Challenges in the American Fire Service with Phil Schiffman

This conversation delves into the experiences and insights of a dedicated firefighter and rescue technician. It covers the challenges faced in the fire service, the importance of leadership and accountability, and the need for maintaining high standards in firefighting. The discussion also highlights the joys and struggles of being a firefighter, aspirations for future tech rescue capabilities, and the significance of camaraderie and traditions within fire departments. The speaker shares personal anecdotes and reflections on the evolving nature of the fire service and the impact of modern technology on relationships and training.

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
I got to sit down with LA nativeand fireman Phil Schiffman
during the wildfires in LA County and had a good discussion
on traditions, our personal opinions on what is happening in
American fire service out West. It's a good honest, raw podcast
on 2 firemen talking shop. We also talked to Phil about
what he is striving for in his current department with rope and
technical rescue. It is a good one.

(00:21):
Enjoy. Welcome everybody.
This is Copper say fireman podcast.
This podcast is for firemen burning the ships of
complacency, laziness and excuses, for promoting the love
and passion for the job, encouraging eagerness, and
mastering the craft of the fire service.
The information, opinions, values, recommendations and

(00:41):
ideas are the host and individuals of this podcast and
are not affiliated or endorsed by the fire departments,
organizations or companies the individuals work for.
This podcast is for general information use only, endorsed
by the Copper Say Fools. Welcome back everybody.
I'm sitting down with Phil Schiffman.

(01:03):
He is currently three years in the American Fire service as a
firefighter, total of eight years, five years prior as a
paramedic in the EMS division ofa fire department.
He is a rope rescue tech, tower rescue, tech structural collapse
technician, rope rescue boat operator.
I took the position as a department as tech rescue
instructor, which encompasses rope, structural and vehicle

(01:25):
rescue. He is trying to promote and
expand his tech rescue in the department he works for right
now to encompass swift water. I should be coming this summer,
which is amazing. He's on the EMS committee to
expand protocols, started volunteering with Pino Rural
fire medical District. He is a dad to two amazing
daughters, 7 and 11 years old. He again like I said, rope

(01:48):
rescue tech, tower rescue technician, structural collapse
technician, paramedic critical care paramedic, Sergeant in the
United States Marine Corps, infantry veteran paramedic
instructor at local college, part time medic in a rural
ambulance district. He served six years in the
United States Marine Corps. Thank you for your service
brother. The tree obviously deployed to

(02:08):
Helmand province, Afghanistan. I'm sure he's going to correct
me when I say that again. Did with advanced MOS school
very few get to go to and even less graduate from.
He's currently heading and expand into departments tech
rescue capabilities to include or expand on the vehicle rescue
and then again add that swift order this summer.

(02:29):
He builds training props for theboys at his houses so he can get
them up to snuff. And he also volunteers for a 4x4
rescue group to help pull out stranded people out of bad
spots. Thank you for sitting down with
us today, brother, and we appreciate you.
So welcome. And did I mess up, mispronounce,
or miss anything in that intro freezer?
No, my man, you're a solid, happy and stoked to be here.

(02:50):
Thanks for having me. Cool.
All right, well, listen, we we kind of got connected through
the the forces of social media, of course, and Instagram to be
exact. So we all know what's going on
right now. So we're sitting down scrapping
and everyone knows what's going on in the American fire service
out West right now. Those boys are getting their ass
handed to them with all the wildor with all the fires in LA

(03:12):
County. There is a there's a lot of
things in the fire service that we are actively fighting against
or fighting to keep and traditions are always something
we're trying to fight to keep. And some things are came to the
head in LA County and it's something we're going to talk
about today sitting down. And it's just a kind of want to

(03:35):
talk about what's going on in the upper echelon of that county
and what they have stated publicly on video.
And I really want to know what you think about this, Phil.
And I mean, that's kind of why we started talking.
So I'd really like you to just kind of hash it out and, and,
and talk about you're from that area originally.
And just what disgust that the the citizens should have for

(03:58):
that fire department's leadership right now.
And I want to say make sure I say leadership and not the boys
because the boys are are doing the work.
Never the boys. Boys are an inspiration.
They are. I can't display or feeling up
respect form and yeah, a Mona native, which is East LA county,
fortunately not touched by the fires at all.
But and jeez, man, every video Isee like it hurts my heart a

(04:20):
little more just watching LA getburned up.
It's kind of easy to say some things as an outsider looking in
like, you know, those documents were released just from a few
months ago when the city of Los Angeles wanted to city city of
Los Angeles wanted to slash her overtime budget by was it like 7
million? I think it was.
It was a lot and the Fire Chief wrote a letter in a memo saying,

(04:43):
look, this is really going to draft our ability to respond to,
for instance, it's disasters, wildfires, whatever.
That's for me anyway. That was kind of a from at least
my perspective, probably a less visible thing.
But the whole like idea came up in amongst all this
specifically, it was an equity chief.

(05:06):
A video first surfaced out saying, you know, we need more
firefighters that look one way or look the other and they look
differently to make certain subsects or be it race,
religion, color, identity, orientation or really whatever
additive or whatever the societylikes to divide people up with.

(05:30):
Basically said like, it's betterfor the public if someone shows
up that looks like them, like they would appreciate that is
what I think she was trying to say.
Right? Yeah.
The fire department needs to be encompassing of literally what
everyone looks like. Right.
And then I guess like that's notexactly a bad thing by any
means. It's it's perfectly fine for
that to be that way. It's fine for it to be the other

(05:51):
way. Realistically, whatever sort of
divisive thing here being in thefire service is calling your
color, religion, orientation, but it has nothing to do with
whether you are called to do this or not.
That's just, you know, ancillary.
If you were a firefighter that'son the outside.
So shouldn't being in the fire service they're calling is

(06:11):
completely irrespective of all that you should want to do this
because you want to do this thatbecause of that.
And then she goes on further to say, well, can you lift my
husband out of a burden buildingto my response is, well, if your
husband's in a burden building, he's in the wrong place.
He shouldn't be there. And that sent me from like zero

(06:33):
to 100 just furious. Like, excuse me, you're a
firefighter, the Los Angeles Fire Department for 30 plus
years. When you boil down to it, as
firefighters, we get 2 jobs. We need to knock down fire and
we need to pull people out of burning buildings.
This is what we're here for. This is what we want to do.
That's why we came this job. That's what our cities are
funding us for. That's what our citizens are

(06:54):
paying their taxes for. That's what they every single
time or we roll down the street,go and code onto something.
That's what they're looking at us and believing in us to do For
a veteran of, in my humble opinion, one of the greatest
fire departments in the country,for you to say you're in the
wrong place and it doesn't necessarily matter.

(07:14):
You know what physical shipment you know you shouldn't be there.
Hey man, I'd like blue my top. We shouldn't be excusing
physical fitness and lowering standards or disregarding
standards whatsoever under the guise of flag of DEI hires or
whatever. And we shouldn't be blaming

(07:35):
victims for people that are unable to pull them out of a
building. When we go back to or when I go
back to thinking about my time with the Marine Corps I was
doing when don't ask, don't tellgot repealed.
And 1st off, we had an openly gay corpsman and one of the guys
in their squads in my unit was openly nobody cared.

(07:55):
It wasn't a thing. It didn't matter to us.
Like the prior service military.The infantry is a really, really
tightly bonded decrease and who cares?
There's almost like we're being told that other people cared by
other people that had nothing todo with the no state.
But either it's a fact. You know, they got the position

(08:18):
they got to because they were able to work their ass off.
They were able to perform they met exceed the standards.
So it didn't matter when I was on my way out the the Pentagon
wanted to like integrate women in the industry.
Realistically, it's kind of the same thing as anybody else.
Who really cares Female could domore pull ups than than she

(08:40):
deserves whatever comes with that she deserves her positions
come with better fitness and shecould outruns you that but on
her that's not on her. That's not me.
That's for me falling short on something or that's a signal and
inspiration me and I need to be better because one of my peers
is surpassing something, you know, So the whole idea of
trying to recruit certain peoplebecause they look like something

(09:00):
or it's using excusing performance or I guess some part
performance, substandard performance by all sort of
blame. No, there's there's no place for
the fire service. And that completely goes against
everything that the hundreds of years of American firefighters
have, according to this, to earnour people's trust.
I mean, you, you said exactly there.

(09:21):
So I always revert back to when people start talking about
traditions and everything else with the fire service itself.
It's you go to you look at the mission statement of any fire
department in the United States and I guarantee you in there
says life safety period. The end.
Most will also say property of some sort right Sable lives

(09:42):
sable property. What however they deem it or
verbiage. It is always number one priority
of the fire service has been from the incept is life safety.
And she literally went on recordstating that it was not her
responsibility being in charge of that fire service, right,
which is absolutely absurd as it's it's almost like you you

(10:03):
had stated before for the audience like you at that point,
you came unglued like that. At that point for me, I almost
became speechless and to the point where I was showing guys
around the job and around the table that hadn't seen it yet.
I'm like, you haven't seen this yet.
Are you freaking kidding me? Watch this.
And the majority of people they weren't, if they weren't angry,
they were literally speechless because it's something that we

(10:25):
had never heard come out of a brother's sister's mouth ever.
And she is absolutely 100% not asister of anybody in the
American Fire Service, was what she stated, You know.
Well, could God no like you exactly that our job is to give
people their loved ones back to hug them another day.
That's what our job is. That's why we're here.
And she literally victim blames them.

(10:46):
She says it's not her problem. She says it's OK that you know
that she can't carry member firebecause they shouldn't be there.
It's absolutely. Yeah, and it's it's it's crazy
too, because so on top of that and the political bereavement, I
hope that they are getting, I know that they're getting on
social media by hope. And like I said, I don't live in
that state. So I don't know what it's like

(11:07):
for those guys. And hopefully they are, you
know, partner putting that entire administration to the
Kohl's right now. But then on top of that, they
had already cut their budget tooprior prior to fire season.
So on top of all of that, and then insurance companies
cancelling like 75,000 insurancepolicies prior to the fire
season, Like what in the world is going on with the fire

(11:28):
service and the States and the administration and insurance
companies is crazy because we all work hand in hand with all
these entities, you know, and itseems like everyone is
piggybacking right this minute against LA County, LA City, you
know, the, the entire, and it, it just boggles my brain like if
like, what's your, what's your insight on that?

(11:48):
What do you, what's your conspiracy theory?
What's, what's any, what do you even feel about the, the entire
almost seems like a movie at this point.
Like you're, you're looking backand the more and more you hear,
you're like, there's no freakingway this is real life.
Do you feel the same way? Is this so shocking that it's
almost unbelievable? Does it seem like some things
are almost scripted in a way? Yeah, I don't want.
I don't want to think that way. But the fact that matter is

(12:10):
like, like most of us, most mostfirefighters were critical
thinkers. And you can't help but wonder
how things came together in the sequence they did.
Like, we slash budgets. So I believe it's State Farm.
They drop coverage. Like, OK, come on.
What's your sole purpose of how home insurance in California.

(12:31):
It's wildfires. Come on.
And you drop, you drop your while your fire coverage.
And I'm sure they pay a lot of money for that too.
Oh my God, I can't imagine. And then all of a sudden some of
the most devastating fire to ever hit on California, you
know, with property damage and some loss of life and whatnot.
Like that's all of a sudden ripping through one most

(12:51):
populated cities and it's decimating a city that, I mean,
realistically, I don't think there's any public water system
in the world that's going to fight that.
I don't, you know, you can say what you want about water, and
that doesn't seem feasible to me.
But the sequence of events that things are happening, you really
truly can't help but wonder. But at the same time, especially
since like we're in this platform they're in right now, I

(13:13):
would never dare put myself in the mind or the heart of one of
those firefighters is just, you know, working like 24 hours
straight and barely getting great, fighting like an absolute
for now. But the closest thing I could do
is relate to being in the combatzone.
And out of respect for them, I don't want to tell them that.
I wouldn't want to know so far as to infer that the world's

(13:38):
against them. I would just kind of narrow in
my view and wanted to support them and just blast them with
pods. Not blast, that's a silly word,
but shower them and be positive towards their plight because I'm
not there. I'm not the one that's
struggling. I can see a lot of things from
afar. Some of it really looks really
fishy, really weird, and it makes me wonder.

(13:59):
But at the end of it all, like they are fighting absolute
uphill battle. I'm sure they're very, very
disillusioned and disappointed with the leadership above their
heads. I'm sure that they have been
watching a lot of these changes that we're just now being made
aware of. I probably watched these things
happen for months and shaking their heads and talking at the
table. You.
Know, Speaking of talking at thetable, you just remind me of

(14:21):
something I caught not too long ago.
And I'm not sure if you, you probably saw it, but I mean,
it's all over the place right now.
That Joe Rogan podcast from likea year ago, he was saying out
again, if if you haven't seen it, it's he's sitting down.
He's like, hey, man, you know, you just talked to LA County
fireman over, you know, they just got done with fire season.

(14:44):
And he pretty much was like, hey, man, we got lucky.
He's like, what do you mean you got lucky?
He's like, yeah. And he's telling Joe Rogan that
he's like, yeah, dude, he's like, we just get lucky.
He's like, if the winds pick up in a certain area during a
certain time of year, depending on the amount of moisture, and
they don't let up and he's like,he goes, it will burn through
the city all the way to the ocean.
And he goes and there's not a God damn thing we can do about

(15:04):
it. He's like, and that was almost a
year ago. And you know, and they're
blasting it out, playing this side by side with what's going
on and you're going holy shit, like these these boys knew, like
these boys know, like the guys that are on the frontline right
now, they know like that this was a matter of time.
But then you watch all these artor all these news articles
popping out and the town that just burned down, they had no
water, right? There's all the all the hydrants

(15:26):
were dead. But they had stated that days
prior to they forgot to fill thereservoir.
It wasn't that they couldn't, they said they forgot to.
It's like, are you like, bro, are you freaking kidding me?
Like there's no way you forgot to when there is the largest
fire ever right within miles of your town and then you forgot to
fill the reservoir at that time and no other time prior.

(15:48):
Come on man, give me a break. Sorry guys, it's on me, I
forgot. Yeah, exactly.
So it's again, like I said, it'sjust it's it's absolutely crazy
what's going on right now. So I mean, so outside of the LA
stuff. So let's let's learn a little
bit about you. So you've been officially on the
job, right career for three years.
Is that correct? All right, So obviously infancy

(16:10):
of your American fire service career right now.
How you loving the job it's? Just the best thing I've ever
done for myself, specifically for myself.
You know what I mean? Like I get to just live out like
my dreams as far back inside to remember it gave me the home
that I was looking for when I left the Marine Corps.
It's an amazing way to be a dad because not only you know, it's

(16:32):
an excellent way to take care ofa family.
I think you minus the time way that that definitely takes hold
of anyone with the support I have, but feel like my own
personal opinion in my upbringing.
I think that family values and Firehouse values tend to
commonly intercept so feel like just by virtue of how

(16:54):
unfortunately I have to be on the staff, feel like it be a
good dad too set a good example for my daughters.
Absolutely. So, So I'm curious because
you're probably the youngest guyI've had on the job so far with
just years on service, which is great.
And I got a bunch of young dudescoming on here shortly.
But it's a question. I haven't had it, had it,

(17:16):
haven't had a chance to ask on the podcast yet.
For a guy that's got like five years or less or whatever, I'm
dying to know. So favorite part of the job
right now and then least favorite part of the job right
now with no PC, no fucking pulling punches, just straight
up like like rapid fire. What's a first thing pops in
your head like best part of the job.

(17:36):
Best part of the job is that it's the ride back after a
fucking fire. And it is, I mean fighting.
It's the shit. Like we all know that, we all
love that. That's awesome.
And it is. But I like getting back and I
like the when you're in the Bay and you're like soaking wet and

(17:57):
you smell like various burnt crap from my house and smoke and
you're all dirty as shit and you're taking apart your gear to
start cleaning it and you're putting your your backup gear
together. And you know, cigars are
probably coming here in a minuteand you're all wore out.
But like you're on this, like you're on this like awesome,

(18:19):
awesome wave of positivity and everybody just gets so, so damn
tight after a fire. Like we're just going to spend
the rest of night bullshitting. We're going to talk about that.
We're going to talk about life. And it's just, it's such a feel
good thing coming back with all your dudes kind of coming
together. Is that like really, really
unique? Like I know the word like try
was getting thrown around for a while a few years ago.
It's still to me, it still feelslike that.

(18:41):
And it's really reminiscent of being in a mortar squad or when
we were rifling. Then we were deployed, we got
broken down the rifle squads andI was an Afghan.
I was really reminiscent of being in a, you know, in an
infantry squad again, but sort of different at the same time.
So just like that tightness and that that really, really deep,
like kind of gritty family atmosphere that like you just

(19:03):
don't touch. It's all the trauma bonds that
we end up going through, you know, it's all the, the goods
and the bads. But you're right.
It's there is a, you know, no one's, no one's really said that
before. And I, I, I know the feeling
you're talking about. Everybody that's on the job
knows that feeling. But it's yeah, it's almost like
a it's almost like a giddy high,you know, like everyone's just

(19:24):
on 9 and giddy and you're makingstupid little jokes and
everyone's laughing about like even that we might have not
laughed a couple hours ago. Definitely not coming off the
lift is this. We weren't you know, and then,
but after a good job always and you're right clean up in the Bay
after, you know, putting your stuff together.
You're talking about the job again and just going through.
I do not love it. That's that is I agree with you,

(19:45):
man. That's one of my favorite things
in the world. Flip side.
Worst. Part of the job.
Worst part of the job? What is it?
Race that go to the worst part like as I as young as I am in
the service starting to discoverthe politics I know that that's
out there and the senior guys are like Oh yeah yeah like well
yeah but you had a moment when you started learning it too and
I think it's kind of exacerbatedmy position, which I know sounds

(20:07):
weird but I got to get there nowthat I'm in this role where I'm
the only currently I'm the only rope tech going structural
collapse tech on the department.We have a lot of boat guys
because we have a boat, right. So where that wraps into
politics is that I am. Like insanely driven and
committed to increasing our techrescue capabilities.
And it sounds really, really cool when you talk to people

(20:28):
like, Oh yeah, like a chief's just like, Oh yeah, that's a
great idea. Captain's like, hey, that sounds
super cool, but then what's it come down to?
Funny. Funny, like council members,
yeah, just like there's the process of OK, that's really
cool idea. How are you going to do?
How are you going to fund it? How are we going to do it?
Like, by the grace of like, you know, all of the divine entities

(20:49):
in the universe, we managed to grant that got us some rescue 42
struts. And then here I am like, oh,
dude, thank God. I'm so, so stoked to have these.
Oh, wait, does it come with the Jack so we can use the struts?
It's a living device. It doesn't.
OK, Well, oh, wow. Hey, hey, Cap, can we like, get
this Jack, you know, can we get maybe two of these?
You know, how are we going to disperse these?

(21:09):
So then like you have passion and I got other people that are
down with this and like for the training budget, we never have a
problem with this. Like you want to go to this
class, go. You want to go to this class go.
Like we get such a supportive Department of Education, but
what are you going to do with that?
Training somebody doesn't cost afew $100 outfitting those
specialties to do their job. There's a whole lot more.

(21:33):
And that's the brick wall that Ikeep running into.
It's not to be construed as running into a lack of support
for my for my leadership. No, they're all about it.
How the hell are we going to do it?
Yeah. Where are we going to get the
money from? Who's going to buy off on it,
Right. All that, all that stuff.
How? Do we get like the city
leadership to go like, yeah, that's great.
I totally want to spend thousands of more dollars on you

(21:53):
guys. Now you got to justify and
that's always the hardest thing,especially in the position that
you're in right now, because that's the I mean that's that's
a battalion or deputy, probably deputy level typically is who's
trying to justify these new or expanding programs, not a back
step guy. Yeah, yeah, I don't, I don't
talk to the people to make decisions.
I don't even see them face to face and better off that way.

(22:15):
But hey, I'm really, really fortunate that I got like that
leadership here that they are interested in what I have to
say. They want same things.
Just it's not up to us if you know.
Yeah, no, I hear you. So with the department work for
right now, so you said the tech rescue side is infant, it's in
its infancy like brand new. You're really kind of

(22:36):
spearheading it. You're the only guy, right.
So where do you see yourself in say like three to five years
from now if you are supported? Are you, are you trying to get,
I mean, obviously we want the world, but realistically are you
trying to like in that timeline?Are you trying to get like a
single team or like a part Time Team or where do you think you
guys are trending currently? So right now we are Rd. rescuing

(22:57):
only as far as equipment goes. The entire department is rope
core. I am the only rope one and two
guy. As much as I love where I'm at,
you had a little bit before me. We had a really, really dark
period where the city did not see eye to eye.
To keep that part just mellow and brief.

(23:17):
A lot of people left because they were unhappy.
Morale was an all time low. So in that period, Trish, we
lost almost all our tech. Rest of you guys, yeah, it's it
was snarly and it's kind of hardto go a week without hearing one
of those war stories. But so right now we have a fully
outside of Rd. band and we had had that's mostly so we could

(23:38):
support Boeing. So a massive Boeing plants in
our first yeah. So we were we have that to be
like almost like an industrial rescue team.
Like I know that they're supposed to sponsor their own,
but that's we're contracted withthem instead.
At one point in time we had an industrial rescue thing, but
then to, you know, there's otherplenty of other times and places
where we can utilize that. So we have the equipment for rib

(23:59):
rescue. Got that already.
Or I would like to be in three to five years, I kind of already
have someone that's positioned down just by being like the guy
that's going to start the instruction of all this, the one
who's probably at the extense ofthe moment as most rescue certs,

(24:20):
I just kind of want to be the guy that might be that's
overseeing. What I would really, really,
really love is at least two techs per shift just on rope
right now. If we can get them in the
structure collapse, that's great.
But we'll be out running our budgetary here.
We are running our budget. We are running our budgetary
capabilities, possibly by doing that.

(24:42):
I would love to get like 2 rope techs on.
And then I would like to expand our vehicle rescue because like
I said, we just got struts. So I want to get sort of a
program together that trains andmaintains training on the
struts, airbags, cribbing, just some of the basics and you know,
compressing and all that. Like it covers and maintains the
basics of like heavy vehicle rescue because we got, you know,

(25:06):
we have 270, it's a major freeway and holy crap.
Like we have a lot of cars get stuck under semis.
It's honestly silly, but I want to be better at that and I want
to be better as like a mutual aid partner for some of the
other cities around us because not everybody is fortunate
enough to have some of the rescue stuff that we even

(25:27):
already have. So to yeah, shorten that up.
I want a more of a functioning rope rescue team and I want,
it's kind of hard to say specialist in this, but more of
a specialized and more of a streamlined vehicle like heavy
rescue programming plates. I know that make that makes

(25:48):
complete sense. So you so with your so I'm a I'm
a big rope nerd, right? I'm assigned a heavy rescue.
Actually, I'm a Rover off a heavy rescue because I'm a
roving captain now. But so when it comes down to
your your guys's needs for your region, your area, your first do
everything else. So where I where I currently
work, we do a lot of mountain rescues and it's because we have
a lot of transient population come through.

(26:10):
They go through hikes that they have no business being on, come
very unprepared and typically a dehydration issue, sometimes
broken extremes. But we'll either big wheel them
down, fly them out, whatever thecase might be.
But for your region, what is your biggest issue?
Is it like like ejections off freeways into wooded areas?
Or is there a lot of water by you and it's more like trail

(26:32):
riders or like what's what's your response area?
What would your need be for yourrope rescue?
Then what do you guys actually currently have equipment wise
when it comes down to like do you guys use the clutches or the
shoot? I can't remember the other one.
We used to have the pencil IDs that they are you still old
school break racks like so what's what's your region like?

(26:54):
What's your need and and what doyou guys really forecast that?
Like why you need that tech rescue company full time?
We so just immediately with our signals, yeah, we do have a lot
of injections in swampy areas. We have, fortunately we carry 2
basically like complete but basically outfitted rope bags

(27:15):
per truck. So a single engine or ladder can
get started on a lot of work very quickly just having unseen.
But we have a lot of objections in the swampy wooded areas that
we low angle, low angle rescue them up like embankments or
whatever. We have a lot of industry.
So Boeing has this like or what is it?
It's one of their like subsidized companies that have

(27:36):
these like giant vats that they work in.
They have like catwalks and stuff.
There's another industrial like metal fabricating company where
they have these huge, huge spools, sheet metal, like like
bigger than a car. And then they run them down like
a well underground and we shoot them down to the other side and
it gets like lifted up somewhereelse, like flattened out.

(27:58):
So there's a lot, there's a lot of fall hazards, a lot of injury
hazards in life. Very kind of awkward to get
places. So that's what our industrial
rescue looks like. We could I would say that in the
north part of our metro area, wecould stand to have a hazmat
team because of, you know, we have a lot of industry out there
and the North End of our county,there is no everywhere our

(28:19):
nearest 130 minutes away maybe wow.
It is one of the yeah, it's we're the South end of our metro
area is probably I want to put this the taxpayers, there's more
tax money coming into those, those those areas.
We'll put it Segway. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
You know, so they got a lot moreresources down there, which is
cool. I'm very happy for them.
But we could use some of our ownin my opinion.

(28:40):
So we don't have a happy rescue nearby to jump on those first
alarms. So I would love, well, that's
that's like my ultimate dream right there is to put up a
rescue that responds to the North End of our county.
And all of it may be we there's a lot of gnarly wrecks on the
freeway that runs through the North End of our county.

(29:01):
I mentioned all the industrial stuff, injections are plenty.
A lot of commercial vehicles areinvolved in these wrecks too.
So not only would we be able to serve our population a lot
better, would be able to be an asset to all of our neighbors,
just kind of lay the landscape out for the listeners.
We are, we are a small department and we work amongst a
bunch of other small departments.

(29:22):
So like worst, we're two state department, our neighbors are
two station or their neighbors one or northern neighbors are
four or southern neighbors are two.
So we're not like a big city department, but we kind of act
like 1, but it's like big city without a rescue.
So I would love to be the driving force that puts that up
and then touch on capabilities. We're a little dated in our rope

(29:42):
rescue, but not bad. Nothing that I would I think
that I wouldn't want to take into anything.
So yeah, we're using Pestilid and we don't have that cool, you
know, vortex tripod, but we got we got a good tripod.
We got like underground ventilation for confined space.
We got the SA, our models and the com lines.
We've got miles and miles of rope crimp into a van and
otherwise say free candy on the side.

(30:03):
But so it's a it's a nice set ofrope rescue van.
We just need to rejuvenate the program and then from other
rescue trucks carry crimming that carry airbags.
We just got stress. So who carries Who does the
extrication? Is a ladder company or truck
company? Or is it?
Or does the engine? Is the engine also equipped?
Either or both our engine and our trucks carry hydraulics.

(30:25):
So you guys have airbags? What other?
So you just got these struts, you said, but you don't have any
way to lift with them. So you're only lifting currently
with airbags, is that right? Yep, and then maybe in a weird
pinch to the spreaders. Yeah, it's, it's funny.
We just, we're just messing with.
We just did a heavy lifting class not too long ago.

(30:46):
They're introducing these huge low pressure bags.
And a lot of guys are. Yeah, yeah, I know what you're
talking about. Like bro, bro, no, it's not a
low pressure bag like everyone thinks.
It's our normal fire department airbags.
And then it's just a different regulator.
I'm like, this thing is like thesize of two beanbag chairs
stacked together and it only takes yeah dude it's insane and

(31:07):
only takes a couple PSI. I think it's like 3 and it lives
like 30,000 lbs. I mean, I don't don't Fact Check
those numbers. They're probably exaggerated
either or but a shit ton of fucking weight.
And it only takes basically one SCBA bottle to completely fill
the thing. So we're messing it with for
exactly what you you were just saying.

(31:28):
We have an abundance of cars that go underneath 18 Wheelers
tractor trailers and it's that was so that was the idea behind
it is that would be a really good tool for those on top of
utilizing the air system that's already on these 18 Wheelers to
elevate and lift up as much as you can and then be able to
actually lift and crib with these bags at the same time.
And then the idea is to move thevehicle out and then you can

(31:51):
finish cutting from from there. But it's, I'm like I said, I was
curious on how you guys run or who runs the extrication, right,
because we're the area I currently work for or work in.
It is very defined like an engines there for a protection
line. The ladder company is, is
cutting like there's no rescue engines, you know, or, or

(32:12):
anything along those lines. And we're really fortunate.
Yeah, we do run rescue engines. Whoever shows up first can't run
to work. There you go.
Now for for education equipment since it's do you guys just
carry a combi tool or do you have dedicated spreaders and
cutters? How does that work for or is
that an engine ladder specific thing?
No. No, no.
So we're really fortunate. We're with the exception of just
a few small things on the ladder, they're actually

(32:33):
outfitted very similarly like some ladder specific things like
ladders, but we got a battery operated and case cutters and
then sprinters. Those are our two hydraulic
tools. And Eric, you said they're both
battery operated, Is that correct?
Yeah. And who makes the ones that you
guys use and KISS and KISS, I haven't heard of them because we
demoed you like them. I think they're great.

(32:56):
They're they're fairly lightweight, I think for what
they are. And I've never seen them not be
able to, you know, move something.
Wow, I know I'm doing a deep dive tonight after a little old
lady goes to be Google Googling and going through because we we
just recently in the department I work for, probably a little
over a year ago converted everything to battery operated.

(33:16):
But we did the we did the big three.
Well, I would say the big 2:00 and 1:00.
So we did the Himacho obviously,and the Hertz and then we ended
up demoing. Man, I can't even think of the
name of the company right now, but it was funny.
It was a smaller company, but I,I prefer that one over the other
two, But it's, we just put it out to vote.
So we ended up sticking with theexact same company that we had
before. And I'm pretty sure it's because

(33:37):
we had them before. But either way, I love, I love
the battery powered extrication tools.
So let me just run something by you because you you're talking
about the obviously the pipe dream is to get a heavy.
And obviously my favorite part of being on Heavy is getting to
respond to those commercial fires and go ahead and force in
a shit ton of doors, softening buildings, doing searches,

(33:57):
everything else. So we figured out something the
other day that's actually prettyeffective because we're no
longer tethered by a 200 foot hydraulic line.
Like when we have all these, youknow, crazy tough full metal
secured reinforced commercial doors on the back of a strip
mall. We're sending two guys down as a
two man unit and all they're doing is they're gapping and

(34:20):
then the third guy comes in withthe spreaders and pops the door.
They may move down to gap another one pop.
And it's insanely fast, right? Is it for every door?
Absolutely not. Does it work really good for
those kind of situations? Dude, brother, hell yeah it
does. Right?
So I don't know if you guys havestarted entertaining those kind
of ideas, but I'm telling you what it's it's the it's the way

(34:41):
to go, I think. My personal opinion, obviously.
That sounds incredible. No, we haven't brought that up
either way yet, but I'm going towhen I'm back in when I get back
on. There you go.
And like I said, that's how we run it.
We run it like if in in the exact scenario that we need it
for, you know, we run 4 main crews, but once an engineer, so
they're typically stay back. But so we have all three guys

(35:02):
captain and two back step dudes.But it's great, you can have the
captain and the back step guy just set gaps and as soon as
they get a gap sizable enough tostick the spreader in there,
then they're moving on to the next door while he's, you know,
popping from there. And it's it's great, especially
when that command staff is like,hey, I want, I want every single
door controlled on the rear for secondary means of egresses.

(35:23):
You're like, oh hell yeah. Instead of committing 3
different companies, one companycould cruise through an almost
entire strip mall. It's pretty cool.
Dude no kidding man that's awesome.
And then I swear like amkus doesn't even know exists.
I'm not making money by but likethose tools they got like
interchangeable tips if you pullthe tips off and put a shaped
tip off. So there you go.
And so that could be part of that game plan.

(35:44):
Yeah. You know, and it's just one of
those things that like, you know, and we didn't invent that.
We saw someone else do it and was like, oh man, that's a good
idea, let's try it. And we tried it on a building
that we were demoing, actually one of our old fire houses and
was like, son of a bitch. Why didn't we think of that
before, you know? And then it's like, well, no one
ever thought because like we tell guys, or at least I tell

(36:06):
guys this all the time, like heyman, especially being on a
ladder truck or a heavy, if whatever my assignment is, I
have at least planned ABC and D with me all the time.
Like I don't have to go back to the truck.
I don't go back to the truck till about E or F, right.
So I don't think that was ever part of those first floor plans

(36:28):
because you were tethered, you had a line, you know, it was, it
wasn't very convenient. So now it's almost like a throw
it on your back go, I don't know.
That's a that's a that's an amazing idea.
It's not right now. If we you know push came to show
we just cut the lock apart with AK14 but I think this better be
way way way faster. Yeah, and and like I said again,
I do not know your region at all, but like in the in the

(36:49):
ghetto versions of the area thatI work, I mean it's everything's
reinforced. So I mean, what you're looking
at is you're not trying to defeat one lock.
You're probably going to have todefeat 4.
So it's it's one of the fields where the more you can
manipulate and break and bend that door, even just exposing
what you're looking at is man, talk about just shaving,
obviously shaving the time and being as as efficient as we can

(37:12):
at this job. But anyway, I'll get off my like
I said, I love ladder work and heavy work as you're figuring
out right now. So I could, I could do day long.
So anyway, so we talked about sowe talked about what you're
currently doing right now. Before we get into the questions
for the season, Is there anything that you really want to
hit on or anything that you wantto talk about before we kind of
transition towards the end, bro?I think we kind of covered like

(37:36):
we didn't write and we really hit like I guess the the flash
points, you know, so to speak that like, you know my mind
lately, at least I know it. So that was the what where you
wanted to go with it. We were kind of like right on
the same page. There were sort of what was in
our minds in our office about saying, but like at the end of
all of you know, our our our independent analysis of what

(37:58):
we're watching happen from the top down over there.
I just got to express my absolute profound love, respect,
and admiration for LA City, LA County, and all of their the
surrounding apartments because Imean, I wouldn't dare put myself
in their shoes, but if I did theclosest thing I could, they've
got to be working their ass off against something that is just
money mentally and monolithically brutal.

(38:21):
They're probably not talking to their families.
They're probably not whether redcycles are probably not very
restful unless they each collapse.
So I think that they at least deserve, you know, a moment for
us to just take a minute, just put ourselves and to like the
observer view, so to speak, and really try to take in what
they're doing and just respect and appreciate their just not

(38:43):
only situation. And I'll, I'll 100% echo that to
you brother, too. It's, it's, I don't know exactly
when this podcast will publish abit.
So the hopefully the fires are out by then.
But it's one of those things where it's like you, the, the
love for the boys is 100%, the support for the boys 100%, you
know, and it's just, they are literally sacrificing every

(39:05):
ounce of energy and time that they have to try to do their
best uphill battle. And so like I said, we're, we're
keeping our fingers crossed to the boys.
We're praying for them and hopefully more, more help and
more relief calms and, and maybethe wind stop and the fire goes
out, you know? Yeah.
Oh yeah. Yeah.
The only, the only thing again meet my personal opinion.
That's what this show's about isjust we are having personal

(39:26):
opinions. And my personal opinion, I hope
when everything is said and donethat the upper echelon is
roasted and fired and never be able to set foot into the
American Fire service ever againand corrupt another department.
So that's my hopes and again my personal opinion.
No, I'm right there with you need to be like a massive
reckoning of accountability. Top, top all the way that I

(39:47):
don't know how far down, man, because I don't know how far
that's the spider web goes with spider legs.
You know, go into the organization, but like to do
nothing to leave things the way they are would probably be the
most criminal, corrupt and negligent thing that a city can
do for its people. Like it's no things need to get
flipped on their head. 100%, absolutely.

(40:09):
All right, very well, without further ado.
So I love to lead off with the first question.
It's a why. So we always say the why for the
fire service. So we asked the why when we're
we're interviewing future candidates, future recruits for
the fire service. Why do you want to do but so but
this specifically for you Phil? Why my brother, did you want to
join the fire service? It's like a funny question

(40:31):
because, like, if you get different points in my life,
it's a different answer because,like, I cannot think of a single
time I, like, I did not want to be a firefighter.
So at one point in time, like, oh, man, that truck's really
cool. I really like those lights and
they drive fast. How awesome is that?
You know, like, it goes back allthe way to like the most, like,
simple and joyful and like, you know, final reasons that a lot
of us are really here. But I remember when those trucks

(40:55):
turned into humans for me, so tospeak, was like I was visiting
my grandma down in San Diego in like her neighbor's house.
So the San Miguel Fire District team, you know, for a lift
assist. And there I am thinking, my God,
this is awesome. Under so close to or Chuck, you
know, fanboy geeking out. Oh yeah, being a cool little 5
year old, right. And then those things were so,
so cool. They're like, hey, want to go up

(41:17):
in the truck? You want to like look around.
They gave me like that little fire, you know, that classic
little fire truck tour. And this showed me cool tools.
They gave me a classic hat, likethe whole cliche thing.
And like, you know, you never know at the time, I don't even
know if like 10 years or 15 years.
Like, that moment stuck with me forever and really changed my
life. So I wanted to, I wanted to be a

(41:39):
part of this organization. These things are so cool.
So like, yeah, I want to be a cool guy, too.
Hell yeah. So just jump forward to, like,
where I'm at now. That meant so much to me.
And that dives into, like, PR for me.
And I want to be what that meantto me.
I want to be that somebody else.So just going back to like the
most early primal, you know, a primal, but like, you know, the

(42:01):
recent growing up and then kind of as time went on, you know,
growing up, see how impactful they are to society.
We don't know, like medical calls, fire calls, They're,
they're really, really positive,contributing to society.
Fast forward some more. I'm 19 years old.
I joined the Marine Corps at thetime of my life.

(42:21):
This is awesome. My daughter was born during my
third deployment. She's floating around.
It goes to Asia. And I was like, you know what?
Like I would have been a later because I was just as
comfortable in what I was doing.And my daughter was born like
just a few weeks before I had togo on my third pump.
Right now, I'm in. This isn't for me.
Yeah. So then you get back to thinking
like, well, what I'm going to do.

(42:44):
And it was just like no brainer,boom.
Like I'm going to be a fireman. Like that's, that's exactly what
I'm going to do. But now we're at a point in my
life where like all that other stuff I mentioned totally holds
true. Like I want to, I want to
essentially positively impact someone's lives.
I want to make bad days good. I want to inspire people to want

(43:04):
to do this. I want to inspire them to carry
the torch that as the way that Iknew it at least.
And it's the way that I like it and feel it should be, you know,
with respect to my, you know, very junior tenure where I'm at.
But then on leaving the Marine Corps, you have a new and very
unique thing that you want me inyour life.

(43:26):
You can't it's, it's very difficult to leave the infantry
and go back to a normal life. That's just we see in the news
it's just that's that's a difficult transition a very
radical transition for any individual would make.
So I like once again super attracted now to what I know is
the family life of the engine house.
I want to continue living in that that family brother listen

(43:52):
it mob kind of environment mentality and I know it might
probably sounds a little cheesy now because you know, we're used
to get thrown around a lot like a few years ago.
But like be part of the tribe, be part of a group of like
minded, really driven, solid people and live amongst that

(44:14):
dynamic and have each other while being able to grow up in
those values, be molded by thosevalues and turn around.
And sort of like within the likeculturally, like within the
Spartans, how like they all embrace each other and they
reach their strength. Kind of come back and be that

(44:35):
way for my own family to my daughters and whatnot.
So you asked me a different phase of my life if you get a
different answer. But the simple of it all is I, I
want to make bad days better. I want to make sure do the best
I can so that someone's level gets to hug them again.
Want to be part of the really, really tight knit Marshall

(44:57):
culture. And then, oh, I mean, of course
I'm leading the infantry. I can't just not, you know, do
gangster shit the rest of my life.
So. Exactly, yes.
I got to fight motherfucking fire.
Yeah, you know, it's, it's it's that there's always that cliche.
It's like, hey, everybody wants to do gangster shit till it's
time to do gangster shit. Like we actually want to fucking
do gangster shit always. So I love, I love having.
More gangster. Shit, yeah, you leave it with

(45:19):
that. So we got the why.
So how about The Who? So I everyone struggles with
this, but we asked very kindly, right?
So it's the one individual, right, that had the most
influence on you in your fire service career.
Doesn't have to be a fireman, just kind of, if it wasn't for
them, you absolutely would not be where you are right now.
Do you have a you have somebody on top of your brain about that?

(45:41):
Absolutely, Dave. And I see why this is a really
hard question because I've been so goddamn blessed to have a lot
of really excellent people, likecross paths with them.
But yeah, I had this tapped in. I'm going to.
I'll just go by first name, I guess this Captain Dennis, he
was my house captain when I was in the EMS division of this fire
district. It was still in the same, still

(46:01):
in the same metro area that I'm in now.
He, I don't know if you experienced this organization
where you're at, but you have the suppression side and you
have the EMS side and it can be similar, but they're not always
similar. It's it's, it's sort of an
interesting melding of cultures.And then like most fire
departments, different ships, different houses are very

(46:22):
different anyway. So, but he really from a very
young tenure, he really, really took me in.
I, I would like using his words,paraphrasing.
He saw how aggressive and passionate I was towards not
just being on that EMS division,but just kind of like the
overall mission of what the district was to be, you know,
was responsible for was providing my job.

(46:44):
I was critical care paramedic. I was going to be, I was going
to do this. I was going to be the most, you
know, extra paramedic that I could be.
And I think that and he told me that once he was drawn to that,
but he really, he was like almost a vanguard of the old way
in a time where I think we're losing our old roots.
I really, really do. And from how I understand them

(47:05):
to just, I don't know, just kindof like society as it's as it's
changing and evolving now that'sactually we had dinner together.
He made us breakfast on the weekends.
That was his thing. I was like, no, that was just
thank you to us. I don't know.
Thank you is the right word. But he did that for us because
he wanted to do that for us. He wanted to help.
He kind of let you, but that washis baby.
So he made us breakfast on the weekends.

(47:26):
That was super like crazy special.
We always ate together. We would play games together,
like on the dining room table when but I needed to be heard
and it was something I might notbe safe saying where certain
people hear me. The dude always had my back and
it goes beyond Firehouse. It didn't have my back in life.

(47:47):
He's had a great year. He's always looked out for me.
He's always been like an amazingsounding board.
He's always given me amazing advice.
He's always just listening to melike maybe I don't need it.
We've seen a face about something and he would, if I saw
something that I wanted to impact effects make different,
he would find the kind of where that middle ground was of actual
feasibility. But then he'd be like the

(48:08):
champion of it. He was the most humble, but his
team was on for like 30 years when I showed up.
Like I was in kindergarten when this guy got hired, but he was
just the most humble dude I'd ever met.
He was a fire ENT. He he would chip in on things
that you didn't think he would and he would completely change
the dynamic, the thought of thatsituation.

(48:31):
If you said anything about it, he would downplay it so much.
He's like, I just suggested pushing a button.
I just thought that might be, you know, thought that might be
this. Like he was the most humble dude
I've ever met. And he carried the weight of
that whole engine house shoulders through a lot, through
a very kinetic period of change.And you know, with the biggest
smile on like the guy who never really bitch, you know, we all

(48:52):
bitch, but like not for real. So he was like, I like he was a
firefighter that carried the flag for what everything
firefighting was supposed to be.And I'm not even a damn fireman
at this point in time. And to like, to be like, he knew
where I was going with my life. Like I wasn't going to be a
Medicare forever. Some people were cool on them.
That's fine. I'm really happy for him.

(49:12):
It's not what I wanted. I wanted to be a firefighter and
he knew that. So when the district would hire
a new fireman or whatever, yeah,when they would hire a new
fireman and we'd be training himto do it.
Phil, I get in here like I get reserved.
I get backup equipment to do thedrills with them.
It's like he knew. He knew I was going to make it.
He probably knew I was going to get out with the fire
department. He probably believed that more

(49:33):
staunchly and feverishly than I did.
Maybe at times, you know, because it can be a frustrating
process, but he was always in mycorner.
And he did his best to be a firecaptain to a single roll
paramedic. And he did better than I think
anybody ever would so like. And then he's retired now and
you can still stay really, really close.
I'm not with that department anymore.
But we still check up on each other, check up on each other's

(49:56):
lives, you know, staying busy, joining his retirement.
I hope he moves to Colorado soonto be with his grandbabies.
But the dudes here, right? OK, sounds like a stand up dude
for sure. We got The Who in like I said,
he's it sounds like he's he's probably The Who to a lot of
guys, which is the good ones always are.
So what about the one of my favorite questions here?

(50:16):
So, favorite fire department tradition, but more importantly,
why? I do exactly what I was going to
say, right? Yeah, when that came up.
So my department, I love this. I love the fuck out of this.
After dinner, after we all lead together, we play poker, We play
5 card draw. I'm not sorry.
Four guys in the engine, two guys in the angels, six dudes.
We play 5 card draw so dude it'srad man.

(50:38):
That's awesome, I love it. You do for dishes.
There's freaky. That's the Best Buy in ever
right there dude. Right.
And like, OK, so like most of the time we all eat together.
Any instance we don't, it's like, you know, someone has like
dietary considerations or maybe just brought something they want
to eat or you know, really, really super options.
Like we got one dude that hates onions.

(50:58):
You know, if you're putting onions on the food, he's not
going to eat it but still still eat with you.
He might not have contributed todishes, but he's still going to
play. Or maybe he didn't eat it or PC,
whoever. Maybe they didn't eat it all.
And it's like we're playing cards for dishes, but we're not
really playing for dishes. We're playing, playing that.
It's like, you know, we're playing to play.
We're playing to each other, each other what it is.

(51:19):
Yeah. So the reward at the end is we
either do or do not do. Dishes.
We do or do not do dishes. I love it.
But like it's gets even better too.
So like the two low hands now they got to go into a playoff
right So like this dude yeah. So this is where it gets super
cool like particularly makes up the rules.
Maybe you do like a best of 3/5 card draw thing like we do this

(51:42):
thing where it's a give take it's 5 card draw, but like you
know, yeah it's one dude give yes nothing to give and like you
give and take cards to each other.
You flip them over when you do it.
So then you can see like I shouldn't have taken or should
have given. So you just get shitty with
yourself or we do low ball, likeliterally just make up the rules
as you go kind of thing. Well, you have to like decide on

(52:04):
before you go in here. But we kind of got our own
thing. So we'll play little ball.
You can make the low hand. I love that because that pisses
everybody off. Like, all right, this was
lowball motherfucker. Yeah, like, damn it.
Because it's just like playing like hot 5 card draw for like
for weeks and weeks and weeks. Now I'm like, guess what?
Low carb bitch and I don't bitch.
Then you decide what the wild cards are.
Like I love like, I love ruffling shit.

(52:26):
So like my wild cards are alwayskings.
So I took the king out of the equation and it's like, ah, you
Dick. It's like, it's awesome.
And then we'll be like narratingfor each other like, oh, card
sucks. What do you want?
That broke sound effects. You know, when it comes down to
the last card, like we try to build this inspector, right one,
you got like 5 people in the rumble, that last one, like it's

(52:47):
on a wire and then they flip it and it's like, oh, you saw this
like that. It's fucking awesome.
It's so much fun. It erupts and then loses the
dishes and the second loser goesthe mob.
But what's also really cool about that is literally
everybody's on the same page of it.
So it doesn't matter if you tookit doesn't matter if you're the
Battalion Chief, you lost, you're going to do the dishes.

(53:08):
That's what you're going to do. Like we got, we got some good
new guys and they'll like run upand try to do the dishes when
like, you know, the Catholic chiefs up there, they will walk
over there and pry it out of your hands.
Like, no, I lost. I'm doing this.
So it's just like, it's just that's like we all come together
over meals. Well, I holy talk to you.
Yeah. It comes together over poker
dishes. I like I said, that's a that's a

(53:29):
first I've heard on the the podcast so far.
So I absolutely love the fact that you guys do that.
And then the reward at the end is the best, literally or the
the punishment, the end. However, however that works.
I mean, the reward is I didn't end up the last two, so I'm not
mopping or doing dishes like andI get to just banter you guys as
you go to you talk about extremely entertaining.
So. Dude, it is.

(53:50):
It's so rad. Well, good.
Well, let's go complete oppositeof that then.
So this is if you could snap your fingers and change, then
that's get rid of alter whateverit is, right, That would
immediately affect the American fire service.
What would it be? But more importantly, why?
I think that's sort of just the way that we are painting in

(54:12):
society with I guess mostly technology is what I'm blowing
it on, not specifically, but it's a big part of it.
Kind of more like social trends.I think that by and large is
doing its part to slowly erode at how we view the fire service
as a family and how it affects our bonds and our camaraderie,
but also how it effects how we train.

(54:33):
So like, I mean, some of it's awesome.
Like it's pretty cool like that everybody can play NHL together.
It's really cool that like the off duty guys can come in and
play online too. Like in a way it does foster
like closer knit relationships in a way, but time I think that
it also breeds isolation. Just we have phones sometimes

(54:54):
they'll play video, people play video games on their own and
like they're fun. Video games are awesome and it
can be super awesome. But we have individual rows of
TV's. So instead of watching hockey or
bass together, so that's people are all in their room and
watching the same damn game. So I mean that kind of like eats
in our bonds a little bit. And I think that sort of also
bleeds into kind of training because I think that the bonds

(55:16):
we form Nick and Robber we have in a tightness and then to which
the degree creates accountability with one another
that sort of directly relates totraining.
So I think that as we lose our tightness with one another, we
lose some of the competition, the magic, the aggression, yes,
but just the flow of training aswe aside to kind of just slowly

(55:41):
become more involved with electronic things rather than
each other. Maybe, maybe we're doing
something closer to a checker box and we should because we
want to get back to the reclinerto pick up where we left off on
NHL. I'm not like calling out an
exact specific situation, but I'm not being too far from the
truth either. Gotcha.

(56:03):
Maybe we're not saying we're notbusting our asses as hard as we
could. Maybe we're not adding two what
we're trying to do as much as wecould.
Maybe it's also on another census affecting communication
within the house. For example, maybe I don't want
to ask a question or seek adviceor get clarification because the
person I want to talk to is, youknow, holds deep in NHL 25 or

(56:27):
whatever, you know, So like, I think that I think as we, we're
going down the path we are though, it's this new, this new
society is breeding, you know, awesome ways to communicate, IE
like, I'm super stoked to be on your podcast.
I'm really, really happy we got a chance to talk.
That's obviously a huge plus side is that like minded people
can sort of share thoughts and ideas with each other.

(56:49):
It's unfortunately that same that is softening and isolating
a lot of us, I'm afraid. I think it's ultimately
beginning to ship away and damage at some of the core
components of our culture. So if I were to fix that, that
was to snap my fingers, not so much eliminating.
I wouldn't say it's really so much eliminating a single thing,

(57:11):
but I think the antidote to thatwould honestly, it would be more
of it would be it would be doingmore essentially, you know,
training in the summer is rough.So with respect to that or in my
situation, it's like, I don't know, 9° outside, right?
So training in the, which is also rough, but there's still
things you can do. But I think essentially putting

(57:32):
a more of an emphasis on the training and diversifying the
ways that can be done, making itmore interactive, making it more
comprehensive and encompassing. And let's take a lesson from the
poker. Let's just throw some like
straight up bullshit into it, you know, to make it more fun.
I think that returning an aggressive mindset to training

(57:52):
would bleed into every other aspect of the Firehouse.
And I think that would change the way we're bonded, change how
close we are. And it wouldn't just be after
that job, you know, that we're all like, yeah.
So, so that would be more of a time.
It wouldn't just in dinner. It would be we, you know, the

(58:13):
bumper talks had come back, you know, the, you know, cigars at
the end of the night kind of thing would come back.
You know, I just think that I think that if we wait an area
where we naturally should be performing at a high level and
we added more to it and add a little more culture to it, that
that would displace some of the distraction that the digital age

(58:38):
is giving. Us no dude, I, I, I agree with
you because I mean take the fireservice out of it.
Just look around anywhere. People are walking across the
street and they're glued to their phone like you know, it's
people don't even look up anymore.
I I don't know how half the people around here are freaking
even function without a phone, because in without dating

(58:58):
myself, I was, you know, phones were new for me out of high
school, you know, like we had beepers in fucking high school,
like that was, and like my, I'llnever forget my high schools.
My high school girlfriend's dad thought I was a drug dealer
because I had a beeper. I worked at fucking Domino's,
you know, so like, like that's why I had a beeper like it.
But it was just, it was funny, But I, I agree with you.

(59:21):
Like everyone's like you look around.
I love when especially like the Lieutenant or the captain on
shift would be like, Hey, like especially at chow time, Hey,
phones down, you know, like they're not even at the table.
And that way you just eliminatesat least for that sacred area of
our job, you know, But I can't agree with you wholeheartedly.
Like, it's the wealth of information is amazing, but the

(59:42):
distraction is horrible, you know?
I would agree with that. And then you kind of like just
reminded me of a little point, but like it's a small point that
they repercussion. I was talking to a guy actually
earlier today. He was telling me about a study
that they're starting to find, especially in children, take it
when once they're left without stimulation and pick up their
phone. Why?
I'm not doing because they're bored.
It's a matter of processing their emotions or distracting

(01:00:04):
themselves from what they were just being exposed to.
I don't know what to do. I don't know what to think.
Let's get picking my phone. It's like a comfort chip of the
air if you think at this point in time.
Yeah, it's like a would be a blanket, you know, like we used
to have like, yeah, you're right.
It's their phone or their tabletor whatever the case might be.
And it's, you know, I'm a parentand I will not lie, you know,
I've, I've given tablets multiple times because it's like

(01:00:25):
it's easier, you know, like distract them for a second to
give me as a sense of sanity, you know, But it's, you're
absolutely right, dude. And but I mean, we're talking
about grown men and women and it's, it's still the same
pacifier for some of us. But I love it, you know, it's a
new one. Hashtags.
Yeah, they, you got it Pacifier with hashtags, right?
Yeah, everything for the gram, you know.
Well, anyway, dude, I, I really appreciate you reaching out.

(01:00:47):
I love the fact that we got a chance.
Like I said, you and I have never met before.
We got a chance to chat real quick and then sit down through
some technical difficulties and then sit down and actually
record an episode. So it's a win all the way
around. And again, I thank you for your
time, taking time out of your day.
Thankfully, we could do this inside you just says 9° where
you're at. It's like 45 here, which is
freezing for us. So everyone's cold.

(01:01:09):
So it's, it's like I said, I appreciate your time.
Thank you for sitting down with us and anything you want to
leave the audience with before we sign up, brother.
Just fucking dig deep, remember why the fuck you're here, do
your fucking job, and do it the way you'd love it there.
You go do your fucking job. I love that, I love it, I love
it. So we'll leave you with that.
And thank you guys so much for listening.

(01:01:31):
Please, like, share. That's the only way we exist and
keep growing. And thank you guys again.
And we'll catch you in another couple weeks.
Have a good one. Thanks.
Thanks for tuning in. Remember, stay aggressive, learn
something new, train and then pass it on to the new members.
Keep the traditions and passion alive.
It's your fire department.