February 17, 2025 • 50 mins
Better late than never, it's Chat out of Hell!
This episode Emma really opens up, generously unburdening herself in the name of amusement with a classic Meat Loaf Memory. Meanwhile Sam continues to fail to find any sincerity in himself, as his attempts at some Steinman-esque lyrics proves. Our questions this week:
- Who invented the keyboard body strap?
- Who goes around picturing women to get them in the creative mood?
- What would our Whigfield podcast be called?
PLUS our intrepid pair launch draft one of some Steinman lyrics on the world, an excellent Nikki French anecdote and a significant amount of sundry nonsense.
Keep your comments, reviews and arguments flying in to chatoutofhell@gmail.com, find us on Facebook or Instagram by searching Chat out of Hell and don't forget to use the hashtag #makeEmmafeelbetter.
Go watch our awful Film Club choices if you must (BloodRayne and Dead Ringer) and we'll see you in April!
Chat out of Hell is a is a review podcast: all music extracts are used for review/illustrative purposes. To hear the songs in full please buy them from your local record shop or streaming platform. Don't do a piracy.
Music extracts on this episode:
All Revved Up with No Place to Go by Meat Loaf from the album Bat out of Hell (1977)
I'll Kill You if You Don't Come Back by Meat Loaf from the album Dead Ringer (1981)
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Sam (00:00):
What is this?
Emma (00:01):
This is Chat Out of Hell, podcast where we dive into a vat
of gloopy information about theworlds of Jim Steinman and Meat
Loaf.
Gloo
Sam (00:13):
Who is Meat Loaf?
Emma (00:14):
Meat Loaf is a singer and actor who was once John
Belushi's understudy in theNational Lampoon stage show on
Broadway.
Who's Jim Steinman?
Sam (00:24):
Jim Steinman is a man whose fridge lost power for two weeks,
and instead of dealing with it,he just left it until he moved
house.
Emma (00:33):
Having read a bit of Meat Loaf's biography about Jim
Steinman, I can absolutelybelieve that.
Sam (00:39):
Do you want the full quote?
Emma (00:40):
Go on.
Sam (00:40):
"One time I went to California for two weeks, came
back, and there had been anelectricity failure.
I opened the icebox and thingswere pretty much rotted, but I
couldn't deal with cleaning it,so I just closed the door.
And of course, things keptprogressing in that direction.
I couldn't deal with it, so Ijust stopped using the icebox.
About a year later, I opened thedoor and this yoghurt grabbed at
(01:00):
me.
Finally, I moved out of theapartment rather than clean it.
Emma (01:07):
kind of approve of Jim's approach.
Sounds like the sort of thingthat I would do.
Who are we?
Sam (01:14):
We are comedians Sam Wilkinson and Emma Crossland,
and by the time you're listeningto this, it'll be too late to
come to our show, Crossland andWilkinson Mean Business, at the
2025 Leicester Comedy Festival.
We'll have done our show by now,and it was brilliant slash awful
delete as appropriate.
But we will be doing it at theDerby Ram
Emma (01:32):
We will, yes.
Sam (01:34):
Jehoon.
Emma (01:36):
On a date in Jehoon.
Jehoon.
Sam (01:39):
Look up the Derby Ram Festival.
Emma (01:41):
Excellent.
Sam (01:42):
Welcome to Chat Out of Hell! Bow now now now! Lovely.
Emma (01:49):
You alright?
Yeah! Not bad, thank you.
Sam, how are you?
Sam (01:53):
Seven out of ten.
Emma (01:54):
Seven out of ten.
Are you looking forward to thebreak?
Where we don't have to listen toMeat Loaf songs for a
Sam (02:01):
I am, but I also love that you phrased that question in the
same way that you ask a child asit's approaching the summer
Emma (02:08):
Well, we are approaching half
Sam (02:09):
you looking forward to your break?
Yeah, will they give you somehomework to
Emma (02:13):
Ha ha ha ha ha!
Sam (02:16):
you normally have to do a project, don't you?
So this is Chat Out Of Hell,where we both bring a Meat Loaf
or Jim Steinman song to thetable to dissect in our own
inimitable way, and then rate iton our officially recognised
Meat Loaf and Jim Steinmanrating scales.
Emma, what song have you for usthis time?
Emma (02:37):
I have brought, I'll Kill You if You Don't Come Back from
Dead Ringer.
What have you
Sam (02:41):
sounds cheery.
Well I've All Revved Up With NoPlace To Go the first album, Bat
Out Of Hell.
And we're gonna listen to thatone first, by dint of it being
slightly better known Solisteners, go away, find your
YouTube or your Spotify, or yourown imagination, just imagine
what it might sound like.
Listen to All Revved Up With NoPlace To Go.
(03:02):
We're gonna listen to it now.
Here's a little clip of it, likewhat they do on the radio and
that.
Soundtrack (03:07):
All revved up but no place to go You know what it's
like All revved up but no placeto go Of a scheming knight I'm
(03:27):
tossing in my seat
Sam (03:31):
we've just listened to All Revved Up with No Place to Go.
Emma, are you all revved up?
Emma (03:36):
I'd like to talk about the opening sax.
I wrote down that it soundedlike it had come straight out of
the title sequence of a 70s copshow or sitcom.
Sam (03:45):
okay, my notes say it's a very thin line between sexy sax
and sitcom theme sax I've goneon to say take away the lyrics
and you've got the openingcredits to a sitcom starring
Richard Briers and Penelope
Emma (03:57):
Yes,
Sam (03:58):
Or it's a bit Cagney and Lacey.
Emma (04:00):
Cagney and Lacey indeed is what
Sam (04:01):
lovely.
Emma (04:02):
That's all I've really got to say about it.
Sam (04:04):
what, the song or the sax?
Emma (04:07):
I'm not a fan of the song.
I really like the opening coupleof lines, and then it sort of
changes direction a little bitin the melody.
Goes from being Kind ofinteresting to being a bit bog
standard, I
Sam (04:20):
Okay, yeah, so lyrically it's not one of Jim's best, is
it?
It is very much, this is a bonusone for you, I'm horny, horny,
horny,
Emma (04:31):
horny.
Yeah,
Sam (04:33):
Yeah, that's exactly what it
Emma (04:34):
it's another I'm horny song
Sam (04:36):
not as, lovely and playful with the lines as a lot of Jim's
other, horny teenage boy works.
Emma (04:42):
it's no Paradise by the Dashboard
Sam (04:44):
is no Paradise by the Dashboard Lights.
It's a song about a teenager whospends every Saturday night
getting dressed up all nice tofind an attractive person, or
pretty baby, in order to makeyou mine.
Emma (04:57):
A pretty baby.
Sam (04:59):
um, so, We can safely assume that while Meat Loaf and
the boys are singing All RevvedUp With No Place To Go, the
girls are singing Whigfield'sSaturday Night.
They are mirror images of one
Emma (05:09):
another.
Yeah.
Sam (05:10):
this is from the Bat Out Of Hell album, track number four.
This is one of the songs thatcame off the Neverland musical.
Emma (05:17):
Okay.
Sam (05:18):
Neverland.
Which did become the Bat Out ofHell musical.
and also the film Bat Out ofHell 2100 on the way.
We've not discussed Bat Out ofHell 2100 yet, but your face.
(05:40):
The script is marvellous and youshould read it before we go see
the musical.
Emma (05:43):
Okay.
Sam (05:44):
Um, but yeah, so this was a single in the UK, can't find an
easy reference for how well itcharted, which probably tells
you everything.
yeah, Edgar Winter is our saxplayer there.
Edgar Winter is a famousmusician in various ways.
He was born in 1946 in Beaumont,Texas.
In his thumbs down column.
(06:05):
Edgar Winter produced, arrangedand performed on the 1986 album
Mission Earth.
The album's lyrics and musicwere written by Scientology
founder L.
Ron Hubbard.
Yeah, Hubbard is said to haveleft detailed instructions and
audio tapes for the musiciansand producers to follow when
making the album.
Winter described Mission Earthas"both a return to rock's
(06:25):
primal roots and yet highlyexperimental." Winter wrote,
Ron's technical insight of therecording process was
outstanding." man's dead, Edgar.
You don't have to suck up to himanymore.
Emma (06:39):
has curiosity made you listen to any of it?
Sam (06:41):
No, because I don't want to be on a
Emma (06:42):
list.
Yeah.
Sam (06:46):
So that's his thumbs down column in the thumbs up column
Edgar Winter is the inventor ofthe keyboard body strap
Emma (06:53):
Wow.
Which
Sam (06:53):
is to say Edgar Winter is the father of the keytar
Emma (06:58):
The keytar.
The coolest of
Sam (07:01):
Absolutely!
Emma (07:05):
to have learned to have played the keytar.
Sam (07:07):
To play the keytar on a summer's day.
Emma (07:12):
It's all I really
Sam (07:12):
Yeah, do you remember when you were at a party and a boy
would bring out a keytar?
And all the girls would swoon?
Emma (07:18):
Oh, how we would swoon.
Bashed out Wonderwall
Sam (07:22):
ha ha ha ha ha!
Emma (07:29):
What a dude.
Sam (07:30):
Hee hee hee! I love a keytar!
Emma (07:34):
It looks like a fun instrument to play.
I can play a bit of piano and Ican read.
music, so maybe I could learn toplay
Sam (07:40):
So somewhere under this sofa is a very basic MIDI keytar
from the, do you remember RockBand and Guitar Hero?
Those Yes.
Yeah.
one of the later versions ofthose games had a keytar.
Emma (07:55):
Wow.
Any good to play?
Sam (07:57):
I mean, I don't know, because I only played it in the
Rock Band form of, you know,press the cool button and the
colours and the it was a goodgame.
Emma (08:06):
I wonder if there are any Meat Loaf songs on Guitar Hero.
Sam (08:09):
Oh, Lordy.
Emma (08:10):
Then we'll have to
Sam (08:11):
Yeah, well, you're going to have to look that
Emma (08:12):
up.
Do you still have the relevantconsoles?
Sam (08:15):
Yes, Because one day I might play rock band again.
I haven't for 10 years.
Yeah,
Emma (08:22):
Yeah, we just found our Wii balance board
Sam (08:24):
normal.
Ha ha ha ha ha.
Edgar Winter, winner and loserin
Emma (08:32):
life.
Sam (08:33):
do you want to talk about the lyrics?
Emma (08:35):
Yeah, can do.
Sam (08:36):
Some of the lyrics are quite good.
I like, I was a varsity tackleand a hell of a block when I
played my guitar.
I made the canyons rock.
I was such a cool dude.
Every Saturday night I felt thefever grow.
Do you know what it's like?
All revved up, with no place togo.
That is a very universalteenage,
Emma (08:53):
Yeah, I think we know what he's
Sam (08:55):
I think we know what he's talking about, but I must say,
Jim, When you get to the line,someone gotta draw first blood.
Emma (09:02):
Oh,
Sam (09:02):
Yeah, yeah.
No, we all know what you meanthere.
Emma (09:06):
And it's, it's not
Sam (09:08):
calm down.
Emma (09:09):
Chill out!
Sam (09:10):
Chill the fuck out,
Emma (09:11):
June.
She'll touch it
Sam (09:12):
ha ha ha! Yeah, it's very, um, at a party gets his keytar
out, sings about drawing firstblood.
Yeah.
I Do like the sax.
It is verging on the sitcom, butnot quite.
It does dance on the line, Ithink.
(09:33):
but then a minute from the endit all kicks in like, Oh, I've
finally done it.
Brilliant.
Emma (09:39):
Bye, love
Sam (09:41):
After this song, we've only got three left from this album,
so I realised it's time to startreally ploughing into the fun
press stuff from it, even if itdoesn't relate entirely to the
song.
Sounds Magazine 1979 had thislovely quote,"Meat has a part in
an upcoming movie, Americathon,wrestling a car in a futuristic
perverse Olympic Games."
Emma (10:05):
for Film
Sam (10:05):
One for Film Club, Americathon is, unlike a lot of
other movies that the twomentioned, something that did
come out and looks fucking dogshit.
Oh, yes! I think it's basicallythe same premise as Idiocracy,
all the reviews are god awful,so, uh, yep.
Emma (10:23):
I imagine that's one to watch on a Sunday morning.
Sam (10:26):
And then I like this quote, actually.
This is from a magazine calledThe Scene, Northeastern Ohio's
free rock music magazine.
a long masthead.
"If Meat Loaf is a sex symbol,he is one to thousands of non
trendy looking women."
Emma (10:44):
Ouch!
Sam (10:46):
"most groupies, you know, skinny blondes with bare
midriffs and big balconies...
Emma (10:51):
balconies!
Sam (10:57):
"would find Meat such a strange character that they
wouldn't know how to handle him.
For the most part, Meat Loaf hasproven that you don't have to be
some half starved pinhead tobecome a rock and roll star.
and for all the guys in theaudience Meat Loaf represents
normalcy.
The kind of guy you might workat the machine shop with so when
Meat sings all revved up with noplace to go he can sell the song
(11:17):
he's been there brother"
Emma (11:20):
I'm still stuck on balconies, to be honest with
Sam (11:22):
you.
know i haven't spotted balconieson first pass but that was very
Emma (11:26):
And
Sam (11:28):
he's a normal everyday he's a guy who works in the machine
shop he's a football
Emma (11:34):
If he can do it, you can do
Sam (11:36):
Exactly.
If he can parade around thestage for three hours, burning
his voice out, why aren't
Emma (11:42):
doing it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Sam (11:47):
It's not got the very funny, silly lyrics that he
reaches for in other songs.
It's not.
musically as exciting assomething like Bat out of Hell.
it is kind of funny in the waythat the whole album is, huge
send up of the teenageexperience, but not enough to
justify that first blood line,Jim.
It might be the least fun songon the album perhaps?
(12:10):
Yeah.
Emma (12:11):
Even if it is about getting all horny before going
out.
Sam (12:15):
Yeah, even if it
Emma (12:17):
Well, that's quite a fun thing, isn't it?
I remember being young and goingout and being all revved up.
Yeah.
then going out and returningback to my student digs with a
lovely kebab.
And a
Sam (12:33):
I did enjoy that Hehehehehehehehe Oh
Emma (12:39):
As the entirely unsuitable chap was once again not
interested.
Sam (12:46):
Do a quiz?
let's lift the mood.
Let's edit out the past fiveminutes and do a quiz.
So Jim and Meat Loaf did a lotof interviews while this album
was touring.
So I've got some juicy quotesfor you below.
Which one of these is a fakeSteinman?
A,"we've turned down an awfullot of requests for merchandise.
(13:07):
The grossest one was, someonecame up with this huge line of
Meat Loaf bedclothes.
quilts, bedspreads andpillowcases.
That was so disgusting that itconvinced us to turn them all
down.
The idea of someone restingtheir innocent head upon their
Meat Loaf pillow.
"That's That's ungodly".
(13:27):
Is it B?
"I always write about women.
All different women.
They don't always exist.
A lot of times I just make themup.
I close my eyes a lot when Iwrite, and that's when I see the
women".
Emma (13:41):
I mean, that's definitely a Steinman quote,
Sam (13:44):
C!"You can't hear it on the album, but I'm doing a lot of
Donna Summer moaning.
Essentially, I just made outwith myself.
First I recorded the boy, thenthe girl's groans.
It was all very hesitant,trembling."
Emma (13:58):
So
Sam (13:59):
So two of those are genuine Steinman, and one is not.
Emma (14:03):
feel a bit sick after the last one.
god, they all sound veryplausible.
I feel like, uh, the women one.
Yeah, god, I'm going to say thatyou have made up the awful women
Sam (14:18):
the awful women quote.
Jim didn't say it.
Emma (14:21):
No?
Sam (14:21):
Meat Loaf did!"I always sing about women, all different
women.
They don't always exist.
A lot of times I just make themup.
I close my eyes a lot when Ising, and that's when I see the
Emma (14:34):
the women.
Uh, uh, the women.
mean, at least he's saying womenand not females.
Sam (14:43):
Females.
Donna Summer moaning quote, thatwas of course a reference, do
you remember on, Paradise by theDashboard Light, he is credited
with lascivious moans.
That is, of course, what it'stalking about.
Meat Loaf had something to sayas well on that subject.
if you could only hear it, itwould be the best part of the
(15:03):
album.
When Jim was recording, Todd waslaughing so hard he was crying.
By the time he got to the girl,Todd was biting the console."
good old Todd.
Shout out to Todd Rongren,wherever you are.
Do you want to hear what thepeople of the internet think?
Emma (15:21):
Always
Sam (15:22):
Cartier specialist,
Emma (15:25):
Ooh, fancy
Sam (15:26):
I saw Meat Loaf for one dollar in Oklahoma City and I
still have the ticket stub.
It was the first of what wassupposed to be a series of 100
cent concerts sponsored by CatRock 1 0 5 fm, the radio
station.
Sorry.
No, that would be KA double T.
'cause that's how Americans dothe radio.
Nobody's moving on.
(15:48):
I don't get it.
Americans Times would I know I'mmarried to what?
She hasn't been able to explainit to me.
It's just a thing that they justbaff uh, times were different.
Then me and my friends all piledinto my Volkswagen Beetle and
went to see the concert.
There wasn't a bad seat in theCivic Centre at that time, but
we still had great seats.
(16:09):
If you never got to see Paradiseby the Dashboard Lights live in
concert That's a shame.
Emma (16:14):
ha!
Sam (16:16):
That
Emma (16:17):
I have seen it live, so, it's all good for me.
It's all good for me! He
Sam (16:23):
And, at ArchieBunker4101.
Does your average millennialknow what a saxophone" is?
Emma (16:29):
Ha ha ha ha!
Sam (16:30):
To which several millennials replied, yes.
Emma (16:33):
It's a fairly common instrument, it's still used a
and also a lot of us have beenaround since the 80s.
Sam (16:40):
Also, we've all seen that episode of The Simpsons where
Homer plays one and goes, sax ama mophone.
Ha
Emma (16:45):
ha ha ha yeah, we were raised on the Simpsons where
Lisa plays a saxophone.
Sam (16:51):
Take that Archie Bunker 4101!
Emma (16:53):
Bunker 4101.
Sam (16:54):
Shall we rate this song?
Listeners, we always rate oursongs on our patented Jim
Steinman or Meat Loaf songrating scale.
So this song was written by JimSteinman and therefore is
governed by the holy laws of JimSteinman for the finest songs.
Jim Fineman for acceptable worksand Jim Declineman for songs we
(17:15):
don't want.
Emma, what is this?
Emma (17:18):
It's a Jim Fineman.
Sam (17:19):
It is a Jim Fineman
Emma (17:21):
it's nothing special, it's
Sam (17:22):
If Jim Fineman had only written songs like this his
entire career, we would be doinga Whigfield podcast right
Emma (17:28):
now.
What's the Whigfield podcastcalled,
Sam (17:32):
Uh, saturday night and the air is getting pod
Emma (17:35):
Ooh.
Sam (17:36):
cast you, baby Jim Fineman, isn't
Emma (17:41):
it?
Yeah, it's a Jim
Sam (17:43):
Jim Fineman.
It's all right, Jim Fineman.
Emma, what song did you bringfor our lovely listeners this
Emma (17:49):
this I brought I'll Kill You If You Don't Come Back from
Dead Ringer.
there is, a video the YouTube.
have a look at it if you want.
Don't if you don't want.
I'm not your mum.
Soundtrack (18:01):
I want you out of my life.
But I'll kill you if you don'tcome back.
If you don't come back.
Emma (18:17):
That was I'll Kill You If You Don't Come Back from the
Dead Ringer album.
wasn't a single, but it doeshave a video.
Released September 1981.
written by Jim Steinman and ofcourse sung by Meat Loaf.
what do you think to that?
Sam (18:33):
RL Grey, often slams, well, me in particular for saying Dead
Ringer is a rubbish album.
I'm starting to come around toRL's way of thinking.
I
Emma (18:44):
is good, isn't
Sam (18:45):
good.
Yeah! You might not enjoy this,but, I am seeing it as a
prototype version of Lovin You'sa Dirty Job But Somebody's Got
to Do It.
They're both about the, can'tlive with you.
Can't live without
Emma (18:56):
uh, End of a relationship kind
Sam (18:57):
thing.
Yeah.
Emma (18:59):
I, haven't listened to this song for a very long time,
with good reason.
It's time, for,
Sam (19:08):
Meat Loaf memories That's so out of tune Meat Loaf
memories Oh Emma, pour yourheart out for the listeners
Emma (19:26):
you like the story?
Sam (19:27):
will it hurt you to share?
Emma (19:29):
Yeah, but I need to.
I am
Sam (19:31):
It's just you and me here, Emma.
Nobody else is ever gonna
Emma (19:34):
I haven't spoken to my therapist about this one yet.
Sam (19:37):
Do you speak to your therapist about all Meat Loaf
and Jim Steinman songs?
all I can say about that stuff.
Ha ha! Am I your therapist?
This is a safe space, Emma.
Thank you for sharing with us
Emma (19:51):
Sam.
So.
Back in year seven of highschool.
Sam (19:57):
for Americans, she was about 11.
Emma (19:59):
11.
Yeah, 11, 12, in my drama class,we had to, provide a piece of
music to use as the backgroundfor a piece of drama that we
were creating.
And because I was a very strange11 I thought that it would be
(20:20):
best to bring the most dramaticsong I could find at the time to
perform to, and so, uh, I choseI'll Kill You If You Don't Come
Back.
Sam (20:31):
that's such a power play for an 11-year-old.
Emma (20:34):
Essentially, I was miming along and playing out the
breakdown of a relationship.
And yes, it went as well as yourface is indicating it would have
done.
It was largely met with bemusedstares from my classmates and
teacher.
Obviously, age 12, I had notexperienced the breakdown in a
relationship, but I was havingdifficulties with my time at
(20:57):
school at that point, becausegirls are horrible.
and what I thought was that aperformance in my drama class
with this as the inspirationwould really show them.
What it actually showed them wasthat I was, as they suspected,
an incredibly weird kid.
I even asked the teacher if Icould do the performance alone,
but she wisely said that Ishould probably work with some
(21:18):
other people.
so another couple of sods wereroped into it.
and we had an excruciating time.
And as it was unfolding, Irealized my mistake.
You know, you know when yourealize as something's happening
live?
When the words tumble out ofyour mouth and you immediately
know that you've made a mistake.
It was very much that.
But for the full length of thesong, the full six minutes and
(21:40):
however many seconds., I thinkthe idea was that I would be all
sassy in the first part of thesong, I'd be all strong, throw
the horrible partner out, andthen when the glass breaks,
that's when I would become abroken down, remorseful, lonely
person.
The, uh, the remorse after thestorm.
(22:02):
What a twat.
What a prize twat.
Sam.
Sam (22:08):
Am I allowed to?
Is the story over?
Emma (22:10):
Um, yeah, that was it.
Just adolescent Emma trying topurge some emotions in the worst
possible way.
Sam (22:19):
Emma, thank you for sharing.
Emma (22:20):
Yeah, you're welcome.
You're allowed to
Sam (22:25):
did the teacher call your parents afterwards to say how
worried they are about you?
Emma (22:30):
No, but I think there were a few other instances of writing
poetry and things where otherteachers became a little
concerned.
Sam (22:39):
Oh, Emma.
This is adorable.
Emma (22:45):
I feel like I've, said too much,
Sam (22:47):
No, I don't, I think you've said exactly enough.
Emma (22:50):
I haven't been able to listen to this song since then.
Because I realised.
I'd gone too far.
I'd made a terrible
Sam (23:00):
I just want to point out that you share the vast majority
of Meat Loaf memories on thispodcast, and that is not because
I don't have equallyexcruciating stories of my
youth, it's just that I've notput in the work in therapy to be
able to talk about them as muchas you have, so well done you.
Emma (23:16):
Do you want my therapist's phone number?
Sam (23:18):
That might help.
Emma (23:19):
help.
Everyone should have therapy.
It does really help.
Sam (23:24):
This podcast is sponsored by
Emma (23:26):
Therapy?
Sam (23:28):
It's not, no, BetterHelp won't sponsor us.
Emma (23:31):
Oh.
Sam (23:32):
Get fucked, BetterHelp.
Emma (23:34):
See a real therapist.
Yeah, I wasn't able to listen toit.
I thought I'd do it for thisbecause I'm in a much better
place now, as a 41 year oldwoman, I'm doing loads better
than my 12 year old self was,which is, I think it's how it's
supposed to be, but
Sam (23:53):
Yeah, I mean, there are some people for whom that is
inversed.
Emma (23:57):
yeah.
I mean, I was a really strangekid, I realise now, I was really
fucking weird.
But do you know what?
That's alright! I thought itwould be a brilliant piece of
movement and theatre, and It wasjust awkward.
Sam (24:12):
yeah, I can see all of that, and There but for the
grace of God.
God
Emma (24:17):
Ha ha ha ha ha Amazingly, after that, I still went on to
study drama, until A Level.
Sam (24:27):
How could you top that?
Emma (24:28):
I should have quit while I was ahead!
Sam (24:32):
Oh, Emma's in this.
What, Emma?
I'll kill you if you don't comeback,
Emma (24:36):
You absolute fucker.
But yeah, yeah.
how my acting career never tookoff, I don't know.
Sam (24:43):
You feel better now?
Emma (24:45):
I don't know.
Sam (24:46):
Okay.
Emma (24:47):
see when I listen back to it next week.
If I want to die or not.
Yay!
Sam (24:53):
I don't think it's that bad a story, obviously it's, an
excruciating thing to happen toyou in the moment to suddenly
realize at the beginning of asix minute interpretive dance
piece.
that this isn't going to do whatyou expected it to do.
Emma (25:14):
It didn't make me any more popular, Sam No.
Ha ha.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha.
Sam (25:20):
everybody listening to this Meat Loaf and Jim Steinman very
specific review slash comedypodcast has definitely done
something like that or worse.
There's no doubt.
Listeners, do drop us a line,chat out of hell at gmail.
com if you want to be as braveas Emma better.
Hashtag make Emma feel better.
You were a, a, kid who done feltemotions, that's fine.
Emma (25:43):
I was an impressionable child in a tumultuous world.
And they said I was at adifficult stage.
they knew.
Sam (25:57):
Emma, there's no shame in that story.
Emma (26:00):
Thanks Sam, thanks.
There's a little though.
No! That note got really highpitched.
Dudes! No, It's all fine! Fine!I feel
Sam (26:12):
I feel like one of the girls in the toilets who's found
another girl crying.
Emma (26:17):
girl crying.
Sam (26:18):
you're beautiful! Yeah.
Come on, let's get you, let'sget mascara fixed.
We'll go out and have a
Emma (26:25):
Hee he hee.
We'll show him! Oh, right.
So actually back to the song nowthat I've got my trauma out of
the way, do you wanna hear whatthe critics had to say?
Fuck you man.
Just because I'm in touch enoughwith my emotions to be able to
do this.
Fuck you.
Sam (26:45):
Repression is free!
Emma (26:50):
I'm gnawing away at your insides.
Sam (26:52):
not at my bank balance
Emma (26:57):
Oh, good lord.
Do you want to hear what SoundsMagazine had to say about it?
Yes, I'll kill you if you don'tcome back, commences the flip,
the second side of the album,uh, with
Sam (27:08):
thanks granddad warren's
Emma (27:13):
I'll kill you if you don't come back, commences the flip,
with hard rock posturing of agritty magnificence, only
matched by Warren Zevon'scurrent output.
That is, a great Kay Rich'sgenre riff making with its ultra
sardonic lyrics.
How do you abuse me?
Let me count the ways, how manyhours and how many days.
(27:35):
A shattering noise gives way toa coda of benediction.
What wanky writing.
reminds me of the Strawbs.
Bestowed upon multitudes ofyoung girls.
Steinman showing genuineunderstanding of the trials of
being a teenager.
Struggling with thereconciliation between the
desire for magic and the pain ofreal life.
(27:57):
Sample lyrics.
Bless all the homecoming queensof the night, they're looking
for magic in gymnasium light.
It's one of the greatest momentsin pop song ever.
Sam (28:09):
I just had a thought about Sounds Magazine was it Sandy
Robertson again?
Sandy's delightfully floridprose, which you don't get in
music reviews anymore.
Emma (28:20):
Sandy's pro Steinman.
Propaganda.
Yes! I can just imagine them atSounds Magazine, Oh, fucking
hell, Sandy, write somethingabout somebody else!
Sam (28:31):
in the days of being paid by the
Emma (28:34):
Ha ha ha Do you want to hear what Jim had got to say?
this is about Dead Ringer as analbum, but it does relate to the
song.
he said,"This album is a littlemore intimate.
The lyrics are more personal.
It's had, like, three differenttitles in the last week.
One of the songs is called DeadRinger.
That might be the title.
(28:55):
The title I wanted to use wasconsidered too strong, which
was, I'll Kill You if You Don'tCome Back.
One of the best love songs Iever wrote.
"Great chorus line.
In every way I want you out ofmy life, but I'll kill you if
you don't come back."
Sam (29:09):
Which, okay, that is a great line.
Jim, typically humble there intelling us how great it is.
Emma (29:15):
Of course, yes.
Sam (29:17):
Obviously Jim knows fuck all about marketing, as we
Emma (29:20):
Yes.
Sam (29:21):
I'm Meat Loaf, this is my second album, I'm really glad to
be putting another record outthere.
I'm going to kill you! I'm agiant 300 pound footballer, and
I'm going to kill you, women.
Emma (29:33):
Yep!
Sam (29:34):
So please buy it! Uh, you can get it at HMV, Woolworths,
Emma (29:38):
Our Price,
Sam (29:39):
R price.
Emma (29:40):
Oh, Andy's records.
Andy's records.
Sam (29:41):
records.
Emma (29:42):
to love the Andy's records.
Sam (29:46):
Any more?
Emma (29:48):
I mean HM v's.
Still there, isn't it?
Yeah.
Stores.
Virgin Mega Stores.
I used to work at HMV.
Sam (29:53):
You did?
any sad stories about that?
Emma (29:57):
it It was, it was all right.
it was really fucking boring,but I'm quite good at the
alphabet, so it was fine.
Sam (30:04):
Go on and take your stuff.
Don't even bother to pack.
How?
What, I want armfuls of clo Fuckyou, Meat Loaf
Emma (30:13):
imagine him throwing the things out of the window as he's
saying that.
It is a full on EastEnders
Sam (30:19):
There's a suitcase and an armful of jumpers.
Emma (30:24):
How do you abuse me let me count the ways how many hours
and how many days is fuckingbrilliant, isn't it?
It's so good.
Sam (30:30):
So it's all literary illusions, innit?
Emma (30:33):
it?
And I, when, 12 year old Emmawas miming to that, I was
feeling it! Yeah! The people ofthe internet have a few things
to say.
Sam (30:43):
I thought they might chip in on this.
Emma (30:45):
Tuesday Patients said, yeah, when I was in early high
school through college andfreshly in love with Meat, late
eighties, early nineties, I wasalways trying to figure out what
type of girl I was and how Icould become the girl he loved.
Let's just say that over thoseyears, I fit into several of his
categories.
Sam (31:09):
a savage.
Emma (31:11):
Breezio5323 said, ah, the Borderline Personality Disorders
theme song.
Sam (31:19):
is being
Emma (31:23):
Love the crazy Meat brought to this song.
Sam (31:26):
Is it time to rate this song, Emma?
Well, Emma, this is once again aJim Steinman song, so we refer
back to our dusty ancient JimSteinman song rating scale,
where the greatest songs are JimSteinmans, the averagest songs
are Jim Finemans, and un goodsongs, they're Jim Declinemans.
(31:47):
But what mans is this?
Emma (31:51):
I think it might be a Jim Steinman.
The low end of Jim
Sam (31:56):
Steinman I had it down as top end Jim Fineman.
Emma (32:00):
It's difficult to
Sam (32:01):
Let me just, um, tell you the illustrious company it might
be keeping in the Jim Steinmans.
Emma (32:07):
Ah.
Sam (32:08):
Bat out of Hell, of course.
You took the Words right out ofMy Mouth.
It's all coming back to me now.
Nowhere Fast, after our accord.
Emma (32:16):
isn't It's a top end Jim Fineman,
Sam (32:17):
isn't it?
End.
Exactly.
Top End?
yeah, Yeah.
it's Top End Jim Fineman.
Top End! Jim Fineman.
so, Emma, that was Chat out ofHell.
Emma (32:30):
or was it?.
Well.
Sam (32:33):
Listeners, we did promise last week an update on our Jim
Steinman style songwritingescapades.
And, we've both certainlyproduced something.
do have to say, having looked atmy document I've not produced as
much as I thought I had.
do you want to make your pitchfirst?
This is very early
Emma (32:51):
Okay, so all I've got, I've obviously got no music
whatsoever.
Sam (32:55):
because neither of us are musicians
Emma (32:57):
Ha.
I don't know how we're going togo about doing this.
Garage band.
So, I've got a title.
and I'm going down the tropethat, Jim has of Overdoing a
cliche.
So I'm calling mine.
Better Late than Never.
I've got some lyrics.
Would you like me to read themto you?
lyrics.
I am cringing slightly.
Sam (33:18):
does this feel more excruciating than telling the
story of
Emma (33:21):
No.
It definitely, it'sexcruciating, but not quite as
Okay, just preparing myself formy dramatic reading.
the shadow of a midnight dream.
Where hearts are wild and fateredeems.
I walked alone on a burningroad, Searching for a love I'd
always known.
(33:42):
was a thunder in my soul andfire in my eyes, Time stood
still under the starry skies,The past haunted me like the
ghost of forever, But now you'reback, we're better late than
never.
Sam (33:56):
than never.
Emma (33:57):
I'm not, I'm not done yet.
It's not finished.
Better late than never.
I should have asked you when Icould.
Better late than never.
You were the best in theneighborhood.
Better late than never.
I've always been under attack.
Better late than never.
But baby now you're back.
Sam (34:20):
Well done!
Emma (34:21):
Thanks.
That
Sam (34:22):
is quite Steinman esque.
Emma (34:26):
Went into full Steinman madness, I
Sam (34:29):
was very good Steinman madness.
Yeah, well done! I, mine isgoing to be so shit by
comparison.
I had such a difficulty Um, notjust doing a parody,
Emma (34:40):
Right, because I'm trying really hard
Sam (34:42):
yeah, you were successfully so sincere, um, in a way that
you and I are never sincereabout anything because we're
comedians.
And if the laughter stops, thecrying starts.
Ha ha ha ha ha.
Again, do you want thattherapist's number So you might
(35:02):
recall, I've been kicking aroundideas about, uh, having
heartburn after a big curry.
which next to your work, doesseem quite trite.
it's a three act piece.
Um, I've got act three in somesort of a form.
(35:25):
So act one is about two loversmeeting over poppadoms.
Yep, and then obviously act twois the consumption of the main
curry.
Um, and then we get into actthree.
Be my Gaviscon, tell me wherethe love has gone, tell me that
(35:47):
I wasn't wrong to eat somethingso spicy.
Be my Gaviscon, soothe theburning that is going on,
burning deep inside me, becausemy heart is burning, burning.
And then Jim does this, so whycan't I?
I've just recycled some earlierJim lyrics.
(36:08):
Heartburn.
Heartburn.
Heartburn.
Burn us away.
Emma (36:14):
So you've Weird Al'd this
Sam (36:16):
I didn't mean to Weird Al it.
I was just writing what I know.
And I You've really shamed me,of.
Emma.
Emma (36:24):
You remember last week you read out the, the Jim, the, Jim
advice.
So I tried to put all of myhorrible cynicism and sarcasm to
one side and think likeSteinman.
And I wrote this really late atnight, when I should have been
asleep or something.
and I'd spent quite a long timelistening to bits of it, to try
and get in the right mood.
(36:45):
To try and put all of thathorrible, cynical, comedian
away.
Sam (36:52):
I really do feel like I did my homework on the back of the
bus.
ha! still a long way to go withthis, I don't really know where
it's going to from It's good.
Emma (37:00):
I'd like to know what, the listeners,
Sam (37:02):
listeners, please do let us know what you thought of either
of those.
Be kind, we're not songwriters,we are twats.
We
Emma (37:09):
appalling twats.
Sam (37:10):
One or two of our listeners have mentioned that they've been
starting to work on Steinmanesque
Emma (37:14):
Oh god, are we inspiring something awful?
Sam (37:17):
We are certainly inspiring something.
Emma (37:20):
Is it something beautiful?
Sam (37:21):
It might be something beautiful.
Emma (37:22):
Let's put out an album!
Sam (37:24):
Let's put on a show!
Emma (37:26):
hands!
Sam (37:27):
if you want to do that, you can email us at
Emma (37:29):
chatoutofhelp at
Sam (37:30):
chatoutofhellatgmail.
com to which several messageshave arrived this week.
Emma (37:38):
Good!
Sam (37:39):
Yeah, it's because I said to which.
Emma (37:40):
To
Sam (37:42):
genuinely reaching the point now where we have to be
those wankers and say, we can'tread out all of every email.
I know.
We've got I'm going to have toedit these as we go, because
people have said some verylovely things.
And, thank you for saying lovelythings, everybody.
We might not read out peoplesaying nice things about us
anymore, because we've got somuch else going on.
So,
Emma (38:02):
but if you could read the nice things to me, I could
really do with it.
Sam (38:05):
yeah, I'll probably edit, I'll edit them out, but I'll do
them for you now.
Emma (38:09):
It's been a
Sam (38:09):
So, we've got, from Charlie
Emma (38:12):
Everidge North.
Hi, Charlie.
Sam (38:13):
You remember Charlie.
Charlie sent us the Christmascharlie is still on the quest to
find pictures of Jim Steinmanriding a motorbike.
he was talking to his partner,and in her search, so Charlie's
partner, Emma, has now alsojoined the search for pictures
of Jim Steinman on a motorbike.
but she has found thispublication which might be of
(38:35):
interest to us.
It's called Endlessly Horny forWonder and Magic: how Jim
Steinman's Bat out of HellPerfectly Captured the
Prepubescent American Id andNearly Ruined Me for Life" Pop
Papers, Book 5.
So this is A pseudo academictext.
And I say pseudo academicbecause it is just published on
Amazon.
Yeah, that's a piece that I'mgonna have to buy and read
(38:57):
during our break, I think.
To see what Tim Quirk thinks ofit all.
Emma (39:01):
Mmm.
Sam (39:02):
Eddie French has been in
Emma (39:03):
Hi, Eddie.
Sam (39:05):
"Hello, well done on the podcast.
you want a general Loaf opinion.
I feel that the words rock androll are misused a lot by Jim
and Meat, it's not a greatdescription of the music they
make." I agree.
Eddie says, I feel it's betterdescribed as, unhealthy
fetishization of a 1950s Americathat never really existed, foie
(39:25):
gras'd through a musical theatregoose, served on a motorbike
with a barely concealederection."
Emma (39:32):
Thanks, Eddie.
Sam (39:36):
"that's hard to fit on a label at HMV so I get the need
for a shorthand."
Emma (39:41):
I mean, they're not wrong.
Sam (39:42):
They're not wrong.
They've absolutely nailed that.
Thank you so much Eddie.
Grey's been in touch.
Hello RL.
Just now got to the most recentepisode.
I don't know if you've noticed,but we have had a lot of news to
keep up with here in the U.
S.
Yeah.
Emma (40:01):
Sorry, guys.
Sam (40:05):
"You got a lot of great material out of two very short
tracks.
Nice job.
Incidentally, I had long wantedcontext for this photo included
in the program for the 1994Everything Louder Tour, and now
I know the story.
Thanks!" Emma, here's the photo.
Emma (40:20):
Oh.
Wow.
Sam (40:23):
a shot from, It's a Royal knockout.
where Meat Loaf is posing withSarah Ferguson, then Duchess of
wherever.
wherever.
Emma (40:34):
Staunch royalists.
Sam (40:35):
Them looking mildly awkward.
Emma (40:37):
Neither of them look comfortable.
Neither
Sam (40:38):
of them look very happy, but I think the implication here
is, the argument he had withPrince Andrew was so great that
in revenge.
he just took photos of himselfwith his wife on a tour 10 years
later.
Emma (40:53):
Wow!
Sam (40:55):
"In answer to your question, there are a couple of
Bruce Springsteen songs that Ialways thought Meat could
perform nicely".
And to my shame, I've not had achance to listen to either of
these, so I do apologize.
But RL suggests BrilliantDisguise and I'm on Fire, Which
I don't so I'm really sorry RL.
(41:17):
I've quite busy this week SoI've not listened.
I'll take your word for it, andwe'll have a listen to those in
the break Then there's thisHarry Chappin Chappin song that
I just adore and again by theway that I've stumbled over this
person's name No idea who theyare.
Song called mismatch.
Thanks
Emma (41:34):
RL we will give
Sam (41:38):
And then R.
L.
has also linked us to what seemsto be the earliest professional
recording of any of Jim's songs,it's Yvonne Elliman singing a
song called Happy Ending.
Emma (41:48):
Happy
Sam (41:49):
Yeah, so we'll stick that on the recommendations list, so
thank you as ever R.
L.
And then this one fromGabriella.
Emma (41:57):
Hi Gabriela.
Sam (41:59):
Just sped through the entire podcast in a week and I'm
finally up to date.
It's so great to hear Steinmandiscourse outside of the
internet, or my own head.
I would say I am both learningfrom your podcast and hearing
lore I know too well.
I don't think I ever realisedwho the for Meat Loaf slash
Steinman music was.
Divorced dads and the Brits werenot on my
Emma (42:20):
radar.
Sam (42:25):
This ties back to Eddie's earlier message though, because
we know that the first album wasmade in the UK, really.
British audiences absolutelylapped it up in a way that
Americans didn't And I, it'sbecause it sells this vision of
Americana that we.
slightly different now, but whenyou and I were young, America
(42:45):
was still the thing.
It was an incredibly cool thing.
Even before I married Kat, I wasat a family wedding and one of
my elderly relatives came up tome and said, I hear you've got
an American girlfriend.
Emma (42:59):
And
Sam (43:00):
And that was like the height of sophistication.
So like the image of Americathat is painted in early Meat
Loaf and Steinman stuff isplugged right into the British
psyche, I
Emma (43:10):
definitely.
Sam (43:12):
Uh, so that's why that is, Gabriela.
"I recently turned 25 and Ifirst became aware of Meat Loaf
as a kid through Total Eclipseof the Heart.
As a kid of the early 2000s, Iinterpreted the featuring Meat
Loaf as meaning the DJ." Youmentioned a DJ Meat Loaf to me
the other day.
Emma (43:30):
Yeah, there was something, I think I found something
Sam (43:32):
Yeah, yeah, we don't know the DJ.
I was so enamored with the TotalEclipse video when I was younger
and fell hard for the RockyHorror Picture Show.
featuring Meat Loaf as a queerteen.
I was so sad to hear you guystrash it, but I know it's
because you've never been in atheatre of queer joy, yelling
raunchy callbacks and singingalong in the way O'Brien
Absolutely true.
(43:53):
Well, certainly for me, I don'tknow if you have.
Emma (43:55):
I've not done it before.
Maybe the next time it comes toone of our local cinemas, we
should actually go.
Sam (44:01):
perhaps
Emma (44:02):
We should try and find it and make the effort, but I'm not
doing the dress up.
I draw the line.
I'm not that kind of girl.
Sam (44:10):
I've never seen Emma dressed up for
Emma (44:12):
anything.
Ha ha ha ha ha!
Sam (44:14):
So Gabriella, yes, you're right.
we did sort of mention this onthe episode, but, I consumed.
Rocky Horror as a 38 year oldstraight cis man sitting
watching a DVD with my dog on aSaturday morning, which is
completely the wrong way toconsume Rocky Horror.
I get that.
I do.
(44:34):
As a cultural artifact, I'm veryglad that it exists to help
people find other people likethemselves and work out who they
are and have an amazing time ina world which isn't always nice
for them.
So, I'm very glad that itexists, but it's not a good
film.
"I found Bat Out of Hell at 15,then learned Marvin didn't write
his own songs.
I've had Steinman brain rot eversince.
(44:56):
Like Emma, I was an angsty anddramatic teen.
teen.
You're gonna love Gabriella, do
Emma (45:00):
And that was the only short
Sam (45:01):
us?
Emma (45:01):
for it.
Sam (45:02):
And Meat Loaf slash Steinman spoke to me deeply.
I know every song by heart.
And like many other Steinmanfans, as I've learned from your
podcast, I wrote a musical ofSteinman songs when I was barely
17.
It centers a butch slash femmeromance around a beach bonfire.
I like to think it would pissoff Aday and Steinman.
Emma (45:24):
It
Sam (45:24):
You read us Steinmaniac's fantasy evenings with Jim.
Later on, you shared Steinmanliking to sit in his hangar,
blasting music and smoking a J.
my fantasy night with Jim isbeing on that blunt rotation.
I'm submitting Left in the Darkslash Medley featuring Barbara
Streisand and yet anotherSteinman monologue.
"Can't wait to hear yourthoughts".
Preview, I love Left in the Darkand I like the Barbara Streisand
(45:47):
version a lot.
Um, but yes, we'll stick that onthe list.
Thank you very much, Gabriella.
Emma (45:51):
That's lovely!
Sam (45:54):
And then link to that, talking of queer culture.
This is from Sean Ponsonby.
Emma (45:59):
Hi Sean.
Sam (46:01):
Hi guys.
I don't have a personal storywith Jim or Meat, but I'm from
Liverpool, and as I'm sureyou're aware, we had Eurovision
here in 2023.
As part of that week, I wasasked to host an interview and
Q& A with Niki French, who was aformer UK Eurovision entrant.
Obviously she had a hit with thedance version of Total Eclipse
of the Heart, produced by Stockand Aitken but not Waterman.
(46:24):
For Gabriella and other peoplenot from the I love how we're
one foot in Britain and one
Emma (46:29):
Yeah, one in the U.
S.
Yes.
We are straddling the Atlantic.
Some of
Sam (46:35):
Like, what's that reference to Richard Briers gonna do for
people like Gabriella, a 25 yearold queer
Emma (46:41):
Canadian?
It'll give them some homework todo.
Sam (46:46):
What I didn't know was that this got her on Jim's radar and
they started work on a projecttogether later in the decade.
"I didn't know that either.
Of course, I couldn't pass upthe opportunity to ask someone
who had worked with Jim abouthim, so even though it was a
Eurovision event, I made sure tobore the room full of people who
had traveled for the finals byteasing out as many details
about Jim as I could."
Emma (47:07):
Wonderful.
Sam (47:09):
"Unfortunately, the event wasn't recorded and I was
hosting, so I had half a mind onkeeping things ticking, so I
can't remember everything shesaid, but she did reveal that
the collaboration fell apart, asthis was right after Jim had
scored major hits with CelineDion and Boyzone, and remixing
Take That's Never Forget for thesingle edit, which I wish we
would all talk about more, coswhat the fuck?
(47:30):
I guess we have to talk aboutthat at some point.
"And his management were pushingfor him to work with more
superstar acts.
She was quite camp, and most ofher anecdotes included the
phrase,'Cause I'd had a bottleof wine".
Emma (47:46):
Oh, I love that!
Sam (47:47):
"She clearly loves wine, and she said something about Jim
that I thought was very nice,sounds like a dick at times.
He gave her a very expensivebottle of wine, dated from 1994,
which was the year that she hadher hit with Total Eclipse.
I thought that was sweet." Thatwas sweet, that's lovely.
That is, yeah.
There's two versions of Jim thatshine through and one of them is
a very lovely man to his friendsand loved ones and the other one
(48:09):
is a bellend to his friends andloved ones.
P.
S.
shameless plug, currentlynearing completion of a book
about unlikely queer icons andhave written a mini chapter on
Meat and Jim because my wordeverything they did feels so
gay".
Sean, please do tell us whenthat book is out and what it's
called because,
Emma (48:28):
to read that.
that'd be amazing.
Sam (48:32):
Thank you so much everybody who's written in so, Emma, what
songs are we doing next time?
There isn't a next time.
We're we're having one of ourtraditional end of series
breaks.
So we're going to be away for afew weeks, but we will be back
on April the 7th for our editionof Chat Out of Hell Film Club,
where we're both gonna watchsome probably God awful films
(48:55):
feature Meat Loaf.
Emma, you've decided on yoursuggestion.
Emma (48:59):
going to watch Dead Ringer.
Sam (49:00):
Dead Ringer, available on the YouTube, I believe.
Emma (49:03):
yes.
Sam (49:04):
and I'm dipping into our suggestion box for this one.
I'm gonna choose the filmBloodrayne.
That's Blood R A Y N E.
which is a legendarily shitvideo game spin off movie about
a sexy lady vampire.
We can probably find out onstreaming or something.
It's on Apple.
So we're going to watch thoseand come back for Film Club on
April the 7th.
(49:25):
And then just to get you allteed up, we're very excited
about seeing the Bat Out of Hellstage show in April.
So when the podcast returns forreal on April the 21st.
We are going to go into a deepdive into the Dream Engine.
Emma (49:40):
Dream Dream Engine.
Woo!
Sam (49:48):
is, as all of you will know by now, Jim Steinman's first
effort at a musical theatershow.
There is a weird bootlegrecording of it on Jim's
website.
if you really want to listen tothe whole thing, it's probably
not worth it.
We'll tell you all about it.
We'll do that work so you don'thave to, but in the meantime,
please do keep your general MeatLoaf thoughts and anecdotes
(50:10):
flying in.
Did you see Meat Loaf atPopeye's Chicken looking for a
big can of spinach?
us know,
Emma (50:17):
chatoutofhell at gmail.
com.
Yeah,
Sam (50:20):
like that one?
Emma (50:21):
that
Sam (50:21):
Thanks.
Off the top of my head andeverything., that's been Chat
Out of Hell series three.
Emma (50:25):
We'll see you for series 4.
Sam (50:28):
Bye bow now now now
What is this?
Emma (00:01):
This is Chat Out of Hell, podcast where we dive into a vat
of gloopy information about theworlds of Jim Steinman and Meat
Loaf.
Gloo
Sam (00:13):
Who is Meat Loaf?
Emma (00:14):
Meat Loaf is a singer and actor who was once John
Belushi's understudy in theNational Lampoon stage show on
Broadway.
Who's Jim Steinman?
Sam (00:24):
Jim Steinman is a man whose fridge lost power for two weeks,
and instead of dealing with it,he just left it until he moved
house.
Emma (00:33):
Having read a bit of Meat Loaf's biography about Jim
Steinman, I can absolutelybelieve that.
Sam (00:39):
Do you want the full quote?
Emma (00:40):
Go on.
Sam (00:40):
"One time I went to California for two weeks, came
back, and there had been anelectricity failure.
I opened the icebox and thingswere pretty much rotted, but I
couldn't deal with cleaning it,so I just closed the door.
And of course, things keptprogressing in that direction.
I couldn't deal with it, so Ijust stopped using the icebox.
About a year later, I opened thedoor and this yoghurt grabbed at
(01:00):
me.
Finally, I moved out of theapartment rather than clean it.
Emma (01:07):
kind of approve of Jim's approach.
Sounds like the sort of thingthat I would do.
Who are we?
Sam (01:14):
We are comedians Sam Wilkinson and Emma Crossland,
and by the time you're listeningto this, it'll be too late to
come to our show, Crossland andWilkinson Mean Business, at the
2025 Leicester Comedy Festival.
We'll have done our show by now,and it was brilliant slash awful
delete as appropriate.
But we will be doing it at theDerby Ram
Emma (01:32):
We will, yes.
Sam (01:34):
Jehoon.
Emma (01:36):
On a date in Jehoon.
Jehoon.
Sam (01:39):
Look up the Derby Ram Festival.
Emma (01:41):
Excellent.
Sam (01:42):
Welcome to Chat Out of Hell! Bow now now now! Lovely.
Emma (01:49):
You alright?
Yeah! Not bad, thank you.
Sam, how are you?
Sam (01:53):
Seven out of ten.
Emma (01:54):
Seven out of ten.
Are you looking forward to thebreak?
Where we don't have to listen toMeat Loaf songs for a
Sam (02:01):
I am, but I also love that you phrased that question in the
same way that you ask a child asit's approaching the summer
Emma (02:08):
Well, we are approaching half
Sam (02:09):
you looking forward to your break?
Yeah, will they give you somehomework to
Emma (02:13):
Ha ha ha ha ha!
Sam (02:16):
you normally have to do a project, don't you?
So this is Chat Out Of Hell,where we both bring a Meat Loaf
or Jim Steinman song to thetable to dissect in our own
inimitable way, and then rate iton our officially recognised
Meat Loaf and Jim Steinmanrating scales.
Emma, what song have you for usthis time?
Emma (02:37):
I have brought, I'll Kill You if You Don't Come Back from
Dead Ringer.
What have you
Sam (02:41):
sounds cheery.
Well I've All Revved Up With NoPlace To Go the first album, Bat
Out Of Hell.
And we're gonna listen to thatone first, by dint of it being
slightly better known Solisteners, go away, find your
YouTube or your Spotify, or yourown imagination, just imagine
what it might sound like.
Listen to All Revved Up With NoPlace To Go.
(03:02):
We're gonna listen to it now.
Here's a little clip of it, likewhat they do on the radio and
that.
Soundtrack (03:07):
All revved up but no place to go You know what it's
like All revved up but no placeto go Of a scheming knight I'm
(03:27):
tossing in my seat
Sam (03:31):
we've just listened to All Revved Up with No Place to Go.
Emma, are you all revved up?
Emma (03:36):
I'd like to talk about the opening sax.
I wrote down that it soundedlike it had come straight out of
the title sequence of a 70s copshow or sitcom.
Sam (03:45):
okay, my notes say it's a very thin line between sexy sax
and sitcom theme sax I've goneon to say take away the lyrics
and you've got the openingcredits to a sitcom starring
Richard Briers and Penelope
Emma (03:57):
Yes,
Sam (03:58):
Or it's a bit Cagney and Lacey.
Emma (04:00):
Cagney and Lacey indeed is what
Sam (04:01):
lovely.
Emma (04:02):
That's all I've really got to say about it.
Sam (04:04):
what, the song or the sax?
Emma (04:07):
I'm not a fan of the song.
I really like the opening coupleof lines, and then it sort of
changes direction a little bitin the melody.
Goes from being Kind ofinteresting to being a bit bog
standard, I
Sam (04:20):
Okay, yeah, so lyrically it's not one of Jim's best, is
it?
It is very much, this is a bonusone for you, I'm horny, horny,
horny,
Emma (04:31):
horny.
Yeah,
Sam (04:33):
Yeah, that's exactly what it
Emma (04:34):
it's another I'm horny song
Sam (04:36):
not as, lovely and playful with the lines as a lot of Jim's
other, horny teenage boy works.
Emma (04:42):
it's no Paradise by the Dashboard
Sam (04:44):
is no Paradise by the Dashboard Lights.
It's a song about a teenager whospends every Saturday night
getting dressed up all nice tofind an attractive person, or
pretty baby, in order to makeyou mine.
Emma (04:57):
A pretty baby.
Sam (04:59):
um, so, We can safely assume that while Meat Loaf and
the boys are singing All RevvedUp With No Place To Go, the
girls are singing Whigfield'sSaturday Night.
They are mirror images of one
Emma (05:09):
another.
Yeah.
Sam (05:10):
this is from the Bat Out Of Hell album, track number four.
This is one of the songs thatcame off the Neverland musical.
Emma (05:17):
Okay.
Sam (05:18):
Neverland.
Which did become the Bat Out ofHell musical.
and also the film Bat Out ofHell 2100 on the way.
We've not discussed Bat Out ofHell 2100 yet, but your face.
(05:40):
The script is marvellous and youshould read it before we go see
the musical.
Emma (05:43):
Okay.
Sam (05:44):
Um, but yeah, so this was a single in the UK, can't find an
easy reference for how well itcharted, which probably tells
you everything.
yeah, Edgar Winter is our saxplayer there.
Edgar Winter is a famousmusician in various ways.
He was born in 1946 in Beaumont,Texas.
In his thumbs down column.
(06:05):
Edgar Winter produced, arrangedand performed on the 1986 album
Mission Earth.
The album's lyrics and musicwere written by Scientology
founder L.
Ron Hubbard.
Yeah, Hubbard is said to haveleft detailed instructions and
audio tapes for the musiciansand producers to follow when
making the album.
Winter described Mission Earthas"both a return to rock's
(06:25):
primal roots and yet highlyexperimental." Winter wrote,
Ron's technical insight of therecording process was
outstanding." man's dead, Edgar.
You don't have to suck up to himanymore.
Emma (06:39):
has curiosity made you listen to any of it?
Sam (06:41):
No, because I don't want to be on a
Emma (06:42):
list.
Yeah.
Sam (06:46):
So that's his thumbs down column in the thumbs up column
Edgar Winter is the inventor ofthe keyboard body strap
Emma (06:53):
Wow.
Which
Sam (06:53):
is to say Edgar Winter is the father of the keytar
Emma (06:58):
The keytar.
The coolest of
Sam (07:01):
Absolutely!
Emma (07:05):
to have learned to have played the keytar.
Sam (07:07):
To play the keytar on a summer's day.
Emma (07:12):
It's all I really
Sam (07:12):
Yeah, do you remember when you were at a party and a boy
would bring out a keytar?
And all the girls would swoon?
Emma (07:18):
Oh, how we would swoon.
Bashed out Wonderwall
Sam (07:22):
ha ha ha ha ha!
Emma (07:29):
What a dude.
Sam (07:30):
Hee hee hee! I love a keytar!
Emma (07:34):
It looks like a fun instrument to play.
I can play a bit of piano and Ican read.
music, so maybe I could learn toplay
Sam (07:40):
So somewhere under this sofa is a very basic MIDI keytar
from the, do you remember RockBand and Guitar Hero?
Those Yes.
Yeah.
one of the later versions ofthose games had a keytar.
Emma (07:55):
Wow.
Any good to play?
Sam (07:57):
I mean, I don't know, because I only played it in the
Rock Band form of, you know,press the cool button and the
colours and the it was a goodgame.
Emma (08:06):
I wonder if there are any Meat Loaf songs on Guitar Hero.
Sam (08:09):
Oh, Lordy.
Emma (08:10):
Then we'll have to
Sam (08:11):
Yeah, well, you're going to have to look that
Emma (08:12):
up.
Do you still have the relevantconsoles?
Sam (08:15):
Yes, Because one day I might play rock band again.
I haven't for 10 years.
Yeah,
Emma (08:22):
Yeah, we just found our Wii balance board
Sam (08:24):
normal.
Ha ha ha ha ha.
Edgar Winter, winner and loserin
Emma (08:32):
life.
Sam (08:33):
do you want to talk about the lyrics?
Emma (08:35):
Yeah, can do.
Sam (08:36):
Some of the lyrics are quite good.
I like, I was a varsity tackleand a hell of a block when I
played my guitar.
I made the canyons rock.
I was such a cool dude.
Every Saturday night I felt thefever grow.
Do you know what it's like?
All revved up, with no place togo.
That is a very universalteenage,
Emma (08:53):
Yeah, I think we know what he's
Sam (08:55):
I think we know what he's talking about, but I must say,
Jim, When you get to the line,someone gotta draw first blood.
Emma (09:02):
Oh,
Sam (09:02):
Yeah, yeah.
No, we all know what you meanthere.
Emma (09:06):
And it's, it's not
Sam (09:08):
calm down.
Emma (09:09):
Chill out!
Sam (09:10):
Chill the fuck out,
Emma (09:11):
June.
She'll touch it
Sam (09:12):
ha ha ha! Yeah, it's very, um, at a party gets his keytar
out, sings about drawing firstblood.
Yeah.
I Do like the sax.
It is verging on the sitcom, butnot quite.
It does dance on the line, Ithink.
(09:33):
but then a minute from the endit all kicks in like, Oh, I've
finally done it.
Brilliant.
Emma (09:39):
Bye, love
Sam (09:41):
After this song, we've only got three left from this album,
so I realised it's time to startreally ploughing into the fun
press stuff from it, even if itdoesn't relate entirely to the
song.
Sounds Magazine 1979 had thislovely quote,"Meat has a part in
an upcoming movie, Americathon,wrestling a car in a futuristic
perverse Olympic Games."
Emma (10:05):
for Film
Sam (10:05):
One for Film Club, Americathon is, unlike a lot of
other movies that the twomentioned, something that did
come out and looks fucking dogshit.
Oh, yes! I think it's basicallythe same premise as Idiocracy,
all the reviews are god awful,so, uh, yep.
Emma (10:23):
I imagine that's one to watch on a Sunday morning.
Sam (10:26):
And then I like this quote, actually.
This is from a magazine calledThe Scene, Northeastern Ohio's
free rock music magazine.
a long masthead.
"If Meat Loaf is a sex symbol,he is one to thousands of non
trendy looking women."
Emma (10:44):
Ouch!
Sam (10:46):
"most groupies, you know, skinny blondes with bare
midriffs and big balconies...
Emma (10:51):
balconies!
Sam (10:57):
"would find Meat such a strange character that they
wouldn't know how to handle him.
For the most part, Meat Loaf hasproven that you don't have to be
some half starved pinhead tobecome a rock and roll star.
and for all the guys in theaudience Meat Loaf represents
normalcy.
The kind of guy you might workat the machine shop with so when
Meat sings all revved up with noplace to go he can sell the song
(11:17):
he's been there brother"
Emma (11:20):
I'm still stuck on balconies, to be honest with
Sam (11:22):
you.
know i haven't spotted balconieson first pass but that was very
Emma (11:26):
And
Sam (11:28):
he's a normal everyday he's a guy who works in the machine
shop he's a football
Emma (11:34):
If he can do it, you can do
Sam (11:36):
Exactly.
If he can parade around thestage for three hours, burning
his voice out, why aren't
Emma (11:42):
doing it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Sam (11:47):
It's not got the very funny, silly lyrics that he
reaches for in other songs.
It's not.
musically as exciting assomething like Bat out of Hell.
it is kind of funny in the waythat the whole album is, huge
send up of the teenageexperience, but not enough to
justify that first blood line,Jim.
It might be the least fun songon the album perhaps?
(12:10):
Yeah.
Emma (12:11):
Even if it is about getting all horny before going
out.
Sam (12:15):
Yeah, even if it
Emma (12:17):
Well, that's quite a fun thing, isn't it?
I remember being young and goingout and being all revved up.
Yeah.
then going out and returningback to my student digs with a
lovely kebab.
And a
Sam (12:33):
I did enjoy that Hehehehehehehehe Oh
Emma (12:39):
As the entirely unsuitable chap was once again not
interested.
Sam (12:46):
Do a quiz?
let's lift the mood.
Let's edit out the past fiveminutes and do a quiz.
So Jim and Meat Loaf did a lotof interviews while this album
was touring.
So I've got some juicy quotesfor you below.
Which one of these is a fakeSteinman?
A,"we've turned down an awfullot of requests for merchandise.
(13:07):
The grossest one was, someonecame up with this huge line of
Meat Loaf bedclothes.
quilts, bedspreads andpillowcases.
That was so disgusting that itconvinced us to turn them all
down.
The idea of someone restingtheir innocent head upon their
Meat Loaf pillow.
"That's That's ungodly".
(13:27):
Is it B?
"I always write about women.
All different women.
They don't always exist.
A lot of times I just make themup.
I close my eyes a lot when Iwrite, and that's when I see the
women".
Emma (13:41):
I mean, that's definitely a Steinman quote,
Sam (13:44):
C!"You can't hear it on the album, but I'm doing a lot of
Donna Summer moaning.
Essentially, I just made outwith myself.
First I recorded the boy, thenthe girl's groans.
It was all very hesitant,trembling."
Emma (13:58):
So
Sam (13:59):
So two of those are genuine Steinman, and one is not.
Emma (14:03):
feel a bit sick after the last one.
god, they all sound veryplausible.
I feel like, uh, the women one.
Yeah, god, I'm going to say thatyou have made up the awful women
Sam (14:18):
the awful women quote.
Jim didn't say it.
Emma (14:21):
No?
Sam (14:21):
Meat Loaf did!"I always sing about women, all different
women.
They don't always exist.
A lot of times I just make themup.
I close my eyes a lot when Ising, and that's when I see the
Emma (14:34):
the women.
Uh, uh, the women.
mean, at least he's saying womenand not females.
Sam (14:43):
Females.
Donna Summer moaning quote, thatwas of course a reference, do
you remember on, Paradise by theDashboard Light, he is credited
with lascivious moans.
That is, of course, what it'stalking about.
Meat Loaf had something to sayas well on that subject.
if you could only hear it, itwould be the best part of the
(15:03):
album.
When Jim was recording, Todd waslaughing so hard he was crying.
By the time he got to the girl,Todd was biting the console."
good old Todd.
Shout out to Todd Rongren,wherever you are.
Do you want to hear what thepeople of the internet think?
Emma (15:21):
Always
Sam (15:22):
Cartier specialist,
Emma (15:25):
Ooh, fancy
Sam (15:26):
I saw Meat Loaf for one dollar in Oklahoma City and I
still have the ticket stub.
It was the first of what wassupposed to be a series of 100
cent concerts sponsored by CatRock 1 0 5 fm, the radio
station.
Sorry.
No, that would be KA double T.
'cause that's how Americans dothe radio.
Nobody's moving on.
(15:48):
I don't get it.
Americans Times would I know I'mmarried to what?
She hasn't been able to explainit to me.
It's just a thing that they justbaff uh, times were different.
Then me and my friends all piledinto my Volkswagen Beetle and
went to see the concert.
There wasn't a bad seat in theCivic Centre at that time, but
we still had great seats.
(16:09):
If you never got to see Paradiseby the Dashboard Lights live in
concert That's a shame.
Emma (16:14):
ha!
Sam (16:16):
That
Emma (16:17):
I have seen it live, so, it's all good for me.
It's all good for me! He
Sam (16:23):
And, at ArchieBunker4101.
Does your average millennialknow what a saxophone" is?
Emma (16:29):
Ha ha ha ha!
Sam (16:30):
To which several millennials replied, yes.
Emma (16:33):
It's a fairly common instrument, it's still used a
and also a lot of us have beenaround since the 80s.
Sam (16:40):
Also, we've all seen that episode of The Simpsons where
Homer plays one and goes, sax ama mophone.
Ha
Emma (16:45):
ha ha ha yeah, we were raised on the Simpsons where
Lisa plays a saxophone.
Sam (16:51):
Take that Archie Bunker 4101!
Emma (16:53):
Bunker 4101.
Sam (16:54):
Shall we rate this song?
Listeners, we always rate oursongs on our patented Jim
Steinman or Meat Loaf songrating scale.
So this song was written by JimSteinman and therefore is
governed by the holy laws of JimSteinman for the finest songs.
Jim Fineman for acceptable worksand Jim Declineman for songs we
(17:15):
don't want.
Emma, what is this?
Emma (17:18):
It's a Jim Fineman.
Sam (17:19):
It is a Jim Fineman
Emma (17:21):
it's nothing special, it's
Sam (17:22):
If Jim Fineman had only written songs like this his
entire career, we would be doinga Whigfield podcast right
Emma (17:28):
now.
What's the Whigfield podcastcalled,
Sam (17:32):
Uh, saturday night and the air is getting pod
Emma (17:35):
Ooh.
Sam (17:36):
cast you, baby Jim Fineman, isn't
Emma (17:41):
it?
Yeah, it's a Jim
Sam (17:43):
Jim Fineman.
It's all right, Jim Fineman.
Emma, what song did you bringfor our lovely listeners this
Emma (17:49):
this I brought I'll Kill You If You Don't Come Back from
Dead Ringer.
there is, a video the YouTube.
have a look at it if you want.
Don't if you don't want.
I'm not your mum.
Soundtrack (18:01):
I want you out of my life.
But I'll kill you if you don'tcome back.
If you don't come back.
Emma (18:17):
That was I'll Kill You If You Don't Come Back from the
Dead Ringer album.
wasn't a single, but it doeshave a video.
Released September 1981.
written by Jim Steinman and ofcourse sung by Meat Loaf.
what do you think to that?
Sam (18:33):
RL Grey, often slams, well, me in particular for saying Dead
Ringer is a rubbish album.
I'm starting to come around toRL's way of thinking.
I
Emma (18:44):
is good, isn't
Sam (18:45):
good.
Yeah! You might not enjoy this,but, I am seeing it as a
prototype version of Lovin You'sa Dirty Job But Somebody's Got
to Do It.
They're both about the, can'tlive with you.
Can't live without
Emma (18:56):
uh, End of a relationship kind
Sam (18:57):
thing.
Yeah.
Emma (18:59):
I, haven't listened to this song for a very long time,
with good reason.
It's time, for,
Sam (19:08):
Meat Loaf memories That's so out of tune Meat Loaf
memories Oh Emma, pour yourheart out for the listeners
Emma (19:26):
you like the story?
Sam (19:27):
will it hurt you to share?
Emma (19:29):
Yeah, but I need to.
I am
Sam (19:31):
It's just you and me here, Emma.
Nobody else is ever gonna
Emma (19:34):
I haven't spoken to my therapist about this one yet.
Sam (19:37):
Do you speak to your therapist about all Meat Loaf
and Jim Steinman songs?
all I can say about that stuff.
Ha ha! Am I your therapist?
This is a safe space, Emma.
Thank you for sharing with us
Emma (19:51):
Sam.
So.
Back in year seven of highschool.
Sam (19:57):
for Americans, she was about 11.
Emma (19:59):
11.
Yeah, 11, 12, in my drama class,we had to, provide a piece of
music to use as the backgroundfor a piece of drama that we
were creating.
And because I was a very strange11 I thought that it would be
(20:20):
best to bring the most dramaticsong I could find at the time to
perform to, and so, uh, I choseI'll Kill You If You Don't Come
Back.
Sam (20:31):
that's such a power play for an 11-year-old.
Emma (20:34):
Essentially, I was miming along and playing out the
breakdown of a relationship.
And yes, it went as well as yourface is indicating it would have
done.
It was largely met with bemusedstares from my classmates and
teacher.
Obviously, age 12, I had notexperienced the breakdown in a
relationship, but I was havingdifficulties with my time at
(20:57):
school at that point, becausegirls are horrible.
and what I thought was that aperformance in my drama class
with this as the inspirationwould really show them.
What it actually showed them wasthat I was, as they suspected,
an incredibly weird kid.
I even asked the teacher if Icould do the performance alone,
but she wisely said that Ishould probably work with some
(21:18):
other people.
so another couple of sods wereroped into it.
and we had an excruciating time.
And as it was unfolding, Irealized my mistake.
You know, you know when yourealize as something's happening
live?
When the words tumble out ofyour mouth and you immediately
know that you've made a mistake.
It was very much that.
But for the full length of thesong, the full six minutes and
(21:40):
however many seconds., I thinkthe idea was that I would be all
sassy in the first part of thesong, I'd be all strong, throw
the horrible partner out, andthen when the glass breaks,
that's when I would become abroken down, remorseful, lonely
person.
The, uh, the remorse after thestorm.
(22:02):
What a twat.
What a prize twat.
Sam.
Sam (22:08):
Am I allowed to?
Is the story over?
Emma (22:10):
Um, yeah, that was it.
Just adolescent Emma trying topurge some emotions in the worst
possible way.
Sam (22:19):
Emma, thank you for sharing.
Emma (22:20):
Yeah, you're welcome.
You're allowed to
Sam (22:25):
did the teacher call your parents afterwards to say how
worried they are about you?
Emma (22:30):
No, but I think there were a few other instances of writing
poetry and things where otherteachers became a little
concerned.
Sam (22:39):
Oh, Emma.
This is adorable.
Emma (22:45):
I feel like I've, said too much,
Sam (22:47):
No, I don't, I think you've said exactly enough.
Emma (22:50):
I haven't been able to listen to this song since then.
Because I realised.
I'd gone too far.
I'd made a terrible
Sam (23:00):
I just want to point out that you share the vast majority
of Meat Loaf memories on thispodcast, and that is not because
I don't have equallyexcruciating stories of my
youth, it's just that I've notput in the work in therapy to be
able to talk about them as muchas you have, so well done you.
Emma (23:16):
Do you want my therapist's phone number?
Sam (23:18):
That might help.
Emma (23:19):
help.
Everyone should have therapy.
It does really help.
Sam (23:24):
This podcast is sponsored by
Emma (23:26):
Therapy?
Sam (23:28):
It's not, no, BetterHelp won't sponsor us.
Emma (23:31):
Oh.
Sam (23:32):
Get fucked, BetterHelp.
Emma (23:34):
See a real therapist.
Yeah, I wasn't able to listen toit.
I thought I'd do it for thisbecause I'm in a much better
place now, as a 41 year oldwoman, I'm doing loads better
than my 12 year old self was,which is, I think it's how it's
supposed to be, but
Sam (23:53):
Yeah, I mean, there are some people for whom that is
inversed.
Emma (23:57):
yeah.
I mean, I was a really strangekid, I realise now, I was really
fucking weird.
But do you know what?
That's alright! I thought itwould be a brilliant piece of
movement and theatre, and It wasjust awkward.
Sam (24:12):
yeah, I can see all of that, and There but for the
grace of God.
God
Emma (24:17):
Ha ha ha ha ha Amazingly, after that, I still went on to
study drama, until A Level.
Sam (24:27):
How could you top that?
Emma (24:28):
I should have quit while I was ahead!
Sam (24:32):
Oh, Emma's in this.
What, Emma?
I'll kill you if you don't comeback,
Emma (24:36):
You absolute fucker.
But yeah, yeah.
how my acting career never tookoff, I don't know.
Sam (24:43):
You feel better now?
Emma (24:45):
I don't know.
Sam (24:46):
Okay.
Emma (24:47):
see when I listen back to it next week.
If I want to die or not.
Yay!
Sam (24:53):
I don't think it's that bad a story, obviously it's, an
excruciating thing to happen toyou in the moment to suddenly
realize at the beginning of asix minute interpretive dance
piece.
that this isn't going to do whatyou expected it to do.
Emma (25:14):
It didn't make me any more popular, Sam No.
Ha ha.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha.
Sam (25:20):
everybody listening to this Meat Loaf and Jim Steinman very
specific review slash comedypodcast has definitely done
something like that or worse.
There's no doubt.
Listeners, do drop us a line,chat out of hell at gmail.
com if you want to be as braveas Emma better.
Hashtag make Emma feel better.
You were a, a, kid who done feltemotions, that's fine.
Emma (25:43):
I was an impressionable child in a tumultuous world.
And they said I was at adifficult stage.
they knew.
Sam (25:57):
Emma, there's no shame in that story.
Emma (26:00):
Thanks Sam, thanks.
There's a little though.
No! That note got really highpitched.
Dudes! No, It's all fine! Fine!I feel
Sam (26:12):
I feel like one of the girls in the toilets who's found
another girl crying.
Emma (26:17):
girl crying.
Sam (26:18):
you're beautiful! Yeah.
Come on, let's get you, let'sget mascara fixed.
We'll go out and have a
Emma (26:25):
Hee he hee.
We'll show him! Oh, right.
So actually back to the song nowthat I've got my trauma out of
the way, do you wanna hear whatthe critics had to say?
Fuck you man.
Just because I'm in touch enoughwith my emotions to be able to
do this.
Fuck you.
Sam (26:45):
Repression is free!
Emma (26:50):
I'm gnawing away at your insides.
Sam (26:52):
not at my bank balance
Emma (26:57):
Oh, good lord.
Do you want to hear what SoundsMagazine had to say about it?
Yes, I'll kill you if you don'tcome back, commences the flip,
the second side of the album,uh, with
Sam (27:08):
thanks granddad warren's
Emma (27:13):
I'll kill you if you don't come back, commences the flip,
with hard rock posturing of agritty magnificence, only
matched by Warren Zevon'scurrent output.
That is, a great Kay Rich'sgenre riff making with its ultra
sardonic lyrics.
How do you abuse me?
Let me count the ways, how manyhours and how many days.
(27:35):
A shattering noise gives way toa coda of benediction.
What wanky writing.
reminds me of the Strawbs.
Bestowed upon multitudes ofyoung girls.
Steinman showing genuineunderstanding of the trials of
being a teenager.
Struggling with thereconciliation between the
desire for magic and the pain ofreal life.
(27:57):
Sample lyrics.
Bless all the homecoming queensof the night, they're looking
for magic in gymnasium light.
It's one of the greatest momentsin pop song ever.
Sam (28:09):
I just had a thought about Sounds Magazine was it Sandy
Robertson again?
Sandy's delightfully floridprose, which you don't get in
music reviews anymore.
Emma (28:20):
Sandy's pro Steinman.
Propaganda.
Yes! I can just imagine them atSounds Magazine, Oh, fucking
hell, Sandy, write somethingabout somebody else!
Sam (28:31):
in the days of being paid by the
Emma (28:34):
Ha ha ha Do you want to hear what Jim had got to say?
this is about Dead Ringer as analbum, but it does relate to the
song.
he said,"This album is a littlemore intimate.
The lyrics are more personal.
It's had, like, three differenttitles in the last week.
One of the songs is called DeadRinger.
That might be the title.
(28:55):
The title I wanted to use wasconsidered too strong, which
was, I'll Kill You if You Don'tCome Back.
One of the best love songs Iever wrote.
"Great chorus line.
In every way I want you out ofmy life, but I'll kill you if
you don't come back."
Sam (29:09):
Which, okay, that is a great line.
Jim, typically humble there intelling us how great it is.
Emma (29:15):
Of course, yes.
Sam (29:17):
Obviously Jim knows fuck all about marketing, as we
Emma (29:20):
Yes.
Sam (29:21):
I'm Meat Loaf, this is my second album, I'm really glad to
be putting another record outthere.
I'm going to kill you! I'm agiant 300 pound footballer, and
I'm going to kill you, women.
Emma (29:33):
Yep!
Sam (29:34):
So please buy it! Uh, you can get it at HMV, Woolworths,
Emma (29:38):
Our Price,
Sam (29:39):
R price.
Emma (29:40):
Oh, Andy's records.
Andy's records.
Sam (29:41):
records.
Emma (29:42):
to love the Andy's records.
Sam (29:46):
Any more?
Emma (29:48):
I mean HM v's.
Still there, isn't it?
Yeah.
Stores.
Virgin Mega Stores.
I used to work at HMV.
Sam (29:53):
You did?
any sad stories about that?
Emma (29:57):
it It was, it was all right.
it was really fucking boring,but I'm quite good at the
alphabet, so it was fine.
Sam (30:04):
Go on and take your stuff.
Don't even bother to pack.
How?
What, I want armfuls of clo Fuckyou, Meat Loaf
Emma (30:13):
imagine him throwing the things out of the window as he's
saying that.
It is a full on EastEnders
Sam (30:19):
There's a suitcase and an armful of jumpers.
Emma (30:24):
How do you abuse me let me count the ways how many hours
and how many days is fuckingbrilliant, isn't it?
It's so good.
Sam (30:30):
So it's all literary illusions, innit?
Emma (30:33):
it?
And I, when, 12 year old Emmawas miming to that, I was
feeling it! Yeah! The people ofthe internet have a few things
to say.
Sam (30:43):
I thought they might chip in on this.
Emma (30:45):
Tuesday Patients said, yeah, when I was in early high
school through college andfreshly in love with Meat, late
eighties, early nineties, I wasalways trying to figure out what
type of girl I was and how Icould become the girl he loved.
Let's just say that over thoseyears, I fit into several of his
categories.
Sam (31:09):
a savage.
Emma (31:11):
Breezio5323 said, ah, the Borderline Personality Disorders
theme song.
Sam (31:19):
is being
Emma (31:23):
Love the crazy Meat brought to this song.
Sam (31:26):
Is it time to rate this song, Emma?
Well, Emma, this is once again aJim Steinman song, so we refer
back to our dusty ancient JimSteinman song rating scale,
where the greatest songs are JimSteinmans, the averagest songs
are Jim Finemans, and un goodsongs, they're Jim Declinemans.
(31:47):
But what mans is this?
Emma (31:51):
I think it might be a Jim Steinman.
The low end of Jim
Sam (31:56):
Steinman I had it down as top end Jim Fineman.
Emma (32:00):
It's difficult to
Sam (32:01):
Let me just, um, tell you the illustrious company it might
be keeping in the Jim Steinmans.
Emma (32:07):
Ah.
Sam (32:08):
Bat out of Hell, of course.
You took the Words right out ofMy Mouth.
It's all coming back to me now.
Nowhere Fast, after our accord.
Emma (32:16):
isn't It's a top end Jim Fineman,
Sam (32:17):
isn't it?
End.
Exactly.
Top End?
yeah, Yeah.
it's Top End Jim Fineman.
Top End! Jim Fineman.
so, Emma, that was Chat out ofHell.
Emma (32:30):
or was it?.
Well.
Sam (32:33):
Listeners, we did promise last week an update on our Jim
Steinman style songwritingescapades.
And, we've both certainlyproduced something.
do have to say, having looked atmy document I've not produced as
much as I thought I had.
do you want to make your pitchfirst?
This is very early
Emma (32:51):
Okay, so all I've got, I've obviously got no music
whatsoever.
Sam (32:55):
because neither of us are musicians
Emma (32:57):
Ha.
I don't know how we're going togo about doing this.
Garage band.
So, I've got a title.
and I'm going down the tropethat, Jim has of Overdoing a
cliche.
So I'm calling mine.
Better Late than Never.
I've got some lyrics.
Would you like me to read themto you?
lyrics.
I am cringing slightly.
Sam (33:18):
does this feel more excruciating than telling the
story of
Emma (33:21):
No.
It definitely, it'sexcruciating, but not quite as
Okay, just preparing myself formy dramatic reading.
the shadow of a midnight dream.
Where hearts are wild and fateredeems.
I walked alone on a burningroad, Searching for a love I'd
always known.
(33:42):
was a thunder in my soul andfire in my eyes, Time stood
still under the starry skies,The past haunted me like the
ghost of forever, But now you'reback, we're better late than
never.
Sam (33:56):
than never.
Emma (33:57):
I'm not, I'm not done yet.
It's not finished.
Better late than never.
I should have asked you when Icould.
Better late than never.
You were the best in theneighborhood.
Better late than never.
I've always been under attack.
Better late than never.
But baby now you're back.
Sam (34:20):
Well done!
Emma (34:21):
Thanks.
That
Sam (34:22):
is quite Steinman esque.
Emma (34:26):
Went into full Steinman madness, I
Sam (34:29):
was very good Steinman madness.
Yeah, well done! I, mine isgoing to be so shit by
comparison.
I had such a difficulty Um, notjust doing a parody,
Emma (34:40):
Right, because I'm trying really hard
Sam (34:42):
yeah, you were successfully so sincere, um, in a way that
you and I are never sincereabout anything because we're
comedians.
And if the laughter stops, thecrying starts.
Ha ha ha ha ha.
Again, do you want thattherapist's number So you might
(35:02):
recall, I've been kicking aroundideas about, uh, having
heartburn after a big curry.
which next to your work, doesseem quite trite.
it's a three act piece.
Um, I've got act three in somesort of a form.
(35:25):
So act one is about two loversmeeting over poppadoms.
Yep, and then obviously act twois the consumption of the main
curry.
Um, and then we get into actthree.
Be my Gaviscon, tell me wherethe love has gone, tell me that
(35:47):
I wasn't wrong to eat somethingso spicy.
Be my Gaviscon, soothe theburning that is going on,
burning deep inside me, becausemy heart is burning, burning.
And then Jim does this, so whycan't I?
I've just recycled some earlierJim lyrics.
(36:08):
Heartburn.
Heartburn.
Heartburn.
Burn us away.
Emma (36:14):
So you've Weird Al'd this
Sam (36:16):
I didn't mean to Weird Al it.
I was just writing what I know.
And I You've really shamed me,of.
Emma.
Emma (36:24):
You remember last week you read out the, the Jim, the, Jim
advice.
So I tried to put all of myhorrible cynicism and sarcasm to
one side and think likeSteinman.
And I wrote this really late atnight, when I should have been
asleep or something.
and I'd spent quite a long timelistening to bits of it, to try
and get in the right mood.
(36:45):
To try and put all of thathorrible, cynical, comedian
away.
Sam (36:52):
I really do feel like I did my homework on the back of the
bus.
ha! still a long way to go withthis, I don't really know where
it's going to from It's good.
Emma (37:00):
I'd like to know what, the listeners,
Sam (37:02):
listeners, please do let us know what you thought of either
of those.
Be kind, we're not songwriters,we are twats.
We
Emma (37:09):
appalling twats.
Sam (37:10):
One or two of our listeners have mentioned that they've been
starting to work on Steinmanesque
Emma (37:14):
Oh god, are we inspiring something awful?
Sam (37:17):
We are certainly inspiring something.
Emma (37:20):
Is it something beautiful?
Sam (37:21):
It might be something beautiful.
Emma (37:22):
Let's put out an album!
Sam (37:24):
Let's put on a show!
Emma (37:26):
hands!
Sam (37:27):
if you want to do that, you can email us at
Emma (37:29):
chatoutofhelp at
Sam (37:30):
chatoutofhellatgmail.
com to which several messageshave arrived this week.
Emma (37:38):
Good!
Sam (37:39):
Yeah, it's because I said to which.
Emma (37:40):
To
Sam (37:42):
genuinely reaching the point now where we have to be
those wankers and say, we can'tread out all of every email.
I know.
We've got I'm going to have toedit these as we go, because
people have said some verylovely things.
And, thank you for saying lovelythings, everybody.
We might not read out peoplesaying nice things about us
anymore, because we've got somuch else going on.
So,
Emma (38:02):
but if you could read the nice things to me, I could
really do with it.
Sam (38:05):
yeah, I'll probably edit, I'll edit them out, but I'll do
them for you now.
Emma (38:09):
It's been a
Sam (38:09):
So, we've got, from Charlie
Emma (38:12):
Everidge North.
Hi, Charlie.
Sam (38:13):
You remember Charlie.
Charlie sent us the Christmascharlie is still on the quest to
find pictures of Jim Steinmanriding a motorbike.
he was talking to his partner,and in her search, so Charlie's
partner, Emma, has now alsojoined the search for pictures
of Jim Steinman on a motorbike.
but she has found thispublication which might be of
(38:35):
interest to us.
It's called Endlessly Horny forWonder and Magic: how Jim
Steinman's Bat out of HellPerfectly Captured the
Prepubescent American Id andNearly Ruined Me for Life" Pop
Papers, Book 5.
So this is A pseudo academictext.
And I say pseudo academicbecause it is just published on
Amazon.
Yeah, that's a piece that I'mgonna have to buy and read
(38:57):
during our break, I think.
To see what Tim Quirk thinks ofit all.
Emma (39:01):
Mmm.
Sam (39:02):
Eddie French has been in
Emma (39:03):
Hi, Eddie.
Sam (39:05):
"Hello, well done on the podcast.
you want a general Loaf opinion.
I feel that the words rock androll are misused a lot by Jim
and Meat, it's not a greatdescription of the music they
make." I agree.
Eddie says, I feel it's betterdescribed as, unhealthy
fetishization of a 1950s Americathat never really existed, foie
(39:25):
gras'd through a musical theatregoose, served on a motorbike
with a barely concealederection."
Emma (39:32):
Thanks, Eddie.
Sam (39:36):
"that's hard to fit on a label at HMV so I get the need
for a shorthand."
Emma (39:41):
I mean, they're not wrong.
Sam (39:42):
They're not wrong.
They've absolutely nailed that.
Thank you so much Eddie.
Grey's been in touch.
Hello RL.
Just now got to the most recentepisode.
I don't know if you've noticed,but we have had a lot of news to
keep up with here in the U.
S.
Yeah.
Emma (40:01):
Sorry, guys.
Sam (40:05):
"You got a lot of great material out of two very short
tracks.
Nice job.
Incidentally, I had long wantedcontext for this photo included
in the program for the 1994Everything Louder Tour, and now
I know the story.
Thanks!" Emma, here's the photo.
Emma (40:20):
Oh.
Wow.
Sam (40:23):
a shot from, It's a Royal knockout.
where Meat Loaf is posing withSarah Ferguson, then Duchess of
wherever.
wherever.
Emma (40:34):
Staunch royalists.
Sam (40:35):
Them looking mildly awkward.
Emma (40:37):
Neither of them look comfortable.
Neither
Sam (40:38):
of them look very happy, but I think the implication here
is, the argument he had withPrince Andrew was so great that
in revenge.
he just took photos of himselfwith his wife on a tour 10 years
later.
Emma (40:53):
Wow!
Sam (40:55):
"In answer to your question, there are a couple of
Bruce Springsteen songs that Ialways thought Meat could
perform nicely".
And to my shame, I've not had achance to listen to either of
these, so I do apologize.
But RL suggests BrilliantDisguise and I'm on Fire, Which
I don't so I'm really sorry RL.
(41:17):
I've quite busy this week SoI've not listened.
I'll take your word for it, andwe'll have a listen to those in
the break Then there's thisHarry Chappin Chappin song that
I just adore and again by theway that I've stumbled over this
person's name No idea who theyare.
Song called mismatch.
Thanks
Emma (41:34):
RL we will give
Sam (41:38):
And then R.
L.
has also linked us to what seemsto be the earliest professional
recording of any of Jim's songs,it's Yvonne Elliman singing a
song called Happy Ending.
Emma (41:48):
Happy
Sam (41:49):
Yeah, so we'll stick that on the recommendations list, so
thank you as ever R.
L.
And then this one fromGabriella.
Emma (41:57):
Hi Gabriela.
Sam (41:59):
Just sped through the entire podcast in a week and I'm
finally up to date.
It's so great to hear Steinmandiscourse outside of the
internet, or my own head.
I would say I am both learningfrom your podcast and hearing
lore I know too well.
I don't think I ever realisedwho the for Meat Loaf slash
Steinman music was.
Divorced dads and the Brits werenot on my
Emma (42:20):
radar.
Sam (42:25):
This ties back to Eddie's earlier message though, because
we know that the first album wasmade in the UK, really.
British audiences absolutelylapped it up in a way that
Americans didn't And I, it'sbecause it sells this vision of
Americana that we.
slightly different now, but whenyou and I were young, America
(42:45):
was still the thing.
It was an incredibly cool thing.
Even before I married Kat, I wasat a family wedding and one of
my elderly relatives came up tome and said, I hear you've got
an American girlfriend.
Emma (42:59):
And
Sam (43:00):
And that was like the height of sophistication.
So like the image of Americathat is painted in early Meat
Loaf and Steinman stuff isplugged right into the British
psyche, I
Emma (43:10):
definitely.
Sam (43:12):
Uh, so that's why that is, Gabriela.
"I recently turned 25 and Ifirst became aware of Meat Loaf
as a kid through Total Eclipseof the Heart.
As a kid of the early 2000s, Iinterpreted the featuring Meat
Loaf as meaning the DJ." Youmentioned a DJ Meat Loaf to me
the other day.
Emma (43:30):
Yeah, there was something, I think I found something
Sam (43:32):
Yeah, yeah, we don't know the DJ.
I was so enamored with the TotalEclipse video when I was younger
and fell hard for the RockyHorror Picture Show.
featuring Meat Loaf as a queerteen.
I was so sad to hear you guystrash it, but I know it's
because you've never been in atheatre of queer joy, yelling
raunchy callbacks and singingalong in the way O'Brien
Absolutely true.
(43:53):
Well, certainly for me, I don'tknow if you have.
Emma (43:55):
I've not done it before.
Maybe the next time it comes toone of our local cinemas, we
should actually go.
Sam (44:01):
perhaps
Emma (44:02):
We should try and find it and make the effort, but I'm not
doing the dress up.
I draw the line.
I'm not that kind of girl.
Sam (44:10):
I've never seen Emma dressed up for
Emma (44:12):
anything.
Ha ha ha ha ha!
Sam (44:14):
So Gabriella, yes, you're right.
we did sort of mention this onthe episode, but, I consumed.
Rocky Horror as a 38 year oldstraight cis man sitting
watching a DVD with my dog on aSaturday morning, which is
completely the wrong way toconsume Rocky Horror.
I get that.
I do.
(44:34):
As a cultural artifact, I'm veryglad that it exists to help
people find other people likethemselves and work out who they
are and have an amazing time ina world which isn't always nice
for them.
So, I'm very glad that itexists, but it's not a good
film.
"I found Bat Out of Hell at 15,then learned Marvin didn't write
his own songs.
I've had Steinman brain rot eversince.
(44:56):
Like Emma, I was an angsty anddramatic teen.
teen.
You're gonna love Gabriella, do
Emma (45:00):
And that was the only short
Sam (45:01):
us?
Emma (45:01):
for it.
Sam (45:02):
And Meat Loaf slash Steinman spoke to me deeply.
I know every song by heart.
And like many other Steinmanfans, as I've learned from your
podcast, I wrote a musical ofSteinman songs when I was barely
17.
It centers a butch slash femmeromance around a beach bonfire.
I like to think it would pissoff Aday and Steinman.
Emma (45:24):
It
Sam (45:24):
You read us Steinmaniac's fantasy evenings with Jim.
Later on, you shared Steinmanliking to sit in his hangar,
blasting music and smoking a J.
my fantasy night with Jim isbeing on that blunt rotation.
I'm submitting Left in the Darkslash Medley featuring Barbara
Streisand and yet anotherSteinman monologue.
"Can't wait to hear yourthoughts".
Preview, I love Left in the Darkand I like the Barbara Streisand
(45:47):
version a lot.
Um, but yes, we'll stick that onthe list.
Thank you very much, Gabriella.
Emma (45:51):
That's lovely!
Sam (45:54):
And then link to that, talking of queer culture.
This is from Sean Ponsonby.
Emma (45:59):
Hi Sean.
Sam (46:01):
Hi guys.
I don't have a personal storywith Jim or Meat, but I'm from
Liverpool, and as I'm sureyou're aware, we had Eurovision
here in 2023.
As part of that week, I wasasked to host an interview and
Q& A with Niki French, who was aformer UK Eurovision entrant.
Obviously she had a hit with thedance version of Total Eclipse
of the Heart, produced by Stockand Aitken but not Waterman.
(46:24):
For Gabriella and other peoplenot from the I love how we're
one foot in Britain and one
Emma (46:29):
Yeah, one in the U.
S.
Yes.
We are straddling the Atlantic.
Some of
Sam (46:35):
Like, what's that reference to Richard Briers gonna do for
people like Gabriella, a 25 yearold queer
Emma (46:41):
Canadian?
It'll give them some homework todo.
Sam (46:46):
What I didn't know was that this got her on Jim's radar and
they started work on a projecttogether later in the decade.
"I didn't know that either.
Of course, I couldn't pass upthe opportunity to ask someone
who had worked with Jim abouthim, so even though it was a
Eurovision event, I made sure tobore the room full of people who
had traveled for the finals byteasing out as many details
about Jim as I could."
Emma (47:07):
Wonderful.
Sam (47:09):
"Unfortunately, the event wasn't recorded and I was
hosting, so I had half a mind onkeeping things ticking, so I
can't remember everything shesaid, but she did reveal that
the collaboration fell apart, asthis was right after Jim had
scored major hits with CelineDion and Boyzone, and remixing
Take That's Never Forget for thesingle edit, which I wish we
would all talk about more, coswhat the fuck?
(47:30):
I guess we have to talk aboutthat at some point.
"And his management were pushingfor him to work with more
superstar acts.
She was quite camp, and most ofher anecdotes included the
phrase,'Cause I'd had a bottleof wine".
Emma (47:46):
Oh, I love that!
Sam (47:47):
"She clearly loves wine, and she said something about Jim
that I thought was very nice,sounds like a dick at times.
He gave her a very expensivebottle of wine, dated from 1994,
which was the year that she hadher hit with Total Eclipse.
I thought that was sweet." Thatwas sweet, that's lovely.
That is, yeah.
There's two versions of Jim thatshine through and one of them is
a very lovely man to his friendsand loved ones and the other one
(48:09):
is a bellend to his friends andloved ones.
P.
S.
shameless plug, currentlynearing completion of a book
about unlikely queer icons andhave written a mini chapter on
Meat and Jim because my wordeverything they did feels so
gay".
Sean, please do tell us whenthat book is out and what it's
called because,
Emma (48:28):
to read that.
that'd be amazing.
Sam (48:32):
Thank you so much everybody who's written in so, Emma, what
songs are we doing next time?
There isn't a next time.
We're we're having one of ourtraditional end of series
breaks.
So we're going to be away for afew weeks, but we will be back
on April the 7th for our editionof Chat Out of Hell Film Club,
where we're both gonna watchsome probably God awful films
(48:55):
feature Meat Loaf.
Emma, you've decided on yoursuggestion.
Emma (48:59):
going to watch Dead Ringer.
Sam (49:00):
Dead Ringer, available on the YouTube, I believe.
Emma (49:03):
yes.
Sam (49:04):
and I'm dipping into our suggestion box for this one.
I'm gonna choose the filmBloodrayne.
That's Blood R A Y N E.
which is a legendarily shitvideo game spin off movie about
a sexy lady vampire.
We can probably find out onstreaming or something.
It's on Apple.
So we're going to watch thoseand come back for Film Club on
April the 7th.
(49:25):
And then just to get you allteed up, we're very excited
about seeing the Bat Out of Hellstage show in April.
So when the podcast returns forreal on April the 21st.
We are going to go into a deepdive into the Dream Engine.
Emma (49:40):
Dream Dream Engine.
Woo!
Sam (49:48):
is, as all of you will know by now, Jim Steinman's first
effort at a musical theatershow.
There is a weird bootlegrecording of it on Jim's
website.
if you really want to listen tothe whole thing, it's probably
not worth it.
We'll tell you all about it.
We'll do that work so you don'thave to, but in the meantime,
please do keep your general MeatLoaf thoughts and anecdotes
(50:10):
flying in.
Did you see Meat Loaf atPopeye's Chicken looking for a
big can of spinach?
us know,
Emma (50:17):
chatoutofhell at gmail.
com.
Yeah,
Sam (50:20):
like that one?
Emma (50:21):
that
Sam (50:21):
Thanks.
Off the top of my head andeverything., that's been Chat
Out of Hell series three.
Emma (50:25):
We'll see you for series 4.
Sam (50:28):
Bye bow now now now
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