November 9, 2024 • 22 mins
Could the bonds in your closest relationships be holding you back instead of lifting you up? Join me as I unravel the intricate web of enmeshment that can blur boundaries and obscure individuality in the relationships we cherish most. This episode sheds light on how these dynamics differ from healthy relationships, where respect and mutual enjoyment reign, fostering individuality rather than dependency.
Discover the nuances between enmeshment and codependency as we untangle the emotional struggles that can lead to isolation and loss of self-identity. By examining both romantic and familial ties, hear how enmeshment can creep into your life, and the challenges that arise when trying to establish boundaries. Don't forget to like, subscribe, and engage with our community as we navigate the road to empowerment and independence.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the Codependent Doctor, a weekly
podcast focusing on all thingscodependency.
Are you struggling to loveyourself, feeling burnt out or
having trouble forming lovingand meaningful relationships?
I can help you heal from thepast and move forward with
healthier selves, healthierrelationships and healthier,
more fulfilling lives.
Join me as we reclaim yourauthentic self.
(00:23):
I'm your host, a family doctorand fellow codependent, dr
Angela Downey.
We can do this together.
Here we go.
Hello to all my wonderfulpodcast listeners and welcome to
the 22nd episode of theCodependent Doctor.
I'm your host, dr Angela Downey, a family doctor and fellow
(00:44):
codependent.
Today's episode we're going tobe focusing on enmeshment.
If you have a moment, it wouldbe helpful if you could like and
subscribe to the podcast, ormaybe leave a comment, so it's
going to be easier for otherswho might benefit to find me.
Don't forget to follow me soyou don't miss any future
episodes.
I haven't been very active onsocial media up until now,
mostly because I've tried tosteer away from it in the past,
(01:06):
but I'm trying to get with thetimes and figure this out.
So I'm now on Instagram andFacebook and I'm ready to go.
So you're welcome to follow me.
On Facebook, I'm Dr AngelaDowney and on Instagram I'm Dr
Angela Downey.
All one word Also for the monthof December.
I'm going to be setting up ajournaling challenge.
I'm going to be sending outdaily prompts for you to
incorporate into your dailyjournaling.
(01:27):
The prompts will all be gearedtowards getting you set up for
the new year and reflecting onwhat you might want to work on
in the new year.
To receive these prompts, youcan send an email to
codependentdoctor at gmailcom,and codependent is
C-O-D-E-P-E-N-D-E-N-T doctor atgmailcom.
(01:48):
Today's topic is enmeshment.
It's a complicated concept thathas so many implications.
This podcast was reallydifficult for me and it was hard
to explore, and it brought up alot of challenging and
difficult feelings for me.
I'm just going to start bydefining enmeshment and give a
few examples that some of youmight be able to relate to.
(02:10):
Enmeshment is when people are soinvolved in each other's lives
that they lose their own senseof independence.
They feel responsible for eachother's emotions and choices,
making it hard to set boundaries, and this can often lead to
feeling guilty or anxious whentrying to make personal
decisions.
Enmeshment is like being tooclose, where each person feels
(02:32):
that they can't be their ownperson without affecting the
other person.
Some key features of enmeshmentcan include having blurred
boundaries, where there's littledistinction between where one
person ends and the other personbegins.
This can make it hard forpeople to identify their own
needs and emotions.
There's a lack of individualityPersonal decisions might be
(02:54):
influenced or controlled by theother person, causing a loss of
self-identity.
In enmeshed relationships,people may feel responsible for
each other's happiness andwell-being to an excessive
degree.
Enmeshed individuals might feelguilty or anxious when they try
to separate or if they try toassert independence or make
decisions without the otherperson's involvement.
(03:15):
People in enmeshedrelationships often depend on
each other to feel secure orvalidated, which can create
challenges when one person wantsto set boundaries or become
autonomous.
A major sign of enmeshment isfeeling like you need the
relationship in order to feelwhole or secure, rather than
simply wanting the relationshipbecause it adds something
(03:37):
positive to your life.
The difference between need andwant is essentially at the
heart of enmeshment.
When a relationship is healthy,each person has a sense of
independence and self-worth.
Outside of that relationship,they choose to be together out
(03:57):
of a mutual respect and care andenjoyment, but they don't
depend on each other to feelcomplete.
This is the want side.
Both people can grow separatelyand support each other without
feeling responsible for theother's happiness.
An example of this would be ina healthy relationship, each
person might reach out to theother because they genuinely
want to.
They might talk once a week oreven once a month, but when they
do, there's no resentment overthe time in between.
(04:19):
One person might wish that theytalked to the other person more
often, but they don't get upsetwhen it's been a while because
they both have other positivethings happening in their lives.
With enmeshment, however,there's a strong sense of need.
The individuals rely on eachother emotionally in a way that
feels almost essential for theirwell-being.
They might feel incomplete,anxious or even guilty if they
(04:43):
don't constantly connect orprioritize the other person.
This neediness creates adependency where each person's
emotions, choices and identitybecome deeply intertwined with
the others.
I was listening to Dr KennethAdams speaking on a podcast and
he said something that reallyresonated with me.
He said dependency is built onobligation and loyalty is driven
(05:06):
by guilt, and this really hithome for me.
Enmeshment is something thatI've experienced in my
relationship with my mom, andthat's why it made it so
difficult for me to record thispodcast.
For a long time.
We would talk every day,sometimes for hours, and we'd
share just about everythingtogether.
She's been such a stronginfluence in my life and I came
(05:29):
to rely on her for so much.
Because of this closeness.
I didn't really feel the needto reach out to other friends or
anyone else as much.
It made it so that I didn'tneed any other relationships,
and it's only recently that Istarted to realize that, while
my bond was really important andreally strong with my mom, it
may have actually had someimpacts on my marriage.
(05:51):
Now, there was a lot of factorsin my marriage that made it
challenging and ultimately ledto me separating from my husband
, and while this wasn't the mainreason, I can now see that I
would often be prioritizing mymom's feelings and thoughts and
opinions over my partner's, andat time, I think my partner felt
like he was competing for myattention, which wasn't fair to
(06:12):
him.
I had difficulty making my owndecisions and would often rely
on my mom to guide me, eventhough I was an adult and I
should have been making thosedecisions for myself.
There was a period when I felta strong need to call my mom
every morning and sometimes inthe evenings, even when I wanted
to do other things, like maybelisten to a podcast.
Our calls had become such ahabit that it felt hard to
(06:35):
change.
My mom would sometimes jokearound about me being her little
alarm clock and I knew that shereally liked starting her day
with our chats, but this made mefeel responsible for keeping up
that routine.
I didn't feel like I could doother things without
disappointing her.
Now I love my mom and I stilllove talking with her, but I
(06:57):
realized that I need a littlebit more of a balance where our
conversations happened because Iwanted them to, not because I
felt like I had to, and I'velearned that a healthy
relationship has space for eachperson to grow.
So now when I talk to my mom,it's because I genuinely want to
, and that's helped me feel moregrounded in all of my
relationships feel more groundedin all of my relationships.
(07:21):
So a couple more examples ofenmeshed relationships would be
I love to travel and on a recentbusiness trip to Vancouver I
planned to catch up with somefriends.
I only had one free evening,but one of my close friends had
a standing dinner that night, asher family gathers every Sunday
.
She really wanted to join usand felt torn, but she didn't
feel like she could miss dinnerbecause her dad would be upset
(07:43):
with her.
So she even went so far as toinvite me to join her for family
dinner.
But I was really hoping for anight out with just the girls
and we would be reminiscing andover dinner in a restaurant.
In the end she ended up goingto her family dinner and it
wasn't because she wanted to.
She went because she felt likeshe had to.
She felt like she didn't haveany other choice.
(08:04):
Imagine a couple who feels likethey can't do anything
separately.
If one partner wants to go outwith friends or take a trip with
someone else, the other partnermight feel hurt or abandoned.
So they start doing everythingas a pair, even activities that
one person isn't even interestedin.
Over time they stop seeingfriends and doing hobbies that
they used to enjoy doing alone.
They might even feel lost ifthey're apart for too long,
(08:27):
relying on each other for all oftheir happiness.
Think of when a parent gets tooinvolved in their child's
sports.
They might see the child's winsor losses as their own.
This can lead to things likeyelling at referees coaching too
much from the sidelines orreacting strongly to how their
child plays.
In these situations, theparent's feelings depend on how
(08:48):
well their child is doing andthe child might feel pressured
to perform just to keep theirparent happy, and this makes it
hard for the child to enjoy thesport for themselves, which is a
key sign of enmeshment.
You might have an enmeshedparent-child relationship if
your parents are overly involvedin your life and make comments
like I don't know what I'd dowithout you.
(09:09):
You're the only one whounderstands me.
I need you to call me every dayso I know you're okay.
Otherwise I worry too much.
I just don't feel right whenyou're not here.
It's like a piece of me ismissing.
I don't want you to make thesame mistakes I did.
Let me help you decide what'sbest.
Why would you keep things fromme?
I thought we shared everything.
You should have married thatperson.
(09:31):
They were perfect for you.
You shouldn't be a doctor.
You would be so much happierbeing a nurse.
Instead, you shouldn't befriends with that person.
They're not good for you.
You might be in an enmeshedrelationship with your partner
if they make comments like Idon't know what I'd do if you
left me.
I'd be completely alone.
It hurts me when you don'tinclude me in all your plans.
(09:53):
I thought we didn't keepsecrets from each other.
Why wouldn't you tell mesomething like that?
I need to know where you are atall times.
It's just because I care.
If you don't open up to meabout everything, I feel like
you're shutting me out.
Codependency and enmeshment arerelated but not interchangeable.
They overlap in some ways, buteach has unique characteristics.
(10:14):
Enmeshment is more about therelationship itself, lacking
boundaries, while codependencyis about behaviors and patterns,
especially the need to beneeded.
Enmeshment can create thefoundation for codependency, but
codependency extends beyondenmeshment, with a focus on
fixing and rescuing others tofeel valuable.
They are similar in that bothinvolve unclear boundaries where
(10:38):
people are overly involved ineach other's lives, feelings and
decisions.
In both, people can lose theirsense of individuality while
prioritizing someone else'sneeds and emotions over their
own.
Both can create a resilience onone another to feel validated,
happy or fulfilled rather thandeveloping internal sources of
self-worth.
But they also have differences.
(11:05):
Enmeshment refers to arelationship dynamic where
boundaries are so blurred thatpeople's identities and
emotional lives becomeintertwined.
It's common in familyrelationships where everyone
feels like they must share thesame thoughts, emotions or
values.
A parent and child might havesuch a close bond that they
share every detail of theirlives, assuming that they feel
the same way about everything,and feel uncomfortable making
decisions without the otherperson's approval.
If the child is sad, the parentfeels sad too, as if their own
(11:29):
emotions are tied to the child's.
Here the focus is on emotionalcloseness and shared identity
rather than on fixing orrescuing each other.
Codependency is a behavioralpattern often rooted in
enmeshment, but extends tofocusing on rescuing or fixing
others.
A codependent person feelscompelled to help others at
(11:50):
their own expense, oftenchoosing partners, friends or
family members who need them tothe point of dependence.
A woman in a romanticrelationship might feel
responsible for solving all ofher partner's problems, even at
her own expense.
She might go out of her way totake care of him, covering for
him at work or handling hisfinances, even if it causes her
stress or financial issues.
(12:11):
Her sense of self-worth is tiedto his need for her help, so
she continues rescuing him, evenwhen it's harmful for her
well-being.
Enmeshment generally happenswithin family systems or close
relationships withoutnecessarily having the helper
role as the primary focus.
It's more about the lack ofindependence.
Codependency is more abouttrying to be needed, often
(12:32):
choosing relationships thatreinforce a caretaker role,
where one person's sense ofpurpose is tied to managing
another person's life oremotions.
In enmeshed relationships,people often run into a lot of
challenges.
When everything revolves aroundthe other person, it's easy to
lose track of who you areoutside the relationship.
Your own interests, goals andneeds get pushed aside.
(12:53):
Boundaries are blurred, makingit hard to say no or focus on
what you need.
There's often a sense ofobligation to meet the other
person's expectations, which canbe exhausting.
People in enmeshedrelationships depend heavily on
each other for emotional support, so it's tough to feel okay or
secure without constantreassurance from that person.
Trying to be independent canbring up guilt and anxiety.
(13:15):
You worry about hurting ordisappointing the other person
just by doing your own thing andanxiety.
You worry about hurting ordisappointing the other person
just by doing your own thing.
Enmeshment can crowd out otherrelationships as well, so you
might start to feel isolated ordisconnected from friends and
family.
When someone becomes your wholelife, a breakup or separation
feels devastating.
Without them, you might feellike you've lost everything,
(13:36):
since so much of your identityand happiness depend on that
relationship.
When one person tries to setboundaries or create space, it
can lead to arguments or hurtfeelings, as the other person
might feel abandoned or rejected.
Making changes in an enmeshedrelationship can be really
challenging, especially becausethe other person is likely not
going to be too thrilled aboutit.
When you start to setboundaries and focus on your own
(13:59):
needs, it can feeluncomfortable for both of you.
But here's the thing Creatinghealthier boundaries doesn't
mean that you have to cut thatperson right out of your life.
It just means redefining therelationship so that it works
better for you and, potentially,for both of you.
One of the hardest parts ofstepping back is dealing with
the feelings of guilt andanxiety.
In enmeshed relationships, youmight feel responsible for the
(14:22):
other person's emotions.
Setting boundaries might feellike you've let them down or
that you're being selfish, eventhough prioritizing your needs
is healthy.
Let's say that you're used tocalling a family member every
single day.
You enjoy the chats, butsometimes you need a break.
When you try to skip a call,they might say something like
why didn't you call me?
Are you mad at me or don't youlike me anymore?
(14:44):
And instead of feeling guilty,you can gently explain I need
some time for myself, but I'llstill call you a couple times a
week.
Imagine you have a friend who'sconstantly asking for favors.
You want to help, but it'sstarting to wear on you.
If you start saying no, thenthat person might push back,
saying I thought you were alwaysthere for me.
You could potentially respondwith something like I care about
(15:06):
you, but I need to take care ofmy own needs too.
If your family expects you tocome over for dinner every
Sunday, but you're starting tofeel overwhelmed when you decide
to take a Sunday off, theymight say we're counting on you
to be here.
You're part of the family.
You might reply with somethinglike I love spending time
together, but I also need timeto recharge.
I'll join you sometimes, butI'm not going to be able to join
(15:27):
you every week.
When you start making thesechanges, the other person is
likely not going to like it.
They've grown so used to thatcloseness and might feel hurt or
confused or even potentiallyresentful.
They might say things thattrigger guilt or pressure,
hoping that you'll go back tothe way that things were.
This reaction can make itharder for you to stick to your
boundaries.
You might hear things like whyare you distancing yourself?
(15:51):
Don't you care about me anymore, after everything I've done for
you.
This is how you repay me.
You're only thinking aboutyourself, or since when do you
need me time?
I suggest that you memorize afew replies that you can use in
situations like this, because inthe spur of the moment, it can
be easy to fall back into someof your old patterns.
So having a few replies can bevery helpful.
(16:13):
You could say something like Iunderstand that this is new and
it might seem unexpected.
Taking time for myself helps merecharge and it's something
that I'm trying to be moreintentional about.
It's not about taking anythingaway from a relationship.
Setting boundaries is a skillthat takes practice, especially
if it's something that's new tothe relationship.
You might struggle to find theright words or worry about
(16:34):
seeming distant or unkind.
This new approach can feelawkward and uncomfortable at
first.
If you're nervous about settingboundaries in person, then
consider expressing them in aletter.
This allows the other persontime to process before
responding, and eventuallyyou're going to need to talk
about these things openly.
But sometimes having time toprocess these things is better
(16:54):
in the long run.
In enmeshed relationships, youridentity often becomes wrapped
up in the other person and asyou start pulling back, it might
feel disorienting or evenlonely.
You need to rediscover who youare on your own terms, which can
sometimes take time and a lotof self-reflection.
So think about activities thatyou enjoy or hobbies that you
(17:15):
may have put aside.
Try taking a class, picking upan old hobby or exploring
something new that's meaningfulto you.
Setting small, achievable goalsfor yourself, like maybe
reading a certain number ofbooks this year or learning a
new skill.
Try working towards a fitnessmilestone.
All these can help rebuildconfidence and they will give
you a sense of purpose.
(17:37):
Carve out moments to be alonewithout distractions.
You can try journaling, goingfor a walk or having a quiet
time at home, and all these canhelp you get comfortable with
your own thoughts and feelings,and they're going to allow you
to tune into what you need andwhat you want.
Try spending time with friends,family or colleagues who bring
out different aspects of yourpersonality.
Try practice setting boundaries.
(17:58):
Talk to a therapist, join asupport group.
This is a chance for you tolearn about yourself and to find
a balance in your life.
Take time to do this and reallykind of explore who you are.
You probably haven't had muchof a chance to do that over the
last couple of years.
Being enmeshed in a relationshipis often comfortable, even if
it's unhealthy.
So change is going to feel verydisruptive.
(18:19):
The relationship has settledinto a rhythm and when one
person shifts it can reallyunsettle both of you.
Accept that it's going to takesome time for both of you to
adjust to new boundaries and toa more balanced way of relating.
So imagine a couple who's beendancing together for years.
Over time, one person haslearned to follow the other
steps and they're matching theirmoves perfectly.
(18:40):
They know the rhythm by heart,even though it's not always the
most fun or comfortable for them.
It's just what they've grownused to.
But when one person decides tostart changing things up, they
might change the beat, theymight change the steps.
Suddenly, the dance is feelingreally awkward and completely
out of sync.
The other person is likelygoing to be feeling thrown off
(19:00):
and not knowing how to matchthese new moves.
This isn't about disrupting thedance entirely.
It's about each person findingtheir own rhythm while still
staying connected.
With time, and with a littleadjustment, they can create a
new way of dancing together, onethat feels better for both of
them and lets each person movemore freely.
Over time, old habits might tryto creep back in, especially if
(19:22):
the other person pushes againstthe new boundaries.
Staying consistent andreminding yourself why these
changes are important can helpyou stay on track.
Having outside support can makethis easier and keep you
grounded.
In the end, these adjustmentsaren't about cutting someone out
of your life.
They're about reshaping therelationship to support a
healthier balance.
Although it might bechallenging at first, setting
(19:44):
these boundaries can ultimatelymake the relationship stronger
and allow you to feel moregrounded and fulfilled.
So this is all that I have foryou this week, but before I
share some self-reflectionexercises, I'd love for you to
take a moment and follow me onFacebook at Dr Angela Downey,
and on Instagram at Dr AngelaDowney.
All one word.
You can also sign up for myjournaling challenge for the
(20:07):
month of December by emailing meat codependentdoctor at
gmailcom, and we can get readyfor the new year together.
So here are someself-reflection exercises for
this week.
If you'd like to do somejournal work.
Ask yourself what do I need orwant that I might not be
expressing.
List your needs and wantsseparately from what you think
the other person might want.
(20:27):
Reflect on whether you feelfree to express your needs
without guilt.
Write about who you are outsideof the relationship.
What makes you you?
Think about your hobbies,interests, values and dreams.
How often do you make time forthese parts of yourself?
Think about what a balancedrelationship would feel like to
you.
What would change?
(20:47):
How would you or the otherperson interact differently?
Visualizing this balance canhelp clarify what you're working
towards.
Spend a few days tracking yourdecisions or interactions with
the person you feel enmeshedwith.
Write about whether thesechoices aligned more with your
needs or with theirs.
How often do you compromiseyour own desires?
Choose one small, specificboundary that you can set in
(21:11):
this relationship.
Write about why this boundarymatters to you, what you hope
that it's going to bring to yourlife and any fears or
resistance that you feel aboutsetting it.
I wish you all a great week asyou learn to foster a better
relationship with the mostimportant person in your life
yourself.
I'm going to meet you here,probably next week, for another
episode of the CodependentDoctor, where I'm going to be
(21:31):
talking about differentattachment styles.
Take care for now.
Thank you for joining me, and Ihope today's podcast resonated
with you.
Click, like and subscribe soyou don't miss any future
episodes and to help others whomight benefit.
This podcast is not meant toprovide medical advice and
(21:52):
should not replace seeing yourdoctor for mental health
concerns.
If you're having a mentalhealth crisis, please present to
a hospital, call 9-1-1 or yourlocal crisis helpline.
I'll talk to you next week withanother edition of the
codependent doctor.
We can do this together.
Welcome to the Codependent Doctor, a weekly
podcast focusing on all thingscodependency.
Are you struggling to loveyourself, feeling burnt out or
having trouble forming lovingand meaningful relationships?
I can help you heal from thepast and move forward with
healthier selves, healthierrelationships and healthier,
more fulfilling lives.
Join me as we reclaim yourauthentic self.
(00:23):
I'm your host, a family doctorand fellow codependent, dr
Angela Downey.
We can do this together.
Here we go.
Hello to all my wonderfulpodcast listeners and welcome to
the 22nd episode of theCodependent Doctor.
I'm your host, dr Angela Downey, a family doctor and fellow
(00:44):
codependent.
Today's episode we're going tobe focusing on enmeshment.
If you have a moment, it wouldbe helpful if you could like and
subscribe to the podcast, ormaybe leave a comment, so it's
going to be easier for otherswho might benefit to find me.
Don't forget to follow me soyou don't miss any future
episodes.
I haven't been very active onsocial media up until now,
mostly because I've tried tosteer away from it in the past,
(01:06):
but I'm trying to get with thetimes and figure this out.
So I'm now on Instagram andFacebook and I'm ready to go.
So you're welcome to follow me.
On Facebook, I'm Dr AngelaDowney and on Instagram I'm Dr
Angela Downey.
All one word Also for the monthof December.
I'm going to be setting up ajournaling challenge.
I'm going to be sending outdaily prompts for you to
incorporate into your dailyjournaling.
(01:27):
The prompts will all be gearedtowards getting you set up for
the new year and reflecting onwhat you might want to work on
in the new year.
To receive these prompts, youcan send an email to
codependentdoctor at gmailcom,and codependent is
C-O-D-E-P-E-N-D-E-N-T doctor atgmailcom.
(01:48):
Today's topic is enmeshment.
It's a complicated concept thathas so many implications.
This podcast was reallydifficult for me and it was hard
to explore, and it brought up alot of challenging and
difficult feelings for me.
I'm just going to start bydefining enmeshment and give a
few examples that some of youmight be able to relate to.
(02:10):
Enmeshment is when people are soinvolved in each other's lives
that they lose their own senseof independence.
They feel responsible for eachother's emotions and choices,
making it hard to set boundaries, and this can often lead to
feeling guilty or anxious whentrying to make personal
decisions.
Enmeshment is like being tooclose, where each person feels
(02:32):
that they can't be their ownperson without affecting the
other person.
Some key features of enmeshmentcan include having blurred
boundaries, where there's littledistinction between where one
person ends and the other personbegins.
This can make it hard forpeople to identify their own
needs and emotions.
There's a lack of individualityPersonal decisions might be
(02:54):
influenced or controlled by theother person, causing a loss of
self-identity.
In enmeshed relationships,people may feel responsible for
each other's happiness andwell-being to an excessive
degree.
Enmeshed individuals might feelguilty or anxious when they try
to separate or if they try toassert independence or make
decisions without the otherperson's involvement.
(03:15):
People in enmeshedrelationships often depend on
each other to feel secure orvalidated, which can create
challenges when one person wantsto set boundaries or become
autonomous.
A major sign of enmeshment isfeeling like you need the
relationship in order to feelwhole or secure, rather than
simply wanting the relationshipbecause it adds something
(03:37):
positive to your life.
The difference between need andwant is essentially at the
heart of enmeshment.
When a relationship is healthy,each person has a sense of
independence and self-worth.
Outside of that relationship,they choose to be together out
(03:57):
of a mutual respect and care andenjoyment, but they don't
depend on each other to feelcomplete.
This is the want side.
Both people can grow separatelyand support each other without
feeling responsible for theother's happiness.
An example of this would be ina healthy relationship, each
person might reach out to theother because they genuinely
want to.
They might talk once a week oreven once a month, but when they
do, there's no resentment overthe time in between.
(04:19):
One person might wish that theytalked to the other person more
often, but they don't get upsetwhen it's been a while because
they both have other positivethings happening in their lives.
With enmeshment, however,there's a strong sense of need.
The individuals rely on eachother emotionally in a way that
feels almost essential for theirwell-being.
They might feel incomplete,anxious or even guilty if they
(04:43):
don't constantly connect orprioritize the other person.
This neediness creates adependency where each person's
emotions, choices and identitybecome deeply intertwined with
the others.
I was listening to Dr KennethAdams speaking on a podcast and
he said something that reallyresonated with me.
He said dependency is built onobligation and loyalty is driven
(05:06):
by guilt, and this really hithome for me.
Enmeshment is something thatI've experienced in my
relationship with my mom, andthat's why it made it so
difficult for me to record thispodcast.
For a long time.
We would talk every day,sometimes for hours, and we'd
share just about everythingtogether.
She's been such a stronginfluence in my life and I came
(05:29):
to rely on her for so much.
Because of this closeness.
I didn't really feel the needto reach out to other friends or
anyone else as much.
It made it so that I didn'tneed any other relationships,
and it's only recently that Istarted to realize that, while
my bond was really important andreally strong with my mom, it
may have actually had someimpacts on my marriage.
(05:51):
Now, there was a lot of factorsin my marriage that made it
challenging and ultimately ledto me separating from my husband
, and while this wasn't the mainreason, I can now see that I
would often be prioritizing mymom's feelings and thoughts and
opinions over my partner's, andat time, I think my partner felt
like he was competing for myattention, which wasn't fair to
(06:12):
him.
I had difficulty making my owndecisions and would often rely
on my mom to guide me, eventhough I was an adult and I
should have been making thosedecisions for myself.
There was a period when I felta strong need to call my mom
every morning and sometimes inthe evenings, even when I wanted
to do other things, like maybelisten to a podcast.
Our calls had become such ahabit that it felt hard to
(06:35):
change.
My mom would sometimes jokearound about me being her little
alarm clock and I knew that shereally liked starting her day
with our chats, but this made mefeel responsible for keeping up
that routine.
I didn't feel like I could doother things without
disappointing her.
Now I love my mom and I stilllove talking with her, but I
(06:57):
realized that I need a littlebit more of a balance where our
conversations happened because Iwanted them to, not because I
felt like I had to, and I'velearned that a healthy
relationship has space for eachperson to grow.
So now when I talk to my mom,it's because I genuinely want to
, and that's helped me feel moregrounded in all of my
relationships feel more groundedin all of my relationships.
(07:21):
So a couple more examples ofenmeshed relationships would be
I love to travel and on a recentbusiness trip to Vancouver I
planned to catch up with somefriends.
I only had one free evening,but one of my close friends had
a standing dinner that night, asher family gathers every Sunday
.
She really wanted to join usand felt torn, but she didn't
feel like she could miss dinnerbecause her dad would be upset
(07:43):
with her.
So she even went so far as toinvite me to join her for family
dinner.
But I was really hoping for anight out with just the girls
and we would be reminiscing andover dinner in a restaurant.
In the end she ended up goingto her family dinner and it
wasn't because she wanted to.
She went because she felt likeshe had to.
She felt like she didn't haveany other choice.
(08:04):
Imagine a couple who feels likethey can't do anything
separately.
If one partner wants to go outwith friends or take a trip with
someone else, the other partnermight feel hurt or abandoned.
So they start doing everythingas a pair, even activities that
one person isn't even interestedin.
Over time they stop seeingfriends and doing hobbies that
they used to enjoy doing alone.
They might even feel lost ifthey're apart for too long,
(08:27):
relying on each other for all oftheir happiness.
Think of when a parent gets tooinvolved in their child's
sports.
They might see the child's winsor losses as their own.
This can lead to things likeyelling at referees coaching too
much from the sidelines orreacting strongly to how their
child plays.
In these situations, theparent's feelings depend on how
(08:48):
well their child is doing andthe child might feel pressured
to perform just to keep theirparent happy, and this makes it
hard for the child to enjoy thesport for themselves, which is a
key sign of enmeshment.
You might have an enmeshedparent-child relationship if
your parents are overly involvedin your life and make comments
like I don't know what I'd dowithout you.
(09:09):
You're the only one whounderstands me.
I need you to call me every dayso I know you're okay.
Otherwise I worry too much.
I just don't feel right whenyou're not here.
It's like a piece of me ismissing.
I don't want you to make thesame mistakes I did.
Let me help you decide what'sbest.
Why would you keep things fromme?
I thought we shared everything.
You should have married thatperson.
(09:31):
They were perfect for you.
You shouldn't be a doctor.
You would be so much happierbeing a nurse.
Instead, you shouldn't befriends with that person.
They're not good for you.
You might be in an enmeshedrelationship with your partner
if they make comments like Idon't know what I'd do if you
left me.
I'd be completely alone.
It hurts me when you don'tinclude me in all your plans.
(09:53):
I thought we didn't keepsecrets from each other.
Why wouldn't you tell mesomething like that?
I need to know where you are atall times.
It's just because I care.
If you don't open up to meabout everything, I feel like
you're shutting me out.
Codependency and enmeshment arerelated but not interchangeable.
They overlap in some ways, buteach has unique characteristics.
(10:14):
Enmeshment is more about therelationship itself, lacking
boundaries, while codependencyis about behaviors and patterns,
especially the need to beneeded.
Enmeshment can create thefoundation for codependency, but
codependency extends beyondenmeshment, with a focus on
fixing and rescuing others tofeel valuable.
They are similar in that bothinvolve unclear boundaries where
(10:38):
people are overly involved ineach other's lives, feelings and
decisions.
In both, people can lose theirsense of individuality while
prioritizing someone else'sneeds and emotions over their
own.
Both can create a resilience onone another to feel validated,
happy or fulfilled rather thandeveloping internal sources of
self-worth.
But they also have differences.
(11:05):
Enmeshment refers to arelationship dynamic where
boundaries are so blurred thatpeople's identities and
emotional lives becomeintertwined.
It's common in familyrelationships where everyone
feels like they must share thesame thoughts, emotions or
values.
A parent and child might havesuch a close bond that they
share every detail of theirlives, assuming that they feel
the same way about everything,and feel uncomfortable making
decisions without the otherperson's approval.
If the child is sad, the parentfeels sad too, as if their own
(11:29):
emotions are tied to the child's.
Here the focus is on emotionalcloseness and shared identity
rather than on fixing orrescuing each other.
Codependency is a behavioralpattern often rooted in
enmeshment, but extends tofocusing on rescuing or fixing
others.
A codependent person feelscompelled to help others at
(11:50):
their own expense, oftenchoosing partners, friends or
family members who need them tothe point of dependence.
A woman in a romanticrelationship might feel
responsible for solving all ofher partner's problems, even at
her own expense.
She might go out of her way totake care of him, covering for
him at work or handling hisfinances, even if it causes her
stress or financial issues.
(12:11):
Her sense of self-worth is tiedto his need for her help, so
she continues rescuing him, evenwhen it's harmful for her
well-being.
Enmeshment generally happenswithin family systems or close
relationships withoutnecessarily having the helper
role as the primary focus.
It's more about the lack ofindependence.
Codependency is more abouttrying to be needed, often
(12:32):
choosing relationships thatreinforce a caretaker role,
where one person's sense ofpurpose is tied to managing
another person's life oremotions.
In enmeshed relationships,people often run into a lot of
challenges.
When everything revolves aroundthe other person, it's easy to
lose track of who you areoutside the relationship.
Your own interests, goals andneeds get pushed aside.
(12:53):
Boundaries are blurred, makingit hard to say no or focus on
what you need.
There's often a sense ofobligation to meet the other
person's expectations, which canbe exhausting.
People in enmeshedrelationships depend heavily on
each other for emotional support, so it's tough to feel okay or
secure without constantreassurance from that person.
Trying to be independent canbring up guilt and anxiety.
(13:15):
You worry about hurting ordisappointing the other person
just by doing your own thing andanxiety.
You worry about hurting ordisappointing the other person
just by doing your own thing.
Enmeshment can crowd out otherrelationships as well, so you
might start to feel isolated ordisconnected from friends and
family.
When someone becomes your wholelife, a breakup or separation
feels devastating.
Without them, you might feellike you've lost everything,
(13:36):
since so much of your identityand happiness depend on that
relationship.
When one person tries to setboundaries or create space, it
can lead to arguments or hurtfeelings, as the other person
might feel abandoned or rejected.
Making changes in an enmeshedrelationship can be really
challenging, especially becausethe other person is likely not
going to be too thrilled aboutit.
When you start to setboundaries and focus on your own
(13:59):
needs, it can feeluncomfortable for both of you.
But here's the thing Creatinghealthier boundaries doesn't
mean that you have to cut thatperson right out of your life.
It just means redefining therelationship so that it works
better for you and, potentially,for both of you.
One of the hardest parts ofstepping back is dealing with
the feelings of guilt andanxiety.
In enmeshed relationships, youmight feel responsible for the
(14:22):
other person's emotions.
Setting boundaries might feellike you've let them down or
that you're being selfish, eventhough prioritizing your needs
is healthy.
Let's say that you're used tocalling a family member every
single day.
You enjoy the chats, butsometimes you need a break.
When you try to skip a call,they might say something like
why didn't you call me?
Are you mad at me or don't youlike me anymore?
(14:44):
And instead of feeling guilty,you can gently explain I need
some time for myself, but I'llstill call you a couple times a
week.
Imagine you have a friend who'sconstantly asking for favors.
You want to help, but it'sstarting to wear on you.
If you start saying no, thenthat person might push back,
saying I thought you were alwaysthere for me.
You could potentially respondwith something like I care about
(15:06):
you, but I need to take care ofmy own needs too.
If your family expects you tocome over for dinner every
Sunday, but you're starting tofeel overwhelmed when you decide
to take a Sunday off, theymight say we're counting on you
to be here.
You're part of the family.
You might reply with somethinglike I love spending time
together, but I also need timeto recharge.
I'll join you sometimes, butI'm not going to be able to join
(15:27):
you every week.
When you start making thesechanges, the other person is
likely not going to like it.
They've grown so used to thatcloseness and might feel hurt or
confused or even potentiallyresentful.
They might say things thattrigger guilt or pressure,
hoping that you'll go back tothe way that things were.
This reaction can make itharder for you to stick to your
boundaries.
You might hear things like whyare you distancing yourself?
(15:51):
Don't you care about me anymore, after everything I've done for
you.
This is how you repay me.
You're only thinking aboutyourself, or since when do you
need me time?
I suggest that you memorize afew replies that you can use in
situations like this, because inthe spur of the moment, it can
be easy to fall back into someof your old patterns.
So having a few replies can bevery helpful.
(16:13):
You could say something like Iunderstand that this is new and
it might seem unexpected.
Taking time for myself helps merecharge and it's something
that I'm trying to be moreintentional about.
It's not about taking anythingaway from a relationship.
Setting boundaries is a skillthat takes practice, especially
if it's something that's new tothe relationship.
You might struggle to find theright words or worry about
(16:34):
seeming distant or unkind.
This new approach can feelawkward and uncomfortable at
first.
If you're nervous about settingboundaries in person, then
consider expressing them in aletter.
This allows the other persontime to process before
responding, and eventuallyyou're going to need to talk
about these things openly.
But sometimes having time toprocess these things is better
(16:54):
in the long run.
In enmeshed relationships, youridentity often becomes wrapped
up in the other person and asyou start pulling back, it might
feel disorienting or evenlonely.
You need to rediscover who youare on your own terms, which can
sometimes take time and a lotof self-reflection.
So think about activities thatyou enjoy or hobbies that you
(17:15):
may have put aside.
Try taking a class, picking upan old hobby or exploring
something new that's meaningfulto you.
Setting small, achievable goalsfor yourself, like maybe
reading a certain number ofbooks this year or learning a
new skill.
Try working towards a fitnessmilestone.
All these can help rebuildconfidence and they will give
you a sense of purpose.
(17:37):
Carve out moments to be alonewithout distractions.
You can try journaling, goingfor a walk or having a quiet
time at home, and all these canhelp you get comfortable with
your own thoughts and feelings,and they're going to allow you
to tune into what you need andwhat you want.
Try spending time with friends,family or colleagues who bring
out different aspects of yourpersonality.
Try practice setting boundaries.
(17:58):
Talk to a therapist, join asupport group.
This is a chance for you tolearn about yourself and to find
a balance in your life.
Take time to do this and reallykind of explore who you are.
You probably haven't had muchof a chance to do that over the
last couple of years.
Being enmeshed in a relationshipis often comfortable, even if
it's unhealthy.
So change is going to feel verydisruptive.
(18:19):
The relationship has settledinto a rhythm and when one
person shifts it can reallyunsettle both of you.
Accept that it's going to takesome time for both of you to
adjust to new boundaries and toa more balanced way of relating.
So imagine a couple who's beendancing together for years.
Over time, one person haslearned to follow the other
steps and they're matching theirmoves perfectly.
(18:40):
They know the rhythm by heart,even though it's not always the
most fun or comfortable for them.
It's just what they've grownused to.
But when one person decides tostart changing things up, they
might change the beat, theymight change the steps.
Suddenly, the dance is feelingreally awkward and completely
out of sync.
The other person is likelygoing to be feeling thrown off
(19:00):
and not knowing how to matchthese new moves.
This isn't about disrupting thedance entirely.
It's about each person findingtheir own rhythm while still
staying connected.
With time, and with a littleadjustment, they can create a
new way of dancing together, onethat feels better for both of
them and lets each person movemore freely.
Over time, old habits might tryto creep back in, especially if
(19:22):
the other person pushes againstthe new boundaries.
Staying consistent andreminding yourself why these
changes are important can helpyou stay on track.
Having outside support can makethis easier and keep you
grounded.
In the end, these adjustmentsaren't about cutting someone out
of your life.
They're about reshaping therelationship to support a
healthier balance.
Although it might bechallenging at first, setting
(19:44):
these boundaries can ultimatelymake the relationship stronger
and allow you to feel moregrounded and fulfilled.
So this is all that I have foryou this week, but before I
share some self-reflectionexercises, I'd love for you to
take a moment and follow me onFacebook at Dr Angela Downey,
and on Instagram at Dr AngelaDowney.
All one word.
You can also sign up for myjournaling challenge for the
(20:07):
month of December by emailing meat codependentdoctor at
gmailcom, and we can get readyfor the new year together.
So here are someself-reflection exercises for
this week.
If you'd like to do somejournal work.
Ask yourself what do I need orwant that I might not be
expressing.
List your needs and wantsseparately from what you think
the other person might want.
(20:27):
Reflect on whether you feelfree to express your needs
without guilt.
Write about who you are outsideof the relationship.
What makes you you?
Think about your hobbies,interests, values and dreams.
How often do you make time forthese parts of yourself?
Think about what a balancedrelationship would feel like to
you.
What would change?
(20:47):
How would you or the otherperson interact differently?
Visualizing this balance canhelp clarify what you're working
towards.
Spend a few days tracking yourdecisions or interactions with
the person you feel enmeshedwith.
Write about whether thesechoices aligned more with your
needs or with theirs.
How often do you compromiseyour own desires?
Choose one small, specificboundary that you can set in
(21:11):
this relationship.
Write about why this boundarymatters to you, what you hope
that it's going to bring to yourlife and any fears or
resistance that you feel aboutsetting it.
I wish you all a great week asyou learn to foster a better
relationship with the mostimportant person in your life
yourself.
I'm going to meet you here,probably next week, for another
episode of the CodependentDoctor, where I'm going to be
(21:31):
talking about differentattachment styles.
Take care for now.
Thank you for joining me, and Ihope today's podcast resonated
with you.
Click, like and subscribe soyou don't miss any future
episodes and to help others whomight benefit.
This podcast is not meant toprovide medical advice and
(21:52):
should not replace seeing yourdoctor for mental health
concerns.
If you're having a mentalhealth crisis, please present to
a hospital, call 9-1-1 or yourlocal crisis helpline.
I'll talk to you next week withanother edition of the
codependent doctor.
We can do this together.
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