Goldie Chan - Founder and Author of Warm Robots & Personal Branding for Introverts | California Leaders - California Leaders

Episode Transcript
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Narrator 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the California Leaders Podcast,
where we dive deep into thestories of the visionaries
shaping the future of ourregion.
Hosted by Christopher Luna,this podcast brings you
conversations with the moversand shakers, driving innovation,
leadership, and communityimpact across California.
Whether you are anentrepreneur, a community

(00:21):
leader, or simply someonepassionate about making the
difference.
This podcast is your gateway tothe insights and inspiration
you need to lead and succeed.
Get ready to get inspired bythe leaders making waves in
California and beyond.

Narrator 2 (00:36):
In this episode, we welcome Goldie Chan, Warm Robots
founder, a creative keynotespeaker, author, and cancer
survivor.
She has nearly half a millionfollowers and was named the
Oprah of LinkedIn by HuffingtonPost and her creative video
channel of nearly 100,000followers won LinkedIn Top
Voice.
Goldie also founded WarmRobots, an award-winning social

(00:57):
media strategy and creativeagency based in Los Angeles with
global clients, and previouslywas a senior contributor at
Forbes, where herinternationally recognized
column received nearly 10million views, and she was named
Journalist of the Year in 2024.
Her book, Personal Branding forIntroverts, through Basic
Venture, Pachette Book Group,comes out in October 2025,

(01:20):
writes for Archie Comics, andhas been featured as a fresh
voice in the New York Times,CNN, Fast Company, and more, and
is based in sunny Los Angeles.
Please welcome Goldie Chan.

Christopher Luna (01:33):
Welcome to California Leaders.
Got you.
There's a reason why I saidthat, and you and I will talk a
little bit about that right now.
But obviously, the show's LosAngeles Leaders.
I'm thinking about changing thename, but I wanted to kind of
run that idea by you.
This this show, this is oursecond season, and the show's
actually been getting a lot oftraction, not just in Los
Angeles.
So I wanted to kind of run by Ihave someone that's known for

(01:56):
branding and uh know better thanyou, Goldie Chad.
So thank you for your time.
Um, you have such an impressivebackground.
Thank you for being here today.

Goldie Chan (02:04):
Thank you so much for having me.
I'm very excited to be here.
I'm very excited to talkspecifically about this branding
issue.
So we were talking a little bitabout it before uh before we
started recording.
I'd love you to explain toeveryone what we're talking
about.

Yeah, I mean, if if anyone visits your your
your business pages and andthey'll they'll get a little bit
about your bio here um beforethe interview, but you are known
for branding.
You've been um you advisecompanies and leaders on their
personal brand.
And I was we're again, we'retalking off camera about this,

(02:40):
and I'm like, you you kind ofhave a different outlook on
this.
So before I get into thatthough, um LinkedIn is big, big
in my industry, and you're knownas the Oprah of LinkedIn.
Yes, you have such a massivefollowing.
I've you've been on commercialsfor Microsoft, you've done so
much.
So tell me a little about that.
Like, how did you get thatname?

Yes, so I wasn't always the Oprah of LinkedIn.
We all have an origin story,right?
Uh, and what's so fascinatingis I worked for over a decade
and I've only lived in twoplaces, both in California.
So I grew up in the Bay Area,went to school in the Bay Area,
and then moved to Los Angeles,both places very close to my

(03:22):
heart, uh, and currently livingin LA and not looking to move
anytime soon.
So when I started creatingcontent on LinkedIn, and this is
such a funny thing to say.
So I coined the term LinkedIncreators in around 2017, 2018,
there's a group of us whostarted using this term.
And everyone said that's sosilly.

(03:44):
There are no creators onLinkedIn, there's no one
creating original content onLinkedIn because at the time
that wasn't really the case.
But there was a group of us, asmall group of us, who started
creating videos.
And I myself started doing alot of videos.
In fact, I did over 800 dailyconsecutive videos.

(04:04):
And for anyone out there who'sever recorded a video by
yourself or say with your kidsor of your business, you know
that 800 is quite a lot.
And I was primarily editingthose myself too.
And along the course ofcreating 800 daily consecutive
videos, Huffington Post calledme the Oprah of LinkedIn because

(04:25):
I was interviewing people and Iwas uh I was doing so much on
the street work, and so peoplethought that I was reminiscent
of Oprah in that way of herearly days when she had her
first show, which I don't thinka lot of people know so much
about her first show, but I loveher first show, it was
fascinating.
And so that's how I got thetitle in the press, The Oprah of

(04:50):
LinkedIn.
And once that happened, peopleinternally at LinkedIn started
using this.
And I will share a very funnyanecdote that I don't always
share, which is on Halloween,during the first year that I
started creating videos onLinkedIn, I got all of these
texts from my friends and theysaid, You need to go on LinkedIn

(05:12):
right now.
And I said, I I'm going to goupload my daily video in a
little bit, guys.
Okay, can you just take abreak?
And they're like, No, it's notabout that.
You have to go on LinkedIn nowand see what you're tagged in.
And I'm like, What am Itagging?
What am I tagged in?
So I went on LinkedIn and itwas at the time the head of

(05:33):
video, he had dressed up as mereally for Halloween.
He put on a green wig, he madea cardboard frame, wow, like a
post frame that had, you know,the likes and the comments on
it.
And he just said, Thank you toGoldie Chan and all of the other
creators on the platform.

Speaker 4 (05:52):
Wow.

So I was the only creator that was shouted out in
this capacity.
And that's when it hit mebecause there had been a lot of
other things that had happenedduring that time.
Forbes asked me to write onpersonal branding and
storytelling and a lot ofopportunities that come up, but
it I suppose it wasn't till thatmoment when I was a Halloween

(06:17):
costume by an employee atLinkedIn about LinkedIn, which
is incredibly meta, incrediblymeta, that I realized, oh, this
is something, right?
And I'm not sure quite whatthat is, but that was my
personal brand.

That's how I feel right now, to be honest.
Um, when I joined thisorganization where I work at
now, uh, no one, I don't want tosay no one, but my intent and
my responsibilities is to helpamplify our members.
Yes.

And you do such a great job of that.

I wasn't really big on LinkedIn before,
but obviously just theprofession that we're in
LinkedIn is huge.
And even Instagram, I just gotInstagram, I don't know, I want
to say maybe a year ago, likelit literally recently.
Um I I was I was still onFacebook.
Like that's just my familything, right?
So so I'm thinking outside thebox, and I just you became I
became a personal brand becauseI would post so much.

(07:09):
I it wasn't intentional.
Um, to me, it was always aboutamplifying other people's work.
So I I I connected with youreally well, and I guess I
should share that too.
So I met you at a videoconference uh presented by
YouTube.
I mean, it was a hugeconference in Anaheim, and
you're one of the speakersthere, and you gave a breakout
session too.
I took my son with me, you gotto meet with the.

(07:30):
Right.

Your son was absolutely adorable and amazing.
So I I want to do this.
If I if you're watching rightnow, hi.

Oh, thank you.
He he wanted to come today, anduh I'm like, son, I'm just
gonna go real quick and comeback.
And he he watches these videosanyways.
So he, you know, we I connectedwith you without you even
knowing.
And I think that's the that'swhat inspires me to these
leaders like you is you'retalking to a room full of
people, but you don't know howyou're connecting to everyone,

(07:58):
right?
And you never know who's inthat room.
So I appreciate you again beinghere because it means a lot.
And and like I said, it'sthere's a there's a connection
to me now with you because ofthis branding issue.
And that's where I'm I'm I hada meeting the other day, and I
was talking to someone, andthey're like, you need to change
the name.
Los Angeles is too narrow.

(08:20):
You're you're expanding, andthere's people in the Bay Area,
there's people in Sacramento,there's people in Orange County,
Riverside, San Diego, and andyou need to call like California
leaders, right?

Speaker 4 (08:30):
Right.

So I'm like, okay, yeah, that's a great idea.
How do I do that?
Since I'm known for being suchan alley native.
I'm this is my home.
The goal is to promote LosAngeles.
I love the city, um, but I cansee how it can expand so easily.
So, what what are some of yourthoughts on that?

I think that having it already be branded Los
Angeles Leaders is such a strongname already, but I could see
how that would be really narrow.
That's hyper-focused, andexpanding that reach to
California leaders, that meansthen you get the Bay Area, the
beautiful Bay Area where I'mfrom.
Um, you get all of thoseoutside regions that are that

(09:09):
are neighbors, our friendlyneighbors to Los Angeles.
So, and you get the, I thinkyou also get, we talked about
this too, you get some of thecompanies that have such a
massive and important footprinthere in Los Angeles, but maybe
are headquartered in a differentpart of California and maybe
are, but would still beinterested, of course, in being

(09:31):
part of the Los Angelesecosystem and discussing what
they do here in Los Angeles.
So I see why you got thatadvice.
I think I'm torn.
Quite frankly, I don't evenwant to say that.

So we literally took off the
microphone things um because ofbranded Los Angeles leaders, and
this is season two.

I was I was supposed to get a mug and I
didn't get my mug.

Um, yeah, and and that's the thing, is it's
I'm like, okay, let's start itfresh.
This is season two.
We have some really strongnames coming onto this episode.
I've been actually gettingphone calls from um I don't want
to the reality uh celebritiesactually from TV shows.
Um, and the the idea is theaudience.
To me, this audience is very umspecial to me because we're

(10:17):
learning from each other.
Um, and the reason why I cameup with this, and I I say show
because the first person Iinterviewed, she's like, this
isn't a podcast.

Narrator 1 (10:26):
Yes, this is a show.

This is a show.
And you're talking about Oprah,right?
But in reality, I I was talkingto someone else in media and
they're like, this can be pickedup in other formats.
So be careful on how you speakand how you present it.
So and the reason why I'mspeaking out loud is because
you're in branding.
So I'm just thinking out loudas I speak.

I I think this is such a fun conversation to go
down because anytime you thinkabout rebranding, there's always
a worry that you will lose yourprimary audience because you go
too broad and then you losethat niche audience, the people
who love hearing from LosAngeles leaders.
I think on the Converse side,that it's such an interesting

(11:04):
idea because then you couldpotentially segment out.
So I have to think about socialmedia because I'm on social
media all the time.
So I think about things likeYouTube.
On YouTube, you have playlists.
So segmenting out, say, if thispodcast will eventually exist
on YouTube as different clipsand things like that, segmenting
it out into here are theliteral Los Angeles leaders,

(11:26):
here are the greater Bay Arealeaders, right?
Here are the outside ofSouthern California or the
greater Southern California, Isuppose.
Maybe that's what we can callit, leaders.
And being able to segment outeven farther and further into
those different demographics onsocial media would to me be very
interesting as another way alsoto be delivering this wonderful

(11:51):
and amazing content todifferent people who are looking
for that.
I think California leaders, Icould imagine it with the golden
poppy, I have to say, or thebear, right?
Whatever that the seal, our ourCalifornia seal is.

You know what?
The more you're saying itthough, the more I'm liking it.

Yes.

It it's just it's it has to get used to.
I'm so used to seeing LAleaders, Los Angeles leaders.
I've I've built the channelaround that.
Um, you know, just all thelogos and the branding.
And but the more you're sayingit, the more it makes sense to
me.

So yes, I would love to see you interview other
Chamber of Commerce leaders.
How interesting would that be?

Yeah, no, there's there's a lot of
opportunity, but look, beforeall of your your your followers
and the Forbes columns and theLincoln Fame, who is Goldie
Chant?
Like, what's your childhoodlike?
What was your upbringing?

Oh my gosh.
So I like I said before, I grewup in the Bay Area, which is a
pretty wonderful and amazingplace to grow up.
I grew up near Oakland,California, uh Lake Merritt, if
anyone is familiar with that.
It is a wonderful community,very diverse.
And so I grew up, I like tosay, eating um Chinese fruit

(13:06):
around Chinatown, but alsohaving soul food in Oakland.
So my diet was a mix of thosetwo things, plus, of course,
classic Americana food.
I used to think that Sizzlerwas the fanciest meal that you
could have, which now living inLos Angeles, I realize that is
not true.
There's Olive Garden.
No, just kidding.

(13:26):
But uh, and I I have to shoutout my favorite restaurant here
in Los Angeles.
Can I do that on this?
Which is Enaka, beautifulJapanese restaurant.
Um, you have to definitelycheck it out.
But I grew up uh pretty, Iwould say pretty, you know, I
have an immigrant family, grewup uh with a pretty traditional

(13:48):
upbringing for a Chineseimmigrant family, went
eventually through all of thosebeautiful stages of life that
you're going through with yourson, and then eventually made it
to Stanford.
So I went to Stanford for myundergrad, and that was such a
beautiful experience.
Also did not go far.
As you can see, I went all theway from uh Northern uh the

(14:11):
north part of NorthernCalifornia all the way to
slightly less north part ofCalifornia.
Uh went to Stanford, andStanford is a beautiful campus.
Stanford is a wonderful placefull of a bunch of, I'm gonna
say this on your podcast,weirdos who are very interesting
and have all very interestingways of thinking about life.

(14:34):
You get so many people likeTiger Woods went there, the
folks who founded Google wentthere, very unique viewpoints
for different people who went tothat school.
And it's a school thatdefinitely encourages people to
have unique viewpoints.
And so coming out of that, Iactually was running a fashion

(14:54):
brand for a couple of years andit didn't work out.
I was 22, it didn't work out.
Not a surprise, right?
Uh but at 22, I thought this isthe end of the world.
Nothing, I nothing's left,right?
Because that's what you thinkat 22 when something doesn't
work out.
And I had what I like to call afriend intervention where my

(15:15):
friend said, You need to get ajob.
Please get a job.
Get any job.
So I got any job, and that jobhappened to be in digital
marketing.
And because I was the youngestperson on the team, they said,
You're in charge of theFacebook, you're in charge of
all the social media becauseyou're the youngest person on
the team.
And I learned trial by fire howto run social media accounts

(15:35):
for all these startups, allthese big brands in-house.
And I did that for over adecade.
And that was my career doingdigital marketing, running
communities from scratch.
I remember literally, and Ifeel like you might be doing
this too with some of yourguests.
I remember just sitting thereand packaging at least a hundred
different care packages justfor people who were customers of

(15:58):
this particular brand becausethat physical care is important.
And I take that now with methrough the different ventures
that I work on now.
Like my book, I'm working oncare packages for some of the
people who are important whowill be receiving my book.
But it was definitely aninteresting journey to I think
go through that digitalmarketing, work in-house, be a

(16:20):
really faceless, quite frankly,person behind the scenes, and
then suddenly be really present.
It was very shocking to me.
I had worked with people in thecontext of being behind the
scenes, as I'm sure you havetoo, who are very present on
camera or who are who had largesocial followings.
And suddenly when it was me, itwas very odd and it was very

(16:45):
unlifelike in some ways.

And that takes us to your book.
Yeah.
It's funny because before my uhexposure to the community, I
was not in social media.
Like I said, I was not inInstagram.
And even to this day, um, whenI post, I'm not really posting
about myself.
I'm talking about someone else.
So there's that that, and yourbook talks about this.

(17:11):
So since you mentioned that,yes.
Tell me a little bit about yourbook.

Yes.
So my book is personal brandingfor introverts.
And it's so funny because Iwill say this when I pitched
this with my agent around twodifferent publishers, one
publisher said, I got it.
What if we called it personalbranding for introverts and
extroverts?
And I said, So that so that'spersonal branding for everyone.
And that's not the book I'mwriting.

(17:36):
That book already exists.
Uh, and it's there's so manywonderful books out there that
exist that are already thatbook.
I want to specifically talkabout the introvert struggle.
And introverts make up 40% ofthe entire population, at least
in the US.
And there are so manyintroverts out there that want
to be successful in theircareers, but there are so many

(17:58):
outside, I would say, pressureto be an extrovert, to be showy
in a way, to be loud in a veryspecific way.
And I think that introverts canhave an incredibly successful
career, can have a wonderfulonline presence, and can be
incredibly present offline aswell, doing things like the way

(18:22):
we met at a conference.

And how do you balance that though?
When you're a leader that'sworking in corporate America and
you're trying to expand yourpersonal brand, how do you
balance that without looking?
Or it's to me, it's all aboutthose optics, right?
Like really Absolutely.
What do you think?
What is my boss gonna thinkabout this?
Like what are the people insidethe organization or even
externally?
What are they gonna think aboutthis, right?

I'm going to give you two words that we don't talk
about enough.
Common sense.
And I think so many of us havelost common sense because social
media rewards oftentimes theseinflammatory concepts and ideas
and titles and and videos.
And I think there is stillroom, though, for common sense.

(19:06):
I think there's room for brandsthat are built on evergreen,
helpful information that isbuilt on being a thought leader
that is built on your expertiseinstead of shock.
So I think that it is stillpossible to build an incredibly
strong brand based off what youknow and what you can share and

(19:30):
how you can help, which is whatwe were talking about before.
You started creating contentbecause you wanted to share and
you wanted to help, and youbecame known for that.
And I think that is so muchmore powerful than a brand that
is based off yelling into thedistance, right?
Because it is such a morelong-lasting brand because it is

(19:52):
built like a spider web off ofso many different parts as
opposed to a single string,right?
To go to that spider webanalogy, it's so easy to say,
knock down a spider web that isjust a single string versus you
have that giant web.
It's so much harder to removethat.
And in a positive light, whenyou're building your personal

(20:13):
brand, when it is built off theconnections and the help and the
amplification and the supportof others, that is for a leader
a much stronger and wiser way tobuild a personal brand than if
you are building a personalbrand simply off uh crowing
about accomplishments.

And how do you how do you keep that alignment
or like let's say obviously aleader of an organization leads
the organization with thosemissions and those that vision,
right?
Sometimes personally there canbe some disconnect.

Speaker 4 (20:49):
Yes.

Um how do you kind of merge that so that way
everything's aligned where itmakes sense so people on the
outside understand like howbecause a lot of times when
you're working for theseorganizations, you want to
believe in what you're doing,right?
Right.
And sometimes there's somedisconnect, but people try to
leverage these platforms to havethat disconnect where you're

(21:10):
not too attached, becausesometimes you we are our own
people too, of course, yes,right.
So just because I I do certainthings doesn't mean I'm
completely attached to that,right?

unknown (21:25):
Right.

So how do you how do you work around that?

How do you balance that?
I think that's such a goodquestion, and it's so tough
because I will give ageneralization, but obviously
everyone is different, right?
And because we're beautifullyhuman, I'm pretty sure you're
not a robot.
I'm not sure.
We haven't checked anything.
It's gonna get that to thatpoint one day and watch our one
day or I'm gonna be am Ispeaking to a robot companion or

(21:47):
speaking to human dependent?
But when you're thinking aboutbalance as work, especially when
you're a leader and you havehigh visibility in, say, a big
brand or a corporation or aproject, I think what is helpful
to think is first of all, whatin that big brand or corporation
or project, what are theoverarching values?

(22:09):
What are the most important twoor three values of that
particular brand?
I spoke at Lego, which is avery interesting place.
And since you have kids, I knowthat you know what Lego is.
You probably stepped on onebefore.
Uh and Lego was an interestingplace because I spoke to a lot

(22:29):
of their women leaders abouthaving a personal brand at a
place like Lego, which also hasan entirely separate
headquarters outside of the USas well.
And when we were talking aboutpersonal brands with women
leaders there, it was sofascinating because so many of
them express, I don't know if Ifeel comfortable even say having

(22:53):
colored hair here, right?
Or I don't know if I feelcomfortable, say, uh, expressing
certain opinions.
And if your opinion is, ofcourse, diametrically opposite
of the overarching belief systemof where you're working, I hate
to say this and I will be thisbad person for saying this,

(23:14):
expressing that opinion publiclyis not in the best interest of
your career, right?
And that's an opinion that youcan express potentially after
you've left that particular roleand you've left being in-house.
But even then, common sense,right?
We're gonna go back to thatword cop those two words, sorry,
common sense.
I think it's helpful to thinkoverall, what do you want and

(23:40):
what do you hope for with yourown personal brand?
And then see how that fitsunderneath the giant umbrella of
the greater corporation and thegreater company.
And melding those together isreally like making uh making a
meal.
It's like cooking because youcould have a delicious meal made
with fish, like a I love fish.

(24:01):
So a delicious roast salmon,and you can have a delicious set
of fresh strawberries, butmaybe salmon strawberry isn't
salmon mushroom strawberry isn'tthe most delicious meal, but
separately those are.
And I think the same thing istrue of your personal brand, is
being really thoughtful aboutthe ingredients that you use in

(24:22):
your personal brand as well ashow those meld together.

Yeah.
And and and I hope you're notgonna bill me for this
conversation, right?
Because I'm assuming these arethe type of conversations you
have with these leaders, right?
Like I'm assuming these aretype of questions that you get
asked.

Yes.
Yes, these are the questions Iget asked.
And I've worked with, oh gosh,I've worked with C level
executives at the Fortune 500level where let's be honest, I'm
working with their team, but Ioccasionally work with them as
well.
And it's fascinating to havethese conversations because even
leaders who are running thesemassive organizations, massive

(24:58):
teams, they have the samequestions as someone running a
three-person team, which is howdo I do this?
Is this appropriate?
I I no longer allow my clientsto text me after midnight.
I didn't realize this issomething I had to set as a
rule, but is now rule, because Ihad a CEO once text me at 3

(25:18):
a.m.
with a picture of a horsehoof,just a blurry picture of a
bottom of horsehoof.
And she said, This is my newhorse that I have like in the
Hamptons or something.
She's like, Can I should I postthis on social media?
And I was like, first of all,please don't text me after
midnight, my time again.
Thank you so much.
Uh but second of all, no.
Is this relatable, which iswhat you want to be?

(25:41):
Is this authoritative?
No.
Is this any of the keywordsthat we are working on?
No.
Why do you want to post this?
And she's like, I really likethis horse.
It's my favorite new horse.
And I was like, great, notrelatable.
Uh, thank you.
And we will talk about this inthe morning.
So I think it's helpful to alsounderstand what are your goals?
What do you want to beperceived as?

(26:03):
And who are you speaking to?
Because right now we arespeaking to what I assume would
be peers, right?
A peer level conversation.
But maybe you want to speak toinstead clients or people who
might hire you, or maybe youwant to speak to that potential
audience or that otherdemographic.
It's helpful to know who youwant to speak to out of these, I

(26:24):
like to call them three basictiers to start.

What are those tiers?

And those sorry, so let's back up a little bit and
we'll go to those tiers.
So the top tier is potentialclients.
And say if you are at that Clevel executive level, that's
your board of directors.
Now, if you're not at thatlevel, then that's your CEO.
That's other people who are atmanagement level.
Then the next level is yourpeers.

(26:49):
That's people who are in yoursame industry vertical, or maybe
not even that, but they are atyour levels.
They're at the same level asyou.
Then one level below that isyour general audience.
So that is, for example, ifyou're running a podcast or a
Substack or something, that'syour readership.
That's the general public thatmight consume your content.

(27:11):
And understanding which ofthese three you want to target
at least first is so helpful forbeginning to narrow down who
your audience is.

Yeah, no, it's it's good to kind of um, I
mean, I think that's in anymarketing, right?
You have to kind of know youraudience and know your client.
I come from banking, and to us,it's always like know your
client, know your know yourcustomer for compliance reasons
too, but definitely forcompliance reasons.

I yes, the the hardest clients I've ever had
have been in uh finance andhealthcare for for regulatory
reasons.

It's it's so funny though, because I I was
watching some of your yourfootage and your media that you
have, and you sent me this videoabout Microsoft, and you're on
this commercial and um I didthis commercial one time for
Intuit.

Oh, great.

And Intuit came to to our place of
business, and they did like thiswhole thing.
And I was on their website formany years.
I don't know.
I I doubt I'm still on there,but um well not go onto the
Intuit website and see.
I should have saved the thecommercial though.
I never saved it, and it I meanI probably would never want to
see it again.
But um what got you into it?
Like what what gave you thatleap of courage to do what

(28:20):
you're doing now?
Like what triggered this?

I wish I could say it was deep insight and
foretelling that I would havegrown a personal brand from
scratch.
However, that wasn't true.
I started creating these videoson LinkedIn because, first of
all, I thought it wasinteresting.
So I originally startedcreating videos on pop culture
branding and marketing.

(28:44):
So, why do we have trains inAmerica?
was one of the videos I did.
Why do we have street art, uh,street posters that are pasted
up on walls?
Why do we have that?
It's a very American thing.
So I was caught I was goingover all of these really
interesting pop culture brandingand marketing things.
And also I like to say I wastaking a sabbatical.

(29:04):
Now, sabbatical is a beautifulway of saying I was unemployed
during that time.
So I had about a month where Ileft a head of marketing job at
a at a startup and I was goingto get my next job, but I wanted
just to take a month off.
We're all allowed to take alittle break sometimes.
So during that month off, Ithought, oh, I need to look
busy.

(29:25):
I need to look like I'm almostgainfully employed.
So when I become gainfullyemployed again, they'll know
what I was doing in that gap.
So I started creating thesevideos because I thought I will
do this for a month.
I will, I will do this as alark for the month that I'm not
gainfully employed.
And at the end, I could say,here are my takeaways from doing

(29:46):
videos on LinkedIn for a month.
We can apply them to whateverbrand I end up at.
And it was wild because 30 daysof doing consecutive videos, I
think I got featured in aninternal keynote.
By the who was at the time thevice president of LinkedIn, who
I believe is now the presidentof LinkedIn, in an internal
keynote that just said, here'seight creators who are doing

(30:08):
really interesting things on theplatform.
And I was one of them.
And my friend was in aninternal editor for this video.
And he said, I can't, you know,give this footage to you to
share externally, but I justwant to know that your name is
being mentioned.
Wow.
And I thought, oh, that wasonce again, that was the first
inkling that maybe this issomething.
And then doors started to open.

(30:30):
So what's funny is before I hadmy agency, people were asking
to hire my agency because peoplewere asking me to do consulting
work.
And I thought, oh, so I alittle bit, I started consulting
individually, and then I had tomake an agency here in Los
Angeles to fill to have a, ofcourse, roof over that
consulting work.

(30:51):
And I scrambled a little bitand created my agency around
that.
But it was for me almost areactive response to all of the
wonderful things that werehappening because I was so
active.
And honestly, I was so active.
I was so curious.
I was so engaged.
I was really excited abouttalking to people.

(31:11):
I had at one point an entirecontingency of Swedish followers
on LinkedIn who would respondto me in Swedish.
And they uh and they were veryinterested in sharing Swedish
culture with me.
And I thought that was so cool.

Before you know it, I'm gonna see all these
videos in different languages.

Right, right.
And so I thought it was reallyinteresting that that was
happening.
And I had created a personalbrand, not because I was being
very forceful about it and I wasbeing very strategic about it.
I created it because I was sogenuinely interested in the
world around me.
And I was so genuinely,genuinely interested in the

(31:53):
community and what people weresaying and what people were
creating around me.
And I built a personal brandbecause of that.
And then ironically, thenForbes came along and asked me
to write.
Once again, my life feels verymeta in some ways, to write
about personal branding becauseI had such a strong personal

(32:14):
brand.

And and why LinkedIn though?
Like because I mean, growingup, I mean, we're we're young,
um, everything's Snapchat orright.

Everything is everything is Instagram,
YouTube, Facebook, etc.
And I will say this, I didLinkedIn because I thought at
the time no one would see thosevideos.
So I thought no one would seethose videos.
So I thought this is a greatplace for me to sandbox.
This is a great place for me tocreate this content that almost

(32:46):
doesn't matter because no oneis going to see it except for my
direct network.
And I think at the time I hadmaybe 3,000 followers.
Now I have over 100,000.
But at the time I thought Ihave 3,000 followers.
These are all ex-colleagues ofmine or current potential
current colleagues.
It doesn't matter as much thatthey will see these videos.

(33:07):
So I'm gonna create in thisreally amazing sandbox.
And then maybe if I feel likeit, I'll make that YouTube
channel.

It's funny because right now LinkedIn is so
video heavy when before theyweren't.

And they weren't.
And they weren't when I startedcreating it because I was
literally in the video beta.
I was one, I would think I wasthe second LinkedIn Live ever.
Um, I think one of my firstLinkedIn lives, I I was at a
NASA launch in Florida and Ilive streamed it.
It went black for a whole likefive, 10 minutes because the
product was so new at the time.

(33:39):
Um, I think it's sofascinating.
And now LinkedIn is a provenplace to have a brand, and it is
a proven place that you can getopportunities.
And you know this firsthand,being someone who has developed
their brand on LinkedIn, it is aplace that you can get
opportunities that can opendoors, that can have career or

(34:00):
client or uh communityopportunities that are very,
very powerful on that platformbecause it is decision makers.
One of my favorite T-words onthe platform, it is people who
hold budget.
It is all of these wonderfulpeople that are incredibly
powerful on that platform.

(34:21):
So now LinkedIn, I think, issuch an interesting and
fascinating place to build apersonal brand because they are
pushing video and they'repushing content creators and
they're pushing in a way thatthey weren't when I when I
initially started.
So I think it's a wonderfultime to jump in and start
thinking about what might apersonal brand as a leader look

(34:42):
like on that particularplatform.

Any merging leaders.
I have a nephew who just got umgetting into a career, and
that's the first thing I toldhim like out of college, or they
should even before or duringcollege, like get a LinkedIn
profile, start building thatconnection, start building that
work network.
Yes, because they it it's it'sliterally your resume online,
right?
And you never know where thatpropels you, you never know

(35:06):
where that's gonna take you.
These connections um arepersonal, they're they're your
connections, they're yournetwork, and it's easy for you
to kind of help leverage them ina certain capacity.
So it's very important.
I mean, when I I have Instagramand I I utilize them
differently.
Instagram, it's still stillbusiness oriented.
I I still I once in a whileI'll post things about my family

(35:30):
because I feel like when youpost your personal life too to
that audience, there's some typeof connection, right?
Um, I I I never do that onLinkedIn.
Um, but there's a way to kindof help navigate these different
platforms.
I think every platform's alittle different in that sense.
How do you how do you do thatnow with because you are your
brand, your personal brand.
So how do you separate that oris there a separation?

So to me, I definitely don't always post
what I post on Instagram toLinkedIn.
I like to think about everysocial platform like being its
own community with its ownlanguage.
So if you go to a differentcountry, you will likely speak
that the language in thatcountry.
I mean, you'll probably stillspeak English, let's be wrong.

(36:14):
But but you might speak adifferent language.
And going to every differentplatform, Instagram has its own
language, and that language iscomprised of videos and images.
So even if you want to do text,you'll see people do who do
those text squares where theywrite the text and they do it on
the white background, or theymake text into an image.

(36:35):
Versus on LinkedIn, thelanguage there is often, it can
be long-form text, it can bearticles, it can be videos, it
can be a variety of differentthings.
Versus, I'll talk about aplatform we haven't talked
about, Pinterest.
Pinterest is so video and imageforward too, but in a very
different way than Instagram isand focused on very different
subjects.

(36:55):
So I like to think about theplatforms in terms of who lives
on there and what are you tryingto say to those different
people.
So on Pinterest, perhaps I haveone of my friends, she's about
to get married, and this willnot surprise you as a use case
for Pinterest.
She is currently pinning all ofher wedding ideas and her
wedding venue ideas and thecolors onto Pinterest.

(37:18):
She's not doing that onInstagram.
On her Instagram, she's notposting literally 200 photos of
purple flowers, right?
Because that would be a reallyfast way to turn off her
audience.
So I think it's helpful tothink about each platform has
their own customs and their ownlanguages.

(37:39):
So each platform is truly likeits own country.

Yeah, Pinterest.
I was using that quite a bitwhen I was remodeling my
backyard.
I'm like, okay, this is a coolpool idea.

I will say that uh very, a very hilarious Pinterest
board my friend once invited meto is he really wanted a black
bathroom.
So I got invited to a Pinterestboard that was only black
bathroom items.
So black, black tiles, blacksinks, etc.

Yeah, no, and it's and it's true.
I think a lot of times um theseleaders, especially when you're
in the sea level, they don'thave the time to research all
these differences.
They have their teens, but eventheir teens, like everyone has
different motives or differentways or different visions,
right?
So I think that's where youcome in with your expertise to
help define those platforms andhelp help them understand how

(38:26):
they can leverage theseplatforms.
Um, I'm not sure if it's okayif we talk about this, but you
went through something verypersonal.
Did you talk about that in yourbook at all?
Or is it okay if we mentionedit?

Speaker 4 (38:37):
Absolutely, yes.

Okay.
So I mean, I I won't I I don'twant to ask you the wrong
question.
So feel free to tell me how didthat impact you in your life
and and and moving forward?
Because I have a friend that'sgoing through something right
now, and I think that's very uhmotivational to see someone like
you kind of get through that.

Thank you.
So, what we're talking aroundright now is is the biggest
health thing that you can evergo through, which is cancer.
So, I am a cancer survivor.
I feel very blessed to be hereright now.
I feel blessed that I gotthrough it.
Uh, shout out to my team atKeck, USC.
I had all my care there.
Wonderful doctors, wonderfulcare team.

(39:17):
It was so interesting to gothrough that.
And it's such a messy process.
It's such a, to me, a communityprocess because I had so many
different people taking care ofme, offering to help, offering
to to literally send me mealsand things like that.
And when I think about it inthe context of my career, so

(39:40):
this is terrible timing, butI'll tell you the terrible
timing that happened.
My book originally got optionedwith the first publisher right
when I got diagnosed.
Uh, and and then the publishersaid, Okay, well, we're so
excited to sign you.
And so when you come out ofsurgery, if you do any surgery
and you you go under, they makeyou sign documentation that

(40:02):
says, I will not sign anycontracts.
So the day I got my publishingdeal, I had just come out of my
initial surgery for for, I thinkit was uh putting in the my
port in my chest.
And I just got that, I justsigned the document for my
doctor saying, I will not signany legal documents.

(40:24):
I just got this legal document.
I sent it to my lawyer saying,I have no idea what words are
right now.
Can you look over this for me?
And I remember that wholeprocess being quite honestly a
lot of that me relying on myteam, my lawyer, my agent, um,
me relying on people around meto help me.
And the front of my book isactually sent to two of my

(40:48):
friends who took a lot of careof me during this journey.
And I wrote this book whilegoing through this incredible
journey of spending most of mytime in the hospital, spending
most of my time barely beingable to sit up.
And so many people are goingthrough these secret journeys,

(41:08):
these secret difficult things togo through.
I went through mine verypublicly.
And as you said before, Ipartner with a lot of brands and
I hyper-specifically and tothis day still do not accept
partnerships around cancer andaround products around that, and
unless I've used them myself,and even then I don't like to do

(41:31):
it.
And I very specifically do thatbecause I don't want to endorse
something that might be harmfulfor others that I haven't
verified.
And I just morally cannot dothat.
Um, but going through thatjourney was so difficult because
I this is dramatic to say, butI saw a death in the face and I
didn't know if I was going tomake it through.

(41:53):
And that's when taking a callabout a promotional part of XYZ,
you realize what's important atthe end of the day.
And of course, what's importantis always love and the love of
your friends, your family andpeople close to you.
Uh, but you also realize thenwhat is important in your

(42:13):
career.
Do I want to be doing this forthe next decade plus of my life?
Also, do I have the next decadeplus of my life?
And that for me very muchclarified what I want to be
doing right now.
And it was such a way to getrid of, you know, there's this
term that I think is reallyfunny, FOMO, right?

(42:34):
Fear of missing out.
And I think prior to gettingdiagnosed, I had been having
this very strong FOMO about I'dbeen seeing there was somebody
else who's in my orbit and theywere getting all these speaking
gigs, and I wanted thosespeaking gigs.
And I think it's really funnythat it removed that FOMO for me
because I was simply thankfuland happy to be alive.

(42:58):
And then after that, all ofthis, say, speaking
opportunities I got, all of theopportunities I got in general,
I have been thankful andgrateful for every single one of
those in a way that I honestly,prior to my cancer journey, I'd
been starting to lose thatluster.
I'd been starting to think,well, I deserve this.
And whenever you get into thatzone, it is such a bad and

(43:23):
dangerous zone to get intobecause I think it just leads
you to feeling jealous andbitter and all those negative
things that can come across,they come across in your energy.
They come across when you areworking and partnering with
people.
And I think when you become avery confident and calm and
joyful person, that also comesacross.

(43:44):
I think people can sense thatin you, that you are not wanting
anything from them, that youare you are present, that you
are happy to be there.
I think that it was such a lifechanger, obviously, not in not
great ways in my health, but inmy mental uh ways of thinking

(44:04):
about ways and ways that Istarted to perceive things.
It was weirdly very, veryhelpful for me.

It's scary.
I can't imagine going throughsomething like that.
Um none of us have tomorrowguaranteed.

Speaker 4 (44:22):
Right, of course.

We don't have to have a scare like that to
think that way, right?
We we we honestly we should allbe grateful for for what we
have and how we live our life,and it and it should be a
reminder.
And and unfortunately, weshould we should kind of think
of people like you because wesome some of us have some family
member or someone that we knoware going through hard times,

(44:44):
and we have to remember what'simportant to us, what's
important in life.
And if you think that way, umthat kind of comes off your your
your aura, right?
You're you're just a an overallbetter person.
Um and it's funny because Iwent through a scare, not like
you, but um, and it's areminder, and it's I well every
time I look at my hands, it's areminder.

(45:05):
I have two small little cutsright here, but I was in a
really bad car uh motorcycleaccident where um I could have
died, basically.
Right.
And again, everyone has thesesituations, but these little
marks, it's so funny.
It's like, why are they on mythumbs?

Right.

Why is it here?
It's like a constant reminder,like, hey, remember what you're
doing.
Right.
There doesn't always have to bea driver of of your work or or
your, you know, I have thesethese ambitions and goals and
things like that, but let'sremember why we're here.
Why we're here.
We have our family and friendsthat we that we need to be

(45:44):
around, so I'm not onmotorcycles anymore.
But I mean, anything can happento any one of us, but I think
that's where we can't lose sightof that.
I mean, we we all have such abeautiful life.
Um, and you're you hadmentioned the space station.
I went, um, I think it was thesame one, uh Kennedy, right?

Uh yeah, I'm gonna get it wrong, so I'm not gonna
see it on camera.

So in Florida.
Yeah, the Florida, yes.
So and there's this beautifulvideo, right?
And they're talking about theuniverse and all these, you
know, they have so much advancedtechnology into looking to all
these other planets and and andthe universe in general, right?
Yeah, and and then they kind ofzone it back to our earth,

(46:27):
yeah, right, and our planet, andthey see like, look at how
beautiful our planet is.
When you look at the sky andyou look at the universe, it's a
bunch of gases and and anddifferent stars and planets, but
there's nothing like ourplanet.
No, there's nothing like aplanet, like we have to take
care of what we have and what weknow because this is what our
kids live off of.

(46:48):
So we can't we have to alwaysremember who we are and how what
we do and and how that affectsour generations to come.
So um, I don't know how Ithought about that now, but I I
really like that tangent.

I'll say one of my friends, Scott, who also lives
in Los Angeles and has abeautiful book called Seek Out,
is a curiosity expert.
And one of the things that hedoes is he really just goes
after things that he findsfascinating.
He's a bundle of just ultimatejoy.
Uh, and he just bought a busand he's just going to drive
around, I think, part of LA, butalso part of the US and ask

(47:24):
questions, ask why people aredoing things from a positive
point of view.
And I think toxic positivity isobviously very real, but I
think that we have room becausewe live in such what feels like
a heavy and stressful time, andtechnology makes it even more
stressful, I think, in someways.

(47:44):
I think it's beautiful to haveand understand that there are
moments of joy, that we havelove around us, that we have all
these wonderful things thatempower us and to bring it back
to leaders that empower us asleaders.
That those things make usstronger as leaders because we
are more well-rounded, and amore well-rounded and grounded

(48:07):
individual is always a betterone.

Leadership is the title of this uh platform.
And you you struck somethingthere.
What are some characteristicsthat make those strong leaders?
Yes.
Um, what are some things thatthese emergent leaders can learn
off of that?

So I think the first thing that I will talk
about is listening.
So a great leader listens andthen leads.
Right.
I think a really great leaderis someone who is a part of a
conversation instead of shoutingduring that conversation.
They're engaging with theconversation either with their

(48:49):
team or their customer base orwhoever it is that they need to
be talking to.
They're always listening andthey're always trying to do
better.
This is why we love those TVshows where the CEOs go
undercover and right, and theydo those jobs for a day, because
we we instinctually understandthat that is a leader that cares

(49:11):
about the lowest denominatorand not the least important
denominator, but the lowestdenominator in the stack that
makes up their business.
And a great leader is one thatlistens and then leads.
A great leader is also one thatis willing to take a step back
and not always have their ego atthe forefront.

(49:33):
And a great leader is one thatI would say empowers other
people to be successful becausea great leader also knows that
they are not always the mostintelligent or talented or et
cetera person in the room.

And they need a good team, you know, they need
to support that and um hire theright people to support the
leader.

unknown (49:56):
Yes.

So I think, I mean, man, I think that's where
your agency you you do a lot.

Yes.

Um in this your agency is warm robots.

Yes.

So how did you get that name?

It's so funny because everyone, with the
advent of AI, everyone thinks myagency is an AI agency, but I
named my agency prior to themassive outburst of AI
Everything.
I named my agency for anincredibly dorky reason, which I
will now share on this podcast,which is it was named after

(50:28):
Battlestar Galactica, which is asci-fi show originally made in
the 70s and then rebooted in thewhat's it 90s, early 2000s?
Um, and it's about it's abouthumanoid robots.
So it's based off a sci-fiterm, basically.
But I like to think that we areall warm robots in a way,

(50:49):
right?
We have we have a functioningsystem, but we are warm.
We have life to us.
So I thought that that would bea very fun thing to name my
agency, not knowing that wewould then have this giant rush
of AI technology that happened,but I named it Warm Robots
because I think it's helpful toalso think about the analytics

(51:11):
and think about the data behindwhy we do things, why we are why
we can be successful or how wecan be more successful.
So that's part of also why Inamed it Warm Robots, because I
think it's important to alsothink strategically about
things.

Yeah.
I mean, I think in marketing,everything's about the ROI and
you have you're and so muchdata.
But when you when I thought ofWarm Robots, I'm thinking about
how do we bring the life toeverything that's so technical
and so digital.
So nowadays, everything is youdon't know who's talking to you
anymore.
Like is this email written byyou or has it been written by

(51:49):
someone else?
And what I love about theseplatforms or something else.
Exactly.
What I love about theseplatforms is we get to see you,
they get to see me.
My vocabulary isn't the best.
I may not be the right theright person to present certain
things or say certain things,but they see me how I am as a
person.
They're not seeing a newsletteror document, which I was

(52:11):
writing, which I was trying todo as well, or I'm still still
doing, but it's always good tobe in front of the camera
because they can see yourpersonality shine through.
And in a lot of thesepositions, um, and or a lot of
these recruiters or thesecompanies, it's hard to see that
through a resume.
It's hard to see that.
So when you're able to kind ofshowcase yourself externally,

(52:32):
it's easier for them to recruityou or kind of talk to you in
that way.

I think it makes you a little bit more, we talk a
lot, or not we, but I'm surewe'll talk about this later.
But I've talked a lot aboutbeing AI proof, especially in
the job market.
When I speak to younger people,we talk a lot about this
because that is one of theirprimary concerns, which is
completely understandable.
I think that having the personin your personal brand makes you

(52:59):
a little bit more technologyproof.
Having little flubs here andthere, I'm sure in this entire
conversation, I've misspoken,I've said the wrong word, I've
maybe not pluralized when Ishould.
My grammar teacher would bevery upset with me.
But those little pieces hereand there make it very human.
And even with AI clones thatnow you see of people who do

(53:22):
podcasts with AI clones, thoseare a little too perfect still.
They don't quite flop.
And that makes them, I think, alittle bit less interesting to
consume, and honestly, a lotless interesting to consume and
watch because they don't havethat truly human aspect to them.
They don't have our littlemistakes, our little facial

(53:43):
ticks, our little things that wedo here and there that make us
very human.
And I think that once again,being an actual person and
showing that off on, say, yoursocial platforms or in person,
quite literally in person beinga person in person is so helpful
for your career.

You talked about that uh during your
breakout session at theconvention that we that I went
to.
Um, you talk about networkingand how it's still important.
I'm big on networking.
Actually, one of my first newletters was called newsletters
was called Beyond Networking.
I think.
And and I at first I didn'tthink anyone was reading it, but
I was talking to uh one anexecutive and she's like, I love
this article that you wrote.
And I'm like, oh wow, you know,it's little stories like that.

(54:24):
I'm like, okay, if you'rereading it, then um, but tell me
a little bit about uh thatbreakout session that you talked
about, networking in person.

Yeah, so we we just we dived into so we dove into
so many different subjectsduring that breakout session,
but really thinking aboutnetworking.
So networking is comprised oftwo parts.
I think most things are onlineand offline these days.
So networking offline, peopleforget about this.
I don't know why people forgetabout offline networking when

(54:52):
we're all still human beings.
But so many people want, theywant the fast fix.
They want the what software canI use to immediately get a
thousand leads or a thousandfriends or et cetera.
And I think there's somethingstill so powerful about meeting
in person, having a one-on-onehuman connection where you

(55:13):
connect as humans.
I can't believe I even have tosay that, but people need to
hear that still.
You connect as humans and youhave a real interaction, you
have a real, I love aconversation, right?
Once again, it's so great to belike we are right now, in
conversation.
You're not just sayingsomething and I'm saying a can
response, right?
We're in conversation, we'relistening, we're getting

(55:35):
feedback, we're responding.
And I think that is the bestand most powerful way is to have
as many conversations as youcan when you are out there.
So if you attend conventionslike the one we were at, as you
know, I did something that wasvery unpopular during this
session.
I made everyone talk to oneother person in the room, and it

(55:57):
was incredibly unpopularbecause it was a room full of
introverts and no one liked mefor that.
And that's totally fine becauseat the end of the day, everyone
in that room met someone new.
And I think that is so helpfulto have a conversation with
someone new.
How else are you going to trulyexpand your network?

I talk about that all the time.
I go to a lot of conferencesand even like uh events where
you buy a table, for example.
Uh, you'll have thisorganization, they bought a
table, they bring theircoworkers and they're sitting
down and they're at the sametable, or they're talking to the
same people.
I'm like, guys, there's like500 people or a thousand people
in this room.
Expand yourself, like divideand conquer, right?

(56:36):
What's the point of coming tothese events if you're just
talking to people you alreadyknow?

Speaker 4 (56:40):
Right.

Um, and I love that you went through that
process a little bit and my sonwas there.
And actually, the way youpresent yourself, the way you
stand, what you do with yourhands, and you went down this
whole um process to it.
And I love that because notenough people talk about that.
And in reality, from what I seejust from these emergent
leaders, that's what they needhelp with.
They lost sight of that commonsense, they lost sight of how to

(57:02):
interact.
Um, just yesterday I was in anevent and I'm and I'm looking
around and I'm like, geez, like,okay, someone needs to kind of
talk to these individuals.

And there's like a lot of right this, right?
I'm doing my invisible phoneright now, but there's a lot of
you're just on, you're lookingdown all the time.
You're always on your mobiledevice, and there's so much less
eye contact conversation,sharing stories.

It's incredible.
Um, I can't believe we're atthe hour already.
It's uh I've learned so muchfrom you.
I really do appreciate youcoming on this platform and
talking about yourself andtalking about your book.
I can't wait to get a copy andread it.
Thank you.
Yes.
Where can we find you and andhow can we get your book?

Yes.
So you can find me atgoldiechan.com pretty easy.
Uh, you can also get my book atevery major retailer, including
Amazon, or you can get it offgoldiechan.com slash book
B-O-O-K.

Um, and and what about your your agency?
Because I know that's a goodthing.

My agency, Warm Robots.
Uh, you can find atwarmrobots.com.
I'm all about getting thesimple URLs.

Um, there's a lot of people that I work with,
there's a lot of nonprofits,there's a lot of big companies
that need someone like you intheir branding.
They need help telling theirstory.
Um, there's a lot oforganizations out there that do
such great work that can helppromote that a little bit more.
And it and it and you do somuch, uh, so much of that.

(58:29):
So I really do appreciate that.
And I'm I'm I'm uh lookingforward to seeing you again.
I appreciate your support.

Speaker 4 (58:34):
Absolutely.

So, again, thank you for joining us.
I'm gonna call it CaliforniaLeaders.
So I really love the name.
Thank you.
Thank you to the person thatgave me the idea, but I really
do believe that this is gonnaexpand more than just from Los
Angeles.
There's a lot of great leadersin our state, um, obviously
within the United States, but Ithink in California in general,

(58:56):
I we just have a big footprintpersonally.
I know a lot of people inCalifornia, and um, I think that
there's so much that we canlearn from each other.

We are the golden state for reason.
Exactly.

So thank you for joining us.
Uh, I'll see you on the nextone.

Narrator 1 (59:09):
Thank you for joining us on this episode of
the California Leaders Podcast,hosted by Christopher Luna.
We hope you find ourconversation as inspiring as we
did.
Don't forget to subscribe andleave us a review on your
favorite podcast platform.
Your feedback helps us bringmore of the content you love.
And be sure to follow us onsocial media for updates, behind

(59:31):
the scenes content, and to jointhe conversation.
Until next time, keep leading,keep innovating, and keep making
a difference.

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Goldie Chan - Founder and Author of Warm Robots & Personal Branding for Introverts | California Leaders

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Goldie Chan - Founder and Author of Warm Robots & Personal Branding for Introverts | California Leaders