or cold feet?
(21:33):
Call King Associates Cardiologyfor an appointment today at
662-368-1169.
No-transcript.
Well, I need to open this nextsegment with really bad news for
Mississippi.
The fate of MUW and ourhistorically black colleges and
(21:55):
universities hangs in thebalance.
I hate to say it, but unlessthere is a major change in our
legislative trajectory, muw,along with several of our
smaller colleges, they're goingto get axed.
They're going to be done.
Ok, it's a possibility.
Msms is just the beginning ofthis.
(22:17):
Here we have the finestresidential school in the South.
Ok, the numbers are out there.
The numbers are wild.
I mean.
These kids are absolutelysomething else.
They're going to be engineers,big time scholars.
They're going to stay here.
They're going to be engineers,big time scholars.
They're going to stay here.
They're going to invest theirmoney here.
They're going to invest theirbrain power here.
You've got a future Elon Muskof the South.
(22:39):
I mean, all this stuff couldhappen, maybe Richard Branson.
Regardless politicians in darkrooms filled with cigar smoke
are plotting to dig it up andmove it.
Where these teenagers will have, shall we say, close fellowship
with 23,000 college students,half of which are male?
(23:02):
How is that safe MSMS?
The bright beacon that it is,will get reduced to being the
nerd wing of Starkville High,where they will be bullied, they
will lose their ID and theywill fizzle away.
And, zach, this made absolutelyno sense to me.
I had to go out there and checkthings out for myself.
(23:23):
So the exact proposed site forthis contraption.
You can't make this stuff up.
It is currently a frog pond.
It is surrounded by woods onall fours.
Well, you've got a four lane onone.
It's got woods all around it.
It's right there, next to theschool.
There is a hundred feet dropfrom every direction.
(23:47):
And so I'm looking at this andnot only am I thinking you know,
some dirt man is going to getfilthy rich, but this is a
scandal, this is ugly, this is anasty chapter in our state
history, and the plans don'teven have a basketball arena or
anything.
There's no ball.
This is something really stinksabout this.
(24:08):
$174 million versus $35 million, all the while MSU has 10 acres
ready to roll.
It is a boondoggle.
And 81 out of 82 counties willfoot the bill for an enormous
school built over a frog pondthat is not in their county.
(24:29):
And I'm not done.
I wish I was.
Muw will not survive this and atsome point a bill will be
proposed and without enoughpressure it will pass both
houses.
And just before Tate Reevessigns it into law, he's going to
think about that moment whenLowndes County went for Brandon
(24:50):
Presley Just saying the MSMSpeople and the W people are
going to have to come togetherBecause, following this, there
will be a long blue line tocircle around the Ginkgo tree
for a final singing of Serene isthe Dawning mark my words.
(25:11):
After that you'll have vacanthistorical buildings overtaken
with vines and these people haveto come together with the same
fire and fury that they had overthat name change or even more.
They're going to have to callup their old roommate.
They're going to have to calltheir local lawmaker elsewhere
in the state.
(25:31):
Andy Boyd can't save us.
Kabir can't save us.
Dana, it's not going to happen.
They need to hear the gentlemanfrom Pontotoc, coffey County,
yalabusha, all these places.
They all need to hear from thealumni and if they don't, zach,
the 140-year-old tradition ofexcellence for women and men
(25:53):
will fade off into the night,followed by Alcorn Jackson State
, rust College, you name it, andI wish that weren't the case,
but that's exactly where this isheaded.
Speaker 1 (26:07):
Well, I mean, they may end up hearing from the
people of Octobahaw Countybefore it's over with, and that
may be the voices that areloudest of all.
I was doing a little bit ofnapkin math here.
So, looking at this bond thatwould build Starkville High
School, that's an $87 millionbond.
They've got it built into whereit can be stopped by a reverse
(26:32):
referendum.
So that's 2,500 or whateverpercentage of voters have to
sign a petition to get it on theballot to be voted on at all.
So what are some reasons whythey would do that?
Well, $87 million.
When you try to add interest injust napkin math, we're talking
about 12, 13, 14 mils thatyou're adding to the rate at the
(26:55):
school district.
You want to know what else ishappening.
The same time that tax is goingto be going on the books,
ocktippahaw County is going tobe reassessed.
Now you may remember whathappened in Lowndes County last
year when it was reassessed Taxbills went up 20% Organically,
if all the millages stay thesame in the city, in the county,
(27:18):
and then the school ends upadding the bond millage and over
on top of what they've alreadygot.
Just organically, with themillages the same, you're going
up 20%.
And so who's going to bite thatbullet?
Who's going to go down?
Who's going to go down onbehalf of the school?
Is it going to be the city?
Is it going to be OctoballCounty?
(27:38):
Which one's going to do it?
And I bet you it's going to beneither.
So 20% is going to happen in2026.
Okay, so you add this 14 mils orwhatever 14, 15 mils that
you're going to have to add toservice this bond for this high
school over 15 years.
(27:59):
So if you're paying okay, ifyou're paying $1,000, if you
last year, if your tax bill was$1,000 property tax, just the
reassessment is going to bumpthat up to $1,200.
You add the school on top ofthat.
You're talking $1,300, $1,400,$1,500 that you're going to be
(28:19):
paying on the same property thatyou're paying $1,000 on.
Now I think they're going toget those when that gets out
there.
I think they're going to getthose signatures on that
petition and I think it's goingto go to a ballot.
And if it goes to a ballot, Idon't think it can get 60
percent.
Which brings us to the nextquestion of if SHS isn't built
because Octavio Hall Countydoesn't want it and you've
(28:42):
already said that MSMS is goingto be part of this is there a
contingency plan for MSMS to bemoved over to MSU without SHS?
Speaker 4 (28:52):
I don't think there is one.
The only thing I hear of is theidea floating out there of
giving them the deed to the landwhere they current exist, and I
am not opposed to that at all.
Speaker 1 (29:02):
Oh, I think that's a great idea, and that was
something that Senator ChuckYounger suggested.
Speaker 4 (29:05):
Yeah, but you're right, the math ain't mathing.
And I'll tell you somethingelse.
The people of Octobahaw Countyare still a little bit but hurt
over the hike in 2016.
Okay, they didn't want to payfor that school.
A lot of them, I mean they theyended up doing it but that bill
was low compared to 87.
Oh my goodness, absolute boondoggle.
(29:29):
And then when you add to thatthe fact that there's there's
not really any sports facilitiesin that drawing, Right.
I mean, where are they going toplay?
Are they going to put them on abus and take them to the old
complex?
It makes zero sense and I hateto be conspiratorial, but it
really really looks curatorial,but it really, really looks dude
(29:55):
.
it looks like they're reachinginto the legislative pot, all
these other counties to help digthem out of a trench right here
, both figuratively andliterally.
If you look at that plot ofland, I have never seen a more
uglier place to build a highschool in my life.
How are you going to do it?
Speaker 1 (30:11):
place to build a high school in my life.
How are you going to do it?
My sticking point is you'regoing to add this bond to the
tax rolls the same year thatyou're going to get reassessed
in the county and your taxes aregoing to go up 20% already if
nothing happens, and then anadditional 14 mils.
I don't see that happeningwithout any very substantial
resistance from the locals there.
Speaker 4 (30:32):
You've been listening to Between the Headlines with
Zach and David.
Next special guest, mr Joe MaxHiggins himself.
Speaker 1 (30:41):
Joe Max, thanks for being with us today.
Speaker 6 (30:43):
Thank you for having me.
Speaker 1 (30:44):
All right, I just want to jump right in Councilman
Joseph Mickens.
He's had a lot to say about thelink lately.
I mean, as you're aware and hehas said publicly, he was the
vote against Rural King, the taxincentives for Rural King
coming in when the city startedtalking about whether to keep
their lobbyist.
Mickens said on the record nowhe said it twice.
(31:06):
He said on the record to thedispatch we need to look at not
just the lobbyists but we needto look at that $100,000 that
we're giving to the link,because I don't think we're
getting anything out of it.
He said that.
He repeated that again Thursdayat the work session.
So I just want to start there.
What's his beef and what's yourresponse?
Speaker 6 (31:24):
You know, I'm not sure what Mickens' beef is.
You know, if you watch him he'spretty colorful.
He'll have one opinion one day,another opinion, another
changes his mind frequently.
There's, I think, a clinicalphrase for that.
But what I'm going to tell youis it makes not a difference to
me which position he takes.
I just wish he would take one.
(31:44):
I don't think the generalpublic knows.
The contracts we have foreconomic development services
are not at the city level.
Speaker 1 (31:50):
Right the contracts with the county and then the
city pays into the countycontract.
Speaker 6 (31:55):
And if Mr Mickens and his peers think that they're
not getting the value that theyneed to get because they
basically write a check to thecounty and become a subset, they
get a seat on the board.
On the board, uh, uh, theirappointee is bill west, fine
businessman in town, good, goodknowledge, good capability, good
(32:16):
judgment.
Uh, all you get for the moneyis a seat on the board and and
those board members representthe area and the region.
But if he doesn't think he'sgetting his hundred thousand
dollars, it doesn't matter tothe link, because our contracts
with the county just means thecounty board supervisors will
write a, a, a check, a,000larger, and they'll have another
board seat on there.
And if that's what he and hispeers want to do, that's fine.
(32:40):
I'd like for them to have avote on it so he would either be
shut up or put up, kind of likeyou just said about off the can
or not.
I mean, is you in or is you out?
Because here's the deal.
The rural king thing was a totalembarrassment.
It was an executive session andthe general public didn't see
much of that and he was rude tothe consultant that came here
(33:01):
that represented at that timewas representing 40 deals around
the country.
He was rude to him the secondmeeting when they approved it.
He was rude to him the secondmeeting when they approved it.
The first meeting he basicallytold the developer that he
didn't trust the link.
The city didn't trust the linkbecause they didn't have a good
relationship with the link.
You don't tell a consultantthat.
(33:22):
At the next meeting, when itwas approved 5-1 and he was not
in the room, I told him.
I said hey guys, when company'sin the house you need to be on
your best behavior.
And he tried to pull a KennyWeigel on me and Joe Max Higgins
ain't going to get Kenny Weigelin a public meeting or a
private meeting, so he's the onethat left the room.
Speaker 1 (33:42):
Other candidates are running.
You've got Mickens who's sayinglet's dump the link or let's
reevaluate our relationship withthe link.
Let's dump the link or let'sreevaluate our relationship with
the link.
You've got other candidates whoare running for mayor, for
council positions, that aresaying if I win we're going to
improve the relationship withthe link.
We're going to.
You know, bill Strauss issaying that.
(34:03):
Leroy Brooks is saying that.
There are others that aresaying we've got to improve the
nature of our partnership withthe link and get more out of
that by having a seat at thetable and better leveraging that
relationship.
Y'all don't have a retailcontract with Columbus.
Speaker 6 (34:18):
Any of the towns.
Speaker 1 (34:19):
Right, y'all provide technical assistance when asked,
and I want you to go into whatthat actually means.
But how, if, say, leroy or billor some of these others, uh,
what they're talking aboutimproving the relationship with
the link what does that looklike in practice?
Speaker 6 (34:39):
with the city.
Well, I mean, use the useallowance county board of
supervisors as an example.
Uh, all of them are routinelyin our office contacting,
talking to us about stuff.
You know, of all the candidates, Leroy knows how it works.
We've been doing it for 21years.
But you know I will be honestwith you.
(34:59):
I was exchanging emails withthe city of Starkville's mayor
last night on some issues we'reworking on.
I talk to Rod Bobo probablythree or four times a month in
West Point.
Speaker 1 (35:11):
How often do you talk to Keith?
Speaker 6 (35:13):
Probably a handful of times in the time he's been
mayor.
Speaker 1 (35:17):
Okay.
Speaker 6 (35:18):
Probably a handful of times.
I think he's been in our officetwo or three times.
The others are frequent flyers,even though they've got to
drive over here.
You know, okay, but therelationship is, you know a it's
a two-way street but but we getasked on those from those other
communities when they've gotproblems.
We get brought in and said, hey, what are the solutions to this
(35:39):
?
How do you think we can fixthis?
Uh, mayor bobbo called me theother day, said I was somewhere
a retailer talked about locating.
He said I need a care, that'swhat we call it.
I need a care package.
Can betsy do me one?
It, I need a care package.
Can Betsy do me one?
I said, absolutely Withinprobably two hours.
We had it to him.
He had it to them.
We followed up with them and Ithink they're going to come to.
It's a retailer.
So I think it's going to cometo West Point.
But he worked the deal and theyjust asked us to get
(36:01):
technically involved.
Our extent on that is adifferent.
Example is example is when theyfirst started talking about the
annexation of that part of townsoutheast part of town when
they started talking about it.
Betsy in our office, she's ourdemographer she is our numbers
expert started running all ofour software and said it's a bad
decision.
The educational level is below,the home ownership is below,
(36:24):
the incomes are below.
You don't do anything but takeColumbus down if you annex it.
Well, we just had that in ourpocket and Mickens called me one
day, said can you go to lunch?
I said sure, I'll go to lunch.
And we met at Prophet's Porchand he said I want to talk about
this idea I've got.
And I said it's a bad idea,joseph.
And I told him why.
And I said you don't improveyour stature at all if you do it
(36:46):
.
And he said okay, then we'renot going to do it.
I said good, well then, lo andbehold, they decided to do it.
That's when our informationbecame public.
And you know, in all of thatstuff you're talking about
relationships.
We only had three people thatasked for that information Leroy
Brooks, a supervisor, asked forthe information, kabir Kareem
(37:06):
asked for the information andJackie DiCicchio asked for the
information.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
When Columbus is brought up, especially in its
relationship with the link anddevelopment and things like that
.
What kind of industrialposition do you see Columbus in
for industrial recruitment?
Landing anything, what can itland?
Is that something that itshould even be focused on, right
(37:33):
?
Speaker 6 (37:33):
now.
Well, again, it probably shouldbe okay.
There's limitations.
You're not going to findsomebody that wants a thousand
acres inside of the city ofColumbus.
It doesn't exist.
You're not going to see anybig-time commercial solar like
we have out in Dunster Park orbeing built in West Point.
Right now You're not going tosee that.
But there's some smallerbuildings that can be occupied.
(37:55):
The port is a location thatprovides a bulk breaking point,
but there's only about less than90 acres out there that's
available and right now I thinkthe port board is really going
through some thinkings aboutdeciding if they just want to be
a bulk breaking point and usemore land for bringing materials
in and loading them in, loadingthem in, loading out.
If we do, the land goes down.
(38:17):
Ironically, the city of Columbushad a chance to be a major
player in industrial developmentback years ago.
About 21 years ago they wereasked to be a partner in the
first megasite out at theindustrial park and the Board of
Supervisors offered them 40%ownership of the first meg site
where the steel mill is nowabout $3.3 billion investment
(38:40):
there, and they declined.
Had they been a partner in that, they would have been a partner
in the mega site where PACCARis located.
They would have probably been apartner where the steel
aluminum mill is being builtright now and they would
probably be a partner in thefixed-to-be-announced Senco mega
site.
But they couldn't see how theycould come up with 40% of $6.25
(39:00):
million.
Speaker 1 (39:01):
Well, and that's I mean that's a lot of money at
the time, but not nearly as muchmoney as what would have been
generated on the back endMillions.
Speaker 6 (39:06):
I mean the steel mills check on their taxes.
This year was $14 million.
Speaker 1 (39:12):
Wow, that's quite a lot.
Well, transitioning intoanother element of this, you
have talked publicly severaltimes about executives from
Steel Mill Aluminum Mill movingto Octavall County.
Living in Octavall County, lynnSpruill, the mayor in
Starkville, is actively openlytalking about when the ADI
(39:36):
workers get here, we're going tocapture them as residents in
Starkville.
What's holding Columbus backfrom being a residential
destination for those workersand how can they compete better?
Speaker 6 (39:47):
Well, you know, historically in the last 21
years, you know, when I got herewhen the steel mill came, it
seemed like almost all theexecutives moved to New Hope.
Now I think that was Corrineand Terry Brown's relationship.
You know Terry was pro-New Hopeguy.
He was y'all move out here,y'all move out here.
But people migrate okay, andschools drive a lot of the
choices okay.
But something weird hashappened in the last just couple
(40:13):
of years that did not exist.
I can't remember when we had anexecutive from a plant we
located that did not live inLowndes County, but that has
changed.
The administrator of BaptistHospital lives in Starkville.
Pat Carr's general managerlives in Starkville.
Aluminum Dynamics lives inStarkville.
The biochar lives in Starkville.
(40:34):
We were in a meeting yesterdaywith the biochar folks and I
think there are two, three andfour live in Starkville.
The biochar lives in Starkvilleand we were in a meeting
yesterday with the biochar folksand I think there are two,
three and four live inStarkville.
Speaker 1 (40:43):
So the worm has changed.
Speaker 6 (40:44):
Yeah, but housing is more expensive.
In Starkville Housing is moreexpensive.
I think the school options theylike better public and private
because both I think they'redoing both.
I think both sides arerepresented there.
But you know, there's a lot ofthings that come into factor
when somebody moves and youthink about you You're not from
here, I'm not from here Schools,churches, neighborhoods all
(41:06):
come into play and people aregoing to go where they feel the
safest, where they think theycan be integrated, where they
can have things to do.
All those things come intoeffect and the worm has turned
and unless something changes itwill continue.
And we track the rank and fileemployees and the executives of
(41:31):
all the facilities that have 50employees or more, that have 50
employees or more, and what wesee is the trend is pretty
strong that the executiveseither go to Caledonia or to
Starkville.
Speaker 4 (41:42):
Joe Max, the question was asked during the mayoral
Democrat debate.
Well, it ended up being anindependent debate what helps
Columbus to stand apart?
And the answer given was well,it's our people, which is a good
, pious answer, I thought.
But but what was not mentionedis what actually sets us apart,
(42:03):
and that is our river.
Okay, we're a water town.
You mentioned the portauthority.
Um, what do we have in theworks, in your opinion, in the
way of development on the tomand the lux.
Speaker 6 (42:16):
Well, we've got, uh, ironically, tomorrow we've got
an all hands on deck meeting onsome improvements that we're
making to the west bank.
Uh, rail, that's where thesteel scrap comes in.
Uh, and we've got a meetingwith neil schaefer and the steel
, the steel mill and and and andthe uh waterway operator.
Uh, we're going to put railinto the west bank, into the
west bank to allow us to get ridof the trucks bringing the
(42:38):
scrap.
Uh, once we get that rail in, Ithink it's going to open up
more possibilities on the westbank side.
But, uh, that's probably all in.
That's probably a 12, 13million dollar project, be my
guess.
Um, so that we're working onthat.
And again, uh, we're workingwith will and his team at the at
the port of.
Do we make it a bulk breakingpoint?
(42:58):
Okay, because there's someargument for agricultural
products to be shipped in andout.
We met not too long ago with aconcrete company that wanted to
bring in cement by barge Notconcrete cement a mixer and
store it in bulk there anddistribute it out of there to
their facilities, grains, moreand more aggregate products.
(43:21):
So they're trying to decide dowe take this 90 acres and put
buildings and plants on it or dowe use it for bulk breaking,
and it's a hard decision to make.
They can probably make moremoney using it as a bulk
breaking point.
Speaker 1 (43:33):
Well, I want to get into the ADI project ongoing.
Just want to get a statusupdate on that from you and also
a status update on, across theroad, the Cinco mega site that
y'all are trying to put together.
Speaker 6 (43:48):
At ADI.
They're making test aluminum.
They're going through testingand so is Biochar.
Biochar did some systems checkstwo weeks ago, but we expect
that the aluminum mill willstart running product by summer.
Speaker 1 (44:01):
Okay.
Speaker 6 (44:02):
You know you've got a lot of kinks to work out on
something big like that.
They'll tell you oh, in amatter of weeks we'll be running
it full production.
That's probably not right butwe see that they're going.
We're now starting to see theircustomers starting to call Okay
.
So we've got our first customerthat we're working with that
will go in their customer parkthat will take product from them
(44:23):
.
I think most people willunderstand that I'm not going to
come build a plant to takealuminum for you until you get
your aluminum plant built andmake an aluminum.
But we've got a.
There's about a 700-acre parkthere, about 20-something.
Lots have been platted.
Water, sewer, roads are inplace and we've got our first
tenant and already in discussionwith our second and third.
So that's going well.
(44:44):
Cinco Megasite we will close onthat before the end of the
month.
It's a Friday 26th, I think, isthe tentative closing date for
purchase.
We've got our applications forthe water and the sewer pending
with the feds.
We went down and met with MDADirector Bill Cork, with an
(45:04):
entourage Stanley Spradling,elizabeth that works for me and
Tripp Harrison and I went downand met with them and his team
last week.
I think we're going to get somehelp from them and grants to
help us on our water and oursewer part.
So we're already marketing thesite.
It's already been shown forthose out there that are that
(45:25):
are nerds the Andrew projectthat went to Ohio.
That was announced at Ohio acouple of weeks ago.
The new drone people we wereone of the third.
Speaker 1 (45:32):
The Cinco site was one of the 13 sites that they
looked at for that and I think aquestion that's on a lot of
people's minds right now, or itwill be, especially where SDI
and ADI are concerned what'skind of your view of how the
tariffs are going to impactthose places?
Speaker 6 (45:50):
Well, not just those two, all of them.
I mean it'll help and it'llhurt if that makes any sense.
I mean you know it can probablyhelp those steel and aluminum
producers, largely, I would say.
But we've got othermanufacturers that it probably
could hurt.
You know, remember Yokohamabrings raw rubber in from Brazil
(46:15):
and into the port of NewOrleans and that's probably
going to have a tariff on it.
People think about PACCAR andKenworth and Peterbilt being
American companies, but theyalso have truck plants in Mexico
and in Canada and those trucks,the American company that
builds them there's importingthem.
(46:37):
They'll take a hit there.
Also, on components, you know,little parts that go in things
are made somewhere.
Well, they got a tariff on them.
You know you may sit there andsay, well, we've got to do
something else.
One of the plant captains toldme the other day said it takes
about 18 months for us to decideto get a new part supplier.
By the time they build amock-up, they test it, they send
(46:57):
it to us, we use it, they toolup.
About 18 months.
Speaker 1 (47:01):
Well, some people think this tariff thing won't
last 18 months so they'reprobably not going to bite the
bullet to go find anothersupplier.
Well, I mean, do you seeemployment shrinkage in any of
those plants?
Speaker 6 (47:13):
No, not because of the tariffs, I think markets I
mean some of them have had aslowdown around the end of the
year presidential election, allthose kind of things, but all of
them are running pretty well.
Their stocks are all holdingreal well.
Had a bad day yesterday butlargely their stocks are up and
their profits are up.
You know, those companies outthere make a lot of money.
Speaker 1 (47:36):
Well, completely switching gears here.
How do you see the MSMS-MUWissue playing out?
Speaker 6 (47:44):
Well, first of all, you know everybody wants us to
get involved and we just simplycan't.
I mean, I work for threecounties.
I work for Starkville, I workfor West Point, I work for
Columbus in the three countiesreally, who we work for?
I had a Columbus leader that Ithink is probably top five of
solid citizen in this countycame to me and said you've got
to get involved in this and Isaid I can't, we've got to take
(48:05):
a neutral position.
It will have an impact, that'sfor sure.
Maybe a bigger impact or alesser impact, depending on what
happens where it goes.
A bigger impact or a lesserimpact, depending on what
happens where it goes.
I think, that it generallystands to be.
That, depending on where youlive, is a side drone, and in my
(48:27):
discussions that I've had withpeople, it's pretty clear to me
that everybody has theirposition and they don't want to
listen to why it might not bethe right position Right, and
nobody wants to talk about planB because Plan B might be a
defeatist deal.
What does it mean?
How does it work?
What's the long-term benefit?
Speaker 1 (48:44):
All those things play into the role Well, one of the
things that's been suggested iscan MUW survive, as say, a
workforce development hub of MSU?
Speaker 6 (48:56):
Yeah, that's one of the things they talk about.
I mean, you know, you reallygot to look at their strength
and you know, I've been here 21years and I've heard well, it's
a top nursing school, it's a topnursing school, and you've
heard that too right, yeah.
Do you know the numbers?
Okay, you know.
We looked them up the other dayand they're ranked 39th.
And one of my staffers said,well, that's not all that good.
And I said, well, wait a minute.
(49:17):
There's over 800 nursingschools.
It's in the top four, betweenfour and five percent in the
country.
Speaker 4 (49:23):
Right, their education department is
something you don't want toshake a stick at.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that'srigorous and legit and speech
pathology okay.
Speaker 6 (49:33):
Now everybody pimps the culinary arts.
I just don't think there'senough majors there.
I think there's too much onthat.
I don't think long-term, butthere are probably some programs
that they do exceedingly well.
Okay, that you would.
I would hate for our state ofMississippi to lose those things
Right, just absolutely.
But you know it's years agothey invited Robert Smith, harry
Sanders, bart Wise, allegraBrigham and I to serve on focus
(49:55):
groups over there and they putus at different tables.
And they did this typicalstrength, weaknesses,
opportunities and threats.
And there was, I will say, ayoung lady she was probably
40-something at our table andpeople were talking about some
of the good things.
Well, the buildings arehistoric and the campus is
beautiful, and that's all trueand she said.
(50:15):
But she said, let me disclose,I sit on the IHL board.
And she said you have no ideahow much these old buildings
cost to maintain.
I imagine that's right, and shesaid it's a big number and so
you know there's pros and consfor either one.
You know I have a sneakingsuspicion the decision is
already made and we're justgoing through the motions, but
(50:37):
everybody's going to stay spunup until that decision is made
Sure.
Speaker 1 (50:41):
Does MUW survive in its current form if MSMS is
relocated?
Speaker 6 (50:47):
Yeah, I mean, I don't know.
I think you're going to have toask the question.
The last legislative session,some of the data that we got was
if the MSMS students 240, 50kids aren't there, it doesn't
make sense to have food serviceson campus.
Well, that's pretty damning.
I would think if you need thehigh school to keep your
(51:10):
residential dining services openI don't know if it's true or
not okay, but those are some ofthe things that if they do leave
, if that happens, you got tofigure this out.
Speaker 1 (51:21):
Switching gears again .
City elections who do you gotin the mayor's race, joe Max?
Speaker 6 (51:26):
Yeah well, I'm just not, I don't live in the city.
I live in the county, so I'mnot eligible.
I'm not eligible to vote, but Iwill tell you this county, so
I'm not eligible.
I'm not eligible to vote, uh, I, but I will tell you this, and
and and probably we haven't seenthis opportunity uh, uh or
issue out in in past years.
You know we, we're guaranteedto get a new mayor in the city
(51:46):
of clemence, absolutelyguaranteed, because current
mayor's not running, uh, he'snot running for mayor well,
that's right, he's running forcity council.
But we've got a chance.
Uh, rusty green is the only oneyou know is coming back.
So we've got a chance to have anew mayor and almost a
completely brand-new citycouncil.
At minimum, you're going to gettwo new ones.
Speaker 4 (52:04):
There's definitely an appetite for that.
Speaker 6 (52:07):
Yeah, well, but Jackie's not running.
Stephen's not he's running formayor, so he's not running.
So those two spots will be new.
And then, you're right, theappetite for the other.
I mean, I think there could bea lot of change.
We'll just have to wait and see.
Speaker 1 (52:23):
Last question I have for you.
Rumor mill swirling around.
I know you're working on acontract.
I know that that contract has acertain length.
Speaker 6 (52:32):
Oh, I've got a new contract.
Speaker 1 (52:33):
Oh you do.
Speaker 6 (52:34):
Yeah, five years, five and a quarter years,
starting in October.
So if you want to say January,five years.
So five years.
Okay, I'll be 70 years old.
I know I don't look it, I'll be70 years old and time to go to
the house, but I think that'sprobably the time that we'll
need.
I did this in West Point withtheir mega site.
(52:57):
I said I think in two yearsyou'll get a major development
there.
I won't do that on Cinco MegaSite.
I'm not going to make aprediction, but I think in that
five years we can get Cincobought, we can get it
infrastructured, we can have adang good chance of getting a
tenant for it and that'll be agood time to say adios.
Speaker 4 (53:11):
Mr Joe Max, I just thank you for being here today
and I thank you for your inputand for what you do for our area
, and I also want to thank ourlisteners for joining in.
Please help us talk it upSubscribe rate and share, and I
hope you'll also join in theconversation.
Talk to us, let us know wherewe're wrong.
Tips at cdispatchcom.
Again, that is tips atcdispatchcom.
(53:32):
You can also follow me onFacebook or X at the Chisholm 00
.
You've been listening toBetween the Headlines signing
off from Catfish Alley Studio inhistoric downtown Columbus.
Your host has been Zach Playerand I am David Chisholm.
Speaker 3 (54:02):
Until next time, keep it real and love the city in
which you live.
Opinions expressed on this showare those of the speakers and
not necessarily those of theCommercial Dispatch.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
24/7 News: The Latest
The latest news in 4 minutes updated every hour, every day.
Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.