Building a Firemanship Culture in Mississippi : Journey of the Old South FOOLS

In this conversation, we sit down with Jacob McVey and Travis Bradshaw, members of the Old South FOOLS, to discuss their journey in the fire service, the establishment of their chapter, and the importance of training and community. They share insights on overcoming challenges, fostering a culture of firemanship, and the significance of brotherhood in firefighting. The discussion also touches on the upcoming conference aimed at supporting St. Jude Children's Research Hospital, personal motivations for joining the fire service, and the traditions that shape their work. The conversation highlights the need for a shift in mindset within the fire service and the importance of physical fitness and training for firefighters.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
All right, welcome back everybody.
I have the privilege to sit downwith two Fools members today
versus Jacob McVeigh. He's got 7 years in the American
Fire Service. He's currently a career engine
driver for Lafayette County FireDepartment.
He's involved and helps out withthe county special operations
team. He's a proud, these are his
words, Mississippian. So hopefully I don't butcher
that. Jake's been driven through his

(00:20):
mission to service community through emergency response and
also facilitating training. And that's kind of why we're
sitting down right now. He is the founding president of
the Old South Fools, which is the Northeast Mississippi
chapter of the Fools International.
Beyond that, beyond his professional life, a Jake's a
grateful husband to his wife, Kayla, and a father to two
daughters, Hazley and Margo. His passions with fitness, which

(00:42):
helps to stay physically strong,mentally strong and sharp, which
obviously helps with the job. I also have the privilege to sit
down with his buddy here. Also Fools.
Member of the Old South, Travis Bradshaw, 31 years old, nine
years in the American Fire Service, currently working at
South Haven Fire Department in Mississippi.
He started in Corneth Fire Department and also spent four
years fighting fires in coastal Mississippi.

(01:02):
Currently he is a secretary chair for the Old South Fools.
Before we get kind of rapping onthese guys, just a reminder,
this podcast is for informational use only.
This is our opinions. The recommendations and ideas
are the members and the hosts only are affiliated with the
fire departments, the current organizations or companies that
they work for. So with that all out of the way,
boys welcome. I'm super fucking excited right

(01:25):
now to sit down with you guys. So let's just start off with the
fools. So that's how we got connected
through social media. I love what you guys are doing.
So if you could break down to the audience and I read in the
bio. So please correct me if I if I
misinformed anybody, but Jake, Ibelieve you were the founding
president. So found in the chapter.
Why? Let's start there.
So why did you found the old South fools?

(01:47):
What were you lacking or what did you, what were you craving
to kind of get this whole organization going, brother?
Yeah. So again, you know, we talked
about facilitating training, it's a big need and and
Mississippians that surrounding areas, we live in kind of
tri-state area between Mississippi, Tennessee and
Alabama and we went very underrepresented for a long
time. Not a lot of people are kind of
in line with the job as a whole.And we've got a strong

(02:10):
firefighting culture, but it's not, it's a job to a lot of
people and there's not a big sense of firemanship.
And we're looking to change a lot of that.
But we look at that as a way to facilitate some of the change
that we want to affect, primarily building a training
culture and a culture of of of firemanship.
So that's we were in the same boat out here in the West Coast
in Arizona. It was and it's literally me and

(02:30):
my buddies all did the same thing at basically over stogies
at the Firehouse one day saying,hey man, I want to do this
right. And of course we all said
absolutely we're on board because we had the same need or
that, that desire, that trainingculture.
But more importantly, to do exactly what you said the to
silence the ones that we're talking.
This is just a job. This is for my benefits,
whatever every 3rd day, not my emergency bullshit, bullshit,

(02:54):
bullshit, bullshit all the way across.
So I love the fact that, you know, we're eons apart, but same
same mentality, same love and passion for the job.
So Travis, let's talk to you buddy.
How were you involved in the theconception of the the fools?
And then how did you find yourself where you are now?
And then what do you, what are you kind of doing with the
organization? Yeah, then so Jacob and I

(03:15):
actually met super early on in our fire service career.
When we started out, we were working at Court Pacific at a
smaller department there. We're fortunate enough to have
some officers and have some guysthere that are super
knowledgeable with the knowledge, aggressive

(03:36):
firefighters that are plugged inand doing great things.
Michael Taylor, Dixie Firemanship, Chris Duncan And
then I also had a Lieutenant that Sean Nelms.
That was a big influence on me. We're we're just lucky enough to
fall in with some, with some good firemen that kind of paved
the way for us and, you know, gave me for a loaf of the job.

(03:58):
It's a real old city. We we did get to make a lot of
fires out there, but that kind of sparked my love for
firemanship and going on some pretty good jobs.
I was like, hey, like this isn'tno joke.
Like you need to know your stuff.
You need to be squared away. And if you're not like there's
no hiding on the fire ground. You can, you can talk whatever

(04:21):
you want. You can say, oh, well, when the
time comes, I can operate and then go 10 times up at 9:00 AM
at the end of the day. You can't hide on the fire
ground. But that's kind of how I got
started and how me and Jacob met.
I did about 3 1/2 years there. And then just due to life

(04:42):
circumstances, I was young. I was saying I was like, like,
we'll be trying something different.
I moved to the coast, spent about four years down there, met
some great guys. And then I met my beautiful
wife, Anna, and she is a nurse at Saint Jude.
And he he was going to move downthere.

(05:04):
We we kind of reconnected and she was going to move down there
and after some long, a lot of praying and deliberate, we
decided come back up this way. I applied a few places and
landed a job at South Haven. It's a super good department.
We're we're Memphis, TN, We're just South of the Tennessee
Mississippi line. But yeah, that's kind of gets

(05:26):
you up to speed with how I got involved with the fools and with
Old South. I'd saw Jacob started the
chapter. I was still living on the coast,
but as soon as I got back up, I was like, hey man, what can I
do? I want a board member or
anything like that. And I was like, what can I do?
How can I help? Like I just, I was excited.
I just wanted to be a part of what they had going on, what

(05:51):
they're doing. Of the story and like I like how
you guys transitioned to it. So let's go, let's go back to
Jake for a second. So when you established your
initial fools chapter, was thereany pushback?
Was there any like, oh, is that a cool kid group or whatever?
The guys just jump on board and say, man, let's go.
How was it when you initially started to right now?

(06:11):
Then I kind of want to start transitioning to your conference
that you started last year than what you're continuing also?
Absolutely. So I mean, as with anything new
in the fire service, there's always going to be a little
pushback. You know, the old heads.
And like I've said before, typically any new thing that you
want to introduce is a point of contention.
But for the most part, as I've said in other interviews we've
done, is that we had a lot of seeds.

(06:33):
You know, speaking back on what Travis was saying of people like
Michael Taylor and Chris Duncan and all these guys that inspired
us, they had kind of planted seeds in our area.
And there's pockets of, of, of firemen in places like DeSoto
County and Lafayette County where I work, Alcorn County, Lee
County, all in the north part ofthe state.
We actually had a pretty, prettygreat reception, you know, and
going back on some of the, the things the fools stand for, you

(06:55):
know, primarily what we were trying to do was find good men
and women, as they say, you know, every fool is a brother,
but not every brother is a fool.And it's that, that's what we
were looking for a primarily. So, you know, when we got
started, I, I called people I could trust, you know, I, I, I
got my friend Evan on board and Jerry on board and a couple of
other ones, Chris Duncan on board.
And we tried to honor our our people that mentored us and give

(07:18):
them, you know, trustee positions where they could help
mentor and guide us into the future.
But that's, that's really where the mission came from.
You know, Travis, he said, he said he liked what we had going
on, but that was very intentionally put together.
Like I said, we were looking forgood people.
And Travis is he's been a brother from day one.
I was more than happy that he came when he did.
It was just at the right time. A lot of people, you know, life
changes it it, it throws some things at you and not everyone

(07:41):
is available. I like to tell people who are
considering starting a new chapter, the most important
thing is not the most qualified people, It's people who you have
access to, people that have timefor it, people who are going to
make it a priority. So yeah, we got, we got going.
We're finally picking up some good steam.
We're hosting, you know, 3 or 4 events a year, smaller
trainings. Again, with this project, it

(08:01):
started last year out of necessity.
So, you know, with the fools, we're about taking care of
brothers. And we had a brother, Chris
Duncan. He's been a rock for all of us.
I mean, you could work 3 lifetimes and not have a leader
like that. I mean, he is just an absolute
stud in every sense of the word.He's a great leader.
He sets expectations and things like that.
But, you know, his wife had beengiven a a pretty bad cancer

(08:23):
diagnosis and she has made a lotof sacrifices for us by lending
him out to let him do the types of things that he's done to be
able to support us in the way that we need and to support our
community. So, you know, we were looking
for things to do. We say we've got this new thing.
What can we possibly do to get it going?
We started thinking, you know, we can have a raffle.

(08:43):
You know, a lot of people rafflefirearms over here.
We got a lot of hunting culture,a lot of shooting culture.
We thought about hosting a fish fry, you know, like a benefit.
And then we said, hey, I talked to Jerry, talked to a couple of
other guys. We'd hosted a training
conference out of Corinth already in years prior.
Why don't we, you know, get our own?
And you know, that was it shouldbe a goal in the future, but you

(09:04):
know, we let necessity drive us in that point in time.
You know, we put our nose to thegrindstone, kicked it into gear
and made hundreds of phone calls.
We made bag bars, stole whateverwe had to do.
And you know, by the grace of God, we were able to get a
pretty great fire conference puttogether in just four months
time. We we got hooked up with some
great sponsorship. A lot of our friends helped us

(09:26):
out. A lot of the instructors.
A big shout out to them. You know, Clay McGee, the guys
from Magic City, Chief Riley. We had a port city.
Anthony Rowette. He showed up.
Yeah. State Fire Academy.
Matt Hinkle, our friend. My mind's going 100 miles an
hour. If I forget anyone, I'm sorry.
But, you know, they they really did help us out.
And they came through in a time of need.

(09:47):
And it speaks to the brotherhood.
And you know what the fools stand for.
We were able to benefit from thereputation.
Sam's Parasola. Small town fools.
Hammond, LA The reputation that they'd already garnered amongst
the fire service, you know, lentitself to us in that situation.
And we were able to donate all the profits that we made out of
registration fees, T-shirt sales, raffle to everything

(10:10):
toward some some cancer treatment for Chris's wife.
And, you know, we decided this year we want to bring it back,
you know, keep the same spirit. We liked what happened.
We were able to sit back now andadjust and, and plan better and
not, you know, have just four months to plan.
No way of saying it, but. No, no, that was that was
perfect because I mean, I'm intrigued like you, you're a

(10:32):
very good storyteller. So it's it's we have the entire
history now of exactly why you guys started and then and where
you're transitioning into the future.
So when we when we talk about you guys existing and now
starting these conferences, whatkind of reaction are you getting
from your state, especially is this something that are there
first of all, are there other fools chapter in your state?

(10:54):
And then how do you guys communicate with them?
And then more importantly, how is the state supporting you when
it comes down to it? Are all the neighboring
jurisdictions are going man, hey, we won last year, we're
going to go again this year kindof kind of deal.
If you've even heard any of thatscuttlebutt yet around the
around your area. Well, you know, there is a a lot
of support from our state. It's it's spotty.

(11:15):
I'll be honest with you. I mean, there's no point in, you
know, making it to be something that's not, you know, like I
say, you're not quite a prophet in your hometown or I probably
butchered that quote. But you know, we've had a lot of
success. You know, our first training
that we did last spring, summer,we had kids driving from three
and four hours away coming to spend the night the night before
to get up to be able to come to our training.

(11:37):
It was very humbling to, to havethese people travel, you know,
the city of Madison, Ms. or Madison, the city, as they call
themselves. They sent, I think 6
firefighters last year. They they took us at our word
and, and really did us a great honor by sending just six new
firefighters to come train with us.
Wow, that's really good, DeSoto.County, I want to say that they
they make up probably what wouldyou say, Travis?

(11:59):
Probably 3/4 of our membership, probably.
About 3/4 I would say. So much and 1/2 and 3/4 but.
Yeah, it's a good amount. And we're 90 miles away.
Wow, The state's been pretty receptive.
Like I said, you know, by the grace of God, we've had had
really good mentors that have been placed in positions of
influence. And that's that's not because

(12:20):
they didn't earn it. You know, like we, we talked
about, you know, Matt Hinkle, he's now the director over
firemanship, which is a new, I don't know exactly what it's
called, but it's a new Bureau ofthe Mississippi State Fire
Academy. And they're able to push on the
type of things that we're movingtowards more practical tradesmen
style firefighting as opposed to, you know, four letter
organization firefighting, you know, the NFP as and all that

(12:43):
jazz. It's been pretty good.
It sounds like, honestly, it sounds like it's been freaking
awesome for you guys and especially having your
membership base being so sporadic through the state.
I think that's a good thing because like for us right now,
we have we're kind of the same because we're the only ones in
Arizona, kind of there's one farther north of us right now.

(13:05):
But with that said, we're, we're, we're almost talking
about like, should we all just be 1?
Like why would we have multiple chapters?
But that's something that we're trying to support them because
they're just getting up and going now and we've been going
for a little bit. So just trying to keep that
brotherhood alive also. But I like what you said about
the fools. It's like I always say the the
question should be like, why areyou not a fool's member?
You know, that's, that's really the question.

(13:27):
But and again, we, we know that we know the people that we
recruit or not really recruit. We know the people that we
desire. We know the people that come out
to us. But before we transition off on
the Fools, I really want to get to some fun firemanship,
especially in your region because we haven't had anybody
in your region on the show yet. Is there anything you want to
add about the fools before we kind of transition to on the job

(13:48):
stuff? Yeah, and I'm sorry, I'm I'm
what they call a non neurotypical human being.
I run on capturing and Adderall,but missed a minute ago you you
would ask me about whether or not, you know, we had other
chapters in our state. You know, we we've been very
blessed to kind of gain some traction, but you wouldn't think
it Mississippi. And honestly, that's that's one
thing I'll say of our state is that we're surprising.
You know, a lot of people have preconceived notions about what

(14:10):
we are. But you know, to tell you the
truth, we have 3 or 4 different firefighting styles in the state
of Mississippi. So we have North Mississippi, we
share northeast and northwest. There's Mississippi mayhem fools
in the northwest corner. That's more of our Delta region.
We've now got six O 1 fools, which is Central Mississippi.
And that's the kind of out of the Jackson State capital area.

(14:31):
That's our urban Center for the state.
And we've got Mississippi. It's the, I don't want to get it
wrong, Magnolia, coastal Magnolia fools on the
Mississippi Gulf Coast now. And that's all within a year's
time when we when we pushed off in December 2023, we were the
only active chapter there is 1 chapter that's went defunct in

(14:51):
the Mississippi Delta. We haven't heard much out of
them, but you know, I would hopeto get them on the line in the
future. But we do, we do have some some
support now across the state that's.
Dude, that's awesome. And it and it is surprising
because I always refer back to like the states with a lot of
chapters, Jersey, New York, stuff like that.
But it's like, you know, I, I think Jersey's got like 10 or 11

(15:14):
freaking chapters. But yeah, I would, I would
imagine you guys would have one,maybe 2, you know, And so I, I,
I guess it's showing the need across the nation, honestly,
because we're new. We started right around the same
time you guys started. And I kind of feel like the more
fools chapter members I meet, it's becoming a new norm.
Like, hey, did we started in 2021-2022, 2023 basically like

(15:38):
their region how lacks after Covic, basically, you know, it's
like, hey, someone lacks quicker.
They started back quicker. But I I feel like it's because
it's the desire that us, I say us is in just the American fire
service as a whole or this new information or more information
because and we've talked about amillion times.

(15:59):
I really want to hear your guys opinion on it.
Old school mentality. You know, it's keep your mouth
fucking shut. Do what I tell you to do, kid,
and that's it. And there's no why, there's no
questioning. Obviously today's day is
completely different for goods and bads.
But with that said, you know, weall we have to know the why now.
But I'm wondering if you're seeing a transition in your
guys's departments, because withus, I'd say over the last five

(16:22):
years there's been a complete transition where it wasn't.
We used to have the guys that would say this, we do it this
way or this way because that's the way we always do it.
Now about five years ago, finally with all these new
modalities being accepted, like guys actually willing to say,
hey, let's what, what don't we actually know?
Let's try it out. Holy cow.
It's easier or it's more efficient or it's faster,

(16:45):
whatever the case might be. And then what?
I I hear we're having a very good cultural shift or how are
you guys experienced that or is that not even on the radar yet?
Yeah, I'm, I've actually got a little bit of AI guess a
testimonial if you will on that.Like I, I agree with you fully.
I'm seeing a huge shift with that.

(17:07):
Just speaking back to our our chapter and having a lot of guys
out at DeSoto. I I've been I haven't even been
at South Haven quite a year now.I fell in with a super good
group of guys. We're at a busy station.
I'm on a truck out there, but immediately just in passing and
mentioning what we have going onwith old South, my Lieutenant

(17:28):
and then my driver who's actually rides out of rank
Lieutenant for me a lot we're like what what's this you got
going on? What do you have going on?
And they that, you know, they were like, well, I want to go.
So they've showed up to a ton ofart as a Lieutenant, that ranked
Lieutenant. They've showed up to a ton of

(17:48):
our events. Now one of them we ended up
being like, hey, we need you to instruct.
But you know, they humbled themselves to be like, OK,
where's this new firefighter? But I want to see what is what
he has going on with this and show up and, you know, be
students of the game and be ableto humble themselves about.
I want there's more for me to learn.
I don't know anything and I, I'mseeing a huge shift with that

(18:10):
with all across the board, at least where I've dealt with it,
Jacob. Yeah, he's absolutely right.
And and that's part of it. As you know, as I said earlier,
it's about facilitating. And, you know, it's one of those
things, if, if not me, then who?You know, I mean, I know I'm
young in the game, but I've madea habit of trying to position

(18:31):
myself under people smarter thanme.
I'm literally, there's an old quote that I love.
It says that I'm the combined effort of everyone I've ever
known. And that's really what I can say
about it. But you know, people have been
very receptive. There've been a lot of people,
I've said it before, you know, people want to bang their head
against the wall because, you know, the saying is once you
know better, you do better. But there's a lot of people that

(18:53):
know better that aren't being able to affect any type of
change. And don't get me wrong, you
know, all the old heads, they probably think that we're trying
to come in and burn the house down and start over.
But, you know, like one of my favorite says Hank Williams,
junior, he says, you know, we like some of the old stuff and
some of the new, you know, the Mississippi Fire Service, when I
started, I had a very salty captain smoke diver named Ty

(19:13):
Weatherby at Moonwood Fire Department.
And man, he, he ground me down. But he, you know, he could, he
cooked it out of my blood. You know, we spent a lot of time
in, in the Heathouse, you know, he got me ready.
And you know, there's aspects toit that you know, we need to
keep. And that's part of preserving
the tradition. You know, we're, we're, we need
to be strong. We need to be, we need to be

(19:34):
smart, we need to be well trained, practice, condition,
all these things. But you know, we don't need to
be scared to implement change. Like I said, when you know
better, you're able to do better.
But our objective is, is not to tell someone, you know, we want
to do it this way. This is the way we want to
provide them with as much information as we can so that
they can make data-driven decisions.

(19:57):
Look at the numbers. You know, if you don't believe
me, let's get out on the pad. Let's let's try this new hose
load. Let's, you know, try this new
search technique. And sometimes it hits, sometimes
it doesn't. But you know, we're gaining
enough traction and like Travis said, there's enough people that
are engaging with us. That are willing to to pitch in
and to listen and it's really humbling.
I, I feel, I feel exactly what you guys are saying right now.

(20:20):
And the, the crazy thing about it is we're going through, we,
we go through all the same transitions.
You know, it's, it's like the between the culture and
everything else, but it's, it's even though we're far enough
apart, it's it's pretty much identical from what I'm hearing.
And we are having this shift in the culture where the guys want
to know more and they want to train and they want to have a

(20:40):
bunch of different things. And I like our preach down here
has been lately and I hope it hits home.
It makes sense to us. But we're like saying, hey, I'm
not trying to eliminate anythingyou've been taught in the fire
service at all. I want to teach you one or two
additional ways to do exactly what you already know how to do.

(21:01):
And then when you get that call,I want to empower you either in
that right front seat or that back step or wherever you are,
you know, to make an educated decision for what you're coming
across that day, that time, thatscene, that house, that step
back, that time of the year, right?
Because there's never always andnever with us.
It's always great. So it's like, I want to give you

(21:22):
20 different options for one single call and then let you
empower you to make the decisionyou feel like it's correct.
And guess what? If you're wrong, we learned
something and we'll talk about it.
We'll do a tail boarding talk, right?
If you're right, guess what? Yeah, pounding back.
Good freaking job, bro. And like, and everyone's better
for it. But the crazy thing to me, that
makes sense. But I still we still get

(21:44):
kickback of well, I don't understand if the old way works
then why even entertain a new way?
Even though we showed them it was quicker, more efficient.
It's, it's just odd to me, but pros, I feel you.
You know, it's, it's, it's the same mentality.
So does that guy does that kind of resonate with your guys's
culture right now too on I'm, I'm a big fan of not eliminating

(22:06):
anything like, you know, vertical ventilation.
Huge topic across the United States right now for us in my
region is tile roofs. Do we ventilate or not ventilate
on tile roof because the additional weight my argument
is, is I don't want to tell any of my guys you cannot do
something. I want to say, do you have the
freaking personnel, the PPE and the training to do it?

(22:28):
If the answer is yes to all three, go.
Like you don't need to even ask.Just go and go to work.
But that's what confuses me whenit comes down to like, why
there's even pushback about these new techniques or cultures
or whatever, I don't know. Yeah, I think the way I approach
it a lot of the time you'll, a lot of people, you know, the

(22:50):
level 1 and 2 stuff, people wantto hate on it or whatever.
And, you know, just just the wayI try to approach it, especially
with what we're doing. And we're getting a lot of young
guys and they come in and they say, hey, well, yeah, but you
know, the Academy showed us thisway or the book told us this
way. And my thing, it is like, it's

(23:11):
just like any other profession. It it's not wrong.
We have to build a framework. We, we can't take.
There are some things that can be taught right straight out the
gate. We don't want to create training
scholars with bad techniques, but you got to lay a framework
for people straight off the graph.
And the fire service isn't meantto be.
We get level 1 and 2 and it stops there.

(23:34):
And that's the tactics we continue in the tactics that an
MLB hitter and the way that he hits isn't going to be the same.
You're taught Little League, youknow, and we we need to take
that framework we have. And then that's where
firemanship comes in and bridgesthat gap to continually learn

(23:56):
and continually figure out what is the best way to do this.
Level 1-2 is just, it's just a framework.
And then, you know, what we're doing is trying to transition
these people into that next level of being a, a true, I've
seen your back step guy. I got you now a question I have
for both you guys real. Oh, I'm sorry, Jake, go ahead.

(24:17):
Do you have something? Well, I was just going to say,
you know, I, I think a huge benefit could be had from just
considering where it's coming from.
You know, as I had a conversation, one of my good
friends earlier, Mike Goldstein,we had a conversation earlier.
You know, I made the statement that, you know, from the time
you slip your boots on for the first time, I think most
schedules hold true to this. You will spend 1/3 of all your

(24:39):
life with your crew. You know the 1/3 of all of it,
not 1/3 of you know, this side and the other, but literally
every 3rd day, you know, two on four off.
But this is your family. You know, these are the people
that are going to have your backand some of your darkest times.
You know, these are your friends.
These are the people that you can talk to about work that you

(25:01):
know when you can't talk about it at home, you're driving your
wife crazy. You can call your friend.
But hey, what do you think aboutthis?
But you know, if you consider from that and we're not pushing
change for the sake of change, we're wanting to do better.
I want all my friends to be rockstars.
I want all my my rookies I have under me coming in to be rock
stars because that makes us lookgood.
It's pride, it's care, it's mentoring.
No, it's more than just a job. And when we look at that, you

(25:23):
know, we need to push it from that aspect is is, you know, we
should want to do better for theright reason, You know, speak to
the heart of the job, which is helping people.
Yeah, and like you said, why, why do we, we always say, hey,
we getting a job, we want to help people, but we never talk
about the brothers like they're the and just like you said and
and we I say it all the time, I mean literally what you said, I

(25:44):
said if you don't work an hour of overtime, you're going to
spend 1/3 of your life with these boys, right.
That's it here in the end. That is exactly why they are
second family. But we also teach them to like
listen, say yes more than they say no things like that for your
department stuff along along those lines.
But this is also the only profession that can actually

(26:05):
replace your family. And that's not a good thing,
obviously, because, and we all know there's guys that work a
ton over time because it seems like a really good idea or
whatever. Then before you know it, you
never see your old lady anymore.You never see your kids anymore.
And yeah, you have a ton of money, but now she just left you
and took half of it. So what was, what was the reason
for any of that? You know, it's, it sucks.
It's a, it's a balance. You got to literally balance

(26:26):
like your, your kids and your step kids, you know, like, you
know, your family's your kids and then your step kids are the,
the boys to work. But yeah, it's, it's still the
best job in the world. I mean, it's the, it's the only
place you can have adult sleepovers, you know, and it's
not weird. So.
And you know you can. Be weird if you are too.
You've been, you've been a lot of work too.
I mean, you know, it's, it's, you know, I, we always catch

(26:47):
that stigma. It's like, man, you don't get
paid anything. And you know, and, and you know,
I don't want my kids to look at me like a bomb.
I don't want my wife to look at me like a bomb.
You know, I, I want her to see that my heart is in this line of
work. You know, I want to legitimize
firemanship as a way of life, you know, something that we can
all be proud of. You know, every dad wants their

(27:08):
kids, you know, to be admired bytheir children and to be admired
by their wife or, you know, females doing it.
They want to be admired by theirspouse as well and their kids.
But that's that's an important part of it, You know, staying in
this, you know, committed to it being as you say, you are not as
you seen, you know, so that that's a big, big reason why we
stay motivated to put as much work into this as we do is

(27:30):
because we can have that. You know, it may not be the
same. Of course we, we're not going to
make up for 100 and 5200 years of culture like Boston or FD and
Y or some of these other departments, Baltimore.
But you know, we can have something nice and we can do
better than what we've been doing for each other and for our
families. Well, well, smoking, brother.
Well, smoking. Yeah.
Mike Goldstein, the man the Can Report great freaking podcast.

(27:52):
He's always linked on the bottomover here.
Yeah, good, solid fireman all the way around.
And again, another dude that's nowhere close to you guys.
Right. And then that's one of the best
things I think about this profession is the firemanship
and the immediate connection. No matter.
Like, we have never met in person ever, right?
And we're brothers. That's just how it is.
It's because of this job and more importantly, I believe it's

(28:15):
because of the love and passion for this calling and this job.
That's, that's what brings us soclose, more than I think any
other thing out there, more thanthe military, more than the
police. Again, my personal opinion, but
that's strongly what I believe. We did have the pleasure of
hanging out. We actually met Mike Jacob, did
a lot of networking at Fools International last year, met

(28:37):
Rusty and the New England Fools guys and they invited.
Rusty Record. Yeah, we, so we actually got to
go out about New England, New England training summit in
Maine. And that's when we, we, we
caught up with Mike and instantly hit it off with him.
Great. Guy so much they're they're

(28:58):
fantastic and you know that's that's you know we we hit on it,
but you know I think we could doa lot better if we focus on the
things we have in common. There's any amount of stuff that
could make us just absolutely hate each other roll our eyes at
each other. You know, some Hick from
Mississippi talking to talking to people from New England,
talking to, you know, transplants from from Maryland
out to, you know, Arizona. Yeah, the fools.

(29:22):
It's been a great experience andit's, it's been really eye
opening. You know, you, you, I've said it
before, but, you know, just watching these guys on YouTube
and like, hey, who is that? And they're like, oh, that's,
you know, that's him. Wow.
You know, but they've been very kind to us.
You know, they brought us up to their conference this March and
we got to meet some of our heroes, you know, just off the

(29:44):
top of my head, you know, getting to see Paul Combs in
person live and in living color and chop it up with him.
That's cool. Was an experience.
You know, it's neat. It's definitely neat for us
Mississippi kids. You know, we don't get a lot of
opportunities. You know, we're not we're not
just walking around with holes in our shoes and wearing
overalls all day like people think.
But you know, that there is sometruth in some of the serial
type. But it was nice to, it was nice

(30:06):
to have some friends in high places with this organization
that looked to take care of us and speaking, you know, to the
entire organization. They're very invested in
watching Mississippi come online.
And that's that's very close to my heart and I appreciate them
for that. I love it.
It sounds like it sounds like you guys are surrounded by the
love and passion for the job. So it's it's just it's it's

(30:29):
amazing to hear. So how to transition from the
fools just to talk a little bit about the job for a minute.
So you guys work in the same state, but different fire
departments used to be together.So I'm just curious.
So Travis, let's start with you.So if you get put out for your
bread and butter, your 95% aggressive interior attack on
the House fire kind of deal, how's that dispatch in there you

(30:51):
work? What do you get?
And then how do you guys kind ofrun the call?
Is it like predetermined runningassignments?
Is it like an IC1 names model? Just kind of breakdown how you
guys run the box, whatever you call it, right?
And just entertain us so we can figure out how Mississippi rolls
out, too. Yeah.
So like Jacob was saying, we have a lot of very different

(31:14):
styles of firefighting in the state.
The way we operate is going to be very different from like the
way a lot of places operate. We run, we've got 5 stations, 5
engines, two true truck companies and then we run 5
ambulances, Firebase EMS, but they're staffed with single
world medics and EMT's. But I don't know, I don't think

(31:37):
we're running off of technicallyany type of like Blue Card or
NIMS model. We have our districts and then
we have our response area and then our first dues for one
alarm, 2 alarm or three alarm. I think, but bread and butter
you're going to get a 31 we're going to get 2 engine companies
and a truck company and then ouran ambulance, one of our

(32:00):
ambulances will respond and be outside.
Yeah. So typically we we just had one
recently I was working on. I was actually I typically run
I'm on a truck company of assigned to truck one kind of in
the hood, but I was actually working at an out station on our
engine too. We so we had two engine and one
truck response. We got there, we stretched lines

(32:22):
for us door and then our while we were stretching lines, our
first do was the same as our truck company.
Our truck company went ahead search the head of our hose
line. We stretched.
It was actually it was a small 3bed, 1 bath apartment stretch up
the stairwell. Our truck company actually found

(32:43):
the fire room first because theywere searching ahead of us and
put it out, you know, got it extinguished.
They finished their primary. But and that that's pretty
typical of what you're going to get on a three one.
We're going to get A2 engine 1 truck response.
Typically truck is good if you know if it Dick if conditions
dictate it, we're going to go ahead and like off my truck

(33:06):
company. We're going to go ahead and
start a primary. We know our roles.
We will if, if we haven't, if it's big enough fire, we'll roll
the second truck company. But if we finish our primary or
if we have another engine company that we can send in to
search without a hose line, we'll and we need to, we'll go
ahead and vent. So we, we operate as true engine

(33:28):
and truck companies. We have a great truck culture
and engine culture especially for the state.
And we typically are staffed, fully staffed with four or five
main engine companies, 4 main truck companies.
But yeah, we, we're very rare inthe state for that.
And that's kind of what I'm trying to bring to the table.
Just as far as the fools go, I'mable to kind of bring a little

(33:49):
bit of that true engine and truck called culture to what
we're doing. Now, do you have, do you have a
battalion that responds on the initial box assignment or no?
Correct. Yeah.
So we actually we just opened upour fifth station to start our
plans for 1/6 station and we were on 2 battalions.
We just added another battalion.So our our three house is

(34:11):
actually split when it comes to battalion between our engine and
our truck company out of there. So one battalion covers the
truck and then 1-2 and three andthen only battalion covers
engine of three and then stationfour and five all.
Right. So the the other question I had
for you, for you travel is so I love hearing the aggressive

(34:33):
truck work. I mean, I'm a I'm a truckie
through and through, so that just I love it.
Freaking gets me hard on every freaking time.
But so you talked about searching ahead of the hose
line. Awesome.
I'm sure you guys do probably a lot of Cam work.
Do you do you do searches through windows also?
So are you like a venting or search isolate company or is
that not? Is that a nuance in in your

(34:54):
region? So our truck boss and so our our
Lieutenant get a good amount of liberty.
Our battalions don't really micromanage.
So there are, there may be lieutenants that aren't going to
send a team in to veneer search.My company does, you know, if,

(35:14):
if conditions dictate and we need to do AVS, we will, if
we're able to just go ahead and search ahead of the hose line
and do a full primary, but bad conditions and searchable space.
I can especially speak for my crew.
We're we're going to visit or isolate search and we'll, we
will search a little bit past that that that door.

(35:37):
If conditions like this. I'm lucky enough, I'm on a I'm
an awesome crew. All my guys are super
aggressive, yeah, but 100%. Cool dude, I love it.
So all right, same question, Jake, your bread and butter,
three in one. What do you get?
How do you guys operate? And then the second-half of that
question, I even get a chance tobecause Travis is a man and

(35:59):
started already talking about truck culture.
That was going to be the next question, like what's the truck
culture and then what's your search culture?
So if you can kind of Travis's answer was perfect.
So I won't give any pressure to you to be better, but you might
be worse. So I would love to hear it
though. It's an it's an interesting
answer. So most of rural Mississippi,

(36:20):
you know, we take an all hands approach.
Just speaking at my first apt I started at we're sending every
rig we have. We had, I want to say 8 or 9
personnel for the entire city. When I started station one, we
had a quint, we had a rescue there.
We had our battalion typically is going to be driving the
quint. The rookie is going to be on the

(36:40):
on the quint with them. The captain typically is going
to take the rescue. Station 2 is is a two man
station. It's going to be a your officer,
your station officer's, your driver at this department.
So it's going to be him and his firefighter.
And then station 3 has got a engine there and they also have
a county rig. So depending on whether or not

(37:00):
the the firefighter staff to thecounty rig is out, you know,
working a job in the, in the rural part of the county, kind
of a mutual aid thing that they have going on, you could have
two or you could have three on that engine.
So a lot of the time, you know, like say we get a structure
fire, you know, we've got all hands there.
If you're first due, you know, obviously you're going to,
you're going to set up, you're going to pull the line, you're

(37:21):
going to get the truck in the pump, you're going to, you know,
go ahead and check the door, seeif you can make entry.
If you can't pop the door, get ready and you're waiting a lot
of times to even make fire attack until second dude gets
there with another firefighter on that rig to team up and you
kind of combine and go ahead andmake the the fire attack.
Now we are we've got an interesting concept we're kind

(37:43):
of working on trying to you knowwhat we always say we're squad
by default. By and large, Mississippi, you
don't get the luxury of being a truck.
You're being an engine guy. You have to know how to do
anything at any given time, whether it's auto extrication,
whether it's a being suppression, doing truck work,
throwing a ladder, doing the BES, doing a primary search,

(38:03):
popping the door, it's just bam,bam, bam, bam, bam.
And with that low staffing, you know, we don't even typically
get the luxury of having a rib tan.
Because if you think about it, you know, you've got to, you've
got to account for, you've got one officer that's got to be IC.
It's typically your battalion. And unless the chief shows up
and they don't always show up, then you've got to account for,
OK, I've got to have somebody man in the pump.

(38:24):
So what you're looking at is typically 6 people, you know,
working an entire fire scene. We don't get this, you know,
large swath of dispatch, like a lot of urban areas, they are
better staffed areas. So I mean, it's one of the
things I like to say that Mississippi does actually have
to offer the fire service is, you know, we have to by
necessity be more well-rounded firemen and be ready to do

(38:45):
anything at a moment. So notice it's like a living,
breathing C pad. You know, you're one thing to
the next to the next. You know, our truck culture and
engine culture are so meshed together and you know, a lot of
our primary searches are done off of the hose line.
And that's that's not something I typically just me personally,
like I said, it doesn't represent the view of anybody I
work for even part time. But you know, like any parks and

(39:07):
parks and rec fans out there, you know the guy, he says don't
half ass two things, whole ass one thing.
I'm big four. I'm very approached truck
culture. You know, the the search is the
job. You know, we're looking for
life, you know, we're in there trying to occupy searchable
space and find victims and let the fire suppression team do
their job. But a lot of times, you know, we
don't have the luxury. So, you know, we're we're very

(39:28):
adaptive in the way that we approach things.
And that's something, you know, you can, you can take these
things, these two D thoughts andkind of amp them up a little
bit, You know, work like a pit crew.
Like when this guy's doing this,you know, Hey, I'm waiting out
here in the yard, you know, yourthird team.
So you've got search in one, youknow, one corner of the house
and you've got fire suppression in the other corner of the
house. Somebody's going to come out and

(39:48):
whoever's tired first is usuallythe ones that come out and
you're in there replacing them. So, you know, you can be
pulling, pulling bottles out, getting ready to do bottle
Swatch. You can be throwing ladders, you
know, making multiple points of egress if needed.
But that's, that's kind of the thing we're we're trying to
establish is, is get more forward thinking, think 2 steps
ahead, you know, to get keep it kind of rolling.
You know, like I said, we don't have the.

(40:09):
Luxury of having all that support or all the resources,
especially personnel wise, but we we had no choice.
The public expects the exact same thing they do from Travis
as they do me or even you. You know, they don't, they don't
think about that. You know, they want SEAL Team 6
come dropping out of the sky coming to save them a bunch of
GI Joe Ninja Warrior type guys just but you know, we don't

(40:31):
always have the luxury of havingthose resources.
That's typically, I would say most of Mississippi.
It's all hands approach. Now.
The department that I work for now is the combination
department. I'm I'm kind of learning how
that works getting into rural firefighting.
You know, we, we have two full time stations and we have a
couple of other stations that westaff with part time personnel.
But you never know who's going to show up there.

(40:53):
Sometimes it's nobody, sometimesit's, you know, everybody.
You know, relay pumping is a bigdeal where we are.
It's it's yeah, we're having to do more with less.
Is there is there any area or I shouldn't say any area is there
any department within your guys?This is general area.
That's still all volunteers, it all combination now in in.
Your guys, I would say it's 70% of our state is volunteer and

(41:17):
that that's a huge part of our mission and our training events.
Yeah, a huge, I would say a lot of our membership is volunteer.
A lot of we do have a lot of combination departments.
But yeah, mid city super roll it.
I would say we're probably 7070%volunteers as far as the
departments go. Like it's, it's nothing for

(41:38):
career departments to be 30 to 60 miles apart from each other
to the next career department. There's there's not a lot just
across. If you go the width of the top
of our state from where Jacob isto where I am, which is the
whole width of the state, there's probably, I would say
maybe, maybe five career departments, not even I think 3.

(42:03):
Typically the way it works is wehave what we call a county seat.
Basically if you're, if you're looking at a county, basically
the city in the middle of it, that's your city.
That's going to be your career agency and everything in between
is going to be volunteer territory.
Typically. Now, places like DeSoto County,
which is like he said is a suburb of Memphis, you know,
they're more industrialized. They need better Fire
Protection. They have a lot higher

(42:24):
population, a lot of more need there.
They have two or three agencies.So I can say, you know, Prentice
County, where I'm from has 1, Alcorn County has 1, Lee County
has two, Pontotoc has 1, Lafayette County has two.
And then I know I'm missing a couple here and there, but it's,
it's typically one or two is allwe get.

(42:44):
And there's no real mutual aid going on.
You know, like we were talking about the, about Evan getting
the, the special operations response team and Alcorn County
getting set up. That's a big deal.
Amazing thing he's doing. We're able to, we've got a lot
of the Sharper volunteers and some of the career guys have
come together and anytime that there is a structure fire within

(43:07):
the county or a technical rescueOSAR or anything like that,
we're able to back them up and kind of cover, cover some of the
bases so to speak, so. OK.
Yeah. So that's a that's a huge part
of what we're doing. To kind of elaborate more on the
volunteers. These guys are working, you
know, these are blue collar guystry, try to pay their bills.

(43:29):
They're working 5-12 hour days in a factory or in a trade.
These guys don't have the luxuryof packing up and going to FDIC
on their own dime. Or they're trying to put food on
the table or go into, you know, you name it, conference.
They, they can't do it. They don't, they don't have the

(43:50):
time, understandably so, and they don't have their their
department's just not going to send them are super lucky.
Our departments are very good about helping us with outside
training and allowing us to go. But we, we feel like we'd be
doing our state and our area disservice if we're going in and

(44:11):
taking this information in and not bringing it back to these
organizations and these volunteer or small career
departments that and guys that aren't able to go get this
information that that's a huge part of what we're doing is, is
trying to bring low cost, easilyaccessible training to our area.

(44:31):
Absolutely. It's, it's tough.
One of the things about Mississippi is pay disparity
between the north northeast corner and northwest corner.
You know, I commute two hours from where I live to, to make
what I make to, to pay my bills.But you know, you have to have
two jobs in most parts of our state.
It you have to, there's no way around it.

(44:52):
You know, you're working for literally like 2027 thousand a
year, 30,000 a year. You know, 50 a year is
considered good pay in the stateof Mississippi and going up from
there. But you know, I, I love my job
and you know, I love these departments I work for and I, I
don't hold any of the guys. There's no resentment toward any
of the guys I've worked with or the cities I work for.

(45:13):
It's just, you know, for the most part, it's just not
feasible to pay firemen what we'd like to be paid.
Most of us would love to not have to have a second job.
Most of us would. That's just kind of the culture
here. You know, we're, we're working
men that believe in taking care of our family.
But, and it's tough. It is like very, very tough to
make in some of these places. So we want to be able to give

(45:35):
them an opportunity to experience some of the things
that we do. Our big thing that we say is
being able to make a play, you know, there's no reason, you
know, you're not gonna be an AllStar all the time, you know,
especially if you don't have thetime to give, if you don't have
the resources, you know, a door prop to train on.
But we want to be able to at least give something to our
volunteers that they can put in their pocket.

(45:55):
But to save a life. I mean, you know, our, our, our
communities deserve that. Our state deserves that.
But that's something that's close to our hardest training of
our volunteers, supporting them.And, and in turn, you know,
we're, we're building a, a network and, and something
that'll will give back to everyone.
That's awesome. What a what a good freaking
solid group of guys you are. I mean, you're doing it for all
the right reasons for the American fire service in your

(46:17):
freaking region. And like I said, and you're
doing it because that it's a need and it's what you guys want
and it's the right freaking thing to do.
So freaking kudos to what you guys are doing.
I'm freaking super stoked to be any part of anything you guys
are ever involved in. But just before we start
wrapping into the question, stand out the season we've been
going for about an hour. Is there anything either you

(46:39):
guys want to add before we startwrapping it down?
Jacob, you want to kind of like pitch or upcoming conference and
kind of speak on that a little bit.
We would like to throw that put out there, bring some awareness
to a conference in October. Yeah, to anybody watching, you
know, we've worked very hard to put this together and we want to
create a good experience, you know, and hit all the good
aspects about it, you know, quality lecture, intense,

(47:00):
intentional hands on training. You know, we're, we're working
to provide a product that is beneficial.
That's not like anything anyone else offers.
We're working on getting good entertainment to have a good
time. And it's always food's great in
Mississippi, you know, but that's part of it too.
We are trying to create a, you know, just a full, full spectrum
experience for everyone. Have a good raffle, have good

(47:21):
vendors, set up brotherhood events.
But you know, this year our conference is set up to benefit
Saint Jude Children's Research Hospital.
And for those of you that are watching that are not familiar
with the work that they do, theyprovide health care for, for
children facing, you know, very,very serious illnesses.

(47:42):
Sorry, that sounded sill, I justhad a stutter there, but I'm
facing, facing very serious illnesses.
And they provide that to them free of charge, regardless of,
of their ability to pay. And that's something that's very
close to our heart. Obviously Travis's wife, Anna,
she works there. But we want to pay it forward.
So basically by coming to this event, we're going to take all,
all of the funds that we raised from registration, T-shirt sales

(48:03):
and, and raffle tickets and all those things and pay that
forward, 100% of it. We rely on sponsorships to cover
our overhead costs. You know, we, we work really
hard to secure those and you know, it's going to be a great
time. And for those of you who don't
already know, Steve's coming to join us.
He's going to help us out with alecture in our hands on
training. We're looking very, very forward
to this, this event. Am I missing anything Travis?

(48:24):
No, I think that's it. We got Steve coming and then
like I said, Mike Goldstein's gonna be helping lecture your
hands on Chief Clive Gordon. And then we've got the some of
the guys from Ambassadors of theCrafts, more Westy guys close to
you we got. Collins.
And then and then his buddy Jay Fulmer of Ambassador of the

(48:46):
Craft and then Mandy Rajas and then some and some more guys
from rural fire tax. We're we're bringing guys from
all around. It's going to be a wide range of
topics and yeah, it's going to be top notch.
And then I think I'm pretty excited about our evening social
events. I think they're going to be
second to none. I think if anybody comes, they

(49:08):
should at least come for that. It's going to be a blast.
But yeah, if there's anyone out there watching this that has a
brand or a product they want to push and we'll we'll make room
to put you a table out. Like that's something that we
stand very strongly with. We support, you know, firemen
owned businesses and ventures that support our craft and
there's room for everybody. And if you want to pitch in to
support us, like I said, we get the conference covered.
Everything north of that is straight to the kids.

(49:31):
Raffle items. Craft a lot of yeah, that that's
a big one too. Yeah.
It's going to be a great time. If you're praying side, just
pray for us and the work that we're doing here.
It's turning to something big. I'm very, very proud of it.
Yeah, it sure is. Well, you guys are like said,
you're doing, you're doing the good work in Mississippi right
now. I mean, I'm incredibly impressed
on what you guys have accomplished in such a short

(49:53):
period of time and it's inspirational.
So just keep up the freaking hard work, man.
And you guys are, they're doing the right thing for the right
reason and good things are coming your way.
It's already you're already seeing an Yeah, so I'm
privileged to be part of that. So I appreciate you guys more
than you know, but yeah, let's let's wrap into it.
So let's get into. I love this question, the why.

(50:14):
So it's just a little bit more about you all, but it's the why.
So why did you guys join the American Fire Service?
Was this something you want to do as a kid?
Did you get bit by the bug? I mean, what it really what what
what it was. So, Jake, let's start with you,
brother. Why?
Why become a fireman in your area?
Man, I took the long way around,you know, 2018, I was, let's

(50:35):
see, 202526. You know, I did a bridge stint
in the military. I'd been a Boy Scout when I was
a kid, went to school pursuing adegree in criminal justice,
Homeland Security, emphasis. You know, I knew I wanted to
help people, but you know, taking some time off and worked
in corrections for a while and Iwas actually going to turn in

(50:57):
y'all can laugh if you want my application for trooper school
the day that the Fire Chief called me in my hometown.
But no. And I truly believe that that
was my calling. And you know, that was God
reaching down and kind of nudging me in the way that he
knows that would make my heart happy.
And that's my wife is no other no other work in the world is
like this. I know that every every night
that I laid my head down. I know that if I've done

(51:19):
anything, it's something to helpsomebody.
You know, there's no ulterior motive behind it other than
goodwill. It's something that hits all the
aspects for me, keeps me, you know, physically straight, keeps
me fit. It's good for me spiritually.
You know, I truly believe that the fire service is the Lord's
work. I know the Lord, he's very

(51:41):
blessed me with, with, you know,the ability to do this line of
work and being rooted in faith is, is something I recommend to
everyone. You know, I'm not saying you
have to do it like me, but you know, there's power and prayer.
It definitely changes things. And when you know what you're
know what you're doing and why you're doing it, it helps out a
lot too. But that's, that's basically not
why I always admired the fire service as a kid, but you know,

(52:02):
never in a million years I thinkI'd be doing it.
But now that I am, I can imaginedoing anything else.
I love it. All right, Travis, you're up
brother all. Right.
So my life kind of changed, but so initially I I don't have any
family in the fire service. I had some good friends and kind
of started the fire service. I was kind of just a shit head
kid. Skateboarding, drinking, chasing

(52:25):
women, whatever I can get whatever I can get a ride,
motorcycles, dirt bikes, whatever I can get a little
little thrill from graduate highschool kind of bounced around a
little bit, just do it out. And then job got got into
personal training. The gym I worked at shut down,
so I called my buddy. I was like, hey, I have a job.

(52:45):
He's like, yeah, come do construction.
Hey, drywall, hung drywall for 12 hours a day, seven days a
week, six months. I was like, I can't do this
anymore, man. Not in the Mississippi humidity.
Like I was like, I just, I, I can't.
So when my boy, he was like, hey, man, put in an application
over here at the fire department.
I was like, oh, I don't, I've never been to fire school.
They're like, no, it's not like that.

(53:06):
You just got hired and they do it all.
So I went and put an applicationin.
I was like OK, whatever. They sent me a letter.
They're like come try this physical thing.
I was like OK, cool. Showed up.
They're like close toed shoes and long pants.
So I showed up in boots and jeans past C Pat.
They called me about a week later and hey, can you come take
a drug test? Took the drug test stuff.

(53:28):
They drove it. I was in the chiefs car, came
back. They start handing me clothes
and I'm like finally I'm like wait, does this mean I work here
Like. Fuck.
Yeah, you're hired. I was like, oh, OK, I guess I'm
doing this thing and but I ran that first call in a in a 10 ton

(53:51):
fire truck screaming down the road like there's nothing more
punk rock than that. I was like, I am hooked from
that day on. I was like it just just the
thrill of it. Just be honest.
I don't have a cool answer, but just the thrill of it.
But now my why has significantlychanged now being a dad and a

(54:12):
husband and just imagining what I would expect from another
fireman if my family was in a bad way and needed them, the the
standard that I would expect of myself and anyone else is just
dramatically changed of my why. Like I think about that daily.
It used to be like ego to some extent of can I be better than

(54:35):
the other guy as far as like whydid why do?
But now just like if it was my family, what would I expect of
myself? What level should I be at?
But yeah, sorry, we. Long waiting.
We didn't know what we were getting into, dude.
But I, yeah, that, that first time I took that CPAP, dude, I
thought it was just the stair stepper.
They're like, come on, I'm like,what do you mean?

(54:56):
Like you gotta do this? I'm like, oh shit.
But man, like I said, we didn't know what we were getting into.
No, it sounds like Travis got hired by accident if he if
you're being honest with. Him.
I think you're like, so so I work here now.
OK, cool. Like I'll figure it out.
Show him tomorrow. All right, So good job.

(55:18):
We know. That.
Yeah, right. It's like, hey, I got a T-shirt
and a ball cap. I'm in, right.
What? What else does a guy need?
Oh my God. So we we know the why.
I love the why's. So let's get into the next
question. Let's talk about traditions.
So this is one of my favorites. So we know why you got the fire
service. Now we know you guys are rooted

(55:38):
in traditions just because of being the Fools member alone.
So Jake, we'll start with you again.
So what's your favorite tradition either in the American
Fire service as a whole or maybesomething that's just per your
department. But the real the real question
is why? Why is that your favorite?
Me personally, you know, I've put a lot of thought into it,
but I'd have to say the probie culture.

(55:58):
I know that's a weird answer, but to me it's, it's something
really special if you do it the right way.
You know, you, you've got your little duckling that follows you
around at the fire department. So they're ready to do their
job. But it's always been something
fun to me. You know, you've got all the
opportunity in the world at yourfeet and you're able to invest
in them. Some things that you, you didn't
get to learn till three to five years in your career that they
get the chance to be better thanyou.

(56:20):
You're literally building your legacy.
Sometimes. That's always really special to
me. And, you know, we had a, a
tradition when I, when I, it's common among a lot of
Mississippi departments is you get your shield.
You know, a lot of times you don't have a frontal on your
helmet until you complete the fire Academy.
But being able to earn that, earn your place, you know, get
your, take your probie shirt offand put your, put your new shirt
on. It's, it's, it's special, but I

(56:42):
don't think that we need to, to take that lightly.
It's, it's something very important.
And you know, you're literally building the framework for what
your department's going to be inthe future by how how much you
put into it. Yeah, I love it and it's I think
it's AI think it's a great answer.
You know, the the entire probationary process because of
kind of how you wrapped it up atthe end.

(57:02):
Hey, it's it's your fire department, bro.
You know, like and it's true because you guys are going to be
gone before they're gone. So it's it's theirs.
You know, when we're gone, it's theirs.
So and see you brother. No, go ahead, Jake.
Oh no. Yeah, it's special, you know,
seeing them win and do well, butthat's all I had left.
Yeah, I don't, I don't know if mine is necessarily.

(57:25):
I don't know. It's considered a tradition, but
I guess my favorite tradition ofthe fire service is just
suffering together, whether it be a sucky workout, a sucky gear
trainer, or a sucky call like you're out there fighting.
We had a big like crush lot of cars, like 200 cars on fire.

(57:50):
We were out there for like for like 13 hours.
We're just just sucking it up and like, dude, there's, there's
no one that takes more pride in just getting being completely
screwed than the fire service. We will laugh about it.
Like dude, that suck. That's my favorite tradition.
Just like nothing brings you tighter, brings you closer than

(58:13):
those calls or those workouts where you're just suffering.
Yeah, you're absolutely right. You embrace the suck, you know,
right? You're I agree together.
You bring your welcome, all aspects, yeah.
Yeah, right. Exactly.
Yeah, we embrace the suck, and then we'll go get tacos at 3:00
AM together if we need to. Holy cow.
All right, so we know the why. We got their traditions.

(58:35):
So my favorite question. So if you could snap your
fingers and change something, the American Fire Service, what
would it be and why and why? I say no sweat equity, instant
gratification. But there's only one thing.
But what's the why? So, Jake, what would you change,
brother? Man, that's, that's probably the
toughest question of all, because there's, you know, if

(58:57):
you're around any Firehouse for too long, you'll hear 1000
answers by the time you leave, you know, man, just being able
to fix the, the culture thing. I mean, that's, that's the
battle we all fight. It's just, you know, getting
people to buy in, you know, and,and it's, it's a hard battle.
It's a, it's a daily, daily struggle, but I think that once

(59:21):
if the day comes and everybody finally figures it out and gets
it, gets it together, man, this thing will really, really
change. I agree.
Good answer, brother. What about you, Trev?
Probably the AAA. No, I'm just.
Kidding. Oh my God.
Yeah, thank you. That's a garbage load.
You guys still use? Hey, hey, it gets all the hoes
on the ground, OK? That's what matters.

(59:42):
It does anyway, no? No, that's not my real answer.
Is probably just which they're kind of go hand in hand, but
just the months and the egos like if you if you don't want to
live, eat, sleep, eat and breathe this job, so be it.
But get to the side man. Stay over there and be quiet.

(01:00:02):
If I would prefer everybody is all about it, but I there I
can't stand. Mutt, but the the only thing
worse than that is a loud mutt that while you're getting
better, while people are gettingbetter, they're over there
running their mouth. Well, what what if we get a
call? What if this what if this is

(01:00:23):
like I'm going to be a better shape tired after this year
workout than you are when you don't do them?
Yeah, that's my answer. Dude it's good and like I said,
I agree. Like physical fitness is huge.
I don't know. Well, I'm guessing, and please
correct me if I'm wrong, but I'mguessing the culture in your

(01:00:43):
guys's region is probably not very active when it comes down
to like the skillies and stuff like that.
Or is that am I completely wrong?
No, you're not wrong. It's just kind of cut down the
middle, like it's pretty far right left.
Like guys are either like hard chargers, go getters, they're

(01:01:03):
working out, they're in shape, they're whatever, or they're
slugs there. There's not a whole lot of
middle of the road from. Place to place obviously from.
Department, Department. OK, They're, they're, you know,
you still got the old school guys.
They're saying, oh, you don't need to be out here sweating and
stuff because when a call comes,you need to be able to respond.
It's like, brother, I don't knowwho told you that being lazy

(01:01:27):
makes you better at at being fit.
But like, that's just not how itworks.
You know, they won't let you work out on shift, lift weights.
They won't let you train in gear.
Man, you don't want to get me going on that one.
But yeah, you're right. It's split down the middle.
You know, that's something we'rewanting to work on because I
mean that that's rule #1 you can't replace fitness, you can't
replace strength. That was probably my biggest

(01:01:50):
culture shock and that's why I was really curious if I was, if
I kind of had a general idea forI was way off, but back east
like it was a running joke. I was in the best shape of my
life the day I graduated from the fire Academy.
It was a, it was a shameful joke, but it was just a joke.
We had yearly physicals, but nothing had to do with how
physically strong or capable or flexible you are.

(01:02:13):
When I came out here to Arizona,that was my biggest culture
shock because their culture hereis the exact opposite.
I'll tell you right now, across the entire state at about 8:30
in the morning, every single Firehouse is doing a skills
course in gear. It's just, but it's just part of
the culture here. Then I was shocked when I came
out. I'm like, what's wrong with

(01:02:34):
these guys? Like, like, but it's, it's a
good, it's a very good culture. Granted, there's a lot of things
that we have out here culturallythat I wish was like back East,
but it's that was my biggest shock.
And I was wondering how you guyssettled in.
But I could speak for pretty much the state of Maryland.
And it's it's not a priority. I mean, you could just look in

(01:02:54):
the news lately. We have a couple brothers out of
Baltimore City, two of them within a couple days medicals,
you know, on duty. And it's freaking sad, bro.
It's just, it's sad when the guys aren't held to some sort of
physical standard, not just for us, but for Mr. and Misses
Smith. But they expect, like you said,
Army Rangers steal, dive bombingwith scuba gear, everything

(01:03:16):
under the sun. That's what they expect from us.
You're exactly right. And I mean that that's a huge
blessing for you to be out therewhere they do that.
That's that, you know, that's a dream.
But, you know, like Jocko says, there's freedom and discipline.
It's a lot easier to to make those small incremental changes
every day and get into shape. And, you know, nobody likes to
do it at first. But, you know, it's like
running. It's like, how do you get better

(01:03:38):
at running? You run.
Yeah, and there's. Yeah, there's no secret sauce to
it. All right, boys.
Well, listen, while we're wrapping up here, please,
whoever wants to do it, plug your plug your website, plug
your Instagram, everything else,everything will be in the show
notes. But if anybody's listening, they
make it all the way to the end here.
Please tell them how they can reach out to you guys.
Emails, Instagram, whatever, whatever you guys prefer for

(01:04:00):
communication, especially for your upcoming conference in
October. Yeah, reach out on our socials
traps runs Instagram. I do the Facebook that's old S
fools, OLDSOUT HF0 0LS. I think it's all caps on both.
That's a good way to reach out to us.
You can find me on Facebook. Jacob K McVeigh.
Travis is on there too. Day or night, anytime.
We'll get back to you just as soon as we can.

(01:04:21):
But please, if you want to be a part of it, come be a part of
it. We'll make a way for you and
accommodate you as best we can. We'll feed you while you're
here. Travis, you got anything?
Yeah, man, that comes you know something Travis Bradshaw on
Facebook and Instagram. I'm pretty available all myself
public our own. I monitor our own S Instagram
hourly prom or when when life permits.

(01:04:43):
But so if you reach out there, if you got any questions about
the event or anything we're doing, if you want to be a part
of what we're doing, we'll make it happen.
We want people that want to be apart of this.
That's why when when you reachedout to us after seeing us on the
CAN report, I was like, look, Jacob, like I don't know this
guy. I don't know nothing about him.
Mike had great things to say about you.

(01:05:05):
And I was like, well, that's been our thing.
As far as the whole plan in thisconference is we want people who
want to be a part of what we're doing and believe in what we're
doing. So if anyone wants to be a part
of what we're doing, we're just facilitators.
Anyone that wants to be a part of that, reach out and we'll
make it. Happen that's great.
We're we're picking up quite theconvoy already, man, but this

(01:05:25):
journey's it's been very fun. We've been very blessed, made a
lot of new friends along the wayand many more to come.
Yeah, and I think that's the that's the biggest thing right
there, boys, like just making, making buddies down the road
and, you know, spreading the love and passing for the job and
the freaking firemanship. You know, like said, you guys
are freaking kicking ass right now.
I'm so excited to be part of it.I hope you guys absolutely

(01:05:46):
freaking explode. Like I said, it's the the best
thing in the world is to watch good dudes do good things and
that's exactly what 2 good dudesare doing freaking good things
right now. So thank you on behalf of our
region for what you guys are doing.
And please, if you guys need anything, reach out.
If you're ever out in our area, you're going to be guest
instructors one day. So we'll, we'll make something

(01:06:07):
happen for sure. Anytime also I do real quick I
want to shout out Evan a given to Jerry Worley.
That's our two of our other likereal playmakers.
I just want to make sure I shoutthem out because they're not
they're not the they're not the podcast and hop on here type
really they but I did want to shout them out because they're

(01:06:27):
doing just as much or more me and Jacob.
So I want to give them credit. Yeah.
No. Good.
Thank you, Travis. So far man, for sure all.
Right boys? Well, listen, thank you again
for your time especially I know you all are busy.
So thanks for sitting down and being on our show.
We really appreciate and I love spreading the word of the fools
and I mean, that's why we're here.
That's why you guys are there. So keep spreading the love

(01:06:49):
brothers and we'll talk soon. Thank you so much and we'll
catch you guys. Thank you.
No, thank you boys. Have a great one.
Thanks for listening back in another two weeks.
Remember to like, share, review if you can.
Helps drive traffic to our podcast.
Remember, let's leave our ego out of the fire service.

(01:07:10):
It's amazing what we can accomplish when no ones looking
for credit. Much love.
Let's stop eating our own. Become better firemen.
Catch you next time.